All Episodes

December 26, 2025 65 mins
Mark as Played
Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
It is indeed a delight to be here this morning.
We're excited to be able to spend this time. We
are here on a two month furlough. We are coming
toward the end of that two month furlough and we
are growing weary. We leave on the eighteenth to head

(00:25):
back to Lusaka. We started off in Dallas and then
drove from there to New Orleans and spent a couple
of days in New Orleans, and then went to Jackson
and spent about a week there, a little over a
week there with the brand new grand baby who was
born on the twenty eighth of December. So we're excited

(00:47):
to be there, and providentially to be there right at
that time, a couple of days after he was born.
And then from there, dinle mission that we're driving all
of this way. And then from there we drove over
to Charlotte and spent a couple of days there ministering there,
and then from there to Atlanta and a couple of

(01:08):
days ministering there, and then after that up to Nashville
and then to Louisville, went to the Creation Museum and arc
and had a nice little break in the middle of that,
and then back down to Jackson because you know, the
grand baby's there, and then after Jackson back over here.

(01:34):
So pray for us. We've we've we've been in. We
tallied it last night because Simeon was saying how much
he misses his house and his toys in his room,
and we talented it up. We're now staying in our
fifteenth place in the last six weeks. So yeah, there's

(01:59):
all that, but we are excited to be back here
and to be at GFBC. It was interesting, you know
when when you said that Stephen, I'm starting doing the
math in my head that that was that that was
thirteen years ago that the Lord started this work and

(02:23):
uh and that, by his grace, still here, still serving,
still carrying out the mission and the vision and the
calling that God has placed on this work. And so
for that we we praise the Lord. Amen. If you
have your Bibles with you, opening this morning to the

(02:47):
Book of Ephesians, Phisians, Fisians, chapter four. If there was
one word, if I could only use one word to
describe and to define Christians and Christianity, it'd be difficult.

(03:12):
It would be difficult to do. And I think for
most of us, we'd kind of be torn between a
few words, and grace would be one of those words
that would come to mind, and salvation would be one
of those words that would come to mind. But if
I had to choose one, it would be the word forgiveness.

(03:33):
That would be the word forgiveness, because I think it
encapsulates so much of what it means to be Christian,
both in terms of our relationship to God and in
terms of our relationship to one another. It encapsulates everything,

(03:56):
It captures everything. I want us to look at the
Ephesians four thirty two when we've looked at this verse before,
we've looked at this verse together before, and I think
it's incredibly important, and I want to move from you know,
before we've looked at this word, and we've talked about
really kind of the mechanism of forgiveness, and I want

(04:20):
to look at it today and talk about the motivation
the motivation forgiveness because now moving into my I'm not
moving into my third decade, I'm well into mid I'm
almost done with my third decade of gospel ministry. Having

(04:41):
done this for all that time, it's amazing. One of
the things that really changes over time in doing gospel ministry.
In dealing with God's people, in walking with God's people,
one of the things that happens is it's kind of

(05:02):
like parenting. Over time, you see the same things over
and over and over again. Over time, you watch people
go down the same roads that you've seen people go
down over and over and over again. And you sit

(05:26):
down with people and this is something that this is
not what happens in the pulpit. And I remember hearing
these things early on in the ministry. You know, you
go into the ministry early on, and you think the
ministry is all about the pulpit. Nothing could be further
from the truth, Nothing could be further from the truth.

(05:49):
Ministry is not all about the pulpit. Ministry is all
about the counseling room, the kitchen table, that place where
you sit down and take these things and apply them
in real life circumstances. Those times where you sit with
people and you look them in the eye and you
say to them, I know this road that you are

(06:12):
about to walk down. I've seen people walk down this
road a thousand times before. I can tell you where
this road ends. I can tell you what's going to happen.
And they look at you, and you can tell by
the look in their eye they're going down that road

(06:34):
because they think they're different. And what's different is after
three decades of ministry, here's what you have. You have
the opportunity to be there when people finish that road
and come back and say why didn't you want And

(06:58):
you can say, well, actually I did, well, why didn't
you warn me? More? Actually I did, well, why didn't
you just grab me and throw me on the ground
and shake me? And because trust me just that close?
But that wouldn't have helped you. And if there's one road,

(07:28):
there's one road that you see over and over and
over again that derails Christians, it's this road of unforgiveness.
It's this road of unforgiveness. You see people walk away
from marriages and walk out on their families because of unforgiveness.

(07:59):
You see young people walk away from home and go
down horrific roads that threaten to derail and destroy them
all because of unforgiveness. You see friendships that are thrown

(08:22):
away because of unforgiveness. You see people who walk away
from the Church, from the Lord because of un forgiveness.

(08:46):
This is this is the crux of the matter. This
is everything, both in terms of our relationship to God
and in terms of our relationship to one another. So
let's look at this here Ephesians four thirty two, and

(09:17):
let's back up the verse twenty five and read that
whole paragraph. Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one
of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we
are members one of another. Be angry and do not sin.

(09:39):
Do not let the sun go down on your anger,
and give no opportunity to opportunity to the devil. Let
the thief no longer steal, but rather let him labor,
doing honest work with his own hands, so that he
may have something to share with anyone in need. Let
no corrupting talk come out of your mouths. Only such

(10:01):
as is good for building up, as fits the occasion,
that it may give grace to those who hear and
do not grieve, the Holy Spirit of God by whom
you were sealed for the day of redemption. Let all
bitterness and wrath, and anger, and clamor and slander be
put away from you, along with all malice. Be kind

(10:22):
to one another, tender hearted, forgiving one another, as God
in Christ forgave you Amen Hallelujah, Praise the Lord. Be
kind to one another, tender hearted, forgiving each other as

(10:46):
God in Christ forgave you. First, I want to define
forgiveness here and then make a few observations about forgiveness
in this text, and then some applications of it. When
we talk about forgiveness, one of our biggest problems with
forgiveness is we we don't define forgiveness correctly, and for

(11:10):
forgiveness is is more than just a statement or more
than just a lack of hostility. Forgiveness means canceling a debt.

(11:32):
Forgiveness means canceling a debt. The classic example is you
know you you you have something of mine that you
have borrowed, right you? You you have you have my
phone that you've that you've borrowed. We have these things.
We take these things everywhere. I don't know why anyone
would borrow anyone else's phone, because you can't ever have

(11:53):
it more than a couple of feet away from you.
But let's just go with it, right, you borrowed my
phone and then you destroyed my phone. Forgiveness is not
me saying you know what, Okay, I forgive you, meaning

(12:15):
I'm not going to do bad things to you right
now like I would like to. I'm going to keep
a level head and a level voice, and I'm going
you know I did right, I forgive you. I'm not
going to I forgive you, right, just buy me another
phone and we're good. Actually, by definition, forgiveness means you

(12:41):
don't have to buy me another phone, because forgiveness means
I cancel the debt that you owe. And this this
is huge. This is huge. This is one of our
biggest issues and one of the biggest problems with this
question of forgiveness because we think I forgive you means

(13:04):
I'm not going to give full vent to my anger.
I have forgiven you because I didn't slap you, I
didn't spit on you, I didn't I forgive you, but
you're going to pay. That is not forgiveness. Forgiveness means
the debt is canceled. Well, okay, but how do we

(13:27):
translate that into interpersonal relationships? Right because I mean, you know,
there's no there's no money that exchanges hands and these
interpersonal relationships there there's Now how then do I cancel
the debt. Here's where the rubber meets the road. The

(13:50):
way that we punish one another. The way that we
express unforgiveness toward one another is by withholding attention, affection,
or honor. That's the price that we make one another pay.

(14:14):
Withholding attention, affection, or honor, that's how we punish. I'm
angry with you. I don't want to see you right now,
Get out of my face. That means I am punishing
you and making you pay by withholding my attention from you.

(14:40):
I don't even want to see you right now. Or
maybe it's not withholding attention, Maybe it's withholding affection. You
can have my attention, but there will be no warmth
from me, no affection from me. You will know by
the stone hard look on my face. You will know

(15:03):
by the coldness with which I deal with you, that
I am withholding my affection from you right now. I
forgive you, Oh, thank you, kiss on the cheek. Nope,
you're paying. That's not forgiveness or withholding honor. Classic example

(15:32):
of this one is my parents weren't great parents. So okay, fine,
what are you gonna do? Your father wasn't a great father,
your mother wasn't a great mother. What are you gonna do? Well,
I'm gonna do withhold honor? How are you gonna withhold honor?
It's their birthday. I'm not gonna call them, can't say amen,

(15:55):
you ought to say our I'm going to withhold that
because they don't deserve it. That's the way that I'm
going to punish them. See, these are the ways in
interpersonal relationships that we make one another pay. So if

(16:19):
we if we, if we define forgiveness wrongly, then here's
what we end up doing. Right, because forgiveness would mean
I'm not going to withhold affection, attention, or honor from you. Right,
But because we're wrong about what forgiveness means, something happens

(16:39):
and we say with our mouth, I forgive you, meaning
I'm not going to throw scalding hot water on you,
and I'm not going to, you know, run a key
down the side of your car. But I am going
to withhold attention, affection, and honor, which means I say

(17:00):
you're forgiven, but you're not. This is why something happens
at church, we get upset. I won't show up. Why

(17:23):
Because not showing up is a means of withholding attention, affection,
and honor and letting whoever I'm upset with at church.
Know that I'm upset, and you must pay. You're following.

(17:45):
This is what unforgiveness looks like in interpersonal relationships. This
is what destroys friendships, This is what destroys marriages, This
is what destroys relationships withholding attention, affection, and honor. And
there are sophisticated ways of doing this, right, you can

(18:06):
do this. You can do this in a number of ways.
You know, the super Bowl is on today. I don't
know if you guys realize this is Super Bowls today, right,
But you can do little things like I have known
people who who decide to root for one team because

(18:27):
somebody that they're mad at likes the other. That's just me, right.
How about, hey, who you got in the super Bowl? Well,
definitely not Los Angeles because my mother's from Los Angeles

(18:52):
and you know how mad I am with her. But
this is how ridiculous it gets. So now that we
are on the same page about what this thing is,

(19:15):
let's let's look here and make some observations about it
from this text. And again, let me just say this upfront,
And unfortunately you have to say this upfront because whenever
you talk about forgiveness. There's somebody who's sitting there right now,
and you're already upset with me because your entire existence

(19:46):
is rooted in the unforgiveness that you hold against someone.
Your entire life is defined by the bitterness that you
have because of what happened to you in your past.
And you're mad at me right now because you know

(20:09):
in your heart of hearts that if you were to
ever forgive and let go of that bitterness, you'd have
to find another way to define yourself. You're mean and
nasty to people, but it's okay because you had trauma
in your childhood. You're stuck in a rut and can't

(20:31):
and won't move, but it's okay because you had a
bad experience in your past. And right now you're sitting
there and you're like, I can't believe he's making light
of my situation. I don't even know your situation. But I

(20:56):
don't have to know your situation because I know what's
in the book. But if that's you, just just hold
on and ask yourself this question, why would you be offended?

(21:18):
Because I'm pressing this issue. I've had these conversations before,
and people who just don't understand my pain and are
always telling me to get over it. Like I'm the

(21:39):
one who the words didn't come out of my mind
because guess what, forgiveness and getting over it are two
very different things, hey, man. Like I said just forget
about it, I didn't say that. Forgive and forget. That's

(21:59):
not you know what, maybe in second hesitations you find that,
but that's not in the real Bible. Forgive and forget
is not in the real Bible. Amen, that's not in
the real Bible. That's in the made up Bible. Right,
that's in the book that has a Kaya or something
something like that. But forgive and forget is not in

(22:21):
this text. Because human beings weren't made to forget, amen, somebody,
we weren't made to forget. When you when when human
beings start forgetting, things were malfunctioning. I guess the medical

(22:45):
professionals in the audience who were going like, yeah, you
know who you are, So no, forgetting, here's the other thing.
Forgetting takes the glory out of forgiving. That's not where

(23:06):
the power is. The power is not in this individual
who has wronged you in some way coming into your
presence and you looking at them like there's no memory
of what. No. The power in forgiveness is when there
is that very real memory, that very visceral experience, and

(23:29):
yet in the midst of it, by the power of God,
by the grace of God, you relinquish any right that
you might think you have to punish that person. That
that is the power of biblical forgiveness, not in forgetting.

(23:58):
Look at the verses. Make a couple of us animations,
kind of one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as God
in Christ forgave you a couple of things one. This
text here and the context is about forgiveness within the

(24:19):
parameters of the body of believers. This is not about
us forgiving people outside. By the way, there's more than
enough biblical evidence that we're supposed to forgive people outside. Amen.
A couple of times we refer in the Catechism and

(24:40):
in the end of our prayer time right to what's
commonly referred to as the Lord's prayer. Right, forgive us
our debts as we forgive our debtors. Forgive us our trespasses,
as we forgive those who trespass against us. Amen. In
Mark eleven, Jesus says, if you stand praying right. And
you have anything against anyone, anything against anyone, forgive. If

(25:05):
you have anything against anyone, forgive, no exceptions, Amen, forgive.
But the context here is forgiveness amongst the family of God,

(25:26):
forgiveness amongst the people of God. And really the whole
paragraph is about that. Let's look at the paragraph again
and pay close attention to what's happening here. Therefore, having
put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the
truth with his neighbor. For we are members of one another.
What is that? That's the church. And I would argue

(25:48):
that it's not a leap at all to apply this
to the family, especially to the marriage relationship. Amen, being
members of one another one flash union. Okay, you can
do that, But next, be angry and do not sin.
Do not let the sun go down on your anger.
Give no opportunity to the devil that's the thief, long
longer steal, but let him labor doing honest work with

(26:11):
his own hands, so that he may have something to
share with anyone in need. Let no corrupting talk come
out of your mouths, but only such as it's good
for building up, as fits the occasion, that it may
give grace to those who here, do not grieve the
Holy Spirit God by whom you were sealed for the
day of redemption. Again, let our bitterness be put away

(26:33):
from you along with all malice. This is within the church,
and the real key to that is found in verse thirty.
Do not grieve the Holy Spirit by whom you were
sealed for the day of redemption. And this is one
of those places who are scripture scripture right that we've
heard so many explanations of what, well, I'm grieving the

(26:54):
Holy Spirit. That's that's the other. You know, we were
talking about phones earlier. I've been in churches where you know,
they scroll across the screen, right, it's you know, silence
your cell phones. We don't want to grieve the Holy Spirit.
Oh that's what that cell phones? Who knew, right, Silence

(27:19):
crying children, you know, because we don't want to greed
the spirit. Do this, do that, because we don't want
to grieve the spirit. Contextually. It's not rocket science to
figure out what's happening here. Go back, if you will
and look at verse twenty nine. Let no corrupting talk
come out of your mouths literally, acidic words words that

(27:45):
corrode like acids. Like acid, words that tear down like acid.
Don't let those words come out of your mouth. But
only such as is good for building up, assays the
occasion that it may give grace to those who here.
Has there been a reference to building before this, Maybe
a reference to building that has something to do with

(28:06):
the Holy Spirit, I don't know. Maybe at the end
of chapter two, Chapter two, verse nineteen. So then you
are no longer strangers in aliens, but you are fellow
citizens with the saints and members of the household of

(28:26):
God built on the foundation of the apostles and the prophets, Christ,
Jesus himself being the cornerstone in whom the whole structure,
being joined together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord.
In Him, you also are being built together into a
dwelling place for God by the Spirit. So in chapter

(28:48):
four we have language that says, don't use words that
corrode like acid and tear down, because that grieves the Spirit.
At the end of chapter two we see the Spirit
building a structure. Huh, What's how would we be grieving

(29:13):
the Spirit by using those corosive words, by tearing down
what he's building? What is he building a body of
believers who belong to Christ and belong to one another.
So this forgiveness that we're looking at in verse thirty
two is forgiveness within the context of the Body of Christ,

(29:40):
within the context of our relationships with one another, belonging
to one another as fellow citizens in the Kingdom of God. Again,
we're not negating our forgiveness of people outside. There's more
than enough evidence throughout the that we're called and commanded

(30:03):
to do that. But this is specific. Notice also he says,
be kind to one another, tender hearted. So forgiveness happens
within the context of this kindness and tender heartedness that
we have toward one another within the body. It is

(30:25):
part of a broader expression of our union and communion
with one another. We belong to each other. Looking again
in verse twenty five, Therefore, having put away falsehood, let
each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor.
For we are members one of another. We belong to

(30:49):
each other. We're members of each other. Don't tear one
another down. We're being built into a dwelling place for God.
Be kind to one another, tender heart. Come with me
to the right and look at the Book of Colossians
Colossians Chapter three, same author, very similar expression. Colossians Chapter three.

(31:19):
Look the beginning of verse twelve. Colossians three twelve. Put
on then, as God's chosen ones, holy and beloved, compassionate hearts, kindness, humility, meekness,
and patience, bearing with one another. And if one has
a complaint against another, forgiving each other, as the Lord

(31:41):
has forgiven you soul, you also must forgive. Above all these,
Put on love, which binds everything together in perfect harmony.
And let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts,
to which indeed you were called in one body, and
be thankful. Same idea. This forgiveness that is being commanded

(32:07):
is not just being commanded out of nowhere. This forgiveness
that is being commanded is part of the environment that
is cultivated. Wouldn't we understand that we belong to each
other by the way that makes forgiveness more important and
more necessary. One of the great ironies is this belief

(32:34):
that true love ought to require less forgiveness. And I
wish I could say that this was something that just
that was just a problem in young marriages or in
new marriages, But it's it's just it's not this foolishness

(32:55):
lasts for decades, right, you would think that this sin
would be gone by now? Really, why you would think
that we wouldn't keep sinning against each other like this? Really?
Why are you not fallen anymore? Hello? Somebody? Or if

(33:21):
you really loved me, you wouldn't keep sinning against me
in the same ways. Actually, the opposite is true. Think
of it this way. Let me let me let me
try to turn it into a mathematical equation. Let's say
that I sin. It's actually more accurate to say that

(33:41):
you perceive my sin once per three interactions. I sin
more frequently than that. But let's say that you perceive
my sin once for every three interactions that we have
with one another. Well, if we only interact with one

(34:01):
another three times a month, then you only perceive my
sin against you once a month. That ain't bad, amen,
But what if we interact three times a day. My
rate of sin hasn't changed. Your rate of perceiving my

(34:25):
sin hasn't changed. What has happened is we spend more
time together. It's sort of like there's a lot of
people who believe that there's more floods now that they've
ever been before. Right, because you hear about these floods
all the time, and it's like it's just it's the end, y'all,
it's the end. This is it the flood you hear about.
There's another flood, a whole village flooded, and all these

(34:47):
people there, they're Statistically there are not more floods now
than there have been in the past. But you know what,
there are more of cameras and news stories. One hundred
years ago, if there was a flood in some small
village in Pakistan, you'd have never heard about it. You
lived and died and never heard about it. But today,

(35:10):
if there is a flood in a remote place that
you can't even pronounce, it's on the news and you
see it. It's not that it's happening more frequently, you're
just being informed of it more frequently. So what's happening

(35:32):
is when we are in relationship with one another, and
when the relationship is real relationship with one another. It's
not that sin is becoming more frequent. It was always there,
but our proximity and the frequency of our interaction makes
us more aware of it. By the way, married people,

(35:56):
please please hear me right now, it is sheer and
utter folly to believe that if your spouse really loved you,
they wouldn't keep sinning against you. That's actually the opposite
of the truth. It is the love that you have
for one another and your proximity to one another that

(36:21):
makes you there more frequently when the sin happens. It's
not that your spouse loves other people more than they
love you, They just don't see them as much. Amen.

(36:43):
By the way, those of you who are considering possible
relationships with people and you think they're the most amazing, awesome,
talk to people who interact with the more than three
times a month just saying right. So that's why this

(37:14):
is so incredibly important because as believers, and I'm not
talking about I'm not talking about people who just happen
to share the same parking lot every week, because you
can have that right. You can have a circumstance where
all you do is share the same parking lot every
week and where you you know you meet you there.
Because there are those churches, and there are those environments

(37:37):
where you meet somebody out at the mall and you
know or you or you see their parking sticker and
they wait a minute, you go to that church. Yeah,
I go to that church too. Really, which service do
you go to? Well? I go to this or oh,
well I go to that. Now I'm not talking about that.
I mean when we're sharing life together, when we're having

(38:01):
more than three interactions a month, where we're actually getting
to see one another's sin. I'm talking about when we
live in the home together. Here's the way we normally

(38:23):
think about it, and this is what it gets us.
We're in this environment where we're spending more time together.
We're in this environment where I'm seeing more of your
sin that i've seen before. That means you have an
obligation to sin less. Actually it means I have an

(38:47):
obligation to forgive more. You see the difference. I have
an obligation to forgive more. You don't have an obligation

(39:09):
to sin less. By God's grace, I pray that you do, amen.
But intimate relationships don't give me the right to look
at you and say that, if this relationship is going

(39:30):
to work, you have to sin less. It gives me
the obligation to notice what they knows what the text says,
be kind to one another, tenderhearted, sinning less against one another,
no greater intimacy, require require, requires greater forgiveness. And it's

(40:10):
unfortunate that many people only learn this in that third
or fourth marriage, because they got married the first time
and the assumption was if it was true love, if
this was the right person, then there wouldn't be this

(40:32):
much sin and they would sin less. And then they
got married again, and now, wow, I've got a problem.
But my problem is I keep choosing the broken ones. Again.
My problem is my choice, right, there's no problem with me,

(40:52):
And so they get rid of this one, and then
they get married again, and all of a sudden, at
some point, at some point, it just dawns on them.
Wait a minute, there's something consistent in this equation. There
is a common denominator, and it's not my choices. It's
me second or third marriage, the fourth or fifth church.

(41:23):
And unfortunately, for many people what happens and that is
they they don't start saying, wait a minute, I have
a forgiveness problem. No, no, no, no, no no. The church
has a problem. That church had a problem. Now that
church had a problem. Now this church has a problem.
I'm done with church because there's just obviously not one

(41:49):
out there that gets it. Another observation and hopefully it'll
help this make sense and we can understand where the
problem lies. Be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another,
as God in Christ forgave you. That there's two sides

(42:13):
to this. We forgive because we are forgiven, and we
can forgive because we are forgiven. But the first thing
is this, you are forgiven. You are forgiven. And this

(42:34):
is crucial because it kills the hypocrisy. It kills the hypocrisy,
because the hypocrisy is this. The hypocrisy is everyone out
there has a sin problem, and everyone out there is
getting on my nerves because they sin so much and

(42:56):
they require so much of me in terms of dealing
with them. But when you understand that you have been forgiven,
when you flip that and you recognize that you are
not this pristine, sinless person going through life being bombarded
with the sins of others, but that you are a

(43:17):
sinner who has also had to be forgiven, it changes
your perspective. You sin. The Apostle Paul referred to himself
as the chief of sinners, and he wrote two thirds

(43:40):
of the New Testament, Amen, you sin, you need forgiveness,
and one of the great ironies in all of this
is that when we again, because we've all got our

(44:04):
own blind spots, we've all got our own burdens to
bear in terms of our sinfulness. But this one tends
to be quite ironic because this one, that individual who
keeps going from relationship to relationship and cutting people off
because everybody's just bombarding them with all of their sin.

(44:24):
This one doesn't see that their greatest sin is unforgiveness,
and that the problem isn't that there are so many
sinners out there, but the problem is that there's so

(44:48):
little forgiveness in here. And the cure for that is
the Cross. Recognize that Jesus did not have to shed
less blood for you. Recognize that when you just get

(45:18):
completely exasperated and put out with the sins of other people,
with the sins with which they are bombarding you, with
the failures that you see over and over and over again,
because you miss nothing in terms of the failures of others.
As you're doing that, go back and visit the cross
again and look into your Savior's face and your sin

(45:47):
that was nailed there, and your forgiveness that had to
be purchased there, and then there's the flip side of it,

(46:09):
we are able to forgive because we're forgiven. This changes
not only the way that I view my saying, it
changes the way that I view yours. Christ died for that.

(46:32):
Unforgiveness is sinister. Unforgiveness does a number of things. Number one,
unforgiveness is costly emotionally. It's costly because it cost me
a lot emotionally to constantly punish you, man, that's a lot.

(46:57):
I got to remember what you did and how much
you oh, how much attention, affection and honor. I need
to withhold until I feel like I've made you pay
enough for your sin. That's costly, that's draining amen, which
is why eventually we just say forget it. I'm done

(47:18):
with this relationship. It's costing me too much. That's costly.
It also costs you emotionally because you're on a hamster
wheel that you never get off of. It doesn't fix people.

(47:39):
What does James tell us? The anger of man does
not produce the righteousness of God. I'm going to withhold attention, honor, respect,
affection from you because I want to inflict as much
emotional damage upon you as I possibly can, so that
next time you're afraid to do this again because I

(48:03):
do not believe that Christ sanctifies I believe my anger does.
I'm not interested in you becoming more like Christ. I'm
interested in you being afraid to experience my wrath so
that you don't do that again. That's costly. It's also

(48:31):
costly in terms of real relationship with God because here's
what three decades of pastoral ministry has are also taught me.
People who are unforgiving toward others always question their own
salvation because they think God's forgiveness is the same as theirs.

(49:02):
You are an exacting and unforgiving person, and you believe
that that's exactly who God is. And you withhold attention,
affection and honor from people when they sin against you,
and when you recognize sin in your own heart, you
automatically assume that God is going to withhold attention, affection

(49:26):
and honor from you because He's going to deal with
you in the same way. That's costly, that's costly, tousled
costly in terms of your theology. Your theology gets completely

(49:47):
warped because ultimately, here's what you're saying. What you're saying
is that thing that you just did to me. The
blood of Jesus is enough to satisfy the tryun God,
but I require more. The one who spoke heaven and
earth into existence can forgive you for that because of

(50:08):
the death of his son. However, I have higher standards
than the creator of the universe. He requires the death
of his son. That's fine for him. But I require
you looking at this face and hearing this voice. I
require you feeling alienated from me. I require you feeling

(50:29):
fill in the blanks because Christ dying on the cross
is not enough for me. It may be enough for God,
but it's not enough for me. How are you going
to be able to have and sustain an appropriate understanding
of doctrine and theology If that's the way that you

(50:52):
view forgiveness and that's the way you view God, you can't.
And finally, it's going to kill your compassion. One of
the things that this does, that cultivating this forgiveness does,

(51:16):
is it creates compassion. I recognize that I'm forgiven, and
now you've sinned against me, and I recognize that you
need the forgiveness that I've experienced. I keep seeing this
same sin from you, and I become compassionate towards you,

(51:36):
because I know what it looks like and what it
feels like to wrestle with a same sin. Amen. And now,
all of a sudden, instead of becoming embittered towards you,
I'm driven. I'm driven to my knees. I'm driven to
the cross on your behalf. And it changes things, changes things.

(52:16):
So the other's observations, What about these applications? One really forgive?
You have been forgiven. You've been forgiven, so you can forgive.

(52:37):
By God's grace, you can forgive. What does that mean?
The forgiveness that Christ has purchased for you on the
cross has transformed you, and you now have the ability
to forgive, to be reconciled again. Go back in the

(53:03):
same book, look at Ephesians, chapter two, beginning of verse thirteen.
So it'll be the last one we look at. But now
in Christ Jesus, you who once were far off, have

(53:23):
been brought near by the blood of Christ. For he
himself is our peace, who has made us both one
and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall
of hostility by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances,
that he might create in himself one new man in
place of the two, so making peace and might reconcile

(53:45):
us both to God in one body through the cross,
thereby killing the hostility. And he came and preached peace
to you who were far off, and peace to those
who are near, for through him we both have access
in one spirit to the Father. This is what the
Cross has done. The Cross has made peace between me

(54:08):
and God, and in turn, it has made peace between
me and you. I am forgiven. Therefore I can forgive.
I can be reconciled to you because I've been reconciled
to God through the Cross of Jesus Christ. My sins
have been forgiven, and I've been granted a new nature.

(54:30):
And I've been made at peace with you and your sins,
even the sins that you commit against me are under
the blood of Christ. What do I have left to
hold on to? What do I have left to hold
on to? Now? Again, some caveats, because I know that

(54:56):
these are here, and the fact that I need to
give these caveats support my argument that this is so
crucial because whenever you talk about forgiveness, there's the people
out there who are like again, you don't know what
was done to me, and you're saying I should. Just

(55:17):
a couple of things. Number one, there is a difference
between forgiveness and reconciliation. There was a song I remember
when I was growing up. The whole time that I
was preparing, this song kept coming into my mind. Be
careful what you listen to, because it'll come back to you.
When I was growing up, some of you know this.
So I found love on a two way street and

(55:38):
lost it on a lonely highway. Don't worry about if
you're not load enough to know that song. Wasn't that
great of a song, but it speaks to this. Reconciliation
is two way street. Forgiveness is the lonely highway. In
other words, to reconcile, right, because some people, you know

(56:01):
what I would forgive, but they haven't asked for forgiveness.
Not required, not required. Well, but doesn't he say if
your brother sins against you, you know, seven times in
a day, and ask for forgiveness, then you forgive. Yes, Yeah,
actually he does, he does. He does in a text

(56:24):
that has to do with discipline, has to do with discipline. However,
again in Mark eleven, if you're praying and have anything
against anyone forgive. He doesn't say, if you're praying and
while you're praying, somebody comes and asks you for forgiveness. No,

(56:46):
if you're praying and you have anything against anyone, forgive, forgive.
You can forgive a dead person, and some of us
in here they need to because there's somebody who hurt you,
a parent, a grandparent, whomever, whomever. There's somebody who's hurt you,

(57:10):
and they're not even alive anymore, and you're holding on
to and harboring unforgiveness, destroying your own life. It's been said,
holding onto unforgiveness against another person is like you drinking
poison hoping they die. Forgive, forgive. Forgiveness is not necessarily reconciliation.

(57:42):
Reconciliation requires that other person's cooperation. Hey man, that's the
only way we can reconcile is with cooperation. And we
pray for reconciliation, but we can't make people reconcile. However,
Forgiveness means I give up my right to punish you.

(58:03):
I give up my right to punish you. I'm not
I'm not. I'm not I'm not punishing you. Forgiveness and
reconciliation are two very different things. Amen. Also, forgiveness does
not negate our obligation to confront sin. If your brother sins,

(58:32):
rebuke him, your pet's forgiven that right. That's the same
text thing we were just talking about. It's it's shorthand
for the discipline process. Right. We still do that, Amen,
we still do that. But there's a difference between someone

(58:52):
sins and it's brought to their attention and there's a
rebuke and withholding attention, affection, honor, respect, so that they
feel punished for what they did. There's a difference between
those seek reconciliation, pray for reconciliation, be open to reconciliation.

(59:26):
But while you're seeking and praying and being open forgive,
don't withhold attention, don't withhold affection, don't withhold honor, forgive

(59:53):
children forgive. Do this as well. You wanted something and
you ask mom and dad for it, and mom and
dad said no, and so you fold your arms and
put your head up in the air and you turn
your head. What is that I'm withholding attention, I'm withholding affection,

(01:00:16):
I'm withholding honor, and I want you to see through
my posture that I am now punishing you. Mom, and
dad for not giving me what I want. That's unforgiveness.

(01:00:38):
Husbands and wives, are you withholding attention, affection, honor from
one another? I've seen it go on for so long
that the couple can't even agree on what the original
cause was. They've been at it for so long that

(01:00:59):
if you separate the two of them and ask them,
one will tell you that it's because of this, and
the other will tell you that it's because of that.
One of them will go back five years and the
other one will go back seven. Forgive, parents, have your

(01:01:26):
children send against you? That's a rhetorical question. Forgive. We
don't use the withholding of attention, affection, and honor as punishment. Forgive,

(01:01:51):
Has your church, some member of your church, some leaders
in your church send against you? Forgive? Forget and pray

(01:02:14):
to God for reconciliation and not just outward. Forget Back
to the super Bowl again. And I only use this
because it's like the new national holiday, right. But I

(01:02:35):
don't even remember when I was having the conversation. But
you know, someone was talking about one of the great
things about you know, football, and there was some some
penalty that happened, and it was it was a pretty
big penalty at a pretty big point in the game,
and you know a guy had jumped off sides or

(01:02:55):
grabbed a face mask or done whatever, and it was costly,
like about to cost him the game. You know, there
was a slap on the backside, the pat on the head,
let's go right, and someone just sort of commented on,
how you know we can learn from that. You know,
I'm like I would not. No, man, you just you know,
you forgive when you just move on, Like, no, that's

(01:03:17):
not forgiveness because because in a couple of days, actually
the next day, they're gonna have a film session and
that's gonna be played over again and again and again,
and if it's in the NFL, there may be fines

(01:03:38):
handed out. So yeah, it looks like forgiveness in the
moment because there's a slap on the backside and the
pad on the head. Come on, let's go onto the
next play. But the reality is that's window dressing and

(01:04:01):
that's just expediency in the moment to get through this.
But everybody knows you're going to pay for that tomorrow.
Don't let that be your family, don't let that be
your marriage, Don't let that be your church, be kind

(01:04:27):
to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving each other as God in
Christ forgive you. And if you're here today and you
have not experienced this forgiveness in Christ, then before you
worry about forgiving others, when you recognize your desperate need

(01:04:49):
for forgiveness from God, because that's the starting point. Because
apart from this forgiveness that you receive from God, you
are incapable of the kind of forgiveness that's required in

(01:05:12):
this text.
Advertise With Us

Popular Podcasts

Stuff You Should Know
Dateline NBC

Dateline NBC

Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com

The Burden

The Burden

The Burden is a documentary series that takes listeners into the hidden places where justice is done (and undone). It dives deep into the lives of heroes and villains. And it focuses a spotlight on those who triumph even when the odds are against them. Season 5 - The Burden: Death & Deceit in Alliance On April Fools Day 1999, 26-year-old Yvonne Layne was found murdered in her Alliance, Ohio home. David Thorne, her ex-boyfriend and father of one of her children, was instantly a suspect. Another young man admitted to the murder, and David breathed a sigh of relief, until the confessed murderer fingered David; “He paid me to do it.” David was sentenced to life without parole. Two decades later, Pulitzer winner and podcast host, Maggie Freleng (Bone Valley Season 3: Graves County, Wrongful Conviction, Suave) launched a “live” investigation into David's conviction alongside Jason Baldwin (himself wrongfully convicted as a member of the West Memphis Three). Maggie had come to believe that the entire investigation of David was botched by the tiny local police department, or worse, covered up the real killer. Was Maggie correct? Was David’s claim of innocence credible? In Death and Deceit in Alliance, Maggie recounts the case that launched her career, and ultimately, “broke” her.” The results will shock the listener and reduce Maggie to tears and self-doubt. This is not your typical wrongful conviction story. In fact, it turns the genre on its head. It asks the question: What if our champions are foolish? Season 4 - The Burden: Get the Money and Run “Trying to murder my father, this was the thing that put me on the path.” That’s Joe Loya and that path was bank robbery. Bank, bank, bank, bank, bank. In season 4 of The Burden: Get the Money and Run, we hear from Joe who was once the most prolific bank robber in Southern California, and beyond. He used disguises, body doubles, proxies. He leaped over counters, grabbed the money and ran. Even as the FBI was closing in. It was a showdown between a daring bank robber, and a patient FBI agent. Joe was no ordinary bank robber. He was bright, articulate, charismatic, and driven by a dark rage that he summoned up at will. In seven episodes, Joe tells all: the what, the how… and the why. Including why he tried to murder his father. Season 3 - The Burden: Avenger Miriam Lewin is one of Argentina’s leading journalists today. At 19 years old, she was kidnapped off the streets of Buenos Aires for her political activism and thrown into a concentration camp. Thousands of her fellow inmates were executed, tossed alive from a cargo plane into the ocean. Miriam, along with a handful of others, will survive the camp. Then as a journalist, she will wage a decades long campaign to bring her tormentors to justice. Avenger is about one woman’s triumphant battle against unbelievable odds to survive torture, claim justice for the crimes done against her and others like her, and change the future of her country. Season 2 - The Burden: Empire on Blood Empire on Blood is set in the Bronx, NY, in the early 90s, when two young drug dealers ruled an intersection known as “The Corner on Blood.” The boss, Calvin Buari, lived large. He and a protege swore they would build an empire on blood. Then the relationship frayed and the protege accused Calvin of a double homicide which he claimed he didn’t do. But did he? Award-winning journalist Steve Fishman spent seven years to answer that question. This is the story of one man’s last chance to overturn his life sentence. He may prevail, but someone’s gotta pay. The Burden: Empire on Blood is the director’s cut of the true crime classic which reached #1 on the charts when it was first released half a dozen years ago. Season 1 - The Burden In the 1990s, Detective Louis N. Scarcella was legendary. In a city overrun by violent crime, he cracked the toughest cases and put away the worst criminals. “The Hulk” was his nickname. Then the story changed. Scarcella ran into a group of convicted murderers who all say they are innocent. They turned themselves into jailhouse-lawyers and in prison founded a lway firm. When they realized Scarcella helped put many of them away, they set their sights on taking him down. And with the help of a NY Times reporter they have a chance. For years, Scarcella insisted he did nothing wrong. But that’s all he’d say. Until we tracked Scarcella to a sauna in a Russian bathhouse, where he started to talk..and talk and talk. “The guilty have gone free,” he whispered. And then agreed to take us into the belly of the beast. Welcome to The Burden.

Music, radio and podcasts, all free. Listen online or download the iHeart App.

Connect

© 2026 iHeartMedia, Inc.