The Pact

It started with the 2014 disappearance of an Upper Michigan man named Chris Regan. The two-year investigation into his disappearance would take authorities on a strange journey into a world of sex, drugs, pig farming, alleged cannibalism, and serial murder; all stemming from a wedding day pact between Kelly and Jason Cochran, that resulted in the murder of at least two men. Investigative reporter, Josh Hallmark, dives through thousands of case files and dozens of hours of interviews with Kelly to make sense of the breadth of her crimes and her often contradictory stories, in hopes of identifying her additional victims she's refused to name... if there even are any. This is a Studio BOTH/AND production: www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Episodes

The Pact | Trailer

February 22, 2023 • 1 min

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1. The Pact

March 15, 2023 • 38 mins

On the night of Kelly Cochran's wedding, her husband Jason forced her to agree to a pact: That if she ever cheated on him, she'd have to kill the man she cheated with. That pact would result in the deaths of at least 9 people.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Music:
Chris Zabriskie: Last Night I Dreamt I Saw True L...

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2. Hunters & Gatherers

March 22, 2023 • 39 mins

Phone records, discrepancies in Kelly Cochran's statements, search warrants, and several interviews lead to some shocking revelations surrounding Chris Regan's disappearance. Plus, criminal psychologist, Joni Johnston, discusses female psychopaths.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and ...

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3. Baby Bird

March 29, 2023 • 34 mins

Investigators and psychologists try to get to the bottom of which Cochran was abusing the other. Chief Frizzo works with the FBI and an unlikely informant to coerce Kelly into confessing. And Kelly hits the road, again.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.
Mu...

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4. Two Women

April 5, 2023 • 43 mins

Kelly discusses a third murder. Josh takes a look at the two women at the center of this case, and how their lives were affected and intertwined by it.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.
Music by William Hellfire, Whithe, Sergey Cheremisinov, Lee Rosevere, ...

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5. Quack Quack, Oink Oink

April 12, 2023 • 42 mins

The trial of Kelly Cochran reveals shocking information about Kelly and Jason, discerns Kelly's truth from lies, and begins painting a clear picture of the Cochrans' killing spree. Plus, we take a closer look at Jason's manuscript.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh ...

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6. Mississippi Street

April 19, 2023 • 29 mins

The investigation into Jason and Kelly Cochran's other crimes begins with a look into their time in Indiana; revealing some strange and shocking connections.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.
Music by William Hellfire, Whithe, Sergey Cheremisinov, Stacxk, ...

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7. Laura

April 26, 2023 • 94 mins

She may be the only living person to truly know Kelly Cochran.
Laura Frizzo talks the Cochrans, David Thayer, the glass ceiling, and how this case has impacted her life.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.
Music by William Hellfire, Whithe, Sergey Cheremisin...

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8. Rotten Love

May 3, 2023 • 43 mins

If Laura Frizzo knows Kelly best, then Walt Ammerman probably knew Jason best. We get to know Jason through an interview with friend and eventual informant, Walt. Then we explore Kelly's Facebook and its odd parallels to her crimes, and an unsolved Indiana homicide and its odd parallels to Chris Regan's murder.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show...

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9. Inside

May 17, 2023 • 28 mins

Josh goes inside the investigation into Kelly Cochran, revealing new information, new links, and a possible timeline. And the investigation itself raises some important questions about what authorities do and don't know.
Next episode: 24 May 2023

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and pro...

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10. The Park

May 24, 2023 • 39 mins

The Kelly Cochran case files arrive, opening a Pandora's Box of depravity. And during an encounter following Jason's death, Kelly shows Hobart police just how calculating and unhinged she truly is.
Next episode: 31 May 2023

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Research assistance by Becca Cline.

Music by William Hellfi...

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11. Camping

May 31, 2023 • 39 mins

Kelly's brother, Colton, shares some revealing and shocking information with investigators. Kelly discusses her first three murders. And patterns begin to emerge.
Next Episode: 14 June 2023

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Research assistance by Becca Cline.

Music by William Hellfire, Whithe, Sergey Cheremisinov, L...

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12. Playing Games

June 14, 2023 • 34 mins

Kelly's lists of 32 alleged victims lead investigators to find some interesting evidence in Illinois and Minnesota. And Josh begins making sense of Kelly's lists (and lies).
Next Episode: 21 June 2023

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Research assistance by Becca Cline and Michelle Kaszuba.

Music by William Hellfire...

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13. The Lists

June 21, 2023 • 36 mins

Josh deep-dives the lists of Kelly's and Jason's alleged 32 victims, with some shocking revelations and a whole lot of WTF moments.
Next Episode: 28 June 2023

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, and produced by Josh Hallmark
Research assistance by Becca Cline and Michelle Kaszuba

Resources include: N...

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14. Sex, Lies, and Manipulation

June 28, 2023 • 41 mins

An exploration into Kelly Cochran's practice of avoidance, her list of trophies, and consistencies in her wildly varying stories, leads to some pretty solid conclusions about Kelly and Jason.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.
Research assistance by Becca C...

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15. MEN

July 12, 2023 • 32 mins

An examination of the disparities surrounding the portrayals of men and women in crime, and how Kelly Cochran exploited them.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.
Research assistance by Becca Cline.
Resources include: The Washington Post, The Chicago Tribune,...

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16. Deep River

July 19, 2023 • 38 mins

A look at how sexual abuse may have contributed to Kelly Cochran's life and crimes; and how it may play a role in deciphering her many stories.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.
Research assistance by Becca Cline.
Resources include: RAINN.org, Psychology To...

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17. A Boreal Feast

July 26, 2023 • 27 mins

An examination of the strange relationship and power dynamics between Kelly Cochran and Detective Ogden, reveals new patterns in Kelly's stories and behaviors. Plus, a cumulative overview of what we've learned about Kelly, helps construct an MO and timeline of her crimes.

This is a Studio BOTH/AND production:
www.pactpodcast.com / www.bothand.fyi
For an ad-free experience or to support the show: www.patreon.com/studiobothand

Written, r...

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Studio BOTH/AND presents: True Crime Bullsh**

August 1, 2023 • 43 secs

If you enjoyed The Pact, check out host Josh Hallmark's other investigative deep dive into serial killer Israel Keyes: True Crime Bullsh**

www.bothand.fyi
www.truecrimebullshit.com
www.patreon.com/studiobothand

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18. Both/And

August 2, 2023 • 39 mins

The finale.

Written, researched, edited, and produced by Josh Hallmark.
Research assistance by Becca Cline.

Music by William Hellfire, Chris Zabriskie, Lee Rosevere, Whithe, and Stacxk.

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The Pact

Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}The Pact | Trailer

.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}1. The Pact

2. Hunters & Gatherers

3. Baby Bird

4. Two Women

5. Quack Quack, Oink Oink

6. Mississippi Street

7. Laura

8. Rotten Love

9. Inside

10. The Park

11. Camping

12. Playing Games

13. The Lists

14. Sex, Lies, and Manipulation

15. MEN

16. Deep River

17. A Boreal Feast

Studio BOTH/AND presents: True Crime Bullsh**

18. Both/And

Popular Podcasts

The Pact | Trailer

1. The Pact