Adele Parks MBE: 25 Novels in 25 Years & Our Beautiful Mess.

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello, and welcome to the Writing Community Chat Show. Hey everybody,
and welcome to Friday Night. The Writing Community Chat Show
is here, and we hope you've had a fantastic week.
Thank you for those tuning in. If you're watching this

(00:21):
back or listening back, thank you for doing that. Please
get stuck into the comments if you're watching live, that's
what it's there for. Engage with each other at the
community and ask you questions to our guest, which is
going to be very exciting to get our guests back
on tonight and chat about what's just been released. Chris,
how are you doing? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (00:39):
Good, I mean, it's been a crazy day. Obviously, we've
done one massive interview which you can't say who it is,
but it's been released on the eleventh of September, So
keep your eyes and ears peals for that because yeah,
guest fribe, who knew that was a thing?

Speaker 1 (00:57):
Say again? Guess what?

Speaker 2 (00:58):
Guest fright?

Speaker 1 (01:00):
Oh yes, yes, right, yes, I had sweaty hands. I'm
not gonna lie. Yeah, it's been it's been a busy.
We've actually this is the fourth show that we've conducted
this week, and it's amazing to do that. Even though
you know we're busy people, but we've got them in
there and we've got some great interviews that are there
will they're posting around, so keep an eye out and

(01:20):
subscribe for more. Definitely do that. And here is in
the chat, Hello to you. Hope you've had a good week. Yes,
and as we mentioned before, Chris has had a little
injury playing football because he's getting old and he shouldn't be.
And yes, it's been it's been a helpful.

Speaker 2 (01:36):
How are you feeling now, Yeah, I'm still nervous, to
be honest, because he's are two really big guests, like
you know when you knock it out of the park
and you get like best sellers and you know, legends
say too much without giving it away. But I was
really nervous before and I'm equally as nervous now.

Speaker 1 (01:54):
So well you shouldn't because tonight's guest is wonderful. We've
had her on before and she's amazing to talk to,
a great person. So yeah, we'll get stuck into that
interview very shortly. Yes, Writing wise again, so busy with
the shows. The new project is not working very quickly
at the moment. What about yourself have you been writing?

Speaker 2 (02:16):
I've done a couple of poemes this week, and that's
all I can say. On the right in front. Yeah,
I've been looking at serialite novels on substack. Yeah, quite
like the idea of that, and I said, which everyone
gets the most engagement is the one that I'll invest
my time and efforts into. So yeah, I'm trying with
the idea of doing that, but no one wants here what.

Speaker 1 (02:38):
I'm just Yeah, substack is quite an amazing platform that
we've been getting into, and we were talking about on
the After Show the other week how people are using
it to drip feed their chapters in the work in progress,
almost getting that early access out there for people. So
I think that's a really intriguing concept and it's obviously
working well for people. So yeah, I'll see. I'd like

(02:59):
to see how that developed moving forward, and if a
lot more authors do take that up.

Speaker 2 (03:04):
Do you have any recaps Chris Off Tonight's guest.

Speaker 1 (03:08):
I do, but I need to wait till the guest
is on because I want to ask her a question
based on that clip. So with that in mind, let
me introduce tonight's guest and everybody, like I said, please
use the chat to get some comments in there about
the conversation and to leave questions. So tonight we are
joined by one of the UK's most celebrated and successful novelists. Incredibly,

(03:29):
she has published twenty five novels in twenty five years,
selling over five million copies and being translated into thirty
one languages. Her Sunday Times number one best sellers Lies, Lies,
Lies and Just My Luck. We're shortlisted for the British
Book Awards. The Image of You has just been released
as a major motion movie, and she has several other

(03:50):
titles optioned and in development. She's earned countless honors, including
an MBE for services to literature, and has written for
major newspapers and magazines. Yes So They saw the release
of a twenty fifth novel, Our Beautiful Mess at the Side,
a tense, emotional and utterly gripping family drama. The book
revisits Connie, the heroine of Adele's very first book, Playing Away,

(04:12):
exploring secrets, motherhood and fierce love. She's also an ambassador
for the National Literacy Trust and the reading agency Champion
Literacy across the UK. Please give a huge welcome to
the brilliant, to the unstoppable Adele Parks. Hello, Adele, Hello, welcome.

Speaker 3 (04:34):
I'm just embarrassed now that I've done that because that
will be the screen grab that everybody saw.

Speaker 1 (04:40):
And I don't know if you noticed, there was an
applause in there very quietly when you came in. It
was play again, can you hear it? You can? It's
okay because last time you said you cheered yourself, which
was amazing because we didn't have an applause. So yes,
there you go.

Speaker 4 (04:58):
So I just cheered.

Speaker 3 (05:00):
I just cheer after those those introductions because I think,
oh god, you put loads of research into it.

Speaker 4 (05:05):
So I'm like cheering. You really getting research?

Speaker 3 (05:08):
Right?

Speaker 1 (05:08):
How are you doing?

Speaker 4 (05:10):
Yeah? Really good?

Speaker 3 (05:11):
As you say, a book came out yesterday, it's all
been a bit of a whirlwind.

Speaker 4 (05:16):
Normally I bring a book.

Speaker 3 (05:17):
Not normally, but the last few years I've brought books
out in early July, so this is a bit different.
Bring out the end of August. But I asked for
on purpose, to give myself a bit more of a summer.
What I didn't understand is that is not what happens.
All that happens is you sort of pull out the
length of the run up.

Speaker 4 (05:36):
And so now that it's finally out. I'm like few,
it's out.

Speaker 3 (05:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (05:40):
Well, in mind, last time I interviewed you, it was
the day after a book release, and this is what
I asked you, So I'm going to ask you a
similar questions straight after it. Please welcome Adele Parks.

Speaker 3 (05:51):
Yay, hell, because, like you know, normally you'd hear something.

Speaker 4 (05:56):
So I'm just along.

Speaker 1 (06:00):
We must get some sound effects in for the next
next announcement. Welcome to the show, and I'm very happy
that you're here and we're very grateful. How is Adele Parks?
Is there a hangover today?

Speaker 4 (06:11):
There is a bit?

Speaker 1 (06:15):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 (06:17):
I love the fact you did actually get the sound effected.

Speaker 1 (06:20):
So there's my question based on the fact the last
time you came on the show it was the day
after a book release. Both of you came out and
our Beautiful Mess came out yesterday. So again, is there
a hangover today?

Speaker 4 (06:31):
No? And you can have an exclusive. You can have
an exclusive. The reason is that there isn't a hangover
is I've given up drink.

Speaker 1 (06:39):
Wow, I know, I.

Speaker 3 (06:41):
Know it's obviously holding me back socially because you know,
look at me, I'm so shy and retiring. What can
you do? Yes, I'm not drinking anymore. So yeah, that's
so interesting because I was listening and listening to it
and thinking, oh, yeah, hangovers, they used to be really
miserable and I don't have them.

Speaker 4 (07:00):
I sleep a bit better. But yeah, so interesting.

Speaker 3 (07:04):
But no, yesterday it was celebrated with are you like
said brands you like? So there's this non alcoholic thing
or delcoholized who.

Speaker 4 (07:14):
Knew that even as a thing.

Speaker 3 (07:15):
So they make alcohol and they go through all the
process and all and then they take alcohol out, which
just seems as crying shame, but it makes it taste
closer to real alcohol, and it makes it smell like alcohol.
And I drink one called naughty but like not as
in the number. And that's what I celebrated with us yesterday.
My naughty I am and I am alcohol hangover free.

Speaker 1 (07:40):
Yes, and we've got a healthier adele on this show.

Speaker 3 (07:43):
And I don't think I've ever told like, I don't
think that's come out in an interview yet, so you
haven't exclusive.

Speaker 1 (07:48):
Yeah, well thank you for that. So yeah, how has
the launch been there celebration?

Speaker 3 (07:54):
Yeah, yes, there's a bit of lots of stuff really,
so sort of started on Wednesday, I went into the
off of the office, my publishing office, and they have
what they call a moment for me.

Speaker 4 (08:08):
Which is adorable.

Speaker 3 (08:08):
It's like everybody in the office, everybody who works in
the publishing not just on my team but on everybody
in HQ get together and we have a breakfast or
it might be a lunch or whatever, but they do
because it was breakfast. We had questants and we had
you know, fruit juice, and the ones who were drinking
could have a book space, and we have a little
speech and some balloons and all that, and that was lovely.

(08:29):
You can see that all on my social media. And
then I rushed off to an independent bookseller called Goldsborough
and signed five hundred and fifty books.

Speaker 4 (08:40):
Wow. Again you can see that on my socials, which
is really funny because halfway.

Speaker 3 (08:45):
Through I went, you know, this would have been really
good as a time lapse, so we started the time
lapse halfway through. It's also still quite long. So I
did that. Then came home Wednesday night, I had an event. Thursday,
I did a lunch, so I went out with my husband,
had lunch just really pleasant, really nice.

Speaker 4 (09:07):
Came home on a first I was on TV.

Speaker 3 (09:10):
Missed It got up at four thirty because I was
on breakfast TV Good Morning Britain.

Speaker 4 (09:15):
Really ridiculous debate. Don't want me.

Speaker 1 (09:19):
Just talk the world.

Speaker 3 (09:20):
But in a way I think it's ridiculous because I
think there's a clear winner. I'll put it to you
lads and you can tell me what you think. Should
people marry for love or money? No, obviously, which is
why I think it is a ridiculous debate. So I
went on and sort of there was a lawyer and
she was all like, oh, it's all about your assets
and I was like, oh, my main asset is my heart.

Speaker 4 (09:41):
You can't buy my time, you know. So so that
was good. So I'd got up at four thirty in
the morning, done that.

Speaker 3 (09:48):
Then I had my lunch to gym and then I
came home and I have to say I was really spoiled.
Flowers were arriving, presents were arriving, lots of messages.

Speaker 4 (09:56):
It was adorable. Today I went up to Manchester deal
recording radio recording.

Speaker 3 (10:02):
Next week I am going to be in swindon a event.
I'm going to be in Wales for an event. I'm
going to be up in Liverpool for an event. And
then I'm going to Canada. Yes, it's really straightforward.

Speaker 1 (10:14):
Yeah, not going on. I'm really interested to know how
long it would take to sign that many books, five
hundred and fifty books.

Speaker 3 (10:21):
It didn't tell me that long. I have got the
world's quicker signature. I could demo it for you right now. Well,
I literally only do my first name. And there's a
story behind that. So we back when in twenty five
years ago. So we've now established twenty five books. Twenty
five years I went out and in those days, they
would send you with a sales rep to the shops

(10:41):
to sort of sign books and things. And I signed
a book and this sales repe I leaned over my
signature and went, Adele, is that your check signature? Because
in those days people still text. And I was like, yeah,
it kind of is. And he went, yeah, that's not
going to work. If for the rest of your life
you're signing these books, you can't sign it with your
check signature. And he said to me, haven't you been

(11:03):
practicing your signature all kind of would you have to
be to sit around and practice your signatures?

Speaker 4 (11:11):
I was like no, and he went.

Speaker 3 (11:13):
Right, well, you need to this ridiculous Adele and lost
confidence and just stopped and went, oh, that's it.

Speaker 1 (11:22):
Now.

Speaker 4 (11:22):
That was way before the.

Speaker 3 (11:24):
Adele came out, and I was like, oh, that's really confusing,
because now I have to go around going yeah, I
know I only said Adele, I was either adele, but anyway,
it's quite It took me.

Speaker 4 (11:36):
Back two hours.

Speaker 1 (11:38):
Yeah, you've got the adele now just for that well, yeah, the.

Speaker 4 (11:41):
Og but I think probably the one a bit bigger.

Speaker 1 (11:45):
Just saying not in the writing world.

Speaker 4 (11:48):
Thank you, Let's get songwriting.

Speaker 1 (11:50):
Songwriting, we prefer you so, thank you, brilliant. Yeah. So,
twenty five years, twenty five best sellers, the question clearly
has to be was that ever an expectation in your
mind or even the dream that twenty five best sellers
would happen?

Speaker 4 (12:11):
Honestly?

Speaker 3 (12:12):
No, I mean I think most writers we all just
write the next book, don't we. You just write a
book fingers crossed, You do that book, then you get
another idea, you write another book. What happened is I
had written a book while I was still working, and
then that got published. But as everybody knows or many
people know, it takes almost well it takes a year

(12:32):
in traditional publishing to get a book from the day
at the author hands into getting it on the shelves.
So in that year I wrote my second book and
then they were ready with that. So they were like, oh,
have you got third? I was like, yeah, I have,
and they said my publisher, my editor at the time,
she said, oh, Adell, your aim should be to become
that person that everybody waits for on their holidays, and

(12:54):
that's that they take.

Speaker 4 (12:55):
That book on their holidays.

Speaker 3 (12:57):
And I just thought, well, I have zero strategy life,
so I'll take that strategy that will that will suit me.
So I just did it, and I I love what
I do. I am so lucky. I am so lucky
to be paid to do what I want to do.
So for me, it's not really it's not what people.

Speaker 4 (13:18):
Say, is it stress? Is it pressure? I'm like, no,
it's a joy.

Speaker 3 (13:21):
I'm lucky. Obviously there are stressful times. Obviously there are pressure.

Speaker 4 (13:24):
I had times. Obviously there are times when I lose confidence.

Speaker 3 (13:27):
But on the whole, I can write a book a year,
and I am so lucky that somebody out there, actually
millions of lovely people out there who woul buy my books,
are allowing that to happen.

Speaker 1 (13:37):
So I'm going to ask that, do you still get
nervous after you know, releasing say this book.

Speaker 3 (13:44):
Well, it's a big different so my nerves come at
a different point. My nerves usually come two thirds of
the way into writing the book, and two thirds of
the way into writing the book.

Speaker 4 (13:56):
There will be and you can almost time it in
our household.

Speaker 3 (13:58):
Now, there will be a little bit of the meltdown
where I am convinced this is the book that I've
lost it. All the others were great, but this one's not,
and everyone's going to find out or if I'm really
in a bad mood, all of them were rubbish and
this one is when they're going to go, yeah, they
were all rubbish and you're a fraud. And I my

(14:19):
husband now sort of goes, yeah, you said that last year,
he said a few years ago.

Speaker 4 (14:24):
He said you said that.

Speaker 3 (14:24):
Last year, and I was like, no, no, I couldn't
have done No you did. And then the next year
I did it again. He went, no, you said that
last year. Look, I've marked in my diary, and he
literally marked it in his diary, going Adele has melt down.

Speaker 4 (14:36):
About her book.

Speaker 1 (14:36):
And I was like, oh wow, and.

Speaker 3 (14:38):
He said, don't know, if you remember rightly, that went
on to be best seller. I was like, okay, he said,
so just go back to your desk and crack on.
And that's kind of it. You just have to crack on.

Speaker 4 (14:48):
And you know, there are many many.

Speaker 3 (14:50):
Occasions when I do lose my confidence like that two
thirds of the way through. I think, two thirds of
the way through a book, you sort of feel too
far to abandon it, but the end doesn't seem to
be around the corner. But now, by the time I
get to the end, I know I've tightened it. I
know I've got the plot, I know I've got my twists,

(15:13):
I hoop, I've developed my characters. So by the time
I'm bringing it to the table I giving it to
my publishing hands, I'm pretty confident. But and any author
who doesn't admit this is telling you fibbs.

Speaker 4 (15:28):
There are still loads of hoops to.

Speaker 3 (15:30):
Jump through because those still well, when will it be published?
What if the day it's published there is a snowstorm
and no one can get out, or what it the
you know it's published, but the distribution breaks down, and
you know, all there's big sort of I don't know,

(15:50):
price of petrol, goes up and so there's a big
shortage and people don't I mean, all these things have
happened to me, honestly, that's why I'm listening to. People
don't get the books out of warehouse quick enough and
you miss your slots, or they didn't get the marketing
printed for whatever supermarket where you had your biggest promotion
that was going to crack you through the charts, and
the marketing just didn't turn up. So your books were there,

(16:11):
but there was no marketing and nobody knew it was
a good price. And all of those things have happened
to me. So it's never, never straightforward. So when the
book comes out, there are still things you're kind of
crossing your fingers, wondering if it can go wrong. But
it's not your problem then that's someone else's. All of
the author can do is write the book.

Speaker 1 (16:32):
I just got the side track.

Speaker 3 (16:34):
What if zombie aliens descend and cause Malachy and.

Speaker 1 (16:39):
And amk ye.

Speaker 4 (16:43):
I don't know what a means.

Speaker 3 (16:46):
I liked you what it means because of the context,
but anyway, and you're completely right, that is the kind
of thing I stay open the middle of the night
and worry about.

Speaker 4 (16:54):
Zombie amazing.

Speaker 1 (16:55):
The guest that we interviewed earlier that obviously we can't
yet very successful, and I referenced Mark Billingham, who came
on the show No John Niven I believe many moons ago,
and said that even he gets that whole procrastination feeling,
and it seems to affect everybody that's in the creative world.

(17:16):
So I think it's not specific to anybody. I think
we all going to go through that process.

Speaker 3 (17:21):
Honestly, if you don't, you're not doing your job. Would
be nervous about what you're writing. You should be challenging yourself.
You should be thinking is this the best stuff I
can possibly write? Because if it's not, you have no
right to ask people to invest their time in it
or their money in it, in my opinion.

Speaker 4 (17:39):
So I'm alright with having the nerves. I think the
day I become.

Speaker 3 (17:44):
So arrogant that I think I don't have to be nervous,
then that is the day I should stop writing.

Speaker 2 (17:48):
Yeah, I was going to say, can you take us
through the protest of Obviously a book comes out and
then you've got a year between the next one. What's
your day to day like in terms of the actual
writing pros and like, how long roughly does it take
you to write a book?

Speaker 3 (18:04):
It roughly takes me about eight months, So I can
do the exact process from now on in because I
have just delivered Book twenty six, so I've delivered that book.
I normally deliver sort of end of August September ish,
so I delivered the book, and then between now and Christmas,

(18:26):
I will probably have three or maybe four ideas that
I will play with, and a bit like you were saying, Chris,
where you were saying, like, how do you know which
one should you invest your time in and put the
energy behind, because it is a lot of time and energy.
I will start playing with those ideas and asking what if,
what next? What if what next? I'll start thinking about
my characterizations. Something will drop within a few days. Something

(18:50):
I'll go, oh, that's a novella. That's a short story
that is not a novel, and then something I might
have two that stick around. I might have three, but
two or three ideas stick around, and I start playing
with them and I might start.

Speaker 4 (19:02):
Drafting them out.

Speaker 3 (19:05):
After Christmas is when I have picked and I get
down to it, and then kind of Monday to Friday,
I write one to two. And also in between now
and Christmas, there's loads of events because that's just the
way the sort of world works. There's a lot of
October festivals, and you know, in November I tend to

(19:26):
do lots of charity events because they tend to be
run up to Christmas and there's that kind of thing,
and then so it's not kind of promotion. And at
the same time, because I'm often doing long journeys, I
can be thinking about the pots. Then between sort of
January onwards, I really put the shift in and I
write one to two thousand words every single day. And

(19:46):
if I never allow myself to write less than one thousand,
and if I cut, I still need to go up
by one thousand. Some days have great days, and I
write two thousand words in an hour of maybe two hours,
and then I stop. It's the minute I notice, oh,
I've done two thousand words, I might write you done.
I used to put it on, but I found my

(20:08):
natural rhythm. I might do two thousand words and two
hours amazingly well and think, oh, I might as well
keep going because I'm having a good day, and then
can't write anything else that is that is how much
I can write. So I stop, so I can give
myself the chance of going, Okay, you've done a day's work,
now you're fine, and then I, you know, I'm still busy.
I've got loads of social media. I always interact with

(20:30):
anyone who leaves a comment. I try and comment back bloggers.
I have total respect for people that spend their time
investing in, you know, promoting books. Not my books, anybody's books.
It's important. It's our industry, it's our community. That's what
you guys are all about. And I totally believe in it.
So I might spend some time doing that kind of

(20:50):
thing instead, and then the next day back at it.
And then if you do that, if you do the
one to two thousand words for roughly six to eight months,
even if you're cutting agressively as you go along, you
will have a novel. You'll have one hundred thousand words
at the end of it. And then I well, I
actually read it aloud to my husband at three points,

(21:12):
at thirty thousand words, to just check I've still got
a plot.

Speaker 4 (21:17):
It's still a good idea.

Speaker 3 (21:18):
When he hears it is it's something he would want to
pick up and carry on reading it's sixty thousand words
because I'm losing my mind as we've discussed. And then
at the end of it and I read them aloud.
Because he's a really transparent human being, I'm soty, like
his face going yeah, as eye rolling, looking around, sort

(21:40):
of thinking about the cobwebs in the house, you know
that kind of thing, and I'm like, yeah, okay, time to.

Speaker 4 (21:44):
Cut, cut cut, that's not good.

Speaker 3 (21:46):
Or other times he's properly emotionally moved, he's excited. I
might be getting horse reading it and he's like, no, I
need to know what happens.

Speaker 4 (21:53):
Carry on. So then I know I'm until winner.

Speaker 3 (21:58):
And then when i've read it him, which usually sort
of like July August, I'll sit on it for a
while before I hand it in because sometimes nearly always
i'll think of something that I think it needs, add
a little final sprinkle.

Speaker 4 (22:16):
Then I'll hand it in.

Speaker 3 (22:18):
Then i'll launch my own launch, you know, whatever's current,
and then yeah, the process starts again.

Speaker 4 (22:24):
I'm back. I'm on the trail.

Speaker 3 (22:25):
I'm doing the promo of the one that's before, and
I wait to see what they come back and say,
and then yeah, so that's my process pretty pinned down,
you know, I mean twenty five years. If I didn't
have this pindown now you'd be wondering why.

Speaker 1 (22:42):
So, how do you think the industry has changed them
from obviously writing your first novel to where you are now?
It's obviously it's a long time and technology and everything's
improved massively everything. So how has that changed for you?

Speaker 4 (22:57):
There's loads of stuff that's changed. I mean hundreds of them.

Speaker 3 (23:01):
Okay, at the beginning, I would do a lot more
on the ground research, a lot more because there wasn't
sort of Google Maps to take you around a city
or a town. You'd have to go and visit there,
sitting in town and walk the streets. Now, I actually
think that was significantly more pleasant, and I try and
stick to that whenever I can, and only use Google
Maps to sort.

Speaker 4 (23:22):
Of check back. Is that right?

Speaker 1 (23:24):
Was there?

Speaker 4 (23:24):
Apart? Could she my character walk through that? You know,
that sort of thing.

Speaker 3 (23:29):
But on the other hand, the fact that if I
want to research, I don't know, when I wrote one
last Secret, I wanted to research ladies of negotiable affection.
Let's go with that, so you know, high end escorts
and I don't know how I would have found them
pre internet days, but now I can just google escorts
near me, find them, reach out, say I will pay

(23:52):
you not.

Speaker 4 (23:52):
To have sex with me, but to talk about.

Speaker 3 (23:56):
Talk about your career with me, and that could happen.
You know, that wouldn't happen twenty five years ago. Lots
of other different things, or ebooks, you know, that wasn't
a thing.

Speaker 4 (24:08):
It was only about the physical books.

Speaker 3 (24:10):
I would say, I now ebooks or audio books as
about twenty percent of my market. What I sell through
physical copies isn't really as important to me anymore. It's
important to the charts because Sunday Times chart, which is
seen as the chart, only track physical copies.

Speaker 4 (24:28):
How weird qashioned does that. But I think the biggest
and most important thing to.

Speaker 3 (24:33):
Me, and I love this change that's happened, is we're
all much more accessible. So writers used to be in
their little ivory tower, and you'd meet them maybe three
times a year. They would be sort of rolled out
to one festival or another and they'd do their talk
and then they'd be rolled back to their ivory tower,
and it was pretty lonely existence. Actually, Luckily for me

(24:56):
when the times were like that. I had a very
young child, So you have other social commitments and things.

Speaker 4 (25:02):
You're busy anyway.

Speaker 3 (25:03):
But I think now I am in contact with my
readers literally every few minutes if I want to be,
because I'm I keep talking about.

Speaker 4 (25:14):
It, but I'm on the socials. I'm questions back and forwards.

Speaker 3 (25:17):
People tell me what they've ordered, they send me their
pre order confirmations, they send me pictures of their cat
next to my books.

Speaker 4 (25:23):
You know.

Speaker 3 (25:24):
They tell me what they think of, you know, page
X and their jaw dropping or whatever, and.

Speaker 4 (25:29):
It's just lovely.

Speaker 3 (25:31):
It's a much more equitable fee field. It's not so
much to them in ours. There's a shift in what
people think is publishing because publishing very much used to
be traditional publishing, and if you self published it used
to be called vanity publishing. Everyone knows that's nonsense. Now
there's a lot of self publishing that's hugely respected. It

(25:54):
actually is a huge pool for the traditional publishers to
try and find new talent and snatched to their pool.
Some go, some don't, so there's all sorts of different things.
It's busier. I think it's hard to work. I think
it's more competitive.

Speaker 4 (26:14):
I think there are many, many, many, many.

Speaker 3 (26:17):
More people published, but they're perhaps given a much shorter
window to become successful.

Speaker 4 (26:24):
So that's a bit of a double edged sword.

Speaker 3 (26:26):
You've more chance of getting published, but you have less
chance of being supported for any length of time in
my opinion.

Speaker 1 (26:33):
Yeah, so there's a lot. Was there a time where
you contacted sex worker and interviewed them?

Speaker 4 (26:41):
No, I genuinely did so for one last secret.

Speaker 3 (26:45):
My character is a sex worker, and I thought, what
keeps those women safe? You know, how does the day
actually work? How do they get the money? Is it
bank transfer?

Speaker 4 (26:55):
What is it? Is this still a madam?

Speaker 3 (26:57):
You know? Somebody controlling it? What keeps them safe? What
keeps them sane? And what keeps their sense of humor?
If they have one they might not?

Speaker 1 (27:06):
And what was the most surprising factor? You learned?

Speaker 4 (27:09):
They're just normal women?

Speaker 1 (27:11):
The three?

Speaker 3 (27:12):
So I met up with three women. I don't think
anybody really chooses this as a career if you have
a lot of options, but I'm not saying nobody would,
but just that the three I talked to, you can
sort of see how their lives were presented that it
became the option which was useful research for my book,
because I obviously wanted you to stay invested in her

(27:35):
as a character. You read a lot of crime books,
particularly where the sex worker is dead in a dumpster
by page three.

Speaker 4 (27:43):
I don't know what I pick page three. That is
such an old reference.

Speaker 3 (27:48):
So I wanted to say, where's her voice? Where is
the humanity behind that person? So, but yeah, all my
books I so in a beautiful mess. I research. This
was a lot trickier. I researched drug gangs, get great Yami,
that is not somewhere I wanted to involve myself. I

(28:09):
am terrified of anything like that. I am you know,
that's not me. But there are ways of doing that.
You can get drive throughs with, Like I found a
way of getting drive throughs with the police to sort
of and talk to the police so that you can
have a clear understanding. We discovered I knew nothing about drugs.

(28:30):
I mean they were killing themselves laughing about how little
I knew about how much this should cost. And I
was like would this work in the plot, And they
were like no. I was like, you need about like
three thousand pounds worth of drugs? Could he carry?

Speaker 4 (28:42):
That was like I was.

Speaker 3 (28:43):
Thinking that was going to be like a small package,
I don't know, bag of coins, like no part so
you have no idea that would be this enormous sattler
drugs cheap and I was like, that's a terrible thing. So,
you know, there are ways of for me, the old
fashioned way of talking to people who do the job,
or better yet, shadowing people that.

Speaker 1 (29:04):
Do the job. I think a lot of people won't
even go to that extent when they're trying to research.
They'll stick to the Internet. So do you think it's
much more beneficial to actually go and do that more
in personal physical research?

Speaker 3 (29:18):
I think it is for me because I really then
pick up on things like what's not being said, looks
between people, what things smell like. You know, what does
the inside of a police car smell like? I think
it smells of fear. I think it smells it smells
of male sweat, because honestly, people are terrified if they're
in the back of a car, or they're adrenaline or

(29:39):
whatever it is in back of a police car. So
you know, you wouldn't know that from the internet. You
realize the genuine you know, I think there's a temptation
for a lot of writers are created generally to take
their creativity from other creatives. So you can watch a
TV show and think, ah, that's how cops work.

Speaker 4 (30:00):
It's not. It's already fiction. So for me to keep
it real.

Speaker 3 (30:06):
And one of the things that I'm very lucky that
it gets fed back and it comes up in my
reviews is that people say, really believe the characters.

Speaker 4 (30:13):
I really believe they could be in this position.

Speaker 3 (30:15):
And I think that is because I put myself in
those sort of down and dirty situations of understanding the research.
But that's only me, and also, honestly, I'm dead nosy,
so it is brilliant to see people do their jobs
and find out about people. My life would be quite
isolated if all I did was sit at home in
my own little head making stuff up. I love the

(30:39):
bit of being out and about understanding the real people
that do these things.

Speaker 4 (30:44):
Maybe not drug gangs. I don't really want to play
with that.

Speaker 2 (30:49):
As early, you've touched on it being harder to be
a writer in terms of the promotion side and the connecting,
and obviously it's great, but is it harder to be
a bestseller? Have you noticed any sort of trends in
terms of the twenty five years that you've been doing it.
You know, maybe it's a case of people whoders want
more twists or something like that.

Speaker 4 (31:09):
Oh, that's interesting.

Speaker 3 (31:10):
It's hard for me to say, because what I would
hope my craft has got better as time has going on,
because surely after twenty five years you should be honing your.

Speaker 4 (31:21):
Craft, and you know that.

Speaker 3 (31:24):
I think what's happened in so in my career I
set off writing romantic fiction. I say that I always
almost roll my eyes because it's the filthiest, dirtiest romantic
fiction you could possibly help time. Now, I think it's like,
you know, it's quite soft, But back then it was
seen as quite raunchy and different, and it was quite

(31:45):
satirical as well, and the characters could be quite mean,
so it wasn't sort of meet cute. It was you know,
it had a bite to it. Then I wrote family
dramas and historical novels, and then I wrote psychological thrillers.
So I quite often reinvented myself. So I quite often
had the challenge of going well, I may have been
a best seller in that genre, but I'm billy no

(32:07):
mates in this genre. I mean it was so interesting
moving into crime because you know, really fabulous people like
Mark Billingham, who is a good friend of mine. Now,
I remember when I first was like, hey, Mark, would
you read my book?

Speaker 4 (32:20):
You could see his little face going no.

Speaker 3 (32:22):
Because you know, you could just tell because that's what
I'd been. I was like, no, it's totally different. I mean,
you know, I have a read a bit and I
had to reinvent myself and start all over again, which
I think is a publisher's nightmare. But for me creatively,
it was really interesting and very you know, kept me
on my toes. But I think what happens now with

(32:46):
being a best seller is there's some elements of luck
to it for a debut.

Speaker 4 (32:52):
Let's talk about debutes.

Speaker 3 (32:53):
So when I was a debut, because you only need
the debut once, aren't you. When I was a debut,
if a publisher believed in you, the probably give you
some time to gather momentum. So you had a whole
year of people talking about the book. You sort of
meeting sales reps, sales reps talking one to one with
a multiple. I didn't even talk about this a multiple

(33:13):
of retailers because back in the day there was Otticas, Books,
Books et cetera, Waterstones, Endless Indies, and.

Speaker 4 (33:22):
A booming wh smith.

Speaker 3 (33:23):
So they one to one would sell you in way
in advance of you coming out, and then you'd come
out and people might go, oh, I like this book,
I'm going to put it on my window. And I
do remember once walking in Piccadilly Circus in London, which
is primarytails place. It was books et cetera, and I
looked and there was this massive, like I'm going to

(33:45):
go with four meter window of my book. There's just
deck chairfter texture out with my book all over it.

Speaker 4 (33:51):
And I went in.

Speaker 3 (33:51):
I was like, oh, my gosh, it's my book and
I'm amazed and thank you.

Speaker 4 (33:55):
And my publisher never told me. They went, oh, you
publishers don't know.

Speaker 3 (33:57):
We did the window just because like, so and so
read it one of the one of the girls, one
of the retailers, and she loved it, and she does
our windows.

Speaker 4 (34:04):
So that's what she wanted to do.

Speaker 3 (34:06):
Amazing, amazing because now that would cost a fortune.

Speaker 4 (34:11):
That would have been monetarized. Somebody would have to pay
for that window.

Speaker 3 (34:15):
The books that are in the front of windows, front
of stores, on the tables, those are all promotions that
are paid for, and that makes it tougher, you know,
that makes it a lot tougher, because if you're not
put in those, the discoverability is so much lower. It's
not so much about word of mouth. Then you might
have the sort of opposite. You might be discovered on

(34:38):
something like TikTok. I don't know it works, Chaps, because
I do not have TI and I've never been on TikTok.
Somebody said to me today, you know you can look
at it without being on it, And I was like,
can you how our hearts? You know, I have no clue.
But if you got some kind of TikTok influencer who
just discovered your book, off you go.

Speaker 4 (34:59):
I don't.

Speaker 3 (35:00):
I had Lisa Jewel on your show, but Lisa would
tell you a story that one of her books had
been published for two years in America and then got
picked up by a Hollywood housewife, you know, and she
was holding the book and went.

Speaker 4 (35:14):
Oh, this is great. So the first book I've ever read,
you know, I am miscourting, do not.

Speaker 3 (35:21):
She was pointing to a book where this is great
and for whatever reason, and it went wild. And she
talks about that being her breaking into America, but it
was kind of a bit of look, so there's there's
always that you never know, you never know.

Speaker 1 (35:35):
Yeah, I was gonna say Colleen, who comes to mind
in that situation. She is always over TikTok all the time,
not herself. People promoted her work.

Speaker 3 (35:44):
Talking about her, which is lovely because that sort of
like the books et ceter Window, where it's just individuals
finding it. I love that because it seems authentic to
me that just genuine people are finding it and talking
about it.

Speaker 4 (35:57):
But there are there are favorites in the industy that
are constantly re promoted.

Speaker 3 (36:04):
You go into a shop and you go, yeah, I've
been in a shop five months in a row, and
that same book is on the shelf. Give me something new.
I've bought that book, I've read that book, give me
something new. But the retailers just got yeah, this sounds
so we keep and it's a virtuous circle if it
is that person. But how frustrating if you're somebody who
is not on that shelf and there's a handful of

(36:26):
people that get that and they become the mega sellers.
They sort of off the scale, you know.

Speaker 4 (36:33):
But as long as people are reading.

Speaker 1 (36:34):
Folks, absolutely, adele are beautiful mess? What it's all about? Please?

Speaker 4 (36:43):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (36:44):
So a beautiful mess begins at the end, which I
think makes it a different book. We open on a
and it says the end, and we open on someone
being shot and there is a desperate mother there, Connie,
and we don't know it's unclear whether it is Connie

(37:04):
being shot of someone she loves, but we know she
is a desperate mum and this is a horrific situation.
And then the next page says eleven days earlier, and
I take the reader on a countdown eleven, ten ninety eight,
right the way down.

Speaker 4 (37:20):
To the end.

Speaker 3 (37:21):
And my hope is by putting that up at the front,
you know that as you are getting invested in these characters,
which I hope you do.

Speaker 4 (37:30):
Get invested in characters.

Speaker 3 (37:31):
And the tension cranks up and the secrets come out
and the twists start to happen, you know that it's
going to end badly, which isn't something we really confront
in life, but actually, inevitably, we all are going to end,
but we try not think about it.

Speaker 4 (37:47):
But by putting that.

Speaker 3 (37:51):
Layer on it, I think we're keeping the pressure because
you're thinking all along.

Speaker 4 (37:54):
Who are we going to lose? Who are going to lose?
I don't want that to happen. So Connie is just this.

Speaker 3 (38:01):
Also, I did put it in at the beginning because
otherwise you'd read chapter one and just think, oh, this
is kind of gentle, this is what's going on here,
because it starts very gently. Connie's decorating her Christmas tree.
She's super excited because this empty nest, a middle aged
woman is looking forward to the three girls, her three daughters,
coming home and being all at home over the Christmas holidays.

(38:24):
Betty yet her eldest, who's only twenty, is bringing home
a boyfriend. So it's the first time.

Speaker 4 (38:29):
That she's had sort of young love back in the house.

Speaker 3 (38:31):
And it all seems so like glowy and gorgeous, and
she lives in the Great House in London and she's
got a lovely husband.

Speaker 4 (38:37):
All everything seems lalla.

Speaker 3 (38:39):
Then the boyfriend walks down the garden path on Christmas Eve.
In a minute, she sees him sort of a hackles
the up. He reminds her of her biggest mistake that
she's ever.

Speaker 4 (38:50):
Made in her lives.

Speaker 3 (38:50):
That's way deep in her past, or so she thought
and it has just been delivered back up to her,
and she knows she's in trouble. She already knows to that.
And this isn't a spoiler because it's all like chapter
one added to that. Her daughter, then aged twenty, says,
I'm pregnant. So this guy, she can't get him out
of her life. He's there for you know. He is

(39:13):
now the father of her grandchild to be. So she
knows there is a problem. She thinks she's the only
one with a secret and you know, this disaster that's
about to brew up.

Speaker 4 (39:25):
She's wrong.

Speaker 3 (39:26):
Everybody in her house, her other child, children, the boyfriend,
everybody has a secret, but one of them is particularly deadly.

Speaker 1 (39:38):
Oh yes, Halo says, what a hook. And I almost
get murderous when decorating my Christmas tree.

Speaker 3 (39:46):
Yeah, that is why I said it at Christmas, because honestly, Christmas,
don't we put ourselves under the masses of pressure. And
you do sort of want to ring in Connie's neck
because to start with, that is all she's obsessing about,
you know, is her like cheeseboard looking at the Instagram cheese.
And by the end of that Christmas, when she is
dealing with bloodshot, you know, bloody shot wounds.

Speaker 4 (40:06):
She is not worrying about a cheeseboard.

Speaker 1 (40:09):
Yeah, I can see why. So Connie is returning after
twenty five years of writing since passing away. What was
it like to go back? Sorry, what is happening? And
it's nice it's not a spoiler. Yeah, So what was

(40:29):
it like revisiting that character after so long and obviously
so many great stories between where I know as a writer,
I would definitely lose that character in my mind. Did
you have to go back and read the whole book?

Speaker 4 (40:39):
I did go back and read the book.

Speaker 3 (40:41):
I've never lost Connie in my mind, though, because Connie
completely changed my life, despite what everybody was thinking, because everybody.

Speaker 4 (40:48):
Thinks, first book, oh it's got to be you.

Speaker 3 (40:50):
Well, first of all, I had written a novella that
I never tried to get published, and the community should
be grateful.

Speaker 4 (40:56):
I never tried to get that.

Speaker 3 (40:58):
I had written a book that's kind of loosely based
on my self indulgent me thing, and I didn't try
and get it published. In any way, it wouldn't have
been published if we never had tried. But the second
book I wrote, she was very different to me in
some ways, but a little bit similar to me in others.
And I write about her terrible mistake that first book,
that Playing Away is her big mistake. And so you know,

(41:21):
if you have read that one, you sort of know
what her mistake is.

Speaker 4 (41:23):
But it doesn't matter whether you've read it or not.

Speaker 3 (41:26):
A beautiful mess, complete scandalone and as I say, very
different genres.

Speaker 4 (41:30):
So don't feel, oh, I have to read the first one.
You don't. But if you want to knock.

Speaker 3 (41:33):
Yourself out anyway, So Connie was with me, but she
always had like this gang of friends, really interesting sort
of you know, fun.

Speaker 4 (41:44):
People running around in the background, but they.

Speaker 3 (41:47):
Never got their full sake because they were the subplots.
So about seven years after I wrote Playing Away, I
pulled two of the subplot characters to the front. I
gave them their main story, and I put Connie as
the subplot. And that book was called Young Wives Tales.
Another eight years after that, I wrote Lies, Lies, Lies,
which was full of psychological thriller. Quite well, I was

(42:10):
gonna say, quite deep and dark, really deep and dark.
You know, there's like a stalker, or in prison, there's alcoholism, infertility,
there's a lot going on in that book, and again
I wrote it from the viewpoint of one of her friends.

Speaker 4 (42:23):
That was the plot, and Connie is part of that too.
So she's been.

Speaker 3 (42:27):
Knocking around because to me, she made me who I am.
If people hadn't loved her in the first place, loved
to loathe her. Actually, there's a bit of that, quite divisive,
and she's messy. She's set my tone right from the
beginning that I often had these heroines or heroes because
I write from mail off in the point of view

(42:48):
all the way through, sometimes both multiple viewpoints, blah blah.
But they're always faulty because humans are the only thing
we have in common is we may have great dictations
of ourselves and we may try very very hard, but
we will mess up.

Speaker 4 (43:03):
We cannot help ourselves.

Speaker 3 (43:04):
That is what human is, and that's why I try
and capture. So I did go back and reread all
those books, largely because I needed to get my facts right.
You know, when did they have offspring, when did they
re meet each other, who was still living in what
the house? And all that, So I needed the facts.
But this book in terms of character, for Connie was

(43:25):
no problem at all. She just wrote herself. But the
book isn't just from Connie's point of view. It's also
from her jen Z child's point of view Fran, and
also from Franz's boyfriend Zach's point of view. So I
had two very new characters with very different voices that
I did have to like rediscover, well discover, not rediscover

(43:46):
discover because I hadn't given them a voice before.

Speaker 4 (43:48):
They would toddlers. Last time I talked to Fran.

Speaker 1 (43:52):
Amazing love that. So the book balances thriller and tension
and family drama. So how do you write weaving all
that together without kind of leaning too heavily on one side.

Speaker 3 (44:07):
Yeah, it's so interesting because I don't set out saying, oh,
this is the genre I'm going to write in. I
set out going, this is the story I'm going to tell,
and then usually at the end of it, somebody else
will give it a label. So I wrote this and
one of my early readers was Lucy Clark, and she went, oh,
my god, you know it's still got all the psychological

(44:29):
thriller elements, but it's so much more heart to it.
It's very much got like this emotional spin. It's kind
of a family drama too, And I thought oh have that.

Speaker 1 (44:36):
You know.

Speaker 3 (44:36):
It just seemed like a really perceptive way of talking
about it, And I think you almost need somebody else
with fresh eyes looking at it and telling you what
it is right well for I do rather than setting
out saying, oh, I'm definitely going to write a procedural
crime or I'm definitely going to write a psychological thriller,
I think they sort of find I find the story,

(44:58):
and then the story finds it genre. So the balance
more comes from not to just as writing, not to
go to Schmaltzyn, not to go too heavy on anything,
because I love a bit of emotion. I literally wear
my heart on my sleeve type of person I just am.

(45:19):
So I have to be careful that that touch is
quite light. And so usually my last chapter I really
stripped back and make that. I think that's a really
conscious effort I do. I don't let there be too much.

Speaker 4 (45:35):
Bang. Like I've given you the.

Speaker 3 (45:37):
Twist that was your bank. The twist is the bank.
The draw dopping moment is the bang. I don't want
to ring it out, ring it out, and I then
usually skip some time and go and then this is
how they got on, This is how they moved on
because I find it. I don't want to embarrass my reader.

Speaker 4 (45:53):
I know that sounds weird.

Speaker 3 (45:55):
We've all read those books where we're going, okay, wrap
it up now.

Speaker 4 (45:57):
All right?

Speaker 3 (45:58):
Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 4 (45:59):
It's just too much and I don't want that.

Speaker 1 (46:02):
Yeah, amazing, No, it's good.

Speaker 2 (46:06):
I like the fact obviously you're not leaving the reader
with so many open ended questions. I hate that with
a book.

Speaker 1 (46:12):
When you get the.

Speaker 2 (46:15):
You're like, no, how did it end?

Speaker 3 (46:16):
I want to know you do need to have some
context up. One time I tried not to wrap it up.
I got such feedback. I'm going with feedback that I
had to write a sequel, so you know, lesson.

Speaker 2 (46:31):
Yeah. I guess my question from that then is, obviously
loads of people have been talking about how great the
hook is for this book, But from a writer's point
of view, how do you know when you've got a
really good hook?

Speaker 3 (46:44):
I it's interesting. I think I'm mine. I tend to
have one hook, one kind of concept. Oh, this book
is going to be about. And I can't tell you
what this one is about because it's such a spoiler.
But there's a really obvious thing there. I could say
it's about sort of heritage in parenting and and why

(47:05):
we are the parents we are all, why we are
the children we are. That's all I can kind of
say without giving too much away. So I kind of thought, well,
there's my theme. But I like a number of twists.

Speaker 4 (47:16):
I just do. I think readers are really intelligent, you know.

Speaker 3 (47:19):
Now nowadays we're so consume, like, we consume so much media,
whether that's TV or podcasts or you know, reading, whatever
it might be. We consume so much that we kind
of second guess all the time.

Speaker 4 (47:32):
I know it's coming.

Speaker 3 (47:33):
I think I can guess, and I want my readers
to guess some of it because I think then we're
in the club.

Speaker 4 (47:40):
You know, we're together, we're having a bit of fun.

Speaker 3 (47:42):
But I want to kind of surprise them with something,
and that is that is a bit of hard work.

Speaker 4 (47:50):
Actually that is you know, it's meant to be hard work.
That is my job.

Speaker 3 (47:54):
But sometimes I think, no, that's really obvious. I can
see that coming a mile off. That cannot be the answer.
So you have to rethink how it could be resolved.
And usually I have When you think you've got the
final twist, there's something else coming.

Speaker 2 (48:09):
Does that obviously I've got like the sort of bread
crumb idea, because you want people to figure some of
them out, but you don't want them to figure them
all out. But again, when I've read books where the
twist has been too left field, I've been like, oh,
that didn't really make sense.

Speaker 4 (48:25):
Trust it. And it's so frustrating, isn't it. It's like, oh,
I found a trust.

Speaker 3 (48:28):
Fund end of my bed, and so now I'm not poor.
It's like, no, you would know you have a trust fund.
Don't talk bollocks. So yeah, that is my view on
Cremy fast Endings. It seems like, oh, they're up against
the deadline and they just whisk that out. So no,
I would hope that you would get to the end
of mine and go oh, okay, I didn't see it coming,
but now it's there. No other answer could be the

(48:50):
answer that has the answer. And actually, if you then
go back and read my book, you'll go, oh, she
did tell me that.

Speaker 4 (48:56):
Was going to happen.

Speaker 3 (48:57):
Because quite often my books, I will tell you what's
going to happen, but in a way like a character
will say it, and it'll just be like just told you.

Speaker 4 (49:07):
You watch for it.

Speaker 3 (49:08):
Yeah, And it's a bit of fun and it's and
some people get to see it and they go, oh
my gosh, she said, maybe I am telling you a lie,
or you know, whatever it might be. Or he says,
you know, I literally can't go through with this, and
then he does not whatever it might be. But yeah,
when you go back and read it, you got ah.
I was sat there all the time.

Speaker 1 (49:28):
N it's fantastic. All right, guys, we've got eight minutes left,
so we're not that much time to finish up. So
if you've got questions, please do send them in now.
I just want to ask you about the image of
you obviously came out as a movie recently. How did
that feel? How was that process to you?

Speaker 3 (49:44):
Oh my gosh, well, the process was amazing. We need
a whole other session on that. Because I was an
exec producer on it. So that means in some people's world,
you do nothing, throw out some money. I didn't try
out any money. I throughout my time for three years.
So for quite a few years, I was working with

(50:06):
the scriptwriter. We were pitching, we were looking talking to directors,
we were talking to cast Stoppy starty. I wanted it
to happen. I thought it was going to happen. It
wasn't happening. Then I got a call going right, I
got a green light and was shooting it next month
because it was pre the strike. All the writers strike

(50:26):
and then the actors strike, and they suddenly said we
need to shoot it quickly. And then suddenly I was
flying out to America and I'm on set, and I'm
in this entirely different world that I've never I hadn't
really had chance to really think that part of it through, and.

Speaker 4 (50:44):
I didn't really understand how that all worked, if I'm honest.

Speaker 3 (50:47):
So there was a lot of sort of standing there,
giving my two pens, being told that wasn't really my
place to give the two pens. Occasionally they're not giving
my two pens and being told that's when you should
have chipped in.

Speaker 4 (50:57):
So there's a lot to learn. There was a lot
to learn.

Speaker 3 (51:00):
But I loved it, and I great relationship with the actors.

Speaker 4 (51:04):
Just really found.

Speaker 3 (51:06):
That so interesting watching other people take my you know,
my characters that have come out of my crazy little
head and go with them and find.

Speaker 4 (51:16):
Their feet with them.

Speaker 3 (51:17):
And afterwards, it was Sasha Peters who was in Pretty
Little Ears. She was my lead and she had to
play twins, identical twins, and she was amazing. And afterwards
she said, am I how you imagined? And I said,
I don't know, Sasha, I cannot imagine anything other than
you anymore. If I'm looking of that book now, I
would see Sasha say the lines. You know, It's just

(51:38):
it became hers. So that's quite interesting. It's like selling
your house and if they redecorate, great because you sold
your house. But yeah, and in my coase she redecorated
and I went, oh that was nice. I wish I'd
thought of Green Draylon curtains, do you know what I mean? Like,
however she decorated I really brought into so yeah, this

(52:00):
fantastic experience.

Speaker 1 (52:02):
So with that in mind, if our beautiful mess became,
you know, another movie for example, have you got a
casting you would ever think of for Connie?

Speaker 4 (52:12):
Oh? I don't know about Connie. I know Lucy. I
would love Nicole Kidman to be Lucy.

Speaker 3 (52:17):
Yeah, because you don't like Lucy, who has popped up
in other books before. She is so cool and that
sort of Iceberg beauty. She's she's everything, that's she's the
you know, Connie is a bit more. Oh, Connie would
be your Reese Witherspoon, then, wouldn't she because she's a
bit more ditsy, not that recent real life is she's

(52:37):
an absolutely genius woman who's you know, major business woman,
but she can play that sort of it all went wrong?

Speaker 4 (52:44):
How did it go wrong? In my and my life?
You know?

Speaker 3 (52:47):
But also that passion of that is my child. I
will walk through a burning building to look after the child.
So maybe those two would be good.

Speaker 4 (52:54):
Powing.

Speaker 1 (52:54):
I think it just popped in mind when you started
to describing that character. Florence Hugh popped up in my
mind and then.

Speaker 4 (53:01):
Yes, it's great, Yes she would be you.

Speaker 1 (53:04):
Know, yeah, and if that does happen, then please get
me on set.

Speaker 4 (53:10):
Happened. I'm really good up keeping these promises. If it.

Speaker 1 (53:13):
Extra amazing. Okay, So a couple of questions here, stable
questions first, Chris, but we have asked these before. We
might get community questions. And if you had to have
a dinner with a reverse Mermaid or of reverse Centaur,
which would you choose? What would be on the dinner

(53:36):
menu or.

Speaker 4 (53:38):
So reverse Mermaid? Visualizing them now or neither of them
are good? Are they? I would go reverse centaur. I think.

Speaker 3 (53:52):
Merd right, a really huge fish tail that's going to
be smelly.

Speaker 4 (53:57):
That's going to be really smelly, and that put me
off my food.

Speaker 3 (54:01):
I don't eat meat, but I do eat fish, So
I think facing a reverse mermaid and having dinner would
would actually be quite It'd be like cannibalism.

Speaker 4 (54:09):
So I can't do it. So I'm going with the
reverse centaur. But we would eat fish.

Speaker 1 (54:14):
But is that like, that's a bull's head right with
a man's legs.

Speaker 4 (54:18):
Yeah, that'll be all right. Balls are all right?

Speaker 3 (54:20):
Are they? They're quite handsome? You know, it's got weird
to look at.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
Good answer, yeah, Chris says. I thank you for that,
Chris says, and thank you for this. How do you
come up with the titles for your books?

Speaker 3 (54:35):
Sometimes I know them right from the beginning, and I'm
just like, bang, I'm in there, like our Beautiful Mess.
There's a chain called small chain of restaurants cold Sticks
and Sushi, and they have a salad called beautiful Mess.
And I was eating the salad and thought, that is
a brilliant title for the book I'm currently writing.

Speaker 4 (54:53):
That came from a salad, So that's weird.

Speaker 3 (54:56):
But other times, like the book I've just handed in.
The book I've just handed in is called the book
with no Name.

Speaker 1 (55:02):
Oh wow, yeah, it's not really.

Speaker 3 (55:04):
Called that, although now I'm thinking that's quite a good note.
But I actually do not know what the next book
is going to be called. I've written the entire book
and I still do not have an answer to that.
So I'm hoping someone in the publishing house will come
up with something. So sometimes they come up with something,
sometimes I come up with something. We always have to
agree the title is the one. Like in publishing traditional publishing,

(55:25):
in the end, every single word on the page can
come down to me. I can say yes or no
to any edits. I can you know it's mine, But
the title is theirs. Interestingly, so I can't say this
is absolutely the title I want if they don't want it,
because it's actually part of the marketing.

Speaker 4 (55:41):
It's part of the package.

Speaker 3 (55:43):
So yeah, you've got to get buy in from both sides,
and quite often it comes from sales. They look at
it and think, is that the kind of thing that
might attract a reader sales marketing.

Speaker 1 (55:52):
They might have a view that's amazing. I didn't know that.

Speaker 3 (55:57):
I know it's a lot of secrets. I do not
have a filter for what should be or shouldn't be told.

Speaker 1 (56:01):
He said, I'm currently through halfway through First Wife Shadow
and he loves it. Thank you, Thank you, brilliant Chris.
Do you have a question there? I could see you
are you were penning something?

Speaker 2 (56:12):
Yeah, no, I was just conscious of the time. But
my question was, obviously you talked about your nearly ideas
when you you know you're going through that Christmas period
of going, oh, could do this, could do this? So
I suppose the question is what's your best nearly idea
that you didn't do? Do you have a well character
that you didn't do?

Speaker 3 (56:31):
They still sort of hang around you See, that's quite interesting.
So I have got an idea and I keep thinking
it's a good idea, and I sort of think it
is a good idea, and I think it might be
book twenty seven, but I haven't worked out how it.

Speaker 4 (56:45):
Ends, and it's yet yet.

Speaker 3 (56:49):
That's my point. Yeah, And it seemed I.

Speaker 4 (56:52):
Want it to end positively because hey, little me, little
you know, little sunshine.

Speaker 3 (56:58):
I kind of whatever I people through, generally my arc
is ending somewhere relatively positive. We learn something, we the
people you want to get through, get through or whatever.
And I haven't wre doubt how to do that with
this particular book yet. But once I do, then that
one that one runs and it's about it.

Speaker 4 (57:19):
Yeah, No, I can't tell you in case.

Speaker 2 (57:20):
It happens, Yeah, that you've got that book that Yeah.

Speaker 3 (57:28):
Then I do have a book that I started writing
and then abandoned, which was a book about a father.

Speaker 4 (57:34):
No again, I'm not going to tell you. Kiss.

Speaker 3 (57:35):
I might come back to it and now on your
show promoting it.

Speaker 4 (57:40):
Yeah, all right, secret.

Speaker 2 (57:41):
But yeah, it's an interesting concept because a lot of
authors say, oh, I had an idea for this, and
then I didn't write for ten years and then realize
how to do it and did.

Speaker 4 (57:51):
It playing in the back of your mind somewhere, and
suddenly one.

Speaker 1 (57:56):
Day there is art that yes, well, adele, we've we've
passed our an hour. We're I know.

Speaker 3 (58:06):
I take out from this is I used to have
a better filter. I hope to God on my screen
because oh I have aged horribly.

Speaker 4 (58:18):
That is my only takeout from this entire lovely interview.

Speaker 1 (58:21):
We all do, we all, we all age, and we all.

Speaker 4 (58:24):
YouTube haven't changed. That's not fair. So I'm just thinking
maybe that before I just had a really good filter.

Speaker 3 (58:30):
I looked at it thought I never looked that good.

Speaker 4 (58:33):
I was like, it's skinned so smooth. What's going on
with that one?

Speaker 1 (58:36):
Brilliant? Okay, before we do wrap it up, you know
our beautiful mess drop yesterday. Where can people go rush
to the shops and buy it? Where can they get
it from?

Speaker 3 (58:45):
They can't get it from anywhere. But at the moment,
and I am just going to say, am I allowed
to just say it?

Speaker 4 (58:49):
Like? Okay?

Speaker 3 (58:50):
It literally I'm going to show you this because this
is beautiful. There is a collector's edition, which is the
first edition which has this beautiful Yeah, it's currently half
price on Amazon that collectors addition.

Speaker 4 (59:03):
I've rushed there.

Speaker 3 (59:05):
But it is also in all the supermarkets, which is
really good. It is in Waterstokes, which obviously is important.
It is in the indies or if not, you can
ask for it and they will get you it in.

Speaker 4 (59:15):
It is everywhere.

Speaker 3 (59:17):
But yeah, if your money conscious, and god aren't we all,
then at the moment, get yourself to Amazon where it's
half price, and get yourself that first edition. I know
how many X amount of thousand were that first run,
so if you move quickly, there are still some.

Speaker 1 (59:31):
And people can catch you on tour, right, and that's
on your website as well.

Speaker 3 (59:35):
Yes, go on to my website at Dell Parks dot
com or follow me on my Instagram and yes, and
I am on tour and I've got those few that
I said next week and then I come back from
Canada and I've got many going into the autumn, lots
of different festivals, lots of things going.

Speaker 1 (59:52):
On the busy time.

Speaker 4 (59:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:56):
To have you back on the show is absolutely brilliant.
You're a fantastic character. You've got an incredible career and
you're doing amazingly well. And book twenty six is on
the way. Book twenty seven you're talking about your unstoppable
So I only.

Speaker 4 (01:00:11):
Do it so you keep inviting me back. That's my
main motivation for producing books. So I hope to see
you again.

Speaker 1 (01:00:19):
Yes, absolutely, anytime. And if you do pop down to Cardiff,
I will try and come and.

Speaker 3 (01:00:23):
See you in Cardiff in it's November, yeah, so definitely
we'll meet.

Speaker 1 (01:00:28):
If any of you around in Cardiff in November, come
and see you as well, and we'll have a we'll
say hello. But everybody, thank you so so much for
tuning in. Thank you for the lovely comments about the show.
Halo says, amazing, and he says, I love the show.
It's great to have you tuning in. Go pick the
book up if you can. Please do look at the
Kindle Storyteller Award if that is of interest. Like I said,

(01:00:48):
and Sunday, so it's a big opportunity for little work
that you haven't already done. But also have a great weekend.
Anything from you, Chris No.

Speaker 2 (01:00:57):
Just again reiterate and the fact that Adele's always a
brilliant guest when she comes on the show. So please
just go out, pick up a book and enjoy it.

Speaker 1 (01:01:08):
Well.

Speaker 4 (01:01:08):
I love being on the show, So thank you for
the time.

Speaker 1 (01:01:11):
Amazing. Thank you Adele, by everybody, By

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