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April 16, 2025 • 58 mins
Thanks for joining us for the live discussion of Sunday's episode of The Last of Us! If you're looking for a full scene-by-scene style recap, you won't find that here. Be sure to watch the episode before listening. We're reviewing a bit, recapping a bit, and reacting a lot. We're basically discussing the episode highs and lows in our unique style! Spoilers ahead, you've been warned! Enjoy.

The Last of Us S1 E5 | Endure and Survive

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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Hey, hey, everyone, Welcome to the Recap of the Last
of Us. We are here every week to discuss the
latest episode. You can catch our recaps anytime, available on
most major podcast platforms, get new and past episodes for free,
and the app of your choice, including YouTube. For those
of you joining us live tonight, thanks for taking time
out of your evening to be here. I'm your host, Tamara,

(00:52):
and I love a good TV show and a good book,
so if you'd like to reach out to me, you
can find me on Instagram and Twitter, at the recap pods,
and if you're into books, you can also find me
at shelf Addiction. Joining me is show co host Lisa. Welcome, Lisa, Hey, Tamara,
Hey everyone.

Speaker 2 (01:07):
My name is Lisa Orban. I am an author. I
am also the founder of Indies United publishing house, and
I love all things pop culture, So if you would
like to connect with me online, you can pretty much
find me anywhere at Lisa Orbin Author or at Indies
United pub All right.

Speaker 1 (01:22):
So before we get started, we just like to remind
you that we want your participation in this conversation. So
if you are listening live, hit us up in the
chat with your comments and If you are catching this
on a replay, you can still leave comments, or you
can call in using the old fashioned voicemail link in
the show notes. So we do want to hear from
you and possibly include your comments in future episodes. So

(01:42):
of course, don't forget to like and subscribe wherever you're listening.
If you're new to the podcast, we are laid back
in our review style, right, Lisa.

Speaker 2 (01:50):
Absolutely, Tamora. This is a conversation, not a dissertation.

Speaker 1 (01:53):
Right. We don't do scene by scene breakdowns. We jump
around a lot. Huge spoiler alert for the show. We
didn't play the video game, so no worries. We won't
spoil that for you. But if you're cool with that
is the place for you, and we should just jump
right on in and endure and survive.

Speaker 2 (02:14):
Just out of curiosity. Did you watch it on Friday
or did you wait? Did you watch it on Sunday?

Speaker 1 (02:19):
I watched it on Friday and today, ah.

Speaker 2 (02:23):
I watched it on Saturday. I split the.

Speaker 1 (02:25):
Difference, all right, nice because when I watched it on Friday,
I really liked it. But I'm like, oh, I probably
should watch it one more time because I feel like
it's been a couple of days.

Speaker 2 (02:37):
Yeah, I mean I didn't watch the super Bowl or anything.
I just I had other plans. I'm like, well, I'll
just watch it on Saturday.

Speaker 1 (02:44):
Yeah, I'm not a super Bowl girl either. I did though,
my husband hollered at me when the halftime started and
I turned on Rihanna and Jams for thirteen minutes and
that turned it back off.

Speaker 2 (02:56):
I didn't even do that. Oh yeah, she killed it.

Speaker 1 (03:00):
She was really good with her pregnant Solf. She couldn't
do all the torquing and stuff, you know, she had
her belly out.

Speaker 2 (03:06):
But you know, I mean, I've heard anyway, anyway, we're
not doing super Bowl. We're talking. We're talking the last of.

Speaker 1 (03:14):
Us, Yes we are. That has nothing to do with
the super Bowl, which I don't By the way, I
don't even know who won, so I don't either.

Speaker 2 (03:22):
I mean, I just asked because I know they moved
it from Sunday to Friday because they didn't want to
lose people, you know, for super Bowl. I see, yeah,
and uh so, yeah, I'm like, well that didn't make
any difference to me. But I did like this episode.
I thought it was It was sad, but it was good.

Speaker 1 (03:43):
It was sad, and it's like I was okay all
the way up into the end, and I'm like I
knew what Henry was gonna do. I'm like, oh my god,
don't I know.

Speaker 2 (03:53):
I'm like, fuck, well, And it was, you know, we
had this kind of build up. We get to see
this that we haven't really seen from Ellie, which is
being a child, an actual child, you know, not a
smart ass, not you know, not the you know, the
the tough girl. But you know, she was, you know,

(04:14):
playing and you know, they were talking comic books and
you know, all the you know, all the kids stuff
and bonding and it was you and you just knew,
you just knew he's gonna die.

Speaker 1 (04:27):
Yeah. She and Sam came became fast friends. I mean
they essentially met and just were like, hey, let's talk.
And she's like learning sign from him. They're using his
little is that like a portable version of like a
dischedule or something?

Speaker 2 (04:44):
Is something Oh you didn't have You never had one
of those as a kid.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
I did, but I don't even remember what it was called.
And I feel like I was so young.

Speaker 2 (04:52):
Yeah, I mean I recognized it, you know, because my
grandkids have some and you know, I don't know what
they're even called. You know, you write something down and
you peel it off, or you peel it you go
it was, you know, which is way better in a
in a society where everything is all commodities are pretty
much precious. This is a really good idea since most

(05:15):
people don't know sign language.

Speaker 1 (05:17):
Yeah, absolutely, And actually, you know, I thought about googling
it to figure out the name of it, but I
just plain forgotten with them, ran out of time. But
I'm like, I remember having like they were. You used
to be able to get them really cheap, and you
would get them like in like.

Speaker 2 (05:32):
Party like yeah, party packs for dollar stores and stuff. Right, Yeah,
you want to.

Speaker 1 (05:37):
A party, you'd get one in a bag with a
bunch of other crap in it.

Speaker 2 (05:41):
Yeah. I got mine. I got them for my grandkids
for I don't know, I think they were like ninety
nine cents, maybe two bucks or something at the dollar store.

Speaker 1 (05:49):
Yeah, but that was really helpful. Glad he had one
because a lot of people don't know sign but as
a sign note to that, Like, I listened to the podcast,
the HBO podcast, and it was so interesting to me
to hear how the showrunners went about finding him because
they put out this casting call and they got nothing. Nothing,

(06:11):
Like they asked for a certain age, they wanted a
certain height because they wanted him to be shorter than Elie.
You know, they wanted La to be older. Right. First,
they wanted an African American boy. They wanted him between
eight and eleven, shorter, and no ASL. So apparently there's
like a black version of ASL. I didn't know that,

(06:31):
but I'm like, wow, I didn't know. So he had
to also be able to use ASL. So and then
they ended up putting out a call on like Twitter
and Facebook, and he was like one of the small
group of people that you know, came and he was
just amazing.

Speaker 2 (06:48):
Oh he was. He was so good.

Speaker 1 (06:51):
Yeah, I'm like, wow, I hope that kid like gets
more jobs.

Speaker 2 (06:55):
Mm hm, you know, And I mean he was. I
thought he was very expressive, you know, and I mean
not just you know, the way that he was able
to communicate without even without sign language, without the writing,
you know, he was you know, he was very I
thought he was very expressive.

Speaker 1 (07:16):
He is and he can act, that's the thing, Like,
oh yeah, he can act. So I'm like, oh, that's
so great. So they really luked out with him. And
then the guy that they hired for his brother, you know,
who's like kind of like a father figure, but her brother.
They were saying how he and the other members of

(07:37):
the cast they were learning asl like in a couple
of days, and this guy specifically he learned it in
a weekend.

Speaker 2 (07:45):
Oh wow, he was dedicated.

Speaker 1 (07:47):
Yes, and he was signing legit. They even had like
a director of ansel so that anyone who watched this
who signs would not say, oh, this is crap, they're
not really signing.

Speaker 2 (08:00):
Well that's good, that's really good.

Speaker 1 (08:03):
I loved it. I just thought both of them were
really great together. They played well off each other. I
felt so bad for them.

Speaker 2 (08:11):
Oh yeah, I mean this is I mean, so you know,
he gets you know, the kid gets sick, and you know,
and uh, Feder being what it is, Oh no, we're
not going to help you out unless you know you
nark on people and you know, I mean, this is

(08:33):
your little brother. What do you do? I mean, of course,
I mean you don't want to do this. But Feder
basically was you know, they were using people that were desperate,
and I really think pretty much everyone that righted, They
didn't you know, when what's her name was going through
that list? Oh for an app you know, for fresh
fruits and vegetables or medicine. Right, well, guess what, you know,

(08:55):
medicine's kind of important. I understand, you know, collaborating with
the enemy and all. But you know, this has been
twenty years, twenty years under Fedra and.

Speaker 1 (09:06):
Yeah, and I mean you have to weigh, right, you
have to weigh what's important to you, right, right, And
that's what he did. And Joel understood that, you know,
He's like, you did that for him, So I understand, right, right.

Speaker 2 (09:20):
You know, but what was a woman's name? Do you
remember the woman's name?

Speaker 1 (09:23):
Kathleen?

Speaker 2 (09:24):
Yeah, Kathleen. Yeah, you know she was like, oh well
these that's not an excuse. She should have just suffered
and died.

Speaker 1 (09:31):
I know, it was like people died like dang, like
that's you mean, very she's heartless, like she didn't care.

Speaker 2 (09:40):
Well that that seed is the in her childhood bedroom. Okay,
that's really where you you we really met her, so
to speak, and you know, and she blatantly said, you know,
my brother was a much better person than I am.
You know, you know, I you know, should I feel bad?

Speaker 1 (10:02):
You know, no, she doesn't feel bad, and she just
knows us the type of person she is. And I
think she did give herself a moment of pause, like, well,
I don't know, you know, he was better and he's
not here. But you know, her little sidekick was like,
you know what, he was kind, you know, everyone liked him,
but guess what, he didn't do anything right.

Speaker 2 (10:25):
I mean, he was trying to make things better, but
he never would have He never would have done the
things his sister did.

Speaker 1 (10:34):
You know, even if passive, he wasn't like her. He
was the opposite of her.

Speaker 2 (10:40):
You know, even if even if he had somehow managed
to wrangle a revolution, you know, he would not have
gone around, you know, bludgeting people and doing things like that,
because you know, she said that, you know, while he
was you know, right before they killed him, said you

(11:00):
need to forgive Henry. You know, he did it, you know,
for his little brother, and you know you need to
forgive him. And she's like, it's the last thing he
asked me to do, and I ain't doing it, you know.

Speaker 3 (11:12):
Yeah, well okay, yeah, so that's that's how we kind
of you know that that's where we really get to
know her when you know she's like, you know, he
you know, he had these.

Speaker 2 (11:23):
Dreams, but that's all they were. And you know he
was a better person than I am. But I'm getting
shit done.

Speaker 1 (11:29):
So you got to ask, you know, in this situation,
what's better? Right? It's great to be a great speaker,
a wrangler you know of people, a calming voice, you know,
a voice of reason, But do you want to stay
in that situation? They called that Killer city? Yeah, you

(11:51):
know they were going around just killing people and raping
and pillaging, you know what I mean, Like why you
have to figure out what's the line?

Speaker 2 (12:00):
Right? You know? But then there's also that other line
is you know, if okay, great, you overthrow the the
the terrible regime, but if you become the terrible regime,
is there any difference?

Speaker 1 (12:12):
Well, no, because that's what she's doing, I mean honestly,
and look at how the violent way they all died.

Speaker 2 (12:19):
Yeah, and and really the the reason they all died
is one she ignored the main the main problem they had,
which you know, were the the monsters you know, under
the city. And she knew that they were there because
you know that the the basement you know with that
circle right, you know, rising and falling. So it's not

(12:39):
like she didn't know was a problem. They I mean,
the two of them knew it was a problem and
chose instead on you know, instead decided to focus Oh no, safety,
you know, safety third, revenge first.

Speaker 1 (12:53):
Let me get vengeance safety last.

Speaker 2 (12:56):
Yeah, and you know, because vengeance was was a higher
priority for and you know, at that point, again, I
understand the need for the revolution. I get the the
that need because this was a horrible place. Yeah, but
if all you were going to do is replace the
last terrible regime with a new terrible regime, there was

(13:20):
no point in all those extra people dying.

Speaker 1 (13:23):
Yeah, you know, I mean honestly, it was like karma.
Like when they left, when Joel and Ellie left, there
was nobody, Yeah, nobody. You know that they ate everyone
and bit everyone.

Speaker 2 (13:37):
Right, you know, I mean, of course, I mean, I'm
sure there's still some people back, you know, in the city,
you know, in the federal compound, but they're you know,
almost I mean all of their fighters.

Speaker 1 (13:49):
Yeah, everyone who was out there in the street coming
for them.

Speaker 2 (13:52):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (13:53):
Why did they need that huge mob of people to
collect four people?

Speaker 2 (13:58):
Because there's nothing like a good Lynch mom.

Speaker 1 (14:03):
I'm like, y'all stupid. You want to see all these
people for four people?

Speaker 2 (14:07):
Yeah, because again her her only focus was revenge. And
I think she wanted and I think the big reason
it wasn't. I don't think she thought she needed all
those people, but she wanted the audience.

Speaker 1 (14:25):
She wanted them scared, you know, like when she was
like talking out to Henan, trying to get him to
come out, you know, I think she was surprised he
actually just stepped out like he did. But yeah, you know,
she she wanted the audience. She wanted him fearful. Look
at all the people I have. We're gonna kill you.
I'm gonna lecture you, then off with your head.

Speaker 2 (14:48):
But it was I think she was. She was doing
that just as much for Henry as for the people
behind behind her. She was making it very clear that
you know, people die, and I'm going to kill your
little brother too, you know, even though technically none of
this was his fault. He was a child, he is
a child. Yeah, but she's going to kill him too,

(15:10):
because you know, her brother died and this is straight
up vengeance. Yeah, and she doesn't care about the reasons
you know, you know, as far as she is concerned,
there were no good reasons except for the she's doing
equally terrible things that other people could just as justifiably
decide to go on on a vengeance venger against her

(15:34):
and all of her.

Speaker 1 (15:35):
Followers and accept it. She owned it. Yeah, she wasn't
in denial about that, and yeah, I can appreciate, you know,
I understand you're crazy. At least you own you're crazy.

Speaker 2 (15:46):
Right, But like I said, I think the reason she
brought so many it wasn't that she needed them because
I you know, again, four people. She could have come
with a with a small group of you know, five,
ten people to round them up, but she wanted she
made a big production of this, and she made sure
that the rest of them knew, I don't care, I

(16:07):
will kill you if you cross any lines that I
don't like.

Speaker 1 (16:11):
And I don't They were on rage high too, like
all of Yeah, they were all like hunting them. They
were like on that high of hunting. Yeah, they were
all like get the prize. They wanted to bring them
back on spicks, you know what I mean. It was
like this whole thing, this whole vibe, and everyone was
just like wild with it.

Speaker 2 (16:29):
And we did find out about you know, because when
we first met the town doctor, you know, he was
in the shipping container, so I didn't know if maybe
he knew where Henry was or if it was just
you know, he might know where some of these people
were just because of who he was. But no, no,
we find out that he was actually you know, with
Henry and Sam and you know, actively trying to leave

(16:52):
the area right with them, and they just couldn't figure
out a good way to do it.

Speaker 1 (16:59):
Yeah. Yeah, because they were in that room for ten days,
ten days before they said, okay, we're out of food,
we have to leave. He's not coming back.

Speaker 2 (17:09):
He's probably dead, right, Yeah, because the doctor left to
go try and get food, probably hoping that maybe some
of his friends or contacts or whatever would help, you know,
and I'm sure one of them turned him in. Yeah,
because you know, we saw you know, the we had
that group of you know, informants, your informants inform.

Speaker 1 (17:34):
It's so funny how she has like this teacher lee
way about her, you know, when she's talking to them
and stuff and turns around, it's like she is like,
I'm gonna trick you by like, Okay, kill them. They
don't know anything, just kill them. And they're like.

Speaker 2 (17:47):
Wait, you know, and then she killed him anyway, she did,
she did, yeah, I mean well, and her voice is
very at odds, you know, because she has kind of
this kind of soft I don't know, little not littlety,
just a very soft voice.

Speaker 1 (18:04):
You know, very unassuming voice. And she looks unassuming until
she comes and shoots you in the in the or
wherever she shoots you.

Speaker 2 (18:13):
You know, So her demeanor and her voice and everything
is very at odds with you know, the bloodthirsty vengeance
she has, you know, raging inside of her mm hmm.
And you never I mean she she never gets I mean,
well hinder that. I mean, she's not like outburst angry,
she's not visibly angry, but this is.

Speaker 1 (18:35):
A murmuring she comes. She has like resting bitch face,
you know what I'm saying. She does not behind she's
not smiling, but she's not raising her voice.

Speaker 2 (18:44):
Right, you know, it's you know, but like, yeah, I
mean you could just she is a simmering ball of
hate and vengeance and that's really her only that's the
only thing that she probably feels, and it's the only
thing that's most revating her, because if it's been ten
days since they've overturned feder you know, honestly, they should

(19:07):
be looking at things like, Okay, we need to fortify,
we need to figure out how to do this on
our own. We need supplies, we need No, what are
they doing. They're just going out and killing more people.
That's all they have done for ten days. Yeah, so yeah,
you know, it's not a good start to a revolution.

Speaker 1 (19:26):
Well, I mean the people are wild, so you know,
I think it was Henry that said, well people, what
the age? You know what the federal people did to
everyone else for decades? What happens when they get loose? Right, Yeah,
they're doing the same thing to you. They're dragging people
in the streets, they're hanging people, they're doing all the

(19:47):
awful things that were done to their community. So yeah,
they're on like I said, they're on a high, you know,
coming off of that, and everyone's getting it. If she
points her finger at that person, the.

Speaker 2 (20:00):
Yeah, you know, and it was you know, what is it?
You know, when when it's all when it's an eye
for an eye, the whole world will go blind, I know.

Speaker 1 (20:09):
But I think that's almost expected the way they kind
of took Feder down. It wasn't like they had this
highly you know ce I a program. They just buck
wild and took them out right, and you kind of
have to expect something like that. It will calm down eventually,
but not in the first immediately.

Speaker 2 (20:27):
This was so you know, but it was you know,
so it was really kind of interesting to watch. You know,
the you could as a focused on you know, Joel
and Ellie and Sam and Henry and and really got
you know, really let us see their normalcy, I guess,

(20:49):
you know, as they they they talked, and you know,
the kids played, and the the guys bonded, you know
over you know, watching over for you know, their their charge,
you know, their their charges, their children.

Speaker 1 (21:03):
Yeah, they were really mirrors of each other. Yeah, you know,
like how Henry was the protector of Sam, Joel is
the protector of Ellie, right.

Speaker 2 (21:11):
M hm, you know, and and you know Sam or
Henry's like, you know, I did do a terrible thing.
And you can see Joel's turning over in his head
going He's probably thinking I've done worse.

Speaker 1 (21:23):
He's like, He's done a lot of bad things. And
you can't mean we haven't. He hasn't verbalized exactly what
he's done, but we can imagine, and you know, we
see them the little clip for next week, like he's
clearly feeling a way about all the stuff he did
with his brother and the group that he was with.

Speaker 2 (21:40):
Yeah, you know, so I'm you know, Joel, Joel understood him.
You know, you do what you have to do for family,
You do what you have to do for those you love,
and and Joel has done what he's had to do,
you know, to keep Ellie safe, even you know, they
haven't even been together that long, and you know he's

(22:01):
killed quite a few people to keep her safe. Oh yeah,
so and you know, so he understands. You know, sometimes
you just have to do what you need to do
for those that you are responsible for.

Speaker 1 (22:15):
Yeah, and I think even when shit was at it's
worst at the end of that episode, Henry understood that. Like,
for example, when Ellie came tumbling out of that door
and Sam was like on her, you know, his instinct was,
of course to keep back Joel. But when he saw
like it only took a second when he saw what

(22:37):
was happening, he shot him.

Speaker 2 (22:38):
Yeah, fast, it and it killed him though literally.

Speaker 1 (22:42):
But it's like, even though you know, you're not gonna
let that happen, you know what I mean, Like, I
cannot let him attack her, right. He knows he's gone,
He's been around the whole time. He knows what happens well,
and that is just the biggest guilt of his life,
you know.

Speaker 2 (23:00):
And then there's even the you know, when you know,
Sam was scared and he didn't want you know, he
didn't want anyone to you know. He told Ellie reluctantly
that you know what, that he had gotten bitten, yes,
and then Ellie, you know, desperate to try and save him,
and of course we don't. You know, she doesn't know why.

(23:20):
Nobody knows why she's immune, right, But she's like, my
blood is special and it you know, I mean, it's
not a terrible theory.

Speaker 1 (23:29):
It is. I mean, I'm like, that's a kid logic, right,
I'm like, that's not how how things work. That's not
gonna do the trick, you know, That's what I saw.
That's what I said. When she was putting the blood
on him, I said, but you know that's kid logic, right.

Speaker 2 (23:43):
Her brain has the you know the power of blood.

Speaker 1 (23:47):
Right, So she tried, but I'm like, dude, that's not
gonna work. Sorry, But yeah, she wanted to be what
she thought she was, like right, likes to save everyone,
to help people, and she couldn't do it, you know.

Speaker 2 (24:02):
She wanted to save him. Yeah, and you know so,
and she was fairly confident even of it. M but
you know, I mean she fell asleep. I did think
it was kind of interesting though, that as he turned,
he didn't go for her until she, you know, came

(24:23):
up and touched him.

Speaker 1 (24:25):
Well, you don't forget he's deaf. That door and he
wouldn't have been able to hear her.

Speaker 2 (24:33):
That's true. I'd forgotten about it. I mean, I didn't
forget that he was deaf, but it I was like.

Speaker 1 (24:38):
So that must that doesn't work still, even if you're
in that other.

Speaker 2 (24:41):
Form you're Yeah.

Speaker 1 (24:44):
And I'd thought about them, like she could have walked
straight out that room and shut the door and he
would have still been sitting there.

Speaker 2 (24:51):
Yeah, except he didn't. You know, she didn't know because
he was sitting there so quietly.

Speaker 1 (24:57):
Yeah, because his back was to her when he changed
mm hmm. So he's sitting quietly because there's nothing to hear. Remember,
they only come like when they can hear like the
sonic sounds and stuff. But you know, the minute she
touched him, yeah, within his periphial and touched him, oh,
game over.

Speaker 2 (25:16):
Game over.

Speaker 1 (25:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (25:19):
And you know now that.

Speaker 1 (25:21):
Whole time, I'm like, just walk out, just walk out.

Speaker 2 (25:26):
But you knew she wouldn't. You know, she wouldn't absolutely,
and you know, and then you know, and again when
they come tumbling out of the room, and I mean,
Joel has some fear for her, for for Ellie, but
he also knows that she'll survive a bite, yes, but
you know, at the same time, there's no savings Sam,

(25:48):
that he has to be stopped. Yeah, and you know,
but when you know, Henry pushed him back and then
shot him himself and then just he stood there and
that look of just lost.

Speaker 1 (26:02):
He was so lost and what did I do? You
know what you did? But yeah, he was his whole
purpose was to protect him. All the things he did
to protect him, and he couldn't when it came down.

Speaker 2 (26:15):
To it, Yeah, because I mean, you know what what
had gotten in trouble with the community, and you know,
the everything had all been to protect Sam, everything he
has done, and then the one thing that he was
supposed to do protect Sam.

Speaker 1 (26:33):
He didn't. But you know what I have to say.
You know, when they were under that truck, and of
course Joel is like playing sniper up there and picking
them off, I'm like, they're kicking their legs. I'm like,
somebody's gonna get bit. There's no way.

Speaker 2 (26:48):
Oh yeah. And honestly, like I said, I I really
did assume that it would be Sam, that that would
get bit, just because you know, it's much more devastating.

Speaker 1 (27:00):
Absolutely, and obviously it's not going to be Ellie. Right,
she survives, right. I hold that scene in the truck though,
you know, she climbs into that window and the clicker
thing climbs in. I'm like, oh my god, like that
thing is in there, get out.

Speaker 2 (27:20):
That was I mean, that was like, oh yeah, like
real horror movie. Oh what is the name the ring
stuff going on there? Yeah, you know, she flips and
crackles all over the place. Apparently they got a gymnast

(27:41):
to do that.

Speaker 1 (27:42):
Okay, yeah, that would make sense. I'm like, oh, she
climbing over the seats. You're right, it's just like the
thing out of the Ring climbing out the TV.

Speaker 4 (27:50):
Oh my gosh, you know, and I mean it was
icky to watch, but could to be in that situation
would just be oh, you know, of course she did.

Speaker 2 (28:02):
On the bride side, Elliott never seen the rings, so
she had no reference for that, so you know, she
had that going for you know, us on the other hand,
you know that added layer.

Speaker 1 (28:19):
Yeah, but honestly, if it weren't for Joel up there
picking them off, they wouldn't have made it. They would
have died as far as you know, as far as
they did, they wouldn't have made it.

Speaker 2 (28:30):
Oh yeah, I mean, he he's the only reason they
were able to make it out of there. M And
it's a good thing. He's a good shut I know.

Speaker 1 (28:40):
So what did you think when that other they called
it a bloater big one came out and it's like like,
oh my god, that thing been down there for a while. Yeah, yeah,
for a long time. That thing was growth. But I
thought it was cool, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (29:02):
Now, I I did. I was thinking though, because between
that one room, you know, the floor breathing, and then
what was you know, and Henry telling us that they
had that FEDERI had pushed them underground completely. I'm like, man,
you know, you guys are gonna have some problems. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

(29:22):
because it's not like they're they're not they're not dying
down there, They're just getting stronger, right.

Speaker 1 (29:33):
So find a picture of it right quick? Oh my god,
I should have searched for one on purpose earlier, you.

Speaker 2 (29:39):
Know, could I mean, truthfully speaking, I mean again that
that should have been one of their main I mean,
it should have been Federick's priority. And as soon as
they found that that sinkhole thing, they should have gone
from you know, safety third to hey, maybe we might

(29:59):
want to make this a priority. We'll continue to look
for Henry, but we need to deal with this.

Speaker 1 (30:04):
Yeah. But that's why that's why you die, right.

Speaker 2 (30:07):
Yeah, And that's why they died, because crazy they were
so focused on one person that they let all of this,
you know, go right past them.

Speaker 1 (30:23):
I think that, you know, the one thing I think
that is so unique about their version of I guess
zombies quote unquote, like they're like plants. It's like big ass,
you know, just overtaken by plant, like a young guy
that's just turned into it looks like a walking mushrooms. No, no,

(30:45):
when you call the plant that you can get that
sits in the rocks and they have like different shapes
and stuff. I can't think of it right now. Yes,
they look like cucculents on the on their heads, different colors.
It's all like glutifol. I'm like, wow, I'm like, all
I want to do is just stare at the makeup

(31:07):
and stuff, like what is this? But yeah, I do.

Speaker 2 (31:12):
I do like the fact that I mean they are
i mean, they're colorful, they're they're they are probably the
most unique zombies that that we that have come out
in recent memory, because you know, instead of like the
you know those you know, the zombies like we've gotten

(31:33):
used to on The Walking Dead or Day of the
Dead or you know, pretty much all of it except yeah,
the typical zombies, and uh, you know, these are you know,
these are unique life forms. I mean they're they're actual
life forms. They're not the walking Dead. They are living things.

(31:54):
You know. The humans are the most.

Speaker 1 (31:56):
Call them zombies. They call them everything else. But basically,
like what behavior is really.

Speaker 2 (32:02):
You know, I mean, they're you know, i mean they're
using humans as a host. But again they're they're they're
living beings and and their hosts are alive. M h god,
I hope they don't actually have retained memories of who
they used to be. That would be God, that would
be awful.

Speaker 1 (32:16):
Let's assume not. Let's assume that the thing just took
over everything.

Speaker 2 (32:20):
Because could you imagine that? Oh God, that would.

Speaker 1 (32:24):
Tell me, because there's no way that would be like
torture to people.

Speaker 2 (32:29):
Oh yeah, you know, to have this horrible thing going
through them and not being able to you know, some
corner of your mind watching but unable to do anything
about it. Oh oh, that would just be terrible.

Speaker 1 (32:42):
Yeah, like torture forever as long as you're living or
you know, in that state.

Speaker 2 (32:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (32:49):
Oh, let's hope not. That's horror, I.

Speaker 2 (32:55):
Ye know, I mean, and it's actually very possible.

Speaker 1 (32:59):
M hmm.

Speaker 2 (33:00):
Because again, I mean, the hosts aren't being killed, you know,
they're just being commandeered.

Speaker 1 (33:10):
Yeah that's true. You know, I don't know, I hope
not anything. Look, if we go making things worse, I know, right,
like how much worse can it get? At least it
will tell you I.

Speaker 2 (33:23):
Got you, man, I got you. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (33:28):
So what else was like really important that happened? I
feel like they're and that's the thing about this show,
Like I feel like they're like every show is a
mini show in itself. Like, although Joel and Ellie are
making this you know, trip across the country, it's so

(33:49):
segmentalized in each episode because these people live and die
in one episode.

Speaker 2 (33:54):
Well technically this one was two.

Speaker 1 (33:57):
Yes too technically, but you know what I mean. Like
each arc, it has a lot of mini story arcs
within the bigger arc. So it's hard to just remember, well,
what this person did three episodes ago, because they weren't
a lot. They weren't in the thing three episodes ago,
and they're not going to be in the next episode.

(34:17):
So it really the whole focus is Joel and Ellie.
That's the only those are the only lines that passed
through the series. So I don't know, it makes it
hard to like have a in depth, long running conversation
about characters, right because they're they're they're here and gone.

Speaker 2 (34:37):
You know, you have to you know at some point
that the two of them, though, we've got to be
going God, everywhere we go there just we just bring
death and destruction. Yeah, or even if they're not bringing
it technically, you know, wherever they go is just decimated
by the time they.

Speaker 1 (34:55):
So Krana in The comment says, Joel is becoming Ellie
and Ellie is becoming thoughts on.

Speaker 2 (35:01):
That, Hmm, I hadn't really thought about that.

Speaker 1 (35:07):
Well, we can tell he's definitely softening a little. He
has toward her and toward like things in general. You know,
he probably would have never before let Sam and Henry
come with them. You know, he probably would try to
kill him. Yeah, well, and ellis.

Speaker 2 (35:26):
Yeah, well, and I love Elie too. She's like, you
want to come with us? And Joel's looking at her, Oh,
don't worry about him. I'll just keep asking like this,
can they come with? And they come with? Okay, okay,
you know, and you're like, oh my god, he's such
a teenager. Yeah, totally.

Speaker 1 (35:45):
I mean because at the end of this episode, though,
I can kind of see it. But she's still young, right,
She's still young, So I don't think she's necessarily I
think like that, but I know, like she's devastated when.

Speaker 2 (35:59):
She yeah, her friend, And that's what I was going
to say, you know, she's it's not so much as
she become hardened, is she really I think she really
thought she could save him or save Sam with her blood.
She knows she's special. I mean people are dying to
keep her, you know, to get her to where she

(36:19):
needs to go so that she can hopefully save everyone. Yeah,
and she couldn't say I.

Speaker 1 (36:26):
Think she's compartmentalizing things, yes for now.

Speaker 2 (36:30):
Right, you know, but you know this one time she
she wanted to save one person because and I know
she has been told since you know, basically she didn't
turn your special, you're gonna save us. You know, whatever
allows you to do this if if we can, you know,
we can figure it out, we can save everyone. You

(36:50):
will save everyone. So she's kind of had this in
her in her head and when she tried to.

Speaker 1 (36:55):
Save because no one should ever say that to her,
I feel like, yes, she has the blood that is
the key to it, but she can't save everyone. She
can't synthesize her blood into a vaccine. She can't give
it to everyone. Right have you masked for? She can't

(37:16):
save everyone? Like I put that on a child's shoulders
by saying it in that way, I feel like she
feels personally responsible for saving the world, right.

Speaker 2 (37:28):
Which that's wrong. And I think she really, she truly
believed that she could save Sam because you know, she's
supposed to be right now the savior, and she couldn't
save this one person and right now. But you know,
I mean, we're also talking about a teenager twenty years

(37:50):
you know, in the future that doesn't understand.

Speaker 1 (37:52):
I understand. And that's why I think it was wrong
that they did her like that, right, Yeah, because she
shouldn't have been thinking like that, you know.

Speaker 2 (37:59):
But but I think and I think, but I think
they told her that because they were trying to impress
upon her how important it was for her to get
to where she was, Yeah, that she wasn't her own
person anymore, that she needed to live to do this. Yeah,
And you know, I don't I don't think they I
probably figured it was just the easiest way to do it.

Speaker 1 (38:21):
I think, though there's a balance in that, right, just
how you lie to kids to try to keep them safe, right, Yeah,
but you have to know how long to lie, you know,
before you just have to tell the truth right before
you go to be straight you can't And same with
that situation, Like, yes, I understand you were trying to
motivate her to do what you want without any pushback, right,

(38:45):
but to her own detriment or what It's just I
don't know I think she's learning a lot with Joel.
You know, on this trip, she's growing fast. Oh yeah,
she started real like she still got that playfulness, right,
She's got the jokiness and we saw that in this
episode when she's playing with Sam, right.

Speaker 2 (39:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:05):
But as more and more things happen, she is really
getting a dose of reality and I think it is
making her more mature every day.

Speaker 2 (39:15):
Oh yeah. And like I said at the end of
the episode, you know when she you know, she threw
down you know, Joel's stuff and you know she wrote,
I'm sorry. Yeah, she does feel responsible for his death.
It wasn't her fault. She didn't she didn't create the
situation that caused his death.

Speaker 5 (39:33):
You know, she she didn't bring the angry mob and
she didn't create the bloater or anything else. But you know,
she feels responsible and you can I mean the fact
that she just threw that stuff down and said, let
you know which way's north and just started walking.

Speaker 1 (39:51):
She's she wants to close the door. She put it
in a box, closed the box, put it on a shelf.
Let's continue, right, because she can't boo who cry over it?
Because she I think she is seeing like when she
you know, when that guy you know, attack them and
then Joel kill them. You know, I think at first
she was a little upset, But what'd she do? Suck
those tears up?

Speaker 2 (40:12):
I'm good, right, Yeah, And she's been doing that a
lot since, you know, I mean this whole trip, she's
been shocked and then she's sucked it up. And I
gotta tell you, at some point she's going to have
a meltdown.

Speaker 1 (40:28):
She might.

Speaker 2 (40:30):
It's just I mean, it's, you know, she is everything
that she is going through. She's you know, she's sucking
you know, sucking it up, putting it in the you know,
a little box somewhere. But there's only particularly at her
age group, there's only so many boxes that you can
stack before they all start to crumble and fall all

(40:51):
over the place.

Speaker 1 (40:53):
Yeah. So I'm curious to see how they handle her
as we get like further along, you know, I mean
we're already at the well, how many episodes is in
this season? Is it nine or ten? I feel like
it's nine for some reason. Hang on, I can check
real quick, yeah, because we already know spoiler alert jump

(41:15):
ten seconds if you don't want to hear, plug your ears.
But we already know there's gonna be a time jump
before the next season, right, so significant time jump. She's
gonna be the actress, is gonna be playing her own
age in season two? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (41:28):
So nine episodes were five Yeah, we're five of nine
right now.

Speaker 1 (41:33):
Okay, So she's gonna have some things happen, and she's
gonna come back either a hard ass or kind of
like herself. It's gonna be a flip to see what
becomes of her, right, I don't know. I mean maybe
if we played the game. We know, we don't, so
we don't know. And of course they take liberties, right.

(41:55):
They've been changing things as they see fit, and they
I think they've made good choices with the changes because
you know, when I listened to their you know, their
HBO podcast, you know, they say what they've changed and
why they changed it, and so far it seems like
they're making really good and smart choices. Right, So hopefully
that will continue. So even even with the source material,

(42:19):
she may end up being a different kind of character
than in the video game, right, So we don't know.
But yeah, one thing I did want to come in
on Joel, you know, mentioned pigging back off of what
Karna said, is that excuse me? It is very evident.
It's very clear at the end of this episode that

(42:42):
he cares more about Ellie than he does the mission.
Like before she was just the mission, and now he
cares about her as a person. That he's turned the corner,
He's turned a very clear corner. Yeah, not not not quite,
not quite. She's getting there. But yeah, he's different than

(43:06):
he was episode one.

Speaker 2 (43:07):
Oh. Yeah, I mean it's it's been they're both on
a journey. Yeah, and you know, so there there's a
lot of I mean, it's not surprising that, you know, again,
Ellie's becoming a little more hardened, where Joel is becoming
a little more softened because while taking care of Ellie,

(43:31):
you know, one, it's it's bringing up memories of him
and his daughter. You know, we're also going to go
find his brother, which is another emotionally charged thing. You know,
he's he's lost, you know, a woman that he loved,
you know, and even even the loss of you know,

(43:51):
of like Bill and and Frank. Yeah, you know, this
has been a journey of you know, both you know
of loss for him. But he's also gained this this ward,
you know, this young girl that is completely dependent on him,
you know, she he knows it. Without her, without him,

(44:12):
she will not survive.

Speaker 1 (44:14):
And that's how I think about Joel. You know, you
said he gained award, he did. I think this whole
trip for him, he is gaining relationships back, he is
gaining you know, how to care for people, right, but
he is not softened. He will still slit someone's throat. Yeah,
so he has his baseline has not changed, but he

(44:37):
has gained things about while being around Ellie.

Speaker 2 (44:40):
Yeah, that's that's a good I think that'd be an
app description.

Speaker 1 (44:44):
Yeah. Yeah, so he's he will kill somebody. He don't care.
He may not like it, but yeah, well.

Speaker 2 (44:51):
And and then he also has concern now too of
is she okay when these bad things happen? Mm hmm,
you know, so it And he's never really told her
to suck it up, you know, but he has said
I'm sorry, and he's acknowledging that the things that she
is dealing with right now are terrible.

Speaker 5 (45:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:10):
It's hard forget right.

Speaker 2 (45:13):
Yeah, And I mean it's legitimately hard for anyone, but
especially you know, you know, the more that he's with her,
the more he's remembering his daughter, and.

Speaker 1 (45:29):
I do think that a little bit, but I think
she's not going to be his replacement daughter. She's going
to be in her own right right. He cares about
her separately from that right.

Speaker 2 (45:41):
Right, But but it's bringing up those or paternal feelings,
you know, to want to protect her, to right to
to you know, to want to make the world a
better place for her, you know, as a as a
good parent, as a as a good guardian, you want,

(46:04):
you know, the the children that you are, you know,
in responsible for, to hopefully live in a better world
than what you what you have right now.

Speaker 1 (46:16):
And he's that's wish Will think. I don't think he's
that far yet. I think he just doesn't want to
be horrible himself, I think, but I think.

Speaker 2 (46:24):
There's you know again, as he grows closer to her,
that's what's going to be a lot of his you know,
that's going to become a real dynamic in the relationship,
because I mean, I.

Speaker 1 (46:39):
Hear what you're saying, but you know, like that whole
thing how they got into that town, right, he wasn't
even with dealing with Henry and Sam. He was not
trust trusting of them at first. He is not Kumbaya.
He is not better World. He is protection mode.

Speaker 2 (46:55):
No. No, what I'm saying is is that's what he
wants for her, not necessarily that he does it, but
he wants to get her to the place where, you know,
hopefully this can happen, and it.

Speaker 1 (47:06):
Can if they actually can do something with her blood,
if they can make something that will save people or
not people from turning right right.

Speaker 2 (47:17):
You know. But you can kind of see, you know,
because in the first like the first episode or two,
he never really looked at her. And you know, but
by the time they reached you know, the city when
they were in hiding, you know, and he was, you know,
three times in that in that episode, you know, he

(47:39):
told Ellie, I'm sorry, mm hmm, you know, I you know,
it shouldn't be like this, are you okay?

Speaker 1 (47:47):
Right?

Speaker 2 (47:47):
You know, And it was that same conversation like three
different times. So you can see that he's he's starting
to it's not enough to just get her bodily there,
you know.

Speaker 1 (47:59):
Yeah, Yeah, she's no longer a package.

Speaker 2 (48:02):
Exactly, She's no longer just cargo, right, And you know,
so like I said, is you know, you can start
to see that that pattern is emerging where he's feeling
protective and paternal.

Speaker 1 (48:15):
Mm hmmm, mm hmm. So I'm curious to see what
comes next, you know, we you know. In the little
clip from the next episode, it seems like the one
character I don't know the character's name, but I oh
my god, her real name escapes me right now as well,
but the black woman from True Blood, she says something

(48:35):
to her and she's like, you know, kind of saying,
you really can't trust people because if you trust people,
they hurt you. Right, So, how much is she gonna
take from others who are giving her advice? Right?

Speaker 2 (48:48):
Right?

Speaker 1 (48:48):
Will that affect her immediately right or later? Is that
like a clue of some kind of betrayal coming that
we don't know, you know, or what Ellie will receive
as a betrayal. Right, So I'm like, I'm very curious
to see what's gonna happen in the next four episodes
because they still got a lot a lot to go, really.

Speaker 2 (49:11):
And I'm going to make an assumption that before the
end of this season, Joel will make it make it
to his brother.

Speaker 1 (49:20):
Oh yeah, he does in the next episode. Oh okay, yeah,
it was in the thing he was talking to his
brother in the Oh.

Speaker 2 (49:27):
That's okay. Yeah, you're right, you're right. Yeah, I kind
of forgot about the pre I forgot what the preview
actually had in it. I'm not gonna lie.

Speaker 1 (49:36):
The preview was pretty I mean they they gave a
lot in the preview. I feel like I gave a lot.

Speaker 2 (49:42):
So I will want to say one other thing though,
as as Joel becomes more protective of Ellie, I think
he'll become way more dangerous.

Speaker 1 (49:53):
Yeah, I agree. I agree with that.

Speaker 2 (49:57):
And he's already a dangerous person, you.

Speaker 1 (49:59):
Know, right, because the more you care about something like
what we just saw with Henry and Sam, the more
you love someone family blood not blood, you know, your
own family, the more you'll do to keep them safe,
especially when you feel like it's your responsibility. And that
is like I think Joel's main directive always like, even

(50:24):
if we go back to the first episode, he felt
responsible for his brother, right, go, I had to go
down to the jail and bail him out, right, right.
I think he's always the fixer, the protector for everyone,
for tests, for everyone that he comes into contact with.
He somehow manages to take that protective role, whether he

(50:46):
likes it or not. I think he secretly likes it,
but yeah, it's just his MO.

Speaker 2 (50:53):
And you know, with with Henry killing Sam and then
killing himself, you know, you could see that he was shocked.
But I think there's also the this hint of don't
let that be me, that could be me. Yeah, you know,
because every every single episode has reinforced you know, as

(51:16):
a protector, your your only job to protect the person
you know that that you're protecting. That's that's protecting a
lot three times in one second. Sorry guys, you know,
but you know he gets out of it's what I
forgot who died. Yeah, and you know she says to him,

(51:41):
you have to protect her. In every SI that we
have seen in every in all five episodes, someone at
some point it is your job, you know, your your
sole purpose in being is to keep her alive. And
he met Henry who sold purpose in life was to
keep Sam alive. And Sam's dead, you know. So I think.

Speaker 1 (52:08):
Henry did not get the enduror and survived message because
he decided to end it.

Speaker 2 (52:15):
You know, but I think that was you know, kind
of struck a chord with with him, you know, because again,
you know that the whole theme of this whole thing
is is you have to protect her.

Speaker 1 (52:27):
Yeah, so I do believe he's going to do that
with every ounce of his being. But you know, if
he didn't not to be mean, but if he didn't
off himself when his daughter died, he's not going to
do it. If something happens to.

Speaker 2 (52:40):
Ali, no he's not. I don't think, right, he'll be miserable.
But I think there was just that, you know that
looking at a lot, like looking in the mirror of
him when he was younger, you know, and just what
happens when you fail.

Speaker 1 (53:02):
So that was so sad. I'm like, oh my god,
I feel like that was even sadder than the couple
from the last uh you know, a little story arc.

Speaker 2 (53:13):
Yeah, at least they got together, right, I was gonna
say it's probably I mean Sam, Sam Henry wasn't.

Speaker 1 (53:23):
He was well, he was he was the twenties maybe
if that, if that, if that, you know.

Speaker 2 (53:30):
So, I mean he was young himself. You know, these
are you know, lives cut very short, you know, so
unlike you know Bill and Frankie, who had this very
long life, good decent life. You know everything about Sam
and and and frank'sl like or Sam and Henry's life
had just been awful.

Speaker 1 (53:53):
You know, they they obviously they grew up in that,
you know.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
Yeah, you know, they'd lost their parents. You know, he
was responsible for little brother forgod only knows how long,
and you know, his brother gets sick, and I mean
everything has just been, you know, a shit show. So
I think that's what probably makes it worse, you know,
and then we just and and before they all die,
we got this brief moment of you know, the the

(54:17):
kids playing and Sam laughing, you know, and and and
being a child and having fun and you know, and
in some ways that makes it even more tragic.

Speaker 1 (54:29):
It does, because you know, Henry is like, wow, I
haven't seen that in a long time, right, Yeah, he
was feeling good about it, He was feeling hopeful about it,
and then that happens.

Speaker 2 (54:39):
Yeah, and they're confident even you know, by the time
they reached the other side, you know, he was talking
and hey, we made it, and you know, he really
thought that they were home free.

Speaker 1 (54:50):
Yeah, they almost were so close.

Speaker 2 (54:53):
And almost were so close.

Speaker 1 (54:55):
Yes, yeah, but you know I get it. They have
because in the game, these are missions, right, there are missions,
so these people don't hang around.

Speaker 2 (55:06):
So right, I mean there's yeah, because you know, we're
just like getting like these little microcosms of each little
place that they visit, you know. And it's I kind
of like it because like you and I talked about,
like with The Walking Dead, we don't we didn't really
get to see a lot of outside of our groups

(55:28):
not and this has been kind of interesting to see
how all, you know, these different people have survived and
what's happened and so on and so forth, and you know,
it's it's kind of been interesting.

Speaker 1 (55:42):
Yeah, even this episode. You know, yes, there's an antagonist, right,
but we even get to delve into her a little bit.
We know more about her, so like, yeah, she's she's awful,
she's awful person, but we really as you know, what
made that, right, where she came from, and now how
strongly she felt for her brother, why she felt this vengeance.

Speaker 2 (56:04):
Yeah, although I will say that she was probably an
awful person before and this just gave her an excuse
to be herself.

Speaker 1 (56:11):
Oh yeah, definitely definitely because with.

Speaker 2 (56:14):
Him alive, you know, because with him alive, you know,
she kept exactly you know, and and Henry said, you know,
he he really her brother, and you know, was very remorseful.
But you know, again, Sam or this guy he knows,

(56:40):
you know, he's a good man. He's a great man,
someone that you could, you know, really fall into. But
he wasn't family, you know, and exactly, you know, so
we so we know that this guy was a really
good guy who probably kept his sister in check just
because even she recognized he's a good person. And I'm

(57:03):
not so and but once he was gone, well you know.

Speaker 1 (57:12):
You know, you know, things just happen.

Speaker 2 (57:17):
Yeah, I'm I'm just gonna go ahead and live up
to my potential. God.

Speaker 1 (57:24):
Well, I mean she did give them temporary relief from FEDRA,
if that's how you want to see it, even though yeah,
they're acting wild and crazy. So yeah, okay, I think
I'm done. What about you, Lisa?

Speaker 2 (57:39):
Yeah I was. I was gonna say, I can't wait
to see next week's episode.

Speaker 1 (57:44):
Same, I'm excited for it. We've got four episodes left
and uh yeah, I'm super excited to see how it
all ends. Do we get a cliffhanger? I wonder.

Speaker 2 (57:57):
Probably? I mean, we already know that it's been greenlit.
I'm gonna go with They're gonna they're gonna ads on
a you know, some kind of dire cliff.

Speaker 1 (58:09):
Mm hmmm mmmm. Okay, well that's it. We're gonna call
it quits here. Thanks so much for listening, you guys.
If you're still listening to the sound of my voice,
don't forget to hit the like button and subscribe wherever
you are listening, and we'll be right back here next week.
Take care of yourselves. Bye guys, Bye bye.
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