December 5, 2024 • 39 mins
Ginny Boggess is in her first season as the head coach at The University of Toledo after a successful stint coaching Monmouth. With a decorated career as an assistant, particularly as a recruiter, Ginny comes to Toledo ready to build off of the foundation left by Tricia Cullop and her staff.
Ginny joins Mark Schindler on the pod to discuss her career, acclimating to Toledo, building out a new staff, developing a new playing style on a roster with minimal turnover, and much more!
Timestamps:
1:10 First Month
2:15 Savage Arena's Homecourt Advantage
5:08 Toledo on the Radar
7:45 Adapting a Program that's Already Successful
13:00 Teaching a New Offense
16:14 Kendall Caruthers
18:45 Empowering a Confident Guard
22:23 Instilling Quick Decisions
25:25 Building Relationships
28:15 Building a New Staff
34:10 Continuing Learning as a Coach?
You can listen to the pod on Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/theyve-got-now/id1652378572
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2eTVgaVudBvS9yox3XbgGX?si=16a02c3ea75942e8
You can watch the pod on https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSPW9eR1D5GWBw1lRpM8qTDSlliwbGp8J&si=rX7RfQZmuB6XAa3T
As always, a major thank you to James Edwards III for the intro and outro music! If you have not already, follow Mark on Twitter @MG_Schindler and be sure to rate and review the pod!
Send any questions, comments, or feedback Mark's way, and enjoy the show. #ncaawomensbasketball #toledo #rockets #maction #macwbb
Ginny joins Mark Schindler on the pod to discuss her career, acclimating to Toledo, building out a new staff, developing a new playing style on a roster with minimal turnover, and much more!
Timestamps:
1:10 First Month
2:15 Savage Arena's Homecourt Advantage
5:08 Toledo on the Radar
7:45 Adapting a Program that's Already Successful
13:00 Teaching a New Offense
16:14 Kendall Caruthers
18:45 Empowering a Confident Guard
22:23 Instilling Quick Decisions
25:25 Building Relationships
28:15 Building a New Staff
34:10 Continuing Learning as a Coach?
You can listen to the pod on Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/theyve-got-now/id1652378572
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2eTVgaVudBvS9yox3XbgGX?si=16a02c3ea75942e8
You can watch the pod on https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSPW9eR1D5GWBw1lRpM8qTDSlliwbGp8J&si=rX7RfQZmuB6XAa3T
As always, a major thank you to James Edwards III for the intro and outro music! If you have not already, follow Mark on Twitter @MG_Schindler and be sure to rate and review the pod!
Send any questions, comments, or feedback Mark's way, and enjoy the show. #ncaawomensbasketball #toledo #rockets #maction #macwbb
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Both vin to the episode that they've got. Now, I'm
really excited to be joined today by the head coach
over at University of Toledo, Genny Bogus Ginny. First and foremost,
how are you doing?
Speaker 2 (00:16):
I'm doing so good coming off two days of recruiting.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
So I was in Minnesota and Cincinnati but little scratchy
voice from the airlines and the hotels, but I couldn't
possibly be better.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Yeah, it's also I mean that's just November and Ohio,
so I mean, you know, you get used to it.
I mean West Virginia is pretty much Ohio, so you know,
you know how it goes. But yeah, I mean somehow
already about a month end of the season. Thanksgiving is
just around the corner, which I am not ready for.
I'm ready for it, but also I just know like
my game watching schedule the next couple of days is
(00:47):
gonna be nuts. How are you kind of feeling so far?
I know you probably haven't had a second to really
sit down and think about it, but what is you
know what his first month kind of felt like as
you guys have gotten into games, the first.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Month felt I think probably like any new head coach
or or you know coach taking over a new position
would say, it feels exciting, it feels encouraging.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
You know, there have been bumps in the road.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
I am so proud of this scene and the leadership
on the team and the buy in of the young
kids and the buy in of the returners. So you know,
it doesn't matter what we're going into, it matters who we're.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Going in with.
Speaker 3 (01:22):
And knowing that I've got, you know, an incredible staff
and I get a lock arms with those young women
every day and that we're all in the same mission
makes me want to work even harder to not let
them down.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
No, I love that, and I think that's you know,
a great aspect to hit on right away in terms
of just looking at this school and the tradition. I
think it's something I took for granted a little bit
being there. And you know, you made a really great
point of talking about in your opening press conference about
just like how you know, the rest of the world
is kind of catching up to Fleeto, but like Toledo
has consistently been like top ten, top twenty five in
(01:54):
the country in attendance for women's basketball, which is I mean,
credit's atrician her staff for that up, but also just
always it consistent part of my dogs decided to make
an interest too. But yeah, I think with that aspect,
like what has it been kind of getting to feel
that because again, like I think, I just it was
what I was used to when I was there, So
what has that been like kind of getting that feel?
Especially quite a few home and we gave us to
(02:15):
open up.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Well, first of all, the six man has has been
a huge boost for us, So they quite literally in
these close games are giving us that extra little jolt
that we need.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
But I'm just still humbled by it. I'm so honored.
Speaker 3 (02:27):
I knew from the outside looking in, oh, you know,
great fan base. My wife so brilliantly articulated.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
I was like, maybe it's like five thousand fans. She's like,
that's five thousand opinions, and I was like, oh.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
Yeah, still a lot of eyes on the program. But
I've been so overwhelmed by their just unwavering support. They
just are so proud of his team and these women
and who they are off the court as well who
they are as student athletes. You know, our GPA is
so impressive. These are high achieving women in every area
of their life.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
So the team is just Teaman and the fans are
just fanning and letting us kind of do what we
do and settle in. And you know, they joke about this.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
We've had a couple of really slow starts, but we've
been able to go three and oh at home, and
so they've been really excited about that. And Coach, we
know you're not trying to start slow, and I'm like, no,
we're certainly not. But they just love the game and
you can feel their energy. I think they're enjoying the
new style. They're enjoying the new players and a little
bit of the unpredictability of a faster pace.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
So it's just been so good.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
Our leadership is all in on women's basketball, which allows
me to kind of do what I do and be
the head coach and be the face of the program.
And they handle the game day experience. We've got a
brand new scoreboard with runners. It's an NBA starting like
lineup pregame show at Toledo. It's absolutely unbelievable, and like
I said, I just feel really honored to be the leader.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
Yeah. I can't say it enough to people. Again, I'm
biased because I went there, but like I just I mean,
Savage is an incredible aread. It's the best in the MAC.
It's one of the best, I mean, beats out a
lot of power arenas in terms of just how today
it is, what it's like actual in game venue is
really great. And I love what you said about the
leadership too. I think the deeper I've gotten into this,
(04:12):
the more that you kind of get an appreciation and
recognition that it's not like that everywhere you know, it
helps you Like Todd is great over with the men's program.
He does this fantastic job, but has always been, you know,
somebody who was probably the number one supporter of the
women's basketball team as well. So just having that side
by side, I think is really big, because again, not
every program is like that, especially as you know we've
(04:34):
gotten deeper in NIL too. But I want to kind
of turn it and conversely ask too, just like how
did this job come on to your radar? Because I
remember I think it was a little bit later in
the cycle for jobs starting opening up as far as
you know it goes now, and I just remember being
like shocks. I was like, I just never envisioned Tricia leaving,
(04:56):
which excited her obviously they're doing great things, but like,
you know, what was that kind of like coming off
of a really good season at Monmouth, knowing that this
was you know, when this first kind of came under
your radar.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
Well, I was not at the Final Four.
Speaker 3 (05:09):
Brian Blair has joked that ninety eight percent of the
candidates he interviewed were right there in Cleveland and so
convenient except for the one that he actually hired.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
And so I wasn't looking. I didn't have an agent, and.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
Kristin and I decided to just after three years at Monmouth,
you know, it's such a build, it's such a grind.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
We decided to forego the Final.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Four last spring and head down to actually keep US game,
which is right outside of Miami, just have like a
long weekend and just kind of unwind and relaxed. And
sure enough, we get settled in at the pool that
first day and my phone buzzes, and I get a
text message from a search firm that said, would you
be interested in the vacant position at the University of Toledo.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
And we had just sat down at.
Speaker 3 (05:52):
The pool, and I looked at Kristin and I read
it out loud, and she goes, we're moving again, aren't
we Not necessarily, so it was just it was one
of those things where you know, I reached out to
my ID at Mammoth instantly, obviously, and then it happened
very quickly.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
But the moment that I got on.
Speaker 3 (06:11):
The call with Brian Blair and his team, I felt
a palpable sense of passion for women's basketball. I felt
the support of his team for him, which lets me
know that he's a really, really good leader. You could
feel that they wanted to get it right for Toledo,
and so it moved very very quickly. We did a
zoom and then we did another one, and then they
(06:32):
flew me to Cleveland on Sunday nights, so instead of
coming back to New Jersey, I went to Cleveland.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Met with them late that night, and Monday morning he
called and I thought.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
It was actually Monday afternoon because I've met with my
athletics director at Mamoth that morning, and he called, and
I thought he was going to ask me on campus.
I thought I might be one of two, and he
instead called and offered me the job.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
So things moved quickly.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
But the more I got into the research of history
of Toledo, the tradition of excellence and not just women's basketball,
across athletics. The opportunity, you know, with three nursing majors,
three nursing freshmen on our team.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
I have a senior nursing major.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
There are women's student athletes majoring and engineering at Toledo.
There's so many opportunities here on both sides of the ball.
I thought it would be a really good fit. And
I thought it was a community that kept get behind.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
No absolutely, and I think kind of off that too,
like you mentioned, in terms of just coming in and
having that like this is a very veteran team, and
you know, the recruiting class was was was massive as well.
When you look at just kind of coming into that
kind of environment, like you mentioned, Momoth was more of
a rebuild than here. It's like, okay, cool, we have something,
and now I need to work to keep you know,
(07:44):
obviously the essence of what it was, but also put
your own stamp on it. How do you do that?
I know that's like I don't know this, it's a
pretty loaded, like bigger question, but in general, I think,
to me, I feel like that's almost harder in some
ways than starting with the blank slate because it's like,
all right, well, I don't want to lose what made
this team a MAC title contre last year. But also
(08:06):
like I have my own ideas, I have my own philosophies.
There's obviously differences with this group now after some departures,
Like how do you kind of go about that?
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Yeah? I think that was.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
One thing that I'll be honest, was really intimidating. Didn't know,
you know, when we got to Marquette Total Rebuild. Well
go back even more more when I was at Columbia
Stephanie Glands total Rebuild. When we got to Marquette Total Rebuild,
we got to Penn State Total Rebuild, Mamath Total Rebuild.
So I knew kind of what that felt like and
looked like, and had a couple of blueprints and was
(08:37):
I'm a leader that's willing to pivot. You know, just
because it worked here doesn't mean it's going to work there.
So going into it, I was like, Okay, how do
you attack something that is not necessarily a rebuild? But
there were things, you know, that needed to be addressed
to play the way that I want to play. Some
of the language was a big was a big hurdle.
You know, what do you call this? What we call it? This?
Speaker 2 (08:58):
So all those things I think that are new to
a pro.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
But I think the biggest thing was identifying what was
really important to the players and making sure that they
could hang on to that.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Some very little things.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
That with all of the newness, some little things that
they wanted to hang on to, like where they sit
in the film room instead of sitting with their little sister,
you know, the timing of their pregame or pre practice prayer.
I felt like there was a big momentum and then
we stop and pray and and that's all things they've
done for all these years. And so, you know, how
do you have conversations about you know, the things that
(09:29):
are really important to them and then the things that
are really important to me. And we had to kind
of meet in the middle on those things, as long
as none of them compromised the standard, which is at
a place Toledo was was not a problem.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
His standard was very, very high. So I think just just.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
Having that having your ears on with your eyes and
seeing and listening to what they're telling you. When the
body language shifts or when the seniors cut eyes at
each other like, wait a.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
Minute, so just let them have their stuff.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
And then I realized pretty quickly that it was more
of a renovation than a rebuild. So we didn't want
to change the structure or the foundation, but we did,
you know, we did want to mix up some things
and the way that we played and the way that
we uh, you know, the way that we left in
the way that we trained, and the way you know,
some things that we could we felt like we could
add value to them individually and collectively.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
Definitely, I do want to go back though, with talking
on the terminology piece. I think that's such a big thing, right,
Like again, I can talk to five different staffs and
they're going to have five different ways of saying the
exact same thing. So in terms of getting on page
with that, is that just like a sit down meeting
at the beginning or kind of how do you work
on I'm building that. I'm sure it's obviously something you
kind of keep doing every practice, every game and reinstilling that,
(10:36):
but you know, kind of having that mind meld between
who's here and getting on board with what the terminology is.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
You know, we use the summer for a lot of
those things.
Speaker 3 (10:44):
Normally in the summer I like to do a lot
of player development individually, you know, work on work on
their bag or you know whatever these are going to
call it these days, and their weaknesses. But we spent
it was really important to the seniors. They made it
clear like they needed to know, like big picture, what
are we doing?
Speaker 2 (11:01):
What is this pace that you speak of.
Speaker 3 (11:02):
Unfortunately, we had Nan Garcia on our team who I
coached at Penn State and could kind of be the
translator for me at times and kind of connect the
dots as far as what we're trying to do in
the pace and things like that. But no, it's just
really important this summer for them to get that big
picture of view. And so we quite literally had a
vocabulary sheet and these are offensive.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Terms, defensive terms. You know, do you call lock and chase?
Speaker 3 (11:26):
You know, what do you call defending a stagger? All
the things around the board, defending ball screens they primarily
iced in the past, So we have three different ball
screen coverages. You know, how are we communicating that to them?
How are they communicating that to one another? So there
was all these different layers of language. So it's like
how we talk to them, how they talk to us,
how they talked to one another was really the biggest
(11:47):
thing because the seniors naturally early on would revert back
to their native language and then we would translate for
the freshman.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
So we had to really buy in. And I'm proud
of the work that we did there early.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Yeah, I think, I mean kind of like you're hitting
on too. It's so fun to see too, because like obviously,
like I don't want to take away anything from the
last couple years because some of the best i mean
pure competitiveness in basketball that this school seemed. But also
like I think what's been really cool is right away.
I mean I just can watch seeing like you know,
being somebody's watched cra gosson she was at Ben Davis,
(12:23):
like Samue mcconnoins since she was, you know, a high schooler,
which also really cool story to you just for her,
like somebody who was not a scholarship player to like
get to where she's at. But like I can watch
both of them and say, I look at this new
office and like, I think this is better for them
in terms of what they can do. And you know,
again that's always how things change and evolve, but it's
not even just the terminology aspect like you mentioned. I
(12:45):
think this is just I mean, in terms of two
different styles of playing basketball. Last year, I mean so
much and it was again it was successful, but like
so much of it was set play driven, smaller pace,
and now it is just like it's a lot of
to me at least in watching, it's a lot more
actions instead of trying to run plays. And I think
that plays so well with again a player like you're
(13:07):
a player like Samy who's just athletic and slash can
make plays, but you can tell too, like you know,
especially you know, I was watching the Marshall game back
again yesterday and I was like, you know, as compared
to now too, like you can see like, oh okay,
well you know there's there's still like that little those
little like lag moments of like filling in in spots.
But again, I think that's part of what makes it
(13:27):
really fun. You can see like where it's going to
keep picking up. But how do you work on on
on making that kind of shift, because that is a
big shift, especially like I think people watch just on
like the actual on core product, but I think what
you are practicing is like just wildly different in terms
of like how you're instilling basketball and kind of teaching reads,
(13:48):
So what is that process like, you know, on top
of the terminology too.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
Well, for them, it probably feels grueling.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
I think the first thing I would say is that
we had to unlearn a lot of things that were
programmed and there, and I mean that in the best
possible way. You know, when you're running set plays, there's
there's the check down reads and they're and they're really
really high IQ players you've got to be to play
for Tricia Clup.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
But we kind of had to unlearn that.
Speaker 3 (14:13):
That fear of mistake, or the fear of failure failure,
or the fear of running play to completion.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
There's no completion.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
And so one day I remember so vividly it was like,
you know, some of these aha moments because we're learning
just as much as they are as we go through this.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
I said, how many actions do we need to get
a shot?
Speaker 3 (14:32):
And I was saying it kind of like we should
have scored by now, and they looked at me and
they're like, we don't know how many actions do we need?
Speaker 2 (14:38):
And I was like, no, no, we.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
Need one if we do it right. And so and
then obviously the more we you know, switchalize the floor,
the better we are. And so I was like, oh
my gosh, they just don't know yet yet, and so
freeing them up to make mistakes and to get curious
on the court, you know. Again, like I said, these
are bright women, high achieving women, so they want to
get it right, they want to get it right every time.
Allowing them to make mistakes and encouraging aggressive mistakes I
(15:02):
think was a big underwriting to kind of the success
and the progress that you're seeing now.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
They had to learn to trust each other.
Speaker 3 (15:10):
You know, there was a lot of conversation earlier about hey, listen, coach,
we just did what what coach said and it worked.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
And I'm like, yeah, it worked really well.
Speaker 3 (15:17):
And so now I'm giving them the freedom to make choices,
and then also coupling that with you know, hey, all
this freedom comes with responsibility on our shot selections, on
our pace, those kinds of things, and so.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
Proud of they're buying Kiera and Sammy especially.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
I think this system is great for nand Garcia, who
is a you know, a really deep, deep ranged threat,
but also an incredible passer and decision maker. She quarterbacks
a lot for us. You're gonna see that more and more.
She gets comfortable. She had some some injury stuff this
summer that kind of limited her, so she's just really
hitting her stride and then adding Kendall Carrothers to that
(15:53):
was a game changer. She just is such a natural
flow four for four from three the other night, which
is incredible. And she takes a little bit of that
pressure off of those guys because she can get in
there and saw us a little bit and make play
for self and others.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
Yeah, you beat me in my question too. I was
gonna ask how did you get Kendall on your radar?
It's like I didn't. I mean, I it's my job
to watch everything, and like icept, I didn't even tell you,
but I did so I do bractology for the athletic
and so it's like, I, you know, you got to
watch everything and uh.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Every time.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
I didn't even watch Saint Francis PA that much last year.
I want you to obviously going through and checking, like
I know you guys didn't play them last year. So
how did you get Kendall on your radar? Because she's
somebody like she pop statistically for me every time I
did kind of stats staves last year. But watching this
exactly you said, I mean, just a perfect, like flow
paced player who can just make place. That's that's what
it's about. So how did she kind of come on
(16:46):
your guys radar? I know, obviously she's from Holland, so
like right in the area. But for sure, I mean
there's a lot of kids from Toledo, so like, you know,
what was the exactly how did that kind of first happened?
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Yeah, no, for sure.
Speaker 3 (16:56):
So at Mommouth Ari Vander who had decided we had
everybody back, but Ari was kind of one of our
really good league guards and so we had one spot
to fill in the portal and she was at combo
guard that score. And we had a really good freshman
class coming in and I told our staff, I said,
I don't And so then we had the five seniors
that were stayed and do their fifth year at Mommouth.
And so I told our staff, listen, I want to
(17:17):
I want at minimum of two year because we need to,
you know, keep building for the future. I said, well,
we need a swaggy guard that can come in here
and run our stuff, and and we need we needed
a personality that wasn't going to step on you know,
the kids that had won that championship and done all
those things, but that had.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
The confidence to play with them.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
So then all of a sudden, I'm at Toledo and
Jeff Lanier, associated a head coach, came with and he
went back through all the notes that we were, you know,
the work that we had done in Mammoth preparing for
Ari to leave, and he said, you remember this kid,
and I was like, yeah, I liked her, and we
thought it would be too far though, because rumor had
that she.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Wanted to come back home.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
When we reached to Saint Francis, so made the call,
talked to her high school coach, got her over and
it went from there. So a little bit of the
pre work that we'd done at our previous institution, but
the moment we met, we just had a connection. I
loved her family, I loved why she wanted to come home,
why she wanted to take the next step. And everything
(18:21):
I heard from Saint Francis was you know, positive, positive, positive.
They were so happy for her that she was going
to get the opportunity to come home and play for Toledo.
So it was one of those kind of fate things
that you're just like, thank you. You could be really
good in recruiting and and I think we try to be,
but then you can also kind of get lucky occasionally.
And I think that was one of those the stars aligned.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
Kind of things absolutely. I mean going off that too,
Like you mentioned having a swaggy guard. I think I
love hearing that because I think so often I hear
a college coach say swagy guard with the negative connotation.
So like, you know, hearing you speak positively on that,
you know, kind of empowering player to just be themselves
on I know it's a big thing, like being able
to do that, you know, when you are looking for
(19:04):
and searching for that kind of thing. And I think,
I mean you mentioned swaggy too. I think of you
coaching Atisha Hydeman and recruiting her at Marquette like definition
of a swaggy guard, but like again, like finding that
and kind of building up the best aspects of that.
What does that look like for you and kind of
getting the most out of that.
Speaker 3 (19:22):
Well, I think it starts in the relationship first, you know,
knowing one another, trusting one another, building that vision for
them as a person, a student and a player at Toledo,
you know, talking about what it's going to feel like
when you come down and hit that huge kickback three
at the top of the key and Savage blows up
and the roof blows off, and then you're running back
(19:44):
and you catch your mom's eye, Like those kind of
moments are what we're trying to paint the picture of
and then you get to work toward it. A lot
of film, a lot of film with Casey, and I
think most of our film is me hitting that space
bar and looking at her because.
Speaker 2 (19:58):
She's wide open and she's like, I gotta shoot that.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
So she was passing up a lot of stuff early
and again, you know her personality is is not is
not needy, it's.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Not demanding even of her teammates.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
You know, she's it was probably you know, maybe Gully
the tenth or twelfth practice of the year before this,
she just like went off and the seniors were like
what And not that she wasn't working hard, it was
just she was just getting a feel, getting to know everybody.
And then obviously she's really really taken off. I think
a lot of film work, a lot of work in
the gym too. Just just getting our feet right, knowing
(20:38):
when and where she's gonna get shots is something that
she had to learn because again we're not running the play,
we're making reads and so and then she's been able
to get downhill.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
But it's just it's really really fun.
Speaker 3 (20:47):
I think I probably spend most of my time saying
to her, like, if I can score every single time
I had the ball, I would, I wasn't.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
Maybe that's why God didn't give me that.
Speaker 3 (20:57):
No, But like I asked her, I asked her and
Sammy accont of with regularly like what's it like to
be able to score whenever you want?
Speaker 2 (21:03):
And then like stop it? So just filling them up with.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
Confidence, yeah, I mean yeah, I mean to keep keep
on that train too. I think I do a lot
of my work in scouting and just in that background.
I think the thing that you really to me, like
I used to always think I was one of those
people come in, was like, oh, you know, you can
teach anybody to shoot. And obviously there's always like a
you know, you can do some stuff mechanically, you can
(21:27):
you can make some things work, and you can get
people to a certain level. But I think the thing
I always come back to you, you can't really teach confidence,
like I think there's just such a difference in that,
Like there are all There was a really great break
dude who worked for the next name, Owen Phillips. He
has a substack now where he does a ton of
stuff with like data tutorials and explaining stuff. He put
(21:48):
this really great thing out recently on how really three
point efficacy and three point confidence slash volume are almost synonymous.
Like being a confident shooter who's going to let it
fly every single time demands more guarding by a defense
through his tracking data. Then somebody who shoots forty percent
(22:10):
for three Obviously you want to have mash at the
same point. But I think kind of that's the exact point.
And especially in a read based offense, so much of
it is just making the right decision quickly. It doesn't
even have to be the right decision. Make a decision quickly.
How do you steal that and still that because again,
like exactly what we're talking about, like a team that
was routinely going like eighteen to twenty seconds in the
shot clock last year, Like I think that you know,
(22:33):
finding that kind of balance of timing and confidence in
what you're doing is I'm always fascinaated to hear how
people are kind of wrapping that out and working on that.
Speaker 3 (22:43):
But I think wrapping it out absolutely and wrapping it
out at game pace, you know, thanks for the practice,
guys of getting in there and adding that extra level
of intensity and the necessity to cut hard in order
to get results. But I think what kind of finally stuck.
And I said this one day and it just kind
of came out. I told him I didn't want them
to have to learn it twice. I don't want you
(23:05):
to have to learn it at a comfortable speed and
pace and then have to learn it again at max speed.
So just make the decision quick and get out of there,
and then eventually you'll make it quick and you'll make
it right.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
I was like, we've got plenty of time.
Speaker 3 (23:19):
If we got it the first time on the curl
or the break or the split or whatever it might be,
you'll get it again.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Just stay with it, stay in it.
Speaker 3 (23:26):
And so they had to feel that the rewards of
that as it came down, you know, and again dozens
and dozens of times.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
And I think the.
Speaker 3 (23:33):
Other thing to your point on the on the three
point confidence. You know, Jackie Alexander and our staff does
a lot of our offensive analytics, and it's been astounding
for me to be reminded.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
I knew this, but to be reminded of the higher
our shot quality is, the more likely.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
We are to get an offensive rebound, and that's something
that we hit really hard.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
We want to crash.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
I think we have the players to crash, especially when
we get in league. I think we'll be able to
create a lot of stuff for ourselves, and that just
gives us a little bit of confidence.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
They only early on, they only see the result. They
can't really.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
Grasp hey, we just did nine things right, but we
missed the three or we missed you know, the dumped
down or whatever it might be. And the tenth thing
is not the most important thing. That thing will come.
So when we were getting offensive rebounds and putting back in,
they can see points going on the board, and they're
good as long as as that's happening. But now they're
into the confidence of coming off the court for a
(24:25):
media and they're saying, hey, look at me on on
They're switching this, look at me on that, and I'm like, guys,
they're getting it.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
They're getting it. This is so good, So that just
it gives them a lot of confidence.
Speaker 3 (24:35):
They're communicating to one another at the highest level we've
had so far, and that just shows you their curiosity
again and their trust that they're building.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
With one another.
Speaker 3 (24:43):
And I think when you run a read offense, there's
an investment because you are giving over some decisions to them.
Speaker 2 (24:50):
So they're so invested in the outcome.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
Not that they weren't in the past, and not that
they aren't when we run set plays, but seeing their
confidence grow and that has been really really cool.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
Yeah, I mean speaking on the media aspect too there
I can't remember which game was from, but recently Hannah
was in postgame was like I got a point where
running like you know, like getting that that like you know,
like exactly you said. I think kind of seeing that
light click is really cool because you just never know
sometimes you know, it takes time and you never know
when is going to happen. So it's it's really dope
seeing that early on. But something I didn't even ask yet,
(25:24):
that is you know less about basketball, but just in general,
like getting to know this entire team, like yeah, how
do you go about that, because I think it's so much.
I mean, I don't know, it sounds cliche, but I
because I just used to always think talent, talent, talent,
like on court, like you really need to know and
because especially in this, you know, to have that trust
and build that up between you know, coaching player, like
(25:45):
you got to build that relationship off the court. So
what is that like coming in and figuring out kind
of how to build that relationship with each player.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
I'm fortunate that I also have an amazing coaching staff
who really cares about relationships. So I would say, you know,
as a unit, we've really attacked that. It's important to
all of us. That's why they were right for me
on on you know, we talk about out teaming the
other team a lot, So we talk about that as
a coaching staff too, like we're a little team as well,
and so you know, how can we model these things
(26:15):
for them?
Speaker 2 (26:15):
But I think that's been a group effort.
Speaker 3 (26:17):
I'm fortunate that that they support me in that and
they give me little nuggets of like so and so
it's got a biotest today.
Speaker 2 (26:23):
You know, she was up all night, you know, whatever
it might be. But I think just time.
Speaker 3 (26:27):
And I do feel a little bit badly for the
freshmen because normally they would get the bulk of that
attention early. I would have recruited them and then we
can nurture them through the homesickness and you know, some
of the things that come with the transition and the challenges.
But I'm getting to know all fifteen at this point,
and so that's been That has been a little bit
of a a hurdle, but one that I love and
(26:52):
I think we're through that now.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
You know, we're through that. I called it with the team,
the messy middle.
Speaker 3 (26:55):
There's just this methy middle where we're gonna have to
mock through like I don't know you, you don't me, And
that's okay. And I think we're at a point now,
you know, with the buy in and with the trust,
and you know, just by showing up consistently every day
as a coaching staff being who we say, we are
bringing energy every day, valuing them as humans and not
just players. Like I said, you know, these these seniors
(27:16):
are getting their master's degree heading over. Rosy's gonna leave
Toledo a nurse practitioner, you know, go down the line,
cure goss is doing our Masters in psychology.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
NaN's getting our MBA.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
There's so many amazing things happening to talk with them
and learn about them beyond the basketball court.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
We tried to dive into that early.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
No, absolutely, I think that's again, like you said with Toledo,
the interesting part, Like I think it is such a
you don't really think about it, but like I mean,
one of the best engineering schools in the midwest of
the country. Same thing with nursing. Like I remember when
I was there. I was in comms, and I was like,
you know, seeing all these people and especially the pharmacy
school is crazy. Like there's just so much going on
in STEM that is like it's beyond me because I'm
(27:56):
just so used to like I'm on the basketball.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
Court, man, but like communications, yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Yeah, exactly, Like hey, whatever keeps me closer to basketball
and as far away from physics as possible. I'm I'm
very excited to be in what exactly I mean, I
think that's part of what's so interesting about the game.
A couple more things to close up onto, you know.
I think, like you mentioned with your staff, part of
what was really interesting and seeing how they were built out.
I think correct if I'm wrong. I believe Draft is
the only person who came with you from Monmouth, So
(28:24):
you know, coming into too building out that staff, Uh,
it seemed like it was very intentional in how you
built it. So I wanted to ask, like, how that
all came together because exactly like you said, I think
so much of you know, getting that buyers, having that
small team within the team as well. So what was
that like in kind of building out how it all
came together?
Speaker 3 (28:44):
I will speak for myself, Hiring a staff is the hardest,
most humbling, scariest thing. So I was fortunate that I
got to hire people that I knew. I was fortunate
that Toledo gave me the resources that we needed, you know,
to to you know, make a big push and get
a really qualified staph. And yeah, I knew Jeff had
Midwest ties. I knew that was really important in Ohio
(29:06):
and in the MAC and he was all in from
the jump, which is amazing. And then I wanted to
give my Monmouth staff a little bit of time to
figure everything out. You know, was was kind of crazy
there with Sean being a candidate at Momouth and some
different things going on a Juley, having never really left
the East Coast.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
I knew that.
Speaker 3 (29:25):
It was a possibility that I would not be able
to bring both of them with me, and so happy
for where they landed. It all works out, It always
all works out. But Jackie Alexander had been on my radar.
I think she's an incredible recruiter, and I say that
first because she's.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
Also a really good basketball coach.
Speaker 3 (29:44):
I'm blown away by her intentionality and her knowledge, her discipline,
the way that she builds relationship with our players and recruits,
and so kind of joked at Monmouth early on, it's
hardest to do the job that your head coach once did.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
I was a recruiting coordinator for eighteen years.
Speaker 3 (30:00):
So Jackie step into this situation and you know, got
kind of idea of how I think that should look
and feel. But I also give our staff full autonomy.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Do you know a better way?
Speaker 3 (30:08):
Do you have a way that's better than mine, that's
more current with technology than mine?
Speaker 2 (30:12):
And so we've been able to collaborate.
Speaker 3 (30:14):
She makes me better every day, and she's incredibly knowledgeable
in the recruiting world and on the court. And once
we had that, I knew I needed someone who's gonna
be a great player. Developer also wanted someone with Canadian ties.
We had a lot of success recruiting in Canada when
I was at Mammoth and Sean Berry did a great
job up there for us, and so Takema had been
(30:35):
at Rhode Islands.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
We were recruiting a lot of the same players.
Speaker 3 (30:39):
I always asked players when we run into We ran
into the same teams over and over at Mammoth, and
so I asked, I would ask her, because who do
you talk to up there?
Speaker 2 (30:48):
And I wanted to know what's.
Speaker 3 (30:50):
Killing it for them h and recruiting, and so found
out that it was TK and know her basketball Q,
it was your basketball family, know her heart. She's she's
the biggest, biggest, She just completely disarms you when you're
in her presence. She's so calm and kind and generous
with her time and her energy. And so you reached
(31:12):
out to Tammy and then and then got in touch
touch with t K, and I don't know, it worked
out really really well. I think we all fit one another.
Like I said, they make me better every day. Jeff
is the best teacher that I've ever worked with. He
just does an incredible job of breaking things down very simply.
He's worked for other head coaches. He understands the language
and and you know how to do it at a
(31:33):
really high level. So kind of bouncing all over. I
could talk about those guys for years and years and years.
I'm I'm so thankful to have them and they're a
huge part of our early success.
Speaker 1 (31:41):
Yeah, especially like you mentioned in terms of call on
Tammy Reeves, Like, how do those conversations go be Like,
you know, I want to I want to hire one
of your I want to talk about hiring one of
your one of your coaches. Like how do you go
about that? Cause like I think that's, you know what,
something you hear about. But in terms of actually doing that,
you know, it's got to be an interesting conversation for sure.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
I think there's just a just for me personally with
Tammy and with with Brenda mot Kirkpatrick Brown down at
Etsu and Jackie. Like Brenda and I have been friends
since college, so that one was a little bit easier.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
Tammy. We just have a tremendous amount of respect for
one another.
Speaker 3 (32:15):
She had called me a couple of years ago for
one of our coaches at Mamath, and so just some
mutual respect. I think, you know, some things have evolved
in the women's basketball world and you can DM somebody
on Instagram and offer them a job, get their number.
Speaker 2 (32:27):
You don't have to. I'm a little bit more traditional
in old fashioned.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
Just want to want to call a head coach, you
know before I reach out to one of their assistants
and make sure that they know that we're talking.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
And I like.
Speaker 3 (32:39):
That both of those assistant coaches were communicating with their
head coaches.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
As well as well.
Speaker 3 (32:44):
Lets me know that if they joined my staff, they'll
treat me with the same respect if if there's another
opportunity for them, just for me, that was the right
way to do it. But the conversation was amazing. You know, Tammy,
I's up to call. She was working with USA Basketball,
made time, had nothing but great things to say. I
think we all want to help our coaches reach their
fullest potential when reach their goals as well. And that's
(33:05):
something that I talk with everyone on my staff about
in the interview process, Like I'm not only here to
help our players reach their goals. I'm here to help
you reach your goals as well and help you, you know,
whatever the next level might be for you, whether it's
to be the best you can be at Toledo for
the rest of your life, or be a BCS assistant
or going to be a head coach. You know, those
are those goals are my responsibility as well.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
Yeah, No, I really like hearing that to close out
to you know, just in terms of like continuing to
grow how you see the game. I think that's something
I've been interested by, especially as you know, when you're
getting to the level of being a head coach. You know,
I not to compare, but even just in doing like
scouting stuff, I get sewing rain and like a cycle
of like, okay, well I have to I know, I'm
(33:46):
watching college for six hours today and when I wake up,
I have to catch up on these euro games and
oh hey there's an Australian game at three o'clock in
the morning, Like where's the time to like kind of
you know, pick a point, Like I don't know. I
know I can struggle some times to pick apart and
find time to like sit down and try and learn something.
And especially for the system that you guys play in,
for what you do. I think that's part of what
(34:08):
I wanted to really ask is like, how you know,
where do you keep learning most? How do you kind
of keep finding time to adapt, tweak and find new things,
because I think, I mean, part of what I love
about the game is how much he continues to grow,
especially like I don't know how much you watch with
the W but I mean that's most of my works.
Like seeing the shift over the last three years in
play has been astronomical, and I think that's so important
(34:29):
for the college level. Knowing that in my opinion, I
don't think everybody agrees with that, but you know, being
in that line is really big. So like what has
that been like for you and kind of continuing to
adapt and see the game grow and you know on
court and like kind of how you have continued to
tweak alongside that.
Speaker 3 (34:46):
We I think probably one of the biggest reasons I'm
sitting in this chair at Toledo is just I came.
Speaker 2 (34:52):
I played Division two. I was in.
Speaker 3 (34:55):
My first job was GA Kennessel State, and then I
kind of worked my way up from there. But the
whole time I just I looked around and I was like,
was it Keennessal State?
Speaker 2 (35:02):
I was like, golly, Georgia Tech is so good. Like,
what are they doing? So I was I was unafraid
to ask. So even still, I'll pick up the phone
and call.
Speaker 3 (35:11):
Early on here at Toledo, there was the players that
we inherited weren't the ones.
Speaker 2 (35:15):
Making ball screen reads.
Speaker 3 (35:17):
And so who was the best ball screen team in
the CA in my opinion was William and Mary.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
So picked a phone called Aaron. I said, hey, what
are you doing practice? Every day? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (35:26):
They run good stuff, and like they even when they
were playing P four teams. Now scouting William and Mary,
I'm like, oh my gosh, they they made them change
their ball screen defense three times because they just pick
and pick and pick and so and they were always ready.
So I was like, what are you guys doing practice
for your ball screen reads? So She's like, oh, well,
you know, we start just breaking it down and talking
about it.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
So I'll pick up the phone and.
Speaker 3 (35:46):
Call you know whoever I you know know is doing
something really well and just ask questions and terminology. And
you know, she talked about the decision line and how
they how they instill that, and now our players are
saying that, no, you went.
Speaker 2 (35:58):
Too far past the decision line. Like that's so they're
starting to use the language with one another. But I
watch a lot of basketball. Unfortunately that my partner loves basketball.
I'll come home and Big Ten Networks on.
Speaker 3 (36:08):
I'll come home and the w n b A is on,
so we watch it on and then I'll, you know,
I'll make little notes and write it down and go
back or call Megan Vogel.
Speaker 2 (36:15):
You know, she was at u W. Green Bay when
I was at Marquette.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
We became good friends, and so I was like, I
actually have a friend who's an assistant the.
Speaker 2 (36:23):
W n b A now, so I'll just like wear
her out. But the film film time is the film time.
Speaker 3 (36:29):
Try to be really intentional about that, but then ask
questions because I think, you know, I learned from Stephanie
Clans when I was at Columbia.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
You can trick yourself into into thinking something's easy to teach.
You see you see.
Speaker 3 (36:40):
Something on that the NBA or the w n b
A or your league is running, and you're like, oh,
we can put that in.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
It's like no, you.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
You you should ask what's going to be hard and
what details are important for them that they that they
really emphasize, because if those are lost, then what they're
making look really easy is going to become really frustrating
and hard for you. So I just try to to
try to, you know, get stuff that catches my eye
and then follow up and follow through on the details
and ways to teach it the best of my ability.
Speaker 2 (37:06):
And then again, I'll keep talking about our coaching staff.
Speaker 3 (37:08):
So sorry not to wear that out, but I give
a lot of I give a lot of autonomy to them,
like bring me stuff, drills, put that in you are
you comfortable putting that in today?
Speaker 2 (37:17):
And they're like yeah, Like all right, cool, you got it.
I'll be on your end.
Speaker 3 (37:21):
You know, let's talk about the things and the points
you want to hit in the language we want to
use and go from there. But I think it's a
collective effort, you know. I encourage them all the time
to manage up, manage up, manage up. It's the skill
that it's been really valuable for me in this head
coaching seat, especially with changing leaderships. So I just want
to empower them to do that, to put them in
a position to be comfortable doing that when they take
their next role.
Speaker 1 (37:41):
Absolutely, yeah, No, I think, like you said, I think
so much of it is it's you can watch a
team running some really well and say oh wow, we
can do that, but then I don't know tomorrow. Yeah exactly.
So I've spent Yeah, I spent a lot of time
around Notre Dame and I used to think to myself like, oh,
Princeton can't be that hard to teach, and then you
watch and they'm like, oh wow, Okay, there's so much
nuance and like every little thing you do and that's
(38:04):
not I mean, it's not just person it's like every
you know, to most levels, every system has like that
kind of uh layering to it. But also I think
that speaks to a how awesome basketball is. But also
it's just like, you know, it's really cool with that aspect.
But Ginny, I've taken a ton of your time. I
really appreciate you doing this. I'm excited to watch you
guys keep growing and keep you know, taking off lifting.
(38:25):
Officer should say, so anything you want to shout out
your mission for you out here.
Speaker 2 (38:29):
No, I just really appreciate your time and what you're
doing to grow the game.
Speaker 3 (38:32):
And yeah, I think these things, these conversations I've already
sparked three four ideas that I'm going to follow up
on just in chat with you and some of the
things that you shared. But I think you know women's
basketball is now. The time is now, and I'm excited
for everybody to get on board. And just want to
make sure everybody who watches Nose if you have any
questions you want to reach out, if you're taking on
a new role or new responsibility.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
I have plenty of time to tell you all the
things that I got wrong.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
Should make you feel a little bit better about your
process and you're doing. But no, I'm excited for the game,
excited for your versus Toledo, and maybe if we chat
again in January or February, you know you'll see that
improvement and that growth.
Speaker 2 (39:09):
But thanks for all the support.
Speaker 1 (39:10):
Yeah, I'm very excited to watch everyone watching and listening.
Be sure to subscribe down below and more sportingly keep
up with all things Toledo women's basketball. Really good season ahead,
Both vin to the episode that they've got. Now, I'm
really excited to be joined today by the head coach
over at University of Toledo, Genny Bogus Ginny. First and foremost,
how are you doing?
Speaker 2 (00:16):
I'm doing so good coming off two days of recruiting.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
So I was in Minnesota and Cincinnati but little scratchy
voice from the airlines and the hotels, but I couldn't
possibly be better.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Yeah, it's also I mean that's just November and Ohio,
so I mean, you know, you get used to it.
I mean West Virginia is pretty much Ohio, so you know,
you know how it goes. But yeah, I mean somehow
already about a month end of the season. Thanksgiving is
just around the corner, which I am not ready for.
I'm ready for it, but also I just know like
my game watching schedule the next couple of days is
(00:47):
gonna be nuts. How are you kind of feeling so far?
I know you probably haven't had a second to really
sit down and think about it, but what is you
know what his first month kind of felt like as
you guys have gotten into games, the first.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Month felt I think probably like any new head coach
or or you know coach taking over a new position
would say, it feels exciting, it feels encouraging.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
You know, there have been bumps in the road.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
I am so proud of this scene and the leadership
on the team and the buy in of the young
kids and the buy in of the returners. So you know,
it doesn't matter what we're going into, it matters who we're.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Going in with.
Speaker 3 (01:22):
And knowing that I've got, you know, an incredible staff
and I get a lock arms with those young women
every day and that we're all in the same mission
makes me want to work even harder to not let
them down.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
No, I love that, and I think that's you know,
a great aspect to hit on right away in terms
of just looking at this school and the tradition. I
think it's something I took for granted a little bit
being there. And you know, you made a really great
point of talking about in your opening press conference about
just like how you know, the rest of the world
is kind of catching up to Fleeto, but like Toledo
has consistently been like top ten, top twenty five in
(01:54):
the country in attendance for women's basketball, which is I mean,
credit's atrician her staff for that up, but also just
always it consistent part of my dogs decided to make
an interest too. But yeah, I think with that aspect,
like what has it been kind of getting to feel
that because again, like I think, I just it was
what I was used to when I was there, So
what has that been like kind of getting that feel?
Especially quite a few home and we gave us to
(02:15):
open up.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Well, first of all, the six man has has been
a huge boost for us, So they quite literally in
these close games are giving us that extra little jolt
that we need.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
But I'm just still humbled by it. I'm so honored.
Speaker 3 (02:27):
I knew from the outside looking in, oh, you know,
great fan base. My wife so brilliantly articulated.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
I was like, maybe it's like five thousand fans. She's like,
that's five thousand opinions, and I was like, oh.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
Yeah, still a lot of eyes on the program. But
I've been so overwhelmed by their just unwavering support. They
just are so proud of his team and these women
and who they are off the court as well who
they are as student athletes. You know, our GPA is
so impressive. These are high achieving women in every area
of their life.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
So the team is just Teaman and the fans are
just fanning and letting us kind of do what we
do and settle in. And you know, they joke about this.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
We've had a couple of really slow starts, but we've
been able to go three and oh at home, and
so they've been really excited about that. And Coach, we
know you're not trying to start slow, and I'm like, no,
we're certainly not. But they just love the game and
you can feel their energy. I think they're enjoying the
new style. They're enjoying the new players and a little
bit of the unpredictability of a faster pace.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
So it's just been so good.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
Our leadership is all in on women's basketball, which allows
me to kind of do what I do and be
the head coach and be the face of the program.
And they handle the game day experience. We've got a
brand new scoreboard with runners. It's an NBA starting like
lineup pregame show at Toledo. It's absolutely unbelievable, and like
I said, I just feel really honored to be the leader.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
Yeah. I can't say it enough to people. Again, I'm
biased because I went there, but like I just I mean,
Savage is an incredible aread. It's the best in the MAC.
It's one of the best, I mean, beats out a
lot of power arenas in terms of just how today
it is, what it's like actual in game venue is
really great. And I love what you said about the
leadership too. I think the deeper I've gotten into this,
(04:12):
the more that you kind of get an appreciation and
recognition that it's not like that everywhere you know, it
helps you Like Todd is great over with the men's program.
He does this fantastic job, but has always been, you know,
somebody who was probably the number one supporter of the
women's basketball team as well. So just having that side
by side, I think is really big, because again, not
every program is like that, especially as you know we've
(04:34):
gotten deeper in NIL too. But I want to kind
of turn it and conversely ask too, just like how
did this job come on to your radar? Because I
remember I think it was a little bit later in
the cycle for jobs starting opening up as far as
you know it goes now, and I just remember being
like shocks. I was like, I just never envisioned Tricia leaving,
(04:56):
which excited her obviously they're doing great things, but like,
you know, what was that kind of like coming off
of a really good season at Monmouth, knowing that this
was you know, when this first kind of came under
your radar.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
Well, I was not at the Final Four.
Speaker 3 (05:09):
Brian Blair has joked that ninety eight percent of the
candidates he interviewed were right there in Cleveland and so
convenient except for the one that he actually hired.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
And so I wasn't looking. I didn't have an agent, and.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
Kristin and I decided to just after three years at Monmouth,
you know, it's such a build, it's such a grind.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
We decided to forego the Final.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Four last spring and head down to actually keep US game,
which is right outside of Miami, just have like a
long weekend and just kind of unwind and relaxed. And
sure enough, we get settled in at the pool that
first day and my phone buzzes, and I get a
text message from a search firm that said, would you
be interested in the vacant position at the University of Toledo.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
And we had just sat down at.
Speaker 3 (05:52):
The pool, and I looked at Kristin and I read
it out loud, and she goes, we're moving again, aren't
we Not necessarily, so it was just it was one
of those things where you know, I reached out to
my ID at Mammoth instantly, obviously, and then it happened
very quickly.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
But the moment that I got on.
Speaker 3 (06:11):
The call with Brian Blair and his team, I felt
a palpable sense of passion for women's basketball. I felt
the support of his team for him, which lets me
know that he's a really, really good leader. You could
feel that they wanted to get it right for Toledo,
and so it moved very very quickly. We did a
zoom and then we did another one, and then they
(06:32):
flew me to Cleveland on Sunday nights, so instead of
coming back to New Jersey, I went to Cleveland.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Met with them late that night, and Monday morning he
called and I thought.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
It was actually Monday afternoon because I've met with my
athletics director at Mamoth that morning, and he called, and
I thought he was going to ask me on campus.
I thought I might be one of two, and he
instead called and offered me the job.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
So things moved quickly.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
But the more I got into the research of history
of Toledo, the tradition of excellence and not just women's basketball,
across athletics. The opportunity, you know, with three nursing majors,
three nursing freshmen on our team.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
I have a senior nursing major.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
There are women's student athletes majoring and engineering at Toledo.
There's so many opportunities here on both sides of the ball.
I thought it would be a really good fit. And
I thought it was a community that kept get behind.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
No absolutely, and I think kind of off that too,
like you mentioned, in terms of just coming in and
having that like this is a very veteran team, and
you know, the recruiting class was was was massive as well.
When you look at just kind of coming into that
kind of environment, like you mentioned, Momoth was more of
a rebuild than here. It's like, okay, cool, we have something,
and now I need to work to keep you know,
(07:44):
obviously the essence of what it was, but also put
your own stamp on it. How do you do that?
I know that's like I don't know this, it's a
pretty loaded, like bigger question, but in general, I think,
to me, I feel like that's almost harder in some
ways than starting with the blank slate because it's like,
all right, well, I don't want to lose what made
this team a MAC title contre last year. But also
(08:06):
like I have my own ideas, I have my own philosophies.
There's obviously differences with this group now after some departures,
Like how do you kind of go about that?
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Yeah? I think that was.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
One thing that I'll be honest, was really intimidating. Didn't know,
you know, when we got to Marquette Total Rebuild. Well
go back even more more when I was at Columbia
Stephanie Glands total Rebuild. When we got to Marquette Total Rebuild,
we got to Penn State Total Rebuild, Mamath Total Rebuild.
So I knew kind of what that felt like and
looked like, and had a couple of blueprints and was
(08:37):
I'm a leader that's willing to pivot. You know, just
because it worked here doesn't mean it's going to work there.
So going into it, I was like, Okay, how do
you attack something that is not necessarily a rebuild? But
there were things, you know, that needed to be addressed
to play the way that I want to play. Some
of the language was a big was a big hurdle.
You know, what do you call this? What we call it? This?
Speaker 2 (08:58):
So all those things I think that are new to
a pro.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
But I think the biggest thing was identifying what was
really important to the players and making sure that they
could hang on to that.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Some very little things.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
That with all of the newness, some little things that
they wanted to hang on to, like where they sit
in the film room instead of sitting with their little sister,
you know, the timing of their pregame or pre practice prayer.
I felt like there was a big momentum and then
we stop and pray and and that's all things they've
done for all these years. And so, you know, how
do you have conversations about you know, the things that
(09:29):
are really important to them and then the things that
are really important to me. And we had to kind
of meet in the middle on those things, as long
as none of them compromised the standard, which is at
a place Toledo was was not a problem.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
His standard was very, very high. So I think just just.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
Having that having your ears on with your eyes and
seeing and listening to what they're telling you. When the
body language shifts or when the seniors cut eyes at
each other like, wait a.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
Minute, so just let them have their stuff.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
And then I realized pretty quickly that it was more
of a renovation than a rebuild. So we didn't want
to change the structure or the foundation, but we did,
you know, we did want to mix up some things
and the way that we played and the way that
we uh, you know, the way that we left in
the way that we trained, and the way you know,
some things that we could we felt like we could
add value to them individually and collectively.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
Definitely, I do want to go back though, with talking
on the terminology piece. I think that's such a big thing, right,
Like again, I can talk to five different staffs and
they're going to have five different ways of saying the
exact same thing. So in terms of getting on page
with that, is that just like a sit down meeting
at the beginning or kind of how do you work
on I'm building that. I'm sure it's obviously something you
kind of keep doing every practice, every game and reinstilling that,
(10:36):
but you know, kind of having that mind meld between
who's here and getting on board with what the terminology is.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
You know, we use the summer for a lot of
those things.
Speaker 3 (10:44):
Normally in the summer I like to do a lot
of player development individually, you know, work on work on
their bag or you know whatever these are going to
call it these days, and their weaknesses. But we spent
it was really important to the seniors. They made it
clear like they needed to know, like big picture, what
are we doing?
Speaker 2 (11:01):
What is this pace that you speak of.
Speaker 3 (11:02):
Unfortunately, we had Nan Garcia on our team who I
coached at Penn State and could kind of be the
translator for me at times and kind of connect the
dots as far as what we're trying to do in
the pace and things like that. But no, it's just
really important this summer for them to get that big
picture of view. And so we quite literally had a
vocabulary sheet and these are offensive.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Terms, defensive terms. You know, do you call lock and chase?
Speaker 3 (11:26):
You know, what do you call defending a stagger? All
the things around the board, defending ball screens they primarily
iced in the past, So we have three different ball
screen coverages. You know, how are we communicating that to them?
How are they communicating that to one another? So there
was all these different layers of language. So it's like
how we talk to them, how they talk to us,
how they talked to one another was really the biggest
(11:47):
thing because the seniors naturally early on would revert back
to their native language and then we would translate for
the freshman.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
So we had to really buy in. And I'm proud
of the work that we did there early.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Yeah, I think, I mean kind of like you're hitting
on too. It's so fun to see too, because like obviously,
like I don't want to take away anything from the
last couple years because some of the best i mean
pure competitiveness in basketball that this school seemed. But also
like I think what's been really cool is right away.
I mean I just can watch seeing like you know,
being somebody's watched cra gosson she was at Ben Davis,
(12:23):
like Samue mcconnoins since she was, you know, a high schooler,
which also really cool story to you just for her,
like somebody who was not a scholarship player to like
get to where she's at. But like I can watch
both of them and say, I look at this new
office and like, I think this is better for them
in terms of what they can do. And you know,
again that's always how things change and evolve, but it's
not even just the terminology aspect like you mentioned. I
(12:45):
think this is just I mean, in terms of two
different styles of playing basketball. Last year, I mean so
much and it was again it was successful, but like
so much of it was set play driven, smaller pace,
and now it is just like it's a lot of
to me at least in watching, it's a lot more
actions instead of trying to run plays. And I think
that plays so well with again a player like you're
(13:07):
a player like Samy who's just athletic and slash can
make plays, but you can tell too, like you know,
especially you know, I was watching the Marshall game back
again yesterday and I was like, you know, as compared
to now too, like you can see like, oh okay,
well you know there's there's still like that little those
little like lag moments of like filling in in spots.
But again, I think that's part of what makes it
(13:27):
really fun. You can see like where it's going to
keep picking up. But how do you work on on
on making that kind of shift, because that is a
big shift, especially like I think people watch just on
like the actual on core product, but I think what
you are practicing is like just wildly different in terms
of like how you're instilling basketball and kind of teaching reads,
(13:48):
So what is that process like, you know, on top
of the terminology too.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
Well, for them, it probably feels grueling.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
I think the first thing I would say is that
we had to unlearn a lot of things that were
programmed and there, and I mean that in the best
possible way. You know, when you're running set plays, there's
there's the check down reads and they're and they're really
really high IQ players you've got to be to play
for Tricia Clup.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
But we kind of had to unlearn that.
Speaker 3 (14:13):
That fear of mistake, or the fear of failure failure,
or the fear of running play to completion.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
There's no completion.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
And so one day I remember so vividly it was like,
you know, some of these aha moments because we're learning
just as much as they are as we go through this.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
I said, how many actions do we need to get
a shot?
Speaker 3 (14:32):
And I was saying it kind of like we should
have scored by now, and they looked at me and
they're like, we don't know how many actions do we need?
Speaker 2 (14:38):
And I was like, no, no, we.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
Need one if we do it right. And so and
then obviously the more we you know, switchalize the floor,
the better we are. And so I was like, oh
my gosh, they just don't know yet yet, and so
freeing them up to make mistakes and to get curious
on the court, you know. Again, like I said, these
are bright women, high achieving women, so they want to
get it right, they want to get it right every time.
Allowing them to make mistakes and encouraging aggressive mistakes I
(15:02):
think was a big underwriting to kind of the success
and the progress that you're seeing now.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
They had to learn to trust each other.
Speaker 3 (15:10):
You know, there was a lot of conversation earlier about hey, listen, coach,
we just did what what coach said and it worked.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
And I'm like, yeah, it worked really well.
Speaker 3 (15:17):
And so now I'm giving them the freedom to make choices,
and then also coupling that with you know, hey, all
this freedom comes with responsibility on our shot selections, on
our pace, those kinds of things, and so.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
Proud of they're buying Kiera and Sammy especially.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
I think this system is great for nand Garcia, who
is a you know, a really deep, deep ranged threat,
but also an incredible passer and decision maker. She quarterbacks
a lot for us. You're gonna see that more and more.
She gets comfortable. She had some some injury stuff this
summer that kind of limited her, so she's just really
hitting her stride and then adding Kendall Carrothers to that
(15:53):
was a game changer. She just is such a natural
flow four for four from three the other night, which
is incredible. And she takes a little bit of that
pressure off of those guys because she can get in
there and saw us a little bit and make play
for self and others.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
Yeah, you beat me in my question too. I was
gonna ask how did you get Kendall on your radar?
It's like I didn't. I mean, I it's my job
to watch everything, and like icept, I didn't even tell you,
but I did so I do bractology for the athletic
and so it's like, I, you know, you got to
watch everything and uh.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Every time.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
I didn't even watch Saint Francis PA that much last year.
I want you to obviously going through and checking, like
I know you guys didn't play them last year. So
how did you get Kendall on your radar? Because she's
somebody like she pop statistically for me every time I
did kind of stats staves last year. But watching this
exactly you said, I mean, just a perfect, like flow
paced player who can just make place. That's that's what
it's about. So how did she kind of come on
(16:46):
your guys radar? I know, obviously she's from Holland, so
like right in the area. But for sure, I mean
there's a lot of kids from Toledo, so like, you know,
what was the exactly how did that kind of first happened?
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Yeah, no, for sure.
Speaker 3 (16:56):
So at Mommouth Ari Vander who had decided we had
everybody back, but Ari was kind of one of our
really good league guards and so we had one spot
to fill in the portal and she was at combo
guard that score. And we had a really good freshman
class coming in and I told our staff, I said,
I don't And so then we had the five seniors
that were stayed and do their fifth year at Mommouth.
And so I told our staff, listen, I want to
(17:17):
I want at minimum of two year because we need to,
you know, keep building for the future. I said, well,
we need a swaggy guard that can come in here
and run our stuff, and and we need we needed
a personality that wasn't going to step on you know,
the kids that had won that championship and done all
those things, but that had.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
The confidence to play with them.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
So then all of a sudden, I'm at Toledo and
Jeff Lanier, associated a head coach, came with and he
went back through all the notes that we were, you know,
the work that we had done in Mammoth preparing for
Ari to leave, and he said, you remember this kid,
and I was like, yeah, I liked her, and we
thought it would be too far though, because rumor had
that she.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Wanted to come back home.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
When we reached to Saint Francis, so made the call,
talked to her high school coach, got her over and
it went from there. So a little bit of the
pre work that we'd done at our previous institution, but
the moment we met, we just had a connection. I
loved her family, I loved why she wanted to come home,
why she wanted to take the next step. And everything
(18:21):
I heard from Saint Francis was you know, positive, positive, positive.
They were so happy for her that she was going
to get the opportunity to come home and play for Toledo.
So it was one of those kind of fate things
that you're just like, thank you. You could be really
good in recruiting and and I think we try to be,
but then you can also kind of get lucky occasionally.
And I think that was one of those the stars aligned.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
Kind of things absolutely. I mean going off that too,
Like you mentioned having a swaggy guard. I think I
love hearing that because I think so often I hear
a college coach say swagy guard with the negative connotation.
So like, you know, hearing you speak positively on that,
you know, kind of empowering player to just be themselves
on I know it's a big thing, like being able
to do that, you know, when you are looking for
(19:04):
and searching for that kind of thing. And I think,
I mean you mentioned swaggy too. I think of you
coaching Atisha Hydeman and recruiting her at Marquette like definition
of a swaggy guard, but like again, like finding that
and kind of building up the best aspects of that.
What does that look like for you and kind of
getting the most out of that.
Speaker 3 (19:22):
Well, I think it starts in the relationship first, you know,
knowing one another, trusting one another, building that vision for
them as a person, a student and a player at Toledo,
you know, talking about what it's going to feel like
when you come down and hit that huge kickback three
at the top of the key and Savage blows up
and the roof blows off, and then you're running back
(19:44):
and you catch your mom's eye, Like those kind of
moments are what we're trying to paint the picture of
and then you get to work toward it. A lot
of film, a lot of film with Casey, and I
think most of our film is me hitting that space
bar and looking at her because.
Speaker 2 (19:58):
She's wide open and she's like, I gotta shoot that.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
So she was passing up a lot of stuff early
and again, you know her personality is is not is
not needy, it's.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Not demanding even of her teammates.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
You know, she's it was probably you know, maybe Gully
the tenth or twelfth practice of the year before this,
she just like went off and the seniors were like
what And not that she wasn't working hard, it was
just she was just getting a feel, getting to know everybody.
And then obviously she's really really taken off. I think
a lot of film work, a lot of work in
the gym too. Just just getting our feet right, knowing
(20:38):
when and where she's gonna get shots is something that
she had to learn because again we're not running the play,
we're making reads and so and then she's been able
to get downhill.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
But it's just it's really really fun.
Speaker 3 (20:47):
I think I probably spend most of my time saying
to her, like, if I can score every single time
I had the ball, I would, I wasn't.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
Maybe that's why God didn't give me that.
Speaker 3 (20:57):
No, But like I asked her, I asked her and
Sammy accont of with regularly like what's it like to
be able to score whenever you want?
Speaker 2 (21:03):
And then like stop it? So just filling them up with.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
Confidence, yeah, I mean yeah, I mean to keep keep
on that train too. I think I do a lot
of my work in scouting and just in that background.
I think the thing that you really to me, like
I used to always think I was one of those
people come in, was like, oh, you know, you can
teach anybody to shoot. And obviously there's always like a
you know, you can do some stuff mechanically, you can
(21:27):
you can make some things work, and you can get
people to a certain level. But I think the thing
I always come back to you, you can't really teach confidence,
like I think there's just such a difference in that,
Like there are all There was a really great break
dude who worked for the next name, Owen Phillips. He
has a substack now where he does a ton of
stuff with like data tutorials and explaining stuff. He put
(21:48):
this really great thing out recently on how really three
point efficacy and three point confidence slash volume are almost synonymous.
Like being a confident shooter who's going to let it
fly every single time demands more guarding by a defense
through his tracking data. Then somebody who shoots forty percent
(22:10):
for three Obviously you want to have mash at the
same point. But I think kind of that's the exact point.
And especially in a read based offense, so much of
it is just making the right decision quickly. It doesn't
even have to be the right decision. Make a decision quickly.
How do you steal that and still that because again,
like exactly what we're talking about, like a team that
was routinely going like eighteen to twenty seconds in the
shot clock last year, Like I think that you know,
(22:33):
finding that kind of balance of timing and confidence in
what you're doing is I'm always fascinaated to hear how
people are kind of wrapping that out and working on that.
Speaker 3 (22:43):
But I think wrapping it out absolutely and wrapping it
out at game pace, you know, thanks for the practice,
guys of getting in there and adding that extra level
of intensity and the necessity to cut hard in order
to get results. But I think what kind of finally stuck.
And I said this one day and it just kind
of came out. I told him I didn't want them
to have to learn it twice. I don't want you
(23:05):
to have to learn it at a comfortable speed and
pace and then have to learn it again at max speed.
So just make the decision quick and get out of there,
and then eventually you'll make it quick and you'll make
it right.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
I was like, we've got plenty of time.
Speaker 3 (23:19):
If we got it the first time on the curl
or the break or the split or whatever it might be,
you'll get it again.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Just stay with it, stay in it.
Speaker 3 (23:26):
And so they had to feel that the rewards of
that as it came down, you know, and again dozens
and dozens of times.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
And I think the.
Speaker 3 (23:33):
Other thing to your point on the on the three
point confidence. You know, Jackie Alexander and our staff does
a lot of our offensive analytics, and it's been astounding
for me to be reminded.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
I knew this, but to be reminded of the higher
our shot quality is, the more likely.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
We are to get an offensive rebound, and that's something
that we hit really hard.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
We want to crash.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
I think we have the players to crash, especially when
we get in league. I think we'll be able to
create a lot of stuff for ourselves, and that just
gives us a little bit of confidence.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
They only early on, they only see the result. They
can't really.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
Grasp hey, we just did nine things right, but we
missed the three or we missed you know, the dumped
down or whatever it might be. And the tenth thing
is not the most important thing. That thing will come.
So when we were getting offensive rebounds and putting back in,
they can see points going on the board, and they're
good as long as as that's happening. But now they're
into the confidence of coming off the court for a
(24:25):
media and they're saying, hey, look at me on on
They're switching this, look at me on that, and I'm like, guys,
they're getting it.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
They're getting it. This is so good, So that just
it gives them a lot of confidence.
Speaker 3 (24:35):
They're communicating to one another at the highest level we've
had so far, and that just shows you their curiosity
again and their trust that they're building.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
With one another.
Speaker 3 (24:43):
And I think when you run a read offense, there's
an investment because you are giving over some decisions to them.
Speaker 2 (24:50):
So they're so invested in the outcome.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
Not that they weren't in the past, and not that
they aren't when we run set plays, but seeing their
confidence grow and that has been really really cool.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
Yeah, I mean speaking on the media aspect too there
I can't remember which game was from, but recently Hannah
was in postgame was like I got a point where
running like you know, like getting that that like you know,
like exactly you said. I think kind of seeing that
light click is really cool because you just never know
sometimes you know, it takes time and you never know
when is going to happen. So it's it's really dope
seeing that early on. But something I didn't even ask yet,
(25:24):
that is you know less about basketball, but just in general,
like getting to know this entire team, like yeah, how
do you go about that, because I think it's so much.
I mean, I don't know, it sounds cliche, but I
because I just used to always think talent, talent, talent,
like on court, like you really need to know and
because especially in this, you know, to have that trust
and build that up between you know, coaching player, like
(25:45):
you got to build that relationship off the court. So
what is that like coming in and figuring out kind
of how to build that relationship with each player.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
I'm fortunate that I also have an amazing coaching staff
who really cares about relationships. So I would say, you know,
as a unit, we've really attacked that. It's important to
all of us. That's why they were right for me
on on you know, we talk about out teaming the
other team a lot, So we talk about that as
a coaching staff too, like we're a little team as well,
and so you know, how can we model these things
(26:15):
for them?
Speaker 2 (26:15):
But I think that's been a group effort.
Speaker 3 (26:17):
I'm fortunate that that they support me in that and
they give me little nuggets of like so and so
it's got a biotest today.
Speaker 2 (26:23):
You know, she was up all night, you know, whatever
it might be. But I think just time.
Speaker 3 (26:27):
And I do feel a little bit badly for the
freshmen because normally they would get the bulk of that
attention early. I would have recruited them and then we
can nurture them through the homesickness and you know, some
of the things that come with the transition and the challenges.
But I'm getting to know all fifteen at this point,
and so that's been That has been a little bit
of a a hurdle, but one that I love and
(26:52):
I think we're through that now.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
You know, we're through that. I called it with the team,
the messy middle.
Speaker 3 (26:55):
There's just this methy middle where we're gonna have to
mock through like I don't know you, you don't me, And
that's okay. And I think we're at a point now,
you know, with the buy in and with the trust,
and you know, just by showing up consistently every day
as a coaching staff being who we say, we are
bringing energy every day, valuing them as humans and not
just players. Like I said, you know, these these seniors
(27:16):
are getting their master's degree heading over. Rosy's gonna leave
Toledo a nurse practitioner, you know, go down the line,
cure goss is doing our Masters in psychology.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
NaN's getting our MBA.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
There's so many amazing things happening to talk with them
and learn about them beyond the basketball court.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
We tried to dive into that early.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
No, absolutely, I think that's again, like you said with Toledo,
the interesting part, Like I think it is such a
you don't really think about it, but like I mean,
one of the best engineering schools in the midwest of
the country. Same thing with nursing. Like I remember when
I was there. I was in comms, and I was like,
you know, seeing all these people and especially the pharmacy
school is crazy. Like there's just so much going on
in STEM that is like it's beyond me because I'm
(27:56):
just so used to like I'm on the basketball.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
Court, man, but like communications, yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Yeah, exactly, Like hey, whatever keeps me closer to basketball
and as far away from physics as possible. I'm I'm
very excited to be in what exactly I mean, I
think that's part of what's so interesting about the game.
A couple more things to close up onto, you know.
I think, like you mentioned with your staff, part of
what was really interesting and seeing how they were built out.
I think correct if I'm wrong. I believe Draft is
the only person who came with you from Monmouth, So
(28:24):
you know, coming into too building out that staff, Uh,
it seemed like it was very intentional in how you
built it. So I wanted to ask, like, how that
all came together because exactly like you said, I think
so much of you know, getting that buyers, having that
small team within the team as well. So what was
that like in kind of building out how it all
came together?
Speaker 3 (28:44):
I will speak for myself, Hiring a staff is the hardest,
most humbling, scariest thing. So I was fortunate that I
got to hire people that I knew. I was fortunate
that Toledo gave me the resources that we needed, you know,
to to you know, make a big push and get
a really qualified staph. And yeah, I knew Jeff had
Midwest ties. I knew that was really important in Ohio
(29:06):
and in the MAC and he was all in from
the jump, which is amazing. And then I wanted to
give my Monmouth staff a little bit of time to
figure everything out. You know, was was kind of crazy
there with Sean being a candidate at Momouth and some
different things going on a Juley, having never really left
the East Coast.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
I knew that.
Speaker 3 (29:25):
It was a possibility that I would not be able
to bring both of them with me, and so happy
for where they landed. It all works out, It always
all works out. But Jackie Alexander had been on my radar.
I think she's an incredible recruiter, and I say that
first because she's.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
Also a really good basketball coach.
Speaker 3 (29:44):
I'm blown away by her intentionality and her knowledge, her discipline,
the way that she builds relationship with our players and recruits,
and so kind of joked at Monmouth early on, it's
hardest to do the job that your head coach once did.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
I was a recruiting coordinator for eighteen years.
Speaker 3 (30:00):
So Jackie step into this situation and you know, got
kind of idea of how I think that should look
and feel. But I also give our staff full autonomy.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Do you know a better way?
Speaker 3 (30:08):
Do you have a way that's better than mine, that's
more current with technology than mine?
Speaker 2 (30:12):
And so we've been able to collaborate.
Speaker 3 (30:14):
She makes me better every day, and she's incredibly knowledgeable
in the recruiting world and on the court. And once
we had that, I knew I needed someone who's gonna
be a great player. Developer also wanted someone with Canadian ties.
We had a lot of success recruiting in Canada when
I was at Mammoth and Sean Berry did a great
job up there for us, and so Takema had been
(30:35):
at Rhode Islands.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
We were recruiting a lot of the same players.
Speaker 3 (30:39):
I always asked players when we run into We ran
into the same teams over and over at Mammoth, and
so I asked, I would ask her, because who do
you talk to up there?
Speaker 2 (30:48):
And I wanted to know what's.
Speaker 3 (30:50):
Killing it for them h and recruiting, and so found
out that it was TK and know her basketball Q,
it was your basketball family, know her heart. She's she's
the biggest, biggest, She just completely disarms you when you're
in her presence. She's so calm and kind and generous
with her time and her energy. And so you reached
(31:12):
out to Tammy and then and then got in touch
touch with t K, and I don't know, it worked
out really really well. I think we all fit one another.
Like I said, they make me better every day. Jeff
is the best teacher that I've ever worked with. He
just does an incredible job of breaking things down very simply.
He's worked for other head coaches. He understands the language
and and you know how to do it at a
(31:33):
really high level. So kind of bouncing all over. I
could talk about those guys for years and years and years.
I'm I'm so thankful to have them and they're a
huge part of our early success.
Speaker 1 (31:41):
Yeah, especially like you mentioned in terms of call on
Tammy Reeves, Like, how do those conversations go be Like,
you know, I want to I want to hire one
of your I want to talk about hiring one of
your one of your coaches. Like how do you go
about that? Cause like I think that's, you know what,
something you hear about. But in terms of actually doing that,
you know, it's got to be an interesting conversation for sure.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
I think there's just a just for me personally with
Tammy and with with Brenda mot Kirkpatrick Brown down at
Etsu and Jackie. Like Brenda and I have been friends
since college, so that one was a little bit easier.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
Tammy. We just have a tremendous amount of respect for
one another.
Speaker 3 (32:15):
She had called me a couple of years ago for
one of our coaches at Mamath, and so just some
mutual respect. I think, you know, some things have evolved
in the women's basketball world and you can DM somebody
on Instagram and offer them a job, get their number.
Speaker 2 (32:27):
You don't have to. I'm a little bit more traditional
in old fashioned.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
Just want to want to call a head coach, you
know before I reach out to one of their assistants
and make sure that they know that we're talking.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
And I like.
Speaker 3 (32:39):
That both of those assistant coaches were communicating with their
head coaches.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
As well as well.
Speaker 3 (32:44):
Lets me know that if they joined my staff, they'll
treat me with the same respect if if there's another
opportunity for them, just for me, that was the right
way to do it. But the conversation was amazing. You know, Tammy,
I's up to call. She was working with USA Basketball,
made time, had nothing but great things to say. I
think we all want to help our coaches reach their
fullest potential when reach their goals as well. And that's
(33:05):
something that I talk with everyone on my staff about
in the interview process, Like I'm not only here to
help our players reach their goals. I'm here to help
you reach your goals as well and help you, you know,
whatever the next level might be for you, whether it's
to be the best you can be at Toledo for
the rest of your life, or be a BCS assistant
or going to be a head coach. You know, those
are those goals are my responsibility as well.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
Yeah, No, I really like hearing that to close out
to you know, just in terms of like continuing to
grow how you see the game. I think that's something
I've been interested by, especially as you know, when you're
getting to the level of being a head coach. You know,
I not to compare, but even just in doing like
scouting stuff, I get sewing rain and like a cycle
of like, okay, well I have to I know, I'm
(33:46):
watching college for six hours today and when I wake up,
I have to catch up on these euro games and
oh hey there's an Australian game at three o'clock in
the morning, Like where's the time to like kind of
you know, pick a point, Like I don't know. I
know I can struggle some times to pick apart and
find time to like sit down and try and learn something.
And especially for the system that you guys play in,
for what you do. I think that's part of what
(34:08):
I wanted to really ask is like, how you know,
where do you keep learning most? How do you kind
of keep finding time to adapt, tweak and find new things,
because I think, I mean, part of what I love
about the game is how much he continues to grow,
especially like I don't know how much you watch with
the W but I mean that's most of my works.
Like seeing the shift over the last three years in
play has been astronomical, and I think that's so important
(34:29):
for the college level. Knowing that in my opinion, I
don't think everybody agrees with that, but you know, being
in that line is really big. So like what has
that been like for you and kind of continuing to
adapt and see the game grow and you know on
court and like kind of how you have continued to
tweak alongside that.
Speaker 3 (34:46):
We I think probably one of the biggest reasons I'm
sitting in this chair at Toledo is just I came.
Speaker 2 (34:52):
I played Division two. I was in.
Speaker 3 (34:55):
My first job was GA Kennessel State, and then I
kind of worked my way up from there. But the
whole time I just I looked around and I was like,
was it Keennessal State?
Speaker 2 (35:02):
I was like, golly, Georgia Tech is so good. Like,
what are they doing? So I was I was unafraid
to ask. So even still, I'll pick up the phone
and call.
Speaker 3 (35:11):
Early on here at Toledo, there was the players that
we inherited weren't the ones.
Speaker 2 (35:15):
Making ball screen reads.
Speaker 3 (35:17):
And so who was the best ball screen team in
the CA in my opinion was William and Mary.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
So picked a phone called Aaron. I said, hey, what
are you doing practice? Every day? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (35:26):
They run good stuff, and like they even when they
were playing P four teams. Now scouting William and Mary,
I'm like, oh my gosh, they they made them change
their ball screen defense three times because they just pick
and pick and pick and so and they were always ready.
So I was like, what are you guys doing practice
for your ball screen reads? So She's like, oh, well,
you know, we start just breaking it down and talking
about it.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
So I'll pick up the phone and.
Speaker 3 (35:46):
Call you know whoever I you know know is doing
something really well and just ask questions and terminology. And
you know, she talked about the decision line and how
they how they instill that, and now our players are
saying that, no, you went.
Speaker 2 (35:58):
Too far past the decision line. Like that's so they're
starting to use the language with one another. But I
watch a lot of basketball. Unfortunately that my partner loves basketball.
I'll come home and Big Ten Networks on.
Speaker 3 (36:08):
I'll come home and the w n b A is on,
so we watch it on and then I'll, you know,
I'll make little notes and write it down and go
back or call Megan Vogel.
Speaker 2 (36:15):
You know, she was at u W. Green Bay when
I was at Marquette.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
We became good friends, and so I was like, I
actually have a friend who's an assistant the.
Speaker 2 (36:23):
W n b A now, so I'll just like wear
her out. But the film film time is the film time.
Speaker 3 (36:29):
Try to be really intentional about that, but then ask
questions because I think, you know, I learned from Stephanie
Clans when I was at Columbia.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
You can trick yourself into into thinking something's easy to teach.
You see you see.
Speaker 3 (36:40):
Something on that the NBA or the w n b
A or your league is running, and you're like, oh,
we can put that in.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
It's like no, you.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
You you should ask what's going to be hard and
what details are important for them that they that they
really emphasize, because if those are lost, then what they're
making look really easy is going to become really frustrating
and hard for you. So I just try to to
try to, you know, get stuff that catches my eye
and then follow up and follow through on the details
and ways to teach it the best of my ability.
Speaker 2 (37:06):
And then again, I'll keep talking about our coaching staff.
Speaker 3 (37:08):
So sorry not to wear that out, but I give
a lot of I give a lot of autonomy to them,
like bring me stuff, drills, put that in you are
you comfortable putting that in today?
Speaker 2 (37:17):
And they're like yeah, Like all right, cool, you got it.
I'll be on your end.
Speaker 3 (37:21):
You know, let's talk about the things and the points
you want to hit in the language we want to
use and go from there. But I think it's a
collective effort, you know. I encourage them all the time
to manage up, manage up, manage up. It's the skill
that it's been really valuable for me in this head
coaching seat, especially with changing leaderships. So I just want
to empower them to do that, to put them in
a position to be comfortable doing that when they take
their next role.
Speaker 1 (37:41):
Absolutely, yeah, No, I think, like you said, I think
so much of it is it's you can watch a
team running some really well and say oh wow, we
can do that, but then I don't know tomorrow. Yeah exactly.
So I've spent Yeah, I spent a lot of time
around Notre Dame and I used to think to myself like, oh,
Princeton can't be that hard to teach, and then you
watch and they'm like, oh wow, Okay, there's so much
nuance and like every little thing you do and that's
(38:04):
not I mean, it's not just person it's like every
you know, to most levels, every system has like that
kind of uh layering to it. But also I think
that speaks to a how awesome basketball is. But also
it's just like, you know, it's really cool with that aspect.
But Ginny, I've taken a ton of your time. I
really appreciate you doing this. I'm excited to watch you
guys keep growing and keep you know, taking off lifting.
(38:25):
Officer should say, so anything you want to shout out
your mission for you out here.
Speaker 2 (38:29):
No, I just really appreciate your time and what you're
doing to grow the game.
Speaker 3 (38:32):
And yeah, I think these things, these conversations I've already
sparked three four ideas that I'm going to follow up
on just in chat with you and some of the
things that you shared. But I think you know women's
basketball is now. The time is now, and I'm excited
for everybody to get on board. And just want to
make sure everybody who watches Nose if you have any
questions you want to reach out, if you're taking on
a new role or new responsibility.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
I have plenty of time to tell you all the
things that I got wrong.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
Should make you feel a little bit better about your
process and you're doing. But no, I'm excited for the game,
excited for your versus Toledo, and maybe if we chat
again in January or February, you know you'll see that
improvement and that growth.
Speaker 2 (39:09):
But thanks for all the support.
Speaker 1 (39:10):
Yeah, I'm very excited to watch everyone watching and listening.
Be sure to subscribe down below and more sportingly keep
up with all things Toledo women's basketball. Really good season ahead,
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