March 11, 2024 • 48 mins
Hey Light Shiners! In this episode, I am joined by Tiffany and adoptee who shares her story about her adoption, her adoptive parents divorce and how that affected her life.
Follow the guest on social media! @Sistatiph
Join the BLACK MOTHERS MARCH! https://www.blackmothersmarch.com/
Watch the video of this episode only on Patreon! https://www.patreon.com/user?u=45714095&fan_landing=true
If you would like to be on the show please fill sign up here https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdFZxNnCSntbuvjrxjjvZco3BmsCVNELmU1WzlYPCOongNNiA/viewform?usp=pp_url
Please help us keep shining light on the truths of the foster care system by donating. Please click the link to donate! https://karlosdillard.com/checkout/donate?donatePageId=611ab8be7dbb68767abf984e
Follow the guest on social media! @Sistatiph
Join the BLACK MOTHERS MARCH! https://www.blackmothersmarch.com/
Watch the video of this episode only on Patreon! https://www.patreon.com/user?u=45714095&fan_landing=true
If you would like to be on the show please fill sign up here https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdFZxNnCSntbuvjrxjjvZco3BmsCVNELmU1WzlYPCOongNNiA/viewform?usp=pp_url
Please help us keep shining light on the truths of the foster care system by donating. Please click the link to donate! https://karlosdillard.com/checkout/donate?donatePageId=611ab8be7dbb68767abf984e
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:08):
Content warning. The Wards of theState podcast may contain material that may be
harmful or traumatizing to some audiences.Listener discretion is advised. Hey, light
(00:40):
Shiners, Welcome back to another episodeof Wards of the State. We get
close, y'all. Every single episodewe're getting closer and closer to one hundred
lived experiences. Before we get tothis episode, we do have some housekeeping.
I'm gonna remind you guys that wewill be in Washington, d C.
On May twelfth at the Black Mother'sMarch. If you're in the East
Coast or you want to just flyout and join us, there will be
(01:02):
hundreds and possibly thousands of US marchingagainst CPS and making sure that our legislators
know that we are not okay withthe CPS system literally policing our communities and
placing our children into slavery. Soif you would like to follow up on
that, please make sure you checkout www dot Blackmothersmarch dot com for all
(01:23):
of the latest news. They alsoare now on TikTok, so make sure
you follow them on TikTok as well. I'm also going to be in Denver
on the twenty fifth at the Untanglingour Roots event. If you're going to
that event, shout out, giveme a shout out. I'll only be
there for one of the three daysthough, because I do have some other
events to do that week as well. But I'm just going to keep you
guys updated on here as best asI can, and I hope to see
(01:45):
you all if you come out toany of those events. I would love
just to see who's listening. So, like, always, make sure you
guys are leaving a one, two, three for five star rating and review
on Apple Podcasts, make sure you'resubscribing to us on Spotify, and sharing
with your friends and family on iHeartRadio. So we have another guest today,
(02:06):
and you guys might know her fromTikTok you may not. I met her
on TikTok a few almost like ayear ago, it feels like. And
I've learned so much from her livedexperience and her being a mother, and
I'm just really excited to hear herlived experience be shared over through the podcast
and her experience in foster care.So, Tiffany, how are you doing
today? How are you? I'mokay, I'm okay. I'm hanging in
(02:30):
there. I'm hanging in there.This is Thursdays are my podcast recording days,
So I think you're number three today. So I've heard three lived experiences
and the last one was heavy,so I had to give myself like a
little hour break. That's why Iwas like, can we extend it?
Thank you so much for pushing itback. I was like, I'm on
knee. I'm on knee. Thisan hour to just like decompress and get
(02:50):
ready for to hear your lived experience. So you were in foster care up
until a young age, right,you were in foster care until you're around
two, So kind of where youwere born, how your story started,
and how did you end up infoster care? Well, I was actually
planned, which was very odd.My parents met at like a party.
(03:15):
And during that period the late seventies, like the late pert of the seventies,
in that particular Washington All County,Michigan, I guess, there was
that whole fetishizing black men movement goingon, and all of the Caucasian women
were like, oh, yeah,there's black guys, you know, that
(03:36):
type of thing, and they madeit a point to like, you know,
date black guys. My mom said, and her friend took her to
a party, and she met mydad, and my dad she was twenty.
She was twenty and she already hadmy brother. And I don't know
what she was thinking, but hewas married actually and didn't tell her,
(04:00):
and he actually had another girlfriend,and I don't I don't know. He
was very suave, I guess becausesomehow they got an apartment together and he
was back and forth between two apartmentsand a wife. Wow, And he
asked her she wanted to have ababy with him, and she said yes,
(04:26):
And when they found out I waspregnant, he went When she found
out she was pregnant, he wentoff his mental health medication again, and
I think that's when the abuse started, like immediately after she found out I
was pregnant. Well, she waspregnant with me, and he ended up
(04:55):
stabbing her when on Christmas Day whenshe was I think she was about six
weeks pregnant with me, and sheleft and he went to jail, and
I don't know why they let himout, but they let him out and
he went back to jail, andshe wanted her mother to take me,
(05:18):
and her mother is Caucasian and hermother lived in Clinton, Michigan, at
which that time there were no blackpeople there at all. And she was
like, look, I don't knowanything about raising a black child in this
neighborhood. The ku kutz Klan livesnext door, Like are you aware of
this? Like, she can't stayhere, but I tell you what if
(05:42):
you find if you find his familyand they help, I will help them.
I will help them money wise,like will I will help take take
care of her money wise. Butshe can't. She can't live here.
It's not safe for her. It'snot safe at all. And so when
I was born, she called mygreat grandmam, and of course my great
Grandmam came rushing up to the hospitaland she's like, I'll you know,
(06:04):
I'll take her home. And thesocial worker was like, you can't.
You're too old. You're I thinkshe was like in her mid seventies.
She's like, you're too old.You have to find somebody else. And
she's like, well, you can'texactly give this baby away because I'm Indigenous
(06:26):
and we have like things that wehave to go through before we can just
give babies away. So I haveto call my family back in Mississippi and
somebody will come and pick her up. And they said, well, she
has to have somewhere to go inthe meantime, and she can't go with
you. And I don't know whathappened as far there was probably no one
(06:48):
there to take me at the time, prepared for me, or that maybe
they weren't good enough in Catholic socialservices eyes. But I ended up getting
placed with my adopt parents who didn'twant kids. They got married and said,
(07:08):
we're not having kids. We don'twant kids, we want to travel,
we want to live our life,and then their marriage kind of got
rocky, and I guess they thoughta baby was gonna fix it, and
they started getting pressure from my maternalgrandmother, my adopted maternal grandmother, like
you need to do something, youknow, get a baby and it'll be
(07:31):
okay. I don't. My dadhad rheumatic fevers, so he was sterile,
and I don't know what happened withmy mom, but she she never
had her own kids either, Andin my mind I always thinking, like,
wasn't that a sign for y'all tolike not have kids? But anyways,
(07:53):
I was actually born on there theythought it was. They thought I
was like some kind of sign becauseI was born on their eighth wedding anniversary,
and when I came into the tothe home, I can remember being
called by my birth name. Andthen one day I was at I guess
you would call it daycare and nurseryschool, and the lady was like saying,
(08:18):
Tiffany, Tiffany, and I can'tremember looking at her like who are
you talking to? And she wrotemy name on a piece of paper and
she goes, this is your namenow, and me thinking to myself like
what you know, like you kindof remember that, like you know,
two and a half three years old, like that's not that's not that's not
(08:39):
what they were calling me. Soapparently around like when my adoption was legalized,
that's when they legally changed my name. I guess because my adut my
birth name was Danita, and Iguess they thought that was unique and my
mom might be able to find mebecause we all lived in the same neighborhood.
That's it's, you know, evenmore weird. Like my birth father
(09:01):
lived three streets over than my biologicalsiblings lived like five streets over. Like
I could literally see their house everyday, like I passed by it,
and we never they never knew whoI was they, you know, and
my you know my my adopted parents. My dad was honest. I remember
(09:26):
being three and he was like,look, don't tell your mom because I
was asked. I asked something aboutmy mom being in my mom's tummy.
He said, look, don't tellher. I told you. But you
know, I showed you that movieAnnie, and I wanted to tell you
that you were. You were kindof like Annie, and I was just
(09:46):
sitting there, you know, kindof like what he's like, Please don't
tell her. I told you,but she didn't have you. And I
can remember that's when you were littlein considered the front seat. So your
mom never told you that you were. She told me that she gave birth
to me. Wow, up untiland I asked her multiple times, you
(10:11):
know, like you know it,like my mom is a black Panamanian woman,
she's brown skin, she's chocolate,and my dad is about your complexion.
So something wasn't adding up to meas a kid, like why do
you look like that and your parentslook like that? But my mom would
say, oh, you just looklike your dad's side of family, which
(10:33):
I I mean, his family wasmy complexion. But it didn't make sense
that I came out of her,you know, and I didn't. She
didn't confess until I was ten,and that's because I was outside playing with
cousins and they all surrounded me screamingit at me. And I was kind
(10:56):
of like, okay, this happened, can you tell me the truth now?
And then she was like, okay, yeah, well I didn't tell
you because I just wanted to protectyou. But she really wasn't protecting me
if you think about it, becausepeople were looking at me crazy, like
how is that your mom? Youdon't look anything like nothing? Yeah?
(11:18):
Did you guys look alike at all? Or like did you anything? No?
No, like like she's five footthree, like even now, like
she's five foot three, I'm fiveeleven. I'm like, I'm like super
super super duper light. And she's, like I said, like she's the
(11:41):
color of like milk chocolate and shehas like type three type four hair.
We look when I say, nothingalike, nothing alike? And was her
husband was he also African American?Or yes he was, he was,
but his dad his dad was likemixed with Native so his dad was my
(12:01):
complexion. So that story could passlike, well, I guess with some
people, but it didn't really flywith kids like no, you know what,
Like my friends used to be like, no, something's not right,
Tiffany like no, so kind oflike describe growing up. How was your
life growing up with your adoptive parents. Well, they they my dad actually
(12:28):
left. He he my dad.My dad actually left because he decided that
he couldn't he couldn't live a lieanymore. And he came out and he
moved in with his uh, hispartner, Bob. And my mom was
(12:48):
so like furious and in denial.She kind of like packed us up and
we moved. We moved across thecountry from Michigan and California. And yeah,
shortly after for that, that's whenlike the physical and emotional abuse started.
And I think about it now,I think she was angry with me
(13:11):
because I was supposed to fix it. It was kind of she kind of
when she yelled at me, italmost sounded like if I didn't have you,
we'd probably still be together type thinghBut my dad was like, she's
the one that wanted you. Ihe and I mean I had to talk
with him about it when I wasolder, and he was like she was
(13:35):
very forceful, like this is gonnawork, this is and and then you
know, when I came into herlife, she she gave her life to
Jesus, so that that was veryheavily. She was very heavily religiously,
you know, abusive. That's sucha that's such a trend that I see
with adopted parents are very involved withwith religion and they use really abuse.
(14:01):
Yeah, she did. I mean, it was just it was we went
from like not going to church togoing to church and then like going to
like the churches where like, youknow, people would be talking in tongues
and stuff like that, and Ican remember being so confused, like and
everything you know that I did wasthe devil or or she'd be rubbing oil
(14:26):
all over my head, like yougot to remove you know, the sin.
And it was it was, itwas heavy, it was, it
was really heavy as a kid,and she was very controlling. And I'm
talking about controlling to the point whereI think, now that I look at
(14:48):
it and I have autistic children,I want to say that she might be
neuro divergent, and she was justnever diagnosed because she was obsessed with church
and the Bible and frame and everythingcan only be done one way, and
that's the only way that you cando it like you can imagine being you
(15:11):
know, ten or twelve years oldand brushing your teeth with hot water and
getting caught and like getting the breakspeed off of you type thing, you
know, and I want She controlledme with food too. She force sped
me like if I was full,she you're gonna eat until I say you're
(15:33):
done type thing. There there wouldbe times where I would go days without
a shower, and she's like,we have to save money, and I'm
like, mom, I you know, I think I need to take it.
Well, here's a washcloth, youknow, go washing the sink type
thing, like that's the kind ofcontrol much money are you saving? I
(15:54):
don't know? She would and thenyou know I have I have more Caucasian
type hair, so I can't gotwo weeks without washing my hair. But
she'd make me so you can imaginewhat my hair looked like. And then
she'd be like she'd put grease andstuff in it, and it was frizzy
(16:17):
when I was little, and sheput a relaxer in it and fried it
type thing. Oh yeah, goodness. And I can remember, see I
didn't see my dad very often becauseI want to say that she kept me
away from him. One she didn'twant him to find out about the abuse
because when he would call, she'dbe on the phone upstairs or of the
(16:37):
landline type thing, you know,hit the mute button and pick up the
phone and listen to make sure I'mnot saying anything. And when she did
send me, I always had likeyou better not say anything about this or
that, or when you get back, you're gonna get it type thing.
(17:00):
And when I didn't see him againuntil I was like eleven. From from
like six to eleven, I didn'tI didn't see him. He called every
once in a while. I wantto say he called more than she said
she and he said he did,but she wouldn't let me talk to him.
And when I was eleven, Iwent up there and he's just like
(17:23):
she packed you like rag, likeshe dressed me in rags, like it
was bad. And he's like,I send like and back in the nineties,
like eight hundred dollars a month inchild support that was a lot of
money he had to pay. He'slike, I'm sending eight hundred dollars a
month and you have on thrift storerags, like what is this? And
I can remember there was a bigargument on the phone, and he was
(17:47):
like, well, I'm just gonnakeep her. He said, I can't
send her back if you're not gonnatake care of her. He was like,
she came up here in rags.He was like, her hair was
dirty, she was dirty. Andshe's like, if you don't send her
back, you know, I'm goingto call the police. And I can
remember my dad saying to me like, look, if you go back down
(18:08):
there and she she's not letting youtake a bath, and she's force feeding
you. Because I told him everything, you know, he's like, you
make sure you call me. He'slike, call me, collect, call
your grandma, call somebody. Wedid not have a phone in our home
for two years and I was like, why don't we have a phone and
(18:33):
she's like, oh, we can'tafford one. We did not have a
phone, no phone. She madesure that she cut it all off.
And as a kid, you don'tthink about that type of stuff, you
don't. But I was like,she really had a phone, so I
couldn't tell him what was going on. So what ended up happening? Did
(18:56):
you? Did you stay with her? She put me off on a lot
of people. I would go staywith my grandma for a bit, and
then I went to go stay withmy cousin because she was a single mom
and she had four kids, andI ended up raising her kids for a
couple of years. And when Iwas fifteen, I went back home for
(19:19):
a little while and she was stillphysically, you know, hurting me.
And at that point I got tired. And by that time I was five
foot ten, so her five footthree. I was like, you know
what, I'm not scared of heranymore. This is gonna stop. And
I gripped her up and I waslike, this is this is gonna stop.
(19:44):
And she's like, oh no,you can't do this. I'm sending
you to your dad. She toldme that on a Friday. I was
on a plane on a Monday,and she did not tell my dad I
was coming until I was in theair and she he had no clue if
he was even going to be atthat airport because she never spoke to him.
She left a message on his answermachine, and my dad said if
(20:14):
he had to take off taking offof work that day for some reason,
he wouldn't have gotten the message andI would have just been up at the
airport. So he came to pickme up at the airport, and I
can remember he took me out liketo eat, and he was just like,
I don't think he thought I knewwhat gay was, you know what
I mean? And he was like, I gotta tell you something. He
(20:37):
was like, and I don't wantyou to flip out. He's like,
I have a partner and we livedtogether, and I'm just like, okay,
He's like, you understand. Iwas like, I under I understood
when I was six what was goingon. And he's like, okay,
we're cool. But you have toremember my mom was a highly religious woman
(21:03):
that engraved in me that being gayis wrong and you're gonna go to hell.
And so I'm having to have thisconversation with my dad, who I
could tell was trying not to laughat the same time, but like really
being concerned, like what did shedo to you type thing? You know?
And I lived with him and thenwhen I was sixteen, his partner
(21:26):
got hooked on drugs really bad andit was I mean, it was terrible,
and his he hit it for areally long time. But then my
dad started finding paraphernalia in the houseand who did who did the partner blame
it on He said it was me. She hangs out with the with the
(21:48):
kids in the neighborhood. She's theone you know smoking crack. Not me.
He planted it. Yeah, itwas crack. He planned it.
He planned He planted crack pipes andin crack in my room under my mattress.
My dad called the police on me. This was like maybe like two
(22:11):
weeks after my sixteenth birthday, andthe police came. The police came,
and they took me to a hospital, and they took me to a mental
health facility and they put me onall this medicine. My dad was like
making I don't know, he wasmaking up stuff, saying I see stuff,
(22:33):
and I guess he didn't want meanymore because his partner said I was
ruining their relationship or they didn't hedidn't want to have a kid or whatever.
So my dad said he didn't wantme back, and they were kind
of like, well, your optionsare, I guess in Pennsylvania back then,
(22:56):
you can sign or over to thestate, or you know you can
you can you know, take herhome or whatever. And he's like,
I'm not taking her home. Hekept me drugged up for about a year
and he administered my medicine. Idon't like to this day, Like he
apologized in twenty twenty one for allof that, but I still don't understand
(23:19):
why he did it. And thatpartner ended up, you know, he
ended up finding out my dad foundout through his partner's drug use, he
contracted HIV and that was a bigthing, you know, in the house
with my dad, Like, hewas angry about that, and so I
(23:40):
ended up, you know, leavinghome because it was kind of like he
didn't he didn't want me either,and he didn't care for the fact that
I was overweight either. So therewas a lot of He never physically abused
me, but he was very emotionallyabusive. So I was just out in
the world. Once I turned seventeen, that was That was pretty much it
(24:06):
my relationship with him. And didyou ever reach back out to your mom
after that time? I did,I did, I didn't, And throughout
the years, I have really tried. I have really tried. After my
birth mom passed away, she Ihad my daughter in twenty ten, and
(24:29):
my mom, actually my doctor momactually came to stay and help after my
first child and my second child,and after I had tatum. She came
for two weeks and she looked medead in the face and said, I
was good to you. And that'swhen the discussion happened, like did you
just when when she said that,my husband jumped up off the couch and
(24:53):
left out the house because she waslike, what are you talking about?
I was good to you. Andit was just like an overwhelming silence in
the room. And I was like, Mom, you don't remember any of
it. No, they never do, they never do. I said,
are you are you kidding me?Like you don't remember beating me up and
(25:15):
down the street, you don't rememberstrangling me over getting a dr report card,
Like you don't remember any of thatstuff. She used to lock me
in closets. I was like,you don't remember any of that and she's
like, well, you gotta letthe past be the past, because God
says, you know, you gottaforgive and move on. And I it's
(25:37):
just it's just pointless. It's pointlike it's kind of pointless with her because
she'll say, please forgive me,and then it'll be just right back to
the way that it was. Withinsix months. And with my dad,
he's got dementia, and he's ina nursing home right now and he can't.
He can't. He doesn't even likehe still thinks that I'm like seventeen,
(26:02):
like he The last time I seenhim was in twenty twenty one when
he had a stroke. I actuallydrove from Louisiana to Philadelphia with my kids
to make sure that he was okay. And that's when when I showed up.
That's when he had like a breakdownwith me and was like, I
can't believe, like, after everythingthat I did, like you would even
(26:23):
be here because because I don't evendeserve for you to be here. And
he was like, I'm really youknow, I'm really sorry that I did
all those things in he was likeand I he openly admits that he should
(26:44):
have done He should have done thingsdifferent. He should have stood his ground
and said, look, I don'twant kids, I don't need kids.
Peace, I'm out. He shouldhave left. He said that, he
said, you can't change the fact, you know, you can't change the
facts that that happened. But hedid ask for forgiveness, and he did
(27:04):
acknowledge all of the things that hedid to me growing up. My mother
still never will She never fully will. Yeah, it feels so good to
get, you know that at leastthat acknowledgment, you know, from an
adoptive parent or even a biological parent, you know, like just that full
accountability. Yeah, but my adoptedmom she'll never be She'll never be fully
(27:30):
accountable for anything that she did.And the last time we went to go
visit her was around the holidays,and she lives two hours from us,
and we don't see her but likemaybe once a year maybe. And both
of my biological parents are deceased now. I did not really have a relationship
(27:56):
with them either, because I thinkI with my a biological mom, I
think I was a reminder of aperiod of her life where she made a
lot of mistakes and made a lotof poor, poor judgments, and I
think I reminded her of it,so she couldn't she couldn't cope. And
(28:19):
with my dad, you know,his mental health never fully got better.
And I did find out via twentythree and me in twenty twenty one that
I had a sister that is twomonths older than me, and she was
in the foster care system too,So it's like he just had a bunch
(28:44):
of kids and he didn't take careof any of them, any of us.
I looked up his obituary online andnone of us were even in the
obituary, you know what I mean, Like he just made kids that he
didn't take care of. Now,he did man to keep four of them
together because my oldest brother, hewas in foster care and he got him
(29:07):
out. But my siblings' mother adoptedhim. Why while they were still married.
That's why she raised him. Buthe when he left, he never
took care of any of us.And we often wonder if there's more.
I mean, he definitely he definitelywas was that. He definitely he definitely
(29:34):
was definitely was that. Yeah,he definitely was that. And I'm not
saying he was a bad person becauseI did talk to him on the phone,
but I didn't really have a connectionwith him because it depended on whether
he was on his medicine or not, you know, and he can't help
that. He needed someone to takecare of him, like to have conservatorship,
(29:56):
and he didn't have anybody to dothat, so he kind of just
was out there taking it or nottaking it. I felt bad for him,
you know what. I felt badfor him because you can tell he
wanted to be, you know,a dad, and you know, he
tell me he loved me and stufflike that, but he just couldn't.
(30:17):
He couldn't be He couldn't be adad to anybody. He couldn't take care
of himself. So, yeah,mental health is really hard to see.
You know, parents struggle, especiallyas as a child, and you you
want to like say, why didI go through this? But then you
see them, You're like, well, you weren't stable, right, Well,
if we're going to take a quickwe're going to take a quick break.
(30:37):
When we come back, I wantto talk more about your life as
an adult and becoming a mother yourselfand how that relationship looks like with your
adoptive mother and your existing family.So we'll be right back. Okay,
Hey, hey, Hey, Thisis Amanda coul chair of the Black Mother's
March, and the Black Mother's Marchon the White House is a direct action
(30:59):
led by a coldish and of blackled organizations that are involved in the struggle
to rescue our children from the custodyof the state. We exist to expose
the systematic attack on black women andthe black family by the US government.
We understand that the government has beenable to perpetrate this terror under the guise
of protecting children and families, butthe facts are clear. The majority of
(31:22):
children taken by this system is dueto neglect, and neglect equals poverty.
Family police and agents are two timesmore likely to investigate black families than white
families. Black children make up fourteenpercent of the US population, but twenty
three percent of the population of usecaptured by this system. The Black Mother's
March is rooted in facts and history. March with us on May twelfth,
(31:47):
twenty twenty four to show that thepeople have the power to abolish this system
and dream of a new way forward. Welcome back to the show, y'all.
Make sure y'a are really going toSpotify and following, subscribing, leaving
us five star rating reviews on ApplePodcasts, and sharing this show. Also,
we're always looking for sponsors. We'realways looking for more support. If
(32:12):
you know anybody who wants to advertiseon the show, let me know big
or small businesses, and make surethat you are following me on social media
because we do have a lot ofevents coming up. Like I said at
the beginning of the show, wehave the Black Mother's March on May twelfth,
twenty twenty four, in Washington,d C. I hope to see
you there. If not, makesure you follow us on TikTok. You
know, I'm on livestream the wholething. So without further ado, I
(32:32):
want to get back to Tiffany's story. Tiffany, So after going through all
of that, because that was justso much, you know, like we
spoke a little bit during the break, but like there's just so much.
But it does feel good to haveat least one parent take accountability. How
has it been being a mother andnot really being able to have good guidance
(32:54):
from parents, either your birth parentsor your adopted parents. How has that
affect at you're parenting? You don'tlike, I don't want to get emotional.
I'm very blessed that I had likean amazing grandmam, you know,
(33:21):
so I got a chance to seewhat what you know, love was like.
But a lot of my parenting camefrom college to like and being a
nanny and asking, you know,friends. My mom had had sisters.
Unfortunately, the one that that Iwas closest to she passed away, and
(33:45):
she does have another sister that Iyou know that I can you know,
confide in about parenting. But forthe most part, it's a lot of
research and in internet searches. Mymother wouldn't be able to give anybody parents
(34:06):
and advice I would. I wouldnever, I would never go to her
for that because she I have threeneurodivergent children, and I don't even like,
I think to myself, they shouldbe so happy that I'm their mother
(34:27):
and not my mother, because thiswould not be going down this way.
And I do admit that sometimes Iovercompensate with my kids and I let them
get away with a lot more thanthey should because I got away with nothing
at all. And I make alot of mistakes, just like I think
(34:49):
every mother makes mistakes, but it'sit's just, you know, learning from
them and trying to be better thanmy adopted mother was. And I feel
like I've already done that, andI do it every day because they're you
know, they're first. I wasnever first for her. And you said
(35:23):
that the last time you saw herwas a few years ago. So does
she have any type of relationship withyour children? I saw her last.
I saw her last July. Notreally. She is my two, my
fourteen year old and my thirteen yearold. She did at one point kind
(35:43):
of have a relationship with them,and you know, teenagers are curious,
and it was kind of like,Mom, why don't you and Nana like
go to lunch and why don't youand Nana like talk on the phone,
And how comes she never liked sendsyou birthday presents and stuff like that you
(36:06):
send her stuff. And it waskind of like, do a lot of
my kids and say, oh,that's just And I mean, I was
honest with them about part of mychildhood, like I couldn't get too graphic,
but they were just kind of like, that's weird. And she was
also talking crap about me to them, and it started adding up in their
head like yo, you're talking aboutmy mom, like like we're not going
(36:30):
over there, and they kind ofjust stopped asking. My younger kids don't
really know her, Like they thinkher name is Nana, I think,
but I don't think that they knowthat that's their grandmam. I have an
older friend that comes over here,Like I think they think that's their grandmam
(36:52):
because they call her grammy. Butlike I told my mom, Nana is
just a title, Like you're notreally a grandmother to them like you baked,
not a cookie, you've knit it, not a blanket, like you
see, you've done nothing with them, and sending them a baby doll or
(37:14):
a puzzle you know once a year, or a ten dollar Chick fil a
card like that really doesn't Where areyou gonna get a chick fl for ten
dollars? First of all, no, she literally sent my kids a t
car. You can't. You can'teven get a full meal for ten dollars.
(37:34):
And I was like ten dollars,Like okay, Like I guess I'm
paying for the other half, forthe other half of the happy meal.
But yeah, I mean, shedoesn't. We did visit our We did
try to visit her back, Iguess in December, but when we went
up, she said she had togo to a funeral. I remember getting
(37:57):
on your social media. Yeah,And I just kind of like, so
you want to go see a deadperson versus your daughter and your living grandkids,
that's wonderful. And my teenagers werelike, yeah, we're kind of
done with her at this point.I can't my fourteen ye I was like,
I can't be fake with her anymorebecause I mean that really hurt him.
(38:21):
He hadn't seen her. He hadn'tseen her in a while because he
was away this past summer and hewas he wanted to see her, but
he was like, she doesn't careabout us. She cared about us,
she'd be making her way, youknow, And we don't stay with her,
like when we when we visit Atlanta, we're not invited to stay with
(38:42):
her. You can't touch anything inher house. You can't you can't talk,
you can't laugh. You just haveto kind of sit there. And
she still has a TV from whenI was a kid with the knobs turning,
so the kids don't really stop likegoing on over there to say,
I'm not exaggerating. She has toturning not television. I don't even know
(39:06):
how it plays. That is insane. That is absolutely insane. So do
you talk to any other members ofyour adoptive family, like and you said
you mentioned a couple of aunts anduncles that you're really closed to. Most
of my well, the aunt thatI was close who passed away, my
(39:29):
cousin. She unfortunately passed away inDecember twenty twenty one. And there's only
one aunt that I speak to.But other than that, really nobody because
My adoptive parents were kind of alienatedfrom their family, so they were never
(39:50):
really active. My mom was kindof like a hermit. She stayed away
from everybody all the time. Andmy dad, up until maybe until I
came up, he was like notaround his family at all. He would
go home and visit on occasion,but nobody ever visited him type of thing.
But I was never really around theirfamily, Like I mean, I
(40:15):
knew who those people were, butI really don't know them. Yeah,
And a lot of people find thatweird, like you don't have any family.
No, not really. I dohave biological siblings. I actually have
quite a few, but I'm notclose with them either. But I didn't
meet them until I was like twentythree and I lived, you know,
(40:37):
far away, so I was makingefforts to go visit them, but it
was never vice versa. And eventuallyyou get kind of tired of that,
you know what I mean, Likewhy I always have to be the one
to come and visit Why is noone coming to visit me? Yeah,
I don't think I'm thankful. Likemy brother. I told my brother that
(40:58):
like two years ago, three orago, and now he's made an effort
because I always go home like onceor twice a year, and now he's
been making an effort to come formy birthday and for Christmas, and it's
been really nice to just to havethat family bond, you know, and
it takes effort for everyone, youknow. Yeah, well know my one
sister, she was like really honestwith me about it. She's just like,
(41:21):
it's not that I don't like hewas not out the She's like,
but I didn't grow up with you, Like I don't know you and I've
never spent any time with you,so I don't know how to be with
you. And she grew up withher with her Caucasian side, so she
doesn't know anything about being you know, a millenated person, a millenated person,
(41:43):
you know what I mean. Likeshe kind of like just lives in
suburbia, Like we have nothing,like we literally have nothing in common at
all. So d your blood,Yeah, I mean that that's it.
And I mean she does say himon Facebook Messenger every once in a while
(42:05):
and ask how the kids are doing. And I can't be mad at her
from not being interested. She hada lot of trauma in her life too.
You know, my dad that himclose to home. That hits so
close to home because like I'm goingto go visit my adoptive brothers, my
adoptive brother next month, and Ihaven't seen him since since I was four
fifteen, since like his dad andhis stepmom that was my adoptive mom.
(42:30):
You know, that whole thing wentdown and I kind of had to like
he's always been there, like reachingout, He's always told me, like
he's supported me. He's always he'she's come on my podcast before and advocated
on my behalf and like said,I know you're telling the truth. Grow
I was there, but it's beenso hard building a relationship with a person
(42:50):
that I experienced so much trauma fromin that same circle, right yeah,
And I want to like see myknee and to hear like my niece legally
that is my niece, that ismy brother. Like I talk about that
every single day, but it justfeels so weird. But I went through
the same thing with my biological familybecause my brother had to sit both of
(43:10):
my brothers had to sit down withme, and they said, Carlos sitting
Birthday gifts and sending Christmas gifts isnot enough, Like we know how it
feels not to have you know,how it feels not to have family?
Why aren't you here for your niecesand nephews? And I had to tell
them, I said, because Idon't know how to be there. I
don't I don't know how to havea niece or nephew. And I didn't
(43:31):
get that right, especially with y'all, and they and they were just really
hard. They said, you know, that's not an excuse, and that
doesn't mean that we can't all learntogether, you know, and that's what
we're doing now. But I candefinitely understand what you just described about,
just like what your sister just described, like about being there, but just
kind of like not knowing, youknow, how to navigate those she doesn't
(43:54):
know. She doesn't know. AndI'm not upset with her because she's honest
about it. You know. Iwas when when I first came into the
family, you know, buying allthe nieces and nephews and stuff like that.
And then I started having kids andit was not reciprocated. Nobody ever
came to a baby shower, noone ever came to a birth. When
(44:15):
I bought my first house, noone came to visit. None of that
stuff. Nobody came to my wedding. Nothing, And it was just kind
of like, yeah, that's notworking for me, Like like you're not
gonna treat me exactly how my adoptiveparents treated me, Like like I like,
(44:35):
you can give me all you wantand I'm gonna take, but I'm
not giving you anything back. Soit was just kind of like, this
is just something that I that Ihave to deal with and I can't be
I'm not upset that my parents didn'tadopt more kids, because that would have
just been a bunch of us traumatized, you know, a bunch of us,
(44:57):
you know what I mean, justlike a bunch of us stuff uck,
you know, with them for parents. So I mean, I'm not
upset that I didn't have any LikeI have a lot of good friends that
I call my sisters. I've mademy own family, my kids, my
kids like they don't they don't seethem as not like their family, you
(45:24):
know what I mean. Like ifthey say you know my aunt or my
uncle, they know it's not theirblood relative. They said, for a
minute, they were kind of confusedbecause all of my girlfriends are either Puerto
Rican or mixed race, and sothey really thought that those were really my
sisters. And one day I waslike, no, no, that's not
(45:45):
your blood relative. They're like,oh man, like we really thought,
because they treat them that way.My girlfriend, my girlfriend Jamie, she
makes sure that she sends all fiveof my kids every birthday. She never
she drove twelve hours to come toa baby shower for two hours to turn
(46:06):
around and have to go back homefor work the next day. That's afraid.
That's my definition of family. That'ssomebody that their loves and cares about
us. But bio adopted, Ijust don't. Everybody is gone, so
(46:29):
it's just me and the kids.They have each other. There's a lot
of them, that's for sure.I'm glad that your kids have each other.
And I want to thank you forsharing your lived experience and being raw
and vulnerable and letting people know likeadoptive parents sometimes need to make the best
(46:51):
decision, which is to not havechildren. And like you said, God
said no at first, like literally, if you want to believe in God,
That's why I understand for such areligious person, why are you not
listening to God? He said no, He said, you can't have kids,
right, and you go out thereand adopt and it's just absolutely astounding.
But Tiff, before we wrap up, I want to ask you the
(47:14):
question that I ask every single guest, and that is, what's one piece
of advice you would give to anotherchild growing through what you went through?
What piece of lived experience would yougive them an advice to make it a
little bit easier for them? Ohgoodness, You can eventually choose your family.
(47:36):
You can make your own family.You're not always going to be stuck
with the people that are making yourlife, you know, feel miserable.
You're gonna grow up. You're gonnameet people that love you more than they
did or could, and you'll makeyour own family and it'll be totally different
(47:57):
because you'll have control over who youchoose to be around and who you choose
to take advice from and live with. I think that's the advice that I
would give them. I love that. I love that well. Thank you
so much, Tiff, and listeners, please be sure to go check out
(48:17):
Tiff. I will have your socialmedia attacked, y'all, like I love
her content even just like your stories. And you know when you're just when
you're talking about crazy things that likepop up. It's just it's so interesting
and you just have so much light, and I hope that you continue to
shine it and thank you for shiningit with me on my platform here on
(48:37):
the War to the State podcast.So light shiners, like we say every
week, always shine your light becauseyou never know who you might inspire or
guide with your light. And untilnext week, keep shining, y'alls. Fine out
Content warning. The Wards of theState podcast may contain material that may be
harmful or traumatizing to some audiences.Listener discretion is advised. Hey, light
(00:40):
Shiners, Welcome back to another episodeof Wards of the State. We get
close, y'all. Every single episodewe're getting closer and closer to one hundred
lived experiences. Before we get tothis episode, we do have some housekeeping.
I'm gonna remind you guys that wewill be in Washington, d C.
On May twelfth at the Black Mother'sMarch. If you're in the East
Coast or you want to just flyout and join us, there will be
(01:02):
hundreds and possibly thousands of US marchingagainst CPS and making sure that our legislators
know that we are not okay withthe CPS system literally policing our communities and
placing our children into slavery. Soif you would like to follow up on
that, please make sure you checkout www dot Blackmothersmarch dot com for all
(01:23):
of the latest news. They alsoare now on TikTok, so make sure
you follow them on TikTok as well. I'm also going to be in Denver
on the twenty fifth at the Untanglingour Roots event. If you're going to
that event, shout out, giveme a shout out. I'll only be
there for one of the three daysthough, because I do have some other
events to do that week as well. But I'm just going to keep you
guys updated on here as best asI can, and I hope to see
(01:45):
you all if you come out toany of those events. I would love
just to see who's listening. So, like, always, make sure you
guys are leaving a one, two, three for five star rating and review
on Apple Podcasts, make sure you'resubscribing to us on Spotify, and sharing
with your friends and family on iHeartRadio. So we have another guest today,
(02:06):
and you guys might know her fromTikTok you may not. I met her
on TikTok a few almost like ayear ago, it feels like. And
I've learned so much from her livedexperience and her being a mother, and
I'm just really excited to hear herlived experience be shared over through the podcast
and her experience in foster care.So, Tiffany, how are you doing
today? How are you? I'mokay, I'm okay. I'm hanging in
(02:30):
there. I'm hanging in there.This is Thursdays are my podcast recording days,
So I think you're number three today. So I've heard three lived experiences
and the last one was heavy,so I had to give myself like a
little hour break. That's why Iwas like, can we extend it?
Thank you so much for pushing itback. I was like, I'm on
knee. I'm on knee. Thisan hour to just like decompress and get
(02:50):
ready for to hear your lived experience. So you were in foster care up
until a young age, right,you were in foster care until you're around
two, So kind of where youwere born, how your story started,
and how did you end up infoster care? Well, I was actually
planned, which was very odd.My parents met at like a party.
(03:15):
And during that period the late seventies, like the late pert of the seventies,
in that particular Washington All County,Michigan, I guess, there was
that whole fetishizing black men movement goingon, and all of the Caucasian women
were like, oh, yeah,there's black guys, you know, that
(03:36):
type of thing, and they madeit a point to like, you know,
date black guys. My mom said, and her friend took her to
a party, and she met mydad, and my dad she was twenty.
She was twenty and she already hadmy brother. And I don't know
what she was thinking, but hewas married actually and didn't tell her,
(04:00):
and he actually had another girlfriend,and I don't I don't know. He
was very suave, I guess becausesomehow they got an apartment together and he
was back and forth between two apartmentsand a wife. Wow, And he
asked her she wanted to have ababy with him, and she said yes,
(04:26):
And when they found out I waspregnant, he went When she found
out she was pregnant, he wentoff his mental health medication again, and
I think that's when the abuse started, like immediately after she found out I
was pregnant. Well, she waspregnant with me, and he ended up
(04:55):
stabbing her when on Christmas Day whenshe was I think she was about six
weeks pregnant with me, and sheleft and he went to jail, and
I don't know why they let himout, but they let him out and
he went back to jail, andshe wanted her mother to take me,
(05:18):
and her mother is Caucasian and hermother lived in Clinton, Michigan, at
which that time there were no blackpeople there at all. And she was
like, look, I don't knowanything about raising a black child in this
neighborhood. The ku kutz Klan livesnext door, Like are you aware of
this? Like, she can't stayhere, but I tell you what if
(05:42):
you find if you find his familyand they help, I will help them.
I will help them money wise,like will I will help take take
care of her money wise. Butshe can't. She can't live here.
It's not safe for her. It'snot safe at all. And so when
I was born, she called mygreat grandmam, and of course my great
Grandmam came rushing up to the hospitaland she's like, I'll you know,
(06:04):
I'll take her home. And thesocial worker was like, you can't.
You're too old. You're I thinkshe was like in her mid seventies.
She's like, you're too old.You have to find somebody else. And
she's like, well, you can'texactly give this baby away because I'm Indigenous
(06:26):
and we have like things that wehave to go through before we can just
give babies away. So I haveto call my family back in Mississippi and
somebody will come and pick her up. And they said, well, she
has to have somewhere to go inthe meantime, and she can't go with
you. And I don't know whathappened as far there was probably no one
(06:48):
there to take me at the time, prepared for me, or that maybe
they weren't good enough in Catholic socialservices eyes. But I ended up getting
placed with my adopt parents who didn'twant kids. They got married and said,
(07:08):
we're not having kids. We don'twant kids, we want to travel,
we want to live our life,and then their marriage kind of got
rocky, and I guess they thoughta baby was gonna fix it, and
they started getting pressure from my maternalgrandmother, my adopted maternal grandmother, like
you need to do something, youknow, get a baby and it'll be
(07:31):
okay. I don't. My dadhad rheumatic fevers, so he was sterile,
and I don't know what happened withmy mom, but she she never
had her own kids either, Andin my mind I always thinking, like,
wasn't that a sign for y'all tolike not have kids? But anyways,
(07:53):
I was actually born on there theythought it was. They thought I
was like some kind of sign becauseI was born on their eighth wedding anniversary,
and when I came into the tothe home, I can remember being
called by my birth name. Andthen one day I was at I guess
you would call it daycare and nurseryschool, and the lady was like saying,
(08:18):
Tiffany, Tiffany, and I can'tremember looking at her like who are
you talking to? And she wrotemy name on a piece of paper and
she goes, this is your namenow, and me thinking to myself like
what you know, like you kindof remember that, like you know,
two and a half three years old, like that's not that's not that's not
(08:39):
what they were calling me. Soapparently around like when my adoption was legalized,
that's when they legally changed my name. I guess because my adut my
birth name was Danita, and Iguess they thought that was unique and my
mom might be able to find mebecause we all lived in the same neighborhood.
That's it's, you know, evenmore weird. Like my birth father
(09:01):
lived three streets over than my biologicalsiblings lived like five streets over. Like
I could literally see their house everyday, like I passed by it,
and we never they never knew whoI was they, you know, and
my you know my my adopted parents. My dad was honest. I remember
(09:26):
being three and he was like,look, don't tell your mom because I
was asked. I asked something aboutmy mom being in my mom's tummy.
He said, look, don't tellher. I told you. But you
know, I showed you that movieAnnie, and I wanted to tell you
that you were. You were kindof like Annie, and I was just
(09:46):
sitting there, you know, kindof like what he's like, Please don't
tell her. I told you,but she didn't have you. And I
can remember that's when you were littlein considered the front seat. So your
mom never told you that you were. She told me that she gave birth
to me. Wow, up untiland I asked her multiple times, you
(10:11):
know, like you know it,like my mom is a black Panamanian woman,
she's brown skin, she's chocolate,and my dad is about your complexion.
So something wasn't adding up to meas a kid, like why do
you look like that and your parentslook like that? But my mom would
say, oh, you just looklike your dad's side of family, which
(10:33):
I I mean, his family wasmy complexion. But it didn't make sense
that I came out of her,you know, and I didn't. She
didn't confess until I was ten,and that's because I was outside playing with
cousins and they all surrounded me screamingit at me. And I was kind
(10:56):
of like, okay, this happened, can you tell me the truth now?
And then she was like, okay, yeah, well I didn't tell
you because I just wanted to protectyou. But she really wasn't protecting me
if you think about it, becausepeople were looking at me crazy, like
how is that your mom? Youdon't look anything like nothing? Yeah?
(11:18):
Did you guys look alike at all? Or like did you anything? No?
No, like like she's five footthree, like even now, like
she's five foot three, I'm fiveeleven. I'm like, I'm like super
super super duper light. And she's, like I said, like she's the
(11:41):
color of like milk chocolate and shehas like type three type four hair.
We look when I say, nothingalike, nothing alike? And was her
husband was he also African American?Or yes he was, he was,
but his dad his dad was likemixed with Native so his dad was my
(12:01):
complexion. So that story could passlike, well, I guess with some
people, but it didn't really flywith kids like no, you know what,
Like my friends used to be like, no, something's not right,
Tiffany like no, so kind oflike describe growing up. How was your
life growing up with your adoptive parents. Well, they they my dad actually
(12:28):
left. He he my dad.My dad actually left because he decided that
he couldn't he couldn't live a lieanymore. And he came out and he
moved in with his uh, hispartner, Bob. And my mom was
(12:48):
so like furious and in denial.She kind of like packed us up and
we moved. We moved across thecountry from Michigan and California. And yeah,
shortly after for that, that's whenlike the physical and emotional abuse started.
And I think about it now,I think she was angry with me
(13:11):
because I was supposed to fix it. It was kind of she kind of
when she yelled at me, italmost sounded like if I didn't have you,
we'd probably still be together type thinghBut my dad was like, she's
the one that wanted you. Ihe and I mean I had to talk
with him about it when I wasolder, and he was like she was
(13:35):
very forceful, like this is gonnawork, this is and and then you
know, when I came into herlife, she she gave her life to
Jesus, so that that was veryheavily. She was very heavily religiously,
you know, abusive. That's sucha that's such a trend that I see
with adopted parents are very involved withwith religion and they use really abuse.
(14:01):
Yeah, she did. I mean, it was just it was we went
from like not going to church togoing to church and then like going to
like the churches where like, youknow, people would be talking in tongues
and stuff like that, and Ican remember being so confused, like and
everything you know that I did wasthe devil or or she'd be rubbing oil
(14:26):
all over my head, like yougot to remove you know, the sin.
And it was it was, itwas heavy, it was, it
was really heavy as a kid,and she was very controlling. And I'm
talking about controlling to the point whereI think, now that I look at
(14:48):
it and I have autistic children,I want to say that she might be
neuro divergent, and she was justnever diagnosed because she was obsessed with church
and the Bible and frame and everythingcan only be done one way, and
that's the only way that you cando it like you can imagine being you
(15:11):
know, ten or twelve years oldand brushing your teeth with hot water and
getting caught and like getting the breakspeed off of you type thing, you
know, and I want She controlledme with food too. She force sped
me like if I was full,she you're gonna eat until I say you're
(15:33):
done type thing. There there wouldbe times where I would go days without
a shower, and she's like,we have to save money, and I'm
like, mom, I you know, I think I need to take it.
Well, here's a washcloth, youknow, go washing the sink type
thing, like that's the kind ofcontrol much money are you saving? I
(15:54):
don't know? She would and thenyou know I have I have more Caucasian
type hair, so I can't gotwo weeks without washing my hair. But
she'd make me so you can imaginewhat my hair looked like. And then
she'd be like she'd put grease andstuff in it, and it was frizzy
(16:17):
when I was little, and sheput a relaxer in it and fried it
type thing. Oh yeah, goodness. And I can remember, see I
didn't see my dad very often becauseI want to say that she kept me
away from him. One she didn'twant him to find out about the abuse
because when he would call, she'dbe on the phone upstairs or of the
(16:37):
landline type thing, you know,hit the mute button and pick up the
phone and listen to make sure I'mnot saying anything. And when she did
send me, I always had likeyou better not say anything about this or
that, or when you get back, you're gonna get it type thing.
(17:00):
And when I didn't see him againuntil I was like eleven. From from
like six to eleven, I didn'tI didn't see him. He called every
once in a while. I wantto say he called more than she said
she and he said he did,but she wouldn't let me talk to him.
And when I was eleven, Iwent up there and he's just like
(17:23):
she packed you like rag, likeshe dressed me in rags, like it
was bad. And he's like,I send like and back in the nineties,
like eight hundred dollars a month inchild support that was a lot of
money he had to pay. He'slike, I'm sending eight hundred dollars a
month and you have on thrift storerags, like what is this? And
I can remember there was a bigargument on the phone, and he was
(17:47):
like, well, I'm just gonnakeep her. He said, I can't
send her back if you're not gonnatake care of her. He was like,
she came up here in rags.He was like, her hair was
dirty, she was dirty. Andshe's like, if you don't send her
back, you know, I'm goingto call the police. And I can
remember my dad saying to me like, look, if you go back down
(18:08):
there and she she's not letting youtake a bath, and she's force feeding
you. Because I told him everything, you know, he's like, you
make sure you call me. He'slike, call me, collect, call
your grandma, call somebody. Wedid not have a phone in our home
for two years and I was like, why don't we have a phone and
(18:33):
she's like, oh, we can'tafford one. We did not have a
phone, no phone. She madesure that she cut it all off.
And as a kid, you don'tthink about that type of stuff, you
don't. But I was like,she really had a phone, so I
couldn't tell him what was going on. So what ended up happening? Did
(18:56):
you? Did you stay with her? She put me off on a lot
of people. I would go staywith my grandma for a bit, and
then I went to go stay withmy cousin because she was a single mom
and she had four kids, andI ended up raising her kids for a
couple of years. And when Iwas fifteen, I went back home for
(19:19):
a little while and she was stillphysically, you know, hurting me.
And at that point I got tired. And by that time I was five
foot ten, so her five footthree. I was like, you know
what, I'm not scared of heranymore. This is gonna stop. And
I gripped her up and I waslike, this is this is gonna stop.
(19:44):
And she's like, oh no,you can't do this. I'm sending
you to your dad. She toldme that on a Friday. I was
on a plane on a Monday,and she did not tell my dad I
was coming until I was in theair and she he had no clue if
he was even going to be atthat airport because she never spoke to him.
She left a message on his answermachine, and my dad said if
(20:14):
he had to take off taking offof work that day for some reason,
he wouldn't have gotten the message andI would have just been up at the
airport. So he came to pickme up at the airport, and I
can remember he took me out liketo eat, and he was just like,
I don't think he thought I knewwhat gay was, you know what
I mean? And he was like, I gotta tell you something. He
(20:37):
was like, and I don't wantyou to flip out. He's like,
I have a partner and we livedtogether, and I'm just like, okay,
He's like, you understand. Iwas like, I under I understood
when I was six what was goingon. And he's like, okay,
we're cool. But you have toremember my mom was a highly religious woman
(21:03):
that engraved in me that being gayis wrong and you're gonna go to hell.
And so I'm having to have thisconversation with my dad, who I
could tell was trying not to laughat the same time, but like really
being concerned, like what did shedo to you type thing? You know?
And I lived with him and thenwhen I was sixteen, his partner
(21:26):
got hooked on drugs really bad andit was I mean, it was terrible,
and his he hit it for areally long time. But then my
dad started finding paraphernalia in the houseand who did who did the partner blame
it on He said it was me. She hangs out with the with the
(21:48):
kids in the neighborhood. She's theone you know smoking crack. Not me.
He planted it. Yeah, itwas crack. He planned it.
He planned He planted crack pipes andin crack in my room under my mattress.
My dad called the police on me. This was like maybe like two
(22:11):
weeks after my sixteenth birthday, andthe police came. The police came,
and they took me to a hospital, and they took me to a mental
health facility and they put me onall this medicine. My dad was like
making I don't know, he wasmaking up stuff, saying I see stuff,
(22:33):
and I guess he didn't want meanymore because his partner said I was
ruining their relationship or they didn't hedidn't want to have a kid or whatever.
So my dad said he didn't wantme back, and they were kind
of like, well, your optionsare, I guess in Pennsylvania back then,
(22:56):
you can sign or over to thestate, or you know you can
you can you know, take herhome or whatever. And he's like,
I'm not taking her home. Hekept me drugged up for about a year
and he administered my medicine. Idon't like to this day, Like he
apologized in twenty twenty one for allof that, but I still don't understand
(23:19):
why he did it. And thatpartner ended up, you know, he
ended up finding out my dad foundout through his partner's drug use, he
contracted HIV and that was a bigthing, you know, in the house
with my dad, Like, hewas angry about that, and so I
(23:40):
ended up, you know, leavinghome because it was kind of like he
didn't he didn't want me either,and he didn't care for the fact that
I was overweight either. So therewas a lot of He never physically abused
me, but he was very emotionallyabusive. So I was just out in
the world. Once I turned seventeen, that was That was pretty much it
(24:06):
my relationship with him. And didyou ever reach back out to your mom
after that time? I did,I did, I didn't, And throughout
the years, I have really tried. I have really tried. After my
birth mom passed away, she Ihad my daughter in twenty ten, and
(24:29):
my mom, actually my doctor momactually came to stay and help after my
first child and my second child,and after I had tatum. She came
for two weeks and she looked medead in the face and said, I
was good to you. And that'swhen the discussion happened, like did you
just when when she said that,my husband jumped up off the couch and
(24:53):
left out the house because she waslike, what are you talking about?
I was good to you. Andit was just like an overwhelming silence in
the room. And I was like, Mom, you don't remember any of
it. No, they never do, they never do. I said,
are you are you kidding me?Like you don't remember beating me up and
(25:15):
down the street, you don't rememberstrangling me over getting a dr report card,
Like you don't remember any of thatstuff. She used to lock me
in closets. I was like,you don't remember any of that and she's
like, well, you gotta letthe past be the past, because God
says, you know, you gottaforgive and move on. And I it's
(25:37):
just it's just pointless. It's pointlike it's kind of pointless with her because
she'll say, please forgive me,and then it'll be just right back to
the way that it was. Withinsix months. And with my dad,
he's got dementia, and he's ina nursing home right now and he can't.
He can't. He doesn't even likehe still thinks that I'm like seventeen,
(26:02):
like he The last time I seenhim was in twenty twenty one when
he had a stroke. I actuallydrove from Louisiana to Philadelphia with my kids
to make sure that he was okay. And that's when when I showed up.
That's when he had like a breakdownwith me and was like, I
can't believe, like, after everythingthat I did, like you would even
(26:23):
be here because because I don't evendeserve for you to be here. And
he was like, I'm really youknow, I'm really sorry that I did
all those things in he was likeand I he openly admits that he should
(26:44):
have done He should have done thingsdifferent. He should have stood his ground
and said, look, I don'twant kids, I don't need kids.
Peace, I'm out. He shouldhave left. He said that, he
said, you can't change the fact, you know, you can't change the
facts that that happened. But hedid ask for forgiveness, and he did
(27:04):
acknowledge all of the things that hedid to me growing up. My mother
still never will She never fully will. Yeah, it feels so good to
get, you know that at leastthat acknowledgment, you know, from an
adoptive parent or even a biological parent, you know, like just that full
accountability. Yeah, but my adoptedmom she'll never be She'll never be fully
(27:30):
accountable for anything that she did.And the last time we went to go
visit her was around the holidays,and she lives two hours from us,
and we don't see her but likemaybe once a year maybe. And both
of my biological parents are deceased now. I did not really have a relationship
(27:56):
with them either, because I thinkI with my a biological mom, I
think I was a reminder of aperiod of her life where she made a
lot of mistakes and made a lotof poor, poor judgments, and I
think I reminded her of it,so she couldn't she couldn't cope. And
(28:19):
with my dad, you know,his mental health never fully got better.
And I did find out via twentythree and me in twenty twenty one that
I had a sister that is twomonths older than me, and she was
in the foster care system too,So it's like he just had a bunch
(28:44):
of kids and he didn't take careof any of them, any of us.
I looked up his obituary online andnone of us were even in the
obituary, you know what I mean, Like he just made kids that he
didn't take care of. Now,he did man to keep four of them
together because my oldest brother, hewas in foster care and he got him
(29:07):
out. But my siblings' mother adoptedhim. Why while they were still married.
That's why she raised him. Buthe when he left, he never
took care of any of us.And we often wonder if there's more.
I mean, he definitely he definitelywas was that. He definitely he definitely
(29:34):
was definitely was that. Yeah,he definitely was that. And I'm not
saying he was a bad person becauseI did talk to him on the phone,
but I didn't really have a connectionwith him because it depended on whether
he was on his medicine or not, you know, and he can't help
that. He needed someone to takecare of him, like to have conservatorship,
(29:56):
and he didn't have anybody to dothat, so he kind of just
was out there taking it or nottaking it. I felt bad for him,
you know what. I felt badfor him because you can tell he
wanted to be, you know,a dad, and you know, he
tell me he loved me and stufflike that, but he just couldn't.
(30:17):
He couldn't be He couldn't be adad to anybody. He couldn't take care
of himself. So, yeah,mental health is really hard to see.
You know, parents struggle, especiallyas as a child, and you you
want to like say, why didI go through this? But then you
see them, You're like, well, you weren't stable, right, Well,
if we're going to take a quickwe're going to take a quick break.
(30:37):
When we come back, I wantto talk more about your life as
an adult and becoming a mother yourselfand how that relationship looks like with your
adoptive mother and your existing family.So we'll be right back. Okay,
Hey, hey, Hey, Thisis Amanda coul chair of the Black Mother's
March, and the Black Mother's Marchon the White House is a direct action
(30:59):
led by a coldish and of blackled organizations that are involved in the struggle
to rescue our children from the custodyof the state. We exist to expose
the systematic attack on black women andthe black family by the US government.
We understand that the government has beenable to perpetrate this terror under the guise
of protecting children and families, butthe facts are clear. The majority of
(31:22):
children taken by this system is dueto neglect, and neglect equals poverty.
Family police and agents are two timesmore likely to investigate black families than white
families. Black children make up fourteenpercent of the US population, but twenty
three percent of the population of usecaptured by this system. The Black Mother's
March is rooted in facts and history. March with us on May twelfth,
(31:47):
twenty twenty four to show that thepeople have the power to abolish this system
and dream of a new way forward. Welcome back to the show, y'all.
Make sure y'a are really going toSpotify and following, subscribing, leaving
us five star rating reviews on ApplePodcasts, and sharing this show. Also,
we're always looking for sponsors. We'realways looking for more support. If
(32:12):
you know anybody who wants to advertiseon the show, let me know big
or small businesses, and make surethat you are following me on social media
because we do have a lot ofevents coming up. Like I said at
the beginning of the show, wehave the Black Mother's March on May twelfth,
twenty twenty four, in Washington,d C. I hope to see
you there. If not, makesure you follow us on TikTok. You
know, I'm on livestream the wholething. So without further ado, I
(32:32):
want to get back to Tiffany's story. Tiffany, So after going through all
of that, because that was justso much, you know, like we
spoke a little bit during the break, but like there's just so much.
But it does feel good to haveat least one parent take accountability. How
has it been being a mother andnot really being able to have good guidance
(32:54):
from parents, either your birth parentsor your adopted parents. How has that
affect at you're parenting? You don'tlike, I don't want to get emotional.
I'm very blessed that I had likean amazing grandmam, you know,
(33:21):
so I got a chance to seewhat what you know, love was like.
But a lot of my parenting camefrom college to like and being a
nanny and asking, you know,friends. My mom had had sisters.
Unfortunately, the one that that Iwas closest to she passed away, and
(33:45):
she does have another sister that Iyou know that I can you know,
confide in about parenting. But forthe most part, it's a lot of
research and in internet searches. Mymother wouldn't be able to give anybody parents
(34:06):
and advice I would. I wouldnever, I would never go to her
for that because she I have threeneurodivergent children, and I don't even like,
I think to myself, they shouldbe so happy that I'm their mother
(34:27):
and not my mother, because thiswould not be going down this way.
And I do admit that sometimes Iovercompensate with my kids and I let them
get away with a lot more thanthey should because I got away with nothing
at all. And I make alot of mistakes, just like I think
(34:49):
every mother makes mistakes, but it'sit's just, you know, learning from
them and trying to be better thanmy adopted mother was. And I feel
like I've already done that, andI do it every day because they're you
know, they're first. I wasnever first for her. And you said
(35:23):
that the last time you saw herwas a few years ago. So does
she have any type of relationship withyour children? I saw her last.
I saw her last July. Notreally. She is my two, my
fourteen year old and my thirteen yearold. She did at one point kind
(35:43):
of have a relationship with them,and you know, teenagers are curious,
and it was kind of like,Mom, why don't you and Nana like
go to lunch and why don't youand Nana like talk on the phone,
And how comes she never liked sendsyou birthday presents and stuff like that you
(36:06):
send her stuff. And it waskind of like, do a lot of
my kids and say, oh,that's just And I mean, I was
honest with them about part of mychildhood, like I couldn't get too graphic,
but they were just kind of like, that's weird. And she was
also talking crap about me to them, and it started adding up in their
head like yo, you're talking aboutmy mom, like like we're not going
(36:30):
over there, and they kind ofjust stopped asking. My younger kids don't
really know her, Like they thinkher name is Nana, I think,
but I don't think that they knowthat that's their grandmam. I have an
older friend that comes over here,Like I think they think that's their grandmam
(36:52):
because they call her grammy. Butlike I told my mom, Nana is
just a title, Like you're notreally a grandmother to them like you baked,
not a cookie, you've knit it, not a blanket, like you
see, you've done nothing with them, and sending them a baby doll or
(37:14):
a puzzle you know once a year, or a ten dollar Chick fil a
card like that really doesn't Where areyou gonna get a chick fl for ten
dollars? First of all, no, she literally sent my kids a t
car. You can't. You can'teven get a full meal for ten dollars.
(37:34):
And I was like ten dollars,Like okay, Like I guess I'm
paying for the other half, forthe other half of the happy meal.
But yeah, I mean, shedoesn't. We did visit our We did
try to visit her back, Iguess in December, but when we went
up, she said she had togo to a funeral. I remember getting
(37:57):
on your social media. Yeah,And I just kind of like, so
you want to go see a deadperson versus your daughter and your living grandkids,
that's wonderful. And my teenagers werelike, yeah, we're kind of
done with her at this point.I can't my fourteen ye I was like,
I can't be fake with her anymorebecause I mean that really hurt him.
(38:21):
He hadn't seen her. He hadn'tseen her in a while because he
was away this past summer and hewas he wanted to see her, but
he was like, she doesn't careabout us. She cared about us,
she'd be making her way, youknow, And we don't stay with her,
like when we when we visit Atlanta, we're not invited to stay with
(38:42):
her. You can't touch anything inher house. You can't you can't talk,
you can't laugh. You just haveto kind of sit there. And
she still has a TV from whenI was a kid with the knobs turning,
so the kids don't really stop likegoing on over there to say,
I'm not exaggerating. She has toturning not television. I don't even know
(39:06):
how it plays. That is insane. That is absolutely insane. So do
you talk to any other members ofyour adoptive family, like and you said
you mentioned a couple of aunts anduncles that you're really closed to. Most
of my well, the aunt thatI was close who passed away, my
(39:29):
cousin. She unfortunately passed away inDecember twenty twenty one. And there's only
one aunt that I speak to.But other than that, really nobody because
My adoptive parents were kind of alienatedfrom their family, so they were never
(39:50):
really active. My mom was kindof like a hermit. She stayed away
from everybody all the time. Andmy dad, up until maybe until I
came up, he was like notaround his family at all. He would
go home and visit on occasion,but nobody ever visited him type of thing.
But I was never really around theirfamily, Like I mean, I
(40:15):
knew who those people were, butI really don't know them. Yeah,
And a lot of people find thatweird, like you don't have any family.
No, not really. I dohave biological siblings. I actually have
quite a few, but I'm notclose with them either. But I didn't
meet them until I was like twentythree and I lived, you know,
(40:37):
far away, so I was makingefforts to go visit them, but it
was never vice versa. And eventuallyyou get kind of tired of that,
you know what I mean, Likewhy I always have to be the one
to come and visit Why is noone coming to visit me? Yeah,
I don't think I'm thankful. Likemy brother. I told my brother that
(40:58):
like two years ago, three orago, and now he's made an effort
because I always go home like onceor twice a year, and now he's
been making an effort to come formy birthday and for Christmas, and it's
been really nice to just to havethat family bond, you know, and
it takes effort for everyone, youknow. Yeah, well know my one
sister, she was like really honestwith me about it. She's just like,
(41:21):
it's not that I don't like hewas not out the She's like,
but I didn't grow up with you, Like I don't know you and I've
never spent any time with you,so I don't know how to be with
you. And she grew up withher with her Caucasian side, so she
doesn't know anything about being you know, a millenated person, a millenated person,
(41:43):
you know what I mean. Likeshe kind of like just lives in
suburbia, Like we have nothing,like we literally have nothing in common at
all. So d your blood,Yeah, I mean that that's it.
And I mean she does say himon Facebook Messenger every once in a while
(42:05):
and ask how the kids are doing. And I can't be mad at her
from not being interested. She hada lot of trauma in her life too.
You know, my dad that himclose to home. That hits so
close to home because like I'm goingto go visit my adoptive brothers, my
adoptive brother next month, and Ihaven't seen him since since I was four
fifteen, since like his dad andhis stepmom that was my adoptive mom.
(42:30):
You know, that whole thing wentdown and I kind of had to like
he's always been there, like reachingout, He's always told me, like
he's supported me. He's always he'she's come on my podcast before and advocated
on my behalf and like said,I know you're telling the truth. Grow
I was there, but it's beenso hard building a relationship with a person
(42:50):
that I experienced so much trauma fromin that same circle, right yeah,
And I want to like see myknee and to hear like my niece legally
that is my niece, that ismy brother. Like I talk about that
every single day, but it justfeels so weird. But I went through
the same thing with my biological familybecause my brother had to sit both of
(43:10):
my brothers had to sit down withme, and they said, Carlos sitting
Birthday gifts and sending Christmas gifts isnot enough, Like we know how it
feels not to have you know,how it feels not to have family?
Why aren't you here for your niecesand nephews? And I had to tell
them, I said, because Idon't know how to be there. I
don't I don't know how to havea niece or nephew. And I didn't
(43:31):
get that right, especially with y'all, and they and they were just really
hard. They said, you know, that's not an excuse, and that
doesn't mean that we can't all learntogether, you know, and that's what
we're doing now. But I candefinitely understand what you just described about,
just like what your sister just described, like about being there, but just
kind of like not knowing, youknow, how to navigate those she doesn't
(43:54):
know. She doesn't know. AndI'm not upset with her because she's honest
about it. You know. Iwas when when I first came into the
family, you know, buying allthe nieces and nephews and stuff like that.
And then I started having kids andit was not reciprocated. Nobody ever
came to a baby shower, noone ever came to a birth. When
(44:15):
I bought my first house, noone came to visit. None of that
stuff. Nobody came to my wedding. Nothing, And it was just kind
of like, yeah, that's notworking for me, Like like you're not
gonna treat me exactly how my adoptiveparents treated me, Like like I like,
(44:35):
you can give me all you wantand I'm gonna take, but I'm
not giving you anything back. Soit was just kind of like, this
is just something that I that Ihave to deal with and I can't be
I'm not upset that my parents didn'tadopt more kids, because that would have
just been a bunch of us traumatized, you know, a bunch of us,
(44:57):
you know what I mean, justlike a bunch of us stuff uck,
you know, with them for parents. So I mean, I'm not
upset that I didn't have any LikeI have a lot of good friends that
I call my sisters. I've mademy own family, my kids, my
kids like they don't they don't seethem as not like their family, you
(45:24):
know what I mean. Like ifthey say you know my aunt or my
uncle, they know it's not theirblood relative. They said, for a
minute, they were kind of confusedbecause all of my girlfriends are either Puerto
Rican or mixed race, and sothey really thought that those were really my
sisters. And one day I waslike, no, no, that's not
(45:45):
your blood relative. They're like,oh man, like we really thought,
because they treat them that way.My girlfriend, my girlfriend Jamie, she
makes sure that she sends all fiveof my kids every birthday. She never
she drove twelve hours to come toa baby shower for two hours to turn
(46:06):
around and have to go back homefor work the next day. That's afraid.
That's my definition of family. That'ssomebody that their loves and cares about
us. But bio adopted, Ijust don't. Everybody is gone, so
(46:29):
it's just me and the kids.They have each other. There's a lot
of them, that's for sure.I'm glad that your kids have each other.
And I want to thank you forsharing your lived experience and being raw
and vulnerable and letting people know likeadoptive parents sometimes need to make the best
(46:51):
decision, which is to not havechildren. And like you said, God
said no at first, like literally, if you want to believe in God,
That's why I understand for such areligious person, why are you not
listening to God? He said no, He said, you can't have kids,
right, and you go out thereand adopt and it's just absolutely astounding.
But Tiff, before we wrap up, I want to ask you the
(47:14):
question that I ask every single guest, and that is, what's one piece
of advice you would give to anotherchild growing through what you went through?
What piece of lived experience would yougive them an advice to make it a
little bit easier for them? Ohgoodness, You can eventually choose your family.
(47:36):
You can make your own family.You're not always going to be stuck
with the people that are making yourlife, you know, feel miserable.
You're gonna grow up. You're gonnameet people that love you more than they
did or could, and you'll makeyour own family and it'll be totally different
(47:57):
because you'll have control over who youchoose to be around and who you choose
to take advice from and live with. I think that's the advice that I
would give them. I love that. I love that well. Thank you
so much, Tiff, and listeners, please be sure to go check out
(48:17):
Tiff. I will have your socialmedia attacked, y'all, like I love
her content even just like your stories. And you know when you're just when
you're talking about crazy things that likepop up. It's just it's so interesting
and you just have so much light, and I hope that you continue to
shine it and thank you for shiningit with me on my platform here on
(48:37):
the War to the State podcast.So light shiners, like we say every
week, always shine your light becauseyou never know who you might inspire or
guide with your light. And untilnext week, keep shining, y'alls. Fine out
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