Episode 768: Alucarda, la hija de las tiniebla (1977)

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Speaker 2 (00:20):
Oh gez, folks, it's showtime. People say good mighty to
see this movie.

Speaker 3 (00:26):
When they go out to a theater, they want clothed, sodas,
hot popcorn in.

Speaker 4 (00:30):
No monsters in the projection Booth.

Speaker 2 (00:32):
Everyone pretend podcasting isn't boring.

Speaker 5 (00:35):
Cut it off, only not gonna be h for alpim

(01:01):
k board pier manifestation duous. But I say say, like
a pa Feterrabian conist from joys to the end, I
will never see that the bodies before probable wound that
your traba posts about mad up to ten year well
resuable by those days body was to maintained sun.

Speaker 6 (01:34):
From your lamm.

Speaker 4 (01:44):
It was mean saying I don't kill a ready humuna fast.
You're the formal des clabby too.

Speaker 1 (01:49):
You can be the wrong.

Speaker 4 (01:50):
Last then, as a superstition, as you go, the Lamente said,
so you number the same here jooraman queen of Franian group.

Speaker 3 (02:02):
Somber mister.

Speaker 4 (02:20):
Rabian Alito de Manda into the Lista said the syns.
Solo Provida said, now they look you stay busy. Man
held them on you a.

Speaker 6 (02:33):
Look gard God, the Father commands, thee God, the Son commands,
see God, the Holy Ghost command stew.

Speaker 2 (02:43):
Gone cloud your group.

Speaker 6 (02:50):
David Silver, Dina Rome, Susannah Amini, Adriana Dina French. Did

(03:34):
he hit that for Juan Lopez to school?

Speaker 1 (03:39):
Welcome to the projection booth. I'm your host Mike White
Germany once again as mister Ryan Lewis Rodriguez.

Speaker 7 (03:44):
Hello, sir.

Speaker 1 (03:46):
Also back in the booth is my Chasing Chevy Chase
co host mister Mark Begley. I like it good Modern
problems reference there Yes, October twenty twenty five continues, They
look at one. Lopez Makta Zuma's al Ukarda released in
nineteen seventy seven. The film stars Susanna Kamini as Justine,

(04:07):
a young woman who is cloistered at a convent with
the mysterious al Ucarda played by Tina Romero. The two
form an instant bond with each other and the dark
Lord himself. We will be spoiling this film as much
as we can. So if you haven't seen al Jukarta,
turn off the podcast and come back after you have.
It's just as simple as that. And by the way,

(04:29):
it's available over on archive dot org. Really nice print
of it.

Speaker 2 (04:32):
So there you go.

Speaker 7 (04:33):
I Criterion Channel right now too.

Speaker 1 (04:36):
I'm not mister big bucks. I can't afford the Criterion Channel.
I spend all money my name or.

Speaker 7 (04:40):
Can I I'm just mister money bags going around here
subscribing to a twelve ninety nine month channel and living
high in the hog.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
I spend all my money over on the RuPaul channel
and the Taskmaster channel myself. But Ryan, when was the
first time you saw al Ukarta? And I think I
know the answer? And what did you think so well?

Speaker 7 (04:59):
The I might even heard of it is when you
were proposing toy. By the time I actually got around
to it, when I knew that this episode was coming up,
I watched it. I believe it was Friday. So I'm
an Ello Karta virgin.

Speaker 1 (05:11):
Basically, well, virgins are appreciated around here. Do you have
any exactly any knife marks across your chest or anything?

Speaker 7 (05:19):
I do, but I don't care to share it.

Speaker 2 (05:20):
Over video. I try to.

Speaker 7 (05:22):
I like to describe it. It gets a better input.

Speaker 1 (05:25):
Very nice and mark. How about yourself?

Speaker 2 (05:28):
Well, I was trying to figure this out. I knew
I had watched it before I had letterboxed. I used
to keep an Excel spreadsheet of all the horror movies
I watched, mainly so that I didn't keep repeating myself,
which I did anyway. But I was looking through it
yesterday and I realized that the newer quote unquote movies

(05:49):
that were close on the spreadsheet were all from twenty sixteen.
So long story short, I watched it for the first
time sometime in twenty sixteen. I had heard about it
at least a couple of years prior to that, and
I probably read about it when I was in my
early twenties because of some of the big, massive film

(06:11):
books I have, In particular, it's a really big book,
the Encyclopedia Horror, that went from I don't know I
guess the beginning of film to like nineteen eighty five,
shortly before it was published, and it's in that book.
I couldn't find it in any of my other film books,

(06:32):
but I know I had heard the name and where
I stumbled on it recently. Was probably somewhere online, you know,
one of those websites ten movies You've never seen, ten
best horror movies you don't know about, and all that
shit that usually isn't true, but for this one it was.

(06:52):
And it took me a while to track it down
because it wasn't streaming anywhere not I mean, there was
no Criterion channel back then.

Speaker 8 (07:01):
Back in my day, there was no Criterion channel. We
had Film Movement and we were happy. We had to
watch cable for five hours a day just to get
the sensation.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
I looked for it on all you know on demand,
on all the channels that.

Speaker 1 (07:16):
We were subscribed to.

Speaker 2 (07:17):
I looked for it on Shutter, on Netflix, everything you know.
There's so many more channels now in streaming service. But anyway,
I believe I just watched it on YouTube. There was
a serviceable copy on YouTube. I think it may have
been missing a few minutes, although I know my initial
reaction and on further watching, it doesn't feel like anything

(07:42):
was cut out. The nudity was definitely intact. The gore
was intact as far as I can remember, and it
was one of those where it lived up to the
hype in my mind. I know that I did some
reading up on it before I watched it, and most
people were like, it's insane. It's just filled with screaming
and there's nudity and gore, and it goes places you

(08:05):
don't expect, and a lot of film from that time
didn't go. And I was like, yeah, yeah, i'll buy that.
I'll buy it.

Speaker 7 (08:12):
It does all that seventy seven minutes, that.

Speaker 2 (08:15):
Tight seventy eight.

Speaker 1 (08:16):
I mean I did find one that was one hundred
and fourteen.

Speaker 2 (08:20):
Yeah, and that's what I watched.

Speaker 1 (08:22):
I didn't really see very many differences. I couldn't read
about any differences as far as that went. So, yeah,
maybe it's just plays is slightly faster. I'm not sure.
It could be a whole ntsc versus heal seekam kind
of thing. I don't know, but yeah, I didn't see
a whole lot of differences either between the two. This
was a relatively new watch for me, kind of like you.

(08:44):
I had read about it for years and years. I've
always wanted to check out Machtezuma's work because he is
in that same camp with some of my favorite filmmakers
such as Hoderowski and araball and Roland Copor we talked well, Gosh,
I can't remember him. Was this year or the previous
year about Angels and Cherubs, the Corkidi film. And he

(09:09):
was kind of in that same camp, and so his
movies and he was not just a filmmaker, but he
was kind of one of these guys where he I
want to say, he did comic books, he had a
radio show. He was a man of many, many talents,
and filmmaking was just one of those. I believe he
was a producer on Fondo e Lease, and I want

(09:30):
to say also with al Copo he was as well.
And this falls into that nunsploitation movement that was going
on in the seventies. I think that was kind of
a answer to things like Ken Russell's The Devils. They
make references to nuns losing their mind, at least in

(09:50):
the book of the Exorcist. I don't know if they
do in the film of the Exorcist talk about the
Devil's a loudon. There are some cases that they read
out in the this movie that would fall into that
as well. Even things like Rosemary's Baby I think falls
into this. As far as the whole daughter of the Devil,
Child of the Devil kind of thing. So this kind

(10:12):
of mashes a lot of that stuff together, as well
as relying a lot on the Sheridan la Fanou novel.
Carmela and I listened to that on audible and that
was a lot of fun. It was a kind of
like a radio produced version, so you had different actors
reading different parts and did a really good job. Kept

(10:34):
me on the edge of my seat. And there are
very similar things in this as far as this Vampirius woman,
though they don't really talk about vamporism in this film.
It's kind of like Angels and Cherubs in that way
that there's vampism, and they even respect some of the
ideas of passing the vamporism around, but here it's more

(10:55):
there's some paganism and then just anti Catholicism that throughout
this whole film.

Speaker 2 (11:02):
I have a little bit of a problem with the
nunsupplitation angle, because the nuns don't really go crazy in this,
and we're not getting naked nuns cavorting around trying to
seduce the priest or the townsfolk, or each other or
the girls. I almost feel like it's more of a

(11:25):
one of the many Exorcist ripoffs from the mid seventies.
Beyond the Door, I mean, there's just I can rattle
off a whole list for the episode, I guess, but
that was really big. It's not hit upon as much.
But they talk about, especially the priest in this talks
about possession much more than vamporism or the sexual nature

(11:49):
of Alo Karta and Justine's relationship or anything like that.
It's more about they're possessed, and this is what happens
when you're possessed, and we're probably going to be possessed,
so be on the lookout for that. And I was
kind of scanning through trying to find older reviews of
the film, but all I could find were recent ones,
And in one I read, they said that the sound

(12:13):
designer for this film was the same person who did
the sound design for The Exorcist, and I could not
verify that online. That doesn't match the IMDb credit information
for both those films. Chris Thompson or Christopher Thompson was
the sound designer for The Exorcist, and al Ukarta is

(12:34):
not listed in his credits. Whether that's here nor there,
I don't know, but there is some familiarity with the
sound design of the creatures that we just hear, particularly
at the beginning of the film, when Alukarta's mom has
given birth to her, we get a little sense of it.
And then when there when she is older and back

(12:55):
at that mausoleum with Justine, we hear them again. And
it does have a famililiarity with the sounds that demon
sounds in The Exorcist.

Speaker 1 (13:04):
It's kind of ironic. This is the second movie this
month for October where we have a main character named Justine.
And I'm I know for sure with the earlier film
that it was a reference to Dussaud, and I'm pretty
darn sure here it's also a reference to Dussaud. And
the name al u Karta always cracks me up because
it so reminds me of Edwood and Edwood when he's

(13:27):
talking about doctor Acula, well.

Speaker 9 (13:30):
You know, I don't believe in thinking small, So I've
got a whole sleight of pictures short you you ready, okay,
The Vampire's Tomb, the Ghoule goes West, and doctor.

Speaker 1 (13:43):
Acula, Doctor Acula.

Speaker 9 (13:48):
I don't get it, Doctor.

Speaker 3 (13:52):
Recula, I get it.

Speaker 2 (13:56):
I don't like it, but it'll start belling the ghost
the lagos lagosis a watched what else you got?

Speaker 1 (14:06):
Yeah, we get it. It's a Dracula spelled backwards. Okay,
but it's a cool name.

Speaker 2 (14:13):
But the way they say it in the movie, it
just sounds like a Spanish or Mexican name. I'm like, oh,
that rolls right off their tongues. That's great.

Speaker 1 (14:20):
And I'm not sure where this is supposed to be
set because it's got a European feel, even though I
believe they shot this in Mexico. But then when they
go to a crypt and they have Lucy from the
actual Dracula story, that's her mom in this, Like Lucy,
what is it Westerna or whatever, it's.

Speaker 2 (14:39):
Like Sterna, yeah yeah or Westernra yeah, Western I think, And.

Speaker 1 (14:44):
It's like, oh, that's my mom. She died fifteen years ago.
I'm like, okay, well that tells me how old you are.
And it also tells me that this is set in
a Bram Stoker universe as well, So all right, that's
kind of cool.

Speaker 2 (14:57):
I think that gets changed. This is sort of another
thing that neither hear nor there sorry interrupt, but that
fifteen years kind of I'm like, oh, they're supposed to
be fifteen, okay. And at one of the reviews I read,
they talked about the girls being eighteen, like the mom
died eighteen years ago, And I'm like, did they change
this so it's not so awful? But you know that

(15:18):
wasn't the version of the version I watched. Obviously said yeah,
fifteen years ago, that's how old we are. Justine. I'm like, okay,
you look fifteen.

Speaker 1 (15:26):
She does, yeah, yeah. And I have to say that
all the actresses in here are really good. I was
really happy to see Claudio Brooke. He's one of two
people because Tina Romero plays both al U Karta and
her own mother in that opening scene, and then Claudio
Brooke plays that. He seems to change through it. He
plays this doctor Ozek character who seems to be a

(15:48):
man of science versus this. They call him a hunchback
gypsy on IMDb, and I know it's not cool to
say gypsy anymore, so I guess hunchback Romani. But at
the same time, he doesn't look like a Romani. He
looks like a fawn to me. And when we see
him fawn as in the Half Man, Half Goat, creature,

(16:08):
very Bacchinalien type of creature and very much to me
kind of a representative of Lucifer. And even though when
we first see him delivering the baby, he looks slightly
different there, and I know that al Ucarda's mother, I
guess Lucy says.

Speaker 2 (16:28):
Please promise me that you were protecting and don't.

Speaker 4 (16:31):
Let him take her away.

Speaker 1 (16:33):
And I think him in that case is Satan himself.
But is this guy that's delivering the baby, is he
also an agent of Satan? In the crypt that they're
byer the temple very very pagan to me as far
as those statues, And even when it comes to al
Ucarta herself, like one of the first things that we

(16:54):
see is her dumping a whole bunch of objects onto
the bed. She's like, oh, look at my treasures. She
dumps all this stuff on there, and I'm just like, well,
these are almost all fetish objects, and the way and
it's all nature stuff. And then the way that they
have that great cut when she's got the clump of
dirt with the little red spiders on there, and then
cut and we're suddenly outside and they're still continuing the scene.

(17:18):
It's like we've completely changed locations, and she starts talking about, Oh,
these spiders are just like us. They're identical and kind
of like forming this bond with Justine Already.

Speaker 7 (17:28):
We've just teleported. And I meant to point out when
you were talking about the doctor and what he represents,
it's fitting that if he represents Satan, that he looks
kind of like Geric Roberts.

Speaker 1 (17:39):
Claudio Brooks had been in a ton of things, and
we're actually going to be talking a lot more about
him in twenty twenty six as we talk about Simon
of the Desert. He worked a lot with Bunuel and
was in I think Exterminating Angel. I don't know if
he was in l or not, but he was definitely
Simon and Simon of the Desert and him with that

(18:02):
crazy kind of freight wig and the big fake teeth
and the long kind of billy goat beard that he has.
And it's interesting because that character is actually in Carmilla.
There's a romani guy who comes by and is talking
with the two girls. There are some similarities between Carmilla

(18:23):
and this movie, but that is one of them, and
especially where he's like, oh, well, so you drink it?
I'll give you a little good lutch arm kind of thing,
and it just adds really to the creep factor, especially
because he just keeps coming back, and there's even a
moment where he just kind of comes out of the
shadows later on and just is right there and he
has this knife. What does he say something about like

(18:44):
the knife is made out of tears and that's the
knife that kind of seals their pack between Justine and
al ucarda well, I wondered if Pete.

Speaker 2 (18:53):
Was even really there in the room when they were
having the ritual, because I'm like, where the fuck did
he come from? He's just there, okay, and then he's
gone and there's a goad and that kind of goes
towards your fun metaphor as well. And almost wish there
were more people playing multiple characters because it gives it
that theatrical feel. And I mean, my daughter was in

(19:16):
a play at the end of her school year last
year and that people were all, you know, playing multiple roles.
And when I was in London that happened a lot.
And that leads also to that whole thing with Podorowski
and Topor and their theater was the theater of the
absurd or whatever they all were.

Speaker 1 (19:35):
It was the panic movement.

Speaker 2 (19:37):
Yeah, panic movie. Yeah, And I think Benwell does some
of that in some of his movies as well. I
love that. I wish there were more that. I wish
that the sister Angelica was somebody else in the film
as well.

Speaker 7 (19:49):
And do you wish that it was fucking with your
mind more than it did?

Speaker 1 (19:52):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (19:53):
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, Like who guy looks kind of familiar?
He doesn't really, Brooks doesn't look familiar in both those roles.
It's you'd be hard pressed to know that was him
if you didn't read the credits or no read up
on the movie. But obviously Tina Rameiro was playing al
Carda and her own mom and stuff like that. But yeah,

(20:13):
that I just loved doppelgangers and doubling and stuff in
films anyway. And I could have used more like at
the daughter Brooks, doctor Osek's daughter had been one of
the nuns or something, or even.

Speaker 1 (20:27):
The woman that lives with the fawn out in the
forest and tries to do the palm reading, Like had
that been one of the older nuns, that would have
been interesting.

Speaker 2 (20:37):
Yeah, she's like, I'm gonna hold my tongue.

Speaker 1 (20:39):
I'm trying to remember which film it was we talked about.
I think just last year it might have been a
Jess Franco film. I don't think it was A Virgin
among the Living Dead. I think it was something else
where at the end of the movie, or maybe it
was Bell from Hell. I think it might have been
Bell from Hell, where it kind of reminded me of
this whole thing with Melbur Tweet, where at the end

(21:00):
of the film you find out, Oh, all of these
characters that were in this house are people in the
real world. Very Wizard of Oz.

Speaker 3 (21:08):
I'm home at last.

Speaker 2 (21:09):
Oh, you must have had a bad dream.

Speaker 9 (21:12):
No, I was on this terrible mountain ruled by the
evil doctor Klawn, and there were prisoners, and Jake was
there in Slim and Ben.

Speaker 3 (21:22):
Maybe it was just a dream, and.

Speaker 2 (21:25):
Quite a nasty one, young fella. It was a dream
of extralginary magnitude.

Speaker 1 (21:30):
He doesn't even recognize that the people that are inside
of the psych hospital were the people that were in
his fantasy. I kind of would have liked that with
these nuns, and these nuns we have to talk about
these habits that they have, kind of the way that
they change color too, because at first they look like
they're weight but then they seem to get inker and

(21:52):
redder through the movie, and at times you get that
I've talked recently too as far as like that kind
of like menstrual pattern between legs and everything. And they
don't look like any habits that I've ever seen in
my life. They can kind of remind me of like
almost like mummies with their faces open. And the one
image that I kept thinking of, and this is going

(22:14):
to be maybe a deep cut. They were reminded me
of when Frodo gets attacked by Shelab and then Sam
pulls the webbing off of his face. They look like that,
like they've been cocooned in a spider web almost.

Speaker 7 (22:28):
So when you were mentioning habits, I was thinking stuff
like smoking cigarettes or using profanity, or.

Speaker 2 (22:35):
They do have some bad habits. I was thrown off
the first two times I watched this by their habits.
It just really was distracting. And this one I let
it go, and I'm like, for me, the increasing red
and pinks kind of go along with their self flagellation
and is it really blood or is it some kind

(22:56):
of strange design that they have. I started on this
view and I felt like, Okay, this is their actual
blood and they're just letting it soak their clothes. That's
like part of their thing. This particular sect of nuns
does this for some reason, because, like you said, some
of the minstrel patterns were like real heavy and some

(23:16):
didn't really have it. And anytime people flagellate in films,
and we'll see this in the other film that we
talk about later, I like it when it shows up
then as kind of the mark for them, like, oh,
you know, they try to cover up and then you
can see the blood coming through the back or through
the front in the case of the other film. But yeah,

(23:37):
I thought, okay, yeah, it's just is just perfectly symbolic
of their lives, and at least they are. Actually that's
why the nunsplitation thing kind of throws me off for
this too, is because they actually, you know, do the flagellation.
They're trying to stay untempted, and I think that brings

(23:58):
up kind of the bigger pointed this or the bigger
problem with this film is it feels like we're leading
up with doctor Ozek, the man of science, who is
patently like, you know, this is baloney. We're past this now,
we have science, we don't believe these silly superstitions. But

(24:19):
then that's by the end of the film, that's all
thrown out the window. It's like, oh yeah, why buy it? Okay,
now I gotta say my daughter, Yeah, everything you were
saying is true. So is it really an indictment of
Catholicism when everything that they're saying.

Speaker 1 (24:35):
Is really true.

Speaker 2 (24:36):
She's really possessed. She's doing this, she's doing that, and
you guys are probably gonna get possessed too.

Speaker 7 (24:42):
They're just too impotent to do anything about it.

Speaker 6 (24:44):
Like that.

Speaker 7 (24:44):
That's the symbology of it.

Speaker 2 (24:46):
Are they though? Because I mean the maker disappear at
the end.

Speaker 1 (24:49):
She can run into a room and just scream. Beels
above and like fire starts. You know, it's kind of wow.
The scene when they're in that crypt where the Lucy
West are coffin is the way that the set is
dressed and the way that the production design is is
just out of this world. It looks like Goudy was

(25:12):
on set to make this as far as the walls
feel like they're melting at times. And yes, you've got
curtains and cobwebs and all of these things, but it
looks like the actual walls themselves are melting. And you
go from that, and I don't know why, she's like, oh,
let's open the coffin, and then like screams and moans

(25:33):
and all this stuff takes over the soundtrack.

Speaker 5 (25:36):
I know.

Speaker 1 (25:36):
I also read that this movie is very, very screamy.
I didn't find it to be as screamy as other movies.

Speaker 2 (25:44):
It's not that bad.

Speaker 7 (25:45):
Alice screaming is like Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom.

Speaker 1 (25:48):
And then you go from that set into their church
that is fucking insane, where you have the Christ on
the cross and he looks moist. It looks like you
just got pulled out of a grave and or like
unwrapped as a mummy. You've got him up on the cross,

(26:11):
and then you have I'm looking at the shot right now,
you probably have a dozen half dozen at least other
christlike figures around, all with their arms outstretched, all behind him,
and then you've got this like three or four rows
of candles all built up, and it looks like the

(26:31):
whole thing is just melted wax, like they've never cleaned
that it's just been wax over and over and over again.
And then you've got that incredibly dark and kind of
mystical look to it. And then you have these young
girls in their dresses and they all just look like
prim and proper and like Sunday go to meeting type

(26:53):
of clothes, and they're just like, yep, we're here, you
know where the novitiates laying on us. Let's hear some
of these sermons here father and the main priest. Wow,
this guy, he's true in the scenery, like nobody's business,
and I'm here for it, every single minute of it.

Speaker 7 (27:10):
Something that really reminded me of is on a Builder's
The Love Witch a dramatic performances. It's clear that Anna
Biller has seen this film.

Speaker 1 (27:22):
That kind of overwrought thing that they bring to it,
and that arched eyebrow type of thing that feels very Alukarta.

Speaker 2 (27:30):
Well in the set dressing, especially in that mausoleum with
the drape cloth was another. And I may be misremembered
that I'm only seen Al Topo once, but I seem
to remember stuff like that in El Topo and just
that those scenes when he's walking through that Western Town,
and then also the caves that they live in that
he lives in with those people for a while, that

(27:52):
all seemed kind of familiar to me while watching this,
and that mausoleum or whatever it is, she gives birth
to Alacarta and keeps creeping back up. I want to say,
as she's giving birth to her, there's like the corpse
of a dog or an animal on the ground lie
next to her. And I don't know if I just

(28:14):
imagine that or if anybody else caught onto that, because
that little detail caught my eye and not necessary. I mean,
it's creepy enough as it is, but that really kind
of put it over the top for me. And then
it matched up later on when Justine disappears and then
there's her skeleton basically on the ground, and the same

(28:35):
thing happens to Alacarta at the end as well, and
I'm like, oh, maybe that was somebody else that this
happened too. I don't know.

Speaker 1 (28:42):
I agree with you as far as the nonsplitation might
be an improper label for this, but I think anytime
you have nuns in the seventies and they're not acting
like the Flying Nun or somebody like that, like Sally Fields,
you are in for a wild ride that first serve
and that's going on where you have all the canted

(29:02):
angles and you've got all the nuns who look like
they're I don't know, petrified or something, and then you
get those young girls and the one girl stands up
and she's just having this moment and everything and just
starts screaming, and I'm like, Okay, this kind of like
over rottenness. And I want to say, there isn't there
an orgy scene that takes place later on, like out

(29:24):
in the country, and it seems to be I think
there's one nun who's still inside and she seems to
be the most pure of all of them, and she's
the one that causes that beam of light to cut
through the room. What a great effect that is.

Speaker 7 (29:38):
To speak on to the nunsploitation thing, because I know
I mentioned earlier that I have Criterion Channel on that
under their nunsploitation category they have Benedetta. I haven't seen
since the theaters, but this stylistically kind of reminded me
a little bit or an appoligorically because I understand wanting
to fuck christ. I totally get that. I think that

(30:00):
completely throw Benedetta is the wooden dildo. I would assume
that that would use splinters, but I don't know much
about wooden dildos. Apparently, Well it's either that or you've
got the bone dildo from the Devils, right, isn't that?
Well that's cut out from a lot of versions, but
I remember seeing that very specifically. Maybe one day we'll
be ready to actually release the full director's cut of

(30:23):
The Devils. Oh, that'll be a good day.

Speaker 2 (30:26):
Indeed, the orgy scene was that not in Satanico Pandemonium?

Speaker 1 (30:30):
Well, there definitely is an orgy scene in Santanico Pandemonium.

Speaker 2 (30:34):
But I want to say, oh, I know it, Yes, yes, yes, yeah, no, yeah,
I know what you're talking about. I thought that was
the Romani people out there.

Speaker 1 (30:43):
I thought it was the nuns. Maybe it's the Romani,
but it just felt like there were so many.

Speaker 2 (30:48):
The one kind of frizzy haired leader of the Romani,
she gets like shot in the neck or something. I
don't know what happened to her. All of a sudden,
she yeah, just kind of comes out of nowhere. He's
hitting the neck and there's blood. But I'm like, did
somebody shoot her. What What did that mean? What's the
implication here? Was it a spirit or satan or something

(31:10):
like that. But they're doing their thing over here, having
the orgy, and they're doing their thing, and the convent,
the nuns work. I thought it was just kind of
an interplay of the two quote unquote religions of the film.

Speaker 1 (31:25):
This is probably a stretch, but when the woman got shot,
I immediately thought, oh, just like student protesters. I don't
know why if this is coming in that, like, obviously
this is nine years post nineteen sixty eight, but it
just felt like it was kind of speaking to like
the rebelliousness of youth and how the system tries to

(31:46):
put you down. We're talking about how quick this movie moves,
and we've got the sermon Seene Justine feints, we've got
how Ukrda coming in talking with Justine, how u Karta
loses her fucking mind and starts spinning around, and her
hair starts going everywhere, and she's just grabbing her head

(32:08):
and spinning around, spinning around. Reaches down, sees that Justine
has a cross around her neck. Reaches down, pulls it
out against keeps screaming and it's within seconds that she
pulls out that knife, and then within a few more
seconds that suddenly it goes from this kind of pristine

(32:29):
daytime scene to the light's changing and her bending backwards,
and then the goat man coming in, and then like, oh,
I love this that she's in this great backwards pose
where she's bent over almost as far as she can go,
and we cut away to maybe like a window or something.

(32:51):
We cut back. It's the same shot, but now she's
completely naked and she still has that knife, and you've
got Justine on the floor and it's like, okay, now
we're going to do this.

Speaker 10 (33:01):
You know.

Speaker 1 (33:01):
The goat man picks her up and takes off all
of Justine's clothes. They kneel together, and you get that
pose that we've seen for this movie of the two
girls looking at each other, and then the other image
that I've seen from this movie so many times, which
is the goat man disappears and then the real goats
there standing between them, and it's like, oh wow. And

(33:23):
that's when they have the whole breast cutting, and I
believe there's a bloody hiss that happens, and that's for me,
one of the most vampiric moments of this movie is
them making this bond and it feels like now they
are one when they do that.

Speaker 7 (33:40):
So what you're saying is this is a perfect question.

Speaker 1 (33:42):
Yeah, basically, I mean, yeah, five minutes in the movie
and they just get through all that stuff. I'd like
to see James Bond do the same thing.

Speaker 2 (33:49):
Hasting is much more frantic than the other film that
we'll be talking about, Four Store, which I appreciate again
that tight seventy eight man. It just flies by. There's
really never a moment where something isn't happening in this film,
and I appreciate that. You don't get a lot of
character development in a situation like that. But that's okay.

(34:12):
Who's Justine really other than an orphan fifteen year old
quote unquote fifteen year old orphan whose parents just died?
And do we really need to know any more about her?
Why does Alu Karta take such a liking to her?
But you know, sometimes that's what teen girls do. They
get really attached to each other and have strange rituals

(34:33):
in their bedrooms.

Speaker 1 (34:35):
Well, I've seen heavenly creatures. I know what happens. They
get really turned down by Mrio Lanza and Orson Wells
third man Orson Wells, Yes, please. The relationship between the
two again, that's where the Carmela of it comes in
because it is played so sweet and I can't say
innocent because it definitely feels like there's a moment where

(34:57):
they are having sex in Carmela, or at least there's
an orgasm that's represented between them. But so the story
of Carmela is basically, there's a stage coach coming down
the road and it crashes and there's this woman in
there with her daughter and she's like, listen, I've got
to get going. I've got this business that I need

(35:17):
to take care of. I'm going to be back in
three weeks. Do you mind, kind sir and noble gentleman,
that you are watching my daughter for three weeks and
I'll be back. And he's like, oh, yeah, of course,
no problem. She's like, well, the only thing is though
you can't ask anything about her, she cannot tell you
anything about herself, just you know, trust me kind of thing.

(35:38):
And he's like, okay, yeah, no big deal. She'll be
best friends with my daughter Lisa. So Lisa and her
get together and immediately you're just like, as a reader,
You're like, Okay, yeah, she's a vampire. Things are fucked up.
You know, she's a vampire. And it's just like them
going back and forth and yes, this whole like we're
best friends and we're out in the forest and we're

(36:00):
playing together and all these kind of things. And then
you know, suspicion starts to mount. There are times where
you know, there are girls all around the village that
start dying under mysterious circumstances. Our main heroin Lisa, she
starts getting weaker and weaker. She starts having these dreams.
She dreams that there's this black cat like creature that

(36:23):
comes in at night, and she also dreams that Carmilla
is there as well. She has this blue mark on
her neck, so and she has talked about how she's
felt piercing going on with her neck and all this,
and I'm like, okay, yep. And then Carmela eventually kind
of disappears and they're going to try to find her,

(36:46):
and that's when they run into this other guy, this general,
who tells the story of what happened to his daughter,
and it's basically the exact same thing, but he figured
out what Carmila was. And then they go to the tomb.
So again we've got this tomb scene and you know,
find her grave and you know, do the whole head steak,

(37:06):
you know, heart staking, head cutting off, burning the body,
throwing the ashes into the river where they can be
separated and never connect again. This whole thing of like
the girls and their relationship and just this kind of
like you're saying this, these strange rituals that they get
up to, That's where I'm just like, yeah, this is
very very Carmela in these points. But really the vamporism,

(37:28):
like I said, other than the tasting of the blood
from one another. And then really the part where Justine
is in that crypt and that is completely filled with blood,
and that almost to me is like a bathroy type
of thing rather than a vampire type of thing.

Speaker 2 (37:46):
And that's really the only vamporism in the film. I
them kissing each other and licking the blood off each
other is more of a ritualistic thing to me than
pure vamporism. Like I don't think that Alu Karta is
a vampire actually and turned Justine into a vampire, but

(38:07):
Justine definitely is vampiric. At the end she bites into
Sister Angelica like nobody's business, so that angle pops up.
But I mean Carmilla is used. I don't know how
many movies from the seventies.

Speaker 1 (38:23):
Anytime there's sexy vampires.

Speaker 2 (38:26):
Yeah, it's like based on loosely based on Yeah.

Speaker 1 (38:30):
I think even when we talked about the gen Roland film,
it was like, oh, yeah, of course those sexy vampire twins,
those are from Carmela as well.

Speaker 2 (38:41):
It's like, are they though daughters of Darkness?

Speaker 7 (38:45):
See? I would love to see a horned up version
of Dracula's Daughter that was in this kind of format.
That would be interesting to me. Give James Whale the
money and a time machine and a cure to death.
It's sent back to making Sony seven to say, now
make Dracula's Daughter. That would be I'd be on board
for that.

Speaker 2 (39:07):
You know, as you were describing the plot of the novel,
I just kept thinking of Cat People because that sort
of feels like what's going on in Cat People? And
I mean the original yeah, not not no, that idea
of the girl being stalked, and it's often in the
shape of a black panther right, am, I.

Speaker 1 (39:28):
Exactly, You're not wrong, You're.

Speaker 2 (39:31):
Right, You're right. I haven't I've only seen that movie
a couple of times. But and there's obvious, i think,
lesbian overtones in that film as well.

Speaker 1 (39:40):
So it's after this blood ritual that we then cut to,
and you're totally right. It is the Romani that are
out in the forest. There's men, there's women, and that
big haired woman is definitely out there. Cross cutting that
with you know, Justine and Carmela's dead center in the
middle as the all the people are kind of to
rolling around them. And then you've got is it sister

(40:03):
Jermaine who's back at the cloisters and she is praying
and she kind of like looks like she's in pain.
She's writhing around. That's where you also get that real
menstrual blood coming in. But she's kind of pink at
that moment because we've seen it looks like after the
or as the ritual is taking place, it starts to

(40:24):
read blood outside because we cut back to that window
that I was talking about where we cut to that
when we removed Alu Karta's close and we keep cutting
out to that window, and that window is also where
that beam of light kind of comes through as well.
And we've got the gypsy woman outside and she's got

(40:46):
her hands up and praying to whatever god she's praying to,
and then you've got the nun inside and she's praying
as well, and it feels like the two ceremonies are
kind of going back and forth. Pretty soon, the nun
starts to get blood all over her head and just
starts to get more and more bloody. Of course, there's

(41:08):
no explanation as to what's going on there, but you
do see it almost looks like she starts crying blood
at one point and then her whole face gets covered.

Speaker 2 (41:17):
That's sister Angelica, if I'm not mistaken, Angelica.

Speaker 1 (41:20):
Thanks.

Speaker 2 (41:20):
He's the one that is obsessed with Justine as well,
So she's kind of fighting Alucarda's obsession with her and
she levitates, yeah, and then she levitates. That shot is
one of my favorites. Alucarda on the bed. There's one
like kind of mid frame shot of her just on

(41:41):
the bed. I think Justine has had one of her
fits or something. Wonderful shot. And then when she's just
levitating in a room. That's a gorgeous shot.

Speaker 1 (41:51):
I don't remember this movie saying segunda parte right after that?
Did your guys' version say that? Does it say like
part two right after that levitation starts? I don't think so,
because there was one version of this I watched that
did have that in there. I watched the AI, oh,
the cleaned up one.

Speaker 2 (42:11):
Yeah, And to be honest, I don't know what was
AI about it. It looked the same as what I
had watched in the past pretty much. You know, everybody
wasn't all smoothed out and fake looking or anything. So
I don't know what they cleaned up with AI.

Speaker 1 (42:28):
But yeah, I still saw real change marks and there's
still some scratches at the very beginning.

Speaker 7 (42:33):
But I was going to point out Bessie grat Burns
where there, oh yeah, for my version as well. So
it's definitely a dupe of a dupe of a dupe.

Speaker 1 (42:40):
Yeah, And I think it was Mindo Micabro that put
this out years ago, and probably the cleanest version of it.
And I don't know if they've ever gone back and
done a re restoration of it.

Speaker 2 (42:49):
That was one of the things I read they were
going to go back and re scan it and everything
for a Blu ray or maybe even a four K,
and by that time the print had disc appeared, So
I don't think you're going to get anything much better
than what they did, and that's probably why somebody decided
to use AI to clean it up a little bit more.

(43:10):
But it didn't. It didn't have that weird AI effect
on it to me when as I was watching it,
because I was hesitant to watch it, but I wanted
to do that one because it had the longest running
time and the ones that I saw that you had available,
so I just was like, I don't know what's AI
about this?

Speaker 7 (43:28):
Both of you guys have watched the longer version of
the film? Is it in lde screen? Because it was
full screen when I watched Criterion, but just wanted to
make sure that they weren't like giving me a crappy copy.

Speaker 2 (43:40):
No, And I don't think it's even an open mat situation.
I think that is the aspect ratio, because it wasn't
you know, there wasn't a lot of headroom in most
of the shots, so that's usually the kind of tell
on those it's like why is the ceiling so high?
I think that was just how it was shot.

Speaker 1 (43:57):
If I had to make a guess, that would be
regular thirty five. But yeah, it was definitely more Academy ratio.
I was a little surprised about that as well, but
I don't think Machtazuma had a lot of money to
make this. And then watching that interview with Germal del
Toro that's on the Manoa Cabro disc, which is funny
to see young Gamel del Toro again. And then also

(44:20):
del Toro was so impressed with this movie says that
he that's why he passed Claudio Brooke in Chronos, which
is great. Kind of love that movie so much. I
kind of wish that he just stuck to making Mexican
horror films, because between that and Hans Labyrinth and The
Devil's Backbone, those are my favorites of his.

Speaker 2 (44:42):
I think I leaned that way too.

Speaker 1 (44:44):
I'd seem to remember reading your review of Blade two
and it was pretty pornographic if.

Speaker 2 (44:50):
The cut for all those out there, Yeah, Mimick was
on a couple of weeks ago, and I don't know,
like maybe the last the third act or something in
my otto us in there, it's like, I kind of
want to watch this in full now I'm kind of
looking forward to his Frankenstein, so I'm definitely gonna watch
that when it hits Netflix. But yeah, those those Mexican

(45:12):
films are pretty delightful.

Speaker 1 (45:16):
I found Devil's Backbone to be actually genuinely scary, which
I can't say about a lot of horror movies that
I watch these days.

Speaker 2 (45:25):
Yeah, and I don't mean delightful as in their pithy
and fun. I just mean the look of them, because
they're pretty.

Speaker 1 (45:32):
They're not fun well, and to have the wartime background
in Pants Labyrinth.

Speaker 2 (45:37):
Pants Labyrinth is depressing, It's all. There are pretty depressing films,
but they're beautifully shot and have a lot of really interesting,
imaginative stuff. Great atmosphere, yes, very much.

Speaker 1 (45:48):
So, very much like this where it looks so often
like we are in darkness but it's actually daytime. Like
when they Justine and al Yukarda have fit in church
and they just start spewing out the most blasphemous stuff
that you possibly could imagine. Again, to your point, Mark,

(46:10):
very exorcists. As far as what Linda Blair is doing
in there, and some of the awful things that she's
doing with the Cross, they're not doing that in this,
but a lot of the words that they're saying are awful,
and I like that too. That shot you're talking Ryan
as far as you know what's the ratio, because you've
got the two of them framed, and then you'll cut

(46:30):
to like a single of Justine and you'll cut to
a single of Alu Carda, and then you cut to
a double a two shot of both of them, and
it's almost like the camera's just moving slightly as you
do that. It's almost jump cuts, and I really like
that effect, and it just it's such an intense emotional
moment that it just adds so much to it.

Speaker 7 (46:51):
Kind of like when the DVDs of Stanley Kubrick's movies
came out, they were all in full screen, and so
you had they had the inevitable comparison, well, which scene
is better in this version in this? And like if
the scene the Shining where he's using the X to
chop down the door, and that the camera moves with
him every single time he takes a swing, and it's
one of those things where it's like, I guess being

(47:13):
in full screen actually makes the shack Ending a better movie,
which is weird.

Speaker 2 (47:17):
Just like Stanley wanted, Well, Metal Jacket was on one
of the cable channels recently and it was presented four
x three. So but yeah, that I wrote in my notes,
I'm like, oh, they keep going from two shots to
one shot, to two shots to one shot. I was like,
I really enjoyed that as well. There were those nice
little touches throughout that we're more cinematic, but there's still

(47:40):
a lot of theatrical stuff going on in this and
that that point that you made about feeling like we're
in darkness, and that reminds me of stage plays as well,
where a lot of times it's just a black background
and yet you're supposed to feel like you're in this setting.
Right now, you're in that setting. And there are some

(48:03):
movies that utilize that theatrical technique kind of you know,
to hi, maybe not having a full set built or
not all the four walls are up, or there's no
ceiling in this this set, because it I mean, some
of that stuff is definitely sets, if not all of it,
all of the interiors, so it's kind of like, well,

(48:23):
let's just you know, the backgrounds in black and we
don't have to worry about set dressing and things like.

Speaker 1 (48:29):
That, because a lot of this takes place in I
believe they call them cells at a nunnery. A lot
of it takes place in Justine's cell, and yeah, you
get those shots from up above, so I'm just like, Okay,
they probably probably is no ceiling, and this probably is
just a big set because they use that quite a

(48:49):
few times. And even when it comes to like the
whipping of the nuns, the scourging of the nuns, it's
very tight on a lot of these shots, kind of
talking about that going back and forth thing too with
their breakdown in church. Also a little reminiscent in a
scene pretty close to that where how your Karta goes

(49:11):
to the confessional and you get the front of the confessional.
There's no doors to the confessional and it's just her
on one side and the main priest on the other side,
and I love that she reaches through the window and
basically grabs this guy by the dick at least that's
my interpretation of it, and he's like, you gotta help

(49:31):
this girl. This is crazy, And that's what I think
leads to the whole we need to stop this where
it comes from and start scourging all of these nuns.
That's a wild scene to have them is they're not
necessarily whipping themselves. It's not a self flagellation. These women
are being whipped big time, and you've got some great
effects of the blood across them.

Speaker 2 (49:54):
Yeah, it wasn't self flagellation.

Speaker 1 (49:55):
You're right.

Speaker 2 (49:56):
I forgot that the robed men were there.

Speaker 3 (49:59):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (50:00):
Yeah. The monks, I guess they are.

Speaker 2 (50:02):
I guess they just seem like kind of there to
do odd jobs or something.

Speaker 7 (50:07):
They're mad monks, man, they're mad monks.

Speaker 2 (50:10):
They don't intervene a lot when one goes to get
the doctor, and that's about it. I kind of forget
that they're there, to be honest with you, it's all
about the and then well, particularly sister Angelica, and then
I can't remember what the Mother Superior's name was other
than Mother Superior. But you talked about how in Carmilla
and this is drew in a lot of vampire movies

(50:32):
where they cut the head off to you know, really
make sure this doesn't happen again, and that scene in
this movie, although it's not, I mean, I guess you
could assume that maybe she's a vampire as well, but
the one none that dies and then comes back and

(50:53):
the priest chops her head off. I was like, holy shit,
this is when we're this is when it really really
struck me. Is a little bit more violent than some
of the other non spoiled in particular the one that
we watched for the show here, but it gives kind
of like fulchy vibes and a little bit of Lamberto
Baba as well. And her head when he puts it

(51:16):
back on the altar, I could tell that it was
the actress's head. So I just kept waiting for her
to like start yelling or screaming or something.

Speaker 7 (51:27):
We have your darling linger soul.

Speaker 4 (51:35):
You're going down.

Speaker 1 (51:37):
They say that she's dead. They torture Justine to death
basically because they're looking for the Devil's mark. They can't
find it. They start poking her. Let go, yeah exactly.
They start poking her with all these sharp objects, and
then she's dead. But then as she's laying out, you
see her hand move and you're just like okay, And

(51:57):
it's not like a oh, the actress move your hand.
You could see your breathing kind of thing. It's a
very legit. The hand moves and you're just like, ooh,
this is a creature of the undead. And then I
love how the the doctor the man of you know,
call them the man of science. Even though he's using
leeches to try to cure poor Justine.

Speaker 2 (52:18):
That was science, then science then oh yeah yeah.

Speaker 1 (52:21):
And she just looks like she has been put through
the ringer, but like al Jukarda looks great the whole time,
but Justine just looks running through the doctor like, oh,
you savages. You know, he's going to save al u Karda.
So it takes her home and it's just like, oh, yeah,
here's my blind daughter. And I'm like, oh, good lord,

(52:43):
what are you doing. You're throwing your daughter to the
wolves almost literally here.

Speaker 2 (52:49):
Yeah, and that's another Carmilla kind of you know, with
the daughter in another spot or a girl in another spot,
and they just keep mom or whoever keeps taking her
to these places to get these girls, I guess. But
I think because of Kermela, I expected her to really

(53:09):
try to take Daniella over as well and get kind
of hooked in with her. I mean, she steals away
with her, but nothing really comes of that. But knowing
that Carmela's story, I thought, oh, this is her second victim,
now that Justine is dead.

Speaker 1 (53:23):
Basically, yeah, I really thought we were going to go
that same way as well when I kept.

Speaker 2 (53:27):
That tight seventy eight. Though.

Speaker 1 (53:29):
No, like we said, this moves very quickly. There's not
a lot of scenes where we're just like, oh, would
you hurry up already, because there's almost always something happening here.

Speaker 2 (53:39):
I really appreciate that. And if it was a matter
of just not having enough money to flush things out,
I'm totally fine with that.

Speaker 1 (53:47):
The image of Justine when she rises from the dead
with all that blood all over her is another moment
that I've seen Stills reproduced. It's fantastic. She so good
when she comes out in that blood, especially on her chin,
or when she's there and opens you know, her eyes
are open. But then when she looks over at the

(54:10):
nun that's opened up the casket, it's like, oh man,
oh man, that is great. And she just starts clawing
at that nun. She's fully nude, hovered in blood almost
from head to toe, and just starts scratching at that
nun and just like, oh man, I've never seen a
woman act like a wild beast. Like this before she.

Speaker 2 (54:32):
Has fings, right, I mean, her teeth are pointing at
that point, if I'm not mistaken, or did I imagine
maybe it was the blood on her in her mouth
that it looked like she had like razor sharp teeth
at that point.

Speaker 1 (54:44):
Maybe not, I didn't notice that.

Speaker 2 (54:46):
No, that image, so, like you say, is along with
Justine and al Carda looking at each other with the
goat guy behind them, is pretty much those are the
two that you'll find on almost every re you online.
They use one of those two pictures, you know, for
good reason. It's on a letter box, on a letterbox review.

Speaker 1 (55:08):
To your point from earlier, I could find some older articles,
but nothing very well written. So many of the older
reviews of this film were just basically, oh, there's boobs
and that was about it.

Speaker 2 (55:21):
Boobs and blood that was like, those are the key
words for just about every article. Yeah, I scanned a
lot of the stuff that you stent over, and like
I said, try to look through my because a lot
of the books that I have are from the eighties,
and you would think there would be something and then Secatronic,
I don't even know if there's anything in the Psychotronic
Encyclopedia film about this movie. I don't think there is,

(55:43):
although it could be in it under a different title,
because I know that it had been the Danny Perry book,
which one guide for the film fanatic. Whichever cult films
I think, I don't think.

Speaker 3 (55:56):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (55:57):
I don't know if this is in one of the
cult film books I have one and three, and I
don't think it's in either one of those. Okay, I
think it's a little more obscure, and whether it had
a cult following or not, I don't know. Seems like
it's one of those films that sort of slipped through
the cracks.

Speaker 1 (56:13):
Speaking of big books, there's the Anti Cristo, The Bible
of Nasty Nun Cinema spoke with an and culture that
covers so many but it doesn't go that deep into
things I found, you know, because there's Doyle Green's book
in the Mexican Cinema of Darkness. There were some good
articles in there, but I think that the best written

(56:35):
one that I read was from the Supernatural Sublime The
Wondrous Ineffability of the Everyday in Films from Mexico and Spain.
What a title, but that really went into I think
it looked at three films from the era, plus then
it kind of looked at the Devil's Backbone in that
chapter as well, and they were talking more about schools

(56:57):
for girls in that and then of course they had
to say, but you know Devil's Backbone, it's these young
boys rather than girls. And with al Yukarta, it's a
convent rather than a school. But just kind of pointing
out these similarities between these films, and that one I
felt to be one of the better readings of the movie,
and they do a nice kind of close reading and

(57:19):
then also put it into more of a context. And
I would love to read more about Maktazuma because he
seems just like a fascinating character. And it was tough,
Like there's a book where it's like fourteen interviews with
Mexican filmmakers, and I really was glad to see an
interview with him, because unfortunately he's not with us any longer,

(57:42):
and I think he died kind of young. Thank goodness,
we still have you know, Ara Ball and Howdarowski and
some of these guys, but a lot of them, Korkiiti's gone,
Maktazuma's gone, So yeah, it's called The Mexican Cinema Interviews
with Thirteen Directors by Beatriz ray As Nevadis that I
recommend that if you want to actually read what mister

(58:05):
Maktazuma himself had to say about things.

Speaker 2 (58:08):
Well, he didn't make very many films day, No, I think.

Speaker 1 (58:12):
A handful, and interestingly enough he made the one. There
was one with Donald Pleasance. That's probably the most. I
think for a while that was the easiest one to find.
But I think Mansion of Madness is another one that
maybe Mando Micabro put that out as well, to Kill
a Stranger as the title of the one with Donald Pleasance. Again,

(58:34):
titles may.

Speaker 2 (58:35):
Vary, such as Doctor Tar's Torture, Dungeon Garden. Okay, yeah,
I've seen her under that title. You mentioned School for Girls,
that kind of subgenre, and that's where my mind kept
going with this film, even comparing it in my head

(58:55):
to Picnic a Hanging Rock and very different, but you
get some of that. I don't want to say. You know,
there isn't a lot of screaming in there, and no
one's doing the whirling dervish thing, but that idea of
not understanding what's happening to these girls or what happened

(59:16):
to the ones that disappeared or even the ones that
are still there, the girl that commits suicide and stuff
like that. There's a film called The House That Screamed
that is a school for girls, and lots of creepy
stuff is happening, and I think they all live like
in a house together, hid from deep end. I believe
is in that as a small role in that, as

(59:37):
like the head mistress's son that's creeping around the house
and going in the walls and spying on the girls
and stuff. And then kind of back to that idea
of the temptation that's happening in this film. So not
school for girls, but this sort of like don't lead
me to into temptation, like please don't. This makes me

(59:57):
think of the blood on Satan's claw. I don't know
if either of you have seen that, but how those
kids and that are just kind of like, fuck, yeah,
let's go man, let's piece this beast back together and
then start doing his bidding and have a heck of
a time. There's another Mexican film called Poison for the

(01:00:17):
Fairies about two young girls, like preteen girls, and they
were actually I mean, I believe the actresses were like
twelve or thirteen. It's sort of that kind of parasitic relationship,
like in this film where one of the girls tries
to lead the other one astray, like acts like she's
a witch and can do these horrible things, and these

(01:00:38):
strange coincidences happen that make the other girl believe like, oh,
this is for real, and you know, leads to tragic
things at the end as usual. And even the idea
of the Satanic panic, which we're kind of getting towards
with this film. I know that it's I've seen conflicting

(01:00:58):
views are conflicting report on when this came out. Some
things say seventy five, somethings say seventy seven, but we're
getting to the eighties. And again that idea of going
along with the temptation like fear no Evil, although I
think that kid is actually Satan's son or something like that.
But evil speak always comes to mind for me because

(01:01:19):
it's Clint at this school for boys and he kind
of falls in possessed computer, yeah, and his possessed computer.
But he's like, yeah, let's do this so that I
can fuck these people. Up because I hate them all
and give me your power, Satan. So yeah, all that
stuff was kind of running through my head as I
was watching this. And Dark Waters is a Ukrainian film,

(01:01:40):
I think from the early nineties. It very much feels
like a seventies nonsplaitation movie. So every time I watch that,
I think about Alacarta. Another thing for school for girls
in my mind is Barbarian sound Studio Peter Strickland's second
or third film, third film, and it's all about sound designer. Yeah,

(01:02:02):
Toby Jones plays this sound mixer actually sorry, who's tasked
with doing this film in Italy. Doesn't speak the language,
doesn't know what's going on, and you never see the film.
He's only there to mix things and you know, fiddle
with the equipment and stuff. You just get the idea
of what the film is about by the dubbing that

(01:02:24):
everybody's doing. So their actresses are coming in because of
course they don't film with sound in Italy. And it's
a school for girls. It's like an equestrians school, and
there's witchcraft going on and they're getting possessed and there's
even like a goblin kind of hunchback character that has
to get dubbed in the film. So every time I

(01:02:46):
watch that movie, I think, oh, he's working on Alu
Carter right now. I love that movie.

Speaker 1 (01:02:51):
So guys, let's go ahead and take a break and
we'll be right back after these brief messages. Looking for
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we're back when we were talking about Alukarta and let's
shift gears a little bit. I was led to believe,
as I was doing my research that there was another
film that was supposed to be very similar to this,

(01:03:34):
and it's called Satanico Pandemonium also known as Las Sex
or Cistooo. It's not really that similar at all. In fact,
I can see more differences between this and Alucarda than anything.
So I was definitely led astray by that. But I

(01:03:54):
had kind of a nice time watching this movie. Did
you guys get a chance to see this? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:03:59):
I did watch it. I saw those comparisons to and
almost everything that I read. It was the inspiration for
Selma Hayek's character in From Dust Still Down. That's where
the name comes from.

Speaker 1 (01:04:11):
That checks out, but the rest of it does not.

Speaker 2 (01:04:15):
I saw that too, and I thought, oh goodie, and
I'll admit to this, Mike, and I feel kind of
bad for it, but not really. I watched this at
one and a third speed because within the first five
minutes there were four minutes of mountain shots, slow moving
shots of scenery, and I thought, oh, hell no, Mao's

(01:04:37):
the hands of fate. I mean talk about filler and walking,
her walking, him walking them walking, and I had beautiful scenery,
but I actually prefer the forest in Alukarta much more.
But anyway, Yeah, I had to speed it up, and
that actually made it feel right. The pacings felt much

(01:05:00):
much more correct at that pace, and since it didn't
really affect the picture of the sound or anything, I
was like, oh, fuck it, I'll just watch it like this.
It'll go buy a little bit faster, but not really
like alucarda much more a nonsploitation film. The only other
thing I can really say is that it made me

(01:05:22):
feel the way I felt when I used to record
Emmanuel films off of Cinemax because I wanted to see
naked ladies. And as I was watching those films, I
got really bored and fast forwarded everything else just to
get to the naked ladies. That's how I felt watching

(01:05:43):
this film.

Speaker 1 (01:05:45):
I guess spoilers for Satanico Pandemonium, but this is also
a question. The end of the film, I'm led to
believe that she has the plague and that most of
this movie was her her fever dream. Is that what
you guys understood?

Speaker 2 (01:06:03):
I think all of the movie was her fever dream
because she runs into the devil quote unquote devil on
the road that first scene that she's out, he just
pops up completely naked in front of her, and she
kind of flips out and then goes. So it doesn't
seem like there was a point where reality and fever
dream connected to me. As I thought back about it.

(01:06:27):
When we get to the end of the film, I'm like, Okay,
what was were they talking about the plague at the
beginning of the movie. Do they talk about the plague
at all during the movie. Is anybody else afflicted by
the plague in the film? Is there some point where
we know something probably happened to her and she's now
sick And I couldn't mark that in my head. I

(01:06:49):
didn't go back and look, but I couldn't recall that.

Speaker 1 (01:06:53):
No, And the only thing I could think of is
maybe one of these diseased animals maybe pass something over
to her, there was that cross contamination. But that doesn't
make any sense. So use the word pastoral. I mean,
this is so pastoral to have freaking baby lambs and
her tending to cows and all these things, and the

(01:07:14):
beautiful flowers that she has. Even the I guess it's
kind of a makeshift altar that's out there. Also. I
was just like, well, that seems kind of pagan to
have this altar out in the middle of the forest,
but I guess it's some sort of saints that's inside
of there. And the devil in this feels very similar
in so far as he wears the wool over the

(01:07:35):
shoulders and stuff. Very normal looking though kind of a
handsome gentleman, kind of reminded me of ze Man Ronnie
Barzel a little bit at times. And yeah, one of
the first times we see her, the first time she
sees him clothed, he's holding an apple, and you're just like, well, gosh,
I don't have to be a biblical scholar to figure

(01:07:56):
this out, because there's apples and snakes all over the
place this movie, and this half eaten apple that we
see Satan eating at the beginning just keeps showing up,
like she'll just be like walking along and this apple
will kind of fall into frame and it's just like, oh,
God forbid it. It's the scariest apple ever.

Speaker 7 (01:08:15):
And imagine if that movie was in three D and
that apple just came flying at you in the audience.
O man, that would really bring it all home.

Speaker 1 (01:08:22):
It's rolling slowly towards me.

Speaker 2 (01:08:24):
Oh my god, this was what nine minutes longer than Alukarta,
and it might as well have been thirty minutes longer
as far as I could tell. I mean, I'm like,
oh my god. I think the bad taste in my
mouth due to the ending is sort of overshadowing the
things that I did like about it. I thought, oh,

(01:08:45):
we're gonna have this interesting thing about race because I noticed,
I'm like, there's an Asian nun here, there's two black
or yeah, black nuns. I I was gonna say African American,
but they're not American. One of them is in distress
and she goes to help her, and it's because of
her race, and I thought, Oh, this is interesting for
especially for this time and even maybe this country, and

(01:09:08):
curious that they are not just completely ignoring the fact
that we have, you know, other races in this almost
said Kevin.

Speaker 1 (01:09:16):
First off, it's pronounced covid.

Speaker 2 (01:09:18):
I thought, oh, this is where is this gonna lead?
And then I was still kind of interested in the
fact that she basically helps that dealt kill herself and
you know, so that put the twist on it. But
I thought, okay, yeah, I'm still I'm kind of buying this.
It's just really languid. It's got a just a super

(01:09:39):
slow pace, and I kind of gave it away to
myself because at some point I was like, is any
of this really happening to her or she just imagining
all of this? Is she imagining this guy? Is she
imagining the other nuns coming in there and molesting her?
Is any of this going on? Or is it an
hysterical woman type of film? You know, is it that

(01:10:02):
like a carnival assault, Yeah, like carnival of souls or
even just let's scare Jessica to death. You know, we
don't we don't get an idea that that this nun
is there for mental health reasons. But you know, you've
got that angle in those hysterical woman films where I
just returned from the mental hospital and now I'm seeing ghosts? Well,

(01:10:22):
is she really seeing ghats or and or vampires and
let's scare chessa got at the death's case? Or is
she going crazy again? And I thought, is that what
we're doing here is without like a background of her
mental health? Is that what's happening? Or is this you know,
is any of this really real? Who is this creep
that keeps throwing apples at her? Showing up naked and

(01:10:45):
the ending kind of I'm I literally face palmed myself.
I just was like, oh, you got to be kidding me.

Speaker 1 (01:10:50):
Well, and they say like, did you see the state
or her body? And so I was waiting for her
to be like completely emaciated or like skeletals, you know,
like something going on with her face, but then they
cut back to her and it's like, oh, yeah, she
looks just normal. I'm like, opuckly fine, okay, yeah, yeah,
I agree. The stuff with the race, I was excited
for that, especially the one nun when she comes in

(01:11:12):
it just like brates and physically attacks these black nuns,
and that the black nuns are the one that are
serving dinner to the rest of the nuns. And how
she's praying away. Yeah, they treat them so like second
class citizens. And the one woman's just like, oh, I'm
praying because I'm black and you know, I've been cursed

(01:11:32):
with this and I'm just like, this is an interesting thing.
And then they go away from it. And yeah, there
were moments like you know, when she's using I can't
remember if you pronounce it salis or slice the band
across her with all the spikes, and she's doing the
self flagellation and stuff, and like you're saying, like you

(01:11:54):
can see at times the blood that's on her clothes.
I was like, Okay, again, kind of interesting, but yeah,
she's taking care of that coy the fucking apple shows up.
I'm like, oh my god, how often are we going
to see this apple going on here, and there are
times where because when she removes her habit, she looks
very different. So I'm like, are there two nuns in

(01:12:16):
this or is this one nun? Or you know, and
there is a lesbian scene that happens, so I was thinking, okay,
so is this where we're gonna go? Is this the
Carmela moment or whatever? And interesting, you just mentioned Let's
Scare Jessica to death. When you look up the inspiration
shared in La Faw, it actually has Let's Scare Jessica

(01:12:38):
to Death as being based on that. I'm like, I
don't see that at all.

Speaker 2 (01:12:42):
Man, Well, it is vampire that girl from the Lake
is supposed to be. You know, she's turned all the
townspeople into vampire. It's such a weird. Oh it's a
vampire thing though. In that film they all have bandages
around their necks, but they just seem like creepy zombies
more than anything else.

Speaker 1 (01:13:00):
Yeah, it reminds me more of a Messiah of evil
than anything.

Speaker 2 (01:13:04):
Mm hmm exactly.

Speaker 1 (01:13:05):
Yes. About to mention that I enjoyed Elokarda so much
that one I was like, oh good, another one. Okay, Yeah,
let's do it. Like, I'm ready for this. I actually
watched a couple non exploitation films for this episode. I
also watched one called Killer None, which was actually fairly
decent and it's more of a murder mystery. They really

(01:13:25):
make you think that Alita Valdi, Alita Vali, that's what
it is. She's the main nun and you're following her
and you're like, oh, she murdering all these people. And
I'm not going to ruin that movie because I had
a good time watching it. Actually a gang kind of
slow but effective, and you know, there was I believe

(01:13:46):
a lot of lesbian nuns going on in that one.

Speaker 2 (01:13:48):
So I've never really gotten into the putting that on
my list.

Speaker 1 (01:13:51):
There you go, I've never really gotten into nunsplitation. I
still haven't seen. Was it Love Letters from a Portuguese Nun?
I still haven't seen. There was one from Japan that
was supposed to be good. Oh is it? It's not
Behind Convent Walls. I don't remember the name of it.
That one's still on the to watch list. But I

(01:14:12):
watched a couple of these and I was just like, Okay,
I kind of see what they're doing. But every version
treats something a little bit differently. There is no oh,
this is the plot for so many of these and
they just do a little variation. Each one seemed to
do a little bit different other than the idea of it.
At some point, you're gonna get, like you said, Mark
and orgy, and in this in al Yukarta it's the

(01:14:36):
Romani people having an orgy. And this one, it's when
she comes back to the convent and you think like, oh,
they're going to put her to death because she's been
so bad. She murdered this little shepherd kid after trying
to rape him. Oh, she's just done for And she
comes back to the convent and it's just all the

(01:14:57):
nuns going woooo.

Speaker 2 (01:14:59):
Then playing guitar blue, his father and everywhere. Yeah, that
thing that the kid was kind of disturbing because.

Speaker 1 (01:15:08):
He looked really young, very young.

Speaker 2 (01:15:12):
Yeah, And I couldn't find the IMDb was absolutely no
help on this film. Found that I'm pretty sure there's
only a couple of guys in this and and the
guy that plays a devil is named in the in
the credits, but no one else has a character name
in the list of credits on this film. And I
thought well, it must be this kid, but he was

(01:15:33):
in maybe one other movie, if it was even the
right person that I picked out, But I thought his
team's really young. He's not He's not fifteen like Alucarda
and Justine, who are obviously not fifteen in that film.
But he looks like he's fifteen.

Speaker 1 (01:15:49):
Why is he not screaming out?

Speaker 10 (01:15:51):
You know?

Speaker 1 (01:15:51):
It's just that he's getting attacked by her and he
never says a word, and I'm like, okay, And meanwhile,
his grandmother is within earshot, like right next to them,
basically you.

Speaker 2 (01:16:03):
Feet away now.

Speaker 1 (01:16:05):
But then after she murders the kid, they cut and
La boila is they're in bed with knife wounds and
blood all over her, though she looks like she's really
I'm kind of talking about that cinema sense thing, you know,
like that's not one of those like oh that was
very definite kind of thing. When it came to that
scene and just the kid not crying out, that's when

(01:16:27):
I started to glean the whole like maybe this isn't real,
maybe this is going on in her head. But as
far as thinking, oh, well, yeah, she's got the plague,
she's having fever dreams, no, that didn't hit me at all.

Speaker 2 (01:16:40):
No, and it still kind of felt like the hysterical
woman type of thing. It is this a mental health
issue she's having or is this any of this really happening?
Kind of like that body swap thing, but in this case,
it really just flummexed me because I'm like, well, why
so was he? Was she making out with.

Speaker 1 (01:17:02):
Her a little room two three seven going on?

Speaker 2 (01:17:05):
And then everything just escalates where she just covers everything
up by like doing the worst thing possible. I'll just
set them both on fire so nobody finds finds me out,
and then she realizes that she loses her necklace in
his hand.

Speaker 1 (01:17:19):
And when you get that moment when she's praying and
then the rope appears over her hands and she's like,
oh cool, I murder weapon. Then she murders the old nun.
You get that great scene of her being tortured, and
then you realize, no, this is just her thinking like
when they capture me, this is what they're going to
do to me. So I'm like, well, if you're into

(01:17:40):
torture stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:17:41):
It wasn't super clear on a lot of points, and
I thought, well, maybe it's the way I'm watching it
because I am speeding it up a little bit. You know,
it wasn't It wasn't sped up to the point where
I'm like missing scenes or anything. It just kind of
helped the languid pace. But yeah, the ending really bothered me.
I'm trying it. There was another film that did that,

(01:18:03):
and I don't know if I should spoil anything. There's
a French one of the French extreme films I fought Tension.
I think it was that one.

Speaker 1 (01:18:11):
Actually, yeah, I walked out of the theater before the twist,
so I was just like, the.

Speaker 7 (01:18:16):
End makes no sense, right exactly?

Speaker 2 (01:18:19):
Yeah, yeah, high tension. Yeah, and I was like, fuck
this shit.

Speaker 1 (01:18:24):
It was also called Switchblade Romance when I saw it,
which was a really weird title to put it under it.

Speaker 2 (01:18:31):
I don't mind twist endings so much, but this felt unwarranted.
And like I said, I don't recall any hints too,
not that you have to, but I think you should
really lay some kind of foundation to the fact that
you know something. The twist in this, with it all

(01:18:52):
being basically a fever dream, a literal fever dream, really
bothered me just because there's no no hint. Even the
subtlest of hints, unless, like I said, it's possible that
I completely missed it, but I just don't remember there
being anything about the plague. I couldn't tell you when

(01:19:12):
this was taking place really like hol Lukarta, I can't
really tell either. I know it's in the past and
we're still using horse and carriage, and.

Speaker 1 (01:19:22):
I'm supposed to be what seventeen sixty five. Isn't the
date on the coffin seventeen fifty and it's fifteen years later?

Speaker 9 (01:19:29):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:19:30):
Is it seventeen or eighteen?

Speaker 1 (01:19:31):
It might be eighteen. I'm not sure.

Speaker 2 (01:19:33):
Yeah, I think I did read that later on your right,
I did miss that in Alakarta, but here, I don't
know if I missed anything, but I know I didn't
miss any hint or I'm pretty sure I didn't miss
any hints about there possibly being a plague. And we
don't see anybody else coming to that, and not even
the animals are or the cow is just sick. I mean,
they do say something about lungs, so I guess you

(01:19:56):
can infer from that that maybe the plague is rom
around the countryside all of a sudden. Oh there's the
nun that I think hung herself. Why is she walking
back to her room? Wait, and there's the mother superior.
She choked, well, what's all You gotta be kidding me,
And then they opened the door and she's laying in

(01:20:18):
bed and oh she passed peacefully heard as they say, like, oh,
fuck you movie.

Speaker 1 (01:20:25):
So Satan wasn't here at all. But then I think
they throw in one more apple and you're just like, oh,
fuck you, I'm done with you. Movie.

Speaker 2 (01:20:31):
Yeah, and everybody, everybody comes by the convent doors. The
Marcello and his grandmar are still alive, and this person's
still alive, and no, here comes the devil. Ah fuck you.

Speaker 5 (01:20:43):
It was a dream of extral and magnitude.

Speaker 7 (01:20:46):
It's like the pilot to the Twilight Zone where originally
he pulls a movie ticket out of his pocket and
he said, oh, so it did happen ooh, and Rod
Serling was like, fuck it, no, this doesn't work, take
it out. He had it right all this time.

Speaker 1 (01:21:02):
The name of that Japanese movie is most commonly known
as School of the Holy Beast.

Speaker 2 (01:21:07):
That is literally on one of my watch lists.

Speaker 1 (01:21:09):
You think of Mexico, you think in Spain and Italy,
these countries are so not just Christian, but Catholic. And
then it's like, what are these nuns doing in Japan?
And yes, I know the Portuguese brought Catholicism and Christianity
over to Japan, and we're very hated for a lot

(01:21:31):
of it. You know, I've seen Silence, I know what's
going on with some of this stuff. I've seen Jogun
or at least the original of it. But then you
get into like Sleepy Eyes of Death, that whole series,
and how the his the samurai's mother was raped by
Portuguese guy with red hair, and so now he's this
poor Japanese guy's got this red hair. He's kind of

(01:21:53):
marked for life kind of thing. The religious angle with Japan,
it just seems to add so much more complication because
I think, even, oh gosh, there's a filmmaker whose stuff
I like a lot, and uh he even has like
nuns in at least one of his films, And I'm
just like, this is really strange to see these Japanese nuns.

(01:22:14):
But it's great because you know, torture films were so
big in Japan, so then you get the torture with
the nuns, so you get all that flagellation going on,
and everybody's just whipping everybody.

Speaker 2 (01:22:26):
It's great sounds right up my alley.

Speaker 1 (01:22:29):
All right, guys, let's go ahead and take another break
and play preview for next week's show right after these
brief messages.

Speaker 3 (01:22:35):
Hungry Wives, My evenings free on a diet of men.

Speaker 2 (01:22:41):
You're not bad in the sack, and missus Robinson, I
bet yourself.

Speaker 10 (01:22:46):
Everything women could want out of marriage except the one
thing they crave most. Joan available surely dissolving her problems in.

Speaker 3 (01:22:57):
Drink, Marion in witchcraft.

Speaker 10 (01:23:02):
They are all hungry wives with an appetite for diversion.

Speaker 3 (01:23:11):
Gambling with life and death.

Speaker 9 (01:23:20):
One of them.

Speaker 3 (01:23:25):
Hungry wives lead normal lives, or do they?

Speaker 4 (01:23:29):
What are these days?

Speaker 9 (01:23:30):
You're gonna find yourself lying there a jackcat between year late.

Speaker 3 (01:23:35):
What goes on while their husbands are at work. You
are sick woman, You know what I was doing.

Speaker 2 (01:23:43):
Fall in the next room, and you go with it
because you didn't know how to handle it.

Speaker 10 (01:23:48):
I didn't know what.

Speaker 9 (01:23:50):
I'll tell you how to have it.

Speaker 3 (01:23:51):
You kick some at you kick from as hungry wives.

Speaker 1 (01:23:56):
That's right. We'll be back next week with a look
at George A. Romero's Hungry Wives aka Season of the
Witch aka Jack's Wife. Until then, I want to thank
my co host Mark and Ryan. So Mark, what is
the latest with you? Sir?

Speaker 2 (01:24:09):
The Chasing Chevy Chase podcast is monthly, so that comes
out regularly. My Cambridge and with Sean podcast comes out regularly.
Uh wickip Hevy is semi regular. And this was actually
a movie I can take off of my to do
list because I was pining on talking about this at
some point on there and never got around to it.

Speaker 1 (01:24:31):
So thanks Mike, You're welcome America. And Ryan, how about
with you?

Speaker 7 (01:24:35):
I have two podcasts. One is called One Track Mind,
where we analyze film through the prism of audio commentary tracks, directors, writers,
actors and crafts people analyzing their own films in front
of a microphone. It inspired me to do every other
week me and a guest discuss what they said, also
in front of microphones, and Mike has appeared on two

(01:24:58):
separate episodes, hope to have them back soon. And then
I also co host Reels of Justice, which is a
fake court of opinion, a movie court where in a prosecutor, defender, judge,
and jury try to conclude whether or not a movie
is guilty of being a bad movie, and you can
find that literally anywhere you listen to this podcast. And
I also have a Patreon at patreon dot com Slash

(01:25:20):
one Track Mine Podcast, where you can get every episode
early in commercial free in an archive of five hundred
hours of bonus content, including all the Coolness Chronicles, a
one hundred episode deep abit of the history and legacy
of Mystery Science the year three thousand and the Sherlock Chronicles.
Mike also appear pleatists. Check both of them out.

Speaker 1 (01:25:41):
Thank you so much guys for being on the show.
Thanks to everybody for listening. Do you want to support
physical media and get great movies by mail, head over
to scarecrow dot com. I try Scarecrow Videos incredible rent
by mail service, the largest publicly accessible collection in the world.
You'll find films there entirely unavailable elsewhere. Get what you want,
when you want it, without the screwing. And of course
al Yu Karta is available as well as Mansion of Madness,

(01:26:05):
which is the one that turned into Doctor Carr's Torture Dungeon.
So get that over there, I believe, so if you
want to hear more of me shooting off my mouth.
Just like Mark, check out some of the other shows
that I work on. They are all available at Weirdowaymedia
dot com. Thanks especially to our Patreon community. If you
want to join the community, visit patreon dot com slash
Projection Booth, and also don't forget about Ryan's Patreon while

(01:26:27):
you're at it. Every donation we get we being Ryan
and I helps the Projection Booth take over the world

Speaker 4 (01:28:11):
In

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