January 25, 2024 • 54 mins
Katy Elizabeth was born in Warwick Rhode Island. She is the worlds leading authority on the Lake Champlain Monster. Katy has been studying the existence of Champ since a child She made her lifelong dream into reality when she had her sighting and experiences of this elusive creature on Lake Champlain. It prompted her to start her group called \"Champ Search\".
She is also the president and founder of the newly launched International Dracontology Alliance an organization dedicated to the scientific study of Lake Creatures worldwide as well as the USA administrator for the Centre of Fortean Zoology based in the U.K.
The goal of \"Champ Search\" is to study, investigate, prove the existence and most importantly protect the unique animals that inhabit New York and Vermont’s beautiful Lake Champlain. In 2018 she was honored with an official world record as the only full-time Dedicated Woman Lake Monster Hunter in the world.
Also in 2018, Katy approached the town of Port Henry NY known as the "Home of Champ" with a written resolution to protect Champ. In April 2018, this law was passed.
She has been featured on an extensive amount of radio and television programs across the globe including the History Channel's "In Search of Aliens" with Giorgio Tsoukalos, The Travel Channel (Expedition X with Josh Gates), Discovery Channel, The Science Channel, as well as NBC and the CW Network.
Katy has done an extensive amount of work with cetaceans (Whales & Dolphins) recording their sounds in the North Atlantic, off the Florida coast, as well as trekking through the sub-tropical terrain in search of the Skunk Ape.
In 2022, she was awarded four Gold awards at the International Fortean Film Festival for her upcoming documentary \"Lady of the Lake: The Search for Champ. She is the author of the new book \"Water Horse of Lake Champlain: The Search.
She is also the president and founder of the newly launched International Dracontology Alliance an organization dedicated to the scientific study of Lake Creatures worldwide as well as the USA administrator for the Centre of Fortean Zoology based in the U.K.
The goal of \"Champ Search\" is to study, investigate, prove the existence and most importantly protect the unique animals that inhabit New York and Vermont’s beautiful Lake Champlain. In 2018 she was honored with an official world record as the only full-time Dedicated Woman Lake Monster Hunter in the world.
Also in 2018, Katy approached the town of Port Henry NY known as the "Home of Champ" with a written resolution to protect Champ. In April 2018, this law was passed.
She has been featured on an extensive amount of radio and television programs across the globe including the History Channel's "In Search of Aliens" with Giorgio Tsoukalos, The Travel Channel (Expedition X with Josh Gates), Discovery Channel, The Science Channel, as well as NBC and the CW Network.
Katy has done an extensive amount of work with cetaceans (Whales & Dolphins) recording their sounds in the North Atlantic, off the Florida coast, as well as trekking through the sub-tropical terrain in search of the Skunk Ape.
In 2022, she was awarded four Gold awards at the International Fortean Film Festival for her upcoming documentary \"Lady of the Lake: The Search for Champ. She is the author of the new book \"Water Horse of Lake Champlain: The Search.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
The Paranormal Project Radio Show. Hereare your hosts, Scott Allen and Christina
(00:38):
Bowen. Hello everyone, and welcomeback to another episode of The Paranormal Project
Radio Show. I am your host, Scott Allen and I'm here with my
lovely co host, Christina Bowen.How are you, my friend? I
am fabulous, cool but fabulous.Yeah, you know. I mean people
(00:59):
probably won't know, but it wassnowing the last time we did a show
together, and that's because it wasabout an hour ago we put This show
is recorded as well. This istwo in one day. But we've got
a lot of travels coming up,don't we We do, we do.
I'm excited about it. Just tryingto have some things. So the next
week we're at the Lone Star paracon and then we are We're going to
(01:26):
be in New Orleans together, goingto Naples. There's a lot of stuff
going on. So it's good tohave a few of these shows that we
can plug in and so and soI'm excited to be here and to have
this opportunity to meet with our guests. Now you've heard of the Lockness Monster
in Scotland, but today we're goingto talk about the Monster of Lake Champlain
(01:53):
Champion. I'm excited to hear this. Yeah, now I am too,
because we have our own and Ifeel like multiple talk to our guests about
this, but I feel like peopledon't talk about Champion as much as they
talk about Locknant. I think Locknestseems to be a little more notorious.
But we're gonna bring We're gonna We'regonna change that tonight because I really am
interested to see what this is allabout and what kind of evidence she's had.
(02:16):
So our guest is probably the mostwell known champion researcher anywhere around,
so I'm going to bring her out. Katie Elizabeth, Welcome to the show.
How are you hi? Good guys, how you doing? I got
my cat here as he was hoggingthe thing earlier. He wants all the
(02:37):
attention. But they're good, they'regood. We've had a bunch of pets
on the show, so they justkind of like walk around into it.
Yeah, what do you see?Christina has this, you know, one
hundred and fifty pound German shepherd thatsometimes walk a sensitive about his weight.
But are we all aren't we alljust call him a large boy? Yeah?
(03:04):
Katie, how did you get involvedwith studying and researching Champ. Oh
God, it was a long timeago. I'm thirty eight now. I
know in the future I'm probably notgoing to reveal my age anymore after this.
But when I was, when Iwas seven years old, is when
I started my fascination with Champ andother late creatures as well. I was
(03:24):
watching an episode of Unsolved Mysteries thatwas hosted by the great Robert Stack back
in that time. He was theabsolute best. I mean, no one
will ever replace him, as Imean David Dennis Farina, excuse me,
Dennis Farina was very good too,but something about Robert Stack that just made
the program. So I was watchingthat and I saw the famous Sandermncy photo
(03:47):
that was taken in nineteen seventy sevenof this long neck twisted around at the
side, and I was totally fascinated, and I yelled to my mom,
Mom, I want to go seethis late creature, this dinosaur of sorts,
and she was like, what inthe world are you watching? So
I said, can we go?Can we go? And I knew it
(04:09):
was in New England, and Ilived in Rhode Island in the Ocean State
at the time, so I pulledout the old Rand McNally map before we
had GPS, and I kind ofestimated that it would be about four and
a half five hours. And mymom never really liked to bring me many
places back that I mean, wewent to Massachusetts and Connecticut and we didn't
(04:30):
even go to Maine at that point. Like, my mom didn't like to
drive far and she worked a lottoo, So I'll give her that credit
because if she watches that, she'sgonna shoot me because I'm dissinger a little
bit. But yeah, that's whatstarted my fascination with Champs. So I
went to my library at school andtried to find every book that I could
on NeSSI on Champ and I didfind a couple of books. One was
(04:53):
A Champ Beyond the Legend by JosephZarzinski, a former Champ researcher, and
the other one, I'm trying toremember. It was a lot in this
book. I think it was byTim Dinsdale, who was one of my
idols. Great guy and very handson, very much how I am today
with the field research because we havea lot of armchair researchers, which are
really great because they're really good atcollecting the reports and getting them out there
(05:18):
and that sort of thing. Butthe fuel work is my passion because I
believe that in order to make newdiscoveries, you have to put your boots
on the ground and get out thereand do the hard work, or else
you're going to rehash the same stuff. Themancy photo. How many times can
you rehash that over and over?So that's how I got started, And
(05:39):
then in twenty twelve, I wasactually working for a paranormal group at the
time, and I as much asI love the parent noormal, I don't
deal with it anymore because I've hada lot of things that had followed me
home and not the greatest experiences attimes because I'm very expensive, so I
kind of gave up on that.I mean, I might still a little
(06:00):
bit, but I'm very careful.So at the time, my friends were
like, let's go on a tripsomewhere different, and I'm like, well,
let's go to Lake Champlain because it'sa place I always wanted to go.
And as soon as I got outof that car, I had tears
in my eyes because I felt likeI was home. It was the weirdest
thing. So that's how I gotstarted, and actually my second day there,
(06:23):
I had my first encounter of somethingI could not explain out in the
bay. So it was really weirdbecause I'm thinking, what are the chances
of me seeing something right off thebat on my trip, because people spent
a lifetime there and never seen anything, So it was really weird to me,
and I just I was looking outat the bay and there was a
(06:45):
sailboat moored in the background to usefor scale size. I saw this black
thing rise to the surface of thewater and it went very casually from left
to right. And growing up inthe Ocean State, my dad was a
fisherman, so I was very familiarwood seeing whales and dolphins and all types
of phenomenon that are natural logs,floating otters and stuff like that. Boat
(07:08):
wakes is a very common thing thata lot of people think they're seeing a
lake monster, and it's just boatwakes. So when I saw this thing,
I was just in total awe.I had a couple of friends with
me that were in the background eatingtheir breakfast, and they were like,
oh, that's cool, Like theyweren't even interested because they wanted to go
out to look for Bigfoot and Iwanted to look for champs. So they
(07:31):
were just I don't know, theyhad no interest in it whatsoever. But
one of my friends that was withme at the time, he was sitting
with me and he witnessed it aswell. So I ran to the car
to get my camera because I didn'thave my camera on hand because I didn't
think I was going to see anythingthe second day there, I mean,
come on. So I ran atmy camera and then it was gone,
and I was just like so angryabout it, and I said, you
(07:56):
know, this is it. Thisis where I'm going to start getting my
own equipment going. I actually hadbuilt a hydrophone system kind of with a
Pisio mic at the time, andI put it in a PBC pipe and
I used JB. Weld to goaround. I did all kinds of stuff.
I kind of everything was what wouldyou use that for for? Hydrophone?
(08:22):
Hydrophone hydrophone is underwater recording system thatrecords underwater sounds. They use it
for cetacean research with whales and dolphins. You can also use it for listening
for any type of seismic activity withearthquakes and stuff like that. Very very
sensitive microphone. So I built myown little jury rigged microphone. At the
(08:45):
time, I didn't get anything itkind of it kind of I looked back
at it and it sucked, buthey, it was an idea and I
was trying to maguiver it at thetime. Yeah, so that's how I
got started. And then because thatI truly know this for a fact,
when you see something that you can'texplain and you have that I've always had
(09:07):
a passion for mysteries anyway, eversince I was a little girl, I've
had I've had paranormal experiences. Idon't really talk about it much now because
I'm in the cryptid field now,but I've had some really strange things happen.
When I was really little, welived in a house that was haunted
for quite some time, and Idon't know. I just think that when
(09:28):
you have an open mind like that, these things seem to gravitate towards you
for sure. And I think it'sbecause some people they don't have blinders on.
They have a whole range all aroundthem, eyes behind their head,
I always say, and I'm oneof those types of people. I noticed
the damnedest things that other people's don'tthey don't notice. They're like, how
the hell did you see that?So that's just my nature, I guess.
(09:52):
So what if you discovered, youknow, what is the biggest aha
thing that you've learned from your ownyour own research. I mean, there's
a few things that I've gathered overthe last eleven years. What's really interesting.
We captured echolocation multiple times in LakeChamplain. The echolocation was the first,
(10:18):
basically the first thing that I hadcaptured in a slew of things.
And when that happened, I hadheard before that there was echo location recorded
there, and I had worked witha woman named Elizabeth von Mugginhaler that was
on quite a few Discovery Channel programswhere she had recorded echolocation in the lake.
(10:39):
And then, okay, echolocation isbasically instead of man made sonar or
electronically made. So if you're ina boat and you have a fish finder,
it's putting out a beam of soundand when that beam of sound hits
an object, say a school offish or a rock or something, it
bounces back induces an image. Socetations that we know today they use echolocation.
(11:05):
Whales and dolphins to navigate the areasto find. Basically, it's a
mental picture. They don't need eyesight, they just use this echo location.
So they put this beam of soundout, it bounces back and produces a
mental image for them. Uh.And they use that too for navigation as
well as finding food. So that'secho that's basically what that is. So
(11:30):
during echolocation they make certain clicking noises. So if you're listening to a type
of fish finder, which is kindof the same sonar, you'll hear a
constant tick tick tick tick. It'snot a tick tick tick tick tick.
It sounds like a clock. It'sjust a constant beat in between. With
echo location, it doesn't work thatway. You're gonna hear variables up and
(11:54):
down because they're they're distributing it outin like a certain pattern to cover all
bases versus a regular sonar. That'sjust a constant mechanical ticking. So it's
the sound that we had gotten,and that was twenty fourteen. It was
very similar to what she had gotten, So I was like, Wow,
(12:16):
I'm really onto something here. SoI've gotten probably at least fifteen echo location
recordings, I'm guessing because I've gota hard drive external hard drive that's full
of stuff that I haven't even like, I've heard weird things like Okay,
this one's cool, but it's alittle Muffuy, I'm gonna use the best
(12:39):
ones that I got or whatever.So I'm very picky with what I present
to the public because I'm very analyticalminded as a person. So the video
that I captured in twenty fourteen ofa Champ animal crossing Button Bay, I
had gotten that and that when Ipresented. I've got some other videos that
were kind of strange, like disturbancesand stuff that weren't boat wakes or anything,
(13:01):
but they weren't good enough for meto put out there and say positively,
this is a Champ creature. Sothere really isn't. I mean,
really, the aha moment for whatI've gotten, I would say, is
the sonar pictures and sonar video thatI've captured. I mean, the other
stuff is just as great, butit was something totally different. Like I
(13:24):
got so spoiled with getting the echolocation recordings. It was just like hearing
a dog barking down the street tome, like it's, oh, there
they are again. So the sonarwas interesting because I always said that I
wouldn't really try it because I believethat it's very invasive to the hearing because
animals that echo locate have that highsensitivity of hearing range. But with people
(13:48):
fishing the lake all the time,they have fishing derbies with hundreds of boats
around, they're really used to it, so it's really not as invasive to
them as it could be. Ifpeople just showed up all of a sudden
in a lake that there wasn't anybodyusing fish finders, then that would be
kind of a different story. SoI mean, yeah, I think it
(14:09):
is very, very bothering to theirears, but they're getting an immunity to
it, so there's no doubt inyour mind that they exist, no doubt
my mind, I wouldn't. I'mthe type of person if I stick in
something this long, I'm not abeliever. I'm a knower, there's no
(14:30):
and I'm a very If you talkto some of the people that know me
for a really long time, they'relike, this girl is no bs.
She is just a straight shooter.Sometimes it gets me in trouble because of
my mouth. I just I tellthe way it is and it's but I
mean, in one way, Ican get myself in trouble being like that.
But in another way, I takepride in what I do and I've
(14:52):
spent so much time, so muchmoney, so much effort in doing this
study, and I've gotten results becauseI believe when you're dedicated to the things
and you use this, you useyour heart to do it, good things
are going to come to you.And my idea with the Champ animals is
(15:13):
my biggest goal is protection because theseanimals obviously are not in every lake.
There's other lakes around the world thathave similar creatures, if not the same,
I don't know yet. I'm doinga study on that as well as
some comparisons. But I think themost important thing is the protection. So
in twenty nineteen, I wrote alaw of protection for the Champ animals and
(15:35):
it was passed unanimously. So thatwas amazing New York State law, and
I was like, wow, Igotta say I've done some really cool stuff
in my life, but I thinkthat was the biggest thing. Yeah,
thank you, I appreciate that.Now you think, I mean, your
belief is that there is more thanone. Absolutely, without a doubt,
it's not a one creature called Champor champion. It's a it's a whole
(16:02):
breed of them, a whole bunchabsolutely. I mean, here's the thing
with my echolocation, there's many andnot just echolocation. I've also gotten ultralow
frequency sounds of communications between I don'tknow what they mean. That's the thing
with bioacoustics studies of whales and dolphins, for instance, or even alligators.
(16:22):
They're starting to learn that alligators communicateunderwater, which is something that bioacousticians never
new. So the study with bioacousticsunderwater in particular are just the tip of
the iceberg. They're starting to figurethis stuff out. So with those sounds,
I don't know if it's for breedingpurposes territorial reasons. Some of them
(16:45):
are ultra low frequency, and inwater, when you have ultralow frequency,
the sound travels further in water,especially salt water, which we don't have
a Lake Champlaine. What's really interestingis when I've done some bioacoustic studies out
in the North Atlantic and down herein off the coast of Florida too,
(17:06):
with whales and dolphins, it's justit's really cool because I can hear for
like I would say a ten mileradius versus four or five in Lake Champlain
because it's salt water, so Ican hear so much further. And I'm
like, why can't we have saltwater where the lake is? You know,
it could be the Champlain Sea againand I could hear more. So
I go in certain places where therehave been sightings and I sit and I
(17:30):
listen and it. You know,I love what I do. But sometimes
watching for these animals to pop upor get any sort of sound is like
watching paint dry. It really is. But the scenery is so worth it.
It's beautiful. It's such a peaceof mind and meditation for me as
well. Why do you think they'reso scarce? Why don't you more people
see them? If the lake isactive, oats and people, Well,
(17:55):
if you look at how do Iput this? Okay? First off,
people are looking for one hundred footlong creature. These animals average size is
fifteen to twenty five feet. I'veheard of some specimens up to thirty five.
One of the ones that I capturedam I sownar images from twenty nineteen.
I would say she's around thirty tothirty five. She is enormous and
(18:18):
with reptiles. Now I believe theseanimals are ectothermic, whether reptile are amphibians.
So with ectotherms, we are ashumans are endothermic. So we can
sustain our innercore temperature and we cando that on our own, but reptiles
and amphibians they cannot. So whenthe water is below fifty degrees fahrenheit,
(18:41):
that's when the sightings start to plummet, which I find interesting. Plus some
people say, well, maybe it'sbecause there's not any trusts on the lake.
The tourism compared to lock ness isnot the same. You hardly see
anything about Champ around the lake.It's the weirdest thing. It's not that
popular. Over the last ten twelveyears that I've been doing this, though,
(19:03):
I've brought so much awareness about Champs. So now it's starting to go
a little a little bit more haywire, and there's a little bit more attention
to it because of the echo location, the sonar and the video. But
it's I mean, how do Iput it. People are looking for this
one hundred ful long thing like awhale, and they're not that large.
There are reports from the eighteen hundredsthat these animals were one hundred plus feet.
(19:27):
But my theory is that I thinkthey move in pairs because I've gotten
these this I belly it's the sametoo in this area. So you add
thirty feet thirty five feet plus twentytwenty five feet, that's that would look
like one massive creature because they swimlike diagonally next to each other. And
(19:48):
I've got them on the bottom ofthe lake. And then three weeks later
when I went back, those weregone because there were some people that are
like maybe their logs and all thisstuff, and I said, okay,
well I'll go back to try todebunk it and see if those logs are
still there. Well, the logsweren't there. Uh, they were gone,
audios. And then further up thelake as I went, they were
swimming under my boat and I gotthem underneath the boat. So it's just
(20:14):
crazy. I could I cry everytime I talk about this stuff, because
if if only people knew what's outthere, that they would just they wouldn't
go swimming in the lake anymore.They really wouldn't. I don't. I
mean, I'll swim in the lake, but I'm more afraid of the lamb
prey that are in the lake.They're like these heel type creatures and they
got like around. I don't knowif you've seen them before, but they're
(20:37):
nasty and they will hook on theswimmers too. Because I want to see
what's around me. I don't wantthat. I don't want it. That's
it. Yeah, So there's nodoubt in my mind what's in there.
I mean, I am just Ifeel so privileged to be the voice for
them and for the protection. Anduh, honestly, I don't give a
(20:59):
rats take if anybody believes there's anythingin the lake, because it's one less
idiot that's gonna bother them. That'sjust my opinion. Why do you think
the population of them though, hasn'tgrown well? Where the lake is just
over blood? Do you know whatI mean? Well, you gonna have
you ever been to Lake Champlain?Both you guys, have you been?
(21:21):
Okay? Well, Lake Champlain isone hundred and twenty miles long, four
hundred feet deep. They say itit's deepest there's I beg to differ on
that one because there are some cavesand tunnels. I know a scuba diver
who's seen some crazy things down there. I also dive myself, but I
haven't. I haven't gone in thelake yet for diving. Maybe maybe one
(21:42):
of these days. The visibility canbe quite poor in places, and I
don't really want one sneaking up tome and I'll be like, oh crap,
now what do I do? Butwith a lake that large, you're
not you're not gonna see them likebeing ramped. I think that these animals
know they're primordial. They know whenthere's people around. They got a high
(22:06):
sensitivity of hearing as well. Soboat goes by, They're like, oh,
screw you, I'm going down tothe bottom. That's what they did
on the first sonar image that Igot. Plus they are blackish brown in
color, and there's been many reportsof people thinking that they were going to
hit a log. They're like,oh no, because they're just like stealth
like this. And I think theydo that because they don't want anybody to
know what they are. They're animalslike that. Alligators are the same way
(22:30):
you go out into the swamps.I'm down in Florida and Central Florida and
I've got an airboat and I'm workingon that. That's another project. So
I've gone out and watched alligator behaviorand they'll do the same. They'll just
sit their stealth and then all ofa sudden they might just get a spook
and then take off like a shot. And that's what's happened too with a
(22:51):
lot of the sightings that fishermen areout and they're like, oh crap,
don't hit that log, it's goingto ruin our prop. And the guy
looks over and splash gone. They'relike, holy crap, I thought that
was a log. So they blendright in with their surroundings. They have
a way of camouflage, and animalshave a way. It's just like tree
frogs. When you see them ona white table, they'll turn that white.
(23:14):
It's amazing. M they blend in. Yeah, And if there's if
there's a lot of waves, they'realmost impossible to see. That's why when
it's really windy at the lake,I usually don't bother to be honest.
When it's calm like glass, that'swhen you're gonna get more reports because it's
easier to see them. Do youthink they look like what the drawings are?
(23:36):
You know, you see like thelong neck like a broosaurus from the
you know whatever that dinosaur is.Am I talking? Am I talking Fred
Flintstone or is that a real dinasse? Well, bronosaurs were basically land type,
but you know what I mean,and everything is that what they are?
Are they not pleasi at sore like? Yes, very much so am
(23:56):
I so. On oar images andvideo you can see the long neck in
front of them with appendages. Butwhat's really strange about the appendages is most
people think a pleasant sore which havereally big flippers, and there's been even
on my sonar you can see theappendage moving back and it's basically like a
webbed foot, which is very prominentin crocodiles, alligators, long necked turtles.
(24:19):
There's different species of long neck turtlesand they had it looks like a
flipper, but there's you got thedigits in between and then you have the
webbing all around it. So yeah, that's the one difference between them.
Their neck is basically like a piston. So have you ever seen a soft
shelled turtle like strike at somebody thoughit's crazy, yes, and they have
(24:44):
that ability. That's an ambush predator. So I think for the most part
what they do is they sit onthe bottom when fisher going by and just
like snap, snap, them backbecause in my sonar video and pictures you
can there's like a wrinkle on theback of that one animal's net, like
a couple of wrinkles where he's kindof pulled back like this, So he
(25:07):
could probably extend his neck maybe threefeet even longer than what it looks like
on that. So they're very strange. I don't think they're a pleasiest store.
They're probably related to them, butthe morphology compared to anything in our
known fossil record, they are notquite the same. They have some differences,
so I don't know if it's evolutionaryadaptation where their morphology is changing with
(25:33):
their environment over time. I havea feeling that might be what we're dealing
with, but there's nothing in ourknown fossil record to match them completely.
There's some features the long neck andthat sort of thing, but they're they're
a little they're a little different thanwhat we know of, which is if
we could find a fossil of one, it would just that's one goal that
I hope to find something, evenif they're washed up or anything. We
(25:56):
don't know anything like that, andI think I think the reason for that.
If you you guys ever watch SwampPeople, Oh the Mytory channel,
Jutem judam So And actually I'm friendswith one of the guys that's on the
show, Frenchy Crochet. He hasn'tbeen on the recent season, but I
(26:18):
know Frenchy very well. They whenthey go out there and sometimes they'll they'll
shoot a gator out in open water. And if you ever noticed, as
soon as they shoot the gator,they have to go right to it and
grab it and pull it into theboat because it's gonna sink sink. And
I think with these animals being extremelymuscular, because in my twenty fourteen video
(26:41):
it was analyzed by the Science Channeland biologists were like, what the hell
is this? All they could thinkof was an alligator, and it's like,
well, alligators don't move in verticalundulation. They don't have this quivering
of the skin, which indicates thatthey have a high mass of muscle.
So any animal which is very muchlike an alligator, because they have a
(27:02):
ton of muscle, they're going tosink right to the bottom very quickly.
And in the winter time, Ithink these animals go into a torpora lake
state where they, like the turtles, do some turtles will bury themselves partially
in the mud, are completely slowdown to less than one heartbeat per minute.
So I think during that time it'sgiving the lake time to replenish food.
(27:26):
A lot of people say, isthere enough food Lake Champlain, But
we have over three hundred thousand acresof marshland and these animals have been seen
in the marsh systems, particularly atnight time, with eyeshine which is taped
to moose seed them. So theyI think they're opportunistic feeders. I think
they eat vegetation as well as acarnivorous diet with fish and waterfowl. Interesting.
(27:52):
Yes, they're moving outside of theirenvironment into the swampy area. Yes,
there's been like a lot of apool reports of four toed webbed footprints,
which is another thing that supports thewebbed foot idea. So I've done
a lot of research. Yes,of the water, Yes, across roads,
(28:14):
and that's been seen at locked Nessas well. By the way,
I wasn't Yes, I love cryptids. I'm sorry, but that's a good
question, Christina, because you knowwe call them cryptids. But are they
or are they just animals that wehaven't seen yet. I don't know.
And I think of cryptid, Ithink of paranormal, I think of other
(28:37):
worldly. You know, we talkabout that with Big Four, some more
mythological mythological although Bigfoot, if heexists, is he coming from somewhere else?
Is there? I mean we've heardall every theory in the book,
and you know, to a certainextent, you know, we talk about
lockedness and Champion that way as well. But but maybe they're not. Maybe
(28:57):
they are just real animals. Youknow, they're animals. They're not paranormal.
They're not cryptics, they're not cryptids, they're not mythological, they're just
animals. We don't know enough aboutall. Yeah, well, to think
that we know every single creature andcan identify it is a huge ego.
(29:22):
But I mean think because we don't. I mean, look at the ocean.
We are constantly finding new animals.They're finding you know, new classifications
of fish and things all the timethat we just didn't know about. So
I think it's very very possible.Yeah, that's absolutely true. It's I
(29:44):
mean, there's just so much outthere that we're discovering every year new species.
I mean, there was a aI'm trying to get my fact street
here because I only read a littlebit of the article, but I saw
it briefly on Facebook and then Idid repost it. That was a couple
of weeks ago. There was afossil of a dragon like creature that was
found in Japan and nobody it doesn'tfit into anything in our own fossil record.
(30:10):
So now we have something in thefossil record that's totally different than any
other dinosaur like creature or dragon likecreature, which I found amazing, and
I said, well, see,this is to show we don't know everything.
There's so many layers underneath the groundthat we haven't even begun to explore.
(30:30):
So there's a lot of stuff outthere for sure. And uh,
I mean, I hope one dayI find something like that of a champ
animal because it's like, hello,I told you, I told you this
stuff was here, I mean outand sticks his head out and yeah you
know. So yeah, it's it'sreally fascinating and it definitely keeps me going.
(30:52):
It's it's definitely my passion and whatI love to do. And I
really believe that in the next fewyears, I think there's gonna be a
big revelation because I've already gotten echolocation, so ONAR video, I would
like to get ahead and neck video. The problem with video, though,
is there's so much fakery going on, and I mean, I'm sent it
(31:14):
to the Jet Propulsion Lab at NASAand be like, here, you know,
check this out and tell me.You know, I want to show
that because everything I've gotten has beenstated authentic, and I just take I
take so much pride in that becauseI'm this little, short girl of a
person and the lake is so huge, and when you see a drone footage
(31:37):
of my boat from up above andhow tiny we look, it's like,
holy crap. I mean, it'sjust amazing. It's just crazy. It's
like it's I feel like an antI feel so small, and it's I
think, if you put your mindinto something and you use your heart,
you sky's the limit. It reallyis. And I think, I really
(32:00):
think that something's gonna happen pretty soonwith this. With DNA, I did
do a DNA type of testing witha TV show. The problem is we
don't have anything to go by ina way, because like I said,
so, I'm thinking either reptile oramphibian unknown is probably going to be the
best thing that we're gonna find.It's gonna take a lot of money to
(32:24):
do it. It's something that i'mworking on right now, but I have
a feeling that we're going to getsome really good results with that. Eventually.
I think we need more samples more. I think more than one lab
involved with larger databases with reptiler andamphibian and there are and the difficult part
(32:44):
about reptile and amphibian type of DNAis that it's very hard to detect it.
But I have some connections down herein Florida which is really interesting and
I'm working on this. There's specificways to test for reptile or amphibian DNA,
so I'm working on that. Soit's because they don't shed like snakes
(33:06):
shed like crazy like pythons. They'redoing testing down here on the invasive pythons
in the Everglades. They do shed, but for some reason sometimes they can't
detect that in some of the watersamples. So I'm definitely going in the
right direction with getting together with certainpeople that know how to do the protocol.
(33:27):
Because the last time I did aTV show and they did the testing,
it was during COVID and I thinkthe samples got degraded a little bit
because they didn't know what the heckthey were doing. You're supposed to put
it through a certain F five filterand all these things, and they didn't
know anything about it. And Itold them as soon as as soon as
you get back, like take thewater samples to the hotel and put them
(33:50):
in a freezer because they need tobe frozen right away. And I don't
I have a feeling they didn't doit because the only DNA that they found
was muskelunge, which is a tighta very large fish, kind of like
a pike. That was good though, because they're endangered in Lake Champlain,
so that was kind of a nicething. That shows that they're replenishing,
they're coming back. They didn't theydidn't find otter DNA. They didn't find
(34:16):
waterfowl DNA. So that's stuff that'sin the lake all the time. So
that shows me that it's not right. Yeah, that's gonna be in your
average pool. You're going to exactlyexactly there you go, So they're not
finding it. Now you're in Florida, they're not finding it down there,
meaning meaning you know what we're seeingat Lake Champlain we're not seeing them because
(34:39):
they would compete with some of thegators and things like that. I mean,
I feel like they'd be more obviousif they were in bodies of water.
You know, in Florida, we'reseeing them more like up north.
Where else have you seen them?Well personally, but people I was going
to say, I've only seen champBy. I hate to break it,
(35:00):
Tea. I wish I saw Moragand Nessie and og Pogo. That would
be freaking awesome. But there arelakes across the latitude, the Boreal Force
Belt, so the northern part ofour globe that these animals have been seen.
So you have Lake Okanagan, Lockness, Lake Champlain. Over in Scotland,
(35:22):
there's a ton of locks where there'sbeen some sightings. Locke mor Are
that's another one that I'm going tobe traveling probably in September, to Lochness
and Marat. So Morar is theway you're supposed to say it in Scottish,
and my Scottish friends probably still gonnasay that I didn't say it right,
But Americans say more are things.So there's like tons of these lakes
(35:49):
that have similar creatures in them.I've never been to, but I want
to try some of the protocol thatI've used at Lake Champlain to see if
if I can get at a locationand do a comparison and if we get
something similar, that means they're eitherthe same species or something very closely related.
So it's going to be an adventureto go over there in September and
(36:12):
check out Lockness and Lockmrale. It'sgoing to be really cool. I'm excited.
That is going to be cool.And it's beauty. Have you ever
been Have you ever been there?I hadn't. Then, No, so
beautiful. I've not been to Locknest, but I've been through the locks in
the Highlands and it's just so beautiful. Oh God, I can't wait.
It's going to be great. Andthere's a lot of fairy lore and stuff.
I'm all into the fairy stuff andkill yeah. Yeah, yeah.
(36:37):
We were just talking about the fairiesa little while ago. I was in
a cave in Scotland a couple ofyears ago and it was just really odd
because this cave there are supposedly alot of fairies there and people will come
and leave offerings to the fairies andif you're mean and they follow you home,
and they're not very nice to you. They're not like night. It's
not tinker Belt, you know whatI mean. It's a different kind of
(36:59):
fairy. So I was taking picturesthroughout and you know, I just had
my I just had my cell phone, that's it. And when I went
back and looked at the photos,they were all like this, And then
there was one that was upside down. This guy was at the tree.
You can't take an upside down photowith an iPhone. That's crazy. I
(37:22):
was android here. I'm not sayingit's paranormal. I'm just saying I have
no idea how that happened, becauseall I was doing was snapping like this.
I wasn't you know, I wasn'ttrying to do any acrobat Well,
it's funny because I had a friendfrom Ireland. He passed away a few
years ago, but I remember tellinghim because he was all into the the
(37:44):
water horses, the kelpies is whatthey call these creatures over in Celtic lore,
and he was all into that stuff. And I remember he had told
me a story about his grandfather,his uh no, his uncle, not
his grandfather's uncle, Seamus, andhe lived in County Cavan, Ireland,
and you have to look it upon the map. I think it might
(38:04):
be kind of in the center iswhere he was, because Ireland's huge.
So he was telling me when hewas a child there there was a there
was a tree on the property ofhis uncle Seamus's farm, and he had
told one of the workers not tocut this tree down because there was a
fairy ring around it with the mushrooms, the fairy ring that was going around
(38:29):
this tree. So I guess theguy didn't listen and he cut the tree
down, and like the worst stuffhappened to this guy and his machine,
like his bulldozer machine, whatever theheck it was. It disappeared and they
never found it, like it justwent poof, it was gone. So
when he told me that story,I was like, get the hell out.
(38:50):
And then I started looking into thestories of leprechauns and fairies and the
fairy fa and it was just likethat's happened a lot. So it makes
you wonder what what is out therewith that spiritual realm, that that other
veil that we don't know about that'scoming through It's it's really weird. So
(39:13):
I don't know. He was totallyadamant about this story. And I've heard
similar stories to that afterwards. Sothat was a fun little story that my
friend Jim told me a long timeago. We had a woman on the
show last week who said, andshe she's she's a medium, and you
know, she's she's been to lilyDale and all these other places that are
very spiritual. She claims she's seenthem with her eyes, and I said,
(39:37):
not your mind, not your mind'seye, right, No, like
with my eyes, I've seen them. And you know, the only fairy
I've seen flew out of Cinderella's castleright over the Magic Kingdom. That's it.
That's the only fairy I've ever seen. But I find it. It
was there was a thing a documentarythat I saw some time back and someone
(40:00):
I think it was trying to remember. I think it was near County Cork,
which is I had a little bitIrish background, very very old though,
like a long time ago that Igot in my DNA test that I
got done, and it was Killarneyand County Cork. But someone had found
this little leather shoe out in afield and they're like, oh, maybe
(40:23):
it's a doll shoe. So theyactually I think they sent it to excuse
me, the Smithsonian or somewhere likethat, and they had it like put
under a microscope and it was likebetter than what a cobbler would do,
Like it wasn't a doll shoe.And they were like, what the hell?
And I don't know where that rangeto, yeah, exactly, And
(40:44):
they think they tested and they saidit was made out of mouse skin,
So I was like, what thehell? So that was really freaky.
Yeah, I could send you thelink to that later. It was really
really weird. And I'm like,and I learned that when I was a
kid. I read about that ina book and I thought maybe it was
bogus, And then I happened tosee it on a documentary not too long
(41:04):
ago and confirm that it was.It was a real thing that happened.
And the family of the guy,I don't know who the gentleman's name was,
but they still have the shoe,but nobody really talks about it.
And that's all I know. It'skind of a secret to wear it is
I like to see it because that'scrazy. It's crazy. So do you
do you think it? You know, sort of getting back to our topic.
(41:27):
But do you think that let's sayBigfoot as an example, and I
know, I don't know that you'vedone a lot with that. You know,
sasquatches and Bigfoot. Do you feelthat they're the same When I say
the same, obviously they're not.They're not the same animal but the same
situation. But they're just animal ordo you think there's a paranormal component to
the bigfoit and sasquatches. I thinkwith champ and Bigfoot, I think that
(41:55):
there's sort of a protective bubble aroundthem. I believe that they're basically biological.
But what's really interesting about the latecreatures and also the sasquatch is that
the Native Americans they have this thing. Well, first of all, with
Native Americans there, I've been arounda lot of I've got a lot of
(42:16):
Native friends, and they were seeingreal creatures. They're not making this stuff
up. And what's really interesting withthe water horses and the kelpies, and
then you have that's in Celtic lore. Then you have the horned serpents here
with the Native Americans. Then youhave the hippocampus, which is Roman and
(42:36):
Greek mythology. Then you have theScandinavians who have these serpents in the front
of their ship. These people didn'tknow each other, so to me,
they were seeing real animals. Imean, as a person who's seen the
Champ animals myself and gutting the datathat I have, it's like, holy
crap, Like these animals are allover the place. Probably not as populated
(42:59):
as they were at the time,I'm sure, but with Bigfoot and also
the late creatures, I think thatthey're biological, but I think that there
is some sort of protection around themfrom the Native Americans in a way.
Because when I had gotten my sonarimages, it was really crazy. Because
my friend Frank passed away a fewyears ago. He had he had a
(43:23):
sighting back in nineteen eighty of oneon the beach, and that's how I
met him. I was over ata Champ event and he came up to
me and says, I got totell you about my sighting because I've never
told anybody about this. So that'show him and I became friends. And
he was part Cherokee Natives. Sowhen we went out to do research,
(43:43):
he said, well I asked him. I said, hey, can you
do me a big favor? Canyou take the stage out and do like
a blessing because anytime around Lake Champlain, the Abenaki and the Iroquois would throw
out tobacco and do a blessing toappease the creatures, to allow them a
safe passage. So I said,well, they're probably something to this.
(44:05):
I really believe in the native stuff, so I said, let's let's do
some little ceremony. So we did, and that's when we get the sonar
and I was like, holy crap. It was like it broke that bubble,
that protective bubble, because the nativessay that the chant animals were created
by the creator to protect Lake Champlainand only those who will not do them
(44:25):
harm will see them. And I'mabout, like you did were to hurt
you. Yeah, And that's whatI think is the spiritual aspect. I
don't think that they're that they're paranormalper se, but there's definitely something around
them and they I think that becauseI have that respect for nature and have
(44:49):
that respect for them, that I'vebeen damn lucky with what I've gotten,
that's for sure. Yeah, it'spretty amazing, but you know, it's
a lot like you know, Christina, I mean we talk about this lot,
right, And I think it's theintention, and I think some way
the universe knows who you are andwhat you're all about. I have I
(45:10):
for the I mean, look,we watch all these ghost hunting shows,
right, and they go and theytry to get an e VP on something,
and you know, you listen toit and you're like, Okay,
well this sort of sounds like thatmaybe yeah, And then they come through
on my radio show and say,Hi, Scott, we've had that happen.
They do have crazy. I getmessages coming through the radio through the
(45:36):
radio show that are as clear asyou talking to me today. I can
put Indiana, we heard your namehow many times? All the time,
all the time when I was doingmy paranormal work and stuff. There's some
episodes on YouTube that I can send. And the other team members they were
(45:57):
a lot older than me, andthey I kind of thought maybe I was
hearing stuff that they weren't because Iwas younger. Because of mosquito tone.
The mosquito tone thing where higher frequencyyounger people can hear it, but older
people can't. I can still hearthe same mosquito tone. I was twenty
eight years old when this happened.I'm thirty eight, so it's really weird.
(46:17):
But what's really interesting about it iswe were getting EVPs that they weren't
hearing but I was hearing. Andthen when we played back the recording,
there it is. And those arestill on YouTube, which is crazy.
So I'll send you the link tothose. And it was really creepy though,
because it was like anytime we goanywhere, they'd be like they would
(46:39):
get something Katie or Hi Katie,Hey, and I'm like, no,
why does it have to be me? And it's just I just think they
just know they know that the noI think when you have a true heart,
they're right there and they're like,hey, this is someone I can
talk to. So if you knowthat, they know who can who will
be able to understand them, hearthem, and and and believe that it's
(47:06):
them and not just you know,there's some people that just in no way,
you know what I mean, There'sno way. And I feel like
this is more energetic, just thesame way children and animals will just run
to certain people they know not tofear them, they know they're a safe
person. They can feel that thatThat's kind of where my brain goes with
(47:28):
this, Oh it happens to me. I'm like an animal and kid magnet.
I'm like, what the heck.It's like some kid in the grocery
store just comes up and hangs onto my leg. I'm like, what
do I do? You know there'ssome animal that's some dog that's running down
the street that somebody lost. It'sit's I used to have like dogs show
up at my house, Like whythe hell are they coming in my house?
So they know? So there yougo. See totally, I totally
(47:52):
believe that because they feel energy somuch more than we do. I mean,
they put us to shame that theyknow how you feel, they know
all your emotions, they know agood person from someone that's not so good.
They just exactly that. Yeah,and I and I think there's a
certain amount of that that goes onin any of this kind of work that
(48:15):
we do. I mean, Idon't know that you know any of these
champions under the ocean or under thesea, under the lake, trust or
religionally, they were originally from thesea, so you're not you're not far
off because it was Plaine was thearm of the ocean ten thousand plus years
ago, so it was the ChamplaineSea. See I've heard a theory that
(48:37):
all of these creatures similar to Champyand you know, NeSSI, et cetera,
that you know, water did coverso much of the earth and all
of these bodies of water were connectedand that that's how they ended up in
all of these deep lakes. Yeah. Absolutely, I mean with Cross,
(49:00):
I mean we have remnants of ancientspecies that are still in Lake Champlain as
well. We have the bouf andthe gar and the sturgeon. They go
back one hundred plus million years andthey're still there. So it's like,
how the hell can anybody say like, oh, they're can't They're totally impossible.
Well, why are they still there? Then why are the bouf and
(49:20):
garn sturgeons still there? And thenyou think about crocodiles, alligators, snapping
turtles, We've got komodo dragons.There's all kinds of reptile and amphibian species
that are primordial that have been heresince the mass extinction because they could go
into freshwater estuaries and they survive thekt extinction. So it's like, why
(49:45):
is it so far fetched for afifteen to thirty foot long creature, a
population of them, with the crocodilesand alligators and all the things that are
still here on this planet today,Why is that possible? They think of
this big whale thing that's one hundredfeet long and it's gonna eat people,
and it's just ridiculous. So yougotta think of it in logical terms,
(50:07):
which is all they are. They'renot monsters. We are the monsters.
We're the ones that destroy our planet, destroy everything, and they they're more
afraid of us than we are ofthem. And you know, it's just
the metaphor the fun of it.I guess that's it. The reality is,
(50:30):
I don't I don't think that theyare. I think they're just undiscovered.
Yeah, I mean there's been likeany stories of people getting a chunk
taken out of their behind or anythinglike that. So attacks from these kinds
of creatures, I mean there's beensome run from us. Yeah, they
do. There's been some accounts inlike Russia, like, oh god,
(50:52):
how do I pronounce it? Labbitner? I can't remember. I'm not
Russian, so I'm not good withthat. But there's been some reports of
that creature running ramming boats and stufflike that. I don't know how true
they are. I have no idea. But for the most part, I
mean, there's been some reports ofpeople running into a champ animal and then
(51:14):
they just dive down they're gone,But nothing really aggressive except for a Russia.
I don't know. I don't knowif it's just they like to party
with too much vodka and they justsay everything's attacking them. I have no
idea. Let me say this,speaking of Russian, We're gonna need to
because the show, we only haveanother two and a half minutes left,
so we need to start rushing.It's always a fix. It's always a
(51:39):
fast hour. It's not really anhour, it's fifty four minutes. It's
what we go. So they've gotlike two minutes left, and so tell
us a little bit your website.We've been scrolling across the bottom of the
page. What are people going tofind there? What will they learn about
you and your work? Will theybe able to see any of your evidence
there? Yeah? I actually havesome some of the sonar images and video
(52:05):
post it on the page. Ifyou go to our evidence page, you
can learn a lot about that stuff. I'm still kind of working. I'm
not that great at keeping up withthe main website. I'm good at Facebook.
I'm always on Facebook, as youknow, so Champ search on Facebook.
I have several pages. I'm alsothe president and founder of the International
Dragontology Not Dragon with the g's grAco and T. L Oguy. It's
(52:32):
a study of late creatures and soInternational Dragontology Alliance is another Facebook page,
and Katie Elizabeth Cryptozoologists is another page, and then my personal page Katie Elizabeth.
But those pages are where I putlike my everyday videos when I go
(52:52):
out on the lake, the livestuff where people can keep up on my
research vessel KELPI two where I havemy hydrophone system, my sonar, my
underwater cameras and we do some livevideos and stuff like that which people love
to see. So June, July, August is the best time for Champ.
So that's usually when my live videosare going and I have all kinds
(53:15):
of stuff going on there. Butmy website, my main website with some
of the evidence that I've captured,is www dot Katielizabeth dot org, so
they can check that out. I'mcoming I'm coming out with another book,
so I've got on one second,Katie, I'm gonna I'm gonna have to
have you back on to talk aboutthis. We have actually come to the
(53:37):
end of our time. They giveus a heart, we can put it
in that, we can put itin the bio. At the end,
thank you for being, thank youfor joining us, and we'll see you
next time on the show. Havea good night, everybody you've been listening
to. Thank you so much.The Project Radio Show with Scott Island and
Christina Bowen. Be sure to subscribeso you don't miss the next episode.
(54:04):
While you're there, leave us arating and review. We'll be back next
week with more exciting guests. Now, go out there and explore the paranormal
The Paranormal Project Radio Show. Hereare your hosts, Scott Allen and Christina
(00:38):
Bowen. Hello everyone, and welcomeback to another episode of The Paranormal Project
Radio Show. I am your host, Scott Allen and I'm here with my
lovely co host, Christina Bowen.How are you, my friend? I
am fabulous, cool but fabulous.Yeah, you know. I mean people
(00:59):
probably won't know, but it wassnowing the last time we did a show
together, and that's because it wasabout an hour ago we put This show
is recorded as well. This istwo in one day. But we've got
a lot of travels coming up,don't we We do, we do.
I'm excited about it. Just tryingto have some things. So the next
week we're at the Lone Star paracon and then we are We're going to
(01:26):
be in New Orleans together, goingto Naples. There's a lot of stuff
going on. So it's good tohave a few of these shows that we
can plug in and so and soI'm excited to be here and to have
this opportunity to meet with our guests. Now you've heard of the Lockness Monster
in Scotland, but today we're goingto talk about the Monster of Lake Champlain
(01:53):
Champion. I'm excited to hear this. Yeah, now I am too,
because we have our own and Ifeel like multiple talk to our guests about
this, but I feel like peopledon't talk about Champion as much as they
talk about Locknant. I think Locknestseems to be a little more notorious.
But we're gonna bring We're gonna We'regonna change that tonight because I really am
interested to see what this is allabout and what kind of evidence she's had.
(02:16):
So our guest is probably the mostwell known champion researcher anywhere around,
so I'm going to bring her out. Katie Elizabeth, Welcome to the show.
How are you hi? Good guys, how you doing? I got
my cat here as he was hoggingthe thing earlier. He wants all the
(02:37):
attention. But they're good, they'regood. We've had a bunch of pets
on the show, so they justkind of like walk around into it.
Yeah, what do you see?Christina has this, you know, one
hundred and fifty pound German shepherd thatsometimes walk a sensitive about his weight.
But are we all aren't we alljust call him a large boy? Yeah?
(03:04):
Katie, how did you get involvedwith studying and researching Champ. Oh
God, it was a long timeago. I'm thirty eight now. I
know in the future I'm probably notgoing to reveal my age anymore after this.
But when I was, when Iwas seven years old, is when
I started my fascination with Champ andother late creatures as well. I was
(03:24):
watching an episode of Unsolved Mysteries thatwas hosted by the great Robert Stack back
in that time. He was theabsolute best. I mean, no one
will ever replace him, as Imean David Dennis Farina, excuse me,
Dennis Farina was very good too,but something about Robert Stack that just made
the program. So I was watchingthat and I saw the famous Sandermncy photo
(03:47):
that was taken in nineteen seventy sevenof this long neck twisted around at the
side, and I was totally fascinated, and I yelled to my mom,
Mom, I want to go seethis late creature, this dinosaur of sorts,
and she was like, what inthe world are you watching? So
I said, can we go?Can we go? And I knew it
(04:09):
was in New England, and Ilived in Rhode Island in the Ocean State
at the time, so I pulledout the old Rand McNally map before we
had GPS, and I kind ofestimated that it would be about four and
a half five hours. And mymom never really liked to bring me many
places back that I mean, wewent to Massachusetts and Connecticut and we didn't
(04:30):
even go to Maine at that point. Like, my mom didn't like to
drive far and she worked a lottoo, So I'll give her that credit
because if she watches that, she'sgonna shoot me because I'm dissinger a little
bit. But yeah, that's whatstarted my fascination with Champs. So I
went to my library at school andtried to find every book that I could
on NeSSI on Champ and I didfind a couple of books. One was
(04:53):
A Champ Beyond the Legend by JosephZarzinski, a former Champ researcher, and
the other one, I'm trying toremember. It was a lot in this
book. I think it was byTim Dinsdale, who was one of my
idols. Great guy and very handson, very much how I am today
with the field research because we havea lot of armchair researchers, which are
really great because they're really good atcollecting the reports and getting them out there
(05:18):
and that sort of thing. Butthe fuel work is my passion because I
believe that in order to make newdiscoveries, you have to put your boots
on the ground and get out thereand do the hard work, or else
you're going to rehash the same stuff. Themancy photo. How many times can
you rehash that over and over?So that's how I got started, And
(05:39):
then in twenty twelve, I wasactually working for a paranormal group at the
time, and I as much asI love the parent noormal, I don't
deal with it anymore because I've hada lot of things that had followed me
home and not the greatest experiences attimes because I'm very expensive, so I
kind of gave up on that.I mean, I might still a little
(06:00):
bit, but I'm very careful.So at the time, my friends were
like, let's go on a tripsomewhere different, and I'm like, well,
let's go to Lake Champlain because it'sa place I always wanted to go.
And as soon as I got outof that car, I had tears
in my eyes because I felt likeI was home. It was the weirdest
thing. So that's how I gotstarted, and actually my second day there,
(06:23):
I had my first encounter of somethingI could not explain out in the
bay. So it was really weirdbecause I'm thinking, what are the chances
of me seeing something right off thebat on my trip, because people spent
a lifetime there and never seen anything, So it was really weird to me,
and I just I was looking outat the bay and there was a
(06:45):
sailboat moored in the background to usefor scale size. I saw this black
thing rise to the surface of thewater and it went very casually from left
to right. And growing up inthe Ocean State, my dad was a
fisherman, so I was very familiarwood seeing whales and dolphins and all types
of phenomenon that are natural logs,floating otters and stuff like that. Boat
(07:08):
wakes is a very common thing thata lot of people think they're seeing a
lake monster, and it's just boatwakes. So when I saw this thing,
I was just in total awe.I had a couple of friends with
me that were in the background eatingtheir breakfast, and they were like,
oh, that's cool, Like theyweren't even interested because they wanted to go
out to look for Bigfoot and Iwanted to look for champs. So they
(07:31):
were just I don't know, theyhad no interest in it whatsoever. But
one of my friends that was withme at the time, he was sitting
with me and he witnessed it aswell. So I ran to the car
to get my camera because I didn'thave my camera on hand because I didn't
think I was going to see anythingthe second day there, I mean,
come on. So I ran atmy camera and then it was gone,
and I was just like so angryabout it, and I said, you
(07:56):
know, this is it. Thisis where I'm going to start getting my
own equipment going. I actually hadbuilt a hydrophone system kind of with a
Pisio mic at the time, andI put it in a PBC pipe and
I used JB. Weld to goaround. I did all kinds of stuff.
I kind of everything was what wouldyou use that for for? Hydrophone?
(08:22):
Hydrophone hydrophone is underwater recording system thatrecords underwater sounds. They use it
for cetacean research with whales and dolphins. You can also use it for listening
for any type of seismic activity withearthquakes and stuff like that. Very very
sensitive microphone. So I built myown little jury rigged microphone. At the
(08:45):
time, I didn't get anything itkind of it kind of I looked back
at it and it sucked, buthey, it was an idea and I
was trying to maguiver it at thetime. Yeah, so that's how I
got started. And then because thatI truly know this for a fact,
when you see something that you can'texplain and you have that I've always had
(09:07):
a passion for mysteries anyway, eversince I was a little girl, I've
had I've had paranormal experiences. Idon't really talk about it much now because
I'm in the cryptid field now,but I've had some really strange things happen.
When I was really little, welived in a house that was haunted
for quite some time, and Idon't know. I just think that when
(09:28):
you have an open mind like that, these things seem to gravitate towards you
for sure. And I think it'sbecause some people they don't have blinders on.
They have a whole range all aroundthem, eyes behind their head,
I always say, and I'm oneof those types of people. I noticed
the damnedest things that other people's don'tthey don't notice. They're like, how
the hell did you see that?So that's just my nature, I guess.
(09:52):
So what if you discovered, youknow, what is the biggest aha
thing that you've learned from your ownyour own research. I mean, there's
a few things that I've gathered overthe last eleven years. What's really interesting.
We captured echolocation multiple times in LakeChamplain. The echolocation was the first,
(10:18):
basically the first thing that I hadcaptured in a slew of things.
And when that happened, I hadheard before that there was echo location recorded
there, and I had worked witha woman named Elizabeth von Mugginhaler that was
on quite a few Discovery Channel programswhere she had recorded echolocation in the lake.
(10:39):
And then, okay, echolocation isbasically instead of man made sonar or
electronically made. So if you're ina boat and you have a fish finder,
it's putting out a beam of soundand when that beam of sound hits
an object, say a school offish or a rock or something, it
bounces back induces an image. Socetations that we know today they use echolocation.
(11:05):
Whales and dolphins to navigate the areasto find. Basically, it's a
mental picture. They don't need eyesight, they just use this echo location.
So they put this beam of soundout, it bounces back and produces a
mental image for them. Uh.And they use that too for navigation as
well as finding food. So that'secho that's basically what that is. So
(11:30):
during echolocation they make certain clicking noises. So if you're listening to a type
of fish finder, which is kindof the same sonar, you'll hear a
constant tick tick tick tick. It'snot a tick tick tick tick tick.
It sounds like a clock. It'sjust a constant beat in between. With
echo location, it doesn't work thatway. You're gonna hear variables up and
(11:54):
down because they're they're distributing it outin like a certain pattern to cover all
bases versus a regular sonar. That'sjust a constant mechanical ticking. So it's
the sound that we had gotten,and that was twenty fourteen. It was
very similar to what she had gotten, So I was like, Wow,
(12:16):
I'm really onto something here. SoI've gotten probably at least fifteen echo location
recordings, I'm guessing because I've gota hard drive external hard drive that's full
of stuff that I haven't even like, I've heard weird things like Okay,
this one's cool, but it's alittle Muffuy, I'm gonna use the best
(12:39):
ones that I got or whatever.So I'm very picky with what I present
to the public because I'm very analyticalminded as a person. So the video
that I captured in twenty fourteen ofa Champ animal crossing Button Bay, I
had gotten that and that when Ipresented. I've got some other videos that
were kind of strange, like disturbancesand stuff that weren't boat wakes or anything,
(13:01):
but they weren't good enough for meto put out there and say positively,
this is a Champ creature. Sothere really isn't. I mean,
really, the aha moment for whatI've gotten, I would say, is
the sonar pictures and sonar video thatI've captured. I mean, the other
stuff is just as great, butit was something totally different. Like I
(13:24):
got so spoiled with getting the echolocation recordings. It was just like hearing
a dog barking down the street tome, like it's, oh, there
they are again. So the sonarwas interesting because I always said that I
wouldn't really try it because I believethat it's very invasive to the hearing because
animals that echo locate have that highsensitivity of hearing range. But with people
(13:48):
fishing the lake all the time,they have fishing derbies with hundreds of boats
around, they're really used to it, so it's really not as invasive to
them as it could be. Ifpeople just showed up all of a sudden
in a lake that there wasn't anybodyusing fish finders, then that would be
kind of a different story. SoI mean, yeah, I think it
(14:09):
is very, very bothering to theirears, but they're getting an immunity to
it, so there's no doubt inyour mind that they exist, no doubt
my mind, I wouldn't. I'mthe type of person if I stick in
something this long, I'm not abeliever. I'm a knower, there's no
(14:30):
and I'm a very If you talkto some of the people that know me
for a really long time, they'relike, this girl is no bs.
She is just a straight shooter.Sometimes it gets me in trouble because of
my mouth. I just I tellthe way it is and it's but I
mean, in one way, Ican get myself in trouble being like that.
But in another way, I takepride in what I do and I've
(14:52):
spent so much time, so muchmoney, so much effort in doing this
study, and I've gotten results becauseI believe when you're dedicated to the things
and you use this, you useyour heart to do it, good things
are going to come to you.And my idea with the Champ animals is
(15:13):
my biggest goal is protection because theseanimals obviously are not in every lake.
There's other lakes around the world thathave similar creatures, if not the same,
I don't know yet. I'm doinga study on that as well as
some comparisons. But I think themost important thing is the protection. So
in twenty nineteen, I wrote alaw of protection for the Champ animals and
(15:35):
it was passed unanimously. So thatwas amazing New York State law, and
I was like, wow, Igotta say I've done some really cool stuff
in my life, but I thinkthat was the biggest thing. Yeah,
thank you, I appreciate that.Now you think, I mean, your
belief is that there is more thanone. Absolutely, without a doubt,
it's not a one creature called Champor champion. It's a it's a whole
(16:02):
breed of them, a whole bunchabsolutely. I mean, here's the thing
with my echolocation, there's many andnot just echolocation. I've also gotten ultralow
frequency sounds of communications between I don'tknow what they mean. That's the thing
with bioacoustics studies of whales and dolphins, for instance, or even alligators.
(16:22):
They're starting to learn that alligators communicateunderwater, which is something that bioacousticians never
new. So the study with bioacousticsunderwater in particular are just the tip of
the iceberg. They're starting to figurethis stuff out. So with those sounds,
I don't know if it's for breedingpurposes territorial reasons. Some of them
(16:45):
are ultra low frequency, and inwater, when you have ultralow frequency,
the sound travels further in water,especially salt water, which we don't have
a Lake Champlaine. What's really interestingis when I've done some bioacoustic studies out
in the North Atlantic and down herein off the coast of Florida too,
(17:06):
with whales and dolphins, it's justit's really cool because I can hear for
like I would say a ten mileradius versus four or five in Lake Champlain
because it's salt water, so Ican hear so much further. And I'm
like, why can't we have saltwater where the lake is? You know,
it could be the Champlain Sea againand I could hear more. So
I go in certain places where therehave been sightings and I sit and I
(17:30):
listen and it. You know,I love what I do. But sometimes
watching for these animals to pop upor get any sort of sound is like
watching paint dry. It really is. But the scenery is so worth it.
It's beautiful. It's such a peaceof mind and meditation for me as
well. Why do you think they'reso scarce? Why don't you more people
see them? If the lake isactive, oats and people, Well,
(17:55):
if you look at how do Iput this? Okay? First off,
people are looking for one hundred footlong creature. These animals average size is
fifteen to twenty five feet. I'veheard of some specimens up to thirty five.
One of the ones that I capturedam I sownar images from twenty nineteen.
I would say she's around thirty tothirty five. She is enormous and
(18:18):
with reptiles. Now I believe theseanimals are ectothermic, whether reptile are amphibians.
So with ectotherms, we are ashumans are endothermic. So we can
sustain our innercore temperature and we cando that on our own, but reptiles
and amphibians they cannot. So whenthe water is below fifty degrees fahrenheit,
(18:41):
that's when the sightings start to plummet, which I find interesting. Plus some
people say, well, maybe it'sbecause there's not any trusts on the lake.
The tourism compared to lock ness isnot the same. You hardly see
anything about Champ around the lake.It's the weirdest thing. It's not that
popular. Over the last ten twelveyears that I've been doing this, though,
(19:03):
I've brought so much awareness about Champs. So now it's starting to go
a little a little bit more haywire, and there's a little bit more attention
to it because of the echo location, the sonar and the video. But
it's I mean, how do Iput it. People are looking for this
one hundred ful long thing like awhale, and they're not that large.
There are reports from the eighteen hundredsthat these animals were one hundred plus feet.
(19:27):
But my theory is that I thinkthey move in pairs because I've gotten
these this I belly it's the sametoo in this area. So you add
thirty feet thirty five feet plus twentytwenty five feet, that's that would look
like one massive creature because they swimlike diagonally next to each other. And
(19:48):
I've got them on the bottom ofthe lake. And then three weeks later
when I went back, those weregone because there were some people that are
like maybe their logs and all thisstuff, and I said, okay,
well I'll go back to try todebunk it and see if those logs are
still there. Well, the logsweren't there. Uh, they were gone,
audios. And then further up thelake as I went, they were
swimming under my boat and I gotthem underneath the boat. So it's just
(20:14):
crazy. I could I cry everytime I talk about this stuff, because
if if only people knew what's outthere, that they would just they wouldn't
go swimming in the lake anymore.They really wouldn't. I don't. I
mean, I'll swim in the lake, but I'm more afraid of the lamb
prey that are in the lake.They're like these heel type creatures and they
got like around. I don't knowif you've seen them before, but they're
(20:37):
nasty and they will hook on theswimmers too. Because I want to see
what's around me. I don't wantthat. I don't want it. That's
it. Yeah, So there's nodoubt in my mind what's in there.
I mean, I am just Ifeel so privileged to be the voice for
them and for the protection. Anduh, honestly, I don't give a
(20:59):
rats take if anybody believes there's anythingin the lake, because it's one less
idiot that's gonna bother them. That'sjust my opinion. Why do you think
the population of them though, hasn'tgrown well? Where the lake is just
over blood? Do you know whatI mean? Well, you gonna have
you ever been to Lake Champlain?Both you guys, have you been?
(21:21):
Okay? Well, Lake Champlain isone hundred and twenty miles long, four
hundred feet deep. They say itit's deepest there's I beg to differ on
that one because there are some cavesand tunnels. I know a scuba diver
who's seen some crazy things down there. I also dive myself, but I
haven't. I haven't gone in thelake yet for diving. Maybe maybe one
(21:42):
of these days. The visibility canbe quite poor in places, and I
don't really want one sneaking up tome and I'll be like, oh crap,
now what do I do? Butwith a lake that large, you're
not you're not gonna see them likebeing ramped. I think that these animals
know they're primordial. They know whenthere's people around. They got a high
(22:06):
sensitivity of hearing as well. Soboat goes by, They're like, oh,
screw you, I'm going down tothe bottom. That's what they did
on the first sonar image that Igot. Plus they are blackish brown in
color, and there's been many reportsof people thinking that they were going to
hit a log. They're like,oh no, because they're just like stealth
like this. And I think theydo that because they don't want anybody to
know what they are. They're animalslike that. Alligators are the same way
(22:30):
you go out into the swamps.I'm down in Florida and Central Florida and
I've got an airboat and I'm workingon that. That's another project. So
I've gone out and watched alligator behaviorand they'll do the same. They'll just
sit their stealth and then all ofa sudden they might just get a spook
and then take off like a shot. And that's what's happened too with a
(22:51):
lot of the sightings that fishermen areout and they're like, oh crap,
don't hit that log, it's goingto ruin our prop. And the guy
looks over and splash gone. They'relike, holy crap, I thought that
was a log. So they blendright in with their surroundings. They have
a way of camouflage, and animalshave a way. It's just like tree
frogs. When you see them ona white table, they'll turn that white.
(23:14):
It's amazing. M they blend in. Yeah, And if there's if
there's a lot of waves, they'realmost impossible to see. That's why when
it's really windy at the lake,I usually don't bother to be honest.
When it's calm like glass, that'swhen you're gonna get more reports because it's
easier to see them. Do youthink they look like what the drawings are?
(23:36):
You know, you see like thelong neck like a broosaurus from the
you know whatever that dinosaur is.Am I talking? Am I talking Fred
Flintstone or is that a real dinasse? Well, bronosaurs were basically land type,
but you know what I mean,and everything is that what they are?
Are they not pleasi at sore like? Yes, very much so am
(23:56):
I so. On oar images andvideo you can see the long neck in
front of them with appendages. Butwhat's really strange about the appendages is most
people think a pleasant sore which havereally big flippers, and there's been even
on my sonar you can see theappendage moving back and it's basically like a
webbed foot, which is very prominentin crocodiles, alligators, long necked turtles.
(24:19):
There's different species of long neck turtlesand they had it looks like a
flipper, but there's you got thedigits in between and then you have the
webbing all around it. So yeah, that's the one difference between them.
Their neck is basically like a piston. So have you ever seen a soft
shelled turtle like strike at somebody thoughit's crazy, yes, and they have
(24:44):
that ability. That's an ambush predator. So I think for the most part
what they do is they sit onthe bottom when fisher going by and just
like snap, snap, them backbecause in my sonar video and pictures you
can there's like a wrinkle on theback of that one animal's net, like
a couple of wrinkles where he's kindof pulled back like this, So he
(25:07):
could probably extend his neck maybe threefeet even longer than what it looks like
on that. So they're very strange. I don't think they're a pleasiest store.
They're probably related to them, butthe morphology compared to anything in our
known fossil record, they are notquite the same. They have some differences,
so I don't know if it's evolutionaryadaptation where their morphology is changing with
(25:33):
their environment over time. I havea feeling that might be what we're dealing
with, but there's nothing in ourknown fossil record to match them completely.
There's some features the long neck andthat sort of thing, but they're they're
a little they're a little different thanwhat we know of, which is if
we could find a fossil of one, it would just that's one goal that
I hope to find something, evenif they're washed up or anything. We
(25:56):
don't know anything like that, andI think I think the reason for that.
If you you guys ever watch SwampPeople, Oh the Mytory channel,
Jutem judam So And actually I'm friendswith one of the guys that's on the
show, Frenchy Crochet. He hasn'tbeen on the recent season, but I
(26:18):
know Frenchy very well. They whenthey go out there and sometimes they'll they'll
shoot a gator out in open water. And if you ever noticed, as
soon as they shoot the gator,they have to go right to it and
grab it and pull it into theboat because it's gonna sink sink. And
I think with these animals being extremelymuscular, because in my twenty fourteen video
(26:41):
it was analyzed by the Science Channeland biologists were like, what the hell
is this? All they could thinkof was an alligator, and it's like,
well, alligators don't move in verticalundulation. They don't have this quivering
of the skin, which indicates thatthey have a high mass of muscle.
So any animal which is very muchlike an alligator, because they have a
(27:02):
ton of muscle, they're going tosink right to the bottom very quickly.
And in the winter time, Ithink these animals go into a torpora lake
state where they, like the turtles, do some turtles will bury themselves partially
in the mud, are completely slowdown to less than one heartbeat per minute.
So I think during that time it'sgiving the lake time to replenish food.
(27:26):
A lot of people say, isthere enough food Lake Champlain, But
we have over three hundred thousand acresof marshland and these animals have been seen
in the marsh systems, particularly atnight time, with eyeshine which is taped
to moose seed them. So theyI think they're opportunistic feeders. I think
they eat vegetation as well as acarnivorous diet with fish and waterfowl. Interesting.
(27:52):
Yes, they're moving outside of theirenvironment into the swampy area. Yes,
there's been like a lot of apool reports of four toed webbed footprints,
which is another thing that supports thewebbed foot idea. So I've done
a lot of research. Yes,of the water, Yes, across roads,
(28:14):
and that's been seen at locked Nessas well. By the way,
I wasn't Yes, I love cryptids. I'm sorry, but that's a good
question, Christina, because you knowwe call them cryptids. But are they
or are they just animals that wehaven't seen yet. I don't know.
And I think of cryptid, Ithink of paranormal, I think of other
(28:37):
worldly. You know, we talkabout that with Big Four, some more
mythological mythological although Bigfoot, if heexists, is he coming from somewhere else?
Is there? I mean we've heardall every theory in the book,
and you know, to a certainextent, you know, we talk about
lockedness and Champion that way as well. But but maybe they're not. Maybe
(28:57):
they are just real animals. Youknow, they're animals. They're not paranormal.
They're not cryptics, they're not cryptids, they're not mythological, they're just
animals. We don't know enough aboutall. Yeah, well, to think
that we know every single creature andcan identify it is a huge ego.
(29:22):
But I mean think because we don't. I mean, look at the ocean.
We are constantly finding new animals.They're finding you know, new classifications
of fish and things all the timethat we just didn't know about. So
I think it's very very possible.Yeah, that's absolutely true. It's I
(29:44):
mean, there's just so much outthere that we're discovering every year new species.
I mean, there was a aI'm trying to get my fact street
here because I only read a littlebit of the article, but I saw
it briefly on Facebook and then Idid repost it. That was a couple
of weeks ago. There was afossil of a dragon like creature that was
found in Japan and nobody it doesn'tfit into anything in our own fossil record.
(30:10):
So now we have something in thefossil record that's totally different than any
other dinosaur like creature or dragon likecreature, which I found amazing, and
I said, well, see,this is to show we don't know everything.
There's so many layers underneath the groundthat we haven't even begun to explore.
(30:30):
So there's a lot of stuff outthere for sure. And uh,
I mean, I hope one dayI find something like that of a champ
animal because it's like, hello,I told you, I told you this
stuff was here, I mean outand sticks his head out and yeah you
know. So yeah, it's it'sreally fascinating and it definitely keeps me going.
(30:52):
It's it's definitely my passion and whatI love to do. And I
really believe that in the next fewyears, I think there's gonna be a
big revelation because I've already gotten echolocation, so ONAR video, I would
like to get ahead and neck video. The problem with video, though,
is there's so much fakery going on, and I mean, I'm sent it
(31:14):
to the Jet Propulsion Lab at NASAand be like, here, you know,
check this out and tell me.You know, I want to show
that because everything I've gotten has beenstated authentic, and I just take I
take so much pride in that becauseI'm this little, short girl of a
person and the lake is so huge, and when you see a drone footage
(31:37):
of my boat from up above andhow tiny we look, it's like,
holy crap. I mean, it'sjust amazing. It's just crazy. It's
like it's I feel like an antI feel so small, and it's I
think, if you put your mindinto something and you use your heart,
you sky's the limit. It reallyis. And I think, I really
(32:00):
think that something's gonna happen pretty soonwith this. With DNA, I did
do a DNA type of testing witha TV show. The problem is we
don't have anything to go by ina way, because like I said,
so, I'm thinking either reptile oramphibian unknown is probably going to be the
best thing that we're gonna find.It's gonna take a lot of money to
(32:24):
do it. It's something that i'mworking on right now, but I have
a feeling that we're going to getsome really good results with that. Eventually.
I think we need more samples more. I think more than one lab
involved with larger databases with reptiler andamphibian and there are and the difficult part
(32:44):
about reptile and amphibian type of DNAis that it's very hard to detect it.
But I have some connections down herein Florida which is really interesting and
I'm working on this. There's specificways to test for reptile or amphibian DNA,
so I'm working on that. Soit's because they don't shed like snakes
(33:06):
shed like crazy like pythons. They'redoing testing down here on the invasive pythons
in the Everglades. They do shed, but for some reason sometimes they can't
detect that in some of the watersamples. So I'm definitely going in the
right direction with getting together with certainpeople that know how to do the protocol.
(33:27):
Because the last time I did aTV show and they did the testing,
it was during COVID and I thinkthe samples got degraded a little bit
because they didn't know what the heckthey were doing. You're supposed to put
it through a certain F five filterand all these things, and they didn't
know anything about it. And Itold them as soon as as soon as
you get back, like take thewater samples to the hotel and put them
(33:50):
in a freezer because they need tobe frozen right away. And I don't
I have a feeling they didn't doit because the only DNA that they found
was muskelunge, which is a tighta very large fish, kind of like
a pike. That was good though, because they're endangered in Lake Champlain,
so that was kind of a nicething. That shows that they're replenishing,
they're coming back. They didn't theydidn't find otter DNA. They didn't find
(34:16):
waterfowl DNA. So that's stuff that'sin the lake all the time. So
that shows me that it's not right. Yeah, that's gonna be in your
average pool. You're going to exactlyexactly there you go, So they're not
finding it. Now you're in Florida, they're not finding it down there,
meaning meaning you know what we're seeingat Lake Champlain we're not seeing them because
(34:39):
they would compete with some of thegators and things like that. I mean,
I feel like they'd be more obviousif they were in bodies of water.
You know, in Florida, we'reseeing them more like up north.
Where else have you seen them?Well personally, but people I was going
to say, I've only seen champBy. I hate to break it,
(35:00):
Tea. I wish I saw Moragand Nessie and og Pogo. That would
be freaking awesome. But there arelakes across the latitude, the Boreal Force
Belt, so the northern part ofour globe that these animals have been seen.
So you have Lake Okanagan, Lockness, Lake Champlain. Over in Scotland,
(35:22):
there's a ton of locks where there'sbeen some sightings. Locke mor Are
that's another one that I'm going tobe traveling probably in September, to Lochness
and Marat. So Morar is theway you're supposed to say it in Scottish,
and my Scottish friends probably still gonnasay that I didn't say it right,
But Americans say more are things.So there's like tons of these lakes
(35:49):
that have similar creatures in them.I've never been to, but I want
to try some of the protocol thatI've used at Lake Champlain to see if
if I can get at a locationand do a comparison and if we get
something similar, that means they're eitherthe same species or something very closely related.
So it's going to be an adventureto go over there in September and
(36:12):
check out Lockness and Lockmrale. It'sgoing to be really cool. I'm excited.
That is going to be cool.And it's beauty. Have you ever
been Have you ever been there?I hadn't. Then, No, so
beautiful. I've not been to Locknest, but I've been through the locks in
the Highlands and it's just so beautiful. Oh God, I can't wait.
It's going to be great. Andthere's a lot of fairy lore and stuff.
I'm all into the fairy stuff andkill yeah. Yeah, yeah.
(36:37):
We were just talking about the fairiesa little while ago. I was in
a cave in Scotland a couple ofyears ago and it was just really odd
because this cave there are supposedly alot of fairies there and people will come
and leave offerings to the fairies andif you're mean and they follow you home,
and they're not very nice to you. They're not like night. It's
not tinker Belt, you know whatI mean. It's a different kind of
(36:59):
fairy. So I was taking picturesthroughout and you know, I just had
my I just had my cell phone, that's it. And when I went
back and looked at the photos,they were all like this, And then
there was one that was upside down. This guy was at the tree.
You can't take an upside down photowith an iPhone. That's crazy. I
(37:22):
was android here. I'm not sayingit's paranormal. I'm just saying I have
no idea how that happened, becauseall I was doing was snapping like this.
I wasn't you know, I wasn'ttrying to do any acrobat Well,
it's funny because I had a friendfrom Ireland. He passed away a few
years ago, but I remember tellinghim because he was all into the the
(37:44):
water horses, the kelpies is whatthey call these creatures over in Celtic lore,
and he was all into that stuff. And I remember he had told
me a story about his grandfather,his uh no, his uncle, not
his grandfather's uncle, Seamus, andhe lived in County Cavan, Ireland,
and you have to look it upon the map. I think it might
(38:04):
be kind of in the center iswhere he was, because Ireland's huge.
So he was telling me when hewas a child there there was a there
was a tree on the property ofhis uncle Seamus's farm, and he had
told one of the workers not tocut this tree down because there was a
fairy ring around it with the mushrooms, the fairy ring that was going around
(38:29):
this tree. So I guess theguy didn't listen and he cut the tree
down, and like the worst stuffhappened to this guy and his machine,
like his bulldozer machine, whatever theheck it was. It disappeared and they
never found it, like it justwent poof, it was gone. So
when he told me that story,I was like, get the hell out.
(38:50):
And then I started looking into thestories of leprechauns and fairies and the
fairy fa and it was just likethat's happened a lot. So it makes
you wonder what what is out therewith that spiritual realm, that that other
veil that we don't know about that'scoming through It's it's really weird. So
(39:13):
I don't know. He was totallyadamant about this story. And I've heard
similar stories to that afterwards. Sothat was a fun little story that my
friend Jim told me a long timeago. We had a woman on the
show last week who said, andshe she's she's a medium, and you
know, she's she's been to lilyDale and all these other places that are
very spiritual. She claims she's seenthem with her eyes, and I said,
(39:37):
not your mind, not your mind'seye, right, No, like
with my eyes, I've seen them. And you know, the only fairy
I've seen flew out of Cinderella's castleright over the Magic Kingdom. That's it.
That's the only fairy I've ever seen. But I find it. It
was there was a thing a documentarythat I saw some time back and someone
(40:00):
I think it was trying to remember. I think it was near County Cork,
which is I had a little bitIrish background, very very old though,
like a long time ago that Igot in my DNA test that I
got done, and it was Killarneyand County Cork. But someone had found
this little leather shoe out in afield and they're like, oh, maybe
(40:23):
it's a doll shoe. So theyactually I think they sent it to excuse
me, the Smithsonian or somewhere likethat, and they had it like put
under a microscope and it was likebetter than what a cobbler would do,
Like it wasn't a doll shoe.And they were like, what the hell?
And I don't know where that rangeto, yeah, exactly, And
(40:44):
they think they tested and they saidit was made out of mouse skin,
So I was like, what thehell? So that was really freaky.
Yeah, I could send you thelink to that later. It was really
really weird. And I'm like,and I learned that when I was a
kid. I read about that ina book and I thought maybe it was
bogus, And then I happened tosee it on a documentary not too long
(41:04):
ago and confirm that it was.It was a real thing that happened.
And the family of the guy,I don't know who the gentleman's name was,
but they still have the shoe,but nobody really talks about it.
And that's all I know. It'skind of a secret to wear it is
I like to see it because that'scrazy. It's crazy. So do you
do you think it? You know, sort of getting back to our topic.
(41:27):
But do you think that let's sayBigfoot as an example, and I
know, I don't know that you'vedone a lot with that. You know,
sasquatches and Bigfoot. Do you feelthat they're the same When I say
the same, obviously they're not.They're not the same animal but the same
situation. But they're just animal ordo you think there's a paranormal component to
the bigfoit and sasquatches. I thinkwith champ and Bigfoot, I think that
(41:55):
there's sort of a protective bubble aroundthem. I believe that they're basically biological.
But what's really interesting about the latecreatures and also the sasquatch is that
the Native Americans they have this thing. Well, first of all, with
Native Americans there, I've been arounda lot of I've got a lot of
(42:16):
Native friends, and they were seeingreal creatures. They're not making this stuff
up. And what's really interesting withthe water horses and the kelpies, and
then you have that's in Celtic lore. Then you have the horned serpents here
with the Native Americans. Then youhave the hippocampus, which is Roman and
(42:36):
Greek mythology. Then you have theScandinavians who have these serpents in the front
of their ship. These people didn'tknow each other, so to me,
they were seeing real animals. Imean, as a person who's seen the
Champ animals myself and gutting the datathat I have, it's like, holy
crap, Like these animals are allover the place. Probably not as populated
(42:59):
as they were at the time,I'm sure, but with Bigfoot and also
the late creatures, I think thatthey're biological, but I think that there
is some sort of protection around themfrom the Native Americans in a way.
Because when I had gotten my sonarimages, it was really crazy. Because
my friend Frank passed away a fewyears ago. He had he had a
(43:23):
sighting back in nineteen eighty of oneon the beach, and that's how I
met him. I was over ata Champ event and he came up to
me and says, I got totell you about my sighting because I've never
told anybody about this. So that'show him and I became friends. And
he was part Cherokee Natives. Sowhen we went out to do research,
(43:43):
he said, well I asked him. I said, hey, can you
do me a big favor? Canyou take the stage out and do like
a blessing because anytime around Lake Champlain, the Abenaki and the Iroquois would throw
out tobacco and do a blessing toappease the creatures, to allow them a
safe passage. So I said,well, they're probably something to this.
(44:05):
I really believe in the native stuff, so I said, let's let's do
some little ceremony. So we did, and that's when we get the sonar
and I was like, holy crap. It was like it broke that bubble,
that protective bubble, because the nativessay that the chant animals were created
by the creator to protect Lake Champlainand only those who will not do them
(44:25):
harm will see them. And I'mabout, like you did were to hurt
you. Yeah, And that's whatI think is the spiritual aspect. I
don't think that they're that they're paranormalper se, but there's definitely something around
them and they I think that becauseI have that respect for nature and have
(44:49):
that respect for them, that I'vebeen damn lucky with what I've gotten,
that's for sure. Yeah, it'spretty amazing, but you know, it's
a lot like you know, Christina, I mean we talk about this lot,
right, And I think it's theintention, and I think some way
the universe knows who you are andwhat you're all about. I have I
(45:10):
for the I mean, look,we watch all these ghost hunting shows,
right, and they go and theytry to get an e VP on something,
and you know, you listen toit and you're like, Okay,
well this sort of sounds like thatmaybe yeah, And then they come through
on my radio show and say,Hi, Scott, we've had that happen.
They do have crazy. I getmessages coming through the radio through the
(45:36):
radio show that are as clear asyou talking to me today. I can
put Indiana, we heard your namehow many times? All the time,
all the time when I was doingmy paranormal work and stuff. There's some
episodes on YouTube that I can send. And the other team members they were
(45:57):
a lot older than me, andthey I kind of thought maybe I was
hearing stuff that they weren't because Iwas younger. Because of mosquito tone.
The mosquito tone thing where higher frequencyyounger people can hear it, but older
people can't. I can still hearthe same mosquito tone. I was twenty
eight years old when this happened.I'm thirty eight, so it's really weird.
(46:17):
But what's really interesting about it iswe were getting EVPs that they weren't
hearing but I was hearing. Andthen when we played back the recording,
there it is. And those arestill on YouTube, which is crazy.
So I'll send you the link tothose. And it was really creepy though,
because it was like anytime we goanywhere, they'd be like they would
(46:39):
get something Katie or Hi Katie,Hey, and I'm like, no,
why does it have to be me? And it's just I just think they
just know they know that the noI think when you have a true heart,
they're right there and they're like,hey, this is someone I can
talk to. So if you knowthat, they know who can who will
be able to understand them, hearthem, and and and believe that it's
(47:06):
them and not just you know,there's some people that just in no way,
you know what I mean, There'sno way. And I feel like
this is more energetic, just thesame way children and animals will just run
to certain people they know not tofear them, they know they're a safe
person. They can feel that thatThat's kind of where my brain goes with
(47:28):
this, Oh it happens to me. I'm like an animal and kid magnet.
I'm like, what the heck.It's like some kid in the grocery
store just comes up and hangs onto my leg. I'm like, what
do I do? You know there'ssome animal that's some dog that's running down
the street that somebody lost. It'sit's I used to have like dogs show
up at my house, Like whythe hell are they coming in my house?
So they know? So there yougo. See totally, I totally
(47:52):
believe that because they feel energy somuch more than we do. I mean,
they put us to shame that theyknow how you feel, they know
all your emotions, they know agood person from someone that's not so good.
They just exactly that. Yeah,and I and I think there's a
certain amount of that that goes onin any of this kind of work that
(48:15):
we do. I mean, Idon't know that you know any of these
champions under the ocean or under thesea, under the lake, trust or
religionally, they were originally from thesea, so you're not you're not far
off because it was Plaine was thearm of the ocean ten thousand plus years
ago, so it was the ChamplaineSea. See I've heard a theory that
(48:37):
all of these creatures similar to Champyand you know, NeSSI, et cetera,
that you know, water did coverso much of the earth and all
of these bodies of water were connectedand that that's how they ended up in
all of these deep lakes. Yeah. Absolutely, I mean with Cross,
(49:00):
I mean we have remnants of ancientspecies that are still in Lake Champlain as
well. We have the bouf andthe gar and the sturgeon. They go
back one hundred plus million years andthey're still there. So it's like,
how the hell can anybody say like, oh, they're can't They're totally impossible.
Well, why are they still there? Then why are the bouf and
(49:20):
garn sturgeons still there? And thenyou think about crocodiles, alligators, snapping
turtles, We've got komodo dragons.There's all kinds of reptile and amphibian species
that are primordial that have been heresince the mass extinction because they could go
into freshwater estuaries and they survive thekt extinction. So it's like, why
(49:45):
is it so far fetched for afifteen to thirty foot long creature, a
population of them, with the crocodilesand alligators and all the things that are
still here on this planet today,Why is that possible? They think of
this big whale thing that's one hundredfeet long and it's gonna eat people,
and it's just ridiculous. So yougotta think of it in logical terms,
(50:07):
which is all they are. They'renot monsters. We are the monsters.
We're the ones that destroy our planet, destroy everything, and they they're more
afraid of us than we are ofthem. And you know, it's just
the metaphor the fun of it.I guess that's it. The reality is,
(50:30):
I don't I don't think that theyare. I think they're just undiscovered.
Yeah, I mean there's been likeany stories of people getting a chunk
taken out of their behind or anythinglike that. So attacks from these kinds
of creatures, I mean there's beensome run from us. Yeah, they
do. There's been some accounts inlike Russia, like, oh god,
(50:52):
how do I pronounce it? Labbitner? I can't remember. I'm not
Russian, so I'm not good withthat. But there's been some reports of
that creature running ramming boats and stufflike that. I don't know how true
they are. I have no idea. But for the most part, I
mean, there's been some reports ofpeople running into a champ animal and then
(51:14):
they just dive down they're gone,But nothing really aggressive except for a Russia.
I don't know. I don't knowif it's just they like to party
with too much vodka and they justsay everything's attacking them. I have no
idea. Let me say this,speaking of Russian, We're gonna need to
because the show, we only haveanother two and a half minutes left,
so we need to start rushing.It's always a fix. It's always a
(51:39):
fast hour. It's not really anhour, it's fifty four minutes. It's
what we go. So they've gotlike two minutes left, and so tell
us a little bit your website.We've been scrolling across the bottom of the
page. What are people going tofind there? What will they learn about
you and your work? Will theybe able to see any of your evidence
there? Yeah? I actually havesome some of the sonar images and video
(52:05):
post it on the page. Ifyou go to our evidence page, you
can learn a lot about that stuff. I'm still kind of working. I'm
not that great at keeping up withthe main website. I'm good at Facebook.
I'm always on Facebook, as youknow, so Champ search on Facebook.
I have several pages. I'm alsothe president and founder of the International
Dragontology Not Dragon with the g's grAco and T. L Oguy. It's
(52:32):
a study of late creatures and soInternational Dragontology Alliance is another Facebook page,
and Katie Elizabeth Cryptozoologists is another page, and then my personal page Katie Elizabeth.
But those pages are where I putlike my everyday videos when I go
(52:52):
out on the lake, the livestuff where people can keep up on my
research vessel KELPI two where I havemy hydrophone system, my sonar, my
underwater cameras and we do some livevideos and stuff like that which people love
to see. So June, July, August is the best time for Champ.
So that's usually when my live videosare going and I have all kinds
(53:15):
of stuff going on there. Butmy website, my main website with some
of the evidence that I've captured,is www dot Katielizabeth dot org, so
they can check that out. I'mcoming I'm coming out with another book,
so I've got on one second,Katie, I'm gonna I'm gonna have to
have you back on to talk aboutthis. We have actually come to the
(53:37):
end of our time. They giveus a heart, we can put it
in that, we can put itin the bio. At the end,
thank you for being, thank youfor joining us, and we'll see you
next time on the show. Havea good night, everybody you've been listening
to. Thank you so much.The Project Radio Show with Scott Island and
Christina Bowen. Be sure to subscribeso you don't miss the next episode.
(54:04):
While you're there, leave us arating and review. We'll be back next
week with more exciting guests. Now, go out there and explore the paranormal
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