What you should know about NCAA women's hockey

This edition of the PodKaz, a new podcast from USCHO.com, introduces NCAA women's hockey to those new to the sport and those looking to go more in depth. Hosts Nicole Haase of USCHO.com and Todd Milewski of the Wisconsin State Journal discuss:

6:15: The history of NCAA women's hockey
8:15: National champions
11:30: The Patty Kazmaier Award
16:10: How NCAA women's hockey develops players for international competitions
36:50: The NCAA women's hockey season
39:45: Conference tournaments
43:50: The NCAA Tournament
52:55: The Frozen Four
57:55: How NCAA women's hockey differs from other levels

This episode was recorded on Nov. 14, 2023.

Follow the hosts at @NicoleHaase and @ToddMilewski on Twitter/X.

Episode Transcript

(00:08):
Hi, everybody, This is NicoleHasey. Welcome back to the Usaho Women's
Hockey podcast that we have decided toname the podcast will explain that reference for
anybody that doesn't get it. I'mhere with Tom Moleski and we are heading
into our second episode. Here we'lldo a little bit of history, get
everybody caught up on what it meansto follow women's college hockey. So,

(00:32):
Todd, why don't you tell everybodyabout why why we're doing this podcast.
Well, we're doing this podcast becausewomen's college hockey is one of the most
exciting NCAA sports out there. Forone, let's start with that, just
from speed and competition wise, itis a tremendous driver of international play.

(00:55):
That you know, if you watchthe Olympics or you watch high level women's
hockey, you're watching players, mostof them that have played NCAA hockey.
Those are for me, those arethe two big reasons why women's hockey is
it was just at the at thetop of for me, competition in terms

(01:17):
of sports in the NCAA sports landscape. I don't know for you, maybe
you look at it differently. Idon't know, what's what's your perspective on
you know why NCAA hockey is abig thing for you. I think women's
hockey in general really appealed to me. I grew up playing soccer, but

(01:38):
I'm sort of older than that boomfrom nineteen ninety nine, right Like I
was eighteen and wondered, like,we're all those new fans that had suddenly
showed up were while I was likethe only girl liking soccer for most of
growing up. So I was tractedto women's hockey because I saw sort of
the potential for growth and saw itsort of echoing and mirroring what women's soccer
had done, and then just reallyfell in love with the game. Like

(02:00):
you said, the speed, thefinesse, There is just a really great
flow to the women's hockey game versusmen's without the checking, and as you
said, it's just this huge driver. I mean, I first went to
a college a men's college hockey gameand with my husband in two thousand and
six, and I hadn't really grownup with hockey, and when I recognized

(02:23):
that there was a really good women'steam too, I was like, well,
why isn't anybody paying attention to them? You know, there's pretty much
multiple Olympians and all the top teams. You get this opportunity to just watch,
you know, elite level, internationallevel talent for a couple of dollars
in really small stadium. Was allowedyou to get up close and personal and

(02:44):
really watch the game and learn thegame. And so to me, if
you are a fan of the internationalgame, if you're a fan of the
progame, then you need to alsobe following the college game. There's just
there is no denying that the NCAAis the driver for development women's international hockey.
And uh, if you like watchingthe game, I don't you know,

(03:04):
there's there's sort of no reason tonot be paying attention to these up
and coming players. I think weshould say. That's a little bit of
the point of what we're doing herewith this episode, right is if you're
interested in women's hockey, but youdon't know much about NCAA women's hockey,
let's talk about that and let's bringyou in, uh to to the family
here and and give you kind ofthe background and some things that you know,

(03:27):
maybe unusual if you follow other levelsof hockey. Uh And and that's
what we're gonna do in our segmentstoday is go through, you know,
what what happens for a seat,what's a season like really for NC women's
hockey, what are the big points? What you're playing for your That's a
multi layered thing, uh, forUH NCAA sports, because you have a

(03:52):
conference level and you have the nationalchampionship level. But we're going to go
through all those things, and Ithink maybe we should you know, also
mention that we cover the game.We're fans of the game, but we
also cover the game. We I'ma reporter for the Wisconsin State Journal and
I've been with us EHL for alot of years. I was thinking about

(04:14):
that. It goes back to Ithink nineteen ninety seven or ninety eight.
The first thing I wrote for usHL whatch Yeah, Okay, thank you,
I am that old so uh AndNicole is is I'll let her speak
to this, but she is thepre eminent UH hockey women's hockey writer for
NCAA NCAA women's hockey and she isour, I guess, our senior writer

(04:39):
for women's hockey at us EHL.So why don't you talk about your background
a little bit there too? Well? Thank you? Yeah, I you
know, like I kind of said. I started watching the women because I
was like, well, why isn'tanybody paying attention? And so little by
little I started, you know,first covering Wisconsin for no longer existing hockey
blog written by a man who's nowand cr a NHL scout, so shout

(05:01):
on Andy Johnson. But yeah,I just started covering it because I thought,
why is nobody paying attention to this? And uh that was, like
I said, around two thousand andsix is when I started paying attention.
I probably started writing a couple ofyears later, and I've been at Usho
as the women's hockey writer for Ithink like eight nine years. So yeah,

(05:24):
you know, I am the onlykind of international women's hory hockey corsepondent.
People like Todd cover you know,their local teams across the country,
but I try to, you know, cover the landscape as a whole.
You know. I've been to thelast I think it's six or seven frozen
fours in a row. So yeah, I this is this is my niche

(05:44):
Sometimes I joke it's the world smallishone, but it is mine. So
yeah, I just I love thisgame. I love telling people about the
game and telling people about the players, the women who are playing it,
who are just extraordinary and you know, year after year just impress me with
what they accomplish on the ice,off the ice, what they go through

(06:05):
playing internationally, keeping up you know, their GPAs, playing on national championship
teams, until I just want morepeople to know about them. Yeah,
so let's get into this. Canyou give us the I guess, the
thumbnail of what the history of NCAAwomen's hockey is, because it doesn't go
back as long as maybe you mightthink as you talk about college sports,

(06:26):
you know, basketball goes back decades. We're still kind of in the infancy
of NCAA women's hockey, even thoughwomen's hockey on campus goes back farther than
that. What can you kind ofgive us on the background there? Yeah,
I think a lot of when youtalk about women's hockey nationally and internationally,

(06:46):
can date back to the nineteen ninetyeight Olympics, which is when they
were added as a sport in Nagado. So the sport was officially sanctioned by
the NCAA starting in the two thousandand two thousand and one season, but
there were a couple of seasons beforethat. That were actually sponsored by the
Olympic Committee that was called the ACCHA, and they had their own championships for

(07:09):
two years. You will sometimes seeteams like Harvard and Minnesota talk about their
national championships that they won in thoseyears, but those were not NCAA sanctioned
because the sports becomes sanctioned until twothousand and one. However, like the
first is still exist, are stillyeah, you kind of have to you
have to make those distinctions. Butyou know, Brown University had their first

(07:31):
women's hockey team in nineteen sixty five, which I think probably surprises people.
The IVY League had their first tournamentin nineteen seventy six. The ECAC,
which is a conference that still exists, had their first women's tournament in nineteen
eighty four. So women's hockey hasexisted, you know, at first at
a club level and then sort ofgrowing and then reaching that NCAA sort of

(07:55):
sanction in the two thousand and twothousand and one season. So we're talking,
you know, less than twenty fiveyears. The WCCHA is elevating their
twenty five years this year. Sorelatively new and young sport in that way.
But yeah, so we were talkingabout the titles, tod, do
you want to talk a little bitabout like the national championships and who's won
them? Yeah, Well, itwon't take long because it's it's been four

(08:18):
teams, correct, I'm I'm lookingat this. That's four teams have won.
No, five teams have won nationalchampionships. No, yes, is
that right? I'm going to goback through this. Yeah, Wisconsin has
won the most with seven. Minnesota'swon six plus the the national Championship,
not through the NCAA. But that'suh, you know that discussion that Nicole

(08:41):
was having that that doesn't really countfor the NCAA championships. Minnesota Luth has
won five. We've got three fromClarkson, one from Ohio State. Am
I missing anyone? No? Idon't think so, because it's all the
w CHA teams, right, Minnesota, Minnesota, Duluth, clarks and Wisconsin
and Ohio State. So, likeI said, it doesn't take long to

(09:05):
go through the list of who haswon the championships. But those those four
teams, five teams have have hadtheir respective eras. I guess, if
you want to look at it,Minnesota was very strong in those early years
a power, and we probably needthe credit to some teams that were close

(09:26):
but didn't actually win. Some ofthose Harvard back in those early years it
was a very strong team didn't getthe championship, but definitely needs to be
in that discussion too. They wererunner up like three or four years in
a row years and Minnesota had itsera and still is one of the top
teams in women's college hockey. Clarksonwon two in a row and they were

(09:52):
the first team out from outside thew c h A to win a national
champion NCAA Championship. Wisconsin has wonseven and as we look in most recently
three of the last four, eventhough we're not counting the year that the
pandemic canceled the national championship in twentytwenty. So Wisconsin really came on in

(10:16):
the mid two thousands, one andsix, seven and nine, and twenty
eleven before Minnesota. It's kind ofswung towards Minnesota. We had Clarkson come
in Clarkson and then Yeah, it'sit's been kind of those those teams have
been in the in the running forit in a lot of these years.

(10:41):
But I think it's it's worth notingtoo that there's been a lot of teams
that have been knocking on that door, and there are going to be more
teams winning championships soon because there areteams that are I shouldn't I say teams,
but I really mean programs because itgoes on that deeper level if there
are programs with a lot of courtand there are programs that are are very

(11:03):
good in there, uh in theirconference and are and are right there when
it talks to when it comes totalking about a h NCAA tournament, and
it's you know, a lot oftimes comes down to luck. You get
a bad, bad draw, abad UH run through the tournament and it
doesn't work out for you. Butthat's UH, that's the way it goes

(11:24):
in single game elimination tournaments. Butas part of the NCAA tournament every year,
the the UH now it's the USAHockey runs UH the Patty Kasmayer Award.
And I wonder if you, Nicole, want to talk about what that
is, since you're you're a voterand you've you've been through that process,
what that is, who it's for, and and who it's named after.

(11:48):
Sure, so we mentioned at thetop, we've decided to call this the
podcast, and that is, youknow, a nod to Patty Kasmayer.
The Patty Kasmayer Award goes to thetop collegiate female player of the year.
It's named in honor of the latlate Patty Kasmyer Sant, who was a
four year varsity letter winner for Princetonin hockey in the eighties but also played
field hockey on lacrosse and she diedon February fifteenth, nineteen ninety at the

(12:11):
age of twenty eight from a rareblood disease. In the name, the
award is named in her honor,so it has been given out every year
that the sport has been an NCAAstation sport. The current of the most
recent winner was Ohio State Sophie Jakes. She was the second ever defender to
win the Patty CAAZ had been severalyears. Angelo Ruggieriro is the only other

(12:35):
defender to win it. The mostwinners have come from Harvard with six,
Wisconsin has five. But yeah,it is it's a long process that involves
but first coaches voting and compiling alist, and then it gets narrowed down
to ten names and then it goesto the committee. The committee changes from

(12:56):
year to year. Journalists are onit in two year stints, so this
year will be my second year ofthis current stint, but I did one
other a few years ago. Andthen there is a selection of coaches from
across the country and we get thename of the top ten, as I
said, was compiled, and thenwe talk about each one of them in

(13:18):
like a conference call, and thenfrom there we vote and they'll announce a
top three and at that point thewinner will already been chosen but not announced,
So we have that discussion, wevote in rank the women, and
then the winner is announced on frozenfour weekends. So used to be prior
to COVID that there was sort ofa brunch on the Saturday in between the

(13:39):
two games between the Friday Sunday NationalChampionship weekend. Now they have turned it
into a more sort of low keybut fan friendly event that happens. It
happened on site in Duluth, whichwas really great, was in the lobby
of the arena and was just areally awesome way to give the award.
I thinking, so I'm really happythat that change has been made. So,

(14:03):
yeah, a couple of goaltenders havewon it, but mostly generally the
lord goes to the top forward forthe year, which is maybe a different
discussion to have, but yes,so Patty has a pretty cool award.
Pretty cool woman. Laura Hollerson,who was the first coach at Minnesota,

(14:24):
knew her, played with her,and so she is often at the awards
ceremony representing the Kasimyir family and it'spretty cool to be able to have that
connection to the woman that the awardsnamed for. All right, well,
that's our first segment today. Whenwe come back, we will talk about
how the NCAA is the driver oftalent and players for the international game.

(14:50):
If you watch an Olympic game,you're seeing an NCAA player. So we'll
be back with the podcast. Welcomeback to the podcast. I'm Todd Moleski.
That is Nicole Hasey. We aretalking today giving you kind of a
primer of what NCAA women's hockey isall about. And it's it's coming in

(15:13):
different layers here, I guess ifyou want to look at it that way.
We we've talked about, uh,just kind of the background of of
of what, uh, you know, what the the history has been and
and what some of the the whatthe Patty Kasmi Award is given for.
And and now we want to talkabout what, uh, you know,

(15:35):
what happens after players are done playingNCAA hockey. Maybe we're jumping the gun
here a little bit. We're goingto get into later in our final segment
about what the season is actually like. But it's important to uh keep in
mind that that players in college hockey, the best of them, are going
to be going to the international stage. And Nicole, I wonder if you

(15:58):
can talk about how that has developed, and I guess how NCAA women's hockey
has developed into the the you know, the driver of what we see in
the international game. And I think, like to start off with it's really
important to you to point out thatone of the reasons the NCAA has to
be the driver of indifferent international developmentis that the for a long time and

(16:22):
even up till now, federations aren'tdoing that, particularly for girls and women,
and so US and Canadian players obviouslyare getting more support than North American
players, but even still, likethe NCAA provides the best resources from nutrition
to facilities, to weight training toall of that that any you know,

(16:45):
sort of teenage girls hockey player canhave access to on a regular basis.
So you're sort of starting with whenyou're talking US and Canada. You know,
at the two thousand and two SaltLake City Olympics, so the second
time women's hockey was in the Olympics, only eight members of the Canadian team
were either current or former NCAA players. In twenty twenty two, all the

(17:08):
women on both US and Canada wereNCAA players, and forty percent of all
players, it's a little more thanforty percent, were committed to play or
had played at least one season ofD one women's hockey. So two hundred
and thirty total women rostered on tenteams and one hundred and four of them
had played for a total of thirtytwo different NCAA D one schools. So

(17:30):
it's just this massive driver you hadmentioned. You know, Minnesota Duluth was
strong in the early years of theNCAA. One of the reasons that happened
is because their coach at the timedid a really good job of recruiting internationally.
She went and found talent and broughtstarted to bring some players over from
you know, one or two playersfrom individual countries that would come over and

(17:52):
really help bolster the team, andthat process has something that's just sort of
grown over the years. So evenyou know, five, ten, fifteen
years ago, we didn't see asmany women from so many different countries playing
in the nca But this year,you know, I just I just did
this article a few weeks ago atUSCCHO. There are one hundred and I'm

(18:15):
sorry, one one hundred nineteen totalplayers playing NCAD one hockey this year.
Six hundred and ninety four of themare Americans, three hundred and sixty five
are Canadians, and sixty of themare international players outside of North America from
fifteen countries. Recently, in internationalwomen's hockey, we've seen sort of the

(18:37):
growth of the of Czechia as aninternational powerhouse, winning the last two bronze
medals at World Championships. A bigdriver of that is that many of their
players have come to the US andplayed NCAA hockey because it is just by
far the best development that they canhave. And this is, you know,
from them telling me this the bestdevelopment that they can have to be

(18:59):
able to to grow the sport athome, their international league or their domestic
league at home just doesn't provide thesame ability for them. So yeah,
it's just it's just this huge it'sa cyclical thing where it's really good to
talk about what's great about the NCAAis a driver for international development. But
I think it's also important to notethat the reason it has to be is

(19:23):
that a lot of these programs havenot historically and continue to not be getting
the support from their federations domestically,and so the players have taken it upon
themselves to you know, go playelsewhere and try and grow the game and
find other ways to make their teambetter. So, you know, in
the current we just saw you know, Alena Mills retire from international play with

(19:47):
cech Ya. You know, shecame over and played at Brown. I
mean, she's was joking with her. There are a couple of teenagers on
her team, so she has alonger career than some of them have been
alive. And you know, shebut she came over and once she had
that experience, she went home andsort of helped share the idea of like
this is possible, this is whatyou can do, this is how you
can go get an education, andthose sorts of things. But yeah,

(20:10):
I think it's really important to pointout how much you know, the international
game, Like I said, everymember of US and Canada are NCAA players,
and how much the game so isgrowing and making the women that we
you know that people see at theOlympics, the players that they are giving

(20:33):
them those opportunities. What I'm fascinatedby is what we'll see in the next
generation because we're still we're really talkingabout this, like you said that we're
kind of in the infancy. AndShannon Miller, like you talked about the
Duluth coach, was really ahead ofher time in looking internationally. Now it's
it's that's just a matter of normalcourse of actions for most NCAA coaches is

(20:56):
looking beyond North America because there aresome really good players out there and they've
come up through these because of someof the players that have traveled this route,
and so you look, you know, that's you know maybe eight nine
years ago that some of those playersyou know developed that well, that's that's

(21:18):
right when the players that are noweighteen or seventeen and eighteen are being recruited
would have been starting in hockey andyou know, getting to that that level.
And just like maybe having a rolemodel from your country go travel this
route has really changed the path forsome of some of the young players from

(21:40):
outside North America. And so whatI'm interested to see is what that looks
like in ten years again, Nowwhat the what the next? You know
what these players that that that cometo the US to play college hockey will
inspire for for for the next twoAnd like you mentioned, as long as
the support is there, and Ithink we're seeing it from from some countries

(22:03):
where there's more supports, it's certainlynot to the level that it is on
the men's side, and that's aI think you can go through any of
the things we're talking about here,and that's going to be a problem in
a lot of the the the areaswe're covering today is that there is not
an equity there in a lot ofsituations. And so where are we ten

(22:30):
years from now, I don't know, but I think there's going to be
more international flavor to college hockey asas we continue to go on, because
it's developing in other countries where it'sobviously still developing here and in the US
Canada as well. And when we'retalking about at the young ages on the

(22:52):
girls hockey side. So it's it'sgoing to be fascinating to see where that
comes comes up in the in thenext cycle of players that we're talking about
a generation from now. Yeah,and I also think we see, you
know, sort of a ebbs andflows as to which countries some of the
international players come from. I thinkearly on, particularly you know, some

(23:15):
of the Nordic countries Sweden, Finland, which are still many of those players
do come over and play in youknow, the the largest number of international
players this season are you know,there's twelve from Sweden and eight from Finland.
But like as we mentioned c Chechiathis year, there are a couple
of players from Norway. There's acouple players, there's five players from Austria.
What's interesting to me about some ofthat is those are those are countries

(23:38):
who are not currently top tier IHFyou know in the I don't even mean
that from a the way that theIHF stratifies the different divisions, so you
know Division one or Division one Aand things like that. So there's a
player from Slovenia, there's the playersfrom Japan and South Korea, and so
as we see, as we haveseen in the past as some of those

(24:02):
Scannavian players, as we said,go back and show what's possible in their
connections with coaches over there. Andnow we've seen this, you know,
sort of growth in Chechia, andso like, maybe what is the next
sort of wave of players that wesee. I think will be really interesting
and I think as we pay moreattention to this, we'll be able to
see a bit more of the thetrends as to where these players may be

(24:23):
coming from and how they're going backto their programs, you know, affects
them on an international level. ButI think too, you use the word
equity, which I think is reallyimportant when we're talking NCAA, right,
because like, if this is allrelative, it is the NCAA for women
in North America is very very good, and yet you know, the state

(24:45):
of the women's game NCAA versus thestate of the men's game is very different.
You know, we just had equityreports come out from the NSANE and
things like that. So I thinkit's important too to just talk about how
relative all of this is. Thatthis is a very good situation, but
it is by no needs perfect.There's definitely stuff to look at and critique
it is better than exists and maybein some other countries. But I think

(25:10):
just to point out that like thisthis situation, First of all, I'm
not sure that we should count ona sort of a private entity to be
the development the main development tool forinternational women's hockey or really any international sport.
But it's statement of fact is thatit is right now. But you
know, there are questions to behad of like why you know there's a

(25:33):
USA men's development like residency program andthat doesn't exist on the women's side.
There there's very little development on thewomen's side, and that was you know,
in twenty seventeen, the US women'snational team threatened to boycott the IHF
Women's World Championships that were we hostedin the US that year, and one
of their big things was about development. And I know that COVID played a

(25:56):
huge part in some of this,But the fact that we are six years
old on from that discussion and haven'tseen a ton of movement from USA Hockey
and like what that development could looklike and what they're going to do for
development for girls and women in theUS is I think a big question.
So you know, there is sortof two sides to this coin, which
is that the NCAA is a veryimportant part of the international game right now.

(26:19):
And also these federations should be doingbetter by their players so they don't
feel like they have to leave theirhome country to go get the development that
they need. When you look atit from I guess, just inside the
US, there's so much that iscentralized with USA hockey in terms of how

(26:41):
I guess just looking at it froma big perspective of how the game has
grown, the girls hockey game isgoing to talking about early young ages,
but a lot of it does comedown to those individual local youth hockey groups
to make those things happen. Andyou know, there's there's money available in

(27:03):
some places, but we all knowanyone who is in hockey knows it is
not a cheap sport. It isnot something you just pick up and do
without a significant investment of money andtime. And and so those to me
are are really big hurdles that Ithink need to be I was going to

(27:27):
say address, but it's more thanaddressing. It's it's you know, just
studying how do we get better atthat Inside the US. I'm talking about
it in terms of you know,providing opportunities and and making this a game
that is is really open for youngkids to play when they are forming those

(27:51):
kind of you know, interest levelsin sport. You know, how do
we get young kids interested in hockeyand you know, while they're also trying
out soccer and while they're also tryingout basketball and these things, having hockey
be part of that conversation. Andwe're talking you know, a real early

(28:11):
part of this year, but thatbecomes so much of you know, when
you talk if we're talking about likegetting them when they're seven, eight years
old, ten years later, youknow, if you're talking about an elite
athlete, have they even considered hockeywhere they even like offered hockey as an
option? And that's where I knowthere are a lot of efforts to make

(28:37):
that happen at the USA Hockey levels. It's just so reliant on you know,
you know, volunteers and parents andthings like that at the local levels
to be knowledgeable and to be experiencedenough to be able to help out with
that. And that's some of wherethings I think in the US have struggled

(28:59):
over the years in terms of gettingquality coaching for young girls players that's that's
something that's that's not easy to find. I think too, is that there
is sort of a disconnect in thatthere's things like try hockey for free days,
and there's there's a lot of gettingpeople in the door, but then
I think that they're that next stepof keeping them coming back, of getting

(29:21):
them on teams on like you said, providing good coaching. I think that
is a part of the pipeline thatsort of gets let down, sort of
making sure once you've got them inthe door, like what is the next
step? And you know, kindof what you were saying is that like
girls aren't picking up hockey as teenagersand becoming NCAA players at this point,
Like you do have to start atthat young age and be you know,
sort of on an elite path bythe time yere. I mean, these

(29:44):
many of these girls are going toboarding schools. They're going to especially schools
at thirteen years old, like theyare, they're doing training regimens to become
NCAA players. You know, thisis a it's sort of a whole listic
like they have to decide pretty early, and so I do think that they're
is a gap there sort of you'renot already a hockey family of like at
five, six, seven, eightnine, Like they came to the door,

(30:07):
they tried hockey, they liked it. What comes next? And then
the other place that I think,you know, maybe not exactly the same
vein, but that what we're lettingdown is that there is a U eighteen
women's national team program, and thereis a senior national team program, and
there is not a lot else.We're starting. The PWHL is starting this
year, and that pro league offersan opportunity for like once you're done with

(30:27):
college, you know, but atthis point, most of those women are
also national team players. Until theleague grows and can get more teams,
we're still talking sort of a prettysmall group of women. So what happens
to the player that didn't catch hockeyCanada USA Hockey's I at eighteen nineteen years
old in college so it wasn't oreven sixteen and wasn't part of a national

(30:48):
team program and doesn't make the seniorteam pool, Like, that's that's kind
of it for them right now.I mean, there are very few women
we've seen like maybe an sophie buttay in Canada who went and had a
very good pro career in the CWHLand that is how she she finally got
invited into the pool. But we'restill seeing some of the top ENDCA talent

(31:08):
not even get invited in some ofthe player pools at this point. So
what happens to a player when shegraduates college if there isn't if she doesn't
go straight to the pros? Likeare all those players just done? Like
what's happening? You know? There'sthe World Juniors for boys at you twenty,
and we don't. We just wedon't have sort of development. And

(31:30):
so the idea that like we knowat sixteen whether a woman's going to be
a national team player or not seemscrazy to me. And she's either in
that pipeline or she's not. Andso where what's the gap of developing and
and sort of scouting that talent betweenages, you know, eighteen and twenty
four kind of thing, so andnurturing and growing that talent. Some people
just don't. And this is whereI think to some of the difference on

(31:52):
the men's side, right, likethe collegiate players on the medside tend to
be a couple of years older.They don't, you know, with junior
hockey and things like that, sothat the pipeline is very different. And
I think at the moment where twogenerally we get too hung up on making
women's hockey look like men's hockey,like that the pathway has to look the
exact same, and I don't knowthat it does. And I think that's

(32:12):
probably a bigger discussion that we've gottime here for today, but I think
it is something we're thinking about,like what does what happens in the pipeline
for these women that you know,we said there's eleven hundred collegiate players this
year, so what what does itlook like that they can do maybe after
their collegiate career is done, orif they you know, they have a
standout junior and senior year, Likeare they are they getting those looks?

(32:35):
Are they getting those opportunities to continueto grow and develop their program or their
their game. A lot of thatin previous year, says happened through going
to Europe and playing right because that'swhat they are club teams in Europe,
Whereas you know that the pro structurehere in North America has been unsettled.
Maybe a kind way of saying that, I think there's a lot of hope

(33:01):
that there will be more settling withthe p w h L starting this season,
as you mentioned, but there areoptions for players who don't play here
in North America to go over andplay in Europe after they're done to which
has always been a I think apretty cool way for starting your post college

(33:25):
life too. Is you know,for sure a couple of years ago play
hockey and live in Europe. Isa couple of players I've talked to and
said, you know, you canunderstand the appeal there absolutely of having that
option. I think too, we'regonna see I think we might still see
some of that in that they canmaybe do some partial seasons. You know,
some of the girls that went toplay in that DHL and Sweden are

(33:47):
still going to come back and playin the p w h L. So
depending on how those seasons can continueto align, we might get a chance
to see that. We definitely sortof went maybe in a be a bit
of a downer in terms of focusingon some of this stuff, and I
just I do want to say that, like the point of being excited about
the international players is that, likeyou can pay about ten dollars max on

(34:10):
a ticket to go see a collegiatewomen's game, and that's usually like at
Wisconsin or Minnesota as that much.Other places are free five dollars or less.
What is a season ticket at Madisonlike seventy five this year's it's pretty
ridiculously inexpensive. And when you seeWisconsin play a team like Minnesota, or
you see Ohio State, or yousee Colgate or you see Clarkson, you're

(34:32):
talking about paying less than ten dollarsto see multiple Olympians or multiple World Championship
roster players on the ice at anygiven time. So you know, if
you talk Wisconsin, Minnesota, AbbeyMurphy, Britta Curl, Layla Edwards,
Lacey Eden, Kk Harvey, allof these players are currently in their national

(34:57):
team poll and they're still collegiate players. So when they're they're going head to
head, and like when you talksort of some of them were the East
Coast schools ECAC were. Now likeI said, Clarkson, Colgate, you'll
see a lot of the Canadian nationalteam players. And so the part where
this is an international driver and you'reseeing these women come play for these programs
is that you get to go watchthem in arenas that hold you know,

(35:20):
a couple thousand people and sit reallyclose and watch for a couple of dollars
some of the best hockey happening inthe world. And uh, that's pretty
priceless and pretty cool. And whatI always try to remind people of when
they're when they're you're trying to tellthem to give it a shot, because
I just think, like the factthat that these women play in small arenas
for a couple bucks is kind ofblows my mind. But now that we've
talked about the international game, whydon't we come back for segment three.

(35:44):
We will tell you a little bitabout the structure of the NCAA, some
of the conferences, what the postseasonlooks like, how the NCAA tournament has
changed, and uh, get youready to become fans of this season.
That's not too far in that youcan't start following this year. Welcome back
to the podcast. I'm Todd Maleski. Nicole Hase is with me. As

(36:07):
always, this week, we're talkingabout the details of what NCAA hockey is
all about. We've talked about someof the history, we've talked about the
awards, We've talked about where playerscome from and where they go. Now,
let's talk about what a season isactually like five Division one conferences spread

(36:27):
around you know, the Northeast andinto the Midwest, and I guess it's
kind of, you know, stretchinga little bit the borders in some directions
there, but that's mostly where itis. Nicole, Do you want to
talk about where the teams are,what kind of seasons they play, and
how some of that is laid outjust from of a high end perspective there,

(36:52):
Sure, So there's the five conferences. The women's hockey season generally lasts
from the end of September till midMarch, so it's a nice long season.
That early September October period will usuallybe some non conference games, meaning
teams that don't normally face each othertravel and give us some head to head

(37:13):
and excitement. You know. Theopening weekend of this year, we saw
Ohio State play Colgate, which wasyou know, two top ranked teams,
top five teams, which was reallyawesome. And so that's a fun time
because the players the teams haven't gottena lot of time on the ice prior
to playing those games because of NCAArules. And then we move into conference
matchups. Where the teams play headto head and the point of that is

(37:37):
within each conference they earn points.At the end of the season, those
conferences each have their own conference tournament. Those are seeded based on the standings
that are crew over the course ofthe season. The winner of the conference
tournament of each of the five conferencesreceives an automatic bid into the NCAA Tournament.
The NCAA Tournament now consists of eleventeams. We will come back round

(38:04):
to that, but so that meansthat there are also six at large bids.
So are those come from the otherteams the other top drink teams over
the course of the season that don'twin their respective conference championships. So we
have Hockey East, College Hockey Americawhich is the cha ECAC, which is

(38:25):
mostly teams out in the Northeast,and New how which is the New England
Women's Hockey Alliance. That's the newestconference. They earned their first auto bid
last season. And see rules requiresyou to have at least six teams in
your conference in order to earn anauto bid. That new conference had to
sort of build up and then there'stwo years that you have to play before

(38:45):
you can get it. So yeah, and then the WHA, which is
the Western Collegiate Hockey Association. Sothe conference is obviously if you are not
super familiar with college hockey, don'talign with sort of more traditional sports conferences.
Uh nearly all of these schools areDivision one. There are a couple
of Division two as Assumption just joinedas a Division two school. You will

(39:07):
find some smaller schools here that areD one in hockey. NC rules have
changed his house, so that needsto be But you know, you'll find
a school the size of Saint CloudState, Saint Thomas, Midgie State play
against Minnesota, Wisconsin, Ohio State, and the w c h A.
So that's really always interesting in howthose different size programs support and build their

(39:31):
programs. So yeah, there's thefive conferences, and Todd, do you
want to talk a little bit maybeabout the postseason and how that how we
how those five conference germans lead usinto a national tournament. Yeah. The
you know, I guess one ofthe uh defining features of college sports is
that there's usually a second chance foryou no matter you know, how your

(39:53):
season has gone. It is,this isn't one hundred percent, but you
usually get a chance to get inyour conference tournament and play for a chance,
like you said, at that automaticbid to the NCAA tournament to keep
your season going. Now, likeI said, it's not one hundred percent
thing where in every college you knowsport, every team gets into their conference

(40:16):
tournament. That's not the way itgoes. There is something get cut out,
But in general that that's the I'mnot sure if that's the way it
is in every league, but I'mpretty sure it is where everyone gets in
in women's hockey to their conference tournament. You would know that better than I
would. It is not currently thesituation, but the leagues are working on

(40:38):
fixing some of that. Let's putthat away. So what it comes down
to is that the conference tournament happens. You get you get seeded by how
you finished in the regular season,uh, and then you go into In
some leagues it's a it's a oneshot all the way through. In some
leagues you're playing best of three seriesis in the first round, and then

(41:00):
you go into a semi final anda championship championship game that are single elimination.
It depends some The WHA, forinstance, has a pre set location
for its conference championship tournament, thesemi finals and finals right now, that
is in Minneapolis at Rhetor Arena whereMinnesota plays, and there are other setups

(41:25):
that are more dependent on going withthe higher seed hosting in those semi final
in championship rounds and so the youknow, that happens over the course of
two or three weekends, two weekendsusually, but it spreads into a third

(41:45):
sometimes, I think where they're actuallymaybe not even weekends. Happens midweek for
some games and goes into a weekendfor the rest, and out of that
we get like Nicole said, wehave five automatic qualifiers for the NCAA tournament,
which is a standard part of anyNCAA tournament. There's automatic qualifiers,

(42:07):
and there are at large bids.Uh. And then that leaves right now
six at large bids to be decidedby the pairwise rankings, which the mathematical
formula by which each team is comparedto every other team in Division one,
So forty four teams you're gonna eachteam is considered is compared to all forty

(42:32):
three others in some criteria that involveyou know, head to head matchups,
and we can we could have awhole podcast about this. We're not going
to uh it's it's there's an explaineron our on the U s HI website
if you really want to get intoit. But that sets the rankings that

(42:52):
are used for picking those six atlarge teams, the top six that aren't
already automatic qualifiers, and then foralso for seating the NCAA tournament. And
I'm going to throw it back toyou for saving NCAA tournament because I know
this has been something that has changedrecently when we have talked about, you

(43:13):
know, priorities of the NCAAs becauseit also should we should note that the
tournament started as four teams way backwhen it started, expanded to eight and
is now eleven. Along the way, there have been some bumps in determining
how teams get seated for the NCAAtournament. This is also something we could

(43:35):
probably spend an entire podcast on,and maybe we will when it comes to
that this season. But there arethere are different ways now of laying out
the NCAA tournament format, and youcould probably get into that. I can
some of it, but frankly,explaining how an eleven team tournament lays out
on a bracket is more mind bendingthan I think anybody is really capable of.

(44:00):
The moral of the story is thetournament expanded from eight teams to eleven
teams. I have some personal thoughtson that, but I will I'll say
some of that for at the endof the season, when there's an even
number right there, right right aboveit, that would make it a lot
cleaner. Right there. It wasa forum. I maintain its malicious compliance

(44:24):
the NCAA. So backing up alittle bit. During COVID, the nca
women's basketball tournament was held in somepretty poor conditions, and the players took
to social media to show you knowthat men's basketball tournament versus the women's basketball
tournam and these women were given likelike a whole quadrant of the bracket was

(44:50):
in one stadium because of COVID,and there was like seven dumbbells for all
of them to share. And soequity became a very big focus. There
was a lot of pressure on theNCAA to look at some of those things.
Women's basketball got their own sort ofbreakdown and investigation. There was an
investigation into to all sports. Thehockey part of this investigation just showed a

(45:12):
lot of inequity in terms of themoney spent, the marketing done, the
really every every way you compare men'sand women's NCAA hockey head to head,
Women's hockey came out behind everything fromhow many signs were up in the host
city for the Frozen four down tolike what swag the students got as part

(45:34):
of making the tournament. And sothis really there was already a group of
coaches and administrators and program directors thatwere pushing to expand the women's tournament from
eight teams. Again, we areup to forty four teams. We have
been somewhere between thirty six and thatnumber for quite a few years at this
point, and so it was apretty small percentage of the teams that made

(45:57):
the national tournament, and so theywere pushing for it. They you know,
had taken it to NCAA meetings,they were told no, it was
tabled. This equity conversation came upat the same time, fortuitous for them,
so it was no longer tabled.It was brought up almost kind of
like in a special session. Andafter all the discussion, instead of upping

(46:19):
it to twelve teams, they saidthis percentage of there are. I don't
know the numbers, Todd you wouldknow, member. There are. However,
many men's collegiate hockey teams. Themen's tournament is sixteen teams. That
is x percent of that, andso they made they used that percentage to
decide how many women should make anNCAA tournament women's teams. That's how we
ended up at eleven. It's quitesilly. They're not going to change the

(46:44):
men's number to like fifteen if ifa program closes, They're not going to
up it to seventeen if more programsget added. It's a very silly thing
to have chosen to adhere to interms of the numbers. I mean,
we would all like to see themin here to things like the amount of
money spent, But those numbers apparentlyaren't important. This percentage number is.
That's how we got to eleven.We seed the top four teams again based

(47:07):
on pairwise, those four teams becomethe host sites. They at each of
those sites where I think we've decidedto call them regionals. This is never
this was never an issue till twoyears ago. This the tournament structure changed.
I think we're still trying to figureout how to how are what to
call some of this and it changedwithout like some of these critical things being

(47:27):
decided. I think, like whatthese are all called or what we should
be naming them. Yeah, ithappened, and it was and I should
put on it happened mid season.Yeah, the teams that were top ranked,
that were you know, sort ofthinking that they would be the ones
to host NCA quarterfinals were suddenly findingout that they were actually gonna host a

(47:47):
game earlier in the weekend that theydidn't know about. So what happened now
is we have two teams at threeof the four host sites. There are
two teams that play usually like ona Thursday. The winner of that region
we're calling them regional semifinals then goeson to play the host team of that
regional So then that is the actualquarterfinal, and the winners of those four

(48:13):
games go to the frozen four atthe third site, which is what is
it the five to six I believematchup. There is no four or five.
There is no regional semi final.There's only one game at that host
site. It's how the structure ofthe bracket and bracket integrity, you know,
one the option that would be likeone would get to play eleven if

(48:37):
everything went the way that it was, that the top teams still have an
advantage for being the top teams.I don't know if anybody followed that.
Bless your heart. I promise wewill come back to some of this,
and I will also make sure thatwe include visuals the links to those sorts
of things. You can check thatout on the us CHO site. Bracket.
I believe last year's practice still willchange that over to this year's once

(49:00):
we get a little bit closer toactually putting teams into the twenty twenty four
tournament bracket. But it's yeah,it it just how much we had to
talk about that, it should probablytell you that it's not a great setup.
So the one of the exciting changes, however, that happened, is

(49:20):
that a few was that two yearsago, the words bracket integrity never existed
anywhere in the Women's Championship manual.The selection committee was told to avoid flights
if possible. Travel was sort ofthe premier thing that was used to decide
which teams would play, so itoften meant that the top seeds again those

(49:42):
top four host teams. It wasn'tnecessarily that one was hosting the lews seed
at this time, it would havebeen eight. It wasn't necessarily that two
was hosting seven. So particularly becausenationally we have this sort of break of
Western teams and Eastern teams, rightlike, you've got a couple, Ohiopen
Slovenia schools in the middle, butmostly you have Wisconsin, Minnesota, and
then you have the East Coast,and so unlike in I think any other

(50:07):
sports championship manual that I could find, I did some research of this.
At the time, the primary criteriawas to avoid spending money essentially, so
there was no bracket integrity to thewomen's hockey tournament, which was just really
so frustrating to watch year after year. And so finally the rules committee decided

(50:30):
to take away that requirement, whichis just a huge win for the sport
and for you know, the integrityof the game and making sure that the
very best teams are playing at theend of the season. So that's a
huge change that happened recently and thatwe're very excited about it. There is
one other part to it though,too, that it's not necessarily that the
bracket is fixed to you know,one play is the eight to eleven that

(50:58):
one, two, three, fourthrough eleven are lined up by how they
finish in the pair wise. Thereare there are conditions where they will try
to avoid matchups of conference teams inthe first round if they if that's how
they line up in some circumstances.So it is. It's not just like

(51:19):
the the selection committee has no leewaywhatsoever in changing the how the bracket looks,
but it is fairly limited. They'renot, you know, they're told
now to stick more toward keeping theintegrity of the bracket in place as opposed

(51:43):
to trying to save a few bucks, which is yes, was a a
big win for everyone in the sportwhen that came through. Yeah, it's
so huge. I mean that,Like I said, the fact that those
words, the words bracket integrity nevershowed up just really showed where the priorities
were. So yeah, that wasa huge win. As Todd said,
the committee still has sim leeway andthat's always going to lead to some interesting

(52:07):
discussions, but it does, Ithink make the whole thing a little more
transparent in terms of if a teamfinishes ranked somewhere in the pairwise that we
are going to see them pretty muchplaced in the bracket based on that number.
Again, as Tod mentioned, there'ssome mandates in that first round avoiding

(52:29):
intra conference matchups, and we mightsee some swap some swaps because of that,
but overall, it's just a muchmore clear picture of what the team's
heading into the selection show, knowingwhere what teams should be playing where.
Yep, and if you followed alongwith all that, it's still with us,
Yeah, thanks for hanging around.But so that leads into, you

(52:52):
know, after that first week ofthe NCAA tourney, you get to the
Frozen Four, which is the semifinals. The way the schedule is set
up now, a semifinals on aFriday, championship game on a Sunday,
and like Nicole mentioned earlier, thePatty Casmier Awards ceremony being the day in
between those. It has become ayou know, a destination event for women's

(53:16):
hockey at least that's that's the wayI've looked at it, right, And
it's because it is in a setlocation. Every year, we know this,
They set them four or five yearsin advance, sometimes four years.
Yeah, yeah, so that youknow where it's going to be. You
know what date it is. Youdon't know if your team, if you

(53:37):
will follow one team, you don'tneed to know if they're going to be
there. But for a lot ofpeople that doesn't necessarily matter. They want
to be there to support women's hockey. And I think that's a pretty cool
statement about you know, the fandomof women's hockey is that they're they're turning
out to Frozen Fours, and yousee the jerseys of teams that in the

(53:59):
crowd, teams that aren't there.And this is a one of those neat
elements of the game that I thoughtwe should bring up here too. That's
the Frozen Four is really a destinationweekend for a lot of people. Yeah,
I think there's you know, Iwould say there's a long way to
go on that the men's Frozen Fourhas long been that way, that there's

(54:20):
fan fest and that people just planto go every year regardless of who's playing.
They know they're going to see highlevel hockey, they know they're going
to see their friends from different conferences, and the second those tickets go on
sale, they purchase them. AndI think we are working our way towards
that on the women's side, whichis great, but I think there's a
way to go in terms of what'sbeing offered as a fan experience. Again,
like I said, making the pattykazAn open ceremony is really awesome.

(54:44):
That's one of the things that that'sreally cool. The other sort of mitigating
circumstance on this is that the sothe men's conference tournament is usually happening at
the same time as the women's FrozenFour. There are also rules as to
the size of the stadium that canhost to a women's Frozen Four. For
example, Wisconsin's Lavon Arena is toosmall, so there's only a handful of

(55:07):
arenas that are sort of I guessthe right size for this until it rows
more right. We don't want toput it in a big, cavernous arena,
and so there is a limited numberof places that the tournament can be,
which does limit some of this.Right, last year we were in
Duluth. Two years ago we wereat Penn State, which is a gorgeous

(55:29):
facility but is real hard to getto. Yeah, that challenge with some
of them is that you've got anice place to do it, but not
exactly an easy place for fans toget to. And then, as I
said, with the men's conference tournaments, you're you're battling for ice space,
you are battling for This is alsousually happening during March Madness, so you're
battling for press coverage and all thosesorts of things. But yes, at

(55:52):
Todd's point of it should be adestination. I mean, you know,
regardless of if your team is thereor not, you know you're going to
see top tier hockey. I thinkis the reason why it should be circled
on everybody's calendar, like you knowwhat weekends is going to be. As
you said, like the I thinkwe'll announce the next four probably this year,
right, because I hope we're doingso next year always stuff to think

(56:13):
that next year we back at PennState. That sounds right, yep,
and then the following year in Minneapolis. This season in twenty four it's at
New Hampshire. Yes, it's inDurhmaw, Hampshire, at the University of
New Hampshire. I already have mytickets and my hotel book, as I
would suggest to everybody else, becausea real small town. But yeah,

(56:35):
it's a it's a really fun weekend. You're gonna see, there will be
represents from USA Hockey, there,there will be you know, former players
there there. It's it's just areally fun and exciting atmosphere and it's the
celebration of this game that we love, which is I think probably the coolest
part. And honestly, it's justas fun to cheer on to like pick
a team that's not your team ifyour team's not there and cheer them on.

(56:55):
And also the low stakes of notbeing on the edge of your seats.
As my friends often tell me,like they really enjoyed a couple of
years ago at Penn State just goingand getting to enjoy watching the game without
sort of having, you know,a fighter in the game kind of thing.
They really just enjoyed being able towatch and really appreciate the individual style

(57:16):
without hanging on on hook wondering what'sgoing to happen. Yep, there's one
last thing I think we should touchon here before we uh, you know,
finish things off. And that's whatthe NCAA Women's Hockey how how maybe

(57:36):
different gameplay wise, and you you'dwritten down a couple of things for us,
your nicole, I think maybe ifyou want to touch on those,
what that what what's different about women'shockey in the NCAA versus other levels,
or what's different about women's hockey versusmen's hockey, and some of that too,

(57:58):
sure, So I think it's reallyimportant to point out is that there
is literally one rule in the NCAAIce Hockey Manual that differentiates women's talking from
men's hoki. So for all thatpeople like to talk about the different sense,
it's literally this one rule. It'sabout body checking. There is no
checking in women's hockey. I thinkit's important to note that it does not
mean that there is not content,that it is not physical. It just

(58:22):
means that there are not open icehits. While there are, they're legal,
but generally you are going to seeyou are not going to see those
open iceed hits that and for me, what that means that it really affects
the style and the flow of play. You're going to see a lot less
stoppage of a women's game. It'sgoing to flow much more because instead of

(58:43):
sort of knocking your opponent off thepuck, you ere either going to see
the person possessing the puck need towork their way around the defense via defense
or puck handling and vice versa.You are going to see the defense need
to steal that puck away. Soit really lends to a sort of I
really don't want to get I alwayswant to call it like pure hockey,
and I don't mean that as likea value judgment, but just in that

(59:05):
like kind of hockey that you learnedwhen when you were learning the game,
in terms of passing work, teamwork, movement on the ice. So just
this sort of really the fundamentals,but at this really elevated level, so
that you're seeing some of the prettiestpuck handling, the best ice vision in
terms of being able to thread passesand feed players and you know, send

(59:28):
them through the neutrals out things likethat. And so to me that so
the biggest difference obviously is that there'sno checking, But to me, the
different that is what that leads tois the difference in the style of play.
And generally I would say it's justit's there's more flow and there's more
finesse. How do you like,do you have a different way of describing
it? Well, I just thinkit's been It's interesting to me that the
NCAA think it was before last seasonbefore the twenty twenty two to twenty three

(59:52):
season, had to clarify that contactis not necessarily a penalty in women's hockey
because it had been started to becalled that way, that any any meeting
of two bodies when it was causedby one of them was kind of being

(01:00:12):
looked at as well, that's gotto be a penalty because it was a
collision. Well, no, that'snot how the rules written. It's it's
written that there's a level there.And this is sometimes hard to distinguish what
uh that what the line is andwhether someone's crossed it. But there are
there are definitely games that are morephysical than others and involving you know,

(01:00:37):
teams. Some teams are play alittle bit more of a physical style.
Some teams play a more wide openuh, want to move the pucking more,
want to let their skilled players haveas much room as possible kind of
game. When you when you seetwo of those different styles come against each

(01:00:57):
other, that rarely kind of makesthat interesting. We've seen a few of
those season, I think. Butthat's the uh for me is that I
I understand you know, the thatbody checking is a penalty, but that
doesn't necessarily mean that every collision isa body check. Uh, and that's
uh, it's something that does takea little bit to get used to.

(01:01:20):
I think when you're watching a gameand you're told that you know, well
checking is illegal, Well that thereare degrees to that, and uh,
that's that's something that players test andsometimes they go to the box for it
and then we you know, they'lltest keep testing it because that's just a
part of the game. And uh, that's we are in a collision sport,

(01:01:43):
as I've heard coach say, Andthat's just some of what you have
to kind of filter through as aspart of the game. What's what's right
and what's wrong. Yeah, Ithink what once you start watching games,
particularly across different conferences, you'll noticeboth that the styles do change from conference
to conference. And some of that, I think is because the officiating is

(01:02:07):
different from conference to conference. Itshouldn't be, but it is, and
those rules are called differently, andso then you get when those teams play
each other, the feeling out ofhow the officials are going to call the
game. But I also, Imean it has been a little different in
the last year or two, butyou used to be able to look at
the teams that were most penalized,and it was almost always all the CHA

(01:02:30):
teams at the top, which justtells you that if it's all of them
and not just one of them,that it's how their game is being called.
And so I think it's just reallyimportant to look and notice those differences.
It's just a really inconsistent thing,as Tud said, because not all
contact is body checking. It's veryinteresting to me because I personally think it's

(01:02:51):
There is one rule in that book. It's rule for ninety four at least
it was last I looked, andit was like rules for women's hockey,
the following rules are to be used. Ninety four point two. Body checking
is not permitted. Body checking occurswhen a player's intent is to gain possession
of the puck by separating the puckcarrier from the puck with a distinct and
definable movement moment of impact. That'sit. That's the description. And so

(01:03:15):
there's right, incidental contact may occur, and angling's permissible. Those are the
three things that the entire NCAA IceHockey Manual says about women's hockey different from
men's hockey. So yeah, Ithink we could again, we could spend
a whole separate podcast just talking aboutthe different ways that this is called,

(01:03:36):
the different ways that it's used.But I think what's important from a spectator
standpoint is to look at how ateam that would prefer to be wide open
would prefer to be, you know, using speed and transition, how teams
defend against that, and how teamscan slow down teams like Wisconsin, who
are you know, trying to movethrough the neutral zone? And so then
you watch what like Saint Cloud Statedoes as a lower ranked team, a

(01:04:00):
team is sort of like less youknow, US national team players, things
like that. Look at what ismaking a team like Saint Cloud's six vessel
against you know, the number one, two, three teams in the country
when they play Minnesota, Wisconsin,Ohio State and the ECAC. You can
look at like Colgate, you know, their their style is they say we
play free. They really put anemphasis on allowing their players to be really

(01:04:24):
creative with the puck. So whatdo the teams they play against do try
to try and interrupt that flow?And that's where I think some of this
comes in. And how you whatwe always talk about, like you know,
some of the best hockey you cansee is like Wisconsin versus Minnesota,
right, and I think on theECACA it's probably like COVID versus Cornell or
Clerkson. But ultimately those games aren'tpretty games of hockey. US and Canada

(01:04:48):
aren't pretty games of hockey. Andit's because those two teams interrupt each other
so well. Right, it's aboutpope checking, and it's about you know,
getting in the way of pass andsort of all of the little,
tiny, sort of nippicky things youcan do to try and slow down your
opponents. So when we're talking likereflowing hockey, that's not happening in the

(01:05:10):
best contested women's hockey games, becauseI mean those moments of brilliance, right
and where where it does all cometogether, but it's so rare that it
does. Right. They're gonna contestevery inch of the ice, they are
gonna you know, use the boards, they're gonna dig in the corners,
all of those sorts of things,and so the the when those top teams
are playing each other, it's about, like you said, finding those those

(01:05:32):
little moments where the perfect pass isthreaded or the perfect sort of drive into
the back post for a possible rebound. It's a lot of those really small
moments that when you see those topteams playing each other, which is I
think what's so fun to watch.And I think that comes it like with
this the you know, there isa lot of body contact, There is

(01:05:55):
a lot of you know, sortof smushing a girl up against the boards
and really trying to slow down,like not get let those teams get into
their flow and if they are ableto pass like they want to and move
down the iceless speed like you're introuble. So uh, I think that's
that's what's fun to watch in termsof of sort of that part of the

(01:06:16):
game. Well, that's pretty much. That's not all we know about women,
I hope not. No, There'sthere's a lot more out there.
But uh, that's what we wantedto bring you today in terms of this,
uh this edition of the podcast andand the primer and the the the
the top issues that we wanted tomention to you. So, Nicole,

(01:06:41):
do you want to wrap things uphere for us this week? Yeah?
Absolutely. I'd say if anybody hasquestions that we didn't cover in terms of
fundamentals, things you're trying to understandto get into being a fan of the
college game. Definitely reach out toWe are both on Twitter, both at
our full names, so I'm atNicole Hasey, He's at Tamala. You
can also email me through the WSor I'm sorry through the us CHO website.

(01:07:06):
There's a fan forum on there aswell, so definitely if there's stuff
that we haven't covered or you stillhave confusion about, let us know.
But otherwise, thanks for listening.We hope this cleared things up and we
will be back next week with anotherepisode of podcasts, the Usaho Women's Talk
Podcast. Thanks for listening.