April 7, 2025 • 37 mins
Charles Denike has Bubba Wallace off to the best start of his NASCAR Cup Series career, and he’s done so as a new crew chief in the series. Denike dishes on settling in at 23XI Racing; how it feels to get off to a strong start this season; impressions of Wallace from afar and now working with him; why the time was right to make this career move; the positive reviews about him before the season even started; the adjustment from the Craftsman Truck Series to being in the Cup Series; if he’s been able to enjoy the fast start to the season or had the pressure that comes with it; finding the same structure in NASCAR as in the military; why he went into the military after high school; his background and experience in the military; going into racing as his second career; the crossover from military into racing; the engineering crossover from one to the other; his NASCAR start being in the K&N Series and then going Truck Series racing; memories from Truck Series racing and his unconventional first career win; seeing his former truck win at at Martinsville Speedway; things that translate from the truck to cup; the balance of how he wants to lead the team but not changing things to change them; what Charles wanted from Bubba and want Bubba wanted from Charles as they paired together; the No. 1 thing the team needs to have accomplished by the end of the year.
Original music created by Tony Monge.
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Original music created by Tony Monge.
Follow me here: https://linktr.ee/kellycrandall
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Hi, everyone, Welcome to the Racing Writers Podcast. I'm your host,
Kelly crandall. Our guest today is Charles DeNike, kerchief for
Bubba Wallace and the number twenty three team at twenty
three to eleven racing. Charles is nude to the team.
He is nudes to NASCAR Cup Series racing. But what
a start he and Bubba are off to this year
a bunch of top tens won a dual race in Daytona.
(00:28):
They are really building something solid to hopefully get back
to Victory Lane soon and compete in the playoffs. Charles
came to the Cup Series from the last five years
in the Craftsman Truck Series, most recently at Bill mcinally
where he guided Christian Ekis to eight wins in championship contention.
If that's all you know about Charles, this conversation is
for you. Not only are we going to talk about
(00:49):
the start he's off to with Bubba, the adjustment to
the Cup Series and everything that comes with being a
crew chief at the top level, but we're gonna get
to know Charles where he came from, how he got here,
his racing background as well as his military background. This
is in a way his second career, and we're learning
all about that today. I love the conversation. I loved
(01:09):
getting to know someone new, and I think you're gonna
enjoy it just as much. So how about we jump
into it and get to know Charles D. Nike on
the Racing Writers Podcast. Sitting here with Charles, And what
I love about this is we're doing it at the
race shop, and that's a good place to start because
this is your new home. I know it's been a
(01:31):
couple months, but does it still feel new or you
know your way around the place already?
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Right? It does still feel new, but yeah, I learned
the way around started the beginning of December, so I've
been here five months so far.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
All right, Well, let's talk about how everything is going,
because from the outside looking in, it seems like it's
been pretty seamless. I'm sure it's not been that easy,
but the fast start this team is off to has
been pretty impressive. As we talk, after Martinsville, three top
tens and seven races, the duelwin at Daytona, So things
are going well in that regard. Are you surprised at
(02:01):
all or what's your first reaction of motion of how
well this is going.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I wouldn't say surprised, but certainly satisfied that we were
able to get off to a good start because it's
very challenging to keep the momentum up if you don't
get off to a good start. This team is highly
capable and that was shown last year too. So there
was only three people that were changed for this season, myself,
(02:27):
one mechanic of one pick. Remember, so it wasn't a
full overhaul. An overhaul wasn't necessary, just a bit of
fine tuning. There was so many things that this team
was doing extremely well before and we didn't want to
change those things, and we just worked on a few
small areas that we felt like there was room for
improvement and kind of got refocused for this year. And
(02:48):
at Bowman Gray we were able to get a top
five there, which was a totally different environment, you know,
a different type of event, but it was an indicator
of what we felt like we were going to be
able to coomplish and just get some communication going. And
then you know, Bubba is an exceptional super speedway racer
and we have really good cars for super speedway races here,
(03:09):
so we expected to be able to go contend to win,
But you just don't know how well you're going to execute,
how well you're going to do your new job, how
where the team is going to function together, until you
get a chance to actually, you know, get on the
ground and do it. So the duel win was just
a huge boost and confidence for everybody to know that
(03:30):
what we were trying to accomplish was achievable and we
could display what we felt like our group was capable
of doing and just got off to a bit of
a jump start to the season.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
What were your impressions of Bubba from Afar? So the
last couple of years, you've heard his name, you've seen him,
and then what is it like now working with him,
meeting him knowing him?
Speaker 2 (03:53):
So I knew he was very capable as a race
car driver, and the first time that I was ever
around him would have been twenty twelve in the can
N Pro Series. I was working for a team competing
at that time and Bowman Gray was actually one of
the races. So it was kind of interesting to go
back there together this year. But you know, Kyle Larson
and Corey Lajoy and Chase Elliott, you know, that was
(04:16):
the group that was together at that time, so you
end up following some of these people along the way,
and Corey Lajoy is a friend of mine, you know
as well, So just knowing Bubba keeps really good company
with a lot of great people, So I knew that
it was somebody that I would be able to work
well with and has the has the talent as well
(04:39):
to drive the car. I mean, he's a multi time
Cup Series race winner and Truck Series race winner as well,
so you know, moving into a new role for me,
it's about the right opportunity with the you know, the
right people, the right organization, having the right equipment, the
right driver, the right pit crew, all of those things.
And perhaps in the past, if all those things didn't
(05:01):
line up correctly, it wasn't the right time for me
to make a career change. This would it was the
right time though obviously for all those things.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Yeah, I was going to ask that of what made
this opportunity the one to take? But you hit on it.
It's when all the things are there you feel like
makes it the right opportunity. Whereas you came from a
place where you're having success, So I guess to expand
a little bit more on what was your thought process
then of what I'm doing now is working. We're winning
races at mcinally, I know I have a good team.
(05:32):
So how did you weigh that success versus this opportunity
and what you also think you could do here?
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Yeah, so sometimes you know, you can get comfortable in
that success and that doesn't push you forward. And I
had accomplished most everything that I felt like I wanted
to accomplish as a truck crew chief. I don't know that,
you know, winning the championship last year and not winning
the championship was going to, you know, change my mindset
for going into the next season. And opportunities like this
(05:59):
don't come around often. They may not come around again,
So you really have to decide whether now's the time
or not, because you don't know when you might get
another opportunity if you felt like, for some reason, this
one wasn't the right one. And you know, last year
felt like we had accomplished everything that I wanted to
accomplish in my professional life. Obviously, there was some changes
(06:21):
with Christian leaving on the nineteen truck and opportunities were
opening for him. Opportunities were opening for me, whether it
was you know here or other opportunities perhaps, so there
was it was kind of a natural time to consider
what was next, and when Dave contacted me about coming
to work here and exploring what that would mean. The
more that we talked, you know, the more it became
(06:43):
apparent that this was certainly the right place for my future.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Dave contacts you, he's been very public about his comments
and support for you. Denny has been the same way. Denny,
I think took a lot of us in the media
by surprise because you and Bubba you had run Bowman Gray,
but really hadn't run point races yet. We weren't into
the season, and Denny was already saying that guy's gonna
be a game changer. I'm telling y'all, he's going to
be a game changer. We found him, you know, he
was just gushing basically about you. Do you hear those
(07:10):
comments and think, wait, wait, wait, I haven't even established
myself yet.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Well, I certainly appreciate that the leadership and ownership has,
you know, trust and confidence in me. Obviously, they you know,
had to feel that way to hire me to begin with,
and it's just it's nice to know that there's that
support surrounding you. At the workplace, and I feel like
that across everybody here, not just not just you know,
(07:34):
the ownership group and the leadership group, but this, you know,
twenty three eleven is comprised of exceptional people, exceptional employees,
and it's it's just nice to be a part of it.
And you feel like you're surrounded by so many levels
of support, you know, every day of the week that
you come to work.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Looking at going from the Truck series to the Cup Series.
A lot gets made when drivers do it, if they
skip Exfinity and go from truck to Cup and it's
a whole new world. And of course the environments are different,
the competition differ, the garage is naturally different. I think
the last crew chief, and I could be wrong, but
the most recent crew chief I can think of that
made a successful transition would have been Rudy Fugal. And
now you're doing it. What has stood out, Charles for
(08:12):
you going from the truck garage and that way of
life to what you're already seeing and having to adjust
to being in the Cup Series and being in the
Cup garage and following Cup procedures and running a Cup team.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Now, yep, Rudy Fugel and Chris Lawson as well. Yeap, Yeah,
I enjoyed competing against both of those guys in the
truck series. So what's interesting kind of different now, I'd say,
is that the natural ladder system doesn't have to be followed,
and some of that is because the vehicles are different.
You know, there's similarities on a truck to a Nccinity car,
(08:44):
and obviously there were similarities progressing to the old style
cup car. You know that there are pieces and parts
that are the same type of pieces and parts. This
cup car is entirely different, you know, I mean about
the only thing that is the same as the steer
will So it wasn't necessary to go from truck to
(09:04):
Infinity to feel like you would have a chance of
success at the cup level.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
You mentioned earlier you were one of three new guys
on this team, but you're the leader of the team.
You're going to be very high profile, one of the
faces of the team. So are you able to enjoy
this early season's success or did you feel the pressure
to come in and that you guys needed to get
off to a fast start.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Well, there's certainly pressure. I kind of grew up in
the pressure as a privileged mentality, so I enjoy that
and that's how I find enjoyment and satisfaction in it,
you know. And it's the one thing that you learn
adapting to Cup Series from truck series is the very
regimented repetitiveness on a weekly basis. You know, you can't
(09:49):
deviate from your Monday to Wednesday or Monday to Thursday
routine because there's just not time in the week to
do something really different. But it provides so much structure
to be able to do that and has really helped
the moving from truck to Cup racing, I think.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
On that note, it's a good segue. I feel like
because one of the things I have learned about you is,
and I didn't know until recently, was you have a
military background, coming from the Army, So I would assume
you like and are used to structure. Yep, and you
like that aspect.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Yeah, and this organization is superstructured, which I thought was
really fascinating when I was getting to know twenty three
eleven and one of the things that kind of lured
me to wanting to come here even more just they
do business a little bit different than a historical legacy
style race team which I think is really efficient and
(10:42):
really effective. But you had to your point. This is
kind of my second career after college. I graduated college
in two thousand and three from University of Virginia as
a mechanical engineer. I grew up next to a racing
family that race light model stock cars in Virginia. Interestingly enough,
kind of grew up with those guys against Denny in
the early two thousands in Virginia. So I went to
(11:03):
college and I stayed, you know, in contact with my
friends that were racing, and came home and did some
racing with them and all. But I went into the
military after I graduated college. At commissioned as a second
lieutenant in the Army and the corp of Engineers, and
I did nine years in the Army. In twenty twelve
was when I decided I was, you know, probably ready
(11:24):
to get out of the military. You reach a point
where you have to decide whether you're going to stay
or go. You don't you don't go to year fifteen
and decide how I'm going to get out of the
military when you could retire at year twenties. So it
was kind of a natural time and I felt like
I had a similar to what we talked about on
the nineteen truck. I had accomplished what I wanted to
accomplish at that kind of level and time of my life.
(11:45):
So in twenty twelve I left the military and went
to pursue professionally racing, you know, as my job, getting
paid to do it, and started at the Canaan Series level,
Canaan pur series level, like when I referenced Bowman Gray
and those guys there, and was able to go from
there to trucks. Dabbled a little bit on a couple
(12:05):
opportunities in exfinity along the way that were kind of
part of the same teams I was working for, but
predominantly had been truck racing and truck crew chief in
the past five years up to now.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
All right, so to fill in some blanks there, So
I want to talk about a bunch of the things
you just said. So originally from Virginia, not from a
racing fan.
Speaker 2 (12:19):
I tea that up. Well for you, you could go
where wherever you want to go.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
You're a professional, this is great.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
I gave you all sorts of opportunities.
Speaker 1 (12:26):
So originally from Virginia, not in racing, but knew of racing.
You said, grew up next to a racing family. Why
the military. What's the connection there of choosing that's the
route that you went.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
I don't know for sure, to be honest with you.
I kind of just grew up probably aiming in that direction.
It was an opportunity to travel and to have some
neat jobs after college, and while I was in college
of are to see, just was exposed to it growing up.
My dad served in Vietnam, so you know, it wasn't
too far from from my past there. So yeah, it
(13:01):
just it seemed like a kind of a natural inspiration
for me to go and really enjoyed the time that
I was in the military.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
What can you share I don't know the rules right,
What can you share about your experiences or what your
role was in the army?
Speaker 2 (13:16):
So I was an engineer officer, I was a dive
Detachment Executive officer and a dive Detachment company commander, which
is basically a commercial diver in the military, an Army diver.
That was areas that we worked in were underwater search
and salvage reconnaissance, port surveys, things like that, as well
(13:38):
as as being in the Army Corps. Engineers. And then
at the end of my time, I was a staff
officer on a sustainment brigade, so I worked in the
logistics field and that was in Fort Eustis, Virginia. So
it wasn't necessarily because I was from Virginia. I just
the stationing that I was able to get put me
back there in a Newport News area. I got to
(13:59):
go to Haiti after the earthquake for emergency response, which
was a really rewarding experience there, and then also deployed
Afghanistan for a year, also a really rewarding experience. But
before then, I got to live in Hawaii, Missouri, Florida, Virginia.
I got to travel to Australia, Vietnam, Quadulin, a toll,
(14:23):
some really neat places.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
Yeah, there's a LinkedIn page that claims it's yours, so
I want to verify is it yours? It has your
name on it and it has a little bit of
this information on.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
This that's mine. Yeah. So I'll be the first admit
that I'm not super good at maintaining social media stuff.
It comes in like spurts, and it's just hard to
do enough effort. As busy as things are, you know,
I'd like to try to figure out how to manage
that a little bit better.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
Well, the reason I ask, right, is because you're doing
research and you're trying to learn about somebody in either
social media or LinkedIn or like the two biggest things
people look at. So I came across a page where
I was like, Okay, it has his name, has his pick. Sure,
some of the stuff's matching up. Okay, it looks legit,
but you gotta make sure you got to do the
due diligence. And one of the things on there is
we're talking about your military experience was Bronze Star and
(15:09):
you mentioned Afghanistan. What can you share about earning that
or how does one be awarded that?
Speaker 2 (15:15):
So there's various different awards and decorations that you can get.
Some are schools, summer service, some are meritorious service. So
I was able to ironed that during my time in
Afghanistan with the support that we did. The unit that
I was with was responsible for the logistics in the
southern half of Afghanistan. So I was stationed in Kandahar
Airfield and worked on engineering projects that was in support
(15:39):
of that logistics unit.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
So come home as you said, once your career is
over and then you decide racing is next. Because you,
as we touched on, you knew about racing, but why
was it enough of a draw that you're like, Okay,
now I want to try that.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
Well, I'd always stayed involved and I was always interested
in it. I took classes for it in college. Like
I said, I grew up next to a family that raced.
When I was about eleven years old, is when we
moved next door to this family that raced. So I
grew up going to the garage next door and working
on cars from a young age. And you reached a
point in my military career, and perhaps it could have
(16:15):
been if I was in a different career path as
well that you say, I feel like I'm going to
regret not pursuing this other venture more than I would,
you know, staying in my current venture. So that's really
where it came from.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
Is there a crossover between I guess is engineering engineering,
no matter where it is or what it's being used towards.
So where is there crossover of things you knew and
your abilities and your education that you easily brought into racing.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
Yeah, there is a crossover. I mean yes, to some degree.
Engineering is engineering as a military engineer. Civil engineering, mechanical
engineering are probably the more common ones that directly apply
to things that you can do as an engineer in
the military airspace as well, and the mechanic the aerospace side,
(17:02):
they directly relate to motorsports. Also, technology, you know, is
widespread no matter what the industry is, so there's there's
crossover there. And then on the leadership side, it certainly
helps you have different professionally taught leadership techniques and things
that you do while you're in the military that helps
(17:23):
in the in the civilian and private sector.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
I think the sport has also evolved over the years,
and I'm sure you know it and you've seen it,
but it I guess it would I don't want to
say lucky, but it it trended in the direction to
where engineers suddenly were becoming the sought after positions and
then a lot of them have transitioned to crew chiefs.
So for you when you came in, it was probably like, oh,
this is going the exact direction I needed to go.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Yeah, and some of it is just the natural evolution
as more as you know twenty years ago, as the
sport relied more and more on engineering. There became more engineers,
and those engineers were in their twenties out of college,
and you know, as the veteran crew chiefs of that
time obviously got older, they got towards the end of
(18:09):
their career, they retired. You know, fast forward twenty years
and the natural tendency as some of those engineers to
promote into crew chief positions. So you know, there's obviously
a large quantity of crew chief now that have an
engineering background. There are still extremely successful ones that don't,
you know, but I would say that a majority of
(18:30):
those have an engineering mindset and have a extremely strong
engineering staff around them, just like we do here at
twenty three eleven.
Speaker 1 (18:36):
Yeah, we mentioned the structure and how you're used to
that and you like that. Are there other trades, Charles,
Whether I guess maybe even from a leadership perspective now
that you're a leader of a race team, that carry
over that you learn in the military, that applied to
as I said, a leader of a team.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Yeah, absolutely, and I think you see that in any
industry and professional sports as well. You know, one thing
that's fascinating to me here is our pit crew coach
John Carvin is, you know, is a professional coach, and
just watching how he interacts with the pit crew members,
you know, professional athletes, is really fascinating from not coming
(19:12):
from that side and not having any experience on that side.
For me, I'm more of a technical leader, you know,
and I believe in the people that you are surrounded with,
empowering them to be able to manage themselves and those
that work for them. And you know, we are fortunate
to have a lot of depth and a lot of
really strong people here that can go and work in
(19:33):
their areas and run their departments at the highest level.
And I think that's what's really nice about here versus
some other places, is just the quality of the people
at every level just exceptional.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
The K and N series, What are some memories or
experiences you had there, the teams you worked with, what's
on the resume from coming in and starting there.
Speaker 2 (19:55):
Well, I was able to work for the Godovic family
in Virgini, which was nice because I was living local
there as I got out of the military, so you know,
I wasn't in a position at that time to move
to North Carolina immediately. So you're trying to figure out
whether you're going to go work as a mechanical engineer somewhere,
whether you're actually going to be able to work on
(20:18):
a race team, and kind of taking a leap of
faith at that moment. So fortunately I was able to
secure a job with them. They were racing in the
Canean Pro Series at the time and late milestock cars
at Langley Speedway. So spent a few years with them
in really good times, and then relocated in twenty fifteen
(20:38):
down to North Carolina.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
So it didn't take long then. It doesn't sound like
to be able to do that.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
No, a few years at a time, you know, it's
kind of a natural flow, I would say. So, yeah,
I worked there. I went to GMS Racing in twenty sixteen,
would have been my first year truck racing.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
So is GMS what led to the transition to getting
to North Carolina? Is that the next step?
Speaker 2 (20:59):
Well, the job I had before led to the transition,
But my first step in truck racing was at GMS
in twenty sixteen. I was already down here at the
time and a.
Speaker 1 (21:08):
Very successful organization there and it's heyday, it's not around anymore.
So again, same question, So truck series racing. Now you're
in it, you're in one of the national series. What
stands out as you're gaining more experience Again, that organization
knows about winning, contending for championships. What's that experience?
Speaker 2 (21:26):
So started as an engineer there and we were able
to win right out the gate on the team that
I was a part of with Ben Kennedy in twenty
sixteen at Bristol. In twenty seventeen, got to enjoy winning
at Martinsville with Chase Elliott driving the twenty three truck
at the time. And then I got paired up with
Stuart Friesen for a few years, which was really a
(21:47):
lot of fun and rewarding. That was through the twenty
nineteen season. We won a couple of races together as well,
super talented driver and enjoy getting to keep up with
him on a regular basis too. Friend and So then
twenty twenty is when I started crew chiefing, and twenty
twenty was obviously upside down with with COVID and everything
(22:08):
going on in the motorsports industry, and.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
No better time to become cruc Yeah first time yea.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
So won my first race at Charlotte with Chase Elliot,
on the Return to Racing race, and which was also
the Bounty race that you know, Kevin Harvick and and
Kyle and all, so really neat to go there and win.
The celebration was kind of anti climactic, and we'd still
joke about it regularly because there was nobody in the
in the stands, we weren't allowed to go in victory lane,
(22:36):
so Chase drove the truck over and the victory lane
got out who you know, and and we're like behind
the fence line, i mean, behind the chain link fence.
Couldn't even go in there to celebrate, and did our
post race interviews, you know, sitting this far apart with
chairs and you know, microphones and on boomsticks and stuff,
and yeah, yeah, just so different. But it was, I mean,
(22:57):
what it is, what it is like you I'll take
winning that way versus not winning for sure anytime. But
then went on later that year to win at Bristol,
which was super cool with Sam Mayor. I mean, we
just smoked them, you know, and it was really neat.
And the best part about that was we were able
to celebrate together in Victory Lane up on top of
the building, you know, and take normal photos and you know,
(23:19):
spray normal beer and all that stuff.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
So your moment, Yeah, I was gonna ask when was
the one you really got to celebrate joy for the
first time.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Yeah, that was That was it. That one was really neat.
And my time at GMS, which which went to twenty
twelve was super rewarding and really what led to being
able to go do the nineteen truck in twenty two,
three and four, and you know, getting there had the
opportunity to help transform that place into a race winning organization,
a championship caliber and playoff contending organization. And we got
(23:51):
Christian there in twenty thirteen and got our first win
in Atlanta, which was just super neat to see Bill
mcinally with all that he's put into the sport for
years and years and years out West and some years
in truck race and you know, finally be able to
accomplish that as a truck series owner was really neat.
And obviously we went on to have a lot more
success for those two years and eight wins, which was
(24:12):
which was neat, and there's you know, every win has
its has its story. You know, Nashville last year really
stands out because we let every lap. That was something
new that you know, not too many people get to do.
We're winning both races of Martinsville last year was neat
and you know, finally getting a win another win at
Bristol last year and being able to beat Kyle for it.
(24:34):
Anytime that you can, you know, beat the best in
the business makes it super rewarding at the end. And
you know, and no different for the drivers, but the
crew chiefs as well. You know, Brian Patty is one
of the best in the business. So not only did
we beat Kyle on the track, I got to beat him,
you know, toe to toe, which is neat too, because
you know, we enjoy competing against each other.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
Let's touch on Martinsville for a minute, because, as I said,
we're recording this week after Martinsville. So two things. That
nineteen truck that you left behind for this new role
goes out wins Martinsville after you. As you said, you
guys swept it last year when you were leading it
and Daniel Hemric of course a very popular winner. What
were just your thoughts and emotions watching that, because that's
(25:14):
the team that you know very well. Those are guys
you know very well. And also to see Daniel get
that opportunity.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
Yeah, super cool. And you know, as it was happening,
and as it was ending, me and Christian were texting
each other. Me and Bubba were texting each other. You know,
Daniel Hemric is a great guy and a great driver,
and Bubba knows him well, so Bubba's texting him, so
like we're you know, everybody is just super happy for
each other, I think, And you know, my goal at
the end of last year was to leave that place
(25:40):
and as best a condition as I could. I couldn't
change the fact that I was leaving. I couldn't change
the fact that Christian was leaving. But you leave it
as good as you can so that they can continue
to be successful. And you know, now Daniel and Josh
Graham the crew chief there, they're you know, they're now
race winners and they can take that company wherever that
they think they need take it moving forward, because it's
(26:01):
it's theirs.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
The second part of that is then on Sunday, you
and Bubba go out and finish top five, another strong run.
Keep building on that consistency as we talked about earlier,
and I know during the weekend Bubba faced quite a
few questions of well, what can Charles bring from the
truck when when he dominated last year? Is that going
to carry over? So not just for Martinsville, but I
guess in general, are there things that you have been
(26:24):
able to carry over? Does anything translate from truck to
cup racing.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
Yeah, I'd say just some of the cadence of some
of the races, the experience of the race tracks, or
just being comfortable and familiar with where you're at helps.
Some of the races are wildly different in links or
stage links. Martins is one of them, you know, where
the strategy of the race doesn't correlate really at all.
But and this question was asked to me at the racetrack,
(26:49):
So my answer then was Homestead was a little bit
more similar because on mile and a half, the final
stage of a truck race is more like a normal
stage cup racing. You have a green flag stop, you
go through a set of tires. You know, you perhaps
don't pit twice, So there was there's more correlation there,
and obviously there's a fair amount of those truck racing,
(27:12):
so there's a little bit that carries over. But you know,
just competing in general, how the race weekend goes with
practice and qualifying. You know, those activities are similar, but
the level of competition is obviously hugely different. The margins
are so incredibly small. We were talking today getting ready
(27:34):
for Darlington and what our goals were for qualifying, and
we in the past two weeks we've had super fast
speed in practice and it felt like we could have
qualified a little bit better than we did each time.
You know, but we still qualified well and it's still
set us up well for the race, but it makes
pit selection a little bit more difficult. So, you know,
(27:55):
we want to qualify six or better this week if
we unload with the pace that we expect, unload with practice,
just to have a little bit better pit selections. So
some of those nuances are all a little bit more
fine details stuff with Cup racing.
Speaker 1 (28:09):
Bubba has had some really interesting comments as he's talked
about this change for him, going from Booty, who he
knew well was comfortable with, to describing the process of
how you were hired and how he kind of took
a step back approach of I'll trust the organization, let
them make the decision, and really how not that you
(28:31):
make him uncomfortable, but he was comfortable with people he
had previously, So what's the balance for you, Charles coming
in as a new guy, of I need to lead
this team, and I have my visions, but I don't
want to come in and just say everything they've been doing,
we're not going to do that anymore.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
Right, And that's kind of what I was touching on earlier.
There's so many processes and things here that don't need
to be changed. So for me, it was more of
just on the execution side, how can we get the
most out of the team. How can we get the
most out above a for a longer period of time,
through the course of the whole weekend, because every weekend
(29:13):
there'd be flashes of greatness, right, and but how do
we keep some of those from declining through the course
of a weekend and have have more great days and
less bad days. Was kind of one of our one
of our mantras to start the year off with. And
to me, I just I think it's it's a repetitive process.
Winning as a process, and you know, there's things that
(29:34):
you have to do and things that you have to
go through, and you have to prioritize and compartmentalize things.
And we talk about how we're going to go through
Darlington this weekend, which is really no different than Martinsville
or Homestead, even the tracts are widely different. Is we
plan to run out practice for as many laps as
possible because it's not really beneficial to make an adjustment
(29:54):
in middle practice. But when that ends, the only thing
that matters next is quite the race trim for Sunday
is not really a concern until we leave the racetrack
and then we work in the evening on what we're
going to do and the changes we're going to make.
So making sure that you know, not just him, but
the whole group has all those priorities in the order
that matters most, I think is one of the one
(30:17):
of the main focuses. And then how do we execute
the race for the whole time. And that's one of
the biggest differences that I've gotten used to in this
short part of this year. So far as you know,
the races are three and a half hours long and
seven hour and a half long or whatever. In you know,
it's just the endurance that it takes to get through that.
(30:37):
We were joking on the way home from Martinsville this
past week because we went through a long portion of
the race and the final stage where not much was happening.
Yet we were non stop communicating on intercom between me
and our two engineers and our strategy group here and
the other engineers that are here at air Speed in
our Exfinity Speed Center that support us in the races.
(31:00):
I mean, non stop communication about what happens if the
caution comes out right now, what happens if it comes
out in fifteen laps? And then you talk long enough, hey,
that we've already passed that and move on to the
next fifteen laps, because you know, we're already passed that
lap count. And you finish the race and you're you're
mentally exhausted from trying to be prepared for any scenary
that might happen. Makes the race go by quicker, I guess,
(31:20):
And so you know, all the same time, we've got
to keep the driver and the spot and the pit
crew ready engaged, performing at the highest level possible the
whole time. And and it's challenging, you know. And it's
challenging at Homestead when you're when you have no margin
of error next to the wall. The same thing at
Darlington too, and when you have long green flag runs,
(31:43):
it can be even harder because there's there's no break.
You know, that's long green flag run, pit stop under green,
which you know takes an extraordinary amount of focus, and
then right back added on another long green flag run.
And at least when you have a few cautions you
can kind of take your catch your breath for a minute.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Two more things for you to to wrap up here.
When you came in and you and Bubba, I'm sure
sat down and talked and got to know each other.
Was there any conversation of you looking at Bubba and saying, Okay,
this is what I need from you and then vice versa.
Did he say okay, this is what I need from
you as a crew chief?
Speaker 2 (32:14):
Yeah, that happens, and we met, We wrote down some
notes about what he felt like he needed from from
me and our engineers to be better this year and
asked us to do the same, which we did, and
then we go back and look at those as we
go and make sure that that's focal points. A lot
of attention was given to how do you build a
(32:35):
relationship with your driver or how do you build a
relationship with your crew chief? And I can tell you.
There's not a playbook, there's not a checklist. You know,
there's not a turnkey answer. But the easiest way is
the reason that you know he's here is to drive
the race car, and the reason that I'm here is
to lead the team. So you naturally start communicating about
work things first, and it starts off with you're in
(32:58):
a new job, so what you know, what does that mean?
And then it turns into your we're going to the
racetracks so that topics are focused on that particular race weekend,
and then communication turns into fifty to fifty, you know,
you start to meet each other's families, and then it
turns into you can have conversations have nothing to do
with work and nothing to do with racing, and that's
just a natural evolution of building a relationship with somebody.
(33:20):
But it's not a there's no you know, playbook or
set checklist that you have to follow. It's just whatever
feels comfortable for the people. But to get to that
point is what helps bring out the most of each other.
And that's his job and my job to bring out
the best in each other. On Sunday, all right.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Last thing for you, and I'm pretty sure, I know
the answer to this, but I'm going to ask it
anyway because sometimes it sounds better coming from the people involved.
At the end of the year, Charles, what's the biggest
thing that this team will have needed to cross off
the list?
Speaker 2 (33:47):
Return to race winning form and return to the playoffs.
That's it.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
I knew the answer, but got it here, so right,
I mean, that's the goal here. It doesn't it doesn't
even really need to be said. And I know I
know bubb has talked about that too, but that is it.
That is number one.
Speaker 2 (33:59):
Yep, that's number one. And you know, the reason that
it's important to have both. I mean, there's certainly a
scenario where we could make the playoffs some points and
still win in the end the playoffs. So obviously if
we win, you know, now, then you make the playoffs.
So it's important to just not lose sight of both.
But that's what this team is capable of. That's what
this team has, you know, been built on, you know,
(34:20):
Denny's vision, in Michael's vision, is a championship caliber team
in year five or in year five, you know they
were the forty five was a championship caliber team last year.
You know, and we want to hang banners here more
on the twenty three team.
Speaker 1 (34:35):
Right, all right, Charles, I'll let you get back to
work to keep making that twenty three car as fast
as it can be. But in all seriousness, congratulations on
it's been a fantastic I think start to the season
from the outside looking in, and I think it's been
really cool to see how seamless you guys have made
it look. I know a lot of work goes into it,
but congratulations for being in this role and again to
(34:56):
see how quickly things have come together and appreciate the
time today to get to know you a little bit better.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
Yeah, thank you so much. Early. Enjoyed this and I
look forward to getting to do it again after our
first win this year.
Speaker 1 (35:05):
All right, it's on the record, remark that good schedule it.
Speaker 2 (35:14):
All right?
Speaker 1 (35:14):
Well, that was fun. Thank you again Charles for coming
on the podcast, sitting down with me at Airspeed for
the conversation. Also my thanks to Sidney Freeson from twenty
three to eleven for coordinating getting this on the calendar
and bringing me over to Airspeed so we can sit
down do this in person. Appreciate both of you very much.
If you enjoyed the conversation, please leave a rating and review.
You can also go to social media and let me
know what you think. My ex handle is at Kelly Crandall.
(35:37):
Facebook is also at Kelly Crandall, as well as Instagram.
Very easy to find me. Appreciate all the feedback. Thank
you for clicking and listening every week. I hope you're
enjoying the podcast. I am on many different social media platforms,
so it's very easy to find me and let me know.
You can also leave a rating and review. Of course,
wherever you're listening to this podcast, not only lets me
know what you think, but it helps push the podcast
(35:57):
out to others in the racing space and hopefully they
can find it and enjoy it and we can just
keep rolling right along. Next week we'll be back with
a new episode. We're gonna go into the nh A world,
but a different fashion. We're gonna talk to Elan Warner,
who has created one of the coolest things in drag
racing that I am loving and I participate in every
race weekend. He is the creator of drag Race Bracket Bonanza.
(36:19):
It is a very cool bracket style game for nh
A Drag racing, you can win prizes, you can follow
along every week and just be as competitive as I
am and have fun with it. And we're gonna dig
into the nerdy side of building a game bringing that
to drag racing and everything that it entails next week
right here on the Racing Writers Podcast st
Hi, everyone, Welcome to the Racing Writers Podcast. I'm your host,
Kelly crandall. Our guest today is Charles DeNike, kerchief for
Bubba Wallace and the number twenty three team at twenty
three to eleven racing. Charles is nude to the team.
He is nudes to NASCAR Cup Series racing. But what
a start he and Bubba are off to this year
a bunch of top tens won a dual race in Daytona.
(00:28):
They are really building something solid to hopefully get back
to Victory Lane soon and compete in the playoffs. Charles
came to the Cup Series from the last five years
in the Craftsman Truck Series, most recently at Bill mcinally
where he guided Christian Ekis to eight wins in championship contention.
If that's all you know about Charles, this conversation is
for you. Not only are we going to talk about
(00:49):
the start he's off to with Bubba, the adjustment to
the Cup Series and everything that comes with being a
crew chief at the top level, but we're gonna get
to know Charles where he came from, how he got here,
his racing background as well as his military background. This
is in a way his second career, and we're learning
all about that today. I love the conversation. I loved
(01:09):
getting to know someone new, and I think you're gonna
enjoy it just as much. So how about we jump
into it and get to know Charles D. Nike on
the Racing Writers Podcast. Sitting here with Charles, And what
I love about this is we're doing it at the
race shop, and that's a good place to start because
this is your new home. I know it's been a
(01:31):
couple months, but does it still feel new or you
know your way around the place already?
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Right? It does still feel new, but yeah, I learned
the way around started the beginning of December, so I've
been here five months so far.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
All right, Well, let's talk about how everything is going,
because from the outside looking in, it seems like it's
been pretty seamless. I'm sure it's not been that easy,
but the fast start this team is off to has
been pretty impressive. As we talk, after Martinsville, three top
tens and seven races, the duelwin at Daytona, So things
are going well in that regard. Are you surprised at
(02:01):
all or what's your first reaction of motion of how
well this is going.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I wouldn't say surprised, but certainly satisfied that we were
able to get off to a good start because it's
very challenging to keep the momentum up if you don't
get off to a good start. This team is highly
capable and that was shown last year too. So there
was only three people that were changed for this season, myself,
(02:27):
one mechanic of one pick. Remember, so it wasn't a
full overhaul. An overhaul wasn't necessary, just a bit of
fine tuning. There was so many things that this team
was doing extremely well before and we didn't want to
change those things, and we just worked on a few
small areas that we felt like there was room for
improvement and kind of got refocused for this year. And
(02:48):
at Bowman Gray we were able to get a top
five there, which was a totally different environment, you know,
a different type of event, but it was an indicator
of what we felt like we were going to be
able to coomplish and just get some communication going. And
then you know, Bubba is an exceptional super speedway racer
and we have really good cars for super speedway races here,
(03:09):
so we expected to be able to go contend to win,
But you just don't know how well you're going to execute,
how well you're going to do your new job, how
where the team is going to function together, until you
get a chance to actually, you know, get on the
ground and do it. So the duel win was just
a huge boost and confidence for everybody to know that
(03:30):
what we were trying to accomplish was achievable and we
could display what we felt like our group was capable
of doing and just got off to a bit of
a jump start to the season.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
What were your impressions of Bubba from Afar? So the
last couple of years, you've heard his name, you've seen him,
and then what is it like now working with him,
meeting him knowing him?
Speaker 2 (03:53):
So I knew he was very capable as a race
car driver, and the first time that I was ever
around him would have been twenty twelve in the can
N Pro Series. I was working for a team competing
at that time and Bowman Gray was actually one of
the races. So it was kind of interesting to go
back there together this year. But you know, Kyle Larson
and Corey Lajoy and Chase Elliott, you know, that was
(04:16):
the group that was together at that time, so you
end up following some of these people along the way,
and Corey Lajoy is a friend of mine, you know
as well, So just knowing Bubba keeps really good company
with a lot of great people, So I knew that
it was somebody that I would be able to work
well with and has the has the talent as well
(04:39):
to drive the car. I mean, he's a multi time
Cup Series race winner and Truck Series race winner as well,
so you know, moving into a new role for me,
it's about the right opportunity with the you know, the
right people, the right organization, having the right equipment, the
right driver, the right pit crew, all of those things.
And perhaps in the past, if all those things didn't
(05:01):
line up correctly, it wasn't the right time for me
to make a career change. This would it was the
right time though obviously for all those things.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Yeah, I was going to ask that of what made
this opportunity the one to take? But you hit on it.
It's when all the things are there you feel like
makes it the right opportunity. Whereas you came from a
place where you're having success, So I guess to expand
a little bit more on what was your thought process
then of what I'm doing now is working. We're winning
races at mcinally, I know I have a good team.
(05:32):
So how did you weigh that success versus this opportunity
and what you also think you could do here?
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Yeah, so sometimes you know, you can get comfortable in
that success and that doesn't push you forward. And I
had accomplished most everything that I felt like I wanted
to accomplish as a truck crew chief. I don't know that,
you know, winning the championship last year and not winning
the championship was going to, you know, change my mindset
for going into the next season. And opportunities like this
(05:59):
don't come around often. They may not come around again,
So you really have to decide whether now's the time
or not, because you don't know when you might get
another opportunity if you felt like, for some reason, this
one wasn't the right one. And you know, last year
felt like we had accomplished everything that I wanted to
accomplish in my professional life. Obviously, there was some changes
(06:21):
with Christian leaving on the nineteen truck and opportunities were
opening for him. Opportunities were opening for me, whether it
was you know here or other opportunities perhaps, so there
was it was kind of a natural time to consider
what was next, and when Dave contacted me about coming
to work here and exploring what that would mean. The
more that we talked, you know, the more it became
(06:43):
apparent that this was certainly the right place for my future.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Dave contacts you, he's been very public about his comments
and support for you. Denny has been the same way. Denny,
I think took a lot of us in the media
by surprise because you and Bubba you had run Bowman Gray,
but really hadn't run point races yet. We weren't into
the season, and Denny was already saying that guy's gonna
be a game changer. I'm telling y'all, he's going to
be a game changer. We found him, you know, he
was just gushing basically about you. Do you hear those
(07:10):
comments and think, wait, wait, wait, I haven't even established
myself yet.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Well, I certainly appreciate that the leadership and ownership has,
you know, trust and confidence in me. Obviously, they you know,
had to feel that way to hire me to begin with,
and it's just it's nice to know that there's that
support surrounding you. At the workplace, and I feel like
that across everybody here, not just not just you know,
(07:34):
the ownership group and the leadership group, but this, you know,
twenty three eleven is comprised of exceptional people, exceptional employees,
and it's it's just nice to be a part of it.
And you feel like you're surrounded by so many levels
of support, you know, every day of the week that
you come to work.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Looking at going from the Truck series to the Cup Series.
A lot gets made when drivers do it, if they
skip Exfinity and go from truck to Cup and it's
a whole new world. And of course the environments are different,
the competition differ, the garage is naturally different. I think
the last crew chief, and I could be wrong, but
the most recent crew chief I can think of that
made a successful transition would have been Rudy Fugal. And
now you're doing it. What has stood out, Charles for
(08:12):
you going from the truck garage and that way of
life to what you're already seeing and having to adjust
to being in the Cup Series and being in the
Cup garage and following Cup procedures and running a Cup team.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Now, yep, Rudy Fugel and Chris Lawson as well. Yeap, Yeah,
I enjoyed competing against both of those guys in the
truck series. So what's interesting kind of different now, I'd say,
is that the natural ladder system doesn't have to be followed,
and some of that is because the vehicles are different.
You know, there's similarities on a truck to a Nccinity car,
(08:44):
and obviously there were similarities progressing to the old style
cup car. You know that there are pieces and parts
that are the same type of pieces and parts. This
cup car is entirely different, you know, I mean about
the only thing that is the same as the steer
will So it wasn't necessary to go from truck to
(09:04):
Infinity to feel like you would have a chance of
success at the cup level.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
You mentioned earlier you were one of three new guys
on this team, but you're the leader of the team.
You're going to be very high profile, one of the
faces of the team. So are you able to enjoy
this early season's success or did you feel the pressure
to come in and that you guys needed to get
off to a fast start.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Well, there's certainly pressure. I kind of grew up in
the pressure as a privileged mentality, so I enjoy that
and that's how I find enjoyment and satisfaction in it,
you know. And it's the one thing that you learn
adapting to Cup Series from truck series is the very
regimented repetitiveness on a weekly basis. You know, you can't
(09:49):
deviate from your Monday to Wednesday or Monday to Thursday
routine because there's just not time in the week to
do something really different. But it provides so much structure
to be able to do that and has really helped
the moving from truck to Cup racing, I think.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
On that note, it's a good segue. I feel like
because one of the things I have learned about you is,
and I didn't know until recently, was you have a
military background, coming from the Army, So I would assume
you like and are used to structure. Yep, and you
like that aspect.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Yeah, and this organization is superstructured, which I thought was
really fascinating when I was getting to know twenty three
eleven and one of the things that kind of lured
me to wanting to come here even more just they
do business a little bit different than a historical legacy
style race team which I think is really efficient and
(10:42):
really effective. But you had to your point. This is
kind of my second career after college. I graduated college
in two thousand and three from University of Virginia as
a mechanical engineer. I grew up next to a racing
family that race light model stock cars in Virginia. Interestingly enough,
kind of grew up with those guys against Denny in
the early two thousands in Virginia. So I went to
(11:03):
college and I stayed, you know, in contact with my
friends that were racing, and came home and did some
racing with them and all. But I went into the
military after I graduated college. At commissioned as a second
lieutenant in the Army and the corp of Engineers, and
I did nine years in the Army. In twenty twelve
was when I decided I was, you know, probably ready
(11:24):
to get out of the military. You reach a point
where you have to decide whether you're going to stay
or go. You don't you don't go to year fifteen
and decide how I'm going to get out of the
military when you could retire at year twenties. So it
was kind of a natural time and I felt like
I had a similar to what we talked about on
the nineteen truck. I had accomplished what I wanted to
accomplish at that kind of level and time of my life.
(11:45):
So in twenty twelve I left the military and went
to pursue professionally racing, you know, as my job, getting
paid to do it, and started at the Canaan Series level,
Canaan pur series level, like when I referenced Bowman Gray
and those guys there, and was able to go from
there to trucks. Dabbled a little bit on a couple
(12:05):
opportunities in exfinity along the way that were kind of
part of the same teams I was working for, but
predominantly had been truck racing and truck crew chief in
the past five years up to now.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
All right, so to fill in some blanks there, So
I want to talk about a bunch of the things
you just said. So originally from Virginia, not from a
racing fan.
Speaker 2 (12:19):
I tea that up. Well for you, you could go
where wherever you want to go.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
You're a professional, this is great.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
I gave you all sorts of opportunities.
Speaker 1 (12:26):
So originally from Virginia, not in racing, but knew of racing.
You said, grew up next to a racing family. Why
the military. What's the connection there of choosing that's the
route that you went.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
I don't know for sure, to be honest with you.
I kind of just grew up probably aiming in that direction.
It was an opportunity to travel and to have some
neat jobs after college, and while I was in college
of are to see, just was exposed to it growing up.
My dad served in Vietnam, so you know, it wasn't
too far from from my past there. So yeah, it
(13:01):
just it seemed like a kind of a natural inspiration
for me to go and really enjoyed the time that
I was in the military.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
What can you share I don't know the rules right,
What can you share about your experiences or what your
role was in the army?
Speaker 2 (13:16):
So I was an engineer officer, I was a dive
Detachment Executive officer and a dive Detachment company commander, which
is basically a commercial diver in the military, an Army diver.
That was areas that we worked in were underwater search
and salvage reconnaissance, port surveys, things like that, as well
(13:38):
as as being in the Army Corps. Engineers. And then
at the end of my time, I was a staff
officer on a sustainment brigade, so I worked in the
logistics field and that was in Fort Eustis, Virginia. So
it wasn't necessarily because I was from Virginia. I just
the stationing that I was able to get put me
back there in a Newport News area. I got to
(13:59):
go to Haiti after the earthquake for emergency response, which
was a really rewarding experience there, and then also deployed
Afghanistan for a year, also a really rewarding experience. But
before then, I got to live in Hawaii, Missouri, Florida, Virginia.
I got to travel to Australia, Vietnam, Quadulin, a toll,
(14:23):
some really neat places.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
Yeah, there's a LinkedIn page that claims it's yours, so
I want to verify is it yours? It has your
name on it and it has a little bit of
this information on.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
This that's mine. Yeah. So I'll be the first admit
that I'm not super good at maintaining social media stuff.
It comes in like spurts, and it's just hard to
do enough effort. As busy as things are, you know,
I'd like to try to figure out how to manage
that a little bit better.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
Well, the reason I ask, right, is because you're doing
research and you're trying to learn about somebody in either
social media or LinkedIn or like the two biggest things
people look at. So I came across a page where
I was like, Okay, it has his name, has his pick. Sure,
some of the stuff's matching up. Okay, it looks legit,
but you gotta make sure you got to do the
due diligence. And one of the things on there is
we're talking about your military experience was Bronze Star and
(15:09):
you mentioned Afghanistan. What can you share about earning that
or how does one be awarded that?
Speaker 2 (15:15):
So there's various different awards and decorations that you can get.
Some are schools, summer service, some are meritorious service. So
I was able to ironed that during my time in
Afghanistan with the support that we did. The unit that
I was with was responsible for the logistics in the
southern half of Afghanistan. So I was stationed in Kandahar
Airfield and worked on engineering projects that was in support
(15:39):
of that logistics unit.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
So come home as you said, once your career is
over and then you decide racing is next. Because you,
as we touched on, you knew about racing, but why
was it enough of a draw that you're like, Okay,
now I want to try that.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
Well, I'd always stayed involved and I was always interested
in it. I took classes for it in college. Like
I said, I grew up next to a family that raced.
When I was about eleven years old, is when we
moved next door to this family that raced. So I
grew up going to the garage next door and working
on cars from a young age. And you reached a
point in my military career, and perhaps it could have
(16:15):
been if I was in a different career path as
well that you say, I feel like I'm going to
regret not pursuing this other venture more than I would,
you know, staying in my current venture. So that's really
where it came from.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
Is there a crossover between I guess is engineering engineering,
no matter where it is or what it's being used towards.
So where is there crossover of things you knew and
your abilities and your education that you easily brought into racing.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
Yeah, there is a crossover. I mean yes, to some degree.
Engineering is engineering as a military engineer. Civil engineering, mechanical
engineering are probably the more common ones that directly apply
to things that you can do as an engineer in
the military airspace as well, and the mechanic the aerospace side,
(17:02):
they directly relate to motorsports. Also, technology, you know, is
widespread no matter what the industry is, so there's there's
crossover there. And then on the leadership side, it certainly
helps you have different professionally taught leadership techniques and things
that you do while you're in the military that helps
(17:23):
in the in the civilian and private sector.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
I think the sport has also evolved over the years,
and I'm sure you know it and you've seen it,
but it I guess it would I don't want to
say lucky, but it it trended in the direction to
where engineers suddenly were becoming the sought after positions and
then a lot of them have transitioned to crew chiefs.
So for you when you came in, it was probably like, oh,
this is going the exact direction I needed to go.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Yeah, and some of it is just the natural evolution
as more as you know twenty years ago, as the
sport relied more and more on engineering. There became more engineers,
and those engineers were in their twenties out of college,
and you know, as the veteran crew chiefs of that
time obviously got older, they got towards the end of
(18:09):
their career, they retired. You know, fast forward twenty years
and the natural tendency as some of those engineers to
promote into crew chief positions. So you know, there's obviously
a large quantity of crew chief now that have an
engineering background. There are still extremely successful ones that don't,
you know, but I would say that a majority of
(18:30):
those have an engineering mindset and have a extremely strong
engineering staff around them, just like we do here at
twenty three eleven.
Speaker 1 (18:36):
Yeah, we mentioned the structure and how you're used to
that and you like that. Are there other trades, Charles,
Whether I guess maybe even from a leadership perspective now
that you're a leader of a race team, that carry
over that you learn in the military, that applied to
as I said, a leader of a team.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Yeah, absolutely, and I think you see that in any
industry and professional sports as well. You know, one thing
that's fascinating to me here is our pit crew coach
John Carvin is, you know, is a professional coach, and
just watching how he interacts with the pit crew members,
you know, professional athletes, is really fascinating from not coming
(19:12):
from that side and not having any experience on that side.
For me, I'm more of a technical leader, you know,
and I believe in the people that you are surrounded with,
empowering them to be able to manage themselves and those
that work for them. And you know, we are fortunate
to have a lot of depth and a lot of
really strong people here that can go and work in
(19:33):
their areas and run their departments at the highest level.
And I think that's what's really nice about here versus
some other places, is just the quality of the people
at every level just exceptional.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
The K and N series, What are some memories or
experiences you had there, the teams you worked with, what's
on the resume from coming in and starting there.
Speaker 2 (19:55):
Well, I was able to work for the Godovic family
in Virgini, which was nice because I was living local
there as I got out of the military, so you know,
I wasn't in a position at that time to move
to North Carolina immediately. So you're trying to figure out
whether you're going to go work as a mechanical engineer somewhere,
whether you're actually going to be able to work on
(20:18):
a race team, and kind of taking a leap of
faith at that moment. So fortunately I was able to
secure a job with them. They were racing in the
Canean Pro Series at the time and late milestock cars
at Langley Speedway. So spent a few years with them
in really good times, and then relocated in twenty fifteen
(20:38):
down to North Carolina.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
So it didn't take long then. It doesn't sound like
to be able to do that.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
No, a few years at a time, you know, it's
kind of a natural flow, I would say. So, yeah,
I worked there. I went to GMS Racing in twenty sixteen,
would have been my first year truck racing.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
So is GMS what led to the transition to getting
to North Carolina? Is that the next step?
Speaker 2 (20:59):
Well, the job I had before led to the transition,
But my first step in truck racing was at GMS
in twenty sixteen. I was already down here at the
time and a.
Speaker 1 (21:08):
Very successful organization there and it's heyday, it's not around anymore.
So again, same question, So truck series racing. Now you're
in it, you're in one of the national series. What
stands out as you're gaining more experience Again, that organization
knows about winning, contending for championships. What's that experience?
Speaker 2 (21:26):
So started as an engineer there and we were able
to win right out the gate on the team that
I was a part of with Ben Kennedy in twenty
sixteen at Bristol. In twenty seventeen, got to enjoy winning
at Martinsville with Chase Elliott driving the twenty three truck
at the time. And then I got paired up with
Stuart Friesen for a few years, which was really a
(21:47):
lot of fun and rewarding. That was through the twenty
nineteen season. We won a couple of races together as well,
super talented driver and enjoy getting to keep up with
him on a regular basis too. Friend and So then
twenty twenty is when I started crew chiefing, and twenty
twenty was obviously upside down with with COVID and everything
(22:08):
going on in the motorsports industry, and.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
No better time to become cruc Yeah first time yea.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
So won my first race at Charlotte with Chase Elliot,
on the Return to Racing race, and which was also
the Bounty race that you know, Kevin Harvick and and
Kyle and all, so really neat to go there and win.
The celebration was kind of anti climactic, and we'd still
joke about it regularly because there was nobody in the
in the stands, we weren't allowed to go in victory lane,
(22:36):
so Chase drove the truck over and the victory lane
got out who you know, and and we're like behind
the fence line, i mean, behind the chain link fence.
Couldn't even go in there to celebrate, and did our
post race interviews, you know, sitting this far apart with
chairs and you know, microphones and on boomsticks and stuff,
and yeah, yeah, just so different. But it was, I mean,
(22:57):
what it is, what it is like you I'll take
winning that way versus not winning for sure anytime. But
then went on later that year to win at Bristol,
which was super cool with Sam Mayor. I mean, we
just smoked them, you know, and it was really neat.
And the best part about that was we were able
to celebrate together in Victory Lane up on top of
the building, you know, and take normal photos and you know,
(23:19):
spray normal beer and all that stuff.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
So your moment, Yeah, I was gonna ask when was
the one you really got to celebrate joy for the
first time.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Yeah, that was That was it. That one was really neat.
And my time at GMS, which which went to twenty
twelve was super rewarding and really what led to being
able to go do the nineteen truck in twenty two,
three and four, and you know, getting there had the
opportunity to help transform that place into a race winning organization,
a championship caliber and playoff contending organization. And we got
(23:51):
Christian there in twenty thirteen and got our first win
in Atlanta, which was just super neat to see Bill
mcinally with all that he's put into the sport for
years and years and years out West and some years
in truck race and you know, finally be able to
accomplish that as a truck series owner was really neat.
And obviously we went on to have a lot more
success for those two years and eight wins, which was
(24:12):
which was neat, and there's you know, every win has
its has its story. You know, Nashville last year really
stands out because we let every lap. That was something
new that you know, not too many people get to do.
We're winning both races of Martinsville last year was neat
and you know, finally getting a win another win at
Bristol last year and being able to beat Kyle for it.
(24:34):
Anytime that you can, you know, beat the best in
the business makes it super rewarding at the end. And
you know, and no different for the drivers, but the
crew chiefs as well. You know, Brian Patty is one
of the best in the business. So not only did
we beat Kyle on the track, I got to beat him,
you know, toe to toe, which is neat too, because
you know, we enjoy competing against each other.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
Let's touch on Martinsville for a minute, because, as I said,
we're recording this week after Martinsville. So two things. That
nineteen truck that you left behind for this new role
goes out wins Martinsville after you. As you said, you
guys swept it last year when you were leading it
and Daniel Hemric of course a very popular winner. What
were just your thoughts and emotions watching that, because that's
(25:14):
the team that you know very well. Those are guys
you know very well. And also to see Daniel get
that opportunity.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
Yeah, super cool. And you know, as it was happening,
and as it was ending, me and Christian were texting
each other. Me and Bubba were texting each other. You know,
Daniel Hemric is a great guy and a great driver,
and Bubba knows him well, so Bubba's texting him, so
like we're you know, everybody is just super happy for
each other, I think, And you know, my goal at
the end of last year was to leave that place
(25:40):
and as best a condition as I could. I couldn't
change the fact that I was leaving. I couldn't change
the fact that Christian was leaving. But you leave it
as good as you can so that they can continue
to be successful. And you know, now Daniel and Josh
Graham the crew chief there, they're you know, they're now
race winners and they can take that company wherever that
they think they need take it moving forward, because it's
(26:01):
it's theirs.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
The second part of that is then on Sunday, you
and Bubba go out and finish top five, another strong run.
Keep building on that consistency as we talked about earlier,
and I know during the weekend Bubba faced quite a
few questions of well, what can Charles bring from the
truck when when he dominated last year? Is that going
to carry over? So not just for Martinsville, but I
guess in general, are there things that you have been
(26:24):
able to carry over? Does anything translate from truck to
cup racing.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
Yeah, I'd say just some of the cadence of some
of the races, the experience of the race tracks, or
just being comfortable and familiar with where you're at helps.
Some of the races are wildly different in links or
stage links. Martins is one of them, you know, where
the strategy of the race doesn't correlate really at all.
But and this question was asked to me at the racetrack,
(26:49):
So my answer then was Homestead was a little bit
more similar because on mile and a half, the final
stage of a truck race is more like a normal
stage cup racing. You have a green flag stop, you
go through a set of tires. You know, you perhaps
don't pit twice, So there was there's more correlation there,
and obviously there's a fair amount of those truck racing,
(27:12):
so there's a little bit that carries over. But you know,
just competing in general, how the race weekend goes with
practice and qualifying. You know, those activities are similar, but
the level of competition is obviously hugely different. The margins
are so incredibly small. We were talking today getting ready
(27:34):
for Darlington and what our goals were for qualifying, and
we in the past two weeks we've had super fast
speed in practice and it felt like we could have
qualified a little bit better than we did each time.
You know, but we still qualified well and it's still
set us up well for the race, but it makes
pit selection a little bit more difficult. So, you know,
(27:55):
we want to qualify six or better this week if
we unload with the pace that we expect, unload with practice,
just to have a little bit better pit selections. So
some of those nuances are all a little bit more
fine details stuff with Cup racing.
Speaker 1 (28:09):
Bubba has had some really interesting comments as he's talked
about this change for him, going from Booty, who he
knew well was comfortable with, to describing the process of
how you were hired and how he kind of took
a step back approach of I'll trust the organization, let
them make the decision, and really how not that you
(28:31):
make him uncomfortable, but he was comfortable with people he
had previously, So what's the balance for you, Charles coming
in as a new guy, of I need to lead
this team, and I have my visions, but I don't
want to come in and just say everything they've been doing,
we're not going to do that anymore.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
Right, And that's kind of what I was touching on earlier.
There's so many processes and things here that don't need
to be changed. So for me, it was more of
just on the execution side, how can we get the
most out of the team. How can we get the
most out above a for a longer period of time,
through the course of the whole weekend, because every weekend
(29:13):
there'd be flashes of greatness, right, and but how do
we keep some of those from declining through the course
of a weekend and have have more great days and
less bad days. Was kind of one of our one
of our mantras to start the year off with. And
to me, I just I think it's it's a repetitive process.
Winning as a process, and you know, there's things that
(29:34):
you have to do and things that you have to
go through, and you have to prioritize and compartmentalize things.
And we talk about how we're going to go through
Darlington this weekend, which is really no different than Martinsville
or Homestead, even the tracts are widely different. Is we
plan to run out practice for as many laps as
possible because it's not really beneficial to make an adjustment
(29:54):
in middle practice. But when that ends, the only thing
that matters next is quite the race trim for Sunday
is not really a concern until we leave the racetrack
and then we work in the evening on what we're
going to do and the changes we're going to make.
So making sure that you know, not just him, but
the whole group has all those priorities in the order
that matters most, I think is one of the one
(30:17):
of the main focuses. And then how do we execute
the race for the whole time. And that's one of
the biggest differences that I've gotten used to in this
short part of this year. So far as you know,
the races are three and a half hours long and
seven hour and a half long or whatever. In you know,
it's just the endurance that it takes to get through that.
(30:37):
We were joking on the way home from Martinsville this
past week because we went through a long portion of
the race and the final stage where not much was happening.
Yet we were non stop communicating on intercom between me
and our two engineers and our strategy group here and
the other engineers that are here at air Speed in
our Exfinity Speed Center that support us in the races.
(31:00):
I mean, non stop communication about what happens if the
caution comes out right now, what happens if it comes
out in fifteen laps? And then you talk long enough, hey,
that we've already passed that and move on to the
next fifteen laps, because you know, we're already passed that
lap count. And you finish the race and you're you're
mentally exhausted from trying to be prepared for any scenary
that might happen. Makes the race go by quicker, I guess,
(31:20):
And so you know, all the same time, we've got
to keep the driver and the spot and the pit
crew ready engaged, performing at the highest level possible the
whole time. And and it's challenging, you know. And it's
challenging at Homestead when you're when you have no margin
of error next to the wall. The same thing at
Darlington too, and when you have long green flag runs,
(31:43):
it can be even harder because there's there's no break.
You know, that's long green flag run, pit stop under green,
which you know takes an extraordinary amount of focus, and
then right back added on another long green flag run.
And at least when you have a few cautions you
can kind of take your catch your breath for a minute.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Two more things for you to to wrap up here.
When you came in and you and Bubba, I'm sure
sat down and talked and got to know each other.
Was there any conversation of you looking at Bubba and saying, Okay,
this is what I need from you and then vice versa.
Did he say okay, this is what I need from
you as a crew chief?
Speaker 2 (32:14):
Yeah, that happens, and we met, We wrote down some
notes about what he felt like he needed from from
me and our engineers to be better this year and
asked us to do the same, which we did, and
then we go back and look at those as we
go and make sure that that's focal points. A lot
of attention was given to how do you build a
(32:35):
relationship with your driver or how do you build a
relationship with your crew chief? And I can tell you.
There's not a playbook, there's not a checklist. You know,
there's not a turnkey answer. But the easiest way is
the reason that you know he's here is to drive
the race car, and the reason that I'm here is
to lead the team. So you naturally start communicating about
work things first, and it starts off with you're in
(32:58):
a new job, so what you know, what does that mean?
And then it turns into your we're going to the
racetracks so that topics are focused on that particular race weekend,
and then communication turns into fifty to fifty, you know,
you start to meet each other's families, and then it
turns into you can have conversations have nothing to do
with work and nothing to do with racing, and that's
just a natural evolution of building a relationship with somebody.
(33:20):
But it's not a there's no you know, playbook or
set checklist that you have to follow. It's just whatever
feels comfortable for the people. But to get to that
point is what helps bring out the most of each other.
And that's his job and my job to bring out
the best in each other. On Sunday, all right.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Last thing for you, and I'm pretty sure, I know
the answer to this, but I'm going to ask it
anyway because sometimes it sounds better coming from the people involved.
At the end of the year, Charles, what's the biggest
thing that this team will have needed to cross off
the list?
Speaker 2 (33:47):
Return to race winning form and return to the playoffs.
That's it.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
I knew the answer, but got it here, so right,
I mean, that's the goal here. It doesn't it doesn't
even really need to be said. And I know I
know bubb has talked about that too, but that is it.
That is number one.
Speaker 2 (33:59):
Yep, that's number one. And you know, the reason that
it's important to have both. I mean, there's certainly a
scenario where we could make the playoffs some points and
still win in the end the playoffs. So obviously if
we win, you know, now, then you make the playoffs.
So it's important to just not lose sight of both.
But that's what this team is capable of. That's what
this team has, you know, been built on, you know,
(34:20):
Denny's vision, in Michael's vision, is a championship caliber team
in year five or in year five, you know they
were the forty five was a championship caliber team last year.
You know, and we want to hang banners here more
on the twenty three team.
Speaker 1 (34:35):
Right, all right, Charles, I'll let you get back to
work to keep making that twenty three car as fast
as it can be. But in all seriousness, congratulations on
it's been a fantastic I think start to the season
from the outside looking in, and I think it's been
really cool to see how seamless you guys have made
it look. I know a lot of work goes into it,
but congratulations for being in this role and again to
(34:56):
see how quickly things have come together and appreciate the
time today to get to know you a little bit better.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
Yeah, thank you so much. Early. Enjoyed this and I
look forward to getting to do it again after our
first win this year.
Speaker 1 (35:05):
All right, it's on the record, remark that good schedule it.
Speaker 2 (35:14):
All right?
Speaker 1 (35:14):
Well, that was fun. Thank you again Charles for coming
on the podcast, sitting down with me at Airspeed for
the conversation. Also my thanks to Sidney Freeson from twenty
three to eleven for coordinating getting this on the calendar
and bringing me over to Airspeed so we can sit
down do this in person. Appreciate both of you very much.
If you enjoyed the conversation, please leave a rating and review.
You can also go to social media and let me
know what you think. My ex handle is at Kelly Crandall.
(35:37):
Facebook is also at Kelly Crandall, as well as Instagram.
Very easy to find me. Appreciate all the feedback. Thank
you for clicking and listening every week. I hope you're
enjoying the podcast. I am on many different social media platforms,
so it's very easy to find me and let me know.
You can also leave a rating and review. Of course,
wherever you're listening to this podcast, not only lets me
know what you think, but it helps push the podcast
(35:57):
out to others in the racing space and hopefully they
can find it and enjoy it and we can just
keep rolling right along. Next week we'll be back with
a new episode. We're gonna go into the nh A world,
but a different fashion. We're gonna talk to Elan Warner,
who has created one of the coolest things in drag
racing that I am loving and I participate in every
race weekend. He is the creator of drag Race Bracket Bonanza.
(36:19):
It is a very cool bracket style game for nh
A Drag racing, you can win prizes, you can follow
along every week and just be as competitive as I
am and have fun with it. And we're gonna dig
into the nerdy side of building a game bringing that
to drag racing and everything that it entails next week
right here on the Racing Writers Podcast st
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