The Skinwalker on the Reservation

Taylor discusses Bigfoot encounters, missing time, a strange creature in TX, a skinwalker, and more.If you love iNTO THE FRAY and want more content….
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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
This is Shannon mcroux, and you're listening to Into the Fray.

Speaker 2 (00:04):
On the X Infinite Complaints people went to and pro
fears about their little affairs, serene in the assurance of
their dominion over this small binning fragment of solar driftwood, which,
by chance or design, man has inherited out of the
dark mystery of time and space.

Speaker 1 (01:08):
On this episode of Into the Fray, I welcome Taylor
on with me, and I'm excited because I have a
nice little bullet point list and these bullet points are
things like missing time and Bigfoot and even the word
shoop of covers in here. So I'm very excited. And
it looks like quite a bit of this takes place
in one of my favorite places that I used to

(01:30):
live in for a few years, and that's Washington State.
But Taylor, welcome on the show.

Speaker 3 (01:36):
Thanks glad to be here.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
I am glad that you got in touch.

Speaker 3 (01:41):
All right.

Speaker 1 (01:42):
So I don't know how much backstory we need to
set us up with Washington State, and it sounds like
you grew up there. But wherever you wanted to begin,
you go right ahead.

Speaker 3 (01:53):
I'll just ramble around and you can reel me in
when you want to the first one or the the
big one? Why I called. First of all, I listened
to her show all the time, so I got a
pretty good understanding of the stuff that people think is
interesting enough that other people would like to hear. And

(02:15):
the first big thing was about man. I was like
thirty five years ago. I was young, fairly recently married,
had a two year old kid, and my wife was
the time, was literally nine months pregnant with the next one.
And so it was Aga or November, and I made

(02:41):
the decision to talker into not caring if I went
deer hunting that weekend, and she had lot We had
both had lots of family in town, and she had
lots of friends. It was a town we grew up in,
so it wasn't that big of a deal. I was
supposed to be back Saturday night for a wedding reception.

(03:02):
Her friend had a wedding reception and it was from
eight o'clock to eleven o'clock, and so I was like, man,
don't worry, I'll be home by seven. Pop in the shower,
we'll be over there, no problem. It's like, okay, cool,
We'll get your little sister to babysit the two year old.
I'll be ready to roll, like, no problem. So of

(03:28):
course we were late leaving, and we were about two
and a half hours away from home when we even left,
so it was about probably nine to fifteen ish. We
were about ten miles away from home. And this was
the days were right when cell phones were coming in.
Nobody really had the handheld. But the guy that I

(03:50):
was with had his own business and he had a
mobile phone in his truck. So as soon as we're,
like I said, about ten minutes away from home, now
it's nine fifteen and the phone rings and he just
looks at me and he's like, man, you know who
that is? My guy? I know I'm in trouble. So

(04:15):
he answers it and he's like, yeah, it's her, and
he hand me the phone. She's like, where are you?
We're late. Your sister's been here for two hours, and
so I gave her, you know, the old excuse, and
we're ten minutes away from town and we'll be there.
I can hop in the shower. It's only nine thirty.

(04:35):
Still got an hour and a half hanging out there
with everybody. And she's like, okay, you know, just get
home and we're coming up on the there's one big
round turn before it's a straight shot into town, and
we could see the bubble lights of a cop and

(04:56):
I hung up the phone and I look at my
wall and it's nine to eighteen, and I was like, yeah,
we'll be there and plenty of time. And as soon
as I put the phone back in the cradle, I
looked up again and there were the flashing lights were gone,
and uh, this was oldie time days. So the cassette

(05:17):
we were listening to on the stereo, same song, but
it bumped forward like about six or seven words, and
it's not you know, like a cedal scratch or an
lp wal scratch, but a cassette doesn't just bump forward.
But anyway, we hit the turn and there's no lights,
there's no cop car, there's no car pulled over on

(05:39):
the side of the road, there's no tail lights, and uh,
we just kind of looked each other like, man, that's
freaking weird. And uh there was another guy with this,
and we go did you see that? And he's like,
I didn't see nothing. Man didn't see nothing. And so
we just drive home kind of in silence, trying to
figure out what was going on. And we get there,

(06:02):
get home. My little sister's car is gone, but my
friend's wife's car is there, and I'm like, man, what's
going on here? That was pretty quick, pretty quick change.
And we get in and she just tore into me.
She's like, where the hell where are you? We're going
to be We're not going to make it now. And
I was like, man, I told you, it's like, what

(06:24):
is it? Nine thirty five? We'll get there. And I
looked down at my watch and it was ten thirty five.
And she's like, where the hell were you? You just
said you were ten minutes outside of town. I was like, yeah,
you're right at the turn I called you at nine
thirty nine eighteen. She's like, where the hell were you? Like,
let me smell your breath. What are you guys doing?

(06:45):
And uh, no excuse. And ever since then so I
don't know what happened there. I don't I have no memory.
I'm not saying anything happened. I don't know. I don't
know what's what. But ever since that time, I've had

(07:07):
I started having sleep paralysis and major insomnia, can't sleep,
don't sleep well. I've looked into sleep paralysis, and people say,
you know, I understand the physics behind it, you're sleep

(07:28):
and all that stuff, But I feel sometimes the presence
that some people feel about and like there's somebody in
the room or or somebody, because sometimes it's just like
a normal normal I guess you'd say sleep paralysis. And

(07:49):
then sometimes it's just like, uh, added added terror to it,
like like I really need to wake up up and
a wand to wake up, but I can't. Sometimes it's
just like, oh man, I'm stuck in the lube and
I just can kind of relax and write it out.

(08:11):
In one house I was lived in in particular, I
got another story with his house too, But every time
I had this sleep proalyss in this house, I felt
that there instead of just a standard you know, sleep paralysis,
and I'd hear three knocks on the wall of my

(08:33):
room and then I could wake up. I could snap
out of it, but not until I heard the three knocks.
And that hasn't never happened anywhere else, so I don't
know what that was all about.

Speaker 1 (08:49):
So you say that you could feel a presence occasionally,
did you ever get to see anything any kind of
a shape or form, or a shadow anything like that.

Speaker 3 (08:59):
No, and that's what I tried. I've talked to other
people that have had it, and and I've read a
lot about it, you know, I've even I've been to
doctor and talked about it, and they're like, yeah, your
r em sleep gets screwed up and your your mind's awake,
but your body can't react. And I'm like, yeah, I

(09:22):
understand the physics behind that, but there's still sometimes when
I feel this presence and but you're locked up. You know,
your body is literally frozen. My mind's going full blast,
but my body won't react to anything. So I feel
like there's something like right out of the edge of

(09:44):
my vision, right out of the corner of my eye,
especially those ones when it took the three knocks to
snap me out of it. But no, I've never seen anything.

Speaker 1 (09:57):
Now, what about your other hunting partners after this over
an hour missing time? Did they have similar problems? Were
sleep and all of that? After this?

Speaker 3 (10:08):
One of them refused to talk to us about that incident,
and he didn't really I didn't. I don't know if
he did or not. The other one he had not
the sleep paralysis like I got, but we both got

(10:29):
I also got locid dreaming out of it, and we
would talk about it every now and then. And he
also he said, man, I can kind of control my
dreams now, and I don't know if it's got anything
to do with you know, what happened. And that's about
all he would say too about what happened. We never
really talked about it because it kind of, you know,

(10:51):
it was bizarre, and I think he got in more
trouble than I did. My wife was a pitbull, and
I think his wife really kind of tore into him
about what happened, about us being late and missing the
thing and blamed him, and so he didn't really liked it.
We didn't talk about it much, but I know he

(11:13):
did get dreaming, the lucid dreaming out of it.

Speaker 1 (11:19):
And none of you guys recall seeing a craft or
anything like that.

Speaker 3 (11:24):
We didn't see anything. That's the weird thing about it.
I don't remember, couldn't tell you anything, you know. I mean,
I'm pretty deep into the weird stuff. That's why I'm
calling you. And there's no you know, marks on the body. No,
we didn't see a craft. We didn't see anything, nothing

(11:50):
other than the fact that it was like guaranteed, we
all know that we lost that time and that we
saw that light, you know, and then it was gone.
The cop car it had someone pulled over. And that's
a stretch. It's like an eight mile stretch that's pretty straight,

(12:11):
and there was nowhere no other side road. So if
there was a car there, even if it was just
a cop car for some reason with his lights on,
not having somebody pulled over, we would have seen him
or seen his tail lights, or he would have spun
around to come back at us. We didn't see another
car on that road.

Speaker 1 (12:32):
It makes me wonder if the police officer and whoever
he had pulled over, had anything weird happened to them.
There's no way to know, but that's where my mind goes.

Speaker 3 (12:42):
Yeah. I didn't even think about it until years later,
and I was like, you know, we should have checked
with the We should have checked with the sheriff and
seen if they pulled anybody over out there that night,
if that was some information we could have got from them.
But it was years later, but before I thought of that,

(13:03):
so we didn't.

Speaker 1 (13:06):
No, this was in Washington State, right, yes, yep. Did
you ever go back and look at and most people
don't take the time to even go to a website
and report anything. And if this was when cell phones
were just coming out, then this was probably not really
a thing that much. But did you ever go back
and see if anyone eventually reported seeing a craft or

(13:28):
strange lights in that area at that time?

Speaker 3 (13:33):
Not that exact area, I don't know. If you're familiar
with the top and Ish lights incident, that's another It
was kind of a big flap, and there's a book
about it now. I just got that book, and I
realized that it was hind of the same time frame

(13:56):
as a few years before what happened with us. But
topping it's only thirty five forty miles away from where
this happened, and they had a whole summer of crazy stuff.
The reservation police, there's a small reservation up there, and
the reservation police were chasing stuff all over, and the

(14:19):
city cops where even they were taking all kinds of
everybody calling in and saying they were seeing stuff. And
that one kind of backs up to h and sneering
at cheese and outside of Yakama. It's in between where
I was in Yakama, and if you're a bigfoot girl.

(14:41):
You know, a lot of stuff there in the Cascades.
I'm around Natchies and Yakama and that was all kind
of tied in. But Poppingish Lights. It's a great book,
But like I said, that was kind of basically the
same time frame and the same area, and it's near

(15:02):
also near we're maybe ten miles from a commercial nuclear
reactor and the Hanford Reservation, the Doe Reservation, so there's
a lot of nuclear stuff going on around there. And
there's also, as you know, theories about kind of extra

(15:26):
people seeing stuff around nuclear installations. I mean, I got
plenty of friends growing up that saw stuff. Nobody, you know,
with the full on I got beamed aboard a ship
or anything. But lots of people see things in the sky.

Speaker 1 (15:44):
Yeah, And there's less light pollution in that part of
the country, especially in that part of that state, so
it's easier to see when there's weird things in the sky.
But yeah, definitely, if there's a nuclear installation, there's going
to be some stories around places like that. So I mean,
do you feel like when you look back on that
and with does do the strange do the sleep issues

(16:08):
still continue to this day? Tailor?

Speaker 3 (16:10):
Oh? Yeah, yeah, and this was, like I said, this
was nineteen ninety so thirty five years ago. And before
that it was great. I was great, man, I was
a no issues really to speak of, and I still
have I don't get the much more where we were

(16:33):
just talking about the paralysis as much as I used to,
but it still comes and goes. But I'm sixty years
old and I fall out of bed sometimes or I
wake up on the floor, or I got like I said,
the lucid dreaming. I didn't even know what a lot
of this stuff was until the last five or ten

(16:54):
years when I started reading and watching shows about stuff.
But I never had that before and now and it's
it goes both ways. If I'm having a good dream,
I can like steer it almost like a movie and
make things happen, but when I wake up, it's gone.

(17:17):
But if I'm in a bad dream and I'm trying
to get out of it, I'll wake up, like I'll
make myself wake up and fall right back asleep, and
I'll be right back where I was in the bad dream.
And I can even get up and go to the
bathroom and walk around for a minute because I'm just like, man,

(17:38):
this dream sucks and I don't want to be there,
and then I go back to bed, fall asleep, and
boom right back at it.

Speaker 1 (17:47):
I mean, do you have what you consider to be
dreams about being taken or being around entities or anything
like that somebody?

Speaker 3 (17:58):
Sometimes I mean, I can't say like I'm seeing getting
probed or seeing anything anything specific, but it's just like
an overall feeling of terror. It's darkness and like a
stuck somewhere that I can't get out of that type thing,

(18:20):
and that nothing specific. I wish it was specific. You'd
probably helped or make it worse, but either way it'd
be better. I think.

Speaker 1 (18:30):
Do you wonder if some of these are not dreams,
Like if you're waking up on the floor, maybe they
put you back in the wrong spot.

Speaker 3 (18:41):
I don't know, that's you know. Sometimes I know, like
I normally, when you fall out of bed, you got like,
oh shit, I fell out a bit man like it
wakes you up. But there have been a couple of
times when I just flat woke up on the floor,
like obviously leaped on the couch or something years ago.

(19:04):
Had happened a few times and I just wake up
on the floor. But it was like a low rider couch,
and I'm like, oh, man, I must just fallen off.
So but yeah, I mean, I gotta say I've thought
of that before.

Speaker 1 (19:18):
It's a scary thought though, So I would be like,
you would be like, oh, it's just a shitty dream,
just a exact bummer of a dream. So these sleep
disturbances happened literally right after this incident for you guys.

Speaker 3 (19:33):
Yeah, before that, I was a man, hard, hard sleeper,
and it never I never had any sleep problems at all.
Sometimes I couldn't get to sleep at night when I
was a kid, But I also had restless legs, bad
and stuff like that. You know, I was off from

(19:54):
the last person in my house to fall asleep. I
could hear everybody else snoring and saw and logs. But
it wasn't like I was up all night. I was.
It just took me a minute to fall asleep, and
once I was out, I was out. I just and
that was it. Nothing weird about dreams, No terrors, no paralysis,

(20:17):
no lucidity. I couldn't control anything. Just a dream was
a dream.

Speaker 1 (20:23):
I do wonder, though, if the one guy that really
refuses to say anything about this, if he actually remembers
quite a bit more about what went on in that
little over an hour time period.

Speaker 3 (20:37):
Yeah, I see, he was like a friend of a
friend and so I knew him. But we were both
there because the guy driving my friend, his brother owned
the land, and it was like, you know, from where
we were up a couple hours north up outside spoke

(21:00):
in and so there were a lot of people that
were kind of in the click that went hunting with
his family and that third guy, and both of these
guys are gone now, so I can't. I couldn't talk
to him, you know, if I want, if I wanted
to about it, but he just flat he fly refused.

(21:23):
He was like, I don't know what you guys are
talking about it. We're like, he saw you, it's a
pickup We're in a pickup truck. You saw the same
shit we did. And he's like, I don't know what
you're talking about, just refused. And I asked my other
buddy about it one time when we were we were
talking about the dreaming. I don't even remember how that

(21:43):
came up, but we were talking about getting this lucid
dreaming out of it. Oh, it's because I was asking
him if he had any other sleep trouble. And he's like, no,
but I can dream like a freaking maniac now. And
I said, well, what about the other guy? You know,
He's like, I don't know. He won't talk to me

(22:03):
about He won't say a word about it.

Speaker 1 (22:06):
Yeah, I bet he remembers something pretty dark. Maybe you're scary.
Maybe he actually does remember seeing a craft or some
weird lights, something close to what happened to Drevis Wolton
and fire in the sky, something like that.

Speaker 4 (22:21):
You know.

Speaker 1 (22:22):
I mean, I know it's very dramatized.

Speaker 3 (22:24):
But we met Travis too a couple of years. Got
what a great guy he is.

Speaker 1 (22:29):
Yes, and he's never changed his story. And even the
people that didn't like him, they they said what he
said and they all passed the line detector tests.

Speaker 3 (22:39):
So yeah, yes, man, just a straight shooter, such a calm, quiet,
genuine guy.

Speaker 1 (22:49):
Yeah. And I appreciate the fact that he's like, hey,
the movie is very dramatized from my actual version, and
he's he's always said that, And I think that he's
always said that. The Paranormal Witness episode that I forget
who did that if it was Discovery, but he said
that was the closest rendition to his actual experience. So

(23:10):
I always like to put that out there. I think
that you can watch those online somewhere. But anyway, Okay,
so Taylor, you mentioned you said the B word, you
said Bigfoot, So why don't we talk a little bit
about that.

Speaker 3 (23:23):
I got okay, I got no firsthand like visions of
but I have. First of all, I was hunting again.
It's a hunting one and it's in two separate parts
of the state. You'll be familiar with both of them.

(23:43):
But I was elk hunting with my brother and a
friend on in the Blue Mountains outside of Walla Walla.
And the Bigfoot guys have been there on film a
few times. And uh, we were camped out and they

(24:05):
were sleeping in the tent and I had a pickup
with a camper on it, so I was sleeping in there,
and uh, I didn't hear anything all night long. I heard,
you know, the wind was blowing a little bit, and uh,
my brother hadn't been around elk much and he's like, man,

(24:27):
the wind was blowing through the tent poles all night
long and all morning long, and it was waking me
up and pissing me off, and the guy that he
was with goes, that wasn't the wind bowing, that was
elk bugling, I think, and he goes, but it didn't
really sound like it. But I thought it was elk
b going And I was like, oh, what was it

(24:48):
And he said, I don't know. It just sounded like
a bunch of screaming and hollering. He said, well, I
don't it's good a been who knows. And uh. Anyway,
so we walked, got our stuff ready. Sunlight, we were
walking down and they were talking about this. Then we
got quiet because we were getting close to the bottom

(25:10):
where we'd seen small herd the day before, and we
heard stuff running through the brush and it was just
daylight and we couldn't really see anything. We just got
slapped in the face with the weirdest, grossest smell. It
was like it was like being the last person in

(25:33):
a taxi in August in downtown Vegas. The freaking body
sweat and it was just horrible, mixed with a little
bit of just general musk and cat pee. It was
just brutal. And I was like, well, man, it's an
elker running. And it was right about rut season, and

(25:55):
I was new too. It's not like I knew what
was going on. I was like, man, I know that
kind of peel on themselves and they go crazy, and
that's probably what it is. We kept walking and we
just we just smelled this stanch and heard stuff running
through this tick brush. But like I said, we never
and we never saw anything. So that was it. No elk,

(26:20):
there were no elk around. They were all gone. Everything
was gone. We didn't see any deer, which was highly
unusual for that area. And uh so we went home.
That was it. That was that story. And then about
two years later, I had a friend of mine that
another guy, just a straight shooter. We never even talked

(26:42):
about anything weird or anything. And we'd just been playing
a poker game and this guy grew up in Yakama
and we got done playing or cribbage tournament it was,
and we were just hanging out talking and he goes,
you know, I saw bigfoot once And I was like what,
and he's like, yeah, when I was a kid, me,

(27:04):
me and my dad went we're up hunting outside of
Yakamar around that cheese again. He's like, yeah, it was
a female and I you know, it was a female
and He's like, because they have big Harry boobs. And
I was like, well that didn't Yeah, I got you,
he said. He was just walking out of the brush

(27:25):
and he was being quiet, and he saw what he
thought was a chimpanzee like Michael Jackson's little pet monkey
by this stream, and he's like, man, what the hell
is a monkey doing out here up in the Cascades.
And then he looked and he saw a big one

(27:47):
leaning over the stream scooping water out like a human
wood and drinking out of it, and he he was
making enough noise. She looked up, and that's when she
stood up, and he saw the big Harry boobs and
she held her arm out and the little one around
to her and they ran in the bushes. And he's

(28:10):
like telling me all this. I'm like, why are you
telling me this, and goes, I don't know. I never
tell anybody about it. Thought you'd be a guy that
would appreciate it. I was like, hell, yeah, that's pretty cool.
So the next season I went hunting with him because
he I usually hunted over there on the east side
in the Blue Mountains, and he hunted up there in

(28:30):
the Cascades, and he's like yeah, we'll go up there
to the spot. I just go with my dad where
we saw the Bigfoot and it's like cool. And so
we got up there and we woke up and there
was like a hot, steamy elk proof about ten feet

(28:51):
outside of our trailer door that we'd been slept in.
And we're like, man, awesome, this is a good sign.
So we took off. We'd been walking for about thirty
minutes and we came up to a stream and he's like,
this is the stream we were about a mile away.

(29:11):
This is the stream I was telling about where we
saw that bigfoot. I was like, oh, cool. And so
we were walking for I don't know, fifteen twenty minutes
and just got hit in the face with that same
exact stench that we got when we were in Walla Walla.
And I was like, man, what's that. He goes, that's it,

(29:33):
and I go that's what and he goes, that's exactly
what I smelled when we saw it when I saw
that Bigfoot when I was a kid. And we looked
and we didn't see anything, and then we heard stuff
on the other side. This stream is like literally maybe
six feet across. It's just a tiny little thing that
trickled down and the water was all muddy from something

(29:59):
running in it, and we could hear stuff crashing through
the bushes. But again it could have been elk deer fox,
who knows. But it was that same exact stench that
I smelled a few years earlier in the Blues. And
then I got thinking. Right then, I was like one

(30:21):
my brother and the other guy we were with at
that time about the sounds they heard, and you know,
the whooping in the eighth calls and everything else. I
was going just thinking, man, they might have been hearing
Bigfoot that night, who knows. Yeah, And he, like I said,
he's a guy he didn't tell anybody. There were like

(30:43):
eight of us that played cribbage, and he waited till
everybody else was gone. It was me and him and
we were just sitting around talking, and you know, we
talked about UFOs and weird shit before, and I was like, well,
why where DoD that come from? Like, I don't know,
I just figured you'd appreciate it. But he's not a

(31:05):
guy that told you know, people that story. He didn't
go around like even when other people at work had
start talking about weird stuff. We were working together for years.
People had start talking about weird stuff and seeing this
and that, and he wouldn't go well, esual I saw Bigfoot.
He was just very specific about who he told about

(31:27):
it because he didn't want people thinking he was a kook.
But the story was so specific and so out of nowhere,
there was no reason to believe him.

Speaker 1 (31:39):
Well, how about we talk a little bit about the chupacabra.

Speaker 3 (31:44):
Yeah, we were kind of nuclear based again for a
while or a few times. We worked. Me and the
ex wife worked refuel outages at the commercial nuclear plants.
I'll go down for you know, six to twelve weeks
in the old days when well they're redoing their fuel

(32:08):
and they go in and kind of work on that process,
and so you get to see a lot of the country.
You know, you travel around, you make good money. And
we're down at the South Texas Project in Bay City, Texas,
and there were you work six twelve hours days in

(32:30):
a row, and then you get a day off and
that's usually just kind of doing laundry and passing out
and regrouping for the next you know. And so we'd
been doing that for like six or seven weeks, and
it was our last last weekend there, and I started
seeing signs up around town for like a town wide

(32:54):
rummage sale type thing in Lagrange. And I was going
with Grange and I talked. I asked somebody there at
local and I goes that, like the Zzy Top song Lagrange.
They're like, yeah, it's just right down the road here.
I was like, that is awesome. I gotta go find
his clothes. So and the wife was really big into

(33:15):
that rumage saleyard sale type stuff. So and you know, like, Okay, cool,
it's Saturday, we're done, Let's let's go down there. We
had a kid. The poor little guy was too young
to know what was going on. He was only like
ten months old at the time or so. But so

(33:37):
the three of us were packing the truck with all
our stuff and we're driving from Bay City La Grange.
And again this was this was nineteen ninety eight, and
I had no no clue about Cuba copper or or anything.
But we're driving, and we left early in the morning

(33:59):
because we men getting up early anyway, and we wanted
to get there. I was driving. Out of the corner
of my eye, I saw something running along the road
and I was like, man, there's a dog or some
kind of animal running, and my wife looked over, and
right when she looked over, this thing started to run

(34:19):
across the road in front of the truck, so I
almost stopped, and it was running pretty fast. But it's
like my brain couldn't figure out what it was because
it was moving like a cat, like it looked like
a mountain lion or a cougar, like a big cat,
but it had the head of a dog. It was
like an obvious doghead, but it ran like a cat.

(34:43):
And it was like blueish gray with spots on it
and stuff, like a very odd color to be any
animal that I'm familiar with. But it ran across the
road and it was gone, and we just liked to
look each other like, what the hell was that? And uh,

(35:04):
you know, I'm just a kid from Washington, So just
being in that part of Texas, I was seeing alligators
and buzzards and all kinds of armadillos animals that I'd
never seen before. And I was really outdoorsy guy at
the time. I was like, man, I got no idea
what the hell that could have been. Anyway, So and

(35:27):
we talk about it every now and then over the
next year or two, but neither one of us. I
didn't have any idea what it was. And then I
was watching the Old Unsolved Mysteries with Robert Stack and
it was a chupicbra and she looks over at me
and she's like, shit, that's what we saw in Texas.
And I was like, yeah, that is and like it

(35:51):
was exactly what Breed Loves did, the cheep oficabra one
with the Elmondorf East. And after I saw that, I
was like, man, that is like exactly almost to a tea,
what we saw when I was younger. I know what

(36:11):
a coyote looks like. I've seen hundreds of coyotes. We
used to get in the mid eighties. You got decent
money for the pelts and just for to help farmers
out during caving season. We'd go out and the pastures
and shoot coyotes and we'd actually turn the pelts in
and pay for the AMMO and the you know, gas money.

(36:34):
And so I've seen I know what they look like,
and I know how big they are, and I know
what they look like with mange, and I know what
they look like in different color phases, and how big
they are. This thing we saw, you know, we didn't
see it for a long time, but we saw really
well and really close, and it was healthy and muscled,
and it moved like a cat. It just like I said,

(36:57):
it looked like a dog. And the closest thing I've seen,
uh is that some of those clips on the Elmondorf Beast,
which I found out later was also not far from
where we were, in between Bay City and Lagrange there
have you seen?

Speaker 1 (37:18):
It's been on TV quite a bit, but there's a
woman in Texas that supposedly has one of these they
called the quote unquote Texas Blue Dogs. It's stuffed in
our house. The whole thing. Have you seen that? Is
that similar as well?

Speaker 3 (37:30):
That's very similar the one. The one we saw was uh,
it was like thicker, It was a very It looked healthy.
I mean it looked like like you could see muscles
moving underneath the skin. Especially since there was no uh fur,
no hide. Uh, it really uh showed how how toned

(37:53):
and muscular this thing was. That's why I thought it
was a cat. But and I mean I had the
head of a dog and it was and it was
hard to describe.

Speaker 1 (38:05):
That's a cool siding, though I would love to see
something like that.

Speaker 3 (38:10):
Yeah, I mean it was right there. It was like
literally it had followed along the side kind of kept
pace with this, and then there was a culvert in
the road, and it didn't It would have had to
either get up on the road or go around at
or whatever, but it chose right then to cross the road.

(38:33):
So it was right in front of us, and it
was running pretty good, but still, like I said, you know,
it's got to get all the way across the road.
So we saw it for a good few seconds, all right.

Speaker 1 (38:47):
So next on the list we have an is Ish
talking relative and photos flying off of the wall.

Speaker 3 (38:55):
Yeah, it's just a little quickie I thought you might enjoy.
This was at the same house I lived in for
ten years, and it was at the same one that
when I locked up with the sleep paralysis at night,
I couldn't snap out of it until the three knocks
and then I'd like come out of it. This house,

(39:18):
I had pictures of a bunch of my relatives up
on my wall, like old eight by tens and whatever
of like old black and white pictures of great grandparents
and great grandparents generations passed. And I had one of
my uncle in the early or my grandpa in the

(39:41):
early thirties sitting on a harley out in Orange Orchard.
And the other side of my family really really stuffy,
and they they were very, very religious. And my great
grandfather was the mayor of a pretty well known town

(40:07):
in Utah, and he's got a hall named after him
at a university there, and he was a big in
the church there, and he was my dad tells us
all kinds of stories about him. It's very different. The
other side of my family. They were kind of rednecks,
came up from Mexico, and he's the one that had

(40:31):
the harley, and I had a picture of him on
a buffalo hunt and this other guy's just sitting in
a straight back chair with his hands clasped over a bible.
And my sister, you're also pretty religious. I'm not, but
they stayed with the family belief. And they were visiting
me one day and we're like talking and they're looking

(40:53):
up at the pictures and they're like, oh, that's such
a good picture of him and grandmas and hands, and
and then we just the picture of the the other guy,
great grandpa. He's just sitting there all pious, like almost
like he was looking down on the rest of them,
and that was kind of like the way I had

(41:14):
it arranged, which was in no particular order, but I
had him kind of up and over and and uh, anyway,
we started kind of talking some crap about, uh, how
he's he's sitting there like he's better than everybody else,
and like, well, I'm sure he thought he was. He
was the mayor and he was the big dog. And uh.

(41:36):
Then I kept going a little further than I should have,
even than I would have with how uh kind of
straight laced my sisters are, and his picture just flew
off the wall. It didn't drop, it flew. It landed
like three feet away from the wall on the floor,
and it landed face up, and the glass shattered, and

(41:58):
and and no other picture on that wall moved, and
they were all hung exactly the same way. There was
no earthquake, nothing hit the outside, nothing else even jiggled
or moved or anything. But that picture of the guy
that I had been shit talking flew off the wall

(42:20):
and landed face side up, and it's the glass shattered.
And that was the last time my sisters went to
my house too. They were like, man, you can just
come visit us a dad's house when we come to down.

Speaker 1 (42:36):
You know, Taylor, that whole three knocks thing that would
bring you out of your sleep paralysis. There's definitely something
to that, obviously. Have you ever come across another encounter
or experience where they said that three knocks would bring
them out of their sleep paralysis.

Speaker 3 (42:55):
No, I've heard. I've heard stuff three knocks meaning something
or or three knocks being a thing, but I've never
like experienced it at any time other than when I
was in a sleep paralysis and that, like I said,

(43:17):
it was just like it was just like if you're
sleeping somebody slaps you. I mean, I could come right
out of it.

Speaker 1 (43:24):
Well, I mean the three knocks is usually the mocking
of the Holy Trinity. So it is interesting that the
one picture that flew off the wall was this, you know,
supposedly very on the high horse, pious man holding a Bible,
and then you have three knocks that brings you out
of this horrifying sleep paralysis. It's very scary to have

(43:47):
sleep paralysis from what I hear, So I don't know,
there's definitely something there.

Speaker 3 (43:53):
Yeah, it was it was interesting. Like I said, it's
only one weird thing, but it was freaking bizarre.

Speaker 1 (44:04):
That's one way to keep relatives out of the house,
right if you want you don't want visitors.

Speaker 3 (44:11):
Yeah, one way to do it. Man.

Speaker 1 (44:14):
Yeah, this is Shannon Lacroe and you're listening to into
the frame on the X. All right, Next, let's let's

(44:35):
talk about skin Walker.

Speaker 3 (44:37):
All right. Before I got a real job and turned
into an adult, and when I was like nineteen or twenty,
I was working at this it's a lodge thirty five
forty miles from the Grand Canyon, and my mom worked

(45:01):
there way back, like in the fifties, and my sister,
my older sister worked there. They hired these people were
of a specific faith. The people had owned it, and
they hired people of basically of that faith. Or they

(45:22):
kind of recruited heavily at one of those Utah schools.
But they had this deal kind of where anybody that'd
worked there when as soon as they had kids, you know,
their kids were getting an interview and if things worked out,
they could go work there too. And they had like

(45:46):
a restaurant, a gift shop with a bunch of Indian art.
There was a gas station, so there were all kinds
of jobs to do, and you lived there. They had
dormitories separated for girls and guys, and they also had

(46:07):
a lot of Native Americans working there that did a
lot of weaving. They sold a lot of weaving and
pottery and art and beadwork out of their gift shop,
and so a lot of those people had children, and

(46:27):
they were mostly like the the maids at the hotel.
Uh there was a hotel attached and some cabin rental cabins,
and so it was kind of a mixture of these
native people and good college kids. And I got an

(46:50):
interview and and got the job up there. And I
was working in the out and the gas station, which
at this time, this was like mid eighty eighty four ish,
and so all I really was was like filling cars
up and cleaning windshield and hanging out and not much

(47:14):
to the job. And I didn't really get along with
a lot of the the people they hired from their
university weren't my kind of people. So I moved my
stuff out of there into the behind the gas stations

(47:35):
where all the native people lived, and so I fell
right in with those guys and became really good friends
with them really quickly. And so they were telling me,
you know, yeah, you need to come down and hang
out with us on the reservation sometimes. So we'd get
a day off and I'd run down there. It was

(47:57):
about a two hour drive maybe to get down to
the reservation and just the edge of it. And I
went down there with them a few times and had
a great time. Man. I learned all kinds of stuff
about their their lore and their life and everything else.
And well, I walked in one day and one of

(48:19):
them was listening to a like I straight out straight
out of the Western movie The Indian the beating on
their drums and singing. I don't want to be disrespectful
of racist, but it was just like you'd imagine and
all the movies. And I was like, for you really
listening to that. They were like, Hey, this is big.

(48:41):
We're trying to learn this. I want to be a
singer in the ceremonies. I want to be into one
of the drum guys. And I was like, I didn't
know it was that big of a deal. And they're like, yeah, well,
in a couple of weeks we're having a I can't
remember pow wow. And he says, come to me, you know,

(49:03):
they're like, come down to that and check it out.
So I went down to that and they had Indian
dancing and singing, and it's like I was just fascinated
by all this because you know, I'm like nineteen twenty
year old guy that had never really been away from home,
and I was just like fascinated. And so when it

(49:26):
was over, when the season was over, I didn't have anywhere,
you know, I was just going to go home. I
didn't have a job at home, I was out of
high school, wasn't going to college. And they're like, hey,
why don't you come down just come hang out and
live with us for a while. So I'm like, yeah, absolutely.

(49:49):
So I just went down there and I was staying
with these guys and kind of right on the edge
of the Navajo and Hopi Reservation is where we started out,
and I was just living the life. We'd hang out

(50:09):
every night, just hang out around fires talking. They had
a house that they lived in. The parents kind of
all lived separate, and they gave the kids one house.
So it was all just a full time party in
video games and all this stuff. And I was just

(50:31):
kind of getting immersed in the culture and how life
was out there, and that the good part about how
they didn't have have to worry about a whole lot,
but also the struggle and that there really wasn't a
whole lot out there, and they never talked. Every now
and then they talk about like the skin walker thing,

(50:53):
but they really didn't like to talk about it, and
they they talk about it just enough to scare me,
like around a fire. They're like, oh, yeah, they hate
white people, and uh, and then they'd started laughing and gon,
it's all good. And after I'd been out there for
like three weeks or a month. Again, not to sound racist,
but I realized, I, like, there was no other white

(51:16):
people out there, and I was just like, man, I
know how these people feel.

Speaker 4 (51:19):
You know.

Speaker 3 (51:19):
It was kind of getting an appreciation for being the
odd guy out and there was There was one other
white guy, and he drove. He was an EMT and
he owned his own ambulance when he was married to
a Native girl, and people they got sick or got
cuts or just needed a little help. Instead of driving

(51:44):
all the way to a place with a doctor trying
to mess with government bureaucracy and insurance, they'd come to
this guy and he'd patch him up or hook him up,
give him, you know, medicine that he had or that
he could get a hold of. But he was the
only other white guy that that was out there. And anyway,

(52:13):
after I'd been out there for about a month, they
were like, yeah, we're gonna go way back to sheep camp.
It's time where we're going to shear the sheep and
dehorned the calves and why. It was like all this
cowboys stuff that I only seen in movies and heard of.
And I was like, hell, yeah, I want to go.
And they're like, man, it is way out there and
this it's like hogon's to mud huts or tents and

(52:41):
that's it. And we're gonna be out there for like
two weeks. And I was like, no, that's cool. I'm down.
And they said, okay, we got to go to uh
there was this other thing kind of like a big
community sale. I don't remember what they called it, but
it's where they bought it all the provisions to go
on this to go up there for a couple of weeks.

(53:04):
So we're there and we're buying all the getting water
and soda, pop and food and stuff, and they sell
for the fry bread. A lot of these guys. People
would buy like fifty pounds or bigger bags of flour
and then they put it into ziplock bags and they'd

(53:27):
sell it at this bizarre thing we were at for
people to take up in the hill, said cook with
And so we were sitting there and I saw a
bunch of these big ziploc bags filled with flour, and
I said, oh, look at that. We can even get
some coke to take up there. And I mean, it
is one hundred percent of kiddy. And I'd never touched

(53:49):
cocaine in my life. I wouldn't have known if it
would have hit me in the head. But I saw
movies and I thought it looked like a brick of coke.
And so they kind of laughed. And then Uh, this
guy being older, uh Indian nav a whole guy, uh,

(54:10):
with kind of glaucomas in his eyes, he says, oh,
funny with your cocaine joke. And I just turned around
and uh, he says, billy ghana with their cocaine, And
bill agana just means white person. I'm probably not saying
it right, and it's not a derogatory term, it's just

(54:33):
the word. But the way he was saying it. It
was sliding out of his mouth and he was looking
at me. It was just like he was calling me
the N word, and uh, I was like what and
uh my friends just saw this guy and they were like, oh,
oh no, he was just kidding. It's no, we're sorry,
and uh he said it again. He kept saying it

(54:55):
Bill a gun and cocaine and you brought the alcohol
and you guys did this, and like all of a sudden,
the fact that I was white and the only white
I felt really terrified for a minute. And my friends
again were like, no, he's sorry, you know, and I said, hey,
I'm sorry. It was just a joke. I didn't mean

(55:16):
to offend you. I didn't, you know. I'm sorry, and
they're like kind of trying to hustle me away from
this guy. And then he kept saying it, and I finally,
you know, I was young and dumb, and I turned
around like, hey, man, I apologize, I'm sorry, and my

(55:37):
friends grabbed me and they're like no, no, let's go,
let's go, just keep going, and the guy was still
yelling and kind of being a dick. The whole time
we were they were hustling me away, and I was like,
what's up with that guy? And uh, two of my
friends just shut up and they wouldn't even talk. And uh,
the one guy that I was really good friends with,

(55:59):
he said, he's just you don't want to mess with
that guy.

Speaker 5 (56:02):
He's the people say he's a witch and that his
family people people just stay away from him.

Speaker 3 (56:13):
I said, what do you mean a witch, like a
like a witch witch and he's like, yeah, they do
bad magic and they live out by their you know,
out by themselves, and you don't want to piss him off.
And I'm like, well, it's a little late for that.
And he's like, well, you know, don't worry about it.

(56:34):
You know, we're going to go up sheep camp. Everything's
going to be cool. We'll get back and things will
die down. So we go up to this sheep camp
for a week and we're sharing sheep dehorning calves. I
was having the time of my life. I saw kinds
of cool stuff and learned a bunch of stuff. And

(56:54):
then they were like, all right, we're gonna go see
my grandma before we head back to town. And she
lived like even another ten miles out in the middle
of nowhere from the sheep camp that was fifteen miles
from nowhere. So now we are like out in the
middlest of the middle of nowhere, and there's like three

(57:17):
or four little hogans out there where this guy's grandma
and one of his uncles and some other relatives lived.
And we were out there for a night and we're
having a great night and good food, hanging out by
the fire. That was the furthest from civilization I've ever been,

(57:38):
and the night sky was so clear you could see.
It was amazing, and I said, I was having the
time of my life. And the next night, the second night,
we were hanging out and it just kind of got
it felt weird. All of a sudden, things felt weird.

(57:58):
And his grandma had three dogs, like a healer's cattle dogs,
and they were like, you know, they're pretty badass little dogs.
And they jumped up from the fire and went and
ran into the house. And my friends like, man, it's weird.

(58:20):
They never do that. And so we're sitting there by
the fire and we hear this, like again not to
be racist, but like in the movies, like a war
cry type sound like you would hear if you're watching

(58:42):
a movie about the natives and it kind of was
jarring out there in the pitch black in the middle
of nowhere, and I'm like, what the hell is that?
And uh, they said, ll go inside, So we go inside,
and we heard it again, and then we started to
hear like iotes yapping, but it was like they were

(59:08):
running away. And then there was a deeper, more grun
to growl, and we look out the window and there
was a light like a torch way far out, and
then it was closer, and then it was closer, and
it was and it was like running in a zigzag,
but running way faster than like a person or an

(59:32):
animal should have been able to in this, like I said,
a zigzag pattern. And we're like, man, what the hell
is that? And the dogs are freaking out and we
were hearing this uh wolf howl and seeing this light
zigzag and uh. His grandma had a it was pretty standard.

(59:54):
Everybody had guns out there, had a old rifle sitting
over by the doorway, and they didn't it didn't have
a real door to have like a big rug hanging
in the doorway. And the dogs were going crazy, and
I was like, what the hell is going on? And

(01:00:16):
she just said just you guys sit down, and the
light stopped and the light went out, and then we
heard more of this weird sound. And then there was
a smack on the backside of this hogan we were in,
and then another went on the side of it, and
then right out like in front of the door aways

(01:00:39):
we heard the howl again or whatever it was, and
she stuck the rifle out the front of the thing
and shot, and then nothing happened. We kept hearing stuff,
and she shot a second time and we heard a
like a yap, like a dog or something got hit,

(01:01:02):
and Dannifer dogs settled down and then they ran outside
and so they like were like, well, everything must be
cool now the dogs are fine, it's gone. And I said,
what the hell was all of that?

Speaker 4 (01:01:15):
Hell?

Speaker 3 (01:01:16):
What's going on? And then and my friends wouldn't say
anything to me. They didn't want to talk about it.
And then the grandma was like, what's going on, Like
she knew something was up, and so then they told
her the whole story about me and the claucoma guy
at the market, and she just shook her head and

(01:01:39):
she said, you guys are messing with stuff you shouldn't
mess with. And I said it was you know, it
was my fault, but I didn't. I wasn't messing with anything.
I just made a stupid joke, and uh, it wasn't appreciated.
I tried to apologize, but maybe I was kind of,
you know, being rude to the guy even in my apology.

(01:02:02):
And the next morning it was blight, like maybe two
hours after that, and she's like, well, you guys should
probably go and get back to where you're going. So
we went back to town and we were hanging out
for a couple of days. Nobody talked all the way
back to town and probably ten words like the whole time,

(01:02:23):
and then we never really talked about it that day.
And then the next day I was like, man, is
this something we should talk about? And they're like, man,
you don't even want to know. That night that an
ambulance driver came over to the house. He was hanging
out and they're playing video games and stuff, and he goes, oh, Taylor,

(01:02:44):
I saw your buddy yesterday. And I was like, what, buddy,
And he goes, the old man he came in two
nights ago and we dug a bullet out of his ass,
and I was like, yeah, we were like what, and
he goes, yeah, and the old man came in, we

(01:03:04):
dug a thirty caliber bullet out of his ass. I
was like wow. And then my friend's like, man, we
shouldn't even And I was like, I don't know. I
don't know your I mean, I know your traditions and
I respect you, but I'm going to tell him. And
I told the guy the story and he was he

(01:03:25):
was like, yeah, I'm not going to add anything to that,
but I've helped this family a couple of times, and
I've seen shit that I don't want to talk about.

Speaker 1 (01:03:36):
Holy crap. I was wondering if that was going to happen,
But when you actually said it, I was like, okay,
that is okay. Wow. Did you how much longer did
you stay after that? Or did you boogie?

Speaker 3 (01:03:53):
Well? I was getting ready to leave anyway, I've been
for a month, yeah, so but I stayed for another
week or so. And this also, this is nineteen eighty four.
I still talk to the guy all the time. I mean,
we're friends, but we have never talked about that again.

Speaker 1 (01:04:11):
So this what you perceived as a torch light off
in the distance when it was quote unquote running back
and forth, whatever it was somebody holding it or whatever
it was, did it dim or did the shape of
it alter when it was in this zig zag pattern?

Speaker 3 (01:04:27):
No, And that's what That's something that was really odd
because I mean it looked like a flame, like a
flickering flame, you know. But there's it's like, just in
pure physics, how the hell could a flame keep lit
moving at that speed? But but it's like we wouldn't
see like you could see the flame. It was like

(01:04:50):
you saw it here, then you saw it here, then
you saw it here, then here.

Speaker 1 (01:04:55):
And it was moving faster than a person could run.

Speaker 3 (01:04:58):
Oh shit, yeah, yeah, yeah, it was crazy. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:05:02):
I love though how the Grandma's like you all need
to go now bye, thanks for stopping bye.

Speaker 4 (01:05:08):
See.

Speaker 3 (01:05:09):
Yeah, she didn't kick us out in the middle of
the night, but as soon as it was was like, man, guys,
bye bye.

Speaker 1 (01:05:16):
That would have sucked out in the middle of the
night with whatever is out there. Yeah. So did you
see the old man again before you left?

Speaker 3 (01:05:26):
No? And I'm glad I didn't. He's I mean, he was.
He was terrifying as it was, this guy. He was
he was very tall and thick, and I said, most
of these again not to sound racist, but generally speaking,
they have very black or dark hair and dark eyes.

(01:05:49):
And uh, this guy was old, so he had long
white hair, but his eyes were like almost catteract. They
almost looked like a like a bluish hard to describe,
but they were terrifying. And he had he just and

(01:06:09):
I thought about it even at the time, like he
just threw off this evil, shitty aura. But at the
time I was thinking it might just be because he's
pissed at me. You know, I said something I was
it was stupid. You know, these people have been through
a lot, and sure, you know, white people screwed him
over and brought into alcohol and caused all these problems.

(01:06:33):
And you know, I was there and I was a
target and I was saying stupid stuff. So maybe I
just brought it out in him. But he really did
project like not a whole lot of goodness coming out
of him.

Speaker 1 (01:06:48):
Holy smokes. See. And even with whatever he had going
on with his eyes, I hazard to say, he could
see just fine, and see a whole lot better than
we could, like another kind of sight.

Speaker 3 (01:07:00):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's uh, I said. And these guys
they don't like I knew what skin They told me,
I'll tell you what a skin markers are, but they
don't just sit around and talk about them, or the
ones I was my friends didn't. And then like when
we were out in the desert in the middle of

(01:07:20):
the night and they started saying something about, you know,
they love white people and they just scare me, just
to give me a little crap, and then but just
long enough to kind of get me fired up. And
then boot we'd be talking about girls and cars and
guns and like normal stuff, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:07:42):
And there was no hint of headlights or tail lights
or hearing any vehicles pull up or leave during that
whole experience.

Speaker 3 (01:07:52):
No, no, And it was like coming straight through the desert,
it would have been like a bit like a Baha
wow where there was the only road going in and
out actually to where this little group of Hogan's was
was the one that we drove in on. And this

(01:08:13):
came from like a forty five degree angle direction out
from the desert towards it.

Speaker 1 (01:08:20):
After you left, did you, I mean, because you say
you still talk to one of the guys that you
were out there with. Did did the old dude ever
bring anything up? Did anyone ask him was your ass, okay?
After getting shot after stock and the white guy, like,
you know, did anything ever come up?

Speaker 3 (01:08:42):
Nobody said, Nobody said a word. They saw him, you know,
they'd see him around town at that uh. And I
can't remember what they call that now, But it's just
like a big general square and it's it's kind of
like out on the road side. If you've ever been
through the Southwest, you know, on the road side they'll
sell their bead work and a jewelry and it's like that,

(01:09:03):
only it's actually deeper in, so they're not trying to
sell each other their own shit. It's just kind of
like a big rummage sale. But they sell a lot
of food items there also. And and that guy would
come in him and his I guess he had a
two sisters and a mom that was still alive. I

(01:09:23):
don't even know how, because this guy looked like he
was one hundred and ten, but supposedly he had a
mother that was still alive that would come in every
now and then too. And my friend Phil, he said,
people just stay away from him because they're creepy, and
everybody knows that they're into weird shit. But nobody says
anything to them, or you know, everybody's kind.

Speaker 1 (01:09:44):
Of afraid of I can see why. Well that makes sense,
so maybe, you know, it wasn't such a great question
because I think that the prevailing thought is we don't
say the word skinwalker around here. We don't talk about
people that we think might be skin walkers around here.

(01:10:05):
We just keep our mouths shut. So that makes sense.

Speaker 3 (01:10:09):
That's why I like the ambulance driver. He just as
soon as he said that he'd been out there and
done stuff for him, he was sorry that he said it,
like he didn't even want to talk about it, you know, yeah,
he didn't want to bring any bad And then I
was even thinking, I was like, man, yeah, if it's
at a point where if they really are into all

(01:10:32):
kinds of their weird shit magic and it's something that
they still need some flunky EMT to drive out there
and has broke down old ambulance to help them with
normal medicine, then it must be bad and it must
be something that I don't know if they swear him
to silence or or he's just terrified of him, you.

Speaker 1 (01:10:55):
Know, yeah, yeah, it could be either way. I would
imagine though, considering what you witnessed I'd imagine they are
absolutely terrified of that dude. Ooh, I love that one.
That one is creepy Taylor, holy shy sound. Oh my god.
To have him actually have a wound that matched after

(01:11:18):
they had been telling you, nope, nope, let's just let's
squash this, let's go to sheep camp. Everything's cool, everybody's cool.
Well it wasn't so cool. I guess he held onto
that for a little bit.

Speaker 3 (01:11:28):
Well, yeah, that's and it was, like I said, it
was like, I mean, I'm sure they've been out there
for generations, so everybody knows everybody. But still just for
if that's really what happened. For this guy to pick
the fact that I'm with the grandkids of somebody and
he knows that we're gonna after sheep camp or gay

(01:11:50):
and how did he know where we were when we
were there always struck me as odd too.

Speaker 1 (01:11:58):
Oh yeah, that's true, because everyone knew you're going to
sheep camp, but maybe not everyone knew that you were
visiting the grandma.

Speaker 3 (01:12:05):
Yeah, that came out at the very last minute. It
was like, well, shit, we're this close, let's go see
my grandma.

Speaker 1 (01:12:11):
Okay, oh man, well that probably means that he was
watching y'all something. Do you remember anything weird during the
time at sheep camp?

Speaker 3 (01:12:23):
No, man, it was a blast. Like I said, I
had the time of my life. I saw. You know,
I'd never been around I mean a city boy. It
was like only a town of thirty two thousand and
thirty thousand when I was grown up. It still I
had no experience with a livestock at all. So watching

(01:12:43):
the sheep shearing and every night we were like barbecue
and sheep and goats, and it was I just was
seeing all kinds of stuff I've never seen. It was
a blast.

Speaker 1 (01:12:55):
That does sound so fun, especially just every night you're
just you're out, you're out of doors, you're having the campfires,
you're seeing the dark sky above you. But holy smokes,
that one as a big wazer. Okay, so last, but
not lease, let's talk about what happened in Pasco.

Speaker 3 (01:13:16):
Oh, it's another weird one. Like like with tight ststers.
I got no explanation for this one either. I was
working like a midshift while I was getting home at
midnight roughly, and I would park my truck, walk around

(01:13:39):
the house and go up the deck and go in
through the sliding door in the back, and we had
one hundred and twenty pounds raw wiler at the time,
and he'd always meet me back there at the fence
when I came in. Then my wife at the time

(01:13:59):
and my kid was like my youngest it was there.
He was like five ish. Probably they'd be asleep, and
so I had to hang out with a dog, watch
TV for a while and go to bed. I was
coming around the side gate the like I always do,
and the dog wasn't there, and it's like, man, what's

(01:14:22):
up with that? And like whe right then every hair
on my body stood up and I was just like
almost terrified in fear for no reason. It's got to
be like when there's a grizzly bear about to jump
out of the bushes ash here or something. I looked
up and there was this guy looked kind of like

(01:14:43):
a I don't know, like a like a picture a
cartoon genie maybe had like a it looked like a
dark skinned Indian, the swami kind of guy, like with
the traditional cartoon turbine and that stuff that you have.

(01:15:06):
I was just like whoa. And when I could talk,
I was like like, who are you? He goes who
do you think I am? I said, I don't know
who are you? And he goes, you know who I am?
And I said, I don't know who you are? Who
are you? And what do you want? And he goes,

(01:15:27):
you know what I want? And then it's like clicking
in my head that his mouth isn't moving, but I
can hear him talking. He's like not really floating, but
doesn't seem to be on the ground, and there's kind
of a like almost like he's a three D projection.
But I know if I stuck my finger out, I

(01:15:49):
could poke him in the chest the very odd look.
And I said again, I said I don't know who
you are, and he's like, you know who I am?
And I said, what the hell do you want? And
he's like, you know what I want and we'll meet again.

(01:16:09):
And then he was gone, just like gone, And I
was like, what the hell was that? And I walked
upstairs and my big tough dog was laying underneath the
kitchen table. He wouldn't even come out, and then he
came out when I came through the door, and I
went and I woke my wife up and I told

(01:16:31):
her and she's like, what I think? I said? I
just saw the devil when I walked in. I said,
I just saw the devil. She's like, what the hell
are you talking about? But again, that's another one that
was like twenty five years ago and nothing's happened since.
And I don't know what the hell it was, but
it was very odd.

Speaker 2 (01:16:52):
Man.

Speaker 3 (01:16:52):
What did you do? Huh?

Speaker 1 (01:16:54):
We shall meet again? That sounds so ominous? Did he
say it? Did he say that last part an ominous way?

Speaker 3 (01:17:02):
He just said no, It was all very flat to me.

Speaker 1 (01:17:05):
It was all very matter of fact.

Speaker 3 (01:17:06):
Yeah, very like you know who I am? It's like
end of this day. I don't. I mean I wanted it.

Speaker 1 (01:17:13):
Who I really don't.

Speaker 3 (01:17:15):
That's why I asked, and you know what I want? Well,
actually I don't. You're scaring the crap out of me,
and I don't know who you are.

Speaker 1 (01:17:26):
I mean, so you say you looked up and there
he was? Was he standing in front of you, in
your path to get into the house.

Speaker 3 (01:17:34):
Yeah, yes, m it's like like out of nowhere. And
like I said, took me a minute to move because
I was it was that fight or flight thing, and
every hair on my body and I was like almost
frozen for a minute. And I was just terrified and
I didn't know why, like an adrenaline shot.

Speaker 1 (01:17:56):
Well, also, your one hundred and twenty pound rottweiler knew
from inside the house that's some really bad stuff was
going on outside.

Speaker 3 (01:18:05):
Yeah, I mean every night that was our thing. He
was out there waiting for me, like you know, he'd
hear my truck and so he'd come over the side
gate and that was it. But not tonight he was inside.

Speaker 1 (01:18:21):
What was this guy wearing? What was his clothes?

Speaker 3 (01:18:24):
Like that was that's the other thing he was wearing.
I'm gonna come across as the most racist person was
ever on your show. But he looked like a like
a swami, like a like a Pakistan Indian type, that
dark dark skin like that and the cloth loincloth type

(01:18:51):
thing that they wear like I don't know if that's
like oldie time biblical stuff. If it was like a
like the Gurus and the swamis off a TV and cartoons.
Black hair, black.

Speaker 1 (01:19:09):
Eyes, black eyes, No no whites in the eyes, uh.

Speaker 3 (01:19:16):
No, just black, like supernatural demon eyes.

Speaker 1 (01:19:21):
How far away do you think you were from him?

Speaker 3 (01:19:24):
I was clo like I said, man, if I had
the guts, I was close enough to poke him in
the chest to see that he was real, but probably
three feet three four feet away. It came out of nowhere.

Speaker 1 (01:19:37):
And then describing as much detail as you can how
he left or poofed or whatever he did, it just
gone like he just did he fizzle loud or it
was like you blinked and then you open your eyes
and he's gone.

Speaker 3 (01:19:52):
That's it. He was there and then he was gone. Hmm,
no poof, no sizzle, no sound, no.

Speaker 1 (01:20:02):
Mouth never moved.

Speaker 3 (01:20:05):
And now and it took me a minute to figure
that out, like I said, because you know, he kept
saying the same stuff over and over. You know who
I am, you know what I want? Like the third
time he said it, I was like, damn man, his
mouth hasn't even moved. How am I getting this?

Speaker 1 (01:20:20):
I mean, besides him floating in the air, I think
the mouth not moving would be one of the creepier parts,
just besides you know how he appeared in front of you.
Of course, did he ever move his hands or make
any gestures?

Speaker 3 (01:20:36):
No, no, like it was all my life could have
been a hologram if it wasn't for he didn't do
it and didn't do anything really his face never really changed,
except that at the very end when he said we'll
meet again, he had this kind of a smirky, crappy

(01:20:56):
look on a grin on his face.

Speaker 1 (01:21:01):
I hope you don't have to meet him again. I
don't think that he was something good, especially since you're
primal fear kicked in even before you saw him.

Speaker 3 (01:21:10):
Yeah, that's that was kind of a bummer.

Speaker 1 (01:21:15):
Yeah, I mean we hear about that a lot in
various accounters where before they ever see anything, their their
body is telling them you're about to have a life
changing situation.

Speaker 3 (01:21:27):
Yeah. Yeah, that's what I mean when read a lot
of stories and watch a lot of stuff on the
outdoors still, you know, and when people are getting tracked
by a mountain lion or there's a grizzly in the
bushes getting ready to jump on him, that sixth sense

(01:21:48):
kind of kicks in and they get locked up with adrenaline.

Speaker 2 (01:21:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:21:52):
Yeah, and that's even before well, if they even see
what it is that's given them this primal fear right,
and sometimes they do see it and they have that confirmation,
which is horrifying, or maybe it's worse not to know.
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:22:07):
It could be.

Speaker 1 (01:22:08):
Any kind of yeah, no thanks, yeah, big no thanks
on that. I mean, that's a that's a no thanks
sided that's a very unique one. I hope that somebody
hearing that will please reach out to me because I
would love to pass that along to Taylor and go,
You're not the only one to see this devil genie dude,

(01:22:31):
whatever the hell he is. That's that's unique.

Speaker 3 (01:22:35):
That's why one of the things that got me to
tell you these are all just kind of little random stuff.
But I notice a lot of times you have other
people that listen that have had similar stuff or know
someone that has, and they can kind of get answers yep.

Speaker 1 (01:22:53):
And a lot of times it's just the little details,
even in the bigger picture of things, that get somebody
to reach out. So I do hope that somebody does. So, Yeah,
as Taylor said, if you or someone you know, or
even if you've just heard it on another show, send
it along, because it's no none you know out of
the two of us. It's not like you can listen
to every show that's out there. There's so many and

(01:23:14):
so many encounters in online that are written. So if
somebody comes across something like that, that is extremely unique.
But Taylor, I thank you so much for being willing
to come on and share these.

Speaker 3 (01:23:27):
Oh, thank you. I appreciate it.

Speaker 5 (01:23:32):
Well, I'm so so.

Speaker 4 (01:23:33):
I was given the name by my parents.

Speaker 3 (01:23:35):
My business, I've.

Speaker 4 (01:23:36):
Such college and I've done these things as my profession.

Speaker 3 (01:23:38):
I producing at the back.

Speaker 4 (01:23:40):
But it says, forget it, that's something your story, that's
all gone, that's all a possible. I want to see
the Melia you are now when nobody knows who that is,
because we don't know ourselves except for listening to out
of and consulting our memoris. But then that's a really

(01:24:05):
and that again leads us BacT to do this question.

Speaker 3 (01:24:09):
What are you? That is the meaning. We shall see
how they play with the success. We'll buy the coins
to get you to come out of your show and
find out when you're very hard