December 27, 2023 • 53 mins
Jeff Belanger is an author, podcaster, storyteller, adventurer, and explorer of the unexplained. He’s written more than a dozen books that have been published in six languages, he’s the Emmy-nominated host, writer, and producer of the New England Legends series on PBS and Amazon Prime, he provides programs and lectures to audiences all over the world, and he’s been the writer and researcher for every episode of Ghost Adventures on the Travel Channel. Jeff has made media appearances on hundreds of radio and television programs over his 25-year career, and he has a passion for mysteries and legends.
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(00:00):
The Paranormal Project Radio Show. Areare your hosts, Scott Allen and Christina
(00:38):
Bowen. Hello, everyone, andwelcome back to the Paranormal Project Radio Show.
This is our special in between Christmasand New Year's show. It's actually
pre recorded, but we're glad tobe here tonight with a very special guest.
Hi, Christina, how are youdoing? Doing great? Going a
little crazy with the holidays, butI know, I get it, I
(01:00):
get it. But it's almost over. Then we'll be in the dead of
winter and praying for Memorial Day,which is why January first. So our
guests today I don't want to wasteany time, is author, explorer,
podcaster, storyteller, adventurer Jeff Balanger. And you know he was on our
show, I don't know last yearor the year before now, and he
(01:21):
has a new book out the frightbefore Christmas, so I thought what better
time of year to bring him onto talk about his new book. He's
also the host of the new EnglandLegends series on Prime and PBS, and
he also has the podcast of EnglandLegends as well, so we're going to
bring him out. Jeff Balanger,Welcome to the show. How are you
(01:42):
Hello? Good to be back withboth of you. I am so glad
to have you with us today.How did this How long you've been working
on this book? And how didthis come out? Yeah, so it's
funny. The it started really aboutten years ago, when it was an
early and cold December day and Iwas hanging lights outside for the holidays.
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Half of them didn't work. Theyworked when I put them in the box
eleven months ago. They are notworking now. And then I was putting
a Christmas wreath on my front door. The wreath was plastic, fake.
Everything about it was fake, exceptthe pine cones, but those were still
sprayed with plastic. And the craftingwire I used to attached it to the
door knocker was old and rusted,and it broke and fell to the ground,
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and I was just like, humbug. I didn't say humbug. It
was like a string of swares thatlike somewhere news somewhere, hadn't been invented
yet. And you know others wereold classics, you know. I dusted
off the hits, played them all, played them all, and as I
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sat stood there with my fingers likenumb I was just like, why am
I doing this? I'm a Halloweenguy. Why am I out here in
the cold putting lights up? Whythe lights? Why the evergreen? Why?
December twenty fifth? Why Santa Claus? Why do we go into hawk
for this one day of the year. Why so much trouble? Why?
Why? Why? Why? Why? And I'm the kind of person that
once those questions start knocking around inmy head, I don't really sleep well
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until I start to find those answers. And then that old there was a
Christmas lyric jumped into my head inthat moment, Andy Williams singing, There'll
be scary ghost stories and tales ofthe glories of Christmases long long ago,
And I went, all right,what was Andy Williams talking about? Because
when I grew up, I hadRudolph the Red Nose Reindeer and not much
else, And so what does hemean scary ghost stories? I'm a Halloween
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person. Why should I should justskip this holiday? But then I started
diving in, and I said,all right, I'm gonna have to break
this thing apart into all its originalpieces and put it back together again so
I could understand it. And Istarted to dive in, and I went,
oh, dear Lord, I wasalways a Halloween person because I like
spooky things. I like spooky,creepy things. And I would learn through
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this journey that, oh my,have I been loving the wrong holiday all
these years? Yeah, because Halloweenis the second spookiest holiday of the year.
It is a distant, distant,distant second, and it can't hold
a candle to Christmas when it comesto fright factor. And so it sort
of started there. And then Iwas asked to give a talk on Crampis
(04:23):
the Christmas Devil, and I went, well, I've been meaning to look
into the old guy a little moreanyway, And one thing just sort of
led to another, and so thiswas all born as like a stage show
where I was telling the story ofChristmas and the monsters in the darkness around
it. And then a couple ofyears ago, publisher contacted me and said
this should be a book, andI said, yeah, I've been meaning
to get to that, and thenbut I don't want to just be like
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another book, and they're like,no, no, no, no,
we want this to be like fullcolor, hardcover, beautiful, like gift
book. And I just went reallytwisted and sick. I'm in I mean,
let's right, Yeah, that's kindof my wheelhouse, so let's do
this. And so so it wasreally it was like ten years in the
making, and many of the storieswere crowdsurced sourced. I would tell the
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stories in front of live audiences andsome would come up and go, I
can't believe you left off whatever,and I'd write it down and I'd go
home and I go, God,that's good, I can't believe it.
And then you know, the nextaudience would get that one, and it
just grew and grew. But itturns out and then also too, I
started to get mad. I wasraised Roman Catholic, which I feel like
I should divulge here in the beginning. And when I was growing up,
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you know, Christmas was a verybig deal in my house, right,
and my priest though, father Lawler, kind of a mean guy for being
honest. He I remember him hatingSanta Claus and thinking, what, like
I was five years five or sixyears old and Santa was coming to our
church hall and all the kids therewere beyond excited because I don't know,
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the world's biggest celebrity is coming.Yeah. Yeah, So all of a
sudden in walks Santa freaking clause,and he's got a big sack, and
he's got candy canes for all thekids, and little wrapped gifts which turn
out to be plastic rosary beads forall the kids, and what I've always
wanted, you know, just likeleering at Santa Claus trying to shoot death
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lasers out of his eyes, tryingto like kill Santa with his brain.
And I remember looking at father Lawlaand being like, what's wrong with you?
That's Santa Claus. This guy's literallylike bigger than Jesus. Uh oh
oh maybe, oh oh that's why. Oh so anyway, I think he
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was sort of telling me in hisown angry, bitter way that this holiday
has nothing in the world to dowith Jesus. And boy was he right.
He was right. Pagan is theday is long? Yeah, forgive
me. It's as pagan as theday is short. True. So yeah,
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So it turns out all the fuss, all this fuss is over one
thing, and that's the Winter solstice. It is the shortest day and the
longest darkest night. Winter is coming. It's a time to be afraid.
It's a time to ask yourself ifyou have enough food and fuel to get
through the winter. It's a timeto put your bigones aside and party with
your neighbors because we're gonna need eachother to get through this season. And
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if we've been having arguments all year, it's time for me to give you
gifts and for us to drink andeat together and say I'm sorry, because
if anything goes wrong, I mightbe knocking at your door and asking to
stay with you, and you mightbe doing the same. Mm hmm.
And that was it, So thatthat was the impetus. And then there's
so many pieces, and I've learnedthat this holiday was originally the most inclusive
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of all holidays. Had nothing todo with what you believed or didn't believe,
or who you prayed to or didn'tpray to. Made no difference if
you live in a place where winter'snot so easy. That was it.
Holiday was for you, the soalstice, whether you want to call it Saturnalia
or Yule or midwinter or Christmas.It was always always about getting ready to
hunker down because the long winter's comingright right, So so the fright before
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Christmas, Crampus where did he fitin? So if you are trying to
explain to your loved ones, especiallyyour children, about why it's so important
that we stay inside. Now,us adults know, if you wander outside
and the cold and the dark,and you're caught unprepared, you will die.
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You'll die from the elements. You'llyou know, you'll go hypothermic,
You'll fall down dead, and that'sthe end of it. So whether the
elements kill your child or a monsterkills your child is kind of irrelevant.
If you teach them this is thetime to stay inside, This is the
time to stay safe among your people, because out there there's literally monsters lurking.
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Maybe maybe some of these monsters arehere to help, you know,
weird twisted sideways around the back kindof way. And so Crampis was born
in Austria, in Germany and inthe Mountainous region. He's many centuries old,
and he eventually got connected with SaintNicholas, and Saint Nicholas was a
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real historical figure born in Myra modernday Turkey, becase he was born into
a wealthy family, he was anorphan from a young age, and he
spent his whole life giving his moneyaway, building orphanages and hospitals and giving
dowries to the poor and throwing coinsthrough windows. Gave it all away because
that's what made him feel good.And he became the patron saint for a
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lot of groups, pawnbrokers for one's, nailors for another, and children and
children as well. And when hedied on December sixth, which is an
important day, December sixth became SaintNicholas Day. That's the day that Saint
Nicholas brings presents to the good girlsand boys around Europe. And if Saint
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Nicholas and Santa are one and thesame in your head, anyone listening right
now, I'm gonna ask you togo ahead and split him apart, at
least for the next hour or so, like the rest of the world does.
Saint Nicholas arrives on December sixth,Santa Claus comes on December twenty fifth.
Certainly plenty of similarities and crossover,however they are they are different.
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So if December sixth is Saint NicholasDay, December fifth becomes the day for
consequence and judgment. And that's whereCrompus fits in. He comes on down,
He arrives often with Saint Nicholas.He's a monster covered in fur.
He's got long horns and a longforked red tongue. He's covered in chains
so you can hear him coming,and he carries a scratchy sack. And
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on December fifth, the evening Kropusknocked. He'll come around and scoop up
all the naughty children, stuff himin the sack, bring him back to
his lair and kill them. Socome December sixth, Saint Nicholas Day,
Saint Nicholas can bring presents to allthe good girls and boys, because that's
all that's left alive. Oh that'sa pleasant thought, isn't that. So
it wouldn't it be great joy ofthe year one day if we could get
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rid of all the jerks in theworld, like now we're not doing a
show on the purge, that's youknow, I mean, let's face it,
I think that would be pretty wonderful. So so that was that was
where it all sort of started.And and if people have called incorrectly Santa
uh crampis rather the anti Saint Nicholasor the enemy of Saint Nicholas, not
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true at all at all. Theseguys just did the work. He did
the work. They they would arrivetogether cohorts, good cop like that easy
right, And and nor is crampas evil. You know, every society
needs someone that dulls out the punishment, someone that that you know, handles
that, and that was crampis.That doesn't mean you can't love your job,
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you know what I mean. Youare a little twisted, aren't you.
But that doesn't make you evil.You know, you should enjoy your
work. Well, you know,killing the killing the little children, I
don't know. I mean, that'sso that's a little bit, that's that's
a little rough. I mean onthe surface, sure, yeah, but
over time he became very metaphorical,you know. And and then he also
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carries a switch of sticks as youcan see behind me. And then he
was known to just beat the naughtychildren as opposed to kill them, just
sort of like correcting them. Buthe was always sort of the consequence for
bad behavior. When I was akid, I was warned, I'll get
less presents, or at the veryworst, I'll have coal and sticks in
my stocking, which is what Iwas. Yeah, I mean, you
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know, you could behave badly fora whole year and coal and sticks,
so what you know what I mean, Yeah, all the cookies. I
stole all the nights. I stayedup late. Small price to pay.
There you go. But that's notreally much of a consequence. Cramps and
there are many other monsters as well, brings that consequence. And uh and
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of course today he's blowing up.He's getting movie deals, you know,
he's in twenty fifteen, the Crampistmovie came out. It was sort of
a cult classic. It's getting playedyear after. You know my Christmas playlist?
Yeah, yeah, you watch It'sa Wonderful Life and then crampis back
to back. Yeah, I wantto see a crossover, you know,
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or Jimmy Stewart's like, oh hey, crap, what's going on? You
know every that would have been brilliantRings Crapus is coming and you little run
I need to see that on thebig screen. Yeah, I know,
some c g I folks, wecould. We're gonna have to start a
gofund me, I guess, butwe can get this done. That would
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be awesome, would it? Ohmy gosh? Oh yeah? So did
I mean did you grow up withscary girl stories or monsters in your well,
not at Christmas time, although youknow I did go to Catholic school.
So there was Sister Francis. Shecarried sticks. Yeah, that was
the consequence. But so you grewup with the was that our lady of
inadvertent flatulence? Is that? Yes? Yes, yeah, that's the one.
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They were rough. They were roughthere. They've turned out many a
psychic medium, I assure you,yes, they literally beat the psychic right
India. Oh my god, Idon't see any dead people. Wa wam.
Brought me to the edge. Nowit's open. I didn't know I
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was gonna laugh so much. Thisis great. So yeah, so it's
really so. The holiday and many, especially northern European countries, incorporate these
various monsters. They're out there lurkingin the dangerous, long, dark,
cold night. And then parents discoveredthat they could use them to keep their
kids in line. And so,uh, anyone who's ever been a parent
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and been trying desperately to get justa little bit of quiet time at night
before you yourself have to go tobed, No, at times you get
desperate, and uh I picture,I mean imagine, imagine instead of being
told you know Santa's watching, oryou know you're gonna get less presents,
imagine just crampis standing in the corner, just hitting the sticks against He's just
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just sitting quietly, you know,like you're you're watching, yeah, and
your parents are like, hey,did you take an extra cookie? Cramps
And he just kind of leans forward. Not yet, buddy, Just wait,
he's ready, you know, justhe's ready, just hitting the sticks
like yep, watching everybody. I'mready. Just say the word and I'm
on the job. You know,Santa is time out and Crampis is the
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time you're out because he's kno gettingyou out. I guess we're talking about
like misdemeanters and felonies. Right,that's it. There you go, Yeah,
that would be that's a good analogy. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
yeah, don't you know wildly popular. I mean there was postcards, lots
of postcards. If you want tospend a fun few minutes, go on
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Google image search and just type inCrampis postcards. You'll see those old vintage
ones. Yeah. I love those. Yeah, that's what you gave instead
of Christmas cards. You'd send those. And they were wildly popular and Crampis
was everywhere. But around the nineteenteens nineteen twenties, he very quickly went
out of fashion when Santa Claus tookover the Christmas holiday. There's a direct
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one to one correlation there, youknow. On once it became about Santa,
then all the monsters had to goaway. But Crampis is just one
one of many. Through the veryfolklore of it. Wasn't the current Santa
that everybody sees and things that wasn'tthat linked to a Coca Cola advertisement early
back then? Is outfit? Sure? Is? Yeah? What you when
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you when someone says Santa Claus andyou picture in your mind what he looks
like. Coca Cola taught us thatin the nineteen twenties, and what was
happening was that America was in agreat depression and the only way out of
a great depression, economic depression orrecession for that matter, is to spend
money. And if you don't havemoney, how do you do that?
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And if you do have a littlebit of money, your instinct is to
save it and not spend it.But Coca Cola came up with this,
like they took. Santa had beenevolving since really like the eighteen fifties or
so. He showed up in Harper'smagazine. Thomas Nast twas the Night Before
Christmas was written by Clement Moore.That really started to make the figure bigger
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and bigger. But it was thenineteen twenties when Coca Cola developed this ad
campaign and the thing is it worked. People bought coke, and then the
following year people that sold anything donutsand pizza, cars and whatever, they
were like, wait, wait,wait, Coca Cola does not own Santa
Claus, we could use them too. And so the world's biggest celebrity was
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out there promoting for free products andservices everywhere, and America started to crawl
out of the Great Depression. Thanksgivingwas moved to the fourth Thursday in November
instead of the last Thursday because retailersneeded more time for shopping for Christmas.
And what's good for the economy isgood for the America. And then that
Christmas squarely became about consumerism at thatpoint. That's what it was all about.
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It was about making sure we spend, spend, spend, and all
the monsters, all the consequences hadto go away. That's that's what was
so important, was to you know, make sure that nobody's scared. We
want everybody happy, bye bye bye. And that's where it sat but I'm
here today to warn you that thesemonsters are coming back. And they're coming
back because they're showing up at popculture references, they're getting movie deals,
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they're they're in parades again. Weare bringing back the darker side of this
holiday, and I think just intime to save ourselves. So is your
balance? Yeah, yeah, thegood guy, the bad guy. I
love that. I'm all about balancein this world, anyhow, I agree
well also to think about this inmy experience anyway, I don't know of
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anybody that can't make changes for thebetter without fear. Unless you are afraid
of something, how can you likeif you know, like it's a good
idea to eat more vegetables and takewalks and exercise regularly. You know that
that's just Everyone knows that, butyou know it's tough to put it into
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practice until your doctor says, youjust had a minor cardiac event. The
next one could kill you. Ifyou do ABC and D, you might
keep this away and be okay.And then you say, oh my,
I'm not ready to die. You'rescared you make changes. This holiday offers
us this inherent darkness, this inherentdanger, and if we face the gauntlet
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of these ghosts, of these monsters. Then we might come out the other
side better for it. And everythingcan change in one night. And I
know a guy who did change inone night thanks to some ghosts haunting him.
I've heard of him. Yeah,I believe it was four or foor
ghosts. The first, of course, was Jacob Marley, the one everyone
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forgets. Yes, yeah, that'sthe and he's most important. He's the
one that shows up and says tohis old business partner, Scrooge, you
know I'm covered in chains, chainsI forged in life. They were just
as long as yours seven Christmases ago, this very night, and you've worked
on yours ever since. It's aponderous chain. But there's a chance for
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you, Scrooge. You are goingto have to face down three more spirits.
And if you get through this,and Jacob Marley arranged it, he
made it happen. You get throughthis, you might make it. And
Scrooge, of course, has toface his past, the ghost of Christmas
past, see his lonely self atthe boarding house, sees his sister dieing
childbirth, sees him self falling inlove and then getting his job with old
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Fezziwig, but then also sees himselffalling in love with something else with money,
and then losing the love of hislife, and you see him turn
into this hardened man. The Ghostof Christmas Present shows him a world where
Christmas cheer is everywhere, even inthe poor houses and workhouses, even at
Bob Cratch's house, where Tiny Timis so sick, and if only they
had more money they could afford medicalhelp and nourishment. And Scrooge is in
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a position to do something about that, but chooses not to. And then
finally the Ghost of Christmas Yet toCome shows him a bleak future where some
old guy dies and people are laughingabout it. Good to be rid of
him. And finally, when wesee the grave, we realize it's Scrooge.
And it's at that point in thestory where all of us who are
reading the book or watching it onTV or play or however you're consuming it,
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were shocked because we go, oh, no, oh, no,
oh, no, I realize whoScrooge is. I had no idea he's
me. I'm Scrooge. I'm gettingolder and crankier. And then in the
next morning, of course, hewakes up to the bells of churches ringing,
and everything is different. He hasfaced as ghosts, faced as demons.
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He's run that God. Let hecame out the other side, and
he can change everything in one instant. He can start giving to charity.
He sends a turkey to Bob Cratchit, he goes to see his nephews for
dinner. Everything is different in onesingle night. And that idea of redemption
overnight sounds so so very good.And it's there for us because of the
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inherent danger ghosts and monsters that arelurking in the shadows of the winter solstice.
I love that it's been there forus, right, it's I mean
the Christmas Carol's been around since theearly eighteen forties, that that story has
never gone away. You know,it shows up year after year. It's
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we've seen muppets do it. We'veseen it on stage, we've seen it
in cartoons. You know, we'vewe won ice yeah, yeah, yeah.
Have you seen it at north ShoreMusic Theater Have you seen their version?
So they they've been doing it fordecades. And the man that plays
Screwed just from Texas and I actuallyhad him on the show last year for
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this very spot to talk about hisrole as Screwge because I thought, you
know, what's more paranormal than aChristmas carol? Really, you know,
And it was a great it's greathow it's all kind of like tied in
together like that. It's so it'ssuch an important story and that you can't
say enough what Charles Dickens did todefine the holiday. The holiday was not
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a thing. It was not Itwas like groundhog Day, like the way
you think of groundhog Day now ishow people thought of Christmas then just to
day. Most people went to workand school and everything else, and Parliament
was in session and all that otherstuff. But this book suddenly said like,
no, this is a day,this is this is special, and
it's a time to give to charity, and it's and it's a secular book
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too. I mean, you know, the Birth of Jesus is mentioned,
barely gets one sentence in the wholebook, but it's really about how you're
supposed to feel about it. Andwhat he's doing is he's tapping into centuries
of Saturday and Yule and these festivalsthat have been omnipresent, you know,
and so many things we do todaystill connect us to those very old ways
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when you put up a Christmas tree, when you put a wreath on your
front door, when you put uplights on your trees outside, when you
baked goods, when you make eggnogand get drunk with friends, when you
go to your office party and getloaded. You know you are participating in
Saturday A. Yeah, you're participatingin Yule. Right. It shines through.
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But we fooled ourselves into thinking like, oh, this is how we
celebrate Christmas. And it is.But it was not wrong because the Church
took what was already happening, thoughexactly, and rolled it into their own
version. And that's super modern.I mean, Christians have been at war
with Christmas since about three point thirtysix eighty until like nineteen seventy, you
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know, like they literally banned it. When the Puritans were in charge of
British Parliament, they banned Christmas.They called it satanical. To dress fine,
give gifts, make merry, you'dbe fined five shillings, which is
about three days wages for the workingclass back then. And even when the
band was lifted, preachers were preachingfrom the pulpit we do more to dishonor
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Christianity in the twelve days of Christmasthan in all twelve months combined. And
they were they were furious with theholiday because it was so so pagan,
And then finally somewhere along the waythey just sort of gave up and said
it was ours all along. Don'tsay, you know, Jesus is the
reason for the season. And allwe know is that if it were important,
if the birth story of Jesus wasimportant, it would get a lot
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more ink in the Bible. Itgets hardly a mention. And if the
date was important, that would betold to you in the Bible. It's
not. It's just all we knowis that shepherds were sleeping out in the
field at night keeping watch over theirflock, and in Bethlehem they did that
in the spring, summer, andfall. They did not do it,
which means, know, we canrule out December. But you know here,
(26:03):
no there, right, we knowthey just picked a day. No,
they didn't pig a day it was, but I mean it wasn't the
day, the actual day, no, no, right, yeah, of
course, yea, the actual celebration. It was the celebration of the birth,
but it wasn't the anniversary of thebirth. And so that happened with
the Emperor Constantine in Rome. Hewas he was the first Christian emperor.
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He's trying to unify Rome. Jesuswas born a commoner. That's that's a
very important part of the Christian storyand Christianity. Of course, hinges on
Easter, not on Christmas. Whatdefines you as a Christian is that you
believe in Easter everyone is born,all of us are born. But the
death and resurrection, that's not somethingeverybody does. And so that's what defines
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Christianity. Easter is the very biggestholiday in Christianity. From a theological perspective,
it's just nobody, but nobody gotthe memo right exactly so. But
but the Emperor Constantine was trying tosell Jesus to the Romans. He was
trying to unify under one religion,didn't ban the others. Knew he couldn't
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ban Saturnalia, which was December seventeenthto the twenty third. But he knew
if Jesus is going to be aking, not just a king, but
a king of kings, he needsa birthday, and he knows the perfect
birthday is December twenty fifth, becausein the Julian calendar. The twenty fifth
was the winter solstice, and thatwas the festival of Saul and victis this
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sun God. It's the shortest day, but it's also marks the day where
the sun starts to return, andthere's hole the light, so it's coming
back, and it will build andbuild all the way until the summer solstice,
when you get the longest day andthe shortest night. And so so
that was it. He thought thatwas a perfect day to celebrate Jesus.
You have this raging party. Theseventeenth to the twenty third, one day
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for the hangover. On the twentyfourth, twenty fifth, we party again.
And Christians were at war with thatdate right up until very modern times.
Here we are and here we are. So so your book is it?
Is it? Is that all ofthat? Or is it really doesn't
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focus on Crampus. No, it'snot just cuss as one chapterus. I
mean, let's face it, he'ssexy, he's got the movie deals,
he dines in the restaurants we can'tget into, you know, he's list,
he sells, he sells. Butbut no, I cover the whole
history of Christmas. How we gothere, how we got to December twenty
fifth, the history of Saint Nicholas, the history of Santa Claus, and
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then the many other monsters that lurk. Not just Crampis, but you know,
Iceland has got stuff that's even worsereally and brings us the Grilla and
Crampis No, that's the matty loadfrom Wales. That's the dead horse that
rises from the grave to try toget in your house for treats and alcohol.
Yeah, which is awesome too.So the gorilla is the She's an
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ogre who lives up in the mountainsand she's got thirteen tails, and she
comes down around the winter solstice.And unlike crap like, if you're a
good person, you don't have toworry about crampis not your concern. Rila,
on the other hand, does notdiscriminate good kids bad kids. Makes
no difference. If you're lost inwandering out in the woods, she will
(29:23):
scoop you up, bring you backto her lair, cut you up,
cook you in a stew and eatyou. Oh. Parents are happy to
tell this story in Iceland. Sowhen Iceland was first settled only about eleven
hundred years ago, there were nopeople there. When the Europeans first arrived,
it was covered by ice, youknow, much before that. But
(29:44):
there were trolls and monsters and impocen, fairies and all kinds of magical creatures.
And as they started to settle intoas the people started to settle into
villages and towns, those creatures gotpushed up into the mountains. But on
the soalstice they come down to collectwhat's owed to them, if you will.
And so the Grilla is the queen, the matriarch of the whole dysfunctional
(30:06):
family. And also you have tounderstand too, in reikievic the capital right
now, the round the solstice,there's about four hours of sunlight. That's
it. That the sun rises andsets in like four hours. If you
go further north it's less. Andif you get to the very northern tip
of Iceland, you're almost at theArctic circle, where there is no sunrise.
It is total darkness. This isthe time we stay inside, we
(30:29):
stay safe, We keep our childreninside because there are monsters lurking out there
and it's dangerous. So the Grilla, she also has she's in charge of
the Ulads, who are these thirteentrolls that come down one by one throughout
the month of December and stay atyour home for two weeks and mess with
you, like one month, stealyour cow's milk. One will you know,
(30:52):
lick your spoons clean after dinner.Another peeps through your window. Another
steals your meat, another steals yourcandles, and there steals your yogurt.
And and they just all come,you know, all throughout the month,
and and it's a it's a wildtime. And Iceland, I mean even
on the news each night they'll say, like tonight is the you know,
the sheep Cote Claude who will comeand poke your sheep, So watch out
(31:15):
for that. Yeah, and hestays for two weeks. So this lore
and legend ties us back to reallyancient ways and reminds us that, you
know, there's there's other stuff outthere. And Iceland's amazing. Iceland they'll
re route highways because they believe that'slike a troll rock. You know,
you can't blast that rock. We'regoing to go around it. I've heard
(31:37):
that. So that's amazing, youknow, like that's they they take it
seriously. And so the Grila hasbecome also part of their own pop culture.
If you land at the Reikivic Airportright now, there will be a
giant cauldron with a big ogre witchlike stirring in it, and you can
get in the cauldron and get yourpicture taken with the with the greela like
we do Malsanta. They've got that, which is also I know, right,
(32:02):
I know. And there's so somany like of these various monsters,
all across various cultures. Every countryalmost has their own version of something,
and it's uh, I think it'sa wonderful way to connect to the darker
side the balance, as you weresaying, Christine, the balance, Yeah,
like you just can't. Did youever eat like some cake that was
(32:23):
just too damn sweet? Yeah?And may you got to go and have
chips to balance it out. That'swhat we did to Christmas. We made
the cake too sweet. You knowsomething else and and and we're collectively working
on that right this very minute.You know that it's changing, and I
think changing for the better. Thisstuff speaks to something very ancient and primal
(32:45):
in all of us, something Ithink a lot of people and especially in
today's society, that we have forgotten. Yeah this, you know, we've
forgotten where we come from and we'vemade up all these fancy stories to explain
things, and then we have thesebig parties and they said, everybody's forgetting
where the roots of it where itstarted. Yeah, and it's but it's
(33:08):
always been there. It always,it always had a way to shine through
even when you no matter what labelyou slapped on it, whether you're hanging
mistletoe or or eating a yule logspeaking of cakes that are too sweet,
right, like that that used tobe a tree that you burned, you
know it was. There's so manythings that sort of made their way through
(33:32):
and which I think is amazing.What a test of it to these old
ways that they make it through allthe way to present day, even if
people don't understand why they're doing itor where it came from. And I
think that's really sort of wonderful.So now you know, last year I
started a new tradition where I makemy own wreath. I actually go out
(33:53):
in the woods and I pull evergreenbranches and I twist them into a wreath
and all this other stuff. Andit came out hard. It's a mess,
but I will say this, itworked. Those prickly needles kept the
bad cheer outside and the good cheerinside. It meant as a green witch.
This warms my heart. That's whatI do. I've got oranges drying
(34:16):
right now to hang, So soyou do it instead of just putting a
fake plastic wreath on my door.Because my dad did it, and my
dad's dad did it, and myneighbors do it, and it looks nice
and all that other stuff. Ithas meaning, I'm putting it up with
intent to keep the bad stuff outsideand keep the good stuff inside. This
(34:37):
tree is more powerful than winter.Our ancestors didn't pick it arbitrarily. I
mean they would look out of thelandscape and see that winter killed everything.
It killed the flowers and the grassand the trees. They're just skeletons,
kills, the ponds and the lakesfrozen solid. But then you go,
wait a minute, wait a minute, what's that tree that winter can't kill
it. It must be magical,it must be powerful. There must be
(35:00):
something about it. And so wetake those branches and we put them over
our doors and windows, and weput them, you know, in wreaths
over our doors, to keep thekeep the bad spirits out. Spirits.
We can clearly hear by the waybecause in the wintertime, you hear this
shrieking, howling sound that you don'thear in the spring, summer, or
fall. And you could say,well, it's just the wind whipping through
(35:21):
the trees, or you could saythose are the cries of the vanquished foe
of the Norse god Odin as herides through the sky and his wild hunt.
And if I don't protect myself,they'll get in. And if they
get in, then things aren't goingto go well for me. And we
still do that, which I thinkis so cool. Well, what about
the trees, like the Christmas trees? Yes, so the Christmas tree.
(35:44):
Well again this is this is theone tree more powerful than winter like.
You don't need to be a botanistor otherwise to figure that out. Just
look look outside, see what's stillalive. And so so our ancestors knew
it too. It provides you shelterif you're stuck outside. You know,
it's some shape and some protection fromwind and everything else. This tree is
absolutely something about It is powerful.And not only that, when our ancestors
(36:07):
would make a kill in the winter, they would pull the entrails of the
animal out and drape it around theevergreens two reasons. One is to make
an offering to the tree. Theother is that other animals could pick that
clean and they too could survive thewinter. And I want everybody to really
let that sink in and think aboutit. If you're ever stringing popcorn and
cranberries to put his garland around yourChristmas tree, well that's just a completely
(36:31):
different visual. I say, let'shave a more traditional Christmas this year.
Get yourself some entrails, put themaround the tree. I know the smell
is going to be awful, it'llbe terrible, but that an orange will
cover it. Yeah, you'll needa few oranges. But when people walk
in and go, oh my god, what is that, you could say
that is the smell of an authenticand traditional Christmas, Thank you very much.
(36:54):
You can start out with some sausagelinks. It might be easier to
go and have to kill something.Sure, sure, sure, yeah,
but that's it. I mean,think about how in Testine like cranberry and
popcorn. Look, that's what you'redoing. You're you're you're literally recreating the
entrails around a tree. Fascinating,beautiful, really just it's a lovely thought.
(37:15):
I know, I know, right. You thought you were just gonna
get like a monster story and youyou finally understand so wrong. It's just
so wrong. They have to havea lot of guts to come in and
tell a story like that. Itell you, Yeah, but he's always
good for a dad joke, always, so yeah, so many, so
many great traditions are born from this, this holiday and now growing up too,
(37:39):
I remember I had Jewish friends andI was like, this sucks.
You know, Santa doesn't visit you, Like, what's up with that?
Is any anti semi you know?And and then I realized, I was
like, but he could. Youknow, Santa does not have to be
exclusively Christian at all. And youcould put up a tree, and you
could put up lights. Those arenot Christian symbols whatsoever. And you not
(38:00):
doing that is your own choice.Obviously no one has to. But don't
tell yourself you're not doing it becauseoh that those that's what Christians do.
I mean, yes, it iswhat they do, but it's it's not
their symbol either. And so Ithink if you like the lights, if
you think they're pretty, put themup, you know, put them Yeah,
(38:22):
And we do it, by theway, because we literally want to
be a beacon during this long,dark, dangerous night and winter that that
we want to find our way backhome in the dark. We want our
neighbors and friends to be able tofind us if they need us. That's
what we Yeah, that's why wedo it. It's not just to run
up the electric bills and you knowit's or to outdo our neighbors, but
(38:43):
it's it's it's something that that hasthat always had meaning. We need to
be beacons in this this long darknight. I love that. So this
is just all right up my alley. I'm I'm a blend of all the
different traditions. Yeah, because Ihave a Christmas tree, but I also
celebrate Yule and you know, soI blend it all together. Right,
(39:07):
Well, that's that to me,that's redundant. Like the Christmas tree and
celebrating Yule goes hand in hand.That's now it's saying I'm a Christian with
a Christmas tree. That's blending traditions. Right. I celebrate the birth of
Jesus and I put entrails on myChristmas tree. That's blending traditions. You're
just you're being consistents this year.Maybe you do you you know, all
(39:36):
good, all good, Yeah,stick to the cinnamon sticks and oranges.
Yeah, totally fine and understandable.Probably smells better the other thing too,
though. I remember thinking about howI didn't grow up with crampis and being
disappointed. Only now in hindsight,and I've I've had a good talk with
my parents about it. We've workedit out, you know. I said,
(39:58):
why didn't I have crampis? AndThey're like, we didn't know.
But then I thought about it,and I said, you know what crampis
was in my childhood. He wasin yours too, By the way,
I need you to think back.He was there, he was green,
and he lived on Mount Crumpets.Yes, he was there, just to
look the same as you know himnow. He was there. He was
(40:22):
just neon green. Yes, hewas green. He didn't have horns,
but his hair could like curl intolike girl lived on Mount Crumpet. Long.
Lot of similarities there that I nevermade that connection. Yeah. So
anyway, am I here tonight toaccuse doctor Seuss of plagiarism? Yes,
(40:43):
yes, accused doctor Seuss. TheGrinch worked because he probably was something a
little bit familiar. There was somethingabout him we're like, I like this
grinch. I don't know why,but he wasn't out killing the kids.
But you know, yeah, there'sthere's a story. But there's an old
adage, right that talent borrows,but genius steals. Oh, I hadn't
(41:12):
heard that one doctor Seuss was agenius. Well he was. Yeah,
No, I know, I getI get it, and I get that
like the idea of all this canbe really uncomfortable for some people because it's
just the antithesis of everything they thoughthow things are supposed to work. But
if you read the old Grim fairytales, the Originals, there's ship they
(41:37):
really are. Yeah, of coursethey are the originals, but they've disneyfied
everything, and ye because they usedto teach you a lesson and now they
don't. Well, the lessons learnedwhen it's extreme. And so for example
Cinderella, right in the original GrimTales, when the wicked stepsisters were trying
(42:00):
on the glass slipper, one ofthem cut their toes off to try to
wedge it into the glass slipper,and they filled the glass slipper with blood.
Couldn't get her foot in the otherone cut her heel off. Also
filling it with blood. Again.You'd think someone would watch that and go,
you know what, No, didn'twork. This isn't your shoe clearly
(42:21):
right flipped by Walt Disney that somehowgot didn't make it to the final edit
of the cartoon Disney version. Butthe grim tails were meant to be tough
because number one, we know,we know as adults there's monsters in the
world. Yeah, no question,you know. You have the news.
In Bulgaria they have the Cara Concolis, who comes out during the twelve days
(42:43):
of Christmas, the days they callthe Unbaptized Days the Unholy Days, and
the Cara Concolus is a subterranean bigfootwith glowing red eyes and claws, and
he's covered in fur, and hecomes out at sundown and he's going to
try to jump on your back andclaw at you until dawn before he has
to go underground again. But he'sa shape shifter. He can look like
anyone and anything, and he's alsosort of keeping tabs on you. And
(43:07):
so I love that story because thatis the most authentic monster, I think
in the world, because we know, we know when we watch the news
that there are monsters as we justsaid. They do horrible things. They
kill people, hurt people, shootpeople, you know, in groups.
(43:28):
And the thing is, if theyhad like glowing red eyes and were eight
feet tall and covered in fur andhad razor claws, we would just know
to run. That's easy. Yousee that real monsters look just like us.
And that is the frightening thing ofall. And so, yeah,
let me tell you about the Caraconcolus. Maybe that's just a regular old
(43:52):
person, or maybe it's a monsterin disguise. And we have to really
be careful when we're out there amongststrangers or even people we thought we knew,
because you never know. And soall of these stories, all the
all these legends, all these monstershave a moral to them that that we
you know, we teach our childrenand we tell each other because we need
(44:15):
to keep the bad cheer away.We need to be safe, We need
to be careful, and we needto be positive and look out for each
other. Because winter is coming,and it's coming again next year, you
know. And it's not just athing from a series on HBO. Yeah,
it's not just Game of Thrones,right, Winter is coming very very
(44:38):
soon, and so and once it'shere. You know that we got to
figure it out, We got toget through this. So oh sorry,
Jeff. Did these stories change inplaces where they didn't have the cold and
the darkness of winter the way thatwe do here, They did not catch
(44:58):
on like they do in southern partsbecause you know, so many of those
stories also made their way through England, and England, as you probably know,
colonize the world. Right at onepoint, the sun never set on
the British Empire, Australia, NewZealand, South Africa, Singapore, you
know. I mean, the Britsspread far and wide and took their stories
with them. But you know,when it's Christmas Day and you're at the
(45:23):
beach sipping a mytai in the Caribbean, it's a little bit. So I've
always said, like, how doyou see the light when you're on a
beach on a bright sunny day withlike the surf tickling your toes. You
don't see the light. The lightis everywhere, things are fine, you
know, you see the light whenyou get into a very dark place,
(45:45):
that's when you can see the light. So these monsters did not travel well
to southern climates. They stay northto where winter was really a force to
be reckoned with and still is.You know, even though today we've got
door dash and you know heat thatwe can just turn up like hit it
a few degrees if we can affordthat. You know. Well, there's
(46:07):
those of us that still have theirchildhood collection of coal. I'm still working
on. So nice from just beingnaughty all those years, which is ironic,
which means being naughty paid off.There you go right like, oh,
I'm keeping warm, this is great. Oh it's so warm. Oh
that's nice. Thank goodness. Iwas such a brat. I could keep
(46:29):
warm for years on this. ThanksMom and Dad or whoever brought me that
coal. Yeah, I get yeah. So so yeah, there was a
time when colon sticks was like,oh, thank god, we're freezing right,
you know, we're going to this. Yeah, we're gonna toast right
(46:50):
up. I love that. Ohgosh. So so anyway, I I
was trying to save Christmas, evenif it was just from me. You
know, I was trying to,like say, like, because when I
was young, Christmas was a drug. You know. I was high on
that drug from the time the dessertfork played on Thanksgiving until the ball dropped
on New Year's Eve, and asI got older, a lot of that
(47:15):
magic went away until it was reallynot even there at all anymore. Then
I had a kid, and alot of that magic came back, which
was awesome. But now she's sixteenand she's you know, she's over it,
you know, and but I stillfind it, you know, I
found it again because of what itmeans. And even though she's sort of
(47:37):
over it, I'm still trying tobe like, hey, I don't care
whether you love it or hate it. There's still magic to be found and
had in this holiday, and I'mgoing to work on that, even if
it's just for me. And atthe end of the day, it takes
your whole life to sort of realize, like I can't control you, even
though you're my kid, Like Ihave to do this for me, and
(47:57):
maybe it'll just sort of radiate outwards. I don't know, but at the
very least I want to be happy, absolutely, absolutely. And it's so
funny we're having this conversation because Christinaand I have been having a conversation over
the last several weeks about you can'tsee the light without the darkness. The
darkness makes the light shine brighter.So bring on the monsters, bring,
(48:20):
bring them on, Bring them allon. Get scared, get frightened,
cower in the corner, just likethey did in the Crampist movie. Right,
Yes, everybody huddled together and butyou got you gotta look back.
And once again this is the familyunited yep around a common enemy and it
(48:40):
brought them together. So are monstersreally a bad thing? I don't think
they are. I mean there mustbe. That's why we keep them and
the Crampist movie. Say what youwill about it on his artistic merit.
But like they nailed the spirit,Crampis is here for us. Crampis was
waiting in the shadows. He wasn'tangry. He was just waiting for us
(49:01):
to call him. That was it. He was just like he was just
filing his fingernails, going I'm here. When you need me, just just
let me know. And and hegot the movie deal and and now he's
in. My parents live in thislittle town in Connecticut, and they have
a Christmas parade which looks like anysmall town Christmas parade. You can imagine
the fire trucks, the marching bandfrom high school kids marching Sannah. But
(49:22):
they also had a Crampus last year, really wandering through their parade and people
are going, who's that and whyis that here? But if you know,
you know, and first started conversationsabsolutely, what's crampis? Why is
crampis here? And I mean thatparade, forget it. He's probably right
(49:44):
behind you, like he's right behindme. That's fascinating, you know.
H So, so yeah, no, he's coming back. I got to
attend a few years ago. TheNew England Crampus Society has an annual ball,
and of course COVID derailed that fora few years, but it's happening
(50:05):
again and I went last year.It was at the Narragansett Brewery in Providence,
Rhode Island, and it was allthese crampuses walking around and beer.
So I mean it's perfect, butyeah, I know right, it was
great. So there's people that arecelebrating Crampus and everything that Crampus represents,
and I think that I welcome it. I totally welcome it because we need
(50:29):
to be having these conversations and realizingthere's stuff that's much older, that's we've
seen little peaks of it here andthere, but I think it's coming in
having a renaissance right now. Sowe only have a couple of minutes left.
Believe it or not, we've gonethrough almost all of our time.
So jeff your book. Where's thebest place to get it? It's gone?
(50:51):
Amazon sold out weeks ago. Booksa million just sold out, Online,
bookshop dot org sold out. Thisis stores out there that still have
it. There's an audiobook version thatthat I narrate, and that's that you
can get that won't run out.You can get that in the electronic ebook
or kindle or whatever. That's thatwon't run out again. But the first
(51:14):
their own Yeah, yeah, Imean, so the first printing, first
edition is just about pretty much gone. If you're if you find one,
hold on to it because it'll Imean, I'm sure next year we'll see
another another printing of it. Butthis first one went faster than any of
us could have ever guessed, andthe publisher printed a lot. Now is
that something you're going to print mostlyat the holidays or do you think you'll
(51:36):
get it all year round? Youthink? I mean, if people will
get it. The publisher they've alreadyordered some to be that, but they
don't expect them until March. Andokay, No one thinks this. No
one expects this book to sell muchin the spring or the submar right,
It's just people that are just thatforward thinking, you know. But in
the fall, you know, they'llthere'll be another reprint. It will be
(51:58):
out again next year. And thatthe beautiful thing about a Christmas story is
that it can come out year afteryear. So yeah, the response to
this book was nothing. I like, nothing I'd ever seen. They just
sold out so fast. That's great. Yeah, so we'll see, we'll
see what happens next year. Andbut I also I really believe in the
story, and I think it soldout so fast because it must have resonated
(52:19):
with others too. And and thatnow we're you know, looking for that,
everybody's still looking for balance. Ibelieve that. Yeah. So I'm
doing my part, doing my partto summon these monsters from the dark recesses
of the holiday and say come onback. We need you, we need
we need you so badly to balancethis thing out and help us figure it
(52:40):
out again and be a little moreinclusive than we used to be. That's
great. And anything else coming up, I know you still have your show
New England Legends. You've got thatyou've got the podcast and you're still on
You're still on Prime. And yeah, yeah, we're still still working on
new podcast episodes every week and that'sstill going. Still working on Ghost Adventures.
We're about to start filming our nextseason next week or two weeks.
(53:02):
Wow, yeah, very soon thenext season starts filming again. And yeah,
and still always working on new projectsand pitching ideas you never know when
one catches on, and then workingon that. So well. Jeff,
thank you so much for being here. It's been a real pleasure having you
back, hearing all about Christmas.I want to wish everyone a very happy
new year. We'll see you intwenty twenty four. Christina, Jeff,
(53:25):
thank you so much. Have awonderful night, everybody. Take care,
Thank you, thank you. You'vebeen listening to The Paranormal Project radio show
with Scott Allen and Christina Bowen.Be sure to subscribe so you don't miss
the next episode. While you're there, leave us a rating and review.
(53:50):
We'll be back next week with moreexciting guests. Now, go out there
and explore the Paranormal
The Paranormal Project Radio Show. Areare your hosts, Scott Allen and Christina
(00:38):
Bowen. Hello, everyone, andwelcome back to the Paranormal Project Radio Show.
This is our special in between Christmasand New Year's show. It's actually
pre recorded, but we're glad tobe here tonight with a very special guest.
Hi, Christina, how are youdoing? Doing great? Going a
little crazy with the holidays, butI know, I get it, I
(01:00):
get it. But it's almost over. Then we'll be in the dead of
winter and praying for Memorial Day,which is why January first. So our
guests today I don't want to wasteany time, is author, explorer,
podcaster, storyteller, adventurer Jeff Balanger. And you know he was on our
show, I don't know last yearor the year before now, and he
(01:21):
has a new book out the frightbefore Christmas, so I thought what better
time of year to bring him onto talk about his new book. He's
also the host of the new EnglandLegends series on Prime and PBS, and
he also has the podcast of EnglandLegends as well, so we're going to
bring him out. Jeff Balanger,Welcome to the show. How are you
(01:42):
Hello? Good to be back withboth of you. I am so glad
to have you with us today.How did this How long you've been working
on this book? And how didthis come out? Yeah, so it's
funny. The it started really aboutten years ago, when it was an
early and cold December day and Iwas hanging lights outside for the holidays.
(02:02):
Half of them didn't work. Theyworked when I put them in the box
eleven months ago. They are notworking now. And then I was putting
a Christmas wreath on my front door. The wreath was plastic, fake.
Everything about it was fake, exceptthe pine cones, but those were still
sprayed with plastic. And the craftingwire I used to attached it to the
door knocker was old and rusted,and it broke and fell to the ground,
(02:24):
and I was just like, humbug. I didn't say humbug. It
was like a string of swares thatlike somewhere news somewhere, hadn't been invented
yet. And you know others wereold classics, you know. I dusted
off the hits, played them all, played them all, and as I
(02:49):
sat stood there with my fingers likenumb I was just like, why am
I doing this? I'm a Halloweenguy. Why am I out here in
the cold putting lights up? Whythe lights? Why the evergreen? Why?
December twenty fifth? Why Santa Claus? Why do we go into hawk
for this one day of the year. Why so much trouble? Why?
Why? Why? Why? Why? And I'm the kind of person that
once those questions start knocking around inmy head, I don't really sleep well
(03:14):
until I start to find those answers. And then that old there was a
Christmas lyric jumped into my head inthat moment, Andy Williams singing, There'll
be scary ghost stories and tales ofthe glories of Christmases long long ago,
And I went, all right,what was Andy Williams talking about? Because
when I grew up, I hadRudolph the Red Nose Reindeer and not much
else, And so what does hemean scary ghost stories? I'm a Halloween
(03:37):
person. Why should I should justskip this holiday? But then I started
diving in, and I said,all right, I'm gonna have to break
this thing apart into all its originalpieces and put it back together again so
I could understand it. And Istarted to dive in, and I went,
oh, dear Lord, I wasalways a Halloween person because I like
spooky things. I like spooky,creepy things. And I would learn through
(03:59):
this journey that, oh my,have I been loving the wrong holiday all
these years? Yeah, because Halloweenis the second spookiest holiday of the year.
It is a distant, distant,distant second, and it can't hold
a candle to Christmas when it comesto fright factor. And so it sort
of started there. And then Iwas asked to give a talk on Crampis
(04:23):
the Christmas Devil, and I went, well, I've been meaning to look
into the old guy a little moreanyway, And one thing just sort of
led to another, and so thiswas all born as like a stage show
where I was telling the story ofChristmas and the monsters in the darkness around
it. And then a couple ofyears ago, publisher contacted me and said
this should be a book, andI said, yeah, I've been meaning
to get to that, and thenbut I don't want to just be like
(04:44):
another book, and they're like,no, no, no, no,
we want this to be like fullcolor, hardcover, beautiful, like gift
book. And I just went reallytwisted and sick. I'm in I mean,
let's right, Yeah, that's kindof my wheelhouse, so let's do
this. And so so it wasreally it was like ten years in the
making, and many of the storieswere crowdsurced sourced. I would tell the
(05:06):
stories in front of live audiences andsome would come up and go, I
can't believe you left off whatever,and I'd write it down and I'd go
home and I go, God,that's good, I can't believe it.
And then you know, the nextaudience would get that one, and it
just grew and grew. But itturns out and then also too, I
started to get mad. I wasraised Roman Catholic, which I feel like
I should divulge here in the beginning. And when I was growing up,
(05:29):
you know, Christmas was a verybig deal in my house, right,
and my priest though, father Lawler, kind of a mean guy for being
honest. He I remember him hatingSanta Claus and thinking, what, like
I was five years five or sixyears old and Santa was coming to our
church hall and all the kids therewere beyond excited because I don't know,
(05:54):
the world's biggest celebrity is coming.Yeah. Yeah, So all of a
sudden in walks Santa freaking clause,and he's got a big sack, and
he's got candy canes for all thekids, and little wrapped gifts which turn
out to be plastic rosary beads forall the kids, and what I've always
wanted, you know, just likeleering at Santa Claus trying to shoot death
(06:15):
lasers out of his eyes, tryingto like kill Santa with his brain.
And I remember looking at father Lawlaand being like, what's wrong with you?
That's Santa Claus. This guy's literallylike bigger than Jesus. Uh oh
oh maybe, oh oh that's why. Oh so anyway, I think he
(06:36):
was sort of telling me in hisown angry, bitter way that this holiday
has nothing in the world to dowith Jesus. And boy was he right.
He was right. Pagan is theday is long? Yeah, forgive
me. It's as pagan as theday is short. True. So yeah,
(06:58):
So it turns out all the fuss, all this fuss is over one
thing, and that's the Winter solstice. It is the shortest day and the
longest darkest night. Winter is coming. It's a time to be afraid.
It's a time to ask yourself ifyou have enough food and fuel to get
through the winter. It's a timeto put your bigones aside and party with
your neighbors because we're gonna need eachother to get through this season. And
(07:19):
if we've been having arguments all year, it's time for me to give you
gifts and for us to drink andeat together and say I'm sorry, because
if anything goes wrong, I mightbe knocking at your door and asking to
stay with you, and you mightbe doing the same. Mm hmm.
And that was it, So thatthat was the impetus. And then there's
so many pieces, and I've learnedthat this holiday was originally the most inclusive
(07:45):
of all holidays. Had nothing todo with what you believed or didn't believe,
or who you prayed to or didn'tpray to. Made no difference if
you live in a place where winter'snot so easy. That was it.
Holiday was for you, the soalstice, whether you want to call it Saturnalia
or Yule or midwinter or Christmas.It was always always about getting ready to
hunker down because the long winter's comingright right, So so the fright before
(08:13):
Christmas, Crampus where did he fitin? So if you are trying to
explain to your loved ones, especiallyyour children, about why it's so important
that we stay inside. Now,us adults know, if you wander outside
and the cold and the dark,and you're caught unprepared, you will die.
(08:35):
You'll die from the elements. You'llyou know, you'll go hypothermic,
You'll fall down dead, and that'sthe end of it. So whether the
elements kill your child or a monsterkills your child is kind of irrelevant.
If you teach them this is thetime to stay inside, This is the
time to stay safe among your people, because out there there's literally monsters lurking.
(08:56):
Maybe maybe some of these monsters arehere to help, you know,
weird twisted sideways around the back kindof way. And so Crampis was born
in Austria, in Germany and inthe Mountainous region. He's many centuries old,
and he eventually got connected with SaintNicholas, and Saint Nicholas was a
(09:16):
real historical figure born in Myra modernday Turkey, becase he was born into
a wealthy family, he was anorphan from a young age, and he
spent his whole life giving his moneyaway, building orphanages and hospitals and giving
dowries to the poor and throwing coinsthrough windows. Gave it all away because
that's what made him feel good.And he became the patron saint for a
(09:37):
lot of groups, pawnbrokers for one's, nailors for another, and children and
children as well. And when hedied on December sixth, which is an
important day, December sixth became SaintNicholas Day. That's the day that Saint
Nicholas brings presents to the good girlsand boys around Europe. And if Saint
(09:58):
Nicholas and Santa are one and thesame in your head, anyone listening right
now, I'm gonna ask you togo ahead and split him apart, at
least for the next hour or so, like the rest of the world does.
Saint Nicholas arrives on December sixth,Santa Claus comes on December twenty fifth.
Certainly plenty of similarities and crossover,however they are they are different.
(10:20):
So if December sixth is Saint NicholasDay, December fifth becomes the day for
consequence and judgment. And that's whereCrompus fits in. He comes on down,
He arrives often with Saint Nicholas.He's a monster covered in fur.
He's got long horns and a longforked red tongue. He's covered in chains
so you can hear him coming,and he carries a scratchy sack. And
(10:43):
on December fifth, the evening Kropusknocked. He'll come around and scoop up
all the naughty children, stuff himin the sack, bring him back to
his lair and kill them. Socome December sixth, Saint Nicholas Day,
Saint Nicholas can bring presents to allthe good girls and boys, because that's
all that's left alive. Oh that'sa pleasant thought, isn't that. So
it wouldn't it be great joy ofthe year one day if we could get
(11:07):
rid of all the jerks in theworld, like now we're not doing a
show on the purge, that's youknow, I mean, let's face it,
I think that would be pretty wonderful. So so that was that was
where it all sort of started.And and if people have called incorrectly Santa
uh crampis rather the anti Saint Nicholasor the enemy of Saint Nicholas, not
(11:28):
true at all at all. Theseguys just did the work. He did
the work. They they would arrivetogether cohorts, good cop like that easy
right, And and nor is crampas evil. You know, every society
needs someone that dulls out the punishment, someone that that you know, handles
that, and that was crampis.That doesn't mean you can't love your job,
(11:52):
you know what I mean. Youare a little twisted, aren't you.
But that doesn't make you evil.You know, you should enjoy your
work. Well, you know,killing the killing the little children, I
don't know. I mean, that'sso that's a little bit, that's that's
a little rough. I mean onthe surface, sure, yeah, but
over time he became very metaphorical,you know. And and then he also
(12:15):
carries a switch of sticks as youcan see behind me. And then he
was known to just beat the naughtychildren as opposed to kill them, just
sort of like correcting them. Buthe was always sort of the consequence for
bad behavior. When I was akid, I was warned, I'll get
less presents, or at the veryworst, I'll have coal and sticks in
my stocking, which is what Iwas. Yeah, I mean, you
(12:37):
know, you could behave badly fora whole year and coal and sticks,
so what you know what I mean, Yeah, all the cookies. I
stole all the nights. I stayedup late. Small price to pay.
There you go. But that's notreally much of a consequence. Cramps and
there are many other monsters as well, brings that consequence. And uh and
(12:58):
of course today he's blowing up.He's getting movie deals, you know,
he's in twenty fifteen, the Crampistmovie came out. It was sort of
a cult classic. It's getting playedyear after. You know my Christmas playlist?
Yeah, yeah, you watch It'sa Wonderful Life and then crampis back
to back. Yeah, I wantto see a crossover, you know,
(13:20):
or Jimmy Stewart's like, oh hey, crap, what's going on? You
know every that would have been brilliantRings Crapus is coming and you little run
I need to see that on thebig screen. Yeah, I know,
some c g I folks, wecould. We're gonna have to start a
gofund me, I guess, butwe can get this done. That would
(13:43):
be awesome, would it? Ohmy gosh? Oh yeah? So did
I mean did you grow up withscary girl stories or monsters in your well,
not at Christmas time, although youknow I did go to Catholic school.
So there was Sister Francis. Shecarried sticks. Yeah, that was
the consequence. But so you grewup with the was that our lady of
inadvertent flatulence? Is that? Yes? Yes, yeah, that's the one.
(14:09):
They were rough. They were roughthere. They've turned out many a
psychic medium, I assure you,yes, they literally beat the psychic right
India. Oh my god, Idon't see any dead people. Wa wam.
Brought me to the edge. Nowit's open. I didn't know I
(14:31):
was gonna laugh so much. Thisis great. So yeah, so it's
really so. The holiday and many, especially northern European countries, incorporate these
various monsters. They're out there lurkingin the dangerous, long, dark,
cold night. And then parents discoveredthat they could use them to keep their
kids in line. And so,uh, anyone who's ever been a parent
(14:54):
and been trying desperately to get justa little bit of quiet time at night
before you yourself have to go tobed, No, at times you get
desperate, and uh I picture,I mean imagine, imagine instead of being
told you know Santa's watching, oryou know you're gonna get less presents,
imagine just crampis standing in the corner, just hitting the sticks against He's just
(15:15):
just sitting quietly, you know,like you're you're watching, yeah, and
your parents are like, hey,did you take an extra cookie? Cramps
And he just kind of leans forward. Not yet, buddy, Just wait,
he's ready, you know, justhe's ready, just hitting the sticks
like yep, watching everybody. I'mready. Just say the word and I'm
on the job. You know,Santa is time out and Crampis is the
(15:41):
time you're out because he's kno gettingyou out. I guess we're talking about
like misdemeanters and felonies. Right,that's it. There you go, Yeah,
that would be that's a good analogy. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
yeah, don't you know wildly popular. I mean there was postcards, lots
of postcards. If you want tospend a fun few minutes, go on
(16:02):
Google image search and just type inCrampis postcards. You'll see those old vintage
ones. Yeah. I love those. Yeah, that's what you gave instead
of Christmas cards. You'd send those. And they were wildly popular and Crampis
was everywhere. But around the nineteenteens nineteen twenties, he very quickly went
out of fashion when Santa Claus tookover the Christmas holiday. There's a direct
(16:26):
one to one correlation there, youknow. On once it became about Santa,
then all the monsters had to goaway. But Crampis is just one
one of many. Through the veryfolklore of it. Wasn't the current Santa
that everybody sees and things that wasn'tthat linked to a Coca Cola advertisement early
back then? Is outfit? Sure? Is? Yeah? What you when
(16:48):
you when someone says Santa Claus andyou picture in your mind what he looks
like. Coca Cola taught us thatin the nineteen twenties, and what was
happening was that America was in agreat depression and the only way out of
a great depression, economic depression orrecession for that matter, is to spend
money. And if you don't havemoney, how do you do that?
(17:08):
And if you do have a littlebit of money, your instinct is to
save it and not spend it.But Coca Cola came up with this,
like they took. Santa had beenevolving since really like the eighteen fifties or
so. He showed up in Harper'smagazine. Thomas Nast twas the Night Before
Christmas was written by Clement Moore.That really started to make the figure bigger
(17:29):
and bigger. But it was thenineteen twenties when Coca Cola developed this ad
campaign and the thing is it worked. People bought coke, and then the
following year people that sold anything donutsand pizza, cars and whatever, they
were like, wait, wait,wait, Coca Cola does not own Santa
Claus, we could use them too. And so the world's biggest celebrity was
(17:52):
out there promoting for free products andservices everywhere, and America started to crawl
out of the Great Depression. Thanksgivingwas moved to the fourth Thursday in November
instead of the last Thursday because retailersneeded more time for shopping for Christmas.
And what's good for the economy isgood for the America. And then that
Christmas squarely became about consumerism at thatpoint. That's what it was all about.
(18:17):
It was about making sure we spend, spend, spend, and all
the monsters, all the consequences hadto go away. That's that's what was
so important, was to you know, make sure that nobody's scared. We
want everybody happy, bye bye bye. And that's where it sat but I'm
here today to warn you that thesemonsters are coming back. And they're coming
back because they're showing up at popculture references, they're getting movie deals,
(18:40):
they're they're in parades again. Weare bringing back the darker side of this
holiday, and I think just intime to save ourselves. So is your
balance? Yeah, yeah, thegood guy, the bad guy. I
love that. I'm all about balancein this world, anyhow, I agree
well also to think about this inmy experience anyway, I don't know of
(19:04):
anybody that can't make changes for thebetter without fear. Unless you are afraid
of something, how can you likeif you know, like it's a good
idea to eat more vegetables and takewalks and exercise regularly. You know that
that's just Everyone knows that, butyou know it's tough to put it into
(19:25):
practice until your doctor says, youjust had a minor cardiac event. The
next one could kill you. Ifyou do ABC and D, you might
keep this away and be okay.And then you say, oh my,
I'm not ready to die. You'rescared you make changes. This holiday offers
us this inherent darkness, this inherentdanger, and if we face the gauntlet
(19:47):
of these ghosts, of these monsters. Then we might come out the other
side better for it. And everythingcan change in one night. And I
know a guy who did change inone night thanks to some ghosts haunting him.
I've heard of him. Yeah,I believe it was four or foor
ghosts. The first, of course, was Jacob Marley, the one everyone
(20:10):
forgets. Yes, yeah, that'sthe and he's most important. He's the
one that shows up and says tohis old business partner, Scrooge, you
know I'm covered in chains, chainsI forged in life. They were just
as long as yours seven Christmases ago, this very night, and you've worked
on yours ever since. It's aponderous chain. But there's a chance for
(20:30):
you, Scrooge. You are goingto have to face down three more spirits.
And if you get through this,and Jacob Marley arranged it, he
made it happen. You get throughthis, you might make it. And
Scrooge, of course, has toface his past, the ghost of Christmas
past, see his lonely self atthe boarding house, sees his sister dieing
childbirth, sees him self falling inlove and then getting his job with old
(20:52):
Fezziwig, but then also sees himselffalling in love with something else with money,
and then losing the love of hislife, and you see him turn
into this hardened man. The Ghostof Christmas Present shows him a world where
Christmas cheer is everywhere, even inthe poor houses and workhouses, even at
Bob Cratch's house, where Tiny Timis so sick, and if only they
had more money they could afford medicalhelp and nourishment. And Scrooge is in
(21:17):
a position to do something about that, but chooses not to. And then
finally the Ghost of Christmas Yet toCome shows him a bleak future where some
old guy dies and people are laughingabout it. Good to be rid of
him. And finally, when wesee the grave, we realize it's Scrooge.
And it's at that point in thestory where all of us who are
reading the book or watching it onTV or play or however you're consuming it,
(21:38):
were shocked because we go, oh, no, oh, no,
oh, no, I realize whoScrooge is. I had no idea he's
me. I'm Scrooge. I'm gettingolder and crankier. And then in the
next morning, of course, hewakes up to the bells of churches ringing,
and everything is different. He hasfaced as ghosts, faced as demons.
(21:59):
He's run that God. Let hecame out the other side, and
he can change everything in one instant. He can start giving to charity.
He sends a turkey to Bob Cratchit, he goes to see his nephews for
dinner. Everything is different in onesingle night. And that idea of redemption
overnight sounds so so very good.And it's there for us because of the
(22:21):
inherent danger ghosts and monsters that arelurking in the shadows of the winter solstice.
I love that it's been there forus, right, it's I mean
the Christmas Carol's been around since theearly eighteen forties, that that story has
never gone away. You know,it shows up year after year. It's
(22:41):
we've seen muppets do it. We'veseen it on stage, we've seen it
in cartoons. You know, we'vewe won ice yeah, yeah, yeah.
Have you seen it at north ShoreMusic Theater Have you seen their version?
So they they've been doing it fordecades. And the man that plays
Screwed just from Texas and I actuallyhad him on the show last year for
(23:03):
this very spot to talk about hisrole as Screwge because I thought, you
know, what's more paranormal than aChristmas carol? Really, you know,
And it was a great it's greathow it's all kind of like tied in
together like that. It's so it'ssuch an important story and that you can't
say enough what Charles Dickens did todefine the holiday. The holiday was not
(23:23):
a thing. It was not Itwas like groundhog Day, like the way
you think of groundhog Day now ishow people thought of Christmas then just to
day. Most people went to workand school and everything else, and Parliament
was in session and all that otherstuff. But this book suddenly said like,
no, this is a day,this is this is special, and
it's a time to give to charity, and it's and it's a secular book
(23:48):
too. I mean, you know, the Birth of Jesus is mentioned,
barely gets one sentence in the wholebook, but it's really about how you're
supposed to feel about it. Andwhat he's doing is he's tapping into centuries
of Saturday and Yule and these festivalsthat have been omnipresent, you know,
and so many things we do todaystill connect us to those very old ways
(24:08):
when you put up a Christmas tree, when you put a wreath on your
front door, when you put uplights on your trees outside, when you
baked goods, when you make eggnogand get drunk with friends, when you
go to your office party and getloaded. You know you are participating in
Saturday A. Yeah, you're participatingin Yule. Right. It shines through.
(24:32):
But we fooled ourselves into thinking like, oh, this is how we
celebrate Christmas. And it is.But it was not wrong because the Church
took what was already happening, thoughexactly, and rolled it into their own
version. And that's super modern.I mean, Christians have been at war
with Christmas since about three point thirtysix eighty until like nineteen seventy, you
(24:56):
know, like they literally banned it. When the Puritans were in charge of
British Parliament, they banned Christmas.They called it satanical. To dress fine,
give gifts, make merry, you'dbe fined five shillings, which is
about three days wages for the workingclass back then. And even when the
band was lifted, preachers were preachingfrom the pulpit we do more to dishonor
(25:17):
Christianity in the twelve days of Christmasthan in all twelve months combined. And
they were they were furious with theholiday because it was so so pagan,
And then finally somewhere along the waythey just sort of gave up and said
it was ours all along. Don'tsay, you know, Jesus is the
reason for the season. And allwe know is that if it were important,
if the birth story of Jesus wasimportant, it would get a lot
(25:40):
more ink in the Bible. Itgets hardly a mention. And if the
date was important, that would betold to you in the Bible. It's
not. It's just all we knowis that shepherds were sleeping out in the
field at night keeping watch over theirflock, and in Bethlehem they did that
in the spring, summer, andfall. They did not do it,
which means, know, we canrule out December. But you know here,
(26:03):
no there, right, we knowthey just picked a day. No,
they didn't pig a day it was, but I mean it wasn't the
day, the actual day, no, no, right, yeah, of
course, yea, the actual celebration. It was the celebration of the birth,
but it wasn't the anniversary of thebirth. And so that happened with
the Emperor Constantine in Rome. Hewas he was the first Christian emperor.
(26:26):
He's trying to unify Rome. Jesuswas born a commoner. That's that's a
very important part of the Christian storyand Christianity. Of course, hinges on
Easter, not on Christmas. Whatdefines you as a Christian is that you
believe in Easter everyone is born,all of us are born. But the
death and resurrection, that's not somethingeverybody does. And so that's what defines
(26:47):
Christianity. Easter is the very biggestholiday in Christianity. From a theological perspective,
it's just nobody, but nobody gotthe memo right exactly so. But
but the Emperor Constantine was trying tosell Jesus to the Romans. He was
trying to unify under one religion,didn't ban the others. Knew he couldn't
(27:08):
ban Saturnalia, which was December seventeenthto the twenty third. But he knew
if Jesus is going to be aking, not just a king, but
a king of kings, he needsa birthday, and he knows the perfect
birthday is December twenty fifth, becausein the Julian calendar. The twenty fifth
was the winter solstice, and thatwas the festival of Saul and victis this
(27:29):
sun God. It's the shortest day, but it's also marks the day where
the sun starts to return, andthere's hole the light, so it's coming
back, and it will build andbuild all the way until the summer solstice,
when you get the longest day andthe shortest night. And so so
that was it. He thought thatwas a perfect day to celebrate Jesus.
You have this raging party. Theseventeenth to the twenty third, one day
(27:52):
for the hangover. On the twentyfourth, twenty fifth, we party again.
And Christians were at war with thatdate right up until very modern times.
Here we are and here we are. So so your book is it?
Is it? Is that all ofthat? Or is it really doesn't
(28:14):
focus on Crampus. No, it'snot just cuss as one chapterus. I
mean, let's face it, he'ssexy, he's got the movie deals,
he dines in the restaurants we can'tget into, you know, he's list,
he sells, he sells. Butbut no, I cover the whole
history of Christmas. How we gothere, how we got to December twenty
fifth, the history of Saint Nicholas, the history of Santa Claus, and
(28:36):
then the many other monsters that lurk. Not just Crampis, but you know,
Iceland has got stuff that's even worsereally and brings us the Grilla and
Crampis No, that's the matty loadfrom Wales. That's the dead horse that
rises from the grave to try toget in your house for treats and alcohol.
Yeah, which is awesome too.So the gorilla is the She's an
(29:03):
ogre who lives up in the mountainsand she's got thirteen tails, and she
comes down around the winter solstice.And unlike crap like, if you're a
good person, you don't have toworry about crampis not your concern. Rila,
on the other hand, does notdiscriminate good kids bad kids. Makes
no difference. If you're lost inwandering out in the woods, she will
(29:23):
scoop you up, bring you backto her lair, cut you up,
cook you in a stew and eatyou. Oh. Parents are happy to
tell this story in Iceland. Sowhen Iceland was first settled only about eleven
hundred years ago, there were nopeople there. When the Europeans first arrived,
it was covered by ice, youknow, much before that. But
(29:44):
there were trolls and monsters and impocen, fairies and all kinds of magical creatures.
And as they started to settle intoas the people started to settle into
villages and towns, those creatures gotpushed up into the mountains. But on
the soalstice they come down to collectwhat's owed to them, if you will.
And so the Grilla is the queen, the matriarch of the whole dysfunctional
(30:06):
family. And also you have tounderstand too, in reikievic the capital right
now, the round the solstice,there's about four hours of sunlight. That's
it. That the sun rises andsets in like four hours. If you
go further north it's less. Andif you get to the very northern tip
of Iceland, you're almost at theArctic circle, where there is no sunrise.
It is total darkness. This isthe time we stay inside, we
(30:29):
stay safe, We keep our childreninside because there are monsters lurking out there
and it's dangerous. So the Grilla, she also has she's in charge of
the Ulads, who are these thirteentrolls that come down one by one throughout
the month of December and stay atyour home for two weeks and mess with
you, like one month, stealyour cow's milk. One will you know,
(30:52):
lick your spoons clean after dinner.Another peeps through your window. Another
steals your meat, another steals yourcandles, and there steals your yogurt.
And and they just all come,you know, all throughout the month,
and and it's a it's a wildtime. And Iceland, I mean even
on the news each night they'll say, like tonight is the you know,
the sheep Cote Claude who will comeand poke your sheep, So watch out
(31:15):
for that. Yeah, and hestays for two weeks. So this lore
and legend ties us back to reallyancient ways and reminds us that, you
know, there's there's other stuff outthere. And Iceland's amazing. Iceland they'll
re route highways because they believe that'slike a troll rock. You know,
you can't blast that rock. We'regoing to go around it. I've heard
(31:37):
that. So that's amazing, youknow, like that's they they take it
seriously. And so the Grila hasbecome also part of their own pop culture.
If you land at the Reikivic Airportright now, there will be a
giant cauldron with a big ogre witchlike stirring in it, and you can
get in the cauldron and get yourpicture taken with the with the greela like
we do Malsanta. They've got that, which is also I know, right,
(32:02):
I know. And there's so somany like of these various monsters,
all across various cultures. Every countryalmost has their own version of something,
and it's uh, I think it'sa wonderful way to connect to the darker
side the balance, as you weresaying, Christine, the balance, Yeah,
like you just can't. Did youever eat like some cake that was
(32:23):
just too damn sweet? Yeah?And may you got to go and have
chips to balance it out. That'swhat we did to Christmas. We made
the cake too sweet. You knowsomething else and and and we're collectively working
on that right this very minute.You know that it's changing, and I
think changing for the better. Thisstuff speaks to something very ancient and primal
(32:45):
in all of us, something Ithink a lot of people and especially in
today's society, that we have forgotten. Yeah this, you know, we've
forgotten where we come from and we'vemade up all these fancy stories to explain
things, and then we have thesebig parties and they said, everybody's forgetting
where the roots of it where itstarted. Yeah, and it's but it's
(33:08):
always been there. It always,it always had a way to shine through
even when you no matter what labelyou slapped on it, whether you're hanging
mistletoe or or eating a yule logspeaking of cakes that are too sweet,
right, like that that used tobe a tree that you burned, you
know it was. There's so manythings that sort of made their way through
(33:32):
and which I think is amazing.What a test of it to these old
ways that they make it through allthe way to present day, even if
people don't understand why they're doing itor where it came from. And I
think that's really sort of wonderful.So now you know, last year I
started a new tradition where I makemy own wreath. I actually go out
(33:53):
in the woods and I pull evergreenbranches and I twist them into a wreath
and all this other stuff. Andit came out hard. It's a mess,
but I will say this, itworked. Those prickly needles kept the
bad cheer outside and the good cheerinside. It meant as a green witch.
This warms my heart. That's whatI do. I've got oranges drying
(34:16):
right now to hang, So soyou do it instead of just putting a
fake plastic wreath on my door.Because my dad did it, and my
dad's dad did it, and myneighbors do it, and it looks nice
and all that other stuff. Ithas meaning, I'm putting it up with
intent to keep the bad stuff outsideand keep the good stuff inside. This
(34:37):
tree is more powerful than winter.Our ancestors didn't pick it arbitrarily. I
mean they would look out of thelandscape and see that winter killed everything.
It killed the flowers and the grassand the trees. They're just skeletons,
kills, the ponds and the lakesfrozen solid. But then you go,
wait a minute, wait a minute, what's that tree that winter can't kill
it. It must be magical,it must be powerful. There must be
(35:00):
something about it. And so wetake those branches and we put them over
our doors and windows, and weput them, you know, in wreaths
over our doors, to keep thekeep the bad spirits out. Spirits.
We can clearly hear by the waybecause in the wintertime, you hear this
shrieking, howling sound that you don'thear in the spring, summer, or
fall. And you could say,well, it's just the wind whipping through
(35:21):
the trees, or you could saythose are the cries of the vanquished foe
of the Norse god Odin as herides through the sky and his wild hunt.
And if I don't protect myself,they'll get in. And if they
get in, then things aren't goingto go well for me. And we
still do that, which I thinkis so cool. Well, what about
the trees, like the Christmas trees? Yes, so the Christmas tree.
(35:44):
Well again this is this is theone tree more powerful than winter like.
You don't need to be a botanistor otherwise to figure that out. Just
look look outside, see what's stillalive. And so so our ancestors knew
it too. It provides you shelterif you're stuck outside. You know,
it's some shape and some protection fromwind and everything else. This tree is
absolutely something about It is powerful.And not only that, when our ancestors
(36:07):
would make a kill in the winter, they would pull the entrails of the
animal out and drape it around theevergreens two reasons. One is to make
an offering to the tree. Theother is that other animals could pick that
clean and they too could survive thewinter. And I want everybody to really
let that sink in and think aboutit. If you're ever stringing popcorn and
cranberries to put his garland around yourChristmas tree, well that's just a completely
(36:31):
different visual. I say, let'shave a more traditional Christmas this year.
Get yourself some entrails, put themaround the tree. I know the smell
is going to be awful, it'llbe terrible, but that an orange will
cover it. Yeah, you'll needa few oranges. But when people walk
in and go, oh my god, what is that, you could say
that is the smell of an authenticand traditional Christmas, Thank you very much.
(36:54):
You can start out with some sausagelinks. It might be easier to
go and have to kill something.Sure, sure, sure, yeah,
but that's it. I mean,think about how in Testine like cranberry and
popcorn. Look, that's what you'redoing. You're you're you're literally recreating the
entrails around a tree. Fascinating,beautiful, really just it's a lovely thought.
(37:15):
I know, I know, right. You thought you were just gonna
get like a monster story and youyou finally understand so wrong. It's just
so wrong. They have to havea lot of guts to come in and
tell a story like that. Itell you, Yeah, but he's always
good for a dad joke, always, so yeah, so many, so
many great traditions are born from this, this holiday and now growing up too,
(37:39):
I remember I had Jewish friends andI was like, this sucks.
You know, Santa doesn't visit you, Like, what's up with that?
Is any anti semi you know?And and then I realized, I was
like, but he could. Youknow, Santa does not have to be
exclusively Christian at all. And youcould put up a tree, and you
could put up lights. Those arenot Christian symbols whatsoever. And you not
(38:00):
doing that is your own choice.Obviously no one has to. But don't
tell yourself you're not doing it becauseoh that those that's what Christians do.
I mean, yes, it iswhat they do, but it's it's not
their symbol either. And so Ithink if you like the lights, if
you think they're pretty, put themup, you know, put them Yeah,
(38:22):
And we do it, by theway, because we literally want to
be a beacon during this long,dark, dangerous night and winter that that
we want to find our way backhome in the dark. We want our
neighbors and friends to be able tofind us if they need us. That's
what we Yeah, that's why wedo it. It's not just to run
up the electric bills and you knowit's or to outdo our neighbors, but
(38:43):
it's it's it's something that that hasthat always had meaning. We need to
be beacons in this this long darknight. I love that. So this
is just all right up my alley. I'm I'm a blend of all the
different traditions. Yeah, because Ihave a Christmas tree, but I also
celebrate Yule and you know, soI blend it all together. Right,
(39:07):
Well, that's that to me,that's redundant. Like the Christmas tree and
celebrating Yule goes hand in hand.That's now it's saying I'm a Christian with
a Christmas tree. That's blending traditions. Right. I celebrate the birth of
Jesus and I put entrails on myChristmas tree. That's blending traditions. You're
just you're being consistents this year.Maybe you do you you know, all
(39:36):
good, all good, Yeah,stick to the cinnamon sticks and oranges.
Yeah, totally fine and understandable.Probably smells better the other thing too,
though. I remember thinking about howI didn't grow up with crampis and being
disappointed. Only now in hindsight,and I've I've had a good talk with
my parents about it. We've workedit out, you know. I said,
(39:58):
why didn't I have crampis? AndThey're like, we didn't know.
But then I thought about it,and I said, you know what crampis
was in my childhood. He wasin yours too, By the way,
I need you to think back.He was there, he was green,
and he lived on Mount Crumpets.Yes, he was there, just to
look the same as you know himnow. He was there. He was
(40:22):
just neon green. Yes, hewas green. He didn't have horns,
but his hair could like curl intolike girl lived on Mount Crumpet. Long.
Lot of similarities there that I nevermade that connection. Yeah. So
anyway, am I here tonight toaccuse doctor Seuss of plagiarism? Yes,
(40:43):
yes, accused doctor Seuss. TheGrinch worked because he probably was something a
little bit familiar. There was somethingabout him we're like, I like this
grinch. I don't know why,but he wasn't out killing the kids.
But you know, yeah, there'sthere's a story. But there's an old
adage, right that talent borrows,but genius steals. Oh, I hadn't
(41:12):
heard that one doctor Seuss was agenius. Well he was. Yeah,
No, I know, I getI get it, and I get that
like the idea of all this canbe really uncomfortable for some people because it's
just the antithesis of everything they thoughthow things are supposed to work. But
if you read the old Grim fairytales, the Originals, there's ship they
(41:37):
really are. Yeah, of coursethey are the originals, but they've disneyfied
everything, and ye because they usedto teach you a lesson and now they
don't. Well, the lessons learnedwhen it's extreme. And so for example
Cinderella, right in the original GrimTales, when the wicked stepsisters were trying
(42:00):
on the glass slipper, one ofthem cut their toes off to try to
wedge it into the glass slipper,and they filled the glass slipper with blood.
Couldn't get her foot in the otherone cut her heel off. Also
filling it with blood. Again.You'd think someone would watch that and go,
you know what, No, didn'twork. This isn't your shoe clearly
(42:21):
right flipped by Walt Disney that somehowgot didn't make it to the final edit
of the cartoon Disney version. Butthe grim tails were meant to be tough
because number one, we know,we know as adults there's monsters in the
world. Yeah, no question,you know. You have the news.
In Bulgaria they have the Cara Concolis, who comes out during the twelve days
(42:43):
of Christmas, the days they callthe Unbaptized Days the Unholy Days, and
the Cara Concolus is a subterranean bigfootwith glowing red eyes and claws, and
he's covered in fur, and hecomes out at sundown and he's going to
try to jump on your back andclaw at you until dawn before he has
to go underground again. But he'sa shape shifter. He can look like
anyone and anything, and he's alsosort of keeping tabs on you. And
(43:07):
so I love that story because thatis the most authentic monster, I think
in the world, because we know, we know when we watch the news
that there are monsters as we justsaid. They do horrible things. They
kill people, hurt people, shootpeople, you know, in groups.
(43:28):
And the thing is, if theyhad like glowing red eyes and were eight
feet tall and covered in fur andhad razor claws, we would just know
to run. That's easy. Yousee that real monsters look just like us.
And that is the frightening thing ofall. And so, yeah,
let me tell you about the Caraconcolus. Maybe that's just a regular old
(43:52):
person, or maybe it's a monsterin disguise. And we have to really
be careful when we're out there amongststrangers or even people we thought we knew,
because you never know. And soall of these stories, all the
all these legends, all these monstershave a moral to them that that we
you know, we teach our childrenand we tell each other because we need
(44:15):
to keep the bad cheer away.We need to be safe, We need
to be careful, and we needto be positive and look out for each
other. Because winter is coming,and it's coming again next year, you
know. And it's not just athing from a series on HBO. Yeah,
it's not just Game of Thrones,right, Winter is coming very very
(44:38):
soon, and so and once it'shere. You know that we got to
figure it out, We got toget through this. So oh sorry,
Jeff. Did these stories change inplaces where they didn't have the cold and
the darkness of winter the way thatwe do here, They did not catch
(44:58):
on like they do in southern partsbecause you know, so many of those
stories also made their way through England, and England, as you probably know,
colonize the world. Right at onepoint, the sun never set on
the British Empire, Australia, NewZealand, South Africa, Singapore, you
know. I mean, the Britsspread far and wide and took their stories
with them. But you know,when it's Christmas Day and you're at the
(45:23):
beach sipping a mytai in the Caribbean, it's a little bit. So I've
always said, like, how doyou see the light when you're on a
beach on a bright sunny day withlike the surf tickling your toes. You
don't see the light. The lightis everywhere, things are fine, you
know, you see the light whenyou get into a very dark place,
(45:45):
that's when you can see the light. So these monsters did not travel well
to southern climates. They stay northto where winter was really a force to
be reckoned with and still is.You know, even though today we've got
door dash and you know heat thatwe can just turn up like hit it
a few degrees if we can affordthat. You know. Well, there's
(46:07):
those of us that still have theirchildhood collection of coal. I'm still working
on. So nice from just beingnaughty all those years, which is ironic,
which means being naughty paid off.There you go right like, oh,
I'm keeping warm, this is great. Oh it's so warm. Oh
that's nice. Thank goodness. Iwas such a brat. I could keep
(46:29):
warm for years on this. ThanksMom and Dad or whoever brought me that
coal. Yeah, I get yeah. So so yeah, there was a
time when colon sticks was like,oh, thank god, we're freezing right,
you know, we're going to this. Yeah, we're gonna toast right
(46:50):
up. I love that. Ohgosh. So so anyway, I I
was trying to save Christmas, evenif it was just from me. You
know, I was trying to,like say, like, because when I
was young, Christmas was a drug. You know. I was high on
that drug from the time the dessertfork played on Thanksgiving until the ball dropped
on New Year's Eve, and asI got older, a lot of that
(47:15):
magic went away until it was reallynot even there at all anymore. Then
I had a kid, and alot of that magic came back, which
was awesome. But now she's sixteenand she's you know, she's over it,
you know, and but I stillfind it, you know, I
found it again because of what itmeans. And even though she's sort of
(47:37):
over it, I'm still trying tobe like, hey, I don't care
whether you love it or hate it. There's still magic to be found and
had in this holiday, and I'mgoing to work on that, even if
it's just for me. And atthe end of the day, it takes
your whole life to sort of realize, like I can't control you, even
though you're my kid, Like Ihave to do this for me, and
(47:57):
maybe it'll just sort of radiate outwards. I don't know, but at the
very least I want to be happy, absolutely, absolutely. And it's so
funny we're having this conversation because Christinaand I have been having a conversation over
the last several weeks about you can'tsee the light without the darkness. The
darkness makes the light shine brighter.So bring on the monsters, bring,
(48:20):
bring them on, Bring them allon. Get scared, get frightened,
cower in the corner, just likethey did in the Crampist movie. Right,
Yes, everybody huddled together and butyou got you gotta look back.
And once again this is the familyunited yep around a common enemy and it
(48:40):
brought them together. So are monstersreally a bad thing? I don't think
they are. I mean there mustbe. That's why we keep them and
the Crampist movie. Say what youwill about it on his artistic merit.
But like they nailed the spirit,Crampis is here for us. Crampis was
waiting in the shadows. He wasn'tangry. He was just waiting for us
(49:01):
to call him. That was it. He was just like he was just
filing his fingernails, going I'm here. When you need me, just just
let me know. And and hegot the movie deal and and now he's
in. My parents live in thislittle town in Connecticut, and they have
a Christmas parade which looks like anysmall town Christmas parade. You can imagine
the fire trucks, the marching bandfrom high school kids marching Sannah. But
(49:22):
they also had a Crampus last year, really wandering through their parade and people
are going, who's that and whyis that here? But if you know,
you know, and first started conversationsabsolutely, what's crampis? Why is
crampis here? And I mean thatparade, forget it. He's probably right
(49:44):
behind you, like he's right behindme. That's fascinating, you know.
H So, so yeah, no, he's coming back. I got to
attend a few years ago. TheNew England Crampus Society has an annual ball,
and of course COVID derailed that fora few years, but it's happening
(50:05):
again and I went last year.It was at the Narragansett Brewery in Providence,
Rhode Island, and it was allthese crampuses walking around and beer.
So I mean it's perfect, butyeah, I know right, it was
great. So there's people that arecelebrating Crampus and everything that Crampus represents,
and I think that I welcome it. I totally welcome it because we need
(50:29):
to be having these conversations and realizingthere's stuff that's much older, that's we've
seen little peaks of it here andthere, but I think it's coming in
having a renaissance right now. Sowe only have a couple of minutes left.
Believe it or not, we've gonethrough almost all of our time.
So jeff your book. Where's thebest place to get it? It's gone?
(50:51):
Amazon sold out weeks ago. Booksa million just sold out, Online,
bookshop dot org sold out. Thisis stores out there that still have
it. There's an audiobook version thatthat I narrate, and that's that you
can get that won't run out.You can get that in the electronic ebook
or kindle or whatever. That's thatwon't run out again. But the first
(51:14):
their own Yeah, yeah, Imean, so the first printing, first
edition is just about pretty much gone. If you're if you find one,
hold on to it because it'll Imean, I'm sure next year we'll see
another another printing of it. Butthis first one went faster than any of
us could have ever guessed, andthe publisher printed a lot. Now is
that something you're going to print mostlyat the holidays or do you think you'll
(51:36):
get it all year round? Youthink? I mean, if people will
get it. The publisher they've alreadyordered some to be that, but they
don't expect them until March. Andokay, No one thinks this. No
one expects this book to sell muchin the spring or the submar right,
It's just people that are just thatforward thinking, you know. But in
the fall, you know, they'llthere'll be another reprint. It will be
(51:58):
out again next year. And thatthe beautiful thing about a Christmas story is
that it can come out year afteryear. So yeah, the response to
this book was nothing. I like, nothing I'd ever seen. They just
sold out so fast. That's great. Yeah, so we'll see, we'll
see what happens next year. Andbut I also I really believe in the
story, and I think it soldout so fast because it must have resonated
(52:19):
with others too. And and thatnow we're you know, looking for that,
everybody's still looking for balance. Ibelieve that. Yeah. So I'm
doing my part, doing my partto summon these monsters from the dark recesses
of the holiday and say come onback. We need you, we need
we need you so badly to balancethis thing out and help us figure it
(52:40):
out again and be a little moreinclusive than we used to be. That's
great. And anything else coming up, I know you still have your show
New England Legends. You've got thatyou've got the podcast and you're still on
You're still on Prime. And yeah, yeah, we're still still working on
new podcast episodes every week and that'sstill going. Still working on Ghost Adventures.
We're about to start filming our nextseason next week or two weeks.
(53:02):
Wow, yeah, very soon thenext season starts filming again. And yeah,
and still always working on new projectsand pitching ideas you never know when
one catches on, and then workingon that. So well. Jeff,
thank you so much for being here. It's been a real pleasure having you
back, hearing all about Christmas.I want to wish everyone a very happy
new year. We'll see you intwenty twenty four. Christina, Jeff,
(53:25):
thank you so much. Have awonderful night, everybody. Take care,
Thank you, thank you. You'vebeen listening to The Paranormal Project radio show
with Scott Allen and Christina Bowen.Be sure to subscribe so you don't miss
the next episode. While you're there, leave us a rating and review.
(53:50):
We'll be back next week with moreexciting guests. Now, go out there
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