December 2, 2025 • 70 mins
Language and culture feed each other. They indelibly define a people.
Guyana’s emergent prominence on the world stage (largely due to newfound oil and the impact on its economy) has attracted interests of many kinds seeking tighter bonds. Her language and culture are no longer sliding under the radar. Communication is paramount.
'What language the people of Guyana speak' is a question with an intricate answer.
Linguists, Dr Carolyn Cummings and Dr Tamarind Nnena De Lisser, unravels the puzzle. It reveals another facet of this young's nation's yearning and wealth.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-journey-with-neville--6405120/support.
Guyana’s emergent prominence on the world stage (largely due to newfound oil and the impact on its economy) has attracted interests of many kinds seeking tighter bonds. Her language and culture are no longer sliding under the radar. Communication is paramount.
'What language the people of Guyana speak' is a question with an intricate answer.
Linguists, Dr Carolyn Cummings and Dr Tamarind Nnena De Lisser, unravels the puzzle. It reveals another facet of this young's nation's yearning and wealth.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-journey-with-neville--6405120/support.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hello and welcome to the Journey, your radio show hosted
by Nevill d'angelou, author of a sound Bite Life and
Flight of the Feused Monkeys, a PRG Emerging Technologies Forum
keynote speaker and founder of RIO Sports. I am Joseph Ellison. Enjoy.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
What is Guyana's language? What language do you Guani speak?
I am Neville. My guests are doctor Carolyn Cummings and
doctor Tamian Nina Delissa. Ghana is a country with vast
varieties that is an aspect of its endowed indigenous wealth.
(00:47):
As Guyana rightfully asserts its identity, its voice, and the
dignity to stand on its own terms in the company
of a global array of new, predominantly powerful interests, the
surge of inquiry is frenetic. Who's this new kid on
(01:08):
the block? Head high, sitting at the table? So unique?
What is best informed? To dispense with familiar labels? Now,
language is a powerful force. It shapes a people's identity.
It's a divining boundary. It's the door to people's culture.
(01:30):
That's just for starters. So I suggest it should not
be taken lightly. Doctor Carolyn Cummings is the director of
(01:56):
the International Center of Excellence for a Culture and Creative
Expression Studies and Sports in the Faculty of Education and
Humanities at the University of Guyana and as a lecturer
of Applied Linguistics and English Language. She is the former
(02:17):
head of Department of Language and Cultural Studies in the
Faculty of Education and Humanities. Her research interests include cultural heritage,
cultural agenda setting and policy, popular culture, language and identity,
(02:38):
and teaching English as a second language, especially in Creole
speaking environments. Doctor Cummings has served as an adjudicator for
Guyana's National Drama Festival for many years and for the
Prestige Cana Prize for Literature Youth Category twenty twenty five.
(03:01):
She has been a trained educator for over twenty five
years and enjoys painting and creating art and fashion. Doctor
tamer And Nina Delissa, Coordinator of the Guyanese Languages Unit
(03:22):
and Senior Lecturer in Linguistics in the Faculty of Education
and Humanities, University of Guyana, holds an MAA and a
PhD in General Linguistics, a BA double major in Linguistics
and Language Communication and Society, and a postgraduate diploma in education.
(03:48):
Her main research area is first language, acquisition of syntactic
systems in Creole languages. Her multidisciplinary research interest straddles general linguistics,
social linguistics, and education. She is also a published translator
(04:12):
for Jamaican. You are on the journey with Neville.
Speaker 3 (04:31):
Along the journey, we stop at intriguing places and meet
fascinating people with novel solutions to some of life's tricky questions.
And we play a few games and track the remarkable
characters of three classic books, A SoundBite Life, Flight of
the Fused Monkeys and Illa Sat A Time to Begin Again,
all of which can be found on Amazon and Barnes
(04:53):
and Noble.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
Dr Cummings and doctor Delissa have asked me to refer
to them by their familiar first names, while I prefer
to all of them with their title. If occasionally you
hear me call them by their first names, I will
rest in the fact that they asked me to kindly
(05:18):
tell us a little bit about yourself before we delve
into what is the Guyanese language or what language do
Guyanese speak?
Speaker 4 (05:30):
I thank you, thank you very much. I am Krolyne Cummins.
I am a lecturer of language arts and linguistics at
the University of Ghana, currently on leave, but I'm still
very much involved with some aspects. And I am also
very much interested in cultural studies cultural a gender setting
(05:56):
for Guyana and also interested in conducting work with regards
to cultural heritage, which includes aspects of language in them.
Speaker 5 (06:12):
And I am tamiran Nina Delisa.
Speaker 6 (06:16):
I know that's moldeful, but you can say Tamir for short.
Speaker 5 (06:21):
So I am also a lecturer here at Yuji University
of Viana in the Department of Language and Cultural Studies,
but I also teach in the Department of Curriculum and Instruction.
For me, I am a linguist ara of specialization first
(06:44):
language acquisition. I have interest and have worked in Creole
studies in particular and with indigenous languages. I'm also a
translator of my name tip Tongue. I'm a Jamaican, so
I translate Jamaican and Creole. Currently the coordinator of the
(07:09):
Guyanese Languages units, and that unit really looks about everything
Guyanese language. So yeah, indigenous language is the Creole is, Yeah,
that's about it.
Speaker 7 (07:26):
In a while, I want to know what is Crele
is and since this is both is a global program
I know that Jamaica plays a warm part of people's
parts across the globe.
Speaker 8 (07:38):
You might have to tell us exactly what it means
by interpreting Jamaican language. But right now, can you guys
tell us why is it you do what you do.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Well?
Speaker 9 (07:52):
For me?
Speaker 5 (07:54):
I think it's a calling. I didn't plan on being
a linguist at any point in my life.
Speaker 6 (08:01):
It just so happened, like developments.
Speaker 5 (08:04):
I initially wanted to do uh something in mass communication,
but when the program wasn't available for me, I decided
to do something that I thought was the next best thing,
which was language communication and society. Upon doing that, I
realized it was heavily linguistics based, and therefore I ended
(08:28):
up with a double mast a double Maysia sorry, in
linguistics and language Communication and society. Because I realized I
liked both, I went on to do the Masters in linguistics,
and opportunities just presented themselves, and I found myself with
a PhD in linguistics.
Speaker 6 (08:50):
Similarly, so I.
Speaker 5 (08:53):
Look at it to more as a calling, something that
I actually like and something that I find that is
totally beneficial. There is nothing that we can do without language,
and I find that it is important for us, especially
in these regions like Jamaica, Guyana, where we have indigenous
(09:17):
languages and Creole languages.
Speaker 6 (09:19):
That are not treated with the same respect.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
As the European languages, for us to work to get
these languages the rights that they deserve. And so I
find myself becoming more and more passionate about that, and
that's why I continue to do what I do.
Speaker 8 (09:38):
I'm keen to the indigenous languages. I'm keen to find
out more about that in a moment.
Speaker 10 (09:46):
But why do I do what I do?
Speaker 4 (09:48):
Yes, okay, So I've always had interest in language as
far as I know, language and art I have from
as early as secondary I was never interested in science
or any of those things. I always wanted I'm always
the kind of humanities person, and so I started out
(10:11):
I was a teacher. I've been a primary school teacher.
But then I came to Yuchi and as a a student,
I did my undergraduate degree in English for English. That
means in our program, we have linguistics and we have
literature in that program, and so I did both. But
I majored in linguistics, and so I took a like
(10:33):
into linguistics and I did some improvement in linguistics at
the master's level. However, I think that because I'm also
a creative I am an amateurre artist, so.
Speaker 10 (10:49):
That's that too, And so I.
Speaker 4 (10:51):
Have an interest in art, as in fine arts as
well as performative arts in Guyana, and also all the
other cultural things I mentioned earlier. So I have a
very very strong passion for the fact that we have
our cultural industry really needs a lot of improvement, and
(11:13):
there are lacks somewhere.
Speaker 10 (11:15):
So for example, there is no cultural policy.
Speaker 4 (11:17):
I think the last cultural policy we had was in
nineteen seventy six or so, where we had burned out.
They had a cultural policy then, but ever since we have,
like I sailled forty years or more than forty years,
we haven't had cultural policy. So those are some of
the things that I'm interested in. And therefore I branched
out a little away from linguistics and language teaching to
(11:42):
more aspects of cultural agenda setting right cultural planning.
Speaker 10 (11:47):
And so I am still right in the very early.
Speaker 4 (11:50):
Stages of doing work in cultural policy or cultural studies,
and so that is where I am. But also I've
just very just like about a few hours ago, been
us to direct the center for it's called International Center
(12:11):
of Excellence for Cultural and Creative Expression, Studies and Sports.
Speaker 10 (12:18):
So very very new and with that center, I.
Speaker 4 (12:24):
Thank you, and we're hoping to add a lot of
programs here so that I'll be doing exactly what my
passion is in performance and sports and film studies.
Speaker 10 (12:35):
And those kinds of things.
Speaker 8 (12:37):
Well, you see, I always learned something more far from
than what I advised you guys to tell us about.
We're going to take a break and then we'll come
into a topic on linguistics. We'll be right back.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
The people of Guyana are ethnically diverse Indo Guyanese, Afro
Guyanese Amerindians. That is an indigenous population of nine tribes,
just to name a few, Roxyy Caribs, a Koyo, they're
(13:28):
more a significant portion sent in. Twenty percent of our
people are mixed race Chinese, Portuguese, Dutch and other European descents.
It is a rich mixture. So what language does a
(13:50):
Guyanese speak? Where can you learn it and how does
it ampact our culture? For a diversity of access, you
may visit the Journey's home base Select Guyana. The Journey's
(14:11):
website is the Journey dot ryosports dot com. The Journey
as in one word, the Journey dot Ryo Sports, Ryo Sports,
but Ryo s po rts the Journey dot ryosports dot
com discover Guyana.
Speaker 8 (14:49):
Well, I'm happily back with Tamir and Carolyn linguists. That's
not something that people choose to be immediately, and you
guys have found yourself in this field. And obviously as
you're I think you're saying that it's so it's important
(15:11):
to a culture because language affects what happens to your
culture or how your your culture developed. Can you talk
to us about that?
Speaker 6 (15:21):
So language definitely affects everything. How do I start?
Speaker 5 (15:29):
Well, as you mentioned language affecting culture, language I would
say is also culture and it builds culture because the
way how we communicate we use language, and that says
a lot about aspects of our culture, how we communicate
(15:51):
with each other. Of course, culture is very wide, but
all that happens in culture depends still on language.
Speaker 6 (16:00):
So I'm not sure if I should.
Speaker 8 (16:02):
Go into please go pleaseguages.
Speaker 5 (16:05):
For example in Guyana and integration of that in Guyanese
culture for example. So Guyana is what we would describe
as multi lingual. There are lots of different languages operating
in the small space not so.
Speaker 6 (16:26):
Small, but.
Speaker 8 (16:29):
I used to think it's a huge space. Someone overseas
corrected me, and I'm like.
Speaker 11 (16:37):
Depending on how we look at the space, right, But
the idea is that we have a relatively small population,
just around eight hundred thousand.
Speaker 5 (16:48):
People, and within that we have nine active indigenous languages.
We have our Creole language, we have a the other
European languages, and as is widely known, Ghana is dubbed
as English speaking, where English is our official language. Right,
(17:12):
all of that creates a very multilingual space and impacts
on culture. Impacts on culture in the sense that we
have different people speaking different toms, but at the same time,
the traditions that are associated with those tongues are all
(17:35):
combined to identify what we term Guyanese.
Speaker 8 (17:41):
Does it enrich us as a culture or does it
cause Talk to me about that. I could see those enriching.
I'd like to think of it that way. Or is
it does it cause a lot of conflict?
Speaker 6 (17:57):
It is enriching, ultimately, isn'enrich in?
Speaker 5 (18:01):
But I can see where there may be some conflict
as a result, I'm gonna try to speak about the
conflict first.
Speaker 6 (18:12):
You know that that is probably.
Speaker 5 (18:14):
A little ticklish area. But why I'm thinking there may
be conflict resulting, it's because of the different ethnicities that
tend to be all in this space, and therefore you
may be we may experience conflict in terms of social conflicts.
(18:38):
Some languages, for example, the European languages, are generally ascribed
to as being the languages, and everything else is seen
to be dialects or bad forms of the European languages
or some sub language, but not given the same respect
(19:01):
as the European languages. That I find to be quite
discriminating not only to the language, but also to the
people who speak this language, because you find that the
resources are not equally available in these languages for the speakers,
(19:24):
and they are also treated very differently from those who
speak the European languages. So, for example, if I should
be a speaker of one of the indigenous languages, say
Akawai or y Y, I would probably opt not to
(19:46):
as in not me, But a speaker in one of
those areas would probably not to include that on their
resume because they don't necessarily find it to be prestigious. Similarly,
the vast majority of Ghanese are speakers of Creoles, but
they will not put Creoles as a language on their
(20:10):
resume because chances are they may be discriminated against because
they identify as a Creole or speaker.
Speaker 8 (20:21):
Yeah, go, red heads, I'll come back. And I see
you're nodding lots of looking forward to what you're gonna say,
And I just want to give your heads up that
I'm going to obviously try to see if we you
guys have a solution to this kind of stuff. But
go ahead, let's go ahead.
Speaker 6 (20:38):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
To add to what she's saying, there is a lot
of language loss as well, because because of the fact
that people are shy of the language, many people are
shy of the Most people are shy of their what'll
we called native languages because most of us, most of
(21:01):
us o our native languages are It's not English, even
though we might grow up learning English and school formally,
our language is Creole. I speak Creole, and most of
the people that I know speak Creole, but they are
we are shy often of using Creole. And for those
(21:23):
who speak Amornian languages, they're even more shy. And so
as a result, especially with Amarni languages, there is language loss.
There's some language loss, and the languages, some of them
are are being threatened, you know, to die because some
of them, there are speakers may have died as well,
(21:44):
last speakers, so that there is a certain kind of movement.
But there is a phytal revitalize and help to maintain
those languages. And this is some of the work that
doctor List is doing in the Guyanese Languages Unit, right.
But there's a language loss. But there is also you
(22:06):
see with language teaching and schools because many of us,
most of us, we are trained to believe and accept,
we are forced to accept that, oh, you speak English,
but Guyana is not English speaking.
Speaker 10 (22:23):
It is English official.
Speaker 4 (22:25):
That means that the majority is doctor List said, speak creole,
like ninety percent speak creole. And then we use English
as a second language.
Speaker 10 (22:38):
English is a second language. And that is why in.
Speaker 4 (22:41):
Terms of the conflict and the challenges that arise from
that kind of thing, is that why is it that
our students, many of them at all levels primary secondary,
cxx sex, even at the university, trouble with English language.
(23:01):
We're terrified of English, threatened by an English class and
threatened by English teachers, right, because it's not our language.
If it was the language that we speak, we would
not be threatened. It is that, okay, you know, but
because of that, there is this struggle to learn a language.
(23:26):
And then you see if you look at the results
some of it for c SEX for example, that's what
we used to call CX right, ce SEX end of
secondary exams that they do, right, you know, the performances
are not so good. And then when you look at
some of the performance as well as for our students who
(23:46):
do English language because they're required to do it at
the first year and undergraduate studies. So and if you
look at the results, you could see that more than
half of the students are still challenged by using English,
by writing English, and by speaking English.
Speaker 5 (24:06):
All right, So, just to follow up, but with what
Carlyn was saying, we have the situation where yes, people
are treated or discriminated based on the language they use,
generally the Creolis language.
Speaker 6 (24:26):
But the reverse is also true.
Speaker 5 (24:29):
In some situations. You may find that people are treated
unfairly also because they use quote unquote standard English. So
I'll give a scenario. In the primary school, you may
have children who are genuine English speakers, but what the
(24:51):
other children tend to do is to call them names. Okay,
she behaving like she's English dot com, high defense, the
twanging and all.
Speaker 6 (25:02):
Of these things.
Speaker 5 (25:03):
So it's not a good feeling for the English monolingual
speaker in that sense because they cannot necessarily naturally speak
the creole language, and therefore they are probably put aside
for that.
Speaker 6 (25:21):
So the reverse is also true.
Speaker 5 (25:24):
But one thing I am very pleased about with regard
to this situation is that since twenty twenty two, the
Ministry of Education have realized probably they did realize.
Speaker 6 (25:38):
Before, but it is now in the new revised.
Speaker 5 (25:41):
Curriculum of twenty twenty two for Language arts in the
primary schools where they are recognizing both English and the
mother tongue, so teachers are encouraged to use both English
and the mother tongue. The mother tongue may not be
real is because we have the indigenous communities. So if
(26:03):
you're from one of they say, what pasion speaking communities,
you're encouraged to use your mother's home in the classroom
as a means of instruction and interaction. So yes, that
is great, but we still need to move a little
bit more where that is concerned, because while this is
(26:25):
under books, teachers are not necessarily trained at our levels.
So that's where our training.
Speaker 6 (26:34):
At UG and probably at CPCE.
Speaker 5 (26:37):
Also what a CPC the serial part of College of Education.
That's a teacher's training college before they actually they would
normally do a teaching certificate or an associate degree and
then they would come to EUG to do their bachelors.
So these institutions are equipped to actually help to bridge
(27:04):
that gap because having this in the curriculum, teachers still
are not clearing how to navigate, and also materials and
resources are generally lacking in these mother town languages. So
we are now training teachers. We have, for example, a
(27:26):
program that recently concluded. We had our first batch of
graduates just last Saturday walking the stage, eighteen indigenous speakers
of Wapishan.
Speaker 6 (27:42):
We had a program.
Speaker 5 (27:44):
In the well.
Speaker 6 (27:45):
It's a certificate certificate program.
Speaker 5 (27:48):
In dual language and a multi lingual practice in education
where we targeted nursery school teachers how to use their
mother tongue as the means of interaction and instruction in
the classroom spaces.
Speaker 8 (28:05):
I think it's also one of them because you've got there.
But I just want to ask a questions. Are all
teachers now trained at the CPC? Did I say that correct?
And at ug or is so?
Speaker 6 (28:21):
On the cost?
Speaker 5 (28:23):
I believe that most of the teachers are trained. I
know that we do have situations majority of all the
teachers are trained, but we do have some rare situations,
especially in the interior, where you may find teachers that
(28:43):
are not trained in the classrooms. So I know, for example,
at the nursery level, you may have a few teachers
who are not trained, but they would have in teacher
in training programs the less that could help them before
they get to CPC. But the move I suppose is
(29:06):
that all teachers are to be trained.
Speaker 8 (29:10):
Awesome. Awesome, Now I know I did have a question
about creole, and creole is can you address that?
Speaker 5 (29:19):
Sure? So, creole is a more general term that is
used well not only to describe languages, because you have
creole languages, but you also have creule culture creal culture,
which should include the food, the music, the traditions and
(29:40):
so on. But in terms of languages, we have creole
being the general term of those languages that well, we
have different ideas of the origin but one of the
theories is that these creole languages originated f apple on
(30:00):
the plantation society, where they develop from the pigeon into
a creole. Where the pigeon initially would have been that
language that is just used as a means of communicating
between speakers who are not normally how do you say,
(30:24):
having communicative competence in either languages, So they would tend
to create this makeshift language that is referred to as
a pigeon, which is used solely for the purpose for trade.
Speaker 6 (30:39):
Children born in.
Speaker 5 (30:41):
That situation now would need a language in order to communicate,
and therefore the theory states that the children generally would
create this creole language. So once that language becomes that
pigeon becomes native used, meaning we have children speaking it
(31:03):
as their native language.
Speaker 6 (31:05):
It is now referred to as a creole language. So
we have.
Speaker 5 (31:10):
Lots of creole languages across the globe. For the Caribbean,
we tend to refer to them as Atlantic creoles or
in sometimes in some cases we have Caribbean creoles.
Speaker 6 (31:24):
Right, So the languages that we.
Speaker 5 (31:27):
Speak in Jamaica, in Guyana, as a result of this
kind of plantation society, we would have them being creole
languages specific to Guyana. For example, it is casually referred
to our amicably better word referred to as creoles by
speakers in Jamaica. In Jamaica, we would referred to it
(31:50):
as Patua. Of course, you know, you have Haitian Creole,
you have Strana, and you.
Speaker 6 (31:55):
Have lots of creoles across the Caribbean.
Speaker 5 (32:00):
Linguists, however, tend to not necessarily want to subscribe to
the name, for example, Patua because it is seen as direcatory.
But we prefer, I personally prefer to call my language Jamaican.
(32:22):
For Guyana, the people are fine with creoleis we call
it crelis. You may see people referring to it generally
linguists as a Ganese creole, right, but.
Speaker 6 (32:35):
The creole as estion.
Speaker 8 (32:38):
But must say on that, don't you lose your thoughts?
So another difference you just pointed out the different thing
creole and creole is Guyanese prefer to call creoles Guyanese
creole or Guyanese creole is which one are you saying?
Speaker 10 (32:54):
I don't know.
Speaker 4 (32:55):
I believe that both, because I think it depends on
who spe okay.
Speaker 8 (33:01):
So it's a it's a free forms. There's no there's
no many people you.
Speaker 4 (33:06):
Would say it's creoles crearly is sorry, but there are
others maybe might be more in a formal setting that
they might want to refer to language as Dyani is creole.
Speaker 5 (33:18):
But your question Guyanese creole versus Ghyanese creole lease. Normally
the linguist would refer to it as Ghanese creole. People
would refer to their language as Creo Leese, not necessarily
Guyanese creole is because once you say creole, is that
(33:42):
it is Guyanese.
Speaker 8 (33:43):
So why would linguists not want to use that term.
Speaker 12 (33:48):
I I am not sure exactly how to answer it,
but I'll give my own inclinations.
Speaker 5 (33:59):
So, just as we would have patois, the idea is
that creole is maybe saying direcatory, right, So they prefer
to use Creole as the broad language family in terms
of origins and to give the name of the country
(34:22):
Guyanese Creole Jamaican Creole.
Speaker 6 (34:26):
However, we have departed.
Speaker 5 (34:29):
I personally have departed from that for Jamaican Creole because
I'm thinking, okay.
Speaker 6 (34:38):
We have French.
Speaker 5 (34:41):
Spoken by the French people in France, we have English
spoken by the English. In England, we have Italians spoken
by the Italian and so forth. Why do we have
to add Creole to distinguish the kind of language and
the historical beginnings? We have Jamaican people, We speak Jamaican
(35:03):
just like everybody else. The situation a little sticklish because
it may be more difficult exactly to call Creoles Diyanese
because indigenous people may see but my language is Danese
do that kind of thing. So it's a little ticklish
(35:27):
to refer to Ganese girl as simply as Guyanese.
Speaker 8 (35:30):
As languists and as you said, as linguists. You know
that languages affect culture, and as a Guyanese people, you
want a culture to be rich. How would you recommend
bridging that gap? Or there's no gap to bridge? The
fact that you've got these many different languages that are
(35:54):
all essentially Guyanese helped me. I don't want to be
jumping into the water. Is there is there anything to
be solved? Maybe not?
Speaker 5 (36:09):
Maybe not?
Speaker 8 (36:09):
We are we just unique there you guys required.
Speaker 5 (36:17):
Let me let me try so just to answer that,
I get your question using language to bridge a cultural gas.
Speaker 8 (36:26):
No, you just mentioned that Italian's language is Italian, the
Germans language is German. What is the Guyanese language? We
have many different languages, so we can't say Guyanese or
(36:47):
probably not because we've got these different So is there
any bridge to be, any gaps to be bridged or
is that just the fact.
Speaker 5 (36:56):
That we stay. How I see it, I'm not GeSe,
I am not privy to talk about this, yes, and
she can tell me what I'm saying makes sense or
if it's not right. But how I see it is
(37:16):
that when we look at the Ganese situation, we have creolies,
which is the Guyanas, which is Ghana's Lingua Franco.
Speaker 6 (37:28):
Everybody speaks creally.
Speaker 5 (37:29):
Is the indigenous people generally speak cruely, the people on
the coast, they all speak really So for me, I
don't think there should be an issue if we should
term Guyanese Creole as Guyanese because it has different well,
(37:50):
it caters for everyone.
Speaker 6 (37:52):
It's the lingual Franco we all use. Not what I'm saying, we.
Speaker 10 (37:59):
Yes, I identify.
Speaker 5 (38:01):
Sometimes as Guyanese, and at this point I identify as Ghanese.
When I speak about linguistic issues in Diana, I identify
as Guyanese. Right, Yes, I don't think that it should
be a grave issue if we should use Creoles as
(38:23):
Guyana's language and therefore referred to it as Guyanese. The
historic backgrounds of the indigenous languages are very different from
how Creole is developed in Guyana, and I think that
based on just the history of who the Gayanese people
are and this language, this language, it caters for everyone.
Speaker 6 (38:47):
In Guyanese Creole, you will have.
Speaker 5 (38:51):
Words probably that are indigenous. You have words that are
frost they the Indian. Sorry, you have words that are
from the African languages. So it is a language that
cases for us. So to say Guyanese should be perfect.
(39:12):
That's how I see it.
Speaker 8 (39:13):
Okay, is there any sense on the street? Do you
guys have a sense across the street or nobody's thinking
about this? It's just never okay, No.
Speaker 5 (39:23):
We have been thinking about it. I have this caused
this already in smaller circles of linguists like mind people.
But you are right in terms of on the street,
it is opportune time for us to find out, do
our survey.
Speaker 6 (39:42):
What is it that the people would prefer?
Speaker 8 (39:45):
That's the possible.
Speaker 10 (39:48):
Yeah, I agree, I agree. With her, there's no reason.
Speaker 4 (39:52):
I'm not sure if there is a gap because you're
a Guyanese. Most of us speak the language, so it
would be fine if it is called Guinese. But like
she said, we can do the research. But also I'd
like to also say that a lot of what we
are talking about now in terms of the response to
the languages in all the aspects, is part of the culture.
(40:18):
And like the fact that we have a language, it's
like almost like a melting pot with you have you
have Indian influences.
Speaker 10 (40:28):
Write a lot of the words that are in.
Speaker 4 (40:30):
Creole, like the versions of Creole that many Indian people use,
or many people in rural areas or specific areas. You
find specific terms that come from various places. Right, we
have African influences of course, and you have your Indian influences,
(40:51):
and then you have other influences that are in there,
even even Amerindian influences in the Guinese creole. So yeah,
it could be called and that's and that's very much
a part of our culture. And that's one that's one
of the bays in which language and culture is connected.
Speaker 8 (41:10):
Awesome will be right back.
Speaker 1 (41:13):
You are on the journey and it's time for our
question of the week.
Speaker 9 (41:18):
The question of the week is this does fluency in
the second language dilute your cultural identity? The question of
the week is this does fluency in the second language
dilute your cultural identity? We're back discussing what is the
(41:51):
Guyanese language.
Speaker 6 (41:53):
Yes, that's a continuu.
Speaker 5 (41:56):
At u g. We have been doing be.
Speaker 6 (42:02):
To you know, get the.
Speaker 5 (42:04):
Language situation in Guyana where we really want it to be.
So for example, we have this year, for the first
time of course elementary Wapishan. This course is there towards
non speakers of the Wapishan language. Anybody who wants to
(42:26):
learn one of our indigenous languages, you can know have
a course at EUGEN. Just yesterday we have approved a
follow up course to that, which is exploring Wapishan because
we have speakers of the language who are yes, they
may speak the language, but they don't necessarily understand the
(42:52):
intriquencies of the language and how it is that this
language works and even the culture situation how the language works. Right,
So we have that course that was only approved yesterday,
so I'm quite pleased about that. Also approved yesterday is
(43:13):
a new course which we have as Elementary Creole Ease,
I'll tell you a bit about that, but before I do, well,
let me go into it. Elementary Crearis is a course
that is designed for non speakers of Creoles. So over
the years and more so known, we have people coming
(43:34):
into Guyana and they are not speakers of the language.
Speaker 6 (43:39):
They don't know.
Speaker 5 (43:39):
Creley is, however, clearly is the language that the general
society use for daily communication.
Speaker 6 (43:47):
So in order to be.
Speaker 5 (43:50):
Integrated well, there is a need to speak really is.
And as I mentioned earlier, the fact that teachers know
are encouraged to use this language, it means that immigrant
children are also encouraged to speak this language. So having
a course where we target non speakers, and even some
(44:12):
Guinese may want to do this course because they are
themselves not.
Speaker 6 (44:19):
Fluent Creole speakers, or they could speak somewhat.
Speaker 5 (44:23):
But they don't know about reading and writing, so this
course will target that. But we do have a course
that we have been offering for some years no Exploring
Ghanese Creole, and that course we look at the structure
of the language, where we explore from the sound systems,
(44:48):
how words are formed, how these form sentences, how the
sentences are used for cultural integration and all looking at
all the different variet so that we of Creoles language
that are spoken in Guyana and so forth. So this
course is really a deep dive into the language of
(45:13):
the Guyanese populace in terms of the varieties. As was
raised yesterday, which a variety are we targeting. We're not
targeting any variety in particular because Ghanies avas space with
multiple varieties. So the people in a sequible probably will
(45:37):
be able to do this course similar to those in Barbie.
Speaker 6 (45:41):
What we do is to.
Speaker 5 (45:44):
Speak in general terms about how the different varieties work
and the different lexical items you may have.
Speaker 6 (45:55):
And we also know.
Speaker 5 (45:59):
That we have, based on probably social stratification and other means,
different varieties where you have the more Creole African retention
Indian retention, which is referred to as the.
Speaker 10 (46:16):
So you can.
Speaker 6 (46:19):
Varieties.
Speaker 10 (46:20):
So we have we have many different varieties.
Speaker 4 (46:22):
And of course it depends on where you are, who
are your influences, which community you grew up in, right,
So for example, in predominantly Indian communities you might you
might hear some some variety, certain kind of variety, whereas
in another Indian community might hear similar art could be
(46:44):
slightly different.
Speaker 10 (46:46):
And in the.
Speaker 4 (46:47):
Rural areas, especially like doctor Lisson mentioned barbies for example,
and not all of but you know specific parts you
hear more rural baslectal creoles.
Speaker 2 (46:59):
So on.
Speaker 4 (47:00):
The creole is on a continuum that moves from the
bas elect right to the acro elect The basilect is
the creole the versions which many of us may not
understand fully.
Speaker 10 (47:17):
It will be more less easy.
Speaker 4 (47:21):
To understand right for some of us, but for most Guyanese,
the bus elect and sorry, and then we have the
mes electal varieties us in the middle Mislo means middle.
But we have their various miss electal varieties along that continuum.
But they are going towards an acrolect. In this case,
(47:42):
a collect is the English language right, very often because
the acrolect is the language that lexifies or meaning where
we get the most vocabulary from. Right, the bas electal
forms are the vocabulary may come from more or Indian
(48:02):
languages like Buchwori and Hindi and other languages, and some
in some cases may be Amorinian luguages and also aspects
of African languages.
Speaker 10 (48:15):
Right, but not only that.
Speaker 4 (48:17):
The distinction between the basilect and the aqulect is often
not just the vocabulary, but more importantly it is the
structure of the language. Right, And maybe doctor the List
could help me little here. But the structure is definitely different,
and this is where you would see, Okay, you might
see in most Latin, in English, for example, you have
(48:37):
a subject verb object order, and in Creole you might
have that, but it may also it may also deviate
depending on which createle language you are talking about, and
the not just the subject verb object that kind of order,
that sense epic order. You'd have other kinds of things,
(48:59):
like the morphology the way the words that create are created,
like for example, bottom house boy, bottom house means doesn't
mean a house at the bottom, it means.
Speaker 10 (49:06):
Under the house, right.
Speaker 4 (49:07):
So so things like that will help to create the
bas elect and you will find ausso that a lot
of the elect that dialects are more heavenly influenced, not
just the vocabulary, but by the way African languages are
for example. Right, So maybe we could give an example,
(49:31):
and maybe doctor List could help me to explain that.
If there is anything to add.
Speaker 8 (49:38):
Will be right back.
Speaker 2 (49:47):
You are on the journey with Neville. Yours related today
we are discussing the influence of language and are personal
and cultural identity. Our home base is the Journey dot
ryo sports dot com. You can find our podcast on
(50:13):
your favorite podcast platform visitors on the Journey dot ryosports
dot com. A slew of activities and goodies are available
to you at your fingertips the Journey dot ryo sports
(50:36):
dot com.
Speaker 5 (50:40):
All right, so Carlyn basically mentioned it all in terms
of the different varieties and the bas elect the mesolectal
varieties alcollect cell form. In terms of the structure, though
as you mentioned that, I could add a little bit
to that.
Speaker 6 (51:01):
What we have is the bas.
Speaker 5 (51:03):
Electal forms retaining the African structure. And well, the Indians
came later, so Indians tend to contribute more to the
vocabulary and not so much the structure. But if we
look at how if we look at how sentences are formed,
(51:27):
for example, in Creole is we will note that the
structure is not in keeping with the English structure, even
though a lot of the lexical items or the words
are from the English language. So so I'll give a
simple example in Jamaica.
Speaker 6 (51:49):
The same example could apply to Ghanese.
Speaker 5 (51:52):
Also Ghanese Creole if I should yeah, so we may
say something like imania.
Speaker 6 (52:02):
Imania right.
Speaker 5 (52:04):
In this case, we have the subject, we have the verb,
and we oh, well, in this case it's just subject
verb right, because that kind of sentence. But let me
add something imaniam in bicle, all right, emaniam in bicle.
In this case you have subject and you have the
predicator made of the verb and the object.
Speaker 6 (52:28):
Right.
Speaker 5 (52:29):
The form is similar to English in terms of the subject,
verb object word order. But when you look closer at
how the structure is made. So we start with im,
we see where im it's the same word. Use later
imaniam in bicle. Where English would normally have a different
(52:53):
subject pronoun the nominative case and the accusative case for
the object pronoun, we realize we have inverbal case in
Jamaica the same happening.
Speaker 10 (53:04):
Danese.
Speaker 5 (53:05):
Chinese would use e or the more Basilectaganese or use m.
Speaker 13 (53:10):
Right.
Speaker 5 (53:12):
So again you look at the second set of words
and yam in this case, the app shows that it
is progressive. It shows a continuous aspect marker, right, but
not how it is formed, how it is used with
the verb. In English.
Speaker 13 (53:30):
For example, in terms of structure, eating would be the
equivalent where the I n G that shows the continuous
aspect is attached to the word.
Speaker 6 (53:43):
So you have eating right. For us with the Creole.
Speaker 5 (53:47):
Language, we have a niam. In this case, you have
an independent marker of the progressive that is placed.
Speaker 6 (53:55):
Before the verb right.
Speaker 5 (53:58):
So imam bikle In this case bickle means food right.
And so it's a totally different word from the English word.
Though we may have the same subject verb object in
terms of structure word order, inherently the different pieces are
(54:21):
formed differently, so you have the total different makeup of
the verb phrase.
Speaker 8 (54:27):
Yeah and you I see you not in Caroline, love it,
love it.
Speaker 10 (54:34):
So it's probably even more intricate and complex.
Speaker 5 (54:37):
But yes, it's nice, I love it love and as
you mentioned intricate. I like to use this example the
ah in Jamaica, and it applies also in Dana's but
I tend to speak more about Jamaica, and I'm more
confident in my native tom of course than Uscanese examples.
But we have a no sometimes to think that, Okay,
(55:02):
people would use the Creole language because it's a simple language.
It is not. So I use the iman yam in
this case shows that it is a progressive aspect, but
the same word ah can be used in about to
seven other different forms. So you may have the vocalized
(55:27):
a particle as in a lumbuckle, and the table adapts
may attack.
Speaker 6 (55:40):
Right ah.
Speaker 5 (55:41):
You may use ah in the prospective aspect also where
it tends to move with go, So I go miagyam
different from miayam. You may also see exactly maya com
(56:03):
may I got com.
Speaker 6 (56:05):
It's two different aspect marker at play there.
Speaker 5 (56:09):
You may use as a proposition in the sense that
in go as school, h right, in go at school
in well to school, So it's proposition. The infinitive would
(56:29):
be used when it's used with the verbs. So it
can be used in an infinitive marker when it's used
with the verb, as in no, no, no. In that
case it's it wouldn't be the infinitive normally the infinitive
it's not marked right, so yeah, so our school would
(56:52):
be to school as a proposition. We can use it
also as the equative in terms of the.
Speaker 6 (57:03):
Aspect, not not aspect.
Speaker 5 (57:05):
The equative coupolar, right, that's the word I'm trying to
The coupola is the form that we're use in cre
for the verb to be. So for example, I would
have Carolyn is a teacher, or Carolyn.
Speaker 6 (57:24):
Is my friend.
Speaker 5 (57:27):
Carolyn equates to a teacher, Carolyn equates her teacher exactly,
so you have Carolyn our teacher, Carolyne am a friend.
That's the end of the name. Yes, So we have several
different ways of using this one form, which clearly shows
that this language couldn't be simple.
Speaker 8 (57:49):
Right.
Speaker 4 (57:52):
Another example pluralization, which is not the same pluralization we
use s for more common forms of pluralization in English. Right,
So where we say the boys, we're gonna say them
by you might have various pluralization markers as well.
Speaker 10 (58:14):
Can you speak yes?
Speaker 5 (58:16):
Sure, So in terms of plural this Creole is Jamaican
Creole languages, and a whole shows how we depart from
the European system because for English, as I said, we
tend to use a bond marker unless it is something irregular.
Speaker 6 (58:40):
Where we add, well, we use other ways.
Speaker 5 (58:45):
Of expressing plural so we change the internal structure. So
you have men, you have men that kind of thing,
but generally you have boys boys girls girls, and so
when we have also the es form, but in Creole languages,
we tend to use distinct markers that are separating apart
(59:09):
from the knowings themselves. So for Ghyanese and Jamaican, the
marker is them. We tend to put them as the
We tend to put them as the marker at the
end of the world. So for example, you have boy,
(59:29):
we have buy them. We can have them showing plurality
before the verb before the word in terms of them by,
but not to the structure between them by and the
by them. It's two different things. Then buy would be
(59:50):
those boys as opposed to the buy them, which is
boys in general. So then by a place we know
that this is those boys, they buy them a play.
Speaker 6 (01:00:03):
It could be those boys or some other boys.
Speaker 8 (01:00:06):
Right, yeah, Now, how do you address a standard that
I just want.
Speaker 6 (01:00:13):
To add something else?
Speaker 5 (01:00:14):
Because that's just one way of expressioning plurality. In the
Creole languages, we also have forms of plurals that are
not expressed in the sense that we rely on the
context heavily in order to understand that these are plurals.
So if within the context I have something like a number,
(01:00:38):
so five buy, we need not say five by them
or five buys. I mean, I'm probably not pronouncing by right,
because I would normally say why in Jamaica. So I'm
going to use my Jamaica and why. We don't say
five why. We would say sorry, We don't say five
(01:00:59):
whys or five why them we would use five why.
So we don't add any rural marker in those cases.
In other cases we may use them more as an
inclusive marker. So if I'm saying Carolyne them, in this case,
(01:01:21):
it doesn't mean more than one Carolyne, but Carolyn and
her associates, Carlyn and her friends, Carolyn them, they right, right.
So we have different ways of expressing plurality. And I
think this is something that also speaks about intricate.
Speaker 6 (01:01:43):
Intricate the Creole languages.
Speaker 5 (01:01:45):
Are in their formation, in their structure, and so forth.
Speaker 8 (01:01:50):
Yeah, how do you standardize the spelling of the words?
Speaker 5 (01:01:54):
I wanted to ask that question, Yes, questions, Okay.
Speaker 6 (01:01:57):
So.
Speaker 5 (01:01:59):
Standard I'm happy that you mentioned this spelling and not
standardizing the language because that's a totally different process. Okay,
So what we have been doing for Jamaica, there is
from the nineteen sixties two linguist Cassidy and Lepage, who
(01:02:21):
developed a writing system. It was more recently modified by
the Jamaican Language Unit, and that is a system that
we use in terms of a standard spelling system.
Speaker 14 (01:02:36):
This system is a phonemic system where we have one
song representing one symbol. The same system is used with
modifications as developed by cav George Kiev for Guyanese. So
we again have the same one symbol, one.
Speaker 6 (01:03:00):
Sound kind of system.
Speaker 5 (01:03:01):
Let me just explain that us. Right, So we have
a phonemic writing system where we have a one sound,
one symbol mapping.
Speaker 6 (01:03:17):
So I'm gonna explain what that means.
Speaker 5 (01:03:19):
Right First, I'm going to use the English situation and
then I go into the writing system. So in English
we tend to have one sound being mapped onto many symbols,
and likewise one symbol being mapped onto many sounds. So,
(01:03:42):
for example, we have letter A. Letter A may sound
like an A in many, it may sound like an
in all, It may sound like a ah in man,
it may sound like lots of other things. I can't
be bothered to im exactly like it can be sound
(01:04:05):
as in that kind of sound, we have lots of
different ways where the same letter is sounded. The question is,
how do you, as a learner know when you see
letter A, how to pronounce it? Similarly, you have a sound,
for example, E, just a sound, not that symbol. Right E.
(01:04:29):
E can be written with an I, as in sit,
where you have an E song SIT. It can be
written as an E as in E. It can be
written as E E E E as in C. It
(01:04:49):
can be written as E A again as in C.
It can be written as a E as in Caesar.
It can be written as y as in silly ye.
Speaker 10 (01:05:02):
At the end.
Speaker 5 (01:05:03):
It can be written as a lot of different things.
The question is how do you know which way to.
Speaker 6 (01:05:11):
Write this word?
Speaker 5 (01:05:12):
And hence we have spelling problems all the time in English.
So the system that we use for writing Creole, Creoles
or Jamaican is a system that avoids all of that.
And that's why I said we have a one to
one mapping. Anywhere you see a symbol, it is sounded
the same way all the time. So A is only
(01:05:36):
sounded as A. E is only A, I is only e,
al is only oh, and U is only oh. Right,
So we have these songs. We have the lung versions
and the short versions, and we also have diep thums.
Diep plans are pretty much simply double vowels.
Speaker 6 (01:05:58):
So if you.
Speaker 5 (01:05:59):
Have two of those songs coming together, so for example
I E E or ai I E or.
Speaker 6 (01:06:09):
Uoo.
Speaker 5 (01:06:10):
Of course some of those songs are not in Guyanese,
but we do have them in Jamaican. Right, So the
writing system is designed based on the needs of the
particular language. Right.
Speaker 6 (01:06:24):
So for Jamaican, while we may have wo, which is.
Speaker 5 (01:06:28):
Not a sound in Guyanese, you guys should still be
able to understand it because it's the same principles that apply. Right,
So we have this kind of system in terms of
the voels. In terms of the consonants, there are similar
to the consonants for the most part used in English,
again with the one to one mapping.
Speaker 6 (01:06:48):
Yes, and therefore we don't.
Speaker 5 (01:06:50):
Have certain consonant symbols. So for example, letter C, you
would know in English it is sometimes pronounced like a
C sorry as an S, and it's sometimes pronounced like
a K.
Speaker 6 (01:07:02):
So we don't want that.
Speaker 12 (01:07:05):
If it's a case that you're pronouncing cup, you simply
write it as a ky.
Speaker 6 (01:07:12):
If you're pronouncing, simply write it as an S.
Speaker 5 (01:07:16):
Right. We have Q.
Speaker 6 (01:07:20):
Normally Q is pronounced q as in Queen, Right, so
we simple write co k W queen. Right, we have
the same thing with an X.
Speaker 5 (01:07:37):
So in English X is sometimes written just as an
X and pronounced X.
Speaker 6 (01:07:45):
But in some other cases you have.
Speaker 5 (01:07:48):
Just a pronunciation or just a pronunciation, right, So for
us we eliminate X totally and we write exactly how
it's pronounced. So in X ray it would be e
K S because X it's all pronounced. But in our
word like.
Speaker 6 (01:08:08):
Sucks for sacks, we would just have s A K
S sucks s.
Speaker 5 (01:08:14):
Right, so right, so in that case it's the same
curse pronunciation saxophone is the same written with a X,
but it's the same pronunciation with the cooks right. So
we simply write precisely how we pronounce. And that is
(01:08:37):
why we don't have to worry about the problem about
the varieties when we write, Because if you pronounce something
in your variety, because I wouldn't say it sucks, right, right,
so you write sucks because that's a maselectal variety. But
the vaplector person who's gonna say sucks.
Speaker 6 (01:08:57):
Would write it with a sucks.
Speaker 5 (01:09:00):
So we write exactly how we pronounce it, and it
becomes simply and applicable to all, you don't have to
say this is the right form or that is the
right form, because once it is not erroneous, like nobody
in Guyana would pronounce it as silks right, So unless
it is erroneous, then it will work.
Speaker 2 (01:09:20):
Right.
Speaker 8 (01:09:21):
Yes, this is awesome. So this is awesome in so
many ways. But we'll be right back.
Speaker 1 (01:09:28):
The Journey is available free on iTunes, Blog talk Radio, Rio,
sports Radio, and several of your favorite Internet platforms, downloading
bed and share why any of the social media you love.
Speaker 2 (01:09:41):
Doctor Delissa and doctor Cummings will be returning. We also
have lighted up experts directly from amongst the indigenous people
of Guyana to discuss how language inferences our culture and
(01:10:03):
our lives. Visit us on the Journey dot ryal sports
dot com. See you next week.
Hello and welcome to the Journey, your radio show hosted
by Nevill d'angelou, author of a sound Bite Life and
Flight of the Feused Monkeys, a PRG Emerging Technologies Forum
keynote speaker and founder of RIO Sports. I am Joseph Ellison. Enjoy.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
What is Guyana's language? What language do you Guani speak?
I am Neville. My guests are doctor Carolyn Cummings and
doctor Tamian Nina Delissa. Ghana is a country with vast
varieties that is an aspect of its endowed indigenous wealth.
(00:47):
As Guyana rightfully asserts its identity, its voice, and the
dignity to stand on its own terms in the company
of a global array of new, predominantly powerful interests, the
surge of inquiry is frenetic. Who's this new kid on
(01:08):
the block? Head high, sitting at the table? So unique?
What is best informed? To dispense with familiar labels? Now,
language is a powerful force. It shapes a people's identity.
It's a divining boundary. It's the door to people's culture.
(01:30):
That's just for starters. So I suggest it should not
be taken lightly. Doctor Carolyn Cummings is the director of
(01:56):
the International Center of Excellence for a Culture and Creative
Expression Studies and Sports in the Faculty of Education and
Humanities at the University of Guyana and as a lecturer
of Applied Linguistics and English Language. She is the former
(02:17):
head of Department of Language and Cultural Studies in the
Faculty of Education and Humanities. Her research interests include cultural heritage,
cultural agenda setting and policy, popular culture, language and identity,
(02:38):
and teaching English as a second language, especially in Creole
speaking environments. Doctor Cummings has served as an adjudicator for
Guyana's National Drama Festival for many years and for the
Prestige Cana Prize for Literature Youth Category twenty twenty five.
(03:01):
She has been a trained educator for over twenty five
years and enjoys painting and creating art and fashion. Doctor
tamer And Nina Delissa, Coordinator of the Guyanese Languages Unit
(03:22):
and Senior Lecturer in Linguistics in the Faculty of Education
and Humanities, University of Guyana, holds an MAA and a
PhD in General Linguistics, a BA double major in Linguistics
and Language Communication and Society, and a postgraduate diploma in education.
(03:48):
Her main research area is first language, acquisition of syntactic
systems in Creole languages. Her multidisciplinary research interest straddles general linguistics,
social linguistics, and education. She is also a published translator
(04:12):
for Jamaican. You are on the journey with Neville.
Speaker 3 (04:31):
Along the journey, we stop at intriguing places and meet
fascinating people with novel solutions to some of life's tricky questions.
And we play a few games and track the remarkable
characters of three classic books, A SoundBite Life, Flight of
the Fused Monkeys and Illa Sat A Time to Begin Again,
all of which can be found on Amazon and Barnes
(04:53):
and Noble.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
Dr Cummings and doctor Delissa have asked me to refer
to them by their familiar first names, while I prefer
to all of them with their title. If occasionally you
hear me call them by their first names, I will
rest in the fact that they asked me to kindly
(05:18):
tell us a little bit about yourself before we delve
into what is the Guyanese language or what language do
Guyanese speak?
Speaker 4 (05:30):
I thank you, thank you very much. I am Krolyne Cummins.
I am a lecturer of language arts and linguistics at
the University of Ghana, currently on leave, but I'm still
very much involved with some aspects. And I am also
very much interested in cultural studies cultural a gender setting
(05:56):
for Guyana and also interested in conducting work with regards
to cultural heritage, which includes aspects of language in them.
Speaker 5 (06:12):
And I am tamiran Nina Delisa.
Speaker 6 (06:16):
I know that's moldeful, but you can say Tamir for short.
Speaker 5 (06:21):
So I am also a lecturer here at Yuji University
of Viana in the Department of Language and Cultural Studies,
but I also teach in the Department of Curriculum and Instruction.
For me, I am a linguist ara of specialization first
(06:44):
language acquisition. I have interest and have worked in Creole
studies in particular and with indigenous languages. I'm also a
translator of my name tip Tongue. I'm a Jamaican, so
I translate Jamaican and Creole. Currently the coordinator of the
(07:09):
Guyanese Languages units, and that unit really looks about everything
Guyanese language. So yeah, indigenous language is the Creole is, Yeah,
that's about it.
Speaker 7 (07:26):
In a while, I want to know what is Crele
is and since this is both is a global program
I know that Jamaica plays a warm part of people's
parts across the globe.
Speaker 8 (07:38):
You might have to tell us exactly what it means
by interpreting Jamaican language. But right now, can you guys
tell us why is it you do what you do.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Well?
Speaker 9 (07:52):
For me?
Speaker 5 (07:54):
I think it's a calling. I didn't plan on being
a linguist at any point in my life.
Speaker 6 (08:01):
It just so happened, like developments.
Speaker 5 (08:04):
I initially wanted to do uh something in mass communication,
but when the program wasn't available for me, I decided
to do something that I thought was the next best thing,
which was language communication and society. Upon doing that, I
realized it was heavily linguistics based, and therefore I ended
(08:28):
up with a double mast a double Maysia sorry, in
linguistics and language Communication and society. Because I realized I
liked both, I went on to do the Masters in linguistics,
and opportunities just presented themselves, and I found myself with
a PhD in linguistics.
Speaker 6 (08:50):
Similarly, so I.
Speaker 5 (08:53):
Look at it to more as a calling, something that
I actually like and something that I find that is
totally beneficial. There is nothing that we can do without language,
and I find that it is important for us, especially
in these regions like Jamaica, Guyana, where we have indigenous
(09:17):
languages and Creole languages.
Speaker 6 (09:19):
That are not treated with the same respect.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
As the European languages, for us to work to get
these languages the rights that they deserve. And so I
find myself becoming more and more passionate about that, and
that's why I continue to do what I do.
Speaker 8 (09:38):
I'm keen to the indigenous languages. I'm keen to find
out more about that in a moment.
Speaker 10 (09:46):
But why do I do what I do?
Speaker 4 (09:48):
Yes, okay, So I've always had interest in language as
far as I know, language and art I have from
as early as secondary I was never interested in science
or any of those things. I always wanted I'm always
the kind of humanities person, and so I started out
(10:11):
I was a teacher. I've been a primary school teacher.
But then I came to Yuchi and as a a student,
I did my undergraduate degree in English for English. That
means in our program, we have linguistics and we have
literature in that program, and so I did both. But
I majored in linguistics, and so I took a like
(10:33):
into linguistics and I did some improvement in linguistics at
the master's level. However, I think that because I'm also
a creative I am an amateurre artist, so.
Speaker 10 (10:49):
That's that too, And so I.
Speaker 4 (10:51):
Have an interest in art, as in fine arts as
well as performative arts in Guyana, and also all the
other cultural things I mentioned earlier. So I have a
very very strong passion for the fact that we have
our cultural industry really needs a lot of improvement, and
(11:13):
there are lacks somewhere.
Speaker 10 (11:15):
So for example, there is no cultural policy.
Speaker 4 (11:17):
I think the last cultural policy we had was in
nineteen seventy six or so, where we had burned out.
They had a cultural policy then, but ever since we have,
like I sailled forty years or more than forty years,
we haven't had cultural policy. So those are some of
the things that I'm interested in. And therefore I branched
out a little away from linguistics and language teaching to
(11:42):
more aspects of cultural agenda setting right cultural planning.
Speaker 10 (11:47):
And so I am still right in the very early.
Speaker 4 (11:50):
Stages of doing work in cultural policy or cultural studies,
and so that is where I am. But also I've
just very just like about a few hours ago, been
us to direct the center for it's called International Center
(12:11):
of Excellence for Cultural and Creative Expression, Studies and Sports.
Speaker 10 (12:18):
So very very new and with that center, I.
Speaker 4 (12:24):
Thank you, and we're hoping to add a lot of
programs here so that I'll be doing exactly what my
passion is in performance and sports and film studies.
Speaker 10 (12:35):
And those kinds of things.
Speaker 8 (12:37):
Well, you see, I always learned something more far from
than what I advised you guys to tell us about.
We're going to take a break and then we'll come
into a topic on linguistics. We'll be right back.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
The people of Guyana are ethnically diverse Indo Guyanese, Afro
Guyanese Amerindians. That is an indigenous population of nine tribes,
just to name a few, Roxyy Caribs, a Koyo, they're
(13:28):
more a significant portion sent in. Twenty percent of our
people are mixed race Chinese, Portuguese, Dutch and other European descents.
It is a rich mixture. So what language does a
(13:50):
Guyanese speak? Where can you learn it and how does
it ampact our culture? For a diversity of access, you
may visit the Journey's home base Select Guyana. The Journey's
(14:11):
website is the Journey dot ryosports dot com. The Journey
as in one word, the Journey dot Ryo Sports, Ryo Sports,
but Ryo s po rts the Journey dot ryosports dot
com discover Guyana.
Speaker 8 (14:49):
Well, I'm happily back with Tamir and Carolyn linguists. That's
not something that people choose to be immediately, and you
guys have found yourself in this field. And obviously as
you're I think you're saying that it's so it's important
(15:11):
to a culture because language affects what happens to your
culture or how your your culture developed. Can you talk
to us about that?
Speaker 6 (15:21):
So language definitely affects everything. How do I start?
Speaker 5 (15:29):
Well, as you mentioned language affecting culture, language I would
say is also culture and it builds culture because the
way how we communicate we use language, and that says
a lot about aspects of our culture, how we communicate
(15:51):
with each other. Of course, culture is very wide, but
all that happens in culture depends still on language.
Speaker 6 (16:00):
So I'm not sure if I should.
Speaker 8 (16:02):
Go into please go pleaseguages.
Speaker 5 (16:05):
For example in Guyana and integration of that in Guyanese
culture for example. So Guyana is what we would describe
as multi lingual. There are lots of different languages operating
in the small space not so.
Speaker 6 (16:26):
Small, but.
Speaker 8 (16:29):
I used to think it's a huge space. Someone overseas
corrected me, and I'm like.
Speaker 11 (16:37):
Depending on how we look at the space, right, But
the idea is that we have a relatively small population,
just around eight hundred thousand.
Speaker 5 (16:48):
People, and within that we have nine active indigenous languages.
We have our Creole language, we have a the other
European languages, and as is widely known, Ghana is dubbed
as English speaking, where English is our official language. Right,
(17:12):
all of that creates a very multilingual space and impacts
on culture. Impacts on culture in the sense that we
have different people speaking different toms, but at the same time,
the traditions that are associated with those tongues are all
(17:35):
combined to identify what we term Guyanese.
Speaker 8 (17:41):
Does it enrich us as a culture or does it
cause Talk to me about that. I could see those enriching.
I'd like to think of it that way. Or is
it does it cause a lot of conflict?
Speaker 6 (17:57):
It is enriching, ultimately, isn'enrich in?
Speaker 5 (18:01):
But I can see where there may be some conflict
as a result, I'm gonna try to speak about the
conflict first.
Speaker 6 (18:12):
You know that that is probably.
Speaker 5 (18:14):
A little ticklish area. But why I'm thinking there may
be conflict resulting, it's because of the different ethnicities that
tend to be all in this space, and therefore you
may be we may experience conflict in terms of social conflicts.
(18:38):
Some languages, for example, the European languages, are generally ascribed
to as being the languages, and everything else is seen
to be dialects or bad forms of the European languages
or some sub language, but not given the same respect
(19:01):
as the European languages. That I find to be quite
discriminating not only to the language, but also to the
people who speak this language, because you find that the
resources are not equally available in these languages for the speakers,
(19:24):
and they are also treated very differently from those who
speak the European languages. So, for example, if I should
be a speaker of one of the indigenous languages, say
Akawai or y Y, I would probably opt not to
(19:46):
as in not me, But a speaker in one of
those areas would probably not to include that on their
resume because they don't necessarily find it to be prestigious. Similarly,
the vast majority of Ghanese are speakers of Creoles, but
they will not put Creoles as a language on their
(20:10):
resume because chances are they may be discriminated against because
they identify as a Creole or speaker.
Speaker 8 (20:21):
Yeah, go, red heads, I'll come back. And I see
you're nodding lots of looking forward to what you're gonna say,
And I just want to give your heads up that
I'm going to obviously try to see if we you
guys have a solution to this kind of stuff. But
go ahead, let's go ahead.
Speaker 6 (20:38):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
To add to what she's saying, there is a lot
of language loss as well, because because of the fact
that people are shy of the language, many people are
shy of the Most people are shy of their what'll
we called native languages because most of us, most of
(21:01):
us o our native languages are It's not English, even
though we might grow up learning English and school formally,
our language is Creole. I speak Creole, and most of
the people that I know speak Creole, but they are
we are shy often of using Creole. And for those
(21:23):
who speak Amornian languages, they're even more shy. And so
as a result, especially with Amarni languages, there is language loss.
There's some language loss, and the languages, some of them
are are being threatened, you know, to die because some
of them, there are speakers may have died as well,
(21:44):
last speakers, so that there is a certain kind of movement.
But there is a phytal revitalize and help to maintain
those languages. And this is some of the work that
doctor List is doing in the Guyanese Languages Unit, right.
But there's a language loss. But there is also you
(22:06):
see with language teaching and schools because many of us,
most of us, we are trained to believe and accept,
we are forced to accept that, oh, you speak English,
but Guyana is not English speaking.
Speaker 10 (22:23):
It is English official.
Speaker 4 (22:25):
That means that the majority is doctor List said, speak creole,
like ninety percent speak creole. And then we use English
as a second language.
Speaker 10 (22:38):
English is a second language. And that is why in.
Speaker 4 (22:41):
Terms of the conflict and the challenges that arise from
that kind of thing, is that why is it that
our students, many of them at all levels primary secondary,
cxx sex, even at the university, trouble with English language.
(23:01):
We're terrified of English, threatened by an English class and
threatened by English teachers, right, because it's not our language.
If it was the language that we speak, we would
not be threatened. It is that, okay, you know, but
because of that, there is this struggle to learn a language.
(23:26):
And then you see if you look at the results
some of it for c SEX for example, that's what
we used to call CX right, ce SEX end of
secondary exams that they do, right, you know, the performances
are not so good. And then when you look at
some of the performance as well as for our students who
(23:46):
do English language because they're required to do it at
the first year and undergraduate studies. So and if you
look at the results, you could see that more than
half of the students are still challenged by using English,
by writing English, and by speaking English.
Speaker 5 (24:06):
All right, So, just to follow up, but with what
Carlyn was saying, we have the situation where yes, people
are treated or discriminated based on the language they use,
generally the Creolis language.
Speaker 6 (24:26):
But the reverse is also true.
Speaker 5 (24:29):
In some situations. You may find that people are treated
unfairly also because they use quote unquote standard English. So
I'll give a scenario. In the primary school, you may
have children who are genuine English speakers, but what the
(24:51):
other children tend to do is to call them names. Okay,
she behaving like she's English dot com, high defense, the
twanging and all.
Speaker 6 (25:02):
Of these things.
Speaker 5 (25:03):
So it's not a good feeling for the English monolingual
speaker in that sense because they cannot necessarily naturally speak
the creole language, and therefore they are probably put aside
for that.
Speaker 6 (25:21):
So the reverse is also true.
Speaker 5 (25:24):
But one thing I am very pleased about with regard
to this situation is that since twenty twenty two, the
Ministry of Education have realized probably they did realize.
Speaker 6 (25:38):
Before, but it is now in the new revised.
Speaker 5 (25:41):
Curriculum of twenty twenty two for Language arts in the
primary schools where they are recognizing both English and the
mother tongue, so teachers are encouraged to use both English
and the mother tongue. The mother tongue may not be
real is because we have the indigenous communities. So if
(26:03):
you're from one of they say, what pasion speaking communities,
you're encouraged to use your mother's home in the classroom
as a means of instruction and interaction. So yes, that
is great, but we still need to move a little
bit more where that is concerned, because while this is
(26:25):
under books, teachers are not necessarily trained at our levels.
So that's where our training.
Speaker 6 (26:34):
At UG and probably at CPCE.
Speaker 5 (26:37):
Also what a CPC the serial part of College of Education.
That's a teacher's training college before they actually they would
normally do a teaching certificate or an associate degree and
then they would come to EUG to do their bachelors.
So these institutions are equipped to actually help to bridge
(27:04):
that gap because having this in the curriculum, teachers still
are not clearing how to navigate, and also materials and
resources are generally lacking in these mother town languages. So
we are now training teachers. We have, for example, a
(27:26):
program that recently concluded. We had our first batch of
graduates just last Saturday walking the stage, eighteen indigenous speakers
of Wapishan.
Speaker 6 (27:42):
We had a program.
Speaker 5 (27:44):
In the well.
Speaker 6 (27:45):
It's a certificate certificate program.
Speaker 5 (27:48):
In dual language and a multi lingual practice in education
where we targeted nursery school teachers how to use their
mother tongue as the means of interaction and instruction in
the classroom spaces.
Speaker 8 (28:05):
I think it's also one of them because you've got there.
But I just want to ask a questions. Are all
teachers now trained at the CPC? Did I say that correct?
And at ug or is so?
Speaker 6 (28:21):
On the cost?
Speaker 5 (28:23):
I believe that most of the teachers are trained. I
know that we do have situations majority of all the
teachers are trained, but we do have some rare situations,
especially in the interior, where you may find teachers that
(28:43):
are not trained in the classrooms. So I know, for example,
at the nursery level, you may have a few teachers
who are not trained, but they would have in teacher
in training programs the less that could help them before
they get to CPC. But the move I suppose is
(29:06):
that all teachers are to be trained.
Speaker 8 (29:10):
Awesome. Awesome, Now I know I did have a question
about creole, and creole is can you address that?
Speaker 5 (29:19):
Sure? So, creole is a more general term that is
used well not only to describe languages, because you have
creole languages, but you also have creule culture creal culture,
which should include the food, the music, the traditions and
(29:40):
so on. But in terms of languages, we have creole
being the general term of those languages that well, we
have different ideas of the origin but one of the
theories is that these creole languages originated f apple on
(30:00):
the plantation society, where they develop from the pigeon into
a creole. Where the pigeon initially would have been that
language that is just used as a means of communicating
between speakers who are not normally how do you say,
(30:24):
having communicative competence in either languages, So they would tend
to create this makeshift language that is referred to as
a pigeon, which is used solely for the purpose for trade.
Speaker 6 (30:39):
Children born in.
Speaker 5 (30:41):
That situation now would need a language in order to communicate,
and therefore the theory states that the children generally would
create this creole language. So once that language becomes that
pigeon becomes native used, meaning we have children speaking it
(31:03):
as their native language.
Speaker 6 (31:05):
It is now referred to as a creole language. So
we have.
Speaker 5 (31:10):
Lots of creole languages across the globe. For the Caribbean,
we tend to refer to them as Atlantic creoles or
in sometimes in some cases we have Caribbean creoles.
Speaker 6 (31:24):
Right, So the languages that we.
Speaker 5 (31:27):
Speak in Jamaica, in Guyana, as a result of this
kind of plantation society, we would have them being creole
languages specific to Guyana. For example, it is casually referred
to our amicably better word referred to as creoles by
speakers in Jamaica. In Jamaica, we would referred to it
(31:50):
as Patua. Of course, you know, you have Haitian Creole,
you have Strana, and you.
Speaker 6 (31:55):
Have lots of creoles across the Caribbean.
Speaker 5 (32:00):
Linguists, however, tend to not necessarily want to subscribe to
the name, for example, Patua because it is seen as direcatory.
But we prefer, I personally prefer to call my language Jamaican.
(32:22):
For Guyana, the people are fine with creoleis we call
it crelis. You may see people referring to it generally
linguists as a Ganese creole, right, but.
Speaker 6 (32:35):
The creole as estion.
Speaker 8 (32:38):
But must say on that, don't you lose your thoughts?
So another difference you just pointed out the different thing
creole and creole is Guyanese prefer to call creoles Guyanese
creole or Guyanese creole is which one are you saying?
Speaker 10 (32:54):
I don't know.
Speaker 4 (32:55):
I believe that both, because I think it depends on
who spe okay.
Speaker 8 (33:01):
So it's a it's a free forms. There's no there's
no many people you.
Speaker 4 (33:06):
Would say it's creoles crearly is sorry, but there are
others maybe might be more in a formal setting that
they might want to refer to language as Dyani is creole.
Speaker 5 (33:18):
But your question Guyanese creole versus Ghyanese creole lease. Normally
the linguist would refer to it as Ghanese creole. People
would refer to their language as Creo Leese, not necessarily
Guyanese creole is because once you say creole, is that
(33:42):
it is Guyanese.
Speaker 8 (33:43):
So why would linguists not want to use that term.
Speaker 12 (33:48):
I I am not sure exactly how to answer it,
but I'll give my own inclinations.
Speaker 5 (33:59):
So, just as we would have patois, the idea is
that creole is maybe saying direcatory, right, So they prefer
to use Creole as the broad language family in terms
of origins and to give the name of the country
(34:22):
Guyanese Creole Jamaican Creole.
Speaker 6 (34:26):
However, we have departed.
Speaker 5 (34:29):
I personally have departed from that for Jamaican Creole because
I'm thinking, okay.
Speaker 6 (34:38):
We have French.
Speaker 5 (34:41):
Spoken by the French people in France, we have English
spoken by the English. In England, we have Italians spoken
by the Italian and so forth. Why do we have
to add Creole to distinguish the kind of language and
the historical beginnings? We have Jamaican people, We speak Jamaican
(35:03):
just like everybody else. The situation a little sticklish because
it may be more difficult exactly to call Creoles Diyanese
because indigenous people may see but my language is Danese
do that kind of thing. So it's a little ticklish
(35:27):
to refer to Ganese girl as simply as Guyanese.
Speaker 8 (35:30):
As languists and as you said, as linguists. You know
that languages affect culture, and as a Guyanese people, you
want a culture to be rich. How would you recommend
bridging that gap? Or there's no gap to bridge? The
fact that you've got these many different languages that are
(35:54):
all essentially Guyanese helped me. I don't want to be
jumping into the water. Is there is there anything to
be solved? Maybe not?
Speaker 5 (36:09):
Maybe not?
Speaker 8 (36:09):
We are we just unique there you guys required.
Speaker 5 (36:17):
Let me let me try so just to answer that,
I get your question using language to bridge a cultural gas.
Speaker 8 (36:26):
No, you just mentioned that Italian's language is Italian, the
Germans language is German. What is the Guyanese language? We
have many different languages, so we can't say Guyanese or
(36:47):
probably not because we've got these different So is there
any bridge to be, any gaps to be bridged or
is that just the fact.
Speaker 5 (36:56):
That we stay. How I see it, I'm not GeSe,
I am not privy to talk about this, yes, and
she can tell me what I'm saying makes sense or
if it's not right. But how I see it is
(37:16):
that when we look at the Ganese situation, we have creolies,
which is the Guyanas, which is Ghana's Lingua Franco.
Speaker 6 (37:28):
Everybody speaks creally.
Speaker 5 (37:29):
Is the indigenous people generally speak cruely, the people on
the coast, they all speak really So for me, I
don't think there should be an issue if we should
term Guyanese Creole as Guyanese because it has different well,
(37:50):
it caters for everyone.
Speaker 6 (37:52):
It's the lingual Franco we all use. Not what I'm saying, we.
Speaker 10 (37:59):
Yes, I identify.
Speaker 5 (38:01):
Sometimes as Guyanese, and at this point I identify as Ghanese.
When I speak about linguistic issues in Diana, I identify
as Guyanese. Right, Yes, I don't think that it should
be a grave issue if we should use Creoles as
(38:23):
Guyana's language and therefore referred to it as Guyanese. The
historic backgrounds of the indigenous languages are very different from
how Creole is developed in Guyana, and I think that
based on just the history of who the Gayanese people
are and this language, this language, it caters for everyone.
Speaker 6 (38:47):
In Guyanese Creole, you will have.
Speaker 5 (38:51):
Words probably that are indigenous. You have words that are
frost they the Indian. Sorry, you have words that are
from the African languages. So it is a language that
cases for us. So to say Guyanese should be perfect.
(39:12):
That's how I see it.
Speaker 8 (39:13):
Okay, is there any sense on the street? Do you
guys have a sense across the street or nobody's thinking
about this? It's just never okay, No.
Speaker 5 (39:23):
We have been thinking about it. I have this caused
this already in smaller circles of linguists like mind people.
But you are right in terms of on the street,
it is opportune time for us to find out, do
our survey.
Speaker 6 (39:42):
What is it that the people would prefer?
Speaker 8 (39:45):
That's the possible.
Speaker 10 (39:48):
Yeah, I agree, I agree. With her, there's no reason.
Speaker 4 (39:52):
I'm not sure if there is a gap because you're
a Guyanese. Most of us speak the language, so it
would be fine if it is called Guinese. But like
she said, we can do the research. But also I'd
like to also say that a lot of what we
are talking about now in terms of the response to
the languages in all the aspects, is part of the culture.
(40:18):
And like the fact that we have a language, it's
like almost like a melting pot with you have you
have Indian influences.
Speaker 10 (40:28):
Write a lot of the words that are in.
Speaker 4 (40:30):
Creole, like the versions of Creole that many Indian people use,
or many people in rural areas or specific areas. You
find specific terms that come from various places. Right, we
have African influences of course, and you have your Indian influences,
(40:51):
and then you have other influences that are in there,
even even Amerindian influences in the Guinese creole. So yeah,
it could be called and that's and that's very much
a part of our culture. And that's one that's one
of the bays in which language and culture is connected.
Speaker 8 (41:10):
Awesome will be right back.
Speaker 1 (41:13):
You are on the journey and it's time for our
question of the week.
Speaker 9 (41:18):
The question of the week is this does fluency in
the second language dilute your cultural identity? The question of
the week is this does fluency in the second language
dilute your cultural identity? We're back discussing what is the
(41:51):
Guyanese language.
Speaker 6 (41:53):
Yes, that's a continuu.
Speaker 5 (41:56):
At u g. We have been doing be.
Speaker 6 (42:02):
To you know, get the.
Speaker 5 (42:04):
Language situation in Guyana where we really want it to be.
So for example, we have this year, for the first
time of course elementary Wapishan. This course is there towards
non speakers of the Wapishan language. Anybody who wants to
(42:26):
learn one of our indigenous languages, you can know have
a course at EUGEN. Just yesterday we have approved a
follow up course to that, which is exploring Wapishan because
we have speakers of the language who are yes, they
may speak the language, but they don't necessarily understand the
(42:52):
intriquencies of the language and how it is that this
language works and even the culture situation how the language works. Right,
So we have that course that was only approved yesterday,
so I'm quite pleased about that. Also approved yesterday is
(43:13):
a new course which we have as Elementary Creole Ease,
I'll tell you a bit about that, but before I do, well,
let me go into it. Elementary Crearis is a course
that is designed for non speakers of Creoles. So over
the years and more so known, we have people coming
(43:34):
into Guyana and they are not speakers of the language.
Speaker 6 (43:39):
They don't know.
Speaker 5 (43:39):
Creley is, however, clearly is the language that the general
society use for daily communication.
Speaker 6 (43:47):
So in order to be.
Speaker 5 (43:50):
Integrated well, there is a need to speak really is.
And as I mentioned earlier, the fact that teachers know
are encouraged to use this language, it means that immigrant
children are also encouraged to speak this language. So having
a course where we target non speakers, and even some
(44:12):
Guinese may want to do this course because they are
themselves not.
Speaker 6 (44:19):
Fluent Creole speakers, or they could speak somewhat.
Speaker 5 (44:23):
But they don't know about reading and writing, so this
course will target that. But we do have a course
that we have been offering for some years no Exploring
Ghanese Creole, and that course we look at the structure
of the language, where we explore from the sound systems,
(44:48):
how words are formed, how these form sentences, how the
sentences are used for cultural integration and all looking at
all the different variet so that we of Creoles language
that are spoken in Guyana and so forth. So this
course is really a deep dive into the language of
(45:13):
the Guyanese populace in terms of the varieties. As was
raised yesterday, which a variety are we targeting. We're not
targeting any variety in particular because Ghanies avas space with
multiple varieties. So the people in a sequible probably will
(45:37):
be able to do this course similar to those in Barbie.
Speaker 6 (45:41):
What we do is to.
Speaker 5 (45:44):
Speak in general terms about how the different varieties work
and the different lexical items you may have.
Speaker 6 (45:55):
And we also know.
Speaker 5 (45:59):
That we have, based on probably social stratification and other means,
different varieties where you have the more Creole African retention
Indian retention, which is referred to as the.
Speaker 10 (46:16):
So you can.
Speaker 6 (46:19):
Varieties.
Speaker 10 (46:20):
So we have we have many different varieties.
Speaker 4 (46:22):
And of course it depends on where you are, who
are your influences, which community you grew up in, right,
So for example, in predominantly Indian communities you might you
might hear some some variety, certain kind of variety, whereas
in another Indian community might hear similar art could be
(46:44):
slightly different.
Speaker 10 (46:46):
And in the.
Speaker 4 (46:47):
Rural areas, especially like doctor Lisson mentioned barbies for example,
and not all of but you know specific parts you
hear more rural baslectal creoles.
Speaker 2 (46:59):
So on.
Speaker 4 (47:00):
The creole is on a continuum that moves from the
bas elect right to the acro elect The basilect is
the creole the versions which many of us may not
understand fully.
Speaker 10 (47:17):
It will be more less easy.
Speaker 4 (47:21):
To understand right for some of us, but for most Guyanese,
the bus elect and sorry, and then we have the
mes electal varieties us in the middle Mislo means middle.
But we have their various miss electal varieties along that continuum.
But they are going towards an acrolect. In this case,
(47:42):
a collect is the English language right, very often because
the acrolect is the language that lexifies or meaning where
we get the most vocabulary from. Right, the bas electal
forms are the vocabulary may come from more or Indian
(48:02):
languages like Buchwori and Hindi and other languages, and some
in some cases may be Amorinian luguages and also aspects
of African languages.
Speaker 10 (48:15):
Right, but not only that.
Speaker 4 (48:17):
The distinction between the basilect and the aqulect is often
not just the vocabulary, but more importantly it is the
structure of the language. Right, And maybe doctor the List
could help me little here. But the structure is definitely different,
and this is where you would see, Okay, you might
see in most Latin, in English, for example, you have
(48:37):
a subject verb object order, and in Creole you might
have that, but it may also it may also deviate
depending on which createle language you are talking about, and
the not just the subject verb object that kind of order,
that sense epic order. You'd have other kinds of things,
(48:59):
like the morphology the way the words that create are created,
like for example, bottom house boy, bottom house means doesn't
mean a house at the bottom, it means.
Speaker 10 (49:06):
Under the house, right.
Speaker 4 (49:07):
So so things like that will help to create the
bas elect and you will find ausso that a lot
of the elect that dialects are more heavenly influenced, not
just the vocabulary, but by the way African languages are
for example. Right, So maybe we could give an example,
(49:31):
and maybe doctor List could help me to explain that.
If there is anything to add.
Speaker 8 (49:38):
Will be right back.
Speaker 2 (49:47):
You are on the journey with Neville. Yours related today
we are discussing the influence of language and are personal
and cultural identity. Our home base is the Journey dot
ryo sports dot com. You can find our podcast on
(50:13):
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(50:36):
dot com.
Speaker 5 (50:40):
All right, so Carlyn basically mentioned it all in terms
of the different varieties and the bas elect the mesolectal
varieties alcollect cell form. In terms of the structure, though
as you mentioned that, I could add a little bit
to that.
Speaker 6 (51:01):
What we have is the bas.
Speaker 5 (51:03):
Electal forms retaining the African structure. And well, the Indians
came later, so Indians tend to contribute more to the
vocabulary and not so much the structure. But if we
look at how if we look at how sentences are formed,
(51:27):
for example, in Creole is we will note that the
structure is not in keeping with the English structure, even
though a lot of the lexical items or the words
are from the English language. So so I'll give a
simple example in Jamaica.
Speaker 6 (51:49):
The same example could apply to Ghanese.
Speaker 5 (51:52):
Also Ghanese Creole if I should yeah, so we may
say something like imania.
Speaker 6 (52:02):
Imania right.
Speaker 5 (52:04):
In this case, we have the subject, we have the verb,
and we oh, well, in this case it's just subject
verb right, because that kind of sentence. But let me
add something imaniam in bicle, all right, emaniam in bicle.
In this case you have subject and you have the
predicator made of the verb and the object.
Speaker 6 (52:28):
Right.
Speaker 5 (52:29):
The form is similar to English in terms of the subject,
verb object word order. But when you look closer at
how the structure is made. So we start with im,
we see where im it's the same word. Use later
imaniam in bicle. Where English would normally have a different
(52:53):
subject pronoun the nominative case and the accusative case for
the object pronoun, we realize we have inverbal case in
Jamaica the same happening.
Speaker 10 (53:04):
Danese.
Speaker 5 (53:05):
Chinese would use e or the more Basilectaganese or use m.
Speaker 13 (53:10):
Right.
Speaker 5 (53:12):
So again you look at the second set of words
and yam in this case, the app shows that it
is progressive. It shows a continuous aspect marker, right, but
not how it is formed, how it is used with
the verb. In English.
Speaker 13 (53:30):
For example, in terms of structure, eating would be the
equivalent where the I n G that shows the continuous
aspect is attached to the word.
Speaker 6 (53:43):
So you have eating right. For us with the Creole.
Speaker 5 (53:47):
Language, we have a niam. In this case, you have
an independent marker of the progressive that is placed.
Speaker 6 (53:55):
Before the verb right.
Speaker 5 (53:58):
So imam bikle In this case bickle means food right.
And so it's a totally different word from the English word.
Though we may have the same subject verb object in
terms of structure word order, inherently the different pieces are
(54:21):
formed differently, so you have the total different makeup of
the verb phrase.
Speaker 8 (54:27):
Yeah and you I see you not in Caroline, love it,
love it.
Speaker 10 (54:34):
So it's probably even more intricate and complex.
Speaker 5 (54:37):
But yes, it's nice, I love it love and as
you mentioned intricate. I like to use this example the
ah in Jamaica, and it applies also in Dana's but
I tend to speak more about Jamaica, and I'm more
confident in my native tom of course than Uscanese examples.
But we have a no sometimes to think that, Okay,
(55:02):
people would use the Creole language because it's a simple language.
It is not. So I use the iman yam in
this case shows that it is a progressive aspect, but
the same word ah can be used in about to
seven other different forms. So you may have the vocalized
(55:27):
a particle as in a lumbuckle, and the table adapts
may attack.
Speaker 6 (55:40):
Right ah.
Speaker 5 (55:41):
You may use ah in the prospective aspect also where
it tends to move with go, So I go miagyam
different from miayam. You may also see exactly maya com
(56:03):
may I got com.
Speaker 6 (56:05):
It's two different aspect marker at play there.
Speaker 5 (56:09):
You may use as a proposition in the sense that
in go as school, h right, in go at school
in well to school, So it's proposition. The infinitive would
(56:29):
be used when it's used with the verbs. So it
can be used in an infinitive marker when it's used
with the verb, as in no, no, no. In that
case it's it wouldn't be the infinitive normally the infinitive
it's not marked right, so yeah, so our school would
(56:52):
be to school as a proposition. We can use it
also as the equative in terms of the.
Speaker 6 (57:03):
Aspect, not not aspect.
Speaker 5 (57:05):
The equative coupolar, right, that's the word I'm trying to
The coupola is the form that we're use in cre
for the verb to be. So for example, I would
have Carolyn is a teacher, or Carolyn.
Speaker 6 (57:24):
Is my friend.
Speaker 5 (57:27):
Carolyn equates to a teacher, Carolyn equates her teacher exactly,
so you have Carolyn our teacher, Carolyne am a friend.
That's the end of the name. Yes, So we have several
different ways of using this one form, which clearly shows
that this language couldn't be simple.
Speaker 8 (57:49):
Right.
Speaker 4 (57:52):
Another example pluralization, which is not the same pluralization we
use s for more common forms of pluralization in English. Right,
So where we say the boys, we're gonna say them
by you might have various pluralization markers as well.
Speaker 10 (58:14):
Can you speak yes?
Speaker 5 (58:16):
Sure, So in terms of plural this Creole is Jamaican
Creole languages, and a whole shows how we depart from
the European system because for English, as I said, we
tend to use a bond marker unless it is something irregular.
Speaker 6 (58:40):
Where we add, well, we use other ways.
Speaker 5 (58:45):
Of expressing plural so we change the internal structure. So
you have men, you have men that kind of thing,
but generally you have boys boys girls girls, and so
when we have also the es form, but in Creole languages,
we tend to use distinct markers that are separating apart
(59:09):
from the knowings themselves. So for Ghyanese and Jamaican, the
marker is them. We tend to put them as the
We tend to put them as the marker at the
end of the world. So for example, you have boy,
(59:29):
we have buy them. We can have them showing plurality
before the verb before the word in terms of them by,
but not to the structure between them by and the
by them. It's two different things. Then buy would be
(59:50):
those boys as opposed to the buy them, which is
boys in general. So then by a place we know
that this is those boys, they buy them a play.
Speaker 6 (01:00:03):
It could be those boys or some other boys.
Speaker 8 (01:00:06):
Right, yeah, Now, how do you address a standard that
I just want.
Speaker 6 (01:00:13):
To add something else?
Speaker 5 (01:00:14):
Because that's just one way of expressioning plurality. In the
Creole languages, we also have forms of plurals that are
not expressed in the sense that we rely on the
context heavily in order to understand that these are plurals.
So if within the context I have something like a number,
(01:00:38):
so five buy, we need not say five by them
or five buys. I mean, I'm probably not pronouncing by right,
because I would normally say why in Jamaica. So I'm
going to use my Jamaica and why. We don't say
five why. We would say sorry, We don't say five
(01:00:59):
whys or five why them we would use five why.
So we don't add any rural marker in those cases.
In other cases we may use them more as an
inclusive marker. So if I'm saying Carolyne them, in this case,
(01:01:21):
it doesn't mean more than one Carolyne, but Carolyn and
her associates, Carlyn and her friends, Carolyn them, they right, right.
So we have different ways of expressing plurality. And I
think this is something that also speaks about intricate.
Speaker 6 (01:01:43):
Intricate the Creole languages.
Speaker 5 (01:01:45):
Are in their formation, in their structure, and so forth.
Speaker 8 (01:01:50):
Yeah, how do you standardize the spelling of the words?
Speaker 5 (01:01:54):
I wanted to ask that question, Yes, questions, Okay.
Speaker 6 (01:01:57):
So.
Speaker 5 (01:01:59):
Standard I'm happy that you mentioned this spelling and not
standardizing the language because that's a totally different process. Okay,
So what we have been doing for Jamaica, there is
from the nineteen sixties two linguist Cassidy and Lepage, who
(01:02:21):
developed a writing system. It was more recently modified by
the Jamaican Language Unit, and that is a system that
we use in terms of a standard spelling system.
Speaker 14 (01:02:36):
This system is a phonemic system where we have one
song representing one symbol. The same system is used with
modifications as developed by cav George Kiev for Guyanese. So
we again have the same one symbol, one.
Speaker 6 (01:03:00):
Sound kind of system.
Speaker 5 (01:03:01):
Let me just explain that us. Right, So we have
a phonemic writing system where we have a one sound,
one symbol mapping.
Speaker 6 (01:03:17):
So I'm gonna explain what that means.
Speaker 5 (01:03:19):
Right First, I'm going to use the English situation and
then I go into the writing system. So in English
we tend to have one sound being mapped onto many symbols,
and likewise one symbol being mapped onto many sounds. So,
(01:03:42):
for example, we have letter A. Letter A may sound
like an A in many, it may sound like an
in all, It may sound like a ah in man,
it may sound like lots of other things. I can't
be bothered to im exactly like it can be sound
(01:04:05):
as in that kind of sound, we have lots of
different ways where the same letter is sounded. The question is,
how do you, as a learner know when you see
letter A, how to pronounce it? Similarly, you have a sound,
for example, E, just a sound, not that symbol. Right E.
(01:04:29):
E can be written with an I, as in sit,
where you have an E song SIT. It can be
written as an E as in E. It can be
written as E E E E as in C. It
(01:04:49):
can be written as E A again as in C.
It can be written as a E as in Caesar.
It can be written as y as in silly ye.
Speaker 10 (01:05:02):
At the end.
Speaker 5 (01:05:03):
It can be written as a lot of different things.
The question is how do you know which way to.
Speaker 6 (01:05:11):
Write this word?
Speaker 5 (01:05:12):
And hence we have spelling problems all the time in English.
So the system that we use for writing Creole, Creoles
or Jamaican is a system that avoids all of that.
And that's why I said we have a one to
one mapping. Anywhere you see a symbol, it is sounded
the same way all the time. So A is only
(01:05:36):
sounded as A. E is only A, I is only e,
al is only oh, and U is only oh. Right,
So we have these songs. We have the lung versions
and the short versions, and we also have diep thums.
Diep plans are pretty much simply double vowels.
Speaker 6 (01:05:58):
So if you.
Speaker 5 (01:05:59):
Have two of those songs coming together, so for example
I E E or ai I E or.
Speaker 6 (01:06:09):
Uoo.
Speaker 5 (01:06:10):
Of course some of those songs are not in Guyanese,
but we do have them in Jamaican. Right, So the
writing system is designed based on the needs of the
particular language. Right.
Speaker 6 (01:06:24):
So for Jamaican, while we may have wo, which is.
Speaker 5 (01:06:28):
Not a sound in Guyanese, you guys should still be
able to understand it because it's the same principles that apply. Right,
So we have this kind of system in terms of
the voels. In terms of the consonants, there are similar
to the consonants for the most part used in English,
again with the one to one mapping.
Speaker 6 (01:06:48):
Yes, and therefore we don't.
Speaker 5 (01:06:50):
Have certain consonant symbols. So for example, letter C, you
would know in English it is sometimes pronounced like a
C sorry as an S, and it's sometimes pronounced like
a K.
Speaker 6 (01:07:02):
So we don't want that.
Speaker 12 (01:07:05):
If it's a case that you're pronouncing cup, you simply
write it as a ky.
Speaker 6 (01:07:12):
If you're pronouncing, simply write it as an S.
Speaker 5 (01:07:16):
Right. We have Q.
Speaker 6 (01:07:20):
Normally Q is pronounced q as in Queen, Right, so
we simple write co k W queen. Right, we have
the same thing with an X.
Speaker 5 (01:07:37):
So in English X is sometimes written just as an
X and pronounced X.
Speaker 6 (01:07:45):
But in some other cases you have.
Speaker 5 (01:07:48):
Just a pronunciation or just a pronunciation, right, So for
us we eliminate X totally and we write exactly how
it's pronounced. So in X ray it would be e
K S because X it's all pronounced. But in our
word like.
Speaker 6 (01:08:08):
Sucks for sacks, we would just have s A K
S sucks s.
Speaker 5 (01:08:14):
Right, so right, so in that case it's the same
curse pronunciation saxophone is the same written with a X,
but it's the same pronunciation with the cooks right. So
we simply write precisely how we pronounce. And that is
(01:08:37):
why we don't have to worry about the problem about
the varieties when we write, Because if you pronounce something
in your variety, because I wouldn't say it sucks, right, right,
so you write sucks because that's a maselectal variety. But
the vaplector person who's gonna say sucks.
Speaker 6 (01:08:57):
Would write it with a sucks.
Speaker 5 (01:09:00):
So we write exactly how we pronounce it, and it
becomes simply and applicable to all, you don't have to
say this is the right form or that is the
right form, because once it is not erroneous, like nobody
in Guyana would pronounce it as silks right, So unless
it is erroneous, then it will work.
Speaker 2 (01:09:20):
Right.
Speaker 8 (01:09:21):
Yes, this is awesome. So this is awesome in so
many ways. But we'll be right back.
Speaker 1 (01:09:28):
The Journey is available free on iTunes, Blog talk Radio, Rio,
sports Radio, and several of your favorite Internet platforms, downloading
bed and share why any of the social media you love.
Speaker 2 (01:09:41):
Doctor Delissa and doctor Cummings will be returning. We also
have lighted up experts directly from amongst the indigenous people
of Guyana to discuss how language inferences our culture and
(01:10:03):
our lives. Visit us on the Journey dot ryal sports
dot com. See you next week.
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