January 9, 2024 • 27 mins
In honor of CES 2024, we’re sharing our recent discussion with Gary Shapiro, CEO of the Consumer Technology Association and co-producer of CES. Whether it’s lobbying Congress for new AI regulations, running the world’s largest consumer tech trade show, or showcasing groundbreaking new startups, Gary has been a leader in the tech industry for more than 30 years. In this episode, we break down where state and federal regulations clash, and how showcasing more positive use cases will help us prove to the general public that AI and machine learning are not as scary as they seem.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
We always distinguish the government officials thathave been to cs versus those that have
not. Those that have been toCSSE the promise of innovations, the promise
of self driving. They see whatAI and generated of AI can do,
and they get excited by it,and they realize that life can be made
better. The world around us ischanging faster than ever before. Ideas once
(00:22):
only imagined in science fiction are becominga reality. Throughout the course of our
amazing twenty three episode season, we'llspeak to some of the greatest minds in
robotics and artificial intelligence to discuss thegroundbreaking work that's fueling it all. I'm
your host, Ryan Marine joined meand my co host Paul Mitchell, the
president of the Indian Autonomous Challenge,and see why we call this the inside
(00:44):
Track. At the end of ourlast episode, you may have heard we
were going to be speaking with retiredfour star Air Force General Gene Renuart.
But with CEES twenty twenty four infull swing this week, we decided now
would be the perfect time to shareour conversation with Gary Shapiro, CEO of
the Consumer Technology Association and lead producerof CEES. We'll discuss what leaders within
(01:07):
the industry can do to highlight morepositive use cases for AI and machine learning
so that the general public understands thatautonomous vehicles aren't as scary as last year's
congressional hearings might have made them see. First of all, I just wanted
to say thanks for rowing out thered carpet for us the last couple of
(01:30):
years at CES, bringing in theautonomous Challenge out to Las Vegas. And
you know, from our perspective,it certainly seems like a great fit.
But how has it been from theCEES side of things having IAC as part
of the program. Well, thankyou. You guys have been wonderful partners.
You produced a very, very excitingdimension to CES that we haven't had
(01:52):
before, and their focus on selfdriving and the way you've done it in
a competitive way and made it excitingand gotten people from all our the world
involved is just spectacular. So youknow, we love the partnership and we
want it to continue. Well,certainly you and CEES you're at the forefront
of anything consumer technology and AI isthe buzzword right now. It's on everybody's
(02:15):
lips, and you know, whenyou look at how it is presented often
it is dichotomis. On one hand, you have people talking about all of
the benefits to society that AI willbring. On the other hand, you
have those that see it and havea little bit of fear in their hearts
when they talk about AI. Howdo you view AI as it creeps into
(02:36):
our everyday life and what examples canyou bring up of AI touching our lives
in a positive manner? Well,AI, like any new form of technology
that mankind has tamed or sought totame, is something that has good things
and bad things, and we figureout how to deal with it. Whether
it's the invention of the wheel,the taming of fire, the printing press,
(02:57):
the radio, the computer, thetelevision, the internet, you name
it. Every new technology has hadbenefits and there's ways that can be used
to cause harm. Our challenge asan association representing the industry that will make
a lot of the products is tomake sure the government has policies which focus
on specific harms, but don't makeeverything illegal, and make sure that new
(03:20):
entrants can come into the marketplace.AI is something that can be there's a
lot of good already we can seejust on the path forward. For example,
in healthcare. Medical researchers will notonly discover new cures for diseases,
but they'll be able to treat everybodyat some point with a customized treatment that
will allow them to get healthy,quicker and safer and with greater statistic loves
(03:43):
of surviving. And of course,with the timeless vehicles, as you know,
the passenger car could not only itcan empower those with disabilities, older
Americans, and it will also createa whole new industry, a new focus
that will allow people to do thingsin a way they've never done before,
which is really very exciting. Andwe'll also see it in the fact that
(04:05):
we have a cute driver shortage fortruck drivers in the United States. We're
looking, you know, over sixtyfour thousand truck drivers short right today.
But it's not getting any better.And obviously there's sustainability efficiency and most significantly
I think for the world, isthey're safer. You know, with one
million people dying around the world eachyear and multiples more being disabled, think
(04:29):
about how they'll reduce a strain onour hospital system, on our tow trucks,
on our collision repair shops. Andyeah, we'll cause some job this
location but you know, as Iheard said recently, it won't take away
jobs, but those people that willget the jobs will be using AI,
and those that don't know how touse AI in some way that may be
something they'd have to choose pretty muchpretty different occupation. So, Gary,
(04:56):
just on this topic of autonomous vehiclesand the application of AI for us within
the autonomous challenge, we've tried tomake autonomous vehicles exciting, but also to
carry a very specific message, whichis, if an autonomous vehicle can drive
at one hundred and eighty miles anhour and pass another autonomous vehicles safely and
(05:19):
effectively, then it's probably capable ofavoiding a collision or an accident on a
highway at seventy miles an hour.And how can we find these use cases
like autonomous vehicles and saving lives onhighway accidents where AI is clearly for good
(05:40):
and elevate those storylines, elevate thoseapplications of AI in a more public way,
in a more exciting way. Howdo we how do we elevate those
stories and make them more make peoplemore aware of the good use cases,
the good applications of AI and hiscees a venue to do that, I
(06:01):
guess is another part of that question. Well, certainly AI will be a
big part of CES twenty twenty fourour discussions self driving. Clearly you help
make it center stage. I thinkthat's important. The Biden administration is definitely
to emphasize self driving in the favorof electric vehicles. So AI is basically
a way of becoming a more reasonablemiddle ground that will make a difference.
(06:26):
We could give the use cases.We certainly see a ton of them at
CES. We'll see even more withgenerative AI, and people will see the
benefits those with diseases that are rarethat maybe can't be cured that easily.
And of course self driving itself,it's just the case is so obvious.
There are some barriers we face.I mean, for example, in self
driving vehicles. We're the only majordeveloped nation that doesn't have a national AI
(06:49):
policy. Congress has not passed anylegislation this sets out a strategy for AI.
So the states are filling the gapand that's causing enormous problems. And
just test you can't you know,drive from one state to another very easily.
You might have to change your licenseplates and what you do and there's
different rules. That's unacceptable and it'sjust a shame. Where are they getting
(07:10):
it right? You're saying that interms of the landscape of self driving vehicle
legislation and regulation that us you knowwhy, we seem to be doing fairly
well in the development and validation ofthe tech, but we're not creating the
structures and the regulatory environment that willallow that tech to be deployed effectively as
(07:32):
quickly as we should. Are.You seeing parts of the world where they
are doing it well that we shouldbe looking to as examples. You know,
Europe and China are doing a greatjob. China, you know,
they don't care about privacy, soforget that they don't have trial ears,
so forget that they have a nationalstrategy they have encouraging it. Same thing
in Europe as well. They've figuredit out that this is AI at least
(07:56):
for self driving if that's what we'retalking about specifically, is they have they
have a policy the EU which encouragesself driving and we're behind. And it's
not that the Obama administration and theTrump and the Biden administration at the federal
level. They're trying, but theyneed to change the laws from Congress so
that not every car has to havea steering wheel. I mean, from
(08:18):
an energy efficiency point of view,if a car doesn't have to have a
steering wheel and all the things adriver needs and the dashboard and all that,
you say, take a lot ofmoney out of the car. It
becomes more efficient. But I'll behonest, the unions don't like that.
They want to build so they betweenthem and the trial lawyers, the Biden
administration and the Democrats in Congress havenot been that favorable towards that. But
(08:41):
there's Look, there's bipartisan legislation thatliterally went through the House unanimously a few
years ago to die in the Senate, and they're trying to get that resurrected
pretty much, and there's a goodchance that will happen. I've testified out
it now a couple of times.It's interesting. But AI generally, though,
if you get step back and goto the big picture away from just
self driving folks and artificial intelligence,which is broader in so many ways.
(09:03):
I mean, that's that's what fliesaeroplanes now. Uh. And and Americans,
Uh, they want artificial intelligence,but they want some safeguards because they've
heard the horror story. So we'vebeen we've been working as an organization.
We work with the National Institute ofStandis and Technology and the Biden administration,
and we're looking at different things tosupport responsible and trustworthy AI. It's really
(09:26):
important out there. So I thinkwe are aligned with Europe on some of
these things, and that's what we'readvocating is let's go with our friends on
a lot of these these issues.Let's work together. Before we move on
from from this topic of the applicationsof AI that are for good. I'm
just thinking about the CTA and youryour annual you know, global event of
(09:46):
cs as really one of the placeswhere so many technologies emerge and and people
interact with for the first time.So you think about the Internet of things,
the IoT revolution when it showed up, it shows up in these consumer
electronics, right, and it's theapplication of IoT to some consumer product,
and it's some either large company that'sinnovating or it's some startup that's bringing a
(10:11):
product. You're going to see thesame thing with AI because whether it's generative
AI, whether it's even autonomy,like the Rumba was existing long before autonomous
cars were on the road, right, there was plenty of robotics deployed in
consumer products, so I think thesame thing's true with AI. And you
(10:31):
know, CEES and these these wonderfulyou know, big tent mix of companies
that come every year and showcase theirtheir their hardware and their software solutions.
You guys are really at the cuttingedge because that technology environment and platform you
represent is the early adopter of somany things. And so I just I
(10:56):
can't wait to see CS twenty fourto twenty five. I've and and and
the explosion I know is going tooccur of AI applications being showcased. Absolutely,
you're correct. CES is the wherethe future is shown, and we
will see that in different applications becauseconsumers can understand and appreciate that at the
(11:18):
same time, whether it's factory automationor even for example, Sweet Greens announcing
that they're going to be using roboticsin AI to make the salads in the
future and in all their fast foodstores, their salad places. You're pretty
hot around the country. Now.They're good. They're good. Consumers will
see the benefit and the changes,and you know, we're not replacing humans,
(11:39):
We're just making them more efficient.And more productive. We're an American
trade association. We benefit from thefact that we're in the US. The
US has a great advantage of havingone big marketplace for the most part,
with one language, and it's it'sin a lot of investment, capital and
extraordinarily creative people that our culture encouragesto innovate and create and do great things.
(12:01):
And we see that obviously in Indianapoliswith you guys. You know,
you're taking the bill by the horns. You're seeing where things are going and
you're figuring out how to deal withit. And I respect and admire that
because that's important for the culture andeconomy of our country that we approach problems
like that. You mentioned a coupleof times the different roles that the industry
plays in developing technology, the rolethat government plays, and you sit at
(12:24):
a very interesting crossroads between the twoas a liaison between the technology companies and
the government that's looking to try andpotentially regulate or at least understand this technology
as it begins to emerge. Soto be at the cutting edge of something
like this, we don't know whatthe outcome is going to be. We
don't know what all the potential usecases of this will be what is your
(12:48):
role, What is the role ofthe CTA to try and make sure that
that balance that you're talking about isstruck between the innovation on one side and
the oversight that is required to makesure this is done responsibly. Well,
thanks for that question. It's areally important one for us. Our fundamental
mission is to encourage innovation, especiallyin the US, and that's why we
have the CEES, that's why wedo standards, that's why we do all
(13:11):
sorts of consumer research, and obviouslyour public policy efforts. But in the
public policy area, you know,our view is the US should lead the
world on AI policy, and thatmeans you have an organized national approach,
which is what Americans want, andthat requires leadership and policies that are friendly
to innovation, that allows investment andexperimentation, that's flexible and adaptable, that
(13:33):
allows small players to get into themarketplace. And that's a fundamental plank of
our organization is we always have tobe there for the startups. That's why
we have Eureka Park at CES withover a thousand startups each year. I
don't disagree with you that having anational policy a north star if you will
that the entire industry and country andentrepreneurs and investors can get behind. Is
(13:58):
the goal that we want to strivetowards, and you're fighting that fight.
But let's assume it doesn't happen.Let's assume that Congress continues to be at
gridlock and we can't get there.What can or should states be doing to
fill that void? And are youseeing examples of that? And can states
work with CTA? Can we leverageCEES. I know there's a big delegation
(14:20):
that we're bringing out from the stateof Indiana that is part of the Indian
Economic Development Corporation that'll be out atCS twenty twenty four. But you know,
do you see some of this fallingback to innovative and creative states as
a result of the lack of actionat the federal level. Yeah, that's
a great observation, and I thinkyou're correct that states can distinguish themselves by
(14:43):
encouraging innovation with policies. In fact, we grade every state every two years
as to how innovation friendly they arein various criteria. One of the criteria
is their focus on self driving,whether they encourage it or not or they
discourage it and as much as IYou know, California has a lot of
crazy laws, but their self drivingapproach has actually been in many ways exemplary.
They have a lot of things goingon there. You mentioned some other
(15:07):
states, including Indiana, which arevery friendly towards self driving, and they
pay attention to that. We alsodo the same thing, by the way,
with countries around the world. Werank them every couple of years on
how innovation friendly they are, andhaving just spent the two trips to Europe
in the last month, they payattention to those rankings. They want to
be considered innovative. So we tryto use a carrot and stick approach.
(15:28):
CES is another approach. We alwaysdistinguish the government officials that have been to
cs versus those that have not.Those that have been to CSSE the promise
of innovations, the promise of selfdriving. They see what AI and generative
AI can do and they get excitedby it and they realize that life can
be made better. Plus, wehad a really good assist from the United
(15:48):
Nations. Just a few weeks ago. I was in New York at the
opening of the General Assembly and wehad a press conference with the United Nations
Top Technology Official, and we werehappy to announce that. In addition to
the human security that we had talkedabout at CEES twenty twenty three in juneure
and Las Vegas, which is focusedon food production and access to healthcare and
as well as clean air and cleanwater, they've now added a specific human
(16:12):
security focused on technology. When you'reout proselytizing about the benefits of AI,
one of the pushbacks you often get, as you alluded to earlier, is
the potential for replacing the human inthe workplace or what have you. The
replacement of the human component, Andas you've talked about earlier, there are
ways that that can be mitigated andin many ways it creates more opportunities for
(16:37):
the human And I think we havean interesting microcosm with our autonomous race car
within the racing industry. Right peoplelook at the race car that's autonomous and
they think, well, you're takingthe racing driver out of the race car,
when in fact that's not what IA SE is about. We get
asked every single interview without fail,you know, are you trying to replace
(16:57):
the human race car driver? Andthe answers is no, we're trying to
actually develop technologies that would make ahuman race car driver faster and safer.
Right, And the reality is,we don't just need autonomous cars to drive
around, we need them to drivearound with people in them. Right.
So, I think if you thinkabout the fighter pilot that's flying an F
(17:21):
thirty five, the blending of humanability with AI, the ability to now
not just operate this incredible piece ofinnovation and machinery which can more or less
fly itself, but then to evenadd into that the potential for that same
operator to be managing drones that maybe operating in parallel with it. You
(17:45):
said this earlier, Gary, It'snot that it's not that AI replaces humans.
It's that it augments human ability,and it creates situations in which a
single human may be a to dothings that otherwise feel like they're you know,
you have to have a superpower toaccomplish, right. You can operate
(18:06):
something in darkness, you can youknow, you can process information in a
different way. So that is partof the message we carry with UH within
the autonomous Challenge. And it's funnybecause you know, there's not that many
human race car drivers in the world, right or at least not that many
that are that are that are legallysupposed to be racing their cars. And
(18:26):
so, you know, we getasked all the time, is that what
you're doing, you're coming after theirjobs or you look in to replace them.
So it's the same conversation that you'regoing to have if you're developing AI
in a taxi application or a truckingapplication, or maybe to work at a
uh, you know, fast foodstore. How do you think about the
(18:48):
you know, celebrating these situations whereAI is enhancing human competencies in capabilities,
and how do we carry that messageforward. I don't know if you have
any any thought or reflections on that. I agree with what you're saying in
many ways. I mean, forexample, I think I heard this from
part of your team or someone associatedwith you that made total sense to me.
(19:11):
Is that if you think about it, you know, when an ambulance
picks up a seriously sick person witha heart attack or a stroke, you
know there's the magic few minutes theyhave to get treatment or they die.
And obviously, you know fast movingambulances, you know there's accidents and AI
what you're doing in a high speedenvironment is helping them develop. Many,
(19:33):
not most, of the new carsbrought today in the United States have some
form of clusion avoidance, whether it'spassive or active, and that's already saving
people's lives when that doesn't mean thedrivers are ending and the human capability and
the opportunity to enhance it in away and do things safely, even in
the racing world, is something whichwill save lives. You know. One
of the things we've noticed with IndyAutonomous Challenge is this fusion of different technologies
(20:00):
coming together. And we're spending alot of time talking about AI and AI
is mostly a software coded thing,but an autonomous race car like we have
running at one hundred and eighty milesan hour or more, it has all
kinds of teket It has sensor fusion, machine learning, It has you know,
advanced actuators and drive by wire systems. It has you know, high
(20:26):
throughput computing, ultralow latency communication,wireless communication. So I'm wondering about this
fusion of technologies that used to beviewed as oh, well, that's a
relevant technology for automotive, or that'sa relevant technology for life sciences, or
that's a relevant technology for consumer electronics, but those barriers seem to be breaking
(20:49):
down. Is there is there suchthing as sector specific technology anymore? Or
is technology becoming so cross cutting thatthat it's not a sector based phenomenon anymore.
That's a great question, and Ithink there is an answer, and
I think that innovation doesn't occur insolos anymore. It's every breakthrough in one
(21:12):
technology influences advances and others. Andwe have designed cees and we viewed CS
as a platform. It's a kinto a media platform and where the curator
or the editor, so we presentthings. And we've been building CS with
a plan for over twenty years nowon the basis that all these different verticals
from mobility to healthcare, to semiconductorsto content creation and many others all affect
(21:37):
each other. And these people haveto talk to each other at a senior
level for innovation to occur, becauseif you think about what innovation is,
it's really putting two disparate things togetherto create something new which has benefit.
That's why CS and our view hasbecome essential for the innovators around the world,
is because they could get together oneplace for four days because whether it's
you know, artificial intelligence, machinelearning, algorithms, stuff on the edge
(21:59):
or as you talk about sensor andfusion. These are all the infrastructure of
the future of the digital world thatis going to make life better and they
are horizonal. They move across fromone industry vertical to another. And the
skills that actually the CEOs and leadersin business need now, you know,
it used to be very focused onone area like engineering or accounting or HR
(22:21):
or something else, and now it'sthe ability to step above all that and
see the bigger picture, to reachout, to go cross cultural, to
develop, find out where the bestpeople are, to be a motivator,
to be a leader by example,to have you know, but also the
human element is and loss, especiallywith what the world's been going through the
last few years with COVID and theconflicts we're seeing, is that you need
(22:42):
to be able to have some humanresources skills and to be able to deal
with people, to lead people,to inspire, to encourage, to share,
to share some genuine feeling with people. One closing question, comment and
question as CTA is an American organization, and CEES is a US American event,
(23:03):
and Indy Autonomous Challenge is a USevent, and yet we know that
that in order for us to dowhat we're doing, we have to have
these deep and broad connections with companiesand universities and governments around the world.
And you know, CEES, you'vehad this great relationship the last couple of
years with United Nations, and youtravel a lot right through throughout the world.
(23:29):
And yet this marquee event is inthe US, It's in Las Vegas,
it's always in January. It attractsthis massive audience, but you know
that you can't reach everybody in LasVegas in January in the United States.
I know that you guys do havethese kind of satellite activities and events and
(23:49):
activations in other parts of the world, but it just it strikes me that,
you know, if there was away for the to bottle up what
CEES achieved eves during those four importantdays and to to put it in locations
where it could reach a broader market, it could reach more companies. You
(24:11):
know, how do you guys approachthat. I'm sure I'm sure that you
get asked all the time by differentgovernments or different companies to say, you
know, move CEES here or Imean, we've seen that in some cases
where you know, major auto showshave moved from a country to another country.
Recently, in Qatar they had theGeneva Auto Show that was going on
(24:34):
as part of their Formula one events. So I just curious sort of how
do you how do you balance theimportance of of of kind of a US
market focus, which is also ourfocus, with this need to reach a
broader audience. We did it byrunning a race in Manza. We all,
I don't know if we've talked sincethat has happened, but you know,
(24:56):
we we have been holding races onlyin the United States, and we
decided, okay, we've got somuch interest in other parts of the world,
so we ran an event in Manzain Italy. But just curious about
your thoughts on the global influence thatCEES has and how do you take advantage
of that. Well, we arean American group when we count Canada as
(25:17):
being our ally, so we haveCanadian American companies. You have to be
either based in or have an officein Canada or the US to be part
of our association. But the showis broader than that. And as long
as you're not right now a Russianexhibitor, I think you're welcome and you
know, no violations of US laws. There's various lists that our federal government
has created, and we don't allowexhibitors from those lists. But what we
(25:41):
do is we already have we area global event. We have more than
one out of three attendees come fromoutside the United States, and that's very
important to us. We've got alot of direct flights from around the world
that are going to Las Vegas,and we expect a very very strong turnout
in January. But we also havefive thousand or so pressed that come to
the show. We count on themto get the word out throughout the world,
(26:03):
and that's been a very effective strategy. We had an event three weeks
ago in Paris, same thing.It was very successful, especially focusing on
Starbucks. And I'm going to Koreaon Saturday, and we don't have an
event there yet, but I'm surewe'll get requests and have discussions about that
because Korea is actually a country shockingfor me to even discovered. They're second
(26:27):
most now after the US in termsof participation in CS with They had almost
four hgeed exhibitors in twenty twenty threeand probably more in twenty twenty four.
Wonderful. It's been a fascinating discussion. Thank you so much for your insight
and your time, and can't waitto see you and everything that you have
in store in Las Vegas come January. Thank you. We look forward to
(26:48):
seeing you guys the Indianapolis. Aton of his challenge in Vegas very exciting.
We will be there again as always. That was Gary Shapiro, CEO
of the Consumer Technology Association and Masterof Ceremonies for CES. Before we go
off and explore the sprawling maze thatis this year's showcase, we hope that
(27:14):
Gary, Paul and I have sharedsome insight into the question of where the
combination of autonomous vehicles, collaborative innovation, and responsible policy will land. Next
week, we'll share our conversation withretired four star Air Force General Gene Renuart
to talk about why autonomous racing isa national security asset for the United States.
We always distinguish the government officials thathave been to cs versus those that have
not. Those that have been toCSSE the promise of innovations, the promise
of self driving. They see whatAI and generated of AI can do,
and they get excited by it,and they realize that life can be made
better. The world around us ischanging faster than ever before. Ideas once
(00:22):
only imagined in science fiction are becominga reality. Throughout the course of our
amazing twenty three episode season, we'llspeak to some of the greatest minds in
robotics and artificial intelligence to discuss thegroundbreaking work that's fueling it all. I'm
your host, Ryan Marine joined meand my co host Paul Mitchell, the
president of the Indian Autonomous Challenge,and see why we call this the inside
(00:44):
Track. At the end of ourlast episode, you may have heard we
were going to be speaking with retiredfour star Air Force General Gene Renuart.
But with CEES twenty twenty four infull swing this week, we decided now
would be the perfect time to shareour conversation with Gary Shapiro, CEO of
the Consumer Technology Association and lead producerof CEES. We'll discuss what leaders within
(01:07):
the industry can do to highlight morepositive use cases for AI and machine learning
so that the general public understands thatautonomous vehicles aren't as scary as last year's
congressional hearings might have made them see. First of all, I just wanted
to say thanks for rowing out thered carpet for us the last couple of
(01:30):
years at CES, bringing in theautonomous Challenge out to Las Vegas. And
you know, from our perspective,it certainly seems like a great fit.
But how has it been from theCEES side of things having IAC as part
of the program. Well, thankyou. You guys have been wonderful partners.
You produced a very, very excitingdimension to CES that we haven't had
(01:52):
before, and their focus on selfdriving and the way you've done it in
a competitive way and made it excitingand gotten people from all our the world
involved is just spectacular. So youknow, we love the partnership and we
want it to continue. Well,certainly you and CEES you're at the forefront
of anything consumer technology and AI isthe buzzword right now. It's on everybody's
(02:15):
lips, and you know, whenyou look at how it is presented often
it is dichotomis. On one hand, you have people talking about all of
the benefits to society that AI willbring. On the other hand, you
have those that see it and havea little bit of fear in their hearts
when they talk about AI. Howdo you view AI as it creeps into
(02:36):
our everyday life and what examples canyou bring up of AI touching our lives
in a positive manner? Well,AI, like any new form of technology
that mankind has tamed or sought totame, is something that has good things
and bad things, and we figureout how to deal with it. Whether
it's the invention of the wheel,the taming of fire, the printing press,
(02:57):
the radio, the computer, thetelevision, the internet, you name
it. Every new technology has hadbenefits and there's ways that can be used
to cause harm. Our challenge asan association representing the industry that will make
a lot of the products is tomake sure the government has policies which focus
on specific harms, but don't makeeverything illegal, and make sure that new
(03:20):
entrants can come into the marketplace.AI is something that can be there's a
lot of good already we can seejust on the path forward. For example,
in healthcare. Medical researchers will notonly discover new cures for diseases,
but they'll be able to treat everybodyat some point with a customized treatment that
will allow them to get healthy,quicker and safer and with greater statistic loves
(03:43):
of surviving. And of course,with the timeless vehicles, as you know,
the passenger car could not only itcan empower those with disabilities, older
Americans, and it will also createa whole new industry, a new focus
that will allow people to do thingsin a way they've never done before,
which is really very exciting. Andwe'll also see it in the fact that
(04:05):
we have a cute driver shortage fortruck drivers in the United States. We're
looking, you know, over sixtyfour thousand truck drivers short right today.
But it's not getting any better.And obviously there's sustainability efficiency and most significantly
I think for the world, isthey're safer. You know, with one
million people dying around the world eachyear and multiples more being disabled, think
(04:29):
about how they'll reduce a strain onour hospital system, on our tow trucks,
on our collision repair shops. Andyeah, we'll cause some job this
location but you know, as Iheard said recently, it won't take away
jobs, but those people that willget the jobs will be using AI,
and those that don't know how touse AI in some way that may be
something they'd have to choose pretty muchpretty different occupation. So, Gary,
(04:56):
just on this topic of autonomous vehiclesand the application of AI for us within
the autonomous challenge, we've tried tomake autonomous vehicles exciting, but also to
carry a very specific message, whichis, if an autonomous vehicle can drive
at one hundred and eighty miles anhour and pass another autonomous vehicles safely and
(05:19):
effectively, then it's probably capable ofavoiding a collision or an accident on a
highway at seventy miles an hour.And how can we find these use cases
like autonomous vehicles and saving lives onhighway accidents where AI is clearly for good
(05:40):
and elevate those storylines, elevate thoseapplications of AI in a more public way,
in a more exciting way. Howdo we how do we elevate those
stories and make them more make peoplemore aware of the good use cases,
the good applications of AI and hiscees a venue to do that, I
(06:01):
guess is another part of that question. Well, certainly AI will be a
big part of CES twenty twenty fourour discussions self driving. Clearly you help
make it center stage. I thinkthat's important. The Biden administration is definitely
to emphasize self driving in the favorof electric vehicles. So AI is basically
a way of becoming a more reasonablemiddle ground that will make a difference.
(06:26):
We could give the use cases.We certainly see a ton of them at
CES. We'll see even more withgenerative AI, and people will see the
benefits those with diseases that are rarethat maybe can't be cured that easily.
And of course self driving itself,it's just the case is so obvious.
There are some barriers we face.I mean, for example, in self
driving vehicles. We're the only majordeveloped nation that doesn't have a national AI
(06:49):
policy. Congress has not passed anylegislation this sets out a strategy for AI.
So the states are filling the gapand that's causing enormous problems. And
just test you can't you know,drive from one state to another very easily.
You might have to change your licenseplates and what you do and there's
different rules. That's unacceptable and it'sjust a shame. Where are they getting
(07:10):
it right? You're saying that interms of the landscape of self driving vehicle
legislation and regulation that us you knowwhy, we seem to be doing fairly
well in the development and validation ofthe tech, but we're not creating the
structures and the regulatory environment that willallow that tech to be deployed effectively as
(07:32):
quickly as we should. Are.You seeing parts of the world where they
are doing it well that we shouldbe looking to as examples. You know,
Europe and China are doing a greatjob. China, you know,
they don't care about privacy, soforget that they don't have trial ears,
so forget that they have a nationalstrategy they have encouraging it. Same thing
in Europe as well. They've figuredit out that this is AI at least
(07:56):
for self driving if that's what we'retalking about specifically, is they have they
have a policy the EU which encouragesself driving and we're behind. And it's
not that the Obama administration and theTrump and the Biden administration at the federal
level. They're trying, but theyneed to change the laws from Congress so
that not every car has to havea steering wheel. I mean, from
(08:18):
an energy efficiency point of view,if a car doesn't have to have a
steering wheel and all the things adriver needs and the dashboard and all that,
you say, take a lot ofmoney out of the car. It
becomes more efficient. But I'll behonest, the unions don't like that.
They want to build so they betweenthem and the trial lawyers, the Biden
administration and the Democrats in Congress havenot been that favorable towards that. But
(08:41):
there's Look, there's bipartisan legislation thatliterally went through the House unanimously a few
years ago to die in the Senate, and they're trying to get that resurrected
pretty much, and there's a goodchance that will happen. I've testified out
it now a couple of times.It's interesting. But AI generally, though,
if you get step back and goto the big picture away from just
self driving folks and artificial intelligence,which is broader in so many ways.
(09:03):
I mean, that's that's what fliesaeroplanes now. Uh. And and Americans,
Uh, they want artificial intelligence,but they want some safeguards because they've
heard the horror story. So we'vebeen we've been working as an organization.
We work with the National Institute ofStandis and Technology and the Biden administration,
and we're looking at different things tosupport responsible and trustworthy AI. It's really
(09:26):
important out there. So I thinkwe are aligned with Europe on some of
these things, and that's what we'readvocating is let's go with our friends on
a lot of these these issues.Let's work together. Before we move on
from from this topic of the applicationsof AI that are for good. I'm
just thinking about the CTA and youryour annual you know, global event of
(09:46):
cs as really one of the placeswhere so many technologies emerge and and people
interact with for the first time.So you think about the Internet of things,
the IoT revolution when it showed up, it shows up in these consumer
electronics, right, and it's theapplication of IoT to some consumer product,
and it's some either large company that'sinnovating or it's some startup that's bringing a
(10:11):
product. You're going to see thesame thing with AI because whether it's generative
AI, whether it's even autonomy,like the Rumba was existing long before autonomous
cars were on the road, right, there was plenty of robotics deployed in
consumer products, so I think thesame thing's true with AI. And you
(10:31):
know, CEES and these these wonderfulyou know, big tent mix of companies
that come every year and showcase theirtheir their hardware and their software solutions.
You guys are really at the cuttingedge because that technology environment and platform you
represent is the early adopter of somany things. And so I just I
(10:56):
can't wait to see CS twenty fourto twenty five. I've and and and
the explosion I know is going tooccur of AI applications being showcased. Absolutely,
you're correct. CES is the wherethe future is shown, and we
will see that in different applications becauseconsumers can understand and appreciate that at the
(11:18):
same time, whether it's factory automationor even for example, Sweet Greens announcing
that they're going to be using roboticsin AI to make the salads in the
future and in all their fast foodstores, their salad places. You're pretty
hot around the country. Now.They're good. They're good. Consumers will
see the benefit and the changes,and you know, we're not replacing humans,
(11:39):
We're just making them more efficient.And more productive. We're an American
trade association. We benefit from thefact that we're in the US. The
US has a great advantage of havingone big marketplace for the most part,
with one language, and it's it'sin a lot of investment, capital and
extraordinarily creative people that our culture encouragesto innovate and create and do great things.
(12:01):
And we see that obviously in Indianapoliswith you guys. You know,
you're taking the bill by the horns. You're seeing where things are going and
you're figuring out how to deal withit. And I respect and admire that
because that's important for the culture andeconomy of our country that we approach problems
like that. You mentioned a coupleof times the different roles that the industry
plays in developing technology, the rolethat government plays, and you sit at
(12:24):
a very interesting crossroads between the twoas a liaison between the technology companies and
the government that's looking to try andpotentially regulate or at least understand this technology
as it begins to emerge. Soto be at the cutting edge of something
like this, we don't know whatthe outcome is going to be. We
don't know what all the potential usecases of this will be what is your
(12:48):
role, What is the role ofthe CTA to try and make sure that
that balance that you're talking about isstruck between the innovation on one side and
the oversight that is required to makesure this is done responsibly. Well,
thanks for that question. It's areally important one for us. Our fundamental
mission is to encourage innovation, especiallyin the US, and that's why we
have the CEES, that's why wedo standards, that's why we do all
(13:11):
sorts of consumer research, and obviouslyour public policy efforts. But in the
public policy area, you know,our view is the US should lead the
world on AI policy, and thatmeans you have an organized national approach,
which is what Americans want, andthat requires leadership and policies that are friendly
to innovation, that allows investment andexperimentation, that's flexible and adaptable, that
(13:33):
allows small players to get into themarketplace. And that's a fundamental plank of
our organization is we always have tobe there for the startups. That's why
we have Eureka Park at CES withover a thousand startups each year. I
don't disagree with you that having anational policy a north star if you will
that the entire industry and country andentrepreneurs and investors can get behind. Is
(13:58):
the goal that we want to strivetowards, and you're fighting that fight.
But let's assume it doesn't happen.Let's assume that Congress continues to be at
gridlock and we can't get there.What can or should states be doing to
fill that void? And are youseeing examples of that? And can states
work with CTA? Can we leverageCEES. I know there's a big delegation
(14:20):
that we're bringing out from the stateof Indiana that is part of the Indian
Economic Development Corporation that'll be out atCS twenty twenty four. But you know,
do you see some of this fallingback to innovative and creative states as
a result of the lack of actionat the federal level. Yeah, that's
a great observation, and I thinkyou're correct that states can distinguish themselves by
(14:43):
encouraging innovation with policies. In fact, we grade every state every two years
as to how innovation friendly they arein various criteria. One of the criteria
is their focus on self driving,whether they encourage it or not or they
discourage it and as much as IYou know, California has a lot of
crazy laws, but their self drivingapproach has actually been in many ways exemplary.
They have a lot of things goingon there. You mentioned some other
(15:07):
states, including Indiana, which arevery friendly towards self driving, and they
pay attention to that. We alsodo the same thing, by the way,
with countries around the world. Werank them every couple of years on
how innovation friendly they are, andhaving just spent the two trips to Europe
in the last month, they payattention to those rankings. They want to
be considered innovative. So we tryto use a carrot and stick approach.
(15:28):
CES is another approach. We alwaysdistinguish the government officials that have been to
cs versus those that have not.Those that have been to CSSE the promise
of innovations, the promise of selfdriving. They see what AI and generative
AI can do and they get excitedby it and they realize that life can
be made better. Plus, wehad a really good assist from the United
(15:48):
Nations. Just a few weeks ago. I was in New York at the
opening of the General Assembly and wehad a press conference with the United Nations
Top Technology Official, and we werehappy to announce that. In addition to
the human security that we had talkedabout at CEES twenty twenty three in juneure
and Las Vegas, which is focusedon food production and access to healthcare and
as well as clean air and cleanwater, they've now added a specific human
(16:12):
security focused on technology. When you'reout proselytizing about the benefits of AI,
one of the pushbacks you often get, as you alluded to earlier, is
the potential for replacing the human inthe workplace or what have you. The
replacement of the human component, Andas you've talked about earlier, there are
ways that that can be mitigated andin many ways it creates more opportunities for
(16:37):
the human And I think we havean interesting microcosm with our autonomous race car
within the racing industry. Right peoplelook at the race car that's autonomous and
they think, well, you're takingthe racing driver out of the race car,
when in fact that's not what IA SE is about. We get
asked every single interview without fail,you know, are you trying to replace
(16:57):
the human race car driver? Andthe answers is no, we're trying to
actually develop technologies that would make ahuman race car driver faster and safer.
Right, And the reality is,we don't just need autonomous cars to drive
around, we need them to drivearound with people in them. Right.
So, I think if you thinkabout the fighter pilot that's flying an F
(17:21):
thirty five, the blending of humanability with AI, the ability to now
not just operate this incredible piece ofinnovation and machinery which can more or less
fly itself, but then to evenadd into that the potential for that same
operator to be managing drones that maybe operating in parallel with it. You
(17:45):
said this earlier, Gary, It'snot that it's not that AI replaces humans.
It's that it augments human ability,and it creates situations in which a
single human may be a to dothings that otherwise feel like they're you know,
you have to have a superpower toaccomplish, right. You can operate
(18:06):
something in darkness, you can youknow, you can process information in a
different way. So that is partof the message we carry with UH within
the autonomous Challenge. And it's funnybecause you know, there's not that many
human race car drivers in the world, right or at least not that many
that are that are that are legallysupposed to be racing their cars. And
(18:26):
so, you know, we getasked all the time, is that what
you're doing, you're coming after theirjobs or you look in to replace them.
So it's the same conversation that you'regoing to have if you're developing AI
in a taxi application or a truckingapplication, or maybe to work at a
uh, you know, fast foodstore. How do you think about the
(18:48):
you know, celebrating these situations whereAI is enhancing human competencies in capabilities,
and how do we carry that messageforward. I don't know if you have
any any thought or reflections on that. I agree with what you're saying in
many ways. I mean, forexample, I think I heard this from
part of your team or someone associatedwith you that made total sense to me.
(19:11):
Is that if you think about it, you know, when an ambulance
picks up a seriously sick person witha heart attack or a stroke, you
know there's the magic few minutes theyhave to get treatment or they die.
And obviously, you know fast movingambulances, you know there's accidents and AI
what you're doing in a high speedenvironment is helping them develop. Many,
(19:33):
not most, of the new carsbrought today in the United States have some
form of clusion avoidance, whether it'spassive or active, and that's already saving
people's lives when that doesn't mean thedrivers are ending and the human capability and
the opportunity to enhance it in away and do things safely, even in
the racing world, is something whichwill save lives. You know. One
of the things we've noticed with IndyAutonomous Challenge is this fusion of different technologies
(20:00):
coming together. And we're spending alot of time talking about AI and AI
is mostly a software coded thing,but an autonomous race car like we have
running at one hundred and eighty milesan hour or more, it has all
kinds of teket It has sensor fusion, machine learning, It has you know,
advanced actuators and drive by wire systems. It has you know, high
(20:26):
throughput computing, ultralow latency communication,wireless communication. So I'm wondering about this
fusion of technologies that used to beviewed as oh, well, that's a
relevant technology for automotive, or that'sa relevant technology for life sciences, or
that's a relevant technology for consumer electronics, but those barriers seem to be breaking
(20:49):
down. Is there is there suchthing as sector specific technology anymore? Or
is technology becoming so cross cutting thatthat it's not a sector based phenomenon anymore.
That's a great question, and Ithink there is an answer, and
I think that innovation doesn't occur insolos anymore. It's every breakthrough in one
(21:12):
technology influences advances and others. Andwe have designed cees and we viewed CS
as a platform. It's a kinto a media platform and where the curator
or the editor, so we presentthings. And we've been building CS with
a plan for over twenty years nowon the basis that all these different verticals
from mobility to healthcare, to semiconductorsto content creation and many others all affect
(21:37):
each other. And these people haveto talk to each other at a senior
level for innovation to occur, becauseif you think about what innovation is,
it's really putting two disparate things togetherto create something new which has benefit.
That's why CS and our view hasbecome essential for the innovators around the world,
is because they could get together oneplace for four days because whether it's
you know, artificial intelligence, machinelearning, algorithms, stuff on the edge
(21:59):
or as you talk about sensor andfusion. These are all the infrastructure of
the future of the digital world thatis going to make life better and they
are horizonal. They move across fromone industry vertical to another. And the
skills that actually the CEOs and leadersin business need now, you know,
it used to be very focused onone area like engineering or accounting or HR
(22:21):
or something else, and now it'sthe ability to step above all that and
see the bigger picture, to reachout, to go cross cultural, to
develop, find out where the bestpeople are, to be a motivator,
to be a leader by example,to have you know, but also the
human element is and loss, especiallywith what the world's been going through the
last few years with COVID and theconflicts we're seeing, is that you need
(22:42):
to be able to have some humanresources skills and to be able to deal
with people, to lead people,to inspire, to encourage, to share,
to share some genuine feeling with people. One closing question, comment and
question as CTA is an American organization, and CEES is a US American event,
(23:03):
and Indy Autonomous Challenge is a USevent, and yet we know that
that in order for us to dowhat we're doing, we have to have
these deep and broad connections with companiesand universities and governments around the world.
And you know, CEES, you'vehad this great relationship the last couple of
years with United Nations, and youtravel a lot right through throughout the world.
(23:29):
And yet this marquee event is inthe US, It's in Las Vegas,
it's always in January. It attractsthis massive audience, but you know
that you can't reach everybody in LasVegas in January in the United States.
I know that you guys do havethese kind of satellite activities and events and
(23:49):
activations in other parts of the world, but it just it strikes me that,
you know, if there was away for the to bottle up what
CEES achieved eves during those four importantdays and to to put it in locations
where it could reach a broader market, it could reach more companies. You
(24:11):
know, how do you guys approachthat. I'm sure I'm sure that you
get asked all the time by differentgovernments or different companies to say, you
know, move CEES here or Imean, we've seen that in some cases
where you know, major auto showshave moved from a country to another country.
Recently, in Qatar they had theGeneva Auto Show that was going on
(24:34):
as part of their Formula one events. So I just curious sort of how
do you how do you balance theimportance of of of kind of a US
market focus, which is also ourfocus, with this need to reach a
broader audience. We did it byrunning a race in Manza. We all,
I don't know if we've talked sincethat has happened, but you know,
(24:56):
we we have been holding races onlyin the United States, and we
decided, okay, we've got somuch interest in other parts of the world,
so we ran an event in Manzain Italy. But just curious about
your thoughts on the global influence thatCEES has and how do you take advantage
of that. Well, we arean American group when we count Canada as
(25:17):
being our ally, so we haveCanadian American companies. You have to be
either based in or have an officein Canada or the US to be part
of our association. But the showis broader than that. And as long
as you're not right now a Russianexhibitor, I think you're welcome and you
know, no violations of US laws. There's various lists that our federal government
has created, and we don't allowexhibitors from those lists. But what we
(25:41):
do is we already have we area global event. We have more than
one out of three attendees come fromoutside the United States, and that's very
important to us. We've got alot of direct flights from around the world
that are going to Las Vegas,and we expect a very very strong turnout
in January. But we also havefive thousand or so pressed that come to
the show. We count on themto get the word out throughout the world,
(26:03):
and that's been a very effective strategy. We had an event three weeks
ago in Paris, same thing.It was very successful, especially focusing on
Starbucks. And I'm going to Koreaon Saturday, and we don't have an
event there yet, but I'm surewe'll get requests and have discussions about that
because Korea is actually a country shockingfor me to even discovered. They're second
(26:27):
most now after the US in termsof participation in CS with They had almost
four hgeed exhibitors in twenty twenty threeand probably more in twenty twenty four.
Wonderful. It's been a fascinating discussion. Thank you so much for your insight
and your time, and can't waitto see you and everything that you have
in store in Las Vegas come January. Thank you. We look forward to
(26:48):
seeing you guys the Indianapolis. Aton of his challenge in Vegas very exciting.
We will be there again as always. That was Gary Shapiro, CEO
of the Consumer Technology Association and Masterof Ceremonies for CES. Before we go
off and explore the sprawling maze thatis this year's showcase, we hope that
(27:14):
Gary, Paul and I have sharedsome insight into the question of where the
combination of autonomous vehicles, collaborative innovation, and responsible policy will land. Next
week, we'll share our conversation withretired four star Air Force General Gene Renuart
to talk about why autonomous racing isa national security asset for the United States.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark
My Favorite Murder is a true crime comedy podcast hosted by Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark. Each week, Karen and Georgia share compelling true crimes and hometown stories from friends and listeners. Since MFM launched in January of 2016, Karen and Georgia have shared their lifelong interest in true crime and have covered stories of infamous serial killers like the Night Stalker, mysterious cold cases, captivating cults, incredible survivor stories and important events from history like the Tulsa race massacre of 1921. My Favorite Murder is part of the Exactly Right podcast network that provides a platform for bold, creative voices to bring to life provocative, entertaining and relatable stories for audiences everywhere. The Exactly Right roster of podcasts covers a variety of topics including historic true crime, comedic interviews and news, science, pop culture and more. Podcasts on the network include Buried Bones with Kate Winkler Dawson and Paul Holes, That's Messed Up: An SVU Podcast, This Podcast Will Kill You, Bananas and more.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.