The Rebbitzen reveals her identity | Danielle Jacobs

Video version of this interview: https://youtu.be/UZTQRkr-rIs

Long before social media became what it is today, the internet met Rebbetzin Rivka Leah Zelwig—a charmingly extreme ultra-Orthodox rebbetzin who covered her mouth when she laughed and dispensed earnest advice with impeccable comedic timing. But who was behind this early viral sensation?

In this deeply personal interview, I sit down with Danielle Jacobs, the brilliant performer behind the character, for a conversation that moved me to tears more than once. Danielle opens up about her traumatic and unstable childhood in a home steeped in religious extremism, her lifelong connection to faith and spirituality, her natural gifts for dance and performance, and the painful limitations placed on talented women in the Orthodox world.

This is a raw, beautiful conversation with a woman whose story is as powerful as her presence.

👉 Follow Danielle:
YouTube: @sodanielleicious
Instagram: @sodanielleicious

And don’t forget to subscribe to this podcast for more heartfelt interviews and stories.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
You know, you gotta do what you got to do
to clean for panza. If there is a is a
tile or two in the kitchen floor that you have
to remove in order to clean better, what's the shadla
if you must remove the kitchen sink?

Speaker 2 (00:14):
How bad that you shouldn't?

Speaker 3 (00:15):
I mean the amount of a high that one gets
for doing a mitzvah all the ways, it is unbelievable.
It's maybe she had of my favorite times of the year,
really the most miraculous. Yes, if you eat many doughnuts,
you'll miraculously gain a few pairs.

Speaker 4 (00:35):
Can you step to leek? Correct?

Speaker 2 (00:39):
Wake up, Surrey, Surrey.

Speaker 4 (00:44):
Good morning, Robertson kalaiaz Elwig. When they stopped talking, the
little grandmother came over. She grabbed me in one hand,
grabs him on the other, and she goes She's like, okay,
it's time for you guys to you know, get to
know each other, you know, And I was like, okay.
Then so she went to the kitchen. Who sat down.
He's just doing this thing this and I was like,

(01:06):
oh my god, this is not happening. You know. I
remember feeling so just like out of my body experience
and just very out of body experience, and then I
only remember him saying one thing. That's all I remember,
because I think I kind of blocked it. He just said,
I know you're a little bit nervous, and that's all

(01:29):
I remove because he didn't really speak English and I
didn't speak Yiddish, so there was nothing to kind of talk.

Speaker 2 (01:36):
About hello and welcome or welcome back. My name is
Frieda Bayzellen. In this channel, I explore various aspects of
Jewish life, New York City, history, Yiddish and war. Nearly
fifteen years ago, when YouTube was fairly new, this woman
went viral. This is Repton Rifkala Zelwig, who is now
also on Instagram. Also, there are other funny characters in

(02:00):
the mix. Today, I'll be talking to the woman behind
the Rabbitson and the comedy, Danielle Jacobs.

Speaker 4 (02:07):
Hi, Danielle, Hello, Hi, I'm a little undercover now.

Speaker 2 (02:13):
So you know, you don't want your Rabbitson identity to
be to be known?

Speaker 4 (02:19):
You know, I don't want to scare anyone away yet,
you know, is.

Speaker 2 (02:24):
That your way of bringing people into the fold by yeah.

Speaker 4 (02:28):
I basically I meet them and like this, and then
I'm like slowly, you know, bring them in, Yeah, bring
them in, you know, but first, you know, you have
to go down in.

Speaker 2 (02:38):
Order to get luck. It always cracks me up when
you laugh, because I watched the comedy Bits so many times,
and you have that last.

Speaker 4 (02:52):
It has to be a bit sneeze, though only bit sneeze,
you know.

Speaker 2 (02:56):
Okay, So now I'm dying to know your story because
clearly from your comedy we know that you're very familiar
with orthodox Jewish life. I don't know anything about your
life story.

Speaker 4 (03:08):
I don't hell. Okay, where do you want me to start?
Once upon a time or after upon a time?

Speaker 2 (03:14):
Let's start with where did you grow up?

Speaker 4 (03:16):
Okay? So I was born in Melbourne, Australia. Wow.

Speaker 2 (03:20):
Yeah, So you don't have an accent at all? I'm
an Aussie. Well, I lost it through the process. So
I moved. I moved a lot.

Speaker 4 (03:31):
I moved about twenty seven twenty eight times in my life.
So the first move was from Australia to Israel, and
I still had my accent. And then when we moved
to America when I was about fourteen. Then I went
to high school in America and that's when my accent

(03:52):
kind of faded because I kind of was just like,
you know, mimicking my peers could fit in. Yeah, I
mean now I wish I didn't.

Speaker 2 (04:04):
No what did you get out? No? No, what did
you get out of the accent?

Speaker 4 (04:07):
I can still put it on, you know, if I
need something, or if I feel I want to get
a freebie in the bar, you know, so yeah.

Speaker 2 (04:19):
Where you get a freebie if you have an Australian.

Speaker 4 (04:21):
I've feel like if you have an Australian accent, people
are nicer to They're like, oh, Michael, she love her
accent where you're from.

Speaker 2 (04:26):
I'm like, oh my god, really not really, Yeah, I
should work on it, okay, but you do other accents also,
you do really funny Israeli woman.

Speaker 4 (04:37):
I couldn't do it with this because my mother is Israeli.
So even though my entire life she talked to us
like this for the thanks God, you know, but they
and I keep singing to her Mom, I'm a long
abilities leads.

Speaker 2 (04:51):
She's like, I am talking? How I am talking?

Speaker 4 (04:54):
I want you to learning the English? So I the English?

Speaker 1 (05:00):
You know.

Speaker 2 (05:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (05:02):
She Actually, my mom was was out of Israel more
than she was in Israel, and she still can't get
rid of the accent.

Speaker 2 (05:12):
Interesting, Yeah, so is your mom from can I ask?
Because your mom orthodox?

Speaker 4 (05:16):
So basically I didn't like I wasn't born into a
religious family. And my dad is from Poland. He was
born right after the Holocaust and my grandparents from to Australia.
He didn't even know he was Jewish till much later.
That's another cool story. They didn't want to tell him. Yeah.
And then my mom grew up in a very Messa

(05:36):
tea house, which is like not religious at all, just
kind of like you know, they would do like the
Huggain a little bit here there, drive whatever. There was
no religion whatsoever. She went to the army. She was
in the Air Force. And then my dad actually flew
to Israel when he was I think like twenty or
twenty one for birthright, just to see what Israel is

(05:57):
all about. And that's where he met my mom a
crossing the street. They met and sweet and voi and
then we moved to They moved to Australia and that's
where I was born, and then we moved to Israel
when I was about eight or nine. I had a
brother at the time, but my brother was born in
Israel because in between we went back to Israel like

(06:19):
a year and then we went back to Australia. And
when I was like about nine, that's when my father
decided we're becoming religious. So it was a very very
fast thing. It went from nothing to my father became
an omption of a Hastid.

Speaker 2 (06:36):
Wow, your mother was okay with it.

Speaker 4 (06:38):
Both my parents were very spiritual and yeah, so they
they both My mom would just like dobbin, she was
praying a lot. She was you know, she's a real
she's farty, so she's like, you know, my dad is Ashkenaz.
So he took on the role of more like the

(06:58):
strictness of everything and taking into the extreme a little bit.

Speaker 2 (07:04):
What does it mean to be an omption of Hassid?
Is it like a specific flavor?

Speaker 4 (07:08):
Amption of a Rebbie lives in by Sagan. That's where
we moved to. We moved to her and then we
moved to fight. So the Amphab lives in by Fagan.
And what does it mean to be an omption of
To be an option of our means you can wake
up late and dab in like at twelve ris, No,
I'm kidding, Like it's a very it's he's a very
holy person.

Speaker 2 (07:28):
You know, he's a little not the norm.

Speaker 4 (07:31):
And I actually used to go to his house a
lot because I was friends with his daughters, so I
actually got to see him like, you know, close up
and personal. He would just like pray a lot. I
remember he used to He used to eat like burnt
toast and one of the things. Because I think the
reason is that it's good for your memory, so I

(07:53):
think like the opposite, No, it is it's good.

Speaker 2 (07:55):
For your memory.

Speaker 4 (07:57):
Eating olives, too many olives is not good for your memory.
But if you put olive oil in the olives, then
it's also the frame memory.

Speaker 2 (08:04):
I always knew that if you eat burned toast, then
it affects your memory and you'll forget your learning.

Speaker 4 (08:11):
I doubt it because he wouldn't do that then. I
never heard that. But maybe we should look it up.

Speaker 2 (08:18):
We should. I mean, I think there's competing superstitions.

Speaker 4 (08:21):
Podcast number two.

Speaker 2 (08:25):
Was your dad enamored with the omission over Rebba himself?
Or just yeah, I think he just wanted my dad, who.

Speaker 4 (08:33):
By the way, passed away about a year and a
bit ago. Sorry, it's okay. He was an extremist, so
everything he did was all the way. You know, there
was no real middle. It was like, let's do this
all the way. And you know, so he took a
cussidos and this was like something he really you know,
he felt the part of it. There was a lot
of singing and you know, he just, I don't know,

(08:56):
he just loved dump never ready, you know, like damps.
Uberbe also is known for his knowledge and health, so
my father would ask him all these health questions as well,
and he was just very very into it, and my
mom kind of went with it. I guess, you know,
we all kind of went with it.

Speaker 2 (09:14):
No one can claim you and your brother were just
so suddenly dressing differently.

Speaker 4 (09:20):
Right. So going back a little, when we moved to Harnouf,
which was the first place we moved, so I was
put right into a basiacle and it was I had
a major, major culture shock. I actually got really sick,
like physically, and they really had no idea what I had.
They took me to doctors and tests and nobody came
up with anything. And then finally after like I think

(09:41):
it was like a month. Again this is to my
memory as a child, but I think about a month
after they realized that I am. I just have had
a culture shock, like it was too much for me.
I remember the moment that I was very taken aback
because back in Australia I was in not religious school
and then I went to Thrift, which is a how
bad school for like a little bit. Again we weren't religious,

(10:05):
but there was like you know, I studied a little
Hebrew and it was a very proper school. Also there
was a lot like it was like it was just
very like that there's a lot of rats. Everything was
very like you know, and then all of a sudden
I come to Israel to the school and things are flying.
I think I came exactly when there was like a
sub that day and I don't know, stuff was being

(10:26):
thrown around, there was no respect. I couldn't handle it.
Like it was just the whole mentality for me was
so out of my what I'm used to that it
kind of really took me by surprise. And yeah, it
was very hard, but again I was I was a
very good girl and I just kind of and I

(10:48):
was also I remember as a child always being very spiritual.
I remember even when I was little, like four or
five six, I would like like write notes to Hasham
and then like when I was scared at hole whatever
was happening, and I would fold it and throw it
out the window and then close my eyes and be
like and then I would look and I'm like, oh
my gosh, this she's a good you know, like by

(11:09):
the way he totally did whatever. I'm just course, But yeah,
I had a little bit of a tough childhood, so
this kind of you know, I think maybe the spirituality
kind of helped me feel a little bit of a
sense of security. Before we moved, my parents got divorced
and then they remarried each other, and then they moved

(11:30):
and then and then so we became ant Frasidon. We
moved to Baifugan, and a couple of years later, my
mom gave birth to two more kids. So there's my
brother and I who are about tow and a half
years apart. Then there's a ten year gap, and then
I have two more sus So by the age of ten,
I was kind of like a second mom for me.

(11:54):
And yeah, we had like tough times, a lot of
tough times. They had a lot of fun though, Like
Israel is the place to be a child, you know,
think so yeah, I mean then, you know, we didn't
have computers, we didn't have phones, we didn't have you know,
Instagram or instat anything or YouTube or whatever. And we
were just busy with being actually social, you know, like

(12:16):
social media these days. Like we were actually you know,
we used to like jump rope. We used to play
called it guomi. We used to run around knocking on
people's doors and running away whatever. Maybe that I shouldn't
know at it, but it was just fun, you know,
like we just like had fun. Yeah, So that was like,
that was good. Like that part was you know, kind
of an escape from you know, my what I felt

(12:40):
at home. But at the same time I got used
to it. You know, I had friends I went to
I started going to Basiakov. Then I started you know,
dobvining and all this stuff, and I just fit in.
I'm like a chameleon. I can fit into any anywhere
and put really yeah, and that's a real blessing.

Speaker 2 (12:58):
You know, yeah, yeah, no, it is.

Speaker 4 (13:01):
Yeah. But we before we moved to Israel, I was
in acting school film for film and for it was
called the Young Talent Time, the Johnny Young Talent School,
and I was accepted already to the TV show, which
was like a hug, huge thing. I was so excited,
and then you know, we had to live.

Speaker 2 (13:19):
Why did you have to move?

Speaker 4 (13:21):
My parents wanted to move, but that's how they were.
It was like, okay, let's go next, you know. And
then we moved to Israel and moved to bite for Gun.
We were there for four years, the kids were born
the next two and then one day my dad is like, okay,
we're moving to bar Park.

Speaker 2 (13:40):
Was the aumption of Abba in bar Park?

Speaker 4 (13:42):
No, he was in bite Pegan. Okay, I don't know.
For whatever reasons financial is that don Chevret? We said
we have to do. You know, we're moving, We're going
to We're.

Speaker 2 (13:52):
Going to bar Park.

Speaker 4 (13:52):
So at the time I was fourteen, and it was
really really hard, difficult moves because I was so already
used to I was and it was again another different
another change of everything, mentality, just everything, you know.

Speaker 2 (14:09):
Yeah, so did you live to buy Sakhov in Bar Park?

Speaker 4 (14:12):
I went to Mahone for high school. Mahon.

Speaker 2 (14:17):
I had some cousins that were Mahone and we thought
they were the fanciest people on earth.

Speaker 4 (14:22):
I was very, very fancy I'm.

Speaker 2 (14:24):
Sure you're always fancy, even when you are. The rabbits
in your fancy. I know it's the black four rabbits
in your You always put in these little jokes that
mildly scandalized me.

Speaker 4 (14:42):
Yeah. Yeah, I went to mahone and again like it
was all about. It was very difficult.

Speaker 2 (14:48):
I didn't you know.

Speaker 4 (14:49):
It was all the time, adjusting to new things, adjusting, adjusting, adjusting.
My brother under me went to Rader like you know,
when we were in Israel, we went to and and
then he went to Moncatch. Your mother went to Scolen
and like they really got into the the pais and
was shaved head and the whole thing. My father was
the tartulon that he didn't really know it is. He

(15:11):
tried to, but they did. He speak Hebrew fluently though
my father, no, not from fluent and he's Australian, so
I mean he was born in Poland, but he grew
up in Australia's and he was like, you know, broken Hebrew,
but it was okay. He didn't need Hebrew anymore when
we moved to America.

Speaker 2 (15:31):
So, yeah, did your parents stay married until the end
of your dad's life.

Speaker 4 (15:36):
No, they didn't know this party. Two.

Speaker 2 (15:42):
I see they seem to be real characters.

Speaker 4 (15:45):
Yes they are. They're good people. They just everyone has
their you know, I don't know. It's like, you know,
my dad pasted already, so I just, you know, I
hope he's in a better place. You know, he had
a very very difficult childhood, being the son of a
polcal survivors. That definitely affected hour upbringing. You know, it's
really true that they say, you know, third generation health

(16:06):
core survivors. It's a real thing, and it really was
a very difficult childhood. But you know, it just I
think as a child, I just had a very positive
attitude and everything was like this was my life. Like
looking back now, I think I was a lot in
survival mode and kind of trying to like push through.

(16:27):
And then my personal escapes were when I was acting
or singing or dancing or making people laugh or in
the play, in the in the place or whatever it was.
That was my escape. And then my little my siblings,
you know, taking care of them and taking me places
and like yeah, that was my kind of like you know,
and my friends. I was very very social. I had

(16:49):
a lot of friends in school, so for.

Speaker 2 (16:51):
Me, high school was great.

Speaker 4 (16:54):
Like I loved high school because I was in the
plays and I was in the dances, and I was
popular and it was fun, you know, and whatever happened
at home, I kind of I didn't really, you know,
focus on it as much because I was focused more
on on school. But if you ask everyone in school,
they'd be like, I hated high school. How long your

(17:15):
skirt is, how long your earrings are? You know, are
you sneeze today?

Speaker 2 (17:19):
Are you not?

Speaker 4 (17:20):
You know, the whole whatever. But for me, it was
like it didn't that didn't affect me.

Speaker 2 (17:25):
No, Yeah, because you thrive by the way. I'm gonna
ask you to try to translate Hebrew words you use sure,
like words like tneus or whatever. Oh okay, like modesty, yes,
Nebrew or Yiddish. I'm just saying, okay, we're just in
the future. Yeah, okay, yeah.

Speaker 4 (17:43):
Sure.

Speaker 2 (17:46):
So So did you think when you were in Mahone
in New York. I mean, you've been on a really
unusual journey in your childhood. I think did you think
when you were in Mahone that, Okay, next step is
I'll leave, I'll maybe go to seminary, I'll graduate high
school and i'll get married.

Speaker 4 (18:04):
Well, we were, I'll tell you what, because there was
a lot of stuff going on at home. I was
very focused, I think, on just being in the moment
and having fun in school and like like what I
was telling you, you know, and I wasn't so focused
on what I was going to I also wasn't asked,

(18:26):
like my parents ever said that what would you like
to do when you grow up? I don't think I
was ever asked that question like ever. You know. They
were also very busy with you know, Michelle's coming, We're
moving again. My dad was very like then, my mom's
constantly dobbining, so you know, I mean, I will give
her credit that I dobin and know a lot of
things because of I guess her dobbining. So I have

(18:49):
to give her credit for that. But it was a
very difficult way of living for me. Yeah, you know,
it's hard. I know we're being like recording, it's hard
for me to.

Speaker 2 (19:00):
I don't want to.

Speaker 4 (19:02):
I don't want to say too much it hurts anybody,
you know, in the process. Because there's still my family obviously,
and I love them. It's just that it was really,
really a very difficult time in my life.

Speaker 2 (19:17):
So yeah, I hear you.

Speaker 4 (19:19):
I hear you for me, you know. My brother was
I don't know, maybe it's better if I don't talk
for anyone else, but I personally, I'm just going to
talk about me because I don't want to, you know,
but I personally feel like for me, my again, the
escape was high school and dancing and acting, always being
in that kind of atmosphere that Hasham really gifted me

(19:41):
with that. So I was lucky to have to keep
me going. But there was a lot of later on,
there was a lot of heartache with that. And I'll
get to it late a little bit later, but basically,
when I was in I would say, eleventh grade, my
dad decided, okay, it's time to get married.

Speaker 2 (20:00):
Really I did not get married.

Speaker 4 (20:02):
In eleventh grade, but my father was like, you know,
we're badi chuva if we If you don't do this now,
we're not going to get someone good. And also, you know,
because of HRAs and we don't have money and all
that stuff. So we struggled a lot with money. That's way.
We also kept moving because we couldn't pay rent. It's
the next place, in the next place, so you know,
it was just a struggle. I remember one time I

(20:22):
came into and to school and my friends just like
like kind of like we're talking to me, and I
was like, I was like, what's going on?

Speaker 1 (20:30):
You know?

Speaker 4 (20:31):
I was like confused. And then one of my friends said,
she goes, why didn't you just tell us your dad's
a spy a spy yeah, And I was like what,
I'm so confused. So they thought the only reason I
keep moving so much is must be because my father's
in the government. Now I can laugh at him, but

(20:54):
back then, I was like, what are you saying? You know, like, no,
he's not a spy. You know, I wish he was
a spy.

Speaker 2 (21:01):
Then maybe we would be in a better.

Speaker 4 (21:03):
Place, a little a little cooler, yeah, a little bit,
but yeah. So anyway, that's when for me, stuff really
started to affect me differently than it did before. I
just I obviously I didn't want to get married. I
was very young. I was in eleventh grade. I was

(21:24):
head of dance at the time, and my father would
get really upset and if I wouldn't want to do something,
he would like yell at my mom, we should put
it in a Husseyish school. We should have done what happened,
So then I'd be like okay, okay. I was like
the peacemaker, like okay, okay. You know, so my first
the show in your day show is right, but it's
not really a day because it's it was in my house,

(21:48):
you know, with a table. And actually this, the first
one was not in my house. The first one was
at this at his this person's ant house somewhere in Barkbark,
and there was like nuts on the table, you know,
like my my Orthodox Unorthodox, which one is it? Not
the show the movie.

Speaker 2 (22:07):
The movie Unorthodox, Yes, based on the memoir.

Speaker 4 (22:12):
Yet so that like that, but you know, I didn't
shave my head, but.

Speaker 2 (22:17):
Like that, I get, I get the room, the awkward room.

Speaker 4 (22:21):
There's like nuts and the you know, stuff everywhere.

Speaker 2 (22:24):
Seltzerd yes exactly.

Speaker 4 (22:27):
And then like the grandmother was sitting there and his
aunt and I'm not sure if his uncle, but my
and my parents on either side of me. And then
we're all sitting there awkwardly and I'm kind of and
then this guy is like with the long beard the
whole shebang, and I wasn't like that, meaning my dad
took it on like whatever, but that wasn't who I
was my mom's party, like it wasn't It was like

(22:49):
a little bit too much pushed. Auntle was something that
we weren't.

Speaker 2 (22:51):
Like.

Speaker 4 (22:51):
We didn't even speak Yiddish or my brothers did, because
at that point they were in Loudcutch AND's Glenn and
whatever other traders for a while, so they were like,
flew it. My brother, one of my brothers even went
to Nitra, did you hear Nike? Sure?

Speaker 2 (23:08):
Yeah, these are real has only Yeah.

Speaker 4 (23:11):
Only people who know no. So yeah, so then he knew,
you know, he spoke it. But I just wasn't in
that kind of mentality. And my friends, most of them
were like Hamish and litfish, you know, which is completely
different than my character. The Rabbitson is not a fussyish character.
It's completely litfish. And it's interesting because a lot of

(23:34):
people don't know that and it's so specifically not you know. Yeah.
People always ask me, oh, my gosh, how do you
even have this gut? And you know what, I've I've
never even had a teacher like that.

Speaker 2 (23:46):
It just popped out of you.

Speaker 4 (23:47):
I think that because I moved so many times and
I met so many different people, and I'm you know,
I pick up on things and and accents and mentality
because of my acting skills and my you know, I
just I kind of put it together.

Speaker 2 (24:02):
You know.

Speaker 4 (24:03):
I never went to seminary.

Speaker 2 (24:05):
So now we were watching me and my aunt and
cousin were watching your video and we were talking about,
you must have gone to seminary to create this character.

Speaker 4 (24:18):
I didn't. I went to mahone and then and then
for like a few months, I went to the Mahone seminary,
which isn't you know, it's in America. It's not like seminary.
It was just like a half day kind of thing
that I just went to work. So I never But
back to my eleventh grade the show.

Speaker 2 (24:35):
The date, Yeah, so what did you talk about to Honestly,
I mean your go to laugh.

Speaker 4 (24:42):
I mean, now it's really funny. But I remember they
were just everyone's like talking, and I was a little
spaced down and kind of like that's when I connect
to like, you know, I'm like ash, I'm just I'm
doing this for the peace, for the quiet freshion, and
for all that jazz, you know. And when they stopped talking,
they grabbed the grandmother came over. She grabbed me one hand,
grabs him in the other and she goes, Okay, it's

(25:05):
time to Maybe that's where I get the voice from.
She's like, okay, it's time for you guys to you know,
get to know each other and you know, and I
was like okay. Then, so we went to the kitchen.
We sat down. He was just like doing this thing this,
and I was like, oh my god, this is not happening.

Speaker 2 (25:26):
You know.

Speaker 4 (25:27):
I remember feeling so just like out of my body
experience and just very out of body experience. And then
I only I remember him saying one thing. That's all
I remember, because I think I kind of blocked it.
He just said, I know you're a little bit nervous,

(25:47):
and that's all I remember. Because he didn't really speak
English and I didn't speak Yiddish, so there was nothing
to kind of talk about.

Speaker 2 (25:57):
Who's here? Brained idea was this to put you two together?
Your dad?

Speaker 4 (26:02):
Yeah, my dad got a call from someone and he's like, oh,
I have this die from Tush tushism Becaussey this in
Canada and he's you know, it's for your daughter La Rah.
So he flew in and you know, my father used
to get very excited about everything and he's like, this.

Speaker 2 (26:21):
Is the one.

Speaker 4 (26:22):
It's from ashm It's yeah, the shmaya Allah it's again.
It was the same, and then you know, I remember
I was just like crying. I didn't want I didn't
want it, you know. When I got home and he's like, this.

Speaker 2 (26:33):
Is what happens.

Speaker 4 (26:34):
The it's a horrah and it's just they it's a hourah,
you know, and it's just then it gets the whole
thing in the house and then my mom is and
then I get like nervous because I just want everything
to be okay. And then thank god, something else comes up,
you know what I mean, Like it's almost happens. And
then he finds out this and he's like, no, it's
not right, you know. And Marko Shama was like spired
so and then twelfth grade.

Speaker 2 (26:55):
I had he so he wanted to go ahead with
a match and he essentially said no, yeah.

Speaker 4 (27:00):
But it wasn't like I just said, like he's like,
what do you know, it's just azahara. You just think
was your parents will get along, you won't get along,
and it's not true. That wasn't the reason. I just
literally did not want to, you know, get engaged at
I was like a romantic from the age of like three,
I'm like always, like always, So I was like, no,

(27:21):
this is not what I sign up for. I really
don't want to And I didn't know what to say
because like I didn't want him to be upset, you know,
and ended up not working out, thank god. And then
the next one came from New Square, which is another.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
By the way, it's just another very insular hasidic sac. Yeah,
by the way, as a teenager, did you have any
interactions with boys?

Speaker 4 (27:44):
No, I didn't even talk to a boy like ever.

Speaker 2 (27:47):
Me neither. But do you feel like, looking back all
that fun you had, or you like, how is it
possible I had so much fun without any boys involved? No?

Speaker 4 (27:55):
I never thought that. I never thought how much fun
I hadn't that boys involved. I just thought I think
later on, it's like, oh, I wish I had those experiences.
I wish I had a boyfriend. I wish I was
you know, I wish I was able to choose and
to you know, but I didn't. I didn't feel like
because I just had a good time. I'm telling you

(28:15):
I was so positive back then.

Speaker 2 (28:21):
That's changed just a teeny bit.

Speaker 4 (28:24):
I kind of see the light now, But I just
I don't know, I just I didn't think like that.

Speaker 2 (28:30):
No, So what happened was the boy from Square Nothing.
It was another one.

Speaker 4 (28:35):
He came to my house and I remember we moved
again because we you know, we just kept moving. I
think we moved like seven times in six years, just
in bar Park along so we you know, he came
into the house. I remember he was wearing what they
call a beber hat, which I know, you know what
it is flat us see the chat and it was
a stickle tilted, you know, it's really cool. So he

(28:58):
was cool. And I remember us sitting there. I was like, okay,
he was like sitting on his hands. I remember. And
then and you know, we're trained, that's the truth. We're
trained to have questions of what we're going to ask.
And they have to learn for five years and have
to go to the yeshiva, and then we're going to
live in Erisisral.

Speaker 2 (29:17):
You know.

Speaker 4 (29:17):
All these things are like I don't know that I
kind of drilled into you like that's what's important, you know,
having kids right away, and he should learn and you know,
and I remember he just sat there and I said,
and I kind of had the list of like what
I'm supposed to ask, you know, And I was like,
and I remember my dad was in another room and
we had like a code like if I go like this,

(29:38):
I don't like he has to come save me. I
do this. It's okay, you know. So he's like, I said,
you know, would you would you live in Arizistra, you know, like,
and he's and he's like, personally, I don't give with them.

Speaker 2 (29:55):
That's what he said. He yeah, wow, But I.

Speaker 4 (29:59):
I was. I was horrified because foul language was never
like spoken, still not but definitely not. Then you know,
like dang, and you don't want to live in Israel.
So right away I was like it was literally two

(30:19):
minutes into the thing, I'm like, my dad comes running
and he's like, my dad is my dad actually is
a really he was a really good actor and extremely
funny when he wasn't not funny. So he came in
and he's like, okay, okay, showing up, showing whatever something,
and the guy's like why, I just go, yes, yes,
it's good.

Speaker 2 (30:38):
It's enough for the first time, you know whatever.

Speaker 4 (30:40):
So that was that and I was able to get
away with it because I told my father what he said,
so obviously it's not you know, appropriate, sirun Yeah, So
then I was spared that. And then there was another guy,
another fussy dish character from elsewhere. And then, you know,
I think that was the end of twelfth grade already,

(31:02):
and then after right after high school, not even actually
I'm not sure if I was still in twelfth grade.

Speaker 2 (31:08):
Apparently the Gabby of the umption of a Rebbie had
a shit me.

Speaker 4 (31:14):
Now, the guy never met me in his life, he
doesn't know anything about me, but he called my dad
and he told my dad, oh, you know, this rush
of a boy, this, that and the other. And he's
an important boy by the way, yes, sorry, important boy,
you know. And he's comes from a great family. He
was French, and he had breastless background or something, which

(31:37):
is a hussy dius and he flew in to maybe
And here's the crazy thing. At that point, I think
it was already after twelfth grade. Some things are a
little like, my memory of all this stuff is a bit,
you know. Yeah, not that it was such a long
time ago. Obviously high school it was like five years ago.
Just saying like sometimes you just forget, you know. Of course,

(32:01):
at the time I had just become a makeup artist actually,
because I wasn't allowed to work in Manhattan. I wasn't
wasn't appropriate to you know. I don't know why that
sounds so silly now saying it out loud, but it
just wasn't. I wasn't allowed to get a license, even
though all my friends did, but my father didn't think

(32:22):
it was appropriate. Also, we didn't have a car. So yeah.
So he came and I had to meet him, and
he and my dad was at the time said oh,
he's twenty two years old and comes to a great
family and blah. And he looked really really young to me.
I remember when he walked in. I was like, I said, tah,

(32:44):
he looks like.

Speaker 2 (32:46):
Eighteen.

Speaker 4 (32:48):
Like he didn't even have a beard yet, do you.

Speaker 2 (32:50):
Know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (32:50):
Like it was like nap hairs and no offense. But
I'm just for me and I was just very like,
you know, it's so strange. And my father was like, no, no, no,
he's twenty three. Is this is that? I was like, Okay,
he's old because I was, I think at the time nineteen.
This was a tough one because my father already decided

(33:11):
that we're getting engaged. Not only that, he decided that
we're moving to Israel, and oh, my mom had a
baby also another baby. Yeah, so a lot of things
happened that year we moved again. My mom had a baby,
So she had a baby when I was nineteen oh,
nineteen and a half. And so there were too my

(33:32):
brother right under me who was in yeshiva summer, my
siblings who were at the time probably like I don't know,
and yeah, l ten seven eight whatever, and then a
newborn and you know, and then this guy comes from Israel,
and then my dad wants to move to back to
Israel because Maschief was probably coming. So so meanwhile my

(33:54):
father goes back to Israel to find the place he
always used to go before us for some reason. So
he went back to Israel to find the place. And
I was at home having to meet this guy, and
I really didn't want to, and my mom didn't really know, like,
you know, what the right thing was and everything.

Speaker 2 (34:11):
And so I met this guy and I.

Speaker 4 (34:14):
Asked this said, please, can I at least go in
the car with him for a drive around the block
so I feel like I'm being taken out, you know,
I wanted to feel parted.

Speaker 2 (34:24):
You know, I say the romantic, I don't.

Speaker 4 (34:27):
I really wanted to like feel like even though he
wasn't my look and anything, but I just didn't feel
like I had a choice, you know, at that point already,
and I was really upset. We were moving as well.
I'm my friends, and I think it was just like
down you know. Yeah, So behind my father's back, my
mom spoke to someone who was close star family and

(34:48):
he's like, okay, you know, it's okay if I don't know,
the doors are open, the windows are open. So we
drove around. I don't even know if people understand what
you know, it means like you're not supposed to be
a little in a room with a guy who's not
your husband. If the doors are a lother or son correct,
if the doors are locked, or if the room is closed,

(35:09):
it's just like not appropriate, even if you're on a tea.
Maybe that's why don't go out on dates because well,
actually that would make sense because they go off to rest. Okay,
cat start over. Anyway, So we went for a drive
and he was telling me he was French, and he's like,
and so say.

Speaker 2 (35:29):
My family is going to love you, is going to
be so nice.

Speaker 4 (35:33):
Did you speak English? And they, Oh, my gosh, it
was just and I remember just looking out the window
and like, it's going to be okay. It's an you know,
it's an assion, it's a trial. I will pass it.
I'll bring my she up. This is what's meant to be.
You'll listen to your parents. This is you know, like

(35:55):
I really kind of brainwashed myself in the feeling of
being Brett watched kind of.

Speaker 2 (36:01):
You know.

Speaker 4 (36:01):
My dad always said, you know, if you don't marry
someone who's like with a beard, it's not the same
level as someone was out a beard, and like he
just like and that's stuff that he was like fed
from wherever. And you know, I just want to make
it very clear, this is not all people that are
like this. My father was definitely an extremist, God bless
his soul, But this isn't the norm.

Speaker 1 (36:23):
You know.

Speaker 4 (36:24):
I don't even think in the hustyish world and it's
the norm, you know, And I wasn't in the hustyish world.
He was just an extremist and had this, you know,
so we basically almost got engaged. He already told my
grandparents in Israel that I was engaged, and I remember
I was crying and I got sick. It was almost
like when I got sick back in Israel when I
was like a culture shop. Was the same kind of feeling.

(36:46):
I lost a lot of weight in a very short
amount of time. And I remember it was a Friday
and the guy called me to say she goot you know,
good Chavis, and I felt really nauseous. And before he
called me, my mom answered the phone and I heard
her saying, but she's not feeling well, and they said something.

Speaker 2 (37:07):
Okay, we'll give her an advil. You know, he has
to go back to Yeshiva and Israel.

Speaker 4 (37:10):
It's a bit tul torah, like a waste of time learning,
you know that he could be learning to write exactly.
So the pressure was really on because he was there
ready for a week, and that somehow Ashem kind of
helped me at that moment. And I remember he called
me and I said, listen, I'm not I'm coming to
Israel anyway in a week, like we'll talk then. I

(37:30):
don't even understand why they flew him in. It was like, oh,
you're going to miss your bust share. I'm like, we're
going to Israel in two weeks. Why do I have
to or whatever it was the month. I don't know
timing wise exactly, but like, why do I have to
see him right now? Like who cares?

Speaker 2 (37:43):
You know?

Speaker 1 (37:44):
So we went.

Speaker 4 (37:45):
We ended up going to Israel. He was like really shocked.
He called my dad he told him what I said,
and he's like, why are we waiting? Whatever? So somehow
we waited. I can't remember all the details, but we
ended up moving to Israel and we moved to Betari
Elite and Besar Elite is another extremely extremely religious place

(38:06):
and that is a whole other story. That whole time
in my life over there, it was crazy. I mean,
they had so many different crazy rules, and they had
something called vad Huts Newts, which is like the Organization
of Modesty Correct, where they kind of like make sure

(38:26):
everybody dresses accordingly and if not, you should tell on them,
and this crazy stuff I don't even want to do.
It was a very small sect, but they just had
a lot of power. They really destroyed a very big
part of my family later on. But basically I moved
to Israel and me while my dad was there already,
so he met someone else and he's like, maybe this

(38:48):
one's better and their parents are Bali Chuba also and
it was just crazy because it went from one extreme
to the other very quickly in my life, so there
was no time to you know. And that was actually
my well my ex husband now, but that was where
I met him in Betar and he was at the

(39:11):
time in a yeshiva. He wasn't so hastygish, to be honest,
but he was like a little going towards the breastlift,
kind of cat pace behind his ear, with a little beard.
And his parents were different like mine. And yeah, we
met a few times, same idea, you know. One time
we were able to go for a walk. So we

(39:31):
met like four times, got engaged on the fifth time.

Speaker 2 (39:35):
Did you feel a little more?

Speaker 4 (39:37):
I just felt like he was the most normal from
everyone I met. I knew he was a very good person.
I had my list. He passed the test of all
the questions and that was it. It was a very
difficult time. I just think that I was I was tired.

(39:58):
I was tired and.

Speaker 2 (40:05):
I had enough.

Speaker 4 (40:07):
So yeah, so you're not supposed to happen.

Speaker 2 (40:13):
That's okay, that's okay. Can I ask how long you
were married?

Speaker 4 (40:17):
Twenty five?

Speaker 1 (40:17):
Years.

Speaker 4 (40:18):
Oh wow.

Speaker 2 (40:20):
Yeah, you have children with him too, a boy and
a girl.

Speaker 4 (40:25):
Yeah girl in a voice. My daughter is older and
my sons yet I got it.

Speaker 2 (40:31):
Yeah. Yeah, we had a good you know, we had
a good run, like you know, twenty five years it run,
you know, we did we definitely we brought up amazing
kids and we had we had a good run. Thank God.

Speaker 4 (40:43):
He was a good person. And you know, again, at
the end of the day, anything that you do that's
not really your choice is always very difficult to handle,
you know when you're when you're told to do something,
you have to do something. So I kind of went
into it with this this is going to bring me, Yeah,
like this is going to bring them aside, This is
gonna you know, this is what I'm meant to do,

(41:06):
and this is it, like this is what God wants,
you know. And everybody who saw us together were like, wow,
you guys are for sure. You're such a holy couple.
You're going to bring she out oh blah blah. So
you kind of go into this like spiritual at about
it kind of thing, you know.

Speaker 2 (41:23):
And and you were always such a good kid, like
were you always thinking of like making your dad happy
or keeping the peace, keeping that.

Speaker 4 (41:32):
Peace, always keeping that peace, making sure my siblings are okay.
When my parents fought, like you know, and protecting them,
I was. I was always like it was scary. I
was the oldest, so there was no one like really
there for me, you know what I mean. And again
my parents had their hardships and they did the best

(41:52):
that they can do. But it just affected me the
way it affected me. There's nothing that you can do
that you know, it just in me, and I just
kind of went into things with just okay, we have
to it's going to be better, if you know. Before
I got married my parents a few times we almost
broke off the engagement. We were engaged for six months

(42:12):
and a few times.

Speaker 2 (42:14):
Long are you saying that?

Speaker 4 (42:15):
It's a very long time, especially in the hotdish world.
Not that I was hostish again, but it was a
very long time. The reason was is like I didn't
I didn't have any friends around, and I and my
friends would only be able to come in the summer
or something, and we got engaged whatever it was, I
don't like after the summer or something, so I wanted
to wait. Anyways, we saw each other all together maybe

(42:38):
ten times since our like since the first time we
met and we didn't have you know, we spoke a
little here and there.

Speaker 2 (42:46):
That was it.

Speaker 4 (42:46):
It wasn't like, you know, it was like, it's just
it was tough. It was really tough. Without getting too
into it, but I remember my dad saying at one point,
you know, it's better to get married and get divorced
than break an engagement.

Speaker 2 (43:02):
Yeah, that is that is the accepted view among hasidam
Is that really? Yeah, that's what I always knew you did.

Speaker 4 (43:10):
So I'm not crazy.

Speaker 2 (43:11):
So he's not crazy.

Speaker 4 (43:12):
I mean he I guess he came from he heard
it somewhere. I've never I think it's the most insane
thing I've ever heard in my life.

Speaker 2 (43:20):
Like, as far as I know, there are people who
have done it. They got married in order to get divorced,
because breaking an engagement is considered a very harsh thing, right,
Like it's a very terrible thing. I don't know why
divorces are somehow not as terrible.

Speaker 4 (43:39):
Maybe because you're doing a mitzpa, Like an engagement isn't
considered a mid sta like a command I don't know
how to say, like a commitment, right, and then when
you get married, you're doing a midspop. You're actually doing
something that God wants you to do, so you're kind
of tying to not which is a mitzvah. And then
when you get divorced, it's also a midspa.

Speaker 2 (43:59):
Is it a mixt with to get divorced.

Speaker 4 (44:00):
When you get a divorce, people say mazalto, it's like
a good thing, meaning it's not a good thing to
get divorced.

Speaker 2 (44:07):
I do get divorced. No one's going to.

Speaker 4 (44:12):
I didn't, you know, but you know what I'm saying, Like,
like you say mazalto, like it should be even with
better luck. I don't know if it's considered a mitzvah whatever.
I know getting married isn't. It's so maybe it's better
to get to do the mitzvah and then I don't know,
I think it's nuts. That's my personal opinion.

Speaker 2 (44:28):
But but anyway, you got married.

Speaker 4 (44:32):
Yeah, when you get married, and then I had a
kid right away, like I didn't even blink, and I
got pregnant. And then a few years later, you know,
we moved my we moved to We had a lot
of stuff happened in Betar, like with my family, my
parents one of my brothers kind of like started wearing
dinner pants and that wasn't acceptable, and the vad was

(44:57):
organized weirdos kind of really made my parents life difficult
and my mom really had a hard time with it,
and nobody was there to help. And also my father
being ashkan as my mom being Safard. It's not very accepted.
It's just they first of all, they put themselves in
a place where they shouldn't have been. You know, it's

(45:18):
like we didn't fit in there. We just didn't. But
also who are you to tell us if we fit
or not? Like at the same time, you know, and
it caused a lot of pain. My parents moved and
stuff happened, and I ended up going to the rabbis,
and I was always scared to talk to rabbis because
my father always my father always said that they can
like read your forehead. And I was like, you know,

(45:41):
oh my god, what did I do wrong? And I
was so upset that this happened to my family. You know, again,
I'm not going into too much detail, but it was
just a lot of things that were just too much
that I I was like, I took matters into my
own hand, and I was like how could you do this?
And these so called rabbis really shocked me by their

(46:08):
their answers, and I couldn't handle it. I just what
do you mean?

Speaker 2 (46:12):
What? What the lack of compassion?

Speaker 4 (46:15):
Is that what you Yeah, definitely lack of compassion and
just this good had like a newspaper, and every week
there would be something else in the newspaper that was
absolutely ridiculous, like do you know someone who has a
cleaning lady who doesn't just appropriately call now for the
you know, like what the heck? Like like almost encouraging

(46:36):
Lussian horror. Like yeah, again, this was a very small sect.
They were not normal. And this is not the entire place.
I need to make that clear, and this is not
what happens everywhere at all, but this is my story
and like what happened to my family specifically in this situation.
And they put out an article after my parents my

(46:59):
so my parents separated again, like and because everything was
happening with my brother and like they weren't treated nicely.
My mother couldn't handle it, so she just picked up
took my youngest brother and went to Australia. My father
moved I don't even remember where he summered in Jerusalem,
you know, and I was still in Batar with my

(47:21):
husband at the time and two little kids and my
siblings were sometimes by me, and then they went to
my mom in Australia, like you know, that's where we
were holding at the time. My sister lived with me
for a while, and I moved to Ramapachish and that's
where my sister was with me for a book after
that incident, after my parents moved, and they put an

(47:44):
article in their newspaper and there was a picture where
my parents rented and they made it look even lessier
than it was, and then there was a huge suitcase
that said my parents' last name on it, so it
was literally like Lasha Parda and I lived there still,
And actually I didn't live there anymore. I had moved

(48:07):
right when my parents kind of moved. I was like, well,
I have nothing to do here after what happened with everyone,
I moved and then my friend called me that, by
the way, did you see the article. So it was
right after they moved out and I just moved to
pitch Remapchamesh. I was like, I have to get out
of here. And then I saw the article and It
broke my heart because I felt like, oh my god,

(48:29):
they already left. Why this is such lush and heart
This has nothing to do with hushiem, this has nothing
to do with religion. This can't go on. And that's
when I went to the the major rebundum. They're the
ones that were like stamping when all these snoop bad
like flus is like a congregation, so they were like
the rabbis of the congregation to make sure everything was,

(48:51):
you know, going as planned. And I approached them both
separately and I really was so said that I had
that strength, and I said, this is very important. I
need to talk to you. I remember one of them
was just walking in the street and I came over
very gently. Also, I didn't dress like this. I was
chad a covered. I was completely religious, like you know,

(49:13):
just religious, and they kind of like just brushed me off,
very rudely. And I was crying and dis didn't care,
you know. And then the other rabbi, who was the
Safarii one, he wasn't home. So I wrote a whole letter.
I was very upset. I was right before Rushashanha, and
I said, if you don't call me, I will never

(49:34):
forgive you, and I put it on the door, and
I ended up getting a phone call from his wife
and his web said, oh, and this was a Hebrew
and I'll say it in English. She's like, oh, I see,
you're very upset. What's going on?

Speaker 2 (49:46):
So I told her the story.

Speaker 4 (49:47):
I said, my brother starts wearing Deni pants. My mom's
struggling with it. He brings a dog home, which is
obviously not allowed because it's not a kosher animal, right,
so in these type of places you're not supposed to
have dogs. She's walking the dog out, she gets fat
on by some hussyish dude or dude who just walks by,
and she just felt so I'm she didn't know what

(50:09):
to do with herself, you know. And then you just
after they leave, you just put this picture up for
everyone to know, like what for what? Like that's lashanhara,
that's that's literally not allowed, you know. So she kind
of hesitates and she's like, you know, my my my
husband isn't up based in like he's.

Speaker 2 (50:29):
A head of like the rabbinic court, the rabbinic corp.

Speaker 4 (50:33):
You know, you can take them to cork like juice
based in. I'll like your husband is one of the
people who signed. He's like, oh, yeah, he's not part
of it anymore. I was like so confused. And then
she goes, but you know, I have to say something.
If your parents see that they have a son who
doesn't really belong in such a place, then maybe they

(50:54):
should have moved somewhere else. And I said, one second,
if I from a Venu moves here, would tell them
to move. So she goes, oh, don't compare yourself to Abramovino.
I said, well, don't compare yourself to God. Abram Avino
had a really bad son. His name was Asov in
case you forgot, you know, like, and she just went, now,

(51:14):
you know. That's when she said to me, oh, you
can take them to Basin. And then I was like,
I can't do this, you know, and I just that
was it. I finished the conversation. And that was a
very That was a very difficult time in my personal life.
It really kind of set me back to what the
heck is happening. And then at the same time, when
my mom left and my dad left, I decided that

(51:37):
I'm going to move to America for a little bit,
because to change the whole Israel mentality for me, I
found very hard, very everything black and white and religious
not religious, like who cares? You know. I couldn't like,
I couldn't deal with that. It's much better now, I
think than it used to be, but at the time
it was intense. So we moved to BARROCOI and then

(52:03):
at the time, but I think right before we moved
already actually my mom just left religion and my dad
just completely, just like that overnight. They just my mom
took my brother, chopped his past off, walked into McDonald's.
Who And I think that I wasn't It didn't digest

(52:27):
yet until she came over to me once and it
was a Friday and she was dressed in pants and
her hair was out, and I was like, you know,
it was just tough. And I think that that time
in my life after things kind of hit me, and

(52:48):
I was in America at the time. First of all,
right away I went to look for a job, so
I was a fitness instructor as well. So I became
a fitness instructor. I was a makeup artist, which I
was doing, and then I kind of like dabbled out
of it. I became a fitness instructor and I was
working at a gym. Right away, I looked for a job.
Then right away I found out there was some kind
of show. So I went to try out, and I went,

(53:08):
you know, I got into dance. It was very difficult
because back in Israel, I didn't tell you a whole
entire park, which is so important. It's not like an hour,
it's it's just such a long story. I have a
crazy story that happened to be in Bitchammish that really
really shook my world after my parents left religion. It
was right at that time I was in a really

(53:29):
big shows in Israel. I'm not going to say what
and which things because I don't want to mention any names,
but basically performances like really big ones like in daunting, dancing, acting,
big stages like they did like they would take musicals
and uh Broadway shows and do the same exact thing
but for women. And it was like you're talking about

(53:51):
like six seven nins thousands people at night, like it
was a big deal. We had like real recordings and
real it was like it was very very professional and
I felt almost like this is right after we moved
from Batar to by chemish and right that the same
time my parents kind of left right so I knew
they were off going off the Derek. I didn't really

(54:13):
focus on it too much. I was kind of focused
now on like, you know, being religious, but also doing
what I love. And this is the time in my
life where I felt like, wow, I can do this
and this and I feel appreciated. And they were like
all for what I was doing, and they were like
really kind of like picked me up, but unfortunately they
stabbed me in the back. And one of our performances.
There's you know, there's always that little like little group

(54:37):
of people that are either jealous or bullied or are
fat and ugly. I'm sorry to say, but a lot
of times it's those people. You know, they always think, oh,
the pretty girls are mean and the ones that are
not are just so nice, and it's not always that
way at all. And they were just nasty. And they
went and complained that I danced like Michael Jackson, which
is a huge compliment to me. So but and then

(55:01):
they went to certain rebunum, and then these certain rebunum
were upset that they didn't get asked to give a
kosher on the show. It's just it's so complicated. It's
a little hard to say in such a short amount
of time. There's a lot of little things to it.
And because I already worked with seminaries before, doing dances

(55:24):
for seminaries and choreographing of choreographed my whole life, so
I know, I knew the GISTs. So the minute they
took me as the main actress and dancer, I already
knew what happens. So I already said, before we do
any of this, I needed to approve the dancing, to
approve whatever it is. If you don't like the shoulder
this way or that way, like whatever it is, do

(55:44):
it now. Get your rabbis and rebusons, because once we
start practicing and we're doing this for three four months,
you can't change it on me and start, you know,
and they're like laughed at me. They're like, oh, Daniel,
don't worry. We have our own people and we know
and whatever. It's amazing, and I showed it's them.

Speaker 2 (56:00):
They loved it.

Speaker 4 (56:00):
Oh my gosh, it's so good. And then these people complained,
and then they came to me this that they they
only have to change it and take this out, and
that out and at that point, because so many things
happened in my life with those things and then my parents,
and I was so fed up and so deeply hurt
that I just felt like, as a religious woman, I
cannot shine in the department of acting, dancing, singing properly.

(56:24):
Like there will always be something that I do that's wrong,
you know, Like there's never an escape. It's always like,
don't do this, don't say that, don't sing like that,
don't like there's always something that I'm doing that's not appropriate,
and it's only for women, you know, And it's just
like and I felt like it wasn't Torah, that's nothing
to do with religion. It's just coming from it's coming

(56:45):
from ego, it's coming from jealousy.

Speaker 2 (56:47):
It's not coming from a good.

Speaker 4 (56:49):
Place, you know. And so many times in the past
I let that kind of slide. But this time I
was so upset because I gave it, you know, I
gave them the heads up on it. So this time
I was like, I'm not changing anything, and we're between shows,
and I said, and if you don't like it, I'm out.
I'm out. And that was a huge deal because I

(57:10):
was the main actress I was the main actress. I
was the one doing the dances, like they don't have
a show. People paid, like there's five five more shows coming,
so they were like, Danielle, please, da da da. You know.
It took me a minute. I just kind of calmed
down and I was like, Okay, I'm gonna change a
little bit and bring your rabbis and or your rabbitsons

(57:30):
to come see it. So we had to show it
in front of three rabbitsons. The dance, I remember, I
told all my girls to just, you know, just to
shoft the mind, you know, just a grape spine, like
whatever it is. Don't move your shoulder, don't move your neck,
don't look the wrong way, you know. And it was
very humiliating. They were like whispering about it, kind of

(57:50):
like just was not a good feeling at all. And
then when the actual show came, we did whatever we
did before, like I wasn't gonna you know. And then
after the show, I was actually working at the time
at a gym and they one of the people who
was in charge of this show took over the gym
as well. They were very wealthy people in the community,
and they loved me so much, and they're going to

(58:11):
elevate me blah blah blah, and they ended up firing me.

Speaker 2 (58:15):
Is that why you ended up in Farrakaway?

Speaker 4 (58:18):
And yeah, I just I just I couldn't. I couldn't
take the backstabbing. It was it was beyond like I
couldn't handle it. People were very upset for me. It
was there was a big deal.

Speaker 2 (58:29):
Do you carry her over? Feeling like you couldn't self
actualize at these opportunities that you couldn't like, like you say,
shine fully.

Speaker 4 (58:39):
Yeah, of course I couldn't shine fully. There was always something,
you know, there was like most people were like, wow,
that was amazing, and it's great. But it's unfortunate that
the small little people that are jealous or envious or
whatever they are, they're the ones that are able to
bring you down because so much, so much advised, there

(59:03):
so much pride and jealousy. You know, it says that
in the Torah, the puss look is hakin a like
jealousy can take a person out of this world, like
like jealousy and envy can destroy you know, And and
that's why, as you know, Jews, religious Jews, we have

(59:25):
to really work on those things like you're always there's
always something to be jealous of or envious of. But
like you have to know your place and how to
control that and how to you know, to know that
everything's from passion and whatever you're supposed to get, you'll get,
and like you have to keep navigating through those things.
But and I keep navigating through those things with my own,
you know, my own stuff. But they really like destroyed

(59:47):
my own, Like they really hurt me. So I moved
to Faraguay and then my parents were completely not religious.

Speaker 2 (59:53):
And not only that, but my father dad also completely
not religious.

Speaker 4 (59:57):
And then my father calls me one day and he's like, oh,
you know, just because they have beards, it doesn't mean
they're religious. I remember that sentence specifically because I literally
hated beards and I ended up getting married to someone
who had a beard because that's what my father said,
and I wanted to do the right thing. It's just crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:00:17):
Wow, there's just a lot of little pieces that are
just yeah, I thought you preferred beards because you didn't
like the twenty three year old boy who didn't have
any beard.

Speaker 4 (01:00:29):
No, he had a scraggly little thing.

Speaker 2 (01:00:31):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (01:00:32):
And obviously I preferred because I ended up getting married
to my eggs, who had a little at last. He
had a beard somewhat also, but I'm saying like I
didn't want anyone with a beard at the time. Like now,
you know, everything changes with time. Now beards are cool.
But also it was like it wasn't like a nice
you know whatever. That was my preference, but it was

(01:00:53):
just the symbol to me that was very unattractive because
of what I've gone through, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:01:00):
And it's amazing how your dad seems to have gone
on this like journey, and you see this happening with
eccentric parents, I think, especially eccentric dads, where their children
just tumble along with their whims and the children end

(01:01:21):
up carrying so much trauma as a result of being
taken on these extremely unusual life journeys.

Speaker 4 (01:01:30):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, to make it even crazier, he
became religious again. Wow, I mean, this story is kind
of never ending. He ended up getting becoming religious, he will,
My parents got divorced. He moved to Canada to the
Touch community, and he lived there until he passed away.

(01:01:51):
So I didn't see him for about sixty years. Like
our relationship was.

Speaker 2 (01:02:00):
You know.

Speaker 4 (01:02:01):
I was always kind of like his therapist, and I
just couldn't. I just wanted my dad, you know, and
I didn't really have that from my perspective. Again, Yeah,
and anytime any time I would talk to him, it
was always like it just ended up bringing things up
and he wasn't I didn't feel he just couldn't do it,

(01:02:23):
you know. I'm sure, I'm sure he loved me and
he just didn't know. Again, it wasn't his fault. He
had a horrible upbringing. He just didn't know how to father,
you know. Of course, all of my siblings have different
views on that and how they felt, but none of
us booked to him really, just my brother under me.
It was amazing that he even spooked him after what
he went through, but he was in touch with him.

(01:02:44):
I wasn't in touch with him anymore, like I was
for a while on the phone and then it got
too much, you know. But then right before he passed away,
when I got a phone call that he was in
the hospital and he's really not doing well. I ended
up flying to Canada. My brother right on that we
met me there and we were with him for a week.

(01:03:06):
So it was the first time I saw him after
sixteen years. He was already on a respirator, but he
could hear us, so you would, you know, sing to
him all the songs we used to sing on Shabbat
whenever we sang, and I massaged his feet because he
used to love that. And he literally died while I
was holding men and told him I forgave him.

Speaker 2 (01:03:37):
You must be glad that you had that. At the end,
I'm happy I went.

Speaker 4 (01:03:42):
It didn't give me closure like people like, oh it
was the Gamy closure. It didn't because it's not like
he said anything. He didn't say I'm sorry. He didn't
he never apologized, he never really took responsibility. But I
also really do forgive him. I do because he just
had his own hard life and he just didn't know
how to be, you know, and he had those moments

(01:04:04):
that he was good, you know. But so yeah, my
mom's still you know, my already. My siblings all moved
to Australia, like a while back, like going back, because
there's a lot of When I was in Ramavichemish, my siblings,
my sister looked with me for a while. I sent
her to a school by me and then she moved back.
You know, she was religious by me for a bit.
Then she moved back to Australia, and so everyone just

(01:04:28):
left religion.

Speaker 2 (01:04:30):
When did you leave?

Speaker 4 (01:04:32):
I didn't leave religion. I just I started to take
I started to say I took my way off. I
went to Stark before it. I just wanted to make
sure I wasn't going to burn in hell and my
kids were going to be okay. And it was a
long process, but I think it of course also affected
my marriage and certain things, you know, which again I'm

(01:04:53):
not going to get to too that. Like it just
I just felt basically like I was put into this
thing and had to do stuff that I was told
without feeling what I want to do. And even though
I was so spiritual, and maybe if we met in
a different way we would still be married. I don't know,
but I'm just saying everything was just put on me.

(01:05:16):
This is what you're doing, this is what's happening. There
was no there was no me, there was no what
do you want to do?

Speaker 2 (01:05:23):
How do you I was never.

Speaker 4 (01:05:25):
Allowed like I just I don't feel like I was
a child. I don't feel like I experienced things. I
don't feel like I was able to. I was busy
taking care of the kids, or moving again, or making
sure there's peace in the house, or you know, kicking
my brother under the table so he doesn't sneeze so
my father doesn't get mad. Like it was just this
constant survival mode. I only see it now years later.

(01:05:47):
It's definitely you know, affected me. And then go through
my own divorce, which was extremely painful, you know, going
to a divorce where you're married most of your life
and then all of a sudden you're not. And then
you find yourself different state, in a different atmosphere. Your
kids are already older as well, so it's leaving the
nest syndrome. You're getting older, Like what the heck is happening.

(01:06:09):
My family's all in Australia having their own kids. You know,
it's just it's life changing and then you have to
find yourself. And you know, in that whole process, my
son became very famous. So it's just it's a lot too,
you know that people don't really know understand and never will,

(01:06:33):
but it's it's a lot of it's just a completely
different life, you know, and it's it's very hard. There's
a lot of grief, you know, when my dad passed away.
I honestly I didn't even really sit shiva because I
didn't feel much and I wasn't in a good place

(01:06:54):
in my own life. Like I had just moved here
at the divorce.

Speaker 2 (01:06:58):
It was like too much for me.

Speaker 4 (01:06:59):
I know, I couldn't. I couldn't do it, you know.
So yeah, I think I sat like one night. Also,
I was like, what am I telling people? You know?
So I didn't have anyone to say because I just
moved here, so I didn't really know so many people,
so I didn't really tell anyone. It was a very
weird thing. One of my friends flew in from New
York to be with me for two nights, which was

(01:07:20):
so nice. So I feel like I celebrated him in
a different way. Yeah, that's you know, in a nutshell.

Speaker 2 (01:07:29):
But now I don't even know to go where to
go from here with this conversation because there are so
many things I want to touch on before we wrap up.
I guess I guess you touched on your son, who's
now a very famous like like you. He's very talented

(01:07:50):
and he has a great stage presence. Yeah, and you
were also in those videos of them sometimes stuck myself
in there. What goes into being cast as as the
non main character, like you.

Speaker 4 (01:08:09):
Know, this would be really funny.

Speaker 2 (01:08:13):
No, you're great together.

Speaker 4 (01:08:14):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:08:14):
And you guys are like you got the moves with
a dancing I love that.

Speaker 4 (01:08:19):
I used to dance with my kids all the time.
There's a couple of videos on my Instagram like that
was my literally my favorite thing to do is to
dance with my kids, to laugh with them. I used
to video them all the time. Like my son was
hilarious ever since he was little. So it's my daughter.
She's just more like behind the scenes kind of girl.
But she's a very spiritual, very strong, very smart. She

(01:08:39):
did the army. She's she's a real pride.

Speaker 2 (01:08:42):
The army in Israel.

Speaker 4 (01:08:43):
Yeah, she left high school and went straight to the army.
She was the only one that did that. And she's
very much in Israel and very much you know, loves
Israel and loves Hashem and the Torah. And she's become
like more religious but also super cool. She like gives
dar toras every week and she inspires people and she's
really really really special, really special. You know, Thanks God,

(01:09:07):
I have you know, with everything that I've gone through.
I feel I'm really blessed in my kids.

Speaker 2 (01:09:18):
Yeah, thank you for sharing.

Speaker 4 (01:09:25):
It's like uncomfortable, like I don't know how much you're
supposed to say. You're not saying, you know, but no,
I so appreciate what it is sharing so openly.

Speaker 2 (01:09:33):
I feel so touched by your journey. I think your
willingness to be vulnerable in your own life, I'm not
talking about here when you're talking to me. I'm talking
about your willingness to be like to look back with
so much compassion, also for yourself, which I think it

(01:09:54):
takes sometimes courage and a life journey to go through
to look back into, especially wh you're a good kid
and you spend so much time worrying about everyone else.
I think I think looking back and worrying for your
past self is also sometimes you know, you need to
get to a certain place to get there.

Speaker 4 (01:10:15):
Yeah, I'm still working on it.

Speaker 1 (01:10:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:10:20):
So did you raise your children from I'm going to
use the word from and not religious because you did.

Speaker 4 (01:10:27):
Yeah, of course they're both religious. It keeps Shabbat, we
keep holidays where you know, I just just different, And
you know, as a single mother, I don't want to
call single mother because they had a great they had
great parents. You know, they have great I'm not a
single I didn't raise my kids by myself, so I'm
not going to give myself that credit. But you know,

(01:10:48):
we raised them together and we did a free job together.
But I will say that being single in this world now,
and I'm just getting out there now because there's first
a lot of grief, which I'm taking me time to
kind of just digest everything is very difficult to keep shabat,

(01:11:09):
which I'm doing.

Speaker 2 (01:11:11):
Why is it very difficult?

Speaker 4 (01:11:12):
I find it difficult because I'm not You're like in
that in between space, you know, like I feel like
religion and family go hand in hand very much. You know,
like you're having Sat meals, You're surrounded by your family.
You're busy baking and cooking. And by the way, I
was really really good. Still I'm in the kitchen, like
baking and cooking. I used to do saragos and sell

(01:11:35):
them and my health cookies and doughnuts and like just
my dips, and like I have the Sardi side of
the Ashkanazi side.

Speaker 2 (01:11:42):
It's so fun with you know, the whole thing. Because
you did that video with akala. Yeah, I'm gonna put it.
I'm gonna put it. That one never arized. I don't
know why.

Speaker 4 (01:11:55):
I think you beat.

Speaker 2 (01:11:59):
It's a little too much frustration.

Speaker 4 (01:12:01):
So much stave rustlation got the scale did go pick down?

Speaker 2 (01:12:07):
When I saw that dough, I thought maybe Danielle doesn't
really big so much.

Speaker 4 (01:12:12):
Yeah, no, I do.

Speaker 2 (01:12:13):
I didn't look. I looked a little.

Speaker 4 (01:12:18):
Yeah, it's just a different lifestyle. It's like you're it's
like there's an alane factor, you know, Like, yeah, I
don't know. I also moved to a different state, you know.
And I also because of everything I do, like you know,
I manage my son now, so you know, we'll go places,
we're doing this, we're doing that. So I'm not I
haven't which is a really silver lining to everything in

(01:12:40):
many ways. But I haven't really settled, you know. I
don't feel settled. So yeah, and no one's at fault
because is she here? Is she not? But like the
invites or people like, I don't know, people just busy
with their own lives. And again, I'm not in my
I have friends here, of course, but I'm not in
my zone that there's always like you know, I don't
always necessarily want to be like, hey, I'm here, can

(01:13:00):
I come over? Like just doesn't always feel good and
it's just different. It's just different. And then you know,
I don't know how to explain it, but it's just hard.
It's it's a lot harder to be like, Okay, what
am I doing this week? Is my son here or
is he it? By that? By his father? And then
while then and then should I go? Should I come?

Speaker 2 (01:13:19):
You know, I'm still trying to figure it all out.

Speaker 4 (01:13:22):
I hear you.

Speaker 2 (01:13:22):
I thought you were saying that it's hard to date,
as in to go on dates while you're single. But
MENI what you were saying is it's hard to be
shower shabis and single because observing shops is really about
the family, spending time as a family, and when you
don't have that family structure just yet.

Speaker 4 (01:13:42):
And my family is you know, I have one brother
here and then also he's very sweet and great and
I have him a lot of time that he's not religious,
and then I have my yet you know who knows.
But I'm saying, in my family in Australia, they're not
really religious. I have one brother who keeps and of
course when I'm there they do Friday night. It's very nice,
but but I'm not there. I'm here, you know, so

(01:14:04):
again I can you know, I can go to people.

Speaker 2 (01:14:09):
I just need to make the moves more, you know.
It's just it's just harder.

Speaker 4 (01:14:14):
Like a lot of people I think that are you know,
my age, in my in my situation where they have
older kids. You know, when you have younger kids, you
have the other kids and their friends kids, and you
kind of mingle with that. But when you have older kids,
you kind of have to find yourself again. And like
it's just I'm going through right now, like who am
I what? What do I want at this stage in

(01:14:37):
my life? And like oh, because until now it was
like family and the kids and whatever. And even when
I wanted to pursue my acting or all that stuff,
I always struggled with. But I have kids. I don't
want to leave them. But also I'm religious, and what
if I do get a part in a film and
I have to do something that doesn't really fit being
religious and I don't want to do that, like you know,
And now it's all of a sudden, it feels like

(01:14:58):
I was just kind of left like this, and it's like, oh,
do whatever you want. It's like, WHOA, what do I
like do with that?

Speaker 2 (01:15:06):
You know?

Speaker 4 (01:15:06):
And I'm still super spiritual. I believe in a sham.
I believe you know that everything happens for a reason.
I just kind of wish he told me what it wants,
you know what I mean. But it's hard. It's hard
to it's a struggle. It's a constant struggle. My big
struggle now, My biggest thing now is really learning how
to let go. We are not in control of so

(01:15:28):
many things, and learning how to let go and I
don't know, yeah, a lot of different things, you know,
and finding myself again and doing things that make me happy.
I just have to figure out what exactly that is
and how to balance everything, you know, how to balance
adult children, how to balance their relationships and things. And

(01:15:50):
oh I'm getting there. But you know, it's a new world,
apps and you know, and all that. Yeah, and I
you know, haven't really talked the waters yet that much.

Speaker 2 (01:16:01):
Oh good luck, thank you.

Speaker 4 (01:16:03):
I get that a lot. And it's not encouraging.

Speaker 2 (01:16:08):
Keep the faith, yes, keep the faith, because you ain't
getting a guide. I didn't say anything like that, No,
you did not.

Speaker 4 (01:16:18):
But I'm just helping you. I'm just.

Speaker 2 (01:16:21):
It is hard out there. I do you where is
it going with your acting, dancing, comedy career now that
you're in a new stage in your life, do you
have ambitions?

Speaker 4 (01:16:35):
Yes, so I'll tell you. Until now. Before I moved here,
I was doing my photography. I dj' my X and
I used to DJ to Go, so we did a
lot of them. It's apartments is all that stuff. And
first I did photography and DJing by myself, and then
he came on board because it was a little hard
to snap and also like have the remote on the
DJing thing and then turn around as the girl comes in.

(01:16:57):
Like I knew all the things.

Speaker 2 (01:16:58):
I just with a camera around and you know, doing
you know, all the dances and stuff.

Speaker 4 (01:17:03):
So then he got involved, so he would DJ Moore
and I was like MC and dancer and photographer and
so I did a lot of that. I did photography
for twenty odd years.

Speaker 2 (01:17:15):
I loved it.

Speaker 4 (01:17:17):
And I did my fitness personal training all the gyms.
And then when I moved here after like the divorce
and everything, I kind of went into this like I
need to heal, Like I went to Australia for a
while as well for a few months, first to my
family there, and then I came here and I just
felt like, I don't really want to do any of
that stuff yet, Like I don't know if I ever

(01:17:38):
want to, but I just I'm just like healing. And
then my son got famous, and then somehow I became
his manager a little bit, and I'm learning that. But
you know, that's that's just a small part. I need
to do other things for sure, especially in and y
end everything I always love to do, which is comedy
and dancing and acting, and you know, I don't know

(01:17:59):
if necessarily also to sing very nice. Yeah, I sing.
I need to work on it.

Speaker 2 (01:18:06):
But I think, wow, we're going to see you on screen.
I feel like I hope, so that's going to be fun.

Speaker 4 (01:18:14):
It is so fun.

Speaker 2 (01:18:16):
Yeah, that's gonna be fun. But in the meantime, you
have these plethora of characters. Before the interview, I was
watching your cleaning lady who's like Jewish people so much.
My name is Clementine. How are you? I'm thank you?
But I like the Jewish people. They're so cute, they're

(01:18:39):
eating a lot.

Speaker 4 (01:18:42):
I really like Clementine. It's like lovable. She's like you
want to be her friend. My sister was like, I
want to Clementine in my life.

Speaker 2 (01:18:49):
I'm like, I'm right here.

Speaker 4 (01:18:49):
She's like, no, not you, Clementine.

Speaker 2 (01:18:53):
Yeah, you have the Israeli lady.

Speaker 4 (01:18:56):
Yes I do. I'm working more on a baking schemes
so I can teach. I have a lot less bakers.

Speaker 2 (01:19:05):
Let's baking. Well yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, well, Danielle, I
am going to link your Instagram account, and I guess
also your son, since he's famous and you're his momager. Yes,
is that what you say? Yeah? Yeah, so you're you're
connected to that project as the the manager and anything

(01:19:26):
else as of now. And also your YouTube. I'm going
to link YouTube.

Speaker 4 (01:19:31):
Sure. I mean, I'll tell you the truth. I don't
really like I'm good on Instagram somewhat, but like all
the other platforms, this is when I feel like, Wow,
you're really really getting old, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:19:45):
What I mean.

Speaker 4 (01:19:46):
It's like my son, I'm like, how do you do?

Speaker 2 (01:19:49):
What can you help me with a budget? You know,
like we used to do to our parents, our parents
and then they'd be like I'll.

Speaker 4 (01:19:57):
Be like, ma, you just have to do this and
this and this just eh, Well.

Speaker 2 (01:20:01):
Then yeah, how do I what's think gogiling what you know,
that's where we're at. Oh yeah, it did take us
like a few hours to figure out.

Speaker 4 (01:20:10):
The Yeah, I have Instagram for my photography, but I
never like developed it, like right now, am I so
deny delicious on Instagram is literally just what I do.
Even TikTok, like I started a while ago of covid,
my son and I used to do all these funny things.
I did it on my own as well, like because
we were so bored and we would just do like
stuff all the time. But I never you know, I

(01:20:33):
don't even like the TikTok because I find it's such
a horrible platform. But it's a great platform also, you know,
so I have to like devote that. Yeah, it's a
lot of work to do in the you know me
in high tech. We've discussed this before before the audience
came on, and how good I am with with fun.

Speaker 2 (01:20:53):
We did have a lot of fun we did.

Speaker 1 (01:20:55):
We did.

Speaker 4 (01:20:56):
We found it lighty, we found I mean, I think
it's a little yellow, but it works.

Speaker 2 (01:21:01):
We're matching at least we're the same, yeah gradient approximately. Yeah, Well,
thank you so much for sharing, Danielle.

Speaker 4 (01:21:08):
I love talking to you. Thank you very much, and
thank you for having me.

Speaker 2 (01:21:12):
I appreciate you. Welcome, thank you, and thank you to
the viewers on YouTube and the podcast listeners.

Speaker 4 (01:21:18):
And bye bye bye