July 3rd - The Science of Compassion and How it can be used as a Tool for Better Health

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to the Wellness and Healthy Lifestyle show on your VOCM. Now,
here's your host, doctor Mike Wall.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
Welcome to the show. I'm your host, Doctor Mike Wall.
Today we're exploring something that sounds simple but might be
one of the most powerful tools we can have for
both personal and community health. Compassion. It's not just a feeling,
but it's also an action. Now, we've all heard terms
like kindness, empathy, altruism, but what's the difference. More importantly,

(00:33):
how do they affect us physically and mentally. It turns
out there's a real science behind the idea that compassion
isn't just good for others, but it's good for us.
It can even be taught, practiced, and strengthened like a muscle.
To help us dive into this, I'm joined by doctor
Francis Scully, a physician, researcher and founder of Be Compassionate NL.

(00:53):
Her journey from growing up in Dublin during civil unrest
to battling personal adversity to launching a movement based on
compatis offers insights not just into the concept, but it's
power to transform. We'll talk about what compassion really is,
why self compassion is often the hardest form to master,
and how practicing compassion can lead to better health, stronger communities,

(01:14):
and even a healthier planet. There's a lot to cover,
so let's get to it. Hi, doctor Skelley, Welcome to
the show.

Speaker 3 (01:22):
Hi Mike, and thank you very much for inviting me.

Speaker 2 (01:25):
Yeah, it's an interesting topic today. We're going to talk
about compassion. But before we get into that, can you
tell me a bit about your background.

Speaker 3 (01:32):
Yeah, well, Mile, I have one sister and we Reckon.
We were pretty lucky. We were adopted by a very
lovely family in North Dublin and it was about five
we met. My family moved to live in a really
pretty place called Oath. So ever, going to Ireland, I

(01:55):
recommend a trip to Hote, related pretty place. So we
had no money and lots of fun and things were
good until sixty nine when an absolutely brutal sectarian war started.
A class war broke out again in Ireland. So officially

(02:16):
the war was happening in Northern Ireland, which is part
of the United Kingdom, so a separate country. But it's
actually a very small place. And I stand to be
corrected here, but I would say, like Dublin to Belfast,
is probably like Saint John's to Googies or something, maybe
even shorter. And I went to medical school from high school,

(02:37):
which was the typical thing then in nineteen seventy three, right,
so that was right in the midst of all this
awful stuff going on, sort of like in what's happening
in theopia now are Ukraine. There was all this dreadful
stuff going on kind of round the corner.

Speaker 2 (02:56):
Right, And you became a physician and you ended up
in New Philt.

Speaker 3 (03:00):
Yes, yes. Initially in Ireland, I did both in turn
of medicine and pediacrists, which you actually couldn't really do now,
and I ended up being interested in hematology, and I
came to Canada actually to train at the Hospital for
Sick Children, planning to go back and as a children's

(03:20):
cancer specialist. And then I met my husband, and he
was originally my late husband, and he was originally from Vietnam.
So I changed in humortology. He trained it in Pexta's diseases,
and we trained in Monta's and a lot was at
Queen's and Gil invested in moreal and then he took
a position in Saint John New Brunswick, Okay, and that's

(03:46):
where we started. And I made both positions here in
nineteen ninety seven, so I've been here ever since.

Speaker 2 (03:52):
It's great. So how did you become interesting capassion? I
know that you know, being a physician is very compassionate
in nature, but did you you took a very keen
interest in it? How did that sort of come to be?

Speaker 3 (04:05):
I think, like a lot of people around through I
ran into a very tough patch in my life. And actually,
in twenty sixteen, I heard a CBC interview with doctor Vincinciletti,
who was the main one of the main authors and
investigators of the Adverse Childhood Experiences study, and I actually

(04:30):
pulled my car over and took out a pen and
paper and wrote down the names and some because I
had never heard any of this, and I found it
interesting because it's a very large study and there's a
huge amount of publications, and I was like, wow, you know,
I've never heard of this. I started reading about this
and all the data showing that adverse experiences actually affect

(04:51):
for our health because I was not aware of this.
I started studying how abuse and cruelty has been documented
again and again to be extremely bad for our health
and midst of that, and a close family member said,
I don't know what you're doing that it's not agreeing
with you, and it was true that this is very dark.

(05:12):
So yeah, but January twenty seven, I just googled what
is the opposite of a word? And the opposite abuse
is compassion. So it was like, okay, I'm going to
see is there any data on compassion? So that's that's
actually how it started.

Speaker 2 (05:27):
Yeah, yeah, okay, so we know that compassion is kind
of the opposite of abuse. Is that how you define it?

Speaker 3 (05:32):
You know?

Speaker 2 (05:33):
And is there a difference between the words compassion And
it also comes to mind like empathy or altruism. Is
there a difference between all that?

Speaker 3 (05:41):
So they are all interrelated. And I think you probably
know our brains are such that we do tend to
focus on the negative, but we're also at our best
when we focus on the puzz So a lot of

(06:02):
people focus on if there's something negative happening in their
lives or in society, they're they're sort of anti that,
and yet there's more and more evidence that were more,
were happier, more more more effective when we're actually motivated
from a positive space. So so that was where yeah,

(06:28):
I became interested in could focusing on compassion actually make
a difference. There's a huge literature, but I think in
a nutshell of what's best for us, for best for
our health and our well being is compassionate empathy. So
we do need empathy as well. But empathy is the

(06:49):
ability to understand other people's feelings. And so empathy in
some definitions includes cognitive empathy emotional empathy, and empathy can
go in different directions. So people can use cognitive empathy
understanding people to be manipulative, which is not a healthy

(07:09):
good thing. So empathy you want, you do need empathy,
and it's part of compassion, but it has to be
this desire to help, right, And altruism is the pure
desire to help, which is wonderful that actually only three

(07:30):
percent of human beings are capable physically capable of pure altruism,
meaning physically capable of in the moment making a decision
to lay that you know, to risk their own life
for the sake of a stranger. That's the definition of

(07:52):
altruism totally.

Speaker 2 (07:53):
So I would summarize it, maybe this way is the best,
is that empathy is understanding people. Altruism is sacrificing yourself
and compassion is taking that empathy and taking action to
help people based on your understanding of them. Is that correct?

Speaker 3 (08:08):
That? That is correct? But into all that we're trying,
you know, like wisdom has to come into this, Like
you may have a destroyer and desire to help people
that if could do it in a way that's reckless,
you may hurt people and yourself. So there's a balance
somewhere in all this.

Speaker 2 (08:27):
Yeah, we see that sometimes in wellness, where people, you know,
have an attempt to help people, but they tend to
give advice that may not be the necessarily the best
advice for people because they don't understand the full picture,
which is the whull point.

Speaker 3 (08:38):
Of the show.

Speaker 2 (08:39):
Now, I've been doing some research on this and getting
ready for our chat, and I came across something called
the Charter of Compassion.

Speaker 3 (08:45):
Can you tell me about what this is, yimah. So
when I put in compassion into Google, when the first
things came up is the Charter of Compassion or Charter
for Compassion. And so my understand is that Karen Armstrong,
who's a very brilliant British lady, won a TED talk.

(09:09):
I think that's probably anyways, over a decade ago now,
and she was talking on how compassion is really fundamental
to all different religious traditions, and she won a TED
talk and she used that one hundred thousand dollars to
form this amazing charter for Compassion. So it is a

(09:32):
great place to start in on compassion. And there's lowt
information there.

Speaker 2 (09:40):
You'll never get to the end of it.

Speaker 3 (09:42):
So that was a place I started.

Speaker 2 (09:44):
Yes, we're talking with doctor Francis Scully with the science
and spirit of compassion, Why it matters, how we learn
it and what happens when we put it into practice.
And we come back, we'll hear about how doctor Scully's
own journey through medicine, personal illness, and teaching led her
to make compassion permission. We'll be right back after the break.

(10:07):
Welcome back today. We're speaking with doctor Francis Scully with
the power of compassion not just as a virtue, but
as a tool for health. Let's get back to our conversation.

Speaker 1 (10:17):
Is there a.

Speaker 2 (10:18):
Science behind compassion and how it works within our body?

Speaker 3 (10:22):
Yes, there is, and it's it's it's massive. So there's
lots and lots and lots of research on this. So
when I so on the Charter for Compassion, there's loads
of information, loads of things you can do. And when
I was there, they were hosting webinars which I think
they still do now, which were free, and one of

(10:43):
them I took was led by a doctor and his
name is doctor Jane's or Jim Dotty, and he is
a eurosurgeon and he had he's at Stanford, so he
is the fan of the Center for Compassion and Altruism
Research and Education at Stanford Medical School and he received funding.

(11:10):
He was the first one of the first term very
few non Tibetans who actually received money from His Holiness
Dala Lama to develop a course compassion focused meditation. So
there have lots of research on the ghost. I was like, okay,

(11:30):
I will go you know, I'll focus here. So I
kind of moved away from the chart of combassion, not
because it isn't wonderful, but just because there's so much
going on.

Speaker 2 (11:40):
Yeah, okay, So we've we've got an individual who wins
a ted Tack Award, which is great ideas and this
one a big award for that. You've got the Dalli
LoVa involved in it, You've got scientists research and compassion.
So I guess the big question is why is compassion important?

Speaker 3 (11:56):
Well, that is the big question. So compassion is desire
to leave suffering, and there is a lot of suffering,
and I would say, from a medical point of view
on resolve, suffering is a massive cause of illness. So
that's my focus, that suffering if it is not released

(12:20):
in a healthy way or resolved or rest or I'm
not sure what's the best temperate. The term that a
lot of people you use now is trauma, but I
think for to me, there's a lot of overlap between
the words trauma and suffering. But trauma is an event

(12:41):
that causes so much suffering that it overwhelms us. So
basically compassion is the antidote to all that. So actually true, Well,
compassionate empathy being able to generate compassionate empathy in our
bodies and protects us from all kinds of trauma, helps
us to heal and helps other people to heal.

Speaker 2 (13:02):
So that's my interest. Yeah, that's interesting, Yeah, that makes sense.
It only makes sense to me that a position that
cares and understands what their patients are going through is
able to offer better care, which makes perfect sense. Why
yourself would do something like this and other physicians would
be interested in this. Now, another thing I stumbled upon
was what's called the golden rule. What is the golden

(13:23):
rule of Kabajian?

Speaker 3 (13:24):
So the golden rule is sort of like do onto
others as you would have others do on to you.
And we are a little a little apprehensive about that
because it kind of falls into the rule again like yes,
do wanto others as you would have others do on
to you. But the thing is we're all different, right,

(13:44):
So it's a simple example. You know, I love cake. Yeah,
my younger son doesn't like cake at all, right, so
you know, for his birthdays, and I have friends and
who are really good cape maker. It's nice to make
cakes and so on, you know, and like those one
year where this friend of mine had made a beautiful

(14:05):
cake for my son and it was in the fridge
and she was coming back and forth and you know,
one and she was like, I was like, I'm just
gonna eat cake because he's really not a bit interested
in this cake. Right, And this year, you know, we
made him a beer cake.

Speaker 2 (14:23):
Right.

Speaker 3 (14:23):
So the point is, like do unto others, is you
have others do unto you, and we have to be
aware of what the other person wants and needs and
likes and all that sort of things. However, I feel
safer when we go back way past the golden rule
to the first rule, which is first, do no harm.

(14:46):
And that was a big part of medicine, premium non
no care. So I think as much as and it's
impossible to go through like without doing harm. That's that's
just you know, we walk on the ground, We're going
to stand on insects whatever. So I'm I'm a fan
of the do no harm aim.

Speaker 2 (15:07):
Yeah, I like it. I like that, you know, and
I think about some people. Some people seem to be
more caring or compassionate just naturally than others. But is
it something that's inherent to us as people, or you
just said you did a course in training. It is
something we can learn how to do ourselves.

Speaker 3 (15:23):
Yes, so we can learn. And so the current idea
from all the huge amount of research in this is
that we are all born our ninety nine point ninety
nine percent of us are born with an a capacity
to defend, to develop limitless kindness and compassion. Now, we

(15:48):
do know that about one in a thousand of us
are born with less ability to feel for others, less
ability to have empathy, and so on. That's a whole
other discussion. But nineteen nine point nine percent are born
with disability. Now again I kind of feel that the

(16:08):
infinite stuff is probably for the three percent. But doctor
Monroe talks about I think most of us are in
the group in between where we can cultivate compassion and kindness.
So the research shows that, you know, it's it's like
anything we do, it's something that can be grown. Like

(16:31):
so we can improve our muscles, we can improve our
capacity for compassion.

Speaker 2 (16:37):
Yes, yeah. And I think about, you know, being compassionate.
I feel like sometimes people have an easier time being
compassionate towards others than we are to ourselves. Sometimes we're
our own worst enemies. Is that something you've run into
in your practice? Oh?

Speaker 3 (16:51):
Absolutely? And myself, yes, yes, yeah, so and again my
friend doctor Monsieur gave me the term on Monday self stewardship.
So in May twenty seventeen, I was I applied to
train to take this course and the requirements were, among

(17:14):
other things that one had to at that time, one
had to travel twice to Palo Alto on California, and
one also had to take the eight week course from
a certi by teacher before one could train, and at
the time there were no search by teachers here. So
I was like, I don't know how this is going
to work. So I sending my application anyway, and within

(17:38):
two weeks I was diagnosed with here with early stage
breast cancer. So I had paid my deposit in US
dollars and I knew that I wasn't going to be
able to travel to Palo Alto. So I thought, well,
this is interesting because this is a compassion course, you know.
So I sent them an email I said, looked about

(18:00):
breast cancer. So they got back to me and they said, yeah,
because we were looking as well. And you have not,
you know, yet taken the eight week course, which is
a requirement. But you know, they said, we're just piloting
teaching the eighth week course on zoom. So I ended
up taking the basic age week course that and I teach.

(18:23):
I took up myself online and I started it just
when I was really feeling all the adverse effects of chemotherapy.

Speaker 2 (18:37):
We're talking with doctor Francis Scully about the science and
spirit of compassion, why it matters, how we learn it
and what happens when we put it into practice. When
we come back, we'll hear about how doctor Scully's own
journey through medicine, personal illness, and teaching led her to
make compassion her mission. We'll be right back after the break.

(18:58):
Welcome back today, we're speaking with doctor Francis Scully with
the power of compassion not just as a virtue, but
as a tool for health. Let's get back to our conversation.
Are people sometimes afraid to become more compassionate?

Speaker 3 (19:11):
Absolutely?

Speaker 1 (19:12):
So.

Speaker 3 (19:12):
You were asking me about the self compassion and another
maybe the most helpful word for that, the self stewardship. So,
starting off, I had never heard of self compassion and
self kindness. You can actually do your score for how
much you are afraid of self compassion. So many people
are afraid if I become self compassionate or self kind

(19:35):
I'm going to just fall apart. I'm just gonna sit
and eat tons of ice cream every night, or I'm
going to drink too much, I'm going to smoke too much,
I'm not going to exercise in it. Whatever it is.
Many people feel that they've got to be you know,
pushing themselves and you know, to keep it all together
and to be any sort of a decent person. So

(19:56):
that's that's so there's a lot of fear, and a
lot of people are like, what the else impact the self kindness?

Speaker 2 (20:03):
You know, what is this?

Speaker 3 (20:04):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (20:05):
So yeah, I think that's something that's uh, you know,
seen sometimes as being a form of weakness, for people
to feel sorry for themselves or take a step back
if they need it because they feel like they're not
being strong, and that's something that's sort of toxic about
the way that we live today. And I feel like
the pandemic may have given people a bit of a
chance to see what it's like to step back because

(20:25):
they were forced to. Did you notice things like that
with people where they became a little bit more mindful
of being compassionate towards themselves.

Speaker 3 (20:33):
Yes, I think people are very kind and very compassionate.
And people went to all sorts of lengths to protect
other people during the pandemic, all sorts of lengths you
saw all the time, and all different, all different people
doing all such things. You know. I caught COVID and
April and I was quite sick, and I was sending

(20:56):
emails to groups of people because you know, just you know,
I had been at events where people were present for
the first time and like in two years, and it
was that evening I developed symptoms. So I sent emails
letting people know, you know, I'm going to get tested.
I have some symptoms. And every single person got back
to me to ask, you know, if I needed anything,

(21:20):
you know, So they weren't like, oh my god, you
we met and I had been wearing a maskim zone,
but I'm just saying. Their response was, you know, do
you need anything, and followed up to say, like, you know,
how are you doing. You know, Kindness and compassion over
that tremendousty, but they are not quite the same thing.

(21:40):
I when people are researching it, they go different angusties.
So kindness can be looked at at the desire for
everything to go well. And in different cultures and traditions
and spiritual traditions, different words I use. So I think
for the Abrahamic faiths, for two day Judeo Christians in

(22:01):
Islam often we use the word love, right, so love
is very important in and in other traditions it's sort
of loving kindness and indigenous traditions, it's you know, kindness,
the love of the creator. So anyway, so I think
these are all terms that all are getting at the

(22:24):
same thing, this love loving nature. So love and kindness
are the desire for things to go well. And there's
a wonderful book called the Five Side Effects of Kindness
and the side effects. The health side effects of kindness
are that if we cultivate kindness, we're happier, we have

(22:47):
less caryovascular disease, we lower because we lower our blood pressure,
are our relationships improve, and we live longer. Now, of course,
cultivating cap kindness is not going to help if we're
if we're you know, some horrible trauma, you know, were

(23:07):
hit by a bus or something. But in terms of
preventing Strauss related illness, cultivating kindness is is very very helpful.
So for example, people who have heart surgery are going
to do better if they have a pet of zone.

(23:28):
Really yeah so if and I'm getting a new puppy today,
so I'm very excited. But anyway, so that was shown
that people who had did better because I guess they
were they were motivated to get back to that test.

Speaker 2 (23:43):
Yeah, yeah, it's funny. We had doctor Carolin Walshawan, and
she's she's a researcher who studies the canine human interaction
therapeutic role of animals, and very very interesting stuff and
it is caring, you know. And so I guess that
brings us to what we were talking about today, which is,
you know, be compassionate and l can you tell tell
me about what you guys do there?

Speaker 3 (24:03):
Well, we're really just starting. So this came a bit
because I was, as I said, I was diagnosed with
breast cancer in May of twenty seventeen, and during that
I was also trying to train to teach this courts
and you mentioned self compassion. So I started the training
in twenty eighteen, and I had never heard of self compassion.

(24:27):
I had heard of self care and sort of scheduling
time in your day to you know, do things like
exercise or walk or whatever else to look after yourself.
But what was interesting, Yes, of course, as a physician
it's very important to stay within, you know, one's boundaries.

(24:50):
So I was going to see, you know, the register
at the College of Physicians and Surgeons in New London,
Labrador to speak to her about doing this core Some
wanting to train to teach this course and wanted to
make sure that it was within you know, what I
was allowed to do as a position. So I spoke
to as many people as I could think of. I

(25:11):
managed to certify to teach this course, which is a
course for a group of ten to twenty eight people,
and I certified in February of twenty twenty. So, Mike,
I don't know if you remember February twenty twenty, but
we were right between Stormageddon and COVID, right, yes, And
so I got certified, and first of all, because of

(25:34):
the weather, we couldn't I actually did have my course.
So the medical school had given me space for my
producum and I had set up to teach my first
course starting in March of twenty twenty and then help
it hit And so I was certified to teach this
course in person, and of course there was no way

(25:55):
we were going to be teaching courses in person. So then,
plus I was trying to find an umbrella of some
kind to be able to teach this and to share
information about the science well of the art and the
philosophy and the science and the theology of kindness and compassion.

(26:17):
So that's where be compassionate nl has come from.

Speaker 2 (26:24):
We're talking with doctor Francis Scully about the science and
spirit of compassion, why it matters, how we learn it,
and what happens when we put it into practice. When
we come back, we'll hear about how doctor Scully's own
journey through medicine, personal illness, and teaching led her to
make compassion her mission. We'll be right back after the break.

Speaker 1 (26:42):
You're listening to a WE broadcast of The Wellness and
Healthy Lifestyle Show with doctor Mike Wall. Listen live Thursday
nights at seven pm and Sunday's at four pm.

Speaker 2 (26:53):
Welcome back today, we're speaking with doctor Francis Scully about
the power of compassion, not just as a virtue, but
as a tool for health. Let's get back to our conversation.
So when you when you're doing your training with people,
what does that involve.

Speaker 3 (27:06):
Well, the course I am trained to teach is an
eight week course, and we ask people to commit to
spending fifteen minutes a day practicing their meditations and to
also volunteer one hour per week in any way they want.
Any volunteer work that's compassive. Well, all volunteer work is

(27:29):
compassion follows, so you can do anything that is helpful, right,
there's many things you can do now. So and then
the course itself is an eight week, two hours per
week course, and there are six steps. So the first
week is called settling the mind, which if anyone has

(27:51):
done different any types of meditation, it is literally just
trying to you know, calm our mind and ways to
do that. And the great thing about it actually is
really there are six steps, or if you like, there's
six meditations, and so people can stay at whatever level.
So I give them along with a lot of information

(28:12):
to the students and then they practice and then we
get together again. So the second week we discuss like
how it went and what the So a big part
of the course it's interactive and experiential, so we meditating
together and we also share our experience or not. So
it's very it but that's why it's really it's a

(28:35):
group thing, and it's so important and interesting and it's
so helpful to compassion to start to realize, oh my,
you know, other people really think differently than I do.
Because one of the reasons, a lot of the time
we all get so irritated. I mean, there are lots

(28:55):
of reasons. But one of it is, you know, we're
going to do something weird. You know, there's one way
we're going to do it, and somebody else comes along
and they do it a totally different way, and from
from our point of view, they totally messed up. And
a lot of the time we think that's deliberate. So
part of it is the pause and then actually listening
to other people and how they approach things. Yeah, so

(29:18):
that's that's it. So the next the next week two
is the loving kindness for a loved one. Week three
is self COMPASSIONO is no self kindness and then self compassion. So,
because self compassion is so challenging for so many of us,
there are two weeks are two different meditations devoted to that,

(29:43):
and then there is common humanity and giving and receiving compassion.
So part of so people do feel okay, if I'm
you know, if I'm a kind person, people take advantage
of me. You know, other people think O being kind
and compassion means I have to be a doormat, you know,

(30:06):
I have to just put up with anything. And interestingly,
there's also fearce compassion because fears compassion is times when
we have to say no and tell people know what
you're doing is hurtful and harmful, and so compassion it's

(30:27):
a very active thing, is not passive.

Speaker 2 (30:31):
But it sounds like, you know, there's a real level
of self awareness that is required, and then from there
you're able to foster this level of compassion. Now, not
everybody may have access to a course such as yours.
But if somebody's listening and they want to start to
develop a bit more of a compassionate lens to the
way that they operate in their day to day life,
what advice would you give them?

Speaker 3 (30:51):
Well, I would say just what you're saying, like noticing,
you know, knows yourself, knows just the people around you,
and so so notice like put your you know, decide
you know, just just when you're you know, when you're

(31:12):
going around your daily business. Notice and if if you're
focused on kindness and compassion, you will notice, you know,
little things that's happening. Now, of course you will also
notice lots of things that are not are on kind
you know, but but but just notice. And on the

(31:35):
website for the compassionate and now there is a resource
section and so for any so well, first of all,
for anybody who lives in Saint John's and likes to read.
As Lee said, I was planning to be doing all
this in person, so I bought all these extra books

(31:58):
to lend to anybody it was taking the course. So
I have loads of books on all different aspects and
at different levels of rereading, on kindness and compassions. So
if anybody wants to borrow a book for me, they
are welcome. So that's a book. Now. Lots of people
don't like to read.

Speaker 1 (32:15):
So on the.

Speaker 3 (32:16):
Website, on the resources, I have curated lots and lots
of talks and articles on a compassion focus. So and
on the my gen network, which is free to join,
there are I don't know how many, maybe a thousand

(32:36):
talks different people because it's an eighty human So everybody,
you know you're what you need and want for kindness
and combassion, what I need are going to be different,
but we all can do it and we all can
learn always.

Speaker 2 (32:52):
Right, So if people want to learn more, they can
reach out to your website and and then you know,
give you some of those free resources that you have
available to people and maybe get involved on a deeper level.
A big, big question here Okay, let's just get a
little bit like philosophically a per second, what happens if
our communities or world becomes a more compassionate place.

Speaker 3 (33:14):
Well, I think in terms of the natural world, there's
something called the Keeling curve, and to people want to
look that up, it's aid Sandy you see San Diego.
It's measuring the meout of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere.

(33:37):
And if I do, you know, I try to study
you know, climate energy stuff for years and I found
it very confusing. But the Kealing curb is very easy
to see. It's just straight, this curb of blewing up.
So we really have to change our relationship with the

(33:57):
natural world and with each with each other. We you know,
we're at it that the planet is at a tipping point. Now,
how we're going to do that? And from my point
of view, it has to be done with great kindness
and compassion. And what a lot of biologists are teaching

(34:19):
us is that actually living systems are mostly symbiotic. Now,
I have a book on mosses. I don't know much mosses,
but it's all about how life really is mostly collaborative.
So there is that phrase from the poem in memoriam

(34:41):
written by Lord Alfred Tennyson. You know nature is read
and tooths and claw. It's it's actually not accurate because
most of the time nature is nourishing, or there wouldn't
be any nature or any life. So we all have
to do small things. But that that's the thing we
have to I think we have to start. We have

(35:04):
to start by loving nature and loving ourselves and loving
those around us. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (35:12):
I love that, and I think that's a very solid
message for people to digest as we wind down here today,
Doctor Scully, thank you so much for taking the time
of joining me today and sharing your story and fun.

Speaker 3 (35:22):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (35:24):
Well, that's our show this week. Today we learned how
compassion isn't just a saw skill. It's a science backed
force for health and healing. From boosting heart health and
reducing stress to helping us connect better with ourselves and others,
compassion has ripple effects that touch every part of our life.
Thanks to doctor Francis s Keully for sharing her story
and helping us better understand the importance of practicing kindness,

(35:45):
especially towards ourselves. If you want to learn more, you
can check out Becompassionate NL dot ca will you'll find
free resources, recommended readings, and ways to connect. Well, that's
our show this week. I'm your host, doctor Mike Wall.
We'll see you back here next week for another episods
are the Weldness and Healthy Lifestyle show on the Stingray
Podcast Network and your vocm