Secret Funds Diverted to Make Trump’s Jet Great Again…Money Comes from Nuke Slush Fund 7/29/25

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Mark Thompson Show on Michael Suore. Back
with all of you again for another day. Mark is
back tomorrow in this well not this too, but you
know that's I'm supposed to say, uh and uh. And
I am a privileged to be with Kim and Tony
today and I am privileged to be with all of
you with the smartest audience out there. So it's always

(00:22):
fun to do this show that way. We have a
lot to talk about. We have some Trump stuff, some
silly stuff. We have David K. Johnston coming in. We
have an interview with Mark that Mark did earlier this summer,
which we're going to air later in the show, so
you get a little taste of Mark. I still have
I have a mud today, but it's not that. It's

(00:44):
my Queen Elizabeth mud that I bought.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
Nice look at you her as young and then her.

Speaker 1 (00:50):
Old, exactly the airport purchase for the show. So glad
to be here. It isn't a Mark Thompson's show. Mud,
but you know that's the way things stand still.

Speaker 2 (01:02):
Put some coach Hella Valley coffee in there. Call it good.

Speaker 1 (01:05):
In fact I can, Yeah, I don't know about that.
So let's so hello to all of you. I see
the people are high to the lad Zeelman Jackson. It
was a big lot of judge. Her text made it
on the show yesterday, right on to you mob day,
good to me here, Thank you, Tammy nice. We look
at all this fancy and thank you all for being

(01:27):
so kind and welcome and welcoming. Sky. Yeah. I don't
know who this guy markets, but we sadly have to
start with something serious today because the news dictates that
we do that. We have silly stuff for you, and
I promise we will get to it. But I think
when a gunman walks into a building in New York,
kills innocent people, kills a police officer, and is able

(01:49):
to just stroll right on end as you see right there,
into a building in pretty broad daylight. It was about
six thirty pm at the end of the work day.
It was obviously the dirt man. He killed himself. Let's
listen to the story of this and then we'll talk
about it on the other side.

Speaker 3 (02:06):
So when we look at this building, we know it
houses the headquarters of several large financial firms like Blackstone,
also the National Football League. This morning, officials familiar with
the investigation to NBC News, this aspect left a note
inside of a car near the scene. What are we
learning about this person and a possible motive.

Speaker 4 (02:22):
Yeah, and apparently was that car that he got out
of and then we saw obviously that surveillance video of
him walking into the building. According to multiple people that
have been briefed on the investigation, there's the note that's
found inside of the car and apparently a reference to
the fact that maybe football injuries led to his mental
health decline. And there's a specific reference to CTE, which
is of course the brain condition that so many former

(02:45):
athletes have suffered as a result of their time playing
football or other sports. Frankly, they can lead to a
breakdown mentally. It's not clear at all if he has CTE.
This is somebody who, you know, when we first googled
him last night, information comes up. He played high school
football and that's something that he had an interest in
that he was involved in. But it's not like somebody
who played twenty years of the National Football League after

(03:06):
a college career, etc. So that's something that they're definitely
going to look at. There was nothing on his person
that they found that could help with respect to motive,
But I think this note appears to be quite clear
and appears to be left behind for investigators to find.

Speaker 1 (03:20):
That photo that we were just showing there, that's taken
from that surveillance footage.

Speaker 2 (03:23):
Of what looks like this very large assault rifle being
carried into building.

Speaker 5 (03:28):
What do we know about that?

Speaker 4 (03:29):
About what weapons are recovered at the scene.

Speaker 2 (03:31):
Do we know if they were obtained legally?

Speaker 4 (03:33):
Yeah, so Police Commissioner Juscasis says that was an M
four assault rifle. So it's the same type of assault
rifle that we've seen on so many of these type
of shootings. Carrying it there is obviously illegal to have
in New York City. It's not something that we see
out unless a police officer has went out certainly would
never carry it that way. They also found apparently a
revolver as well as additional ammunition and magazines were found

(03:55):
inside the vehicle.

Speaker 2 (03:56):
The revolver inside the vehicle.

Speaker 4 (03:57):
As far as whether or not they're obtaining legally, that's
something that they're in the process of investigating right now.
That is something in the past where we have seen
if they are additional individuals charged and somebody sell them
the gun that shouldn't have, particularly given his mental health history.
But those laws could be tricky as well, So that'll
all be part of the investigation.

Speaker 2 (04:16):
That's one of the reasons.

Speaker 4 (04:17):
Why we saw last night and heard on the radio
transmissions the NYPD was calling for its heavily armed teams
because they knew what they were dealing with, and they
knew that this was somebody who had a lot of firepower.

Speaker 3 (04:28):
Let's talk about the victims. We mentioned an NPD officer
lost his life. Officer did a rule Islam work out
of Islam, but was on detailed assignment in midtown last night.
What are we learning about this officer and the other victim.

Speaker 4 (04:38):
Yeah, so out of the four seven precinct in the
Bronx and as we see and Frank we see here
at our own building, we have officers that are on
paid details. Basically that means that they are a member
of the New York City Police Department. They show up
in uniform, but the building or the company pays for
that police presence. Ended up building like this. But the
type of companies you know, you reference Blackstone, other major

(04:58):
multinational companies. You've got the NFL that's there, all of
these buildings have companies that people really know.

Speaker 2 (05:04):
Are well known, and that a very small.

Speaker 4 (05:07):
Segment of the population might have some sort of an
issue with or perceived issue with, And so that's the
reason why you see that uniform presence. Also, you know
that individual is going to be armed and has a
potential opportunity to stop something like this. Obviously, when you
have somebody come in and just start firing, it's very
difficult for any officer. This is particularly difficult. This officer

(05:27):
has two sons, his wife is pregnant with the third child,
an immigrant to the United States, and as the police
commissioner said last night, doing you know what.

Speaker 2 (05:36):
Everybody has asked him to do. He died a hero,
as she said.

Speaker 3 (05:40):
He's been with MIPD three and a half years. No
doubt everyone is paying tribute to him and his.

Speaker 1 (05:44):
Service and the other victims there. He was. He was
part of New York's Bangladeshi community, about one hundred thousand
people of Bangladeshi descent in New York, and he was
a leader in that community. He had been previously worked
secure already in the schools and then became a police
officer three and a half years ago. Wesley Lapatner is

(06:07):
an executive with Blackstone Group. She runs a real estate
part of that multinational, huge company. And apparently she was
shot in the lobby and so she went behind a
pillar when he started springing the whole scene with bullets
when he walked in there. That's when he killed the
police officer. He also killed a man who was a

(06:31):
security guard for the building. That man was a land
at Tienne. He died there as well and took his
own life. But that was on the thirty third floor
where he injured, critically a member of the NFL staff
there because the NFL's executive offices are in that building.

Speaker 2 (06:48):
Which is why do you think he went there?

Speaker 5 (06:50):
Right?

Speaker 2 (06:50):
And it's because of it.

Speaker 1 (06:51):
To make a note, he had some sort of ripe
against the NFL, against you know again like Tom Winter
reported their friend. See, he was not a former professional
football player. He just was apparently felt himself to be
a victim in that way. He had a concealed carry
permit in Nevada. He drove from Nevada to do what

(07:13):
he did. It's the worst shooting in New York City
in twenty five years, the worst mass shooting in New
York in twenty five years, and it comes on the
heels of, you know, the shooting earlier this year of
the head of United Healthcare, and you know, so it
is and us versus them type of thing. I'm not
drawing that conclusion. I'm saying that here's somebody coming in

(07:35):
to kind of manifest a gripe with a gun, and that,
you know, that is what we saw here. There was
also a shooting yesterday in Reno where three people were
killed and six were shot. We can't just forget about
the other ones because it happened all the time. This
one was of higher you know, I guess notoriety because

(07:56):
of where it happened, and happened in midtown New York,
and most more people can identify with Midtown New York
than probably can Casino and Reno, where somebody pulled up
to the ballet open fire, killed three and they don't
know the motive there in Reno. But we have this,
we have what happened in New York, and again the

(08:18):
conversation becomes this sort of vigilante justice. If he did
have a gripe with the NFL, clearly he was disturbed, Kim.
But if he had a gripe with the NFL. This
is how he sought best to do it. And then
you have to wonder how he got a concealed Carrie
permit if he had mental deficiency in the state of Nevada.
So they're going to have to be answers from that

(08:38):
state about why he was allowed to have this gun.

Speaker 2 (08:42):
Well, what's interesting is the Republicans don't ever want to
have the conversation after something like this happens about how
we can do better as a country, about how we
can stop this madness and nonsense, people losing their lives
for zero reason, how we can help. They don't want

(09:03):
to have the conversation about perhaps better controls, better rules,
better laws. They say, we have enough laws. We need
to enforce the laws we have. You know. Meanwhile, people
keep getting killed. So is it enforcement? Is it mental health?
Is it gun control? Is it all three prongs? There?
Who you know, why don't we as a nation do better?

(09:26):
As Kamala Harris said, and really there was some mass
shooting when she was running, and it was one of
the moments of her campaign that touched me the most
when she said, it doesn't have to be this way,
It doesn't have to be this way. We're allowing it
to be this way.

Speaker 1 (09:43):
Right, And I think Democrats, and I'm not signal singling
you out here. I think it's easy to blame the
other side, but Democrats also when they have the chances
and opportunities few and far between, though they may be
for to control the White House and the Congress, don't
do enough either. I think there is a fear, almost
an ingrained fear in elected politicians not to piss off

(10:06):
the people that give money and not to look like
you want to take our guns away. I Beto Aroorke
at a debate in Houston, Texas, was asked would he
take guns away from people? And in Texas, I think,
is you know, I may. I believe that's where that
debate was. I think it was in Houston. I was there,
but I don't know. It's like a blur of debate

(10:27):
and it sank him, right, I mean, you're saying what
a lot of people think. So there is it is.
It tends to be a third rail in politics and
getting something done on But you know, Democrats and Republicans,
Republicans need to come to the place where reasonable Americans.
You know, eighty five percent of the NRA believe in

(10:48):
background checks, right. I mean, that tells you all you
need to know. There's no need to fear in the NRA.
Isn't the behemoth that once was. They went bankrupt, they
lost Wayne Lapierre, they lost a lot of their swagger
on Capitol Hill. I think in the wake, you know,
it started declining after Newtown, but not enough, and then
it kept going Parkland, et cetera. So I you know,

(11:08):
I totally agree with you. I think you do have
to blame the people that go up there with a
you know and put AR fifteen's lapel pins. I'm talking
to you, Andrew Clyde, Congressman Georgia on their lapel in Congress.
I mean, that's too far right. But Democrats also have
to push harder and not just let go and not
just give it rhetoric. So it's it's a it's a

(11:31):
tough spot, but Democrats certainly do more for it. And
that is that's that's a problem because Republicans, you know,
generally the way that the country is divided now represent
you know, gun toting states, and so they go to
Washington and they don't want to take those rights away.
And everywhere you go in this country during an election,
people think that Democrats want to take your guns away.

Speaker 2 (11:54):
Sure, and at the end of Obama's term he said,
I didn't. I didn't try to take anyone's going to
look at that. How amazing is that there's a senator.
His name is John Kennedy. As a matter of fact,
he's a top mega guy, which with that name is
kind of weird. But he was on Fox News last night.

(12:15):
I guess I didn't see it, but I read about it,
and he was saying, you know, democrats or liberals or whatever,
they're going to talk about more gun control in the
wake of this type of thing. He said, what we
need is better control of idiots. Okay, how do you
control idiots? Then he said, I don't know. I don't
have a you know, a solution for how to control

(12:36):
the idiots. Well, I think how you control so called
idiots would be mental health laws and restrict the idiots
from getting guns. So, I mean, what he's saying is
that he is a proponent of gun control, right if
you want to control the idiots, I don't.

Speaker 1 (12:53):
Know in a way. But he's also equating people with
mental health problems as idiots. Yeah, which is not the
which is not the avenue down which to go. I mean,
you know, and John Kennedy is kind of a blowhard.
He loves to hear himself speak. He does have a
good voice, and he has an ironic tone. But the
way he does his politics is so completely different from

(13:16):
the kind of progress that people need on guns. But
he also, you know, on Louisiana license plate it says
Sportsman's paradise. So you're not going to be a senator
from Louisiana and go out and talk about how we
have to take guns way. By the way, no Democrats
are saying you know, Betto said it about assault weapons,
which a lot of people agreed with, but there's no
sort of you know, take away the Second Amendment or

(13:39):
take guns away. There are a lot of anti gun
people that wish that Democrats wanted to do that, but
Democrats as a party and as most national candidates and
most federal candidates, they don't. That's not what they're after, right,
They don't want to do that. They just want to
make things safer, and by making things safer, they allow
the other side to spin what their position is into

(14:00):
a way that it just it just isn't so there's
a lot to talk about here. You're going to find
we'll find out a little bit more about the motivation.
I think we can all say that this person was
not someone who was saying at the time of what
he was doing, it seemed a bizarre way to make
your point. But the real question is going to be
the overreaction of New York and security and police officers

(14:23):
are going to be at every building now, because that's
what we do. All we do is, you know, we
make people take their shoes off before they get on
a plane without looking at what the real problems are
and mental health and things like that. And then of
course they're going to they'll they'll probably see how this
guy was able to get a gun, and Nevada will

(14:44):
probably have to answer more questions than New York in
terms of that. But very sad, A very accomplished woman,
a security guard, a police officer who was, you know,
seemingly beloved in his own community, all gone. The gunman
took his own life. And then of course there's this
man who was shot in critical condition now but they

(15:06):
say will be eventually recover is what I read. I
don't know that for sure he was an employee of
the National Football League. But if this was a distraction
from Donald Trump, fear not Mark Thompson Show audience. And
I'm sorry, mister President, because you probably want people to
be distracted from what's been going on. We are going

(15:29):
to be talking today with David K. Johnson at the
top of the hour and he will address a lot
of the questions that we have about Trump, about Epstein,
you know about certainly about what these tariffs and the
settlement of tariffs with the EU means. I think it's
always and I could talk about a ham sandwich with

(15:52):
David K. Johnson. I know more so I've been you know,
I've known him for quite a long time before my
day is at the Mark Thompson Show, and I always
loved having him on shows that I have hosted in
the past. So anyway, he'll be with us. He's joining
us from a cool place. So we'll talk about that later.
Let's let's lighten things up here a little bit, and
what better way to do that than to look at

(16:15):
President Trump and golf. So here's what happened the president.
President Trump was in Scotland. We saw a lot of
that coverage. That's where you know, a lot of the
EU and Tariff conversation happened. He was there. It seemed
as if he was just there to open a golf club.
But we all know that a lot of people think

(16:36):
think that he is a dishonest broker as it were.
But uh, but we didn't know about it on the
golf course because very few of us have golf with him.
But then came this tony right. I mean, we see
the president golfing and he had a caddie. Watched the
caddy very.

Speaker 2 (16:52):
Closely, Patty walking over to.

Speaker 1 (16:59):
The bend's over. Let's let's run that again, and he
what that's a little golf ball that must have just
fallen out of his pocket? Right? Oh, no, he lays
that golf course golf ball there, and look who comes
to address the ball. It's President Trump getting out of
the golf cart. There's the ball and look at that.

(17:22):
Look at that nice lie that he had there.

Speaker 2 (17:25):
So what we don't know is where was it before
the caddy put it there at the edge of the
sand trap.

Speaker 1 (17:30):
I think we don't know because nobody knows where it is.
That's what happens, Like the President may have taken a
golf shot again, this is all I was.

Speaker 2 (17:40):
So it looks like his ball ended up in a
more favorable location. Can we just blame the caddy for that?
Not Trump?

Speaker 1 (17:47):
Well, I mean, you know, just following orders has been
a point of blame. But yeah, I don't think we
can just blame the caddy. I think the caddy is
told when President Trump's ball is lost or is in
a bunker, or he's in a place where the photos
would not be good, just drop a ball there and
he can shoot. So if you think he it's great

(18:10):
because he talks about how how many people other people
cheat And we're not talking about his fidelity in marriage,
which is well documented, but we're talking about you know
that they cheat in the election. They cheat in the vote,
they cheat in the numbers that they're giving us because
the numbers are favoring or are just unfavorable to him.

(18:31):
And here he is on a golf course in Scotland
and it looks like he is cheating. I see somebody
putting it one per one. Everything. This guy is unethical. Yeah,
it's uh, he doesn't drink. I mean there's that, but
I maybe he you know, maybe he ought to.

Speaker 2 (18:49):
So there's a book that's called commander in Cheat. It
was written by a guy named Rick Riley, and he
writes this, and because this is this whole cheating at
golf thing is a long term deal with Trump. Everyone
knows he treats cheats at golf. But he writes this.
At Winged Foot, where Trump is a member, the caddies
got so used to seeing him kick his ball back

(19:10):
onto the fairway that they came up with a nickname
for him. They say, Hell is his name, because you know,
the soccer player. Yeah, because he's always kicking his ball
where he wants it to be. Mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (19:23):
It's that's not surprising. I mean, and I guess since
time immemorial, most presidents are cheat at golf because of
what I just said. You don't want, you know, the
unflattering picture of a president, and Trump probably cares more
about being in a bunker. And I should say, I'm
not a golfer, so I don't know that, but I

(19:43):
know the terms, and I know Rick Riley's work. But
I think that when you know that you do give
favorable positions to presidents, generally they give them the benefit
of the doubt. I mean, Gerald Ford was a fantastic
scratch golfer. They say he was the best golfing president.
But apart from Gerald Ford, the ones that have golf

(20:04):
probably get the benefit of the doubt. I don't know,
but you very rarely see it. And it's all you
know about Donald Trump and all you know about him
not playing by the rules or being unethical and not
knowing how to do anything with ethics. It's not surprising
that you see that. But it's funny to see. Man,

(20:26):
it is certainly funny to see because it was couldn't
have been more blatant. So there you have President Trump
and what's going on there Another sort of lighter story
which I can't believe, the sick offense in Congress sometimes,
but as you know, the Kennedy Center that Donald Trump

(20:48):
has completely reshaped in terms of its leadership. There was
a vote in Congress that was approved by the Congress
has to go to the Senate and to rename the
Opera House the Millennia Trump Opera House. So everybody thought,
oh my god, this is absurd. What does she know
about opera? Why do we want Trump on something that
he has tried to dismantle, Why do we want that

(21:10):
name there? Et cetera, et cetera. Well, if you thought
that was bad, it gets worse. Kim, There's a Republican
in the House who wants who is put forward the
mega at the Make Entertainment Great Again Act. Not only
does he want to put Trump's name on it, he
wants to take President Kennedy's name off of the Washington

(21:34):
Entertainment Hub because it was to be it was built
there to honor him, and he does of his association
with the arts and the things that he loved about
the performing arts. They thought it would be a great
way to memorialize the president of the wake of his
assassination in the sixties. This bill was introduced by Bob
Onder and it aims to designate the John F. Kennedy

(21:56):
Center for the Performing Arts now as the Donald J.
Trum Center for the Poor Performing Arts. This would also
have to pass the House, and it would have to
pass the Senate. Even Ander probably doesn't think it's going
to happen. But what is he doing. He's sucking up
to the president. This is the best way to suck
up to the president, to say you want to name

(22:18):
something named something after him and to honor him in
any way. Jack Schlossberg, who is John F. Kennedy's grandson,
the daughter of Caroline Kennedy Schlosberg. Yesterday or in the
wake of you know, I don't know if the I
think it was the Opera House Amendment. When this happened, said,
a nation reveals itself not only by the men it producers,

(22:40):
but also by the men at honors and the men
it remembers. The Trump administration stands for freedom of oppression,
not expression, is what he said. And of course that passed,
but it will likely not pass the Senate, likely won't happen.
And this sort of thing is a stops right. Well,

(23:01):
it also may not be able to happen. It may
not be legal, Kim, because that's what I was.

Speaker 2 (23:07):
That No, no matter how bad they want to, you know,
memorialize or however, you know, honor Donald Trump. When they
built this, when they put it up, you know, and
named it after Kennedy, they actually put some caveats in there.

Speaker 1 (23:23):
Yeah, that's right. So according to US Code, after December two,
nineteen eighty three, no additional memorials or plaques in the
nature of memorials shall be designated or installed in the
public areas of the John F. Kennedy Center for the
Performing Arts. Republicans would have to pass legislation to change
that part of US code. They can't just put her

(23:46):
name on them. That we're talking about Milania Trump, and
of course they naming the center completely probably can't happen
if this can't and they without congressional action, they cannot
put Really it's changing the law put her name on
the Opera House. And if Republicans can't off the budget,
which they usually can't, the Milania Trump renaming provision would

(24:08):
die when they can't pass that budget. So this was
inserted and approved into the budget, but in order to
do that they would have to jump through a few
more hoops in order to see that happen. Also, the
amendment could die in the appropriations process.

Speaker 2 (24:25):
And one wonders, do we not have more pressing business
in the United States? Do we not have more important
things to deal with in the name on a building? Really?

Speaker 1 (24:34):
Yeah, right, of course we don't. I mean, it's absurd,
and you know, I mean, it is very important that
we give Milania Trump the credit for everything she has
done for opera. But as you think that, there are
a couple of other things that need to be done.
But these are the kinds of provisions that curry favor

(24:54):
with the White House, that get people to know Mike Simpson,
who sponsored that, a Republican from Idaho, andor who was
answered the bigger one. And so now he's there both
on the radar of the White House. If it gets toast,
if it gets tossed in appropriations, if it doesn't make
it through as a continuing resolution, then at least they

(25:16):
know that that happened. And so that's really something that
is beyond the pale for a lot of people like
Maria Shriver and she was a niece of President Kennedy.
She called the proposal petty, small minded. She says it
makes her blood boil. So again, those are family members.
Of course they're going to be up said about it,

(25:37):
but it's more about what it says about these people
to me, about these people in Congress, and how they
will do anything to suck up to this man.

Speaker 2 (25:47):
And it's true. Suck up is right if you look
at who gave you know, who should be memorialized or
who should be remembered. Here you have one man who
was assassinated while in office, gave his life, you know,
while he was serving, and you have another guy while
he was running who was grazed on the ear by
a bullet. I don't know. I mean that's your you know,

(26:10):
your criteria for who should have the building named after him?
Who gave more? Who's more worthy of being, you know,
honored in this way. It just seems silly.

Speaker 1 (26:19):
Yeah, there are things that are done to honor presidents
and that usually they I mean in many cases they don't,
but usually they reflect something the president did. Kennedy was
a big patron of the arts. His White House was
constantly having performances. It was really The Kennedy Center Honors
are about honoring artists from you know, choreographers to rock stars,

(26:44):
everybody who is somebody that you think contributed to the arts.
And those were the Kennedy Center Honors every year. I
think they were suspended during Trump's presidency because he would
have to go and sit through the concert or whatever
it was. And those are really great. It's great programming,
you know, to see people paying tribute to these stars

(27:05):
and lessertain people who aren't stars, but people who contributed
to the arts. That's why it's named for Kennedy, That's
why it was appropriate to do it. That is not
you know what was there for Trump. I remember I
was at Trump headquarters the night he won in twenty
sixteen in New York City at the Hilton, and it
dawned on me, Oh my god, there's going to be
a Trump library. And I thought, oh wow, I can't

(27:28):
believe one day there's actually going to be a Trump library.
That's before we knew that he would be president twice.
But it was the first thing I thought, you know,
and then how do we ot? But there will be
one day and we'll have to live with that because
presidential libraries happen. And you know it's different now actually,
because they used to be built to house by the
National Archives to house all the documents from an administration.

(27:52):
And I've been to several of these museums because I'm
a geek, but as a matter of fact, I think
I've been to all of them. But the the when
they do that now so much as electronic the paper
having those papers, you know, for archivists to go in
and handle and look at and do research and historians,

(28:14):
et cetera. Those are the kinds of things that we
are becoming obsolete. So maybe, you know, maybe we won't
need a big aid Trump Library. But his supporters are
going to build something that I'm sure will be you know,
elegant and classy and sit go.

Speaker 2 (28:28):
It'll be dripping with gold. You know, he's a guy.

Speaker 1 (28:32):
Trump. The Trump Library will have every issue of Penthouse,
Playboy and.

Speaker 2 (28:36):
Oh my god. Trump is used to having his name
on buildings. You know, We've got Trump Tower this and
Trump that, and Trump Casino and Trump University and Trump
He's always slapping his name on buildings. So it just
it's and that's, you know, his choice, which it's always
has seemed to me a little pompous. As a matter
of fact. I I every at every opportunity make fun

(28:58):
of Mark for calling this the Mark tom Show, even
though it is the Mark Jompson Show, and he's you know,
he's the guy. But it's just it's one of these
these things where, especially with Trump, it just seems like,
don't you have enough named after you already? And and
isn't it normal, especially for federal buildings or schools or
what have you, to name things after people after they've

(29:21):
passed away and not while they're still Yes.

Speaker 1 (29:25):
It is, I mean, Trump is named saying I think
you're right. I mean, for the most part. That's what
we do.

Speaker 6 (29:30):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
There are you know, like former presidents get things named
after them, battleships, airports. I mean that it's the Bill
and Hillary Clinton Airport in Arkansas. In Little Rock, there's
the Jimmy Carter battleship that was named for him while
he was alive. So there are there are things that
are named after presidents typically, but there's nothing quite like this.

(29:53):
And it's also not done by the president themselves right
where they try and dismantle it and and and arrange
for it to be named after you then. But it's
also former presidents. Sitting presidents don't really get that. You know.
They might they might get a street signed and there,
you know, you might go to Hope, Arkansas while President
Clinton was in office and see, you know, a Bill

(30:14):
Clinton Street. But I don't even know that that's the
kind of thing small scale stuff, but big stuff. No,
that doesn't happen while the president is in office. I
don't know if there's any precedent for that.

Speaker 2 (30:26):
M I don't know. Well, you know what's going to
be at the library, what's at the Katari jet? Apparently
when Trump is done with it, after the US taxpayers
have footed the bill for renovating this thing to the
tune of nearly a billion. It will be after, however
many months it's in use, taken to the Trump Library Foundation,

(30:48):
where then it will serve out the rest of it
todays as a tourist area to go through.

Speaker 1 (30:54):
Yeah. Yeah, and you're talking, you're talking about the free jet,
right that didn't cost anything.

Speaker 2 (30:58):
That's not so free, Mike.

Speaker 1 (31:01):
It's though, it could cost as much as a billion
dollars to refurbish this plane. So this was the gift
that the Guitari government gave to the United States. You'll recall,
and Pete Hegseth said, was the greatest thing, and you know,
et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Now, Chris Murphy of Connecticut,
Democratic senator said, why would we ask the American taxpayer

(31:24):
to spend upwards of one billion dollars on a plane
that would then only be used for a handful of months,
then transferred directly to President Trump. That doesn't sound like
a wise use of taxpayer dollars. That's what Chris Murphy said.
In a hearing earlier this summer, Air Force Secretary of
Tony Metnik told lawyers that the money to refurbish the

(31:45):
jet would be pulled from a program and tended to
replace aging nuclear missiles called the Sentinel Intercontinental Ballistic Missile program.
But mine said that the Sentinel nuclear program, which is
over budget, would be immediately wouldn't be immediately impact because
it was being restructured. So they're not even denying that
this money is coming from places where it could be

(32:07):
better spent, if even you think that is how to
better spend it. But what you're seeing is a boondoggle
for the Trump Library. Right, you get a couple of
months of use out of retrofitting this jet, and then
it immediately goes to become a museum piece after a
billion dollars is spent on it. I mean, that's just

(32:27):
an absurd use of taxpayer money. And it is also deception.
It is leaving the golf ball in a good place
for the president and deceiving people into believing that that
that's legit.

Speaker 2 (32:43):
And the money that will come that will go toward
this jet. The billion dollars it comes from a fund
meant to replace aging nuclear weapons in America. You could
argue that nuclear weapons are meant to protect the United States, Right.

Speaker 1 (33:00):
That's just what I Yeah, it's just what I was
saying like that, that seems like it's something we could use.

Speaker 2 (33:06):
Yeah. So, and air Force one is really meant to
protect the president in this case Trump. So what Trump
is saying is his protection is more important than our protection.
That's that's how I read it. That, you know, his
need to fly around on what's called the Flying Palace
with all these luxurious fixtures and everything else. And I

(33:27):
realized that part of the cost, the reason for the
cost is that they have to wire it in a
certain way to you know, deflect missiles and whatever else,
because they wanted to be secure for the president. And
I understand that. But what he's saying is that he
needs something so fancy that it's worth our safety.

Speaker 1 (33:47):
Yeah. Yeah, well, and it's all it's something that he
has talked about from the very beginning. He's been complaining
about Air Force one, the president complaining about air Force one.
I mean Jimmy Carter, for example, thought that air Force
one should be done away with because it was a
waste of money to even have it. You can protect
the president in different ways, but it was it was inefficient,

(34:09):
it was a waste of energy, et cetera, et cetera.
Of course, the Secret Service thinks that it's not, and
understandably so because they're charged with protecting the president and
it is the you know, a fully updated and integrated
security it's almost a military plane. It is a military plane. Also,

(34:30):
do you know that any plane that the president is
on is air Force one? So that yeah, so whenever
a president's on any plane, it's Air Force one.

Speaker 2 (34:39):
And I just wonder, like, what's so wrong with the
plane we have? Now?

Speaker 1 (34:43):
Yeah, well he said that it's the President has complained
about its condition. Uh, and that he said that that
it's dated. And you know, so in taking this plane,
he was very excited because it was a newer plane.
So it's it is a it was a gift, and
he's turning a gift into a way of getting money

(35:06):
out of the US government to spend on this. It's
going to be like a boondoggle, like so much of
what he does, and you know, there's no surprise there.

Speaker 2 (35:15):
Well, it's a done deal. Now the United States has
accepted unconditional donation of this jet. So we're stuck with it,
and we're stuck with a billion dollar price tag.

Speaker 1 (35:25):
And I would argue, it's a deal, Kim. It's a
done deal, Kim. But the Congress can go after how
much is going to be spent on this and whether
or not it's necessary, And then they can also say
that if if they determine that it is a gift
to the president and not a gift to the United

(35:45):
States government, then they could say that, you know, the
Trump Library Fund has to buy it back from the
US government and maybe get those you know, nine hundred
to a billion dollars back in a way. Well, that
would be nice, it would be There are lots of
because it is I believe it is not constitution I mean,
I know it's non constitutional for them to take that

(36:05):
gift exceeding a certain amount of money. But if they
wanted to do it in such a way that they
could buy it back from the government at the end,
that would be fine. Where he would have that money,
I guess he could start a new coin of some
kind of a bitcoin.

Speaker 2 (36:21):
You know, why don't we take the money from the
meme coins and the bitcoins? That might make sense. You're
frozen in time there. I don't know. If you you
said you've been to all the presidential libraries as I
wait for you to unfreeze. I don't know if you've
been to the Reagan Library in southern California, they have
Sorry you were frozen for a second. They have a

(36:42):
I don't know if it's the same plane or if
it's a replica plane, but they have an air force
one and a marine one that you can tour and
walk through. And it is interesting to see it. But
I don't know if it's interesting to the tune of
a billion dollars. I'd rather have that aircraft if we're
going to spend that money in service for future presidents
as well.

Speaker 1 (37:02):
Yeah, no, no, it is it. Look, the one of
the Reagan Library is certainly interesting, and that's what should
be done with old aircraft. And mean, what they did
is they took the shell of that old aircraft. You
see it there, some of the that that's called the
Beast that the car the president gets into, and get
people an idea of what the motor kids are like. Look,
that's what these libraries are for showing people. These museums

(37:22):
that are attached to libraries are for showing people what
it was like at that time in the presidency. I'm
all for that, Like I said, I'm a geek about
that stuff, and the government the plane can be acquired.
I don't know what the provenance of that aircraft was
at the Reagan Library, but there's this shining city on
the hill there in Seem Valley, California. But it's a

(37:43):
cool thing to be able to walk through, just as
it's cool to go to Graceland and walk through Elvis's plane.
It's just part of the show. But to make the
government improve the jet and then have the jet go
to the library on taxpayer these are these libraries are
privately financed. That the archives themselves are publicly financed, but
the libraries next to them are are. You know, there's

(38:05):
a Reagan Foundation that privately that raises money and finances
the library. How about it put whatever you want in there,
as long as it's historically accurate. But what Trump is
doing is totally different. It's a total application of that
kind of mission.

Speaker 2 (38:21):
So yeah, well, congratulations. Taxpayers were stuck with a billion
dollar bill.

Speaker 1 (38:26):
Yeah, a billion dollar bill. They so the current air
Force one aircraft too modified Boeing seven forty seven, two
hundred bees. This is something that Tony just put up
designated VC twenty five A are both over thirty years old.
They first flew in nineteen ninety and ninety one. A
new fleet of Boeing seven forty seven eighths is designated
BC twenty five B is currently undergoing modifications to replace

(38:48):
the aging aircraft, but they are not expected to be
delivered until some time in the future, So tomorrow or
twenty thirty.

Speaker 2 (38:56):
Eight, whenever.

Speaker 1 (38:57):
Yeah, that would be that's interesting, leave vague there, so
what so? I guess you know, there are reasons to
update these aircraft, obviously, as there are with any aircraft,
but this is not the way to do it through
a donated Katari aircraft that you're going to then move
immediately to your library. Boeing's on it. They're doing it,

(39:19):
you know.

Speaker 2 (39:20):
And then it begs the question, what you know, when
someone gives you a gift like that, are you beholden
to them for something like then? What's the what's the
give and gat? You know? Yeah, I mean, what are
we on the hook for? Here?

Speaker 1 (39:35):
Michael by the next one? Right? I mean? So there
is a little bit of that dynamic that happens with
governments and presidents and certainly in politics, where there is
a much more blatant put pro quo, which is why
politics is now, you know, sort of ruined by rulings
like Citizens United and by unlimited basically unlimited ability of

(39:56):
wealthy people to raise money and give it to political
action committees without their names even being shown. So, yeah,
there is definitely this is influence pedaling. Right, What do
you think the coctari people just like Donald Trump so
much they want from a plane? Yeah, there is. There's
a definite quid pro quo with these sorts of things
his What they want from him after he's president, I

(40:18):
don't know, but but clearly that there is something to this,
and he's going to want to have the library. There's
never been a library like this before, Right, He's going
to want He's going to want that library. So he's
going to have the bigger plane and the newer plane
in his library.

Speaker 2 (40:34):
Where I've never seen anything like it.

Speaker 1 (40:35):
No, Well, hopefully nobody goes to the library and no
one will have ever seen anything quite like it. But
people suck up to Trump, including that the Harvard is
now reportedly willing to spend five hundred million. That is
half a jet. If my math is right, to settle
with Donald Trump, there in order to settle their legal disputes.

(40:59):
People with the negotiations. Familiar with the negotiations have told
The New York Times that they're willing to spend as
much as five hundred million. A potential deal could restore
more than two billion in federal funds to the university
that Trump froze, claiming university policies around diversity, equity and
inclusion programs were illegal. The settlement could also resolve the
legal drama around Trump stopping Harvard from enrolling international students.

(41:23):
People familiar with the talks, whoever, said Harvard is hesitant
to directly pay the federal government. The five hundred million
dollars summer is more than double the amount Columbia University
agreed to pay to settle its legal issues with Trump
last week. So I went to the University of Virginia
and the president of UVA resigned. Rather than fight, he

(41:44):
said I could win. He was already going to lead
at the end of this academic year this coming year,
which I guess would be next May. I think at
July versus as long as he would serve. And he
left early. He said I could fight this, but it
would cost too much to fight it, and I know
that we are not doing what the administration says we
are doing. They said that they were being two lacks
on enforcing the abolition of DEI, and I used that

(42:09):
word abolition perfectly, and getting rid of DEI at the
University of Virginia would have been one of the things
that a public university has to do. Because of what happened,
and because Governor Youngkin, a Republican in Virginia, wants to
make sure they enforce all of the Trump policies. So
Jim Ryan resigned rather than put the university and people

(42:30):
close to the university under such scrutiny, which I think
you know he was applauded for doing that at his
own expense and own humiliation. They're doing this to all
these institutions of higher learning like Columbia that we just mentioned,
like the University of Pennsylvania where Trump from which Trump
graduated at least the Warden School, and then and now

(42:51):
Harvard because they looked at as liberal bastions and that's
a way to own the Libs. But Harvard doing this
is really going to ruffle a lot of feathers at
a place like Harvard.

Speaker 2 (43:05):
I'm really disappointed because if there's ever a school that
has the best lawyers in the country, it would be Harvard. Right,
they raise them, they handgrow them at Harvard, really excellent attorneys.
And so if there's ever a school in this whole
Trump going after colleges and universities that could beat Trump
at his own game here, it would have been Harvard.

(43:27):
And for a while it seemed like they were truly
fighting back. So why they come out now and say
they're ready to settle or they will settle for more
money than Columbia settled. I just it makes me. It
bums me out because I thought they were in for
the fight.

Speaker 1 (43:42):
Yeah, look, I think that they're being in for the fight.
Is these are reports, right, so we don't know for
sure that this is where they're going. And very often
they float this, and they're not the way that a
candidate will float it to their party, float an idea
to their party, or to a senator, may float an

(44:03):
idea to see if it's popular. I think Harvard may
be floating some of this to see how their wealthiest
alumni and their most generous alumni would approach this. It
may if there is a great deal of pushback then
then this may not It may be seen as well
those reports were not true and Harvard would never do that.

(44:24):
It's also a way of seeing possibly And this is
me speaking because I don't know this to be a fact,
whether or not they can raise money off of this, right,
if there's another way to do this rather than giving
money to the federal government, I think that could be
part of what we're looking at here as well. So
it's a story that needs more legs, but these are

(44:47):
some possibilities for what could be at play here. It's
it's the other part of it is that it's extortion, right,
and extortion was something that people talked about a lot
about Donald Trump when he was in the real estate
business in New York, is that he would extort contractors,
he would extort you know, real estate brokers. And now

(45:12):
that he's in the White House, he's going to these
higher education centers and saying the most elite of all
of them and saying, you've got to pay us in
order to get out of this. So it is extortion,
and that's something that these universities really do not want
to be a part of the government. You know, accused

(45:33):
Harvard of civil rights violations and they and Trump wanted
to make sure that they would be paying at least
twice as much as Columbia, according to this report. Again,
I haven't heard Trump say that, but certainly that's what
this amounts to.

Speaker 2 (45:51):
So I guess if they do this, they will be
able to restore some of their federal funding, which so
financially maybe it makes sense, it makes some kind of
deal like this, but morally I'm annoyed.

Speaker 1 (46:05):
Yeah, well it's it's it's annoying, and I think you
know a lot of people don't They look, Harvard is hamstrung.
This stuff with international students is terrible, that the freezing
of assets is terrible. This is what fascist governments do.

Speaker 5 (46:20):
You know.

Speaker 1 (46:21):
This is what happens. They go to the to the media,
and they go to the higher education facilities, and that's
how they start changing minds, or at least freezing minds
and not allowing them to learn and grow. And that
is what you're seeing at play here, and it's in
its raws form. So whenever you see someplace like Harvard

(46:44):
kind of kowtow to that because they're forced to, it's horrible.
But you also understand the bind they're into which is real.
It's real, and it's really ugly. There's more ugly, of course,
and we're always to you know, I'm not really really
happy about it. But the Jeffrey Epstein's story we're going

(47:08):
to i think, get into a little bit with David
Kate Johnston when he arrives. But there, you know, this
isn't going away for Donald Trump. Republicans are worried about it,
and it's being talked about as something that has thicking power, right.
I mean, it is not going to be something that

(47:29):
Donald Trump clearly can get out of. I mean, he's
trying to deflect with with calling Barack Obama treason US.
He's trying to deflect with going overseas, which presidents do
when it's time to talk about it. But he was
asked about that and we covered it yesterday. We're going
to cover it more with David k. Johnson just a
little bit. But there is more to the Epstein case.

(47:52):
And I think the fact that you have somebody like
Joe Rogan talking about it, I want to run that
and I want to talk a little bit about out
why what happened. What was said on Joe Rogan is important.
Let's let's Tony, if we have that, let's watch that.

Speaker 7 (48:08):
Look we still have ADHD right collectively as a nation, right,
I mean, things move on, And I think maybe that's
what they're you know, some people are saying, look, they've
called the recess on Capitol Hill because they figured by
the time they come back in September, everybody will have
moved on from this.

Speaker 8 (48:21):
Right.

Speaker 1 (48:21):
Yeah, I think they're wrong.

Speaker 8 (48:22):
I don't.

Speaker 7 (48:22):
I don't think this is this again. This feels like
and and just looks like that one of those handful
of conspiracies again you go to JFK whomever that's just
gonna hang around.

Speaker 9 (48:33):
This is a line in the sand. This one's a
line in the sandy, because this is one where there's
a lot of stuff about. You know, when we thought
Trump was going to come in and there are a
lot of things are going to be resolved. They're a
drain the swamp, gonna figure everything out. And when you
have this one hardcore line of sand that everybody had
been talking about forever, and then they're trying to gaslight.

Speaker 1 (48:54):
You on that, Joe, Yeah, and nobody likes to be
gassed And the line in the sand they're talking about
is you know, even during the election people were saying
that the MAGA people were saying, you know, I would
the only thing that would make me reconsider is if
I learned this stuff about Jeffrey Epstein is true. Well,
it's not going away. It's not going away because Mike

(49:16):
Johnson called a recess, and in fact, the fact that
he called the recess to me means that it's really
not going away. Because the day the gavel bangs in
September and they come back into session in the Congress,
the first thing Democrats are going to talk about is
Jeffrey Epstein and having hearings, and not only they're not
going to be alone in doing it. Thomas Massey, a

(49:37):
Republican who has other people in his camp, is going
to bring up Epstein and try and have hearings on Epstein.
So I predict that it will backfire. I predict that
what Joe Rogan and the other gentleman on the show,
I don't know who that is. Do we have a
name on him. I know he's probably on the show
all the time. I don't watch it, but I don't
watch it there as a matter somebody does, and that's fine.

(50:02):
But what they're talking about is the notion that by
having these kind of this kind of obfuscation, it actually
invites more you know, I would say more interest, it
invites more curiosity of scrutiny. Yes, certainly. Yeah, So I

(50:24):
think that that it's an important thing that that it's
happening in the way that it is, because this is
something that a lot of people are are going to
be spending a lot of time looking at and for
the first time, it's one of those things that we
look at and we see Republicans doing the same thing.
And this is a really, I guess, a really big

(50:48):
part of why the Epstein case could come back to
haunt him. JD Vance, who you'll recall as the Vice
President of the United States, he blamed George Bush and BARACKO.
Obama of the Epstein files. So that to me, that's
Obama is winning two to one over Bush. And also

(51:09):
so it's to Obama one Clinton one Bush. As to
who is at fault over the Jepsy Jeffrey Epstein files.
Vice President J. D Vance took aim at former Presidents
Barack Obama and George W. Bush when asked about the
late disgraced financier and convicted sex offender Jeffrey Epstein. Now
you feel for any vice president who has to go

(51:30):
out and defend at all costs their president. It's happened
to all of them at one point or another, even
when it puts you in a sort of uncomfortable place.
Vanceandswer a reporter's question about the Epstein files while speaking
can't Ohio on Monday. First of all, the President has
been very clear, we're not shielding anything, which to me
means the president has been very clear, but we are

(51:50):
shielding things. Van said. The president has directed the Attorney
General to release all credible information and frankly, to go
and find additional credible information related to the Jeffrey Epstein case.
He's been incredibly transparent about that stuff. But some of
that stuff takes time. So you know, again the Trump
administration is facing the scrutiny and they take it seriously

(52:11):
from MAGA supporters and others recently over the handling of
that case. You've got to assemble that stuff, You've got
to compile that stuff. You got to redact some victims'
names so you protect the victims, Vance continued, which is
why there is a delay. He added that Attorney General
Pam Bondy is hard at work fulfilling Trump's recent request

(52:32):
or at lease whatever she thinks is credible. But there's
a little more on BONDI isn't there, Kim, there is?

Speaker 2 (52:40):
You know, I can almost hear the conversations. I wonder
if Bush and Obama and Clinton, if they're all calling
each other saying, hey, guess what you got blamed for today.
Guess what they're saying you did today. You know, it's laughable.

Speaker 1 (52:55):
It would be Yeah, it would be interesting that the
former president of the club, you know, even because you
know now there are fewer of them than we've had
in a while, but there are three Democrats and a Republican,
and that Republican, George W. Bush, has endeared himself to
some of the others. And because of that, I mean,

(53:17):
he didn't have a great relationship with Jimmy Carter, but
he certainly does with with Bill Clinton, and seems to
have an affable relationship with with Barack Obama, in a
close relationship with Missus Obama. But that notwithstanding, they I
feel exactly what you said, that they that they have
this kind of they're in cahoots over I can't believe

(53:38):
this guy is the president. I can't believe this guy
is the president. And I think that's part of what
all this is. So, yeah, are they keeping tabs?

Speaker 2 (53:47):
Yeah, I'm sure. Well, and now if you know, you
think it's it's a joke, right that they're wildly flailing
about trying to blame anyone and everyone. The I blame
you really is appropriate.

Speaker 1 (54:00):
Here, right, everybody but yourself. I mean that's the classic
classroom you know.

Speaker 2 (54:06):
The problem is they've taken it to another level. And
now they're threatening to indict Hillary Clinton and James Comy,
and I believe is it, John Brennan, They're they're trying
to seek indictments for these people on you know, on
allegations and wild blaming, and so I think you're they're

(54:26):
trying to draw people into these legal cases that really
have no merit, just as a distraction, and that's not fair.

Speaker 1 (54:34):
Yeah, uh I I do, I agree with you. I
think that's that's that's what's happening. But like we heard
in the Joe Rogan piece, and by the way, Tony
and our crack staff here at the at the Thompson
Show said that the guest was Mike Baker. The person
speaking to Joe Rogan, who's a CIA covert operations officer,

(54:56):
current CEO of Portland Square Group of Global intelligen and
security firm, just want that out. Thank you Tony for
coming up with that. So yeah, I mean that's what
they're doing. They're deflecting, and deflecting often works. Let's just
remember that it really does work. People have and as
Mike Baker said, people have these attention spans that do

(55:18):
not hold on to things anymore. That's just the world
we live in. This one's different. This one's sticking. So
you can blame every president you can, you can go back,
you can blame Rutherford Hayes and Thomas Jefferson. Right, this
one is sticking. And I think that when you see
that that it's not going away, it means that Republicans

(55:41):
are behind it because the Republicans have the Congress, they
have the Senate, and they have the president right now.
So ordinarily those things, if they're not swept under the rug,
they're they're ignored because they have the power to ignore,
which is one of the great things of majority is
you don't have to entertain this stuff. Butubplicans and Magro
Republicans too want to see the answers on this particular subject,

(56:06):
and that, you know, to a lot of Republicans and
a lot of you know, people in the administration, is
why they're treating this so seriously, because they're trying to
figure out how to deal with it, and everything they've
done so far hasn't worked. And it's going to come
back in September.

Speaker 2 (56:22):
I believe that the show's crowdfunded and we have some
people to think. I just saw some contributions pop through,
one from Harry for five Bucks, who asks you regarding
the Katari jet, the taxpayers are paying a billion dollars
to retrofit, do you think the retrofit will be done
by the end of Trump's term.

Speaker 1 (56:40):
I don't. I mean because I don't think things get
completed by Donald Trump. I mean, I don't think walls
are built by Donald Trump. I don't think legislation is
put into play by Donald Trump. He's not a finisher.
He is somebody who just says things and does things.
That's the only reason I say no. But that's just
my yes.

Speaker 2 (57:00):
Thank you. Gary Wes says for five bucks, there's some
nuance and how they say protect victims. Some say victims,
some say innocent as in protecting names of victims and
guests of Epstein.

Speaker 1 (57:12):
Yeah, there is some nuance, and I don't know what
the difference is there. I don't know how they how
they delineate that, and I guess you know, it's however
the sayer is saying it and the listener and the
hearer is hearing it, right, I mean, I think that's
to me what it becomes to be about. But who
deserves protection, who's entitled to protection as well? I think

(57:35):
is important? And who does the president not want to
piss off and Pam BONDI not want to piss off
whose name might be on there, and who they want
to redact. And you heard Vice President Vance talking about
redaction taking a really long time. It's really kicking the
can down the road a bit, I would say. And
then of course we have one more twenty dollars gift.

(57:58):
We think depressed Canadian. I was recently in Canada. I
don't see why one in Canada would be depressed. Now
this is sports, Michael, and a far more serious topic.
The Oilers haven't made a play for Soroken yet. They
need a number one started to get McDavid resigned. Maybe
Mikey Piatro said, this is great talking about hockey in July.

Speaker 5 (58:17):
I love it.

Speaker 1 (58:18):
That's you know. I agree the Oilers need a goalie.
I think McDavid's going to sign. I don't think dry
Sidle would have signed it were that not the case.
But we have more important things to talk about. Even
me saying that there's something more important right than hockey,
I think is impressive. But thank you for the donation
to the show. These donations of support and shows of

(58:41):
support are more important than you could than you could know.
Mark talks about them all the time, Kim and everybody.
This is a crowdfunded show, but it's a good show,
and without your support, it would not be that. So
thank you very much, and without the guests that come
in here, one of whom I am every Friday. But

(59:02):
when I hear that I am co hosting, when I'm
the substitute teacher, I'm always excited to know that I
will be revisiting with my friend David K. Johnson, who
joins us now from a pretty exotic spot and tell
us about the Chautauqua Institut in institute where you are
love me.

Speaker 6 (59:20):
That well, Go afternoon, Good afternoon, Michael, Jennifer and I
last month decided to spend a week seeing civil rights
sites in Mississippi and Alabama and being gluttons for punishment.
We're taking a week here at the Chautauqua Institute, which
has been around for one hundred and forty some years

(59:41):
on Lake Chautauqua and Western New York, and we are
studying the rise of authoritarianism and autocracy along with about
twenty thousand people who are here.

Speaker 1 (59:51):
What a beautiful, wonderful thing. And I'm glad you did that.
I happen to be friend This is mean name dropping
a little bit, but I happen't have been very good
friends with Julian Bond, who was a civil instrumental in
the civil rights movement. And I met Julian on a
tour he did of civil rights sites throughout Alabama and
Mississippi and Georgia. And I went on a trip with

(01:00:12):
him and went on five trips with him doing that.
It was really an extraordinary thing. So every America here.

Speaker 6 (01:00:19):
This is an inter denominational religious movement that does summer
season here and they have I think it's nine weeks
of different kinds of classes every week, and so we
came over. Here in the background behind me is Lake Chautauqua,
which is south of Buffalo, and I don't know, seventeen
miles long and a mile wide.

Speaker 1 (01:00:41):
Beautiful. That's goodful, looks like you're on a golf course
there too.

Speaker 6 (01:00:46):
That's just the lawn to the Anthonyum Hotel one hundred
and some year old hotel that we're saying at that
is right.

Speaker 2 (01:00:54):
Above the water.

Speaker 1 (01:00:55):
There we go, there, we look at that. That's beautiful.
That is really beautiful.

Speaker 6 (01:01:00):
Unfortunately beastly hot because of the heat dome back.

Speaker 1 (01:01:02):
Here right, Yeah, I get it. But you know people
in Buffalo always complaining about the heat, aren't They can't stop.
So let's talk a little bit about authoritarianism, why don't we,
since that seems to be the coin of the realm
where you are right now. We you know, we've been
talking about and I'm going to start with Epstein and

(01:01:24):
we're going to get into stories that aren't Epstein. But
I think it's incumbent upon us to not forget that
story because it's going to come back and it's not
going to go away. And as you know, let's tie
it in. Let's let's make the layup segue here, as
it pertains to authoritarianism, as it pertains to absolute power
that this president seeks constantly, how is this case being

(01:01:47):
handled under that prison?

Speaker 5 (01:01:51):
Well?

Speaker 6 (01:01:51):
Interestingly, Trump the other day asserted, not just which got
a lot of attention, that Obama and Biden and Clinton
had fabricated the files that he has been screaming about
for years need to be made public. But he also
asserted that ge, if there are really files, why didn't
they make them public? Which tells you about his mindset

(01:02:12):
that the government is not here to seek justice, but
it is to instead serve the interests of the authoritarian leader.
And it's very important this story be kept alive with
new revelations, with asking questions that aren't at the moment
being asked and new ones, because otherwise we will never

(01:02:32):
get the material here. Now, the Trump administration pulled what
they thought was a pretty slick move, and to those
who don't know the law, it probably was. They asked
a federal judge to release grand jury transcripts, knowing perfectly
well that it was highly unlikely that would happen. But
more importantly, those grand jury transcripts were from the indictments

(01:02:55):
of Epstein and his procureur and rape fellow rapist a Maxine.
I'm sorry the Maxine, Jilly Maxwell, Jillane Maxwell. Sorry the
heat's get into me a little pit.

Speaker 1 (01:03:09):
And to forget.

Speaker 6 (01:03:10):
And of course those grand jury transcripts would have nothing
to do with Donald Trump because they were indictments thought
of the other two people, not Trump. What we haven't
seen are, among other things, the transaction records. Senator Widen,
the senior senator from Oregon, says that there are more

(01:03:31):
than four thousand, five hundred wire transfers involving Epstein and
Russian banks, not all banks, just Russian banks. And of
course we know Russian banks are used all the time
for criminal behavior because Vladimir Putin's oligarchs are the biggest,
best funded criminal gang in the world. Epstein held himself

(01:03:55):
out to be a Finnan seer. Well, where the trading records?
Where are the statements sent to Leslie Wexner, the founder
of the Limited, who was his initial and by far
biggest client. As best we know, what kind of returns
did he earn if in fact he was actually Epstein
was actually a fin and seer, rather than that an

(01:04:15):
extortionist and a rapist I mean, there are lots of
lots of avenues to pursue here, and keeping this story
alive is critical. And then the question I think that's
the most important to ask is, gee, Donald, after you
said you'd make all of these public if you became president,
and now you're saying, oh, no, we can't do that.

(01:04:36):
To protect the innocent, you can redact the names. It
doesn't take that long, contrary to the claim that has
been you referenced minutes ago. Just remove everything that doesn't
refer to Donald Trump, Malania Trump, the Trump organization. And
let's see those those records. Let's see what was on

(01:05:00):
the CDs. Apparently there were numerous video and image recordings
of wealthy men engaged in sex with girls as young
as twelve. Some of these young women have a lawyer
of Katie Johnson has been interviewed on video. You can
see that on the internet telling about what happened to her.

(01:05:22):
And we have other young women who have spoken up.
So there's lots here. And the core question is this
is the president of the United States a serial child rapist.
There's an enormous amount of smoke pointing in that direction.
No fire, but that's because we don't have the documents,

(01:05:46):
and we haven't gotten the right witnesses. Of course, if
you don't want to know something, see no evil here,
no evil speak no evil, or, as I like to
call them, sightless sheriffs who look the other way. But
if you want I want to find out, and you've
got subpoena power, it's entirely doable. And so I would
call upon Letitia James, the Attorney General of New York,

(01:06:08):
and Alvin Bragg, the district's attorney in Manhattan, where a
lot of the rape took place, to pursue their own
investigations into what went on, and what was Trump's involvement,
and what are the interests and the positions of the

(01:06:28):
victims or survivors of this long running operation to identify
and rape young women. And of course remember Donald as
many many times comments about things like a ten year
old girl he said he'd be dating in ten years.
When his second daughter, Tiffany was in diapers, he was

(01:06:51):
asked on a TV show, do you see anything of
yourself or your spouse? And little Tiffany and he conted
her legs and then cupped his hands over his chest
instead of we won't know how big bees will be
for a number of years. I mean, who says that
about a baby girl in diapers, but someone who has
a very sick mind. And given his walk.

Speaker 1 (01:07:12):
He also said, if I'm not mistaken about Ivanka, that
he would date her if it wasn't if she wasn't
her daughter.

Speaker 6 (01:07:20):
Yes, And if you go on a Google image search
and type in Trump parrot Ivanka, you will see a
huge number of pictures that, in the words of many people,
I've shown them to have Donald inappropriately touching his daughter.

Speaker 1 (01:07:40):
Yeah, this is now. Let me ask you a procedural
question after on something you just said, because there are Republicans,
because there are manga people who are upset by this.
To put it mildly, was getting James and Alvin Bragg
in there looking for partisanship, looking for something to be

(01:08:04):
partisan when it may not have to be. And maybe
some maybe seeing this through another avenue might be the
best way.

Speaker 6 (01:08:12):
Well, I think that what matters is that we find
out what's in the evidence that's already been collected. There's
no shortage of material here. The inventories from the search
warrants executed on Epstein's properties, the one virtually next door
to Morrow Lago, his huge townhouse apartment that at one

(01:08:35):
time was the most expensive residence in Manhattan and in
the Virgin Islands are full of documentation. The Virgin Islands,
you know, has reached a large settlement with the estate.
They have records you haven't seen. You're not going to see.
Pam Bondy, the utterly corrupt Attorney general, who was the
utterly corrupt Attorney General of Florida when much of this

(01:08:57):
went on, and she did nothing when it was going
on produce any kind of investigation. I mean, this is
the important thing about authoritarianism. Trump has created a protection racket.
So what we need to do is break through that
protection racket. Because Donald Trump can survive being a liar,

(01:09:19):
being a cheat, being all sorts of things, but I
don't think he can survive actual evidence that he is
a serial child rapist.

Speaker 1 (01:09:29):
Yeah. I agree that that would be And we heard
Joe Rogan even say that's a line in the sand
that can't be crossed. And if that is in fact,
what comes out of this we'll see. But of course,
you know, Pam Bondi was handpicked knowing that this stuff
wasn't going to go away, and that's part of her charge.

Speaker 6 (01:09:49):
And to go to it and Michael, I think it's
important to point out that among the extreme Christian nationalists,
they could live with this. They don't see anything wrong
with that, think that girls should be married off as
soon as they have their first period. They have no
problem with a child marriage.

Speaker 8 (01:10:06):
With what.

Speaker 6 (01:10:07):
We had a discussion in one of the court classes
I took today about Supreme Court decisions about wife beating,
and I talked with a judge who was a domestic
court judge in Texas and how there were fellow judges
who thought that, you know, husbands are entitled to beat
their wives and rape them. Not in New York State,

(01:10:28):
where I live, that's a crime. But we need to
keep in mind that there are actually people who would
find this acceptable. I don't think though the vast majority
would find this something they can live with. And when
I say survive, I mean Donald Trump being removed from office,
I don't mean anything.

Speaker 1 (01:10:45):
More than that, right, of course, survive politically, and the
MAGA movement were to survive politically, and we don't know
who that baton would be passed to, but it would
not be a baton you'd want if he is in
fact found guilty of these things and did these things
you mentioned the Supreme Court, Julaine Maxwell went to is

(01:11:06):
taken going to the Supreme Court now to try and
get her conviction overturned because she said it violated a
plea deal that was made by Epstein that she was
then immune from any kind of prosecution.

Speaker 6 (01:11:18):
I don't know there is such a deal that is
a reasonable interpretation of the deal which on its face
was unconscionable. So there's also a legal doctrine known as unconscionability.
And so I can see some of the Supreme Court
justices going along with her, but I have our time
seeing five of them doing so. But the underlying issue

(01:11:43):
is Donald Trump has said again and again and again
that you know, there are these files and he would
make them public as soon as he got back to
the White House. Well, you're back in the White House,
let us see the files. Just walk your talk, and
nobody should give up on this, especially white House journalists,
every new ite.

Speaker 7 (01:12:02):
I mean.

Speaker 6 (01:12:03):
One of the things about Watergate, which you know most
Americans didn't live through because it was fifty years ago,
was the story didn't die. The Washington Post, the LA Times,
sometimes ahead of The Washington Post and the New York
Times and CBS all kept coming up with new stuff,
and it kept that story alive when the public didn't care,

(01:12:26):
until we got to the point where we got irrefutable
evidence that Richard Nixon was in fact a crook. And
I'm not talking about the tax cheating part. He was pardoned,
didn't have to stand trial for one of his tax
advisors went to prison for that, but the obstruction of
justice that finally came out after a unanimous Supreme Court

(01:12:47):
said he couldn't withhold tape recordings, and that's the same
story here. Fundamentally, we got to keep this going. The
Democrats in Congress needs to keep coming up with new
ways to find this. The handful of Republicans who are
demanding action on this, they need to be listened to.
And I think there should be a serious effort by journalists.

(01:13:07):
I just talked to one today works for a major publication,
and said, you know, you need to go to this
lawyer who was on Laurence O'Donnell a couple of nights ago,
who represents over two hundred of the young women and
talk with him.

Speaker 5 (01:13:21):
Now.

Speaker 6 (01:13:21):
The young women they don't want to come out and
be public. Understandable given the docsing and the threats to
lives and the threats by crazies in the Mega movement.
But there's lots of ways to get information out without
releasing the names and identities of those young women and
where they are today. But what do they say in
AffA Davis under pseudonyms like Jane Doe one, Jane do two.

Speaker 1 (01:13:44):
Hundred, right right, that's clearly important stuff. And you know,
I want to ask you this. When I was covering
this last election and going to MAGA Trump rallies all
over the country during the election, I probably went to
the last cycle, probably about thirty of them, and I'd
be outside and I always said, a lot of the

(01:14:05):
people are there for the tailgate, but they weren't really
there for the games. They liked the camaraderie, they liked
all of that. What I would speak to some of
these people even then, they were saying, if I find
out that this stuff is true, then he would lose
my support.

Speaker 2 (01:14:19):
Right right.

Speaker 6 (01:14:20):
There's a lot of that, and that's part of the
division you're seeing because some of the people in MAGA
are saying, wait a minute, you promised this stuff. Now,
why are you withholding this. Yeah, this doesn't make sense,
And you can see how desperate Donald is both by
the angry reactions he's giving you questions but also coming
up with nonsense like these were fabricated. All these files

(01:14:40):
were fabricated. Oh, okay, there's no client list. Well, you
don't need a list to know who the clients were.
You know, you don't have to say, here's one, two, three, four, five.
You have records of who visited, who made phone calls,
who was at what events, And I don't I just

(01:15:00):
I think journalists should be very tough with any politician
who wants to protect the privacy of someone in a
case that there's clear evidence from the conviction of gillne
Maxwell and the death of Epstein, along with records that
have been things that have been put in the public record,
that this was an organized, ongoing criminal conspiracy involving a

(01:15:25):
vast sum of money hundreds of millions of dollars, if
not more than even more than a billion, to identify
vulnerable and very cute twelve thirteen, fourteen up to eighteen
year old girls to be used for the pleasure of
wealthy men who were friends of Epstein.

Speaker 1 (01:15:48):
It's a remarkable thing. One of the things that I
want to play this Tony for David is the President
talking about Epstein when he was in Scotland just now.
This was over the weekend, so I don't know the
exact date. Well, let's let's take a listen to the
President answering a question from a reporter here.

Speaker 10 (01:16:07):
That's such old history, very easy to explain, but I
don't want to waste your time by explaining it. But
for years I wouldn't talk to Jeffrey Epstein. I wouldn't
talk because he did something that was inappropriate. He hired help,
and I said, don't ever do that again. He stole
people that work for me. I said, don't ever do

(01:16:28):
that again. He did it again, and I threw him
out of the place persona on Grada.

Speaker 8 (01:16:34):
I threw him out and that was it.

Speaker 1 (01:16:39):
And implicit in that is a relationship that they had.
When he said he didn't have a relationship with him,
Bright he finds the most inappropriate thing that Jeffrey Epstein
ever did was hire away some staff from him. When
we're talking about, you know, pedophilia and sets trafficking here, well,
I believe at.

Speaker 6 (01:16:57):
Least one of the people he hired away was one
of the underage women who was then trafficked. And remember
that the only comment Donald made before this about Gallainne
Maxwell after her conviction was to say, I wish her well.
I'm sorry, Michael. Can you imagine what would have happened
if Barack Obama asked what do you think of this

(01:17:18):
convicted sex trafficker and rapist and he had said, well,
I wish.

Speaker 11 (01:17:22):
Her well.

Speaker 1 (01:17:24):
The time. I can't believe it, just as I can't
believe when he's asked a few times whether or not
he would consider pardoning her, he said I could. I
don't know, because what's going on here.

Speaker 6 (01:17:38):
Actually, in the meeting between Trump's personal lawyer who's now
number two at the Justice Department, and the Gallaine Maxwell,
in a closed meeting that we don't have access to,
were more than one hundred people, presumably most of all
of the men were brought up. Is very clear Gallaine

(01:17:58):
Maxwell's lawyer said she wants a pardon or clemency. This
is so facially corrupt that you know, you can love
Donald Trump and still have principles. And that's the issue here,
I mean, do we have principles or we're going to

(01:18:19):
enforce principles. One of the unfortunate things that seems to
be pretty well ingrained in human beings is that, of course,
if you like someone, you tend to excuse what they've done.
If you don't, you tend to go after them. This
isn't even in the gray zone of is this acceptable
conduct unless you know you're part of this extreme movement
that believes that beating your wife and marrying ten year

(01:18:42):
old children is okay. Unless you're part of that little
fringe group, this is not okay with ninety eight ninety
nine percent of Americans. And so that keep the story alive,
keep the pressure on, that's what matters.

Speaker 1 (01:19:00):
And somebody asked me when I was saying, you know,
not as as well as you just said it, but
saying sort of the same idea, Well, what difference does
it make, right, what difference does it make? He's already
won his election. He can't according to the constitution, if
not himself can't run again. What are we doing this
for now?

Speaker 6 (01:19:19):
And well, that's a here's why we're doing that, because
we're supposed to be a nation of laws, not men.
I warned people as early as twenty eleven, if Trump
got to the White House, he would never leave peacefully.
And what did he say recently this year was the
only mistake he's ever made in his life. I shouldn't
have left the White House in twenty twenty one. What

(01:19:42):
makes you think or anybody think Donald is not going
to try to stay on as President of the United
States permanently. He asserts, this is his words, not mine.
I have an article too that says I can do
anything I want. Article to the Constitution says nothing of
the kind. He is busy telling football or a commercial

(01:20:04):
sports teams how to name the teams. He is telling
universities what you may and may not teach. This is
not the action of a president who executes the laws.
These are the actions of a dictator. And that's right now.
We do not live in a free country. We live
in a dictatorship. Trump has not yet fully consolidated his power.

(01:20:26):
And if the Epstein story comes out fully, it isn't
just Donald Trump can't stay in.

Speaker 2 (01:20:32):
The White House.

Speaker 6 (01:20:34):
Neither can Pambondi, neither can cash but Tell neither can
the appointees at the Justice Department who are systematically turning
it into a law firm on behalf of Donald Trump
to prosecute those people he dislikes. All of that will
come apart and so and you know I would I've

(01:20:56):
said to several journalists. I know, since you know six,
I'm not in the middle of the ball game anymore.
You should be asking the Virgin Islands people for the records.
You should be asking the lawyer who represents the two
hundred or so young women what he can release. You
should be scouring every place and document you can, and

(01:21:21):
you should be asking for the financial records about this.
And at some point there will be enough evidence that
some of the key Republicans on Capitol Hill will back off, right.

Speaker 1 (01:21:36):
And that's that's key. That's what people need to understand.
I'm so glad you put it so well. You answered
the question. The other thing that in terms of manipulating,
you know, we talk about dictatorship and fascism, you try
and dismantle your enemies. The other day I said on
a different show that the reason he's going after Barack

(01:21:56):
Obama for treason maybe because what you do is you
dismantle your enemy at all costs, no matter what. And
if he fancies himself as someone who's going to stay
in the White House, or could run again. Well that
would mean that Barack Obama could run again too. But
if he's treason US and he is in jail or
you know, it carries the death penalty federally, treason does

(01:22:16):
if convicted. So if you do that, that's part of
what you're talking about too.

Speaker 6 (01:22:21):
They're never going to actually go forward with this. I
just I don't believe that if they do. But people
should know something very important. Under our constitution, it is
impossible for Barack Obama to have committed treason. If Donald
Trump actually has given methods and sources to the Russians,
as they've indicated he has, and as other foreign intelligence

(01:22:44):
agencies have indicated has happened, he can't be charged with
treeson either. Because we have to be in a state
of war. The US was last in a congressionally declared
state of war in December of nineteen forty five, was
four months after the Japanese surrendered, that the last belligerent
surrendered to the United States. So it's been now almost

(01:23:08):
eighty years since we've been in the state of war.
And secondly, you have to be engaged in an enemy
or not war. So we don't have enemies under the
law engaged with an enemy against the United States or
making waging war in the United States. Now had we
had a US federal judges who went to work for

(01:23:30):
the Confederacy in the Civil War, and one of them
was later removed from office because he literally used his
judicial powers to wage war in the United States. So
there's no way you can make and sustain such a
charge under our constitution.

Speaker 1 (01:23:47):
Yeah, okay, and again this is these are the sorts
of things a Trump administration would do. So the seeds
of doubt. But of course you can't do the things
that you're talking about doing. Before I let you go, David,
I want to ask you quickly. We were we were
talking about You're an educator, you know what's going on.
You referred to it Harvard now saying that they're going

(01:24:08):
to possibly pay five hundred million, Columbia's pay two hundred million,
My amma model University of Virginia has you know, has
their president resigned because of the de stuff? Jim Ryan,
I think was the right thing, even though I love
the guy. But what what should Harvard? What what can
we see here that we should be fighting? In your

(01:24:29):
estimation number one rule?

Speaker 6 (01:24:32):
Professor Timothy Snyder, the great scholar of authoritarianship, says is
you do not voluntarily comply. Harvard has an endowment of
more than fifty billion dollars. Harvard should take an absolutely
firm stance that we're not submitting to this. And at
the end of the day, if they win in court

(01:24:52):
and get all their money restored, it hasn't cost them anything.
But this is when you reach into your endowment to
stand up for principle. We would be in a much
better situation if Columbia University hadn't immediately caved when the
Trump administration came after them. Now lawyers, civil lawyers are
going to advise, well, it's for if you can get

(01:25:13):
out of this for two hundred and fifty million dollars,
it's a bargain. You should do it because there algebra
is the costs of this, the cost of litigation and
the financial penalties. The problem is Donald Trump is not
going to stop and go away and suddenly go oh, yes,
come by Harvard, I love you now, Harvard, which by

(01:25:33):
the way, rejected him to be a student, and Donald
Harber's grudges. Trust me, thirty seven years of covering Donald
one of the things I early learned was how much
he Harbor's he lets things fester inside for years. Harvard
should stand up, Other universities should stand up, and they

(01:25:53):
should say no, we are not going to knuckle under
to this illegal activity, which is what it is. And
Trump is, you know, not spending money. Congress directed, well,
we dealt with this under Nixon. He tried to do
what was called impound the money. That was his euphemism
for not doing what Congress said. He is trying to

(01:26:16):
not fund universities. But if Congress has appropriated this money,
then the argument should be you are required to do so.
You took an oath to faithfully execute the office of
the president, and that office's duty is primarily to do
whatever Congress tells you to do. You're simply the executive

(01:26:36):
for the branch that decides.

Speaker 2 (01:26:37):
What to do.

Speaker 6 (01:26:39):
Trump, of course, is trying in every way possible to
avoid accountability for anything he does, including going after individual
federal judges. They just went after Judge Boseburg for what
they say was an inappropriate comment he made. Read the
quote in the news stories. It is actually a one
hundred percent appropriate comment for a federal judge to make,

(01:27:02):
expressing his concern about the rule of law.

Speaker 5 (01:27:07):
So I I.

Speaker 6 (01:27:10):
Think the universities and other institutions need to stand up.
And there will be some damage along the way. It's
going to hurt. Bad things are going to happen. But
if you don't stand up, he just accrues more power
and then he'll come back after you again with something new.

Speaker 1 (01:27:25):
Yep, and these and what he's doing is sort of
one of the earmarks of fascism, and go after the
institutions of higher learning.

Speaker 6 (01:27:36):
Well, these people who know what that word means, Michael,
people do not know what the word fascism means.

Speaker 1 (01:27:43):
Yeah, and so they should look that up. Just maybe
even look that up before you google Donald Evanka Parrot.
I think maybe maybe go to fascism first and learn
about that.

Speaker 5 (01:27:56):
So David K.

Speaker 1 (01:27:57):
Johnson, continue in joining and enjoying your retreat. Uh. And
we hope that the trip to Civil Rights South was
profitable because it's a it's a really important thing to see.
I'm glad you.

Speaker 6 (01:28:07):
Went down deeply informing take care and I.

Speaker 1 (01:28:12):
Would say also impressive that what Alabama does to keep
those the memories of the civil rights movement alive. You know,
there are a lot of things to criticize about Alabama,
but they've done, I think a wonderful job of memorializing
that period.

Speaker 6 (01:28:26):
Yep, I agree. Take care, Michael bie Fall.

Speaker 1 (01:28:29):
Thank you. Yeah, take care guys ower by David so
Uh yeah, Well, you know David K. Johnson, Kim is
our institution of higher learning here on R. Thompson Show,
so his takes on that stuff are always are always interesting,
so we were happy to have him. We're gonna have
an interview in a little while, and I think that

(01:28:50):
it's time to start talking about Coachella Valley Coffee.

Speaker 2 (01:28:53):
Don't you you want some news? I would take some
yet take I'll give you some news. Yeah. I loved
seeing with k Johnston at that place in New York.
What a beautiful grounds and beautiful lake in the background.
That was awesome.

Speaker 5 (01:29:06):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:29:07):
That's it. It is the news. Let's hit it, Tony
right on well on the Mark Compson Show. I'm Kim McAllister.
This report sponsored by Coachella Valleycoffee dot Com. Oh yeah,
take a big sip of it. The motive of the
suspect in the shooting in New York City that left

(01:29:28):
four people dead, including a police officer, may be related
as you had mentioned earlier, Michael to CTE, an alleged
suicide note reportedly found in the pocket of the suspect
Monday asked for his brain to be studied. CTE is
a brain disease linked to repeated blows to the head,
often seen in athletes like football players, though it can't

(01:29:49):
be diagnosed yet in a living person. I'd heard that
that there may be some type of scan that they've
come up with that you might be able to diagnose
it in a living person, but so far the only
way doctors have been doing it is by autopsy. So
there was a note regarding that Jeffrey Epstein associate Gilain
Maxwell's request for immunity in exchange for testimony is being

(01:30:13):
declined by a House committee. In a letter today, Maxwell's
lawyer said she would be willing to testify before Congress
if she was given formal immunity. If not, her lawyer
said she would invoke the Fifth Amendment and decline to testify.
The House Oversight Committee said it will soon respond to
this letter, but they immediately ruled out any congressional immunity.

(01:30:34):
Maxwell currently serving a twenty year sentence in federal prison.
She did, though meet with Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche
for questioning last week. As the Trump administration faces pressure
to release all files related to the Epstein case, President
Trump says he is giving Russia ten days to agree
to a ceasefire with Ukraine. Speaking to reporters today, Trump

(01:30:56):
said he doesn't know what impact this deadline will have,
as Russia seems to want this war to continue. His words.
President said he's going to put on tariffs if no
deal is reached. Trump said it may or may not
impact Russia, but it could. He said it could. The
tariff deadline for China has not yet been extended. The

(01:31:16):
US and China wrapping up discussions in Sweden today after
two days of trade talks. A Chinese official had said
that tariff truce was extended, but US trade representatives said
an extension was discussed, but Trump will have the final
say on that. This all comes after a deal was
reached with the European Union over the weekend. North Korean

(01:31:38):
leader Kim John Yung's sister said her brother's relationship with
President Trump is not bad, but the United States has
to accept that country as a nuclear power. Kim Yo jong,
who apparently wields a great deal of power in that
isolated country. Said today that North Korea is a nuclear
weapons state and that fact is irreversible. She went on

(01:32:01):
to say that any effort by the United States to
restart talks with North Korea without that recognition would be
a mockery of the leader's personal relationship. A company based
out of Virginia getting ready to build one of the
largest ice detention centers in the country. Acquisition Logistics recently
won a bid to build the facility in El Paso, Texas.

(01:32:24):
Reports list the contract as being worth about one point
two six billion dollars. This facility will be able to
hold about five thousand detainees, making it the largest immigrant
detention center in the United States. The center expected to
be completed by September of twenty twenty seven. Two of
the biggest US railroads have merged to create the country's

(01:32:47):
first trans continental freight railroad, Union Pacific and Norfolk Southern,
announcing the deal today worth seventy two billion dollars, the
company's confirming last week they were in talks. The deal
still needs regulatory approval. This feels like a story from
like the nineteen fifties. Here we have a vital rail,

(01:33:08):
doesn't it.

Speaker 1 (01:33:10):
So yeah, I would not have been able to get
that Norfolk Southern was one of the two biggest railroads.
But yeah, it feels that's just what I was thinking. Really,
this is the story that's breaking today.

Speaker 2 (01:33:22):
I know, I know. Football legend Dion Sanders says he
is now cancer free after undergoing surgery for bladder cancer.
Doctors discovered a tumor during a routine vascular checkup. They
confirmed it was a high risk form of this disease.
Sanders urging others to get checked, noting the importance of
early detection, bladder cancer affecting more than more men than

(01:33:45):
women as well, with smoking usually the leading risk factor. Again,
he says he's cancer free after undergoing treatment for this
The actions of immigration agents in the Los Angeles area
remain up for debate. The ninth US Circuit Court of
Appeals in San Francisco heard arguments recently against a judge's

(01:34:07):
order calling for limiting immigration enforcement in this region. That
order followed findings that patrols in and around Los Angeles
were being conducted without reasonable suspicion and that detainees were
being denied access to legal counsel. The Trump administration pushing back,
arguing the raids are targeted and are carried out with
probable cause. The appeals Court has yet to rule on

(01:34:29):
the issue as of late last night, so we're still
watching for that. Governor Tim Walls is activating the Minnesota
National Guard following a cyber attack in Saint Paul. Officials
say the city website is experiencing unplanned technology disruptions. Walls's
office says the magnitude and complexity of this incident have
exceeded the city's response capacity, and the Saint Paul Mayer

(01:34:53):
says the city has now declared a state of emergency
to address this cyber attack. Is that is that? Is
that the mayor of a mayor of of.

Speaker 1 (01:35:05):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (01:35:05):
Same, okay, all right. A mainland based company is planning
to offer ghost tours of Lehina, Maui, where more than
one hundred people died in a wildfire in twenty twenty three.
Bad taste anyone, eh. US Ghost Adventures says.

Speaker 1 (01:35:21):
It was mainland company too. It's not even like local,
it's like right, it's a double whammy for them. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:35:28):
US Ghost Adventures says it will show guests the city's
most haunted and historic locations. Many residents in Hawaii are outraged,
calling the tour insensitive and inappropriate. This comes only about
two years removed from the fire, which was one of
the deadliest in US history. Locals also say the destinations
being advertised for the tour are very sacred, some of

(01:35:51):
them are near burial sites. They are not happy with
US Ghost Adventures trying to pull this boloney. In Lahina,
there is and I don't know if you've seen this, Michael,
but there's a new Tesla diner and charging station that's
in Hollywood. I don't know if you can see it,
but in front of that apartment building is a giant
like LED screen or TV screen that's right in front

(01:36:15):
of some people's windows. It's so weird the way they
did that. But they're already drawing protests out there. In
recent days, dozens of people have held demonstrations outside of
the Tesla Diner. Some upset with Tesla's CEO, Elon Musk
after his involvement with Trump earlier this year. Others are
upset about the twenty four to seven diner itself. Residents

(01:36:36):
say it's been causing significant traffic issues since opening last week,
and they are also complaining about constant honking, saying they're
having trouble parking and crossing the street. Yeah, look at
all the protests out there the Tesla diner.

Speaker 1 (01:36:51):
I did hear you say no, of course they're protesting it,
and out of all places, Hollywood. I think this was
put on the map well before people learned about what
they formed opinions about Elon munsk crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:37:05):
Yeah, they don't like the diner. Lastly, a pair of
Kobe Bryant game worn shoes have sold for two hundred
forty thousand dollars. I hope I'm not scooping you in
forty eight seconds of sports. They were sold on Monday
by SCP Auctions. Bryant, who died in a helicopter crash
in twenty twenty, wore these shoes during his first ever

(01:37:25):
NBA start January twenty eighth of nineteen ninety seven, when
he was just eighteen years old. The autographed Adidas EQT
Top ten are now the second most expensive pair of
Kobe Bryant shoes ever sold. Again, that was a lot
of money. That was two hundred forty thousand dollars for
a pair of Kobe Bryant shoes.

Speaker 1 (01:37:45):
Only to come in, only to come in second, only
to come in second. I was spending a quarter of
a million dollars on a pair of shoes and they're
not even the most expensive Kobe Bryant shoes. Wow, that's
kind of wild.

Speaker 2 (01:37:58):
And what do you do? You keep them in a
glass case? Right, You're not gonna wear them around.

Speaker 1 (01:38:02):
Right until you sell them for one hundred and sixty
one thousand in a few years probably, But I mean,
I don't know how this stuff holds onto its value,
but maybe it doubles and triples and I guess.

Speaker 2 (01:38:12):
Well, Actually the worst part is sneakers disintegrate, so oh
do they?

Speaker 5 (01:38:17):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:38:17):
Yeah, so the glue everything comes apart.

Speaker 4 (01:38:20):
So unless you even if you put them in treated stuff,
it's still they still just disintegrate.

Speaker 1 (01:38:25):
Wow. Well, I mean that's sort of encouraging because we
wear so many sneakers. It's good that they disintegrate. Not
good for this guy who both I'm not saying, I
don't know if it's him, but the person who paid
a quarter of a million dollars for this stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:38:38):
This report is sponsored by Coachella Valleycoffee dot Com. It
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(01:39:00):
in this house with the Lion's Main coffee. Mark is
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something in your shopping cart, please use our exclusive Mark
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I'll get you ten percent off your total. So basically
free shipping is what it amounts to. So that's pretty cool.
It is Coachella Valleycoffee dot Com. I'm Kim McAllister and
this is the Mark Thompson Show, The Mark Thompson Show.

Speaker 1 (01:39:53):
It's Mark Thompson.

Speaker 2 (01:40:00):
Which one you use?

Speaker 1 (01:40:00):
Mark Thompson, not me? I'm not Mark Thompson. But but
I know him well and he is a friend, and
he also hosts a really good show here. And we
have we have an interview that Mark did earlier this summer,

(01:40:24):
and I wanted to run it because I, you know,
these things, with all the news that happens, these things
sometimes you know, get set aside, let's say, but he
interviewed John Casey on lud love and marriage equality. It
was filmed in July July seventh. And once you have
a listen to this, and then we will see you

(01:40:44):
on the other side of Mark's interview with John Casey.

Speaker 11 (01:40:52):
Feel in your soul the Mark Thompson Show.

Speaker 8 (01:41:00):
Right on, right on, right on, I'll tell you it
is with great anticipation I welcome our next guest. In fact,
there's a new book out it's called Love, The Heroic
Stories of Marriage Equality, potentially tracking the marriage equality movement

(01:41:22):
since two thousand and four, but a number of award
winning writings on this subject. From our guest, how about
it for the great John Casey. Everyone, Yeah, Senior editor
the Advocate. Wow, these are busy times for the gay
rights movement, and I feel as though I have so

(01:41:46):
much to ask you about in such a short time.
But let's comment and get your thoughts on that which
has been historically a great success, which is marriage equality.
I mean it was a law battle. You can give
us some sense of that and then tell us I
guess the book memorializes very specific stories within the overall

(01:42:10):
issue of marriage equality.

Speaker 5 (01:42:11):
Is that right, John, Yeah, that's correct. Mark, First, thanks
for having me. The book was a labor of love
from my co author Frankie Frankeney, and she had been
starting collecting stories marriage marriage stories since two thousand and four,
and so she brought me on when the book started
to kick into high gear and we were signed by Rizzoli,

(01:42:36):
a great publisher. The book has about one hundred stories
of people who were in an integral part of the
marriage equality fight, and so I was privileged enough to
be able to speak to a number of those people
who are featured in the book and write about their stories.

Speaker 8 (01:42:57):
Yeah. The court decision at the Supreme Court level, which
really decided the law of the land, is this Overfell decision.
You can speak to what it involved, but you actually
talked to Overfeld in the book.

Speaker 6 (01:43:13):
Yes.

Speaker 5 (01:43:14):
So Jim is on the book and Jim has become
a very close friend. And you know, I think what
Jim does is really represent what all of the people
featured in the book. Most of the people featured in
the book are, and that is, they were every day American,
everyday human beings, and they were in love with their partner,

(01:43:35):
and they wanted that love to be recognized lawfully. Jim's
partner was dying of als, and so Jim and his
partner fought the courts in Ohio. They won a few,
they lost a few, but they eventually went to the
Supreme Court, and I think more than twenty other plaintiffs

(01:43:58):
joined their case the court room. In June twenty fifth,
twenty fifteen, which was ten years ago, that marriage equality
was the rule, the law of the land. So lately
we've been, at least for me too, I've been hearing

(01:44:19):
from a lot of the readers of The Advocate who
were worried about their own marriages because not only have
Thomas and Alito on the Supreme Court, but you know,
you have a Republican controlled Congress who can certainly overturn
the codification of marriage equality. That Nancy Pelosi is somebody
I know very well. Was her biggest achievement in Congress.

Speaker 8 (01:44:41):
Yeah, this is really brings me to my anxiety on
behalf of what's right and wrong and on behalf of
the gay community. I mean, there's no reason that the
gay community shouldn't have access to these same freedoms and
customs that the rest of society has. And that is
what you've just alluded to, which is that the hard

(01:45:03):
fought victory which you're celebrating the ten year anniversary of
is now it seems inconceivable, but a victory that may
be reversed. And so the vigilance that you have to have.
What I'm curious about is, you know, what is the
system within the gay community. You, as a writer on

(01:45:24):
so many issues associated with the gay freedoms, I'm wondering
how those anxieties play out in terms of public policy
and vigilance on the part of your community.

Speaker 5 (01:45:34):
Well, that's the key, is vigilance. And I was privileged
to sit on a panel with Lieutenant Tom Carpenter, who
had and he was featured in an MSNBC documentary. That
was the panel we were on when MSNBC debuted, and
Colonel Carpenter was integral in the fight. So somebody got

(01:45:57):
up and asked him a question and they said, you know, oh,
we we've got equal rights, we've got LGBTQ people in
the military, we have our freedom to marry. What's our
next frontier? And he said, there is no next frontier.
And this was back before Trump was elected. He said,
we have to be vigilant. We have to be vigilant

(01:46:18):
and be ready to fight, because in a stroke of
the pen, all of the freedoms we've won over the
last fifty years could be taken away from us.

Speaker 8 (01:46:28):
Yeah, and it's funny that a lot of these freedoms
that we've seen taken away through the years, they start
around the edges, you know, and then before you know it,
it's happened.

Speaker 1 (01:46:39):
Here.

Speaker 8 (01:46:40):
It felt as though it was really a broadside again,
taking nothing away from the victory and the celebration that
one should have for ten years of marriage equality, but
just cutting you know, ahead in the movie to the
fact that you have a new administration, which seems very comfortable,
as you suggest, sort of buoyed by GOP transigence on

(01:47:01):
this issue to begin with. They had to kind of
be drag kicking and screaming to this. It seems as
though the gay community and marriage equality among other things. Broadsided,
I mean, it's all happening at one time.

Speaker 5 (01:47:13):
Yeah, And I think the key to that. I mean,
you said it is around the fringes, and that same
holds true forgetting something like marriage equality pass. And it
actually started, you know, over fifty years ago. And I
spoke to the first recognized couple that was married in
nineteen seventy two. And when the overfelt decision was made

(01:47:37):
by the courts, they recognize Michael and Jack's marriage of
retroactive to nineteen seventy two. But I asked them, I said,
you know, what what happened to you guys that they're
in their late seventies. You know, they don't sort of retired.
If the Supreme Court came along and nullified gay marriage
or turned it back to the States and they said,

(01:47:57):
we don't care. They can't take away our marriage license.
What are they going to do to the millions of
people who have already been married? And society as a
whole has seen that marriage equality marriage gay marriage never
did not have the effect of watering down or belittling
straight heterosexual marriage. It actually solidified families around the country.

(01:48:21):
Gay couples are now in neighborhoods and every part of
communities around the country. People have seen them. Their neighbors
have seen them, They work with them, they go to school,
you know, pta meetings together, their kids play together, and
they see it's just normal. So it's so far entrenched
in society over these last ten years that would really

(01:48:44):
be I think a slight to so many people in
the heterosexual community to see that those rights taken away.
That's something that I think even you know, Republicans and
the Poles have been really strong on that don't want
to see. That does mean it won't happen, but again,
I don't want to see that.

Speaker 8 (01:49:03):
I just feel as though the one of the great
things that's happened through the years is that the gay
community out of the shadows, and the gay community is
embraced increasingly by.

Speaker 2 (01:49:18):
If you can, the mainstream straight community.

Speaker 8 (01:49:20):
Again, this is you know, I'm I'm just a mainstream straighter,
so I can kind of comment on that part of it.
And I see that, you know, people finally are ready
to say, yeah, you know, my brother's gay, my hairdressers gay,
my you know, my therapist is gay. Whatever it might be,
it could be. And you just said everywhere, because there's

(01:49:44):
no specific difference between the gay community and the straight
community apart from the sexuality. So i'd see that playing out.
And I'm hoping that what you've said, I fervently hope
that what you've said is that in regard to the polling,
in regard to the public support is something that's respected
by lawmakers, because it wouldn't have seemed possible to me

(01:50:05):
to get rid of those serving in the military heroically
and honorably for any number of reasons associated with sexuality.
But that's exactly what's happening now, and I worry that
that then, you know, as we were just saying from
the edges to the center, that could kick the door

(01:50:26):
open for a lot more and all of a sudden
it becomes okay, you know, to get rid of and
to deny rights for this community.

Speaker 5 (01:50:35):
Well, that's what's happening in the military right now. I mean,
they've gone full throttle after trans members of the military,
and they're not going to stop there. You know, Pete
heg stuff that's already Sadden His passed that there should
not be queer people in the military. So the deal
is this, and they ship away slowly that they get

(01:50:59):
rid of the trans members of the military, which is
actually a national security threat on many reasons, and then
they chip away at the lgb on on that ad
and you know, it's it's detrimental not only to the
morale of the service members, but it also singles out

(01:51:21):
you know, if you're look, the Defense Secretary has has
you in the target, UH has the LGBTQ community in
his sights, and you know, you're you're starting to be
looked at as something different or and outlier. That that
feeds into two bullying and harassment. And you know back
in the days when our gay service members were beaten

(01:51:43):
up in back alleys exactly, yeah.

Speaker 8 (01:51:47):
Yeah, and it sort of becomes self enforcing that way.
But it's let me get back to but I think
this is all instructive because the uh memorialized nature of
the success stories that you have in your book, these
can inform the present and do inform the present, which

(01:52:09):
is why I think your book is so very relevant.
I mean, it's wondrous to think that this is a victory,
I mean, so hard fought, like so many of these
kinds of victories, but it can also inform what's going
on now. Tell me about some of the other people
to whom you've sort of turned focus with the book Love,

(01:52:33):
the heroic stories of marriage equality.

Speaker 5 (01:52:35):
Sure, so I mentioned Jack and Michael, who were the
first to be recognized as being a couple to be married.
But I also spoke, or couldn't speak. I wrote about
the two men back in the eighties who moved to
a place called Silver Lake in California. They were both
sick with AIDS. There was a documentary about the View

(01:52:56):
from Silver Lake, and it was about these two men
who had an immense love for each other, and they
cared for each other as they were sick and dying
of AIDS, and they eventually both died. The documentary is searing,
but it just it's you know, love is the first
word of this book, and that's for a reason, because

(01:53:19):
that is the thread that ties together each story in
the book. And so you go to somebody like Jack
and Michael in nineteen seventy two, and then Mark and Tom,
and then more recent weddings, you know, like Neil Patrick
Harris and David Berta and others. The threat is love.

(01:53:40):
And the one thing we wanted to do was to
call out those things that the people who suffered from
age and died, and then those people who were fighting
for real estate for to be included on a will.
All of these different components of marriage and the legal

(01:54:01):
issues around marriage people had to fight for. And then
you go to a famous story. You know, I have
the opportunity to speak with Alan the generos and when
she came out in nineteen nineteen ninety seven, ruined her career.
Then she got the talk show. Talk show was doing
very well, but she started to talk about Porscha on
the talk show and the producer said, you might want

(01:54:23):
to stop doing that. People aren't ready to hear about
your girlfriend. She said, no, people will listen to my
story and they're going to understand that this is the
person who I love. And she did an enormous, enormous
great thing by getting Middle America to accept a gay marriage,

(01:54:43):
and you know, and she recognized that, and she appreciates
the fact that as part of LGBQQ history she's in
there because she had a lot to do with people saying,
you know, if Allan loves Porsche and it's all about love,
what why are we fighting the sure?

Speaker 1 (01:55:01):
Sure?

Speaker 8 (01:55:01):
And then you have so much wrapped up in that
I'm so glad that you reference the fact that there's
a sense of courage that one has to have to
kind of swim upstream against the political currents or the
cultural currents of the day. And Ellen, and I know

(01:55:22):
she's become sort of an embattled figure with you know,
how she treats her staff, et cetera. But you've got
to give her credit for swimming upstream against those cultural
currents which were so strong.

Speaker 5 (01:55:35):
Yeah, I think, you know, sure. I even wrote a
column about her when all of this stuff was coming out,
and you know, some of it was true a little bit,
but that's not what she should be remembered for. And
that's what she did, and that's actually, you know, so
her story. Everybody knows who she is, But there were
so many normal, regular people who fought, had the courage

(01:55:59):
to fight simply because they loved this person so much
and they wanted to be that love to be recognized,
and that was critical. If it wasn't for the love,
there would have been no courage.

Speaker 8 (01:56:13):
So so well said, you know, I lived in San
Francisco through the eighties. Excuse me, so I saw all
the greatness of the gay community and a different kind
of greatness as the gay community tried to enlist the
support of the straight community and the broader community of
all communities in the fight for funding for awareness around AIDS.

(01:56:38):
It just so happened that I was there for that decade,
and I lost dear friends, journalists, award winning journalists who
went down to this awful scourge. But I mention it because, hey,
it informed a lot of sort of my sense of things,
but also the way in which that movement had similar

(01:57:01):
aspects to what you're talking about, which is the movement
to maintain marriage equality and equality generally within the culture.
You know, you have to broaden the perspective to enlist
the help of all of these other communities for something
which shouldn't even be We shouldn't have to take a
meeting on it. It should just be understood. But nonetheless

(01:57:22):
you have to fight.

Speaker 5 (01:57:23):
For it, right And I just tended I would invite it.
To go with Speaker Pelosi to see an exhibit at
World Pride in Washington, d C. Last month about the
Ages quilt, And there was an exhibit there, and so
I went with the speaker and they gave us a

(01:57:43):
private tour, and the Gay Men's Chorus sang for us.
The Gay Men's Chorus loss over fifty members during AIDS
the Age Crisis, the quilts that were hanging their panels
from the quilts that were there, you know, we were
from nineteen eighty seven, which was the first year that
both I worked on Capitol Hill back in the late eighties.

(01:58:06):
So Nancy Pelosi and I started on the Hill at
the same time, nineteen eighty seven, and it was nineteen
eighty seven when they quilt made its first appearance on
the National Mall. And the stories are haunted, and the
stories need to be kept alive and need to be told.
And you're right. It was the people like act Up,
people who were dying whose friends and families saw this,

(01:58:29):
saw how horrible this was. But they also got a
glimpse into the fact that these these men who were
dying were also partners to somebody, They were in love
with somebody, and it you know, the Ages Crisis was
a terrible thing that should never be forgotten about, and
this generation need to be informed. But it was the

(01:58:51):
way of fighting for the research money and it was
that fight that enabled much changed to happen. And it's
that fight also that should be used as an example
for our community right now to see how we have
to dig in and fight and we have to be.

Speaker 1 (01:59:10):
In it together.

Speaker 8 (01:59:11):
So well said, so well put, there is the age quilled.
Look how huge it was. The other thing that I
remember and the images are just so moving. I remember
the families. You know, it's not just those who had
a loved one, had a connection, had what would have
been a wife, husband, partner, spouse, whatever you want to

(01:59:34):
put whatever title. But my point is the families. To
see these again, mainstream families with the gay son or
gay daughter or gay son and daughter. I mean, it
was the breadth of America, all of the greatness of
America touched by the scourge of age. Just as you've said,

(01:59:56):
the courage that was summoned for that battle was summon
for this marriage equality battle, and you chronicle it in
your book. But it's also again we note repeatedly the
battle that has to be fought to maintain freedoms and
to turn back this tide. I mean, it's a very
kind of nineteen fifty eight mentality that's kind of settling

(02:00:22):
in over the country, and it's it's scary. I'm talking
about from the Washington perspective, anyway. I mean, it's the
Christian right, it's these political coalitions that are are quite
cruel to all of these minorities, and the gay community
among them, you know, John.

Speaker 5 (02:00:39):
Yeah, Well, I talked to doctor Fauci, talked to him
a lot over the years, and he told me that,
you know, he was instrumental and to fight for HIV
and AIDS for treatment. I mean, he saved many, many, many,
many lives. But doctor Fauci said he hasn't seen this

(02:01:00):
bad since the age crisis, and he thinks it might
even be worse. And I agree with them. I mean, well,
you were talking about the fact that many, many of
the men who died were from middle class in America,
who had their families and who had their friends. But
there are still trans kids, still LGBTQ youth who are
suffering so bad right now, who can't come out at home,

(02:01:23):
and the suicide rates among them are skyrocketing versus those
heterosexual kids. So the hate is still there, The reticence
of coming out is still there, the fear of coming
out is still there, and it's been manifested in put

(02:01:43):
in things like what Ron Descent has has done in Florida.
When you single out these kids and you pass laws,
and it's on the news, and it's on the it's
on the web, and it's it's out there. These kids
see that, and it all it does is that fuel
to the fire for for other kids to pick on
these kids and bullying them. So when you said that

(02:02:04):
things look like they're back from nineteen fifty eight, you're right.
It's it's all of this hate, all of this legislation,
that's the state legislatures are passing. All they're doing is
field the fires of hate and bullying. And you do
take it back decades. We you know, many people thought
we were over that. I always hear from my friends like, well,

(02:02:25):
more more queer youth are coming out than ever before.
That may be true, But the same holds true that
there's more now who won't come out than there ever
have been before.

Speaker 8 (02:02:35):
I can so see the argument for why they wouldn't.
And I similarly am appalled at the way that trans
youth are being used politically. And I think the trans issue,
I don't know a lot about the trans world. I
have friends, of course who have trans kids, but I'm

(02:02:58):
saying I don't know to wade into however, it should
be handled. But I do know a political talking point
when I see one, and it is being used as
this cultural wedge issue to gain power without regard for
the kids or the issue or anything. It's just really

(02:03:18):
an area of political land that they can till until
they are able to achieve power. So that compounds the
tragedy because there's no real earnest conversation going on around
these kids who are really in crises. Wow, we talked
about a lot of stuff, John. It's kind of what
my hope was to get into some other stuff. And

(02:03:41):
you've really done it well. I wish we had more time.
The book is Love the Heroic Stories of Marriage Equality,
and John Casey again talks to so many who helped
establish the Marriage Equality Act as law, including Jim Oberfeld,
co authored the forward to this book. And Uh, you

(02:04:03):
know so many great things in the LGBTQ plus community
and you've been part of so much of it. I mean,
it really is a great credit. What a life you know, John,
I know it never ends, but it's Uh, it's nice
to talk to you because I have mad respect for
all the work you've done.

Speaker 5 (02:04:22):
Well. I appreciate you having me Mark. I'm happy to
come back anytime, and thank you so much for pushing
this book forward. The stories are so critical and so important.

Speaker 8 (02:04:32):
We're going to link to the book under this video,
and we hope to see you again soon. Thanks John Casey,
John Casey, everybody.

Speaker 5 (02:04:39):
Thank you.

Speaker 8 (02:04:39):
Mark right on, my friend, right on.

Speaker 11 (02:04:45):
Feel it in your soul, the Mark thumpson show, Feel
It in your Soul.

Speaker 1 (02:04:56):
What a what a good interesting interview there. You know
the I saw in the commissars somebody asking where the
AIDS quilt is Now, It's at the National AIDS Memorial,
the physical quilt the panels of that quilt, or at
the National AIDS Memorial in San Francisco. But there are
digital copies that I think are maintained by the Library

(02:05:18):
of Congress, and so if you go into their website,
I think you'd be able to find that. You know
that it's there, and you might have to do a
little hunting, but I believe that's where I remember saying
it was there. We will we have forty eight seconds
of a show left for you on this Tuesday. Mark Thompson,

(02:05:38):
the gentleman who conducted that interview, will be back here
tomorrow to be with all of you and I think
that you know, look, Ryan Sandberg, a Baseball Hall of Famer,
died yesterday at the age of sixty five. He was
sort of universally loved as a Cub. He couldn't become
mister Cub because Ernie Banks took that all. But he

(02:06:02):
won gold gloves, he won batting titles. He was, you know,
one of the really good guys of eighties baseball, and
then he went on to manage the Phillies. He was
elected to the Hall of Fame. He was diagnosed with
metastatic prostate cancer. So it's always a good time to
bring that up and say, you know, tell men to

(02:06:23):
get checked for that, and it's eminently treatable if found
before it metastasizes. Unfortunately, for Rhino, the Cubs ambassador, he
wasn't able to do that. So in twenty twenty four,
in January that said that he last year he started
treatment and he died yesterday.

Speaker 2 (02:06:41):
And so I'm sorry to here.

Speaker 1 (02:06:44):
Yeah, yeah, so we say goodbye to Ryan Sandberg. But
he was an incredible baseball player, well liked as a player,
a manager and also man was he really good. So
to Ryan Vandberg and all Cubs fans out there we
send our beat and our condolences and we let you
know tomorrow we have we have Mark Thompson coming back here.

(02:07:06):
I thank him and Tony for all their support over
the last two days. I will see you Friday briefly,
and then whenever Mark decides it's time to go on
a cruise or a hike or a Safari ride or
you know whatever, or to Vegas, I'll be here. Thanks guys,
It's the Life.

Speaker 2 (02:07:25):
Tomorrow John roth Will will be on the show Melinda
Weymouth with It's the Planet Stupid and our thanks to
Michael Shore sitting in the captain's chair today. You are
super awesome. Have a great day everybody. Bye bye

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