Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to the Wellness and Healthy Lifestyle show on your VOCM.
Now here's your hopes, Doctor Mike Wall.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Welcome to the show. I'm your host, Doctor Mike Wall.
Today we're taking a closer look at mental health, specifically
men's mental health. Now, let me be clear, mental health
affects all of us, regardless of gender. Men often face
unique barriers when it comes to opening up, seeking help,
or finding safe places to connect. We'll explore those patterns today,
(00:33):
but it's important to know that loneliness can impact all
of us and the value of social connection is key.
To start, I'm joined by doctor Assuan Clearly, a mentor
of mine and a leading voice in psychology here at
Saint John's. He spent decades helping people better understand mental health.
He'll help us frame up today's discussion around loneliness, isolation
and connection. Then in the second half of the show,
(00:54):
we'll hear from Colin McLane of mucking About. This is
a grassroots group here in newfound and working to create safe,
welcoming spaces for men and others to connect, share and
support one another. So there's lots to cover, So let's
get to our conversation with doctor. Clearly, Hi, doc, clearly,
welcome back to the show.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Yeah, I think this is the third time I've had
you on. Youre my go to for mental health I have.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
I'm lucky man.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Well, look, I love having you here. And today we're
talking about a little bit more of a specific aspect
around mental health. We're talking about the men's mental health
and why that is important. But maybe before we get
into that, you could tell us a bit about yourself
and what your background is.
Speaker 4 (01:40):
Well.
Speaker 5 (01:41):
I the audint of course, from university nineteen seventy back home,
we went from viewership Teira. Well, I ended up pointing
business and data at all Psychology and I've been in
at our Psychology almost fifty.
Speaker 4 (01:55):
Five years as well.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
Yeah, it's forty years.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
And for that that's great.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
And you're also an author of the book A Lifespan Listening,
which is a fantastic read for anybody listening so much. Yeah,
and that's why I wanted to reach out to you
today because when you look at mental health, why do
you think loneliness and isolations are these big universal challenges
and how do they show up for men as compared
to maybe other populations.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
The men especially they don't permit themselves to talk to
keep to themselves, you know. And and most of them
they don't have to connect with themselves. They better learn
connection learn saying you have to learn to connect yourself.
You get to know you, especially if you want to
(02:44):
collect the others that you need to know the language,
the mannerism, vocabulary, and so some men don't have that.
And the other thing that I would I wrote it
down for myself the other day is men and talk
to others, the thinking of expectation, how they see them,
(03:06):
so they basically past, they get experiences to come in.
So uh, for example, if I walk in my neighborhood,
if I say to ten men, hi borning, hm, I
hear back to a tree seven people by past.
Speaker 4 (03:25):
So to me, it's at.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
More learned behavior in every culture they showed.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Is that is that because of I mean, obviously everybody
is different and we all have different circumstances. But are
other stereotypes that men feel like they need to embody
in some way.
Speaker 5 (03:41):
Mostly they haven't practiced chat. But I found for example,
my patient, but it was seventy percent female.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
They're willing to talk.
Speaker 5 (03:53):
But what for for most male the thing's a shame
to talk about their problem.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
Mhm. So so yeah, so there's a difference so that
you know, we find that maybe certain other populations are
more likely to reach out that it might be a
learned behavior. Is that the main barriers for people? Is
it this like sort of sense of pride or this
sense of like having to put an idea of strength
forward or something. Is that what that is is is
talking equating to vulnerability.
Speaker 5 (04:21):
What I really learned that they have a low view
And for Japo female, they talk to the mother many times,
but most of us, our father didn't talk to us.
So there's few adults who talk to us and the
day day and shlp they have so they have a
learned to share.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
Yeah, that makes sense. I mean, you know, so we're
obviously you know, these habits are passed down from generation
to generation. There's different approaches to parenting and maybe that
was it was absent for a lot of men. But
when it look at like organizations like this group I'm
going to speak with today mucky about they're here in
New Fland and they're and they're creating these space is
for connection. Why are these kind of grassroots peer support,
(05:04):
friend based initiatives so powerful, and how do they complement
connection for all people, not just for men, but in general.
How does peer support bring people together?
Speaker 5 (05:15):
Because I think that what happened they allow them set
to talk. They allowed to They allowed to say, especially
male and especially a support group, that they know that
they are not going to be evaluated, They're not going
to be exposed.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
It's safer to not to talk. When I run mixed group.
Speaker 5 (05:34):
What percentage of male talk in the first couple of
couple of time they answered the question, but they didn't
get engaged emotionally. Then there's a session for session they
were so allow themself to be lucky others.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
So there's an element of trust that comes into it.
Do you think that Do you think that part of
that comes from the fact that in modern culture today people,
although they're connected more through digital devices, they may not
have that chance to interact with people one on one
like they used stealing exact very true?
Speaker 3 (06:04):
That what was we say?
Speaker 5 (06:05):
Because it is do they rely on especially new generation
I'll talk about between the ten or twelve to maybe
thirty forty, they learned to to rely on the gaming
or themselves. They watch television on them them said because
(06:26):
it's safer.
Speaker 4 (06:27):
You don't have to evaluate that.
Speaker 5 (06:29):
One of the saying that I encourage you need to
socialize and social doesn't doesn't doesn't mean you have a friend,
but you need to any gook places be able to cheat, chat,
yeap mail, especially the levee.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
My generation.
Speaker 5 (06:47):
Maybe more generation, we learned to go to McDonald have
a group and chat. Okay, go become part of shriner.
There many many things that of this thing is.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
Helping or we join it, but it's not complete.
Speaker 5 (07:10):
We have you know, the limited number of people there
are more lowly I read from different places, but fifty
nine fifty eight fifty five percent of people spill lonely.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
And I believe that learn learning to talk and and
the other thing that is bonding male bonding is that,
for example, I have a group of friends be a hiker.
Speaker 5 (07:38):
I mean you, I've told you before that we've been
hiking together for five years. We all over seventy close
to it and when we go out there boys mm hmmm.
Speaker 3 (07:53):
Yeah, we learned from each other.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
So that's interesting because I think about like sports. For example,
when I was young, I played a lot of sports.
That was time to spend with other guys, and it
offered a huge social support for me. But as I
got older, I had to find other ways to stay engaged.
Is sometimes doing activities that are familiar a way for
people to find common ground and create new friendships. So
(08:17):
for example, doing a hike in nature, doing a woodworking
shop or something where you're sharing that sense of familiarity.
But with new people. Is that good for people?
Speaker 5 (08:28):
Well, it's physical activity, right, you know, anything going to gym,
assuming going hiking, and social activity like going to music festival,
playing with music, and and creative activity like you know, painting.
(08:50):
But the person has to find a way. But we
are not teaching people how to do it. The number
of people who talk about it it limited. You know,
I have a number of people who talk to me
and they feel lonely but they don't know.
Speaker 4 (09:04):
Where to go.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (09:06):
Yes, and we are not talking about it to our
leaders or church leaders or social leaders. They need to
talk about it over and over till people say yes,
that does exist, that does exist. That I'm okay, okay,
We'll be there.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
So I mean, you know, loneliness we know is not
good for us, but like why is it not good
for us?
Speaker 6 (09:29):
Like?
Speaker 2 (09:29):
What what does loneliness lead to for somebody? You see
a lot of patients. Obviously been counseling people your entire career.
Why is loneliness such a bad thing?
Speaker 5 (09:40):
Because, first of all, most of us we are not
validated ourselves. We need we need some people validate themselves.
There's social being. We are not individual being, you know,
but we turned to become individual being. We act like
we are socially, but internally we don't. Most people kept
the mental fact inside of themselves instop talking about it.
(10:04):
And unfortunately social media is allow us to people become
in private doing and so we don't connect with each other.
We don't, we don't briefly near somebody. We have to
lower this social media and sell the phone and engage
(10:25):
more outside activity.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
And I knew you would have the resources of this.
You've been a mentor of mind for a long time.
I always trust your opinion on these things, and one
of the things I always find is that you give
practical advice. And I just really appreciate you taking the
time today to share a few of your insights. I
know we can probably talk for hours, but it's great
to see Doc, and I guarantee I'll be reaching out
again to have you on the show.
Speaker 5 (10:46):
Well, I hope.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
So that was doctor Hassan, clearly author of a life
spent listening, helping us understand some of the social patterns
they can make it harder for men to speak openly
about their mental health. When we come back here from
Colin McLean about, how much and about is building safe
spaces for connection and support right here in our community.
We'll be right back after the break. Welcome back. I'm
(11:13):
joined now by Colin McLain from Mucking About, a new
nonprofit focus on connection, wellness and support well. Their starting
point is men's wellness. The group is open and inclusive
to all people, and the lessons they share about belonging
applied broadly. Let's dive into how they're creating safe spaces
for conversation and for community.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
Hi.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
Colin, welcome to the show. Hi, how are you doing fantastic?
I'm really excited chat today. We've had lots of interactions
back and forth getting ready for this interview, and part
of that is because your project that you're working on
is brand new. Maybe you could give our listeners a
bit of a background on yourself and how you got
involved with this.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
Sure, my name's Colin maclan.
Speaker 6 (11:53):
I live in Saint John's, Newfoundland, but I grew up
in a calo at Nunavuot. I live there for eighteen
year years and moved here when I came to university.
My dad is from Labrador and my mom's family is
from Saint John's, Newfoundland, and you know, just being in
(12:14):
those places and seeing the different people that I grew
up around and the different issues that people are dealing
with and on a daily basis, makes you more aware
of the social aspect of community and connection and reasons
to get involved with that sort of thing on like
(12:35):
a grassroots level. And my fellow directors at George Michelin,
who is also my first cousin, he grew up in
a Goose Bay and Northwest River, Labrador and lives in
Saint John's now and Jared Roberts, the other director, also
grew up in Goose Bay, Labrador, so they had a
lot of the same experiences that I did. And we
(12:55):
were all quite close growing up and have been throughout
the year, and that's how kind of this all started.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
It's fantastic. It's so nice when you've got that lived experience,
you understand the value of something like being out in nature.
But also I think we underestimate the importance of social connection.
I think it's one of the hallmarks of healthy aging.
You know, loneliness is a real challenge for people, but
there's nothing better than being in the outdoors and being
able to engage with people. And that kind of brings
(13:23):
us to our conversation today. Tell me a little bit
about what mucket About is and how would you describe
it to our listeners who have maybe never heard of it.
Speaker 6 (13:35):
So it's a very new it's a nonprofit that's focused
on men's wellness, connection and support for whatever reason. You know,
it seems like there's a bit of a gap in
outlets for those types of things, places for people to
just kind of show up.
Speaker 3 (13:54):
I know, a lot of talk about like.
Speaker 6 (13:55):
You know you'll see anywhere on social media or between people.
It seems like there's kind of like the invisibility of
the third place now and it's this is meant to
be like a kind of a modern third place for
men and others, not just men, but the focus is
on men in Newfoundland to reduce isolation. So, you know,
(14:18):
in terms of life stresses in the economy, you know,
the political situation of the world, even just regular things
in everyday life, like you know, becoming a new parent,
of getting.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
A new job. That's kind of thing.
Speaker 6 (14:32):
Men oftentimes tend to suffer in silence, I guess is
a way to put it, but you know, tend to
keep their feelings and emotions kind of bottled up and
try to.
Speaker 3 (14:43):
Deal with them on their own.
Speaker 6 (14:44):
And this is meant to be like kind of a
safe space to you know, explore those different things in
a very casual way.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Yeah, that's right, and you know men can sometimes have
issues with vulnerability around mental health. I used to work
with a lot workforces that were male dominated, and that
is a challenge for men. And I was actually looking
at an organization in Tasmania and Australia that were these
shed groups that got together for retirement to give them
(15:13):
that sense of community whence they retired. And so when
I saw this pop up on the radar here locally,
I knew I had to reach out. You know, you
mentioned what it kind of inspired. It was the need
for this to exist. But was there a moment or
an experience that like sort of made this resonate with you,
especially where you've got such a good background when it
comes to the outdoors. Was there like an aha moment,
(15:35):
It's like I needed to do this.
Speaker 3 (15:37):
Not so much for me.
Speaker 6 (15:38):
But I do know that my fellow director, George Michelin,
both of us grew up like doing a lot of
outdoor activities and you know, experiencing different things with our
families that I guess a lot of other.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
People weren't exposed to.
Speaker 6 (15:51):
And you know, in that sense, I've always felt a
good connection to nature and being outside and how it
reduces your anxiety and and just kind of centers you
in a way that a lot of other experiences don't.
And I think growing up like that, it became like
kind of a gradual determination that this is something that
(16:14):
people need to experience.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
And we lose a lot of that in the.
Speaker 6 (16:18):
Fast paced, technological day to day that we live in,
and it's good for people to kind of just slow
down and take a moment and think about the things
that really matter to you in your life.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
I couldn't I couldn't agree more. I mean I think
about like, you know, there's chemicals the trees that help
us relax. There's a randomness to it that captures our attention,
there's a chance to get away, Like when you're in
the middle of the woods and you're ten kilometers out
or whatever, you have to get back too. See, you
can't just jump off that, So there's that forced duration.
Perhaps it's a good way to put it. So, you know,
(16:51):
so what's what's what's your overall mission with it? It
sounds like you're creating a place for community. You're creating
a place where people can feel safe to talk about
or engage with others that may be also facing new
challenges in life. Do you guys have a vision or
a mission as you guys begin to launch this initiative.
Speaker 6 (17:08):
Yeah, so realistically, our mission is to improve men's wellness
through connection, community and support.
Speaker 3 (17:16):
That's our main hope.
Speaker 6 (17:18):
And I guess the vision is that we will have
men and any other members.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
We're not just limited to men. I make that clear.
Speaker 6 (17:27):
Men are feeling healthier, connected, supported, and engaged and this
will help to build stronger communities through all of these things.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
Yeah, that's great, that's important caveat to make sure that
you know everybody is included, of course, But again, you
guys came from a standpoint looking at a specific challenge
within men's mental health. Are there any stats that exist
out there about how big of a challenge it is
for men or other populations that are facing social isolation
when it comes to mental health.
Speaker 6 (17:57):
Well, certainly there are, and obviously, especially in places that
are isolated, you can look at any number of statistic
suicide rates or higher mental health issues tend to be
more undiagnosed. These are things that again we're not an
organization looking to deal directly with these things, but we
(18:20):
are more looking to deal with root causes that can
address these issues indirectly, which will help everybody, not just
the individual themselves, with the wider community.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
And it's an opportunity to participate too, right, So quite
often people are told, oh, I need to be engaged.
You should get out of nature, you should get some
physical activities, spend more time with people. Sometimes they need
the organization to be able to make these things happen.
And I'm curious about this. This sounds really intriguing. What
kind of experiences or activities do you guys plan on
having that will bring people together.
Speaker 6 (18:55):
So we're open to many different ideas and it's really
just in the early stages, but we've talked a lot
about having focus on outdoor activities, so things like hikes,
sunrise walks, or gatherings in the park, even just a
place to connect and have a morning coffee.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
I know the many times on the way to.
Speaker 6 (19:16):
Work when I get a coffee, I see a group
of older gentlemen having a coffee in the same spot
every single morning, And you know, that just kind of,
you know, reiterates the importance of those spaces, in those
places to meet and to just talk about anything. So
right now, that's what we're going to focus on. And
eventually we hope to get into things more like skill
(19:39):
shares or workshops to focus on different things that people
might have issues with or barriers too. But what we
really want is just a place to meet that's casual,
welcoming and rooted in you know, local culture.
Speaker 3 (19:56):
For right now.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Well, I think that sort of also really lends itself
to the name. Right Like, when I think mucking about,
I don't think highly organized or rigid in any way.
I think when you're mucking about, you're just having a time.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
You're just having a time. You're going out for a
boil up.
Speaker 6 (20:12):
You know, you're seeing what you can see and seeing
where the day takes you kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
We're talking with Colin McClain about connection, community and wellness.
Stay with us because we'll be right back after the break.
Welcome back. I'm continuing my conversation with Colin McLean from
Mucking about exploring how grassroots groups can play a big
role in mental health and wellness. So you guys are
(20:40):
in your infancy, if you're coming up with your final
steps to launch the program, how are we going to
hear about it? How are we going to see what's
going to be to launch?
Speaker 6 (20:48):
So yeah, we're definitely in our early stages and we've
done all the initial legwork that you need to to
incorporate as a nonprofit and all that. So that's all
done mostly thanks to George. But our first events are
going to be small and local, and our first official
event will be on September twenty seventh, and it's going
(21:09):
to be a sunrise walk around Kitty Vid so you
can find all this information and I will share all
this about our website and our social media and that
you find all of that on those places. But it'll
just be a regular sunrise walk. You know hopefully that
you know, after these initial events, the growth will be gradual,
(21:31):
but you know through word of mouth people will if
they enjoy it, you know they can connect with other
people and have more people come.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
I have a six am crew that I go to
the gym with every morning, and having that sense of
community and place has always been really good. I remember
I used to live abroad and I would always create
consistent places where I could have familiar faces. And I
think not only for people that may be lonely here
or lacking that social interaction. I mean, do you hope
to be able to attract people that are new to
(22:02):
the community as well, people that are looking at forging
those relationships they may not have had from a lifetime.
Because I know you're from away as well, like I am.
Is that one of the audiences you're encouraging people to
reach out to.
Speaker 6 (22:13):
Absolutely, and we hope that as an organization we can
appeal to all generations and all walks of life. So
you could be, you know, an immigrant who just moved
here a month ago and looking for somewhere to connect
or to meet people, or you could have lived here
your entire life and you just don't have an outlet
for this sort of thing. But I think through a
(22:36):
lot of conversations that we've had too amongst ourselves and
with other friends and confidants. It's nice to have a
place that's not specific around an activity or so, like
you said, the gym, or I have a friend who's
very into squash or badminton or that sort of thing,
(22:56):
and you get the same idea of the sense of community,
but it is sort of around the activity, around the sport,
that kind of thing. So for some people who may
not have that kind of interest or for whatever reason,
just don't participate in those kinds of things, this is
kind of meant to be that place for you.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
I guess I love that, And I think when you
go for a walk, you can migrate between different groups
of people. If you're doing a boil up, everybody can
take different roles. And if you are in a structured
place like playing a sport or at the gym, you
tend to work out in your little groove and media
people is intentional. This way you're allowed to filter together
and be able to have experiences where you can move
(23:36):
from group to group. That makes a lot of sense.
Is that really what you hope people take away from
it when they when they come that they do something.
Number one is probably really good for them physically, mentally,
you know, emotionally, but secondly, faster those connections.
Speaker 3 (23:52):
Yeah, then you hit it. You hit the nail right
on the head.
Speaker 6 (23:54):
Like we're you're hoping that, you know, we're just kind
of hoping to foster a sense of belonging. Connection doesn't
have to be complicated. You can connect to somebody on
the bus sometimes, but through these outlets and in a
structured way, you can have stronger community ties, deeper friendships,
experience some fun and enjoyment without like the pressures of
(24:16):
everyday life sometimes because a lot of times were we
seem to have to plan out or fun and you
don't sometimes you don't really want to do that, Like
you just kind of want to go somewhere and have
a new experience and.
Speaker 3 (24:30):
Maybe meet somebody you might not have met otherwise.
Speaker 6 (24:32):
So that's kind of just what we're hoping and eventually
down the road perhaps lead into developing new skills, new interests,
new hobbies, that sort of thing. But really just a
low barrier, easy way.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
To meet people and connect.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
Yeah, well you just said it. There's two things that
really stand out to me for what you just said.
Number One, low barrier. Socioeconomic challenges are real cost of
living is up high right now. It sounds as though,
I mean, we'll just sort of tackle this one first,
but it sounds as though a lot of the activities
planning aren't going to have that financial barrier of the
key goal of disipating.
Speaker 6 (25:05):
Absolutely not. And you know, we're hoping that we will
have many different types of activities that will be a
very very low effort financially because, yes, everything costs money
these days, even sometimes going to the store, it will
cost you more money than you thought it would. Yeah,
but yeah, this is the type of thing that we're
(25:26):
hoping and you know, it's just something that obviously you
could enjoy doing these things on your own, but it's
always more fun sometimes when you have people to enjoy with.
Speaker 2 (25:34):
So another thing is even if you've beme part of
the community for a long time, and so I've encourage
people to think about while we're listening to this, is
that we have groups of friends that we've had maybe
for an entire lifetime, and when you meet these friends
in grade school, you may not have had the same
interests that you have now as an adult, and now
you've developed new ones you've always wanted to be outdoorsy
(25:55):
but never had the group of friends to be able
to participate with that, or you're looking to expand your
rison to meet new people because schedules aren't working with
some of your old friends. Is that Another thing that
you're thinking is that, like you know, when people have
a shared interest, there tends to be a natural connection
immediately just from having something in common.
Speaker 3 (26:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (26:13):
Absolutely, And like you said, you know, people grow and
develop in different ways, and you drift away from people
that you were close to.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
When you were younger. But yeah, even if somebody doesn't
think that they have.
Speaker 6 (26:25):
An interest in the outdoors or outdoor activities or that
kind of thing, they might grow to enjoy them if
they do them once or twice, you know, and maybe
they haven't even tried it. But yeah, that's the sort
of thing because oftentimes people will go into something with
the preconceived notions of what it's going to be about
or how you're going to feel about it, And we
(26:46):
kind of just want to remove those barriers in your
mind before you get into something, because you know, there's
no expectations here.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
You can come into it and not enjoy it and
never come back one.
Speaker 2 (27:02):
That's true. That's true, you're not. Yeah, it's not the
fraternity of any sort. And that's another thing. As a
wellness show, you know, this is the angle that we
always take with our programming, is what would you see
as a definition of wellness And how do you see
something like this actually improving somebody's well being even long
after they've finished a tending year event.
Speaker 3 (27:24):
Well.
Speaker 6 (27:24):
I think wellness in terms of like I work in
the healthcare psychological space. Let's say I work with adults
with autism, and I think wellness in terms of how
people usually view it as physical. Obviously, you know, physically healthy,
(27:44):
physically fit, but a lot of times your physical and
mental health are so integrated that you don't even realize
one is affecting the other.
Speaker 3 (27:53):
So I think just the ability to be able to.
Speaker 6 (27:58):
You know, have a place to either talk about your
problems or issues or whatever's going on in your life,
you'll build stronger connections to people. And in that sense,
maybe by doing something physically demanding or you know, physical
in some way, but you will build a stronger mental
(28:20):
psychological outlook, I think, and that will translate to your
entire your entire life.
Speaker 3 (28:27):
So yeah, just for.
Speaker 6 (28:29):
Me, you know, wellness is being happy and content in
your mental and physical of state, and just being able
to deal with life's challenges as they come around kind
of thing.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 3 (28:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:42):
And I feel like you know, when you look at
the outdoors in particular, and the fact that we have
unlimited nature around us, especially if you know how to
navigate it properly.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
We live in a we live in a very a
very nice place for that absolutely.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
I think, I think probably the best in the world.
Speaker 6 (28:57):
To be honest with you, united even I would agree
with you, I would agree with you.
Speaker 3 (29:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:01):
No, it's seriously dangerous animals and not many ticks things
like that. Even on that side. But I think about myself.
If I have a nice weekend where I get a
chance to get out, go for a beautiful hike, maybe
camp or or go out of the beach and have
a fire or whatever it is, that can carry with
me for the entire week. It's like a recharge sometimes
even you know, we'll go down by the water and
(29:21):
have dinner, just myself, my wife because we live not
too far from the coast, just like most people and
new Fromlanta, Labrador. How do you think that's going to
be able to translate to stress management for people throughout
the week when they have those little doses of vitamin
n as Ta Laffler, My friend says, Vitamin nature.
Speaker 3 (29:40):
Vitamin nature.
Speaker 6 (29:41):
Yeah, yeah, I think you know well, like I know,
I feel the same way whenever I get to do
something not necessarily social, because I do consider myself an introvert,
so I like to do things on my own sometimes,
but just being able to go out and have an experience,
you're you're gonna feel better at work. You're gonna feel
(30:04):
better approaching deadlines or school or anything like that.
Speaker 3 (30:08):
You really.
Speaker 6 (30:11):
Get to the point where sometimes you feel burnt out
and you don't really know how to tackle that feeling.
Speaker 3 (30:17):
I know a lot of people don't.
Speaker 6 (30:19):
So something like this will get you out of your
comfort zone a little bit and it'll help you. Just
like you said, recharge, recharge the batteries.
Speaker 3 (30:28):
So I think people will feel more relaxed.
Speaker 6 (30:32):
You can, you know, laugh a little bit, and just
small everyday things will seem a little bit easier.
Speaker 3 (30:38):
I think after something like this.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
We're talking with Colin McClain about connection, community and wellness.
Stay with us because we'll be right back after the break.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
You're listening to what we broadcast of the Wellness and
Healthy Lifestyle Show with doctor Mike Wall. Listen live Thursday
nights at seven pm and Sunday's at four pm.
Speaker 2 (30:59):
Welcome back. I'm continuing my conversation with Colin MacLean from
muck And about exploring how grassroots groups can play a
big role in mental health and wellness. Well, yeah, and
I think you said something too that's really really important
is when there's an organization like yours that's handling the
safety side of things, that how to the making sure
that people aren't limited by the fact that I don't
(31:19):
feel comfortable in the woods or I've never been in
the woods before. I'm not an outdoors person. I was
never raised that way. That's a barrier I think for
people to get out in nature, because they might feel
intimidated by nature. How are you guys going to plan
your events? I know obviously the walker, right Katy Vidi
is one, but say you guys do something a little
bit more intensive in nature, How are you guys going
(31:40):
to be able to circumvent that apprehension that people may
have participating?
Speaker 3 (31:45):
Yeah, So I.
Speaker 6 (31:48):
Want to make it clear too, that we're we're open
to all walks of life, you know, in terms of
like disabilities or anything like that. Especially with our first activity,
Vitty like, it's a very approachable trail, it's very well maintained.
If you're perhaps in a wheelchair or something like that,
is very easy to get around. But we're going to
(32:11):
have a lot of activities with those things in mind,
and we just wanted people to know that, you know,
if you're not comfortable doing something, you can absolutely reach
out and let us know and we'll take that into
account for future events and activities and that sort of thing.
Speaker 3 (32:26):
But again, like we're in our.
Speaker 6 (32:28):
Initial stages, so we've yet to have these issues pop
up kind of thing. Yeah, but we want to make
it accessible for everybody. We don't want anybody to feel
left out or not included in any way. So we
will take all these things into account going forward.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
Yeah, okay, So that's that's great, And you know, obviously
this is coming from a place, like I said, I thought,
I've seen a few examples of different organizations that have
brought people together and made a big difference in their
social health. Have you seen some examples of this in
your own life? Where this approach has actually impacted somebody
quite significantly.
Speaker 6 (33:10):
Yeah, well, I would say myself, I like, you know
yourself is the best example. I guess when I was younger,
in my early twenties, when I first moved here, I
found it quite difficult because it was isolating. I'd moved
away from my friends that I grew up around, and
(33:31):
I was in a new place where I've made new friends,
and I have made friends that I would consider lifelong
friends now, but there were quite a lot of times,
and you know, in university and after university when it
was a very isolating experiences, and I've dealt with anxiety
and depression and all of that stuff, and obviously, you know,
the the outlets for that are are can be few
(33:55):
and far between sometimes, especially if you don't know where
to look. So I think in the sense that when
I met my wife now at the time, she really
helped me to find outlets and places to discuss these
issues with people. And I think just having somebody to say, hey,
(34:17):
I'm going through this, I need I like, I don't
really know what to do. And if somebody has life
experience where they can you point you in the right direction,
that's kind of what we're hoping to achieve here because
everybody has different life experiences, Everyone goes through different things
wherever they are, and oftentimes people just don't talk about
(34:39):
that or they don't feel safe enough to talk about that.
So the ability to do that and to have a
space where you can ask somebody question and they could
point you in the right direction, that's kind of what
we're hoping for.
Speaker 3 (34:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Yeah, peer support is such a powerful tool for mental health.
As you would know as a mental health practitioner yourself,
that plays a big role. And also we also know
that there's lots of other groups and organizations and societies
out there that also specialize this type of stuff. Are
you looking to potentially partner with different groups as you
(35:14):
continue to number one, maybe address a specific audience or
engage their participants, but also have that expertise as part
of your toolbox.
Speaker 6 (35:24):
Yeah, I think we're definitely open to different partnerships because,
like we said, we're purely a nonprofit group looking to
get together with people. We don't want to claim to
be mental health professionals, like in the sense of therapists
or psychologists or psychiatrists.
Speaker 3 (35:45):
Or anything like that.
Speaker 6 (35:46):
But if we can have partnerships with different groups or
communities that can address those needs. We will certainly be
open to those different things, and we have looked into
it and talked about different groups that are available just
locally here. But we want to complement the supports that
(36:10):
are around and we don't want to duplicate anything, but
we do want to be able to partner with groups
that have the same sort of vision that we do
that want to focus on men's mental health and building
stronger communities type thing.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
So that's great, That's fantastic. So let's pull a crystal
ball out for a second. Okay, you're just starting, you're
just starting on that road, but you're going to be
working your way down and moving forward. Where do you
guys see yourself in five years? What's the hopes?
Speaker 6 (36:42):
Yeah, so obviously the grand vision would hopefully we would
be a recognized hub for men's wellness in Newfoundland. We
would hope to have some sustainable programs that reach across
the province. Right now, we're obviously in the metro area
and say John's, but we do want to expand into
(37:03):
a rural areas which obviously a lot of supports and
groups are not available mostly because there's not enough people.
But if you can get something that's sustainable to reach
into these smaller communities, you can address the needs that
are there and hopefully in five years we can expand
into Atlantic Canada. And yeah, that would be our ideal vision.
Speaker 3 (37:28):
I suppose.
Speaker 2 (37:29):
Well, that's a great mission, and I think that's an
important mission. It's really nice when people are looking at
something very specific, especially something that requires our attention, in
particular around mental health. As people are curious in finding
out more, they want to know about the events, how
do they get a hold of you? You guys have social media,
you have a website. How are we going to be
able to keep up to everything mucking About is doing?
Speaker 6 (37:51):
Yeah, so if anybody is interested, you can find us
on Facebook and Instagram just search for mucking About in corporate.
Speaker 3 (38:01):
And we also have a website, mucking About twenty twenty five.
Speaker 6 (38:06):
Dot wixsite that's wixsiite dot com and it has all
our information. You know, people can attend our events without
being members of our organization. So if you just want
to learn more, you can always come.
Speaker 3 (38:21):
To an event.
Speaker 6 (38:23):
But if you'd like to be a member, there's links
on our website that you can go to and fill
out a form and see what it's about. Kind of
thing that's fantastic.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
Well, I just want to say thank you so much
for sharing all your expertise with us today. It was
a really interesting conversation and I wish you all the
best of luck. I know it's going to be something
going to be really appealing to a lot of our
audience and something that we definitely need here in our communities.
Thanks so much for joining me, Calin.
Speaker 6 (38:49):
Well, thank you, Mike, and I really appreciate what you're
doing for the wellness space with your podcasts and stuff,
and this was great.
Speaker 3 (38:55):
I had a really good time.
Speaker 2 (38:56):
Good I'm sure there'll be lots more in your future,
so I'm glad to be one of the first.
Speaker 3 (39:00):
Excellent.
Speaker 6 (39:01):
Thank you, Thank ere you too, Bye bye.
Speaker 2 (39:04):
Well that's our show. This week. We began our chat
with doctor Hassan Khlilli, who reminded us that mental health
challenges like loneliness and isolation affect people everywhere, across all genders,
ages and backgrounds. And then we heard from Colin MacLean
about Mucking About, an inclusive grassroots effort to create safe,
low barrier spaces where people can come together, talk and
(39:25):
support each other. The takeaway is simple. We all need connection.
Whether you have challenges connecting with others, expressing your emotions,
or navigating life stresses, there are safe spaces where we
can share, belong, and grow well. That's our episode this week.
I'm your host, doctor Mike Wall. We'll see you back
here and next week for another episode of the Wellness
(39:45):
and Healthy Lifestyle Show on the Stingray Podcast Network and
your vocm
Welcome to the Wellness and Healthy Lifestyle show on your VOCM.
Now here's your hopes, Doctor Mike Wall.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Welcome to the show. I'm your host, Doctor Mike Wall.
Today we're taking a closer look at mental health, specifically
men's mental health. Now, let me be clear, mental health
affects all of us, regardless of gender. Men often face
unique barriers when it comes to opening up, seeking help,
or finding safe places to connect. We'll explore those patterns today,
(00:33):
but it's important to know that loneliness can impact all
of us and the value of social connection is key.
To start, I'm joined by doctor Assuan Clearly, a mentor
of mine and a leading voice in psychology here at
Saint John's. He spent decades helping people better understand mental health.
He'll help us frame up today's discussion around loneliness, isolation
and connection. Then in the second half of the show,
(00:54):
we'll hear from Colin McLane of mucking About. This is
a grassroots group here in newfound and working to create safe,
welcoming spaces for men and others to connect, share and
support one another. So there's lots to cover, So let's
get to our conversation with doctor. Clearly, Hi, doc, clearly,
welcome back to the show.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Yeah, I think this is the third time I've had
you on. Youre my go to for mental health I have.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
I'm lucky man.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Well, look, I love having you here. And today we're
talking about a little bit more of a specific aspect
around mental health. We're talking about the men's mental health
and why that is important. But maybe before we get
into that, you could tell us a bit about yourself
and what your background is.
Speaker 4 (01:40):
Well.
Speaker 5 (01:41):
I the audint of course, from university nineteen seventy back home,
we went from viewership Teira. Well, I ended up pointing
business and data at all Psychology and I've been in
at our Psychology almost fifty.
Speaker 4 (01:55):
Five years as well.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
Yeah, it's forty years.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
And for that that's great.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
And you're also an author of the book A Lifespan Listening,
which is a fantastic read for anybody listening so much. Yeah,
and that's why I wanted to reach out to you
today because when you look at mental health, why do
you think loneliness and isolations are these big universal challenges
and how do they show up for men as compared
to maybe other populations.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
The men especially they don't permit themselves to talk to
keep to themselves, you know. And and most of them
they don't have to connect with themselves. They better learn
connection learn saying you have to learn to connect yourself.
You get to know you, especially if you want to
(02:44):
collect the others that you need to know the language,
the mannerism, vocabulary, and so some men don't have that.
And the other thing that I would I wrote it
down for myself the other day is men and talk
to others, the thinking of expectation, how they see them,
(03:06):
so they basically past, they get experiences to come in.
So uh, for example, if I walk in my neighborhood,
if I say to ten men, hi borning, hm, I
hear back to a tree seven people by past.
Speaker 4 (03:25):
So to me, it's at.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
More learned behavior in every culture they showed.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Is that is that because of I mean, obviously everybody
is different and we all have different circumstances. But are
other stereotypes that men feel like they need to embody
in some way.
Speaker 5 (03:41):
Mostly they haven't practiced chat. But I found for example,
my patient, but it was seventy percent female.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
They're willing to talk.
Speaker 5 (03:53):
But what for for most male the thing's a shame
to talk about their problem.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
Mhm. So so yeah, so there's a difference so that
you know, we find that maybe certain other populations are
more likely to reach out that it might be a
learned behavior. Is that the main barriers for people? Is
it this like sort of sense of pride or this
sense of like having to put an idea of strength
forward or something. Is that what that is is is
talking equating to vulnerability.
Speaker 5 (04:21):
What I really learned that they have a low view
And for Japo female, they talk to the mother many times,
but most of us, our father didn't talk to us.
So there's few adults who talk to us and the
day day and shlp they have so they have a
learned to share.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
Yeah, that makes sense. I mean, you know, so we're
obviously you know, these habits are passed down from generation
to generation. There's different approaches to parenting and maybe that
was it was absent for a lot of men. But
when it look at like organizations like this group I'm
going to speak with today mucky about they're here in
New Fland and they're and they're creating these space is
for connection. Why are these kind of grassroots peer support,
(05:04):
friend based initiatives so powerful, and how do they complement
connection for all people, not just for men, but in general.
How does peer support bring people together?
Speaker 5 (05:15):
Because I think that what happened they allow them set
to talk. They allowed to They allowed to say, especially
male and especially a support group, that they know that
they are not going to be evaluated, They're not going
to be exposed.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
It's safer to not to talk. When I run mixed group.
Speaker 5 (05:34):
What percentage of male talk in the first couple of
couple of time they answered the question, but they didn't
get engaged emotionally. Then there's a session for session they
were so allow themself to be lucky others.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
So there's an element of trust that comes into it.
Do you think that Do you think that part of
that comes from the fact that in modern culture today people,
although they're connected more through digital devices, they may not
have that chance to interact with people one on one
like they used stealing exact very true?
Speaker 3 (06:04):
That what was we say?
Speaker 5 (06:05):
Because it is do they rely on especially new generation
I'll talk about between the ten or twelve to maybe
thirty forty, they learned to to rely on the gaming
or themselves. They watch television on them them said because
(06:26):
it's safer.
Speaker 4 (06:27):
You don't have to evaluate that.
Speaker 5 (06:29):
One of the saying that I encourage you need to
socialize and social doesn't doesn't doesn't mean you have a friend,
but you need to any gook places be able to cheat, chat,
yeap mail, especially the levee.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
My generation.
Speaker 5 (06:47):
Maybe more generation, we learned to go to McDonald have
a group and chat. Okay, go become part of shriner.
There many many things that of this thing is.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
Helping or we join it, but it's not complete.
Speaker 5 (07:10):
We have you know, the limited number of people there
are more lowly I read from different places, but fifty
nine fifty eight fifty five percent of people spill lonely.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
And I believe that learn learning to talk and and
the other thing that is bonding male bonding is that,
for example, I have a group of friends be a hiker.
Speaker 5 (07:38):
I mean you, I've told you before that we've been
hiking together for five years. We all over seventy close
to it and when we go out there boys mm hmmm.
Speaker 3 (07:53):
Yeah, we learned from each other.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
So that's interesting because I think about like sports. For example,
when I was young, I played a lot of sports.
That was time to spend with other guys, and it
offered a huge social support for me. But as I
got older, I had to find other ways to stay engaged.
Is sometimes doing activities that are familiar a way for
people to find common ground and create new friendships. So
(08:17):
for example, doing a hike in nature, doing a woodworking
shop or something where you're sharing that sense of familiarity.
But with new people. Is that good for people?
Speaker 5 (08:28):
Well, it's physical activity, right, you know, anything going to gym,
assuming going hiking, and social activity like going to music festival,
playing with music, and and creative activity like you know, painting.
(08:50):
But the person has to find a way. But we
are not teaching people how to do it. The number
of people who talk about it it limited. You know,
I have a number of people who talk to me
and they feel lonely but they don't know.
Speaker 4 (09:04):
Where to go.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (09:06):
Yes, and we are not talking about it to our
leaders or church leaders or social leaders. They need to
talk about it over and over till people say yes,
that does exist, that does exist. That I'm okay, okay,
We'll be there.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
So I mean, you know, loneliness we know is not
good for us, but like why is it not good
for us?
Speaker 6 (09:29):
Like?
Speaker 2 (09:29):
What what does loneliness lead to for somebody? You see
a lot of patients. Obviously been counseling people your entire career.
Why is loneliness such a bad thing?
Speaker 5 (09:40):
Because, first of all, most of us we are not
validated ourselves. We need we need some people validate themselves.
There's social being. We are not individual being, you know,
but we turned to become individual being. We act like
we are socially, but internally we don't. Most people kept
the mental fact inside of themselves instop talking about it.
(10:04):
And unfortunately social media is allow us to people become
in private doing and so we don't connect with each other.
We don't, we don't briefly near somebody. We have to
lower this social media and sell the phone and engage
(10:25):
more outside activity.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
And I knew you would have the resources of this.
You've been a mentor of mind for a long time.
I always trust your opinion on these things, and one
of the things I always find is that you give
practical advice. And I just really appreciate you taking the
time today to share a few of your insights. I
know we can probably talk for hours, but it's great
to see Doc, and I guarantee I'll be reaching out
again to have you on the show.
Speaker 5 (10:46):
Well, I hope.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
So that was doctor Hassan, clearly author of a life
spent listening, helping us understand some of the social patterns
they can make it harder for men to speak openly
about their mental health. When we come back here from
Colin McLean about, how much and about is building safe
spaces for connection and support right here in our community.
We'll be right back after the break. Welcome back. I'm
(11:13):
joined now by Colin McLain from Mucking About, a new
nonprofit focus on connection, wellness and support well. Their starting
point is men's wellness. The group is open and inclusive
to all people, and the lessons they share about belonging
applied broadly. Let's dive into how they're creating safe spaces
for conversation and for community.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
Hi.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
Colin, welcome to the show. Hi, how are you doing fantastic?
I'm really excited chat today. We've had lots of interactions
back and forth getting ready for this interview, and part
of that is because your project that you're working on
is brand new. Maybe you could give our listeners a
bit of a background on yourself and how you got
involved with this.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
Sure, my name's Colin maclan.
Speaker 6 (11:53):
I live in Saint John's, Newfoundland, but I grew up
in a calo at Nunavuot. I live there for eighteen
year years and moved here when I came to university.
My dad is from Labrador and my mom's family is
from Saint John's, Newfoundland, and you know, just being in
(12:14):
those places and seeing the different people that I grew
up around and the different issues that people are dealing
with and on a daily basis, makes you more aware
of the social aspect of community and connection and reasons
to get involved with that sort of thing on like
(12:35):
a grassroots level. And my fellow directors at George Michelin,
who is also my first cousin, he grew up in
a Goose Bay and Northwest River, Labrador and lives in
Saint John's now and Jared Roberts, the other director, also
grew up in Goose Bay, Labrador, so they had a
lot of the same experiences that I did. And we
(12:55):
were all quite close growing up and have been throughout
the year, and that's how kind of this all started.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
It's fantastic. It's so nice when you've got that lived experience,
you understand the value of something like being out in nature.
But also I think we underestimate the importance of social connection.
I think it's one of the hallmarks of healthy aging.
You know, loneliness is a real challenge for people, but
there's nothing better than being in the outdoors and being
able to engage with people. And that kind of brings
(13:23):
us to our conversation today. Tell me a little bit
about what mucket About is and how would you describe
it to our listeners who have maybe never heard of it.
Speaker 6 (13:35):
So it's a very new it's a nonprofit that's focused
on men's wellness, connection and support for whatever reason. You know,
it seems like there's a bit of a gap in
outlets for those types of things, places for people to
just kind of show up.
Speaker 3 (13:54):
I know, a lot of talk about like.
Speaker 6 (13:55):
You know you'll see anywhere on social media or between people.
It seems like there's kind of like the invisibility of
the third place now and it's this is meant to
be like a kind of a modern third place for
men and others, not just men, but the focus is
on men in Newfoundland to reduce isolation. So, you know,
(14:18):
in terms of life stresses in the economy, you know,
the political situation of the world, even just regular things
in everyday life, like you know, becoming a new parent,
of getting.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
A new job. That's kind of thing.
Speaker 6 (14:32):
Men oftentimes tend to suffer in silence, I guess is
a way to put it, but you know, tend to
keep their feelings and emotions kind of bottled up and
try to.
Speaker 3 (14:43):
Deal with them on their own.
Speaker 6 (14:44):
And this is meant to be like kind of a
safe space to you know, explore those different things in
a very casual way.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Yeah, that's right, and you know men can sometimes have
issues with vulnerability around mental health. I used to work
with a lot workforces that were male dominated, and that
is a challenge for men. And I was actually looking
at an organization in Tasmania and Australia that were these
shed groups that got together for retirement to give them
(15:13):
that sense of community whence they retired. And so when
I saw this pop up on the radar here locally,
I knew I had to reach out. You know, you
mentioned what it kind of inspired. It was the need
for this to exist. But was there a moment or
an experience that like sort of made this resonate with you,
especially where you've got such a good background when it
comes to the outdoors. Was there like an aha moment,
(15:35):
It's like I needed to do this.
Speaker 3 (15:37):
Not so much for me.
Speaker 6 (15:38):
But I do know that my fellow director, George Michelin,
both of us grew up like doing a lot of
outdoor activities and you know, experiencing different things with our
families that I guess a lot of other.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
People weren't exposed to.
Speaker 6 (15:51):
And you know, in that sense, I've always felt a
good connection to nature and being outside and how it
reduces your anxiety and and just kind of centers you
in a way that a lot of other experiences don't.
And I think growing up like that, it became like
kind of a gradual determination that this is something that
(16:14):
people need to experience.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
And we lose a lot of that in the.
Speaker 6 (16:18):
Fast paced, technological day to day that we live in,
and it's good for people to kind of just slow
down and take a moment and think about the things
that really matter to you in your life.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
I couldn't I couldn't agree more. I mean I think
about like, you know, there's chemicals the trees that help
us relax. There's a randomness to it that captures our attention,
there's a chance to get away, Like when you're in
the middle of the woods and you're ten kilometers out
or whatever, you have to get back too. See, you
can't just jump off that, So there's that forced duration.
Perhaps it's a good way to put it. So, you know,
(16:51):
so what's what's what's your overall mission with it? It
sounds like you're creating a place for community. You're creating
a place where people can feel safe to talk about
or engage with others that may be also facing new
challenges in life. Do you guys have a vision or
a mission as you guys begin to launch this initiative.
Speaker 6 (17:08):
Yeah, so realistically, our mission is to improve men's wellness
through connection, community and support.
Speaker 3 (17:16):
That's our main hope.
Speaker 6 (17:18):
And I guess the vision is that we will have
men and any other members.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
We're not just limited to men. I make that clear.
Speaker 6 (17:27):
Men are feeling healthier, connected, supported, and engaged and this
will help to build stronger communities through all of these things.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
Yeah, that's great, that's important caveat to make sure that
you know everybody is included, of course, But again, you
guys came from a standpoint looking at a specific challenge
within men's mental health. Are there any stats that exist
out there about how big of a challenge it is
for men or other populations that are facing social isolation
when it comes to mental health.
Speaker 6 (17:57):
Well, certainly there are, and obviously, especially in places that
are isolated, you can look at any number of statistic
suicide rates or higher mental health issues tend to be
more undiagnosed. These are things that again we're not an
organization looking to deal directly with these things, but we
(18:20):
are more looking to deal with root causes that can
address these issues indirectly, which will help everybody, not just
the individual themselves, with the wider community.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
And it's an opportunity to participate too, right, So quite
often people are told, oh, I need to be engaged.
You should get out of nature, you should get some
physical activities, spend more time with people. Sometimes they need
the organization to be able to make these things happen.
And I'm curious about this. This sounds really intriguing. What
kind of experiences or activities do you guys plan on
having that will bring people together.
Speaker 6 (18:55):
So we're open to many different ideas and it's really
just in the early stages, but we've talked a lot
about having focus on outdoor activities, so things like hikes,
sunrise walks, or gatherings in the park, even just a
place to connect and have a morning coffee.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
I know the many times on the way to.
Speaker 6 (19:16):
Work when I get a coffee, I see a group
of older gentlemen having a coffee in the same spot
every single morning, And you know, that just kind of,
you know, reiterates the importance of those spaces, in those
places to meet and to just talk about anything. So
right now, that's what we're going to focus on. And
eventually we hope to get into things more like skill
(19:39):
shares or workshops to focus on different things that people
might have issues with or barriers too. But what we
really want is just a place to meet that's casual,
welcoming and rooted in you know, local culture.
Speaker 3 (19:56):
For right now.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Well, I think that sort of also really lends itself
to the name. Right Like, when I think mucking about,
I don't think highly organized or rigid in any way.
I think when you're mucking about, you're just having a time.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
You're just having a time. You're going out for a
boil up.
Speaker 6 (20:12):
You know, you're seeing what you can see and seeing
where the day takes you kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
We're talking with Colin McClain about connection, community and wellness.
Stay with us because we'll be right back after the break.
Welcome back. I'm continuing my conversation with Colin McLean from
Mucking about exploring how grassroots groups can play a big
role in mental health and wellness. So you guys are
(20:40):
in your infancy, if you're coming up with your final
steps to launch the program, how are we going to
hear about it? How are we going to see what's
going to be to launch?
Speaker 6 (20:48):
So yeah, we're definitely in our early stages and we've
done all the initial legwork that you need to to
incorporate as a nonprofit and all that. So that's all
done mostly thanks to George. But our first events are
going to be small and local, and our first official
event will be on September twenty seventh, and it's going
(21:09):
to be a sunrise walk around Kitty Vid so you
can find all this information and I will share all
this about our website and our social media and that
you find all of that on those places. But it'll
just be a regular sunrise walk. You know hopefully that
you know, after these initial events, the growth will be gradual,
(21:31):
but you know through word of mouth people will if
they enjoy it, you know they can connect with other
people and have more people come.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
I have a six am crew that I go to
the gym with every morning, and having that sense of
community and place has always been really good. I remember
I used to live abroad and I would always create
consistent places where I could have familiar faces. And I
think not only for people that may be lonely here
or lacking that social interaction. I mean, do you hope
to be able to attract people that are new to
(22:02):
the community as well, people that are looking at forging
those relationships they may not have had from a lifetime.
Because I know you're from away as well, like I am.
Is that one of the audiences you're encouraging people to
reach out to.
Speaker 6 (22:13):
Absolutely, and we hope that as an organization we can
appeal to all generations and all walks of life. So
you could be, you know, an immigrant who just moved
here a month ago and looking for somewhere to connect
or to meet people, or you could have lived here
your entire life and you just don't have an outlet
for this sort of thing. But I think through a
(22:36):
lot of conversations that we've had too amongst ourselves and
with other friends and confidants. It's nice to have a
place that's not specific around an activity or so, like
you said, the gym, or I have a friend who's
very into squash or badminton or that sort of thing,
(22:56):
and you get the same idea of the sense of community,
but it is sort of around the activity, around the sport,
that kind of thing. So for some people who may
not have that kind of interest or for whatever reason,
just don't participate in those kinds of things, this is
kind of meant to be that place for you.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
I guess I love that, And I think when you
go for a walk, you can migrate between different groups
of people. If you're doing a boil up, everybody can
take different roles. And if you are in a structured
place like playing a sport or at the gym, you
tend to work out in your little groove and media
people is intentional. This way you're allowed to filter together
and be able to have experiences where you can move
(23:36):
from group to group. That makes a lot of sense.
Is that really what you hope people take away from
it when they when they come that they do something.
Number one is probably really good for them physically, mentally,
you know, emotionally, but secondly, faster those connections.
Speaker 3 (23:52):
Yeah, then you hit it. You hit the nail right
on the head.
Speaker 6 (23:54):
Like we're you're hoping that, you know, we're just kind
of hoping to foster a sense of belonging. Connection doesn't
have to be complicated. You can connect to somebody on
the bus sometimes, but through these outlets and in a
structured way, you can have stronger community ties, deeper friendships,
experience some fun and enjoyment without like the pressures of
(24:16):
everyday life sometimes because a lot of times were we
seem to have to plan out or fun and you
don't sometimes you don't really want to do that, Like
you just kind of want to go somewhere and have
a new experience and.
Speaker 3 (24:30):
Maybe meet somebody you might not have met otherwise.
Speaker 6 (24:32):
So that's kind of just what we're hoping and eventually
down the road perhaps lead into developing new skills, new interests,
new hobbies, that sort of thing. But really just a
low barrier, easy way.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
To meet people and connect.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
Yeah, well you just said it. There's two things that
really stand out to me for what you just said.
Number One, low barrier. Socioeconomic challenges are real cost of
living is up high right now. It sounds as though,
I mean, we'll just sort of tackle this one first,
but it sounds as though a lot of the activities
planning aren't going to have that financial barrier of the
key goal of disipating.
Speaker 6 (25:05):
Absolutely not. And you know, we're hoping that we will
have many different types of activities that will be a
very very low effort financially because, yes, everything costs money
these days, even sometimes going to the store, it will
cost you more money than you thought it would. Yeah,
but yeah, this is the type of thing that we're
(25:26):
hoping and you know, it's just something that obviously you
could enjoy doing these things on your own, but it's
always more fun sometimes when you have people to enjoy with.
Speaker 2 (25:34):
So another thing is even if you've beme part of
the community for a long time, and so I've encourage
people to think about while we're listening to this, is
that we have groups of friends that we've had maybe
for an entire lifetime, and when you meet these friends
in grade school, you may not have had the same
interests that you have now as an adult, and now
you've developed new ones you've always wanted to be outdoorsy
(25:55):
but never had the group of friends to be able
to participate with that, or you're looking to expand your
rison to meet new people because schedules aren't working with
some of your old friends. Is that Another thing that
you're thinking is that, like you know, when people have
a shared interest, there tends to be a natural connection
immediately just from having something in common.
Speaker 3 (26:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (26:13):
Absolutely, And like you said, you know, people grow and
develop in different ways, and you drift away from people
that you were close to.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
When you were younger. But yeah, even if somebody doesn't
think that they have.
Speaker 6 (26:25):
An interest in the outdoors or outdoor activities or that
kind of thing, they might grow to enjoy them if
they do them once or twice, you know, and maybe
they haven't even tried it. But yeah, that's the sort
of thing because oftentimes people will go into something with
the preconceived notions of what it's going to be about
or how you're going to feel about it, And we
(26:46):
kind of just want to remove those barriers in your
mind before you get into something, because you know, there's
no expectations here.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
You can come into it and not enjoy it and
never come back one.
Speaker 2 (27:02):
That's true. That's true, you're not. Yeah, it's not the
fraternity of any sort. And that's another thing. As a
wellness show, you know, this is the angle that we
always take with our programming, is what would you see
as a definition of wellness And how do you see
something like this actually improving somebody's well being even long
after they've finished a tending year event.
Speaker 3 (27:24):
Well.
Speaker 6 (27:24):
I think wellness in terms of like I work in
the healthcare psychological space. Let's say I work with adults
with autism, and I think wellness in terms of how
people usually view it as physical. Obviously, you know, physically healthy,
(27:44):
physically fit, but a lot of times your physical and
mental health are so integrated that you don't even realize
one is affecting the other.
Speaker 3 (27:53):
So I think just the ability to be able to.
Speaker 6 (27:58):
You know, have a place to either talk about your
problems or issues or whatever's going on in your life,
you'll build stronger connections to people. And in that sense,
maybe by doing something physically demanding or you know, physical
in some way, but you will build a stronger mental
(28:20):
psychological outlook, I think, and that will translate to your
entire your entire life.
Speaker 3 (28:27):
So yeah, just for.
Speaker 6 (28:29):
Me, you know, wellness is being happy and content in
your mental and physical of state, and just being able
to deal with life's challenges as they come around kind
of thing.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 3 (28:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:42):
And I feel like you know, when you look at
the outdoors in particular, and the fact that we have
unlimited nature around us, especially if you know how to
navigate it properly.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
We live in a we live in a very a
very nice place for that absolutely.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
I think, I think probably the best in the world.
Speaker 6 (28:57):
To be honest with you, united even I would agree
with you, I would agree with you.
Speaker 3 (29:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:01):
No, it's seriously dangerous animals and not many ticks things
like that. Even on that side. But I think about myself.
If I have a nice weekend where I get a
chance to get out, go for a beautiful hike, maybe
camp or or go out of the beach and have
a fire or whatever it is, that can carry with
me for the entire week. It's like a recharge sometimes
even you know, we'll go down by the water and
(29:21):
have dinner, just myself, my wife because we live not
too far from the coast, just like most people and
new Fromlanta, Labrador. How do you think that's going to
be able to translate to stress management for people throughout
the week when they have those little doses of vitamin
n as Ta Laffler, My friend says, Vitamin nature.
Speaker 3 (29:40):
Vitamin nature.
Speaker 6 (29:41):
Yeah, yeah, I think you know well, like I know,
I feel the same way whenever I get to do
something not necessarily social, because I do consider myself an introvert,
so I like to do things on my own sometimes,
but just being able to go out and have an experience,
you're you're gonna feel better at work. You're gonna feel
(30:04):
better approaching deadlines or school or anything like that.
Speaker 3 (30:08):
You really.
Speaker 6 (30:11):
Get to the point where sometimes you feel burnt out
and you don't really know how to tackle that feeling.
Speaker 3 (30:17):
I know a lot of people don't.
Speaker 6 (30:19):
So something like this will get you out of your
comfort zone a little bit and it'll help you. Just
like you said, recharge, recharge the batteries.
Speaker 3 (30:28):
So I think people will feel more relaxed.
Speaker 6 (30:32):
You can, you know, laugh a little bit, and just
small everyday things will seem a little bit easier.
Speaker 3 (30:38):
I think after something like this.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
We're talking with Colin McClain about connection, community and wellness.
Stay with us because we'll be right back after the break.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
You're listening to what we broadcast of the Wellness and
Healthy Lifestyle Show with doctor Mike Wall. Listen live Thursday
nights at seven pm and Sunday's at four pm.
Speaker 2 (30:59):
Welcome back. I'm continuing my conversation with Colin MacLean from
muck And about exploring how grassroots groups can play a
big role in mental health and wellness. Well, yeah, and
I think you said something too that's really really important
is when there's an organization like yours that's handling the
safety side of things, that how to the making sure
that people aren't limited by the fact that I don't
(31:19):
feel comfortable in the woods or I've never been in
the woods before. I'm not an outdoors person. I was
never raised that way. That's a barrier I think for
people to get out in nature, because they might feel
intimidated by nature. How are you guys going to plan
your events? I know obviously the walker, right Katy Vidi
is one, but say you guys do something a little
bit more intensive in nature, How are you guys going
(31:40):
to be able to circumvent that apprehension that people may
have participating?
Speaker 3 (31:45):
Yeah, So I.
Speaker 6 (31:48):
Want to make it clear too, that we're we're open
to all walks of life, you know, in terms of
like disabilities or anything like that. Especially with our first activity,
Vitty like, it's a very approachable trail, it's very well maintained.
If you're perhaps in a wheelchair or something like that,
is very easy to get around. But we're going to
(32:11):
have a lot of activities with those things in mind,
and we just wanted people to know that, you know,
if you're not comfortable doing something, you can absolutely reach
out and let us know and we'll take that into
account for future events and activities and that sort of thing.
Speaker 3 (32:26):
But again, like we're in our.
Speaker 6 (32:28):
Initial stages, so we've yet to have these issues pop
up kind of thing. Yeah, but we want to make
it accessible for everybody. We don't want anybody to feel
left out or not included in any way. So we
will take all these things into account going forward.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
Yeah, okay, So that's that's great, And you know, obviously
this is coming from a place, like I said, I thought,
I've seen a few examples of different organizations that have
brought people together and made a big difference in their
social health. Have you seen some examples of this in
your own life? Where this approach has actually impacted somebody
quite significantly.
Speaker 6 (33:10):
Yeah, well, I would say myself, I like, you know
yourself is the best example. I guess when I was younger,
in my early twenties, when I first moved here, I
found it quite difficult because it was isolating. I'd moved
away from my friends that I grew up around, and
(33:31):
I was in a new place where I've made new friends,
and I have made friends that I would consider lifelong
friends now, but there were quite a lot of times,
and you know, in university and after university when it
was a very isolating experiences, and I've dealt with anxiety
and depression and all of that stuff, and obviously, you know,
the the outlets for that are are can be few
(33:55):
and far between sometimes, especially if you don't know where
to look. So I think in the sense that when
I met my wife now at the time, she really
helped me to find outlets and places to discuss these
issues with people. And I think just having somebody to say, hey,
(34:17):
I'm going through this, I need I like, I don't
really know what to do. And if somebody has life
experience where they can you point you in the right direction,
that's kind of what we're hoping to achieve here because
everybody has different life experiences, Everyone goes through different things
wherever they are, and oftentimes people just don't talk about
(34:39):
that or they don't feel safe enough to talk about that.
So the ability to do that and to have a
space where you can ask somebody question and they could
point you in the right direction, that's kind of what
we're hoping for.
Speaker 3 (34:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Yeah, peer support is such a powerful tool for mental health.
As you would know as a mental health practitioner yourself,
that plays a big role. And also we also know
that there's lots of other groups and organizations and societies
out there that also specialize this type of stuff. Are
you looking to potentially partner with different groups as you
(35:14):
continue to number one, maybe address a specific audience or
engage their participants, but also have that expertise as part
of your toolbox.
Speaker 6 (35:24):
Yeah, I think we're definitely open to different partnerships because,
like we said, we're purely a nonprofit group looking to
get together with people. We don't want to claim to
be mental health professionals, like in the sense of therapists
or psychologists or psychiatrists.
Speaker 3 (35:45):
Or anything like that.
Speaker 6 (35:46):
But if we can have partnerships with different groups or
communities that can address those needs. We will certainly be
open to those different things, and we have looked into
it and talked about different groups that are available just
locally here. But we want to complement the supports that
(36:10):
are around and we don't want to duplicate anything, but
we do want to be able to partner with groups
that have the same sort of vision that we do
that want to focus on men's mental health and building
stronger communities type thing.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
So that's great, That's fantastic. So let's pull a crystal
ball out for a second. Okay, you're just starting, you're
just starting on that road, but you're going to be
working your way down and moving forward. Where do you
guys see yourself in five years? What's the hopes?
Speaker 6 (36:42):
Yeah, so obviously the grand vision would hopefully we would
be a recognized hub for men's wellness in Newfoundland. We
would hope to have some sustainable programs that reach across
the province. Right now, we're obviously in the metro area
and say John's, but we do want to expand into
(37:03):
a rural areas which obviously a lot of supports and
groups are not available mostly because there's not enough people.
But if you can get something that's sustainable to reach
into these smaller communities, you can address the needs that
are there and hopefully in five years we can expand
into Atlantic Canada. And yeah, that would be our ideal vision.
Speaker 3 (37:28):
I suppose.
Speaker 2 (37:29):
Well, that's a great mission, and I think that's an
important mission. It's really nice when people are looking at
something very specific, especially something that requires our attention, in
particular around mental health. As people are curious in finding
out more, they want to know about the events, how
do they get a hold of you? You guys have social media,
you have a website. How are we going to be
able to keep up to everything mucking About is doing?
Speaker 6 (37:51):
Yeah, so if anybody is interested, you can find us
on Facebook and Instagram just search for mucking About in corporate.
Speaker 3 (38:01):
And we also have a website, mucking About twenty twenty five.
Speaker 6 (38:06):
Dot wixsite that's wixsiite dot com and it has all
our information. You know, people can attend our events without
being members of our organization. So if you just want
to learn more, you can always come.
Speaker 3 (38:21):
To an event.
Speaker 6 (38:23):
But if you'd like to be a member, there's links
on our website that you can go to and fill
out a form and see what it's about. Kind of
thing that's fantastic.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
Well, I just want to say thank you so much
for sharing all your expertise with us today. It was
a really interesting conversation and I wish you all the
best of luck. I know it's going to be something
going to be really appealing to a lot of our
audience and something that we definitely need here in our communities.
Thanks so much for joining me, Calin.
Speaker 6 (38:49):
Well, thank you, Mike, and I really appreciate what you're
doing for the wellness space with your podcasts and stuff,
and this was great.
Speaker 3 (38:55):
I had a really good time.
Speaker 2 (38:56):
Good I'm sure there'll be lots more in your future,
so I'm glad to be one of the first.
Speaker 3 (39:00):
Excellent.
Speaker 6 (39:01):
Thank you, Thank ere you too, Bye bye.
Speaker 2 (39:04):
Well that's our show. This week. We began our chat
with doctor Hassan Khlilli, who reminded us that mental health
challenges like loneliness and isolation affect people everywhere, across all genders,
ages and backgrounds. And then we heard from Colin MacLean
about Mucking About, an inclusive grassroots effort to create safe,
low barrier spaces where people can come together, talk and
(39:25):
support each other. The takeaway is simple. We all need connection.
Whether you have challenges connecting with others, expressing your emotions,
or navigating life stresses, there are safe spaces where we
can share, belong, and grow well. That's our episode this week.
I'm your host, doctor Mike Wall. We'll see you back
here and next week for another episode of the Wellness
(39:45):
and Healthy Lifestyle Show on the Stingray Podcast Network and
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