Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
And so we're gonna talk about baseball today now, unless
you were living under a rock. One of the biggest
news stories that broke this week was that Pete Rose, Shoeless,
Joe Jackson, and a number of other players I think
of seventeen total were lifted off Major League Baseball's all
time band lists. And the reason was was that because
after they have since passed, they are no longer banned
(00:24):
because it's a quote unquote lifetime ban, and therefore they
become eligible for reinstatement, which is kind of disrespectful in
the fact that many of these guys on this list
have died years ago and they're just now doing this.
But I think it is a good and in some
ways a bad thing for Major League Baseball to have
these guys lifted off the band list. So obviously guys
(00:44):
like Pete Rose and Shoelis, Joe Jackson, they highlight this list.
Now they become Hall of Fame eligible. And how you
and I both know this the baseball riders of America.
They are the ones who decide who gets into the Baseball
Hall family. That's why a lot of people criticize the
Best Hall of Fame because it's based on guys who
did the reporting, and there's enough guys who actually made
(01:05):
it into the Hall of Fame they're actually a vote on this.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Yeah, I think that's tough.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
I mean the voting system for MLB Hall of Fame
is interesting in itself as far as you know, letting
the writers decide that, and you know, as the writers
just start to pass on, so does some of those guys,
like you think about cheeless Joe Jackson, So does their
legacy Because now we're getting to that. You know, we
talked about that with NBA debase not to change sports,
but everyone has a different go based on their air
(01:30):
and where they were, who they grew up with. Right, sure,
So as these writers, you know, get older and go on,
there's there are less people to be able to tell
that legacy of those players. So if they don't get
voted in within a certain window, it's truly missed.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:45):
But the big thing with this, it's a slippery slope
with this. Now it's great that they're off the list,
but say you let pe Rose in, say you let
chewless Joe Jackson in. Right, Yeah, Now the conversation becomes
what we're doing. Mark McGuire what we were doing with Barry.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Bonds, put him in in our era, there were two
of if not the two greatest hitters of our era.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
You know, you look at Alex Rodriguez, I mean, and
then the story we heard at the top of the
hour Jose Alvarado for for the Phillies being suspended eight
eighty games and out.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
For the playoffs.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Now if he, if he bounces back, has a great career,
Tatis Junior, you know, bounces back, has a great career.
We gotta throw that steroid allegation out the window, that
that doesn't that no longer harms their Hall of Fame chances.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
And I think over the years, because when the when
the steroid story first broke and all those players were listed,
whether it was Mark McGuire, Barry Bonds, Jason Giambi, whoever,
Roger Clemens, whoever was that you focused on at that time,
it feels like the public overall, not entirely, but overall
has kind of lapsed, relaxed.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
A little bit on that on that sort of thing.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
They start to realize, Okay, so many players at that
point were on something that if we separated as its
own era, who was the greatest of that era.
Speaker 2 (02:58):
Now, a lot of people would argue that the great.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Players of that era would even they wouldn't include these guys,
including Sammy Sosa. They would say guys like Ken Griffy Junior,
which is fine, he's definitely in that list. They would
say guys like uh, they would say Randy Johnson, that's okay,
he's definitely in that list. But once you when we
take away bands off these players, at that point we
had to say this, the band has been lifted.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Therefore, we can't hold that against them anymore.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
Correct correct, and so we can have to only judge
them based on what they did. Because Pete Rose was
not only a great player, I think he's the all
time leading hits player.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Well, well not anymore because.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
Once they added in the Negro League stats, I forgot
who his name was. Unfortunately, feel bad. He's now the
all time hits leader in Maajor League baseball history. He's
also a great manager, and he's been banned throughout his life,
and obviously he died recently. And so now they're doing
what Coach Prime talked about, in which we are honoring
them now that they passed.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
So my question is this is that.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Is there enough and I'm not even gonna talk about knowledge.
I'm talking about just like, is there enough enough legacy
on these players, especially the guys who are around one
hundred years ago, to carry over into an a legit
Hall of Fame vote?
Speaker 2 (04:03):
No.
Speaker 3 (04:04):
I once again, I think that windows still just due
to the way that MLB voting is. You know, yes,
I'd look up who she was. Joe Jackson was on.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
The Black Sox. He was their star.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
That's great, But we're talking about the Black Sox. You know,
I know you hen I've seen it. Yeah, yeah, well
then you know the story exactly. I'm saying I know
the story, but I had to be reminded and I
had to go Google was like, oh, who she was?
Speaker 2 (04:26):
Joe Jackson?
Speaker 3 (04:26):
So now if you're not say, you know, we're modern
journalists when we're mindern MLB writers and we got to vote,
and he's up against let's go back to our guys,
Mark Maguire, Barry Bond, Sammy Sosa.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
And you need seventy percent.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
Yeah, you get below a certain amount, you don't get
on the second ballot exactly.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
That's what's happed to. Uh.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
I think it was Paul Merrow or right, I think he,
I think he, I think he went below the threshold.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
So I mean you're really at the will of the
age and the era of these writers. So if the
writers are our age, we grew up on Samy Sosa,
we grew up on Mark McGuire, we grew up on
Barry Bonds. Those guys are and get more votes out
of guys like you and I then shoots Joe Jackson
would so.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
It the baseball purists are gonna consider Joe Jackson as
opposed to.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
The guys who bounce.
Speaker 3 (05:09):
How many baseball peerists versus you know, modern baseball guys
are on this list because.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
There's gonna be guys who don't vote for him, just
to be the guy that didn't vote for him, and
I hate and this is where my.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Bill comes in effect. Yeah, I don't know how you
feel about it. But do you know how like there's
players who are not players.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
There's people who vote their ballot, whether it's MVP, Hall
of Fame, whatever, and they post it online.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
Do I feel like it's a little disrespectful? Yeah, I
feel like that should be private.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Because they're saying I'm only picking these guys in this
word I'm and it's a it's an indirect direct shot
at who they didn't pick.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
Yeah, I feel like, you know, and just to say something,
I felt like I personally felt victim to in this.
Uh not that I've been voted for anything, but you
look at Tyrese Halliburn and knocking off my calves.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
I feel like that most.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
Overrated of that got to him lists coming out prior
to the NBA playoffs and he him finding out you
know this player voted for me on this and that.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
When if that personal I think that changed.
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Yeah, his run for this this post is that I
think that stuff should be private. I mean, we take
it another step. College football, you know, how would you
feel if you're head coach? You know they vote on
all conference players, all Americans, right, how would you feel
if if your coach just posted, hey, yeah this is
who I thought. And also on the other end, you
(06:23):
got players on your own roster and you know you
look at and you probably put put well, you know,
I think I started every game.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
My coach thinks this guy is better than me.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
Still, how much you know and and transferport Era, how
do you build confidence around that?
Speaker 1 (06:37):
If I had for the All Conference then coaches are
going to vote for their guys, but they're also going
to have that reasonable vote where they're like to vote
for their guys like that, Well are they not?
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Even for the most part they're not. Okay, Well, I.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Mean, like the reality is like a bad Bama like
Ryan Williams for all sec like Kaylin d wore was
going to vote for Ryan Williams, Like I'm assuming whether
he had the option to or not. I don't know
the exactly and I'm not a voter, Okay, I don't
know the rules of it. But there are some guys
who was like, it's obvious this guy was the best one,
so that's that's okay.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
They vote for their wrong guy. Like to your point,
that makes the most sense.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
When it comes to baseball, there really needs to be
in it's it's unfair and it's unjust because in baseball
current all Hall of Famers don't get a vote.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
Owners don't get a vote. It is baseball writers only.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
The Baseball Writers Association of America is the one who
controls Cooperstown. They're the ones who control the vote going
in and going out, and they're the ones who basically
have said these guy like the guys who did who
don't get a second ballot or whatever it is, they're
never getting in Goose Gottage ever. You know, Goose Gotsage
is I've heard the name, but no, he's the guy
who pitched for the Yankees for a long time. He
pitched for like the in the eighties or the seventies,
in the part of the eighties. He got in I
(07:39):
think like ten years ago, like thirty years after he retired,
And so that means that he had enough eligibility to
basically stay on the ballot up to that point. Yeah,
And so that's a huge criticism of the Hall of
Fame itself. But now when you get to guys like
Pete Rose and Joe Jackson, guys who arguably are Hall
of Famers in their own rights, do they have enough
(08:00):
legacy for what they did on the field purely to
get into the next ballot?
Speaker 3 (08:05):
Yeah, I mean that depends on the writers. And that's
that's part of the issue. The same guys have been
writing on the legacy of these guys for so long,
knowing that they could not vote for them. They could
have built some disdain toward these guys over these years
because of Hey, you know, like you said, they're a
baseball peurists. They're trying to with uphold the standard of
the game.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
One yes. Two.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
The way I see it is it feels very nineteen
eighties boys club or like you know, private golf club
as Yeah, very elitists. Ask where it's like, hey, selective, exclusive,
exclusive group. That's we're not going to venture from these guys,
and we are the We're these group of guys that
think in one mind, one brain, one sound, and we
hang out all the time and you know, this is
(08:48):
just our view and we get to control the.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
Legacy of baseball this way. Yeah. Right. I think that
should be diversified. I think if you if.
Speaker 3 (08:57):
You're voted into the Hall of Fame, you should now
be getting votes and there should be maybe a waiting
scale verse off the baseball writers, you know, those guys
that have been the baseball peers as you call them,
versus the guys who have made the game so great
and been voted in.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
I think there needs to.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
Be a modern update and bounce to that because when
you talk to these more modern players, they give respect
to Barry Bonds. Yes, they're like steroids are not hitting
that many home runs. It's difficult to do. Barry Bonds
was their Kobe, their MJ. That that's the guy that
grew up watch. Yeah, that's all they know.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
That's all they know. And they're like, steroids are not
that's hard to do.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Yes, So but you talk to baseball peerists, that's absolutely no, no, no,
And I'm not here to sway you one way or another.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
And Barry Bonds' radio, Yeah, it's kind of your job. Yeah,
it's kind of much at least to talk about it
and then.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
You can have your own decision. But I think baseball
has grown past that. The baseball has more diversity, and
the way that they're determining guy's legacy and their long
term attachment to the league is very much rooted into
the inception of baseball. How it was how they left
a lot of guys out and that needs to be reconsidered.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
Yeah, it's like with colleges, you don't you know, you're
not based on who you accept, You're based on who
you reject. But coming up next final segment of the show,
we're going to get back into the NBA playoff talk.
We're going to talk about how now that now that
after today the thunder and the Nuggets take on In
Game seven, they will take on the t Wolves, who
could be the favorites moving forward. All that's next on
(10:27):
ticket seven sixty. We are the Fanatics.
And so we're gonna talk about baseball today now, unless
you were living under a rock. One of the biggest
news stories that broke this week was that Pete Rose, Shoeless,
Joe Jackson, and a number of other players I think
of seventeen total were lifted off Major League Baseball's all
time band lists. And the reason was was that because
after they have since passed, they are no longer banned
(00:24):
because it's a quote unquote lifetime ban, and therefore they
become eligible for reinstatement, which is kind of disrespectful in
the fact that many of these guys on this list
have died years ago and they're just now doing this.
But I think it is a good and in some
ways a bad thing for Major League Baseball to have
these guys lifted off the band list. So obviously guys
(00:44):
like Pete Rose and Shoelis, Joe Jackson, they highlight this list.
Now they become Hall of Fame eligible. And how you
and I both know this the baseball riders of America.
They are the ones who decide who gets into the Baseball
Hall family. That's why a lot of people criticize the
Best Hall of Fame because it's based on guys who
did the reporting, and there's enough guys who actually made
(01:05):
it into the Hall of Fame they're actually a vote on this.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Yeah, I think that's tough.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
I mean the voting system for MLB Hall of Fame
is interesting in itself as far as you know, letting
the writers decide that, and you know, as the writers
just start to pass on, so does some of those guys,
like you think about cheeless Joe Jackson, So does their
legacy Because now we're getting to that. You know, we
talked about that with NBA debase not to change sports,
but everyone has a different go based on their air
(01:30):
and where they were, who they grew up with. Right, sure,
So as these writers, you know, get older and go on,
there's there are less people to be able to tell
that legacy of those players. So if they don't get
voted in within a certain window, it's truly missed.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:45):
But the big thing with this, it's a slippery slope
with this. Now it's great that they're off the list,
but say you let pe Rose in, say you let
chewless Joe Jackson in. Right, Yeah, Now the conversation becomes
what we're doing. Mark McGuire what we were doing with Barry.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Bonds, put him in in our era, there were two
of if not the two greatest hitters of our era.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
You know, you look at Alex Rodriguez, I mean, and
then the story we heard at the top of the
hour Jose Alvarado for for the Phillies being suspended eight
eighty games and out.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
For the playoffs.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Now if he, if he bounces back, has a great career,
Tatis Junior, you know, bounces back, has a great career.
We gotta throw that steroid allegation out the window, that
that doesn't that no longer harms their Hall of Fame chances.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
And I think over the years, because when the when
the steroid story first broke and all those players were listed,
whether it was Mark McGuire, Barry Bonds, Jason Giambi, whoever,
Roger Clemens, whoever was that you focused on at that time,
it feels like the public overall, not entirely, but overall
has kind of lapsed, relaxed.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
A little bit on that on that sort of thing.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
They start to realize, Okay, so many players at that
point were on something that if we separated as its
own era, who was the greatest of that era.
Speaker 2 (02:58):
Now, a lot of people would argue that the great.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Players of that era would even they wouldn't include these guys,
including Sammy Sosa. They would say guys like Ken Griffy Junior,
which is fine, he's definitely in that list. They would
say guys like uh, they would say Randy Johnson, that's okay,
he's definitely in that list. But once you when we
take away bands off these players, at that point we
had to say this, the band has been lifted.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Therefore, we can't hold that against them anymore.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
Correct correct, and so we can have to only judge
them based on what they did. Because Pete Rose was
not only a great player, I think he's the all
time leading hits player.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Well, well not anymore because.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
Once they added in the Negro League stats, I forgot
who his name was. Unfortunately, feel bad. He's now the
all time hits leader in Maajor League baseball history. He's
also a great manager, and he's been banned throughout his life,
and obviously he died recently. And so now they're doing
what Coach Prime talked about, in which we are honoring
them now that they passed.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
So my question is this is that.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Is there enough and I'm not even gonna talk about knowledge.
I'm talking about just like, is there enough enough legacy
on these players, especially the guys who are around one
hundred years ago, to carry over into an a legit
Hall of Fame vote?
Speaker 2 (04:03):
No.
Speaker 3 (04:04):
I once again, I think that windows still just due
to the way that MLB voting is. You know, yes,
I'd look up who she was. Joe Jackson was on.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
The Black Sox. He was their star.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
That's great, But we're talking about the Black Sox. You know,
I know you hen I've seen it. Yeah, yeah, well
then you know the story exactly. I'm saying I know
the story, but I had to be reminded and I
had to go Google was like, oh, who she was?
Speaker 2 (04:26):
Joe Jackson?
Speaker 3 (04:26):
So now if you're not say, you know, we're modern
journalists when we're mindern MLB writers and we got to vote,
and he's up against let's go back to our guys,
Mark Maguire, Barry Bond, Sammy Sosa.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
And you need seventy percent.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
Yeah, you get below a certain amount, you don't get
on the second ballot exactly.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
That's what's happed to. Uh.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
I think it was Paul Merrow or right, I think he,
I think he, I think he went below the threshold.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
So I mean you're really at the will of the
age and the era of these writers. So if the
writers are our age, we grew up on Samy Sosa,
we grew up on Mark McGuire, we grew up on
Barry Bonds. Those guys are and get more votes out
of guys like you and I then shoots Joe Jackson
would so.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
It the baseball purists are gonna consider Joe Jackson as
opposed to.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
The guys who bounce.
Speaker 3 (05:09):
How many baseball peerists versus you know, modern baseball guys
are on this list because.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
There's gonna be guys who don't vote for him, just
to be the guy that didn't vote for him, and
I hate and this is where my.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Bill comes in effect. Yeah, I don't know how you
feel about it. But do you know how like there's
players who are not players.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
There's people who vote their ballot, whether it's MVP, Hall
of Fame, whatever, and they post it online.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
Do I feel like it's a little disrespectful? Yeah, I
feel like that should be private.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Because they're saying I'm only picking these guys in this
word I'm and it's a it's an indirect direct shot
at who they didn't pick.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
Yeah, I feel like, you know, and just to say something,
I felt like I personally felt victim to in this.
Uh not that I've been voted for anything, but you
look at Tyrese Halliburn and knocking off my calves.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
I feel like that most.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
Overrated of that got to him lists coming out prior
to the NBA playoffs and he him finding out you
know this player voted for me on this and that.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
When if that personal I think that changed.
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Yeah, his run for this this post is that I
think that stuff should be private. I mean, we take
it another step. College football, you know, how would you
feel if you're head coach? You know they vote on
all conference players, all Americans, right, how would you feel
if if your coach just posted, hey, yeah this is
who I thought. And also on the other end, you
(06:23):
got players on your own roster and you know you
look at and you probably put put well, you know,
I think I started every game.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
My coach thinks this guy is better than me.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
Still, how much you know and and transferport Era, how
do you build confidence around that?
Speaker 1 (06:37):
If I had for the All Conference then coaches are
going to vote for their guys, but they're also going
to have that reasonable vote where they're like to vote
for their guys like that, Well are they not?
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Even for the most part they're not. Okay, Well, I.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Mean, like the reality is like a bad Bama like
Ryan Williams for all sec like Kaylin d wore was
going to vote for Ryan Williams, Like I'm assuming whether
he had the option to or not. I don't know
the exactly and I'm not a voter, Okay, I don't
know the rules of it. But there are some guys
who was like, it's obvious this guy was the best one,
so that's that's okay.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
They vote for their wrong guy. Like to your point,
that makes the most sense.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
When it comes to baseball, there really needs to be
in it's it's unfair and it's unjust because in baseball
current all Hall of Famers don't get a vote.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
Owners don't get a vote. It is baseball writers only.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
The Baseball Writers Association of America is the one who
controls Cooperstown. They're the ones who control the vote going
in and going out, and they're the ones who basically
have said these guy like the guys who did who
don't get a second ballot or whatever it is, they're
never getting in Goose Gottage ever. You know, Goose Gotsage
is I've heard the name, but no, he's the guy
who pitched for the Yankees for a long time. He
pitched for like the in the eighties or the seventies,
in the part of the eighties. He got in I
(07:39):
think like ten years ago, like thirty years after he retired,
And so that means that he had enough eligibility to
basically stay on the ballot up to that point. Yeah,
And so that's a huge criticism of the Hall of
Fame itself. But now when you get to guys like
Pete Rose and Joe Jackson, guys who arguably are Hall
of Famers in their own rights, do they have enough
(08:00):
legacy for what they did on the field purely to
get into the next ballot?
Speaker 3 (08:05):
Yeah, I mean that depends on the writers. And that's
that's part of the issue. The same guys have been
writing on the legacy of these guys for so long,
knowing that they could not vote for them. They could
have built some disdain toward these guys over these years
because of Hey, you know, like you said, they're a
baseball peurists. They're trying to with uphold the standard of
the game.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
One yes. Two.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
The way I see it is it feels very nineteen
eighties boys club or like you know, private golf club
as Yeah, very elitists. Ask where it's like, hey, selective, exclusive,
exclusive group. That's we're not going to venture from these guys,
and we are the We're these group of guys that
think in one mind, one brain, one sound, and we
hang out all the time and you know, this is
(08:48):
just our view and we get to control the.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
Legacy of baseball this way. Yeah. Right. I think that
should be diversified. I think if you if.
Speaker 3 (08:57):
You're voted into the Hall of Fame, you should now
be getting votes and there should be maybe a waiting
scale verse off the baseball writers, you know, those guys
that have been the baseball peers as you call them,
versus the guys who have made the game so great
and been voted in.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
I think there needs to.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
Be a modern update and bounce to that because when
you talk to these more modern players, they give respect
to Barry Bonds. Yes, they're like steroids are not hitting
that many home runs. It's difficult to do. Barry Bonds
was their Kobe, their MJ. That that's the guy that
grew up watch. Yeah, that's all they know.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
That's all they know. And they're like, steroids are not
that's hard to do.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Yes, So but you talk to baseball peerists, that's absolutely no, no, no,
And I'm not here to sway you one way or another.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
And Barry Bonds' radio, Yeah, it's kind of your job. Yeah,
it's kind of much at least to talk about it
and then.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
You can have your own decision. But I think baseball
has grown past that. The baseball has more diversity, and
the way that they're determining guy's legacy and their long
term attachment to the league is very much rooted into
the inception of baseball. How it was how they left
a lot of guys out and that needs to be reconsidered.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
Yeah, it's like with colleges, you don't you know, you're
not based on who you accept, You're based on who
you reject. But coming up next final segment of the show,
we're going to get back into the NBA playoff talk.
We're going to talk about how now that now that
after today the thunder and the Nuggets take on In
Game seven, they will take on the t Wolves, who
could be the favorites moving forward. All that's next on
(10:27):
ticket seven sixty. We are the Fanatics.
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