All white uniforms covered in dirt | Seahawks bury Saints 44-13

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Ladies and gentlemen, if you're still sober after that game,
let me tell you something. You have what they call
intestinal fortitude. But let me tell you who doesn't. Man
are New Orleans Saints. Yeah, this is gonna be a
sad recap. It's gonna be a tough one, and I'm
gonna admit I've got some hot takes, not because I
wanting to be hot takey, but when you even look
at the head coaches who have started off seasons their

(00:22):
first year, including Dennis Allen and Sean Payton, you can't
name a game where they got absolutely embarrassed like today
didn't happen. They might have lost games. And I'm not
sitting here saying Dia is a great coach. You off
heerd me plenty of times, say no, but today was embarrassing.
And as always, elliots, it's good to see you.

Speaker 2 (00:44):
Likewise, it wasn't good to watch that trash hass game,
though I wouldn't it normally.

Speaker 1 (00:49):
I'll leave these knowing this team's in the rebuild. I'll
leave it and go, you know what, maybe this and that. No,
I don't have anything. I don't have many positives to
say about this game. You know honestly, who's probably most
consistent player. Shout out to Kendre Miller and Brandon Cooks. Like,
if I just got a name, two people, shout to
Brandon Cooks and Kendrey Miller. AK didn't have a great game.

(01:09):
I don't really blame things on Ak. The offensive line
obviously didn't have Huaga, you didn't have riding starting, you
didn't have Trevor Penning ready to slide into anything. It's
obviously the offensive line coming to very hobbled problematic, But
that is what it is, you know, the biggest thing.
And I think coach Phield Galiano is a good coach.
I do believe he deserves the opportunity to be a

(01:30):
special teams coordinator. He's gotten to sit under a lot
of great guys. But you've now got three games in
a row, Blake Groupie, missing field goals, you let a
punt return go, you let a kick return go sixty yards. Like,
It's not like I'm just trying to pick on one
person though, because it's everything it does. Defense, no pressure.
I mean, you know who gave you the most pressure
today on defense? Brian Burse, who we've talked about being

(01:52):
maybe should even be a three down starter in this
game right now? He led your team in pressures today
like every body is getting a big l even though
they look great. Like I know, I've talked about the
khaki uniforms, not liking it, but the white on white
with the white hats look clean. They looked real good
as they got beat. I'll tell you that, man, what

(02:14):
was this? Hell?

Speaker 2 (02:16):
Yeah, you wasn't gonna tell me I had a piece
of fuzz right there where you was gonna let me
just sit in the camera with a piece of fuzz.

Speaker 1 (02:23):
I didn't, but you just didn't say nothing. Why you
always do that? Ain't cause I ain't laughing, all right.
To know you is to get to know you. And
I know you ain't laughing, but nobody.

Speaker 3 (02:38):
Laughing because you can visually see that.

Speaker 1 (02:43):
Oh man, uh yeah, I agree with Kendall. Horrible game.
Horrible game. I truly everybody deserves some fault. Everybody. And
by the way, Clint Kobiac now looking so bad as
an o C right now his offense two and one.

(03:04):
So with Sam Donald at QB.

Speaker 3 (03:12):
Donald's also a former first round.

Speaker 2 (03:14):
Highly drafted quarterback, sure exceedingly amounts of talent. Maybe he
was just drafted into a bad situationation and it Yeah,
I mean that could be fair.

Speaker 1 (03:25):
But at the same time, like if you had asked
every Saints fan right now, would you rather have Spencer
Rattler or Sam Donald? Pretty universal most people would have
chosen Spencer Rattler. So I mean Sam Donald at this
point in his career has definitely looked at negatively, even
with the first round backing. So he did make some
some throws today, though, I will say that about Donald.
He made some throws.

Speaker 2 (03:47):
Yeah, I mean we talked about it, Like I said,
if you saw the same issues you saw in the first.

Speaker 1 (03:53):
Two games, yeah, let's talk about that. I mean it
was the same team.

Speaker 2 (03:58):
So I guess the eery thing about it, or at
least the expected thing about it, is it's the same
team we've been watching the first two weeks, the same
exact team. They were away, which you know leads to
things being a little bit more unfavorable, and then the
opposing team was far better, and so the results looked

(04:20):
far worse because of that. But it was the exact
same stuff we've been seeing. The lack of pressure, the penalties,
the inability to get anything going, the lack of explosive plays,
the falling behind early, like the misfield goal like it was.

Speaker 3 (04:38):
It was the same things we've been seeing, just played
a better team and.

Speaker 1 (04:42):
They were away.

Speaker 2 (04:43):
So I don't know if that I wonder if that's
something you can take solace from in that it wasn't
like they were worse.

Speaker 1 (04:52):
If it wasn't, if it wasn't forty four to thirteen,
I might be with you. But I mean, heck, just
two weeks ago, you were and our saying hey, this
this could be a winnable game in Seattle, like it
could be right. We weren't saying they were going to win,
but we were saying, hey, this is a winnable games.

Speaker 3 (05:09):
Did I say that?

Speaker 1 (05:10):
Yeah, we talked about them going to and too. We
said they couldn't win against the Bills, but they had
a shot against Seattle. But forty four to thirteen is
a loss. Is not a shot, that's just a drubbing. Again,
neither of us were picking them to win, but we
I don't think either of us expected a blowout because
Seattle took their foot off the gas and still scored
forty four points.

Speaker 2 (05:32):
Yeah, I probably was being delirious when I when I
said that Initially, I don't think I ever saw them
going to Seattle and winning. I always thought the first two,
the first opportunities for them to win were in the
Dome at home again the forty nine Ers and the Cardinals.
You can maybe like they're like, oh, you know, they
played two tight games. If they can fix what their

(05:52):
issues are, maybe they have a chance to go to
Seattle and do an upset. But I don't think I
ever expected them to. I guess this game, I was like,
you know, I guess it's for me.

Speaker 1 (06:02):
It's just seeing the level of the problems magnified in
this game, like for example, and for anybody that wants
to come comment afterwards, because it seemed to happen every week.
I've given Spencer Ratler mad props for two weeks. This
game was Spencer ratl You look, It's the truth. Spencer
Ratler's accuracy issues and ball placement issues were present from
drive one throughout the end of the game. His best

(06:23):
throat did not present. His best throw was the stall
the backup tight end in the end zone. That was
his best throw, but the pick was very bad.

Speaker 2 (06:35):
Him trying to make a play the pick. Listen, the
pick was a desperation. He from a team that is
watching this game go down to dream sure, and he's
absolutely just trying to force a play. It was the
worst play he's made, but it's understandable within the context
of the entire game.

Speaker 3 (06:52):
He was trying to make a play.

Speaker 1 (06:53):
If it was a one off. Sure the second quarter,
when he tried to thread the needle through four defenders
stuff like that. I mean, if you rest, it doesn't
depend though, because if he has the ball placement on ball,
like if he's coming into the game hot and he's
feeling it and he's actually got great ball placement, I
don't typically mind it. But from the very jump he

(07:14):
had bad ball placement this game, not just the Ak
miss in the first drive, but even the past before that.
Now you and I agree, we say if it hits
the hands, you should catch it. But that pass with
Juwan Johnson was, as we've talked about before, well over
his head. He had to go up try to get it.
He should still should have caught it, in my opinion,
because it touched your hands, but through the hands that's out.
He had a bad day with ball placement, and then

(07:36):
the running game just wasn't there to help him out
and we saw the Spencer Rattler that we worried about seeing.
And to be clear, this is everybody. We can call
out every name on this offensive defense for disappointing. I'm
disappointing in Carl Grandison, who I just talked about being
the best player on defense. Pete Warner looked like a
better player today. Grandison got nothing in terms of pressure.

(07:57):
Has some good edge plays, but nothing in terms of
pressure when you needed pressure. You know, it's this was rough,
But I think the biggest one you talked about this
being scenes. We've already seen eleven penalties, five of them
in the first quarter, so I guess technically they cleaned
it up. For those keeping track, This brings the sayings
up to thirty four, which at the time of this
recording is the third worst number in the entire NFL,

(08:19):
which I guess makes sense because they're oh and three.

Speaker 2 (08:23):
Yeah, planning a weight game, to me, magnified all of
the issues from the first two games. Yeah, it just
put it it just it expanded it a lot more.

Speaker 1 (08:32):
Listen.

Speaker 2 (08:32):
The only solace I think that they can take from
this is there are two things here, and I talked
about it at the beginning of the season.

Speaker 1 (08:38):
Number one, you.

Speaker 2 (08:39):
Haven't played the division game yet, so even if you
lose the first four games, you can still potentially win
your division based on a few things.

Speaker 1 (08:47):
Know that real quick. Just because you mentioned division, did
you see Panthers Falcons?

Speaker 3 (08:53):
I wouldn't watch that crash even if I was forced to.

Speaker 1 (08:56):
Well, just to own your point, the Panthers beat the
Falcons thirty to zip blank them, the Panthers who everybody's
talking about potentially going completely defeated. So the division trash
is what I'm saying, the division trash.

Speaker 2 (09:10):
I mean, I listen, I look at division games. When
I see two division opponents play each other, I always
take whatever the outcome is with a grain of salt,
because they these teams draft to beat each other, so
you're usual. I always say division games either go one
of two ways. Either they're extremely close or they look
like a blowout. So I always take like, if I

(09:30):
see an opponent we're getting ready to play and I
see they had a tough division game the week before,
and everybody's like, oh, we have an opportunity to be
I really kind of throw out that division game.

Speaker 3 (09:40):
Because the setup is such as it is.

Speaker 2 (09:44):
As much as they they're losing, I think they're finding
out what the hell isn't working. That's also something that
they can take from these games. It is very much
exposing what is wrong, what hasn't worked to this point,
what they thought was gonna work to this point, and

(10:05):
you get to see it and now you can kind
of adjust from it, which I think the entire month
of September is going to expose that. I think they
will have an opportunity to build on that maybe in October,
But I September was gonna be rough once they lost
the two games anyway. I mean, Buffalo is probably gonna
destroy us. But October you have a chance to just

(10:26):
completely start fresh, so to speak. And that's kind of
the only solace. But everything else, man, it's kind of crumbling.
The special teams crumble, the penalties again, very very rough.
It's an away game. You can expect the crowd to
kind of have that issue. Here's what I'm gonna say.
This is what I'm saying what I've always said a a.

Speaker 3 (10:48):
Spencer Rattler fan.

Speaker 2 (10:50):
When I looked at him in that quarterback class, I
thought he was the best play action quarterback that I saw,
and I thought that he was a steal to get
in the fifth round. However, despite the fact that I
understand the circumstances from last year were not built for
him to succeed. I do recall one game in particular

(11:16):
where Ratler comes in and it's versus the I don't
want to say that it's the Commanders, it's versus the Commanders.
Ratler goes down and we have the opportunity to win
the game, and we get the score. It's the two
point conversion. We cannot make the play. Now in the
grand scheme of things, the inability to make that play

(11:39):
based on everything that was going on around him. It's
not necessarily his fault, right, but the fact that he got.

Speaker 3 (11:47):
Us there was wonderful.

Speaker 2 (11:49):
Here's what's going to push Shuck into the conversation at
some point until and I can't say until I think
in that particular game it exposed that Ratler is a
quarterback you can win with, not because of and because

(12:10):
Schuck is an unknown. At some point you have to
see if he's a quarterback that you can win because of.
And that's what's gonna push him to the forefront at
some point. I don't know when it's going to.

Speaker 1 (12:24):
Happen because I wouldn't make that swat now, I mean
I would. I would give Ratler a lot more snaps
before I made that swap. But I get where you're going.

Speaker 3 (12:33):
It's it's it's not an indictment on Rally.

Speaker 2 (12:35):
It's not me suggesting that he should be pulled or
that they should be mentioning them.

Speaker 3 (12:40):
They should be focusing on the development of both.

Speaker 2 (12:43):
However, it is in my opinion, despite me being a
Ratler fan, and it goes back.

Speaker 3 (12:49):
To his college. Some quarterbacks you just see it.

Speaker 2 (12:53):
They have it doesn't it doesn't matter what level they're
playing at.

Speaker 3 (12:56):
You just see it.

Speaker 2 (12:58):
But I do not think that here a quarterback that
you win because of I do not think that he's
a quarterback that can take a roster that is below
average and.

Speaker 3 (13:09):
Raise the height of that roster like Drew Brees did
twenty fourteen to twenty sixteen. Those were terrible rosters.

Speaker 2 (13:17):
Yeah, with any other quarterback and any other head coach,
those are three and like fourteen, three and fifteen rosters easily,
and you were still able to squeeze three consecutives, seven
and nine until you get the big twenty seventeen draft
to go along with the twenty sixteen draft where you
had Rankins and Michael Thomas and you.

Speaker 3 (13:34):
Get a couple of hits there.

Speaker 2 (13:36):
But prior to that, there is no reason that they
should have won seven games. But that was because of
the type of quarterback that Drew Brees was. I do
not think that Ratler is that quarterback. I don't know
if Shuck is that quarterback, but at some point they're
gonna have to find out.

Speaker 1 (13:52):
It's a fair point. Like I said, I'm definitely not
ready to move from Ratler at the moment. And I've
said very loudly that I hate win losses being attributed
to quarterbacks. I think that's silly. But I won't deny
that there are people in media in the NFL who
care about QB record help. Bill Parcells cared about it,
you know, wrote about it, Sean Payton. Now, is this

(14:14):
thing like we've seen that before. If people are gonna
look at Ratler being oh to nine and they're going
to judge based off that, and that will influence decisions,
and that will, whether I like it or not, that's
going to be a thing. So Rattler does have to
play with a sense of urgency to make sure that
the opportunity for shuck is it sooner rather than later.

(14:34):
He's got to push it off so that he can develop.
Loved what we saw the first two weeks in terms
of his development, but we had a couple of questions.
I want to grab her because it's pertinent to what
we're talking about. Number one from Raheem. Also, I see
your question, Bazil. We'll talk quarterbacks drafting next year, but
only three weeks in. Man, it's a little bit early.
But I do agree with you that Spencer Ratler's accuracy
can be wild. Me and Elias have talked about that.

(14:55):
Sometimes he's gonna throw a beam, sometimes he's just gonna
really overthrow a lot, especially when it comes to how
he operates his lower body mechanics. He uses too much
upper body, which causes passes to sail, and that leads
to problems. But Raheem did say, how would you or
Elius fix the issues with the passing game with the
offense starting now? And I'd say a big thing. And

(15:15):
like I said, this isn't a diamond on Ratler, although
Ratler has been this guy since he started playing. They
have got to play pushing the ball more what I
mean by that Today stat wise, Rattler threw twenty eight
completions for only two hundred and eighteen yards. That's five
point six an attempt. Chris Olave, who is a four
to three speed demon better set to be a flanker,

(15:35):
but irregardless, averaged five point seven yards for his catches
and had ten receptions. Like they switched the main targeting
to him versus Johnson, but all of it was short
intermediate throws for the most part. Right, if they're going
to start having better success with this offense, it's got
to stop operating basically everything is seven yards, eight yards

(15:56):
or shorter, whether it's the running game, the screen game,
the short passing game. We've talked about pushing deep, and
I still think that should happen, but the entire offense
is it's almost like they're playing condensed. They've got to
spread more. They'll show spread looks, but everything comes back
to within, like this bubble. They've got to bust out
of that bubble. That's the big one for me. And
whether that is Rattler doing it at some point, Shuck

(16:18):
doing a brand new quarterback, not name Manning, maybe name Manning, whatever,
that's a big thing. This offense is stuck inside of
a little bubble and they've got to burst out of it.

Speaker 3 (16:27):
Here's my question to you before I even touch on it.

Speaker 1 (16:30):
Yeah, is this.

Speaker 2 (16:32):
More of Rattler not taking the shots or is it
more of killing more not calling shot play?

Speaker 1 (16:42):
So a lot of Rattler's looks are you in my
opinion and other people who watch Saints tape for the
past two games. Obviously, I've not seen the all twenty
two for this set, so I don't know exactly what
the pass calls were in terms of seeing how many
or five you know, full field reads versus half field
stuff like that. But a lot of Rattlers run so

(17:06):
far have been pretty simple in terms of, hey, this
is gonna be your half field focus. If it's not
there by time, roll out, make a run whatever. And
he tends to find what his target is and hit
the first look that tends to be his read. He
can progress. I'm not saying he doesn't. There's gonna be
that person in the comment says, oh, he's greatly improved
in you know, progressing reads. Whatever. That doesn't seem to

(17:28):
happen with him a lot. And if his guy is
close if that is a lot of a he's going
to throw the ball to him if that's the read
and he thinks he can make it, even if it's
not the best option on the field that's been drawn up.
That also could just be him being a young quarterback
who doesn't even have a year of NFL experience yet,
because in college, look, let me play Devil's Advocate for

(17:50):
a second. I get where you're coming from, but in
college people can play more in terms of you can
you make a tight throw, but you trust your guy
to be that elite guy who's just gonna break it right.
Like it's easier in college to have that player who's
on your team who you just know is significantly better
than the opposing team. But the NFL is such a
culture shock, and you could actually see it today with
Rashiz shahat serious question for the chat and you is

(18:12):
Rashisha Heat as fast as he was before all the injuries,
because it's tough to imagine Rashisha Heat getting run down
on punk returns, but that happened today And I'm not
saying that he's not a good player, but that shows
the NFL, like even if you fell back two percent
everybody else is caught up with you. There's no big
gaps anymore, and Rattler could be used to Okay, if
I just get it to my star guy, he'll make

(18:33):
a play. In the NFL, it's a hell of a
lot harder to just make a play.

Speaker 2 (18:38):
I guess the point that I was putting out is
I think that's who he is. Got in my notes
when I scouted his college games put he needs a
number one receiver because when things are tight, when things
are close, when everything is muddy, he's going to throw
it to his guy. That's that's who he's been, That's
who he is. So the fact that you're telling me

(18:59):
that that hasn't grown about him in two years, it
confirms that, yes, you he has to have a dominant
receiver on his team and they'll they'll make wonderful music
together if that receiver is a dominant receiver. If you
put Ratler with Michael Thomas twenty twenty Michael Thomas, twenty

(19:22):
nineteen Michael Thomas, they probably moved the ball up and
down the field just because he has someone that he
can throw to and someone that can save his off
target throws, someone that can.

Speaker 3 (19:34):
Make music with his terrible chords, so.

Speaker 2 (19:40):
I you know, plenty of people pointed out I saw it,
or at least I felt it during preseason. I felt
like there were two different offenses based on what quarterback
was in. It seemed like with Ratler everything was quick
shot kind of just to the point. It seemed like

(20:02):
when Shuck was in the game, it felt a little
bit more aggressive. I don't know if that is the
play caller, which is why I asks. I don't know
if that's the play caller calling different plays, or if
it's the quarterback.

Speaker 3 (20:15):
Making different reads.

Speaker 2 (20:18):
And it's an arguable point, or it's something to at
least question, because it just seems like with Ratler, I
don't feel like the way that Kellen Moore wants his
offense to run, I don't think it suits Ratler to
a degree like we didn't. And it's obviously you know,

(20:39):
it's loud, so you can't run as much.

Speaker 3 (20:41):
Hurry up. But there were things that Ratler did that.

Speaker 2 (20:47):
Accentuated who he was and could have helped, and then
it seemed like they did not want to do it
in the next few games. It's like Kellen Moore wants
to be a let's call it fifty five forty five
past heavy offense.

Speaker 3 (21:04):
Will will argue maybe sixty forty.

Speaker 1 (21:06):
It's like he.

Speaker 2 (21:07):
Wants to be sixty forty when he should probably be
closer to like fifty five forty five or a fifty
to fifty or maybe even a run balanced offense and
then run the play action off of that. I do
not feel like we're using Kamara really well either. I

(21:27):
think Camara has been relegated to a bell kyle back,
which he's never been. You just turn around, hand the
ball off to him, turn around and hand the ball
off to him. I do not like, why are we
drawing up plays for Juwan and not drawing up plays
for Alvin to be used as the short of the
intermediate receipt not even intermediate, but I almost like the

(21:48):
safety valve.

Speaker 3 (21:49):
It's like I'm seeing.

Speaker 2 (21:50):
Clear play designs for that are designed for Juwan Johnson
to get him the ball, and then I'm kind of
just seeing like Alvin is like here, catch this swing
and go something happened, Like where's the angle routes?

Speaker 1 (22:02):
Where's just as gonna say, like.

Speaker 2 (22:05):
On a on a linebacker and having him run like
a choice route, Like where are these things for him?

Speaker 1 (22:12):
Yeah, I agree, because the Texas concept was huge with him.
These love that lining him up in the slot. I
don't have numbers in front of me, but he's not
lined up in the slot a lot. And I'd even
go as far as I say, when it comes to
just being honest, I don't think three games in we
can really judge more or know all of where he's at.
But I did expect more kind of Philly. I did

(22:33):
expect coming in with a guy like Rattler, more RPO looks,
more jet sweep looks, you know, more of those touch
pass looks. I expected a lot more movement, and I
specifically expected more getting Rattler outside, whether that was running
more RPOs and be more consistent with that, and especially
given the state of the offensive line, I would want

(22:53):
to try to rely in trust on that movement instead
of a place where you know that right now penetration
in both sides of b gaps are just almost guaranteed.
Right now, you know there's that internal pressure. Where are
more of those tass sweeps, Where are more of those
type of plays to get ak in space, which we
talked about forever, not treat him as a bell cow
and then actually get rattler where he tends to be

(23:14):
more successful, which is more of the scramble drill, get
him outside roll he either runs or he throws a
quick pass. And if you're going to run these more
simplistic reads, which seems to be the current case for him,
I just feel like he's being stymied into Hey, you're
going to succeed as a pocket passer or you're not.
And I expected more of a Hurtz look, and maybe
some of it's on Spencer, some of it's own more.

(23:35):
But either way, that's a part of why of this
offense is a little stale. And we know who Ak is.
That's why I'm not harping on the run game too much.
When you're missing essentially three offensive linemen, it's tough. But yeah,
it's whatever direction that's going. I mean, you can't average
four yards a gain and have success as an offense.
It doesn't matter who's a quarterback. I have not.

Speaker 2 (24:02):
I've grown. I've grown to like Kellen Moore as a
choice for head coach. However, I recall when doing the
research and looking at his offense and trying to figure
out what a kind of a feel was for his offense,
I recall looking at some of the Philly stuff and

(24:22):
I remember a lot of it being like short, maybe intermediate,
but not a very explosive offense. And I remember asking myself,
does this feel like a New Orleans Saints offense? YEP,
And my answer was no.

Speaker 3 (24:38):
I was very high on Mike Cafka.

Speaker 2 (24:42):
Mike Cafka, who is who I wanted for the head
coach before. I was like, Okay, I see where they're
where they're going with Kellen Moore, I get the direction.
I actually wanted Mike Cafker because he talked about being
aggressive and using formations, and I didn't see that in
Kelly Moore's offensive DNA when I looked at him, I

(25:03):
just didn't see it. And so it's interesting to see
that they're consistently playing that way. It doesn't seem like
he wants to be an attacking downfield what New Orleans
is used to. It seems more methodical, It seems more
you know, and that can work. It just doesn't feel
like New Orleans now coaches are just they they figure

(25:25):
out what they are.

Speaker 1 (25:26):
So this is not only a challenge.

Speaker 2 (25:27):
For the team, but it's also a challenge for Kellen Moore.
To kind of adjust and start to kind of It's like, Yo,
if you gonna call plays for Spencer Ratler like he's
Tyler Shuck, then you might as well just put goddamn
Tyler Shuck in a game.

Speaker 1 (25:43):
Just I mean, you might as well go.

Speaker 2 (25:45):
If that's the quarterback you feel more comfortable calling plays
for at this point, then you may need to pivot
to that, or you should adapt and play with what
you have or call plays design based on what you have,
which arguably flips.

Speaker 1 (26:02):
Oute of the defense just where I was gonna go,
we gotta we.

Speaker 2 (26:07):
Gotta flip to the defense because it's like, listen, there's
things that are that are obviously not working, and you
boy is like he's the high IQ genius that's so
high IQ that he does dumb.

Speaker 1 (26:23):
Things look like it. I want to hit one comment
just on your more what he's used to doing. One
big difference between Philly and why I feel they can
be methodical is they live by one of my favorite
football idioms, you win the war in the trenches. Philly
has had elite olon and front seven slash D line

(26:44):
play for about a decade now, and it stayed that way.
You don't see Philly having blowout games. Right, the defense
keeps it close and they consistently have success. But a
huge difference here is even just how Staley is running
a defense compared to what Kellen was used to with Philly,
or even when Kellimore was used to things in Dallas.

(27:05):
I'm gonna ch Chicago through two games, two games, ladies
and gentlemen, because Philly's numbers aren't even updated yet. Philly
had blitzed forty nine, I'm sorry, thirty nine times this year,
so let's just say they're averaging twenty a game. They're
around fifty to sixty after game three, and I don't
have those numbers yet. New Orleans through three games now,
because I watched today, has blitzed sixteen times. Right, It's

(27:29):
awful for a team that is struggling to consistently get pressure,
has got corners who are unproven. Which one positive I
want to throw out real quick to all the viewers.
Quincy Riley got snapped today and forced that fumble that
Pete Warner recovered. Great job putting that hat on a ball,
great tackle, Riley, Thank you so much for being some
glimmer of positive in what was a terrible game today.

(27:51):
But Riley got snaps, which was nice for me to see.
We talked about, you know, maybe swapping out Isaac, which
if they did that and that happens to be the
way that the season ends up going, you can put
that comp pick back on the table that would be
taken off if they decided to start you item all
season long. But if you do Riley and he's below
thirty percent snap count, then you will get that compick,
which we really desperately need at this point. So it's

(28:14):
big for me. And then it's even what Raheem was
also talking about in our chat. The penalties, man, so
many of them being pre snapped on both offensive and defensive.
Just stupid stuff, right, Uh, even special teams like how
often you we had a blocked field goal called back
because of special teams problems? You know, pay penalties.

Speaker 3 (28:33):
Is a.

Speaker 1 (28:35):
Special I would if it wasn't the entire team would
I'm with you, if it wasn't the entire team three
games in and preseason consistent. Yeah, it's every you see
a team that's that.

Speaker 2 (28:47):
I see a team, but I see individual players that
are pressing because they I mean, they're frustrated. Listen, this
is what national losses that dating back to last year. See,
so two things I want to point out. One, here's
what's last season was a terrible season, right, But I've
always said it's gonna take two years for this this

(29:10):
team to kind of right because you still have players
from last year's awful team that are still on this team,
which means they have some of the same experiences.

Speaker 3 (29:23):
Sometimes you got to gut everything.

Speaker 2 (29:25):
So the people that experienced the trauma and the terror,
you got to move on from them because they carry
that with them. You got to bring all new stuff
in that that doesn't have an awareness of how bad they.

Speaker 3 (29:39):
Are capable of being.

Speaker 2 (29:41):
And so it was always going to take two years
for this team to completely be gutted and kind of
reformed so that it can fit within Kellen Moore's image.

Speaker 1 (29:51):
But I gotta say one thing, man, I agree with you,
but those type of penalties this consistently is I don't know,
that's not a player in Dietmond. That's a coach indictment.
And that's something that's got to get fixed. Regardless of
who the players are. That is a leadership and coaching issue.

Speaker 3 (30:08):
I could I agree about sixty percent.

Speaker 2 (30:11):
I'm just saying I see players trying to make plays
because not enough plays aren't being made so effectively. To me,
it does still fall on coaching because it's like players
are like, damn, I gotta do something.

Speaker 3 (30:23):
I gotta play outside the structure of the defense.

Speaker 2 (30:26):
I gotta try and get off on this, on this
this field goal, I gotta try and get off and
make a play because collectively we're not making enough plays.
Either the coaches aren't putting us in position to make
plays or something.

Speaker 3 (30:38):
But it's causing guys to press.

Speaker 1 (30:40):
And so when it is logical, I'm with you. I
do him going offside.

Speaker 3 (30:44):
They're pressing, and I get why they're pressing. Listen, it's
a This is a game of.

Speaker 2 (30:56):
It's ninety percent mental, it's only ten percent physical. They
have a bad stench on them, they do. And when
you have a bad stench on you as a staff,
to me, you have to put the pedal to the
floor as often as you can to give them a
chance to find something to believe in. The Only way

(31:21):
to do that is to be aggressive in all aspects.
You call a blitz, throw the ball downfield, hit on
some shot plays, call a fake punt, do things that
invigorates the team's belief fair that they can make plays,

(31:42):
and then once they believe they can make plays, they'll
make them. Right now, this is a team that I
don't think believes that they can win.

Speaker 3 (31:55):
And there and it's it's showing in the output. They're
not winning. They're losing close, they're losing b They're making.

Speaker 2 (32:02):
Penalties left and right. It's pre snap penalties. It is
stupid penalties. Yeah, it's bad officiating penalties, it's snowballing.

Speaker 1 (32:12):
Reminds me a little bit of twenty sixteen in a
lot of ways. Remember there's twenty sixteen we lost by
the weirdest ways. That was the year that the white
shoe Denver Bronco on the sideline. I mean, just ah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
I remember that. Yeah. Bad teams find a way even
if they're not meaning to. They just they find a
way to lose again, lose. And that just feels like

(32:33):
where the Saints are right now. They're gonna find a
way to lose because they don't have that identity, they
don't have that full belief yet. And I'm still not
saying get rid of more, although Godfather is he says
zero to four. Here we come. I'm not gonna even
argue at that point because I agree, but Loomis, Moore
and Staley have to go. They said they would have
rather have like Joe Brady or Mike McDaniel. I wouldn't personally.
I wouldn't real quick aside, because I feel like their

(32:56):
style of offense, which is specifically Joe Brazen off to
Sean Payton. It's kind of becoming a dinosaur right now
as the league shifts to a different style and older style.
Give me somebody who's still familiar with running an older
I form, you know, running a twenty two personnel. We're
getting back to the old school, baby, I mean, hmm,
bring out you, Brian McKnight. It ain't no more time

(33:17):
for NBA young boy. We're done with NBA young boy. Okay,
got back to the oldies classics. And I just don't
know if those two guys are there. But I understand
where the frustrations coming from, and that I truly do,
especially when you're oer and three staring down oh and four.

Speaker 3 (33:32):
Yeah, so they they have it.

Speaker 2 (33:35):
This is a month of figuring out what the hell
doesn't work.

Speaker 3 (33:38):
That's the sild that I can take.

Speaker 2 (33:40):
Keller Moore, I think you either said it or I
think I heard it somewhere. They were saying, great hire,
but he's gonna have to take some time to find
his footing as a coach, as a head coach, and
I think that takes time. I understood the intelligence in
bringing along Staley as a former head coach.

Speaker 1 (33:58):
I understood the lie and why you make that play.

Speaker 2 (34:01):
I hated the decision because there was a reason he
didn't immediately get a defensive coordinator spot after losing his
job with the Chargers, ended up having to take a
sabbatical with the forty Niners, where they hired him as
a assaultant. That spoke volumes, because when you were a
good DC, or when you're a good coordinator, they usually
scoop you up instantly, no different than Dennis Allen getting

(34:24):
picked up by the bags.

Speaker 3 (34:25):
It was not of a job soon, so to me
that was a red flag.

Speaker 2 (34:28):
But it was a bigger red flag and that he
only had one year of a successful defense.

Speaker 3 (34:32):
He had an entire three year run of drafting.

Speaker 2 (34:34):
The players he wanted put in the defense together that
he wanted, and that Chargers defense was terrible and the
players didn't like him much.

Speaker 3 (34:40):
Either after he left. They actually were hire on jesse.

Speaker 2 (34:42):
Mentor's defense when they were put in that one, and
he turned that defense around in a year. He turned
that defense suddenly with the same players that Staley drafted
that they weren't good with. Jesse Mentor took that defense
and improved it the following year would only addition of
a few of the players. That speaks volume. I understood

(35:03):
the logic and the decisions. I have the patients to
deal with Kellen Moore for a while, but the same
way I needed and I wanted, and I understood why
we were so patient with Dennis Allen. It's like baked
in top ten defense. All he needs to do is
progress as a head coach, just he needs to work
with his player whatever he needed to work on as

(35:25):
a head coach. I need to see Kellen Moore find
a way to progress in his blind areas so that
he can ultimately become a better head coach. The patients
with More I think should be extended, like the patients
with Dennis Allen. Probably shouldn't have been there as long
because it was his second stint, but at least with
more I can understand giving him two to three years

(35:46):
to grow and develop as a head coach while he
continues to build his culture.

Speaker 1 (35:53):
I would say the main thing that concerns me is
with Staley, and I know that in the long run,
I'm comparing apples to oranges to Kiwis, but it worries me,
even with this being a team where they're at talent
wise everything losing thirty one points and why I bring
it up. Dennis Allen his first year of head coach,

(36:13):
they did not lose. A thirty point loss. Didn't happen.
Sean Payton in his first year didn't happen. Jim Haslin
in his first year didn't happen. Mike Didcken his first
year with us didn't happen. That is the big thing
that concerns me. I can get the rebuild, I can
even get losing. It's this style of loss that does
concern me. And I, like you, I'm good with more.

(36:34):
I was not really sold on Staley, and I'll say
that while I'm not kicking him out the door, nothing
he's done so far has sold me yet.

Speaker 2 (36:42):
Yeah, I'm not impressed, but I don't know that I
ever expected to be. I can't think about his name
right now.

Speaker 1 (36:49):
Christian.

Speaker 3 (36:49):
It might be Christian Wilkins or Christians.

Speaker 1 (36:51):
I wanted.

Speaker 2 (36:52):
I figured, if you're gonna go with the Staley defense,
I mean not the Staley but the Fangio defense, you
might as well go with the purest form of it.

Speaker 3 (36:59):
I actually wanted.

Speaker 2 (36:59):
To to interview the defensive back pass game coordinator for
the Eagles. That's who I actually wanted, very very highly
thought of in circles. He was the one that came
in and tied the entire secondary player everything that Fangill
wanted to do in the Eagles first year. When you

(37:21):
think about the development of their draft picks Quintin McHale
or not Quinton forget their first round, they also drafted
the second round safety slash slot player. When you think
about the development that he got out of that secondary,
and then you look at the way that that secondary
played in that Fangio defense, I thought that that was
an easy selection. And yet, obviously going with a former

(37:45):
coworker that you feel comfortable with who was also a
former head coach is also a logical decision. So I
understood it. I just I saw too much bad things
on Stateley that I just I didn't like. And yet
it was a very safe choice for a first time

(38:07):
head coach, So I understand.

Speaker 1 (38:08):
Like I can't fault him for it, Like who's going
to fault a guy getting that much NFL experience with
an NFL resume in terms of as a DC. But
at the same time, it's, like we said last week,
at some point, if Moore is going to survive here,
he's got to find his Greg Williams.

Speaker 3 (38:24):
Well. And I think the most frustrating the part about
it is watch this.

Speaker 2 (38:27):
If you go back to Kellen Moore's introductory press conference,
he said he wanted his footballs, the football players to
play smart. He said he wanted them to play fast,
and I think physical.

Speaker 3 (38:40):
Was the other one.

Speaker 1 (38:41):
Right.

Speaker 2 (38:42):
The penalties that we're seeing so that they're not playing smart, okay,
they're not also being able to play fast. This defense
does not look like it's playing fast. You know why,
because they're thinking too much. Something about that scheme needs
to get dumbed down because the guys aren't flying around.
There is an adjustment that needs to happen on that

(39:03):
in that scheme, just like the offense needs to make
an adjustment to kind of attack more and lean more
on the run game, get Kendre involved with more touches,
find a way to get Kamara out on the edge.
Just find a way to use all this four two
four three four three four two speed that you have
to open things up. There's an adjustment that needs to
be made. But then on the defense side, it's the

(39:24):
exact same damn thing. I shouldn't be I'm getting Listen.
I was very happy to see more zone coverage. I
was like, I was like, this is a lot more.

Speaker 3 (39:35):
I feel like I'm I'm done watching zone coverage at
this point.

Speaker 1 (39:37):
I'm played. They just played cover three pure zone. It's
gotta be just for that one goal. Yes, get that.

Speaker 2 (39:46):
I haven't seen much man coverage, like, not a mix up,
not a change up, not a little bit of sprintser
not no lime, not no lemons, zest nothing. It's just
we gonna we're gonna drop back and we're gonna look
to the lyft and we're gonna look to the right
and we're gonna watch the ball get completed right to
my right side in front of him behind me, And

(40:08):
I'm hm, they gotta do better. I need to see
these coaches make an adjustment. M And we got to
the end of the month they got they October. I
need to see some development all the way around. I'm
giving them to September. I'm not expecting much from them
versus Buffalo. In fact, I'm not expecting anything enough that

(40:30):
I wouldn't actually be surprised if they found a way
to beat Buffalo.

Speaker 1 (40:35):
I'll say, look, as long as we don't get blown out,
I'll be happy with an l If I get enough
film where I can look forward to watching film the
next day, that's all I care about, you know. But
I would say this, if they win, man, I'm gonna
be a very very happy man. On Sunday. I'm gonna
be telling y'all we're going to the super Bowl if
we beat the Bills. I'm just lett y'all know ahead
of time. I'm gonna flip every script from this week

(40:55):
We're going to super Bowl. So I would be that
might be my super Bowl this year. To be honest,
it might be.

Speaker 2 (41:03):
Because they all they need is a little bit of momentum.
It's just for me, it's belief if they can just.

Speaker 3 (41:08):
Get some type of momentum and belief.

Speaker 2 (41:11):
But I also still don't want to see the coaches
coaching scared, even though Keller Moore had the couple of
foot down conversions, or at least the foot down attempts,
there was also that field goal he decided to kick,
where it's.

Speaker 3 (41:22):
Like, we're just kind of trying to take the points
at this point.

Speaker 1 (41:26):
Na, yeah, you're down at the half touchdown.

Speaker 3 (41:30):
Go for the damn touchdown. Like, I get what.

Speaker 1 (41:33):
I tell your players too, Like, hey, we know, we
know your ass is getting whooped, but we're going to
kick a field goal right here.

Speaker 2 (41:40):
Yeah, Like smart dude. The decision making wasn't It wasn't
a bad decision. It's like, Okay, we haven't been able
to get anything going, we just need to get any
points because we don't want this to go to waste.
I get it, logically, I get it, but it still
screams I'm playing in a passive mode. I'm I'm I'm playing,
I'm coaching scared here and I need to see him like.

Speaker 3 (42:01):
Yo, drop your balls, bro.

Speaker 1 (42:04):
I mean when it's thirty eight to three in the second, bro,
you do something. You got come on something because that
three points. Does it feel worse to go down thirty
eight to three or thirty eight to six. Let me
tell you don't like either one of them. So the
three points ain't do nothing? Yeah, and for no other
reason for your players, Yeah, your players should go into

(42:24):
the locker room at least with some energy, back in
on some excitement.

Speaker 3 (42:28):
All right, we scored.

Speaker 1 (42:29):
We're still down four scores, but we got it. Instead
of like, didn't add anything to it.

Speaker 2 (42:36):
It's like, look, if you wouldn't have made it, and
let's say you go for it and you don't make it,
it's definitely not adding anything to it. But the three points,
I mean, did that inflate anybody's chances that we're getting
closer here?

Speaker 1 (42:48):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (42:49):
Hell no it didn't. So it's like I need.

Speaker 2 (42:52):
To see I need to see more aggressiveness more like yo, like, yeah,
come on, man, do something.

Speaker 3 (42:59):
You got to do something, bro.

Speaker 1 (43:01):
Who that forever? Get this young team energy.

Speaker 2 (43:03):
You gotta make the boys really believe or at least
feel like, Hey, we're about to.

Speaker 3 (43:07):
Come out here and we gonna you know, win, lose
or draw. We're gonna give you. Hell you gonna do
that by kicking the damn field go down thirty something points.

Speaker 2 (43:15):
That ain't that saying we're trying to take what we
can get.

Speaker 1 (43:20):
Shout out to Shot my shot. But one day, oh damn,
not even it's lunch, not even dinner, all right, y'all.

Speaker 2 (43:29):
It's like walking up to the chicken man like, hey,
can I can I take you to lunch one day more?

Speaker 3 (43:34):
Versus like it's get in my car right quick, let's go.

Speaker 2 (43:37):
It's just I need to see a little bit more,
a little bit more aggressiveness.

Speaker 3 (43:40):
Not that that you know. I don't know if you
like me or not.

Speaker 1 (43:43):
I need to know you love me, my man, my man,
Ellis said, I don't need no high school offense like
you gotta grow up up. Shout thro raheem shut, he said,
he said, stop with the push. We ain't Philly. Hey,
if it works, I'll be Philly. But we just can't
do it. It's a amazing how hard apparently that is
to learn that play.

Speaker 2 (44:02):
I mean, it's amazing how how referee that play gets
for everybody too. That's what's amazing, Like it gets called
so much tighter for every other team that tries it,
except for Philly. That's I'm okay with going for the play.
I'm okay with even attempting it. Most teams are at
tempting it and actually being successful. It is very annoying

(44:24):
to see that. When Philly does it, they get away
with all these discrepancies. But every other team that does it,
it's like hawk eyes watching it. What you assimi meet
over the line?

Speaker 3 (44:36):
Five?

Speaker 2 (44:36):
Y'all?

Speaker 1 (44:36):
Penalty?

Speaker 3 (44:37):
Do it over again? Kick it?

Speaker 1 (44:38):
Do something different?

Speaker 3 (44:40):
I just you know, I.

Speaker 1 (44:42):
Hey man, I'm with you.

Speaker 3 (44:44):
That was real rough to watch.

Speaker 1 (44:45):
It was.

Speaker 3 (44:45):
It was real.

Speaker 1 (44:46):
I can tell because you watched this whole game has
got us both in it. But we're gonna be good
by tomar who else says y'all? Remember what happened in
Buffalo twenty seventeen. I do ran twenty seven straight times,
ak and Ingram. I think we ran for two hundred
and fifty yards that day.

Speaker 2 (45:06):
Just I would love to see Kellen Moore actually lean
on the running game, and that he would to strike
me as somebody that wants to.

Speaker 1 (45:14):
But we'll look at the look at his first down.

Speaker 2 (45:17):
Percentages, look at how often Kellen Moore passes on first down,
which to me is frustrating.

Speaker 3 (45:23):
Because as predictable.

Speaker 2 (45:25):
But b if you don't get more than two to
three yards on the play A, you turn back around
and it's still second and loan and guess what you're
gonna do on second and long. Guess guess what he
typically does on second and loan He passes again, which
means now you've gotten two straight passes. But now you've
only game three two you know, four total yards. So

(45:47):
now it's it's third and six or third and seven.
Guess what he's gonna do on that third down pass again.

Speaker 1 (45:52):
Damn, it feels like I've been here before too.

Speaker 2 (45:57):
His philosophy lends itself to being pass heavy the moment
the pass doesn't get enough yards or the moment the
run doesn't get enough yards. If you're gonna, you're gonna
it's gonna turn into a pass heavy offense. And that
annoys me because you're not good enough to be pass heavy.
You don't have enough a good enough quarterback to be
pass heavy. You don't have a good enough offensive line

(46:18):
to be pass heavy. You don't have good enough receivers
to be past heavy. So why the physic are.

Speaker 3 (46:24):
You being pass heavy.

Speaker 2 (46:25):
Your formula should be based around run, That's what it
should be.

Speaker 3 (46:31):
Do the window dressing with the formation or listen.

Speaker 2 (46:34):
If you're gonna be pass heavy, pass from running formations,
at least add some disguise to it.

Speaker 1 (46:40):
You mean the play action that they very rarely run.

Speaker 2 (46:43):
Pass from running formations, run from pass informations.

Speaker 3 (46:47):
You gotta add some complexity if.

Speaker 2 (46:49):
You're gonna be straightforward, if you're gonna say, hey, I'm
gonna drop back. I'm a first down past team, right,
I'm gonna be a team that passed on first down. Okay,
come out in a running formation if at least make
them think.

Speaker 3 (47:03):
You gonna run the ball.

Speaker 1 (47:05):
I love this version of Elius. I like it. Come on, man,
that's somebody.

Speaker 3 (47:09):
It's physical, come on wrong.

Speaker 2 (47:12):
Like, I'm not a football coach, I've never been, but
a lot of it is just like, hey, if you're
gonna design this this thing the right way, there's like
quality control, Like I'm sure there's a quality control coach
that can be like, hey, bro, were running the ball
eighty five percent, I mean, were passing the ball eighty
five percent on first down. It's making us predictable on
second down. I think we need to alter something about

(47:33):
this philosophy here, like our first down philosophy. It's not
helping us. Somebody could tell them that.

Speaker 1 (47:39):
I agree. I'm very innest to see what the numbers
are when we do our episode on Tuesday, we'll share
a little of it. Who do you want to focus
watch this game?

Speaker 3 (47:48):
You watch it?

Speaker 1 (47:49):
Oh man, you don't want to watch it? Or I
will do a little bit. But that means Tuesday we'll
focus mostly on what's going on. Like number one, can
we get Chase Young back?

Speaker 2 (47:58):
Like that defense is broken without Chase Young. I really
do believe like Chase Young is de straw that stirs
that drink. I really do think that Chase Young likely
unlocks the majority of what that defense can be. But
until they get him on the field, it's going to
be trash. Why because it's it's a defense that's based
on cover cover principles.

Speaker 3 (48:18):
It's not an aggressive defense. It's based on cover principle.

Speaker 2 (48:22):
Well, if you're gonna play that much zone, you better
have a pass rush.

Speaker 1 (48:26):
Better have it.

Speaker 3 (48:27):
You better have a pass rush if you won't play
that much zone.

Speaker 2 (48:31):
Because the long winner quarterback holds the ball, the bigger
the holes.

Speaker 3 (48:35):
In the zone become. So you have a pass rush
and the Saints don't have one.

Speaker 2 (48:40):
So that's why it's perplexing that he doesn't blitz more
a Carmell goddamn man coverage.

Speaker 1 (48:47):
Stupid Elliot's over here turning into Chris Tucker here over
under on Eliot's having a stroke by week five. Now,
my man's gonna have nothing but health. We speak of
health over and by the same time stroke. I'll be
here till I'm ninety five. A long season, be a
good season. Hey, look y'all, y'all come join us Tuesday.

(49:09):
Don't watch this game again. I'll do it for don't
watch the game again.

Speaker 3 (49:14):
I'm gonna struck listening.

Speaker 2 (49:15):
I'm gonna struggle writing for the website this week because
there's nothing.

Speaker 1 (49:20):
I have nothing good to say, says football Talk. I
tell you, I give you one thing. Quincy Riley got snaps.
He deserves to get looked at.

Speaker 3 (49:29):
Yeah, they better look at him.

Speaker 1 (49:31):
He one of the players that got a nose for
the Listen.

Speaker 2 (49:33):
That ball was the cause of the first turnover at
the Saints have gotten this season, and he's He was
known as having a nose for the ball during his
college experience. He showed it in preseason. He has a
bit of a nose ball. This is again, this is
a defense that's supposed to make it easier for players
to make turnovers. But you gotta have players that kind

(49:55):
of are good at forcing turnovers for the work his
This is what I think frustrates me about the thinking
of this defensive staff. Yeham wasn't good with the forty
nine ers when he went to play in that scheme.
Yet them, Ye left us as a primary man corner
looked good and Dennis Allen's defense went to the forty

(50:17):
nine ers to go play in a match coverage scheme,
which is why they brought Stale in to have him
kind of.

Speaker 3 (50:23):
Give his inputs.

Speaker 2 (50:24):
Went to play in that match zone scheme, eventually got benched. Okay,
we signed stay and then we go and get Yet them,
did anybody expect him to actually perform well in a
defense that doesn't fit who he is. He's not an
off coverage guy yet him is not somebody that you

(50:46):
line up eight yards nine yards off the ball and
tell him to open his hips up when a receiver
getting ready to run past him and try to make
a break on the ball. He's not a breaking cornerback.
He's somebody that you say a lineup close, get physical
with the receiver, stay in his hip pocket, make the
throw harder.

Speaker 3 (51:04):
That's who you them is not. Come on, man, I
the boys better tighten up.

Speaker 2 (51:09):
They better, they better do something different, or I'm gonna
look at this coach and staff and be like, y'all
can hide me for this, boy, I'll take a check.
Y'all could hide me for this I can get you.
Better make me listen. Let me be a quality control coach.
If there's anything I'm good that I'm good at being nitpicky,
I nitpick everything about both schemes and tell you everything
you need to not be doing, says football talk dot Com.

Speaker 3 (51:34):
Man, I don't know what else to say.

Speaker 1 (51:38):
Who that God blessed catch you? The next one, you

(52:01):
better beat it