May 20, 2025 • 30 mins
Kathy Boufford is a dedicated and skilled family law attorney with many years of experience as a trial advocate and mediator. She is a partner at Bellenot & Boufford, LLC. She's also the author of “Divorce Matters”, where she discusses the practical issues to consider at the outset of a divorce. Her book explains how to find the right professional to help you with your divorce and walks you through how to prepare for your case, detailing all the elements you may be required to produce. Kathy’s book is available through Amazon, Barnes & Noble, and wherever books are sold.
Find out more about Kathy and her book:
www.bbesq.com/divorce-matters
Find out more about Kathy and her book:
www.bbesq.com/divorce-matters
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, I'm Wendy, and this is Divorce Doesn't Suck. I'm
talking all about the life you can live after divorce.
You'll hear regular people's stories about their divorces and how
they reinvented themselves and grew. You'll also get invaluable advice
from experts who serve in the divorce community. A little
about me. I'm a former TV producer and mom of two.
I got divorced in two thousand and eight when there
were really no outlets or platforms for me to turn to.
(00:22):
So I'm paying it forward and have created a platform
to help men and women learn that there absolutely is
a fresh, new and exciting life after divorce. Come with
me on this journey and paint your brand new blank
canvas of happily ever after divorce. This episode is brought
to in part by the Needle Kuda Law Firm Guidance
that Moves Lives Forward. Welcome to another episode of Divorce
(00:43):
Doesn't Stuck. I'm Wendy Sloan, your host and my guest today,
a dedicated and skilled family law attorney with many years
of experience as a trial advocate and mediator. She is
also the author of Divorce matters, what you really need
to know when it's time to get divorced. I'm thrilled
to welcome to my show, Kathy Bouffard.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Thank you, nice to be here.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
So nice to have you. Thank you so much for
joining me. Tell us a little bit about yourself, Kathy,
and why you decided to get into family law.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Well, I'm Connecticut resident, and I wasn't sure what type
of area of law I wanted when I when I
graduated from law school, I had worked in a number
of different venues. I had worked for a corp, I
had worked for, I had intered in a jail setting.
At one point, I had worked for a larger insurance
(01:37):
defense firm, and then I ended up coming to a small,
you know, general practice firm, and that's where I felt
the most useful, and I think I felt the most
connection because I was dealing with individuals who were at
that time, dealing with all different types of matters. I
(01:57):
was helping the attorneys as a paralegal when I first started,
when I was in school, and I got to experience
a number of different areas of law and the family law,
even though I knew it was a difficult area.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
It seemed for me to have the most impact.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
I was able to have the most impact on people
in their lives going through a very difficult time. So
I don't know, I was just drawn to it. And
as I continued to do it, I got more and
more experienced in that area, and I started getting more
and more referrals, and you know, I just that that
became my area.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
So that's it. They say, that's it.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Okay, Well, you had experience in so many different settings,
so then you found you found your your space experience
as a trial advocate and mediator. Tell us about that
and is mediation? Is is it right for everybody? No?
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Mediation really requires good faith.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
On both both from both sides.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
One of the biggest differences between mediation and litigation is
that you don't have that whole discovery process, which normally
an attorney takes the lead on, and that's going back
and looking through financial records for the most part, but
sometimes other records as well and other bits of evidence
to kind of, you know, make sure that what everyone
(03:36):
is disclosing now is in fact an accurate picture of
the finances, but also that there was no red flags
along the way.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
Usually we go back two or three years, we do
kind of a forensic you know, a basic forensic accounting,
and then if we see things that don't add up,
you know, deposits from an account that maybe is not disclosed,
or huge drops in money or increases in money that
we don't know where the source is coming from, we
kind of dig and scratch a little bit to find
(04:05):
out why that is. And oftentimes that's when you discover
things like the financial fidelity, infidelity or other you know,
like substance abuse issues, gambling issues, you know, extramarital affairs.
Usually the money leads to certain things like that. So
when you're in mediation, people still have to disclose their
(04:28):
financial picture by filling out financial forms, but we're kind
of assuming that everyone's being honest and that there there's
nothing that in the in the past that maybe like
some money had disappeared, or that there's a source of
(04:48):
income that maybe is not being disclosed.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
We're not usually going backwards. Now.
Speaker 3 (04:52):
One of the first things I'll do is I'll exchange
the financial information with the parties and we go through
it and I ask each party, are you familiar you're
or do you feel confident with the financial history of
the marriage, or is there something on the financial disclosure
that confuses you. Either you thought that there was an
account that's not there, or maybe there's a credit card
that you've never seen before didn't know existed.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
And I will give them the opportunity. And I say
this right from the get go. If someone is not
comfortable or doesn't fully understand the financial picture, We're going
to take the time to either look into a question
or to catch them up to speed before we go forward.
And everyone has to be okay with that. But again,
you don't know what you don't know, and some people
(05:34):
are not confident enough to ask those questions because sometimes
even if you give people the opportunity, they don't feel like,
for whatever reason, that they can do it. Mediation does
require a lot of individual you know, self help so
to speak. Like the parties are the mediator is facilitating
(05:55):
an agreement and facilitating the process, but the parties are
the ones that are driving it.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
So people have to be confident enough to speak up.
And I'll give someone every opportunity, but they still have
to be able to do it and confident enough to
maybe challenge the other person or question the other person.
And if they don't feel that way, they don't feel
that they can do that, then I tell them that
mediation is not the best place for you, and it
doesn't mean that you have to have a fight. It
(06:22):
doesn't mean that you can't still have an amicable divorce.
But some people need that attorney's assistance to take the lead.
So in those cases, mediation may not be right for people.
Or if you think that your spouse is not going
to be truthful and is not going to be forthcoming
about certain things, mediation is probably not the right space.
(06:45):
There's a big difference of opinion with regards to substance
abuse issues mental health issues. Some people think that, you know,
we can still proceed with mediation dealing with those issues,
and there are some met eaders that think that those
are really big obstacles. I tend to think that that's
a really big obstacle to overcome, and I'm very careful
(07:06):
about taking mediations with those issues. It's not a hard
no for me, but we're really going to explore as
to if it's going to be productive and if it
has a good chance of a positive outcomes at the
end of the day. A lot of people go through
mediation because they think it's going to be easier and
it's going to be less expensive than litigation, and it
(07:26):
often is. But if it's not successful, then it becomes
more expensive because it's you've spent that money for nothing,
You've spent that time for nothing, and it's it's a
big deal.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
It takes a lot of emotion out of you to
go through that.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
As it really does, as just getting a divorce takes
an emotional toll in every situ way financial, legal, practical aspects.
You expects your life, your family's life, if you have children,
your children, so many things. Do you think that divorce
has Do you think has the divorce rate gone up
or down since COVID?
Speaker 3 (08:06):
I think, you know, the statistics are always behind, right,
but I think that the level of contested matters has
definitely gone up, if not the numbers themselves have gone up.
I mean there's there's fewer and fewer people that are
(08:28):
getting married now, and there's there's people that are getting
married later in life. So I think based on those
two factors you have, you have less frequency in the numbers.
But I think that everyone in our space would agree
that it's it's becoming more contested. I start I'm starting
to see a little bit of a drop off on
the level of contested matters now. But the past, you
(08:52):
know from from from two thousand and twenty one, definitely
through last year twenty twenty four, everything was very, very
heightened in terms of aggression and in terms of just
not being willing to compromise. Last year's when I first
started to see it taper off, and this year already
(09:13):
I see a big difference and just how people are
approaching the whole process. So we'll see maybe maybe it's
finally paper down a bit.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
That would be wonderful. Are the courts up to speed
since COVID.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
A lot of them are.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
There's I work in a lot of different jurisdictions, a
lot of a lot of different courthouses about I usually
do up five different courthouses and it's it's it's interesting
to see how they're run differently, and and so some
are are moving along very well. Some seem to be
a little bit behind in general. And I think you've
(09:58):
mentioned this before on your show. The one of the
benefits of the pandemic was that it stream blind a
lot of things. And one of the things that that
was streamlined. A lot was family law, and they were
in the process of making things easier procedurally beforehand, and
(10:18):
then the pandemic kind of sped that up out of
necessity because this was one area of the law obviously
that that needed to continue.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
We couldn't have a big, huge delay.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
And although there are a lot of people that will
complain that, you know, some things and some courts weren't
moving as quickly as they should. There were other things
and certainly other courts, and unfortunate that I was in
those courts that were working beautifully and they went through
you know, I wasn't a big fan of the online litigation,
(10:52):
but when we had nothing else, it was grateful.
Speaker 2 (10:56):
And then they automated.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
A lot of stuff so that there were you know,
if you have agreements now and there's certain other matters
where we can just file remotely, we can upload the
documents and we can get things approved without having to
go to court, whereas before, even if you had an agreement,
how to go to court, so people would have to
(11:18):
you know, arrange childcare, they'd have to travel, they take
the day off from work, all to go into court
and say yes I sign this, Yes I agree yes,
I'm satisfied with my counsel and I don't have any questions.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Whereas now we don't have to do that.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
They fill out affidavits that will take care of what
that that questioning, which was called the canvas used to accomplish.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
We upload everything and.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Nine percent of the time, unless the court has any questions,
they will just approve the agreements.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
Nathy, that's amazing. I did not know that. That is amazing,
not only for the lawyers involved and everywhere, but for
the for the you know, moms and dads who have
to take take off of work or have to get
like you said, babysitters and stuff like that. That's wonderful.
That's good news.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
And it's a big incentive to to to reach an
agreement and to come to a compromise, because that's a
big benefit. It used to be that it was just
available for temporary orders, but now it's available for even
final orders and even whole divorces. And if if you
can agree on all matters to your divorce, even you know,
(12:29):
temporary agreements and then the final agreement, whether you do
it by mediation or you do it by just you know,
like litigation, you could still come to in agreements with
with a litigated matter, with two attorneys.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
I tell people you can do your whole divorce process
and never have to set foot in the court, which
is a wonderful thing, is.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
Wonderful benefit, that is amazing. I remember I used to
get like the shaky's right before I had to go
into court. That whole feeling is And we're going to
dive into your your amazing book Divorce Matters, But before
we do, I've said this over and over and over
on the podcast. The most important first step that you
can do is find the right attorney. Find the person
(13:11):
that is you feel is going to you know, go
in there with your questions, Go see as many as
you can teet What is your biggest strength as an attorney?
My biggest what your biggest strength?
Speaker 3 (13:21):
Your biggest strength, the strength I would have to say
giving information to people, And I don't mean just legal information,
I mean information about the entire process. I've always felt
that an educated client is a good client, and we
really strive to not only give that information orally as
(13:44):
I'm representing people, but we've put a lot of information
over the years on our website, and we've put information
out in newsletters, and we've done workshops and presentations, and
that was really the start of the book. It was
the catalyst because as more and more people contacted us
(14:05):
and talked to me and said, I really, you know,
appreciated that information or I really I read a lot
about I read a lot of your you know, the
blogs or the articles, and and it made me feel
more comfortable or more confident.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
You know, I wish you could have more.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
I would do a presentation and they would say that
information was wonderful, but I need more, and I need more,
and everyone needs more. But there's never enough time, you know,
or to write everything, or at least I thought there wasn't.
Speaker 2 (14:35):
And then, you know, and people would.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
Say, you know, you should, you should, you should write
a book, or you should have a book or so
you get more information. And eventually that's really what prompted
me to sit down and say, Okay, I can never
you know, consult with someone this long to give them
all that information, but.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
I can at least start.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
So I started by taking those articles, organizing them for
an outline for myself, and then obviously a little by
a little, filling in the blanks with the help of
my editor, who would you know, he would notice all
the holes, you know, because I know what I know,
but you know, it was easier for him to see
where pieces were missing. So we would have weekly meetings,
(15:13):
weekly pow wows where he would kind of tease apart
what I had written and would ask the questions. And
it was great because he had never gone through a divorce.
He was an older gentleman who was it wasn't even
that familiar with divorce. So it was wonderful because what
I thought people would know or how would jump from
A to B. He would say, no, no, no, you
(15:34):
need to you know, how do you get from.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
A to B?
Speaker 3 (15:36):
And he would he would I would as I was talking,
he would say, Oh, you need to write that. You
need to write that, you need to write that. So
it was good to talk to someone who was so
outside YAH area.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
Amazing, wonderful.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Your book is a guideline, it's an education, and we're
going to talk about that more with Kathy Bluford when
right after this break from a from our sponsor, we're
going to take a quick commercial break. And one of
the things that I loved so much about this book
is that you even talked about life after divorce, and
people don't touch on that enough. So we're going to
talk about the entire book and that right when we
(16:13):
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percent on your device. We're back with Kathy Bouffard. She's
a partner at Bellnott and Beaufort and the book is
called Divorce Matters. It's such a great book. It's a guideline,
it's an education. And I bet if you hand people
that come to see you, you hand them the book
and they read that book, at least they'll have the
start of a guideline for them. There's so much in
(17:18):
this book. Where should we start. I get why you
wrote the book, and I get why it's so important.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
Yes, well, people would, people would and still do call
me up. Some people call me up with specific questions, right,
but most people call me up with that huge question
like what are my rights? Or you know, how can
I prepare myself for a divorce? Or I'm not sure
I'm ready for a divorce, but I'm thinking about it
(17:47):
and I want to get some information. And of course
those are all those valid questions, but they're so large.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
How could I possibly answer that?
Speaker 3 (17:55):
In you know, we always offer we offer a free
you know, phone consultation, but that's you know, that's heared
for like fifteen minutes. Just how can I help? Can
I help you? What's the approximate cost? What's the procedure?
Even when they came in for an hour long consultation,
I couldn't give them all of the information. So now
I can tell them, well, you know, I have this book.
(18:18):
I know it sounds like it sounds like a salesman.
You know, I have this book, it just came out,
But they're so happy when I tell them what it
what it's about, right, and what it entails, and how
it's going to give them the information. And I'm sure,
you know, I'm always sure to tell them. Look, this
is not going to be the only information you need.
It's not going to replace an attorney. It's not going
to tell you how your individual divorce is going to
(18:39):
end up. But it's going to give you that layout.
You know, it's going to give you. You're going to
see the process of how the divorce goes. You're going
to understand how it moves to the court. You're going
to understand what information you are going to need up
front before you even see an attorney, so that you
can start to prepare and gather some information. It's going
(19:01):
to tell you how to find an attorney, what to
look for an attorney, how to prepare for meeting with
your attorney, Like what questions you should start thinking of
so that you can ask the attorney what the attorney
might ask of you. You know, So these are all
things that people usually don't think about. That sort of stuff,
(19:22):
and why would you you know, you just think about,
you know, mostly the fear and the uncertainty, and you know,
like it's it's a it's a lot of emotion and.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
You don't even know where, you don't even know where
to start where, what do you're you're so you're it's
so overwhelming. The whole process is so overwhelming everything about it.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
Yeah, and it's and yeah, it's a big I mean
it's it's it's changing your whole entire life.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
It's affecting your whole entire life.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
So I do go through that and explain that what
they're going through is very common, is very natural, but
that you can't let you can't let fear and motion
obviously control of you, because because that's then you don't
you're you're, you lose control. So the whole point of
the book is regaining control. And the way you regain
(20:10):
control is to get information, because once you find out
the right information, then you know, you know, there's so
much worryings over sometimes over things that that never come
to pass, or that aren't aren't accurate or based.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
On incomplete information.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
So if you can get rid of that fear, and
then there are things that you should be worried about.
But once you know what you should be worried about,
then you know, how do I prepare? Okay, how am
I going to address this? And once you start to
address it and you have a plan of action, that's
you just start to regain control. And once you regain control,
(20:49):
then you can kind of calm yourself and say, Okay,
I have I have a plan, I know what I'm
supposed to do. I know this is the difference between
this is going to be hard, but there's a way
through it, and there's a path out, and I'm going
to focus on, you know, getting through that and looking
towards the future, which again is why I thought it
(21:10):
was important to include that last chapter is on the
future because people need to focus on that. So many
people focus behind and what they're losing and how everything's
changing and how nothing's going to be the same, And
it really is a mindset shift that's so important to
look forward and think about how things are going to
(21:33):
change for the better, how not everything has to change.
How how you know, think about what was working well,
you know, whether whether it was communication with you or
soon to be X, what works well that doesn't have
to change. Think about what traditions you have with your
children that you want to keep. Not everything has to
(21:53):
start anew you know, it's a it's a way for
you to kind of create your own next chapter.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
So I tell them about that.
Speaker 3 (22:03):
They get excited about it, they want to come, you know,
they pick up the book or they order the book,
and and they know that there's that help, that information
out there, and then obviously they build on it. I
explained to them that it's a it's a kind of
a springboard for you to then get an attourney, move forward.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
Help yourself.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
Knowledge is power, Yes, yeh, Knowledge is so pow.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
That's so important with your podcast that you're focusing on
positivity and not focusing on the negative.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
And I was very drawn to that when I was
introduced to your podcast.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
I think that that's excellent because I'm really, really I'm
not a fan of that victim mentality and and just
that the the the whole negativity you know that's out there.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
There's a lot of negativity. It's one thing to to.
Speaker 3 (22:56):
Empathize with someone and there's one thing to you know,
I certainly acknowledge that bad things happen to people, and
that people are taking advantage of. But I'm really a
big believer in, you know, getting the information, moving forward,
getting yourself out of a situation that's bad, and making
the best and the most of your life. And I
think everyone has that power to do that. They just
need a little help along the way. And a lot
(23:19):
of that help comes from from people like you who
provide the information for them to need and to make
them feel confident and move forward.
Speaker 1 (23:28):
Well, that means a lot. That means a lot to me, Kathy,
thank you. When I got divorced in two thousand and eight,
there was no books like yours Divorce Matters, there was
no podcast for me to listen to, there was nothing.
I've told this story often that there was this in
my small town. There was this one girl that I knew.
I didn't know her, but I knew she was going
(23:49):
through a divorce. And I sent her a message and says,
you don't know me, but I think we have something
in common.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
And she was my only link.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
And she didn't know anything either. So here we were
we're like, we don't even when we at these little kids,
we don't even know what to do. And you know,
I got blindsided a lot. I got gas lit a lot,
So it's important. This my podcast is so important. It's like,
this is what happened, and this is where I am,
this is what I did, and this is how I
(24:16):
got to the other side, and this so I'm living
my best life. And your book touched me so much
in the fact because it had so much information in it.
It was such a great guideline for people, and it
was easy to read, and it was full of information
that is so helpful that we that you need when
you're going through this because your emotions are all over
(24:36):
the place and you're not always thinking straight right, And
then you put in the in the in it also
like what happens after, because we don't when we're going
through this, we don't think about that. And there will
be a life after, whether it's a two point oh,
three point oh, there will be all of that.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
Sure.
Speaker 3 (24:54):
Another another big thing for me is I really like
to save people money, you know, and I am so
cognizant of the fact that divorce costs so much. If
you're trying to get good legal help, it's just not
inexpensive at all. So I wanted to let people know
(25:15):
that there were different options for like this whole chapter
dealing with attorneys fees. Right, it's like voodoo asking anyone
about money, and people are just so afraid of it.
But I wanted to break down how the charges. You
know what to expect with charges, not in particular dollar amounts,
but how they build and how you can keep your
costs lower. And there are options such as limited scope representation,
(25:38):
where if you really can't afford the full representation, you
can at least get some legal help. Because so many
people don't know that, that was very important to me,
and also the book itself being a reference. So so
many times people will call and talk to me, even
my own clients, and because their emotions and because they're
emotional and understandably so, and because so much is going on,
(26:02):
they may not get everything that I explain to them,
so sometimes they have to contact me again or say
can you repeat that? Whereas here they have the book
as a reference. So if I'm talking about depositions or
I'm talking about interrogatories, things that people just start familiar discussing,
they can hear me, they can understand my explanations. But
(26:23):
then if they need to, they can go back and
they can reference not that they can't call me. Of
course it doesn't to reheat myself. But they can go
back and now look at the chapter that deals with
the depositions, insturrogacaries their discovery, and it's like the notes.
It's like taking notes for them ahead of time. And
they've done the reverse where people have come to me.
(26:44):
It's so funny. They've come to me and they said, oh,
I've already read your book, and they know when I
start to talk about things, they're like, oh, yes, I
understand this, and then then I only understand it. It
reduces the time that I need to explain things to them,
which of course reduces their their their charges. So it's
(27:05):
it's coming full circle. And then they'll ask me those
springboard questions that you know that are really it's good,
like they've learned from the book. So it makes me
feel really really good.
Speaker 1 (27:18):
You have very fulfilling yes. And they can also like
write notes inside each chapter, like you know, the term's
child custody, write notes on it so and then keep
notes so then when they go to see you or
they go to see an attorney, they have all their
notes right there. They don't have to make the phone
cof to the phone call which winds up costing, and
so many people stay in a marriage because they can't
(27:40):
afford to get out. Yes, the money part was so important.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
Yes, and how to how and even just the different
ways of how people you know, come up with like
a retainer for an attorney, you're different options, like just
just to let them know there are options, you know,
So that was very important for me.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Yeah, the book, the book is so great. It's a
must read if you're thinking about going through a divorce,
if you're going through a divorce, divorce matters, what you
really need to know when it's time to get divorced.
It's such a well written book with so much great information. Remember,
knowledge is power. Last minute thoughts, Kathy.
Speaker 3 (28:24):
Just you know, don't be afraid to ask questions, to
reach out to get help. There is someone out there
who will help you, who will direct you to the
right information. And really try to focus on the positive.
A lot of life is about all about attitude and
(28:44):
positivity and it's not it's not just a word, you know,
it really is a movement that you have to start
within yourself and it will get better.
Speaker 2 (28:58):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
It's gonna be rough, but you can swim. You can
swim through it and you'll get there. You'll get you'll
get to the end eventually. This book. Remember divorce, it's
so much, such an emotional toll, financial, legally, all aspects,
especially if children are involved, the impact of yourself, your family,
your health, your well being. It affects everything. So this
book Divorce Matters. I encourage everyone, if you're going through
(29:22):
a divorce or you're thinking about divorce, get the book
Divorce Matters. Read it. It's your guideline. It's an education.
It's so well written, there's so much information, it's everything
you need to know. Thank you so much for sharing that.
Thank you so much for writing the book and for
helping so many out there.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
You're welcome.
Speaker 3 (29:40):
Thank you for helping spread the word, and for all
the good that you do as well.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
Thanks Kathy Nito Kuda. Divorce and Family Laws attorneys have
guided Connecticut and New York families through complex divorce actions,
contested child custody, and alimony disputes for over thirty years.
Their Connecticut and New York attorneys have extensive experience in
family matters involving substance abuse, domestic violence, mental illness, and
many other X factors that can complicate a divorce. Their
(30:08):
attorneys adeptly manage privacy and reputation concerns inherit to public
divorce proceedings and the related exposure for their ultra high
net worth clients. Find your new path forward, define your
post divorce family, and secure an enforceable agreement to protect
your future with Needlecuda Act. Now put the strength of
their team behind you. Visit them at needlecuda dot com
(30:31):
or call two O three five five seven nine to
five zero zero
Hi, I'm Wendy, and this is Divorce Doesn't Suck. I'm
talking all about the life you can live after divorce.
You'll hear regular people's stories about their divorces and how
they reinvented themselves and grew. You'll also get invaluable advice
from experts who serve in the divorce community. A little
about me. I'm a former TV producer and mom of two.
I got divorced in two thousand and eight when there
were really no outlets or platforms for me to turn to.
(00:22):
So I'm paying it forward and have created a platform
to help men and women learn that there absolutely is
a fresh, new and exciting life after divorce. Come with
me on this journey and paint your brand new blank
canvas of happily ever after divorce. This episode is brought
to in part by the Needle Kuda Law Firm Guidance
that Moves Lives Forward. Welcome to another episode of Divorce
(00:43):
Doesn't Stuck. I'm Wendy Sloan, your host and my guest today,
a dedicated and skilled family law attorney with many years
of experience as a trial advocate and mediator. She is
also the author of Divorce matters, what you really need
to know when it's time to get divorced. I'm thrilled
to welcome to my show, Kathy Bouffard.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Thank you, nice to be here.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
So nice to have you. Thank you so much for
joining me. Tell us a little bit about yourself, Kathy,
and why you decided to get into family law.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Well, I'm Connecticut resident, and I wasn't sure what type
of area of law I wanted when I when I
graduated from law school, I had worked in a number
of different venues. I had worked for a corp, I
had worked for, I had intered in a jail setting.
At one point, I had worked for a larger insurance
(01:37):
defense firm, and then I ended up coming to a small,
you know, general practice firm, and that's where I felt
the most useful, and I think I felt the most
connection because I was dealing with individuals who were at
that time, dealing with all different types of matters. I
(01:57):
was helping the attorneys as a paralegal when I first started,
when I was in school, and I got to experience
a number of different areas of law and the family law,
even though I knew it was a difficult area.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
It seemed for me to have the most impact.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
I was able to have the most impact on people
in their lives going through a very difficult time. So
I don't know, I was just drawn to it. And
as I continued to do it, I got more and
more experienced in that area, and I started getting more
and more referrals, and you know, I just that that
became my area.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
So that's it. They say, that's it.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Okay, Well, you had experience in so many different settings,
so then you found you found your your space experience
as a trial advocate and mediator. Tell us about that
and is mediation? Is is it right for everybody? No?
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Mediation really requires good faith.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
On both both from both sides.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
One of the biggest differences between mediation and litigation is
that you don't have that whole discovery process, which normally
an attorney takes the lead on, and that's going back
and looking through financial records for the most part, but
sometimes other records as well and other bits of evidence
to kind of, you know, make sure that what everyone
(03:36):
is disclosing now is in fact an accurate picture of
the finances, but also that there was no red flags
along the way.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
Usually we go back two or three years, we do
kind of a forensic you know, a basic forensic accounting,
and then if we see things that don't add up,
you know, deposits from an account that maybe is not disclosed,
or huge drops in money or increases in money that
we don't know where the source is coming from, we
kind of dig and scratch a little bit to find
(04:05):
out why that is. And oftentimes that's when you discover
things like the financial fidelity, infidelity or other you know,
like substance abuse issues, gambling issues, you know, extramarital affairs.
Usually the money leads to certain things like that. So
when you're in mediation, people still have to disclose their
(04:28):
financial picture by filling out financial forms, but we're kind
of assuming that everyone's being honest and that there there's
nothing that in the in the past that maybe like
some money had disappeared, or that there's a source of
(04:48):
income that maybe is not being disclosed.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
We're not usually going backwards. Now.
Speaker 3 (04:52):
One of the first things I'll do is I'll exchange
the financial information with the parties and we go through
it and I ask each party, are you familiar you're
or do you feel confident with the financial history of
the marriage, or is there something on the financial disclosure
that confuses you. Either you thought that there was an
account that's not there, or maybe there's a credit card
that you've never seen before didn't know existed.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
And I will give them the opportunity. And I say
this right from the get go. If someone is not
comfortable or doesn't fully understand the financial picture, We're going
to take the time to either look into a question
or to catch them up to speed before we go forward.
And everyone has to be okay with that. But again,
you don't know what you don't know, and some people
(05:34):
are not confident enough to ask those questions because sometimes
even if you give people the opportunity, they don't feel like,
for whatever reason, that they can do it. Mediation does
require a lot of individual you know, self help so
to speak. Like the parties are the mediator is facilitating
(05:55):
an agreement and facilitating the process, but the parties are
the ones that are driving it.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
So people have to be confident enough to speak up.
And I'll give someone every opportunity, but they still have
to be able to do it and confident enough to
maybe challenge the other person or question the other person.
And if they don't feel that way, they don't feel
that they can do that, then I tell them that
mediation is not the best place for you, and it
doesn't mean that you have to have a fight. It
(06:22):
doesn't mean that you can't still have an amicable divorce.
But some people need that attorney's assistance to take the lead.
So in those cases, mediation may not be right for people.
Or if you think that your spouse is not going
to be truthful and is not going to be forthcoming
about certain things, mediation is probably not the right space.
(06:45):
There's a big difference of opinion with regards to substance
abuse issues mental health issues. Some people think that, you know,
we can still proceed with mediation dealing with those issues,
and there are some met eaders that think that those
are really big obstacles. I tend to think that that's
a really big obstacle to overcome, and I'm very careful
(07:06):
about taking mediations with those issues. It's not a hard
no for me, but we're really going to explore as
to if it's going to be productive and if it
has a good chance of a positive outcomes at the
end of the day. A lot of people go through
mediation because they think it's going to be easier and
it's going to be less expensive than litigation, and it
(07:26):
often is. But if it's not successful, then it becomes
more expensive because it's you've spent that money for nothing,
You've spent that time for nothing, and it's it's a
big deal.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
It takes a lot of emotion out of you to
go through that.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
As it really does, as just getting a divorce takes
an emotional toll in every situ way financial, legal, practical aspects.
You expects your life, your family's life, if you have children,
your children, so many things. Do you think that divorce
has Do you think has the divorce rate gone up
or down since COVID?
Speaker 3 (08:06):
I think, you know, the statistics are always behind, right,
but I think that the level of contested matters has
definitely gone up, if not the numbers themselves have gone up.
I mean there's there's fewer and fewer people that are
(08:28):
getting married now, and there's there's people that are getting
married later in life. So I think based on those
two factors you have, you have less frequency in the numbers.
But I think that everyone in our space would agree
that it's it's becoming more contested. I start I'm starting
to see a little bit of a drop off on
the level of contested matters now. But the past, you
(08:52):
know from from from two thousand and twenty one, definitely
through last year twenty twenty four, everything was very, very
heightened in terms of aggression and in terms of just
not being willing to compromise. Last year's when I first
started to see it taper off, and this year already
(09:13):
I see a big difference and just how people are
approaching the whole process. So we'll see maybe maybe it's
finally paper down a bit.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
That would be wonderful. Are the courts up to speed
since COVID.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
A lot of them are.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
There's I work in a lot of different jurisdictions, a
lot of a lot of different courthouses about I usually
do up five different courthouses and it's it's it's interesting
to see how they're run differently, and and so some
are are moving along very well. Some seem to be
a little bit behind in general. And I think you've
(09:58):
mentioned this before on your show. The one of the
benefits of the pandemic was that it stream blind a
lot of things. And one of the things that that
was streamlined. A lot was family law, and they were
in the process of making things easier procedurally beforehand, and
(10:18):
then the pandemic kind of sped that up out of
necessity because this was one area of the law obviously
that that needed to continue.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
We couldn't have a big, huge delay.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
And although there are a lot of people that will
complain that, you know, some things and some courts weren't
moving as quickly as they should. There were other things
and certainly other courts, and unfortunate that I was in
those courts that were working beautifully and they went through
you know, I wasn't a big fan of the online litigation,
(10:52):
but when we had nothing else, it was grateful.
Speaker 2 (10:56):
And then they automated.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
A lot of stuff so that there were you know,
if you have agreements now and there's certain other matters
where we can just file remotely, we can upload the
documents and we can get things approved without having to
go to court, whereas before, even if you had an agreement,
how to go to court, so people would have to
(11:18):
you know, arrange childcare, they'd have to travel, they take
the day off from work, all to go into court
and say yes I sign this, Yes I agree yes,
I'm satisfied with my counsel and I don't have any questions.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Whereas now we don't have to do that.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
They fill out affidavits that will take care of what
that that questioning, which was called the canvas used to accomplish.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
We upload everything and.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Nine percent of the time, unless the court has any questions,
they will just approve the agreements.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
Nathy, that's amazing. I did not know that. That is amazing,
not only for the lawyers involved and everywhere, but for
the for the you know, moms and dads who have
to take take off of work or have to get
like you said, babysitters and stuff like that. That's wonderful.
That's good news.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
And it's a big incentive to to to reach an
agreement and to come to a compromise, because that's a
big benefit. It used to be that it was just
available for temporary orders, but now it's available for even
final orders and even whole divorces. And if if you
can agree on all matters to your divorce, even you know,
(12:29):
temporary agreements and then the final agreement, whether you do
it by mediation or you do it by just you know,
like litigation, you could still come to in agreements with
with a litigated matter, with two attorneys.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
I tell people you can do your whole divorce process
and never have to set foot in the court, which
is a wonderful thing, is.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
Wonderful benefit, that is amazing. I remember I used to
get like the shaky's right before I had to go
into court. That whole feeling is And we're going to
dive into your your amazing book Divorce Matters, But before
we do, I've said this over and over and over
on the podcast. The most important first step that you
can do is find the right attorney. Find the person
(13:11):
that is you feel is going to you know, go
in there with your questions, Go see as many as
you can teet What is your biggest strength as an attorney?
My biggest what your biggest strength?
Speaker 3 (13:21):
Your biggest strength, the strength I would have to say
giving information to people, And I don't mean just legal information,
I mean information about the entire process. I've always felt
that an educated client is a good client, and we
really strive to not only give that information orally as
(13:44):
I'm representing people, but we've put a lot of information
over the years on our website, and we've put information
out in newsletters, and we've done workshops and presentations, and
that was really the start of the book. It was
the catalyst because as more and more people contacted us
(14:05):
and talked to me and said, I really, you know,
appreciated that information or I really I read a lot
about I read a lot of your you know, the
blogs or the articles, and and it made me feel
more comfortable or more confident.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
You know, I wish you could have more.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
I would do a presentation and they would say that
information was wonderful, but I need more, and I need more,
and everyone needs more. But there's never enough time, you know,
or to write everything, or at least I thought there wasn't.
Speaker 2 (14:35):
And then, you know, and people would.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
Say, you know, you should, you should, you should write
a book, or you should have a book or so
you get more information. And eventually that's really what prompted
me to sit down and say, Okay, I can never
you know, consult with someone this long to give them
all that information, but.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
I can at least start.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
So I started by taking those articles, organizing them for
an outline for myself, and then obviously a little by
a little, filling in the blanks with the help of
my editor, who would you know, he would notice all
the holes, you know, because I know what I know,
but you know, it was easier for him to see
where pieces were missing. So we would have weekly meetings,
(15:13):
weekly pow wows where he would kind of tease apart
what I had written and would ask the questions. And
it was great because he had never gone through a divorce.
He was an older gentleman who was it wasn't even
that familiar with divorce. So it was wonderful because what
I thought people would know or how would jump from
A to B. He would say, no, no, no, you
(15:34):
need to you know, how do you get from.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
A to B?
Speaker 3 (15:36):
And he would he would I would as I was talking,
he would say, Oh, you need to write that. You
need to write that, you need to write that. So
it was good to talk to someone who was so
outside YAH area.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
Amazing, wonderful.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Your book is a guideline, it's an education, and we're
going to talk about that more with Kathy Bluford when
right after this break from a from our sponsor, we're
going to take a quick commercial break. And one of
the things that I loved so much about this book
is that you even talked about life after divorce, and
people don't touch on that enough. So we're going to
talk about the entire book and that right when we
(16:13):
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percent on your device. We're back with Kathy Bouffard. She's
a partner at Bellnott and Beaufort and the book is
called Divorce Matters. It's such a great book. It's a guideline,
it's an education. And I bet if you hand people
that come to see you, you hand them the book
and they read that book, at least they'll have the
start of a guideline for them. There's so much in
(17:18):
this book. Where should we start. I get why you
wrote the book, and I get why it's so important.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
Yes, well, people would, people would and still do call
me up. Some people call me up with specific questions, right,
but most people call me up with that huge question
like what are my rights? Or you know, how can
I prepare myself for a divorce? Or I'm not sure
I'm ready for a divorce, but I'm thinking about it
(17:47):
and I want to get some information. And of course
those are all those valid questions, but they're so large.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
How could I possibly answer that?
Speaker 3 (17:55):
In you know, we always offer we offer a free
you know, phone consultation, but that's you know, that's heared
for like fifteen minutes. Just how can I help? Can
I help you? What's the approximate cost? What's the procedure?
Even when they came in for an hour long consultation,
I couldn't give them all of the information. So now
I can tell them, well, you know, I have this book.
(18:18):
I know it sounds like it sounds like a salesman.
You know, I have this book, it just came out,
But they're so happy when I tell them what it
what it's about, right, and what it entails, and how
it's going to give them the information. And I'm sure,
you know, I'm always sure to tell them. Look, this
is not going to be the only information you need.
It's not going to replace an attorney. It's not going
to tell you how your individual divorce is going to
(18:39):
end up. But it's going to give you that layout.
You know, it's going to give you. You're going to
see the process of how the divorce goes. You're going
to understand how it moves to the court. You're going
to understand what information you are going to need up
front before you even see an attorney, so that you
can start to prepare and gather some information. It's going
(19:01):
to tell you how to find an attorney, what to
look for an attorney, how to prepare for meeting with
your attorney, Like what questions you should start thinking of
so that you can ask the attorney what the attorney
might ask of you. You know, So these are all
things that people usually don't think about. That sort of stuff,
(19:22):
and why would you you know, you just think about,
you know, mostly the fear and the uncertainty, and you know,
like it's it's a it's a lot of emotion and.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
You don't even know where, you don't even know where
to start where, what do you're you're so you're it's
so overwhelming. The whole process is so overwhelming everything about it.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
Yeah, and it's and yeah, it's a big I mean
it's it's it's changing your whole entire life.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
It's affecting your whole entire life.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
So I do go through that and explain that what
they're going through is very common, is very natural, but
that you can't let you can't let fear and motion
obviously control of you, because because that's then you don't
you're you're, you lose control. So the whole point of
the book is regaining control. And the way you regain
(20:10):
control is to get information, because once you find out
the right information, then you know, you know, there's so
much worryings over sometimes over things that that never come
to pass, or that aren't aren't accurate or based.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
On incomplete information.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
So if you can get rid of that fear, and
then there are things that you should be worried about.
But once you know what you should be worried about,
then you know, how do I prepare? Okay, how am
I going to address this? And once you start to
address it and you have a plan of action, that's
you just start to regain control. And once you regain control,
(20:49):
then you can kind of calm yourself and say, Okay,
I have I have a plan, I know what I'm
supposed to do. I know this is the difference between
this is going to be hard, but there's a way
through it, and there's a path out, and I'm going
to focus on, you know, getting through that and looking
towards the future, which again is why I thought it
(21:10):
was important to include that last chapter is on the
future because people need to focus on that. So many
people focus behind and what they're losing and how everything's
changing and how nothing's going to be the same, And
it really is a mindset shift that's so important to
look forward and think about how things are going to
(21:33):
change for the better, how not everything has to change.
How how you know, think about what was working well,
you know, whether whether it was communication with you or
soon to be X, what works well that doesn't have
to change. Think about what traditions you have with your
children that you want to keep. Not everything has to
(21:53):
start anew you know, it's a it's a way for
you to kind of create your own next chapter.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
So I tell them about that.
Speaker 3 (22:03):
They get excited about it, they want to come, you know,
they pick up the book or they order the book,
and and they know that there's that help, that information
out there, and then obviously they build on it. I
explained to them that it's a it's a kind of
a springboard for you to then get an attourney, move forward.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
Help yourself.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
Knowledge is power, Yes, yeh, Knowledge is so pow.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
That's so important with your podcast that you're focusing on
positivity and not focusing on the negative.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
And I was very drawn to that when I was
introduced to your podcast.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
I think that that's excellent because I'm really, really I'm
not a fan of that victim mentality and and just
that the the the whole negativity you know that's out there.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
There's a lot of negativity. It's one thing to to.
Speaker 3 (22:56):
Empathize with someone and there's one thing to you know,
I certainly acknowledge that bad things happen to people, and
that people are taking advantage of. But I'm really a
big believer in, you know, getting the information, moving forward,
getting yourself out of a situation that's bad, and making
the best and the most of your life. And I
think everyone has that power to do that. They just
need a little help along the way. And a lot
(23:19):
of that help comes from from people like you who
provide the information for them to need and to make
them feel confident and move forward.
Speaker 1 (23:28):
Well, that means a lot. That means a lot to me, Kathy,
thank you. When I got divorced in two thousand and eight,
there was no books like yours Divorce Matters, there was
no podcast for me to listen to, there was nothing.
I've told this story often that there was this in
my small town. There was this one girl that I knew.
I didn't know her, but I knew she was going
(23:49):
through a divorce. And I sent her a message and says,
you don't know me, but I think we have something
in common.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
And she was my only link.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
And she didn't know anything either. So here we were
we're like, we don't even when we at these little kids,
we don't even know what to do. And you know,
I got blindsided a lot. I got gas lit a lot,
So it's important. This my podcast is so important. It's like,
this is what happened, and this is where I am,
this is what I did, and this is how I
(24:16):
got to the other side, and this so I'm living
my best life. And your book touched me so much
in the fact because it had so much information in it.
It was such a great guideline for people, and it
was easy to read, and it was full of information
that is so helpful that we that you need when
you're going through this because your emotions are all over
(24:36):
the place and you're not always thinking straight right, And
then you put in the in the in it also
like what happens after, because we don't when we're going
through this, we don't think about that. And there will
be a life after, whether it's a two point oh,
three point oh, there will be all of that.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
Sure.
Speaker 3 (24:54):
Another another big thing for me is I really like
to save people money, you know, and I am so
cognizant of the fact that divorce costs so much. If
you're trying to get good legal help, it's just not
inexpensive at all. So I wanted to let people know
(25:15):
that there were different options for like this whole chapter
dealing with attorneys fees. Right, it's like voodoo asking anyone
about money, and people are just so afraid of it.
But I wanted to break down how the charges. You
know what to expect with charges, not in particular dollar amounts,
but how they build and how you can keep your
costs lower. And there are options such as limited scope representation,
(25:38):
where if you really can't afford the full representation, you
can at least get some legal help. Because so many
people don't know that, that was very important to me,
and also the book itself being a reference. So so
many times people will call and talk to me, even
my own clients, and because their emotions and because they're
emotional and understandably so, and because so much is going on,
(26:02):
they may not get everything that I explain to them,
so sometimes they have to contact me again or say
can you repeat that? Whereas here they have the book
as a reference. So if I'm talking about depositions or
I'm talking about interrogatories, things that people just start familiar discussing,
they can hear me, they can understand my explanations. But
(26:23):
then if they need to, they can go back and
they can reference not that they can't call me. Of
course it doesn't to reheat myself. But they can go
back and now look at the chapter that deals with
the depositions, insturrogacaries their discovery, and it's like the notes.
It's like taking notes for them ahead of time. And
they've done the reverse where people have come to me.
(26:44):
It's so funny. They've come to me and they said, oh,
I've already read your book, and they know when I
start to talk about things, they're like, oh, yes, I
understand this, and then then I only understand it. It
reduces the time that I need to explain things to them,
which of course reduces their their their charges. So it's
(27:05):
it's coming full circle. And then they'll ask me those
springboard questions that you know that are really it's good,
like they've learned from the book. So it makes me
feel really really good.
Speaker 1 (27:18):
You have very fulfilling yes. And they can also like
write notes inside each chapter, like you know, the term's
child custody, write notes on it so and then keep
notes so then when they go to see you or
they go to see an attorney, they have all their
notes right there. They don't have to make the phone
cof to the phone call which winds up costing, and
so many people stay in a marriage because they can't
(27:40):
afford to get out. Yes, the money part was so important.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
Yes, and how to how and even just the different
ways of how people you know, come up with like
a retainer for an attorney, you're different options, like just
just to let them know there are options, you know,
So that was very important for me.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Yeah, the book, the book is so great. It's a
must read if you're thinking about going through a divorce,
if you're going through a divorce, divorce matters, what you
really need to know when it's time to get divorced.
It's such a well written book with so much great information. Remember,
knowledge is power. Last minute thoughts, Kathy.
Speaker 3 (28:24):
Just you know, don't be afraid to ask questions, to
reach out to get help. There is someone out there
who will help you, who will direct you to the
right information. And really try to focus on the positive.
A lot of life is about all about attitude and
(28:44):
positivity and it's not it's not just a word, you know,
it really is a movement that you have to start
within yourself and it will get better.
Speaker 2 (28:58):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
It's gonna be rough, but you can swim. You can
swim through it and you'll get there. You'll get you'll
get to the end eventually. This book. Remember divorce, it's
so much, such an emotional toll, financial, legally, all aspects,
especially if children are involved, the impact of yourself, your family,
your health, your well being. It affects everything. So this
book Divorce Matters. I encourage everyone, if you're going through
(29:22):
a divorce or you're thinking about divorce, get the book
Divorce Matters. Read it. It's your guideline. It's an education.
It's so well written, there's so much information, it's everything
you need to know. Thank you so much for sharing that.
Thank you so much for writing the book and for
helping so many out there.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
You're welcome.
Speaker 3 (29:40):
Thank you for helping spread the word, and for all
the good that you do as well.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
Thanks Kathy Nito Kuda. Divorce and Family Laws attorneys have
guided Connecticut and New York families through complex divorce actions,
contested child custody, and alimony disputes for over thirty years.
Their Connecticut and New York attorneys have extensive experience in
family matters involving substance abuse, domestic violence, mental illness, and
many other X factors that can complicate a divorce. Their
(30:08):
attorneys adeptly manage privacy and reputation concerns inherit to public
divorce proceedings and the related exposure for their ultra high
net worth clients. Find your new path forward, define your
post divorce family, and secure an enforceable agreement to protect
your future with Needlecuda Act. Now put the strength of
their team behind you. Visit them at needlecuda dot com
(30:31):
or call two O three five five seven nine to
five zero zero
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