Flying High In Low Moments

Fear is a natural part of life, but how we face it can define our journey. In this episode of First Comes Love, we dive deep into the topic of fear—what it teaches us, how it shapes us, and how God uses it to prepare us for greater things. John shares one of the scariest moments of his Air Force career, reflecting on how it challenged him, stretched his faith, and ultimately strengthened his trust in God’s plan. We also discuss how stepping into the unknown requires preparation—because when God takes you to new heights, you need to be ready to rise to the occasion. Whether you’re facing personal fears, career challenges, or spiritual battles, this episode is a reminder that fear doesn’t have to paralyze you—it can position you for purpose.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
All right, so we're back for another episode, the first
comes Love podcast.

Speaker 2 (00:04):
So excited, you know.

Speaker 1 (00:05):
I actually I want to start off by saying hello
to anybody who's new to this podcast.

Speaker 2 (00:11):
This is our what fourth episode?

Speaker 3 (00:13):
Yeah for you? Yeah? Yeah, okay, cool.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
My name is Nisha, I'm John, just John.

Speaker 3 (00:20):
That's it. No Jonathan, no Johnny, just John, just John.

Speaker 1 (00:27):
So first of all, let me just get a round
of a flaws test to me, no, to both of us,
because we've been consistent, consistent. Yeah, I mean four episodes in, Like,
this is exciting, Like this makes me feel like we
have a podcast. No maybe okay, maybe not four, but okay,
how many episodes in will it feel like? No, we
have a legit, like we have a straight up onecast.

(00:47):
Twenty episodes, twenty piece, oh, twenty p lemon pepper, okay,
oh flats, twenty piece.

Speaker 2 (00:54):
You don't even like flats, that's what you say. I know,
I know you like drum sticks.

Speaker 3 (00:59):
I go against the.

Speaker 1 (01:01):
So, yeah, this is exciting this episode. I'm really excited
because we're gonna, you know, be really fluid with the
conversation so to speak.

Speaker 2 (01:11):
He says, we're gonna be fluid.

Speaker 1 (01:12):
I'm sure he does pause, but no, Yeah, So First
Comes Love podcast. If you're new here, we really kind
of the precedent that we try to set here is
that that is the actual title, right, first comes Love.
When we think about what is most important, what should
be the priority in your life, it should be ultimately

(01:33):
to love. And God commands us to love, and that
is like the cornerstone I think of the Christian faith
is us having the ability and the fortitude and the
willingness to be able to love in the midst of
whatever it is that we're going through and whatever circumstance
we find ourselves in, in whatever trial we might be engulfed.

Speaker 2 (01:58):
Or overcome by.

Speaker 1 (01:59):
At the end of the day, the thing that we
always should remember is that first comes love.

Speaker 3 (02:04):
First comes love. And it just made me think about, like.

Speaker 4 (02:09):
The real one aspect of love is just like to
be connected, right, And so when I'm connected to somebody
a a stranger, a foe, enemy, family, for and whatever, uh,
you have a different like affinity and affection for someone
and that allows you to you know, see things from

(02:29):
their point of view, jumping their shoes, and that appreciation
of that connection of like we're all connected.

Speaker 3 (02:36):
We all have similar uh trials and tribulations.

Speaker 4 (02:39):
I think it makes it easy to a little bit
easier to to love folks.

Speaker 3 (02:43):
I think so too.

Speaker 2 (02:44):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (02:45):
I was doing a uh and this is not to
sound like, oh my God, I've just like so spiritual
and uh holier than that. But when I was doing
my devotion on my Bible study this morning, that was
actually one of the things that they were talking about.
And it was talking about God's uh to be able
to extend like unconditional forgiveness and grace and mercy, unconditional

(03:06):
you know, and so unlimited forgiveness, let me say it
that way. And and it made me think, because there's
a portion in the you know, in the study where
you get to journal and you get to you know,
it has different prompts and stuff, and one of the
things that it does ask you is, you know, are
you good at forgiveness? And I will say, like if
I when I was doing the journaling and I went
back into time to think about like from like a
very early age, and this is not a common thing

(03:29):
for a lot of people understandably, but I've just somehow
always been really good at forgiving. It's just been kind
of like an innate thing. I've been offended, I've been betrayed,
I've been disrespected.

Speaker 2 (03:44):
A all of the above.

Speaker 1 (03:45):
Right, the human experience everything that everybody probably has experience
at some point in their life. But somehow b I now,
not even somehow I will now I can attribute it
to the grace of God.

Speaker 2 (03:58):
I have just been really good at forget.

Speaker 3 (04:00):
What does it? How does it make you feel when
you forgive someone free?

Speaker 1 (04:04):
And that's one of the things that I actually put
in the journal is that when you.

Speaker 2 (04:10):
Here's the thing.

Speaker 1 (04:10):
It's one thing to forgive people, it's another thing to
forgive people fast. And so for me, I have been
able to forgive people fast, you know, and and that
has served me so well in terms of my freedom
and my What that does for me is like, Okay,
when you were able to forgive somebody fast, it allowed

(04:33):
me to create space and energy within my own life,
within my own mental, physical, spiritual capacity to leave room
for God to be able to still move.

Speaker 2 (04:45):
And so when you have these.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
This blockage of like grudges, you know, with this energy,
let's just call it, it's an energy that is filled
with like grudges, bitterness, all of the things that forgiveness
is not basically you know.

Speaker 2 (05:00):
And so when you have.

Speaker 1 (05:01):
This blockage and then it it it disables you from
being able to operate at a.

Speaker 2 (05:09):
At your full self that God has intended for you.

Speaker 3 (05:11):
Mm.

Speaker 1 (05:12):
And so for me, and I'm not trying to sit
here to say like, oh, I've never done anything. Everybody
like woe is me? Like, uh, you know everybody has
done this.

Speaker 2 (05:21):
You know. I have been on the r the other side.

Speaker 1 (05:23):
Of forgiveness where I'm seeking forgiveness m for things that
I did knowingly, unknowingly and all of the above. But
I think for me, you know, when it comes to
me thinking about how I've been able to really, I
guess excel in life. And I'm not even talking about
career aspirations. I'm talking about literal, spiritual personal aspirations on

(05:47):
who I've been able to become as a person like
as niche and as the woman that I you know,
that God has called me to be. And I think
a lot of that comes from my ability to be
able to forgive fast and so so yeah, so I
don't know who he kind of went down that wormhole.
But but anyways, the show is geared towards us talking

(06:08):
about how you know, first comes love and and and
and really when we think about love, we think about life.

Speaker 2 (06:14):
We think about all that life has to offer.

Speaker 1 (06:16):
And so this is also an extension of a conversation
that we're gonna have about what life has to offer,
because life be life in Yeah, So anyways, let's let's
let's digres as I digress a little bit.

Speaker 2 (06:33):
So excited to have you here.

Speaker 1 (06:34):
If you're a first time viewer of the podcast, thank
you for coming.

Speaker 2 (06:38):
I'm giving us. So let's let's talk about the hair. Okay,
let's get into the hair.

Speaker 1 (06:42):
You can't if you're listening, you can't see it, but
just imagine, just imagine Michael Jackson and Janet Jackson.

Speaker 3 (06:49):
An eighties scream video in the eighties.

Speaker 2 (06:52):
But I'm Michael Jackson.

Speaker 1 (06:56):
So so anyways, I'm I have my natural hair out,
which John loves. By the way, Okay, why do you
like when I have on? Like, uh, when I wear
my natural hair?

Speaker 4 (07:04):
First of all, it's the most it is the most transparent.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
It's transparenting, so w what do you Okay, so unpacked
that a little bit.

Speaker 4 (07:18):
It's the most transparent, so it it gets directly to
the core I see who you truly are without the
extra effort of the.

Speaker 3 (07:24):
Layers of cause. So you know, I share it with
you often.

Speaker 4 (07:29):
But every decision that you make, and like every memory
is like intertwined with so many.

Speaker 3 (07:35):
Layers, so many emotional layers.

Speaker 4 (07:37):
Okay, and so let's say you go get your buzz
down part Oh, so you so you gotta schedule it,
You got to drive, you gotta sit, exchange stories right
from the from the whoever's doing your hair, whatever is
going on with your with their life, and the vice
versas you tell them what's going So all of these
are like there's like interconnected like moments in time, and

(08:00):
so you associate all of that with the hairstar. But
when you do natural, you usually do it at home,
and so you it's like more pure energy, it's like
more refined again, straight to the core. I get to
see who you truly are like when you display it
and when I wear.

Speaker 1 (08:18):
My natural hair, this is like you feel like this
is the most authentic person.

Speaker 3 (08:23):
Yeah, you you did it.

Speaker 4 (08:24):
It came from your own you know, volition, you did
it and the confines of privacy of your own home,
which is the most comfortable in.

Speaker 3 (08:34):
That loone. That's free. I'm fiscally conservative.

Speaker 4 (08:37):
It's great socially liberal, physically conservative, so that's why I
can go in the middle of politics and independent. But yeah,
all of those attributes I I get to. It's like
a a brighter light is shown. It's like your candle
is brighter because all of those other things. Look, I mean,
I'm getting practical here, you know. I I like to

(08:59):
get very deep.

Speaker 2 (09:01):
Yes you do.

Speaker 4 (09:05):
But like I said, like when I think about you
getting your hair done, you gotta schedule, you gotta communicate,
you gotta pay for it, you gotta go sit all
the things and like all those contribute to and it
like masks the I don't know the beautification of it
as opposed to none of those things are done. You
do it solely by yourself within the confines of your home,

(09:28):
you know. And yeah, you know, within the bathroom whatever,
And that just more further accentuates that, Like that's just
the real youth.

Speaker 2 (09:37):
Yeah, this is the real meat.

Speaker 3 (09:39):
Your arms get tired, you like boxer breeze.

Speaker 1 (09:42):
Okay, all right, okay, you're going too far now, too
many details, But I will say, you know, one of
the really really cool insights that we got to John's
point about this this version of me, because you know,
women are so complex and amazing and beautiful and intricate
that we get to be versatile and how we show

(10:03):
up to the world through hair just let alone, like
the black woman showing up to the world through just
her hair is crazy. And so I think one of
the really coolest things that we were able to receive
as from one of our mentors in this spiritual walkthrough
marriage is from Willie Robinson. He gave you some incredible
advice about his wife because he's like, oh, she keeps squishing.

(10:25):
There's a certain perspective that you can have when you're
when a woman, a black woman specifically continues to switch
up her hairstyles and for you, like we were just saying,
this is your favorite hairstyle of me, But do you
remember the advice that he gave you as far as
like a man's perception a husband. Let me let me
rephrase that, a husband's perspective more so of when his

(10:48):
wife decides to just continue to switch.

Speaker 3 (10:55):
Born and raised. There's no place they don't watch podcast
We've got We're going.

Speaker 2 (11:00):
To get them. We're going to get this episode to him.
But anyways, what was his advice.

Speaker 4 (11:04):
Imagine you having sex with a different woman with each hairstyle.
This is a tried and true full of the Holy Spirit,
been in church probably his whole life as far as
I know, and i've known, I've met him with fifteen
over fifteen years ago.

Speaker 3 (11:21):
Now yeah, yeah we're old. Now not old.

Speaker 2 (11:24):
I'm not old.

Speaker 3 (11:25):
Yeah, that's that's true.

Speaker 4 (11:26):
But uh, anyhow, and so he had that perspective fifteen
years ago, well established, mature Christian, married with probably twenty
thirty plus years. Yeah, and so if that fresh take
from a man, I'm looking at him in his eyes,
and he didn't need to say almost anything else.

Speaker 3 (11:45):
And he was a man of free words, yeah.

Speaker 4 (11:47):
Relatively, And so when he said that, those words left
his lips into my ear and like down in my heart,
it's just like exploded.

Speaker 3 (11:57):
It's like, yeah, you know, fireworks going off.

Speaker 4 (12:00):
Like this is how one aspect, one little hack, one
little secret of how I can continually look at you as.

Speaker 3 (12:06):
The apple maye.

Speaker 4 (12:08):
And it takes like my effort of like how I
view you. Uh, and you you know you you help
with that by changing looks so frequent, so frequent, like
two times a day or something, and so yeah, that
that helped. Of course, it carried me throughout the years,
but that has been a pillar. Yeah, there's been a

(12:29):
strong foundation and know how.

Speaker 2 (12:31):
To keep the marriage zesty.

Speaker 3 (12:33):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (12:34):
So yes, women if you.

Speaker 5 (12:35):
Cause you've you've had you faded the side pixie cut
currently uh natural twist out.

Speaker 2 (12:47):
Highlights, Okay, we okay, I haven't.

Speaker 3 (12:55):
No whigs, Yeah, yeah, no whigs.

Speaker 2 (12:56):
I'm gonna do the wigs though soon it's coming.

Speaker 3 (12:59):
But they look thick.

Speaker 2 (13:00):
No, it's I will be fiscally responsible to start with.

Speaker 1 (13:02):
No, no, no, it's it's we're getting into the details, but
you know, I'm still trying to learn the difference between
lace front all the things.

Speaker 2 (13:10):
It gets complicated. It's it's like a whole thing.

Speaker 3 (13:12):
Yeah, it goes down to like here.

Speaker 2 (13:13):
No it doesn't need to though it doesn't have to.
It's not, it's not gonna happen.

Speaker 1 (13:17):
But anyways, with you saying that, you know, it's just
really exciting to see the different journeys and the different
things that we've been through in terms.

Speaker 2 (13:26):
Of like our marriage.

Speaker 1 (13:27):
And that's one piece of advice I want to give
anybody who's watching this who finds themselves in like a
committed relationship is that's one of the key things to
keeping your marriage fresh, right. We have a lot of
people that we come across like that we know and
then just even seeing it on the outside, you know,
looking into other things in life, other relationships, other celebrities,

(13:48):
other friends and family who are going through different things,
as far as, like you know, being able to continue
to keep boundaries and respect within the confines of a relationship.
And I think, like to your credit in what you're saying,
there's a lot of temptation out there in the world,
there's a lot of opportunity out there in the world
to color outside the lines.

Speaker 2 (14:11):
I'll say it that way.

Speaker 1 (14:13):
Within your marriage, in fidelity, you know, creeping, whatever you
call it. But I think this adds a really really
refreshing take on being able to allow your spouse, in
this case, your husband to experience you as the wife,
as the woman in the relationship to fulfill his desires

(14:34):
and his fantasies of experiencing you the woman that he
loves and the woman that he is the apple of
his eye in a new and different way. So, ladies,
with that being said, I wish I had a hair
sponsor right now, Like I could just plug him right here.

Speaker 2 (14:48):
This will be it's kind But anyways, ladies switch up,
you know.

Speaker 1 (14:54):
Moral of the story is, ladies switch up your hairstyles
like at least once a month, just to keep you know,
just to keep things a little zesty, a little fresh, uh,
in the intimacy aspect of of of your relationship. Alright,
moving along, Okay, so a this is.

Speaker 2 (15:12):
A total switch of gears.

Speaker 1 (15:13):
But I I definitely wanna talk about this because this
event no knowing that, like, obviously when this is posted,
this will obvious obviously be a story that's in the past,
but I definitely wanna bring it to the forefront right
now because it's extremely important and I wanna get your I.

Speaker 2 (15:30):
Insight on it.

Speaker 1 (15:31):
So the kind of foundation that we wanna lay for
today's episode is that there's no real topic for today
other than us wanting to tell you stories that have
been instrumental in our lives individually and collectively that have
kind of shaped who.

Speaker 3 (15:46):
We are today.

Speaker 1 (15:48):
Okay, So, so I wanna start off with some current
current events, and by the time you guys watch this
or listen to this, it might not necessarily be current,
but it is just as much relevant as any day.
So whether you're s hearing this today, tomorrow, a month
from now, a year from now, this particular question I

(16:09):
think is gonna resonate with people and hopefully you get
something out of it. But so in the news right
now everywhere, if you turn on the TV, you can
see that there has been a catastrophe of an event,
of a circumstance that has occurred where an actual airplane
has collided with the helicopter.

Speaker 2 (16:28):
MM okay, okay.

Speaker 1 (16:29):
And so this story really resonated with me because John,
if you guys don't already know he was in the military,
you can tell.

Speaker 2 (16:37):
I don't have to I don't have to talk for you.
Ar not at a restaurant.

Speaker 1 (16:40):
So just give like a quick, like two sentence your
background with aircrafts and those things, because I wanna segue
into something else, But go ahead and tell them a
little bit about your air aircraft background.

Speaker 4 (16:52):
Uh let's see going on seventeen years, Uh airplane mechanic crew.

Speaker 3 (16:57):
Chief, what's the jack of our tades? Jack of our trades,
master of none.

Speaker 4 (17:02):
So my signature was the final signature that would certify
the plane is safe to fly. Uh, so I would
be the middleman to gather, organize and you know, collaborate,
collaborate with the actual specialties from which they only specialize
in a certain you know, uh, fixing on the air
pl fixing on uh the engines, hydraulics, the elect electric electricians,

(17:26):
et cetera. So I would be the nucleus in the
glue that again, my signature would be the the last
one to certify it's uh safe to fly. And so
any airplane crash, it's always a little triggering, but it
always as thought of I've been in the shoes as
a mechanic MM who the pilots are trusting with their lives.

Speaker 2 (17:46):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (17:46):
We would do a little uh uh a quick uh.

Speaker 4 (17:49):
We call it walk around uh A very practical word,
but we would literally walk around with the pilot and
they would check all the most sensitive, most critical areas
systems of the airplane exteriorly exteriorly on the exterior and
if they got a quick question about something, Hey, you know,
why is this screw missing?

Speaker 3 (18:08):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (18:08):
Well that you know, that's not really impactful. There's you know,
it's nineteen or twenty, that panel is still secure.

Speaker 6 (18:14):
X y Z.

Speaker 4 (18:15):
Walk around some more, A couple more steps, uh, you
know what's this uh red fluid here?

Speaker 3 (18:19):
Oh, this is uh, you know, this is part of
the hydraulic.

Speaker 4 (18:22):
System that actual systems from the engineering uh from the engineers. Uh,
it's it's allowed to leak. Let's say two drops, and
that's what's on the floor. So you're safe, You're good.
You know, let's continue to press on any more questions
than you know. So they'll walk around like that, justifiably
so because again their lives are in my hand and
so complete circle around the airplane.

Speaker 3 (18:43):
You know.

Speaker 4 (18:43):
Then they're they'll walk up and you know, they do
their pilot thing from that point on. So, yeah, every
every almost every crash in the news, almost every time
any person within my sphere of influence gets some an airplane,
I'm always thinking from the perspective of the of the mechanic,
you know, Yeah, they do their due diligence, Do they
care enough as if their own family member was flying

(19:04):
on it?

Speaker 3 (19:05):
And so many more sentences.

Speaker 1 (19:10):
That's okay, Yeah, No, I kind of want to just
lay the foundation for the importance of like something that
people just don't understand. They haven't been able to really
be able to.

Speaker 2 (19:24):
Grasp.

Speaker 1 (19:25):
I guess the ramifications of how you know, everybody, you know,
not everybody, but a lot of people, like they just
fly so casually.

Speaker 2 (19:32):
It's just this.

Speaker 1 (19:32):
Really casual experience for a lot of people who travel
often or who don't travel often, they don't think of
it as this like extreme situation, like the idea that
literally you have metal that's just bent and it's just floating.
Like all right, that's a whole another topic. But the
fact that that's like a thing, it's still crazy. It's
still mind boggled, mind boggling and crazy. And it's literally

(19:55):
a form of transportation for millions of people, like you're
around e every day, and so it's just it's just.

Speaker 2 (20:03):
Crazy to me. So when this story, you know, broke
and I started.

Speaker 1 (20:07):
Learning about it and the impact about it, and the
first and foremost you know, prayers up to everybody who
was involved in this particular situation is extremely catastrophic. Nobody
wants to envision this, nobody wants to think that like
this could ever happen to me. But nonetheless, this is
a situation that is very real and it happened, and
we're gonna continue to pray for the people who were

(20:27):
involved in it.

Speaker 2 (20:29):
But it just.

Speaker 1 (20:29):
Reminded me of you, Like every time that you would
fly as a military wife, I'm like nervous and scared,
and then you just get into these situations and these
predicaments in air right of these I I guess seemingly
traumatic experiences. And so I kind of want to backtrack
a little bit because I think it's important for you

(20:51):
maybe to revisit, you know, your career, you know, flying
crew chief, Like you just kind of you know, explained
what it was like maybe most maybe the most memorable
story that you have in terms of like flight. And
I guess any cautions that you would give people moving

(21:12):
forward if if somebody's listening to this podcast and they
have like a fear of flying or something that they
need to overcome, Like for me, example, like I used
to love flying. I would get sent to fly to
California by myself. M as a eight year old, Yeah,
as a like eight year old, nine year old, ten
year old. But that's like another podcast, So yes, like

(21:35):
why am I flying by myself? To be continued, but anyways,
we'll put a we'll put a a a a mark
in the a.

Speaker 2 (21:42):
Pin in that for right now.

Speaker 1 (21:43):
But yeah, so just people who deal with flying, like
any stories that you have to be able to share
that you know you can kind of run through I
guess not quickly but swiftly, Yeah, about your experience with
flying and just like being in that moment because I
think it really stood out to me.

Speaker 2 (22:01):
And then this is this could.

Speaker 1 (22:02):
Be very bad and this is bad. Now it's not
could be, it's very bad. So I internalize things. So
when I watch the news, yeah, it's bad and like
in the sense of what I'm about to say, Okay,
so when I see a news, When I see a
story on the news, it's like devastating in like sad,
and there are casualties. I start to like literally internalize them,

(22:25):
which I don't have to do.

Speaker 2 (22:26):
It's not safe.

Speaker 1 (22:26):
I don't recommend it to anybody, but I start to
internalize them. So I started to envision the people that
are on this plane the minute before, like it's literally
about to crash. Like I start thinking about putting myself
in their shoes, Like what does it feel like?

Speaker 2 (22:42):
And like you know, like not even a minute. It's
just so fast.

Speaker 1 (22:46):
It's just like do I realize what's happening? You know,
the first sounds, the first like the first jarring movement
that happens in the plane where you can clearly tell
this is not this is not good may day. May day,
I don't know the actual definition of may day, but emergency.

Speaker 2 (23:07):
This is an emergency situation.

Speaker 1 (23:09):
And so I start to feel with you know, I
start to embody what that feels like, which is dangerous
because sometimes I'm not in that same I'm literally just
living life like I'm in the kitchen or I'm on
the computer, and I'm starting.

Speaker 2 (23:19):
To think about what that feels like.

Speaker 1 (23:20):
M But for you, you've been in a very like
sit You've been in a real situation where it wasn't
may day, it was an emergency. Uh, with your military experience,
So I kind of want you to unpack that a
little bit briefly, to like let people know how did
how did you navigate through that, and you know what
what came of that, and and how did you overcome

(23:41):
that particular situation in flight mid flight?

Speaker 4 (23:44):
Yeah, so I'll start with the lather would you share
almost like encouraging people like when they when they do fly,
I will say emphatically say this to the to the rooftop,
of course, cause it's statistically proven.

Speaker 3 (23:58):
It is very safe fly.

Speaker 4 (24:04):
Statistically, how many you know, mishaps there are? Uh, the
Air Force calls got different level levels of mishaps to
ABCD and you know anyhow there's there's different levels to it. Uh,
but it is a very safe to fly statistically. How
many flights per day per city per p uh pl uh,

(24:24):
how many how many flights you can talk, how many
flights per day per city per company. It is a
very high success rate without any mishap.

Speaker 3 (24:37):
The part that sucks about my field is the one
mistake is of course deadly.

Speaker 4 (24:45):
So it gets for lack of a better words, blown
out of proportion because we can be battening a thousand
percent one hundred safe flights, which is actually the case
in America. I believe the last airplane crash of this
magnitude of like a major airline I'll classified as that
cause unfortunately there's smaller air airplanes very like.

Speaker 3 (25:07):
Two seats of five seats, six seaters.

Speaker 4 (25:09):
Uh, those are a little bit more frequent. But major
airline crash within the soil of America, I wanna say
last one is like ten years ago, over ten years ago.
But of course justified so is is blown out every
you know, I.

Speaker 2 (25:26):
Mean, yeah, it's it's it's the it's the it's the
top story.

Speaker 4 (25:29):
Yeah, because it's deadly like, there's no getting around it.
There's no getting around it.

Speaker 3 (25:34):
Uh. So again I'll emphasize.

Speaker 4 (25:36):
It is very safe statistically, uh, based on their numbers.
So if you can't find any assurance in that allows
just binary black and white data to be a friend
in this situation. And so any personal stories, yes, definitely
personal stories. Actually, the very first flight, r the very

(25:57):
first airplane I ever flew on was two Air air
Force boot camp. The very first flight, the very first
time you ever got on, ever got on the airplane
was because of the military. Really, it was going to
boot camp.

Speaker 1 (26:12):
Whoa little John, Just John at a baton rouge, first
time getting on an airplane.

Speaker 3 (26:20):
Five just jumped out the porch.

Speaker 2 (26:21):
Okay, thank you for that, all right, relax, first.

Speaker 3 (26:28):
The first time who first time flying?

Speaker 4 (26:31):
Coincidentally because of the Air Force, and uh, let's say fast.

Speaker 3 (26:35):
Forward and you got through all of that train graduated.

Speaker 4 (26:38):
I would say, my very first the very first deployment,
we were not definitely not married. I think we were
not even a gage. Yeah, we're not even engage yet.
But the very first deployment. So my second flight in
my life, we were flying I think we had to
land in Europe, in England.

Speaker 1 (27:00):
Wait, I'm just gonna interject for a second. It's where
you took all the time in alls.

Speaker 3 (27:03):
No, no, no.

Speaker 2 (27:04):
This is the emergency. No no, no, I needed I needed
to fast forward to that. Yeah, definitely, no, no, not
definitely do it now?

Speaker 3 (27:13):
No, definitely, that's it, But that is it? No, no, no.

Speaker 4 (27:15):
The very first second flight I ever took was the
second most scariest flight. It was in England and they
always have an overcast. Yeah, that's just how God made it.
I don't know why.

Speaker 2 (27:30):
If you think of England, you think of rains.

Speaker 4 (27:32):
Yeah, in clouds. And so we were landed at night.
And my first real flight was my first deployment. I
got up, well, I walked up, and I was in
the cockpit. And so these pilots had no visual which
normally a regular person will want to see what they're doing.
Imagine driving a car and only relying on the GPS.

Speaker 2 (27:53):
Lord Jesus, So all.

Speaker 3 (27:55):
Of these windows two three feet.

Speaker 4 (27:58):
You know, wide windows at disposal, but they're they're not useful.
So these pilots are flying by instrument as they call it.

Speaker 2 (28:06):
That's another level of skill. Yeah, that's what they study for.

Speaker 3 (28:10):
Yes, and that's when they get paid.

Speaker 4 (28:13):
So I looked out the window again, second flight ever
in my life, first deployment, and I didn't see anything.

Speaker 2 (28:20):
Crazy.

Speaker 4 (28:21):
So at that, at that age of my career and
education level, I'm thinking, like, why y'all not looking up?
I looked at all of them and they were looking
down again, trusting all the instruments and so and so. Yeah,
so I seen nothing for a long time. We were
on descent every minute minutes that take, but it felt
like forever. And then uh, before you knew it, we

(28:41):
were like blending, like we've seen the lights on the ground.

Speaker 3 (28:45):
So I'm like, how are y'all able to do it?

Speaker 4 (28:47):
So that was the first one that just blew me away,
like I know what I'm doing, I know what I do.

Speaker 3 (28:51):
I'm good at what I do. But you guys, that's
the next level, y'all next level.

Speaker 2 (28:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (28:55):
And then years later, so my plane was actually was
why it is still so safe? You know, I can
emphatically say that to fly, Uh, my plane was a
middle of refueler if you remember, Yeah, damn, that's the
primary mission, and so we would get up, fly, get
the cruiser altitude thirty forty thousand feet and we would
transfer fuel to any plane in the world that has

(29:15):
that ability, of course, but you know it was other
military branches, it was other foreign governments, and you know,
it was everything helicopters, and so my plane, that's what
his job was. It would fill it up with so much.
It was a flying gas station. And so that's his
primary mission. Secondary mission was a cargo and uh personnel
uh carrier almost never happens.

Speaker 2 (29:38):
Yeah, which one never happened?

Speaker 4 (29:40):
The secondary mission pun intended, right, say, primary versus secondary mission. So, uh,
we would do a routine a routine mission to me.
But the planes of course have to be in tip
top shape, you know, very to the calendar, very to
the date. Uh, you know, routine inspections. And so from
where we were stationed at in Kansas, Uh, we had
planes you know in the Middle East and in the

(30:00):
Middle East, and so the planes in the Middle East
were due for inspection. The plane at home is good
to go, it's nice, water shiny, you know, et cetera.

Speaker 3 (30:09):
So we will swap them.

Speaker 4 (30:11):
So the the coming phrase we will say at work
is like, oh man.

Speaker 3 (30:14):
You're going on a tail swap next week.

Speaker 4 (30:16):
So tail swap will mean we've did all the TLC
tender loving care to the plane at home, k it's
not ready to deploy also, okay. And then the plane
that's already been there for you know, month of six
months or whatever long it.

Speaker 2 (30:30):
Is, that plane needs now.

Speaker 3 (30:33):
Yeah, and so they swapped.

Speaker 4 (30:34):
We call it a tail swap, okay, and so uh
for this one particular mission which uh you j your
jarremy here, but there's one mission. That's what the mission was.
Tail swap in uh common language. And so we get there,
I stay, you know, do the time difference or whatever.
So anyhow, we're we're we're uh pr headed to come
back home, come back home to you mm and only

(30:58):
tarmac and just not quite ready. I'm on headset looking
up up a pilot and I see that they are
like frantic, they like like something's going off, and so
I'm waiting for them to, you know, tell me, hay, chief,
you know, I.

Speaker 3 (31:12):
Got this problem.

Speaker 4 (31:13):
Can't come check out this computer system, you know, navigation system,
it was all off, you know, Uh, we got a problem.
Come up here, come upstairs and come check it out.
Well he didn't do that, and so I'm like waiting.
I'm looking at him, not making an eye contact, but
I'm looking at his body languages like this is weird,
this is off. You know something, something's going on. And
so within you know, five ten minutes or something like that. Uh,

(31:34):
he says, uh, hay chief, you know he read radios
in and my headset hay chief, for got the mission change.
You know, we'll tell you everything that we know in
a few minutes. So I'm like, alright, cool, you know,
copy of that. So I'm like, what the heck is this?
So we're already in the Middle East, like the war
zone area, you know, the scary zone. So uh, tips
tip my hat to the other branches, Uh, their combat,

(31:57):
We're not combat.

Speaker 3 (31:58):
I enjoined the Air Force for a reason. Uh. Or
in other words, I school high enough so I could qualify.

Speaker 4 (32:06):
And y'all know we eat our own, so don't take
no shade of that. So yeah, in this moment, you know,
it's one hundred and thirty degrees the some bearing down.
I'm ready to get home, Ready to get home to you.
They's supposed to be a quick mission, like about six
seven days or so, with you know, all the travel
and uh time different change and all that, and then
you know, so he tells me, hey, you know, hay

(32:26):
chief the crew chief. We say, hey, chief, the mission change.
We'll tell you everything we know here in a few minutes.
So again run through my mind, like, what the heck
could happen? This is this the secondary mission finally fin
to happen? Yeah tee if it happened, which hadn't happened
to me in my career yet h B maybe about
five years in at that point. And so a couple
of minutes later he tells me the full details, like
I look, we gotta go from this place still dangerous,

(32:48):
but it's not the.

Speaker 3 (32:49):
Heart of the matter.

Speaker 4 (32:50):
Yeah, of the war then uh under Obama and he says, hey, look,
we gotta go to the thick of it, pick up
some injured guys from another branch, and then you know,
take them to a more suitable and capable hospital so
they can get the care they need.

Speaker 3 (33:03):
Yeah, I'm paraphrasing.

Speaker 1 (33:04):
Here, but when he says that, like, what is what
are you thinking? Like what is actually going through your mind?

Speaker 4 (33:09):
So it's very loud out there, you know, it's I
think we got like fifty or so planes out there,
and I got the big ones, big, big, big, big ones,
so they're very loud. All of that was like tunnel vision,
all of it that, Like, I like got toun of
visions because I'm looking up at him. And then all
of the extra noise of being at a airport. In
other words, like all of that was like it was

(33:32):
like dead silence.

Speaker 3 (33:33):
Wow, because I don't know what the mission is.

Speaker 4 (33:35):
Yeah, yeah, because he said, hey, we got to go
you know in paraphrasing here, but he said, hey, we
got to go pick up some injury guys from another branch.

Speaker 3 (33:42):
Can tell you more like or that's it.

Speaker 4 (33:46):
Yeah, go ahead and start the engines and come upstairs,
and we're gonna take off.

Speaker 3 (33:49):
So I don't know anything about anything.

Speaker 4 (33:51):
Yeah for that, Yeah, so you know, start engines, we
take off, you know, get upstairs.

Speaker 3 (33:56):
We take off, and I still don't almost don't where
we're going.

Speaker 4 (34:00):
So you know, we take off, flying cr cruise altitude
and you know, I'm I'm up in the plane and
I can hear that chatter on my headset and I'm
still connected, and you.

Speaker 3 (34:09):
Know, I'm a I'm a mechanic. I don't understand their
lingo and all that stuff.

Speaker 4 (34:13):
So, uh, once we got kind of close to where
we go, where we're going, you know, hour or two
into the flight, I think I finally asked, Uh I
was a junior crew chief, I guess. And then I
had a superior who was a sergeant, and uh he
had been in maybe like fifteen sixteen years, you know,
very experienced nothing this before. So once we finally got
word of where we're going, We're like, oh, this is

(34:37):
what we get paid for.

Speaker 2 (34:39):
Like it was scary.

Speaker 1 (34:40):
Oh oh blank as in like I'm terrified or I
don't know what it's about to get real, like.

Speaker 3 (34:46):
You could you could be scared. I wasn't struck by
fear because I know.

Speaker 4 (34:49):
Fear would make me weak and not decisive, right, so
I would probably I probably had like a millisecond of fear, but.

Speaker 3 (34:57):
It's like, alright, well it's god time, it's go time.

Speaker 4 (35:00):
I gotta compartmentalize that and yeah, make sure I make
it home. And so yeah, once I finally realize where
we're going, I would say, maybe thirty minutes later, it
was time for a combat lending.

Speaker 2 (35:12):
Okay, well let me this introject for a second. So
once you realize the.

Speaker 1 (35:16):
Ramifications I guess of what can take place.

Speaker 2 (35:20):
After learning this.

Speaker 3 (35:21):
I realized Okay, go ahead, okay.

Speaker 2 (35:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (35:22):
So once you're realizing the ramifications of what can take
place after you get this information, are you at all
thinking about me? Are you thinking about like your family?
Are you thinking about your future? Are you thinking about
what is running through your mind?

Speaker 4 (35:37):
When people say the life flash before you, I can
relate to that, That's probably what it happens because it
practical terms. I guess I'm thinking, like, did I tell
Nisia all the passwords to all the bills?

Speaker 3 (35:48):
All?

Speaker 2 (35:49):
Are you really thinking that?

Speaker 3 (35:50):
It crossed my mind? You know, it's glossing over, But
I'm thinking, logistically, is it.

Speaker 2 (35:54):
And I could die? I could I could not come home?

Speaker 3 (35:56):
Yeah, definitely, really very rare for the air Force.

Speaker 4 (35:59):
But yeah, so I'm thinking this book that I put
it in, like, can't she see it?

Speaker 3 (36:05):
Will she be able to like make sense of it?
Put too and two together.

Speaker 4 (36:08):
Now, it was a millisecond, you know, it was a
short term because I got control moment.

Speaker 1 (36:13):
Yeah, you gotta tap in there like action. It's like
you said, it's game time.

Speaker 3 (36:17):
Yeah, and so again we don't have a small plane.

Speaker 4 (36:20):
So combat landing is extremely rare, and it's it's pretty
stressing on the airplane.

Speaker 1 (36:26):
Let alone, mean, it's a gigantic plane. It's not like
I said, it's not a jet.

Speaker 3 (36:30):
It's like it's.

Speaker 1 (36:31):
Not inconspious, not inconspicuous by all means. It is the
type of plane that is like I have arrived if
there was a plane that said.

Speaker 3 (36:39):
Yes, definitely that it's been around a long time, very
proud of it.

Speaker 4 (36:42):
So so yeah, once I finally realized, uh, you know,
we're once I was, it came to my attention that
we have to do a combat landing, which is we
have to drop as fast as we could out of
a very yeah, you know, for safety. So you know,
no no no weapon RPG or no missile, a gunfire

(37:04):
or anything.

Speaker 1 (37:04):
But before you go on, I want to break that
down a little bit because can you explain that what
you mean by we have to drop at a very
high altitude? Like I guess logistically, what what do you mean?

Speaker 4 (37:19):
So everybody has probably experienced a little bit of turbulence, Yeah,
flying on Delta, especially flying.

Speaker 1 (37:26):
On Spirit shout out Spirit in Frontier.

Speaker 3 (37:30):
Yeah, front Tier two.

Speaker 4 (37:31):
So again everybody has experienced uh, turbulence, right, So imagine
turbulence that is shocking, jarring, debilitating. Yeah, for about four
minutes straight.

Speaker 2 (37:52):
Okay, and so so four.

Speaker 4 (37:53):
Minutes is it's sixty seconds a minute four times six
is two twenty four and is there are two to
two hundred and forty.

Speaker 3 (38:01):
So let's count one.

Speaker 2 (38:03):
We don't have to count. We don't have to count,
but just imagine. We'll imagine, okay.

Speaker 3 (38:08):
All the way up to you count from one to
two hundred and forty.

Speaker 2 (38:11):
And that's scary.

Speaker 4 (38:14):
Your stomach is in your throat, stuff like seat belt,
seat belts, just like like this.

Speaker 3 (38:23):
Oxygen mask is like this, like whatever is.

Speaker 2 (38:26):
So it's like a free fall.

Speaker 3 (38:27):
Uh yeah, that's that's a good phrase.

Speaker 1 (38:29):
Yeah all right, So basically you did so basically, so
basically the pilots are essentially saying, hey, guys, at this moment,
we're getting ready to just turn the engine. They're not
necessarily doing this, yeah, you know, just painting the picture here.
We're about to cut the engines off and just fall essentially.

Speaker 4 (38:47):
Yeah, and so when I heard that, that is crazy.
So all my flights I've flown, I've had I was
a flying creachy. I flew I was attached to the
pilots whenever they flew missions all around the world.

Speaker 3 (39:01):
Uh training in real war, I would always have my
seatbelt a little bit loose. Yeah, I've done this, that's
what art. This. This is what I'm in Air.

Speaker 2 (39:09):
Force for practice exercises. Yeah, this is training.

Speaker 3 (39:13):
Nothing.

Speaker 4 (39:13):
I've been on my phone, I've reading books like it's nothing.

Speaker 3 (39:17):
When I heard this, I got that little loose strap
right here, yank. That's like it was like this one
was tight as own.

Speaker 4 (39:28):
And so yeah and so yeah yeah, so he told me,
you know, realizing on combat landing, you know, drop out
free free fall essentially, and so it's it's like you
can you can almost hear like the wind the air
differential on the wings, and like how does that sound
up against metal?

Speaker 3 (39:46):
It sounds scary, sounds like the like the metal is
like bending. It's very terrifying.

Speaker 4 (39:53):
And so you hear this, it's almost like a whistle
like when you project whistle.

Speaker 3 (39:57):
That's what happens when the wind is hitting metal.

Speaker 4 (40:00):
At at at at a high speed, high velocity, like
so fast, yeah.

Speaker 3 (40:05):
And so y you like hear the whistling and you think,
like are we ever gonna like pull up to where
we can be like horizontal, and.

Speaker 4 (40:13):
So he's like a nose dive you know into this
UH area UH in the Middle East, in Afghanistan, and
it's a mountain range. And so when I looked, I
glanced out the window, I could see the mountain range.
Oh god, I couldn't see you know, obviously a a
m a runway is very small when you so far
in in the air.

Speaker 3 (40:30):
So all I can see this big, huge mountain range,
thinking like, oh, we we about to crash into the
mountains or what.

Speaker 4 (40:36):
And you know, before you know it, you know, he
like nose dived and like flatten out and you can
hear the strain up through the wood and the metal
like that. I would never forget that that. It's like
screeching in my ear right now.

Speaker 2 (40:48):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (40:48):
But you know he he like leveled it out. We
end up landing and yeah, you know, then we did
the mission, picked up the uh the injured or army guys.

Speaker 2 (40:58):
Wow, that is I couldn't even imagine. I know.

Speaker 1 (41:02):
For me, like I used to fly all like I said,
all the time as a kid, I would fly back
and forth to California to see my.

Speaker 2 (41:09):
Dad and somewhere along the lines.

Speaker 1 (41:11):
In my adult life, I for whatever reason became very
fearful of flying and it just would overcome me. Like
when I would get on the flight, I would feel
the opposite of what you said, which is it's very
safe to fly. I would feel like it's this is
this is not safe, this is not good, and I
would just be overcome with fear out of nowhere. Like

(41:33):
I've been flying since I was seven years old. And
so you know, for you to share that story and
for you to give the insight, it is just really
profound because that's a real situation, like when I'm just flying,
no normal going from here to there, like you know,
that's not a that's not a real situation.

Speaker 2 (41:52):
But what you went through was a real situation.

Speaker 1 (41:54):
And then even upon landing, if you can, you know,
just I guess quickly run us through what that experience was,
like when you do this noseedive and you do this
free fall experience. Now is time to really do what
they've trained us for, what they prepared us for, what
they have equipped us for this real life battle experience.

(42:18):
Like what was the actual mission once you guys.

Speaker 4 (42:20):
Landed, Yeah, it was a medivac as we call it
but medical evacuation, which n later I realized to be
in the we call it AAR but to be in
the Middle East, essentially we got every branch in the
military there and there was. Air Force is not the

(42:41):
only branch that has airplanes, right, and so for them
to call us, which is our secondary mission, that means
either all the options were exhausted, not available, or all
the above, yeah, to some degree, And so that resonated
with me once we finally landed, touch ground, touched down,

(43:03):
you know, going to our parking spot. Of just the
severity of this, uh because you know, again every branch
we eat our own you know we we we are
of course in the same team, uh, just different uh facets.
You know, Air Force is always called the uh chair
force because of all of the irregular jobs.

Speaker 3 (43:23):
In the Air Force.

Speaker 4 (43:24):
But you know this combat in airplanes is they epited
me of the air forces. So uh yeah, So we landed,
get to our parking spot, and then it hits me
like this is what it's all about. Cause when I
get off the plane, which I'm the first to get,
the mechanics are the first to get off.

Speaker 3 (43:39):
Uh, I immediately hit with all the other branches m.

Speaker 4 (43:42):
I saw Marines, I saw you know, some navy, you know,
I saw uh, some air some army, and then it's
a cohesive unit.

Speaker 2 (43:49):
Then at this point we're we're one branch.

Speaker 3 (43:52):
At this point, yeah, we're one team, one mission.

Speaker 4 (43:54):
Hey, look we at this particular mission, we had some
army guys that got uh hit the previous night with
the I duh. They were doing their mission right their branch,
and so you know, they got you know, they got
they got injured, you know, in that regard, and so
uh they you know, reached out the air airplane you know,

(44:15):
hours later, but early in the night, they got injured,
and they needed to leave that place, which is more
dangerous and a very very minimal medical staff, uh to
go to another country, Germany, where there's full medical staff there.
And so we landed, get there, and again what mely
struck me when I got off was all the different
branches working together.

Speaker 3 (44:36):
There was no difference where it was one team, one fight.

Speaker 4 (44:41):
Let's get these injured guys on our airplane and on
to you know, more support, medical support.

Speaker 3 (44:47):
And so within a few.

Speaker 4 (44:50):
Short minutes they transformed the inside of my plane to
a hospital. And I know about that, I you know,
I've took classes on it, like how to do it.
But they bombarded my plane right next level. Yeah, get
out the way, y, Like their mission.

Speaker 2 (45:04):
Is a hospital. Yes, this is no longer a plane.

Speaker 3 (45:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (45:07):
Go get your little sleeping bag, get your little iPhone
at that time, out the way because we need to
change l you know, we need to transform it.

Speaker 3 (45:14):
So they did that short amount of time.

Speaker 4 (45:16):
It's got oxygen m bottles and gas uh oxyton uh
tanks just like we went to the hospital. It got
hart mounted doors, all those different machines, tubes and wires
the hospital, you know, type bed uh whatever is comparable.
And so they transformed it. And then there was about
twenty some odd minutes maybe of just dead silence, Me
and my superior and ah a sergeant.

Speaker 3 (45:38):
Then uh they lead krew chief. Uh.

Speaker 4 (45:41):
You know, we're just kind of sitting and watching and
I remember looking up around and it's a.

Speaker 3 (45:46):
Mountain range in Afghanistan.

Speaker 1 (45:48):
Mm.

Speaker 4 (45:48):
And so you don't know who what kind of sniper.
This is fifteen years ago, So you don't know what
kind of sniper is there in the crevices of a.

Speaker 3 (45:56):
Of a valley, you know, of a of a mountain.

Speaker 4 (45:59):
Uh, mountain top, and so I remember walking out into
the sun, and then I thought to myself, I got
no covering.

Speaker 3 (46:06):
I probably should walk back.

Speaker 4 (46:08):
Except for the next like twenty minutes, I stayed underneath
the the wings of the plane.

Speaker 3 (46:11):
So I could be less visible.

Speaker 2 (46:13):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (46:13):
And then the next things next second, I know, the
uh paramedic the medical bus came to unload the the
passengers who were injured, and uh, it was about I think.

Speaker 3 (46:24):
Like seven injured army guys.

Speaker 2 (46:26):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (46:26):
I was one critically the most severely injured, and six
I guess technically minor, but I mean they make they
had like broken arms. Uh, they had cast had cast
on their arm, cast on the they leg like crutches.

Speaker 3 (46:40):
Couple guys had like bandages like across the.

Speaker 4 (46:42):
Head from like shrap moil or you know, eye injuries
or face injuries or whatever. And so so the medical
person that were you know up uh uh exerted them,
you know, up to the upstairs into the airplane. And
then the very last guy who was the most injured,
after they you know, loading them up into the.

Speaker 3 (47:03):
Plane, escorted them. Uh.

Speaker 4 (47:04):
Somebody came from my left, yeah, my left side, and
it was a medical nurse or whatever, kind of.

Speaker 3 (47:12):
Jogging and it was like way, wait, wait, wait wait.

Speaker 4 (47:15):
And so when she did that, she got closer closer, closer,
and she had like a a clear goverage bag. I
never remember a clear garverage bag of the the most
you never forget it.

Speaker 3 (47:25):
Oh yeah, definitely not.

Speaker 4 (47:26):
The most severely injured army guy. Later I found out
it was his uniform, but you know, it was a
clear garverage back she had in her hand.

Speaker 3 (47:34):
She was walking up, you know, running up, jogging up.

Speaker 4 (47:36):
Saying hey, wait, wait, wait, wait, and so my plane,
let me see when we opened the cargo door, it's
maybe about fifteen feet high north of that, you know,
give or take.

Speaker 3 (47:46):
And so when she was walking up, she was a short,
little white girl.

Speaker 4 (47:49):
She had to clear garverage back and she like tossed
it up, and I was maybe about ten feet away,
and I never forget that when she tossed the clear
garverage bag up, the the the guyver's bag was like
rotating in slow motion because as I saw it again,
it was clear.

Speaker 3 (48:05):
It was blood stained.

Speaker 4 (48:07):
And I don't know, it's like a a Russian memories too,
of you know, the previous my at that point five
years in the in the military of all those time, hours,
attention to detail. Me looking at my uniform, make sure
that it's clean, it's pressed, you know, it starts is creased.
And then here's this guy with a different job, different branch.

Speaker 3 (48:26):
But here's this guy.

Speaker 4 (48:28):
Uniform is balled up in a trash bag and it's
it's blood stained. There's no camouflage, there's no color, although
he is red. And so she tossed it up, you know,
into the uh cargo door the entry of my airplane.
And then it hit me, this is the military, Like, yeah,
I left br two two five to get away, get

(48:49):
away from the hood, all that stuff, education, benefits, salary.

Speaker 1 (48:54):
Got you left? You left the hood to get away
from the blood stain. And he entered the blood stain.

Speaker 3 (48:58):
Yes, with I could I I can never remove that image.
And so then it hit me like, this is.

Speaker 4 (49:04):
The military, this is this is what it means to
this epitomizes the military as a whole. And then again
the Air Force, we got a little fragmented view of
it because most of the jobs are like regular you know, typical.

Speaker 3 (49:18):
Non coo on the ground, w exactly.

Speaker 4 (49:20):
Yeah, And so then they hit me, this is the
military of a whole, as a whole, so newfound respect
in that regard.

Speaker 3 (49:27):
And uh, yeah, I s I saw the the aer
the trash bag almost like floating in there is rotating
like super slow.

Speaker 4 (49:33):
And yeah, once it reaches you know it it it
entered into the door a the other person like caught it,
you know, from the top and like business as usual
for them. And yeah, so within ten fifteen minutes, the
vehicles cleared out. Medical extra medical person ever cleared out.
You know, we started our injuries. I jumped up to
the top, uh you know, entered their plane and I walked.

(49:56):
I had to walk past him cause it was the
most severely injury. He was incapacitated, and so I had
to walk past him. And he was laying on his belly.
I'll never forget, and I would reckon.

Speaker 3 (50:05):
He probably had to lose.

Speaker 4 (50:07):
Uh a leg, uh from the knee down because when
I walked past them, here, I'm see he was on
my left shoulder. I had to I had to look
to the left, so that would have been he's on
his stomach, so his left leg so from his knee
down is what.

Speaker 3 (50:21):
We call blood clot Uh.

Speaker 4 (50:23):
It would look you know, quickly walking past and so
it was blood clot unlike the calf reason of his leg,
so they didn't look like skin.

Speaker 3 (50:31):
In other words, it was not skin mm.

Speaker 4 (50:33):
And so you know, whatever the medical professionals used to
stop blood, you know from you know, from licol blood
clot that, as I understood, then it was essentially like concrete.

Speaker 3 (50:46):
So it's it's irreversible mm. And so I would I would,
I would reckon.

Speaker 4 (50:51):
I would probably take a really good educated guess that
once it got to the facility with the full medical care,
he had to you know, cut his leg from his
knee down to save it.

Speaker 2 (51:01):
Wow.

Speaker 4 (51:02):
And uh yeah, walk walk to the cargo, walk through
the cargo again. All the other guys were you know, uh,
you know, minor injured at as I remember, uh, but yeah,
I sat down, you know, looking at him, and they, you.

Speaker 3 (51:15):
Know, just woozy.

Speaker 4 (51:17):
Eventually a couple of guys you know, fell asleep from
the sedation. But yeah, that that was never many more details,
but I glossed over a lot.

Speaker 1 (51:28):
But yeah, no, just I mean what you're saying is
extremely captivating, right when you think about you know, in
terms of just you know, we we kind of set
the tone of just you know, the the the idea
of being able to fly in itself, and the you know,
serious situations that can come as a result of flying,

(51:50):
and then the serious situations that can that can come
as a result of flying also in the military. You know,
just to add on to it, but I think what
you're saying, it's just so important and and and and
what I want, you know, for people who are listening
right now or who are watching right now to take
from this conversation is to not become sad or to
become discouraged about you know what John's you know, his

(52:13):
story is telling, but more so, you know, finding if
you can you know, if you can find like uh
what do they say, you know, the sh the like
the silver.

Speaker 2 (52:25):
Lining you know in this story, what will be what
will be the silver lining?

Speaker 1 (52:31):
Would would you say for what you were able to
experience and witness and and and and overcome essentially from
the story that you just told in retrospect to the
the the catastrophe that just happened, you know, with the aircraft,
aircraft just colliding with the.

Speaker 2 (52:47):
With the hells as a.

Speaker 1 (52:49):
Military airplane, military helicopter, Yeah, with a military helicopter. So
the aircraft colliding with a military helicopter. How do you like,
what words of e what encouragement would you get to
people who maybe have a fear of flying or just
in general, like, what words of wisdom would you.

Speaker 3 (53:05):
Have our epsite.

Speaker 4 (53:05):
Again, safe, it's very safe to fly statistically American soil.
You know, other countries they may have more unfortunately crashes,
you know, more frequent.

Speaker 3 (53:18):
But I believe again you know, fact check me or whatever.

Speaker 4 (53:22):
But I believe this is the first flight of this
magnitude on American soil over the last like ten years.
So imagine again every city, every airplane.

Speaker 1 (53:33):
Well, there was like a crash at an air show.

Speaker 2 (53:36):
I don't know if that was two years ago.

Speaker 3 (53:38):
It's different because it's just less people.

Speaker 4 (53:41):
It's it's not like del oh you mean, I guess
a commercial okay, okay, commercial flight, which.

Speaker 3 (53:46):
Is most people want experience.

Speaker 4 (53:47):
Yeah, a little more unfortunately a little more frequent with
military flights.

Speaker 3 (53:51):
But uh for you know, again those are listening. It
is Statistically it's more safe to fly than to drive,
if that makes sense. You start your car up three
five times a day or whatever, so it is more
safe to fly.

Speaker 4 (54:08):
And then the other part takeaway is kind of twofold
more more or less, lack of better words, are selfish
and then more of have more gratitude for the military.

Speaker 3 (54:21):
So for me, it was appreciation of life.

Speaker 4 (54:24):
However, the forces to be conspired to lead me down
the path of choosing that job which i'm in the
same way, it is not combat. It that you know,
to be there within feet of somebody who they could
have reasoned and concluded as well, this could have been
their last day in the military, and you know, that's

(54:47):
that's a job that was that they had just appreciation
that in that moment that while I am a part
of the military, and that was the reallest example of it. Yeah,
just to tip my hand to the people who are directly.

Speaker 3 (55:02):
Combat related jobs.

Speaker 4 (55:04):
I had a new found respect for all the special forces,
all the secret squirrel stuff, all the like crazy chaotic
Navy seals, Army rangers tack pee like they are another breed.

Speaker 3 (55:19):
There are another breed for sure.

Speaker 4 (55:21):
And then the larger one is when some you know,
I get it a lot, absolutely appreciate over the years.
But if you can see someone in public and they
may be you know, brandishing you know, military you know,
maybe a hat, a shirt or something.

Speaker 3 (55:37):
Like that, especially the old old heads.

Speaker 4 (55:40):
Tip your hat to them, nod to them, appreciate your
service because they were literally, I would reckon visited, viewed,
envisioned death that most people don't. I believe if the
numbers have changed now, you know, increase rather, but I
would say probably war to five percent of the country,

(56:03):
it's uh has been in the military.

Speaker 3 (56:05):
That's it.

Speaker 4 (56:06):
Like, so there's ninety five percent of Americans have not
been in the military.

Speaker 3 (56:12):
And so what we do, don't take it lightly.

Speaker 4 (56:14):
I somebody in office right now, uh politicizes it to
the umpty degree. But we're supposed to be a political
and you just understand, you know, the Americanism behind it.

Speaker 3 (56:26):
Uh. There we are on the same team.

Speaker 4 (56:29):
There are people in other countries who literally hate our
guts and they're willing to die them suicide, kill themselves
just to say that they killed others.

Speaker 3 (56:38):
Uh as well.

Speaker 4 (56:40):
So without diving into that, uh, just taking fun appreciation
surface level.

Speaker 3 (56:46):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (56:46):
You know, if you see someone in public again they
brandishing something military, they proud of it. It was quite
a challenge, you know, to to experience those things, and
you know, I've grown a lot, Uh, but yeah, tip
your had to them, tell them you, thank you, thank
You're thankful for what they do because it's not easy
and literally ninety people don't do it.

Speaker 1 (57:08):
Yeah wow who All right, so that's not even scratching
the surface.

Speaker 2 (57:13):
What do we like on time?

Speaker 1 (57:14):
Because, like I said, we got kids. Oh god, it's time. Okay,
we gotta stop to it, all right. I'm gonna wrap
it up before No, no, no no, I'm not gonna do
the story. We're gonna save it for another episode.

Speaker 2 (57:26):
But I do want to. No, I can't do it.
It's we're done.

Speaker 3 (57:28):
Oh yeah, you you you you gotta go.

Speaker 2 (57:30):
Yeah, okay, I gotta go.

Speaker 1 (57:32):
So before we close, though, I do want to kind
of culmulate it with this. I want to wrap it
if I were to wrap it up in the bow.
I want you to touch on this a little bit
because that's interesting. Like the last little couple of sentence
that you said just reminded me of sacrifice and the.

Speaker 2 (57:49):
Idea of religion and state.

Speaker 1 (57:54):
Okay, we don't have a lot of time, we don't
have trying to unpackt that, but the fact that you
just talked about, like the idea of people being able
to sacrifice, you know, tip your hat to those who
were in service who really like understood what it mean.

Speaker 2 (58:10):
To sacrifice.

Speaker 1 (58:12):
Like when you joined the military, you held up your
right hand.

Speaker 2 (58:16):
Did you hold it to a Bible?

Speaker 4 (58:18):
No?

Speaker 2 (58:18):
Okay, well you held up your.

Speaker 1 (58:19):
Right hand God, and you vowed right, you vowed to
God that what.

Speaker 3 (58:28):
I would die for it, that you would die for it.

Speaker 1 (58:30):
And that just brings so many parallels to my life
with you as a Christian man when I think of
the context of Christ Christ essentially making a vow to
God that I'm willing to die for this.

Speaker 2 (58:44):
I'm willing to die to save your people.

Speaker 1 (58:48):
So I kind of want you to touch on that
a little bit because I think that's an important thing
when we think about, you know, sacrifice in terms of
you're in an interesting predicament because one you've you sacrifice
for the country with you know, obviously joining the military,
making that vow like I said, and honoring that a
in his own respect.

Speaker 2 (59:08):
But at the same token, when we think about your walk.

Speaker 1 (59:11):
Like as a Christian man and in context of like
what Jesus the s the sacrificial obviously if then I
I'm not stupid, like they're not the same.

Speaker 2 (59:23):
The sacrifice, the love of sacrifice, it's not.

Speaker 1 (59:26):
The same, but you know, just conceptually, uh uh, I'm
thinking about that, and I think that there's a interesting
thing to kind of touch on, you know, with you
you know, vouging, I guess, and so to speak, you know,
to sacrifice yourself, to sacrifice like a life or death experience,
like what you just explained for your country, but also

(59:47):
like in this in this really juxaposition of like a
g your relationship with Christ and him also kind of say,
serving that same narrative where I'm like sacrificing my life
and and on behalf yeah, you know, on behalf of
a group of people. So so I just I'm you know,
as we get ready to close, I don't want to

(01:00:07):
take too long on this, but I just thought it
was interesting as I'm listening to you say it.

Speaker 2 (01:00:11):
Like, you know, what what is your what is your commentary?
I guess on.

Speaker 4 (01:00:14):
That what what I realized so that what the life
switch was for me.

Speaker 3 (01:00:20):
Was now I guess I'm back up. So we again,
we eat our own what we would say. Another phrase,
you know, to to you know, beat up on each
other is that you're bleeding blue.

Speaker 4 (01:00:35):
Air force is blue, you know, the main color air
Force is blue.

Speaker 3 (01:00:39):
And so when we would.

Speaker 4 (01:00:40):
Say that when I, when I was in was it
was the persona that man you really.

Speaker 2 (01:00:45):
Believe in this as in your patriotic.

Speaker 3 (01:00:48):
As, then your yeah, that's good, but yeah, I'll searching
for that one.

Speaker 2 (01:00:51):
You're bleeding blue.

Speaker 3 (01:00:51):
You're bleeding blue like air force.

Speaker 2 (01:00:53):
But you got it in your blood.

Speaker 4 (01:00:54):
You got in your blood you totally believe in this thing,
the mission, everything, and so while that that's funny, but
that's a good correlation to your walk with Christ in
that So both of them, in my walker Christ and
in the military.

Speaker 3 (01:01:10):
When the light switched off, When the light switched.

Speaker 4 (01:01:12):
On for both Walker Christ and in the military, it
was when I and I remember this, this like impression
upon my heart. You will find yourself when you lose
yoursef ah, I remember when the light switch finally went off.
In both my walk with Christ and in the military,

(01:01:34):
you will find yourself when you lose yourself in something
bigger than yourself.

Speaker 3 (01:01:40):
Mm.

Speaker 4 (01:01:41):
And so both I was instructed in the Bible basic
constructions before leaving Earth to give my life for you.
They laid my life down for you me. Yes, you
my right my right hand. I give you my rib
you are a part of me. So that was that

(01:02:02):
epiphany or that kind of mark, you know, s time,
a mark in my in my timeline of you know,
early in our marriage. And then it was probably the
story I just recanted. But you know, eventually some years
later in the military it you know, I began to
find myself in this thing called the military. And it
was only because I found myself when I lost myself

(01:02:25):
in something bigger than myself.

Speaker 3 (01:02:27):
So when I'm.

Speaker 4 (01:02:28):
Faced with a situation where I would die, what life
or death is the only two predicaments, right binary for
the sake of you, I would die because I understand
the power, and I understand the presence and the the
the magnitude, the zenith, the highest of the highest of

(01:02:51):
what that sacrifice would mean. Understood that likewise, so you know,
swear over to the Constitution to supporting against all any
enemies falling and domestic. When you face with that opposition,
like it's a fork in the road, Uh, what's gonna
help you decide?

Speaker 3 (01:03:10):
You know, choosing left, choosing right? Or what have you? Reard?
Peel on the blue pill?

Speaker 4 (01:03:15):
Is that have you found yourself in something bigger, bigger
than yourself?

Speaker 3 (01:03:23):
M hm.

Speaker 4 (01:03:23):
And so you must like submerge yourself into an ocean
of wonder mystic like this journey called.

Speaker 3 (01:03:31):
Life, you know, that's that's it.

Speaker 4 (01:03:33):
So when you get lost in it, you get submerged
in it, you really find the survival like devices.

Speaker 3 (01:03:40):
It's gonna help you float back up to the top.
And once you get to.

Speaker 4 (01:03:45):
The top, you know you you stand, you know, you're
floating in the in the middle of the ocean, and
then you really find like who you really are, like
you you have the ability.

Speaker 3 (01:03:52):
To survive, you know.

Speaker 4 (01:03:53):
Yeah, there's I'm sure there's googleble cause that's the word googleble.
Stories of somebody you know, being capsized and lost at
sea and when they did survive, it was just them
and their thoughts. Yeah, and so like how did they
survive in the middle of the ocean or you know,
you know, some other kind of story in snow and
the mountain of what you there, there's something like a

(01:04:17):
spiritual for sure, but some intervention that they had of
like they were solidified in their and their being, their
their cause of life, the purpose of life. And so yeah,
definitely would epitomize it and you know, summise it.

Speaker 3 (01:04:31):
Yeah. Wow, I'm able to do that.

Speaker 6 (01:04:34):
So you're willing to die for me, yes, and and
for the country with and with content, I would say,
but for me.

Speaker 3 (01:04:44):
First, Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's easy. Yeah, because I understand
my my my position. That's not the end of me.

Speaker 2 (01:04:50):
That's in the context of your priesthood in the home.

Speaker 3 (01:04:53):
Yes, my my, my covenant.

Speaker 4 (01:04:56):
I would live on forever the same way I would,
you know, if if certain leaders would perpetuate that, uh,
your sacrifice. But in the same way in the military, like, yeah,
it's not gonna be the end of me, and I chose.

Speaker 3 (01:05:09):
I chose that. Obviously, it's voluntary.

Speaker 4 (01:05:12):
Unlike you know, any other path where you kind of
you don't have auh a h a huge enough mission
to where you could get lost in it, and then
when you get lost in it, you really.

Speaker 3 (01:05:22):
Find your position in the mission. Yeah, so it's it's
kind of a counterintuitive.

Speaker 2 (01:05:26):
Yeah, a this is good. We we have the sop.

Speaker 1 (01:05:29):
We have the sop because we're in the next episode,
you know, wh like I said, we're gonna be diving
into stories that, like our real life stories that have
served us and hopefully then you know, you can get
insight and revelation from them.

Speaker 2 (01:05:41):
Too.

Speaker 1 (01:05:41):
But you know, just with you saying that, I I
kind of wanna preview the next episode as we get
ready to close, because what you said was extremely profound,
and I appreciate you and I love that about you,
that you're just God fearing and that you have an
understanding and this covenant that we've created, right, this three
braided covenant that we've created with God to where you
un a stand your position in life and.

Speaker 2 (01:06:02):
Even in death to what you're speaking of.

Speaker 1 (01:06:05):
And so yeah, so I want to leave this podcast
saying that, you know, hold on to your seat belts,
ladies and gentlemen, because this is only the beginning. You
kind of predicated to it a little bit right now
when you were using the analogy of being capsized and
flipped over and being.

Speaker 2 (01:06:22):
Lost at sea.

Speaker 1 (01:06:24):
So yeah, so stay tuned because next episode we're gonna
get into it.

Speaker 3 (01:06:27):
That was us, right.

Speaker 2 (01:06:30):
You see how I did that? You see how did that?

Speaker 3 (01:06:33):
People clap black clap it up?

Speaker 2 (01:06:36):
All right, So next episode we have a real life.

Speaker 3 (01:06:39):
Story where it tested us.

Speaker 2 (01:06:42):
It tested us and we were like almost capsized.

Speaker 3 (01:06:45):
Yeah, it was scary.

Speaker 1 (01:06:47):
No, this is like a real life thing where black
people try to be in nature black people.

Speaker 2 (01:06:53):
Let me just set the tone black people in nature with.

Speaker 6 (01:06:57):
No resources that we didn't know, with no resources.

Speaker 1 (01:07:04):
Thank you so much, like Gyuess, like you said, thank
you for your service. I appreciate you the sacrifice, the dedication,
the discipline, the fortitude, the spiritual wherewithal to be able
to navigate in that space and to be able to
still operate at a high level of Christianity with a

(01:07:28):
high level of integrity of who you are and never
forfeiting who God has called you to be.

Speaker 2 (01:07:35):
In the midst of you being engolfed in in the
military life.

Speaker 1 (01:07:38):
I appreciate your service as a military personnel, and I
appreciate your service as a believer.

Speaker 2 (01:07:45):
So let's keep going. Oh, I was going for the
hi Fi