Episode 5: St. Cloud State makes a statement, Delaware makes an entrance

Nicole Haase and Todd Milewski recap last week's NCAA women's hockey action, including St. Cloud State's 2-1 victory at No. 1 Ohio State and Minnesota Duluth's win at No. 2 Wisconsin. And we hear from officials at Delaware, which announced plans to add a varsity women's hockey team in 2025, and the CHA, which invited the Blue Hens to the conference.

Drop us a line with questions or comments. Connect with Nicole at @NicoleHaase and with Todd at @ToddMilewski.

Episode Transcript

(00:05):
Hi, everybody, Welcome back tothe podcast. We're here for episode five.
I'm Nicole Hasey, He's Todd Moleski, and I'm gonna eat my words
a little bit about Saint Cloud's State. After saying I was no longer looking
forward to seeing them play Ohio Stateafter how much the Buckeyes had dominated over
the last couple of weekends, theHuskies went in and won the first game

(00:27):
of that series with a pretty impressiveshowing, right, like, not just
I think, obviously goaltender has playeda huge part of the weekend. They
do for everything Saint Cloud State does. But I said on Twitter, like
you might see that there were somany saves and think, oh, the
goldtender stole this, But like SaintCloud had the run of play for quite

(00:49):
a quite a bit of the timeof that and they really really threw the
Buckeyes off. And I thought thethird period, like they had there were
some power plays that were opportunities,and really Ohio State never got set up
nicely back in the offensive zone.And watching that third period to me was
just like, Yeah, this isn'tthis isn't a stolen win. This is
a heck of performance from Saint CloudState, who scored twice on the power

(01:11):
play. Those were their two goals. They had their opportunities, they took
advantage of them. What did yousee when watching those games, Todd Well,
I think that's a little bit ofhow you get Ohio State off their
game, right, is you don'tlet them play that the style where they
are able to control the puck twohundred feet and you know, take it

(01:33):
away quickly. You've you've got toestablish yourself in their offensive zone and make
them play defense. And so thatwas what stood out to me is that,
yes, Ohio State got their chances, but I thought Saint Cloud State
did a pretty good job and inmaking them, you know, not necessarily

(01:56):
second and third chances. And that'swhere we see that they can be,
you know, really dangerous. Thata lot of teams are. You know,
when you when you're getting a lotof second and third chances around the
that that's that's a pretty good wayto to put some goals up. But
we've seen this before out of SaintCloud you know, pretty consistently over the
last two seasons that when they areable to you know, you know,

(02:17):
let a team have it shot,but but not be uh, controlling of
the offensive zone and not spend youknow, forty eight minutes of offensive zone
time. Uh. They you know, they may not you know, necessarily
spend a lot of time in theoffensive zone themselves, but they're able to
counterattack pretty well. You know.It was a couple of power play goals

(02:39):
that that wanted for them on onlast Friday, so that that wasn't necessarily
the case there. But I feellike it is a little bit of the
uh, you know, the themfor Saint Cloud is, you know,
take the best punch, you know, make you know you have you're gonna
have good goalies, uh and andand take advantage of, you know,

(03:01):
whatever opportunities you can get, whetherthat be on a counter attack or you
know, you draw a couple ofpenalties and and go on the power play.
So you know, Ohio State cameright back and established itself on Saturday
to get a win there. Butyou know, the you know, Saint
Cloud really I thought, you know, kind of announce itself in a lot

(03:24):
of ways as like, you know, all right, we're we're here in
w c h A. You know, no taking the Huskies for for granted
anymore. Uh. And and wealso saw that happen, uh you know
into this week of Tuesday night gameas well, where they at home against
Minnesota to uh to even out ofa home and home series from earlier.

(03:49):
I believe they got a one onetie and uh you know, and and
it wasn't like that the Gophers weredominating that game either. Saint Cloud was
right there them, So think Cloudwas had ten more shots than them before
the Minnesota had quite a bit ofpower play into the end of the that
game and into overtime. But beforethat, I would argue Saint Cloud State

(04:12):
had the run of that game,or I had the control of the offense
at least. And going back tothat that win in Ohio State, I
just wanted to point out too,like the final shots were forty seven to
seventeen, but I thought importantly likewhen Ohio State scored, that wasn't like
Saint Cloud didn't think they were outof that game, and they actually got
better as the game went on.They allowed twenty two shots in the first
period, thirteen in the second,and twelve in the third, and that

(04:35):
includes several power plays for Ohio Statelate in that game. So Saint Cloud
State not only took advantage of theiropportunities, but really like closed in,
found their confidence and really played theirgame the rest of that game. So
even though Ohio State scored, youknow, somewhat early and had that lead
after one, that like there wasat no point did Sat Cloud believe that

(04:56):
game wasn't winnable for them. SoI think that was That's just really important
in terms of like, again,I think if you look just at the
statuet, it might look like thiswas a stolen game, and I just
think it's really like you need tolook at the details here and really see
that, Like they put together acomplete sixty minute game and that's that's why
they walked away with that victory.Saint Cloud State is a team that really
made over its roster in a almosta pretty heavy way. I was gonna

(05:21):
say almost the entire roster, butit wasn't quite that level, but it
felt like it a lot of peoplein from the transfer port a lot of
people going out in the transfer portal. The second year with a new coach,
you're going to see that kind ofstuff, right, Like, it
felt like it wasn't his roster,right, and then this was the time
to change it, you know,and they're able to do that now with

(05:43):
a transfer portal, it's a loteasier and a lot quicker, I guess,
to be able to make over ateam in the way you want it
to be. And you know,credit to Brian and Olski for you know,
having the vision and sticking to it. You know, first year was
was okay. I mean, youknow, it was way better than the
year before that. It's you know, an important thing to point out,

(06:05):
like he did a lot of thislast year with the roster that clearly wasn't
the one he wanted and that hewasn't super happy with. And so now
you're seeing a little bit closer Ithink, to the roster he does want
and we're seeing the results. Soyou kind of extrapolate that out a few
years and and you know it mightbe time to start buying on Saint Claud's

(06:28):
state. Well, and I justsay too, like, think about the
programs that got new coaches in thelast couple of years or like more than
a couple of years, right sincesince North Dakota shutted their program, like
Brian has been you know, hewas coaching in China and just I like,
after seeing what he did with thatprogram, to make them a contender
against you know, the top ofthe w c CHA when they weren't they

(06:49):
weren't recruiting, like they weren't ableto recruit people the same way right,
Like they weren't recruiting the same peoplethat Wisconsin and Minnesota were, and they
still made themselves a player the wc h A. And now he turned
around and did this in such ashort time at Saint Cloud State, and
I think, wow, that's alot of people that probably should have hired
him in that time. So luckyfor Saint Cloud's State that they you know,

(07:11):
they asked at the right time andhe is available. But I just
think like there are a lot ofpeople that a lot of programs that are
probably thinking, huh gous wish wishwe would have done that. Yeah,
there's you know, some some oportunity, some opportunities, some openings that uh,
you know, yeah, he probablywould have been pretty good for and
you know, but you know,things work out for for a lot of
what they're supposed to do. Yeah, yeah, sure, you know,

(07:33):
who's to say what's the what's theright fit for anyone at a given time.
But I know I'm not here foryour saying takes on this. I
you're like you, I appreciate that, you're like toting that my craziness down.
But yeah, I just that wasa straight thought I had that was
like, man, this look atwhat this mean has done at this program
and in a year and a half, and like to think how many people

(07:56):
passed up on him. It's justit's pretty interesting. Well I don't think
that's gonna happen again. I havea feeling he'll, you know, he's
got a space at Saint Cloud forfor quite a while here. If this
trajectory continues the way it is,and it's it's an important time for them
to to h to re establish themselves. You don't want to spend you know,

(08:24):
very much time, you know,not being important. Uh, you
know, you don't want to spendany time not being important. But you
know, everyone knows there's a rebuildingprocess. But the sooner you get out
of that, the sooner your fansappreciate it. The sooner you know,

(08:45):
people pay attention, Recruits pay attention, people in the transfer portal pay attention,
and all of a sudden, somedoors start opening for you that that
maybe weren't there. And I thinkthat's gonna be an important part of things
going forward to these next few yearsis that, well, you know,
people are to start to notice SaintCloud State as you know, as a
desirable landing spot as players. Ithink too, it's interesting because, particularly

(09:11):
at the beginning of the year,I talked about, like it can be
really difficult to be a middle teamin a conference like WHA or ECAC,
where like how do you bridge thatgap when you've separated yourself from the teams
below you, but the teams aboveyou are sort of at that elite level,
and like, well, they've showedpretty quickly that there's a way to
do it and it's possible, andyou can be getting these you know,

(09:33):
you can be stealing these points awayfrom teams that, like, arguably you
you aren't supposed to be able toget them from. And you know,
this was the number two team inthe country. Hio State was the number
one team in the country, likePort of Minnesota, Saint Cloud at maybe
the worst time of the season withthis one, just the Saint Cloud couldn't
have been more confident in what they'recapable of, right, And I just

(09:54):
I do think it's interesting because Ireally do kind of believe that there is
that like for the same Lawrences andthe St Clouds of the world, where
you're in the middle of a packand clearly better than you know, sort
of the bottom half, but havingdifficulty making that next jump in here.
Saint Cloud has done it in areally short time. So definitely something to
keep an eye on too. Itjust in terms of like, is this

(10:16):
a blueprint for how programs can cankind of overcome that gap. So one
of those other teams in the whin the middle is over the last few
seasons has been Minnesota Duluth and lastweekend the luth went to Wisconsin and got
to win the second game of theseries, a three to two win on
Sunday at Labon Arena, the Wisconsin'sfirst home loss of the season. And

(10:41):
I thought that was a gritty performanceby the Bulldogs. Zero zero game after
two periods, you know, alot of good goaltending in the first you
know, five periods of that series, and then continued on in the third

(11:01):
period. But yeah, you know, the Luthers, they earned their goals,
they earned the three goals that theygot in that third period, and
I thought that was a a goodsign for them going forward to uh,
you know, you lost the firstgame, you got shut out three nothing,
But then you come back the nextday and you have a better performance,

(11:22):
You have a a the kind ofgame that you know you need to
win. You need to you know, especially on the road. You're going
into a roads environment, one ofthe toughest buildings to play in in college
hockey, and you are in thezero zero game going to the third period.
Yeah, you'll take that. You'vegot a chance to do something.
And they did right away early inthe in the third period to get a

(11:45):
lead and then built on it.And that was I thought a pretty good,
uh showing for Duluth. And youknow, coming out of Madison with
a split is usually not a badthing. No, I thought to They're
they're just really patient, right there, isn't They're they're not worried, they're

(12:05):
not gonna get frantic. They're they'regonna play their patient game on defense and
know that doing that gives them opportunitieson offense. And then you know they're
they're making the most of those opportunitieswhen they have them. But I like,
to me, it was the patiencethat you're talking. You know,
you're You're and to five periods intothe weekend, two periods and on Sunday

(12:28):
and they're still, you know,like they're not feeling like they're out of
it. They've clearly had the Badgerssort of thrown off their game. Wisconsin
looked like they couldn't complete a passlike that was the first time they'd been
on the ice together at times thisweekend, and yeah, I just they
really, as you said, justmade the best of it. And I
think too, like huge shout outto Haley McLeod. I think coming into

(12:48):
the season, I definitely was focusingmore on of Gascon as their as their
goaltender, and but Hailey McLoud hasjust come up absolutely huge for them,
and she was stellar for for themin goal on Sunday against Wisconsin, just
really rebound control and it wasn't necessarilyabout standing on her head, but just

(13:09):
really taking away opportunities, taking awayside lines. You know, she's a
bigger goalie at six foot, butI just she she sort of controlled the
air around her net. And thenwith the way that the defense can can
force their opponent to the outside andforce them to you know, or you
can kind of just be passing incircles around the outside and make it.
It looks really good from a processionpossession standpoint, but you're not doing much

(13:31):
with the puck. And uh yeah, I think Sunday's game was just sort
of a classic Duloof game under morekroll. And I think the other thing
too, is that one of thethings I love about Minnesota Duluth and has
been the case even when they hadyou know, sort of maybe flashy or
showy or forwards like like Gabby Hughes, is that often, particularly against Wisconsin,

(13:52):
it is a it's a player usuallynot the standout, not the first
or second line, it's usually youknow, some of the other players that
are that will come up big thatthat even when you know matchup to match
up, their their best forwards arenot getting opportunities that that somebody steps up
them. So I think, youknow, some of their biggest names,

(14:13):
obviously Man and McMahon is always goingto do do great things for them.
But then you know, some oftheir younger players really stepped up, and
I thought, that's that's what youneed. I got goals from their top
three centers, I mean one rightafter the other. I think it was
right down the line actually it wasthe second line center, then the first
line center, and the third licenerI'm remembering it right, But so yeah,
that's that's a great way to bewhen you're talking about having you know,

(14:39):
three different lines scoring, uh toget a three to to win.
I thought too, like they adjustedright when McNaughton started giving up those rebounds
rebounds, then they adjusted the waythey were putting the puck on that and
they were ready well. And thatwas such a strange game too, this
especially the start where Wisconsin had wasit nine minutes of power play time,
and the for six minutes in thefirst nine of power play time, then

(15:03):
the luth had a five on threefor a minute forty It just felt like,
you know a lot of players werejust sitting on the bench for the
first you know, the fourteen minutesof the game or whatever it turned out
to be because you weren't playing specialteams. You're you're playing it on the
bench, and that's that's not agreat way to start a game, and
you want to get out there andget the get some some shifts. Yeah.

(15:28):
Yeah, I think particularly for Wisconsinwas like getting their full lineup back
for the first time, right,right, I sort of joked like it
looked like they were back in September, but in some ways they were.
And then like you said that thatstart to the game just really meant that
I don't know that they ever feltcomfortable. Yeah, we should mention Caroline
Harvey was back for the Badgers lastweek, and you know, did you

(15:48):
know she looked like Caroline Harvey.I mean it looked like a solid player
who's going to move the pucket andmove herself up ice quickly. And some
of the Wisconsin players are saying shewas feeling bad about herself because she her
her breath wasn't coming back as quicklyas that she's used to. You know,

(16:11):
having been out of game, isn'tthat crazy for six weeks whatever,
five weeks and whatever it ended upbeing, It's going to take some time
to get back the game condition.But you know, she expects herself to
be that good right away, andso it was it's gonna be a little
while to get back into Itchell,But I think really important for Wisconsin to

(16:36):
have her her back and started buildingup towards again towards the second half of
the season. You don't want tojust you know, have her out through
the break and then try and getit back for the second half of the
season. You'd like to have thesegames to start that process again. Sure,
And I think the thing about Carolineis that like she she makes them
better, right, Like KK justabsolutely the team is better with her,

(16:56):
But I think importantly like she makesthe people around her her better, And
so I think everybody just has adifferent level when when you're seeing someone do
what she does, when you're gettingthe feeds, when you are starting a
breakup from the back with somebody likeher, Just the way that she elevates
the entire game, I just thinkis maybe an underlooked Like when she plays

(17:17):
with the national team, maybe youdon't see it as much. But I
think having gone several weeks without heron the Badgers, it was just really
clear the difference having her on theice made, and it wasn't just what
she individually can do with the puck. Yeah, definitely one stats thing I
wanted to mention at some point thisas we look back at last week.

(17:41):
Sarah Filiate five goals over the lastweek. Yeah, pretty good player,
right, Yeah, you know,doesn't get the the visibility as some other
players do in college anyway, whenshe's playing at Princeton. But man,

(18:03):
she can be a game changer ina hurry, it seems like, and
I think she showed that a coupleof times in this last week for Princeton.
When we come back, we willhave some audio from the announcement of
the University of Delaware as the newestD one women's college hockey program, and
Todd and I'll talk a little bitabout expansion. Welcome back to the podcast.

(18:34):
The University of Delaware had an eventon Monday to formally announce the edition
of a varsity women's hockey team intwenty twenty five. The Blue Hens accept
an invitation from College Hockey America tobecome the least seventh member. Here are
some of the highlights from that pressconference in audio form, and you'll hear
first from Delaware President Dennis Asanas onthe bold steps that the school is taking,
not only in adding a women's hockeyprogram in College Hockay America, but

(18:56):
moving the football program from fc FBSand joining Conference USA. Then CJA Commissioner
Michelle Morgan touched on how Delaware fitsin geographically and academically with the conference.
Last voice, you're going to hearis Delaware Athletic Director Christy Raywalk, who
talked about how the process developed andchoosing hockey be the women's sport that the

(19:17):
Blue Hens are going to add.So here, take a listen. So
at the University of Delaware, weare committed to excellence, excellence in everything
we do, Excellence in our academics, in our research, and our service
in our athletics. And we liketo say that we are innovators and trail
base plazers. Just to paraphrase WayneGretzky. We always skate where the pack

(19:42):
is going to be, and todayit's just another moment where we're going to
demonstrate that we're taking both steps.This is the second time in a week
that we're doing that. As youall know, earlier on Wednesday, we
announced a major milestone in the growthand evolution of our athletics program. We

(20:06):
are moving up to basically confidence USAand FBS football, which is the most
competitive level in football. Yes,you are supposed to clap here. And
now we are adding women's size hockeyas a artist sport and joining College Hockey

(20:26):
America. Together, these moves raisedthe profile of outstanding bluehemd student athletes and
the entire University of Delaware. Thegreater rich and visibility of our athletics program
means more opportunities to tell the UDstory, a story of excellent academic programs,

(20:49):
outstanding faculty, groundbreaking research and innovations, and, more broadly, our
positive impact on the world. Theaddition of women's varsity ice hockey also expands
and strengthens our commitment to gender equityin athletics and throughout the University of Delaware.
We believe that every student must havethe opportunity to excel and succeed in

(21:14):
the classroom and in competition, andwe are thrilled to be on the leading
edge of this fast growing sport.Of the more than three hunder sixty Division
one college athletic program, UD becomesonly the forty fifth to sponsor a women's
ice hockey program. Of course,getting to this moment, just like winning

(21:37):
on the ice, the field,or the court, requires a lot of
teamwork. So I want to thankeveryone who helped make today. Let's give
them a hand, in particular theNational Hockey League, whose visibility study helps
solidify our decision. The Philadelphia Flyers, who will partnered with UD to promote

(22:03):
and develop our team. More aboutthat in a few months. I guess
around February, USA Hockey and CollegeCocky Inc. For their support and collaboration,
and of course College Cockey America forinviting us to join the Conference of
Excellent Women's Hockey Teams. In particular. Once again, I want to thank
Commissioner Michelle Morgan for her support ofour program launch and her work to bring

(22:29):
Delaware Hockey into the CHA family justfive months after she stepped into her current
role. She really knows how topick a winner, Thank to Michelle.
So that's quite an accomplishment, andthat's just on the first year in your
job. So please welcome Commissioner Morgan. Thank you President as Honest. It's

(22:49):
a privilege to be here today andto celebrate the University of Delaware and their
exciting announcement in the addition of women'shockey. Today is an important moment for
College America as we stand committed ingrowing the game. I'd like to thank
President Asanis, Director of Athletics ChrissyRayrock, and our team for their due
diligence and preparedness throughout the exploratory processand helping us to get to this point.

(23:15):
It's evident that the leadership on thiscampus is committed to creating and providing
a holistic and world class environment forBlue hen student athletes. I'd also like
to echo my thanks for the peopleand the partnerships that have been formed with
the NHL, the Philadelphia Flyers,USA Hockey, and College Hockey, Inc.

(23:36):
Collectively, those organizations have provided valuableguidance, insight, and resources to
allow institutions like Delaware to make visionsa reality. We're thrilled to have the
newly formed program at Delaware join thelikes of Lyndenwood, Mercyhurst, Penn State,
Robert Morris, rit and Syracuse.Since being formed into two thousand and

(24:00):
two, our league has seen successon a national and international stage, with
teams competing in the NCAA Tournament andmultiple players being representative on World championships and
rosters at Winter Olympic Games. Inall, they have skated away with fourteen
Olympic medals, including four goals.Not only does the University of Delaware nicely

(24:23):
fall within our geographic footprint, thisinstitution aligns with the academic and Athletic mission
and the values of our member institutionsthat make up College Hockey America. Because
of this, the College Hockey Boardof Directors unanimously voted to extend an invitation
to Delaware, becoming the seventh memberof our league. I look forward to

(24:45):
the next year and a half togetheras we work towards the inaugural puck drop
in twenty twenty five and officially welcomeDelaware women's ice hockey into College Hockey America.
Today is a special day and animportant day for the continue commitment and
growth of women's hockey. Many ofus respect and honor a game that has
given us so much in different ways. In fact, it can be said

(25:08):
that hockey is a kinship, andthe University of Delaware is now part of
that as the forty fifth program inNCAA Division one women's ice hockey and the
Cha family. I cannot wait towatch the impact this program has on the
lives of so many young women thatwill soon be here competing for the University
of Delaware. Congratulations to the Universityof Delaware, and is my honor to

(25:33):
extend a very warm welcome to haveyou join College Hockey America. You're all
aware that last week we announced thatwe are joining Conference USA and moving to
FBS level of football beginning in twentytwenty five. One of the many benefits
of that move is the ability forUS to add a women's varsity program.
When we began looking at potential optionsfor sports, ice hockey quickly stood out

(25:59):
as one for us to strongly consider. Similarly to our decision to move to
FBS, we consulted with experts incompleting a feasibility study which included evaluation of
our facilities, a financial analysis,a study of readiness and likelihood of success.
As you can imagine, the resultswere incredibly positive. The geographic location

(26:23):
is ideal. The interest in hockeyin the Mid Atlantic region continues to grow,
with almost ninety thousand girls registered asUSA Hockey participants in twenty twenty one.
In twenty twenty two, which wasa twenty five percent increase from the
year before, and over twenty sixthousand are in Delaware or neighboring states.

(26:45):
As you know, we are sittingin fred Rust Ice Arena, a terrific
facility that already exists on our campus, one of two ice arenas, and
our existing student athlete performance facilities arein Another reason that women's ice hockey made
sense for US Finally, the successof our women's club ice hockey program was

(27:07):
a factor. That's right, GevinMcLeod. This program has been nationally ranked
in the top ten each of thelast ten years and has earned a bid
to the ACCHA National Tournament nine ofthe last eleven years. We are incredibly
excited to be joining College Hockey AmericaConference in twenty twenty five twenty six.

(27:33):
They were established in twenty twenty twoand conference teams have competed in nineteen NCAA
Women's Ice Hockey Championships, including fourtrips to the Frozen Four and a national
Championship appearance in two thousand and nine. To add to the excitement, we
are grateful to the Philadelphia Flyers organizationfor their commitment to growing the game.

(27:56):
There is no doubt our partnership isgoing to be epic. We'll be sharing
more details at a celebration at theFlyers game on February eighth, and hope
many of you will be there tojoin us, And don't you worry,
we'll send a reminder. It hasbeen an incredible week, an incredible week
for our university, the Blue Hens, and the state of Delaware. I

(28:18):
couldn't be more excited for the futureof our department and to sit in the
stands here for our first varsity competitionin just a few short years. Thank
you again, and let's go hens. Well, Nicole, you had the
exclusive story on this happening right whenit was being announced. I wonder what

(28:38):
you out of that right away,what you thought this is going to mean
for women's college hockey. It's anotherbig state school that is adding women's hockey
as a varsity sport. That meanssomething, I think, what were your
takeaways from it? Yes, so, I actually, you know, got

(29:00):
the embargoed information just before Thanksgiving andwas told that a state that does not
currently have a D one women's programwas getting women's hockey, and while and
then I was told it was Delaware, and for a moment, I was
a little disappointed. You know,obviously I had high hopes for something like
Michigan or Colorado or somewhere out west. But then you know, that lasted

(29:25):
just a second. The cool partabout Delaware, right is like, especially
with this announcement coming right after wehad the D one in DC tournament in
Washington, d C. It's it'sless than an hour from Philadelphia. It's
within a couple hours of Washington,d C. Baltimore, and Philadelphia,
in an area where the only otherwomen's hockey program is Princeton in New Jersey.

(29:45):
It's several hours away from Penn State, right, So this is an
area of the country that has biggrowth in women's in girls hockey participation.
We've seen that through the capitals inthe DC area, We've seen that through
the Flyers in philadelph and so justa lot of excitement to me. I
think, as you said, it'sa state school. There is excitement and

(30:08):
attention happening around the athletic department atthe university. There is money to be
spent, kind of for lack ofbetter terminology on that, and so I
think, yeah, I think initiallypeople are probably like, oh, another
East Coast and things like that,but I think it's also just really important
this partnership they're going to have withthe Philadelphia Flyers. Obviously some of that
is still information yet to come.There's going to be a big announcement with

(30:30):
the Flyers. It's part of Girlsand Women in Sports Day. But I
just think that there's a lot ofopportunity here and in an area that wasn't
already being served by by collegiate Done women's sports, so you know,
it's feels pretty obvious when you talkto them, and like, this is
a campus that had two ice frunkson like not just on campus, but

(30:52):
like in the middle of their athleticfootprint. The stadium, the arena they're
going to play at, the girlsare going to play at, is literally
right now to the football stadium.So when you have that all that right
there on campus, it just itreally did seem to make sense if you're
when you're talking to the folks fromDelaware, from CHA from you know,
I talked to folks from College Hockey, Inc. Who were part of the
feasibility studies. It just really seemednone of this is ever easy, especially

(31:18):
amid all the other shake up withinthe athletic department at Delaware. But while
this is as easy as it canbe in terms of everything just kind of
falling into place and being a reallyobvious choice at Delaware. I think this
is really important too for the CHA, isn't it. I Mean, no
one as a league likes to beat six teams because that's you know,
the bare minimum to automatically qualify fora automatic bid for the NCAA Tournament and

(31:44):
and no conference is more aware ofhow fragile that is, exactly right.
So I think if you're adding toany conference, I mean, CHA is
the one that makes sense and thatit does also fit within their you know,
relative geographic footprint. It helps thatmatter, and I think that's you

(32:05):
know, there will be some someopportunity for Delaware to lean on some of
those programs that are in the CHAright now for help on you know,
what it's like to build a program, or what it's like to restore a
program. In Robert Morris's case,you know, there's you know, some
some recent experience there from from alot of those schools that can probably help

(32:25):
the Delaware contingent get started. SoI think that's that's going to be something
to watch for out of that,that partnership between Delaware and the c CHA,
and and really it just it helpseveryone to have another team, another
school playing women's college hockey. Andat some point we're going to have that

(32:47):
discussion of I know you you hadthis on social media, does this mean
a twelfth team for the NCAA Tournament? M H. I mean, my
thoughts on the making the team thetournament. Eleven teams are are well documented
in starchy. Uh so I willI'll try to keep that. But yeah,
I mean, if if the contentionfor eleven teams was about, you

(33:10):
know, keeping the percentages and numberssimilar to what is happening on the men's
side, then like, absolutely thathas to happen. I don't understand how
there could be any other argument.I mean, I think when you're in
the middle of it, I guessI was kind of surprised to go back
and read my columns on that andsee that there were forty one women's teams
at the time. Part of thatis because Robert Morris wasn't playing. But

(33:34):
yeah, like we we do.We keep adding teams. It's like we
went from forty one to forty fiveand I mean forty five announced obviously in
the matter of two years. That'sthat's kind of crazy, adding Assumption and
Stonehill and so yeah, I youknow, I just think if if we're
gonna I to me, now,I when they did it, I said
it was, you know, sortof malicious conformity, and now, like

(33:58):
my I kind of want to throwit back and be like, well,
you set the boundaries like you setthe law. So sorry you did this
to yourself. I do wonder whetherthey're going to hold out and say,
well, for to hit the number, you need to get the forty eight
teams so that there is the actualequal proportion thing, it would be a
pretty well but so the argument,but an equal number anymore now either because

(34:23):
of Augustana, Right, So,like I don't know if I'm remembering it,
right, They well, and thisis why you know as of this
year, right, it's sixty fourteams, sixteen in the tournament. So
but that's not it's been sixteen tournamentin the tournament since it was sixty or
fifty eight or whatever it was wayback in two thousand and three for the
men's side, so that it wasit's twenty seven percent, which they call

(34:49):
the team access Yeah, and theit's it's it's a the goalposts have been
moving on that for right, Andit's team access point is a as to
student or student athlete access point,which is less on the women's side because
less women get to be on theroster for they're frozen four. I mean
it gets Yeah, we all knowthat this is ludicrous, and all the

(35:09):
goal posts will continue to move becausenone of this was actually sound decision making
or you know, done with anysort of purpose. It was Yeah,
I'll stop, But I just I, you know, I, yes,
it should be twelve teams at thispoint. You know, you've added four
teams, like when Delaware is tournamenteligible that I think you have to move

(35:30):
the women's tournament to twelve teams.I just like, I don't necessarily think
it will happen, but I justto hold any sort of credibility and then
try to be on any leg thatyou stand on. The committee that laid
the crowd rules really kind of hasto follow, you know, they did

(35:51):
this to themselves. Yeah, thisis kind of my thought on it.
But and of course my other soapboxis about the lack of women's college hockey
programs state of Michigan. Currently thereis one D three program at Adrian,
No Division I programs. There arewhat did we just it's like eight or
nine men's programs seven there's a tonof men's D one programs UH D one

(36:14):
men's programs in the state of Michigan, including at both Michigan State and Michigan
UH to you know, flagship universities. And what I was on. What
I was not expecting with alongside theDelaware announcement was to find a whole new
part of the Internet that is asupset about that as I am ready to
attack. Like I think, partof it was, oh my goodness,

(36:37):
this tiny state university is getting apro D one women's program, And secondarily
was because Delaware uses a winged helmetsimilar to the University of Michigan, So
there was a very easy tie inthat I can't believe, oh my goodness
that this team is gonna hit theice before you know, Michigan or Michigan
State fields a D one team,or at this point any of the as

(37:00):
we've been pointed out seven programs thatfeel D one men's programs, So I
mean, I think again, myfeelings on this are quite clear. I
think it's pretty ludicrous at this point. The state of Michigan produces some of
the best women's college hockey players andinternational players, you know, Megan Keller,
just so many of these women.We had the percentages, you know,

(37:22):
Michigan was one of the top fivestates producing the women. They're playing
D one women's college hockey this year, and they have to look in the
state to continue to play, whichis pretty much a shame and just kind
of sucks for the girls of Michigan. Like it just sucks that if you're
growing up as a girl playing inMichigan right now, like you don't get
to hope to play stay in stateand play for, you know, a

(37:45):
team that means a lot to yourfamily that you know your family might have
ties too. So it was funbecause usually it's you know, I know
there are a few other hockey fansthat are very adamant and upset about the
lack of women's team in Michigan,but I felt like I found several new
comrades in that in that site.This week community grew yeah, based on

(38:07):
the Telaware a ouncemit, which wasfun. Some of the history behind that
is that there was a Division Ischool in Michigan for a while, Wayne
State had a program, and Idon't remember the year that that ended,
sometime in the mid two thousands.I want to see if I'm remembering that
right. But also more recently,Northern Michigan went through, or said it

(38:34):
was going through, one of thesefeasibility studies funded by the NHL to look
at whether a women's hockey program wouldwork on its campus, and that just
kind of faded away at some point. So I'm guessing I never heard a
definitive resolution on it, but I'mguessing that it just wasn't going to work

(38:54):
with their situation right now, becauseyou know, it's not like a lot
of school essentially, especially smaller schools, are seeing the money rolled in for
everywhere academics and athletics. So youcan you can imagine why it would not

(39:15):
be a perfect time right now tobe talking about adding sports. But that's
why I think it's it's notable andit's commendable when when schools do, when
schools are able to to take achance, and uh, you know,
obviously Delaware had a had, youknow, an opportunity to uh you know

(39:37):
expand a little bit trying to gofrom you know, f CS FBS.
That opens up more players that theycan have, and so that they have
to have more players on the women'sside of their their whole program to to
make it uh equitable quote unquote.I always like to throw in the quotes

(39:58):
there because I don't know if ittruly is is, but we say it
is. Well. I would pointout too, like to Delaware's credit,
like the three prong argument for Titlenineties. They didn't technically have to add
Yeah, they you know, thatis a choice that they made that if
we are adding more scholarships for football, then we are adding more scholarship for

(40:21):
women's sports. And so they decidedthat the way to make that equitable was
to add another women's team. Butas we all know, Title nine is
you know what, like the onlya law that doesn't actually require you to
fulfill it. You just have toshow that you're working to fulfill it.
So there are many ways that manyother colleges find to get around that isn't
adding a women's program. So youknow, like I applaud Delaware for looking

(40:45):
at that saying we're expanding on themen's sides, we're adding a women's team,
because it's over simplification of Title nineto say that, like if you
add one, you have to addthe other, because it's you don't it's
it's usually how it ends up playing. But it's it's also a questionable strategy,
I guess for falling in line withsomething. Yeah, I mean I

(41:09):
always say if you if you're cuttinga women's if you're cutting a men's program
because of like if you expand amen's if you're cutting programs basically as an
athletic director at a university, ifyou are cutting teams that exist to fulfill
some sort of equity quota you thinkyou have, then you're probably quite bad
at your job because it's it's thatreally should be the last resort, not

(41:31):
the first thing you think of.Well said, all right, So that's
it for this segment. We're goingto take a break. When we come
back, we'll talk about what's comingup this week and then a little bit
into the future and look into someof the standings around the country. So
stay with us on the podcast.Hi, welcome back to the podcast.

(41:59):
I'm Hase, He's Todd Maleski.We are talking about this sort of last
week of slate of games before wehead into the winter break. The big
one, of course is Wisconsin headingup to Minnesota, but we've also got
you know, Minnesota, Duluth atSaint Cloud State, Yale at Penn State,
which I think could be interesting,and we will see Quinnipiac face Princeton.

(42:22):
Those are sort of the big rightgames. Obviously, we can talk
a little bit about Wisconsin Minnesota,but what else are you looking forward to
this week, I think that Duluthin Saint Cloud series is gonna be one
of those. So we've talked aboutin the past. I think that the
you know, the fourth spot inthe WHA as you know, I have

(42:43):
that in air quotes here because youknow, it's not definite that they're playing
for fourth. But historically we've hadyou know, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Ohio
State in the top three in theWA and then there's been another team fourth.
You know, Duluth has been thatmost of the last well geez six

(43:05):
seven years, it feels like,right, But I think they're getting a
run for their money this year withSaint Cloud. And we've seen that,
you know, what Saint Cloud cando obviously last week with the win at
Ohio State. Those are gonna bebig points towards the end. So the
LUTH's gotta you know, uh,you know, if they can go in
there and win the series, youknow, not necessarily get six points,

(43:29):
but if you can get four points, five points something like that, that
that shows you that they're they're alittle bit of ahead of Saint Cloud.
And I think for me, thatwould be a big thing for De Lutha
and the first half half with onthe other side, Saint Cloud. If
they do the opposite, if theycome out ahead on in that series,
I mean, man, that's thatputs them in a great spot, i

(43:51):
think for the second half of theseason. So you know, a lot
to be played for there. There'syou know, important important points on the
line. And then you get youstart talking about pairwise implications and everything like
that, big games when you're playinga top ten pair wise team. So
yeah, a lot a lot tobe decided there, I think this weekend.

(44:13):
Yeah, I also am really interestedin watching that Quinnipiac Princeton game.
Quinnipiac, you know, started reallystrong and just compared comparatively, like I
think, you know, they're stillreally happy sitting at seven and three in
the conference, but they are youknow, fourth in the conference standings.
You know, it's up in theair, right because Cornel's only played Cornell.
Some of these teams have only playedeight games. But you know,

(44:35):
Quinnipiac isn't as high up as they'vebeen in the years past. And so
I think just sort of every oneof these these series and every one of
their their games, particularly against otherteams in the ECAC that are ranked are
really important. So I think ifwe're talking, if we're starting to look
ahead, which I think you doin December, I think this this will
be a really important game for themto end their first half on black better

(45:00):
words. But yeah, I thinkobviously the big circle matchup this weekend is
Wisconsin heading to Minnesota. It isand that's you know, looking back the
last season, that's a national semifinal game that went to overtime, you
know, border rivals. You know, just you can go down the line

(45:22):
in terms of you know the importanceof these games and how they mean things
towards the end of the season andfor you know, playoff positioning and everything
like that. And Mark Johnson gotasked at his press conference this week about,
you know, whether he had anyfavorite Wisconsin Minnesota memories, and he

(45:43):
was listing off a bunch and thenhe went back and said, well,
you know, from when I wasa coach with the men's team or assistant
coach with the men's team, Igot more, and from when I was
a player with the men's team,there's even more. And so that could
have gone on a long time.But he also said, you know,
Frosty Brad Frost has has his ownlist too, and so it's a really
just you know, it goes onand on the important games that these teams

(46:07):
have played against each other. AndI think that's is really what makes it
special, even though it's a youknow, end of the first half kind
of series, and you know,there's so much more hockey to be played
and these teams are not finished products. I think that that really makes it
kind of compelling to see where wherethese teams are at because they've been measuring

(46:30):
six for each other for so manyyears. Yeah, I think what's cool
about this series is that, likeeven if you took away all those games
that mattered, that had big implicationsor that you know, decided tournaments nationally
or within the conference, you'd stillbe talking about two coaches that know each
other really well, that have playeda bunch of games against each other a
lot of the players, and thesetwo teams know each other really well,

(46:52):
both from you know, prep playingand playing New eight teams and national team
and like these are the game thaton any calendar, these two teams circle,
you know, for each other,Like these are the games they get
the most type for They they justmatter more, they need more, and
what's fun about them, I alwayssay, is that, like these are

(47:13):
the games where we say, like, oh, there's so many Olympians,
Olympians or national team players on theice, but like it's not actually pretty
hockey when these do play each other, right, because they they know everybody's
each other's tricks, and neither ofthem is able to get really settled in
their game, the game that theywould prefer to play. So it's it's
chippy, and there's a lot ofyou know, slapping it loose bucks and
just like trying to fight for everyinch and and find that little bit of

(47:37):
room in front of the goal andstuff like that. So I mean,
it's never the quote unquote pretty hockeythat both teams are capable of. But
that's because they are both so capableof pushing each other out of their comfort
zone. And it's it's who adaptsto that and who can handle it that
that comes out ahead. So Ithink that's what's fun about that is that,
like you could list all the timesthey played with something on the line,

(47:59):
but like even without all of that, this would be a big deal,
particularly for the players, and that'swhat makes it fun. It is
really one of those you know,when the when the schedule comes out,
the series that you try to findbecause it like like you're talking about from
the coaching perspective, just the theexperience that those two guys have behind the

(48:22):
bench and and their staffs with themon down into the the players who,
like you said, are national teamplayers, but it feels like sometimes it's
it's not those players that the sidethe games. It's the point. It's
the you know, the what you'dcall maybe role players because sometimes the uh,

(48:43):
you know, the national team playerskind of cancel each other out.
I think in a way that youknow, you have so much strength on
both sides, it's the third liners, the third deep pair players that that
end up making a difference because,uh there you need you need your depth
through in games like these. Andso that's that's something I'll be looking for
coming out of this is who canbe a depth player that can stand up

(49:09):
and make a difference. And reallyit's you know, you're you're talking about
goalies too, that they come throughin series like this. Was it last
season that there was like a sevento six game or a six five game?
I can't remember. It was justlike, you know, whoa this
is a you know, old timehockey for the best to the best defenses

(49:30):
of the country. Some really goodgoalies played two Well yeah, a low
scoring game in the National in theNational semi final, but yeah, like
hear the end of the season itwas seven to six. It was like,
oh, okay, sure, Imean, I guess the takeaway there
for me is that you never reallyknow what to expect coming out of it,
and you're there's a chance anything canhappen. No, and Mark and

(49:52):
Frosty would say the same thing.I mean, those two have respect for
each other. If you ask eitherone of them about playing the other,
they'll smile and last and we'll alwayscall it a chess match, right because
as we said, they know eachother so well, the programs know each
other so well. There's not alot of surprise to be had between the
two teams. So you're looking tofind those ways to catch somebody off guard

(50:13):
or to to you know, puta different look out on the ice or
something that will that will give youthat little bit of an advantage. So
you've got, you know, twoof the smartest minds, smartest staffs in
women's college hockey possibly ever so matchingup and having the tools of some of
the best women's players in the world. So yeah, that's that's what makes

(50:35):
it so fun, because it's justit's really at a high level. This
will be interesting too. I think, you know, we learned last week
that Wisconsin is a very different teamwith KK Harvey and Kristen Sims on the
ice. I think KK gets thegot the attention, right, but I
think without her, and then alsowithout Sims, who I think sometimes filled
in some of the roles when KKwas gone, you wrench in that to

(50:59):
you know, like who's leading thepower play of KKs out there? It
might be Kurston, And without thatthen they were really in trouble, you
know. And so I definitely don'tblame those Ohio State games just on those
two being missing, but like,it just was so clear to watch this
group last week against Minnesota Duluth thatthey look different and they skate different and
are a different team with those twoon the ice. And so I'm excited

(51:22):
for viewers, for us, everybodythat could tingeoy this Minnesota Wasisconsin series that
those two are back in the icefor the Badgers. But you mentioned goaltending,
and it was not always great forWisconsin this weekend. Lots and lots
of rebounds, and that is absolutelysomething that like Abby Murphy will kill you
on right. I mean she'll doa bazillion other things that will kill you,

(51:42):
but she is just absolutely massive infront of the net. So I
think that'll be a big thing tokeep an eye on. Yeah, both
of these teams need someone tenacious infront of the net, and we saw
last weekend, well we've seen allseason where Abby Murphy is that player for
Minnesota. I don't know who thatis for for Wisconsin consistently. You know,

(52:06):
Britta Curl can be there. Shecan, I mean, she's as
strong as anyone and sometimes gets penalizedfor it. It's I think they're they're
talking about, you know, thereneeds to be more commitment, more compete
uh for those spaces and and toto be playing in those areas. And
I guess we'll see whether that thatcomes through and whether that's that becomes part

(52:30):
of Wisconsin's identity because you know,their players have talked about, yeah,
you know, we're good at scoringpretty goals and in making good looking plays
and it maybe doesn't come as naturallyto be going to the hard areas in
front of them that and that's youknow, I think something somewhere. You're
gonna have to win some games playingthat way. Uh, it helps be

(52:52):
able to win games a lot ofdifferent ways, and that that's one of
them you have to to throw inthere by the end of the season.
Yeah, And I felt like thefirst game last weekend against Minnesota Duluth was
one of those games. They triedall the pretty stuff and that didn't work,
and the goals they scored were gritty, dirty goals and like, conversely,
that wasn't working in the second game, right, and actually un D's

(53:15):
goals were those gritty rebound goals.So if the Badgers sort of need that
lesson, need to learn, likeyou need to win like this and this
is like this is why we sayyou have to do that. Like they
have that recent history to look backon, so hopefully there were some lessons
learned to see that, like justbecause you can, you know, a
score a pretty goal, doesn't meanyou're always going to be able to,
particularly against a defense like Minnesota Duluth. So so let's let's kind of zoom

(53:42):
out a little bit here and lookat some standings around the country. Let's
start with New Hop because we probablydon't start with New how often enough.
Long Island twelve and zero at thetop of the league, outscoring opponent's forty
to nine in league play, andthat's that's impressive to me. They Yeah,
to see that kind of spread,you know, And so twelve games,

(54:06):
nine goals allowed, obviously you're you'redoing some things pretty well on the
back end, but also the fortygoals. Yeah, her name is Tindraholme.
I mean, it's it's a bothsides of it, both sides of
the coin here. You know,you're getting the offense and the defense,
and you know they have a threepoint advantage on st Ansum, but also

(54:29):
two games in hand, so yeah, important there. As we're looking towards
the second half, LAU is goingto start in a pretty comfortable spot,
right And I was going to pointout too that, like they basically didn't
score that much in their non conferenceplace, so I mean, they do
schedule themselves tough opponents. But thepoint about being a strong offense, I

(54:51):
think is even sort of more enhancedwhen you see that they're doing it within
the league and really seem to havesort of used those non conference games to
find their stride and really settle in. Uh yeah, and then I think,
you know, not to be thedowter, but I just don't.
Saint Michael's is, you know,currently winless, and so just hoping for

(55:12):
them. You never want to seethat from a team, and so just
hoping for them that they can canfind some some ways to pull out games.
You know, post is got asimilar like goals for goals against the
kind of situation in there. They'veat least, you know, they're three
and nine in conference, so Ithink it's possible, particularly Newha, for
teams to steal those games. Sowe're we're pulling for you, Saint Michael's.

(55:36):
You need something, yeah, somethingto to feel good about and the
build on when you get in thesecond of the season. Yeah, well,
where are we going next? Let'stalk Hockey East because that result last
week the Yukon and BC ending upin a tie didn't really give us much

(55:57):
definition. There is that a fairway of saying that. Yeah, and
I you know, like to pointback to me saying how I feel like
nobody and Hockey East feels like theydon't want to reach out and grab what's
possible. And wow, did thatgame really illustrate that point for me.
You know, Boston College had thattwo goal lead, they were, you

(56:19):
know, let Connecticut even it upin the final minute of the third period
of regulation. You know, likethey had control of that game. They
were doing what they wanted and thenyou know, it slipped away. And
so it's kind of exactly my point. I always feel bad like I'm picking
on the conference, but yeah,this is this is what I was talking
about, Like that was there forthem. They are, you know,

(56:43):
behind Yukon in terms of points andgame points, you know, per game
played, their their win percentage,and so you know, this is a
huge opportunity for them, and Ithink, you know, they they might
be looking back at this that gamelater in the season and ruining that they
let it slip away, or teamsabove five hundred point percentage, if you

(57:05):
want to look at it that way. In Hockey's Yukon at seven eighteen,
BC six sixty seven, New Hampshirefive eighty three, and there's Northeaster and
at five thirty eight. Then Maineand Vermont both five hundred in league play.
Yeah, a lot to be decidedthere, and you know, not
even just talking about the championship race, but you know those those those second

(57:29):
and third season that's gonna be Ithink we were talking about at one that
the Wisconsin one of the Scott WisconsinDuluth games over the weekend, that this
is gonna be one of the oneof those races that's gonna go to the
last weekend and we'ren't going to haveno clue of you know, who's going
to finish where. No. AndI think the other point then is that
because they are so close, andbecause so many of the teams have beat

(57:52):
each other or played each other totie and things like that, like it
it means that I think the tournamentis really up for and it's not like
the one seed has a sort ofadvantage to make that championship game, right,
Like, I think that means theauto BID's really up for grabs in
Hockey East and that that impacts everyonebecause if you're in that bubble range of

(58:14):
you know, weather an extra uhspot gets taken up by an auto bid.
Oh, you don't want to seethat happen if you're waiting on that
in the last weekend before the selectionscome out, right, And the Hockey
East did change their format a fewyears ago, right, so they're you
know, they do that opening round, the top six seeds get a bye

(58:37):
and then they recede, and sothey're not doing that. You know.
It's it's it's a one and donesituation, is what I'm trying to say.
And so, uh, it's notgonna take much for a lower seed
within the conference to to really makea run and mess with things and the
way that things are happening. Imean, like if that happens, they
could end up screwing their own conferencechampion basically like you cons the eleventh eleventh

(59:01):
in the polls right now, youknow, So that could be a really
interesting sort of like subplot to whathappens within Hockey East, which is why
that last week of the season isso great. And really, I mean
when you're i mean, if you'relooking at it from a neutral perspective,
if you're a fan of one ofthe teams you probably hated, but a

(59:22):
lot to be interested in when youget into that weekend. Yeah, absolutely,
it just be a lot of fun. So over in the CHA Penn
State has a essentially two game leadover Mercy Hearris at the top of the
conference. Penn State seven and one, Mercyhurst is five and three. Then
you've got rat and Robert Morris.You know Robert Morris. First, you're
back Robert Morris at four and fourin the league. And so there's it

(59:45):
feels like Penn State's gaining some distancethere, but not like, you know,
running away with anything. I think. So I think there's there's some
some intrigue there into how that's goingto shake out with the second half.
But I think you have to likethe way the Penn State has started the
season in conference. Yeah absolutely,I mean, I think it's probably fair

(01:00:08):
to say that it is her conferenceto lose, but they've been fallible,
right like they they have lost toMercy Hurst. That they are showing that
like there are this isn't I don'tthink it's a given, but I do
think that they are in control oftheir destiny. Like they you know,
they have the skill. They splittheir series with the Mercy Hurst. They
have the skill to beat these teams, but they have to keep do it

(01:00:30):
and they have to do it consistently. And yeah, so I think I
think the other the flip side ofthat is, I think it's also Mercyhursts
to steal and I learned a longtime ago that you you don't really bet
against them. They've they've got alot of experience and just really our team

(01:00:51):
that I think like does go outand grab those opportunities that I was talking
about with hockey. So I thinkPenn State has to take every point capable
they're capable of, and I thinkMercy Hurst is really going to put their
nose to the grindstone in that secondhalf and really push them and force them
to have to win it and notjust sort of take it by default.
I was just looking us up becauseit felt like Penn State hasn't played very

(01:01:15):
many home games yet, so theyshould have a lot of them coming in
the second half, and I believethat's the case looking through all this.
Uh is it right that their firsthome CHA games were last weekend? Yeah?
I was looking. I mean Iwas looking at the schedule too.
They and they played quite a bitof on Coon so and then they also

(01:01:36):
just played Dartmouth too, so like, yeah, it's really interesting. And
now they have Yale and so yeah, it'll be it'll be interesting. Well,
the CHA they play each other moreoften, right, because there's so
few teams. But obviously as wetalked about, they'll be that'll be expanding,
So that's pretty cool. Yeah,And I guess the point of that
was that, you know, they'vedone pretty good so far, and they've

(01:01:57):
done most of it on the road, so they'll be happy to be at
home a lot in the second half, and maybe that's so somewhere they build
on the lead that they've built.I feel like I'm completely unsure how to
wait into the standings and ECAC,but at the moment, it is Colgate
and Clarkson. Colgate fully undefeated eightto ou in the ECAC standings, Clarkson

(01:02:22):
seven oh and one, so justthat little half step back. We in
the e C A C also havehalf points, so there's that added extra
wrinkle when you talk about points.But you know, Saint Lord's still seven
to one and I don't even knowwhat that last overtime loss. So it's

(01:02:42):
it's the most confusing conference, Imean, and there are some confusing conference
standings out there. E C AC UH is the winner. If that's
a win, does that make usthe losers? The rest of us plus
their hearts. It's just yeah,there's just even with some teams with twelve
teams. It's just it's difficult.But like we're you know, you're looking
at Brown and Yale have played twelvegames, but several half the conference has

(01:03:07):
only played eight conference games, andso makes it really difficult at this point
to kind of get a grasp onwho is you know, who's at the
top, who is knocking at thedoor. You know, it's it's just
to me, it's really difficult tomake any of those pronouncements anything, you
know, kind of like you putpointed out in New Huh, like Colgate

(01:03:29):
has allowed just nine goals against.Clarkson's allowed just seven goals against. I
mean the big difference is Colgate scoresjust in bunches, right, But you
know that it becomes really tough tobeat a team that is allowing less than
a goal of game, you know, like Clarkson is and and Colegate is
you know, just just under that. But yeah, it's uh, I

(01:03:50):
think that those are the two teamswe're going to keep talking about. In
terms of the ones that are arefighting for the top spot. It's hard
to tell with Saint Lawrence because Saintit's as big losses have come in non
conference games. So where do theystack up against the rest of the conference
where they've managed to you know,keep they have just that one loss in

(01:04:11):
the overtime loss. Like, howmuch do you weigh like that series in
Ohio State versus how they'll fare inthe ECAC. I kind of don't.
I'm not sure how to wrap myhead around it or what to expect from
them. Yeah, it's I thinkthey're part of the UH. I guess
if you're putting on a marketing hathere for an ECAC standpoint, A lot

(01:04:33):
of excitement possible in the second halfbecause there's there's an opening there because you
know, no one's running away withit, like you talked about, and
so it's what can you find tomake yourself a challenger for the conference title?

(01:04:55):
And yeah, it's you know,Colgate and Clarkson are probably the one
in the two in some order,but you know, stranger things have happened.
You can get a couple of winsand and make a lot of change
in the standings, and and sothat's I think one of the things that
makes that that intriguing going in thesecond half for me is that there's not

(01:05:18):
a lot of and there's not ahuge gap between first and really fifth in
the ac AC. I mean honestly, like six Cornell is still only six
and two, right, and yeah, right, so you know the fact
that like if you're scanning the topof the standings and don't even look at
Cornell even though they're when they geta seventy five percent, like it's just

(01:05:40):
like it's it's really hard to wrapyour head around like what this would look
like at the end of the season. And what's interesting to me always with
the ec AC is because of thetravel pairs, like you don't necessarily always
get some of these big teams playingeach other head to head at the end
of the season, like the wC h A, like they're gonna so
that those top couple of teams arefacing off in those final few weekends and

(01:06:03):
you know those games matter. Butjust looking at the ECAC composite schedule and
like Colgate plays Brown and Harvard orClerkson has Harvard on the final weekend,
so like, probably not a tonof drama there, though I guess there's
probably an opportunity to like rest onyour laurels and lose and drop some points
that might be necessary, but itis it is interesting to look at the

(01:06:25):
composite of the last couple of weekendsin the ECAC and kind of see who's
playing each other and where those youknow, Clerkson will have Quinnipiac the weekend
before things like that, but uh, you're not necessarily going to get those
head to heads in the ECAC,so things might be more settled there before
that final weekend and we'll finish upwith the wha standing. So Ohio State,

(01:06:46):
you know, kind of in controlat the top there with their one
loss, they have two overtime wins, so they are top the conference both
by percentage points and points earned.Minnesota will be ahead of Wisconsin and Saint
Cloud State will be ahead of MinnesotaDuluz. So at the moment, Saint
Cloud State is the fourth team inthe w CCHA, Minnesota Duluth the fifth.

(01:07:09):
Definitely means we could have an interestingdiscussion at the end of the season
when it comes to how many teamsper conference are going to get vins into
the national tournament. Saint Cloud Statewas ten going into this weekend. Minnesota
Duluth was what number six going intothis weekend. So these are these are
teams that are high up in thenational rank, not just the polls,

(01:07:30):
but in from RPI pairwise discussions.So again, as we mentioned earlier,
WHA teams, these teams will befacing off with each other over those last
couple of weekends in two game series, So there will be a lot in
the line in those last couple ofweekends in the w c CHA. Yeah,
and I'm you know, you're lookingat the bottom of the WHA.
And the reason why it's it's youknow, it's cramped at the top is

(01:07:54):
because the bottom three teams have acombined twelve points and so to state imagate
St. Thomas have relegated themselves tothe bottom three in some order and uh
Saint Thomas as of yet without apoint in Minnesota state with nine, to
Omidge with three. So there's uh, you know, there's it is really

(01:08:18):
going to be interesting to see whichteam is going on the road for that
for that first weekend of the playoffs, because there's there's a lot on the
line there. And I do wonderyou're talking about can can we be talking
about five teams from the w ch A getting getting in the tournament?

(01:08:38):
I think it's it seems feasible rightnow. I mean, I know there's
gonna be someone. They're gonna haveto beat each other, right, someone's
gonna and it's gonna come this weekendis to start. But I I feel
like it can happen. I'm notgreat with the numbers and especially in the

(01:08:59):
predict of a sense of of whathappens with the pairwise, but I think
that there's there's something to be saidthere for a five team look from the
WHA and I feel like a coupleof weeks ago we were talking about possibility
of that from ECAC and so wellright, and if you if you say,

(01:09:19):
discount Saint Cloud State, which whenlooking at pairwise and obviously WHA standings
have a different but like Saint CloudState would be sort of the fifth team
looking at at you know, overallnational rankings. If you take them out,
then you have Cornell and Saint Lawrenceright before them, which would be
the fourth and fifth ACAC team.So you would be kind of switching one

(01:09:41):
for the other. And as wewere noting Connecticut at eleven, so Connecticut
might just be an autobid. Butif they're not, like do you take
a multi loss a team that youknow is not performing the same way and
is not running away with their conference, like if there weren't upset in the
Hockey East tournament, Like where howdo you you rank what Connecticut's done versus

(01:10:01):
Saint Cloud State or Saint Lawrence iflooking at the current poll of sort of
who would be the fifth team fromone of those two conferences versus a second
Hockey East team. And this iswhy, especially in the context of the
college football playoff happening, or lovethe pair wise, because these decisions are
not in any person's hands. Theyare done on the computer. So I

(01:10:29):
forget who was a branch lassman?I think had it long lived the pair
wise on Twitter earlier this week,and that felt legit, and I agree
with that sentiment wholeheartedly. I mean, I will always say that with an
astres to someone coming at it fromthe women's side, just because the pair
was wasn't. I mean, it'sgetting better the more teams we get.
But pairwise definitely has its flaws withthe smaller pool of teams on the women's

(01:10:55):
side. You know, it definitelywas made for the men's side and sort
of shoehorned on the women's side.I will agree to that with an asterisk,
But you know, like I justwanted to point out too when we're
talking like should it be you know, another ECAC team, another WHA team
like Saint Cloud States strength the scheduleis seventh in the country, CONNECTICUTS is
twenty fifth, so you know,Saint Cloud State has is twelve five and

(01:11:17):
one, Connecticut is eleven four andtwo, so like very similar. But
Saint Cloud State's got those, gotthese wins, and it's getting points off
these top three, four five rankedteams in the country. It would be
really hard to look at all ofthis and be like wow, they you
know, and and to choose oneover the other. I mean, Lord

(01:11:38):
knows we come at this and wetry very hard to not have our biases,
but it is pretty hard to lookat those numbers and not think like,
okay, you know, like whyare we having this discussion? Right?
So, and you like to thinkthat that's there's someone that cooked into
the the NPI and then then whatfeeds the pair wise to to make that

(01:12:00):
argument for it happen on its ownthat you know, this will be addressed.
You know, the team with thebetter schedule should be ranked higher,
all other things being equal, andthat's right, and then that's supposed to
come pound through all the math thatis beyond my comprehension, but very much
to NPI versus r P. Iis supposed to account for some of that

(01:12:24):
as well. Right, it's supposedto be a cleaner way of doing it,
although somebody tried to explain it tome and it made less sense.
Somehow. We are journalists. Wedo not maths. If I can't see
it on a spreadsheet, that's mythat's my limitation. So you math way
better than I do. But eitherway, we're both. There's a reason

(01:12:45):
we're writers. That's correct very much. Well, I think that sit up
for us here this week on thepodcast, Nicole, great talking to you
again. We will have one moreof these before the new year, coming
next week to wrap up the finalweek of play, and they kind of
look ahead at what's what's coming,and uh, we hope you join us

(01:13:08):
for that one and make sure youdrop us a line on social media.
I'm at Todd Maleski, Nicole isat Nicole Hasey. You can find us
there and ask us questions. We'dlove to have a mail bag at some
point something like that and let usknow what what do you want us to
have here on the podcast so untilnext week, enjoy the hockey everyone