The Paranormal World with Andy Thomas

Learn how this new book constitutes a whole new insight into the paranormal! Andy Thomas is one of the UK’s best-known researchers and speakers on unexplained phenomena and cover-ups, making these subjects accessible and refreshingly unpolarised. He has given thousands of lectures in Britain and around the world for more than three decades. Andy is the author of many books, including his latest title Strange, one of the broadest assessments on people’s everyday paranormal experiences. Other acclaimed books include The New Heretics, Conspiracies and The Truth Agenda. Andy is the world’s most prolific author on the controversial crop circle mystery and his investigation Vital Signs was nominated for Kindred Spirit magazine’s Best Book award. Andy also writes and speaks on mainstream folklore and history and is author of Christmas: A Short History from Solstice to Santa. Andy has made numerous radio and TV appearances over the years. Mainstream spots have included programmes on the BBC, ITV, NBC, History Channel, National Geographic, Vice and Sky. He is regularly interviewed on numerous podcasts. Andy is one of the organisers of the Glastonbury Symposium, the long-running annual ‘Expand Your Horizons’ conference, which began in 1990, and he regularly arranges other events on truth and mysteries.

Find out more about Andy Thomas on his website at www.truthagenda.org 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
It's time for the Unexed News News extraterrestrials, time anomalies,
dimension dimensions, remote viewing, UFOs, UAPs and USO's, ghostly encounters, abductions,
Bigfoot and more more, your end of the week news

(00:25):
source for everything unexplained. Here is your host for the
unex News podcast, Margie K.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
Welcome to NX News. I'm your host, Margie K. We
are here every Friday evening at six pm Central Time,
and most of my shows are live as you are aware,
and of course tonight is no exception. I have a
most excellent guest this evening that I think you're going

(01:08):
to find fascinating. If you're into the paranormal at all,
you're going to want to stay tuned for the entire show.
Andy Thomas is one of the UK's best known researchers
and speakers on unexplained phenomena and cover ups, making these
subjects accessible and refreshingly unpolarized. He has given thousands of

(01:28):
lectures in Britain and around the world for more than
three decades. Andy's the author of many books, including his
latest title Strange, one of the broadest assessments on people's
everyday paranormal experiences. Andy has made numerous radio and TV
appearances over the years. Mainstream spots have included programs on

(01:49):
the BBC, ITV, NBC History Channel, National Geographic Vice, and
Sky Welcome to the program from the UK, Andy.

Speaker 3 (02:00):
Thomas, great to be here, Thank you well.

Speaker 2 (02:04):
Thank you so much for joining me tonight. And I
know it's very late for you where you are right now,
so I appreciate you taking the time to join us
this evening. You have a new book out, of course,
You've written a number of books which we will eventually
talk about, but let's start with how did you get

(02:24):
interested in the paranormal?

Speaker 3 (02:27):
So I got drawn in well over thirty years ago
now by crop circles and UFOs and it was really,
you know, that kind of thing that made me aware
of people who were studying all kinds of other paranormal things.
And I realized, just from my own experience with crop
circles that you know, the mainstream media didn't discuss them properly,

(02:51):
they didn't get the truth about them. You know, it
was always one side and it was always debunking, and
I thought, well, if they're doing that's something like that,
and they must be doing it to anything deemed paranormal,
And of course then you start to investigate one branch
of the paranormal, and before you know it, you're meeting
people who were investigating all of them. And I became

(03:13):
fascinated by the whole thing and just wanted to get
a good broad look at it. And before I knew it,
there I was giving talks about it, writing books, and
in my life took a whole different turn to what
I ever thought it would.

Speaker 2 (03:27):
And what type of work were you doing before you
got involved in this?

Speaker 3 (03:32):
So I was very much working in the music world.
I was a musician, but I also wrote music for
various projects, and then got into pr That was the
world I was in. And then suddenly along came crop
circles and everything that then followed from that. And yeah,
it opened doors and made me realize that the world

(03:53):
that we live in is actually far more interesting than
many people would have us believe. And you know, my mission,
and if you like, has always been to show other
people that there is something going on here that you know,
we do need to talk about much more, and yet
most people shy away from it or we're told there's
nothing there to see, and we shouldn't worry about it,
but I've discovered there is something to see, and we

(04:16):
should not worry about it, but we should be aware
of it, and I think really investigate anything that shines
a whole new light on the way the universe works.

Speaker 2 (04:27):
Indeed, and you mentioned that you're a musician, I've found
that there are many people who are involved in paranormal
investigations or authors or podcasters who are musicians. I wonder
why that is. Do you have any ideas?

Speaker 3 (04:43):
Yeah, my guess there would be that it's quite a
creative thing to be a musician, and if you're creative,
you should be open to new imaginings, and you know,
you are in some way more open at what's around you,
and that's certainly true of many of the musicians I've worked.
So yeah, then if you're open to things like the paranormal,
of course you're going to be looking at things. You

(05:06):
want that inspiration, you want to create in different ways,
and you know, now, you know, I create by a
writing and I create by giving presentations and trying to
make this whole world of the strange. Hence they're the
book title accessible to people. Because I'm very aware that
some people, they're a bit afraid to go near it.

(05:28):
The media always puts a sort of spooky atmosphere around it,
which sometimes they can be, of course, but equally, you know,
it can be truly fascinating, It can be beautiful sometimes
the paranormal, and it makes you look again at the
way that the whole world that we live in ticks.
And to make people look again at that, I think

(05:49):
it's a really important thing to do, especially in this
world today, where you know, so often you're closed down
by skeptics, or you're told just to look at the
material world, or to look over there and there, but
not here. We should of course be looking there.

Speaker 2 (06:06):
Right exactly? Do you find that the world has changed
recently and people are more open to discussing paranormal subjects.

Speaker 3 (06:16):
Yeah, it's something has given. I mean, I think social media,
of course, you know, for all the good and bad
of it, what it did do was enable people to
share things about experiences that they were having, but that
previously there wasn't really an outlet for it. Thought of
beating up the people or you know, magazines, and suddenly
they could exchange and you found that, you know, the

(06:39):
unusual experiences that you were having were actually happening to
other people as well, so that made a big difference.
And of course now even if the mainstream still debunks
and laughs, you could just put that aside and say,
well what is mainstream anyway? And more people now have
the chance to share these ideas in their own way,

(07:00):
and so gradually that is having I think a wider
knock on effects. I mean, just a good example of that.
Here in England we've got the BBC, of course, which
has been in the news of lake but even they,
who were very closed to the paranormal for many years,
they've started to cover it a little bit more and
less programs about ghosts and things, and that's really new

(07:21):
and I think that sort of identifies that they realize
there is an audience for it, that rather than making
fun of them all the time, perhaps they should open
up to them and be there more for them, which
is a good thing. I don't always like the way
they cover it, but at least they are opening those.

Speaker 2 (07:38):
Doors, yes, And there are a lot of good shows
coming out of the UK as well. What is your
new book strange about? And why is a book like
this needed right now?

Speaker 3 (07:51):
So in a way I've been very lucky because I
was asked quite early on when I got involved with
the world of investigating the unexplained, to be asked to
give presentations, and people found out what I was doing
and said, would you come along and talk about it?
And before I knew it, without any planning there, I
was addressing community audiences who weren't really, you know, specifically

(08:16):
targeted at anything unusual, but they just wanted somebody to
come along and do something that was a bit out
of the ordinary. And therefore I became exposed to meeting
so many just very normal, everyday people. And of course
because they'll see me standing up on the stage talking
openly about these things, it opens them up because a

(08:38):
lot of people are afraid to share experiences because they
feel somebody will make fun of them, as indeed sometimes
that does happen. But when they've seen me being up
there and open about it, and they see written books
about it and whatever, they realized I can share things
with me. So over the years I realized people were
telling me incredible stories and I would then think, well,

(08:59):
that's really some little what I heard over there from
that person. Gradually I thought I need to write this
down because this is such a broad cross section of
the population that you know, perhaps hasn't been covered before
in this way, I need to record what they're saying.
So I've been writing down their stories. People have been
sharing their stories with me and emailing them to me,

(09:20):
and Strange is really an analysis of all of that.
It's showing that every day, really normal people with no
interest in this are still having very, very extraordinary experiences.
And I thought trying to make people look at that,
to get that conversation going, that was a really crucial
thing to do. So it's a way of looking at

(09:41):
what is happening here, what does this mean, and hopefully
encouraging other people to share their experiences.

Speaker 2 (09:49):
You've got quite a few stories about people's experiences and
personal experiences. What are some regarding ghosts or UFOs psychic
experiences that you can tell us a little bit about tonight.

Speaker 3 (10:04):
Yes, I mean the book so it's split into a
number of categories, but what you realize as the book
goes on is that they actually link together, perhaps more
than you might think. So I kind of go to
begin with in order of what people tend to speak
about the most, and ghosts would certainly be very much
at the top of that list. So many people are

(10:25):
having ghost experiences of different kinds. Now some it might
be an apparition that comes out of nowhere. They'll see
somebody walk through a wall. I've had a number of
people who are couples or groups of people who've all
seen the same thing at the same time, so it's
not just an hallucination, which is what we're normally told.

(10:45):
But then of course you get other people who will
have interaction with people that they knew, often loved ones,
relatives or whatever, who passed on and often fairly recently,
and they've come back and they conversations with the people
that are remaining here, and they are extraordinary, and that
to me is often comforting. And the people that describe

(11:09):
those experiences say, you know, it was actually a beautiful thing.
It wasn't a scary experience. So there's a number of
different kinds, whereas there are some, of course ghost experiences
which are more scary, and you know, then you do
get spirits which seem to be a bit mischievous and darker.
So all sides of that are reflected in the book.

(11:31):
But then you start to realize, yeah, but there's also
out of body experiences, and there's near death experiences, and
you think, well, they are related because like an outer
body experience, in a way, it's a way of being
a ghost without actually being dead. And you know, I'm
sure that you know many of your viewers will know
the ability to project our consciousness is real. So what

(11:54):
does that have to say about the way that reality works?
And then you put that together with apparition of be it, aliens, angels,
whatever you you know here describe maybe what it all
says to us, and the book gets to this conclusion
is that the world is leaky. The universe doesn't run
for me to be Time and space is a very

(12:15):
strange thing, and entities clearly live within these multi dimensional
layers that come and go, and sometimes even we come
and go, and we can project ourselves or people report
time slips things like that. So to put that all
together and realize that what looks like separate phenomena actually
isn't and it's probably much more related than we know. Yeah,

(12:38):
I think that's a very important thing to do now
when people are beginning to look at these things far
more holistically.

Speaker 2 (12:46):
Yes, you've reached the same conclusion that a number of
investigators I know, and you know, and myself included, I
have come to that all of these things are related.
And when you have a person who who has seen UFOs,
seen and interacted with extraterrestrials or interdimensional beings, people who

(13:07):
have passed on, you know, their spirits, whatever you want
to call them, it just it seems that the person
themselves is responsible as far as their level of awareness
or their level of consciousness. Are you finding that more

(13:31):
and more people are becoming aware of these things.

Speaker 3 (13:36):
I think so, And I mean what I think is
becoming clear too, is so you know, we will talk
about a place that attracts strange phenomena, whether it be
ghosts or aliens or you know, the whole skin Walker
ranch type phenomenon where odd things seem to come and
go in certain places. You have that, and that's recognized.
But you also have people who are themselves it would

(13:58):
seem portals, and I write about this in the book,
that they seem to attract phenomena to them, maybe because
they are on some frequency level that you know, it
is very open to that, and you get tales and
there are some of these in the book where somebody
will have a lot to say of ghost experiences or

(14:18):
poltericalists in one house, they move homes and they think, great,
I've left all of that behind, and then it starts
up again where they go, because it's been carried by
them really, rather than just the space, although spaces can
also be portals as well. And when you start to
chat with people and say, this is perhaps the lucky

(14:39):
gift that I've been given to have such exposure to
so many different people, you realize that this is now
happening either more and more or more and more people
are beginning to open up about it. And I think
now that we live in a world where, you know,
we're continually told by a scientist, even it's multi dimensional,
you know, look at quantum research, things are entangled. They're

(15:02):
saying that on one level and on the other level
they don't want to acknowledge the paranormal, which is probably
explained by many of those things, but others are and
they're saying, we're hang on a minute, maybe that explains
what's happened to me, And so they beginning to open up,
I think more than they did, and I really hope
that will happen more and more.

Speaker 2 (15:22):
Do you have any stories in your book about time
slips or time anomalies, Can you share one with us?

Speaker 3 (15:32):
Yes, I mean so obviously you could argue some ghosts
so that don't seem to be spirits, but seem to
be just performing an action rounding a loop. It's almost
like you are seeing back through time or even forwards
in time. Sometimes that's a form of a time slip
that you are witnessing from the outside. But yes, there
are tails in the book of people who have witnessed

(15:53):
it from the inside. I'll give you just one example
of that. There was a chap called Tony, who I
knew well and sadly no longer in this realm today.
He used to drive a van around London, and this
was several decades ago now, and there was an area
he knew and he just drove down there to make

(16:14):
one of his deliveries. When as he drove and he
was looking around, he thought, what's going on. It's like
they're filming some old film or something. And people walking
around him were in like old dress, like early nineteen hundreds,
and there were very old cars there, and there were
horses going through the streets, and he thought it must
be filming something you know. But then the more he looked,

(16:37):
the more he realized what had happened was everything had changed.
He had literally somehow gone back through time, and he
got this really weird feeling, and he wanted to get
out of the car and explore it, as you probably would,
but he also knew in his core if he got
out of the car, he would be trapped back in

(16:59):
that early time. So we had to force himself to
just sit there. And then as he watched, it all
just faded away and just went back to the normal
modern world again around him. And he swore by that.
And I've heard other people describing similar things. Walking around
and suddenly the environment they're in it's like they're seeing
as it was or experiencing it, not just seeing it

(17:21):
as it was long ago. So these things do happen.
And that's just one good example of that. And again
what it says is that, yeah, time and space, it's
a leaky phenomenon, doesn't always work the way that we think.

Speaker 2 (17:36):
It makes you wonder about all of these missing people
all over the world who have just suddenly disappeared. They've
left behind all their belongings and they're just gone. It
makes you wonder if they have slipped into a portal
of some type and they're still alive, but they're in
a different time, it won't.

Speaker 3 (17:57):
Be ruled out. I mean, obviously, you know. Sometimes so
there's darker options as to what's happened to them. But
also for those that see strange creatures. So we mentioned
skin Walker Ranch, and a strange creature seem to come
and go there. But then you get sightings a big
foot or the sascratch or the etty or whatever. But
nobody can ever seem to find where they live or
they're lair in any provable way. But maybe we're looking

(18:21):
in the wrong dimension. If they have the ability to
cross dimensions, maybe this isn't where they live, and sometimes
we see them come through here, and that may well
be true of a number of entities that people see.
And again, whether it be creatures, angels, aliens, you know, whatever,
it is, ghosts. In a way, what you're looking at
are beings that just cross dimensions, and we give them labels,

(18:44):
and sometimes they may well be all the things people
say they are. But equally there might be labels that
we give them because we don't really understand what we're seeing.
But we know there are other realms. Those that do
astral projection have described being able to go to these
other realms just every now and then. It's like the
doorway opens here and they come in here, or we

(19:04):
sometimes occasionally cross over into their worlds. So yeah, I
mean I think that they're you know, we're always sort
of seeing everything in one reality, but if it is
a multi reality, yeah, things are going to come and go.
That almost seems perhaps an inevitability really rather than a
strangeness and one ironic level.

Speaker 2 (19:26):
Do you ever find when you are working on an
investigation or you're talking to witnesses that then you become
part of the scenario, You become part of the investigation.

Speaker 3 (19:41):
I think not too badly. I mean, you know, I'm
very keen on trying to keep myself out of influencing
what somebody is saying or certainly what they are experiencing.
I mean, I've have my own experiences of the paranormal,
and in the book Strange, I relate some of those
because they interrelate with other stories that I've heard from
other people. So I've seen balls of light flying over

(20:02):
crop circles, I've had my own ghost experience. I've had
a premonition that was so real it wasn't really a premonition,
that was like a time slip where I experienced time twice.
And I explained this in the book, and these things
that have happened to me that strangely I didn't always
think that much about at the time, but I realized

(20:23):
they've made me far more open to listening to other people,
because what I have found is the tendency when somebody
shares the story is for other people, yes, either to
try to shape it into what they want it to be,
or they leap in with denial. Well, that can't happen.
You must have dreamt it. You must have been drinking,
you know all of this, And that, to me is

(20:44):
what I try not to do. I try not to judge,
and the accounts that I give in the book, I
try to deliver without judgment, though I do try to
then analyze it. And I had a panel of experts
that came in to help me, who are open to
the normal but also very scientifically minded to see how
could this be happening with our new understanding of the

(21:06):
way science is opening up quantum realms and things like that.
So there is analysis, but not judgment. It is not
for me to say to somebody, no, that's not how
it happened, because I wasn't there. If that's how something
felt to them, you know, that must always be respected.
And I think we should always hear people before we
start to sort of project our own version onto them.

Speaker 2 (21:31):
How do you get people to open up to you
and tell you about their stories?

Speaker 3 (21:37):
So I mean again, in a way, it's kind of
come to me because I'm up there on platforms talking
about this kind of thing, and people think, well, he's
going to listen to me, and they'll often come up
to me at the end of watching me give a lecture,
and they'll often open with the words, listen, I've never

(21:58):
told anybody this before. But and they will then share
the story with me, and sometimes they will be standing
next to their friends and their friends will look at
them and say, you've never told me that before, and
it's because they haven't felt safe to share it. So
in a way, I mean I have over the years,
of course ask people as anything happened to you, but
mostly it's the other way around. People come to me

(22:20):
and they share stories or you know, they will know
of me and they will email me and say, well,
this has happened, And of course I have to exercise
discernment because although I don't like to judge equally, you
have to think is this person being genuine? You know,
does this sound like this is coming from an authentic place?
And everything that's in the book, you know, they are

(22:42):
the ones that I felt really well authentic. Anything I
had any doubt about I didn't include. But you know,
and you will know this when somebody is speaking from
the heart and they're just sharing something genuine that happened
to them. You know, when that is the case, you
can tune into that and you can feel that desperate
in a way to share these experiences. It's almost like

(23:04):
they just feel they need to express it to somebody.
And often they have sat on these stories about things
that have happened to them all their lives and never
felt safe to share it. So it's a nice moment
when somebody does, because I feel very honored by that
that they feel safe enough to do that. And so
really the book strange. It's the combination of years of

(23:27):
this of people sharing it and I want to share
something back now and try to get this out in
the open and get conversations going about it.

Speaker 2 (23:37):
You mentioned your scientific panel, can you tell us who
some of the scientists are.

Speaker 3 (23:43):
So for certain? So one of them is that Dr
John Cole, and he is a physicist. He was a
maths teacher at a very big school here in England
for the years. But again he is also happily and
this is not always the case, but he is open
to the supernatural if you want to call it about
the paranormal and the spiritual, and he will come in

(24:05):
and say, well, look there is a way that this
could happen. So he was one good example of that.
The other was a chap called Chris Connelly. Chris is
a space scientist. He works on space missions here in England,
but he is also a medium and he has to
kind of keep that quiet really for much of his
time in the world that he moves in. But he's

(24:27):
found a way to meld them together. And if you
look Chris Connolly up you'll find that he's doing scientific experiments,
very important ones, I think to show that mediumship does
actually change the brain. It's recordable on instruments that something
is happening that is not just somebody making something up.
There is an actual shift to change coming in and

(24:48):
he is trying to demonstrate that scientifically because he knows
that if that can be done, it's going to be
taken more seriously. And he moves in the world of science.
And then the other chap he is involved, who I've
worked with for many years on and off, is Michael
Barry Reynolds, and he is a statistician. He wants data,
he wants facts, he wants numbers, but even he can

(25:10):
see there's something going on in certain realms. And you know,
he's a very good person. If you want to understand
something as a chart or I say, well, you know,
what do you think is going on here? He will
analyze it. But again he won't judge it. He will
not debunk it. You'll look at it in the faces
it were and give you some good feedback. So I
thought it was very important that it wasn't just me

(25:31):
giving my opinion. That I had some other views in
there too, And that's sort of woven into the narrative
of the book.

Speaker 2 (25:39):
That sounds really good, sounds very interesting. I ordered my
copy today. I will get it later, but I do.
I'm very interested in reading it. We are on a
break and we'll be back right after these messages.

Speaker 4 (26:41):
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(27:05):
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Speaker 2 (28:30):
We are back with the next news. I'm your host,
Margie Kay and with me this evening is Andy Thomas.
He is an author, and we're talking about his latest book,
Strange at the moment, and I'm going to pull up
that picture right now of the book as soon as
I can find it.

Speaker 3 (28:54):
Here we go.

Speaker 2 (28:55):
Okay, that is a nice cover, and I like I
like the center part where you're kind of looking through
a distorted lens. I assume that was well planned.

Speaker 3 (29:09):
Well if you look carefully, so there's a fishy lens
and you've got just normal people walking around either side,
and yet manifesting in the middle when you look closely,
as this sort of ghostly figure could be a ghost,
could be an alien coming from a portal, from a doorway,
And it's just making the point really, as the book does,

(29:29):
this is going on in the world in which we live,
and it's actually going on more than people think. So
it was a very subtle way of showing that, and
yet most people are not aware. Only sometimes do they
suddenly become aware of the strange that walks among us,
and the ones that do, you know, it does often
change them very profoundly.

Speaker 2 (29:49):
Oh yes, I've talked to a number of people who
never had anything strange happen to them, and then all
of a sudden, boom, they see a UFO, see a ghost,
and they come to me and say, it's real. It's
real because they experienced it.

Speaker 3 (30:06):
Yes, yeah, Well it's a funny thing because also that
you have some people that it changes them. Although I've
also met some people who will insist they are skeptics
and say they don't believe in these things, but they
will still tell you about the ghost or the UFO
that they saw. Yeah, and it's like it's a stranger
that again there's that denial, they that part of them

(30:28):
that can't accept that it's real because that might then
mean changing their view of the world around them. So
it's funny, and I hear that a lot. They'll say
they're a skeptic, but then you realize whether they're not
really that they still insist that they are there we are.
That's their choice.

Speaker 4 (30:44):
M hm.

Speaker 2 (30:46):
Now let's talk about AI for a minute. Do you
think that AI technology is going to help us in
paranormal or research.

Speaker 3 (30:56):
So as the book progresses and you get towards the
end of the book, I start to look at, well,
what is the future of paranormal research? You know, where's
it going to go? And look, AI is a big
issue for our well we know it is. It's going
to put a lot of people out of work, It's
going to present a lot of issues. It will also

(31:16):
do some wonderful things. So, like anything, it's its dreams
and nightmares coming up. But one thing it could be
useful for because it analyzes data very well, and when
quantum computing becomes more available, which we think it will,
which is much faster, it gives incredible powers of calculation
that we've never been able to have until now, it

(31:38):
might well start to look at the paranormal It might
start to think, well, hang on, I'm going to go
beyond those that say it doesn't exist, and I will
just look at the data when it gets a bit
more intelligent and a bit more correct than it is
at the moment, and it might start to consider ways
in which the universe could produce the phenomena that we

(31:59):
see in a way that is not loaded with denial.
And it might even in due course come up with
ways in which this could be explained, and who knows,
might even learn to open doorways to it to actually
trigger it. Now, maybe that's a little further down the
line yet we're not there yet, but I do think
it will be fascinating what it discovers and many of

(32:21):
the things that you know, people have denied it might
look at and say, yeah, but hang on, this wasn't considered.
That wasn't considered, and it will do it, we hope,
without any bias. The problem we have at the moment
is that a lot of AI is programmed with bias.
But I hope that the time will come where it

(32:42):
isn't and it will be intelligent and powerful enough to
see beyond that, and what it reveals could be extraordinary.
And I mean, if it learns eventually, and again we're
going a long way ahead here, but to manipulate time
and space itself. It might even learn to become psychic.
People think a computer could never do that, only we

(33:03):
organic life could, and maybe they're right. I mean, I
don't know, but it's possible that, you know, it might
transcend all of that one day. And you know, that
last big chapter it really does look at what is
the future of thinking really as well as investigating the paranormal,
and the implications are huge. We're only just at the
infancy of AI and the world that we're moving into,

(33:27):
and there is a discussion of that, and so it
is unsettling in many ways, and I recognize that, and
the books honest about that, but it also offers opportunities
that maybe we've not had before. So yeah, we're moving
into unsettling but also very exciting times and I do
think in due course, Yeah, paranormal research will probably benefit

(33:49):
from AI in the end.

Speaker 2 (33:53):
You know, I can see that. And I just am
thinking that AI will learn about other dimensions and our
theories about time and space, and then it will want
to explore that. And yes, I can see AI doing

(34:13):
time travel much more easily than humans.

Speaker 3 (34:17):
Well the thing is, I mean, so already we're quantum computing.
It has calculation powers. Things that would have taken decades
for a person who have worked out it can do
in seconds. So with that kind of calculation power, Yeah,
if there is anything that opens portals up between dimensions
or whatever. Sooner or later it's going to work out

(34:40):
how that works. And when it does, it might just
say and here's how you do it, and we might
find that that completely changes the way we interact with
the reality. I don't think this is next week, but
you know, I don't think so far in the future
that it can't be imagined. And I certainly think, yeah,
it's quite a ride that we've got ahead, but of

(35:00):
course it also brings many dangers too, so let's hope
we get over those first.

Speaker 2 (35:07):
Absolutely, you've written several books. I'm not quite sure how
many you've written, but one of them cut my eye.
Conspiracies tell us a little bit about what this is.

Speaker 3 (35:20):
Yeah, So, I mean over the years, and it began
again because I got involved with things like crop circles
and you know, whatever people think, and I know many
people are very skeptical. What I realized was they were
not being represented correctly. And I've realized that that's true
with the paranormal in general. And then researching those things,

(35:41):
I began to meet people who were researching conspiracies. Now
this was before it became the big world of social
media that we're in today, where you know, nearly everything's
conspiracy theory, and I realized, well, they also are probably
being misrepresented. The problem that we have is is that
everything is loaded. Everybody wants to load that dies to

(36:03):
make you think this or make you think that. And
what I've always tried to do is just stand back
from it and say, what's the overall picture here, what's
the real evidence here? Again, we they are trying to
be too judgmental, but trying to hear out all sides.
And the book that you showed their conspiracies, and also
it's a sequel it's called The New Heretics, in which

(36:26):
looks why people believe what they believe. It makes a
case that when you look back through history, certainly there
have been some conspiracies to say that there are none
today and it's all madness. It is clearly not true
which ones you believe in. I mean, it comes down
to your personal view on one level, but it also
must come down to evidence. You know, putting something out

(36:49):
there on social media just because that's what you believe, well,
that's fine on one level, but if you have no
evidence to back it up, and you don't have a
constructive debate why you believe that you're kind of not
really help in a situation, and it just causes more confusion.
But what the book tries to do is say, here's
the pattern of history, this is where conspiracies have occurred.

(37:13):
This clearly is not being accurately represented today. What does
this mean? And ultimately it leaves the reader to make
their own minds up. However, it does make clear that
just to dismiss talk of cover ups and conspiracies is
I think an unwise thing to do because sometimes that
there is a truth to it. And again, what I'm

(37:34):
always trying to do is to open up conversations and
allow these things to be discussed rather than closing them down.

Speaker 2 (37:44):
What are some of the conspiracies that you covered in
that book?

Speaker 3 (37:48):
So we covers some classic ones, I mean, you know,
the obvious one being like did we really go to
the moon? And some controversial ones of course, like nine
to eleven and all of that, And again, what I'm
trying to do as not judge, but say, here's the arguments.
Is there any validity to some of these arguments? And
certainly some are if you just take the moon landings,

(38:09):
did we go to the Moon. I don't know. I
wasn't there. I hope we did, because it seemed quite
exciting at the time when I was young and growing up. However,
are there some issues around the evidence? And when you
ask that question, the answer does seem to be yes.
And you know, I think there are debates you can
have about some of the imagery that we are told

(38:31):
he has taken on the Moon. There are anomalies that
are quite hard to explain. But equally, I'm very aware
that it has been made a joke, and you know,
King Kardashian was talking about it recently, so and then
people laugh it all off, and I'm always trying to
separate that and say, Okay, what's the reality here. Many
of us of certain generations, less so with younger people now,

(38:55):
we have an emotional attachment to something like the moon landings.
You know, in a I'm of upheaval. It seemed like
a positive, good thing that we were doing. When you
just detached from that and look at the evidence, you discover, yeah,
there are grounds to doubt. And quite a lot of
people are now beginning to say though not the media
over here, but I don't know what it's like in America.

(39:18):
Why is it so hard to go back to the moon,
like the Artemis Project seems to keep meeting, you know,
struggle after struggle, bloc after block, delay after you think
it all seems so easy in the nineteen seventies, you know,
can't we just use that technology? And that's the question
that I think isn't unreasonable to ask. And maybe now

(39:39):
they're just being a lot more safer than they would
have been back then. But it's understandable why some people
get a little bit dubious. And I mean many Poles
if you look at what people believe, I mean some
Poles have put it that more than fifty percent of
the world doesn't believe the official story about the moon landings.
And what that says to me is whether we went

(40:00):
or didn't go, that's quite an important thing to acknowledge.
Where is that they are coming from? You know, is
it just fed by misinformation or are their grounds for
discussions here? And that's what I'm trying to do always,
is say, well, what is the ground for discussion? They
make your own mind up and let's have a look
at it. Let's not just put the block on it.

(40:20):
And that's what a lot of people try to do
in the mainstream, and of course that doesn't make talk
of conspiracies go away. It makes it worse. And those
that believe in them were saying, hmm, they're not representing
me correctly. I must be right, and that's why they're
trying to stop me, which course in itself, is not
necessarily a good judgment, but that's the way it works.

(40:40):
So it's trying to get around that because at the moment, polarization,
as you know, is one of the big problems of
our time. It is possible to avoid it. It's not
fashionable to avoid it, but I think until we do
learn to do that, we're not going to get that
much further forward. Sadly.

Speaker 2 (41:00):
Yeah, interesting stuff. I can't wait to read that one either.
And then I saw that you wrote a book called
Christmas Is Short History from Solstice to Santa, which I
think is really important because I don't think people really
know the history of the holiday, and here apparently that

(41:21):
is what you have done. And so tell us a
little bit about that.

Speaker 3 (41:26):
Yeah, it's funny because some people say, how does Christmas
connect with the paranormal and talking about cover ups? But
to me, I just follow lines of inquiry that just
feel natural to me. And I always loved Christmas, but
I was always fascinated because I just am about where
does it all come from? And again putting aside the
dogma and what you're told to believe, what actually is

(41:47):
the evidence for why we do what we do at Christmas?
And the book is very much celebration of it. And
what you discover is that it's layered. Lots of people
have their own interpretation of what you should celebrate the Christmas,
But in the end, when you look back at the
earlier big traditions and festivals that came before we call

(42:08):
it Christmas, the winter solstice celebrations, a lot of different
celebrations of light in the darkness around the world, you
realize that it all means the same thing. In essence.
You are celebrating light and the return of light in
whatever way, whether that be celebrating the birth of a
Messiah or the return of the sun's to full strength

(42:29):
or whatever. But the other thing you realize is that
many of the traditions that we have are rooted in
really ancient stuff, you know, really old rituals that go
back a very very long way into Egyptian mythology, Norse mythology.
But then the other thing, and this book brings it
out that I think a lot of people don't realize,
is that some would argue today that Christmas is a

(42:52):
bit of a you know, opium for the people to wear,
keeping them distracted for a few days, but actually isn't.
Christmas has long been seen as radical and a lot
of people have tried to stop Christmas. So the Pilgrim
Fathers when they arrived over where you are, of course,
would not celebrate Christmas because they were very much more

(43:13):
of the Puritan mindset and they didn't believe you should
celebrate Christmas. And over here we had the English Civil Wars,
and we eventually wound up under the rule of a
Puritan called Oliver Cromwell rather famously, and they actually banned Christmas.
So I think we here were the first sort of
nation to completely ban Christmas, and Scotland did as well.

(43:38):
And then when you look back at that and you
see the fight people had to start celebrating Christmas again,
and how long it took to come back to full strength,
that you begin to appreciate it and you think, okay,
maybe there is something worth doing here. It was worth
fighting for, and many people had to bring Christmas back,
and it makes you, yeah, I think take less for granted.

(44:01):
And when you see where it's all come from and
coming up to modern times and all the kind of
different things that make it what it is, it's far
more interesting than people think it is. And what it
does for me is think, yeah, this is worth celebrating,
and celebrate whatever version you want, but it's still worth
doing because I think we've got very cynical about things

(44:21):
like that, and that seems a shame to me, you know,
in a world that, as we know, is pretty dark,
sometimes just to stop and celebrate lights in whatever way
it works for you, you know, I think is a
crucial thing to do.

Speaker 2 (44:36):
Very good sounds fascinating. And then I wanted to bring
this one up, an introduction to crop circles, And you've
written one or two more about crop circles as well,
Is that right I have?

Speaker 3 (44:48):
So I mean this book, I mean, you know, I
stand by it very much, but it's very much the
shorter version of an earlier, much longer book I wrote
called Vital Signs. So Vital Signs are still out there where,
and what I was trying to do with that, and
here in a more compact form in the introduction book
is again just to say to people, look, here's the debates,

(45:09):
the arguments about crop circles. Here's what's actually happened, not
what the skeptics tell you have happened. Because if you
go onto Wikipedia, you would absolutely assume they were all
made by people. They were all invented by two elderly
men in nineteen ninety and of course it's just not
that straightforward. And you know, crop circlers go back centuries,

(45:30):
and there's records going back to the nineteen thirties and
photographs and you know, I know we've talked about having
a whole program about crop servers, so maybe we should
do that. But you know, what these books do, and
that book especially is just to say, look, here's why
the debate about crop circles has never really gone away.
Because we all know some are man made. Everybody gets that.

(45:53):
Does that explain the whole thing? No? And there's too
much evidence. There's too much eyewitness testimony, people who've watch
crop circles appearing within seconds, there's biological anomalies in some
of them, there's incredible geometry, you know, strange lights get
seen in and around them. And again, I've been working
with this for thirty four years now, and what I've

(46:15):
realized is crop circles are not straightforward. You know, a
lot of people think there's going to be an easy answer,
and maybe I thought that when I first began, and
I now know it's not easy, and that's why it's
still debated. And I think it is fascinating that even
now you get so many skeptics still trying to attack it,

(46:35):
desperate to prove they're all man made, and yet they
never quite can. But that desperation says to me that
there is something about crop circles. Therefore they should be
looked at because you can always be sure that if
somebody doesn't want you to talk about something, there is
something worth talking about you. That's a good example of that.

Speaker 2 (46:55):
Have you been inside of a crop circle?

Speaker 3 (46:58):
Many hundreds? Yes, So, I mean I'm less active than
I was I am today because life's busy and there's
lots of things going on. But I spent many years
like just going into every crop cycler could, photographing and
measuring them, surveying them, taking samples. So yeah, absolutely been
into many, many crop circles over the years and lived

(47:19):
to tell the tale.

Speaker 2 (47:21):
Well, that's good, that's one of the things that I
would love to do. But in the United States we
have very few, at least very few that are reported.
And I do know some people who are farmers who
tell me, oh, yes, in nineteen seventy five, we had
a crop circle in our field and we immediately, you know,
got rid of all the evidence because we didn't want

(47:43):
anybody thinking we had aliens here or you know, something
like that. That happens a number of times. They seem
to be more hushash about it here in the year.

Speaker 3 (47:53):
I mean, you have definitely had crop circles over the years,
and a very good research called Jeffrey Wilson a lot
of work documenting them. It's certainly been quiet in more
recent years. I mean, yeah, it is extraordinary. You have
miles and miles of fields and yet not that many
crop circles. But I'm sure that, yes, some have just
not been reported. And in the very remote area, the

(48:16):
last thing a farmer wants is everybody arriving there and
damaging their fields, so they just get rid of them
as quickly as they can. So I'm sure many more
get missed. Here in England, we do get far more
crop circles. We do seem to be crop circles central
for whatever reason, and maybe we'll talk about that in
another show. But you know, it's more compact. It's easier

(48:39):
here to find them. It's harder to miss one, although
even there sometimes they do. But yeah, America, you're not
a hot spot. But there have been times where you've
had years where there's been a few more. For instance
in Ohio and near the Serpent Mounds, which the ancient
mounds you have there spata crop circles at one point

(49:02):
back in the nineteen nineties. So it does happen. But yes,
for some reason you're not gifted that much with them.
But it might be geological. You know, there's a lot
of debate about why some areas get more than others.
It's not that one place is better than another. There's
probably various qualities which are playing a role.

Speaker 2 (49:19):
There are there any paranormal hotspots that where if somebody
wants to have an experience they could go to and
perhaps get lucky and have an experience.

Speaker 3 (49:34):
So I mean if you took something like you know UFOs,
obviously we know there are definite areas where many of
those are seen. We have the hot spots like that
here in Britain, you have your own in America. And
of course if you're anywhere near somewhere like Area fifty one,
are they testing something? Are they alien? Well that's another debate,
but you know a lot of strange things do get

(49:55):
seen flying around there. And again this is something which
is now really hot top and you know, we've just
seen the movie come out, The Age of Disclosure, which
is trying to get a really sensible debate going about
it because so many high level people are now seeing
these things. So you've got that side of it. You've

(50:15):
got areas where more crop circles appear than others, and
especially in the West Country of England, that seems to
be the main hot spot. And people also see strange
lights and things there. But in terms of other phenomena
like ghosts, I mean, interestingly, and the Strange Book discusses
this where there has been a lot of death sadly,

(50:39):
you know, perhaps obviously, but that's often where you get
a lot of ghosts. So battlefields would be a good
example of that, and the Battle of Gettysburg in the
American Civil war. I mean, you know, is it just
tourist spin. I don't know, but there's so many accounts
of people who've been in the area today who've heard cries,

(51:00):
you know, shouting and death and not very nice things.
It's almost like battle fields. They leave a scar in
time and space, and sometimes the doorway opens up and
you hear it. Same big train crashes or other disasters.
So yeah, I mean, if there's anywhere like that and
you're desperate to see a ghost or or hear something strange,

(51:22):
you could do worse than start there. But you know,
there's obviously a disturbing element to that, so you'd better
be stealed for whatever happens. And I'm well aware there
is always some mythology which is stirred up around these things. However,
I have heard from a number of people, and again
it's in the book, who have experienced the sounds of

(51:43):
battle and very strange sightings where they were battles where
they didn't even necessarily know that was the case until later.
So yes, something about traumatic deaths will often leave ghosts
of that kind that seem a little bit stuck between dimensions.
And sure you will have discuss this on previous shows
with others speakers. You know when you leave this will

(52:06):
calmly and gracefully. It seems to be a better transition.
If you end your life in a very quick way
or a very unpleasant way, you're more likely to be
left as a ghost for whatever reason, which I discussed
in the book Possibilities. But yeah, it is fascinating. So
the way we go does seem to matter if there's
any choice in it, and of course sometimes there isn't.

Speaker 2 (52:30):
I've also noticed in some of these shows, and then
also visiting England, that a lot of the castles are haunted,
and I suppose that that would be expected given the
many generations that they've been around, many hundreds of years.
Things have gone on their battles or people just dne

(52:53):
on site. Have you been too many of the castles?

Speaker 3 (52:57):
Yeah? I mean I love castles anyway. I mean, in
a history thing that I'm absolutely fascinated by. And we
are lucky because we've got castles everywhere. And I mean
where I grew up in a town called Lewis down
here in England, I mean I had the castle on
the horizon. You grew up with castles, you know, So yes,
I mean, they are places. A lot of them were

(53:17):
used for centuries, so there's a lot of activity, and
the battles were there. Again, you've got that disruption there.
But yeah, there's other places. I mean what interestingly, wherever
there has been a lot of human activity, you will often, inevitably,
I suppose, get more ghost or paranormal activity. And another

(53:38):
place where you tend to get that, and this is
in the book hotels and obviously especially older hotels. You know,
a lot of human dramas play out in hotels, good
and bad, and it seems to disrupt the you know,
the energy, call it what you will there And yeah,
there's several stories about very strange experiences in hotels. So

(54:03):
you know, anywhere where there's been a lot of focused
human activity, of course, that's going to be far more
likely to be a portal for the strange.

Speaker 4 (54:13):
M h andy.

Speaker 2 (54:15):
Where can people get your books?

Speaker 3 (54:18):
No, I mean you can find them in all the
usual places that sell books. Strange is available in America
and Britain and Australia around the world, you know, Amazon,
anywhere like that, Barnes and Noble. Yeah, I mean, you know,
just look me up and if anybody wants the short
version to them. To understand where you can buy them,
have a look at my website, which is truth Agenda

(54:40):
dot org, truth agenda dot org, and that you can
find all about Strange and my other books and my
other work, and there's lots of videos to watch and
articles to read. So yeah, I'm out there. But yeah,
just look up the book Strange anywhere that sells books
and you will find it. And that the subtitle is
paranorm All Realities in the Everyday World, which kind of

(55:03):
tells it like it Israel.

Speaker 2 (55:06):
And that is the name of this broadcast. And I
thank you so much. It's fascinating speaking with you, and
I look forward to reading your books and having you
back in January to talk about crop circles.

Speaker 3 (55:18):
That great.

Speaker 4 (55:19):
Thank you all.

Speaker 2 (55:20):
Right, thank you so much, And that will do it
for this evening. I will see you here again next
week