The Viewing Room Ep 38- Revenge of the Sith - Review and Analysis - The Viewing Room

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
What way too long? Shut up?

Speaker 2 (00:03):
Yeah, that was my one of my problems. As I'm
watching this, We're like, at we're friends anymore. We're at
like minute ten of this fight, and I'm like, Okay,
get on with it, guys. What it's ridiculous, It's incredible.

Speaker 1 (00:14):
It's way too long watching three years of mentorship, friendship,
and brotherhood all come together in one final epic battle,
and you're like, I want it over in thirty seconds.

Speaker 2 (00:23):
Just I don't want it over in thirty seconds, but
I also don't want it to be fifteen minutes long.
They just duel for way too long with nothing. There's like,
it's just a straight up duel. If you're gonna make
it that long, at least make something more interesting out
of it. And now time for the viewing room with

(00:47):
Adam and Eton.

Speaker 1 (01:00):
Welcome to the Jewni Room. We talk about films new
and olds, and local and global. Today we're talking about
Star Wars episode three, Revenge of the Sith, which released
on May twelfth, two thousand and five. May nineteen five.

Speaker 2 (01:12):
Actually it should have been Betterefit released on my fourth
Yes true.

Speaker 1 (01:17):
It has been playing in theaters this kind of week
because it is the twentieth anniversary and then a couple
of weeks or whatever, and so this is the release
window they chose, and bing bad a boom, we're here.
It was pretty busy. We went to Scotiabank saw it
and it was a lot of fun. There's some people
quoting some lines. It wasn't a sypus the Minecraft movie,
but yeah, there we are that.

Speaker 2 (01:39):
Yeah, well, I guarantee you people were quoting that one.

Speaker 1 (01:43):
Yeah, that was a pretty big one. I think this
is probably the best prequel movie. Sorry, this is the
best prequel movies. This is the best prequel Star Wars movie.
It's way better than The Phantom Menace. It's way better
than Attack of the Clones. It's good. It's good. I
enjoy this one. I'm not a huge prequel fan, but
I like this one. I like this one. It's it's

(02:03):
the least weird. It's like super emotional.

Speaker 2 (02:06):
I'll be honest. I have not watched the prequels in
so long, it's probably been ten years, so I can't
really compare them very well. All I know is that
the original trilogy is up here. Yeah, and every other
Star Wars movie except for Rogue one, it's down here.

(02:30):
There's like the original trilogy Rogue one.

Speaker 1 (02:33):
I disagree.

Speaker 2 (02:34):
Everything else I disagree.

Speaker 1 (02:35):
I think all of Star Wars is here already, like
in the real good and then like, ah, the Phantom
Menace is maybe here. Solo is about there too, yeah,
and then like Tac of Clones is a little bit
like here, but just set up here, ding ding ding
ding ding. Then Rise of Skywalker is like here, Well,
the Force Awakens is up here, and then the Last
Jedi is like here. You know what I mean?

Speaker 2 (02:58):
No, I don't, especially since twenty twelve, it's all gone.

Speaker 1 (03:04):
I think there's been some there's been some gems. There's
been some gems, and there's been some flops. I really
like The Force Awakens, the Last Jedi. There's some really
good cinematography. Overall, is a movie not a huge fan of.
Rise of Skywalker is like okay too, Like I don't
think the sequels were as bad. I think Luke Skywalker
sucked and all of them. I was like, oh, poor
Mark Cammell, like they.

Speaker 2 (03:22):
Yeah, they but Ray Skywalker is a whiny bitch whoa Okay,
so you know, maybe we'll send to that one. No,
the world gets to know how I feel.

Speaker 1 (03:35):
Wow, okay, okay, yeah, okay. Wait.

Speaker 2 (03:39):
The other thing I realized watching this movie all the
way through the first time in ten years, is how
many memes came out of this movie? Like, how many
how many like you know, memes or iconic scenes are
there in this movie?

Speaker 1 (03:50):
Like, there's a lot. I feel like there's a lot.
There's a lot. Yeah, hello there And sixty six is.

Speaker 2 (03:59):
Another one high ground Yeah, yeah, high ground ones you
would like a brother anikin or whatever it is.

Speaker 1 (04:05):
Yeah, yeah, No, there's some there's some good stuff. Uh
it was. It had a budget one hundred and thirty
million USD pretty substantial. It did gross over eight hundred
million at the box Do you know what the original
trilogy had off.

Speaker 2 (04:18):
The top of your head, No, not as much. No,
I often made they made.

Speaker 1 (04:23):
They made their money intoys, yeah, and nostalgia. No. No,
I'm curious to see how much money they make off
of this next, next, next runoff of like the North
American kind of tour that's going on right now. It'd
be very interesting to see. Uh. It was the second
highest grossing film of two thousand and five, the first
one going to Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire

(04:43):
with not very much, more like less than one hundred
million more so, like like they were pretty econnect there,
And so that's kind of where we were at in
two thousand and five Star cast. Hayden Christensen, Ian McGregor,
Ian McDermott obviously Anakin obi one in for Palpatine or
Chancellor Palpatine. I guess I should say I really like

(05:07):
Ian McDermott, like his performance as as assidious. Yeah, i'd
say it's pretty like I'd say, like it's up there,
like it's it's good, like.

Speaker 2 (05:17):
It's he does do that that pretty well.

Speaker 1 (05:19):
Anakin's acting is, although there is some issues. I think
Aiden Christensen.

Speaker 2 (05:28):
Hold on my mother's calling me hello mother.

Speaker 1 (05:33):
Yes, I think I think there's some weird moments with
with Chancellor Palpatine where he's where I'm like, oh, why
does it sound like he's almost taking pleasure in certain
things like God and I'm like uh okay uh. And
then Aiden Christensen, I think I was given a raw

(05:56):
deal with dialogue. That's one actor there was. I was
there's some dialogue in this.

Speaker 2 (06:01):
I was reading the Roger Roger Ebert review and there
was one line that I really liked that specifically when
it comes to Anakin and padme to say that George
Lucas cannot write a love scene as an understatement, greeting
cards have expressed more passion.

Speaker 1 (06:21):
Yeah, it's it's pretty bad. Like I feel like there's
just some dialogue and it's unfortunate that George Lucas isn't like.

Speaker 2 (06:26):
Especially those opening scenes with Ian McGregor, those are just
not good. I felt like the first few scenes, especially
like when they're going to rescue Chancellor Balpatine, that was
just like.

Speaker 1 (06:40):
It was worse for Grievous where he's like leaving his
like no talk to escape and like what Yeah, like
that would never fly like in a movie nowadays. It
would be chastised and ridiculed. And and like they had
some dialogue like that, and like the sequels and and
everyone's like, oh, we hated that it was so bad

(07:01):
and the acting is bad, but then that happens in
the prequels and everyone's like it's a space opera, guys.
I feel like I'm a huge Star Wars fan. I
have to admit there's kind of a lot of hypocrisy,
Like when Finn in the sequel says they fly now
or whatever, and everyone's like, oh, that was terrible. Everyone
knows there was jet backtroopers and stuff like that. I

(07:22):
was like, okay, whatever, it's a line. It wasn't even
that bad acted, it's crappy dialogue whatever. It was something
they could say to be a cheesy little thing because
they have to make it a little light hearted. And
everyone's like, that was bad sequel writing. But those same
people on Reddit are like glazing the sequels and they're like,
oh my god, it was so good. It's like but
they're like, everyone's willing to completely turn a blind eye

(07:43):
to be like it's time to escape and no, you
fell right into my trap.

Speaker 2 (07:47):
But a dialogue, it's not.

Speaker 1 (07:49):
It's like, okay, I get it. The dialogue can be
good and bad and acted poorly in different scenarios. It's
never black and white. But come on, as a Star
Wars fan, you have to agree that sometimes the writing,
like in dialogue is a little cheesy. And I find
to admit that because it's a space opera.

Speaker 2 (08:07):
Yeah, well, but it's at the same time, I'd like
to see it better.

Speaker 1 (08:11):
It's a sci fi fantasy. We have to understand that
some things are gonna be different, and sometimes they use
stilistic things to showcase that like the world isn't when
they say, like Dank Ferrick in The Mandalorian, you know
what I mean, It's.

Speaker 2 (08:23):
Like, well, there's some things where it's like I like,
you know, one of my biggest pet pieces when you
have like a fantasy movie or like a high fantasy
or something and they talk with like modern slang. It's
one of my biggest pet pees in movies, Like if
you gotta you've got to match the dialogue to the
time period. And while this is set like a long
time in the past, it's essentially a future future civilization, right,

(08:43):
It's a future timeframe that is set in the past,
And but they talk in such a weird way. And
I get what they're trying to go for, like kind
of more of like a royalty, a little more proper,
but it just feels kind of basic and weird.

Speaker 1 (08:57):
They're they're supposed to be elegant, like very civilized, and
and it is it's such a weird thing because they're
also trying to sell how dramatic it is. And so like,
I've never really had a huge problem with Dialogue and
Star Wars because I'm like, okay, like interesting choice, but like,
I'm okay with it. But my main point here is like,
as a huge Star Wars fan, and I'm guilty of it,

(09:19):
there's kind of a bit of hypocrisy that gets thrown
in the mix because it's like a lot of the
people who hate the sequels love the prequels, But a
lot of the people who like the sequels who hate
the prequels overlook a lot of things that are very
similar in the two that they criticize the other four.

Speaker 2 (09:34):
And one of the big, big things that makes the
prequels better in my mind is that the characters are better. Yes,
characters are fin I mean, like, look at like Anakin's
character is, whether or not however you want to talk
about the dialogue or the acting whatever, the character itself
is really well constructed, and the internal conflicts in the

(09:56):
way and you know, I mean, it's it's really well done.
The ones in the in the in the the the
new movies, they're they're not.

Speaker 1 (10:03):
They weren't just that you weren't attached to that.

Speaker 2 (10:05):
No, you're not attached to them, and they just feel
like they're not as as they just don't have the
same realistic feel that the characters like they just feel
like either they're perfect you know, heroes, or they're evil villains,
and it's just it's just I wish there was a
little more of that. Like with this one, it feels
a little more like really it makes you quote the prequels.

(10:26):
It really makes a question are the jedis the good
guys at all the time? You know what I mean,
Like some of the things they do, and and like
you know, with Anakin, you're like, he's you know, he's
trying to do the you know what he feels as good,
but it's taking him down the wrong path. Like there's
there's that conflict, internal conflict, and and it's a little
less cut and dry, which I don't like about the
new ones, you know, and the characters just they feel

(10:48):
more real.

Speaker 1 (10:49):
How I look at it is, And you made a
good point there, like if they feeling real, I look
at it as like the prequels are like almost like
the characters are figuring out the world still, and you're
like following Anakin's journey on him learning like what did
it means to be a Jedi? And then his past
coming into the dark size and it's interesting and you're

(11:12):
like you're learning more about the world and following it
and you're learning about the Trade Federation and all that stuff.
And then the sequels to me feel more like we
already know the whole world, so instead of like following
the characters learning the world, it's like they're going on
an adventure through that exact same thing. Like it's like,
how do I put this in an analogy? It's like
my buddy is showing me his minecraft world. Yeah, and

(11:34):
I'm seeing all the things he's built and stuff like that,
and he's giving me a tour. That's what the sequels
feel like in comparison.

Speaker 2 (11:40):
Yes, to like, or he's like showing me his new house, yeah,
and and and.

Speaker 1 (11:45):
Instead that, like the prequels are like, okay, let's explore
how this was built. Yeah, and and and follow a
character journey and the like yeah, the sequels to me
just feel like, yeah, we've been there, so now instead
of all the characters learning, it's like they know everything.
Oh yeah, exactly, gonna just.

Speaker 2 (12:00):
And they're perfect at it, whereas with the with the
with the prequels, we see Anne can go from little
boy to you know, man like and we see that
that journey, you know, whereas with the new ones, it's
like we meet you know, Ray, and she's living on
a desert island, never been off the planet, and she
knows exactly how to you know, do all this stuff,

(12:21):
and it just feels like, I.

Speaker 1 (12:22):
Ray, I like Daisy Ridley. I think she did a
good job, but I feel like a lot of it
was just so scuffed, you know what I mean, Like
there's just a lot of stuff that was just like
creative differences that weren't ironed out. I feel like Finn
could have really been the Jedi. I was kind of
really hoping to see, like Finn be the Jedi. That
would have been cool, like and then like or have
them both be Jedis in some capacity, but it just

(12:44):
like the first movie starts off in the sequels of
Ray not even like, wait, the Force is real, and
Han Solo's like, yeah, it's true, all of it, and
you're like, oh, like okay, like yeah, and then she's
immediately like a Jedi and it's like it's like wait, wait,
hold on a second, but you didn't even believe in
the Force. Took us.

Speaker 2 (13:00):
It took us three years, three movies to get Anakin
to be a full on Jedi even then he wasn't
a Jedi master.

Speaker 1 (13:05):
Exactly, you know, and and I mean Luke obviously. Again,
here's something, and this is a criticism I have with
the original trilogy. We go and see Luke. Okay, this,
I love the original trilogy and Pera strikes Back is insane.
A new Hope is. I think they're the best. But
here's the little issue. Luke in the and the Empire

(13:29):
strikes Back, goes and see Yoda decides he doesn't want
to even complete his training, goes because it's hand chopped off,
defeated by Darth Vader. But he goes, right, so he's
not a Jedi. But then the next movie picks up
and he is a jedis he's considered a Jedi night
and don't we don't see any of that. He goes
back to Yoda to complete his training or whatever. But right, yeah,
he knows all the Jedi mind tricks. We don't see

(13:50):
any of that. And people excuse that, and I'm willing
to excuse that. Whatever. That's fine. I really liked it,
and I love Luke in A Return of the Jedi.
He's awesome. The black robes and stuff like that. He's
such a cool Jedi. But again, another thing people criticize
the sequels for they do that with Ray and everyone's
fine with it. No one, No one's fine with that.
But they were fine with that in the original trilogy.

(14:12):
Why do you think that it?

Speaker 2 (14:13):
Yeah, but the timeline even like let's look at look
at that set swamp scene with Yoda, Right, So he
goes to the swamp and he's like, you know, teach
me how to be a knight. And then then he realizes, Oh,
this isn't gonna be as easy as I thought it was, right,
and you know, he tries a few things, he kind
of sucks at it.

Speaker 1 (14:32):
We have the Yoda's theme.

Speaker 2 (14:33):
Yeah, so yes, yes, But then with with with Ray
in the in the newer movies, it just kind of
feels like she just is already perfect at it and like,
I don't know it, Like it's sort of like the
the She Hulk. She's treatment she's perfect at it.

Speaker 1 (14:54):
She's she's pretty clumsy though, and she can't use the
force at first and stuff like that, But she has
raw talent, is what they trying to explain it. I
don't have it, so did Luke.

Speaker 2 (15:02):
But just because you have the talent doesn't mean you,
like I mean, you can be a musical genius, you know,
with raw talent, but if you don't like learn how
to hone that you're never gonna be as much as
you would if you did, you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (15:15):
So I was just posing you the question. In my mind,
it makes sense to me that like that, like I
don't like raise journey as much because here's the thing
we've set up knowing that Luke is like a skywalker.
He's pretty powerful, or's right, we know this information as
we go through the trilogy that he's like, he's pretty
powerful and the boy must be trained in all this jazz.
And then Luke goes to the most powerful Jedi, Yoda,

(15:35):
and Yoda was like, no, I do not there is
no try and like, okay, cool, Like he's learning things,
he's growing perfect, he's pretty powerful. He must be the
chosen one or or resemble the chosen one in in
one way bring balance to the force. And and we
go through and like, okay, he's the chosen one. This
is great, and so we know he must be pretty important.

(15:57):
And so we're okay with Luke kind of time jump
some training because he's the chosen one, right, we don't
know anything about Ray, and so what they do to
try and sell you on the idea that Ray is
it can do the same exact thing that they passed
Luke off to do is they're like, well, raise a Palpatine.
They reveal that in the third movie whatever, and it's
like what, Everyone's like, no, that what? Yeah, you just

(16:19):
spent the whole time convincing us that she was literally No. One.
And then you're like, but she's not a No one.

Speaker 2 (16:23):
Yeah, And you're like but but there's no foreshadowing or nothing.
It was just all of a sudden, she's like, wait,
why does it even matter?

Speaker 1 (16:30):
Then? Like like what She's like, oh, you're Palpatine's granddaughter,
Like okay, like and and so that's why to me,
it's not as convincing that she was able to do it,
because it's like, we're convinced that she's No. One and
they keep throwing us in our face. Everyone keeps calling
her a nobody. Yeah, And obviously part of the Here's
journey is we're like she's trying to convince everything that

(16:52):
she's not a nobody and she isn't. But like the
movie wants to tell us that she's a nobody, and
then the movie's also like but she's the most powerful Jedi,
you know what I find about that?

Speaker 2 (17:00):
But you know what, you know in the whatever whatever
the movie with the ship ton of destroyers was you
remember that one?

Speaker 1 (17:08):
Which one?

Speaker 2 (17:09):
Whichever one where they revealed the massive army of start stroyers.

Speaker 1 (17:13):
Oh, and then like the force Lightning comes and that's
the last one. That one.

Speaker 2 (17:15):
Yeah, you know when she goes to you know, you know,
defeat Palpatine or whatever, and there's like the two Emperor's
guards or whatever, and she's like a whole fight sequence
with them. Can I just point out that when Yoda
goes to see Palpatine, he just walks in and flicks
his hand and the two of them are down. Yeah,
it's like the most powerful, but we have to have

(17:36):
a whole fight sequence.

Speaker 1 (17:37):
Interesting thing. Ian McGregor actually wanted to play one of
those guards. Oh yeah, And I couldn't figure out if
it actually wasn't, but he requested to play one of
those guards. It is like a funny little thing. Let
me read a synopsis. Yeah, that was a really good
preliminary conversation. Yeah, just as like summarize I like the
original trilogy the best. I think the prequels have some Sorry,
the prequels have some great moments, but some of them

(17:58):
are a little too goofy for me, and I'm not
a huge super duper fantasy sequels. I love all of
Star Wars. I think Star Wars is great, and I
love all the movies for different reasons, but if we're
comparing them, I have problems with each. So when I
say someone something's weaker, I'm like, I don't like it
as much, but I've still watched it twelve times, you
know what I mean. And I don't think Ray Skywalker
is perfect. I like Daisy Ridley. I liked the way

(18:20):
it was played, I just don't like again, I think
some of the dialogue and the journey there was so
scoffed and not planned out. It felt more like it
was coming making it away. And there's some stuff in
the original trilogy that was made up along the way.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
Yeah, I just for me, I just don't. I just
don't like her character at all. I think it's it's
kind of silly and and I don't know anyway, it.

Speaker 1 (18:41):
Just feels like a worse version of Luke Skywalker in
a way, I have a desert kid that doesn't know anything,
and she's a chosen one, but they don't tell us
that she's a chosen one, and we're like, she's a Palpatine. Yeah, exactly. Okay,
I'll read the synopsis. Okay, if you can figure out

(19:03):
how to unlock your phone. Yeah. It has been three
years since the Clone Wars began. Jedi masterbi Wan Kenobi
and Jedi nine Anakin Skywalker rescue Chancellor Palpatine from General Grievous,
the commander of the Droid Armies. Grievous escapes. Suspicions are
raised within the Jedi Council concerning Chancellor Palpatine, with whom
Anakin has formed a bond, asked to find the Chancellor,

(19:24):
and full bitterness towards and full of bitterness towards the
Jedi Council, Anakin embraces the.

Speaker 2 (19:29):
Dark side, yes, and also to what he feels to
save his wife.

Speaker 1 (19:35):
Yes. Yes, So we go through here. We have a
really awesome CGI sequence where like Anakin and Obi Waner
and their Jedi star Fighters and they're shooting down like droids,
tri fighters and stuff like that, and you see like
the Venitors. Is this the first time we see a
live action veenitor. I can't remember.

Speaker 2 (19:51):
I don't remember.

Speaker 1 (19:52):
I'm not sure. But anyways, they basically hop on like
the Invisible Hand is what it's called. It's general grievous
as ship. They don't call it the Invisible Hand in
this book.

Speaker 2 (20:02):
But I don't like this sequence, this opening sequence is
what terrible? What when they get goosebumps every time when
they get on his ship.

Speaker 1 (20:10):
It's just that's a little it's a little it's a
little goofy, and it's a really goofy. It's suspension of
disbelief though that's what Star Wars is. It's like, no,
but like, once they get on, the ships are hippo,
where are the guards?

Speaker 2 (20:22):
That's my problem with it is there's battle droids. Okay,
there's like two of them, and then they their biggest
challenge is getting up the elevator, like come on, you're
gonna tell me here's warned by an elevator, Like come on.

Speaker 1 (20:34):
It's it's kind of ridiculous, a brother. There's a lot
of elevator mechanics who would tell you the exact same thing.
But listen, here's the thing. This is what I mean
when I said, Star Wars fans are hyppric. It's as
a Star Wars fan, I'll admit I'm a hypocrite about
a lot of things. Some things just work and some
things don't because it's it's a lot of bit about
of personal enjoyment. Right, Here's the thing, It's just the

(20:58):
whole world is suspension of disbelief, right.

Speaker 2 (21:00):
Yeah, but you can have what am I willing to
Why am I willing.

Speaker 1 (21:03):
To suspend disbelief that that Anakin can use his ship
to knock off buzz droids off of Obi Wan's ship
and cut off his wing and Obi Wan still find
talking about that, But I'm not willing to suspend disbelief
that the elevator broke on their way up.

Speaker 2 (21:19):
I mean, but I'm talking about I'm talking about the
like the elevator being like their biggest challenge. Once they
get in there, there should be guards all over. There
should be swarms of droids trying to take them out there.
Should They shouldn't just be able to waltz on into
the main command post of General Grievous's ship.

Speaker 1 (21:37):
Yes, they absolutely should. You know. You want to know why,
because Chancellor Palpatine is controlling the strings. He needs the
Jedi to be able to get to him so that
he can convince them that he needs rescuing before they
actually are like kidnapped by Grievous and taken away. You know,
you know what I mean, Because he's pulling the strings right.

(21:58):
If they were immediately killed, well then like the plan's
not really working because then how else is Chancellor Palpatine
going to escape? He needs to be able to escape
and make it realistic. Well. Also, that's why he wants
to leave obi Wan when obi Wan gets knocked out,
because he's like, okay, perfect, that's one problem down. Now
I just have Anakin. Anakin can free me and we
can escape together, and now obi Wan doesn't have to
get in the way. That's what I mean. Like he

(22:19):
that's why he's he's pulling the strings. And not everyone
knows about the plant, you know what I mean? Not
everyone knows that Chancellor Palpatine is the bad guy on
both sides.

Speaker 2 (22:28):
That's the other thing in that scene where he gets
knocked down by like that like beam or whatever it is,
Oh my.

Speaker 1 (22:34):
God, awful, least awful. I currange when I see that shot,
and it's just I don't know why. It's just like
he knocks the platform over and then Obi Wan's corpse slides,
you know.

Speaker 2 (22:45):
And the interaction between them is just wrong, like just
it's just and come on, you guys can do better
than that. If you did what you did in the
eighties with those models, you can do better than that.
In like two thousand and two, come on, Yeah, that
one was pretty rough. Like that one's definitely pretty rough.

(23:05):
I cringe when I see that shot.

Speaker 1 (23:07):
Yeah, especially since you have such a beautifully crafted CGI
sequence in my opinion, where they're flying through CGI is
pretty it's a crazy awesome scores and then all of
a sudden, this shot on ground in real life. Yeah,
it's the worst shot I've seen in the whole movie.
And it's just like so many how did you perfect
all the ship sequences? And then the VFX team was like, yeah,

(23:29):
the audiences are gonna love.

Speaker 2 (23:30):
This, and it's just like crushed on the I mean,
and that fight sequence to that, that opening fight sequence
with oh what's his face? Doku? Yeah, doku, that is
terribly choreographed. There are so many opportunities there where they

(23:51):
had to end that fight like within thirty seconds, Like
there was one in particular where like they you know,
he had a little exchange with Anakin and then he
turned to Kenobi and then Anakin's just standing there, like
literally just standing there with the guys back to him. Yeah,
there's like and like like because the fight choreography overall

(24:13):
was quite good. It's classic Star Wars, some great and
right right, but like that one, I was.

Speaker 1 (24:19):
Like, oh my god, Like the Duku fights were pretty
rough unfortunately. Like I felt like the same way in
the Attack of the Clones, just like they make Obi
Wan so weak compared to Anakin, and I get it.
They want to show Anakin's like better and the chosen one,
but Obi Wan just consistently gets his ass handed to him.
And all these movies, yeah, kidnapped and destroyed and defeated,
and you're just like, how am I led to believe

(24:41):
that this is the guy who's gonna take down Anakin
at the end of the movie. Like it's just like
it's just too bad because I feel like in all
the secondary media, like the Kenobe TV show. Sorry, I'm
touching a lot.

Speaker 2 (24:49):
Careful that bottle too.

Speaker 1 (24:53):
We didn't have water in the studio, so I'm drinking wine.

Speaker 2 (24:57):
You're not you're drinking an adult beverage adull beverage.

Speaker 1 (25:04):
Uh. I don't think we're allowed to do that on
a Yeah we are. It's space wine zero percent. It
was directed by George Lucas. I don't know if I
said that, obviously we know George directed Star Wars. I
don't know. I feel kind of bad for saying Starvice
fans are hypocrites, but you get what I know they are.
It's just like I feel like I've been a fan

(25:25):
of Star Wars since I was a little kid. It's
my favorite media. I buy all the Star Wars lego lego.
My whole room is Star Wars.

Speaker 2 (25:31):
I remember, I have a lightsaber your your full sized
Star Destroyer is. I am very jealous.

Speaker 1 (25:36):
Yeah, every every December, I watch every single Star Wars movie,
like two years in a row. Now I've done that,
and I've done that like my whole life. Pretend I
went to my grandma Sue. It's my favorite thing in
the whole world. And that's why I'm kind of comfortable
saying in a way, and I don't care if it
really offense people. If like I think a lot of
Starvice fans are hypocrites because I know, I admit if
I look at the things I say, a lot of
it it means I'm a hypocrite because I say, like, oh,

(25:58):
like like I can pass off certain things, and some
of it just comes down to better writing and other stuff,
but a lot of it just means, like, hey, listen,
everyone has different opinions, and we have to understand that.
There's never been a time where every Star Wars fan
has been happy. Yeah, everyone's like, oh, that was too
violent or that was nonviolent? Enough of that. I didn't

(26:19):
like the dialogue there, right.

Speaker 2 (26:21):
Yeah, I'm making a violence appreciating Sorry, speaking of violence,
you got to check out that cord Our Crew video.
I just showed you this before the episode. They make
Star Wars like there's much a special effects artist and
they make Star Wars R rated. I'll leave a link
to it, yeah, in the description of this video. But yeah,
it's it's pretty funny.

Speaker 1 (26:38):
Yeah, it's it's fine. I don't know. I just I
love Star Wars so much. Yeah, and I think it's great.
And I know, just like, you can't make everyone happy.
So a lot of times when I don't like something
as Star Wars, I truy appreciate the world that I
know and love, like with the stuff I do like
because it's like I'd rather do that than just be
negative all the time and be like, oh, I hate,
I hate the sequels and all this stuff. And there

(27:00):
was a lot of rap in the sequels. But let's
think of some good things just off the top of
her head, just as a thank you to the Star Wars.
Like that shot in uh in the the Last Jedi
where they look like the shuttles coming down, but it's
really just an iron pressing the clothes. That's hilarious. That's
probably one of the funniest scenes in all of Star Wars.
Loved that in the theater. Hilarious. Right, that's a great

(27:22):
thing that happened in the sequels, hilarious comedy that worked
so well. And then the next scene sucks ass, but
like that was just amazing. Right. It's like there's things
you can appreciate and love overall. They may suck, but
like I like to focus on some of the stuff
that like, hey, that was funny. That was I would
have rather just those movies though. I Mean that's a
fair point too. Yeah, yeah, that's a fair point. I

(27:45):
I just to me, the only thing was Luke Skywalker,
Like that was not the only thing, but the biggest
thing was Luke Skyworker.

Speaker 2 (27:51):
For me, it was Ray, I just Ray was just
her character just was was ridiculous in my opinion. And
and and when you're when your main character is not
a great character, it's hard to it's hard to get
behind a movie.

Speaker 1 (28:07):
So yeah, we should also say that Star Wars is
coming up with the Mandalorin and Grogu show or sorry
movie yes next May. And in May twenty seven, they
just announced that Ryan Gosling is gonna be starting in
a new Star Wars movie called Jedi Starfighter or sorry,
sorry star Wars Starfighter. Is it? Like? What is it?
It's set after I think it's set a few years
after the sequels. But it's like I think it's a

(28:28):
standalone thing. I don't think there's like it's Ryan Goslin starting.

Speaker 2 (28:31):
It's like the standalone like when they did Rogue one,
I really like was awesome, and a lot of people
hated it, you know, a lot of people hated that
they all died in the end. I'm like, no, I
like that.

Speaker 1 (28:42):
This is what I mean, right like it?

Speaker 2 (28:44):
And I mean I don't want to see them die.
But it was such a compelling movie, like that ending
scene where they're all where they're on that planet and
you realize, oh shit, they're all gonna die like you,
It's it's compelling.

Speaker 1 (28:54):
It's a very good standalone movie. And people are complaining like, oh,
jin Urso didn't know Rector Krenick at the end, and
so the final scene where director Krenic's like trying to
figure out who she is and like she doesn't know her,
people are like, oh, that sucks, Like you're supposed to
have them the bad guy know each other and stuff
like that, and I was like maybe, but like also
it helps so much with scale, you know what I mean,

(29:15):
Like it's like, how did that ruin the movie for you?
Because then they have this scene where they realize like
she's Gale or So's daughter and stuff like that, and
like that's cool. It doesn't mean the characters weren't fleshed out.
They're all gonna die for so lot anyway, And second
of all, it's like a cool big reveal for Krenick
where he realizes he's beat. Yeah. Anyways, and Or season
two just came out. I haven't started watching it. Andrew
season one was amazing. There's this incredible scene with Andy

(29:37):
Serkis that I won't spoil, but it was just a
phenomenal show and season one loved it.

Speaker 2 (29:41):
I've watched most of the Star Wars shows. I watch
a couple of episodes of Mandalorin, and I haven't watched
anything more. Now I spoil it. Yeah, okay, so so
it spoilers for season one.

Speaker 1 (29:50):
They get sent to this prison, like and Or gets
sent to this prison and basically he's sent there to
do like work and labor and stuff like that. And
all these prisons, all these prisons are crossed like and
stuff like that. They're not allowed to talk to people
on other floors and stuff like that because it's sectioned
off in mega prisons. Yeah, they find out they have
this ability to like floor shock and kill people because
like whatever it's is security prison, they kill an entire floor,

(30:13):
like the Empire of one hundred and fifty people, three
hundred people like someone in there, all of them instantly
killed and everyone's freaking out and sucks, and you want
to you know why they killed them because someone found
out in the floor that when people's sentences were over
at this prison instead of releasing them. They were secretly
transferring them to other prisons across the galaxy. So crazy, right,

(30:33):
So anyways, the whole prison goes into Mayhem and escape happens, right,
and they're like this prison surrounded by water. A bunch
of stuff happens. They escape, and the guy who leads
the escape like and helps and Er break free Intuck
like that is played by Andy serkis like gall him
and shit like that. He realizes he can't swim, like
they don't know the prison surrounded by water, so he
can't escape the prison. He's the one that led the

(30:54):
whole escape and so he ends up dying because or
like we don't know exactly what happened to him, but
but like, yeah, he can't leave the p and that
he helped everyone escape because because he can't swim, isn't
that just like crazy? Yeah? Like that that was like
I get goosebumps every time I watched that scene. I've
watched like three times just because like, yeah, like everyone's escaped,
everyone's so happy, and like Anderill looks over and he's
like what's wrong, Keno, and he's like I can't swim, dude, dude.

(31:17):
It's like heartbreaking, but like anyways, great show, loved it,
very cool. Let's get into this movie.

Speaker 2 (31:23):
Yeah, we we've kind of we've kind of we've kind
of jumped around a fair bit here.

Speaker 1 (31:28):
More of the story. We're gonna do more Star Wars
down the line. I think we're probably gonna do may
help a new hope for Star Wars day because people
have strikes back.

Speaker 2 (31:35):
Yeah yeah, Colseum's putting on Empire strikes Back, So definitely
check them out. Colsseum Presents Dot. They got a whole
bunch of fun ones coming up. Bill and Ted is next,
Monty Python is in there, Indiana Jones. They've got Mother's
Day and Father's Day movies. You've got Mama Mia from
Mother's Day and Field of Dreams Day for Father's Day. Yeah, so, uh,
lots of good stuff coming there will be at most

(31:56):
of those, so check yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:58):
Uh. Okay, so we start off this movie, we're we're
in the Invisible Hand. We're gonna go find basically Anakin
Obi Wan. They find the Chancellor, they get into a
bit of a fight with Douku. Anakin ends up killing Douku,
beheading him because Chancellor Palpatine told him to, which isn't
the Jedi way. But basically Chanceller Palpatine's like, yeah, he's

(32:19):
he's too powerful to be kept alive. Basic that double
whiteab kills and cuts his head off, and uh Anakin's like,
oh man, I probably shouldn't have done that because that's
not like the Jedi. And then Chancellor Palpatine's like whatever,
he was a bad guy, and an Can's like okay,
and so so they leave. Obi Wan kind of like
gets like destroyed, but they carry him out of there. Basically,

(32:43):
they get kidnapped on their way out by General Grievous,
and General Grievous is like haha, well now you've fallen
into my trap, and YadA, YadA, YadA. They break free,
kill a bunch of his guards, and General Grievous escapes.
They crash his ship into Coruscant, and basically everyone's like, well,
Chancellor Palpatine's back, even though we like destroyed millions of

(33:03):
dollars in property damage's back again. They literally like destroyed.

Speaker 2 (33:09):
I thought the same thing. I was like, like, hold on, like,
you're you're you're not you're you're you're happy that they've
just crash landed and destroyed, you know, millions of dollars
or whatever space credit's worth of.

Speaker 1 (33:23):
Yeah, exactly, it is mega run with right. Yeah. Anyway,
so Chancellor Palpatine is back. They're going through all the
things they need to figure out how to end the
war because the Clone Wars have been going on for
a couple of years now. Basically, the Jedi Council needs
Anakin and obi Wan to do some certain things. So
they get Anakin onto the council, but they don't grant

(33:43):
him the rank of Master because they don't think he's
like necessarily trustworthy enough or earned it yet. And instead
of being happy that Anakin's on the council, he's like, well,
it's embarrassing they didn't give you the rank of master.
And so obi Wan's like, Anakin, it is, It's very
good that you you're on the the council is so young.
He's like, it's embarrassing Master, So.

Speaker 2 (34:06):
Uh whiny bitch.

Speaker 1 (34:08):
Yeah yeah, he's kind of being a little bit of whiny. Uh.

Speaker 2 (34:13):
And and and then we find out Padme is pregnant too.
On that way, when they come back, had Me is.

Speaker 1 (34:18):
Pregnant with a baby with a baby. Keep that in mind, mitosis.
That's how Luke and Lao were created like no. So basically,

(34:44):
the Council needs the boys to do a couple of things.
First of all, they need to figure out where she
Grievous went so they can go and kill him. And
they need someone to spy on Palpatine because even with
Duku dead, he's not relieving relinquishing his emergency powers. He's
still in control of like the Senate, making all the decisions.
So they're kind of like, hold on a second, why

(35:04):
hasn't he done this yet? So they need to see
if when they kill Grievous, if he's gonna relinquish control
or not, because if not, then they have like a
serious problem in their hands. So interesting, right, So eventually
they find Grievous, they send Obi one to kill him. Basically,
Douku and Anakin are kind of buddy buddy and Duke.
That's right, Palpatine and Anakin, he's like, hey, if they
don't sell you, send you to kill Grievous, the Jedi

(35:27):
must be evil because there's got to be a plot
to kill me because you're clearly the best choice. And
they send ob One and said and Anakin's like, hmm,
this is weird. Anakin and Obi Wan have a nice
sendoff and stuff like that. They talk and and do whatever. Basically,
Anakin and Palpatine get a little closer with each other.
Anakin finds out that he's he thinks he's having these

(35:51):
visions that padme' is gonna die in childbirth and and
so he's trying to avoid.

Speaker 2 (35:55):
And it's the same ones that he had when his
mother died, right, and so he's like, wait, hold on,
this might actually mean something.

Speaker 1 (36:02):
So he goes to Yoda because he's fearful, and Yoda's like, well,
basically like the fear of you have to get rid
of that fear of loss, because yes, it might make
you act out in a way, and you might actually
cause these issues by doing this, and and you need
to basically like know that like when people pass on,
like it's actually a joy that they're with the force
and turn into the force and not like be afraid

(36:23):
of losing them, because that's like a fear of too
jealousy and anger and hatred, because that's like what the
dark side is. Yeah, and then it can's like all right, cool,
but then the immediately goes to badmes like I want
more so Palpatine's sensing this kind of weakness. And we
know Palpatine is like Emperor Palpatine, he's evil whatever, so
he's trying to course Anakin into the dark side. He

(36:46):
basically tells him, hey, like the path the way to
the Force is a pillar of ability, something to consider
it to be. I'm natural or whatever he says, and
and basically like tells him about like Darth Plague is
the Wise and how he could like people from people
from dying but not himself in himself. How ironic. And
Anakin's like, well, I want to learn this power. And

(37:07):
so Palpatine reveals himself to be the sith Lord, and
Anakin's like, whoa hold on a second, like this ain't
who I'm gonna tell mass window window on you. But
but Chancellor Palpatine's like, hey, but just no, like you
won't be able to stop pad made from death if
you if you do this. So Anakin fights with himself
in a bit for a bit, and he goes this

(37:28):
is all over the course of like the whole movie.
I'm just going over at all once because I can't
keep going cut to cut too, because that's ridiculous. So
all that's happening, and yeah, it's It's very interesting because
Anakin has this little dilemma where he's like, Okay, do
I turn him in or do I, like whatever, try

(37:52):
and learn the dark side. And he eventually decides he's
gonna turn him in, but he's very much like already
in the dark side in a little bit because he's
he's so he does he wants to keep Palpatine alive
if they kidnap him, because there might be a way
that he can still learn all these things from Palpatine.
And everyone wins, right, But that kind of agreed is

(38:12):
what leads people down the path of darkness. Yes, spoiler alert,
the Jedi councils spread out, Yati Mundy is out, he's gone,
yaddles away. Yoda goes to Kashik to help the Wookies,
and we see Chewbacca and Chief Tarful.

Speaker 2 (38:27):
I love the Wookies, probably some of my favorite characters.

Speaker 1 (38:29):
In Star Warsies are pretty cool. We see Kashik and
probably the most iconic battlefront map and the council spread
out and whatever we know, and Mace Window stays to
kind of oversee things and keep an eye on the Palpatine,

(38:51):
and I can obviously feels bad about Spines, so he
actually feels like the Jedi Council must be up to something. Guys, Chincer.
Palpatine isn't necessarily a bad guy, right because it doesn't
seem like it. He seems like he really wants basically
Anakin's being manipulated by the Dome.

Speaker 2 (39:05):
And again he feels like he's he should be loyal
to the Republic because you know, he feels that that
that well Mace murder. Palpatine wants what's best for the Empire,
and he's loyal to the Empire.

Speaker 1 (39:21):
Yeah, he wants Padme and the Republic to be like
alive and stuff like that, because the Jedi, the Jedi
is supposed to keep like democracy and stuff like that.
They're not necessarily for the Republic. Yeah, uh, they're like
four piece and stuff like that. And it just so
happened to be on the republic side because that's yeah,
the war didn't start with the Republic. It started with
the separatists basically. Anyways, obi Wan goes, he fights Grievous,

(39:47):
uh kills Grievous a bunch of cool sequences, basically finding
out that he's on this one planet what's the planet called?
I forget Uh, let's it's a car, but that's the
planet in.

Speaker 2 (39:59):
Uh, I don't remember the planet name.

Speaker 1 (40:01):
This is gonna eat me up. Uh, that's the planet.
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (40:08):
I you keep them all straight. And he gets to
the how and.

Speaker 1 (40:12):
Basically like tell him that, like, yeah, Grievous is there,
and the army's there. They're about to move all the
separatist leaders to Musafar, which is like a lava planet
designed to be George Lucas's version of Hell. It's basically
how we illustrated that one and and so oh we
won fights, Creevius kills him, we have the iconic hello

(40:33):
there scene, and they fight, they duel pretty cool. Then
now Palpatine urges everyone to execute Order sixty six while
this is going on, execute ODIs, which turns all the
clones on the republic side basically evil.

Speaker 2 (40:52):
I wish it was I wish it was execute Order
six hundred and sixty six. That would have been a
lot better. Why the number of the Beast?

Speaker 1 (41:01):
Oh I see, I see, I see. It's very interesting.
Yeahs like six six the number of the beast. That's
a very interesting fire. We're born to be released. D
Dent Iron made great song We're Gonna overlay you playing
guitar hero Like. Uh So, basically, all the Clones start

(41:26):
killing the Jedi because and and the Wookies. A lot
of the Wookies too, ah, which is kind of interesting
because you'd think the Wookies would be able to also
kind of communicate here's the thing. They're killing the Jedi
and Wookies and all that stuff. The Wookies would be
able to tell people like, hey, hold on a second,
this isn't necessarily right because if it's just the Jedi,

(41:48):
people can convince easily that the Jedi turned and stuff
like that. But then if people are like, oh, yes,
it was the Jedi and the Wookies, well hold on
a second, both of them. Yeah, the Wookies had nothing
to do with this. I just come and helped them
with the war. You tell me, the Wookies and the
Jedi and that village on Tattooing all rebelled. Hold on
just a second, you know what I mean? So that

(42:08):
was kind of like a bit weird basically, but they know,
like the Wooies would turn on them anyways, but start
killing the Jedi because the Jedi turned on them and treason.
So all the Clones are convinced like, okay, let's because
they have inhibit or chips basically Star Wars Lord, we
won't explain it. They turned, they killed the Jedi. There's
a mass murder of all the Jedi across the galaxy
who're fighting the Clone Wars. Anakin assent to the Jedi

(42:32):
Temple to kill younglings because now he's he's Darth Vader
basically well.

Speaker 2 (42:35):
And he's also so powerful that he can't take on
any of the other Jedis. He has to deal with
the kids.

Speaker 1 (42:40):
The kids. Yeah, yeah, that's a little weird. Yeah, So
he goes. He goes and kills a bunch of Jedi
young wings at the temple and the Skywalker. There are
too many of them. What are we going to do?

Speaker 2 (42:49):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (42:51):
Yeah, yeah, So he kills the kids. Obi Want's troops
turn against him. Obi Wan escapes barely. Uh. He meets
up with Barrel bail Or gone uh and and Yoda
who escaped casketschik and they're like, okay, what do we
do next? And they're like, okay, we have to go
to the temple to figure out what happened. And set. Basically,
there's like a a projection from the Clone army telling

(43:13):
everyone to go to the Temple to regroup because of
the war, which is basically a trap to kill any
Jedi that go there. So they decide, okay, we're gonna
go there.

Speaker 2 (43:21):
If it is a trap, then we must spring it.
Spring it we must and and UH basically change the
thing just to record the message that says like, hey,
don't don't come, this is not good.

Speaker 1 (43:33):
And so basically they do that. They go, they kill
a bunch of clones. They find out Anakin's turned to
the dark side. Obi Wan tries to Telpadme of this,
but she's not convinced because mia Ani wouldn't do that exactly.
So she goes to Mustafar to find Anakin, who has
gone there to go kill all the UH the Separatists
to end the war once and for all again. Palpatine's

(43:55):
controlling all the strings here and Uh obi Wan sneaks
on her ship. They to Moustafar, Anakin kills all the Separatists,
Trade Federation guys and UH. Basically they shut down all
the droids. So now it looks like the Republic has
finally won the war. But it just means chance for
Palpatine has won and he decides that like, hey, it's

(44:16):
now going to be an empire instead of that.

Speaker 2 (44:18):
There there's a there's a quote there in that scene
from Padme when he declares it's going to be an
empire democracy. So this is how liberty dies with Thunder's applause.
That that, to me just applies so much in the
in our modern day. And we're not going to go
into that because you know, it's politics, but very you
know what I mean to me, like, that's this that's
a line that it's like that applies like a lot

(44:40):
of places, a lot of places in the world and
a lot of time. And yeah, just a really good
line right there.

Speaker 1 (44:46):
Yeah, that's also how my toilet bowl turns around. Talking
about Thunder's applause is how it turns into there we go, okay, good, Yeah, yeah,
I had to bring that back down to earth and

(45:07):
they can't think we're too smart. Yeah, let's see, I'm
just trying to see. I read some of that every
single clone in this movie is CGI and that there
was no practical clone.

Speaker 2 (45:17):
I thought so, I honestly thought so, Like there was
a couple times where the way they moved. I'm like,
that's cgi yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:24):
But we're gonna go into the big climax. I'd say
everyone's favorite part. My sorry, my personal favorite part of
this movie the Anakin Obi Wan duel.

Speaker 2 (45:34):
It's too long? What way too long?

Speaker 1 (45:38):
Shut up? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (45:39):
That was my one of my problems. As I'm watching this,
We're like, at we're friends anymore. We're like minute ten
of this fight, and I'm like, Okay, get on with it, guys.
What it's ridiculous, it's incredible. It's way too long watching
three years.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
Of mentorship, friendship, and brotherhood all come together in one
final epic battle, and you're like, I want it over
in thirty seconds.

Speaker 2 (45:58):
Just I don't want it over in thirty seconds, but
I also don't want it to be fifteen minutes long.
They just duel for way too long with nothing. There's like,
it's just a straight up duel. If you're gonna make
it that long, at least make something more interesting.

Speaker 1 (46:12):
Out of it. Whoa, it's just right now.

Speaker 2 (46:16):
No, I'm serious.

Speaker 1 (46:17):
You wanted it to be more interesting than fighting on pillars,
sinking into lava and jumping on mining droids and backflips
and oh yeah, of the hog Road, I hate you. Yeah,
but they want it to be more special than that.

Speaker 2 (46:29):
Yeah, because there's like a good five minutes and there
where they're just straight up jeweling boring.

Speaker 1 (46:33):
Ever, I'm so sorry to all of you founds of
Star Wars. I don't see eye to eye with him
on this. I'm on your side. This is insane.

Speaker 2 (46:41):
No, please, it's ridiculous.

Speaker 1 (46:43):
Make fun of him, belittle him, do whatever you have
to do, because that is insane. That is an insane garbage.
Take you wanted. This is the climax of three movies
worth a character building and lore and to why Anakin
is turning into Darth Vader.

Speaker 2 (47:00):
Then make it feel like that, what do you mean?

Speaker 1 (47:02):
He's like Obi Wan's like you were said to join
the destroy they say, not join them, and he's like,
if you're not with me, you're my enemy. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (47:11):
But okay, there's like a few of those lines. Yes,
But then you intersperse it with three minute duels that
make no sense.

Speaker 1 (47:18):
They make perfect sense. And I was about to leave
to our next fact. They spent two months of training
for this duel, Like, okay, good.

Speaker 2 (47:26):
They couldn't come back down to two weeks if they
had made the duel.

Speaker 1 (47:30):
You know, it's incredible.

Speaker 2 (47:32):
It's boring for the first half of it boring to
you why the score is so good? It's boring.

Speaker 1 (47:42):
What it's boring? What it's too long?

Speaker 2 (47:46):
Either make it more interesting or shorten it.

Speaker 1 (47:50):
That's insane. You're insane. That's ridiculous. What look less boring?
It's incredible, not mean.

Speaker 2 (47:58):
It's just it's just they're just dueling. There's nothing more
to it. At least you got to give them something
more to do.

Speaker 1 (48:04):
They're trying to kill each other.

Speaker 2 (48:06):
Okay, but it's no different than any of the other duels.

Speaker 1 (48:08):
In the movie. I don't know, man, that's pretty crazy.
I don't know, Like that's come on. Think of your
best friend, Uh huh. You're like that you've been best
friends with for the basically like the last fifteen years,
and now you have to kill them because they basically
hate you and are trying to kill you that and
you're like, yeah, thirty seconds should make it interesting enough.

Speaker 2 (48:30):
No, No, not thirty seconds.

Speaker 1 (48:34):
You're you're ridiculous.

Speaker 2 (48:37):
It's too long.

Speaker 1 (48:38):
Wow, that's insane. That is insane. Garbage. Take Nope, that's ridiculous. Nope,
that that's just insane that yes it is, yes, it is. No,
this is like the peak climax of the whole movie.
You just watched two hours that's led in to this point.
You know, like, yeah, thirty seconds or so should be
it should be enough.

Speaker 2 (49:00):
Okay, not thirty seconds, but not you know, fifteen minutes
or ten minutes or however long.

Speaker 1 (49:04):
It teen minutes, it's it's like four it's way more.

Speaker 2 (49:08):
It was at least ten minutes. Kay, let me, let
me look at the shirt, sure, whatever, because it was.

Speaker 1 (49:12):
That's ridiculous. It shouldn't matter how long it is.

Speaker 2 (49:15):
It is. It does, though, because after it's been going
on too long, it's.

Speaker 1 (49:23):
I don't know, personally, I didn't think it went on
too long. To me, didn't matter if it was four minutes,
ten minutes, fifteen, twenty minutes, because I was invested and entertained,
And I don't think it should have been shorter, because
this is exactly it would have been a disservice to
the fans to cut it short, a moment of basic betrayal.

Speaker 2 (49:42):
That's how here's another person on Reddit who thinks it's
way too long of a fight. So obviously I'm not alone.

Speaker 1 (49:49):
Okay, Well, if fucking Joe in his basement decided with
his cheeto dust hands that he it was too long,
and then I must agree, like it's perfect. I'm just
saying it's not just me obviously. Yeah, but there's a
large community of people with lower intelligence who think things online,
and I feel like just because they like to talk

(50:11):
online doesn't mean they're right.

Speaker 2 (50:13):
I can't find an actual time.

Speaker 1 (50:15):
Okay, well we'll let that be. It doesn't matter how
long it is regardless, because it's a high eight.

Speaker 2 (50:23):
To eleven minutes long, is what this person says. That's
way too long.

Speaker 1 (50:27):
It's a high quality fight that summarizes years and years
of friendship and betrayal all summed into one fight scene
that took two months to plan. And I think that's incredible.
That's high quality work. And that's kind of the stuff
that didn't go into the sequels as much. That's this
stuff is way better because it feels like, sure, it's
trying to make money and do what all that stuff,

(50:49):
but like it also feels like it cares about its
characters enough to put a high quality fight scene at
the end of this brilliant kind of conclusion to the saga.
Rather than like the sequel fight scenes where some of
them just feel like the choreography doesn't make sense or work,
or it feels sloppy. I mean know, like whether it
feels sloppy or not. I like flashy lightsabers, I like,

(51:11):
I'm like a caveman brain rug oh sort of light cool.
So like I never really had a huge problem, but
a lot of the sequel fight scenes kind of do
feel rushed or slow, or or some of them feel
like they're they're not put enough care into. But when
it's just too long, these ones, it just feels like
so well crafted. I just don't know how you can
say it's too long. When it's like it's just too long.

Speaker 2 (51:30):
There's there's there's not enough substance for it.

Speaker 1 (51:33):
It would justify. It would be a disservice to cut
it shorter. I know it wouldn't. It would no, it wouldn't.
These characters deserve to have their final moments on.

Speaker 2 (51:42):
Yes, But the thing is when you have at like
five minutes of them just dueling with nothing more happening,
when it's just a straight up duel, there's not they're
not saying anything, and yet you have and then you
have another five minutes where there's a little more dialogue
and there's a little more tension there. It just makes
those other ones look plain and boring. I think I'm
not saying from an.

Speaker 1 (52:03):
Outsider perspective, it can look boring, But when you really
dig into the meat and potatoes, no, think about it,
you're like, like I said, this is a conclusion to three.

Speaker 2 (52:12):
It is, and it didn't feel like that to me.

Speaker 1 (52:15):
How could it not feel like that to you? It's
literally factually the conclusion it is, but it doesn't. It's
actually the conclusion.

Speaker 2 (52:21):
Yeah, but it just feels like anti climactic.

Speaker 1 (52:24):
It just it just it's a fight scene.

Speaker 2 (52:27):
Yeah, but it's just a straight up fight scene. That's
my point. There's nothing special about it.

Speaker 1 (52:31):
For like, how I feel anti climatic. If you want
to shorten it, how how does that correlate?

Speaker 2 (52:36):
Either shorten it so that you it's more the the
the climactic parts are more condensed, or add more climactic
dialogue and stuff with it.

Speaker 1 (52:47):
I mean, I don't know what to say to that part.
Like it's like it's just like I feel like they
did just exactly what they needed to do, and that's good.
That's good.

Speaker 2 (52:55):
You feel that way. I disagree.

Speaker 1 (52:57):
I just I can't believe you'd want to shorten probably
one of the most iconic fighting duels in the history
of Star Wars.

Speaker 2 (53:03):
Hey, it's a hot take, but I'm gonna stand by it.

Speaker 1 (53:06):
Yeah, well, that one might be too hot to stand on.
You might burn your feet a little. Nope, you're literally
on fire right now, Like, like, yikes, that's insane. That's wow.
Well we're not gonna have agree on this, I don't
think so, might as well move on. That's yeah, that's insane.
I feel like walking out right now.

Speaker 2 (53:28):
Be my guest. I'll just rag on the movie for
the rest of the episode.

Speaker 1 (53:32):
Okay, how many shots do you think are like in
an average movie.

Speaker 2 (53:38):
Like an average like two hour movie. Yeah, three hundred
and twelve okay, there in twelve that that's super low.
I would say probably about five thousand, Like three twelve

(53:58):
is really low. I'd give like a basic scene like
the amount of like that's true shots. Yeah, that's very true.

Speaker 1 (54:03):
I would say probably a couple of thousand, especially an
action movie like this.

Speaker 2 (54:06):
True.

Speaker 1 (54:07):
Anyways, there's two point two thousand VFX shots in this film. Yeh.

Speaker 2 (54:13):
That surprised me. The whole movie. I mean, they shot
like ninety percent is on a blue screen, so.

Speaker 1 (54:20):
Doesn't it really Yeah, that's a lot of VFX shots.
I probably I don't know exact number of shots. I'm
probably in three to five thousand mark, i'd say at least,
like especially some of the fighting scenes. Anyways, A New
Hope had three hundred and fifty, so just for reference.

Speaker 2 (54:38):
Well that's one thing about this though, I mean like
this movie has a much bigger sense of scale than
that original trilogy. I feel like, like, I mean even
just like the sets and the design of like the
city scapes like those are are are. I liked those
city scapes. They were they were well done, and I
thought it it gave us a good sense of like there's.

Speaker 1 (54:58):
More infrastructure to show that, like like CGI.

Speaker 2 (55:02):
Kind of like Corse. Well, and it's also it feels
like this the world hasn't like fully devolved into a
full un rebellion yet, you know, compared to the original trilogy.
And and so the original trilogy is a lot more
like you know, the rebel outposts on random planets and
a little more rugged and everything, but this one it's
still like that high class society on the main planets
and stuff, and the skill of Star.

Speaker 1 (55:22):
Wars doesn't feel huge until Return of the Jedda, until
that last scene really where the Ewoks are party and
then it cuts the chorusonants and then naboo. Obviously that
was digitally done after, like like even after the movie
came out, but that's when it feels like the most
the most large scale. I don't know. That's one thing

(55:43):
about this though.

Speaker 2 (55:44):
They shoot so much of it on a blue screen
or green screen or whatever, like the on virtual sets
that it's it's it. It feels like sometimes they just
they don't interact with the environment enough, you know what
I mean, like even in their in the way they're acting.

Speaker 1 (55:59):
But yeah, I agree with some of that. But then again,
when you look at Attack of the Clones and Anakin's
picking up the grass and he's like, I hate sand,
and it's like, maybe it's okay that they didn't interact
with the world as much. No, No, it's uh yeah,
Like I like to have actors in practical places, Like
I think that's just like I like it. I think

(56:19):
it's I think it's better for an actor like too.
I'm not an actor, but like I just feel like
it makes sense that if you're actually in a place
doing the thing, it's a lot easier.

Speaker 2 (56:27):
To it's got to be easier to act.

Speaker 1 (56:29):
Well, think of Ian McKellen's breakdown.

Speaker 2 (56:31):
Yeah, like that's like perfect example.

Speaker 1 (56:35):
Obviously, it's a it's a ton of pressure and stress
to be acting with nothing. It's tough on the Marvel people,
it's tough on whatever. It's it sucks. I mean sure
they get paid enough so so whatever. But but but
like it's a tough thing. And so that's why I
feel like it.

Speaker 2 (56:52):
Especially for someone like Ian McKellen who's a traditional stage act.

Speaker 1 (56:54):
Classic trained the actor used to training with people and
doing the thing, and then he's forced to stand in
a room alone for days on end. Yeah that's insane
while people just stare at him. Okay, try it again,
uh in but uh but this time, tilt your face
a little bit to the left, Like yeah, I would
go insane, Like it's yeah, it's ridiculous. It takes a

(57:15):
lot of like not to glaze actors who do this
because whatever, Like obviously, like there's other harder jobs, but
like it is mentally draining to do stuff like that,
and it's it's it's it's hard in its.

Speaker 2 (57:27):
Own right compared to it's hard to just do it
well then too.

Speaker 1 (57:31):
Yes, exactly, yes, but yeah, two point two thousand VFX
shots and forty screen wipes.

Speaker 2 (57:39):
That was one thing I noticed. I like the transitions
in this movie, like with the like the the wipes
and the circle transition star classic transitions. I like that
that vibe, like it's not just straight up cuts all
the time. I like that it It gives it a
bit more of a storybook vibe. That's what makes it
feel like more like a large epic. Yeah, so.

Speaker 1 (58:00):
We see a bunch of stuff of Order sixty six too,
Like obviously Baille Ragana does his thing, there's a Jedi
that protects him, gets shot and killed. That's actually George
Lucas's son. Fun little fact. Uh yeah uh. Basically, obi
wansted defeats Anakin, cuts off his legs and like I

(58:21):
hate you, blah blah blah. Obi Wan tells him like yeah,
he loves him, but like this isn't cool. Uh. Obi
Wan leaves to tell Padme, who's basically starting to die
for no reason that they can't explain. Yeah, and per
Palpatine kind of comes picks up. Anakin to try and
bring him back to life.

Speaker 2 (58:41):
The origin of Darth Vader.

Speaker 1 (58:42):
Yeah, and so it's just mirror.

Speaker 2 (58:44):
Is Darth Darth Vader's voice weird in this one? Like
they didn't have James Joel Jones doing it in this one?
Did they? I think they did because it sounded different.

Speaker 1 (58:52):
They must have. They must have done it, And I
think the audio is just cleaner. This is the first
time we're hearing Darth Vader. But it's just it's just
I think it must have been because I know, like
I know, I feel like they did some Ai Vader
voicing for Kenoby show, and that's how they're gonna do
it now, is like AI a mixture of AI and Souf.
But yeah, I'm pretty confident that. I'm pretty confident it

(59:16):
was actually James Earl Jones. Yep, he did. He did, Yeah,
because I know, for for I don't think there was
any lines in Rogue one or and Rogue one. The
Vader lines I believe was a mixture of James Earl
Jones and a little bit of AI, and then Kenoby
was Ai James Earld Jones like like lines mixed in
like but like AI. Yeah, and now they're moving like

(59:38):
for all the games and stuff like that, like it's
going to be AI James ol Jones, and that that
was decided prior to his death. Even obviously James Earl
Jones died last year, but but even even prior to
his death two three years before, they decided that they
were going to go down the AI route because they
already used him so many times. They they have like
they have a full replica of his voice at their disposal. Yeah,

(59:59):
and that's kind of like this is where it gets
a little iffy, like where they're like, yeah, we don't
need you anymore. It's like, oh, it's James old Jones.

Speaker 2 (01:00:05):
Though, I mean, you know, I feel like this is
this is the solution to this sort of dilemma, is
you know, a copyright sort of you know what if
I am going to use a song in a YouTube video,
then I I have to get a I have to
get a copyright for it. You know, I have to
to you know, pay a copyright fee or something. I
feel like that's the yeah, licensing fee. I feel like

(01:00:27):
that's the answer to it. If you're going to use
an actor's voice, you have to pay them either a
state or you have to pay them a royalty or
like a yeah, like a licensing fee, basically licensing. It's like,
you know, if if you're gonna, you know, use someone's
image on a website, you know, you're using their likeness.

Speaker 1 (01:00:45):
They should get the exact same residual that they should
have gotten otherwise, in my opinion.

Speaker 2 (01:00:50):
Or something like it. However you want to, however you
want to work it. That's kind of the solution. It's
the same thing with art. If you're going to use
somebody's art to train an AI model, they get a royalty.

Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
Didn't Robert Downey Jr. Didn't he say that he like here,
like didn't he like announce that like he would his
estate would automatically sue anyone who tried using an AI
version of his voice.

Speaker 2 (01:01:07):
Maybe I don't. I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:01:09):
I feel like I feel like I saw something about
that like that he said, like, yeah, that's not gonna happen.
But again, it's how they're like there's some actors I
think who love and respect their characters enough like in
that version that they're like okay with it being shown
after their death. And I feel like whatever with James
Old Jones, he already wasn't voicing for a number of years. Yeah,
I feel like he was like he knew he couldn't

(01:01:29):
do it anymore, so he's like okay with him doing it.
But I definitely feel like there's a certain point where
it's like how much can we milk something before it's
disrespectful to use that person's identity, you know, you know
what I mean. It's like I get like when they
did when they did Princess Leah and Rogue One, and
they I think, I want to say, carry Fisher was
alive when they did that.

Speaker 2 (01:01:49):
Still there was no there was somewhere she was dead
or she died. There was at least some of the
sequels she he.

Speaker 1 (01:01:54):
Was dead before the Last Jedi came out, and then
she was still in the Rise of Skywalker.

Speaker 2 (01:01:58):
Right well, and that so that's where they did use
some sort of technology to to digitally.

Speaker 1 (01:02:03):
Yes, it's it's it's very it's tasteful when they do it.
It's like a cameo thing, and you're like, that's like
respect to the character and like an ode. But then
like there's a certain point where it's like, Okay, well,
Carrie Fisher's been dead for six years, but she's in
eight movies. Hmm, yeah, what's happening here? Right, That's when
you're like, okay, did we go too far with it?

Speaker 2 (01:02:23):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (01:02:27):
Not my wheelhouse. I I I'm not like the moral dileminate,
dilemaist whatever, like I'm not gonna I'm not gonna try
and and sit here and argue whether or not like
it's right or wrong. I think it's it's very personal
and it that is an argument that belongs to solely
the the person's estate, their person like themselves. They're like

(01:02:47):
they're like the people that take after them for after
they're gone. Yeah, and and between like studios to decide
because it's not I'm the only one who can control
what happens to me, and then the people following me
like exactly, yeah, yeah, Like that's basically it m had
me dies during childbirth. We realize that she has two kids.

(01:03:09):
No one, no one sensed with the force that there
was two very strong chosen ones, like don't know how
that happened. That was like yeah, interesting, Like okay, well,
maybe we still have a little bit more of like
medically training to do, like yeah, it's like okay, like
like I understand being able to sense that Palpatine wasn't
a Sith for so long because he was so powerful

(01:03:31):
at the dark Side that he was actually able to
hide his his force usage. Yeah, interesting idea, cool whatever.
That's how we explained that, like loophole, that he's surrounded
by the most powerful Jedi in the universe and none
of them were They were all too blind to be
able to see. It's just unfortunate that. Uh yeah, it's
just unfortunate.

Speaker 2 (01:03:50):
That that speaking of sidis, that transition when he's fighting
Mace Windu, when he turns from like normal yeah, yeah.
Well and also so just like the face transition, I
thought that was pretty clean. I I I thought I
thought that was that was pretty well done.

Speaker 1 (01:04:05):
Yeah, I minus the dialogue where it sounds like you
have moaning and pleasure like yeah, right, no, uh whatever.

Speaker 2 (01:04:17):
One thing with with him is sometimes some of those lines,
he just feels like he's enjoying his own voice too
much when he's talking strike me, but right down and
you're bad to the dock side shall be complete?

Speaker 1 (01:04:35):
What mean? Yeah, it's like it's like I'm not sure
about that, buddy. Yeah. No, Like they did a good
job on that. That's just I I am willing to,
like again suspension disbelief, to believe that the powerful, most
powerful Jedi were blindsided for a bit to figure it

(01:04:56):
out because he was such a strong, powerful sithole or
that was able to do all this stuff. Okay, cool,
I get it, but like, not one of the most
powerful Jedi in the entire universe realize that there might
be two chosen ones bad maid's stomach. Yeah, okay, okay,
like like really not one. Doctor was like, hey, by

(01:05:17):
the way, you're carrying twins. You mean freaking Yoda was blindsided.
You're like, I did really really you see this all right?
A little bit weird. That's why my my toesis theory,
like they didn't like actually like shove another one in

(01:05:38):
and they're like that, like we did find her off
the street, but she's really yeah anyways, so so that yeah,
that that that didn't like, that didn't that part doesn't
work for me. But but whatever. To arrive Luke and
Lea bing bay a Boom. That's their origin stories. They
gets Lucat sent off to live on with Owen and

(01:06:01):
Peru on tattooing. Leah goes with bail Organa to basically
Alderon whatever, bring about a boom. She's gonna go work
for the the Republic whatever.

Speaker 2 (01:06:12):
She's going to be a princess.

Speaker 1 (01:06:13):
Yeah and uh and yeah there we are we Uh.
That's Revenge of the Sith. That's Revenge of the Sith.
Padme dies in childbirth. Obi wan Uh kind of goes
to watch over the boy on tattooing and kind of
goes into hiding. Yoda goes into exile.

Speaker 2 (01:06:29):
Anakin finds out or Darth Vader by this point finds
out that Padme died, and it's like, no, that's so cheesy.

Speaker 1 (01:06:35):
Yeah yeah, but it is cool seeing him done this
suit for the first time. And then we hear the yeah, yeah,
that's pretty cool. That probably did not translate on the
mic at all. It's gonna sound like me like, yeah,
the original Kett this movie was four hours long.

Speaker 2 (01:06:55):
I mean it was a long movie. It's like two
twenty I think at least the Disney Plus version.

Speaker 1 (01:07:02):
Yeah, we're almost out of time here, so let's speed
run likes.

Speaker 2 (01:07:04):
And dislikes trying to look through. I did take a
couple of notes.

Speaker 1 (01:07:08):
Yeah, yeah, go hit me with it.

Speaker 2 (01:07:12):
Talk about that. We talked about that, talk about that,
talked about that, talked about that, talked about that, talked
about that. No, that's I don't have any I don't
know anything else in my notes.

Speaker 1 (01:07:28):
Yeah, I think the weakest parts corny dialogue.

Speaker 2 (01:07:32):
Yeah, that's the thing is it's it if the writing
and had been better, the acting would have been better.

Speaker 1 (01:07:38):
And and I should say this is this is far
better than the other two though, Like for in terms
of prequel dialogue, Yeah, this one is like the most solid.

Speaker 2 (01:07:46):
Yeah, but it's still not.

Speaker 1 (01:07:49):
There's just yeah, there's some lines where you're like, oh,
that was the best we could do. Yeah, Like especially
it's been like oh, time to escape or whatever.

Speaker 2 (01:07:56):
Yeah, well and even just I just find a lot
of the interactions between Anakin and and Obi Wan are
just so weird and like overall the way Ewan McGregor
delivers his lines, I feel like the lines are just
miss miss misplaced sometimes whoa, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:08:11):
I get having a problem with some of the Hayden
Christensen dialogue. But Ewan McGregor, that man's a national treasure.

Speaker 2 (01:08:17):
Well, I'm not saying it's acting. It's not his fault.
I think it's the line that he did a pretty
good job, given what he was given to work with.

Speaker 1 (01:08:24):
Yeah, but oh there's some Obi Wan lines are just
so good, like when he's like so uncivilized.

Speaker 2 (01:08:30):
Yeah, well and see that's what I mean. Like there's
there's some that are that are that are are on point,
but then others where they obviously were trying to do
it and it just didn't it. But whatever, you know,
that's the way it goes.

Speaker 1 (01:08:39):
Yeah. Otherwise, I love the fighting, thought it was great.
I think the movie has pretty good pacing. Overall. It
feels epic. It feels like a journey. You know. The
original cut of the like the Palpatine escape scene was
actually over an hour alone, Like that first portion of
the movie was over an hour and they cut that
down to what like an eight minute sequence, Like that's insane,

(01:09:00):
like escaping the ship.

Speaker 2 (01:09:02):
Yeah, uh.

Speaker 1 (01:09:05):
Yeah, so I don't know. I I enjoy this one.
I again, I'm a huge in the original I'm a
huge fan of All Star Wars. The original trilogy is
my favorite.

Speaker 2 (01:09:16):
It doesn't get better than the original trilogy. The Original
trilogy will always be the top. Like I said, Original Trilogy,
Rogue one, everything else. That's that's the way it goes
for me. But this is about Revenge of the Siths
and overall, so yeah, we'll focus on that and I
enjoy it. Yeah, okay, rate it?

Speaker 1 (01:09:38):
Rate it?

Speaker 2 (01:09:39):
What do we think? What A think in here?

Speaker 1 (01:09:42):
You first? Okay, I know you're gonna give it a
lower score than I do. What do you think I'm
gonna give it? I want to hear what I think.
You're probably gonna give it a six and a half?

Speaker 2 (01:09:57):
Really, you think I hated that much?

Speaker 1 (01:10:00):
Maybe a seven? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:10:03):
Seven, that's what I'm gonna Yeah, it's a seven.

Speaker 1 (01:10:05):
It's an eight for me.

Speaker 2 (01:10:07):
Yeah that's fair.

Speaker 1 (01:10:08):
Yeah, for reference, I'd probably give Attack of the Clones seven,
and then like a six to the Fountain Menace, like
if that makes sense. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:10:17):
The one thing that that this movie doesn't have going
for it is you only see jar jar Binks once
the what Charge jar Binks? It's my favorite character.

Speaker 1 (01:10:26):
I think they did that on purpose, though I think
people were sick of jar jar Binks.

Speaker 2 (01:10:29):
Yeah, but I love jar Jar Binks. Georgia is like
my favorite character.

Speaker 1 (01:10:33):
Miss Jarge. Yeah, exactly. Charge is pretty good. Ach my
best My man came back from the Mandalorian season three.
That's a Jedi. But yeah, Anyways, there we are thank
you for watching the viewing room. You guys have a
great day. Bye.

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The Viewing Room Ep 38- Revenge of the Sith - Review and Analysis

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}The Viewing Room Ep 38- Revenge of the Sith - Review and Analysis