The Fortified Life Podcast with Jason Davis - EP 191 | Shae Bynes | teacher, speaker and writer - THE FORTIFIED LIFE PODCAST

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:13):
Welcome to the Fortified Life Podcast, where we learn how
to develop a dependency on Jesus in the marketplace. From
the boardroom to the bathroom.

Speaker 2 (00:22):
God is with you.

Speaker 1 (00:23):
Here's our host, author, speaker, teacher, encourager, here a chief coach,
and my husband. It's the man they call mister forty
five Jason Davis.

Speaker 3 (00:38):
Hey, what's going on? Everybody? Welcome back to another episode
of the Fortified Life podcast where we are passionate about
building a dependency on Jesus in the marketplace. I'm your host,
Jason Davis aka mister Fortifi. Every week we have the
opportunity to bring on authors, speakers, CEOs, leaders and nonprofits

(00:59):
that are also passionate about putting God back in business.
We have a returning guests today, Shae Bides She is
no stranger to this platform, but I'm in case you
don't know about Shae. I want you to leave this
episode with the you know you say. If you don't know,
now you know, That's how we want you to leave

(01:21):
this episode. She's affectionately known as Chief fire Igniter. She
equips and inspires leaders to be catalysts for transformation in
the marketplace. Twenty five years of experience in including corporate
leadership at a fortune fifty company. She's a pioneer in

(01:41):
the Kingdom business movement, multi time author, which is we'll
come back to in a second, because that's going to
be the primary topic today. But she's also the host
because we want to make sure she's a host of
a podcast Kingdom over Everything, and you need to check
it out be in the show notes later. But folks,

(02:02):
welcome back to the Fortified Life podcast. Shaye Byne Shaye.
How are you doing.

Speaker 4 (02:07):
I'm doing great, Jason and Black Glad to be back.
I was a mister four to five.

Speaker 3 (02:13):
I love it well, folks. Today is part of our
Tools and Resources episode where we specifically have guests on
to talk about tools and resources that helping your day
to day life, both personally and professionally. And that resource
will be Shae's most recent book, Grace under Pressure, and Folks,

(02:33):
I am telling you, I was talking to Shay offline.
I've already read the book, and I'm telling you it's
not that you need to read the book. That's what
That's all I'm going to say is you need to
you must read it immediately. And if you're one of
those people that. Well, you know, I've got like a
book list. I'll put it to you this way. You

(02:54):
need to make sure in twenty twenty five that this
is part of your reading list. And as I talked
to Shae, you'll understand why. My goodness, Shay so Shae
with you've written works like Grace Overgrind, and I mean goodness,
the book count is really starting to stack up. But
what's interesting about Grace under Pressure is it's fiction. It's

(03:18):
a business fable. What made you make that decision in
writing this type of book in that genre?

Speaker 4 (03:27):
Yeah, so years ago, I don't know how many years ago.
I want to say maybe seven or eight years ago.
It's quite a while ago. I'd had this, this thought
of one day I even have the Facebook receipts on this,
like one day I'm going to write a fiction story
for business owners.

Speaker 2 (03:44):
I didn't know what it was going to be about.

Speaker 4 (03:45):
I just love to tell stories, and I'm used to
telling stories that are true stories, like I'm retelling something
that actually happened.

Speaker 2 (03:52):
But I wanted to.

Speaker 4 (03:53):
Like scratch the itch and what's it like to tell
not a real story, but to illustrate things that I
teach and I share and I'm ment her through story,
through a fictional story.

Speaker 2 (04:02):
So it's always been something that I didn't know what
I was going.

Speaker 4 (04:05):
To do it about, but I just had the heart
to do it, and so I have all these Facebook
receipts when I would share I'm going to work on
it this year, you know, all of those things, and
then I would work on another book instead. And then
finally it got to the point where I was actually
doing a speaking engagement and I was talking about typically
my topic around grace Overgrind. And after I spoke, one

(04:26):
of the women who was in the audience, she was
at the same place that I had lunch, and we're
having a conversation and I told her about just this
thought I had had around doing a business business fiction
book and she said, oh my goodness, I saw you
doing grace overgrind as an allegory. And then she just
started talking and it was so funny because as she

(04:48):
was saying that, it was like, Holy Speer was just
like because I had already started writing out allegory about
a different topic and I just wasn't hitting and I
was just like, this isn't quite it. And when she
said that, it was like everything came together and it's like,
this is actually my life message. Grace overgrind is a
life message for me, the with God, all of that,
and to be able to have a way to express

(05:08):
that message in a new way was really important. So
that's one thing, if you don't mind me giving you
the other.

Speaker 3 (05:14):
Side of that, oh absolutely.

Speaker 4 (05:16):
The other thing was that the Lord was also inviting
me into delivering a message that would be accessible regardless
of someone's faith. And so if you had asked me
whether I could talk about Grace overgrind to someone who
wasn't a believer, I would just be like, no, because
Jesus is a personification of grace and this is all Jesus.

(05:36):
And I came into this because of Jesus, and this
is all about with God. But when I tell you,
the Lord's like, this is a message I want you
to express in this way.

Speaker 2 (05:46):
It's a seed.

Speaker 4 (05:48):
And so for those who already know my work, already
are on that path, they'll they'll get it and they'll
be able to contextualize that.

Speaker 3 (05:55):
Right.

Speaker 4 (05:56):
But the message was specifically given. There's no scripture in it.
All of my books have scripture, and except for this one, Yeah,
all of my books mentioned Jesus except for this one, right,
because guy very intentionally was saying, I want to.

Speaker 2 (06:09):
Deliver this as a seed message for an even larger audience.
So those are the kind of the two core reasons
behind it.

Speaker 3 (06:16):
Wow, that is huge, Shay, and I love especially as
a seasoned author. Just what I heard is a level
of self awareness and customer feedback because you could have said, oh,
you know, that's a nice thought, but the fact that
you already had been thinking about an allegory and then

(06:38):
to hear the excitement of that lady and you go,
huh okay, like you could have ignored that, but you
followed that.

Speaker 4 (06:46):
I read because I was having a whole encounter with
God at the table over lunch when she was talking
about it, Like I felt God all over it. So
it was like, I'm going to go, I'm going to
go explore that. I'm not going to ignore that.

Speaker 3 (06:57):
My goodness, Shay. As we dive in, I got to
tell you just experientially and we'll just we'll just kind
of go back and forth.

Speaker 2 (07:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (07:05):
While reading the book Shape, I had many thoughts and
one of the things to the listener that I will say,
and I don't want to give away too much because
I want to encourage you to go get it. I
felt there was learning in the book, Shay, but then
I felt my emotions. I told you offline. I was

(07:25):
reading it downstairs and my wife's upstairs, and I found
myself interacting with a book going oh, my goodness, Now
I know you personally, Shade. So I found myself in
two buckets. I found myself going, oh, no, Shade did
not just do that. That was on one hand, and
on the other hand, as a reader, I found myself going, oh,

(07:46):
my gosh, I did not expect this. So talk about
the element of suspense, Yeah, that you worked into writing this.

Speaker 4 (07:57):
Yeah, that one of the things. And I shared this
with you offline. I think it's worth worth sharing here too,
is that when I went to this process of writing
this book, I actually hired a book coach, a guy
that I had met that we'd spoken on stages before,
and I hired him and I was talking to him
about the concepts around this book. And one of the
pieces of advice he gave me that I really held onto,

(08:17):
as he said, a lot of business parables that you
read when you read them, they're very they're good stories. However,
there are also stories where all the elements around it
tend to be pretty realistic, right, And what he was
challenging me to do is to take a business owner
or this book is really for any business leader, whether
you're a corporate or an entrepreneur, doesn't matter, but to

(08:40):
take them outside of their day to day reality and
kind of do something that surprises them that they don't
expect because it engages your imagination in a new way,
it captures your attention in a new way. And so
that was one of the things that he challenged me with,
and so that's why there's there's multiples within the story

(09:01):
that people would not expect going in.

Speaker 3 (09:04):
Hmm, that's a perfect segue. Shit, because a big element
of this story, again without giving much away, the way
that technology was weaved into this. Can you talk about
shade in writing this, because I feel like it's it's
part of a larger conversation sometimes within the body of

(09:25):
Christ and the growth where technology is going. We went
from economically the industrial age to the information age that
the Internet ushered in now we're in the age of
AI and sometimes within the body of Christ there can
be this hesitation or this well we're just not going

(09:46):
to talk about that. One thing I liked about the
book is you kind of brought that to the forefront.
Like as all these things leadership and teamwork and all
that stuff, but you brought tech to the front. Just
just talk about that or even your opinion on I
think we should need to be we do need to
be talking about technology.

Speaker 2 (10:07):
Oh, I believe.

Speaker 4 (10:08):
First of all, my background is in technology and so
I so you know, degrees of computer science. But the
thing is is that I don't think the Body of
Christ can afford to ignore technology. I mean, it's happening
whether we put our heads in the sand about it
or not. Advances in technology are happening. Advances of technology

(10:30):
should happen with people that are part of the Body
of Christ, who have a mind and a heart for
the King of the Kingdom, to actually engage technology, to
be thought leaders in the aspects of technology, to be
the people in the room to perhaps slow down some
things that shouldn't be happening with technology. Like we should
be engaged in this conversation. Whether we are whether or

(10:52):
not it's happening, but we should be at the table
in these conversations for sure.

Speaker 3 (10:57):
M I love it, Shait. Love it. The other aspect
of this, Shay, As you know, a good story has
a hero and a villain, And one of the things
I loved about this book is the villain may not
be who you think it is, but I will kind

(11:18):
of put it in two buckets. Shay. You kind of
had this concept of a physical villain that people could
attach themselves to, but then there's this sinister villain that
I'm gonna call a dark cloud. And without getting too
much in the book, I do want to mention it
because it's something that if we're not careful as leaders

(11:40):
in the marketplace, whether believer or non believer, And it's
this whole concept of ambition and even the differences between
how it creeps in that there's a hidden cost, and
also when we get into conversations even in the church

(12:02):
about godly ambition. So talk about the tension that you
wanted to elevate within the story, and then maybe reflect
on the larger conversation about like, wait a minute, we
actually need to regularly be examining ambition as followers of Christ.

Speaker 4 (12:23):
Yeah, Because so the subtitle for this book is a
story about leadership and the hidden costs of ambition.

Speaker 2 (12:30):
That's the subtitle for Grace under Pressure.

Speaker 4 (12:32):
And the thing is is that although I don't talk
about godly ambition, I don't talk about the various types
of ambition in the book. The book is not, you know,
isn't a overtly christ centered story. But the bottom line
is is regardless of whatever that ambition is, if you
are driven by that ambition, then you consistently be placing

(12:53):
yourself in a vulnerable posture for going after things that
you should not go after, for making concessions where you
shouldn't make concessions, for not having conversations where you should
have conversations, for having conversations where you shouldn't have conversations,
all types of things because you are driven motivated by

(13:14):
the wrong thing. And so that's one of the aspects
that's being shown in this story. The other thing I
really loved about this I loved hearing your reflections some
that we won't talk about, you know, on this show,
because I want people to experience the book. But what
I love is that when you're reading it, you can

(13:35):
read it from the lens of Okay, what's the Lord
showing me in this book? So you may find as
you're following. Grace is the name of the main character,
the protagonist. If you will, you know, you might find
yourself find things about Grace's story and how she's navigating ambition.

Speaker 2 (13:58):
The people who are on this team in the company.
You know.

Speaker 4 (14:03):
Grace, by the way, is an executive. She's a leader
in a company that she desires to be the future
CEO of small business right, that she desires to be
a future owner of. So there's her ambition, there's the
ambition of her team, there's their collective ambition. There's the
ambition of the CEO.

Speaker 2 (14:19):
Right.

Speaker 4 (14:20):
There's all of these places of space for you to
see how this plays out, how they navigate it, and
that would probably have you also reflect or might even
reveal even how you see how your emotions might get
attached to certain aspects of it. You know, it may
reveal things for yourself and lessons for yourself. I also
want to add, by the way, at the end of
the book, it's not all fiction. It's actually a nonfiction book.

(14:43):
After the fiction story, then it goes into a short
nonfiction story to talk about what to kind of glean
some of the keys around transformation in your leadership and
kind of breaking those things out so that you can
be a grace empowered leader.

Speaker 2 (14:58):
So I just believe that as people are.

Speaker 4 (15:00):
Eating it, they will find themselves in aspects of it
and be able to even ask themselves some questions around
how they're looking at certain situations.

Speaker 3 (15:09):
So good, Shane. You mentioned I was kind of thinking
about taglines ambition for everyone because I've seen stories Shay
where it's like, Okay, we're going to show this theme
with the protagonist, or we're going to show this theme
with the antagonist. One thing I like that you kind

(15:31):
of just laid out is you were like, no, this
is something, and this is why I kind of mentioned it.
It's kind of the dark cloud and the background. Because
I said that facetiously, but it's like, no, if you're
not careful, it doesn't matter if you're the CEO, if
you're a senior executive, if you're in middle management, if

(15:55):
you're an individual contributor, if you're a solopreneur or an
entreprene or, that dark cloud is ever present. So I
liked how each character, as the story drives on, you
kind of see like, oh wow, this this thing is
kind of matriculating throughout, like person to person or level

(16:20):
to level, and yes, as you were doing like the
character development, what made you go that direction instead of
you know what we usually see, Well, let's just kind
of have this issue play out with the main protagonists
or the main antagonists, like why kind of the group Like, mm, no,

(16:40):
we're this is going to be a group project.

Speaker 4 (16:43):
That's because I was going after leadership. Right. If I'm
going after business transformation, corporate transformation, it's more than the protagonists,
more than that executive or more than that that business
that business owner. There's people that are all part of
a vision in something, and so I wanted to capture

(17:04):
that element. And I also wanted to capture aspects of
company culture. Right. So it was funny, you know, I
actually came from you talked about this on the front end.
I spent ten years out of college in corporate and
then I've been a full time entrepreneur for fifteen years. Right,
So I have lived leadership in both aspects of this.

(17:25):
And it doesn't matter whether I thought when I was
reading that not reading writing that story, I was thinking
about the culture in my corporate days, and I was
also thinking about how things could be and like maybe
in a startup company, or those types of things. So
I really wanted to capture that environment because leadership means
that there's more than one shay.

Speaker 3 (17:47):
There were so many things, There were so many quotables
in this book. I just wanted to read one because
I feel like this I saw even the message out
of your other book, Grace over Grind, And I just
wanted to get your thoughts because I feel like you
did such a masterful job of weaving and what you

(18:10):
have previously learned with the Lord, with your stops in corporate,
with your stops as an entrepreneur. You place strategic nuggets
throughout the book, whether through the story or with certain characters.
And so I just want to get your thoughts on
this one because this kind of reminded me of Grace
over Grind, and it was grace stillman. The grind may

(18:33):
have built the old virtue path at the company. The
grind may have built the old virtue path, but the
but Grace has given it life and just talk about
even in business. And and folks go get Grace over Grind,
by the way, definitely get that. Yes, yes, read them

(18:54):
like companions, but just the concept of building with the grind.
But then the transformation that occurs with grace. So when
you're penning a quote like that, what were your thoughts
in bringing that element even into this book.

Speaker 4 (19:14):
Yeah, I think it's I think it's important, and it's
not about it's not about saying, oh, the grind is
this is great, it's grind. We build with the grind.
I'm not advocating for that. So, just in case someone
heard that, in fact, that's not what I was saying.
She was literally just stating the fact, which is that

(19:35):
that is how that business was built, which, by the way,
that wasn't the best. It had lots of issues, but
she's also acknowledging that the way forward. She was acknowledging
the beauty of a grace empowered approach in all the
various ways that grace gets expressed through our work, and

(19:55):
how that is what makes it life giving, that's what
makes it transformational. By the way, that's what makes it sustainable.
And so that's what that quote is really about.

Speaker 2 (20:05):
Ultimately.

Speaker 4 (20:06):
I know some people, and I had to say that, Jason,
because I hear some people that are just like, no, no, no,
you've got to you gotta grind, you gotta grind your way.
You gotta you gotta grind it, grind and grind and
make it happen. And then it's like all of a sudden,
they oh, now I'm going to have this shift. Now
I'll shift to this focus that is not God's best
and that is not to God be the glory either. Right,

(20:26):
So if we want to experience his best, right, if
we want to experience the goodness of God, and this
we're we want to walk this thing out with God
from as from from the point of actually understanding that
that's a thing, to the invitation to then walking that
out knowing that, oh, there's a better way of approaching
this thing and not idolizing the grind.

Speaker 3 (20:48):
So good and well, said Shae, because we know even
in life and business culture we hear phrases like rise
and grind, and so it's it's it's even in the
psyche of people that I wake up, I gotta go grind,
and it's like, yeah, and I love how you and

(21:09):
your your journey, your ministry, everything tying together. You've really
challenged that notion, and we need more people thinking about
that because it's like, wait a minute, where has that
really brought us? Like what like the hidden costs of that. Okay,

(21:30):
you did that, and in the context of the story
even Grace's comment, Okay, well the sure the company built
that way, but what was the outcome ultimately? So that's
that's what I love about, not just the book, but
even your overarching message that you often speak coach and
train about. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (21:52):
Absolutely, And I think that we're just kind of thinking
about real life application with this is that with the
generations that are coming up in environments now, they don't
have that same perspective as the generation So I'm forty
I'm forty eight, forty eight, Yes, just for forty eight,

(22:13):
there's a different Those who are in their twenties and
early thirties now are way more, way more attracted to
this idea of grace overgrind, just inherently, and so a
lot of this it's like, if we don't embrace that,
and then you've got people who are coming in, whether
they're followers of Christ or not, there's an appetite for this,

(22:36):
and so part of it is really even embracing this
just out of the practicality of those coming up right now.
That's what they have an appetite for, that's their reality.
And so the ways of there's a little bit of
tension in that when you think about even corporate spaces
right now or businesses that are multi generational in nature,

(22:57):
and so I mean, I just believe that there's there's
a lot of goodness in there and so if we
embrace that, I think that's just we just experience more
of His goodness in the process.

Speaker 3 (23:07):
Mmm, Shay, I could talk to you for three more
hours about this, but folks, we can't. But what we
can do is go out and support Shay and go
buy this book. And I don't care whatever list shay
bestseller all that. We just need to break all any
lists that exists. It needs to be broken because it's

(23:28):
that good. So whether you are an executive, a member
of your senior leadership team, a middle manager, an individual, contributor, entrepreneur,
business owner, I'm telling you there's something for everyone out
of this. So say just final comments on Grace under

(23:51):
Pressure and then where can people get a copy? And
then if they resonated with the message out of this book,
I know, especially with the launch, and folks, that's why
you got to pay attention to pay attention to there
were some bonuses at launch, but you're even taking this
a step further where you can actually come and train
and speak about these deeper concepts with teams. So talk

(24:14):
about that where you get a copy final message to
people why they should get it, and then uh, some
of the things that you're you're exploring with organizations based
on these concepts.

Speaker 4 (24:26):
Yeah, yeh absolutely, Okay, So Grace, you can get any
of these books off of Amazon.

Speaker 2 (24:31):
A Grace under Pressure, Grace Overgrind. It is.

Speaker 4 (24:35):
I will tell you, I don't know when this is
releasing right now. It is a Grace under Pressure is
available in paperback and kindle.

Speaker 2 (24:42):
A audiobook is forthcoming.

Speaker 4 (24:44):
It's a it's a more complicated project because I'm looking
to do multiple voices for.

Speaker 2 (24:48):
All the characters and all the things.

Speaker 4 (24:49):
So that's why that one's taking a bit of time.
For those who love audio, it is forthcoming this year.
So you can grab you so you can go to Amazon.
You can go to my website shapevines dot com. You
can get in you'll see links to all the things. Right,
so you go to shape yes dot com where you go
to Amazon directly and get the book you were asked
me about.

Speaker 2 (25:07):
There was another thing you asked me about.

Speaker 4 (25:08):
Oh, I do do strategic advisory work, yes, in corporate
transformation consulting work as well with CEOs and their teams
with the leader themselves. So you're all the information right
there on shape bines dot com.

Speaker 3 (25:21):
Love it, love it, and folks will have all of
Shay's information in the show notes as well. Check her
out on her podcast Kingdom Over Everything, and I love
it because Shae. Shae goes under the hood, as if
you haven't noticed by now, in surface level the Shae
doesn't really do that. She wants to know. I don't
like her hang out. We're not going to talk about that.

(25:43):
We're going to talk about the thing. We're not going
to talk around the thing. So make sure you subscribe
to her her show as well and follower there. Shae.
I can't tell you enough. Thank you. I love the book.
I know personally I will be shouting praises about the
book and telling people to go read it. But for

(26:05):
the listeners out there or if you're part of our
YouTube audience that likes to watch the show, you got
to see Shane and I's expressions. There's a reason for that,
and I'm telling you when you read it, you may
find yourself getting emotionally, like a good TV show or
a good movie that you like. There's some parts in
the book where it's it's like, wow, why why is

(26:27):
Mike My heart starting to And it's been a minute
since I had that happen in a book. It's like,
wait a minute, like, hold on, is that the blood
is that the blood pressure rises a little bit? So
And I'm a dude, and I'm willing to I'm willing
to admit that, like, man, I might have felt a
little shift in the blood pressure a little. But but Shaye,

(26:48):
thank you so much, love you, thank you so much.
And folks, obviously she's going to be back on the podcast.

Speaker 2 (26:57):
Oh I forgot one one tiny detail.

Speaker 3 (27:00):
No, no, go ahead, you go to.

Speaker 4 (27:01):
The website I forgot. Because this is the first book
I've done this with. You can actually get the first
chapter of Grace under pressure free. We need to shape
mines dot com. So if you're just like I want
to get a little taste of the book, it's only
gonna be a little taste. It's only the first chapter.

Speaker 2 (27:14):
But you can get the first chapter on my website.

Speaker 3 (27:17):
Love it, love it well, folks, that's all we have
time for here on the Fortified Life Podcast. This has
been part of our Tools and Resources series all about
the book Grace under Pressure. We'll have all of Shay's
information in the show notes. You know how we leave things.
Don't compartmentalize your faith and the marketplace, and remember, from

(27:39):
the boardroom to the bathroom, God is with you. We'll
see you next time on the Fortified Life Podcast.

Speaker 2 (27:49):
Thank you for listening to the Fortified Life Podcast.

Speaker 1 (27:52):
You can catch us live on Wednesdays at eight thirty
pm Eastern Time and on demand. Check out Fortified Life
podcast dot com for more details. So learn how to
live out your faith in the marketplace. Grab a copy
of Jason Davis's book and Fortify being Rooted in God's
Plan for work in business.

Speaker 2 (28:11):
Available on Amazon

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The Fortified Life Podcast with Jason Davis - EP 191 | Shae Bynes | teacher, speaker and writer

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}The Fortified Life Podcast with Jason Davis - EP 191 | Shae Bynes | teacher, speaker and writer