The host of the Down & Dirty and Utes legend on the season beginning this month, His criteria for Pro Football Hall of Fame quarterbacks, Eric Weddle a Hall of Famer + more
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
This is the Sean O'Connell show.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
You were home of the best stun side of your US.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Let's get back to WOC.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
From the Murder Chevrolet Studio of ESPN seven hundred ninety
half Anna Shaw. On Monday, Scott Mitchell, the Utah quarterback
legend color analyst on Utah Radio broadcast.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
He's going to be calling Utah football this month. How
about that, Scott.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
We're in August and Utah's first game is also in August.
We're almost there, pal, Scott you there, Oh there he is?
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Sorry, Sorry, sorry, yeah, hello, Hi everybody.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
It's not game week, but it is Game month.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
No, it is, and it's it's really exciting. I mean,
the Hall of Fame game it always it always kind
of jumps up and bites you. You go, oh, it's
the Hall of Fame game is right now, and then
it just seems to just all be downhill from there.
But I'm super excited about this season for one reason,
and that's coach Winningham. He kind of said, look, I
(01:11):
wasn't going to go out on a note like I
did last year, and there just seems to be this
renewed fire seems to be coming from a place of
being the underdog and being counted out, and that's when
he's at his best coaching. I'm just really excited. I
just I just feel a really good energy with the
new players, the new coaches, and new direction, the new
(01:32):
found commitment from the school, and I can't wait for
it to start, all.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
Right, Scott, We're having some fun as the season approaches,
doing start bench cut and also doing the over, some
overs and unders on Utah numbers, offensive numbers especially, and
I sent one today over under the yardage total for
Utah's top individual wide receiver.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
Now, we don't know who that's going to be.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
You know better than I that at this in this
Utah football offense, sometimes a guy emerges that we we
have no idea who he's gonna be. Sometimes it's a
tight end, sometimes it's a slot wide receiver.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
Occasionally it's a it's.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
The you know, the big body, tall Tim Patrick or
Devon Vley types. I took the average of the last
decades worth of top wide receiver numbers and that comes
up to six hundred and ninety three yards, so six
ninety two and a half over under the top wide receiver,
(02:34):
whoever that ends up being for this Utah offense in
twenty twenty five. Do they get more than that or
less than that?
Speaker 2 (02:41):
I'm gonna say under that, And that's not a bad thing.
I really think this offense is gonna be one of
patchwork for production, and I just think you're gonna see
a lot of different people contribute in a lot of
different ways. I just I don't see with Utah being
able to run the football and having a way Seawn
(03:02):
Parker and having a quarterback that can run, I just
I don't I don't see that happening. But being able
to run the ball, it allows you to throw the
ball and if you can do it effective, which I
think Utah will be able to. I just I just
don't think there's a guy there that they're going to
rely on. I think they're going to rely on a
group of guys, and I think it's going to come
from a lot of places, including the tight end. I
(03:24):
think the tight end will be a part of what's
going on. So I don't think it's a bad thing,
but I think it's under that number.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
Okay, yeah, there, And we looked at we looked at
individually year by year. I mean even in the back
twelve championship years, you didn't have these, like Sellar super
huge numbers. I mean, dun Kin Kid had eight hundred
and ninety in one of those championship years. But there's
been plenty of times where Utah has had really good
teams contended for or even won a conference championship, or
(03:51):
your top receivers looking at it, you know about a
seven hundred yard season, So we'll we'll see how it
plays out. But a fun number to try and play with.
I was listening to Dirty today as I was driving,
and you were talking about a lot of different things,
your own start in sports, which is really interesting to hear.
As you know, I'm watching Little League World Series right now.
But but I know, like the Hall of Fame, the
(04:12):
NFL Hall of Fame Weekend is a special thing for
sports fans. I imagine even more so for guys who
played in the league for a long time to see
you know, the best of the best honored in that way.
And I just wanted you to expound on your thoughts
on you know, Hall of Fame weekend and especially what
you saw from Sterling Sharp and Jared Allen and company.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
Yeah, I usually like the Hall of Fame and it's
really the speeches, and it's I love to hear the backstory.
I love to hear why these guys got into it,
or who was that person or there's always some great
story or multiple stories from from how kids grow up.
And you know, you have Sterling Sharp and Shannon Stark
(04:56):
Sharp the only two brothers to make it into the
Hall of Fame, and man, I can't imagine what their
parents feel like, you know, and you know one would
be incredible, but to actually have multiple and then kind
of how they interacted and just I was just really
touched by, you know, Sterling giving his gold jacket to
(05:17):
his brother and genuinely doing that, and it was a
return on something that Shannon had done for Sterling because
he knew Shannon knew that how much it hurt Sterling
not to his career being shortened, and and and knowing
how much it meant to him and giving him a
super Bowl ring was really quite a tremendous thing. I mean,
(05:39):
we're all killing to get one Super Bowl ring and
here Shannon Sharp has given it away like it's candy.
Was a very very touching thing to me. And and
I love people like Jared Allen who's someone who kind
of comes out of nowhere. And it's really a testament
to you know, having that drive and that burn, and
that that you know, that work ethic, and that willingness
(06:03):
to just take your body to places that most people
just don't want to do. And and and so many
of these guys that they're just that there's willing to
just make unbelievable sacrifices, uh to to play consistently at
a high level for such a long period of time.
But I just I just love, I love the backstory.
(06:24):
I love I love you know, there's I think of
John Randall, who was undrafted. We were drafted the same year. Well,
he wasn't drafted. He was a free agent when they
had twelve rounds. So twelve times teams went through and
nobody picked John Randall, who became a Hall of Famer,
And the only way he got a shot was he
(06:45):
was undersized. He went the way in for.
Speaker 4 (06:47):
The the Minnesota Vikings, and he went to the hardware
store because he was too light, and he bought a
chain and a lock and he wrapped it around his
stomach like a belt, but he had sweats on and he.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Rolled it up. So they couldn't see it and he
barely made it like on the number, and they signed
him as a free agent, and that was a Hall
of Fame career started by you know, Shane from a
hardware store, you know. And I just love the story,
you know, and because so many of them, they're just
not cookie cutter and they're really like I just really
(07:22):
think they're an American story, you know, where these you
have dreams, and you know, I had a dream as
a kid and it became a reality and it was
a cool thing to accomplish that and to do it,
and so many people do it in so many different
areas of their life. But on this week it's it's
that celebration from football, and what an amazing thing, you know.
(07:45):
I just I've always been I wonder what that luncheon's
like with all the Hall of famers and you're in
that room and people talk about it who are there,
and they say, it's just an incredible experience to be
among the best of the best of all time and
you're in that room. Just really, I mean, who would
not want that.
Speaker 3 (08:08):
So one of the interesting things about Halls of Fame
for me is that there's there's very few that have
a written criteria of what you have to have accomplished
in your career in order to qualify. I mean, Utah
just established this ring of honor on the stadium and
they actually put some parameters on it and said you
(08:30):
have to have been part of two conference championships and
things like that, and it's like, Okay, that gives us
a framework to decide who gets to go in, at
least for Utah football, and I like that. But I
also like in the Pro Football Hall of Fame and
the Basketball Hall of Fame and the Baseball Hall of Fame,
you know, there's these debates and these other questions you
can have. I want to know the Scott Mitchell criteria
(08:53):
for what makes a Hall of Fame career, because there's
nuance to it at every different position. We'll go with
quarterbacks because that's the position you know best, that you
played at such a high level for so long. But
what makes a Pro Football Hall of Fame quarterback? In
your mind, it's more than just winning Super Bowls. Obviously,
there's plenty of guys in there who haven't won one
(09:14):
and still made it. You tell me, if you get
the vote, what does a guy have to have done
in order to get the Scott Mitchell endorsement into the
Pro Football Hall of Fame.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
So it kind of you have to go on eras
really quick before I answer your question. I've had I've
had people who have a vote for the Hall of
Fame actually call me about players and and kind of
because did I contemporaries that I played against, you know,
and on on multiple uh you know times, or you know,
(09:47):
like Leroy Butler, who was a defensive back for the
Green Bay Packers, who I thought was one of the
best safeties in my era. Uh, you know, better than
several guys who made it into the Hall of Fame.
But you know, so it's kind of easy to speak
of that debate. You know, I've been a part of
that debate, and it's a fun debate to have and
(10:08):
to be a part of. But for quarterbacks, you know,
you look at a guy like Dan Marino, where like
if you talk to anyone, everyone says he was the best,
like he was the best, like how he threw the football,
the era that he was in and the production he
had was not a common thing. And then you look
at someone like Joe Montana, who was of the same
(10:31):
era who won multiple Super Bowls and was just masterful.
Like those two guys were, you know, the class of
the class of that era. And yet Joe Montana will
tell you that Marino was the very best. And then
there are other people like you know, Troy Aikman, who
won multiple Super Bowls and was a part of really,
(10:53):
really good teams and didn't have the numbers but certainly
had you know, he was very successful within a very
successful team. And that's similar to a guy like you
could say that about Terry Bradshaw, you could say that
about Bob Greasy, you could say that about someone like
Roger Staubach. But I think also, and this isn't my vote,
(11:19):
but there's certainly there certainly is name recognition, popularity. A
guy like Kenny Anderson. Kenny Anderson played every year against
the Pittsburgh Steelers and you know, one of the greatest
defenses of all time and he had to face him
his whole entire career twice a year and went to
(11:40):
a Super Bowl, and the numbers for his era, you
absolutely could say that guy was in the Hall of Fame.
And being around him and just the production against the
competition in the era, you know, Kenny Anderson has a
better career than Ken Stabler, then you know, you could
argue against than Roger Stopbach other than winning the Super Bowls.
(12:03):
And he was a really really good player that's really
gotten bypassed and probably won't make it, but should make it.
And then you have a guy like Kurt Warner who
had kind of a shorter window but really kind of
made a punch, you know, won a super Bowl, lost
the Super Bowl, went to and you know, lost two
(12:24):
super Bowls. And I would have said, had Kurt Warner
not had a resurgence with like the Arizona Cardinals, don't
I don't know that he got in. I don't know
that I don't you know, I don't know. It's I'm
kind of I'm like, you got to play for a
long time, and and you got to throw for a
lot of yards, and you got you just have to
(12:45):
consistently be productive at that position. And and so I'm
going to say, guy's got to play, you know, at
least twelve years. I mean, now it's it's it's like
playing with monopoly money because these guys five thousand yards
seasons are like normal. So it's just so different today
and it's harder. It's harder to gauge, but you know,
(13:07):
these guys are going to be upwards of like Philip
River is probably going to be in the Hall of Fame.
He and Eli Manning are kind of the two guys
right now. I was surprised Eli Manning didn't get in
this time. I mean because numbers wise, he's certainly up there.
But it's there's a perception thing that it's almost like, well,
they won kind of in spite of him. He wasn't
(13:29):
really because Eli's kind of frumpy. You know, he's not
really he's not really that entertaining or engaging or but he,
you know, he was. He was pretty productive. He was
a percentage wise, it's much more productive than than Peyton
in the playoffs and the Super Bowl era. I mean,
Peyton Manning lost his first five years in the playoffs,
(13:51):
didn't even win. I mean, if Peyton mann doesn't have
a great playoff record, but he has the personality, he
has the name, he has the kind of thing that
and I think that's part of why some guys get
in the hall. I mean, you could argue Paul Horning
shouldn't be in the Hall. There's a lot of guys
that you could argue about. I'm not like John Lynch.
(14:12):
I know we're talking about quarterbacks here. I just think
I think it's super subjective. I know I'm probably not
answering your question like specifically with numbers, but certainly it's numbers.
But I think there's also like it's kind of the
respect of the players around you, like being not in
(14:35):
the Pro Bowl, but being like an All Pro. I
think there needs to be so many because the Pro
Bowl is kind of a that's just a joke, that's
a that's a popularity contest.
Speaker 3 (14:45):
Is a popularity contest, and All Pro is more prestigious
inside the locker room.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
Yeah, and it's kind of one of those things where
players just know, you know, you know, like you know
who the best guys are, even if they're like I
you know, I remember sitting in a meeting with Dan
Marina watching game film and he goes, you know who
was playing really good? Is that Troy Aikman. Like he's
(15:14):
like he like Troy Aikman was and he probably could
have had bigger numbers had he been on a different team,
but but he, you know, he was a good guy.
And it's it's the same. I mean you think back
of like it's Terry Bradshaw and Roger Staubach in kind
of that seventies era, Like those were the names. Those
were the guys, like they just were the They just
(15:37):
were looked at as the best players, you know, and
you look at the best players today, it's like Lamar Jackson,
Josh Allen, Patrick Mahomes, Matthew Stafford, Joe Burrow, like you
just know, those are the best guys. Like Matthew Stafford
will be in the Hall of Fame. And he had
a really you know, terrible win loss percentage when he
(15:59):
was with the Detroit Lions, but he's he's like he's
one of the best quarterbacks. I guess you know, I
would pick him on my team. I think he's really good.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Are wins the quarterback staff for you?
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Oh man, it's it's not as it's not as as
important as it is production. I think it's I think
it speaks well for someone who you know, you look
at Joe Johnson or who played for the Cleveland Browns,
who's in the Hall of Fame, like to go, you know,
(16:35):
almost a decade with like barely winning a game and
showing up every week and playing and playing well and
playing at a high level. I mean, you look at
a guy like Warren Moon never never won a super Bowl,
but certainly played. I think I think Warren Moon's best
trade is that he played a long long time and
(16:58):
played at a pretty high level for a longeriod of time.
But it wasn't really very successful in the playoffs or
you know, but he so winning total. I mean, Jim
Kelly was extremely productive for the Buffalo Bills and never
won a super Bowl. And I got to the Super Bowls,
but you know, a lot of I mean, Philip Rivers,
(17:22):
it's going to be that conversation. I just you know,
and you know, I think what they do is they
get they put super Bowls on it for guys that
maybe don't have the same you know, like Troy Aikman
won a lot of Super Bowls, but I don't know
that his production was as much as some of these
other guys. Or I mean, you could even say, like
(17:42):
Drew Brees would be in the Hall of Fame. It
should be in the Hall of Fame, but you know,
he did win the one super Bowl. But the other
thing you have to realize, it's freaking hard to win
a Super Bowl, especially when Tom Brady just gobbles a
bunch of them up by himself.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
There's gonna be documentaries someday, and if nobody else makes them,
I want to about the people who stood in the
way of other people's championships.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
In the NFL, certainly in the NBA, we saw that.
Speaker 3 (18:14):
You know, John Stockton and Carl Malone are two of
the best fifty players ever in the history of the NBA.
They were on the same damn team for twenty years
and couldn't get a finals win because of Michael Jordan.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
Right, if Michael Jordan just could have played baseball a
little bit longer.
Speaker 3 (18:31):
If the NBA would have just suspended Michael Jordan a
little bit longer for his gambling and made him go
play baseball, then Carl and John could have won it.
I mean, there's just there's sore in combat sports. There's
great examples of this where you can beat everybody in
the world as a boxer or as an MMA fighter,
but you just can't beat the champ, the one guy,
(18:51):
and you're just so you go down as the also ran.
It's a It's fascinating and Tom Brady is that dude.
Speaker 1 (18:57):
For I don't know how many players in the NA Yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
I mean Peyton Manning. I mean you could say each
ton of guys. You know, there's no question. Maybe it's
the Pittsburgh Steelers and Ben Roethlisberg. I mean there's you
know that they were really good and maybe they got
robbed a little bit. I mean who knows that, But yeah, definitely,
definitely Brady heard a lot of people.
Speaker 3 (19:17):
Okay, somebody calls somebody calls Scott Mitchell and says, hey,
is Eric Weddle going to be an NFL Hall of
Fame or what do you say?
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Oh? See, I think safeties are really hard. I really,
I really do, because your value to a team in
so many ways is not you know, it's not it's
not measured on interceptions, it's not measured on you know, tackles,
(19:46):
it's it's there. There's just a lot of interest in
interested well, there's a lot of I can't even say
that word right now. I'm trying to, Uh, there's some
value that you can't put into into statistics. And I
think Weddle's one of those guys. You look at what
he did for the Rams. You know, he was just
(20:08):
this calming influence in this kind of piece that I
think really helped them get over over the top, and
he was just very productive. They kind of their gamers,
you know, they just tend to show up at the
right time, at the right place, and I think he's
one of one of those guys, Like, well, let me
(20:30):
just say this, if John Lynch is in the Hall
of Fame, Eric Weddles should be in the Hall of Fame.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
I'm glad you said exactly that, because I'll be saying that.
I pulled up the numbers for both guys. John Lynch
played from ninety three to two thousand and seven, so
he's fifteen seasons, right, and he in those fifteen seasons
he had twenty six interceptions. Eric Weddle in his thirteen seasons,
(20:56):
plus the little stint with the with the rams that
ended up giving him the Super Bowl ring he's so
long coveted, he had more. He had twenty nine interceptions
in fewer years. John Lynch never scored a touchdown. Weddell
scored four touchdowns. Uh, and he was a five time
All Pro and a six time Pro Bowler. So it's
(21:19):
right there, right, I mean, you're talking about a guy
who's on that in that same conversation. And if one
guy's in that conversation and he gets in, what would
keep the other guy in the conversation out?
Speaker 1 (21:32):
That becomes, I guess something above my pay grade.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
But if Eric Weddle, if Eric Weddle wants to get
into the Hall of Fame, he needs to go out
and publicly be public. I just think I just think
John Lynch was a part of being out and kind
of about because a lot of the voters are sports
writers and a lot of people you know and you
kind of are. When you put front of mind, it does.
(22:00):
I think it does play into people's psyche and and
you just you've talked about more, you know, when you
when you're out there, it's like, you know, I'm on
the radio talking about my career, which was never a
Hall of Fame career, but I you know, I'm I'm
talking about my experiences, and I think it's one of
those things would bode well from I mean, if I
(22:20):
had a choice between the two, I would take Eric Weddle,
and not because he's a Utah guy or whatever, but
just because of how he played the game. John Lynch
never put the fear of God into me like I
never thought, oh man, John Lynch is going to make
a play. But there are you know, Benny Blades I
played with in Detroit, thought he was a better safety.
Mark Carrier who played for the Bears and we played
(22:41):
together in Detroit. You know, Leroy Butler, A lot of guys,
Darren Woodson, Steve Att. I mean, there's a ton of
guys that I would put ahead of a guy like
like John I was. That was a shocking one to
me actually, And I know he's a great guy and
he's a smart guy. Went to Stanford and he was
a really good player. But that defense he was in
(23:03):
just you know, it wasn't it almost in some ways
kind of protected someone like that. I just I never
saw anything from him. I go, Wow, John Lynch's kind
of got the it factor.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
Well, the the eras obviously, what ear you played in
affects things pretty drastically, the teams you played on, if
you collected those rings, this Pro Bowl, the All Pro,
all that stuff. It's really fascinating to see how it
all kind of shakes out. I mean, there's Alex Smith
his first year of eligibilities next year. I don't even
think he's going to be talked about as a Hall
of Fame guy. He's got some pretty tang impressive numbers,
(23:39):
some longevity, and how do you factor in like the
comeback after you know, almost dying, almost losing your leg
and then you come back, Like what is that in
terms of like, you know, a reputation builder or a
way that people might consider you more strongly because of
what you did, even if it's harder to measure, you
(24:01):
know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (24:02):
Yeah, And and Alex is out, you know, he's he's
he's doing commentating and and and so he's he's able
to kind of tell his story because his story is
compelling and and and there's certainly a sympathy vote for
it or you know, it's it's one of those great
story kind of things, and and you you get a
lot of you know, uh, it's like it's it's the
(24:25):
magic of marketing and promotion. And you know, you just
you say it enough, you're repeated enough, and people hear
it enough and then they engage with it, and and
you know, that's that's where I think some of these
Hall of Fame decisions come from.
Speaker 3 (24:39):
For sure, Well, Scott, I've chewed up way too much
of your time. I always appreciate you jumping on.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
That's fun conversations.
Speaker 3 (24:47):
Uh, we're almost there, man, just a few more weeks
and then we're you're you're calling you tough football games.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Can't wait.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
It'll be a lot of fun. Thank you, Sean Scott Mitchell.
Speaker 3 (24:57):
You can hear him on The Down and Dirty immediately
preceding my show Monday through Friday here on ESPN seven
hundred ninety TWOEFM
This is the Sean O'Connell show.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
You were home of the best stun side of your US.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Let's get back to WOC.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
From the Murder Chevrolet Studio of ESPN seven hundred ninety
half Anna Shaw. On Monday, Scott Mitchell, the Utah quarterback
legend color analyst on Utah Radio broadcast.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
He's going to be calling Utah football this month. How
about that, Scott.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
We're in August and Utah's first game is also in August.
We're almost there, pal, Scott you there, Oh there he is?
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Sorry, Sorry, sorry, yeah, hello, Hi everybody.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
It's not game week, but it is Game month.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
No, it is, and it's it's really exciting. I mean,
the Hall of Fame game it always it always kind
of jumps up and bites you. You go, oh, it's
the Hall of Fame game is right now, and then
it just seems to just all be downhill from there.
But I'm super excited about this season for one reason,
and that's coach Winningham. He kind of said, look, I
(01:11):
wasn't going to go out on a note like I
did last year, and there just seems to be this
renewed fire seems to be coming from a place of
being the underdog and being counted out, and that's when
he's at his best coaching. I'm just really excited. I
just I just feel a really good energy with the
new players, the new coaches, and new direction, the new
(01:32):
found commitment from the school, and I can't wait for
it to start, all.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
Right, Scott, We're having some fun as the season approaches,
doing start bench cut and also doing the over, some
overs and unders on Utah numbers, offensive numbers especially, and
I sent one today over under the yardage total for
Utah's top individual wide receiver.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
Now, we don't know who that's going to be.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
You know better than I that at this in this
Utah football offense, sometimes a guy emerges that we we
have no idea who he's gonna be. Sometimes it's a
tight end, sometimes it's a slot wide receiver.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
Occasionally it's a it's.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
The you know, the big body, tall Tim Patrick or
Devon Vley types. I took the average of the last
decades worth of top wide receiver numbers and that comes
up to six hundred and ninety three yards, so six
ninety two and a half over under the top wide receiver,
(02:34):
whoever that ends up being for this Utah offense in
twenty twenty five. Do they get more than that or
less than that?
Speaker 2 (02:41):
I'm gonna say under that, And that's not a bad thing.
I really think this offense is gonna be one of
patchwork for production, and I just think you're gonna see
a lot of different people contribute in a lot of
different ways. I just I don't see with Utah being
able to run the football and having a way Seawn
(03:02):
Parker and having a quarterback that can run, I just
I don't I don't see that happening. But being able
to run the ball, it allows you to throw the
ball and if you can do it effective, which I
think Utah will be able to. I just I just
don't think there's a guy there that they're going to
rely on. I think they're going to rely on a
group of guys, and I think it's going to come
from a lot of places, including the tight end. I
(03:24):
think the tight end will be a part of what's
going on. So I don't think it's a bad thing,
but I think it's under that number.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
Okay, yeah, there, And we looked at we looked at
individually year by year. I mean even in the back
twelve championship years, you didn't have these, like Sellar super
huge numbers. I mean, dun Kin Kid had eight hundred
and ninety in one of those championship years. But there's
been plenty of times where Utah has had really good
teams contended for or even won a conference championship, or
(03:51):
your top receivers looking at it, you know about a
seven hundred yard season, So we'll we'll see how it
plays out. But a fun number to try and play with.
I was listening to Dirty today as I was driving,
and you were talking about a lot of different things,
your own start in sports, which is really interesting to hear.
As you know, I'm watching Little League World Series right now.
But but I know, like the Hall of Fame, the
(04:12):
NFL Hall of Fame Weekend is a special thing for
sports fans. I imagine even more so for guys who
played in the league for a long time to see
you know, the best of the best honored in that way.
And I just wanted you to expound on your thoughts
on you know, Hall of Fame weekend and especially what
you saw from Sterling Sharp and Jared Allen and company.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
Yeah, I usually like the Hall of Fame and it's
really the speeches, and it's I love to hear the backstory.
I love to hear why these guys got into it,
or who was that person or there's always some great
story or multiple stories from from how kids grow up.
And you know, you have Sterling Sharp and Shannon Stark
(04:56):
Sharp the only two brothers to make it into the
Hall of Fame, and man, I can't imagine what their
parents feel like, you know, and you know one would
be incredible, but to actually have multiple and then kind
of how they interacted and just I was just really
touched by, you know, Sterling giving his gold jacket to
(05:17):
his brother and genuinely doing that, and it was a
return on something that Shannon had done for Sterling because
he knew Shannon knew that how much it hurt Sterling
not to his career being shortened, and and and knowing
how much it meant to him and giving him a
super Bowl ring was really quite a tremendous thing. I mean,
(05:39):
we're all killing to get one Super Bowl ring and
here Shannon Sharp has given it away like it's candy.
Was a very very touching thing to me. And and
I love people like Jared Allen who's someone who kind
of comes out of nowhere. And it's really a testament
to you know, having that drive and that burn, and
that that you know, that work ethic, and that willingness
(06:03):
to just take your body to places that most people
just don't want to do. And and and so many
of these guys that they're just that there's willing to
just make unbelievable sacrifices, uh to to play consistently at
a high level for such a long period of time.
But I just I just love, I love the backstory.
(06:24):
I love I love you know, there's I think of
John Randall, who was undrafted. We were drafted the same year. Well,
he wasn't drafted. He was a free agent when they
had twelve rounds. So twelve times teams went through and
nobody picked John Randall, who became a Hall of Famer,
And the only way he got a shot was he
(06:45):
was undersized. He went the way in for.
Speaker 4 (06:47):
The the Minnesota Vikings, and he went to the hardware
store because he was too light, and he bought a
chain and a lock and he wrapped it around his
stomach like a belt, but he had sweats on and he.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Rolled it up. So they couldn't see it and he
barely made it like on the number, and they signed
him as a free agent, and that was a Hall
of Fame career started by you know, Shane from a
hardware store, you know. And I just love the story,
you know, and because so many of them, they're just
not cookie cutter and they're really like I just really
(07:22):
think they're an American story, you know, where these you
have dreams, and you know, I had a dream as
a kid and it became a reality and it was
a cool thing to accomplish that and to do it,
and so many people do it in so many different
areas of their life. But on this week it's it's
that celebration from football, and what an amazing thing, you know.
(07:45):
I just I've always been I wonder what that luncheon's
like with all the Hall of famers and you're in
that room and people talk about it who are there,
and they say, it's just an incredible experience to be
among the best of the best of all time and
you're in that room. Just really, I mean, who would
not want that.
Speaker 3 (08:08):
So one of the interesting things about Halls of Fame
for me is that there's there's very few that have
a written criteria of what you have to have accomplished
in your career in order to qualify. I mean, Utah
just established this ring of honor on the stadium and
they actually put some parameters on it and said you
(08:30):
have to have been part of two conference championships and
things like that, and it's like, Okay, that gives us
a framework to decide who gets to go in, at
least for Utah football, and I like that. But I
also like in the Pro Football Hall of Fame and
the Basketball Hall of Fame and the Baseball Hall of Fame,
you know, there's these debates and these other questions you
can have. I want to know the Scott Mitchell criteria
(08:53):
for what makes a Hall of Fame career, because there's
nuance to it at every different position. We'll go with
quarterbacks because that's the position you know best, that you
played at such a high level for so long. But
what makes a Pro Football Hall of Fame quarterback? In
your mind, it's more than just winning Super Bowls. Obviously,
there's plenty of guys in there who haven't won one
(09:14):
and still made it. You tell me, if you get
the vote, what does a guy have to have done
in order to get the Scott Mitchell endorsement into the
Pro Football Hall of Fame.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
So it kind of you have to go on eras
really quick before I answer your question. I've had I've
had people who have a vote for the Hall of
Fame actually call me about players and and kind of
because did I contemporaries that I played against, you know,
and on on multiple uh you know times, or you know,
(09:47):
like Leroy Butler, who was a defensive back for the
Green Bay Packers, who I thought was one of the
best safeties in my era. Uh, you know, better than
several guys who made it into the Hall of Fame.
But you know, so it's kind of easy to speak
of that debate. You know, I've been a part of
that debate, and it's a fun debate to have and
(10:08):
to be a part of. But for quarterbacks, you know,
you look at a guy like Dan Marino, where like
if you talk to anyone, everyone says he was the best,
like he was the best, like how he threw the football,
the era that he was in and the production he
had was not a common thing. And then you look
at someone like Joe Montana, who was of the same
(10:31):
era who won multiple Super Bowls and was just masterful.
Like those two guys were, you know, the class of
the class of that era. And yet Joe Montana will
tell you that Marino was the very best. And then
there are other people like you know, Troy Aikman, who
won multiple Super Bowls and was a part of really,
(10:53):
really good teams and didn't have the numbers but certainly
had you know, he was very successful within a very
successful team. And that's similar to a guy like you
could say that about Terry Bradshaw, you could say that
about Bob Greasy, you could say that about someone like
Roger Staubach. But I think also, and this isn't my vote,
(11:19):
but there's certainly there certainly is name recognition, popularity. A
guy like Kenny Anderson. Kenny Anderson played every year against
the Pittsburgh Steelers and you know, one of the greatest
defenses of all time and he had to face him
his whole entire career twice a year and went to
(11:40):
a Super Bowl, and the numbers for his era, you
absolutely could say that guy was in the Hall of Fame.
And being around him and just the production against the
competition in the era, you know, Kenny Anderson has a
better career than Ken Stabler, then you know, you could
argue against than Roger Stopbach other than winning the Super Bowls.
(12:03):
And he was a really really good player that's really
gotten bypassed and probably won't make it, but should make it.
And then you have a guy like Kurt Warner who
had kind of a shorter window but really kind of
made a punch, you know, won a super Bowl, lost
the Super Bowl, went to and you know, lost two
(12:24):
super Bowls. And I would have said, had Kurt Warner
not had a resurgence with like the Arizona Cardinals, don't
I don't know that he got in. I don't know
that I don't you know, I don't know. It's I'm
kind of I'm like, you got to play for a
long time, and and you got to throw for a
lot of yards, and you got you just have to
(12:45):
consistently be productive at that position. And and so I'm
going to say, guy's got to play, you know, at
least twelve years. I mean, now it's it's it's like
playing with monopoly money because these guys five thousand yards
seasons are like normal. So it's just so different today
and it's harder. It's harder to gauge, but you know,
(13:07):
these guys are going to be upwards of like Philip
River is probably going to be in the Hall of Fame.
He and Eli Manning are kind of the two guys
right now. I was surprised Eli Manning didn't get in
this time. I mean because numbers wise, he's certainly up there.
But it's there's a perception thing that it's almost like, well,
they won kind of in spite of him. He wasn't
(13:29):
really because Eli's kind of frumpy. You know, he's not
really he's not really that entertaining or engaging or but he,
you know, he was. He was pretty productive. He was
a percentage wise, it's much more productive than than Peyton
in the playoffs and the Super Bowl era. I mean,
Peyton Manning lost his first five years in the playoffs,
(13:51):
didn't even win. I mean, if Peyton mann doesn't have
a great playoff record, but he has the personality, he
has the name, he has the kind of thing that
and I think that's part of why some guys get
in the hall. I mean, you could argue Paul Horning
shouldn't be in the Hall. There's a lot of guys
that you could argue about. I'm not like John Lynch.
(14:12):
I know we're talking about quarterbacks here. I just think
I think it's super subjective. I know I'm probably not
answering your question like specifically with numbers, but certainly it's numbers.
But I think there's also like it's kind of the
respect of the players around you, like being not in
(14:35):
the Pro Bowl, but being like an All Pro. I
think there needs to be so many because the Pro
Bowl is kind of a that's just a joke, that's
a that's a popularity contest.
Speaker 3 (14:45):
Is a popularity contest, and All Pro is more prestigious
inside the locker room.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
Yeah, and it's kind of one of those things where
players just know, you know, you know, like you know
who the best guys are, even if they're like I
you know, I remember sitting in a meeting with Dan
Marina watching game film and he goes, you know who
was playing really good? Is that Troy Aikman. Like he's
(15:14):
like he like Troy Aikman was and he probably could
have had bigger numbers had he been on a different team,
but but he, you know, he was a good guy.
And it's it's the same. I mean you think back
of like it's Terry Bradshaw and Roger Staubach in kind
of that seventies era, Like those were the names. Those
were the guys, like they just were the They just
(15:37):
were looked at as the best players, you know, and
you look at the best players today, it's like Lamar Jackson,
Josh Allen, Patrick Mahomes, Matthew Stafford, Joe Burrow, like you
just know, those are the best guys. Like Matthew Stafford
will be in the Hall of Fame. And he had
a really you know, terrible win loss percentage when he
(15:59):
was with the Detroit Lions, but he's he's like he's
one of the best quarterbacks. I guess you know, I
would pick him on my team. I think he's really good.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Are wins the quarterback staff for you?
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Oh man, it's it's not as it's not as as
important as it is production. I think it's I think
it speaks well for someone who you know, you look
at Joe Johnson or who played for the Cleveland Browns,
who's in the Hall of Fame, like to go, you know,
(16:35):
almost a decade with like barely winning a game and
showing up every week and playing and playing well and
playing at a high level. I mean, you look at
a guy like Warren Moon never never won a super Bowl,
but certainly played. I think I think Warren Moon's best
trade is that he played a long long time and
(16:58):
played at a pretty high level for a longeriod of time.
But it wasn't really very successful in the playoffs or
you know, but he so winning total. I mean, Jim
Kelly was extremely productive for the Buffalo Bills and never
won a super Bowl. And I got to the Super Bowls,
but you know, a lot of I mean, Philip Rivers,
(17:22):
it's going to be that conversation. I just you know,
and you know, I think what they do is they
get they put super Bowls on it for guys that
maybe don't have the same you know, like Troy Aikman
won a lot of Super Bowls, but I don't know
that his production was as much as some of these
other guys. Or I mean, you could even say, like
(17:42):
Drew Brees would be in the Hall of Fame. It
should be in the Hall of Fame, but you know,
he did win the one super Bowl. But the other
thing you have to realize, it's freaking hard to win
a Super Bowl, especially when Tom Brady just gobbles a
bunch of them up by himself.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
There's gonna be documentaries someday, and if nobody else makes them,
I want to about the people who stood in the
way of other people's championships.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
In the NFL, certainly in the NBA, we saw that.
Speaker 3 (18:14):
You know, John Stockton and Carl Malone are two of
the best fifty players ever in the history of the NBA.
They were on the same damn team for twenty years
and couldn't get a finals win because of Michael Jordan.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
Right, if Michael Jordan just could have played baseball a
little bit longer.
Speaker 3 (18:31):
If the NBA would have just suspended Michael Jordan a
little bit longer for his gambling and made him go
play baseball, then Carl and John could have won it.
I mean, there's just there's sore in combat sports. There's
great examples of this where you can beat everybody in
the world as a boxer or as an MMA fighter,
but you just can't beat the champ, the one guy,
(18:51):
and you're just so you go down as the also ran.
It's a It's fascinating and Tom Brady is that dude.
Speaker 1 (18:57):
For I don't know how many players in the NA Yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
I mean Peyton Manning. I mean you could say each
ton of guys. You know, there's no question. Maybe it's
the Pittsburgh Steelers and Ben Roethlisberg. I mean there's you
know that they were really good and maybe they got
robbed a little bit. I mean who knows that, But yeah, definitely,
definitely Brady heard a lot of people.
Speaker 3 (19:17):
Okay, somebody calls somebody calls Scott Mitchell and says, hey,
is Eric Weddle going to be an NFL Hall of
Fame or what do you say?
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Oh? See, I think safeties are really hard. I really,
I really do, because your value to a team in
so many ways is not you know, it's not it's
not measured on interceptions, it's not measured on you know, tackles,
(19:46):
it's it's there. There's just a lot of interest in
interested well, there's a lot of I can't even say
that word right now. I'm trying to, Uh, there's some
value that you can't put into into statistics. And I
think Weddle's one of those guys. You look at what
he did for the Rams. You know, he was just
(20:08):
this calming influence in this kind of piece that I
think really helped them get over over the top, and
he was just very productive. They kind of their gamers,
you know, they just tend to show up at the
right time, at the right place, and I think he's
one of one of those guys, Like, well, let me
(20:30):
just say this, if John Lynch is in the Hall
of Fame, Eric Weddles should be in the Hall of Fame.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
I'm glad you said exactly that, because I'll be saying that.
I pulled up the numbers for both guys. John Lynch
played from ninety three to two thousand and seven, so
he's fifteen seasons, right, and he in those fifteen seasons
he had twenty six interceptions. Eric Weddle in his thirteen seasons,
(20:56):
plus the little stint with the with the rams that
ended up giving him the Super Bowl ring he's so
long coveted, he had more. He had twenty nine interceptions
in fewer years. John Lynch never scored a touchdown. Weddell
scored four touchdowns. Uh, and he was a five time
All Pro and a six time Pro Bowler. So it's
(21:19):
right there, right, I mean, you're talking about a guy
who's on that in that same conversation. And if one
guy's in that conversation and he gets in, what would
keep the other guy in the conversation out?
Speaker 1 (21:32):
That becomes, I guess something above my pay grade.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
But if Eric Weddle, if Eric Weddle wants to get
into the Hall of Fame, he needs to go out
and publicly be public. I just think I just think
John Lynch was a part of being out and kind
of about because a lot of the voters are sports
writers and a lot of people you know and you
kind of are. When you put front of mind, it does.
(22:00):
I think it does play into people's psyche and and
you just you've talked about more, you know, when you
when you're out there, it's like, you know, I'm on
the radio talking about my career, which was never a
Hall of Fame career, but I you know, I'm I'm
talking about my experiences, and I think it's one of
those things would bode well from I mean, if I
(22:20):
had a choice between the two, I would take Eric Weddle,
and not because he's a Utah guy or whatever, but
just because of how he played the game. John Lynch
never put the fear of God into me like I
never thought, oh man, John Lynch is going to make
a play. But there are you know, Benny Blades I
played with in Detroit, thought he was a better safety.
Mark Carrier who played for the Bears and we played
(22:41):
together in Detroit. You know, Leroy Butler, A lot of guys,
Darren Woodson, Steve Att. I mean, there's a ton of
guys that I would put ahead of a guy like
like John I was. That was a shocking one to
me actually, And I know he's a great guy and
he's a smart guy. Went to Stanford and he was
a really good player. But that defense he was in
(23:03):
just you know, it wasn't it almost in some ways
kind of protected someone like that. I just I never
saw anything from him. I go, Wow, John Lynch's kind
of got the it factor.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
Well, the the eras obviously, what ear you played in
affects things pretty drastically, the teams you played on, if
you collected those rings, this Pro Bowl, the All Pro,
all that stuff. It's really fascinating to see how it
all kind of shakes out. I mean, there's Alex Smith
his first year of eligibilities next year. I don't even
think he's going to be talked about as a Hall
of Fame guy. He's got some pretty tang impressive numbers,
(23:39):
some longevity, and how do you factor in like the
comeback after you know, almost dying, almost losing your leg
and then you come back, Like what is that in
terms of like, you know, a reputation builder or a
way that people might consider you more strongly because of
what you did, even if it's harder to measure, you
(24:01):
know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (24:02):
Yeah, And and Alex is out, you know, he's he's
he's doing commentating and and and so he's he's able
to kind of tell his story because his story is
compelling and and and there's certainly a sympathy vote for
it or you know, it's it's one of those great
story kind of things, and and you you get a
lot of you know, uh, it's like it's it's the
(24:25):
magic of marketing and promotion. And you know, you just
you say it enough, you're repeated enough, and people hear
it enough and then they engage with it, and and
you know, that's that's where I think some of these
Hall of Fame decisions come from.
Speaker 3 (24:39):
For sure, Well, Scott, I've chewed up way too much
of your time. I always appreciate you jumping on.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
That's fun conversations.
Speaker 3 (24:47):
Uh, we're almost there, man, just a few more weeks
and then we're you're you're calling you tough football games.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Can't wait.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
It'll be a lot of fun. Thank you, Sean Scott Mitchell.
Speaker 3 (24:57):
You can hear him on The Down and Dirty immediately
preceding my show Monday through Friday here on ESPN seven
hundred ninety TWOEFM
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