October 23, 2023 • 30 mins
In this episode, Parth & Abdul interviewed Julian Khursigara, who is the co-founder of Search Party Property. They discussed Julian's upbringing, personal believes and motivations, and what problem his company aims to solve.
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(00:00):
In a guess being a zoom,you could just just cut it up.
Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen.Welcome back to the Investors Podcast, where
we help you work smarter and harderby providing weekly market of days and insights.
Today's a very special episode because afterseveral weeks, we have another special
guest on the podcast, Julian Causigar. Julian Casigar is a property investment advisor
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who had who helps busy professionals buildproperty portfolios by providing strategic investment plans,
buy your Agency services and property investmentcoaching. He also offers a ten step
program for first time property investors.Julian is a passionate is passionate, but
helping people achieve their financial goals throughproperty investing. That's enough for me.
I'll let Julian introduce herself. Welcometo the podcast, Julian, Thank you
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Dil thanks for the intro. Awesomeyou can tell our viewers a little bit
about yourself. Yeah sure so.I'm as Abdul said, a Buye's Agent
or a BYAS advocate based in Sydney, Australia. Our core reason for being
is to assist property investors and homebuyers to achieve their goals, and we
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do that through setting up the strategyfor their for their portfolios, understanding their
background, their pain points, theirneeds, construct that full needs analysis and
then put the strategy together and thentalk about the buying brief and start hitting
the hitting the road to to findtheir right properties. We tend to buy
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in key sort of major city areasright now. We're focused due to you
know, the correct data points andteam allocation in Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane
and Perth. Okay, So,given your experience in the Australian real estate
market, from your perspective, whatare the current latest trends and developments in
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the Australian housing market with you know, rising inflation, rising interest rates and
well there's a lot of concerns surroundingthese. So what are your thoughts on
that and how that impacts the market. Yeah, it's been an interesting ride
definitely since you know, the lastcouple of years since COVID. Really the
back of COVID, we saw thisbig boom happen at the end of twenty
twenty and into twenty twenty one.Obviously that cooling, then the fiscal cooling
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kicked in which when we had tenmonths in a row of interest rates hikes,
and that really put a dampener anda cooling on the market. We
really saw our business take a realdownturn in just the investor activity and investor
interest. I guess is panic.The press of a big part to play
in our business in the good timesand not so good times, and with
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the negativity that was in the marketplace, it was a really you know,
a different type of market that cameout of such a buoyant period that we
had in twenty twenty one and theearly parts of twenty twenty two. But
since then, you know, we'vesince settled a lot of we're still you
know, still the business is stillrunning and running very well. In that
period, what we found more sophisticatedinvestors were coming to us. So investors
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had always have money of see youknow, good incomes, good jobs,
good good yeal capital growth, goodequity in their properties, and they came
out of the market and started tobuy during that time, probably the first
few months for three four months,very quiet, and then once they saw
everything was the dust was settling,they came in and started to buy.
The sophisticated investor and we're probably buyingat a higher price point, pretty closer
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to a million dollars rather than youknow that sort of mid range where we
were buying sat in Perth and evenin parts of Brisbane for that six fifty
range. And then as as wegot into later in the mid and mid
into this year and we saw thepaws on the rates and the floodgates opened,
and you know, once the pressstart talking positively and people start talking
at barbecues about property investment, reallysee the market open up. And we
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just had our busiest quarter that weactually ever had in the last the last
three months past. So yeah,we're feeling very buoyant about the industry,
about the sector and really seeing thatthe smart investors getting out there and not
waiting, you know, for thenext boom to happen, or or listening
to too much of the white noisewhere we're hearing a lot about you know,
property market's going to crash you tothe mortgage cliff that's about to come.
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Well, yeah, congratulations for forfor your for your amazing quorder.
So we understand that the you guysattract smart investors and people that have money
all the time. Do you haveany advice for the average investor, the
average individual that's looking to enter thepoppy market in Australia giving its current dynamics
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today. Yeah, Bill, Iwould actually say, our our our average
or our eighty twenty principle, eightypercent of our clients are the mum and
dad investors. You know, they'renot We're not talking doctors and lawyers,
and you know that that that ilk. We're talking mom and dad investors.
So eighty percent of our clients,you know, we're buying four bedroom homes.
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The average budget is around about thatsix fifty seven hundred range, so
you know we're not talking for threemillion dollar properties. We're talking that average
price point that gets them into themarket to either start their investment portfolio or
continue to grow their portfolio using equitydraws from their previous purchases. God,
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and you said and mentioned that youoperate in a few different regions try in
Melboyn, Sydney, in Brisbane,and et cetera. So are there any
regional variations or emerging markets that youhave noticed and that investors should also be
aware of. Yeah, I mean, I guess in terms of you know,
we're definitely already seeing the emergence ofsay a Perth market for example.
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So you know, we all studythe data. We look at what's happening
for different macro and micro elements suchas in a migration, infrastructure, government,
spand new industries. And so Iwent to Perth for example, two
years ago, eighteen months ago,roughly eighteen months ago, spent a couple
of weeks there, met with thecounselors, met with local governments officials,
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met with developers, traveled up ateastern is, the north and West to
look at different property areas and realizethat Perth is ready to go again.
Background being that Perth had a realyou know, it's a bit of a
boom and bust sort of town.We get these really great booms and we
have these busts and mining tends tofalter. So yeah, we feel very
confident with that. And we thenhired a couple of people in the Perth
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market because the Western Australians are prettypatriotic, so we knew we had to
hire someone local and that really gotour p Perth business moving. And yeah,
we're now probably our biggest We're buyingmore properties in Perth anywhere else right
now, Brisbane is still steady andstrong. We're definitely point about Brisbane with
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what's coming up, you know,again a huge migration shift we've had,
you know, a big domestic migrationas well. Victorians are still pouring up
into into Queensland, particularly you knowthe Gold Coast Sunshine Coast regions, which
is still voting well for the capitalgrowth and that sort of push and squeeze
of how and obviously rental demand aswell. Thank you for that overview.
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Understanding the larger market context is crucialfor our listeners. But let's dive into
how search property party property fits intothis landscape. How does how does your
approach at search party stand out,especially in the face of the current market
dynamics with UH with new opportunities.Like you said, yeah, I guess
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the core principle of our business isalways based on the on on building the
individual strategy for each of our clients. So as opposed to taking the view
off, we're just going to moveclients wherever we want to buy, wherever
we're finding we have a team orwe enjoy buying with. We actually take
that time to initially sort of havewhat we call a property investment assessment of
each client, really understand them,get them to talk a lot at the
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beginning, get to understand where they'reat, where they're headed, their goals,
that desires, their pain points,so we can really get get into
their mind and then try to assistand pull that out from there. So
we actually don't even talk about propertyprobably for the first thirty minutes of that
conversation, because it's really about themand us explaining how we put strategy together
to help them through their to achievetheir goals. I see. So I'm
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just looking at this from a perspectiveof if I was a client, what
would I want? And the firstquestion that comes to mind is what is
your background? What sort of credibilityhave you garnered in your career so far?
Can you walk us through from like, you know, your first job
to today, what does that journeylook like for you? Geez, I'm
gonna have to go turn back theclock. Yeah, well, I finished
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school and didn't do X, didn'tdo that great at high school, but
you know, like a good Indianson, listened to my father and he
said, become an accountant, son. So I started doing accounting for two
years and realized I didn't really likethe the accounting side, the ledgers side,
but I really enjoyed the economics andprobably like you guys, the economic
side and the marketing particularly attracted me. So I left that that course,
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went into the workforce, walked workedinto actually got a job as a courier
like the Gopher office goper in thelargest travel company in Australia, and yeah,
I just really enjoyed that experience.And I was always very inquisitive and
nosey and used to read everything thatI got my hands on, and then
ended up finishing my studies in marketing, tourism, marketing, and yeah,
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it was that industry for probably anotherseven or eight years. Went from airlines
to so I went from that travelindustry into hotel into airlines and worked in
airlines in always in sales and marketingroles, and then went into hotels,
which is probably the best training gownfor me. Just that really high,
excellent standard of service, which Ithink resonated well with me. I enjoyed
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that. You know, there's almostthat friendly competition between all of us how
do we over achieve and how dowe over impress our clients every day?
And that's something that's probably stuck withme throughout my career, and I think
it was boughtant for me to giveme that discipline early in my you know,
and I was really my twenties atthat stage. And then from there
I moved into still in a salesrole, into one of the Australia's largest
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loyalty marketing companies. So what wedid there was run at the loyalty programs
for the likes of the biggest banksin Australia and zed Westpac American Express.
We also ran customer engagement programs andcustomer experience programs likes of Telstra Optics,
so some really big the biggest playersin the country really and that business was
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really started to grow. Other thangiven the opportunity to go to actually live
in India and Mumbai for three yearswith my family and we set up a
company. My wife actually worked forthe company as well, so we set
up India's first premium loyalty credit cardprogram and did that for three years,
signed up for the biggest banks inIndia and had about ten thousand merchants on
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board, and then came back toAustralia and had that entrepreneurial bug in me
obviously got that opportunity to be anentrepreneur really to set up a business.
Although you got the backing of abig company back home, but you were
able. We had to start fromscratching, you know, one in the
in the country and so yeah,I started a technology business around car logbooks,
automating the car logbook experience. Raiseda bunch of money lost that money
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had to go back to the corporateworld. Did a couple of more jobs
for large international companies setting up theirbusinesses in Australia. So I really loved
that startup feel and you know,getting in my hands dirty across all elements
of the business. So I didthat for another five years for two large
companies and then yeah, then Iwas made redundant and that was my that
was that was a gap for meto make the leap. You know,
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I always felt I had the goldenhandcuffs on my myself to you know,
working for the corporate's well paid jobs. Kids in private schools very hard to
let go of that big income.But you know, my wife was very
supportive and allowed me to follow youknow, my dreams, which is always
to be an entrepreneur, and particularlythe property market, which is where my
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passion was as we throughout that periodof work in the corporate world build a
large portfolio with my wife and sothat was something I always wanted to do.
And yeah, bumped into my anold colleague of mine, Luke,
who's now my business partner, andthe rest is history. As they say,
thank you very much for sharing that. You're impressive your impressive professional journey.
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It's clear that you know your experienceshave really helped you gain a valuable
insight. But let's dive deeper intosome key aspects of your business. So
what sets you guys apart from traditionalproperty investment strategies in Australia. I think
a couple of two of the keythings that we see, you know,
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the feedback we get from clients thatether coming to us some other other buyers
agents. One is I think reallysetting that taking that time to understand the
client and really getting that strategy right. It's a really big big element for
us to set them at the sceneat the beginning, build out a ten
year twenty rear portfolio using different softwareprograms as well, like a company call
game plans from their customer service isa big deal. I know probably everyone
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says we've got great customer service.But it was actually one of the areas
we built initially in the business beforewe set up a wholesale stream. We
actually set up the customer engagement schemeand hired our customer lead, customer service
lead, and farr And really builtthat out, and she just built that
bit by bit and it's just gota beautiful flow all the way through.
We have, you know, seventypercent of our clients or repeat clients.
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Now eighty percent of our clients arereferrals as well, So that proves that
investment, you know, obviously abig investment to hire someone full time in
that role when you probably don't havethe business to counter that, but it's
paying off handsomely for us now.So I say customer service, I guess
strategy customer service third one or wouldbe having boots on the ground, as
we say, or having people onthe ground. So again, a lot
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of our count our colleagues, maybesmaller ones or new entrances to the market,
will just vibe from behind the deaththrough the Internet and then use we
use a real estate agent or theproperty manager to do their inspections. We
find that's a little bit of conflictbecause the real estate agent gets paid by
the seller. We get paid bythe buyer, so it's our job to
do those inspections and making sure thatproperty is the right property for us to
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invest in. So we've obviously doneall the data work, which is external,
which is a lot of the numbercrunching that you guys plealy do day
to day. But we still dohave someone on the ground, one of
our team that we can put ahand on our heart and say we've inspected
the property and we're happy for usto proceed with negotiating. So they're probably
the three key points, got it? And what sort of properties do you
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look at? And how do youinvest or how do you assess their investment
potential? Yes, I guess twoparts of that question. One is what
type of properties. Again, it'snot a one trick pony approach, so
I would say ninety nine percent ofour properties that we are selling our houses,
so mining land with a house ontop, so we're not into apartments.
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We've had sold many blocks of apartments. We've sold what we call walk
up apartments, so not but wedon't buy high rise apartments off the plan
apartments, house and land packages we'refocusing more on the established end of the
market, and so that can vary. We've bought three hundred thousand dollar properties
and we've also bought five million dollarproperties, so there's no real one size
fits all in our approach in howwe go about that. So what was
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the second part of the question,It was how do you assess their investment
potential? So, yeah, howwe assess that is through I guess a
whole bunch of data, analytics andfocuses. So I guess we've put that
in two parts toget the macro andthe microdata. So the macro data would
be software that we subscribe to.You know, we probably spend tens of
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thousand dollars a year on software aloneand looking at the different types of data.
So there's various brands out there,the biggest ones in the world like
core Logic, Happy Data, Hatetag DSR. So a lot of these
ones are crunching different algorithms, maybethirty forty algorithms to assess suburb data.
So from obviously national, country,state suburb data. So that's one angle
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that we look at. Looking atheat mapping, where the metrics are positive,
you know, the clear metrics likeinfrastructure, span, transport, schooling.
Then we can use census and theABS to have a look more around
the type of people are living inthe area, what's their social economic scores,
what's the vacancy rates, what's theirsalaries, where are they from,
what's their nationalities. We also lookat metrics such as the difference between renters
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and homeowners in a market. Wepredominantly think growth appears where we have more
occupiers in a suburb rather than renters. So these are all those metrics that
we look at to decide that anarea is good to buy in and then
obviously gets down into the street levelto fund the right property. Awesome,
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So could you walk us through howfrom the start to beginning, the beginning
to the end of the investment theproperty investment process. If I'm a family
of four and I have let's seea budget of seven hundred thousand dollars,
could you walk us through how itstarts from the strategy development, to the
ongoing support and to the eventual buyingof the property. Yeah, I better
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do this quickly because that's quite along process. But initially it is going
through that property investment assessment where weunderstand the client, their goals, their
strategies. We would then present ourbusiness modeling, display how we analyze data,
actually share the deals that we're buyingas well, so we're very open
booking and transparent in what we do. We talk about the areas of buying,
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the suburbs are buying, the typeof deals we're buying, and we're
happy and glad to share that.We're not trying to hide anything if a
client or a prospect wants to goand do it themselves. You know,
a lot of people can buy property, so it can be done. It's
a lot of hard work, butit can be done. So we're happy
to share where we're buying and whereour expertise takes us. From there,
we send through a proposal which analyzesall the all the information that we put
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together, wraps all that up,gives them a you know, a summary
page of their goals and what wecan do for them within a within a
larger document. From there, werebook, have another meeting and the client
will then decide if they wish tojoin our community and become a client.
Once I become a client, awhole new process starts again, so that
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you know the welcome emails and thewelcome pacts come in intermixed, and then
we sit down and within a coupleof days have a strategy session. So
it's another session about an hour's worthit myself and my acquisition lead and strategist
David, and we sit down andgo through the strategy in detail of how
we're going to extend the strategy outfrom the initial overview that within the in
the assessment to now putting putting pento paper, so to speak, and
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stretching that over the short term,what are we going to buy here in
right now, and then look atthat over maybe a ten or twenty year
period depending on the age. Likeyou said, it could be a family
for looking to buy, so whatis the strategy for that, So that
could be something that looks like twentyyear plan. We need to look at
the incomes. Are any more kidscoming along because there could be a gap
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in incomes there. We need toascertain schooling for example private schools versus topic
schools. It's an important element ofa budget because if we're planning a ten
or twenty year strategy, that's abig chunk of your income is going to
go towards education. Site, whichmay mean you're not going to be able
to buy property during that time,so we might front end or front load
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their strategy by trying to buy twoor three properties in that maybe first three
to five years, maybe before highschool and private school fees, and then
it may be a gap of buyingproperty because of the ability to obtain finance.
But if they're able to obviously makemoney through that period through capital growth
and the properties we bought, wecan then extract equity and go again.
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So we're not all about, youknow, by ten properties in ten years.
It's not about for us about thequantity of your properties. It's really
about the quality. Because you canachieve your game plan or your end game,
which could be set to say twohundred thousand incremental revenue with four or
five properties. You don't need tohave ten properties to do that. We
oh, thank you for walking usthrough that example. I can tell us
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quite a long process, but Iappreciate the detail you went into. So,
given that you've been in the industryfor quite some time and have been
running this firm for quite some time, could you share details about one of
the most interesting or your most successfuldeals or something that just some deal that
you were just really proud of overthe last two to three years. Yeah,
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to be honest, the deals thatI remember the most. Obviously,
we're selling hundreds of properties years.It's hard to remember all of them.
But are the ones that, youknow, the people that remind me.
Obviously, the clients that get toknow better. Some of the clients that
maybe have a bit of a Iwouldn't say a hard luck story, but
just haven't got you know, bigjobs, or it may not be a
couple, it may not be youknow, some a lot of people have
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inheritance and things like that. Butone particular lady who's a single mom with
a small I think the child isfour or five years old, and you
know, it was just a littlebit scared, apprehensive about getting to the
property market. But you know,so we had a few calls that took
a little bit of time to beconvinced that if she let's go of her
deposit that she had and takes aloan to buy a first property, you
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know she was going to succeed.So but we you know, took it
easy, walked it through. Wefeel that these are really a partnership.
It's not this sort of client relationshipsreally out a partnership. So we like
to educate our clients along the journeyif that's what they want, so really
explain through the process what we're doing. Also, we produce every deal we
present to a client is in adue diligence report. That's a very detailed
report covering all those data points thatI mentioned in a report for each property.
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It takes us at least two hoursto produce each of those reports,
present that to a client, workthrough it with the client why we like
the property. If they don't likeit, there's no pressure. We move
on and we keep repeating the process. But this client ended up buying a
property with us. This is abouteighteen months ago now in Brisbane in a
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Perth place called Bourbon Carrie. Ithink it was four hundred and forty thousand
dollars and today that property so I'mjust saying just over twelve months is closer
to seven hundred thousand dollars. Soshe made money very quickly and she has
now bought a third property within eighteenmonths. So to me, that's a
really nice story because this mother wasso apprehensive at the start and was a
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little bit scared a little bit worried, I know, are we going to
do a good job for her?She was a reference as well referral,
so she knew who we were.She trusted us, but just didn't trust
the process. But because we explainedthe process, we showed her what a
plan would look like over a periodof time, she took action, which
is the most important word in propertyinvest actually taking action, and she trusted
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the process, trusted us, andyou know, now she's got three properties
from zero, So that's a that'sa I guess this client story that I
remember fondly awesome, and sometimes marketconditions can be unpredictable. You want to
ask, have you ever encountered asituation where you've had to adapt a strategy
and midway through a deal, andif so, how did you how did
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that change the impact of the article. Yeah, it's a really good question.
I guess there have been. Probablyfinance is the economic indicator that does
catch us at times, and it'smainly because the client, you know,
may have gone in for pre approval, got that finance, It may have
may have taken a little bit oftime before they decided what they're going to
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do. We find a lot ofclients will try to buy on their own
first, find out that it's reallyhard work. How do you do that
when you're working full time? Howdo you do that when you're trying to
buy into state. There are waysto do that, but it's not easy
for you know, the average investor. So what can happen is their loan
expires, their pre approval, sowe have to go back in and get
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they have to go back and getthe reapproval. However, during that time,
interest rates could have gone up,the boring, legislative borring rules may
have changed, that bank might havetightened a screw there or two for whatever
reason. And all of a sudden, your budget, let's say it was
six hundred and fifty thousand, isnow six hundred thousand. So as you
said, we have to change tax. So the buying brief that we put
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together, so we're going to buyin this area for this price, may
mean we have to take a relookat that and move a suburb across,
you know, so wait for thatripple effect to hit that suburb. It
just means we might have to rethinkand where we're buying, recalibrate the strategy,
got it, and we're going toask a bit of a personal question,
so feel for you to disclose asmuch as you wish, but and
we asked us to every guest thatcomes on our podcast, what does your
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current personal investment portfolio look like?Is it one hundred percent allocated to real
estate? Is it seventy real estateequities or stocks? And what is that
ratio? Yeah, unfortunately, probablynot a financial planner's dream because we are
one hundred percent real estate. Andthe reason being is we were absolutely torched
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and burnt in the GFC where weinvested a lot of money, you know,
close to half a million dollars cashplus the same amount again through a
credit facility, a margin loan,and then the GFC hit and so you
know what happened to all of thatmoney in within a month's time. And
so that was a real, areal changing of the guard for us in
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our in our mindset in around particularlyaround share investing. And so from that
time onwards we recalibrated and it tooka while to get over that. Obviously
financially we were and we were alsooverseas at that stage during that expat journey.
So when we got back to Australia, then yeah, I said,
well, we're going to go backinto investing. We always knew we were
going to invest in property. Wealready had a couple at that stage and
(26:04):
a home as well, so wewent hard and fast into properties. So
I think when one year we boughtfive properties, mainly because the bank.
Again I always say, finance isking. Finance is very important, far
more important than the property property.We can find finance is really really important.
So it really is a game offinance. And at that time,
the bank's pre raw commission, sothe banks we're handing off a lot of
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loans without a lot of due diligence, and so we took advantage of that,
and I guess looking back, ifwe didn't do that, today would
be in a very different position.All right, awesome. I know this
is a place where we interview you, but we'd like to give our guests
one question to ask us. So, woul do you have any questions do
(26:48):
you want we'd like to ask?Actually, yeah, I've listened to your
podcast I think a month or soago, and you guys were waxing lyric
bill about the property market and whereyou see things are going. You could
understand here your take on the market. Now that we've had three rate pauses
in a row, Where do youthink we're headed in twenty twenty four?
(27:08):
Oh yeah, So I'll start offwith that. So yeah, just echoing
our sentiment that we mentioned in thepodcast in July for the rest of twenty
twenty three, at least in myopinion personally, I do think the industry
is going to continue just booming.Prices are going to go up, especially
in Australia. The real estate market, or the bubble as a lot of
(27:30):
people like to put it, isn'tgoing to pop in my opinion. And
with the new RBA governor who wasjust appointed a couple of weeks ago,
also looking to essentially set her imprinton the economy, I don't think she
will be making any drastic moves toosoon, as such as decreasing height rates
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anytime soon. And Australia as aneconomy is lagging behind the rest and the
rest of the Western countries such asthe US and the European Union and the
UK in terms of their aggressiveness ofthe raid hikes, and so I think
that I would price in another ratehike by the RBA by mid of twenty
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twenty four and only in twenty twentyfive would we see a potential decline in
interest rates. So that's my opinion. What about you, Yeah, I
have a different take. I thinkthese I mean, you do see globally
a lot of federal banks to theU. S. Riverbank and the UK
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Central Bank and actually paused rate hikes. There's questions they might, you know,
increase rates soon. But a lotof people are thinking that the top
is in and I do feel thesame way too, And I feel that
the real estate market is anticipated toperform well, although there is potential risk
for recession and you know global economicdownturn, but little you know result in
(29:00):
use demand. I do feel thetop is infrareds and for investors, i'd
say to remain bullish on the globalbirthstate. Mikey mighty excellent. Now.
I tend to agree with both ofyou on that. I mean, yet
we don't really know what's going tohappen interest rates, but I feel where
our few we're just about there,and I think they're not going to be
(29:23):
too many bullish statements firstly from theappya and too many movements I think at
least into well into that new yearin twenty twenty four. Well, thank
you Julian so much for coming onour podcast. I'm going to wrap up
this episode for today. In today'sepisode, we went quite in depth about
the real estate market, about searchparty property and how they help you from
(29:47):
stage one to stage ten and assessto you in building that real estate investment
portfolio. We will share all therelevant links on our LinkedIn page and on
Spotify, Apple Podcasts and wherebels youcan find out. Thank you so much
for tuning in for today's episode ofthe Investor Daries podcast and we will catch
you next time. Thank you.Peace,
In a guess being a zoom,you could just just cut it up.
Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen.Welcome back to the Investors Podcast, where
we help you work smarter and harderby providing weekly market of days and insights.
Today's a very special episode because afterseveral weeks, we have another special
guest on the podcast, Julian Causigar. Julian Casigar is a property investment advisor
(00:22):
who had who helps busy professionals buildproperty portfolios by providing strategic investment plans,
buy your Agency services and property investmentcoaching. He also offers a ten step
program for first time property investors.Julian is a passionate is passionate, but
helping people achieve their financial goals throughproperty investing. That's enough for me.
I'll let Julian introduce herself. Welcometo the podcast, Julian, Thank you
(00:45):
Dil thanks for the intro. Awesomeyou can tell our viewers a little bit
about yourself. Yeah sure so.I'm as Abdul said, a Buye's Agent
or a BYAS advocate based in Sydney, Australia. Our core reason for being
is to assist property investors and homebuyers to achieve their goals, and we
(01:08):
do that through setting up the strategyfor their for their portfolios, understanding their
background, their pain points, theirneeds, construct that full needs analysis and
then put the strategy together and thentalk about the buying brief and start hitting
the hitting the road to to findtheir right properties. We tend to buy
(01:30):
in key sort of major city areasright now. We're focused due to you
know, the correct data points andteam allocation in Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane
and Perth. Okay, So,given your experience in the Australian real estate
market, from your perspective, whatare the current latest trends and developments in
(01:51):
the Australian housing market with you know, rising inflation, rising interest rates and
well there's a lot of concerns surroundingthese. So what are your thoughts on
that and how that impacts the market. Yeah, it's been an interesting ride
definitely since you know, the lastcouple of years since COVID. Really the
back of COVID, we saw thisbig boom happen at the end of twenty
twenty and into twenty twenty one.Obviously that cooling, then the fiscal cooling
(02:15):
kicked in which when we had tenmonths in a row of interest rates hikes,
and that really put a dampener anda cooling on the market. We
really saw our business take a realdownturn in just the investor activity and investor
interest. I guess is panic.The press of a big part to play
in our business in the good timesand not so good times, and with
(02:36):
the negativity that was in the marketplace, it was a really you know,
a different type of market that cameout of such a buoyant period that we
had in twenty twenty one and theearly parts of twenty twenty two. But
since then, you know, we'vesince settled a lot of we're still you
know, still the business is stillrunning and running very well. In that
period, what we found more sophisticatedinvestors were coming to us. So investors
(02:58):
had always have money of see youknow, good incomes, good jobs,
good good yeal capital growth, goodequity in their properties, and they came
out of the market and started tobuy during that time, probably the first
few months for three four months,very quiet, and then once they saw
everything was the dust was settling,they came in and started to buy.
The sophisticated investor and we're probably buyingat a higher price point, pretty closer
(03:20):
to a million dollars rather than youknow that sort of mid range where we
were buying sat in Perth and evenin parts of Brisbane for that six fifty
range. And then as as wegot into later in the mid and mid
into this year and we saw thepaws on the rates and the floodgates opened,
and you know, once the pressstart talking positively and people start talking
at barbecues about property investment, reallysee the market open up. And we
(03:44):
just had our busiest quarter that weactually ever had in the last the last
three months past. So yeah,we're feeling very buoyant about the industry,
about the sector and really seeing thatthe smart investors getting out there and not
waiting, you know, for thenext boom to happen, or or listening
to too much of the white noisewhere we're hearing a lot about you know,
property market's going to crash you tothe mortgage cliff that's about to come.
(04:08):
Well, yeah, congratulations for forfor your for your amazing quorder.
So we understand that the you guysattract smart investors and people that have money
all the time. Do you haveany advice for the average investor, the
average individual that's looking to enter thepoppy market in Australia giving its current dynamics
(04:28):
today. Yeah, Bill, Iwould actually say, our our our average
or our eighty twenty principle, eightypercent of our clients are the mum and
dad investors. You know, they'renot We're not talking doctors and lawyers,
and you know that that that ilk. We're talking mom and dad investors.
So eighty percent of our clients,you know, we're buying four bedroom homes.
(04:50):
The average budget is around about thatsix fifty seven hundred range, so
you know we're not talking for threemillion dollar properties. We're talking that average
price point that gets them into themarket to either start their investment portfolio or
continue to grow their portfolio using equitydraws from their previous purchases. God,
(05:13):
and you said and mentioned that youoperate in a few different regions try in
Melboyn, Sydney, in Brisbane,and et cetera. So are there any
regional variations or emerging markets that youhave noticed and that investors should also be
aware of. Yeah, I mean, I guess in terms of you know,
we're definitely already seeing the emergence ofsay a Perth market for example.
(05:34):
So you know, we all studythe data. We look at what's happening
for different macro and micro elements suchas in a migration, infrastructure, government,
spand new industries. And so Iwent to Perth for example, two
years ago, eighteen months ago,roughly eighteen months ago, spent a couple
of weeks there, met with thecounselors, met with local governments officials,
(05:57):
met with developers, traveled up ateastern is, the north and West to
look at different property areas and realizethat Perth is ready to go again.
Background being that Perth had a realyou know, it's a bit of a
boom and bust sort of town.We get these really great booms and we
have these busts and mining tends tofalter. So yeah, we feel very
confident with that. And we thenhired a couple of people in the Perth
(06:19):
market because the Western Australians are prettypatriotic, so we knew we had to
hire someone local and that really gotour p Perth business moving. And yeah,
we're now probably our biggest We're buyingmore properties in Perth anywhere else right
now, Brisbane is still steady andstrong. We're definitely point about Brisbane with
(06:40):
what's coming up, you know,again a huge migration shift we've had,
you know, a big domestic migrationas well. Victorians are still pouring up
into into Queensland, particularly you knowthe Gold Coast Sunshine Coast regions, which
is still voting well for the capitalgrowth and that sort of push and squeeze
of how and obviously rental demand aswell. Thank you for that overview.
(07:04):
Understanding the larger market context is crucialfor our listeners. But let's dive into
how search property party property fits intothis landscape. How does how does your
approach at search party stand out,especially in the face of the current market
dynamics with UH with new opportunities.Like you said, yeah, I guess
(07:26):
the core principle of our business isalways based on the on on building the
individual strategy for each of our clients. So as opposed to taking the view
off, we're just going to moveclients wherever we want to buy, wherever
we're finding we have a team orwe enjoy buying with. We actually take
that time to initially sort of havewhat we call a property investment assessment of
each client, really understand them,get them to talk a lot at the
(07:49):
beginning, get to understand where they'reat, where they're headed, their goals,
that desires, their pain points,so we can really get get into
their mind and then try to assistand pull that out from there. So
we actually don't even talk about propertyprobably for the first thirty minutes of that
conversation, because it's really about themand us explaining how we put strategy together
to help them through their to achievetheir goals. I see. So I'm
(08:13):
just looking at this from a perspectiveof if I was a client, what
would I want? And the firstquestion that comes to mind is what is
your background? What sort of credibilityhave you garnered in your career so far?
Can you walk us through from like, you know, your first job
to today, what does that journeylook like for you? Geez, I'm
gonna have to go turn back theclock. Yeah, well, I finished
(08:37):
school and didn't do X, didn'tdo that great at high school, but
you know, like a good Indianson, listened to my father and he
said, become an accountant, son. So I started doing accounting for two
years and realized I didn't really likethe the accounting side, the ledgers side,
but I really enjoyed the economics andprobably like you guys, the economic
side and the marketing particularly attracted me. So I left that that course,
(09:03):
went into the workforce, walked workedinto actually got a job as a courier
like the Gopher office goper in thelargest travel company in Australia, and yeah,
I just really enjoyed that experience.And I was always very inquisitive and
nosey and used to read everything thatI got my hands on, and then
ended up finishing my studies in marketing, tourism, marketing, and yeah,
(09:24):
it was that industry for probably anotherseven or eight years. Went from airlines
to so I went from that travelindustry into hotel into airlines and worked in
airlines in always in sales and marketingroles, and then went into hotels,
which is probably the best training gownfor me. Just that really high,
excellent standard of service, which Ithink resonated well with me. I enjoyed
(09:48):
that. You know, there's almostthat friendly competition between all of us how
do we over achieve and how dowe over impress our clients every day?
And that's something that's probably stuck withme throughout my career, and I think
it was boughtant for me to giveme that discipline early in my you know,
and I was really my twenties atthat stage. And then from there
I moved into still in a salesrole, into one of the Australia's largest
(10:09):
loyalty marketing companies. So what wedid there was run at the loyalty programs
for the likes of the biggest banksin Australia and zed Westpac American Express.
We also ran customer engagement programs andcustomer experience programs likes of Telstra Optics,
so some really big the biggest playersin the country really and that business was
(10:35):
really started to grow. Other thangiven the opportunity to go to actually live
in India and Mumbai for three yearswith my family and we set up a
company. My wife actually worked forthe company as well, so we set
up India's first premium loyalty credit cardprogram and did that for three years,
signed up for the biggest banks inIndia and had about ten thousand merchants on
(10:56):
board, and then came back toAustralia and had that entrepreneurial bug in me
obviously got that opportunity to be anentrepreneur really to set up a business.
Although you got the backing of abig company back home, but you were
able. We had to start fromscratching, you know, one in the
in the country and so yeah,I started a technology business around car logbooks,
automating the car logbook experience. Raiseda bunch of money lost that money
(11:20):
had to go back to the corporateworld. Did a couple of more jobs
for large international companies setting up theirbusinesses in Australia. So I really loved
that startup feel and you know,getting in my hands dirty across all elements
of the business. So I didthat for another five years for two large
companies and then yeah, then Iwas made redundant and that was my that
was that was a gap for meto make the leap. You know,
(11:41):
I always felt I had the goldenhandcuffs on my myself to you know,
working for the corporate's well paid jobs. Kids in private schools very hard to
let go of that big income.But you know, my wife was very
supportive and allowed me to follow youknow, my dreams, which is always
to be an entrepreneur, and particularlythe property market, which is where my
(12:01):
passion was as we throughout that periodof work in the corporate world build a
large portfolio with my wife and sothat was something I always wanted to do.
And yeah, bumped into my anold colleague of mine, Luke,
who's now my business partner, andthe rest is history. As they say,
thank you very much for sharing that. You're impressive your impressive professional journey.
(12:22):
It's clear that you know your experienceshave really helped you gain a valuable
insight. But let's dive deeper intosome key aspects of your business. So
what sets you guys apart from traditionalproperty investment strategies in Australia. I think
a couple of two of the keythings that we see, you know,
(12:45):
the feedback we get from clients thatether coming to us some other other buyers
agents. One is I think reallysetting that taking that time to understand the
client and really getting that strategy right. It's a really big big element for
us to set them at the sceneat the beginning, build out a ten
year twenty rear portfolio using different softwareprograms as well, like a company call
game plans from their customer service isa big deal. I know probably everyone
(13:11):
says we've got great customer service.But it was actually one of the areas
we built initially in the business beforewe set up a wholesale stream. We
actually set up the customer engagement schemeand hired our customer lead, customer service
lead, and farr And really builtthat out, and she just built that
bit by bit and it's just gota beautiful flow all the way through.
We have, you know, seventypercent of our clients or repeat clients.
(13:33):
Now eighty percent of our clients arereferrals as well, So that proves that
investment, you know, obviously abig investment to hire someone full time in
that role when you probably don't havethe business to counter that, but it's
paying off handsomely for us now.So I say customer service, I guess
strategy customer service third one or wouldbe having boots on the ground, as
we say, or having people onthe ground. So again, a lot
(13:56):
of our count our colleagues, maybesmaller ones or new entrances to the market,
will just vibe from behind the deaththrough the Internet and then use we
use a real estate agent or theproperty manager to do their inspections. We
find that's a little bit of conflictbecause the real estate agent gets paid by
the seller. We get paid bythe buyer, so it's our job to
do those inspections and making sure thatproperty is the right property for us to
(14:20):
invest in. So we've obviously doneall the data work, which is external,
which is a lot of the numbercrunching that you guys plealy do day
to day. But we still dohave someone on the ground, one of
our team that we can put ahand on our heart and say we've inspected
the property and we're happy for usto proceed with negotiating. So they're probably
the three key points, got it? And what sort of properties do you
(14:43):
look at? And how do youinvest or how do you assess their investment
potential? Yes, I guess twoparts of that question. One is what
type of properties. Again, it'snot a one trick pony approach, so
I would say ninety nine percent ofour properties that we are selling our houses,
so mining land with a house ontop, so we're not into apartments.
(15:05):
We've had sold many blocks of apartments. We've sold what we call walk
up apartments, so not but wedon't buy high rise apartments off the plan
apartments, house and land packages we'refocusing more on the established end of the
market, and so that can vary. We've bought three hundred thousand dollar properties
and we've also bought five million dollarproperties, so there's no real one size
fits all in our approach in howwe go about that. So what was
(15:28):
the second part of the question,It was how do you assess their investment
potential? So, yeah, howwe assess that is through I guess a
whole bunch of data, analytics andfocuses. So I guess we've put that
in two parts toget the macro andthe microdata. So the macro data would
be software that we subscribe to.You know, we probably spend tens of
(15:52):
thousand dollars a year on software aloneand looking at the different types of data.
So there's various brands out there,the biggest ones in the world like
core Logic, Happy Data, Hatetag DSR. So a lot of these
ones are crunching different algorithms, maybethirty forty algorithms to assess suburb data.
So from obviously national, country,state suburb data. So that's one angle
(16:14):
that we look at. Looking atheat mapping, where the metrics are positive,
you know, the clear metrics likeinfrastructure, span, transport, schooling.
Then we can use census and theABS to have a look more around
the type of people are living inthe area, what's their social economic scores,
what's the vacancy rates, what's theirsalaries, where are they from,
what's their nationalities. We also lookat metrics such as the difference between renters
(16:40):
and homeowners in a market. Wepredominantly think growth appears where we have more
occupiers in a suburb rather than renters. So these are all those metrics that
we look at to decide that anarea is good to buy in and then
obviously gets down into the street levelto fund the right property. Awesome,
(17:00):
So could you walk us through howfrom the start to beginning, the beginning
to the end of the investment theproperty investment process. If I'm a family
of four and I have let's seea budget of seven hundred thousand dollars,
could you walk us through how itstarts from the strategy development, to the
ongoing support and to the eventual buyingof the property. Yeah, I better
(17:25):
do this quickly because that's quite along process. But initially it is going
through that property investment assessment where weunderstand the client, their goals, their
strategies. We would then present ourbusiness modeling, display how we analyze data,
actually share the deals that we're buyingas well, so we're very open
booking and transparent in what we do. We talk about the areas of buying,
(17:48):
the suburbs are buying, the typeof deals we're buying, and we're
happy and glad to share that.We're not trying to hide anything if a
client or a prospect wants to goand do it themselves. You know,
a lot of people can buy property, so it can be done. It's
a lot of hard work, butit can be done. So we're happy
to share where we're buying and whereour expertise takes us. From there,
we send through a proposal which analyzesall the all the information that we put
(18:11):
together, wraps all that up,gives them a you know, a summary
page of their goals and what wecan do for them within a within a
larger document. From there, werebook, have another meeting and the client
will then decide if they wish tojoin our community and become a client.
Once I become a client, awhole new process starts again, so that
(18:33):
you know the welcome emails and thewelcome pacts come in intermixed, and then
we sit down and within a coupleof days have a strategy session. So
it's another session about an hour's worthit myself and my acquisition lead and strategist
David, and we sit down andgo through the strategy in detail of how
we're going to extend the strategy outfrom the initial overview that within the in
the assessment to now putting putting pento paper, so to speak, and
(18:56):
stretching that over the short term,what are we going to buy here in
right now, and then look atthat over maybe a ten or twenty year
period depending on the age. Likeyou said, it could be a family
for looking to buy, so whatis the strategy for that, So that
could be something that looks like twentyyear plan. We need to look at
the incomes. Are any more kidscoming along because there could be a gap
(19:18):
in incomes there. We need toascertain schooling for example private schools versus topic
schools. It's an important element ofa budget because if we're planning a ten
or twenty year strategy, that's abig chunk of your income is going to
go towards education. Site, whichmay mean you're not going to be able
to buy property during that time,so we might front end or front load
(19:41):
their strategy by trying to buy twoor three properties in that maybe first three
to five years, maybe before highschool and private school fees, and then
it may be a gap of buyingproperty because of the ability to obtain finance.
But if they're able to obviously makemoney through that period through capital growth
and the properties we bought, wecan then extract equity and go again.
(20:03):
So we're not all about, youknow, by ten properties in ten years.
It's not about for us about thequantity of your properties. It's really
about the quality. Because you canachieve your game plan or your end game,
which could be set to say twohundred thousand incremental revenue with four or
five properties. You don't need tohave ten properties to do that. We
oh, thank you for walking usthrough that example. I can tell us
(20:25):
quite a long process, but Iappreciate the detail you went into. So,
given that you've been in the industryfor quite some time and have been
running this firm for quite some time, could you share details about one of
the most interesting or your most successfuldeals or something that just some deal that
you were just really proud of overthe last two to three years. Yeah,
(20:49):
to be honest, the deals thatI remember the most. Obviously,
we're selling hundreds of properties years.It's hard to remember all of them.
But are the ones that, youknow, the people that remind me.
Obviously, the clients that get toknow better. Some of the clients that
maybe have a bit of a Iwouldn't say a hard luck story, but
just haven't got you know, bigjobs, or it may not be a
couple, it may not be youknow, some a lot of people have
(21:10):
inheritance and things like that. Butone particular lady who's a single mom with
a small I think the child isfour or five years old, and you
know, it was just a littlebit scared, apprehensive about getting to the
property market. But you know,so we had a few calls that took
a little bit of time to beconvinced that if she let's go of her
deposit that she had and takes aloan to buy a first property, you
(21:33):
know she was going to succeed.So but we you know, took it
easy, walked it through. Wefeel that these are really a partnership.
It's not this sort of client relationshipsreally out a partnership. So we like
to educate our clients along the journeyif that's what they want, so really
explain through the process what we're doing. Also, we produce every deal we
present to a client is in adue diligence report. That's a very detailed
report covering all those data points thatI mentioned in a report for each property.
(21:57):
It takes us at least two hoursto produce each of those reports,
present that to a client, workthrough it with the client why we like
the property. If they don't likeit, there's no pressure. We move
on and we keep repeating the process. But this client ended up buying a
property with us. This is abouteighteen months ago now in Brisbane in a
(22:17):
Perth place called Bourbon Carrie. Ithink it was four hundred and forty thousand
dollars and today that property so I'mjust saying just over twelve months is closer
to seven hundred thousand dollars. Soshe made money very quickly and she has
now bought a third property within eighteenmonths. So to me, that's a
really nice story because this mother wasso apprehensive at the start and was a
(22:41):
little bit scared a little bit worried, I know, are we going to
do a good job for her?She was a reference as well referral,
so she knew who we were.She trusted us, but just didn't trust
the process. But because we explainedthe process, we showed her what a
plan would look like over a periodof time, she took action, which
is the most important word in propertyinvest actually taking action, and she trusted
(23:03):
the process, trusted us, andyou know, now she's got three properties
from zero, So that's a that'sa I guess this client story that I
remember fondly awesome, and sometimes marketconditions can be unpredictable. You want to
ask, have you ever encountered asituation where you've had to adapt a strategy
and midway through a deal, andif so, how did you how did
(23:23):
that change the impact of the article. Yeah, it's a really good question.
I guess there have been. Probablyfinance is the economic indicator that does
catch us at times, and it'smainly because the client, you know,
may have gone in for pre approval, got that finance, It may have
may have taken a little bit oftime before they decided what they're going to
(23:45):
do. We find a lot ofclients will try to buy on their own
first, find out that it's reallyhard work. How do you do that
when you're working full time? Howdo you do that when you're trying to
buy into state. There are waysto do that, but it's not easy
for you know, the average investor. So what can happen is their loan
expires, their pre approval, sowe have to go back in and get
(24:07):
they have to go back and getthe reapproval. However, during that time,
interest rates could have gone up,the boring, legislative borring rules may
have changed, that bank might havetightened a screw there or two for whatever
reason. And all of a sudden, your budget, let's say it was
six hundred and fifty thousand, isnow six hundred thousand. So as you
said, we have to change tax. So the buying brief that we put
(24:29):
together, so we're going to buyin this area for this price, may
mean we have to take a relookat that and move a suburb across,
you know, so wait for thatripple effect to hit that suburb. It
just means we might have to rethinkand where we're buying, recalibrate the strategy,
got it, and we're going toask a bit of a personal question,
so feel for you to disclose asmuch as you wish, but and
we asked us to every guest thatcomes on our podcast, what does your
(24:52):
current personal investment portfolio look like?Is it one hundred percent allocated to real
estate? Is it seventy real estateequities or stocks? And what is that
ratio? Yeah, unfortunately, probablynot a financial planner's dream because we are
one hundred percent real estate. Andthe reason being is we were absolutely torched
(25:15):
and burnt in the GFC where weinvested a lot of money, you know,
close to half a million dollars cashplus the same amount again through a
credit facility, a margin loan,and then the GFC hit and so you
know what happened to all of thatmoney in within a month's time. And
so that was a real, areal changing of the guard for us in
(25:41):
our in our mindset in around particularlyaround share investing. And so from that
time onwards we recalibrated and it tooka while to get over that. Obviously
financially we were and we were alsooverseas at that stage during that expat journey.
So when we got back to Australia, then yeah, I said,
well, we're going to go backinto investing. We always knew we were
going to invest in property. Wealready had a couple at that stage and
(26:04):
a home as well, so wewent hard and fast into properties. So
I think when one year we boughtfive properties, mainly because the bank.
Again I always say, finance isking. Finance is very important, far
more important than the property property.We can find finance is really really important.
So it really is a game offinance. And at that time,
the bank's pre raw commission, sothe banks we're handing off a lot of
(26:27):
loans without a lot of due diligence, and so we took advantage of that,
and I guess looking back, ifwe didn't do that, today would
be in a very different position.All right, awesome. I know this
is a place where we interview you, but we'd like to give our guests
one question to ask us. So, woul do you have any questions do
(26:48):
you want we'd like to ask?Actually, yeah, I've listened to your
podcast I think a month or soago, and you guys were waxing lyric
bill about the property market and whereyou see things are going. You could
understand here your take on the market. Now that we've had three rate pauses
in a row, Where do youthink we're headed in twenty twenty four?
(27:08):
Oh yeah, So I'll start offwith that. So yeah, just echoing
our sentiment that we mentioned in thepodcast in July for the rest of twenty
twenty three, at least in myopinion personally, I do think the industry
is going to continue just booming.Prices are going to go up, especially
in Australia. The real estate market, or the bubble as a lot of
(27:30):
people like to put it, isn'tgoing to pop in my opinion. And
with the new RBA governor who wasjust appointed a couple of weeks ago,
also looking to essentially set her imprinton the economy, I don't think she
will be making any drastic moves toosoon, as such as decreasing height rates
(27:55):
anytime soon. And Australia as aneconomy is lagging behind the rest and the
rest of the Western countries such asthe US and the European Union and the
UK in terms of their aggressiveness ofthe raid hikes, and so I think
that I would price in another ratehike by the RBA by mid of twenty
(28:15):
twenty four and only in twenty twentyfive would we see a potential decline in
interest rates. So that's my opinion. What about you, Yeah, I
have a different take. I thinkthese I mean, you do see globally
a lot of federal banks to theU. S. Riverbank and the UK
(28:36):
Central Bank and actually paused rate hikes. There's questions they might, you know,
increase rates soon. But a lotof people are thinking that the top
is in and I do feel thesame way too, And I feel that
the real estate market is anticipated toperform well, although there is potential risk
for recession and you know global economicdownturn, but little you know result in
(29:00):
use demand. I do feel thetop is infrareds and for investors, i'd
say to remain bullish on the globalbirthstate. Mikey mighty excellent. Now.
I tend to agree with both ofyou on that. I mean, yet
we don't really know what's going tohappen interest rates, but I feel where
our few we're just about there,and I think they're not going to be
(29:23):
too many bullish statements firstly from theappya and too many movements I think at
least into well into that new yearin twenty twenty four. Well, thank
you Julian so much for coming onour podcast. I'm going to wrap up
this episode for today. In today'sepisode, we went quite in depth about
the real estate market, about searchparty property and how they help you from
(29:47):
stage one to stage ten and assessto you in building that real estate investment
portfolio. We will share all therelevant links on our LinkedIn page and on
Spotify, Apple Podcasts and wherebels youcan find out. Thank you so much
for tuning in for today's episode ofthe Investor Daries podcast and we will catch
you next time. Thank you.Peace,
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