Ep. 77 - The Mystic Touch Roller Coaster

Hello friends and enemies of the PoddyC Podcast. In this weeks episode we are discussing Scarizard leaving Blizzard, Class Changes, Upcoming Raids & So much more! hope you enjoy!

For Business Inquiries: [e-mail]

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, welcome to episode seventy seven of The pottyc. This
week a bunch of news including We'll start off with
some sad news. Scarzard has left the Wow dev team
effective I think next week, so in like a week
he's out of there, which, for those who don't know,
he's Max and I know him recently. Well, we did
an interview with him thing that was almost a podcast

(00:23):
but not quite, and he's responsible for a lot of
the cool rewards stuff that's been in the game for
the past two and a half. Expansions stuff like the
naming of the tear sets as well is kind of
been his baby. So yeah, very sad to see him go.
I've always been a big fan of his work.

Speaker 2 (00:40):
Yeah, really well received thing we did with him. I
think that interview interview slash podcast thing. I know the
community was really a fan. I think I don't know
how happy Blizzard was with him being like so talkative
and stuff, but I think people like seeing the passion
from developers. My thing with him is, so this is

(01:03):
truevil of a few people I've met at Blizzard, certainly,
but he's the one that whenever I hear people say, oh, man, developers,
you know, they don't play this game. They don't like
this game, you know, just the super Doomer no job stuff.
It always really bothers me because like when you know

(01:23):
some of these people that, I mean, he fucking loves Wow,
Like he plays the shit out of Wow as his
own guild stuff like that. And I've always felt like
he's approached his job with you know, something they do
at at Blizzard, not just him, but just in general
is you know, a decent amount of their work is
whatever they want to do for fun. And whenever he
starts talking about shit that he finds fun, you know,

(01:47):
like the cool interesting names for stuff, and like how
much time he'll spend just looking up cool words for
a new currency or stuff like that. Like he just
he just fucking loves that sets and and that has
an impact on the game. You know, so so sad
seeing him go. I guess plus side could be he
he might be easier to book as a podcast guest

(02:08):
now I suppose, because that was just an absolute I
guess you can kind of that was such a nightmare
behind closed doors. We were like trying to get it
set up for so long, and they're always they were
so close to doing it and just wouldn't let us
do it.

Speaker 3 (02:21):
Yeah, that was the first thing I thought about when
I saw that he quit. I was like, oh man,
this guy is a potty Sea favorite. Sucks that he's gone,
but hey, at least we can maybe get someone on now.
That would be kind of cool.

Speaker 1 (02:33):
Yeah, I think that's definitely something that could be arranged
in the near future. I do want to say I
think that it's definitely it's especially true of him, but
it's been true of pretty much everybody that I've talked
to the arks at Blizzard. So there's always this narrative
that people like to build where it's like, you know,
the the haters that are like, oh well, that was
the one good dev he's left now now the game's

(02:55):
going going down the toilet. And I don't think that's
as much as I think Scars aren't was was the goat.
The other people that I've interacted with the Blizzard have
also been about the game and have loved it, And
I don't think that's something that is that was exclusively
his domain, but he might.

Speaker 2 (03:11):
Have been the most Do you want to know something
that I find super interesting too, just based on like
people's opinions of developers or whatever, and some of it
is what you were talking about where I said even
really were talking about it, because I think, at least
I feel pretty confident in saying those people were talking
about are definitely never changing their minds, you know, like
that's just that's just the way they're going to be.

(03:31):
But one thing that I think about with Blizzard is,
do you guys remember Jeff Hamilton. Yeah, you guys remember
that name JH. He would he was when he left Blizzard,
he was Wowhead posted this article and just listed not
things that he created, but just systems he was involved with,
and they were systems that some of them were really good,
but some of them were systems people didn't like, like

(03:53):
Conduit energy and just random Actually I might even just
be making that up, but a few of them were
like controversial, and then like that threat got so much hate.
And I remember talking to specifically scars Art about that
because I think the reaction from this will most likely
be damn it sucks to see a good one go.
I think is gonna be the community reaction. He has
positive pr with the community, but he was so mad

(04:15):
when people were shitting on JH. Basically because of some
random shit wowhead attributed to him. When he will tell
you and if you guys have a high opinion of him,
hopefully this should matter to you. He thinks Jeff Hamilton
was the fucking goat, like he was like, dude, that
guy's insane at his job and it super sucks that
he's gone and stuff like that. So I always I
think it's gonna be maybe really interesting for him, knowing

(04:37):
how much it bothered him that Jeff Hamilton got all
that shit, and then now he's gonna go, and I
assume the pr is gonna be positive of him, right,
and it's gonna be like, I don't even deserve this.
You guys should on someone who's like better than me
now and now you're and now you're gonna, you know,
be praising me instead.

Speaker 1 (04:56):
Yeah. I think the thing is like we have a
very bad idea of like who's actually responsible for stuff,
And almost all the big stuff that happens in a
game is not one person, right, Like something like the
naming of the tier sets. One person can take take
charge of that if they want to, because you know,
at the end of the day, that's a fairly small project.
But all of the bigger things that happen, and wow,

(05:17):
are multiple people doing it. And I think players like to,
we like to get this idea in our head of
like the forces of good and the forces of evil
at Blizzard, each embodied by different developers that you know,
there are some that.

Speaker 3 (05:29):
Are just like trying to make good changes and.

Speaker 1 (05:31):
Some that are just trying to get those monthly active
users up by by raking us over the coals and
taking all the fun out of the game and putting
up more cash shot bounts or whatever, right, and like
we kind of get this idea of which of those
is people put the different developers into those different boxes,
and I definitely definitely think that's not how it actually
works or anything. And when somebody leaves, you know, the

(05:51):
actual contribution that they made to the game, it's going
to be very hard to actually know, you know, what
directional pushes they were responsible for, which ones they were
fighting against, all of those kind of things.

Speaker 2 (06:04):
So, yeah, yeah, what was his public sighting reason? Was
it just burnout?

Speaker 1 (06:10):
Yeah? I think that was exactly let me find.

Speaker 3 (06:12):
It burnout and mental health issues from what yeah mentioned.

Speaker 1 (06:18):
Uh, I don't have anything lined up, there's no announcement
of an announcement. This was all for burnout slash mental
health reasons and needing to give myself space to actually
imagine a future not tied to a patch schedule, which
is that's a funny sentence because my entire life is
based on a patch schedule that husband for for the
better part of a decade.

Speaker 2 (06:38):
Now, I mean I kind of feel that. That's kind
of like what I mean, isn't that kind of like
how what all of our lives are?

Speaker 1 (06:43):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (06:43):
Yeah, yeah, it really is.

Speaker 2 (06:44):
Yeah damn, maybe he's maybe he's honest something maybe And
then he said going to stream more and try and
heal and relax for a while.

Speaker 1 (06:52):
So yeah, if you haven't caught any scars Ar streams,
he does like he does all kinds of he does,
like souls, like randomizers and all kinds of stuff on
a street. That's yeah.

Speaker 2 (07:04):
He recently said that that new Donkey Kong game apparently
owns looking forward to that.

Speaker 3 (07:09):
Oh yeah, people wouldn't blame that. I've been seeing a
bit of that.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
So anyways, now that Scars Are has gone, Blizzard is
making a ton of bad decisions, like the Mage Tower
appearances not being obtainable, in Legion Remix. Scars would have
sought this if he was not leaving. But you know,
since he's out of there now, the the evil Devs
have taken the helm and.

Speaker 3 (07:28):
Now, yeah, we gotta find.

Speaker 2 (07:29):
Some Does that break? Does that break precedent with what
they did in MOB?

Speaker 1 (07:34):
No, it's it's pretty similar because the Challenge Mode appearances
weren't in MOB. Apparently there were some Elite PvP appearances
that were obtainable in mop Remix, and those ones aren't
going to be in Legion Remix. But I think that
was just like a mistake that there were some that
you could get in in mop Remix.

Speaker 3 (07:49):
But there was something in the ATC mount too, right,
I don't know exactly what happened.

Speaker 1 (07:54):
So the I think the Agency Mounts weren't in mop Remix.
But the Violent spell Wing AOTZ amount is going to
be in Legion Remix. I have that, yeah, I mean,
so I have the major Shower artif expperances, I have
the Violence Spell Wing. The Mythic Chosen Dead ensemble as well,
which was the reward from doing the like Deathless Mythic

(08:15):
Trial of Valor is going to be in Legion Remix
as well. But yeah, the Mage Tower appearances, artifact be
Weppon appearances from PvP and seasonal PvP gear will not be,
which I think is a bummer. I think it's uh,
you know, anything that could make people excited about going
and doing Legion Remix, like those things that were some

(08:37):
of the most iconic parts of Legion. Taking that out
of the remix I think is a mistake.

Speaker 3 (08:42):
It is quite interesting. They made an official statement abalve
Is in a blue post. They said, these exceptions represents
a very limited subset of skill intensive, limited time rewards
that we feel are consistent with a precedent sets in
pand the Remix. So, I mean, we had this whole
topic last week was the last week about people who

(09:05):
are gatekeeping collectibles because of the whole events we had, right,
and this kind of like lines up with that whole topic,
which is very interesting to see Blizzards stands on it.

Speaker 1 (09:20):
Yeah, this one though, it's like, Okay, Maje Shower artifact
appearances were not skill intensive and pats seven point three
point five. I'm sorry to burst your bubble if you
think they were like you, if you were going in
there at at able nine to eighty doing those Maje towers.
They were trivial difficulties, so putting that next to like
mythic chosen debt ensembles like that, even doing that at

(09:41):
the end of the expansion was a pretty high coordination check.
You had to survive a mythic Trial of valor, you know,
one shot all three bosses never die. That was pretty hard.
So I don't know, I feel like it's a little
bit inconsistent because major Power artifact appearances were much more
about whether you were playing Legion at the time and
decided you wanted it, rather than like you were sick,

(10:05):
super sick at the game, and like there weren't There
weren't a lot of people who tried to get those
that failed unless you tried to get them the patch
they came out and then didn't try again, you know,
a patch and a half later, when you had way
more gear.

Speaker 2 (10:20):
How do you guys think Legion Remix is going to do?

Speaker 3 (10:23):
When is it? Do we know?

Speaker 2 (10:25):
I mean, I'm assuming it's just like this new raid
is going to come out and then it's going to
be like the season four replacement or I mean, I
mean it was in season four last time. It just
I think did they did they announce that there isn't
going to be a faded or are we just heavily
assuming they're not doing We're just kind.

Speaker 1 (10:41):
Of assuming that, I think at this point. But I
don't know if anything's been announced on that front. There
is the teleport at the end of the renowned track,
which makes you think because that was that was historically
a faded reward. So uh, that's my tinfoil for how
for no faded confirmed, but it's not it's not confirmed.

Speaker 2 (10:59):
Or maybe they'll just cook again, you know, like they
especially last time they they like crazy cooked, right it
was Plunderstorm plus uh, Plunderstorm plus the remix, the mop
remix thing on top of fate. It's like clearly there's
some some interest. Or maybe they'll just try to like
ship out the housing with uh with the new expansion
maybe something like that.

Speaker 1 (11:20):
Yeah, just yet midnight in our hands like quick enough
that we don't need stuff.

Speaker 2 (11:25):
To know exactly. Yeah, I mean, I I've always assumed
that isn't an option, right, but like I think that
most players would want that, Like if they had the
choice of like that, like making the super long last
season a little bit more palatable, they'd rather just be like, Okay,
well maybe what if we could just like play the
new expansion.

Speaker 1 (11:45):
Yeah, we've always kind of assumed that was not an
option on the table. But this time around, when they
talked about the World School Saga, wasn't there some implications
that they were going to like a year and a
half instead of two year expansions with the.

Speaker 2 (11:57):
Implications nothing that was like clear. It was all they got.
It was pure speculation, right, Like yeah.

Speaker 1 (12:06):
It was like last blizz Con. I remember having these conversations.

Speaker 2 (12:09):
I mean, we'll be able to tell by we'll know
what the entire World Soul sagas. Like kind of release
schedule is going to be based on when this next
expansion is announced.

Speaker 1 (12:18):
And they're announcing a games Com which is a date.

Speaker 2 (12:23):
Yeah, they're announcing a date at it, not just like
well they're doing the cinematic and everything.

Speaker 1 (12:28):
I imagine there will be a date associated with all that.
I guess we don't know for sure for sure there
will be a date, but.

Speaker 2 (12:34):
If anything will get it'll be like a spring.

Speaker 1 (12:38):
Ye.

Speaker 2 (12:39):
Are we gonna get a a roadmap? Uh? Usually we
got it a blizz Con last time, and it was
later in the year, but obviously there isn't one this time,
so like, if they're doing a big announcement, maybe maybe
All I'm saying is if they do roadmap, then you'll
like Turbo, No, you'll know everything.

Speaker 1 (12:57):
Yeah, my guesses were still too early in the year
for next year's roadmap, but maybe. Yeah, I think there's
a good chance we'll either get a date or a season,
like a you know, spring twenty twenty six, summer twenty
twenty six thing for Midnight. Yeah, dude, imagine if they
could imagine, if they could accelerate it enough to do
it on twelve twelve of this year, right because Midnight's twelve.

(13:19):
WA's twelve twelve. Hang on, let me pop the ten foiler. Bro,
there's no where that's a Friday.

Speaker 2 (13:24):
Come on too, it's a Friday Friday. I just go
after this season, they got you. Yeah, it's a two
month cutting edge. Just get in there.

Speaker 1 (13:31):
Yeah, I mean, just get it, just just get it.

Speaker 2 (13:34):
I mean. I on the remixing though, like I think
I think Legion remix is gonna go absolutely crazy for
basically one reason is that like on the tech side
of things, like things working the way they were supposed
to as far as I know mop Remix was an
absolute disaster, Like it was just constant changes. People were

(13:57):
really frustrated with the way that things are playing out.
But still if you ask people about it now, they're like,
I mean, yeah, dude, mob Remix was sick. I got
to farm all this stuff. I had so much fun.
I had so much fun in this mode that was
clearly like designed at like the skeleton of it. The
structure was so poor, and I think a lot of

(14:19):
those things that they fixed or would do better next time. Right,
I think most people would acknowledge, like when Blizzard tries
to do things, you know, you may not like it immediately,
but you know, they usually end up being pretty good,
but it takes a while. This is going to probably
better than the first one. Legion has a ton of
nostalgia to it, even though it's like relatively recent or
we think about that in our in our minds just

(14:40):
because we're this game's been out for so long, but
it was like it was fucking eight years ago. It
was a long time ago.

Speaker 3 (14:45):
Right.

Speaker 2 (14:45):
We got a little bit of Legion mythic plus recently
and like some Mage Tower stuff we got to do.
But I think people are going to be really interested
in like diving back into it, and I assume that,
and this is a big assumption, but I assume that
the how it works and the tech side of stuff
will probably be a lot better than it was last time.

Speaker 3 (15:05):
Yeah, Legion also leads itself well to the whole remix
system because remix was all about just like getting infinitely strong, right,
sort of like an RPG, and that is kind of
what Legion is, especially with them releasing M plus vet
infinitely scales in remix. That actually sounds kind of cool,

(15:26):
sounds like something that doesn't make well. They they mentioned
something like didn't they like explicitly mentioned something about doing
like going up to like a plus hundred or something
like that, or may maybe someone else I don't.

Speaker 2 (15:38):
Mimber if you remember, like the powers that exist in remix,
at least in Mob Remix were like crazy strong, Like yeah,
you do.

Speaker 3 (15:46):
Like some crazy keys or some crazy shit happening.

Speaker 2 (15:48):
What might be? I could it's weird. I actually can't see.
I wonder if it's going to be really boring or
really fun for this reason, Like do you remember rating
early Mob Remix with all the like really broken powers
where like you had crazy absorbs and like you couldn't
take any damage, but if you ever did, you were
just getting purely one shot, so you actually just couldn't
outplay anything. It was just like you were dead or

(16:09):
you just never did anything.

Speaker 3 (16:10):
It's basically any RPG.

Speaker 2 (16:12):
Yeah, yeah, exactly, but like that was boring as fuck,
Like that was there was no outplay, there's no skill.

Speaker 3 (16:18):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (16:19):
And then if if that's what the infinitely scaling you, yeah,
you can go up to one hundred, but you're just
like running through mobs and killing them and you take
no damage. Like, I don't know that's gonna be fun
to a point, but if they make it where the
power is like actually kind of interesting. You wanted to
feel way different than Mythic Plus because we've already done
the Legion Mythic Plus throwback a few times, right, and
that's run its course. I think it does need to
feel distinctly different, even crazy like unrelatable to live, but

(16:43):
in a way that's like its own fun, different thing
I want to do.

Speaker 1 (16:46):
So I hope that's like possible, like roll up on
a bloody Ka or venge stage or whatever and just
just see how you can push it by yourself with
the yeah, I guess, you know, all the infinite or.

Speaker 3 (16:59):
If there's like a cool half build to or you
just like play having the agent try togle for like
the highest possible or like the fastest possible on.

Speaker 1 (17:05):
Yeah, yeah, I wonder what the solo leader boards.

Speaker 3 (17:09):
I don't know, no, but yeah, should think that.

Speaker 2 (17:13):
I mean, think about the effort. There's so low effort
to implement that, and then people could try to like
sold these dungeons too. That'll be fun.

Speaker 1 (17:20):
Yeah. I do wonder what they'll do with the legendaries,
because that's like legendaries and artifact weapons are both so
iconically Legion. I wonder if that's where you put the
like infinite scaling power is just the in the artifact
weapon or something like that. Ap AP is basically a perfect,
you know, infinite thing.

Speaker 3 (17:37):
Get Yeah, I mean, uh, that's kind of what my
remix was to.

Speaker 1 (17:41):
Max basically just gave you a p but they they
gave it to you as like here's the agility or whatever,
which I don't know. Yeah, and we'll see anyway. I'm
so excited for Legion remix. I do hope they reconsider
the Mage Tower thing. It looks like the community's sentiment
across the board has been pretty negative on this decision,
So it's not too late, not too late for them to.

Speaker 2 (17:58):
The world there be no Mage Tower at all.

Speaker 1 (18:01):
I'm not sure.

Speaker 2 (18:03):
I mean, that's the only reason that kind of makes
sense to me is they like they did just bring
it back on live, like relatively recently. But I mean
I imagine a lot of people that are like, maybe like,
let's play Legion remix. Maybe even Classic players like, hey,
I didn't I started playing. Actually, there's a there's a
large amount of people that are actually kind of young,
like in their twenties that did not play O G

(18:25):
Wow and basically just got into Classic because it was
a big twitch thing and they're from and like they
never got to play Legion, and like those Classic content
creators are all pretty high on Legion, right, Like that's
a lot to them. That was the last time the
game was good, right, So I could see those players
wanting to get into this that never did live and
then like they can't even experience the Mage Tower, which

(18:46):
is like kind of objectively one of the coolest parts
of Legion. So uh, I think in just that alone,
it's a mistake. Let alone, the reward structure. Mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (18:56):
Yeah, speaking of Classic, this is a bit of a tangent.
But the guys seen all of the world of Warcraft
Classic streamers going into OSRS that, Yeah, a lot of
people have been jumping on the OSRS dream. I don't
know what exactly is, like happened to order it. In fact,
I've never played Old School Run Ski before. I don't

(19:16):
even know what the purpose of the game is, but
it seems like that game is doing really well.

Speaker 2 (19:21):
I mean the way I look at it from it
I haven't watched it at all, but just purely outside perspective,
is like for a lot of those streamers, only things
and that classic community was a huge pop off for
their stream and a lot of streamers are kind of
tied to uh, you know, their viewership. If you're going
to do something that gives you higher viewers, it's like
pretty You're like, okay, it seems like a good thing
to do, regardless of the fact that it may just

(19:41):
be really fun. But like I remember, I like recently
browsed my uh MYU my like following list on Twitch.
I very rarely am on Twitch, but like I'll look
and I saw Peekaboo playing League for a while, and
I'm like, oh, that makes sense, like just looking at
it from like an outsiders PV. Like, League is a
game a lot of wild players have played. It's another
super old ass game that a lot of people have tried.

(20:04):
And if you're Peekaboo and you're riding that hardcore momentum,
going back to like retail, Wow is not the viewership choice, right.
It might be the fun choice personally for him, but
like that's not the viewership choice. I'm like, Okay, So,
like these guys are trying to like build something off
of the the only fans kind of reaching out into
the broader gaming landscape, like totally makes sense. League totally

(20:25):
makes sense.

Speaker 3 (20:26):
And it's crazy you called League and the old ass
game by the way it is is League is not
that all was like twenty twelve, twenty eleven before before that.

Speaker 1 (20:34):
I think that's and even that would be old.

Speaker 2 (20:37):
Yeah. I think League is League and Wow are like
the two most successful, like longest running games.

Speaker 1 (20:43):
League was released in two thousand and nine.

Speaker 2 (20:46):
It's almost twenty years old, man.

Speaker 1 (20:47):
Yeah, ancient holy but.

Speaker 2 (20:50):
Regardless, though, it's like a game that like if you play,
if you're hanging out in your guild. It's just one
of those games where like if you said let's play league,
like ten, people are probably down, you know, like just
a lot of people play it. So I think it's
like feeding off the nostalgia bit. And then I think
Old School RuneScape is another game where I think by
doing it and all of them doing it, they're creating
this event thing, just like they did with Hardcore Classic,

(21:14):
and I think they saw that success that they're like, Okay,
I want to try this, and also maybe it's great.
I actually never, I never. I probably would have been
so degenerately obsessed with Old School RuneScape if I had
a computer as a kid and not like an N
sixty four or something, but I just like, I just
didn't have one so I couldn't play. But I mean
that just sounds like MMO Dopamine Simulator or like one

(21:36):
of the earliest versions of it. I haven't watched any
of it, but I can't imagine I would find it
fun now.

Speaker 1 (21:41):
Dude, speaking of Classic players, they got a little hosed.
Maybe not like Classic Classic, but if you were playing
MOP Classic and retail, the release timing is like really cursed.
The MOP Classic comes out in like a week and
then the raid comes out in retail in.

Speaker 2 (21:58):
Like three weeks.

Speaker 3 (21:59):
Yeah, it comes out a MOP in.

Speaker 1 (22:01):
Like two weeks, so you get I think you get
one reset of Mogushan Vaults raid and nothing else before
retail patch comes out. So people that play both are
like turbo screws, and especially when when it's MOP, like
MOP is probably the one that has the most overlap
with people who are still playing retail of the expressions
that like, there are a lot of mopheads in the

(22:23):
in the retail space still.

Speaker 3 (22:25):
That's like most of my mplus friends, a lot of
them are trying to play it.

Speaker 2 (22:28):
So let's let's try to figure out why. Because I
think one thing is definitely true in that it's not
an accident, right, like, like it's pretty easy for multi
billion dollar company to be like, well we have these
like we have all the stata and like the player
base of like who plays each, so let's just release
them at the same time. Oh, does they want to
move that? No one raised their hand, like there, it's
clearly they've either talked about that potentially being a conflict

(22:50):
or there's two options. In my opinion, right there is
that there's way less overlap than we think, which at
least within our circle of friends, that does not seem true.
I think there's a pretty decent amount of overlap for sure,
or there's like some kind of other business thing that
makes sense, like you'd think you spread them out, but
maybe they have some information where like, really they're using

(23:12):
MOP to like get people to sub, and then once
they're on the sub, maybe they have some data where like, oh, well,
you only play a few weeks of MOP Classic most
people before they stop, and then their sub's already there
and they could try the retail season and then maybe
they're using it to advertise retail, or maybe they're trying
to make that one month of sub have more value
because you can sub for one and you get both.
I don't know. I was thinking about it a lot,

(23:33):
but I mean, it's it's clearly intentional, but it seems bad.
But they must have some reason to think it's good.
What do you guys think that is?

Speaker 3 (23:41):
I had a complete opposite take on it. I thought
it was unintentional and where they just had to release it,
like they couldn't delay either one, right, like they're not
gonna delay retail. But also if they're pushing back Classic
this far, it's going to be really bad, right, Like,
what are you going to do? Just release Mob Classic
one more? That that would suck real bad for actual

(24:02):
Classic players. Really that's really interesting.

Speaker 2 (24:06):
I mean, I I hadn't really thought of that, but
I just something tells me. Obviously I could be wrong,
but I just I just can't imagine. There's just all
this crossover and they have all this information that everyone
plays both, and they're like, fuck it, let's just release
them two weeks apart. Like it just seems like they.

Speaker 3 (24:24):
Have no choice because like what would he do Otherwise
they could do.

Speaker 2 (24:27):
Anything, right, Like they could delay either one until after
the games. Like remember how in Dragonflight we got blizz
Con and then season three numbers were crazy because like
there was so much hype around Warcraft and it really
like for the first time ever, like a third season
and expansion peaked with more players than a second. So

(24:48):
like you could delay, You could delay the retail patch
by two weeks. You could get you would get the
games Com announcement before the patch, maybe drive hype right uh,
and then you also given up you get enough time
to play Classic. I don't know about Classic or release
schedule at all. I can't even begin to theories about
that because I just completely just connected from it. But

(25:10):
at least if you felt about you could do you could.
If you cared at all about splitting them up, you
could do that. And doesn't seem that hard.

Speaker 1 (25:16):
Yeah, yeah, I agree, Like if if the experiences in
our friend groups aren't like exclusive to the high end
player base, like because at least in my guild, I
think there's maybe ten people that are bummed by the
timing being this close, and some of them are still
gonna play a little bit of MOOP, and some of
them are just not gonna play the mop at all
at least or until like throwing a thunder now or something.

(25:36):
I think, yeah, pushing pushing back the retail patch by
two weeks would accomplish that, and like you said, it
would mean the games Calm thing could be not in
the middle of the race to World First as well,
but it could be like right before the race to
World First and being like, yeah, you know, we're excited
to see the depentsiat race to World first, build some
pipe for that, and then here's what's coming next with Midnight.

(25:58):
I don't know that that seems like it would be
a dub. So I'm also a little confused about I
guess the only thing that makes sense to me is
maybe there just aren't actually that many people who do
play both, and it's it's pretty concentrated among you know.

Speaker 3 (26:11):
Yeah, I just feel like if the patch went on
for a number two weeks or so, people would definitely
not be too happy about that, especially the ones who
don't care at all about mom exactly.

Speaker 1 (26:21):
Like if you if you don't care about any of
those things and you just want the new season. I
guess there's also some benefit to dropping the new season
while it's still summer break.

Speaker 2 (26:29):
But I don't know how many, how many children, how.

Speaker 1 (26:33):
Many kids are still playing wow?

Speaker 3 (26:35):
Yeah, And it would also be pushing back midnight too,
Like everything just kind of gets to pushed back by Yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:40):
That's the thing that I think you might be right
about that is like they just feel like they're looking
at this six months ahead of time. They're like, man
being too yeah.

Speaker 1 (26:48):
Because they're planning to hit that twelve twelve midnight, so
they know they got to get this back to the gates.

Speaker 2 (26:54):
Yeah, that's right, Okay. I after talking it through the
thing that I'm coming that I'm closest to believing is
just that the average player that is playing these Classic expansions,
just like a retail season, plays for a few weeks
to a month and then they stop, rather than it
being an ongoing, concurrent thing. And then, if you think

(27:17):
about it, for maybe a not a majority, but for
a sizable amount of players, if they have to split
the difference, like they feel like their timing is tight,
they're not able to do a perfect scenario, like they
actually see that the hype for a new Classic expansion
is like a couple of weeks at its peak, and
then they can drive that right into retail. Maybe maybe

(27:37):
is a thought.

Speaker 3 (27:39):
I don't know. I mean, to me, those feel like
the seasons have been kind of dragging on for too long.
Like I know I've already said this for a few
seasons now, but it really feels like, man, like this
season has been so done for the past month already.

Speaker 2 (27:55):
Isn't that every that? I feel like that's every time?
And these patches are like two months shorter than they
were even like a couple of expansions ago. These are
the shortest patches I've ever been in this free while.
But it's still like.

Speaker 1 (28:05):
And they've done so much stuff in the middle of it,
Like if you compare this to you know, the average
like b F A Patch or whatever. This time around
we got uh Turmaboo's terrific Visions, Dastardly Duos, collector event
thing Diablo.

Speaker 2 (28:23):
Those didn't hit. I will say they hit.

Speaker 3 (28:27):
There's a lot of people were not happy about these events,
for sure. I've seen a lot of this course.

Speaker 1 (28:31):
Yeah, I'm dude. The dash lydo is it's so like
I I played through enough to get my mount right
on the day before it went away, and like I
don't know that mode is it's weird. It's it's like
it seems so wrong it works. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (28:50):
Yeah, they gave us a bunch of poor but the
point is is that they're like, clearly, there's so much
more effort to make the end. They've both shortened the
season significantly from what they were and like BFA and
before that and like just Dragonflight onwards, they've been uh
and yeah, Shallan's really long too. Yeah, dorky, you didn't

(29:10):
play back in WAD did you?

Speaker 3 (29:12):
I only pvp'd or like on off, so none of
that shit mattered.

Speaker 2 (29:16):
Oh yeah, man, I never thought about that. Pvps are
just like kind of vibeing dude.

Speaker 1 (29:21):
Ppers got a dub this the rare PvP dub. They
they recolored a the PvP mount that was gonna be
next season because everybody was mad and now it's now
it's like a sick recolor.

Speaker 3 (29:30):
So oh yeah, speaking of PvP mounts too, A lot
of like so ever since last week, a lot of
people have been just talking about, like, man, maybe really
need to just make PvP mounts available. And yeah, that's
been kind of back and forth to you because we
are like, you know, nobody even fucking pvps anymore, so
just like give them mounted players.

Speaker 1 (29:50):
Yeah, we talked about this, I think last week a
little bit, uh when we were talking about like old
exclusive mouths. So maybe maybe we started the conversation around it,
but it would be used to say, Okay, you guys
want to jump to the Patreon question and then we
can do some other stuff afterwards.

Speaker 2 (30:06):
Perhaps, Yeah, all right.

Speaker 1 (30:08):
This week's Patreon question comes from Tennis the mole Man.
Does how do you and or other players, you know,
balance collecting progression and life context. I'm a full time
student during the week and a full time employee at
a restaurant on weekends. I like to play Wow when
I can, but I'm unable to commit to a rating
guild to give in my schedule, so when a new
patch comes out, I try to collect a lot of
the mogs and sets that I can, going so far

(30:30):
as to use my catalyst charges on veteran pieces so
that I can get the LFR and normal tier set
appearances unlocked. I still enjoy progressing M plus to get
KSM and Heroic Tear set appearances, but feel that I'm
eternally behind everyone else in the season and struggle to
get into groups when everyone is in the ten to
twelve range and I am in early M plus.

Speaker 3 (30:53):
Third. Only one who actually does this, I mean.

Speaker 2 (30:57):
He can maybe give some input because he cares more
about this stuff in the game, but like, I don't
think he or any of us are gonna be able
to give any input itaying Wow being a full time
student and I have a full time job. I only
briefly did that in my Wow history, and I quit
for six months because it was too much. So, like,
I don't know, I don't know how the fuck anyone
does that. This game requires way too much of you

(31:18):
to do that.

Speaker 1 (31:18):
Yeah, I mean, it sounds like you've picked some priorities
in Wow that you can achieve given your studentness and
your employeeness. Obviously, what all three of us eventually did
was we were like, well, what if we just do
Wow at one hundred percent, I'd let everything else go,
And like that worked out for us. That's usually a
recipe for disaster for most people who make that decision.

(31:40):
That's uh, most people would not be better off quitting
their job to focus more on Wow. Most people probably
better off quitting Wow to focus more on other stuff.
But if they, if they are super pressured between you know,
a bunch of different competing priorities, Wow is probably the
one that that should be lower there. So yeah, I
don't know. I mean, it sounds like you are getting,
you know, collecting some appearances that you like each season

(32:02):
and doing some keys. Could you try and get into
higher keys with playing less but playing more efficiently?

Speaker 2 (32:10):
Maybe?

Speaker 1 (32:11):
I mean that's something that some people do fairly high
keys on a fairly restricted schedule, So it is possible,
but it's not easy to do by any stretch. Right
Like that, it sounds like you probably are are in
a fairly healthy like equilibrium. Right now, I'm not sure.
I'm not sure what directions you could move in from
there that wouldn't be just worse.

Speaker 3 (32:33):
Yeah, I mean, it's all about efficiency as long as
you're just super efficient with how you do things in games,
and you could manage a lot of your goals. But
if you do lose a lot of the fun if
you go for efficiency. You know how a lot of
people play games, We just like go for like whatever
is the best way of mid mixing how to do
this and that, But you take away a lot of

(32:53):
the fun end of the adventure. Or it could just
become a streamer, right, Like you could just become a streamer,
quit everything you do, just focus on collecting as many
stuff as you can and getting as high of parses
raid boss kills as possible. Then do trans mod comps.
Then eventually become a political streamer and you can just

(33:15):
make millions of dollars too. Like that is never a
yep option.

Speaker 2 (33:18):
You can start drifting yep.

Speaker 1 (33:20):
That's uh. If you need to find some time to
do all that stuff as well, just don't clean your room.
That's something that will take time that you don't need
to spend so you can instead do all the other
stuff that way.

Speaker 3 (33:32):
No, Yeah, but realestic, I don't I don't even bober
collecting anything, so I can't even relate to this at all.

Speaker 1 (33:37):
Yeah, I mean, basically, how do I balance collecting progression
in life? It's like, if progression is available, that's that's
what I'm focusing on pretty much.

Speaker 3 (33:47):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (33:47):
And then, like I guess life is sort of you know,
I guess casting and stuff, casting the restore first or
whatever is something that I do have to balance with
progression progressions. So that is just like those two and
then sleep are the only thing I'm doing for the
first few weeks of a patch. Yeah, I couldn't. Couldn't
have a job or a student and do that. I
don't think.

Speaker 2 (34:07):
Yeah, I don't know how the fuck we answer this.

Speaker 3 (34:09):
Yeah, I can't.

Speaker 2 (34:10):
I have no input. You. I mean, he's like saying,
I feel permanently behind. Dude. Just thank god you're not
playing like BFA or Legion. Oh man, not only were
you behind, but your character is just complete ship because
he didn't have any artifact power too. So you're you're
you're at least in a better time now, all right.

Speaker 1 (34:28):
You guys want to cover the Mystic Touch roller coaster ride.
It went up and now it's gone back down, back
down to five percent on Mystic Touch.

Speaker 2 (34:37):
Oh I didn't even see that.

Speaker 3 (34:38):
Yeah, yeah, no, you didn't see that.

Speaker 2 (34:41):
Yeah, I didn't say that.

Speaker 3 (34:43):
I saw that, I believe, But that's crazy. I mean,
this is something we wanted to cover it last week
because there was actually a lot of talking points around this.

Speaker 1 (34:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (34:55):
Yeah, the reason for going back to five makes sense.
It didn't make sense for them to uh to buff
at to eight because at least raid buffs and raid
you only need to be good enough to get yourself
in the raid, and ideally no better than that. It
was exactly good at five. It would have never been
sad for any reason at five, And if you want
to know why, very quickly, regardless of tank and healer damage,
just a you need a hunter at every raid. You

(35:18):
need a warrior in every raid. Those are both basically
pure fizz and warrior could be a tank. But yeah, sure,
but just those two alone, them buffing those two things
by five percent is enough within reasonable tuning, which is
every tier. You will want to have a monk in
your raid. So it's like you would have never sat
at So eight was like, yeah, technically it's like still

(35:41):
competitive with like Chaos Brand, Like the the impact it
has on other parts of the game is so negative,
so I'm glad they Yeah.

Speaker 1 (35:49):
There were some knock on effects as well, right, where
like in a world with eight percent Mystic Touch and
five percent Battleshout and then three percent Chaos Brand three
percent Arcade Intellect, the baseline damage that say a Fury
Warrior does versus you know, Chadow Priest or whatever, like,
you would have to have the Fury Warrior doing like
ten percent less damage baseline, so that they actually did
the same once those buffs got added to both of them. Yeah,

(36:13):
so yeah, it was.

Speaker 2 (36:14):
It was weird, and it also forever removed. You're cooked, right,
your class just has to suck or else op right exactly.

Speaker 1 (36:20):
And also so like if you're trying to buff physical
damage dealers, you actually end up basically having to compensation
nerf them by the same amount here, and so they're
the same if they have a monk and they're worse
without one. And it doesn't actually really buff monk either,
because monk is already a lock and raid and even
at eight percent in M plus it's like, well, you
still only can bring five people. You're that you're not

(36:40):
going to be like I need a monk one hundred
percent of the time here. It would have made them
more desirable in M plus comps. But yeah, it's weird,
Like it's a weird spot where buffing the monk buff
because you're already playing the monk buff and raid. It
doesn't buff them in Raid. It doesn't. It doesn't really
change anything about how much you want a monk, because,
like you said, Max, you already basically one hundred percent
want a monk always.

Speaker 2 (36:59):
Yeah, yeah, did you all see that video?

Speaker 1 (37:03):
More specifics?

Speaker 3 (37:05):
Uh was out there? Source of the video, right, I
don't know.

Speaker 2 (37:09):
Australian videos all the time.

Speaker 1 (37:11):
The tomato guy, he is that my thing person, He's
a tomato the tomato YouTuber.

Speaker 2 (37:18):
He's a tomato YouTuber. I clicked on his video. As
far as I know, it could be his first video
you ever made. I have literally no idea, but the
video is fucking great. That was my only point. It
was like, really good video. Probably had a lot to
do with uh, with why it got changed. Honestly, was
like laid out every single reason why it's bad and
it was exactly right.

Speaker 3 (37:39):
Yeah, I mean it's really cool. Does it actually listened?
And those were some really legitimate concerns. In fact, a
lot of people didn't understand why Blizzard reverted for buff
because to a lot of physical players or monk players,
they feel like they got fucked over, but they don't
understand that vera are bigger implications to the whole mistic

(38:02):
touch being eight percent than just all you know, months
are weaker over. Yeah, they did not get fucked over,
absolutely not. But I mean that's how a lot of
monks are interpreting it, at least from what I've seen.

Speaker 2 (38:13):
Well, I mean it's I mean, part of that isn't surprising,
like like when when you really think about it, what
we're trying to do is like make a statement on
like what is good for the overall health of the game.
But for a lot of people, why would they have
that disposition? They don't maybe they don't play every class.
They literally play a monk and all they care about
is exactly how good that thing is, So they could
get a completely unreasonable buff or something that's bad for

(38:34):
the game, and losing it feels bad because all you
care about is how good you are. And that's not
like crazy, No, I think it's like completely logical that,
like most people will play this game and only play
one class actually have that extremely narrow like point of
view on how not how the game should work, but
like how you view nerves and busts and stuff. Because
all you care about is naturally, why wouldn't you only
care about what affects you if that's where you're at, right, So.

Speaker 1 (38:56):
Yeah, I just I don't think it actually really helps
monks by that much to have that strong of a
rad buff, Like having a raid buff that's strong enough
to be brought is really important. Having it be much
stronger than that doesn't help you much. Like the thing
you'd want is you want it to be stackable, Like
that's the if you're a monkey, you want to you
want to be in high to depend.

Speaker 2 (39:12):
You want the evoke or shit, yeah, exact, you want
to like every time you bring an extra one of you,
you just got some tool, you got a tool bell.

Speaker 3 (39:18):
I mean, I think if anything, that makes it worse
because it pigeonholes of the specific comps too much. Like
as much as it's cool to see physical comp and
castor comp being really good at the top and very
two very distinct comps. It's also kind of a problem
where it's almost like PvP, where you have strict comps.

(39:39):
You have like you know, r MP LSD and turbo cleave,
et cetera. And like, just imagine, if you're playing a monk,
you have friends who happen to play Maje and Priest,
then are you just like not allowed to play with them,
because if you're playing with them, you're just going to
be complete dog shit And I don't think that's a
good scenario to be here.

Speaker 2 (39:59):
It is weird. So I think that the idea that
your class is the worst part of it. I think
is your class, you know, is going to be tuned
around it. Maybe going into this tier short term, you're
a physical damn doer and you're like, all right, I
just got three percent stronger because it's buff cool, and
maybe that will actually last into the season. But over time,
they they have some other tools. But as time goes on,

(40:22):
I'm more and more convinced that they literally look at
like warcraft logs all bosses like, and they look at
the bars and they just try to even that shit out,
and you're going to be up because of that, and
your class is going to get nerve because of it
over time for sure. So imagine once that happens and
you show up in a mythic plus group as a
physical damn doer without like battle shout and mystic touch,

(40:44):
you're just like, I think the number for Feral Druid was,
weren't they missing sixteen percent damn or something like that?
They're missing It's like, I mean you can even miss
quick and yeah, yeah, all those things. Let's just but
let's just just say Monk just saying eight percent damage
by not having one class like that is a fucking
huge number.

Speaker 3 (41:05):
Yeah, that's a massive nerve too.

Speaker 2 (41:07):
So I mean five isn't you know much, but it
is smaller. Yeah yeah, that's uh yeah dude.

Speaker 1 (41:14):
It's like it's like getting addricted to drug addicted to
drugs right where it's like at first you're like, oh, yeah,
this is great, and then eventually it just becomes your
baseline and then if you don't have it, you're just worse.
That's a that's basically what this would have been. Missed.
It would have been a hell of a drug.

Speaker 3 (41:26):
Eight percent miss its almost like augmentation evok.

Speaker 2 (41:29):
Yeah, Yeah, yeah, speaking of that that, I don't know
when it's gonna happen, but I hope people are mentally
prepared for that class to make a comeback anything. I'm
not even probably not this season. I'm just saying like
in the future, there's gonna be a time like right
now we've been existing without OG and then like all
that hate is going to be coming back to the
second they're remotely viable, or will it or will it? Was?

(41:50):
Was the issue with OGG that it was different and
it was or was the issue with OG the primary
issue that it was just in every comp and you
needed one all the time because you can.

Speaker 1 (42:01):
That was a lot of it, Like a lot of
the high end hate of it was from people that
felt like if you didn't play with one, you were griefing.
And that was true in RAID for a while, in
an M plus for longer, and like that is a
pretty bad feeling, especially when a lot of people didn't
want to play OGG, so it was like hard to
find them compared to how many you needed.

Speaker 3 (42:20):
Yeah, I think it's as simple as just people like
seeing the same class being played over and over, because
I mean that part of it, the exact same thing
is actually happening right now with Vengeance and disc Like
I've been seeing so many people, I mean, especially because
I'm a Tank M Plus player and I stream and like,
you know, like I see so much people are just
non stop complaining about like, oh my god, here we
go again on the Revengeance season, which I mean, by

(42:41):
the way, it is kind of looking kind of it's
not too far off. I mean, Vengeance and Priests are
still keep pretty insane. And if it's going to be
a third season or like you know, this many seasons
in a row of these guys being played, it's a
second for Vengeance, right like season one was second, but yeah,
I mean I think it wasn't.

Speaker 1 (42:58):
But it's sort of like OGG though, in that a
lot of tanks don't like playing Vengeance, especially for.

Speaker 2 (43:03):
How good it is.

Speaker 3 (43:04):
I don't know, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (43:06):
I just I don't think it's that popular of a play.

Speaker 3 (43:08):
Style would be popular.

Speaker 2 (43:10):
It is definitely more different I think than the other tanks.

Speaker 1 (43:14):
Yeah, like I think like Warriors and stuff like that
are the more kind of plastic tank things that people like,
Like I don't know, if you look at Legion, for instance,
very few people played Vengeance when it first came out,
and it didn't, it didn't like instantly catch on. I
don't know for sure, it's just my my tinfoil is.
Vengeance is one of the ones that would if you
had to have a tank be dominant. I think Vengeance

(43:35):
would be less popular for a lot of people, even
though I think it would be more popular for some
of the really high skill players because it's a very
high agency tank. It's like second only the Blood Decay
in terms of how much you know agency you have
over your own survival. But I think for a lot
of players they just don't. It just doesn't really like click,
so they don't really want to be forced to mate it.

Speaker 3 (43:56):
Yeah, that's fair.

Speaker 2 (43:58):
I mean I also you mention that it wasn't the
season one tank, but it was also the tank at
the end of last expansion.

Speaker 3 (44:05):
Yeah, for two patches, for two patches.

Speaker 2 (44:07):
So actually, if you remove season one or if you
include season one, you can say that if it's a
Vengine season next season, that would have mean for five
seasons it was only not the meta tank once true,
which is that's a lot of that's a lot of
playing one spec, especially from tanks who are like typically
multi classers, right, or more typically multi classers than other specs.

(44:30):
And if you like multi classing, that actually is kind
of lame. You know. If you like playing other classes,
you can play some alt and stuff, but like, I
don't know, I think most people who multi class would
probably rather it rotate a little bit more per season.

Speaker 3 (44:44):
Yeah, maybe you are sick and Target is shuit for sure.

Speaker 1 (44:47):
It's tough because it's like not been the meta tank
in Raid any of.

Speaker 3 (44:51):
Those seasons, right, like at all.

Speaker 1 (44:52):
Yeah, So it's it's one of those things where like, yeah,
but it's not been like a meta Raid tank in
a way where it's it's not like easy for a
Blizzard to just be like, oh yeah, we could just
nerve that like it because if they nerve it, then
the vdhs and raid or are going to suffer even
more than.

Speaker 3 (45:08):
I mean, I don't think it should be nerve. If
it's nerve, that's like really shitty to be in. I mean,
I made a whole video about this, but like, I
feel like tanking is in such of a shitty state
and if you're just gonna nerve the h it's like
what tank even feels good to play? I don't know,
I don't feel like any of the tanks particularly feel
good on PTR, especially since they just nerve the pro Warriors,
Like that's like a numb tank that was looking good

(45:29):
and now it's not all getting so hot.

Speaker 1 (45:32):
Yeah, Like, so I guess you have there's the relative
balance concern and then just the the absolute power of
tanks against the content, and that I think especially because
these set bonuses aren't like they usually are. Like, usually
tanks get set bonuses that make you feel like a
god at this point in the expansion, and this time around,
we are not getting that at all. We're getting like
watered down versions of the DPS set bonuses. Uh, and

(45:55):
they're like there's nowhere near the defensive power of the
late expansion set bonuses of previous expansions. So yeah, I
think it's I think it's going to be a pretty
watered down season for tanking in terms of how it feels.

Speaker 3 (46:08):
Oh dude, some tier sets are ridiculous. Have you guys
seen the Shadow Priest tier set being like literally forty
percent of their power or some shit like it is ridiculous.

Speaker 1 (46:18):
That one got a kind of huge nerve already this
most recent built. But yeahs still good.

Speaker 3 (46:22):
Well it wasn't huge, but yeah, it's exafinitely.

Speaker 2 (46:25):
I don't think a DPS tierset bonus has ever gone
live at a number like that. Yeah, that's that's that's
above the realm of like, well, well, we'll catch me
when they change this, because it's clearly not going to
go live like that too big.

Speaker 1 (46:39):
Okay. Another piece of kind of interesting news. There was
another Reddit post I found that I marked down and
it says, for the first time since BFA, the entry
rate of the expansion will not have the highest mythic clears.
More guilds have killed mythic Galleywicks than mythic answer Ak

(46:59):
with still a few weeks to spare until the next season.
And the last time this happened was Niilotha having fifty
more than Oldier, But every other expansion basically it's been
the first raid has been where the majority of the
kills happened right like sire way more than than other
ones in that expansion. So interesting.

Speaker 2 (47:19):
That is interesting. I feel like BFA isn't surprising because
the Nihloatha patch was way longer and corruption got really
op so like, uhadow ends it. Yeah, COVID dropped like

(47:40):
one month after the race.

Speaker 1 (47:41):
Yeah, I remember, because I remember flying back from the
Nihiloatha race and like you know that I was following
the news of this new funny disease spread aground China.

Speaker 2 (47:52):
Yeah. Okay, so that's interesting then, so that that that
COVID probably did have a lot to do with that.

Speaker 1 (47:57):
Yeah, but that's also buffed sire kills.

Speaker 2 (48:01):
Yeah, exactly. So this expansion is so what do you
think is it? Is? It? Is it a historically easy
end boss and turbo boost like what's.

Speaker 3 (48:11):
The what's well? Also historically hard being supers?

Speaker 1 (48:16):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (48:17):
Yeah, and on the Silking Court as well?

Speaker 2 (48:19):
Are are were answerc by the end of Cutting Edge
and Silk and Court? Were they actually historically hard?

Speaker 3 (48:26):
I mean they're still pretty damn challenging.

Speaker 2 (48:28):
I mean I watched them answerrect kills near the end
of that patch, and you you actually just like if
you got into P three just like killed the boss
before it did anything. That's pretty even even for how
hard of a boss that was, that's pretty uncommon levels
of like that. That looked like when I was watching
kills like that, it looked like killing Jaylor Layton Cutting So.

Speaker 3 (48:47):
You would have to get past the Silken Court, right,
which was like.

Speaker 1 (48:50):
You have the harder boss, right, you had to have
a mythic rating guild but hadn't decided to call it
for the season yet, which I think was the hard part.

Speaker 3 (48:57):
Like I think, yeah, they probably caught it off at
the next.

Speaker 1 (49:00):
Yeah, if you reach some of those bosses, you know,
medium way through the season, there's a decent chance you
were just like, yeah.

Speaker 2 (49:08):
I mean this raid has some frustrating bosses, doesn't it,
Like I know, like one armed bandit all through farm
like slay people Muggsy.

Speaker 1 (49:16):
Yeah, although you can skip, you just killed them once
and then you never have to kill them again, which
is a nice feature of this raid. Do you just
like you can take the skip every week? And I
guess you have to kill Muggsy to skip to Muggsy?
So maybe maybe that doesn't change too much because you
could already extend a lockout.

Speaker 2 (49:35):
So what is I have a raid question for you, guys,
non race world first take. This is a a WOW
player's take, not a race viewer take. What is going
to be the opinion of liberation of Undermine from people
who did it, like three or four years from now
when they're thinking back to raids that they used to do.

(49:59):
I think also kind of detached from from that side
of things.

Speaker 1 (50:02):
I think it's probably gonna be a pretty positively remember
Like my suspicion is Liberation is going to be remembered
fondly and Narabar Palace is not really going to remember
that fondly.

Speaker 3 (50:12):
Yeah, but likely there's just gonna be another raid. I
don't know if it'll be like special in any regards.

Speaker 1 (50:18):
Do you think it'll a mid in the people's mem like.

Speaker 3 (50:22):
Not really memorable is kind of how I would, Yeah,
to be fair, I don't know which raid in particular. Yeah,
I mean, I just know if there's any raid in
like since Sorer and Afrias that has been particularly memorable
for a lot of people.

Speaker 1 (50:36):
Liked as people didn't like Balt I don't think, dude.

Speaker 2 (50:43):
I have one big issue with this raid, and that
is that the aesthetically coolest part of this raid by
far was like that when you walk through the casino
to get to one arm bandit Like I think they
they fumbled bad by basically having you ever interact with that.
In fact, the only time when you're there is when
you're like trying to skip everything, like you want to

(51:04):
get out of there as fast as possible, and I
feel like it genuinely is like one of the coolest
looking things they've put in this game, and it's just
like you completely avoid it.

Speaker 1 (51:12):
Yeah, it's a casino raid and you have one casino
boss and then seven not really, you have to walk.

Speaker 2 (51:18):
Through the casino to get there, and it does look sick. Yeah,
it looks sick as fuck, and then it's just like
you just don't even care because you're just like death running.

Speaker 1 (51:25):
Yeah real.

Speaker 3 (51:28):
I think Next Raid will be memorable. I'm just calling
it Earl the head of time.

Speaker 1 (51:32):
Next raid looks kind of goaded. Yeah, the like the
vibe of it looks exceptional. So if the thing is
like an exceptional vibe, raid can still be killed by
some nasty bosses if they if they do that wrong.
But I think this is gonna be one of those
raids where it gets like plus two out of ten
just for free by by having a sick vibe.

Speaker 2 (51:51):
Well, I think I think it's getting more too, So
I don't know how much the race actually matters and
stuff like this, but I know they're like certain bosses
that were really good but also really watchable. Like aesthetically
really cool to look at. In the past have been
really have been really really popular with viewers like Halandrous
and Ragwan or two to pop it into my head,
and you could see the duality of that when you

(52:11):
got to Jailor, which was an insanely not watchable boss,
and viewership actually just went through the floor. Both Nexus King,
the second to last boss. When the first time it
is streamed where people are looking at that last phase
are going to fucking it's gonna be the cool like
probably the coolest looking looking not playing or just whatever,
just looking the coolest looking thing maybe you've ever seen

(52:34):
on a raid boss and Dementius also is going to
look very fucking cool, especially the last phase. So I
think maybe that adds something to it too, where just
like the aesthetics of it, I mean, obviously the shadow
aesthetic always goes kind of hard, you know, like they're
doing the whole shadow void thing, which I know Dorky
said that works for you.

Speaker 3 (52:54):
I do think there needs to be something that like
happens around the raid for it to be memorable too,
So like for example, like kill Jayden. I've never done
Kill Jayden, but I've heard so many stories about kill
Jaden or I gues. It's just like toomstre Garrison in general, right,
like how Avat Harvest would see like football whatever. I
just like always hear these stories about Arkhaman that's like

(53:14):
a lover boss Xavius. Whenever there's like something attached to it.
I feel like that's when it becomes memorable.

Speaker 1 (53:23):
What do you mean?

Speaker 2 (53:23):
Like, uh, what do you mean? Yeah, Xavius threw me off.
There the other ones that were like really hard bosses
than you mentioned, well.

Speaker 3 (53:29):
You know, just fell over, right, So like that's like
something oh.

Speaker 1 (53:33):
Something happened.

Speaker 3 (53:34):
Yeah, yeah, like some type of narrative exactly, not necessarily
a race, but like even like amongst a lot of
the people who are progressing the fight at the time, just.

Speaker 1 (53:42):
Like some unifying experience that everybody had with the raid. Okay, yeah,
it's plausible. Okay. I think that is all the topics
I have written down. Anything else you guys want to
cover in this week's potties?

Speaker 2 (54:02):
Going once, Like, there's gotta be a little Oh, let's
talk about the Epstein case.

Speaker 1 (54:10):
Nobody wants to talk about that. Yeah, what what are
you talking about that? Everybody's done talking about that?

Speaker 2 (54:17):
Yeah, it's not even who cares.

Speaker 1 (54:18):
Who cares about that? Nobody cares about that? Why are
you still talking about this? It's crazy.

Speaker 2 (54:22):
No, we're not gonna talk about it. Everyone does want
good videos on that though. Coffee Zilla is like alt
channel void Zilla. It's got some bangers, right, which is
exact kind of content it. What what did you say, dorgy?

Speaker 3 (54:37):
Oh no, I was just saying like it was kind
of it's kind of interesting to keep over it.

Speaker 2 (54:40):
Oh, it's one hundred percent interesting. Yeah, I just I
just don't know how much of a departure that would normally.

Speaker 3 (54:45):
Be for it.

Speaker 2 (54:45):
It's great, it's it's definitely fucking crazy, like it's it's
a yeah, it's like a mystery case. It's like a
fucking it's like as isn't so mysterious. It's like kind
of clear what's going on? Yeah, it's just like you
know your wait and see what happens.

Speaker 1 (55:00):
The only mystery to me is why you guys are
still talking about this. This is super boring. Nobody cares obviously,
Just please stop bringing it up. Okay, it's you know,
it's a ridiculous home.

Speaker 3 (55:09):
We've got the files, but we actually don't have them
the files are lost.

Speaker 2 (55:13):
Yeah, they're actually not real.

Speaker 1 (55:15):
They're made up by Clinton and Obama in twenty nineteen
when Trump was president. All right, on that note, we're
out of here. We'll see you next week later by
everybody body else the h