0204: Meet Jessica K. Foster: Behind the Books “Andy and the Extroverts” and “Summer of Something

🎙 Season 2, Episode 4: Discovering YA Magic with Jessica K. Foster 🌟

In this episode of The Uncomfortable Talk Show, host Susan Moore sits down with YA author Jessica K. Foster, the creative force behind Andy and the Extroverts and Andy and the Summer of Something. Jessica writes funny, heartfelt stories about introverted teens learning to find their voice, and in this conversation, we explore the inspiration behind her books, her journey as an author, and how she balances life as a middle school teacher and storyteller. 🌱

Jessica opens up about her love of YA fiction, the process of creating relatable characters like Andy, and her own experiences navigating introversion. Whether you’re a fan of young adult fiction, a writer looking for inspiration, or just someone who enjoys a great conversation, this episode is for you!

 💬✨🔗 Check out Jessica’s books and learn more at jessicakfoster.com

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hello everyone, and welcome back to The Uncomfortable Talk Show.
I'm your host, Susan Moore, and today we have an
episode I'm really excited to share with you. It's Season two,
episode four, and trust me, you're in for a treat.
Our guest today is the wonderful Jessica K. Fasteret, a
talented author who's making waves in the young adult world

(00:22):
with her heartfelt, funny, and ohso relatable books. Jessica is
the author behind eight d of Extroverts and Any in
the Summer of Something, both capturing the struggles of being
an introverted team and a world full of big personalities.
These stories are packed with humor, friendship, the little romance,

(00:42):
and a lot of personal growth things we can all
relate to. Jessica's not just a writer, She's also a
middle school language arts teacher, a proud hufflepuff, and a
lover of all things hot, tea and b treats. We're
going to dive into our journey as an author, her
experiences living in Michigan, and what it's like balancing life

(01:04):
is a teacher and a storyteller. Drive your favorite drink,
settle in, and let's get ready to meet the mind,
fond Andy and the Extroverts, the incredible Jessica K. Foster.
All right, so, thank you so much and welcome to
the Uncomfortable Talk Show. Hopefully it won't be so uncomfortable,

(01:28):
but thank you Jessica for joining me today, and you know,
giving us all a chance to hear a little bit
more about you. And you know, if you want to
go ahead and tell people about who you are, where
you're from, you know, about your work, I'd love to
hear that.

Speaker 2 (01:46):
Yeah. So my name is Jessica K. Foster and I
am a young adult romance contemporary romance author and then
from Michigan. I also teach here in West Michigan to
teach eighth grade language arts. And I have a husband
and two sons and a ragtag crew of rescue animals
and just drink a lot of tea and have a

(02:08):
great time.

Speaker 1 (02:10):
Excellent English was absolutely my favorite subject. It was that
in history, like I really loved all the like Romeo
and Juliet type stuff. And people thought it was strange
because back when I was in school, you had to
do the diagram diagram to sentences and stuff. Do you

(02:33):
still have to if you still teach that?

Speaker 2 (02:37):
Not in the same exact way that you and I
probably learned it. It's like a slightly different now, a
little more modern.

Speaker 1 (02:45):
Okay, okay, times are a change, and aren't they.

Speaker 2 (02:49):
Yeah, well, you know there's something to be said to
the way we learned it, though, because we haven't forgotten it.

Speaker 1 (02:54):
Absolutely absolutely, And I always found it. Did you find
it as kind of like a puzzle whenever you were
dog ramming? I'm like that, like we had.

Speaker 2 (03:03):
I had always always felt like logic, always felt like
math to me.

Speaker 1 (03:07):
Were you more English like those kind of subjects when
you were in school?

Speaker 2 (03:13):
Yeah? You know, actually I was more music than anything else, really, yeah,
And then you know, as I got older, it really
became more about the reading for me than anything else.
And I thought, you know, should I be a music teacher?
Should I be an English teacher? But I was going
through college during the you know, like that recession area,

(03:37):
and it would be more employable for me to be
an English teacher, and so I'm like, okay, well, it's
hard to choose in the first place. So I thought, okay,
I'll be English and history. So I'm English and History.
And as I was going through the program, I just
absolutely fell in love with everything about it, and I'm
really glad that I made the choice that I did. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (03:58):
Yeah, I mean it's got to be fulfilling to you know,
be a teacher and you know, show these kids like
the right way to do things, you know, and have
that kind of spark inside of you. I'm sure that
you might have some students that you kind of do
you see like yourself and them, and you know, kind

(04:20):
of a mentorship. I used to have teachers like that
that I would really look up to, you know.

Speaker 2 (04:28):
I love that. Yeah, for sure, I see different pieces
of myself and different kids, and I just love sharing
just the love of literature and a love of reading
with my students. I love talking about books, and I
have a job where I just have an excuse to
talk about books all day. So it's great.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
Absolutely. So would that be kind of like a part
of the journey that you came to be a young
adult author? Like, is this what kind of sparked your
interest writing for young adults?

Speaker 2 (05:00):
I don't think so. I've always loved writing, but it's
definitely been a back burner for me to you know,
being a teacher, being a mom, being a husband, or
being meant a husband, being a way and that kind
of thing. And then, you know, after I had my
second son, I you know, really wanted to reclaim just
a tiny piece of my day just to feel like myself.

(05:21):
You know, you get to that point where everything is
for someone else, and it was just this beautiful escape
moment and I felt like, well, I'm surrounded by teenagers
all the time. I feel like I could write a
teenager right and everything I write is entirely escapist. It
is very like you get that happily ever after, you

(05:44):
get that humor, you get that that teenage coming of
age experience, which is sometimes tough but most of the
time just really uplifting. And that's what I hope to
do with my books.

Speaker 1 (05:55):
Yeah. And I was kind of looking through your Instagram
earlier today and I saw that you really kind of
like the angsty part. And I saw this one, uh,
this one particular photo that really captured my attention. Or
She's sitting there and she's looking at her bowl of
cinnamon toast crunch and she's like, you know, she's just

(06:18):
watching them drown themselves. And I'm like, wow, I actually
felt that. I'm like, oh, yeah, I get that, you know, because.

Speaker 2 (06:26):
Yeah, you're always so very dramatic and they're air monologues, right.

Speaker 1 (06:30):
Yes, yes, I mean I know I'm like forty two now,
but I still absolutely remember that angst, you know, just like, well,
I can't really talk to these people, so I'm just
gonna look at this and oh.

Speaker 2 (06:42):
Man, yeah, well and I'm always there. That's actually my
favorite scenes to write are the scenes where there's an
argument or the scenes where you know the love interest
is fighting with the main character or trying to get
through to them or trying to clear themselves and it's
just like a hot mess. It's for some reason, I

(07:03):
just really love writing mostly yeah.

Speaker 1 (07:06):
I like, yeah, it's it's more fun, and uh, it's
like you get it to their to their actual character
more like, yeah, everybody has those sweet little moments and
you know, kN and ma can bekn and stuff. But
sometimes it's fun just to watch them kind of lose
it a little bit, you know, and like kind of

(07:28):
like in a I think that was one reason when
I was growing up, I was watching like Buffy the
Vampire Slayer, and there was so much angst in that
and like you loved it. Whenever there was like a
problem between her and like, uh, I don't know if
you watched it, but like, you know, those kind of
moments just really shows who Buffy was, who Angel was,

(07:52):
and Willow and all them, you know, like, Okay, it's
good to see them in happy moments, but what happens
whenever you put them through Well, yes, yes, for sure.
And what inspired you to write Andy and Extroverts and
the sequel Andy in the Summer of Something. Are there

(08:13):
any personal experiences?

Speaker 2 (08:16):
Well, I used to be a leadership camp counselor, so
I felt like I could speak to a leadership camp specifically,
and actually my team was too hippo, so I brought
that back for I think I gave that to Tyler
to lead Lucas through it, and then we kind of
got rid of hippo in the second book, may become

(08:37):
the Cheetah Team or what have you. But you know,
I just thought that was kind of like a nice callback.
So I had a lot of material to work with
of what a leadership camp would kind of be like,
though I did make it more of a loose experience
than the one that I had as a counselor. But
you know, so I thought that would be a fun

(08:58):
setting to try and drop someone into that had no
interest in leadership, So you know, what's the worst place
we can put her, what's going to create the most comedy,
the most drama.

Speaker 1 (09:12):
So somebody that's not even looking to be a leader
and suddenly there you are. And can you like kind
of give us a look into what a typical writing
day you might look for? You like, do you have
any rituals or routines? Because I would I would kind
of think that with you being a teacher and a
mother and a wife, you would have to kind of

(09:34):
schedule your time out, you know, Yes, and no.

Speaker 2 (09:40):
It depends on kind of what season I'm in, if
that makes any sense, Like am I in a drafting season?
Am I in a revision season? Am I in a
line editing season? Am I waiting for something? Am I
doing more marketing this month? Right? But I am a
person who thrives on lists. So I give myself goals

(10:00):
and if I don't make those goals, I don't beat
myself up over it unless I'm on a deadline of
some sort with for my publisher, and then I better
to do that. But I you know, I like making calendars.
I like making lists, and you know, if I get
to it, great, If not, then it just rolls over
and I do something the next day. But I try
to carve out at the very least a half an

(10:22):
hour to an hour every day where I've got my
butt in the chair and I am doing something toward it,
whether it's marketing or drafting or revision or what have you.
And sometimes I'm able to sit there and I sit
there for half an hour, and a half an hour
turns into two hours, you know. And other times I
sit there and I'm like, thirty minutes is up, and

(10:43):
I'm done, so so, and it's always usually after my
kids go to bed. I don't have time during my
waking day most of the time. And sometimes, you know,
there's like this thing in teaching where September is usually
the roughest months to try and get things done, just

(11:05):
because your body' is not used to all of the decisions,
all of the public speaking, all of the right and
you're trying to adapt. And so sometimes I'm gassed by
the time i should sound through right in night in
September specifically because I'm like and I'm done, then fall asleep.

Speaker 1 (11:24):
But it's like you're kind of WUSA Tom like you're
down tom a little bit in that month.

Speaker 2 (11:30):
Oh yeah, and you know people have suggested, well, why
don't you just wake up early and do that? Oh no, no, no,
I will not know I would. People can't wait and
wake up.

Speaker 1 (11:44):
Some people can do that, but it's it's really hard,
Like does it take you like a couple hours to
even get your mind to realize you're awight now, like
you need to wait or or something.

Speaker 2 (11:58):
I mean, my body he has always, like basically from childhood,
wanted to wake up at eight am. Like I'm an
eight am riser. I'm currently teaching starting at seven thirty am.
So it's it's usually a bit of a job to
get myself to a place where I can do that

(12:21):
because my body is not there for it. So waking
up even earlier to do something that requires a lot
of thought, which I think writing does for me require
a ton of thought. It's not like breathing or working out.
Even I feel like I could wake up early to
work out if I was so motivated, because you don't
have to think a whole lot, just do whatever it is, right, Yeah,
But writing takes so much thought for me, so it

(12:42):
feels like a late night activity.

Speaker 1 (12:44):
Yeah, Yeah, I absolutely feel you there because like when
you're writing your characters, you want to make you're using
your mind muscle more than you are your body. So
I mean, like a back, like a few years ago,
like a decade or so ago, I was a stalker
at Walmart and I could wake up like thirty minutes

(13:08):
before my ship go in and be fine because I'm
not really thinking. I mean, I'm thinking. There's parts, you know,
where you're thinking about what you're doing. But you know,
it's like a different kind of work than it is
to be a writer, because you want to plan out,
Like if you're doing like an article or something, you
want to plan that out. If you're writing a book,

(13:29):
you know, it could be like a brain dump session.
So you know, I feel you that that would be
something you would need to be fully awake, aware and
may are you the kind of person that likes to
be have quiet around you whenever you're working on something
like writing.

Speaker 2 (13:45):
Laws or in an ideal world in a yeah, with
all our rescue animals and our kids who are in
elementary school, it is rare that I have that kind
of Wyatt. But my best chance is after everyone goes
to bed, right, So in an ideal world, I am

(14:06):
a quiet writer. Yes, And I do actually have noise
canceling headphones that I use occasionally to try and create
that for myself if I can.

Speaker 1 (14:16):
Yeah, I have those phone right now. Actually, so people,
I try to talk to you when you're on them,
and then you look at them like what.

Speaker 2 (14:29):
Yep, my husband tapped me on the shoulder.

Speaker 1 (14:37):
I don't know what you're saying. Hi, right. Do you
have a favorite character from your books and what makes
them so special to you? If you do, I'm.

Speaker 2 (14:50):
Only thinking a couple of books ahead, so I'm trying
to backtrack to Andy in my head right now. But
I guess that'd be Andy and the extroverts like war Old.
I don't know that anybody will be happy if I
say this, if they've read the book. But my favorite
character is Susie. I love Susie. I know she's a
bad guy, okay. I know that everybody hates her and

(15:13):
he thinks that she's super annoying. But I wrote her
as somebody who does the wrong thing but had really
great intentions, Like she was really trying to like get
through to Andy. She was really trying to be a
good counselor she was really trying to make this a
summer everybody would never forget, and it just always blows

(15:34):
up in her face. But she just remains positive, like
manically so through the whole thing, and I just love her.

Speaker 1 (15:41):
I don't know, I mean, that's you know, that's really
a good character like that can really keep your attention.
Is the ones that like they keep meaning well, but
stuff just keeps going wrong. You know, it's kind of funny,
you know, you know, I guess would kind of dark humor,
would you think, like.

Speaker 2 (16:02):
You know, I like slightly maybe, I just you know,
it was fun though to like, because I can, I
can have a lot of perspectives on that. But I
wrote it so deep into Andy's personality and into her
point of view that everybody who reads the books hates
Susie because Andy would hate Susie. Andy would not enjoy

(16:24):
Susie at all, Right, And so she's like, good lord,
this book. This woman will not leave me alone, like,
get out of my face. And then Susie gets all
jealous because she thinks that Tyler is spending more time
with this camper than other campers, and she's engaged to
Tyler and it's just like a whole thing, and so
everybody's like, how could you possibly like Susie? Well, because

(16:45):
I did that on purpose, you know, and like I
wanted that to be part of the conflict, part of
the humor, part of the ridiculousness that was the camp,
Like she's basically like a caricature of herself at this camp.

Speaker 1 (16:58):
So yeah, yep, yep. And how do you like approach
the balance between entertaining your readers and addressing deeper things
in your work?

Speaker 2 (17:09):
So I think it all comes back to conflict really,
and one of the first things that I look at
when I'm writing, Well, I'm kind of like a panther,
but I'm also sort of a plotter, Like I pants
like the first couple of scenes that I write, and
then I kind of take that and create a huge
conflict around it, like why is this an issue? Because
I love writing angst, so I'm always writing the anks

(17:29):
youse scenes firstus, yes, yeah, and so then I like
created around it, like what would be the worst environment?
Will be the worst possible scenario here? And then why
is it so specifically bad for this character? Like what
about them internally? What about their personal lives or their
background or their what's happened to them in their life

(17:49):
has made this the nightmare that it is for them,
because it's probably not a nightmare for other people. It's
just a nightmare for them, right, And so when you
write internally like that for like young adults, you have
to kind of give them something. And so for Andy,
it's the fact that she was always very introverted and
always tried to do the right thing and had one

(18:10):
friend that she really liked when she was growing up,
and that one friend ended up being absorbed into a
popular crowd that Andy couldn't drive with because she didn't
like the things that they did, and she lost her
only friends and then didn't want to make other friends
and was just sad and kind of just got stuck.
And nobody was ever really mean to her. But also

(18:31):
nobody ever really was friends with her, which I think
is a thing that is sort of underplayed in novels
a little bit and does exist, like I see it
in middle school all the time, that there are kids
who don't have friends. They have acquaintances, yes, and that
can sometimes be just as alienating as having no friends

(18:52):
at all.

Speaker 1 (18:53):
Yes, Yeah, because you don't.

Speaker 2 (18:54):
Feel like you're really connecting with anyone. So, you know,
I really wanted like that to be a thing that
existed here because I didn't feel like I always feel
like you read these Ya novels and they always have
like a couple of really close friends, or they have
real friends at all, and everyone hates them, and like
the reality is that you can go through your entire

(19:15):
middle school or even most of your high school and
have no real friends and just have like people you
hang with, and it's sad. You know, Yeah, I don't
love that for people. And so I was trying to
get Andy to a place where she would be open
enough to be able to seek out a kind of
friendship with anyone or rekindle the friendship that she had

(19:37):
with her previous friend, and then by the time camp ends,
she's in a better mental place to be able to
tackle the next school year. And that's what I wanted
for her. Is just a little hope.

Speaker 1 (19:46):
That's beautiful, It really is, And it speaks to my,
you know, little self, my little Susan self, because I
was very quiet, Like if you read in my yearbook,
people would sign my yearbook. They never really knew me,
but they would say things like you're so quiet and sweet,
and I hope you have a great summer stuff like that.

(20:08):
But you know, it's just it was like there was
like one boy that I was friends with, like and
and we got really closer in high school and I
could just really job with him really well.

Speaker 2 (20:22):
You know.

Speaker 1 (20:23):
So I mean I did have I did have one
or two close friends that knew who I was, but
more or less, I was very introverted and very quiet,
you know, and I had my head stuck in a
bunch of RILs time books. I don't know if you
listen to the episode with Maren, but yeah, like when
I was talking about that, but that's that was my thing,

(20:44):
was like those horror type why you know, young adult
sort of books. And I was like, yeah a lot,
and like I liked horror and things of that nature.
So but I completely I really want to read your
book now, especially you know, like since I've been getting

(21:05):
to know you and knowing more about this work, because
I'm like, huh, that sounds like something I would have
really really been into when I was a kid, you know,
because I could totally I could absolutely relate, you know,
to and he's going through even like you know, the
memory is still there, you know, still a part of you,
no matter how old you get, you know. So I

(21:26):
think this is something that this book is, you know,
very entertaining sounding, but it also will help, you know,
introverts understand, like in school and everything, that they're not alone,
Like there are more of us out there to feel
that way. She's trying to find each other because we're
so client, you know, yes.

Speaker 2 (21:48):
And sometimes that can be tough, I mean, and yeah,
other things in the book too, Like the big thing
that people talk about with this book is her romance
with the very like golden boy of camp, Like the
most leadery leader that is a leader in camp is
the guy who is her love interest in the novel,
and so it's kind of like jarring for her. So

(22:09):
I don't know if I can hang like but this guy,
And so that's like a fun part of it. But
then also like her kind of finding some quiet power there,
and like she hasn't given up caring about other people
and knowing what's right from wrong, and she is brave

(22:31):
enough to say like that's not okay, that's not cool
to people who act in a way that doesn't drive
with her. And I just really liked that about her,
that she never really gave that up. There's also a
little bit of a mental health aspect to it. She
has a panic attack on a rock climbing wall in
the novel, and it just I just really liked writing

(22:54):
that scene because I do know what panic attacks feel like.
I don't have as many nowadays as I used to
when I was younger, but I always wondered, you know,
what if there had been actually, in any of my
panic attacks, someone who was there who knew exactly just
intuitive what to do for me, Because I think that's
the scariest thing when people see another person having a

(23:16):
panic attack, is that they don't know what to do,
and there's nothing false that they don't. But I'm like,
what if there was somebody there who actually like got it,
like understood what that person needed in that moment, you know, yes, yeah,
And that's actually like kind of where Lucas's character came from.
Who is the love and truest of the book is
because he snapped right into action and was like this

(23:39):
might not work, We're just gonna go for it, you know, yeah, yeah,
And you know, it was just like a really great
moment between the characters because then afterwards when she's like
calm down, she's like, oh my god, how embarrassing, Like
it was so amazing, and he's like, nah, you're cool,
like it's fun.

Speaker 1 (23:57):
Yeah, that is so oh my gosh. That is such
an important theme to really hit on in today's world,
especially because personally speaking, my brother he really does suffer
from them panic attacks really badly, and at first you

(24:18):
don't understand it from the outside looking in, and it
does take there's like certain things you have to do
for him to help him know that things are safe
and not to judge him. So that that is such
a that's such an important thing to be bringing up
in any kind of story right now. I think, you know,
because he gets so stressed out when people just want

(24:40):
to say it's all in your head, you know, and
all the wrong things that you could possibly say to
a person having one. You know, he's been.

Speaker 2 (24:49):
It's all in your head. That doesn't make it any
easier because your head is part.

Speaker 1 (24:52):
Of your body exactly, Like I've looked at like other
people that like will try to tell him that and
I just kind of blurt out, what do you think
the brain is? Like, it's an organ, it's not some
kind of mystical thing that just it's an organ you know,
and it's like having a problem right now, you know.

(25:15):
So yeah, yeah, I like like one thing, like one
time we were driving to UH to the store and
he was having one, and automatically I was just like, Okay,
touch my hand, tell me what you smell, tell me
what you feel, tell me what you can hear, close
your eyes. Yeah, it was like helping him, like, you know,
kind of chill out and you know. But then my

(25:39):
heart breaks for people that suffer with that. I mean,
I do have mental health issues. I think you can't
get through this life without having something going with you, right,
But I don't have panic attacks. Have it's more depression.
But I feel so terrible for people that have panic
attacks because they can come up and like the straight.

Speaker 2 (26:01):
You know, definitely they can definitely take you by surprise.
Like sometimes they're triggered by an event, right like the
rock wall with Andy. But other times you're like, I
think you're doing fine and then your body's like, oh,
just kidding, now you're not. Yeah, it's not well, it's
not great, but you know, the cool thing I was
able to do in revisions actually I think mostly with
my publisher is. I didn't want the book necessarily to

(26:24):
just be about mental health, because that was the kind
of book I was writing. I was writing this escapist, fun, comedic, humorous,
romantic summer camp book, and so I just wanted it
to kind of be an inherent part of who she was,
but not anything that anybody felt the need to analyze,
not anything that anybody felt the need to like fix

(26:47):
in her, because it's just who she like, It's not
who she is, but it's like just a part of
the way she exists. Yeah, and so like, you know,
you know who else does this really? Well? I just
read a book, what was it called Yours Truly by
Addy jiminez or him andez Or I can't pronounce things,

(27:09):
and I'm sorry, okay, but but Yours Truly. I really
loved the way that, you know, the book was centered
around like thoughtfulness, I felt like in many ways, and
it was like a work romance, enemies to lovers, fake relationship,
et cetera between two people who worked in like an

(27:30):
er as doctors. And the guy has like a GAD
like I assume I think he has g AD like
generalized anxiety disorder and so he has a lot of
anxiety around a lot of different things, and she just
kind of inherently is like, oh, okay, well, you know,
like I can tell you where to part before you
come here, so that's going to be a problem, not
a big deal, and then just sort of adapts to it.

(27:52):
But it's not like the central focus of the novel.
The central focus of the novel is like all of
the fun romantic trope and so just like how that
was represented in that novel. And I, you know, I
really enjoyed that. Well, probably one of my more favorite
reads that I've read in the last couple of months,
but I read a lot, so yeah, I'll see that.

Speaker 1 (28:12):
I saw like you're a reading list and stuff on
good Reads, and yeah, you're definitely an avid reader.

Speaker 2 (28:19):
Well, I think authors probably sticky. I hope that a
lot of authors are avid readers, because it's essential to
basically internalizing all of that story structure to be able
to regurgitate it but in a new way in your
own writing.

Speaker 1 (28:31):
Yeah, and I love just a new way that you're
saying about, you know, how to approach mental health. You know,
don't make it the central part. It's just another you know,
piece of the person, you know, another flavor, you know,
nothing that really works, just something to adapt to.

Speaker 2 (28:47):
And yeah, and I mean that's that's anything away from
books that do that, which is also fine, like because
that is also like a necessary thing. It's just not
my genre, right, Yeah, and that's okay too.

Speaker 1 (29:00):
But yeah, that's a good thing about you know, being
you know, writers, is that you know, it's just just
because like this perspective is different than you know, what
someone else may do doesn't necessarily mean it's wrong or anything.

Speaker 2 (29:14):
You know.

Speaker 1 (29:16):
And I also saw that you love to do a
lot of book talks, a lot of readings. What's your
favorite part about engaging with readers in persons?

Speaker 2 (29:25):
So I'm always nervous. I know. Everybody always tells me, oh,
you don't look nervous at all. You look so outgoing,
you look like you're having a great time. And I
am also having a great time. But I'm always nervous
too about that type of thing. I just think, you know,
I think my favorite part of being up on a
stage because like they're so different, there's different pieces to it, right,

(29:48):
But my favorite part of being up on the stage
is being able to read because I love dramatically reading
things I don't even need to read my own work.
I will dramatically read the phone book that you need.
I just really enjoy dramatic readings. I did a bit
of drama when I was younger, not now, but you
know it handy now and reading. But I honestly just

(30:12):
really love meeting people who love books. It's my favorite thing.
Like if i go to a place where I've got
a table and I'm selling books at like a fair
or something like that, I love just talking to people
about what they're reading. You know, it doesn't have to
be my book, but like what are you reading or
what did you buy over there? Like I'm always scoping
at what other people are buying so I can go
buy it too. I swear I spend more money that

(30:35):
kind of stuff. But you know, and I just love
talking to other authors about their journeys and about, you know,
what publishing feels like to them, or what success feels
like to them, because I'm coming to find that my
idea of success when it comes to writing is probably
not the norm because I'm already there. I already feel

(30:58):
successful because my goals, apparently according to people at my
last one that I went to are very small because
my goals were, it would be really cool to meet
somebody who I don't know who's read my book, yeah,
and like enjoyed it, you know, I didn't hate it.
Well I have exceeded that goal, so that's great. Or

(31:22):
like another goal of mine was, it would be really cool.
Is just a library decided to stock my book? Well, yeah,
it's actually like not as difficult as you might think
to submit it and then they can decide. Or I
think another goal of mine was, you would be really
neat is if I could just like go into a

(31:44):
Barnes and Noble and see my book there and I
can do that, and that's just like, I don't know,
that's really cool.

Speaker 1 (31:51):
So yeah, so your work out there and people enjoy
it that you don't even know who they are, you
know it, I would imagine it would give you kind
of pep and your steps.

Speaker 2 (32:01):
It really does, you know. It's the side hustle that
keeps my main hustle fun too, Like I feel like
it makes me more fun as a teacher that it's
not the only thing I am, Like I have different
facets to my personality.

Speaker 1 (32:14):
Yeah, how with all these events and stuff, was there
any like moment that sticks out to you or interactions
with your readers during these events that come to mind?

Speaker 2 (32:26):
Yes. Okay, so I can't remember exactly which event it
was because I've done quite a few recently, but there
was an event where there was a very quiet girl
and she was sitting kind of in the back and
I was doing an awful talk and then afterwards, you know,
you do the signing her whatever, and she came up
and she said, I just absolutely loved your first book.

(32:50):
And I said, oh, you read my first book. Because
a lot of times I'm meeting new readers at these
types of things, or it's you know, my family coming
out in droves to support me, which is great. And
I'm like, oh, you got my first book, and she goes,
I'm obsessed with your first book. She goes, it makes
me feel like I could be a writer somebody too.
She goes, it's so nostalgic. I feel like I am

(33:10):
Andy And I'm like I can die now, Like that's
all I ever wanted was somebody to see themselves in it,
or somebody who would feel helped by it. So it
was just a really great moment. And then you know,
I do love. Sometimes people come out like I would
just at an event at Hooked and Lansing, and there

(33:31):
were a lot of students from Michigan State University, which
is like across the street from there, who came over
who are in writing programs, and they had a lot
of really great questions about publishing. And you know, we
didn't have enough time to answer everything even after it,
and so I said, you know, hit me up on
social media, like message me on Instagram, Like, if you've

(33:52):
got additional questions, I'm not here to gate keep. I
would love to help you out and help you figure
out what your path is to publication, because there's a
lot of valid paths, Like some people go indie, some
people do hybrids, some people go traditional. Right, Yeah, And
I've just done an inordinate amount of research on all
of that, Like I'll share. You know, it's the teacher

(34:16):
and me too. And I had a couple of girls
who are like, hey, I have this other question or
I have this question, And that kind of stuff gives
me energy, It makes me happy, makes me excited.

Speaker 1 (34:26):
Is it really hard to become like a published sort
of author, Like thinking about the journey that you've been on,
like was there a moment where you were thinking, I'm
gonna do Indy, but I could also be published and
like what kind of I mean, I didn't write this
question now, this one is coming, but like, was there
like a kind of like what was the thing that

(34:46):
made you want to go to the publisher you're with
right now instead of going like, you know, the indie wrote.

Speaker 2 (34:53):
So I had I'm very like organized in the way
that I think about business. I don't. I know, it's
really hard for a lot of authors to separate themselves
from this very personal novel that they've written that they feel,
you know, is all wrapped up in you know, who
they are and the business side of things. And that

(35:14):
is something that I've never really struggled a whole lot with.
When someone rejects my book traditional publishing wise, whether it's
an agent or a publisher, I do not feel personally
victimized by that, right, I just feel like that is
a part of the process, and everybody is money minded,
so like, if they don't think they can make money
off of this specifically, or they don't have the passion

(35:35):
to be able to put the marketing behind it, I'd
rather they said no anyway, and so that has never
bothered me. I had an agent for a little while
and we ended up parting ways. It was a tough time.
It was COVID and we just didn't drive the way
we thought we were going to on a different novel.
And so then after that I did flounder a little bit,
and then I decided, you know, we're gonna bring it

(35:56):
back to basics, and I'm just going to write novels,
not necessarily with the intention of public any of them,
but just for the absolute joy, right. So I wrote
a couple couple, I don't know, two or three books
during that time where it was just me in the
in the words, you know, right, And then I thought,
you know, this andy concept feels like it has legs,

(36:18):
like it feels like it could be published. So there
was a Twitter contest, like they're doing things like pitch
contests on Twitter, and it was one where you basically
just like make an aesthetic and I love kanva because
I'm a teacher and all teachers basically love canva. Yes, yes, okay,

(36:40):
and so I could do that. I'm just gonna make
a grid, throw it all through the Bain filter. See
if anybody cares, you know, what I mean. And my
publisher liked not only that one, but I had another novel.
I was like, oh, throw that one out there too,
you know what I mean. They ended up liking both
of those pitches that I did, like, they wanted to
see both of those manuscripts, and they actually followed up

(37:02):
with me, like the head of the publishing company followed
up with me and said like, I want to see them.

Speaker 1 (37:07):
Wow, has you already finished your entire book the target?

Speaker 2 (37:13):
Yeah. You don't usually pitch unless you've got them done, right,
And so I had them done and I was like, okay,
sent them one over. And then, however, many weeks went
by and I just sent my like cursory follow up
email because publishers are so busy, they're always slammed, right,
And I'm like, hey, I don't know if you had
a chance to take a look at them. If you didn't,
no big deal. If you have, great And then I

(37:35):
got an email back like, hey, love to have a
phone call about this specific manuscript. So not one of them,
but the other one, right, and it was in me
and we had a phone call and I felt like
that phone call was really great because they were talking
about how like they are an up and coming company,
like like a publishing company. So they weren't like they
didn't have their feet firmly rooted in the publishing industry yet,

(37:56):
but they had a lot of potential. And you know,
they were really into working like on growing new authors,
which was a thing that was really important to me
because though I had been writing for a while, you're
a new author if you haven't been published, right, Yeah,
And so I really liked that. I liked the tone
of that conversation. I ended up having a chance to

(38:18):
talk with the person who would be editing the novel,
and our visions lined up for what we thought was
important in the novel, which to me was making sure
that Lucas was flawed. Actually, I wanted the main love
interest to feel like realistic. I didn't want him to
come in and be this white knight who was perfect

(38:39):
in every single way. I wanted him to seem like that,
but then also just have some issues. And so I
was very protective of that specific thing in my novel.
But then I also just the overarching concept of you
don't have to become an extrovert to be a leader. Yes,
like you can lead, You can lead quietly is a

(39:01):
big scene in the and I also was like willing
to go to the mat for that particular thing, and
you know, it wasn't even a question in their mind.
My Vanessa is my editor, and she was like, oh yeah,
she she was totally on the exact same vibe as me.
When we did edits, everything jelled really well, and I

(39:23):
just had a great I've had like the best experience
with Winding Road Publishing by Winding Road Stories. And I'm
actually flying out to New York City here in few
days to meet New York City. So it's pretty exciting.
I'm pretty stoked to go. If I can be a
millennial for a second and use the word stoked.

Speaker 1 (39:45):
Go ahead, go ahead. Yeah, I saw that you were
going to uh New York Brooklyn right for this, Yes,
and I was going to ask you about that actually,
so we can go ahead and talk about that. Is
this the first time? This the first time you're going yes?

Speaker 2 (40:02):
I don't, well, you know, you get to I've been
invited previously, but I don't normally exit my current date
unless it's with my family, just you know, for a
variety of reasons, one of which the fact that I
just love Michigan. I adore the states I live in,

(40:23):
and I live in West Michigan right next to Lake Michigan,
and it is just absolutely gorgeous here, and I don't
feel the need to go anywhere else. Most of the time,
I'm a very big home body, Like I'm the mom
sitting on the sidelines of my kids' sports.

Speaker 1 (40:38):
Like, oh yeah, you know, like.

Speaker 2 (40:41):
The I'm the person still trying to perfect like recipes.
I'm the person who I just like being home, you know.
So it's a big step for me to accept the
invitation of my publisher this year and head out to Brooklyn.
But I couldn't be more excited. I love new experiences too,
so it's going to be really fun.

Speaker 1 (41:05):
I bet you're you know absolutely well. You did say
you were stoked for it, So you know, what's a
while you're there? Is there anything special you want to
see in New York?

Speaker 2 (41:18):
So I went to New York City and did all
the tourist things when I was a teenager, so I
don't feel the need to necessarily like go to the
Empire State Building or you know what I mean, like
or go see the Statue of Liberty, that type of thing,
like I'm only going to be there for a couple
of days. My hope, and you know, if you're listening
to this, Michael and Vanessa, my hope is that we

(41:40):
just really rock that Brooklyn Book Festival, which is what's
happening there. And I'm very excited to hang out with
them the night before and just really like dig into
some like publishing industry contacts and meet some of these
authors whose books I've read from my same publishing company
that you know, I read their books, but I don't
ever get to see them. And I think that's really
fun cool, and hey, if we have time for it,

(42:03):
and I'd really love to hear some jazz, I hear
some really great jazz is Brooklyn.

Speaker 1 (42:08):
Is that kind of like your favorite kind of music? Jazz?

Speaker 2 (42:11):
I don't have a favorite music.

Speaker 1 (42:15):
I love to hear that.

Speaker 2 (42:16):
A lot of people say they do, and maybe they do, right,
But I am just as home, like at home with
like dirty rap, scream out Christian music, country pop, jazz.

Speaker 1 (42:31):
I'll be there.

Speaker 2 (42:32):
I'm there for it. It's got it.

Speaker 1 (42:35):
There's like I've been hanging out on Twitter a lot
lately myself and like for the last couple of years,
and there's this guy that does this monthly music challenge
and here recently since June, I think we've been making
a playlist. You can't figure me out because I've got
exactly what you just said. I got country rock, you know,

(42:57):
I got a little bit of rap. You know, you
can't just like point because music is music. And do
you feel like it's kind of like just a different
form of storytelling, because that's kind of how I say it.

Speaker 2 (43:09):
Oh, I think that's a beautiful sentiment. I've never thought
of it really that way, because for me, like it's
about like the beat, kind of like the like, I
don't know, like the energy. I just feel like all
music has energy. And I love to dance. I like
to dance. I'm just dancing. It's hilarious because never many

(43:32):
people in my personal life actually enjoy dancing, although if
my husband has a couple dreams, he'll get out there
on the guests floo. But I actually recently just like
the wedding of one of my childhood friends, well really
like the friend of my sister originally, and she's like
a family friend of ours, and man like the Smith Girls.

(43:53):
We call ourselves the Smith Girls, even though none of
us are Smith's anymore? The Smith Girls. We really just
we shut down that dance floor.

Speaker 1 (44:01):
There you go.

Speaker 2 (44:02):
So I'm not afraid. I love dancing honestly. You know
what would be also be cool if we found it
when we were in New York would be like I
would go to an ed M concert in a hot second.
That sounds great, that sounds fun.

Speaker 1 (44:14):
Maybe do you like to dance to soul music?

Speaker 2 (44:17):
Like I danced anything. I can dance to literally anything. There,
you I got it. Maybe I should go move to Nashville.

Speaker 1 (44:30):
Yes, yeah, there's lots of Nashville's really kind of grown,
and you know, they're doing a lot more fun stuff.
I used to live closer than a dude now to them,
and uh yeah, there's a bunch of stuff you can
get into in Nashville.

Speaker 2 (44:46):
Oh yeah, yeah, I've been there a couple of times.
I'm always finding these things every time I go there.

Speaker 1 (44:53):
Well, if you dance over the weekend, I if you
take some videos and post them.

Speaker 2 (44:58):
On the videos, it won't be me.

Speaker 1 (45:07):
Like we've talked about. You know, you've got a fairly
long to the red list. Yeah, is there any kind
of books right now? A few books that you're particularly
excited about reading.

Speaker 2 (45:20):
Oh man, so somewhat I've got a les Oh well, yeah,
definitely all of the ones that I've bought. Right, So,
have you read Fourth Wings?

Speaker 1 (45:34):
No? Not yet?

Speaker 2 (45:35):
Okay, this is like a Dragon young adult slash fantasy
slash romance slash something everybody is read for its wigh
that I know, and they keep telling me you got
to read it, and then Iron Flame is next. I
have bought both of these books. It is not that
I do not intend to read these books, because I
know that the second I start reading them, I'm going
to get obsessed. But the series is not over yet,

(45:57):
and I'm not going to have the last book, and
that is my biggest pet peeve that I can't read
the last book in the series. So I'm mostly just
hoarding them right now. But I'm very much so looking
forward to reading those. I got Christina Lawren's books The
Paradise Problem. They came to Michigan and so I have
like this amazing signed copy of The Paradise Problem, but

(46:18):
I can't wait to dive into. I really like reading
summer books during the winter. I know everybody likes to
read seasonally. I like to read opposite of seasons usually
I don't know why. So I'm waiting for the Snow
to fly to read The Paradise Problem, which is like
a random quirk of mine, and so I'm excited about

(46:39):
that too. And that's an adult romance, contemporary romance. I
picked up the book Diguerella the other day, and I
also picked up the book The Way You Make Me
Feel by Mariene Goo. So I'm excited about those two.

Speaker 1 (46:51):
Yes, those sound like really good books and the totally
sell you like on the you know, pet thave is
there's not much that gets on my nerves, but that
is one thing that definitely does. Is like when you're
not sure that a certain book is ever going to
be finished and you start worrying a little bit. Came

(47:13):
a throne stump.

Speaker 2 (47:19):
I just like everybody off, I couldn't read that one.

Speaker 1 (47:23):
Yeah he does not you know, pull punches with that,
but like he's kind of made me very gunshot about
finishing or starting a book series, if you know, because
you know it, you get that invested in something and
then you're like I need the end. And now, like

(47:45):
you know, I'm not trying to be in orbit, I'm
not trying to be dark I can have dark humor,
but you know he's not. He's not a young spring
chicken anymore. And I don't worry.

Speaker 2 (47:58):
Is that Georgia R. Martin?

Speaker 1 (47:59):
Yeah, yes, yes, yeah, Well.

Speaker 2 (48:04):
I mean I guess you could just make up in
your mind that everybody in the book dies, because that's
probably the most likely ilcome in you.

Speaker 1 (48:10):
That's probably You're absolutely right, that's.

Speaker 2 (48:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (48:15):
And then everybody died.

Speaker 2 (48:18):
Everybody died. It's like it's like when my kids write stories. No,
everybody died the end. Okay, are you sure? All right?

Speaker 1 (48:30):
I also wanted to ask you, since you're an avid
reader and you're writer, are there any young adult authors
or books that have influenced your writing style or the
way you tell stories? Hmmm?

Speaker 2 (48:43):
You know, I read this story and they made it
into a movie, But the movie, I don't feel like
follows the story the way that I followed the story,
Like it pulled some of the stuff from the story,
but it wasn't the stuff that I had gotten hooked on. Actually,
I read this book. It was called The Duff That
Designated Ugly Fat Friend, and it was by Cody Kaplinger
and she was a teenager when she wrote it, and

(49:05):
it felt so authentic to me, and you know, she
talks in it the way teenagers talk because she was
a teenager at the time, you know too. So it
just felt very like real to me. And it's a romance,
but it also had some darker themes in it too,
like alcoholism and that type of stuff on the part
of the data of the main character, and I just

(49:26):
really liked it. So I think that that probably was
a bit of an influence on me, because though I
don't I don't like swear as much in my novels
because I live in West Michigan and I would like
some of my students to be able to read it
more conservative families over here, but I do I'm not
scared of it, you know. And I just felt like,

(49:48):
you know, that was so authentic that I just really
wanted to replicate authenticity in general in my own work,
and it became a priority of mine. So I liked that.
I also read the book like These Are Like A
long time ago. I read the book Awkward by Marnie Bates,
which is about a girl who like tries to give

(50:09):
CPR to somebody who doesn't actually need CPR because she's
panicking and its being this viral YouTube video, but then
it like turns into a romance between her and like
a popular guy in school, and I just remember that
feeling like that whole book was ridiculous in the absolute

(50:30):
best way, Like, and so I felt like that book
kind of inspired me to just be like, you know,
it might seem strange or weird or stupid or dumb
or silly or whatever when I'm writing the scene, but
if it's bringing me joy, it is likely that it's
going to bring other people joy to. Yeah, there's a

(50:50):
scene in Andy in the Summer of Something, which is
my most recent book, where they're doing a color war
and she's against all these other cabins or whatever, and
she gets tagged in by one of her campers because
she's a counselor, and so does Lucas, who is in
charge of the other team, and they end up underneath

(51:12):
the dock fighting over a flag, and she's like almost
flirting with him to get him away from the flag,
even though she shouldn't be because she has a boyfriend
at the time, and then like at the end, you
think like they're gonna kiss, and then she like grabs
this flag and she's like vectory and then when I

(51:32):
was writing that scene, originally I was like, what if
all our campers were just standing up there on the dock,
will listen to their conversation, And so I wrote it
in and I really did think that it was gonna
die on the revision floor. But it seems to be
like the scene that everybody loves, like, oh my gosh,
we can't believe that the campers were there the entire time.

(51:54):
And she's like, well, no, we still have to win.
We still to go get their flag. And they're like,
oh no, the game was over before you. You too
were even under that doc. But we just wanted to
see what happened.

Speaker 1 (52:04):
Oh my god, that's.

Speaker 2 (52:07):
They're just like watching. And so I don't know, it's
just kind of reading Marni Baits sort of like inspired
me to be like, just go that extra ridiculous smile,
because it's gonna be fun. If I'm having fun, then
usually the readers having fun.

Speaker 1 (52:20):
Absolutely, that's great. You know, putting your characters in like
awkward moments like that, you know it's real, you know,
because I'm pretty sure you've had awkward moments like that
in your real life, and you know it's authentic. No, not,
everything's gonna go perfectly great every single time.

Speaker 2 (52:45):
No, No, And you know what would they? What book
was I reading yesterday? Man, I did blowing through some
books lately. I was reading. It was a young adult
novel Too Better than the Movies by Lyn Painter. I
was reading yesterday, and I just really love, like how
embarrassed this girl is. Like every time she tries to

(53:07):
hang out with the popular crowd, like a basketball like
breaks her nose basically, or like blood everywhere, or she
tries to go to like this popular party and like
a girl pukes all the way down her like dras
and then like it shouldn't be embarrassing for her. It's
not like she's the one that puked, but it doesn't matter,
and everybody's calling her pukee girl, and like it's what

(53:29):
it is. So so I just like I enjoyed that.

Speaker 1 (53:33):
Yeah, I like the I like the way that you
like to make your readers laugh because that's absolutely hilarious.
And I haven't read your book yet. It was just
the idea of that, you know them up under the
doc and everybody's listening, Yep, that's hilarious.

Speaker 2 (53:51):
Well, they're they're like you know.

Speaker 1 (53:52):
I don't.

Speaker 2 (53:53):
I don't know if you ever went to summer camps,
but there's always like the counselors, you're trying to get
together or whatever, and that was like the that project
of their cabins, as they're always trying to get them together,
and it was like fun.

Speaker 1 (54:06):
I went one time church camp. I stayed a week
and I kind of liked it, but I was very quiet.
I just kind of was like, I just got to
get through this. I just got to get through this.
I was like, I remember that being my thought. I
just want to get through this week. That's all I

(54:27):
want to do.

Speaker 2 (54:28):
And you survived somehow, somehow.

Speaker 1 (54:36):
If you could have dinner with any author general love,
who would it be and what would you want to
discuss with them?

Speaker 2 (54:42):
Jude Devereaux she writes historical romance, okay, and she's still writing.
And the very first real romance novel outside of like
Harlequin that I read was a Jude Devereux novel that
I picked up at a library book sale. I believe
it was The Princess, and I was just totally hooked.
And she writes all of these books from these two

(55:04):
like families called the Montgomerys and the Taggarts, and he
talks about how like the Montgomerys are a little more slave,
they're a little more like well to do, They're a
little more polished, but they're also like the alpha males
kind of thing. And then the Taggarts are more like
rough and ready and like, I don't know, like cowboys

(55:25):
are like people who you count on in a crisis,
you know, like more like blue collar kind of guys.
And that is what I would discuss with her if
I ever got a chance. It's the difference between the
Taggarts and the Montgomerys and which one would be better
for me in my fictional world where I marry a

(55:45):
Taggart of Costgomery. And I know that she probably has
had that conversation with a bunch of people, but this
is my fantasy. So I read every book that Jude
Dever has ever written, and yeah, I'm a big fan.

Speaker 1 (55:59):
Maybe one day you'll be to you know, maybe you
never know, you never know. I bet you, uh, I
bet you didn't expect to, you know, have a publisher
and be going to Brooklyn either, like five years ago,
but now you're anything can happen. And I was like
thinking to you know, we were talking about that girl

(56:21):
that came up to you and you know, said that
really nice thing about how you gave her hope that
she could write a book. And I think that's what
a lot of people just really kind of need, is
just the belief that they can write a book. They
can do that if they want to do that, you know,
And it's really it's really kind of beautiful like that authors,

(56:42):
Like I guess on some level, this author that you admire,
you know, kind of gave you a little bit of
that hope too downbeat, don't you think, Oh.

Speaker 2 (56:50):
You know, for sure, definitely. And I do think that,
like I'd like to believe that I am somehow the
composite strengths of every thing I've ever read. Yeah, Like
I would love to believe that all of the words
that have been poured into me throughout my entire life,
in some way are an essential piece of my personality. Now. Yeah,

(57:13):
I don't know, Maybe that's just me romantically thinking about reading,
but it sometimes feels that way, like I feel so
deeply with each of the characters, they have to somehow
still be with me.

Speaker 1 (57:23):
Yeah, I mean, like, you know, your life is a
summation of all kinds of experiences and they make you
who you are. So I mean, we take bits and
pieces out of, you know, what we experience, what we read,
you know, is what I think I might be romanticizing
it too, but I do believe that, you know, because
I do like to read fantasy. I like to read like,

(57:45):
you know, young adult stuff too, like I told you,
like like how I did when I was younger. But
I also like to read like other people's stories, like,
for example, Jim Varney. You know, he's ernest pre world guy,
the funny guy in the eighties and nineties, his nephew
wrote a biography about him and kind of trailed like

(58:10):
the deeper part of who he is. And I read
that book like ten years ago, but I still remember
parts of it, you know, like things weren't always beautiful
for him, Like he didn't always have success, he didn't
always have money, you know, or you know, anything like that.
But the moment that he started getting like he used
to lay fours and then whenever he started getting like

(58:32):
a career going with his acting, first thing he did
was just bought himself a normal kind of house in
White House, Tennessee. You know, and like, you know, he
just lived life the way he wanted to. But you know,
even when he was struggling, he still believed that eventually
he wasn't going to be able to get to where
he was, even through the rough times, you know. And

(58:54):
like I said, I read that ten years ago, but
it still sticks with me, you know, like, no matter
how bad things seemed to be getting you know, it
could be leading somewhere better. Does that make sense here? Yeah, definitely.

Speaker 2 (59:06):
Well. And I also think that we use books for
different things too. I know a lot of people in
my life, and you know, even students too, who still
haven't found their stride or maybemever who knows. I hope not.
I hope they find their stride in my class actually,
But like people who don't like to read, there are
people who do not enjoy reading at all. And I

(59:28):
just think how very sad that is, because I have
used reading in different parts of my life for very
different things. Sometimes reading was my therapist. Yes, it was
my way to escape what was happening in my life
at that moment that felt very tough for me.

Speaker 1 (59:42):
It was a.

Speaker 2 (59:43):
Break for my brain. Other times reading was felt like
maybe a little bit more of a chore, but then
like almost worth it, like when I was in college,
because then you're basically uploading information into your brain and
that you know can be usful but also really rewarding
when you think about like the practical uses that you

(01:00:04):
could make for it. You know. In other times, reading
is something that helps me relax enough to be able
to go to sleep, or reading is something that I
get to share with my children, or books that I
find funny, like I remember reading to my kids the
books that like they would ask you to read over
and over and over again when they're little. And my

(01:00:26):
family it was Little Blue Truck. So little Blue Truck,
like every single night, Little Blue Truck. I have, Little
Blue Truck. And Chick a Chicken Boom boom just memorized
at this point, So everybody who was in the Chicken
chick of boom boom, probably because whenever we did boom boom,
mom like shook the room, like shook the shook the
chair because then they had to go boom, you know

(01:00:47):
what I mean. We all thought that was hilarious. I
though my kids aren't that little anymore. They're getting older
every day. It's just one of those essential memories that
I'll always have and it's just a core reading memory really.

Speaker 1 (01:01:00):
Yes, I mean one of my favorite memories, like is
when I was little and my mom would set beside
my bed and read. It was like a very big book,
but it had like a bunch of different stories in it,
and there were Bible stories but told in a way
that a kid can understand them. And I remember my

(01:01:21):
favorite one being the one about Joseph and the coda
mini colors like yeah, yeah, like and like those memories
like they take you know, you never forget stuff like
that because your mom's sitting there reading to you and
all these little things that are just special for you
and your you know, your kids and your family and
stuff you know, and it's it's great how we can

(01:01:45):
carry these throughout our entire lives really and make us
uniquely who we are. So so kind a question about like,
what's a fun fact about you that might surprise your readers?

Speaker 2 (01:02:00):
Pretty mench an open book, But something that might surprise
my readers is that, you know, I don't always plan
to write young adults. I'm currently in a very passionate
place with young adult I do plan on writing it
for the foreseeable future. But I can also envision a
future where I'm writing other genres as well. I think that, like,

(01:02:25):
I think comedy will always be like a thread that
connects me through whatever other genres I do, right, because
I just really love, like I just feel like human
make me happy. Right.

Speaker 1 (01:02:36):
I think you can.

Speaker 2 (01:02:37):
Have humor in other genres too, And I think that,
you know, I read so very widely, I listen to
music so very widely, you know, all genres, all of everything,
and I just am ravenous about it that it wouldn't
surprise me if later in my life I felt like
branching out.

Speaker 1 (01:02:54):
Well, I did see another post on your Instagram earlier
today that piqued my interests about horror comedy. Horror horror comedy,
I will see something like that, Like that would because
like the first horror movie that I saw that got
me into it was he But uh oh yeah, yeah,
maybe you love It Is Dead because of the comedy

(01:03:16):
because it's so crazy, you know, so you.

Speaker 2 (01:03:19):
Love the Evil Dead. All the og people have seen
the Evil Dead, like the like the original Evil Dead. Yeah,
this is like so campy, you know other campy horror
movies that I like so on Netflix, they have a
movie it's called The Babysitter, and I like literally cry,
like basically cried. I was laughing, so I was dying, Like, well,

(01:03:43):
there's a part where like they're all trying to kill
this kid, and then in the middle of it, like
there's this random bully who's bullying him while people are
trying to kill him. It's very interesting, and the killer
stops and he's like, you gonna let him talk to
you like that, like what are you talking about trying
to kill me right now? Like it was so funny.
So I really loved The Babysitter. I also really liked

(01:04:05):
The Faculty. That's an older one and that's like one
where aliens take over like the school, and I just
thought that, like there was so much humor in there
that was like at the height of like the Josh
Hartnett popularity. But like the Wijah Wood is also in
that movie. Like there's a lot of like stars in
that movie, and I thought that was really funny. I

(01:04:28):
think John Stewart is actually in that movie, like.

Speaker 1 (01:04:33):
It's it but yeah, I don't know what you're talking about.

Speaker 2 (01:04:36):
Yeah, yeah, And I just I thought that one was
so funny. I also liked sleep Away Camp, not to
be like so On Brands. I like all the camp things,
but I also thought that that was like one of
the old classics that I was just like what, And
I'm also like, was it club? I think it's Club
Dread or Club Dead or something Club Dread right where

(01:04:58):
they're like on the island and the like. That one
was really funny too. I was dying like it was
a bunch of people who didn't want to run this
resort on this kicked off one by one by a
killer and you can't figure out who it is. So
I'm really into campy horror. And I don't know how
I would translate that into a book at this current
juncture in my career, but I've always been very interested

(01:05:20):
in that.

Speaker 1 (01:05:21):
If you ever do it, I'm definitely reading that book.
You're down, I'm definitely down for it, because that's just
you know, it should scare you, and it does scare you,
like some moments, but then there's some moments that you're
just cracking up because they're so goofy. Yes, I love that.
I love it, and I would love to read your

(01:05:41):
take on a story about that. Yeah, I would definitely
definitely be down with that.

Speaker 2 (01:05:48):
I currently have no plans by you know. Yeah there,
I did have like one idea about it that I
am just like throwing in my Google drive for now,
for however many years down the road if I ever
want to pursue it.

Speaker 1 (01:06:02):
So uh huh, So I guess that would be your
guilty pleasure books, right or are there any other generas
to you want to share with us?

Speaker 2 (01:06:12):
You know, I have toyed with romanticy as I'm sure
a lot of like romance writers toy with romanticy is
a potential for their future, right, but currently world building
has me like, maybe not yet, it could be complicated. Yeah,
content in reading a lot of romanticy right now.

Speaker 1 (01:06:34):
So I like the way they I know, they say
don't judge a book bots cover, but you gotta admit
that those book covers are very beautiful in that genre,
you know. Oh yeah, I do like to look at them.
I'm sorry, I'm a visual creature.

Speaker 2 (01:06:48):
Oh yeah, well, I mean they say don't judge a
book by its cover, but don't we all kind of
like a little bit, because otherwise you don't really know
what genre it is if you don't like dissect that
a little bit like if everything was like a brown
paperbag book, it would take me forever to select something
that I actually wanted.

Speaker 1 (01:07:02):
Yeah, yeah, exactly. And I do want to ask you,
like this morning, I saw that you you made a
post on your Twitter account about you had just you
wrote a poem and you hadn't done that in a while,
and oh yeah, poetry is kind of a thing. It's
been for a while now, for a long while, and
I was just kind of curious, you know, like what

(01:07:23):
inspired you to write a poem for the first time
in a while?

Speaker 2 (01:07:27):
You know, I don't know. Sometimes they hear someone say
something and I'm like, wow, that's like profound, and then
I want to kind of expand on it.

Speaker 1 (01:07:37):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (01:07:38):
Or sometimes they see a piece of art and I'm like,
what if that piece of art was in some way
verbalized or was in some way like written, and what
would that look like? So like, when I write poetry,
it's much more like image based, whereas I feel like
when I'm writing novels it's much more story based. Yeah
that makes any sense. But I've had a few poems

(01:08:00):
published over the years by different journals, you know, But
like if you ever, Like, nobody's ever going to do this.
But if anyone ever went back through all of my
publishing croupents halls found all the things I'd ever written,
they would realize that any time I had been published,
it was like a snapshot imagery type thing. Yeah, as
opposed to as opposed to like anything that had a

(01:08:21):
ton of plot. I think most recently I had a
poem published in like the fifty Haiku's Challenge or whatever,
and the entire thing is just like it's like three
lines because it's a haiku, right. Haiku is just like
about like visualizing daisies after a rain, or visualizing I
don't even know if it was daisy some sort of flower.

(01:08:41):
I wrote about it, Sure I did. But yeah, but
like an image, you know, or like I think, you know,
sometimes just like a turn of phrase might come to
me and I'll want to write around it. But it
doesn't happen very often anymore. Poetry was actually what I
studied originally. Might have a creative writing minor in my
bachelor's degree, Okay, yeah, or major, I can't remember. It

(01:09:02):
was part of my bachelor's degree in some way you
perform like in addition to the teaching aspect, right, and
but like poetry was my focus because you had to
like choose at Central University whether you wanted fiction or
poetry to be your focus, and poetry was actually my focus.
It was never fiction, So that was you know, it
was just kind of nice to return to that the
other day.

Speaker 1 (01:09:22):
Yeah, yeah, I mean that's kind of how I see
poetry as like it's a snapshot of a particular feeling
or thought that I'm having at the moment, and it's
just yeah, I kind of use it as a way
of free therapy, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:09:35):
I love that to.

Speaker 1 (01:09:36):
Kind of make it, you know, tangible. Now I can
see it, I can confront it and heal from it.
You know, like no matter if it's like extremely you know,
it can be humorous, it can be dark, it can
be whatever. You know, just whatever it is you're feeling
right now. It's just the way that you can kind
of express that emotion and not have it fester inside
of you so long.

Speaker 2 (01:09:57):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:09:58):
Yeah, And I love that, you know, he for one,
I'll say that. So as we wrap up, I was
just wondering what can readers expect from you next? And
are there any other upcoming projects you want to share
or so.

Speaker 2 (01:10:14):
I am contracted for one more book so far through
my publisher, and it is called The Framing Game and
it is what Gilmore Girls meet Scooby Doo. Okay, So
it takes place in like a prep school and it's
about a girl who is sort of framed for this
graffiti prank and they're considering like taking her out of

(01:10:36):
school for it because it's a private school and they
can do that. And she's got to kind of get
to the bottom of who's framing her for this major crime,
and she's like, I don't have any enemies. I don't
know who could be doing this for me and ruining
my shot at Yale. And then as the book progresses,
you realize she's an unreliable narrator and actually she sort

(01:10:57):
of stepped on everyone to get to the top, so
there is no like the list of people who have
something against her is crazy long, and you know, she's
like screwed everyone over and so then she enlists her
ex boyfriend to basically like help her figure out who
it is because she just knows for sure it's not him,

(01:11:18):
and they mostly like there's the worst detectives ever. They
keep getting caught in closets making out. I'm to be
perfectly honest. It is like hilarious Scooby Gang antics set
against like a Gilmore girl's flash like gossip Girl type background,
and it was really funny write.

Speaker 1 (01:11:36):
They're supposed to be investigating stuff and they won't quit
make I mean.

Speaker 2 (01:11:42):
I'm hey, if I was in high school, I would
have made out with Xander two he had.

Speaker 1 (01:11:51):
Oh well, that's great. So is there any like like
the last advice she'd like to or not forever just
for this particular show, of course, you would like to
give aspiring young adult authors who are just starting out.

Speaker 2 (01:12:08):
You know, I've given different advice whenever I'm asked those question,
so I'm always trying to give something different every time
I do it. And I guess probably my different one
for this one would be that you know you are
what you make A habit like a book is not
just going to happen, but if you have a habit
of sitting down to write, things will happen for you.

(01:12:28):
You will make progress. It will come. And I'm always
a person who doesn't look at oh man, I have
to write an eighty thousand weird novel like that would
be crazy to think about it in that kind of term.
But when I sit down and I think, Okay, today,
I'm going to write the scene where it's like the
dark night of the soul. This is going to be
like the sad time before everything gets happy again. And

(01:12:50):
if I'm just focused on that one tiny thing that day,
even if I only end up writing half of it,
well that's half more than I've written. So I guess
my advice to other people would be dedicate the time
and it will come.

Speaker 1 (01:13:01):
Yeah, I kind of I feel like you do, Like
putting word counts kind of kind of squelches the creativity
for me personally, you know, like I just want to
get the scene written, you know, not this has to
be exactly two thousand words or whatever, like whatever, whatever
amount of the words that needs to be used to
get this scene told is exactly how many words I

(01:13:24):
need it to be, you know. And yeah, that's excellent
advice that you've given.

Speaker 2 (01:13:29):
We'll see.

Speaker 1 (01:13:32):
And is there any messages or what message would do
you hope readers take away from and the extroverts and
and the end of summer of something You are enough.

Speaker 2 (01:13:42):
I think it's probably like the biggest message, like you
are already enough.

Speaker 1 (01:13:46):
That is beautiful. I remember, like I told you, like,
I've also had like problems like in my past, like
everybody does. And I remember one time I painted like
a painting and the only thing I put on there
was I am enough. And I think everybody used to
remember that. You know, yeah, that they there, there's only
going to ever be them. Their unique and they are important.

(01:14:07):
So that's wonderful, yes, And the you want to tell
everybody where they can find you and what you have
coming up next.

Speaker 2 (01:14:17):
So you can find me at Jessica Kfoster dot com.
You can find me on Twitter at Jessica K Foster.
You can find me on Instagram at Jessica K. Foster Authors.
You just Google me, You'll find me. I'm there. Find
my books on Amazon. You can find them on Barnesondoble
dot com. You can find them on like in your

(01:14:37):
nearest indie bookseller. They should be able to order them
as well. It's on bookshop as well. And you know,
if you are in the Brooklyn area this Sunday, hit
me up. I'm at booths three two one. I would
love to see you. Other than that, you know, if
you're in the Michigan area. I will be at bu
Zeland Pumpkinfest here on October third as well. So those

(01:14:59):
are my next two things that I've got going on.

Speaker 1 (01:15:01):
Yep, you got busy busyness right.

Speaker 2 (01:15:05):
A little bit. It is the book season.

Speaker 1 (01:15:06):
It's the seasons of books, Yes, it is. I really
appreciate you being my third guest and being on here today,
and I'm going to get this you know, edited up
so it'll be up before Sunday. I'm hoping to have
this episode going ahead up by Friday morning tomorrow morning.

Speaker 2 (01:15:23):
Sound great. Thank you so much for having me. I
really appreciate it. I love having the opportunity to talk
about books. I'm not gonna lie.

Speaker 1 (01:15:30):
Yes, I enjoy this conversation very much. I really did.
And I'll enjoy meeting you too, And I appreciate everything
you do. And you know, the good viobs are sending
out to this next generation and it's going to be amazing,
you know, to see what they come up with.

Speaker 2 (01:15:47):
You know, yes, definitely, I can't wait to read. I'm
hoping someday that like a student is like, hey, check
me out, I have this book, you know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (01:15:56):
Yes, what a great conversation with Jessica Kposter, from navigating
introverted teenage years and her books to sharing how she
finds time to write while teaching. I love getting to
know the person behind these fantastic young adult stories. If
you haven't yet, be sure to pick up Andy and
the Extroverts and Andy in the Summer of Something You'll

(01:16:17):
laugh for Late and root for Andy every step of
the way. He can find Jessica and all her upcoming
events at Jessicakfoster dot com. Thank you so much for
tuning in to this episode of the Uncomfortable Talk Show.
We'll be back soon with another amazing guest. Until then,
keep reading, keep writing, and remember it's always okay to
feel a little uncomfortable.