Reviewing the Buffalo Bills' Rookie Class! | UR - Under Review

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:13):
Previous play, we'll go under Review Happy Tuesday evening, everybody,

(00:44):
thank you so much for being here for this week's
episode of Under Review. My name is Joe DeRosa. You
can find me on Twitter slash x at show Underscore
de Rosa, and I'm excited for tonight's episode, Everybody. Last
week we had the conversation about the Buffalo Bill second
year players and then the spirit of talking about the
youth infusion of this roster, I decided to make it

(01:04):
this week's episode focus solely on the most impactful rookies
from this past year's draft class, and with draft season
upon us, I always think it's a good time to
reflect on who you were talking about last year that
got to your roster and the overall performances from each
of these players, because even though it was a mixed
bag of results, I think there's a lot of positives
that can be taken away from each of these players

(01:25):
and hopefully a lot of development in year two that
brings improvement and ultimately some stabilization on the back end
and the death they're even in the starting points of
this roster. So appreciate you all checking this one out,
and I appreciate my guests for being here tonight, friend
of mine, friend of the show, someone that I interact
with pretty often, especially during draft season, and you might
have seen that when we were there in person last year,

(01:47):
but also just on Twitter. He's an awesome guy, awesome
contact creator, and his name is John helthcap John, welcome
back to the show. Thank you again for being here
this fine Tuesday evening. How are you doing tonight.

Speaker 2 (01:58):
My friend, I'm doing wonderfully.

Speaker 3 (02:00):
I'm sitting in my beautiful living room with the grand piano,
just basking in the sunlight of seven thirty five pm
Eastern time, doing great.

Speaker 2 (02:09):
Yeah, No, I'm here. I'm just ready to settle in.

Speaker 3 (02:12):
Came with a little cup of tea and we're just
gonna we're gonna get cozy, and we're gonna talk about
some young guys, some year two, some last year rookies
and get them go in the right direction.

Speaker 1 (02:22):
Yes, sir, nice cozy show this evening. Trying to make
the vibes a little better because last week's episode about
the sophomores was not as optimistic, but again that's year two,
only three impactful players from that class, and there was
there was still positives to take away from it. But
you know, a majority of that episode was basically being
like Anthony actually kind of had a quote where it's like,

(02:42):
why didn't he cook when he was referring to Dalton Kincaid,
which I think summarized the entire episode. But this week,
you know, we're talking about our rookies, and when you
look at each one of these players, there's one that
I think we could both based on how we expected
him to perform this year, say I'm a bit disappointed,
but otherwise I saw some flashes from each of these players,

(03:02):
even the one that disappointed us, that I could say
we could build off it. Let's hope your two goes better.
But before we get into that conversation, John Combine just
came and went. A fun time of the year for
everyone who is a draft nerd who wants to see
dudes run in you know, short shorts on the forty
yard dash and jump really high. It's a very fun

(03:22):
time and it always has the draft community buzz egg.
I want to hear first your thoughts just on the
Combine and really who stood out to you and who
you really think could be a potential fit for this
bill's roster to considering what the needs are for this game.

Speaker 2 (03:36):
Yeah, I think it was a great combine.

Speaker 3 (03:39):
I was not a part of my team from my
company that was there in person, but obviously glued to
the TV and listening to all the reports and listening
to podiums and all that stuff and digesting a ton
of information that came out of there. The underwear Olympics
are always a great time. I mean, who doesn't like
to see three hundred and thirty pounds men, you know,
rolling down.

Speaker 2 (03:58):
The field faster than I can. So I think it
was great.

Speaker 3 (04:01):
I think all in all, the position groups that matter
the most to the Bills defensive line, both interior and edge,
and the secondary.

Speaker 2 (04:09):
I think those are.

Speaker 3 (04:10):
Arguably the two easiest position groups that the Bills are
going to be talking about this offseason. I think that
those position groups showed very, very well at the combine.
So as a Bills fan and content creator and all
that stuff, I'm really optimistic about what's going to be available.
I really think that one of the biggest things that

(04:31):
might be a disappointment. I kind of tweeted this out.
I think it was yesterday morning. I'm losing track of time,
but I tweeted out that I think the defensive tackles
that everyone is clamoring over, Derek Harmon, Kenneth Grant, those
kind of guys, I think they're going before we're on
the clock. I really don't think that those guys are
going to be available, Which opens up an entirely different conversation.

Speaker 2 (04:52):
Is this the year that Brandon Bean.

Speaker 3 (04:54):
Goes and gets aggressive and moves up into the twenties,
moves up, you know, eight picks ors so to go
get one of these guys that he thinks is going
to be an impact defense alignment. He's got the amo
to do it. He's been talking all offseason. He really
has been carrying on a tone of frustration. It sounds
like this offseason every time that I've heard him speak,

(05:15):
it's like, Yeah, I gotta do better. I gotta get
us the playmakers. I got to get us difference makers.
They're not easy to get where we draft. I'm more
than willing to trade a first round pick for talent.
Like he's saying all the things that make me feel
like he's going to be aggressive, But again, it takes
two sides to make it happen. He can call every

(05:35):
team in the twenties about making a move up and
they can just be like, no, I'm good. Like we
got a guy here that we like and it doesn't
pan out, so we'll see what happens. But I think
we're honestly going to be looking at some guys in
this secondary sitting there at like an Andrew mccuba. That
would be a nice pick, would be a really really

(05:56):
nice pick. Late in the first there's going to be
defensive tackles. Actually one text, zero text that you can
get on day two that can just be some big
old run stuffers take on the double teams, stuff like that.
They that have abilities to collapse the pocket. Not the
super disruptors like Derek Harmon's fourteen percent havoc cret or
whatever it was, which is just out of this world

(06:18):
for a defensive tackle. But some really talented guys on
day two that I think are available as well. And
then obviously we got free agency, we got trades, we
got all kinds of stuff, all kinds of different ways
to put their roster together.

Speaker 1 (06:29):
Yeah. I really like your point about Brandon being because
you and I had this conversation honestly, I think it
was a few days ago just about what would his
mentality be in this draft, and for me, you know,
I'm something more of a draft, you know, like I
don't want to call it a purist, but someone who
is very much like a I don't want to trade
up unless I am foresure going for someone that I

(06:50):
think is just a can't miss guy. And last year,
when we had that like whispering of maybe they do
it for Odunza, I would have been okay with that
because I really think o'doons is fit for Bill's all
off and getting a boundary guy would have been perfect.
They decide to stand pat, but they end up taking Coleman,
who will get to in this episode. It wouldn't shock
me at all if Brandon Bean decided to be aggressive
in this draft. But it also wouldn't shock me at

(07:11):
all if the Bills wouldn't have pick thirty anymore by
the time the draft gets here, either considering some of
the whispers of who they're interested in, and maybe some
of that aggression bleeding into free agency and the trade
market and trying to go capitalize on getting one of
the premier d linemen to just get the shore thing
and build around that with some of your later draft capital.
But I do think Kenneth Grant and Derek Harmon are

(07:33):
players I would love, which is exactly why they won't
be there at thirty because we like them, and because
we like them, they will not be available. But I
do think that pick thirty is it's interesting because when
you're in this position every year, there's a lot of
fluidity because it's essentially the second round and there's a
crop of players that are still very valuable that can
still fit you well, but there's not as much urgency

(07:54):
because all those positional groups are there for you. It's
just not the absolute top tier. So if it's not Harmon,
if it's not Grant, I think that does adjust your
perspective of do we maybe pivot to the secondary and
go for a cornerback like a Sharon Revel or a
Trey Amos, or maybe a if you want to go
for the kid from Texas Barron, if you want to
go for even another player like Hairston who had a

(08:16):
really nice combine. Those options are there for you. But
it's why I go on the reverse side and say,
think of how many names we're saying that could realistically
be there in the middle of the thirties, and what
does it look like to maybe trade back and try
to go get your third round pick in addition to
the competitory picks, and just go full send on a
massive youth infusion for the following season, because the Bills

(08:37):
are consistently good at finding value in the later rounds,
and I think that when you have that ability, as
annoying as it is that they haven't, you know, quote
unquote hit the home run in the earlier rounds, it
does give you some peace of mind to know that
if they are accumulating capital, there is a good chance
that they could find a lot of value on a
prospect later on, whether that's in the secondary, whether that's
in your linebacking course. So it's going to be interesting

(08:59):
to see how free agency turns out and potentially the
trade market turns out for the Bills, because that will
obviously shape a lot of what you could expect them
to attack in the draft, but also maybe shape if
they are going to be aggressive or if they decide
to stand pat or trade back and maybe just accumulate
capital and try to build a young, sustainable roster for
maybe the next four or five seasons. So any final

(09:21):
thoughts on the combine, John before we get to our
Young Player review.

Speaker 3 (09:26):
Yeah, you can't promise that you're gonna run a four
to one and then run a four to four.

Speaker 2 (09:29):
That's my biggest biggest takeaway.

Speaker 1 (09:32):
I do agree, man, And I was I was actually
like going into the combine very excited for Isaiah Bond
because I was like, you know what, man, I could
see it right, like he's his speeds through, that's his
game and he markets himself as that and that's how
they ran him to Texas and something that the Bills
could use. Granted, I have some concerns over a physical
profile and how he's going to do against press Man,

(09:52):
like any speed threat, because a perfect world, if you
have a speed threat that could be Pressman to be
consistent deep threat, he's probably not waiting till like the
second or third most likely. But with Isaiah Bod, I'm thinking,
let's see this forty yard dash. If he hits a
four to two, like awesome, repel your draft stock up
even though they say it doesn't happen, it happens, but nope,
still worthies record, And I just feel like you got

(10:14):
to put your head down and go for the forty.
You can't say it if you're not gonna do it.
I do think Bond has great game speed, but like.

Speaker 3 (10:21):
Well, his teammate Matthew Golden said nothing and then went
out he posted a fourteen ninety yep. So it's like, yeah,
how about you just leave it, leave it on the track.
One last thought, just before we move on here, I
just want to point back to Brandon Bean one more time.
I think that he's really really frustrated about consistently not

(10:41):
getting one of these guys that can just blow it
out of the water. And that's why I feel like
he is going to explore every option very earnestly this uh,
this offseason, whether it's trade, whether it's tradding up in
the draft, whatever it is, because you're right, getting those
consistent and producers in the mid rounds are great and

(11:02):
you need those. But like man, four years in a row,
the first round pick not turning into a real difference
maker and all pro caliber player is tough. When you're
trying to get over just that last hurdle. You're right there, right,
and it's like if one of these first round picks
ended up being a super stud, I'm it's it's sad

(11:26):
to point at Kansas City, but like Trent McDuffie, like
a late first round corner that we wanted that they
moved up to get, but a late first round guy
that is now considered like a lockdown, all pro caliber corner.

Speaker 2 (11:39):
It's like, we.

Speaker 3 (11:40):
Need that one piece. You need that one piece. You're
one or two of those pieces away from and being
cost controlled, which is a huge thing that needs to
be discussed, by the way. That's why hitting on the
draft and hitting those studs in the draft is so important,
because yeah, you can go out and you can trade
for it, but it's gonna cost you multiple draft pick
and you're signing the guy to a thirty million dollar contract,

(12:02):
or you can hit on it in the first round
and they're cost controlled for four years of the fifth
year team option. That's how you build these contending teams
that are able to get over the hump. But that's
how Philly built theirs mostly is through the draft. In
the trenches. That's where it's like, Brandon, I need to
see it. I need someone this year, one guy out

(12:23):
of this draft class, one guy that can end up
being a real difference maker. I don't care what Yeah,
I don't even care what position. It doesn't matter what position,
Just someone that pops, someone that can really excel and
be like, oh shit, we found something. Like I want
that conversation this time next year, Like when we're doing
the rookie round up next year, I want to be.

Speaker 2 (12:42):
Like, dude, we crushed it, Like that is the guy.

Speaker 3 (12:45):
He's a stud, locked in for the next however many years,
Like I want to be having that conversation.

Speaker 1 (12:51):
And I totally agree with that. I absolutely agree with that,
And it's been a common talking point when you talk
about Brandon Beach's drafting. I don't think Brandon Bean is
bad at drafting, but I do think Brandon Bean hasn't
found enough elite talent when you think of how many
first round picks he's had in his possession now. Obviously
Josh Allen is the example of that. I would argue,

(13:12):
you know, they traded away their first round pick for
Stefan Diggs, who was an elite talent for them, so
something of a win, but not someone he physically drafted.
And then you have a bunch of either good or
fine or just mediocre, and you look at kind of
the track record of that and you kind of get
concerned and it gives some weight and merit to potentially
moving on from thirty and moving up. The only thing

(13:33):
that kind of concerns me is if you're going to
trade up, trade up with a plan, right, and you
bring it up, you know you want to find that
elite guy. I have a fear that trading up is
to go get a player because we are nervous about
maybe a player or just being aggressive for the sake
of being aggressive. But I don't think Brandon Bean would
do that. I think if he moves up, it's because

(13:53):
of someone he truly wants. When they moved up for Kincaid,
they saw the vision of Kincaid basically being their Kelsey.
He hasn't molded into that. It's not too late for
him too. But I do think that you know that
was the mentality is we are aggressive, but we have
to be selectively aggressive, so you pick at thirty. It's
a difficult situation if you're talking about trying to go
up and find that guy. But if you see, like

(14:15):
Matthew Golden falls into the mid twenties, yeah, I'm okay
with moving up. If you see Derek Harmon falls to
twenty five, I'm okay with it. Like these types of
players that not only fill the need but have so
much potential as being a pro. That's a guy. I
think it's okay to trade out four, and I could
see Brandon being doing I think at this point it's
just proven that Brandon Bean goes with the board, goes

(14:37):
with the flow. If I got to be aggressive because
I have this guy, I'm doing it. But if I
can wait, I'll wait. And he's talked about both ends,
which is why this conversation is going to go in
a circle until it's on display and he either takes
the Dan pick or he makes the poor members of
Cover one whoever's there wait till day two to see
the pick and stand out in the cold just to
see the giant Kansas City logo appearance.

Speaker 2 (14:57):
Anyways, thanks for that. What a great end tonight one.

Speaker 3 (15:00):
Right, we're just standing out there the city logo and
Xavier Worthy and then go home.

Speaker 2 (15:03):
Cool.

Speaker 1 (15:03):
I have like five strawberry uncrustables that night, so I
like to think I'm the real winner.

Speaker 2 (15:08):
I forgot.

Speaker 1 (15:09):
And also how many bubbles? John, how many bubble selters
did I drink in that night? Tell the chick, tell
the people you.

Speaker 3 (15:16):
Were pushing ten plus I can't remember the exact number.
I cannot remember, but you were constantly because they were free.
They had them in the media room, the uncrustibles and
the bubblies, and it was like watching a sixth grader
go for his snack pack.

Speaker 1 (15:28):
And it was dulous. I was. I was overjoyed. And
I brought this up to members of the cover one
chat and got made fun of because I like strawberry
and crustables. On crustables have a place in this world.
Sometimes you don't want a PEB and J. Sometimes you
want the taste of refined sugar and processed bread in
a plastic package. And you know what, it slaps every

(15:49):
damn time. So if you hate on me for like
the incrustables, that's a you problem. It's like I equate
this John, So like sometimes you don't want pizza, you
want Dominoes. Dominoes is not pizza, it's Dominos and it
has its own so pu Taco Bell Mexican. It's not
Mexican food, but it's got a place right that's in

(16:10):
on crustables to the PB ANDJ community. And I had
five of them that night. Found out they were a
thousand calories total. After I ate all of them. Gains. Yep,
let's go. Anyways, tonight's episode, what we're actually focusing on
John Games, Let's class gains. Let's go. There's a lot
of Listen, if you eat five of them, that's gotta
be like thirty grams of protein. Dude, is it efficient?
Not at all? But no, hey, listen, I'm an active guy. Anyways,

(16:35):
the rookie class and I say mixed bag at results,
But when you talk about rookies, it's a little different
because that's their first year in the league, and there
is getting your feet wet, getting used to NFL game speed,
getting used to just the regimentation of the professional league
versus college that. While it's still regimented, you know, programs
have differences and how they're going about their day and
what you're how intense it really can be. I think

(16:57):
the NFL, even though you're an adult and you're meant
to fend fears, is still offering you just a whole
new perspective on the game you play. And it's a
transition physically and mentally for a lot of rookies. So
I have a bit more grace, which is probably why
I'm more optimistic in this episode. But we're gonna start
with Keon Coleman, John, and your evaluation of Keon Coleman
as a Bills fan is entirely dependent on what your

(17:20):
expectations of were him coming out of college and how
you viewed him as a prospect. If you were someone
that was bought into the idea of the Bills drafted
this guy first because he is going to be your one.
No more Stefan Diggs, this is your guy, You're probably
disappointed if you went into it at least the way
I did, which was, yes, he is their first pick,
but he is also a completely unrefined, super raw but

(17:44):
freakishly athletic rookie that needs a lot of development. Then
I think you could be pretty pretty okay. I wouldn't
say over the moon or super happy, but pretty good
with this rookie season. But John, what do you think?
I mean, just based on again your rejection of Keon
Coleman in the NFL and the Bills offense, what were
your thoughts on his rookie season?

Speaker 3 (18:05):
Yeah, I mean you and I had very similar thoughts
on on Keon. You know, when we were there for
the draft, all we were doing was sitting there and
talking about the different wide receiver options a thousand times over,
discussing the upside, discussing.

Speaker 2 (18:20):
Who they could be.

Speaker 3 (18:20):
Who should we go after, What kind of players should
we draft? We want the speedstereer like Xavier Worthy? Do
we want a big target? What about Brian Thomas Junior
if he fell? Like we were talking about all these
different guys, Keon is still so young, which everyone knows,
very athletic, very unrefined, all the things that you mentioned,

(18:41):
and it shows, you know, it shows. I think that
in his first year we saw some flashes, but I
think mostly what we saw on the field is what
I expected from a twenty to twenty one year old
player that has athleticism, has leap ability, has speed after
the catch, but is not polished in his routes. And

(19:04):
I think that that's pretty much what we saw.

Speaker 2 (19:07):
So with sorry about that.

Speaker 4 (19:09):
With ke On PTSD hearing that sound, sorry man, from
up this morning, from every morning of my life, every alarm,
yes from Keon. It was really tough because before the injury,
those few weeks before he got hurt, he really started
to ramp it up. That game against Tennessee seven targets,

(19:32):
four catches, one hundred and twenty five yards that one
catch and run where he just took off. We saw
him a couple times downfield on Josh Allen scramble drills
beyond the receiving end of those, which I really thought
that could be one of his biggest things. Right, if
Alan can trust this six' to three guy that can
jump out of the building on some of these throws
down the, field then that's some way that he's going

(19:54):
to be able to, contribute, Right he's that big body
down the field that can do. That we also started
to See Joe brady utilize him more creatively early in the.
Season he really didn't have much that he was. Doing
in those few, weeks we started to see him line
up in the. Slot we started to see.

Speaker 3 (20:08):
Them you, know cross him across the, field those those free,
releases those quick slants which looks like it was an
audible at the line From josh Like, hey IF i like,
this then we're going to him right here off the,
jump right like we're going to him like we saw
a couple of times one joined them right in the,
helmet but a couple other times on the. YEAR a
couple other times on the year he caught it, right

(20:29):
so you started to see what the utilization could look
like and what the upside is because he does have
the athleticism after the catch to house call. ANYTHING i
don't care about his forty. Times he has, speed he
has game. Speed and then he got hurt and after
that it just really derailed. It he only played four
games down the stretch. Top you, know his high watermark

(20:51):
was sixty four. Yards he only had one touchdown the
rest of the. Year it was not. Ideal SO i
think from, keon he's pretty much what you. Want and
NOW i will say THAT i have concerns with his potential.
DEVELOPMENT i think there's things there to, like but the
fact that he can't separate down the field is something
that showed up a lot this year and that concerns

(21:14):
me because that is something that he's going to need
to know how to. Do he's going to need to
be able to generate separation at the top of his,
route not just at the line of, scrimmage which he
struggles with that, too but generating separation at the top
of his route to create that space is a nuance
that he does not have, yet And i'm really worried about.

Speaker 2 (21:33):
That catching.

Speaker 3 (21:34):
Up if he figures that, out if he figures out
how to create separation at the top of a route,
effectively it doesn't have to be, great just. Good then
you're talking about a wide receiver That, okay he's a
player that is going to be a consistent producer in this,
offense potentially weak in and week. Out you, know he's
just got to find those those, refinements that ability to

(21:56):
create that separation late AND.

Speaker 2 (21:59):
I think that's how he's to.

Speaker 3 (22:00):
Win and also on pre, releases if we can get
a speedsterer that's on the outside Of Matthew golden that's
gonna run a four to two nine and take the
top off a, defense and you move him inside into
THE z wide receiver position instead of out wide AT,
x or he's lined up off the line of scrimmage
and he gets the free release and he's running you,
know deep overs or you know different row combinations where

(22:20):
he doesn't have to worry about creating the.

Speaker 2 (22:22):
Separation the separation is created for.

Speaker 3 (22:24):
Him THEN i think that's where you're gonna start seeing
him really.

Speaker 1 (22:27):
PRODUCE i completely agree with your take on his, game
AND i think THAT i have those same concerns just
because they were CONCERNS i had about the prospect THAT
i don't think completely gout. Alleviated WHAT i did, see,
though were moments of confidence where if he was able
to go up for a fifty to fifty, ball he
has the height and the catch point separation to get.

(22:47):
It AND i feel like there's refinement needed when to
talk about the stem and when you talk about separation
at the top of, It but when you get to
the actual catch, point he can absolutely dominate in that.
Regard AND i feel like when you have that trait
already within, you just because of your frame and the
confidence you play, with once you can do one in the,
league that's a great thing to build off. Of SO
i can still see a world Where coleman builds on

(23:10):
that more to become a true one just on the boundary,
Alone like if he figures that, out whether it's his,
release whether it is at the, top that is something
that that, ALONE i think propels him to being a
true boundary threat in this. League because if you're separating
and you have that extra, step, Great but now pair
that with the fact that even if you're, not you
can win a fifty to fifty ball And you're just
this hybrid threat on the boundary that makes it very

(23:32):
difficult for defenses to play and against, you where if
it's man coverage that, corner better be able to be
physical and better have a size or at the least
the radius you, know whether it's they play above their
frame to be able to match. You and that's what
The bills vision is with. HIM i get a little
frustrated BECAUSE i think that with the abundance of slot
targets on This bills, team it makes it very difficult

(23:53):
to Give Keyon coleman more slot. Targets BUT i do
think that that is how you can help him gain
more confidence and also become that better, player just by
adding that dynamic component to his game where he is
lined up out of the slot more. Often because based
on PFF's, charting they had him at slot seventy five
snaps this year wide six hundred and thirty three snaps this.

(24:14):
Year so like you're talking about a player THAT i
think has more value than you think when you talk
about slot alignment and getting him going across the middle
of the field and on these lateral, routes and it's
a way that you can create separation whether it's in,
zone whether it's against, man but also be able to
make defenses realize that you have a player that's more
versatile than you are lining him up to. Be AND

(24:37):
i think this is kind of something THAT i could
say is a fair critique Of Joe brady is does
he know how to be more fluid or more versatile
with some of the players he has in his backfield
or on his receiving. Core because we had this conversation
last week where something's With Dalton. Kka granted there's limitations
in his game inherently THAT i think keep this from,
happening but where you could stand to see him used

(24:57):
in more unique ways that could help the player in,
turn and you, know build off of the fact that
they're getting production from. Scheme AND i think that's the
case With Keyon coleman. Too can we See Joe brady
do more things For, coleman like free, releases like motion
with this, receiver like slot alignment where it's ramped up
from a seventy five snap count to maybe two, hundred
and all of a, sudden it's more of a consistent

(25:18):
threat and you are just mixing and. Matching you, know
some of the formations that you show and the way
you're lining up these receivers where maybe you Have shakir
out on the boundary and you brought Up. Golden but
that component to the wide receiving room right, now wide
receiver room right now is something they need because if
you can add a true vertical threat in addition To,
coleman now you have the flexibility to not have to

(25:39):
depend on him to be a true boundary. Target have
him get that more freedom or more creativity For Joe
brady to line him up in different. Ways and it's
another dynamic to This bill's offense that makes them more,
threatening more difficult to defend, against especially when you just
talk about passing and not that running, attack which is
already as formidable as any unit in the. League SO
i love those. Points anything else you want to add On, Coleman.

Speaker 3 (26:02):
YEAH i mean what you're talking about in terms of
him at the catch. Point he got one On Reek
wolan up In, seattle. Right they gave him that jump
ball in the end zone and he came down with.
It so he does have that in his. Bag AND
i think that that catch, point that leaping, ability all
of that, stuff that's why they drafted, HIM i think
they knew that he was, raw they knew that he was,

(26:22):
young they know that he is very, athletic and they're
hoping that they can mold him and that he can
can grow past. It, now one thing To keon's, credit
AND i don't want to sit here and seem Like
i'm ragging on the, guy BECAUSE i, think all in,
all he did have a good first season for what
was expected of him and for how young he, is
he's handling it. Great like by all, Accounts coleman's attitude

(26:44):
and his approach and his you, know his mentality to
everything has been.

Speaker 2 (26:48):
Great you haven't heard a negative thing about. Him he's Been.

Speaker 3 (26:50):
He's loved in the locker, Room the coaches love. Him
they know that he's working. Cool, Great let's give him
a little bit of runway to progress in the. League
he wasn't drafted to be one of these difference makers
that we're talking, about where you need that guy that's
an all pro out of the. Gate, now If coleman
does develop into, that, fantastic AND i would love to see.

(27:12):
It i'm not sure that that is a realistic range.

Speaker 2 (27:15):
Of outcomes for.

Speaker 3 (27:16):
Him BUT i do think that he can be a
legitimate boundary wide receiver that can be used in a
variety of, ways that can come down with jump, balls
that is good in the red zone and be a
valuable asset to the. Offense but he's not like a
top ten wide receiver in THE. NFL i don't. THINK
i don't think that's within his.

Speaker 1 (27:34):
Back, no not at the, moment definitely. Not but could
he get? There? SURE i think the red zone component's
very big, too because even though it's not showing up as,
consistently you know when you would get his total yardage and.
Touchdowns he was a big part of their two point,
package and he got a few two point conversions towards
the end of the, season which makes you, realize, hey
we could do this. Here maybe we could ramp this
up next season and try to get some more passplays

(27:56):
if we're within Or i'm, sorry if we're ten yards or,
more to try and get cold in, space or try
to Get coleman on a quick. Hitter and you know
they tried it Against. Miami ball went up in the
air Into Jaalen ramsey's. Hands didn't work out the way
you wanted it. To BUT i do think that they
are building off of, that AND i think in year
TWO i can expect to see some more of what
we were just discussing and some more resone packages that

(28:16):
are featuring. Him but it's also on the player to,
develop AND i am curious if he's going to add
anything to his bag to try and be able to
have a little more success when it comes to man,
coverage you, know not get pushed off his stems as,
frequently be able to separate at the, top be able
to draw yourself open in tight, space because The bills
need that right. Now and if they get another player
to help and he becomes a bit more of an ancillary,

(28:37):
piece so be. It because if it works and you
have someone that's Giving coleman some breathing, ROOM i Think
coleman is going to shine and bring up The seattle
game that was his best game of the season in my.
OPINION i just think when you talk about how he
dominated on the, field the confidence he was playing with The,
bills ramping up play action in that game, too and
getting him involved in some of that that was A
bills OFFENSE i dream. OF i think you, know the

(29:00):
guys have talked about, this but like the play action,
usage needing to go up and needing to get the
receivers more. Involved that's another way you help Keon. Coleman you,
know get him more involved on play action shots if you.
Can and it doesn't always have to be just a
vertical route down the. Field if you've got to get
him going, horizontally you, know the same way you were
getting your tight ends to do. It do it For. Coleman,
man give him some, confidence get him in, space because

(29:22):
you talked about this when you brought him up in
something we've talked about in the. Past with the ball
in his, hands he's a. Weapon he just. Is he
has the, frame he has the speed open, field he's
very difficult to bring. Down so use that to your.
Advantage and not just in the short distances or the
zero to five, yards but down the. Field let's get
chances for this kid to make things happen in, space

(29:43):
Because i'm telling you it could be a lot of.
Fun and you, know just another element to a physical
offense if you have a receiver that's physical enough to
just generate yak by bullying people in the open field undersized.
Me so anything, Else, jean before we move on to
our next.

Speaker 2 (29:57):
Player, now let's move.

Speaker 1 (29:58):
On let us move on before we. Do, actually people
in the chat see the shirt cover One Premium Subscriber
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(30:21):
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(30:43):
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and if you haven't signed up, yet but you, think,

(31:03):
hey that could be. Cool Maybe i'll check it out
and never do appreciate you think and it's. Cool that's
pretty awesome. Too let's move On Cold. Bishop Now Cold.
BISHOP I i will say, THIS i think he was
put in a tougher spot only BECAUSE i think when
he got to training camp my impression it was very,

(31:24):
early was that they wanted him to be the starter
and they were giving him the first team. Reps early gets.
HURT i think that stunts his. Development it's stunts his
ability obviously to be on the, field and you end
up in a situation Where rap And hamlin Are now
you're starting to and he has to now work into
a room that has already established that dynamic because he missed.
Time now he comes, back and when he comes, back

(31:45):
it's more of a rotational. Role and it's The houston.
Game he gets dusted because there's a miscommunication The Nico collins,
touchdown and now you kind of see him almost in
a way like from my, impression playing from, behind like
NOW i have to catch up and also shake off
the weight of this play that happened earlier in the.
YEAR i do think, though that on the field there

(32:06):
were moments For bishop where instincts were, there his ability
to tackle was, there his speed to the ball was,
there and some good reps in. Coverage but also sometimes
where you see a rookie safety in The bills defense
and you, say he's still learning, it and we got
to give him some time to figure this out because
it's difficult to be a safety in a McDermott. Defense, So,
john back to you your thoughts on Col bishop's rookie.

Speaker 3 (32:28):
Year, YEAH i can't remember if it was McDermott or
if it Was brandon down at the combine that was
speaking with the media where they were asked About Coal
bishop and his, development what they, expected and their answers
pretty much line up with what you. Said by all,
accounts it sounded like they were wanting him to emerge
as their starter out of training. CAMP i can't remember which.

Speaker 2 (32:48):
One was saying.

Speaker 3 (32:49):
It sorry THAT i can't, offhand but one of them
was saying stuff About, bishop how they had really high
expectations for, him and how getting hurt in training, camp
especially like you, said in a McDermott, defense when you're
the safety in your rookie year.

Speaker 2 (33:02):
Man you're behind the eight ball. EARLY i think all in, all.

Speaker 3 (33:07):
We Saw bishop develop throughout the course of the, season
AND i think development's just going to be the key
of this whole.

Speaker 2 (33:14):
Episode we're going to be talking about development a.

Speaker 1 (33:15):
Lot all of.

Speaker 3 (33:16):
Them have, developed needs to, develop are going to hopefully
continue to. Develop bishop was very much the same. WAY
i think there was instincts. THERE i think his speed
to the ball is probably his best, attribute AND i
think that going into this off, SEASON i think that
he's going to have every opportunity to earn one of
the starting. Jobs you, know he got three starts down

(33:38):
the end of the season Against, detroit Against New, england
and against The, jets and in those, GAMES i felt
like he did pretty. Well you, KNOW i felt, like
all in, all he was. THERE i think the game
is still a little fast for him at THE nfl,
level and the decision making and reading what offenses are
doing and understanding where he needs to be at the safety.

(33:59):
Position if you're have a step to a step slow
in making your decision in terms of where to.

Speaker 2 (34:04):
Go you're.

Speaker 3 (34:06):
Done like they beat. You like that's how that, Goes
so For cole the game needs to continue to slow
down for. Him he needs to continue that work in
understanding of The seawan mcderm and, defense understanding how the
safeties play. Ball BUT i really do THINK i don't
think That hamilon's coming back in free. Agency that's, YEAH

(34:26):
i think he's. Gone SO i think that you have
rap AND i think that you Have bishop and behind,
That please someone explain to me why it doesn't make
sense for them to draft, Safety like they need more
people in the room than just those people And raps
starting to get up there in years and stuff like,
that like it needs to. Happen LIKE i feel like
they're adding a safety at some point in the. DRAFT

(34:47):
i don't know if it's going to be earlier or,
late depends on the, value BUT i think safety is
going to be in the. Plans BUT i think That
Cole bishop is going to be one of those guys
where his speed to the ball is really. Important and
if this defense is going to continue to develop into
more of a man heavy, approach THEN i think that
that almost serves him better because it's not that complicated

(35:08):
system on the back end of rotations and understanding where
to be and things like. THAT i think that it'll
put him in a situation more where it's just like
we're manned, up Like i'm a single high or we're
going too high or whatever it. Is i'm just responsible
for this half of the. Field you, know whoever gets
BEAT i help. LIKE i think that that will help
him play faster and utilize that athleticism and those instincts

(35:32):
to the, ball because when the ball is in the,
air he tracks it down like he is really good
when the ball is in the, air if using that
speed to get to it to break up a, pass
which you saw a couple. Times AND i really do
think that he has a high. UPSIDE i think that
he can be a better tackler than we saw from, him,
too because he was a better tackler in. College, AGAIN
i think it's just the speed of the. GAME i

(35:52):
think once it slows down for, HIM i think you're
going to see him trusting himself and.

Speaker 2 (35:58):
Being in the right position and in the. PLACE i
think that he's a solid.

Speaker 1 (36:01):
Option, YES i agree with. That i'm very encouraged for
Coal bishop's. Development even though the rookie year was kind
of A i wouldn't call it a. DISAPPOINTMENT i think
the injury early was just making him again have to
play from, behind and he didn't have a spot in the.
Room SO i was kind of always, saying next, year
this kid's going to be more. Impactful but he did
get his, reps he did get his. OPPORTUNITY pff charted

(36:22):
him at two hundred snaps box and then for free
safety they had him charge at two, nineteen so a
pretty even. Ratio and For Cold, bishop the, strength you,
know given his draft profile THAT i had been talked
about last, year was really more towards the, box. Right
it's not that he couldn't play, both but the aggression
he played with the processing he, had he shined a
bit more when he was closer to your front, step
AND i think that that component of, it when you

(36:44):
talk about what you just brought, up WHICH i do
love that you mentioned, this The bills maybe pivoting to
a bit more man coverage and more packages that encourage
man coverage is great for Col bishop because the athletic
traits now can be able to shine without the deficiencies
of processing if they do still exists next season to
the degree they did this past. Year if it is
something WHERE i don't want to say you don't, think but,

(37:05):
rather hey we can man up And i'm just on this,
Guy i'm on this. Part THEN i think taking the
extra layer of difficulty away when you talk about dissecting
the play and just this is what we're, doing this
is What i'm. Covering let the body decide at that.
Point that's really good for, him especially when you want
to integrate more man, coverage but also try to get
him more refined in his zone, role where now It's

(37:28):
i'm just playing, again kind of similar to my topic On,
coleman playing with a little more, aggression playing with a
little bit more. Confidence and, now in, turn BECAUSE i
know that they could turn to me to play the
free safety or at least the deeper half of the,
field Because i'm going to rotate If i'm a safety
in The bills, Defense play with a little more of
your head, up and then just let that communication and
that development continue on into year two the way it

(37:49):
was in year. One because towards the back. Half, YEAH
i do think he looked a little bit better at
the free safety. Spot there were some. Miscommunications there were
some times WHERE i felt like he played a little too.
Deep maybe didn't react to something quick, enough got there
to clean, up but wasn't there to break, up and
then you, know here you are and you're charging something to.
Him BUT i think in year, two with the, tweaks
they might be having to the defensive. Philosophy it's a

(38:11):
great opportunity For Cole bishop to cement himself as a.
Starter and then if that processing continues where they play
zone and he is playing that deeper part of the
field and there is no drop, off that is a
huge boost for This bill's. Defense just they relied so
much on coverage disguising and their safety is being able
to play into a different position post, snap but be

(38:32):
smart enough to get. There Because Micah hyde And Jordan
poyer were not the most athletic, guys but they played
so quickly that it didn't matter if they weren't because
they knew where to, be just because of all the
film they, watched and just because of their understanding of
defensive coverages and The bills defense That, hey IF i
got to drop to this part of the field because
this is what they're showing us pre, snap and this

(38:53):
is Where i'm, going AND i will be. There you,
know you can think of The Micah hyde pick and
The patriots playoff game as the best example of. That
bishop as an opportunity to do. That but now pair
it with a very good athletic. Profile if that processing,
grows the player is going to be, Great and like
you just pointed, out if they compare him with an awesome,
safety whether that is in the draft or whether that
is their splash being in free, agency if they are

(39:16):
somehow able to go get A Jevon, holland WHICH i
Think john pointed out in our, Chat like if they
could do that and pair that kid with Cold bishop
and Have rap as the rotational or just some three man,
game they would be very fun to. Watch and if
that would mean more dime potentially With Cole bishop as a,
dinebacker that would also be very. FUN i think ATHLETICISM

(39:37):
i would love it. TOO i, mean it's all going
to depend on what they do in free agency, draft
But i'm encouraged by Just bishop as the prospect and,
player AND i think seeing flashes from him given the
offseason and what happened was ALL i. Needed it was
ALL i needed to feel really confident in year. Two
whether he lives up to. It, obviously with any of
these players is to be. Seen but there's a lot

(39:57):
to like about the Way bishop plays his, game and
if they had get him more refined as a deeper,
safety a lot of optimism in the safety room In,
buffle at least where he. Plays AND i liked What
rap did this, year SO i would actually be perfectly
comfortable at least to start if it had to Be
bishop And rap and then some young player you, take
if it's like A Billy bowman or A makubo like
you pointed, out that works in and then eventually could

(40:18):
take over a starting spot When rap. Goes But i'll
turn it back to you anything else you wanted to
say About bishop before we move.

Speaker 2 (40:23):
ON i just really want to highlight his.

Speaker 3 (40:26):
ATHLETICISM i pulled up rass here AND i did a
rass compare Between Cold bishop And Micah.

Speaker 2 (40:30):
Hyde.

Speaker 3 (40:32):
Cole bishop's rass was a nine point eight. Eight micah
hides is a four point seventy to.

Speaker 2 (40:36):
One.

Speaker 3 (40:37):
Okay Micah hyde was not an athletic, safety but he
understood the, system he knew where to, be and he
trusted his. Eyes and that was the biggest thing about
my Gu. Hide he's also gritty as. Hell, yeah once
Col bishop develops those, things which he's going to because
he's a good. Player he's a good, player he just
needs time in THE. Nfl expecting a safety to go

(40:57):
out there as a rookie and be a difference maker,
player especially in this defensive, system is not something that
anyone should. EXPECT i think that what we saw off
him in his first year is exactly the expectations for Cool.
Bishop flashes of, athleticism still learning the, scheme still waiting
on the game to slow down a little bit for,
him but once it. Does he ran a four four

(41:19):
or five. FORTY i know forty isn't, everything but Mikeah
hyde ran a four five. Six he jumped six inches
higher Than Micah, Hyde like he has more traits than
what they had for the better part.

Speaker 2 (41:30):
Of a decade back there at the safety.

Speaker 3 (41:31):
POSITION i think that he's going to develop into being
like a fan favorite, safety kind of like the two
that we had.

Speaker 1 (41:37):
Before just to bring this up from Spind devil on my,
shoulder thank you for watching spin is A bishop more
boyer Than, Hide, no definitely more similar at least in
my opinion To Jordan. Poyer but it's more so just
about the position and the relative athleticism and talking about
how high did have worse athletic. Testing but, Again hie
just played with faster. Processing As, now granted we bring In,

(41:57):
hide he was already a veteran right, like he was
in the league for a few years and he was
doing that slot corners safety hybrid role In Green. Bay
they bring him in as a full time, safety he
had more tenure in the. League so we're talking about
a rookie who is going to be twenty three years
old and there's so much development ahead of. Him so,
AGAIN i just bring it back to we already know

(42:19):
the athletic profile is, there what can it look like
when you ask him to have a more complex role
in This bill's. Defense AND i think there were times
where he did a great job playing that deep role
AND i think it could be built off of which
is WHY i am encouraged and very excited that they
took a safety with that, profile AND i hope they
do it again if they decide to draft, someone because
it's a good class with a lot of athletic, guys
and you know we use that, term but when you

(42:41):
talk about what The bill's safeties do and their. Responsibility
it is a. Plus if you can get a guy
who's just naturally, fast great vertical, strong he'p seeking, missile great,
tackler those are pluses if you can build the development with,
it the same way you talk About Keon coleman being
a plus for the receiving. Corps if you take those
traits and mold. Them will that again up in the.

(43:01):
Air But i'm pretty cool with the. PICK i, HOPE
i really, REALLY i really hope he.

Speaker 2 (43:06):
Develops, YEAH i mean too if we want to Use.

Speaker 3 (43:08):
Poyer same thing is the rest is a five point
six y eight Cole bishop jumped nine inches higher Than
i'm on the vert like same. Thing we did not
have athletic safeties back.

Speaker 2 (43:17):
There it was all the.

Speaker 3 (43:19):
Heads it was all understanding what offense is we're. Doing
and once Col bishop gets that, speed the closing, speed
the ability to jump and break up passes and go
up for. INTERCEPTIONS i still am very bullish On Cold bishop's,
future especially with the way that this team develops secondary.
Players give me year Three Cold, bishop, DUDE i think he's.

Speaker 2 (43:39):
Gonna be a. Force LIKE i really am bullish On Cold.

Speaker 1 (43:42):
BISHOP i totally agree AND i think That vitch, McDermott
the personnel they brought, in especially the dv's coach From New,
england like all these little pieces and little pivots they're,
making it's perfect for a player Like, bishop it just.
IS i think it's going to be a huge help for.
Him And i'm excited for year two and year. Three

(44:02):
hopefully year two is really good so that year three
could just be like a yay cold bitch kind of
like how we talked About bernard who someone in the
chat did mention that. Too, Okay, john we got to
move on to number, three and it hurts. Me it
hurts me so. Badly but UNFORTUNATELY i have to say
the player that of the rookie quest that at least

(44:22):
had more snaps and more of a role because some
players full, spoiler there's players on this list we are
gonna even cover because they barely, played or they were
special teams or relegated to like you, know. Development with this,
player he was on the, field he was. PREVALENT i
had very high hopes for, him we both. DID i
was cheering and the draft room when they picked, him
but unfortunately it WAS i would call it a disappointing rookie,

(44:45):
season and that was From Dwayne. Carter AND i don't
want to pile on the guy because he seems like
the most awesome. Dude His instagram is just constantly reposting
his teammates. Stories he seems like the best. GUY i
want this man to succeed so, Badly so please understand
that this entire segment is just because we're going off
what we saw in the hopes of. Development BUT i

(45:07):
will say there were. Flashes there were moments For Dwayne,
carter whether he was singled up and was able to
show off some pass rush, ability whether it was some
positive flashes and run defense which he, had and those
are there and they are real and they can be
built off. Of, however apart from the injury which derailed
his rookie year, two which kind of a THREE a
theme with like most of his, class there were just

(45:29):
moments where he just gets completely washed out in double
teams and they asked him to just maintain a role
where he could take on too when he, couldn't and
he gets moved off the ball and he can't do
anything about the physicality in front of. Him he can't get.
Through he can't alter his you, know his. Position he's
just getting moved and it's not. ENCOURAGING i will turn
it back to, You john our, Guy Dwyane, carter what

(45:53):
are your?

Speaker 3 (45:53):
THOUGHTS i mean you pretty much you pretty much said.
IT i don't think that there's a whole lot else
to say about my. Baby blastoice over, here very very
bullish on Doing carter coming into THE. Nfl his tape was.
Great he was a physical force in the. Interior he
didn't get pushed. Around it's just almost like THE nfl

(46:13):
is too strong for, him you know WHAT i, Mean
like that's just the way that it kind of.

Speaker 1 (46:16):
Reads.

Speaker 3 (46:17):
Now can he continue to get? Stronger can he work
on some? Technique, absolutely there's still things that he can
do to be. Valuable but as of right, NOW i
have a hard time viewing him as a starter anytime
in the.

Speaker 2 (46:32):
FUTURE i think that he's working.

Speaker 3 (46:36):
To hold his spot as a rotational three tech right.
NOW i think that's kind of how it's going to go.

Speaker 2 (46:45):
Or one. Tech, sorry.

Speaker 3 (46:48):
My brain is frid rotating in on the interior of
the defensive, line which he came in in backup spots
of multiple players this.

Speaker 2 (46:54):
Year but like you, said he.

Speaker 3 (46:56):
Got washed out in the run like he did not
have the ability to anchor, down didn't have the ability
to just hold the fort, sink you, know the, backside and.

Speaker 2 (47:07):
Take on the double.

Speaker 3 (47:08):
Teams and that's why we're talking about guys Like Kenneth.
Grant that's why we're talking about guys Like Derek carmen
that are similar in size to him and have that
ability to just anchor down and also pierce through and
create havoc on the interior collapse of the. Pocket stuff

(47:29):
like that that we really didn't see From carter when
he was on the field this.

Speaker 2 (47:33):
Year so it's.

Speaker 3 (47:34):
Disappointing he's not trending in the right way right. NOW
i think that's kind of my overall take On Dwayne.
Carter got a few years left on the rookie. Contract
hopefully he continues to grow and can get some stuff
fixed and they can turn him into someone that's going
to be serviceable on the defensive. Line BUT i think
that's that's about the ceiling for me right.

Speaker 1 (47:55):
Now and when you watched him At, duke you saw
some in the pass rush. GAME i did think when
it came to taking on doubles, though it was something
that he did need to work, on AND i think
The bills really did want to get him in that
position of someone that could rotate in and be able
to whether it was kind of fill, in is it
a facto one tech and just hope that he does.
Well but you, know given how thin the room was

(48:18):
and the, death and with your top end not really
playing up to, par it was, Like, ken this could
give us. ANYTHING i hang my hat on the one
hope that maybe he was actually starting to figure it
out a little bit more and then gets hurt right
after That houston, game missus significant time comes back and
in the same vein Of coal bishoping Keyon, coleman that

(48:40):
delay in being able to get on the field takes
away your ability to, develop and it slows you down
more to a point where you're just a rotational ancillary.
Piece and then eventually a game day. Enacted which was
the most disappointing part of it to me was just
seeing kind of the fall from, grace especially BECAUSE i
just point to This houston, game not because it was,
perfect because it wasn't by any, stretch but any of

(49:00):
moments WHERE i Saw carter shed and see him get
into the backfield and create. Pressure And i'm, like all, right,
kid like here we, go let's this is? It like
rough couple of games, preseason you're figuring it. Out BUT
i could see it, now you, know and he's filling
in for injury and just we didn't get that. Again
BUT i think it can be. MOLDED i think it is,
possible and an off season of training and refinement to

(49:22):
his game and trying to figure out better ways to
anchor and get low and not get pushed around would benefit.
Him But i'm with, You, JOHN i just think right,
NOW I i you, KNOW i didn't Want anthony to
be right and he might not. Be, No i'm not
Calling anthony, out but just we WE i talked About
carter with him so, much like so, much and it
broke my heart BECAUSE i WAS i was, like, oh

(49:43):
he could be.

Speaker 4 (49:43):
Good he.

Speaker 1 (49:44):
Could he's, like, listen he, Could he definitely. Could but right,
NOW i just see him as a ROTATIONAL dt rotational
three tech And i'm, LIKE i really don't want him
to just be like what we had With Tim, Settle
LIKE i want him to be bore And i'm pulling
for this guy to figure it. Out but when it
came to any semblance of integrity when it came running
or run, defense it was it was hard to watch at.

(50:06):
Times it was just hard to. Watch AND i think
that that's gonna be the biggest thing you gotta work,
on because if you want to hold your spot on this,
duie you gotta hold your, integrity your gap. Integrity AND
i just don't think it was there for. Him i'm
hoping he figures it, out BUT i don't really know
what else you can. Do i've NEVER i don't know
if it's putting more weight ON i don't know if
it's just getting out the lab and, refining like what

(50:27):
is the? Path you?

Speaker 3 (50:28):
Know, WELL i was just gonna say, that what are, you,
like are you a one tech or a three you
know WHAT i? Mean if you're a one, tech you
can't play at three hundred and five, Pounds like that's
just not going to cut it. There you can be
three h five out of three tech where you're trying
to pierce through some guards and stuff like. That but

(50:49):
he doesn't have the athleticism and the mobility to do,
That like he's not At, oliver you know WHAT i.
Mean he doesn't have that, build the, length the, speed
of an at oliver where he's freaking. Havoc but he's
also not big enough right now to hold the point
of attack against double teams are in the. Run so
it's like maybe your path, forward man is go to the.

(51:09):
Buffet like maybe your path forward is just you gotta
be in a calorie, surplus my, Guy LIKE i don't, Know,
YEAH i don't know what the path, is but it
might just be.

Speaker 1 (51:24):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah five strawberry and, crustables a, knight
five strawberry adcrustable is a, knight a glass of, milk ten,
bubbles let's.

Speaker 2 (51:31):
Go, yeah that'll do it just as your neck.

Speaker 3 (51:35):
Yet but LIKE i think that's. It like if he's
gonna be a rotational one tech maybe Someday philan as
a starter, Maybe like you've got to be a lot
bigger and a lot, Stronger AND i don't know if
his frame can really support, that you, KNOW i don't
know that he's got that much more on, Him like
he's not going to go from three to five to three.

(51:55):
Thirty like if he, is he's gonna lose any mobility.
Whatsoever he's just going to be your old school one
tech fat guy that doesn't. Move SO i don't really,
know like if he can get up to three fifteen
and still have some spryness and the strength and, conditioning
can can work with them.

Speaker 2 (52:14):
There like maybe it'll.

Speaker 3 (52:16):
Help BUT i think that it's a serious case of
like body transformation kind of needs to, happen because what
we saw rookie years, like you're not big enough and
or strong enough to hold the point of the attack
right now against the. Run so if you're gonna be
three h, five, dude you gotta get. Jacked you got

(52:36):
to be like bench pressing trucks at three oh. Five
so we'll see what. Happens maybe that's the route. Too
maybe they just want to be, like all, right get
strong as, Hell LIKE i don't, KNOW i don't know
what it's going to.

Speaker 1 (52:46):
Be and you know, SOMETHING i wonder if a commitment
to finding that true one tech in the, draft like
your actual big, man whether that is a, grant whether
they get it way called, well whether you want to
talk about like the kid was It Norman, LOT i
think is the one tech IF i remember, Correctly i'm
trying to remember that there's so many of them he's

(53:06):
got so. SURE i do think that a big part
of the flaws for THE dt room was the fact
that there was no death and no quality, runs like
even With Dick Kwan, jones like it was just it wasn't,
consistent it wasn't good. Enough if you actually do find
that player in the, draft then maybe it helps you
Because carter might be able to be pushed into a

(53:26):
true rotational three tech and even if that's what he's
got to be to just have a good enough. Season
like AND i like this From spin because, yeah you
look at the size profile AND i was optimistic that
could make it. Work but you, know if you see
that he's struggling with, it then you got to stop
forcing the. Issue but this is WHAT i. Mean if
you don't have that personnel to fill in for Thea
Kwan jones and you just need anybody to go out

(53:47):
there and do. It hence why they probably went and
Got jefferson And phillips towards the back half of the.
Year then getting the true one tech and someone that
if you still Have jones for the one more year
and you don't let them, go but you get this
young prospect that could take a to that work and
putting him into that three tech. Role just to get
something and give him some. Spark that wasn't. That that
to me is just that's. It that's the path For

(54:08):
carter to remain on the, team to remain, successful and
to remain someone that you could actually turn to and
put him in better positions to, succeed where if it's
not facing a, double but you're a manned or one
on one with a, guard he can get a ball,
through he can get to the backfield and it could be.
Successful but and spin's going into the. Chet But i'm
saying he played all over the. Line first, off it

(54:29):
wasn't just exclusively three. TECH i saw him take reps at.
ONE i saw him take reps right or out even
it was a mix of. Three but they saw him
take one tech two and just try to mold him
and it didn't.

Speaker 2 (54:39):
Work SO i think it was out of.

Speaker 3 (54:41):
Necessity like you, Said, JOE i don't think that they
drafted him to be a one.

Speaker 2 (54:45):
TECH i just think he was.

Speaker 3 (54:46):
The best option that they had Behind Diikelon, jones you
know WHAT i, Mean, LIKE i think that it was
just out of necessity that they put him. There now
here's my. Concern we know that The, bills, Sorry we
know that The bills have a ton of draft picks this,
year they have ten of. Them we know that they're
going to be going after defensive line in some. CAPACITY i,
mean there's there's a chance that he doesn't make the,

(55:07):
Roster like that's that's not out of the realm of.
POSSIBILITY i think that it's not. Likely but if you
bring in a one, tech like a true one tech
And Alfred Collins Jamari, caldwell three hundred and thirty, pound
three hundred and forty pound guy to be your backup
at one, tech and then you have someone else that
comes in at three tech that shows more athleticism and

(55:28):
more ability to get to the.

Speaker 2 (55:29):
Quarterback Does Dwayne?

Speaker 3 (55:31):
Carter maybe he makes the, roster but is he a
game day and active like every? Week like is he
your fifth defensive?

Speaker 2 (55:37):
Lineman you?

Speaker 3 (55:38):
Know AND i think there was a lot of times
where they carried Four SO i think that it does
get a little sticky for. It AND i don't want
to say that after just one, year but it's, like,
dude something's got to change in your.

Speaker 2 (55:49):
Profile you either.

Speaker 3 (55:50):
Got to get like a lot faster and play a
three tech or you got to crush some on crustables
and play one Tech LIKE i don't, know but something
has to change in order for him to have a
path on this. Roster otherwise they're gonna look at him
as a tweeter that can't really do, either and that's
not a successful.

Speaker 1 (56:07):
Path, yeah you, got you got to, commit and, like
it's good to be, versatile but you gain that versatility
from having the high enough four to play both, positions,
Right like if you talked about like If Cole bishop
developed in the deeper half role to a point where
you're comfortable with him playing that most of the, time
then you'd feel good about him playing you, know box
or deep and being a more versatile. Safety SO i like.

(56:29):
That it's like what are you and what's the role
you're giving? Him because With, CARTER i think if you
just commit to one thing to, start we build it
off the other. Way and it felt like there was
something of like A BILLS d line identity, crisis which
is Why i'll keep going back to they just needed the,
body and they put the body in a bad, position
And i'm sure it weighed heavy on him, Too SO
i don't THINK i get it being a. CONCERN i

(56:52):
think he's still gonna be on the. Roster but, right
what is the function for Dwank? Carter? Right how many
DT's do they bring in and are they bringing guys
that have multiple alignman like or able to play multiple?
Wirements like CAN i have someone who could be potentially
a one side to three and maybe even kick out
wide like they did with smooth.

Speaker 2 (57:08):
Slighttimes derek could do.

Speaker 1 (57:09):
That like, yeah if they get.

Speaker 3 (57:11):
Aggressive and they bring a guy in like Like, harmon,
like oh, man you're kind of in trouble there now
to find some playing time Because harmon can go from
zero to, Five like he is a big fellow with
athleticism and he can hold the point of attack, also
SO i think he makes the. Roster Like i'm not
saying that that's my, prediction but like you're trending towards

(57:32):
being the odd man out in the future unless something,
Changes AND i think that's just kind of my biggest.

Speaker 1 (57:38):
Point. No, absolutely and we'll just have to say, AGAIN
i will keep saying. THIS i was a huge fan
of the. PICK i really liked his. GAME i liked
that they went for defensive tackle last, year AND i
thought they got him as a steal, obviously rookie season was,
disappointing And i'm still gonna be optimistic in some, degree
BUT i do think right now the expectations have been
tempered to just rotational THREE t until proven. Otherwise but

(57:59):
that's a world he could still live. In it could
still very much help the. Team and if that is
the way For Dwayne carter to eventually be able to
wear more hats and become more reliable in that, role
then so be. It BUT i think a lot was
put on his plate as a rookie and it just
didn't pan out the way the team wanted it to
and unfortunately the way we wanted it. To but no bad.
Things rooting for the guy five encrustables a night for

(58:20):
the foreseeable. Future let's get up the three twenty, together.
Man but, yeah, babe let's move. On let's move on
To Ray, davis the final rookie that we'll talk about extensively.
Tonight AND i was. PLEASED i, mean there's no other
way to put. It you, KNOW i was never Expecting
Ray davis to put up a thousand. YARDS i was
never expecting anything to the to the degree of rotational

(58:41):
back that has his. MOMENTS i would just like to
see some positives in pass, blocking which mixed. BAG i
thought he did really well as a. RUNNER i thought
when he went between the tackles it was really. Encouraging
BUT i think he also has a lot of juice
when it came to his, balance his ability to stay
upright even when he's facing, contact and how he pushed through.
IT i Like Ray davis a, lot AND i also

(59:03):
like the times they did use him as a receiving,
back AND i hope that that in general goes up
next year for, everybody but especially With Ray. Davis john
back to you thoughts on.

Speaker 3 (59:12):
Him, YEAH i was surprised by that element of his,
Game like they didn't use him a ton in college
in the passing, game like it was, there but not a.
LOT i didn't expect him to have nineteen targets this
year and catch seventeen of them like that is a
very pleasant, Surprise, like, oh, okay we have more versatility
in this backfield THAN i think we thought we. Did
my biggest thing for him was he stepped in against

(59:36):
The jets When James cook was out and had a
ball out game ninety seven rushing, yards three of three
on his targets for fifty five more yards after. That,
like this is a guy that showed that he's capable
of coming in if needed and being a starting caliber running.

Speaker 1 (59:55):
Back.

Speaker 3 (59:55):
Now he's not the same level As James cook right,
Now absolutely. Not James cook was that level when he
was a rookie, either by the, way continue to, develop
but he showed that he's a very capable and versatile
running back that's able to come in and do a
little bit of. Everything he runs with. Power they used
him a lot in short yardage. Situations he was a
little bit of the, hammer even though he has more

(01:00:16):
agility and explosiveness to just label him as, that you
know WHAT i. Mean he wasn't just the, hammer but
that's how they used him in a lot of situations
WHERE i think that that.

Speaker 2 (01:00:25):
CONTINUES i don't know if you've.

Speaker 3 (01:00:28):
Heard there's just a little bit of a running back
conversation happening around the league and with The bills in
particular right. Now SO i think having a talented second
running back on the roster right now looks very.

Speaker 2 (01:00:41):
IMPORTANT i agree.

Speaker 1 (01:00:43):
COMPLETELY i really can't add too much to. IT i,
mean what we got From Ray davis is kind of
what we. Wanted you got him in the fourth round For.
Kentucky he ATE's a bit of an older, prospect but
you saw the potential in his game and being kind
of a nice mix With James cook behind that offensive
line that predicates self on physicality and could beat you
up in the. Trenches he's a great compliment to everything

(01:01:05):
they have going on right, now AND i think this year,
two it's really just how much of his role. Increases
what do they do with their third? Back Is Ty
johnson coming? Back Because Ty, johnson with the flashes he,
had there's perfect justification for this team to give him
a contract and get him. Back but if they, don't
do they Think Ray davis can man some of that,

(01:01:26):
role not that they're the same, player but rather just
up the snap, count up the, share be able to
get him as your primary two and mix them, in
and more, importantly what does it look like if they
are your primary two? Backs and Does Joe brady get
creative and maybe run some pony with both of these
guys on the field if he so, chooses does he
want to utilize him as a receiver a bit? More,
again it's all about your, development AND i think pass

(01:01:47):
blocking is just such a big component when you talk
about The, bills when you talk about what their offense
does from their tight, ends from their, receivers from their running,
backs and With Ray, davis more enhancement in THAT i
think gets him on the field more, often especially if
you're looking at a potential world Without James, cook whether
that's this upcoming season or the season. AFTER i like
having him in the. ROOM i like his. PROFILE i

(01:02:08):
think there really isn't much Negative i'll say about him
for what his rookie year, was apart from even though
he didn't have like a detrimental amount of, FUMBLES i
did see sometimes WHERE i got a little nervous about ball.
Security but rookie running back happened To, cook happens to
a lot of. People tighten that up and maybe we'll
be okay and really just get better as a pass.
Blocker and again he wasn't the best at, it BUT

(01:02:29):
i thought there was a lot to build off of
from his time AT uk AND i think as a
pro if he's getting in position and able to kind
of get to even most of that level That Ty
johnson got, to that's going to make him a big
part of this offense for the foreseeable. Future And i'm
a huge fan Of. DAVIS i mean just as a.
Person as a, player he did everything you wanted him to.
Do and you talked about The jets, game but LIKE

(01:02:51):
i think about it a lot, too the offscript, component,
Right AND i talked about this With Ty johnson when
we talk about players and the roster and who's going
to come back. WHATEVER a big thing for me is
how do you work With Josh allen? Offscript Because Josh
allen is going to go off script and you need
to be really good at understanding that what he rolls
out of the, pocket sirens are going off and like

(01:03:11):
it's like The Benny hill theme starts. Playing just everything
goes absolutely. Insane and you need to have the chemistry with,
this with this quarterback to be able to be in
the positions When josh wants to Go sico, mode WHICH
i Think coleman is doing and that's awesome AND i love,
that But davis to be able to go off script
with him and get into the open field and make that,
play just just get up, there get behind the dbs

(01:03:34):
and get. THAT i was, like this is, It like
he can do? THIS i believe in. THIS i needed
to see, it Like cooka can do it. Now davis
has that, ability And i'm always showing you one. Example
but you can build off this if you give him more,
snaps if you give him more, opportunity and you're willing
to go to him more. Often plenty of, flashes plenty
of positive. Runs i'm a huge. FAN i like to
pick nothing consequential about, it only good things from. Here, Really,

(01:03:57):
LIKE i Think Ray davis is the one that gives
me the least dress on this. List just, Like, yeah,
man even if you run back what you did in
your rookie, year like it was still pretty solid for
running back. Three if you go to, two let's up
the production is really the only THING i.

Speaker 3 (01:04:09):
Asked, YEAH i think that ability to play off script
he got a little taste of it in. College his
college quarterback Was Will, Levis so that shared ability In.
Kentucky you Think Will levis was just sitting back there
and operating from the pocket and doing everything.

Speaker 2 (01:04:26):
Exactly how it.

Speaker 3 (01:04:27):
Scripted hell, No SO i Think Ray davis got a
little bit of that mentality instilled in him in, college
which which.

Speaker 2 (01:04:33):
Helps in this. Situation SO i like it as, WELL
i think that he's.

Speaker 3 (01:04:38):
AWESOME i think he's a great addition that's great bowling
ball than a.

Speaker 2 (01:04:42):
Hammer he is a bowling.

Speaker 1 (01:04:43):
Ball he's.

Speaker 3 (01:04:43):
Built we saw it last year down at The Senior
Bowl man he was just rumbling AND i was, like, oh, okay,
YEAH i saw that on. Tape it's nice to see
it in. Person he's a great second running.

Speaker 1 (01:04:53):
BACK i loved.

Speaker 3 (01:04:54):
It remember we were out, there we were standing down
in the crowd when that pick was, made AND i
was just, like, oh, YEAH i love, this love this
pick as.

Speaker 2 (01:05:02):
A second running.

Speaker 1 (01:05:03):
Back.

Speaker 3 (01:05:05):
YEAH i, MEAN i don't think we're getting into the
Whole James cook situation, here BUT i think you're comfortable
in your options Behind cook right now where if that was,
needed whether it's a holdout or whether he's not on
the team or. WHATEVER i think that it's a fine
place to be with room for. Improvement and we'll see

(01:05:28):
what the next two months old before the.

Speaker 1 (01:05:29):
Draft, really, Yeah James cook is valuable to this. Offense
i'm not trying to downplay his impact oh. EITHER i
think it's. More i'm not saying you are just more,
so like WHEN i say, THIS i feel comfortable if
we have to survive a couple games Without cook because
we Have. Davis and if It's johnson or one of
the many running backs in this class who show you
a lot of potential to fill, IN i Think Ray

(01:05:51):
davis again in the game That James cook got, hurt
stepped up really well and match That bill's physical front really.
Well and again when he's in the open when he's got,
acceleration he's going to keep. Going AND i like this
From roy Because roy does bring up the one thing
That Ray davis doesn't give you a. Speed maybe, not
but if you're hard to bring, down then you're still
gonna generate that. Yak and not having the breakaway ability

(01:06:12):
to the degree that Like cook may have does. Suck
BUT i will still take the punishing nature of the
way this man runs the ball every day of the.
Week and you, know if it's the difference Between, okay
he broke in the open, field then it turned into
a thirty yard run instead of a forty yard, run
that's a. TOUCHDOWN i still trust This bills offense to
punch it in like they just always seem to find
a way. To and what more demoralizing thing for a

(01:06:35):
defense than we just gave up a chunk run To
Ray davis and now they wind up under center in
the red zone and give it right back to. Him
that's gonna. HURT i don't want to deal with. That
that's WHY i don't play, football because football. Hurts But
i'm encouraged by. HIM i think, of you, know wrapping this,
up just talking about this, list and even With, Carter
i'll include. THIS i think everyone had flashes to some
degree that can give you some thing to take away

(01:06:57):
going into year. Two for every player With cole in
it was the athleticism that we were promised and just
a lack of refinement THAT i think as he gets,
older more time in the, league then that is something
that can be developed and hopefully is a more polished
receiver used in more unique ways to give him more
chances beyond just go into the boundary and go. Up
and maybe that'll come with whoever they add to the.

(01:07:18):
Offense maybe that comes with differences in the. Playbook this.
Offseason we will have to See. Bishop we know how
athletic he. Is he was playing from behind because of that,
injury gets on the field and each week develops a
little bit more closing speed was their tackling ability while
it was hit or. MISS i thought when he made
those hits was really. SOLID i think there is a
player there that if you can get him into the

(01:07:39):
rhythm of being a safety in The bills defense and
grow his ability to communicate and understand how to be
in the right position post snap when you're disguising. Something
this is a guy that can give you both that box,
mentality that really aggressive upfront safety play and THE dp half,
play which is very important in This bill's. Defense, carter
still love, You, carter but we saw the flashes, again,

(01:08:03):
LIKE i know there's something. THERE i don't think this
guy is. DONE i don't think he's going to roll
over and. DIE i think he just needs to, be
like you, said find his, identity commit to something that
you think he could be good. At and if that
is truly rotational three, tech then so be its. Start
and maybe again the role develops more as he gets
more comfortable And Ray davis to keep doing what you're
doing and if you end up becoming THAT rb two

(01:08:25):
and get yourself into that position where the snapshare goes,
up whether it's Because cook's, gone whether it's Because johnson's,
gone and you have a rookie come. In i'm very
optimistic about the future of this guy in what will
probably be a running back standard four year deal for The.
Bills john final thoughts before we sign.

Speaker 3 (01:08:40):
Off solid but not exceptional rookie season all the way,
around with room to. GROW i think that's the general.
Takeaway AND i just want to See Brandon. Bean LIKE
i said at this, START i want to be having
this conversation a year from now and be like blank
player is a bleeping, Stud like that's the CONVERSATION i

(01:09:03):
want to have a year from.

Speaker 2 (01:09:04):
Now so let's. Try, man what lines up?

Speaker 3 (01:09:08):
Well is that the depth and the talent at the
positions that we directly need those line up and that's
a very good. Thing so you need an, edge you
need a defensive, tackle you need a. Corner get one
with a sky high ceiling that's already a good ball,
player and let's see what.

Speaker 1 (01:09:28):
Happens and don't be afraid of an older. PROSPECT i
think is the real. Thing i'll say, too because like
you look at the rams, right like it's like a
player turns twenty four and everyone's scared of. Them AND
i think that's so funny because Like Gray davis is
a great. Example Like Gray davis is an older, prospect
but he had a great year and he was a
pretty high four rookie to begin. With whereas you look
at some of the tracy picks That bean has, taken

(01:09:49):
like A Gregory russell or like a Key On, coleman
and these are extremely, young raw players and there is
a commitment to their. Development and if you Are Brandon,
bean it's up to you to decide do you want
to go for the really cool athletic traits like A
Dion walker or like A Landon jackson on your d
line this, year or do you want to, say, nah
we need this. Now we are even THOUGH i don't

(01:10:09):
believe in a window in his eyes its we just
went to THE Afc championship and. LOST i need impact.
Players let's get this. Now then that's. It SO i
feel pretty good about this rookie. CLASS i think a
lot of them are going to be mainstays for This
bills team next, season end seasons to. Come BUT i
think this draft class is the very pivotal nexus event

(01:10:33):
for this team because when you talk about all of this,
retooling all of this trying to get younger youth, infusion
cap space generation because you were in a tough spot last.
Season this class being good and you hitting on these,
picks whether it's even just half of, them even if
it's just thirty something percent of, them if you could
just get one elite player or just four really good,

(01:10:56):
players or however it's got to, be that is a
huge swing for the next few. Years so this is
a big draft. Class Brandon, Bean we're trusting you don't
mess it. Up And dwayne five five on crestables at
night and a glass of. Milk it could be non
dairy if you'd prefer, whatever whatever your preference. Is But,
JOHN i appreciate, you. Man this was a ton of.
FUN i always love having you on the. Show you
always give me great analysis on everything we talk, about

(01:11:19):
AND i appreciate you and your. Time please let all
of these good people know what you got going on
in your. World.

Speaker 3 (01:11:26):
Yeah it is esports Dot. COM i cover The Buffalo.
BILLS i will be doing a ton of work in
the next month and a half breaking down prospects and
doing mock. Drafts i'm actually gonna be posting A bill's
mock draft this. Week so if you want to be
looking at who some of those rookies.

Speaker 2 (01:11:41):
Might be follow. Along let's chat.

Speaker 3 (01:11:45):
At you On helme camp ON x and uh, yeah
really looking forward To we're in ramp up.

Speaker 2 (01:11:50):
Mode it's draft, season.

Speaker 1 (01:11:51):
Baby it's draft, season. Friends it's also free agency season
and next week that's what we'll be talking about on the.
Show But, john thank you, again and if you haven't
followed on please do so On, twitter on all social media,
platforms works his butt off and puts out some great,
content great. Analysis AND i actually Met john Through cover
one when we were talking about draft stuff and it
is just so fun to engage in those conversations with the.

(01:12:13):
Man so, again thank you to all of you in the.
Chat thank you so much for tuning into this week's
episode Of Under. Review we appreciate everyone's contributions to our
chat room as. Always if you are interested in the one,
past check the description below you could find the link
to sign up. Again sixty gold lablloons a year get
you some pretty sweet. Perks AS i mentioned earlier in this,

(01:12:33):
episode the shirt is an option join our discord and
just be a part of an awesome community with a
bunch of people that we engage with on a day
to day, basis it's really cool. STUFF a Name's Joe.
DeRosa you could find me On, twitter slash x At,
Show underscore D rosa and do not go anywhere if
you are on YouTube or really any of our streaming,
platforms because at nine pm you could check out my

(01:12:54):
guests from last, week Mister Anthony prohaska On disguy's coverage
and his episode IF i looked at it correctly and
didn't look at some. Wrong he's going to be On
Free agency and you know, It he's going to get
down to the nitty gritty in detail and you cannot miss.
It you're not allowed. To i'm actually forcing you all
to go watch. It i'll be in the chat room
as well BECAUSE i always do. That but, Again, john thank,
you everyone in the, chat thank. You we'll see you

(01:13:15):
next week and as, always Go, bills see you, soon

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Reviewing the Buffalo Bills' Rookie Class! | UR

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Reviewing the Buffalo Bills' Rookie Class! | UR