May 2, 2025 • 30 mins
if college athletes are being paid will high school athletes be next?
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Why Johnny Hates Sports is broadcast live Fridays at 11AM ET on W4CY Radio (www.w4cy.com) part of Talk 4 Radio (www.talk4radio.com) on the Talk 4 Media Network (www.talk4media.com). Why Johnny Hates Sports is viewed on Talk 4 TV (www.talk4tv.com).
Why Johnny Hates Sports Podcast is also available on Talk 4 Media (www.talk4media.com), Talk 4 Podcasting (www.talk4podcasting.com), iHeartRadio, Amazon Music, Pandora, Spotify, Audible, and over 100 other podcast outlets.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
The topics and opinions expressed in the following show are
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Speaker 2 (00:12):
No liability, explicit or.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
Implied shall be extended to W FOURCY Radio or its
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Speaker 3 (00:36):
Sports for kids in America began with what we affectionately
called sandlot ball, where kids organized their own games, made
their own rules, and played until the sun went down.
Then came along parents.
Speaker 4 (01:25):
The National Alliance for Youth Sports was born out of
a desire to bring order to the world of organized
sports for children in America. While for the most part,
children have a great experience playing sports, far too often
parents and coaches lose perspective. This program is aimed at
bringing some of America's best experts to talk about what
(01:46):
we can do to change the atmosphere of win at
all costs and parent poor behavior to one that focuses
on children having a positive learning experience through sports. Here's
our host, Fred eng Under of a National Alliance for
Youth Sports.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Hey, good morning everybody, and welcome to Why Johnny Hates Sports.
And today we got a guest that I'm very happy
to present to you. He was the Coach of the
Year in Palm Beach County football coach and then he
coaches other stuff. But what a great guy to have
(02:28):
on this program because he and I have talked about
an issue concerning the NIL. You know, it took me
a while for I figured out what NIL was, but
then I'm will let coach tell you what NIL means
even though I do know. So please welcome Brian Coke,
(02:49):
Coach of the Year. Boy to Brian, Hey, Brett, are
you doing?
Speaker 5 (02:53):
I coached you and I was back in twenty nineteen,
so that that ship has sailed, you know, I'm still having.
Speaker 6 (02:59):
A good time doing it and guiding youth.
Speaker 5 (03:04):
So you uh, The NIL stand for name, image and likeness,
and that's a way that these kids now in the
collegiate level have been afforded an opportunity to benefit from
their generating the money for the college programs over the
years where the NCAA dropped the ball on allowing them
to do so.
Speaker 6 (03:24):
They want a court case.
Speaker 5 (03:26):
So now these kids are able to get paid for
their contribution to these institutions raising you know, millions to
billions of dollars a year in college sports.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
That's to me kind of crazy. Coach. I was looking
at the thing the other day and this guy named
let me look here, Darren menshis he was going to
Tulane and then they went to Duke for eight million
bucks they gave him were going there. And then there's
another guy, Bryce Underwood. It was a high school player
(04:03):
and they gave it ten point five million dollars for
four years. I mean, he's in high school. And then
I mean, what is going on? Is this crazy or
what's your take on all this?
Speaker 6 (04:14):
It is crazy.
Speaker 5 (04:15):
I mean I understand the aspect of it as far
as like the collegiate sports, where these kids, you know,
everybody wants to say, well, they're getting a collegiate education.
Speaker 6 (04:24):
For that guest, I totally agree.
Speaker 5 (04:26):
However, these kids can't benefit from all the financial gains
that these institutions make from ticket sales to food and
beverags at games, to the TV rights, the parking and
all those things. That these kids helped generate there and
(04:48):
if they go to a function and sign autographs somewhere.
Speaker 6 (04:54):
Back in the day, they got, you know, declared ineligible.
So I understand that.
Speaker 5 (04:59):
Aspect of it, but I agree with you it is
getting out of hand in a sense of the purity
of college sports. I mean, we all sports fans enjoy
college sports more than we do pros at times, and
it's really messing that up. And my fear is when
it really gets into full swing with high schools, it's
going to be a terrible situation, a terrible situation for
(05:22):
high school athletics.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
Well, you say when it gets into the high school level,
has in it already to a certain degree, Yes.
Speaker 5 (05:31):
It's been approved, and of course everything starts out West Texas,
I believe was the first to do what I think,
and now it's coming across. It has been approved here
in Florida, but they haven't wrapped their head around how
to make it work yet because the high school institutions
are not permitted to have anything to be involved with it.
But once it gets figured out and they figure out
(05:52):
how to do this and pay these kids, high school
sports is going to be the wild wild West it's
going to be really crazy for these kids. Are the
coaches more so than the kids. The kids are going
to get what they want, but coaches are going to
have a very difficult time managing to run in a legitimate,
respectable program.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
Yeah, I mean, you've been around for a while, so
tell me. I mean, I remember, it just seemed like
yesterday that the nc double A was well against paid
college athletes, and they went into a big fight and
everything with you know whoever, and then all of a sudden,
it just seemed like overnight. Now we have all these
(06:36):
college athletes going from one college to another, getting paid,
you know, to go. And then the effects of what
I wonder is the booster clubs with all the money.
Speaker 6 (06:49):
How did this all change so quick? So like what happened?
You know, we had a couple of stories.
Speaker 5 (06:55):
I'm the biggest one was this kicker I think now
he's I believe he's kicking in USFL now forget his
name became a YouTube sensation and then the NCAA declared
him ineligible because he was making money off of who
you know, of being himself and he had gotten into.
Speaker 6 (07:10):
The whole thing.
Speaker 5 (07:11):
He was making a bunch of money so that prompted
the lawsuits and and things. From the perspective of the players,
I mean remember NCAA football used to be really big,
and then because the people are like, well, you guys
are making all this money by me, you know, the
college athletes, that it would stopped for a while because
you know, they stopped promoting because they couldn't use the
(07:33):
kids' names and stuff, and nobody was very interested. Now
that all this has come back, the money part of
it is being you know, generating. These kids are being
allowed to benefit from that. I think it's gone out
of control. And I think the NCAA, you know, they
have to look at themselves and bland themselves. I mean,
because they were in a situation they could have did
some type of litigation to allow these kids to you know,
(07:57):
make a little bit more money or whatever the case
may be, whether you know, whether we think is right
or not.
Speaker 6 (08:01):
But they could have been in control.
Speaker 5 (08:02):
But they let the laws get it, you know, the
the they let the you know, the law get it.
Speaker 6 (08:09):
Lawsuits happened, and and now this is what we have now.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
You use the term of you know, the wild wild West,
and and it just seems to me that's so correct,
because you know, I wondered about booster clubs. I remember,
I was a high school coach like you, and and
I knew the effect of booster clubs when I was coaching,
and they they kind of had control over the program
(08:35):
and certainly had control over me because they would buy
uniforms and everything and anything that I need as long
as I was winning. But I wonder, in the aspect
of the n C Double A and n I L
is what effect did booster clubs play in all of this?
I mean, you got you got a lot of people
(08:57):
with a lot of money. So you know, you got
one guys, like I said before, whatever his name was,
getting eight million dollars to go from too Lane to Duke.
What is it to say that they don't get twenty
five million dollars? I mean, the booster clubs have a
lot of money.
Speaker 5 (09:14):
And that's and that's what me and my friends that
we always talk about all the time.
Speaker 6 (09:18):
I mean, I knock on wood.
Speaker 5 (09:20):
Unfortunately I didn't have a booster club at the schools
I coached at where it allowed me to have more
economic support. But as far as a coach that wanted
to be in control of my own program. I didn't
have to answer to them, so I lucked out on that.
But I know a lot of places where, uh you know,
the small town areas where their sports, high school sports
(09:40):
are very big. Yes, the booster club does play a
very big role in mandating hiring and firing of coaches.
I mean, that's that's really big. And you know, those
are those things where you know, I had to tell
my guys, hey, be careful what you asked for. You
go get one of those big time positions in a
little small town and lose that big game with that
(10:00):
crosstown rival. You know, like the old movie I was
at on Friday Night Lights, that's that signs in your
front yard fire coach code, you know. So they're going
to have a big input on that. Like I said,
once it gets managed to where they know how and
what's acceptable and what's not acceptable.
Speaker 6 (10:22):
With reference to.
Speaker 5 (10:24):
The money being given to these high school kids, I
mean it's already been approved, but once they figured out, you're.
Speaker 6 (10:29):
Going to have what I what I call to have
versus the have not.
Speaker 5 (10:33):
Communities that have a lot of money from boosters and
businesses are gonna be able to entice these young men
and women to come to their schools and play.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Yeah, let's get down to another different topic, not topic,
but same topic, but different level. I'm talking about below
the high schools. When do you think that that's gonna happen?
I mean, I look around and I live in an area.
They got a park right across the street, and I
see elite soccer programs going on with these paid coaches
(11:08):
and kids out there that I'm saying, uh oh, these
kids are being recruited from one program to the other
because they're all trying to win these championships. And do
you see that maybe money would come into paying a
ten year old kid to play because he's exceptionally good.
Speaker 5 (11:28):
Yeah, I mean in a roundabout way. I mean, I
wouldn't say legally, are morally ethically those things are happening already.
I mean the travel program is a little bit different
in the sense that those kids and those families have
to pay for those program roster spots or whatever. But yes,
(11:49):
they are recruited to come play for certain teams. As
far as basketball, baseball, soccer, those things are very very
big travel season, So yes, they are being recruited to
come to places. But as far as the economics, with
that being in play, that's done.
Speaker 6 (12:07):
The problem that.
Speaker 5 (12:08):
I've noticed, especially as football is concerned, is when you
go to these parks and you see these little league
parks being played.
Speaker 6 (12:15):
You probably saw a couple of stories on ESPN years.
Speaker 5 (12:18):
Ago where these neighborhood individuals are paying these kids to
come play at their parks and paying them for performance
on the fields and touchdowns, score tackles made, making a
tackle that takes out the other teams.
Speaker 6 (12:38):
You know, they're you know, they.
Speaker 5 (12:39):
They are doing that quote under the table, and I
think that is horrendous to be doing in little league
sports or sports in general, let alone. You know, you
have eight, nine, ten year twelve year old kids out
there being paid to you know, score touchdowns and being
blamed if a team loses a game. I mean, it's crazy,
(13:02):
but it's happening.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Yeah, you talk about ten year olds being out there,
you know, with them being paid or whatever. But the
reason that they're getting paid and to make those tackles
and whatever they're doing is the fact that you know,
there's guys up in the stands that are betting money
(13:24):
on whose team wins. So that's influencing that to a
great degree. That's amazing how all of this that used
to be recreational sports, fun for kids and development, which
with the national lines for you, sports is all about,
is trying to make sports positive and safe for kids.
(13:46):
And yet you have all this new influence based on money.
So you know, I know that what you've done and
at the high school level has been tremendous. And you know,
I know the win loss records are one thing, but
it's so great when you have kids that come back
to you to tell you what you did to implode
(14:10):
improve their life and made it great because not only
are you telling them how to tackle and punt and
kick and throw whatever, but how to live life. And
I know that's what you based a lot of your
coaching on. You agree with that, I know one percent.
Speaker 5 (14:30):
I sit around Collage times and I tell people, you
know why, coach, I've never picked my family up and
moved to another county or state in order to get
a coaching job that would be more prestigious or whatever.
I would consider myself very blessed to be chosen to
be a high school coach at the places I've been.
(14:52):
And that's the one thing I hang my hat on
is the fact that I've had those moments that you know,
a kid came back. I mean, I had this one
particular moment where I was in that little what am
I doing moment. I'm not a head coach anymore. I'm
just a little league football coach. You know, what is
my purpose?
Speaker 2 (15:11):
What is it?
Speaker 5 (15:12):
Know?
Speaker 6 (15:12):
Whatever?
Speaker 5 (15:12):
And I had one of my former players come by
and give me a conversation such as that, and he said, Coach,
I never got a chance to tell you, thank you
for everything you told me when I was in high school.
Speaker 6 (15:23):
And that meant so much to me.
Speaker 5 (15:27):
And the last thing he said to me says, coach,
thank you, and if you ever get a chance, can
you coach my son?
Speaker 6 (15:33):
And that right there was worth a million dollars.
Speaker 5 (15:35):
I mean, is that answered my question and got my
head clear and put me back in a good place
for my own personal life because of that moment you
referred to.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
Yeah, that's so great for those kind of stories, let
me tell you one that's on the opposite side. We
do a training program for coaches and one of the
first ones that we did was using a video and
we had a sports psychologist who would be on the
screen and be talking about you know, the role that
(16:09):
coaches play in winning with kids in sports, and you
know why they come out for sports. And we let
the coaches talk about it amongst themselves. And when it
was over, I thought, okay, because the program was mandatory
that the coaches had to be there, and this coach,
the coach came up to me and pointed his finger
(16:34):
and I thought, oh, here he goes. He's going to say,
how come I had to come to this program. I
know all about coaching and I know everything. But he said, hey,
I want to ask you a question. I said, you
go ahead. He said, do you think I should be
a coach? I said, excuse me? Do you do you
(16:54):
think I should be a coach? He said? And I said,
why do you say that? He said, because I heard
all these other guys talking in the group I was in,
and they were talking about how important it was to
try to help kids and whatnot. And he said, but
I want to tell you something that's not what I did.
(17:15):
And I want to know do you think i'd for
sure really be a coach? And I said, of course
you should, because one thing you told me that this
program is working. And he turned around, took about two steps,
but the most critical thing he said when he came
back to me, he said, I want to tell you something.
(17:37):
I've ruined a lot of kids, and that has stuck
with me for all these years. And then I turned
around to hear your story about how important role you
play as a coach. So one thing that you did say, coach,
I read all the time, and I can't believe it.
(17:57):
Where Coach X goes to Georgia and signs is to
be ahead football coach and val dasta making wherever you
know that far it could be farther away, and I'm thinking,
wait a minute, this guy's going to uproot his whole
family and move to be a coach at the different
(18:18):
high school. Is a booster clubs paying him under the
table a lot of money? What goes on in these situations?
Speaker 6 (18:26):
Oh no, it's not anything wrong, slash or illegal about that.
Speaker 5 (18:31):
I mean when you get to those like I said,
when you get to those towns like that, like your Georgia's,
your Alabama's, your Northern States Texas, those places.
Speaker 6 (18:41):
I mean, football, high school sports is big. I mean
there's nothing wrong with that. I mean it is big.
Speaker 5 (18:46):
Unfortunately, sometimes it gets it gets taken away from what
you and I talk about all the time as being
the true essence of youth sports, which is to help
raise young men and women that can be productive citizens
and be part of a team, be it an athletic team,
be it a group project in school, be it on
(19:07):
the job when they become a professional.
Speaker 6 (19:09):
And that's why most of us do what we do.
Speaker 5 (19:13):
Some people are professionals and this is what they do
as a profession I'm an educator that coaches. There's a
lot that are professionals, and yes, when those opportunities to
move on, I'm not mad.
Speaker 6 (19:24):
That's what they want to do.
Speaker 5 (19:25):
They want to go to that big time job and
get paid and those and those those places pay their
coaches very well. You know, I think Florida now is
in a possibility where they're looking to legislation. Talks are
happening to pay coaches better because a lot of good,
really good coaches are leaving the state because we don't
(19:45):
pay our coaches very well.
Speaker 6 (19:47):
But that's in talks right now.
Speaker 5 (19:49):
But there's nothing wrong with that with the coaches going
to move to do that as long as they're for me.
My only judgment is, hey, are you raising young men?
Are you raising young men women, when you go to
these places, if you're doing that, and you're providing for
your family and taking care of your own personal wants
and wishes, because we all have to have a drive,
we all have to have a purpose, and yes, helping
(20:12):
kids become better people it should be the basis of that.
But then you know, hey, you want to submit your
personal selfish mark on this sport or whatever sport it
is as well, and I can't blame it for that.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
You know, I mentioned before the fact that you were
the coach of the year in Palm Beach County. Now
a lot of people may be watching this and saying, well,
you know, Palm Beach County, how many of you high
schools are there? But there are plenty of high schools
and football is very important in Palm Beach County. But
I want to ask you this important question. You gave
(20:49):
it all up. Why it was time?
Speaker 5 (20:53):
I promised myself that, well we'll back up a little
bit further.
Speaker 6 (20:59):
You know, in my minority coach in Palmbi's county.
Speaker 5 (21:02):
When I first started, there were only two black head
football coaches in the county, and I was coaching and
educate teaching, and I realized that the young kids didn't
have that leader, the head.
Speaker 6 (21:17):
Football coach that looked like them.
Speaker 5 (21:19):
They didn't have that mentor to say, oh, I could
be a head coach if I want to do this.
So that was my drive to be a head coach,
and I became a head football coach. You know, you're
coaching and trying to earn the respect of your peers
is one of the big things that we do. We
want to know that our peers respect us, not because
we want a championship because of the type of program
(21:41):
you have, because how your kids act on and off
the field, that's what you really shouldn't be judged by,
in my opinion. And went through that whole thing and
then I wasn't a head coach for a while, and
then I said to myself, Hey, can I do this?
Speaker 6 (21:55):
Can I really coach? Do I know what I'm doing?
Speaker 5 (21:58):
And so when I got the opportunity to be here
said Rancious High School, I said to myself, Okay, I'm
gonna go all out. I'm gonna do everything that I
think I need to do, get good people around me,
raise young men and women that are evolved in my program.
And when it becomes not fun for me anymore. Selfishly,
then I'm going to back away. And after the COVID season,
(22:18):
I didn't see it going.
Speaker 6 (22:20):
To be enjoyable for me anymore.
Speaker 5 (22:22):
So I knew it was time for me to step
away because I wasn't going to be as productive as
I want to be when leading the football program.
Speaker 2 (22:31):
You mentioned the fact that there were only two African
American coaches when you started. Did you set a trend? Now?
Are there more African American head coaches?
Speaker 6 (22:44):
Yes? In the county. I don't know if I set
the trend, but the.
Speaker 5 (22:47):
Opportunities have made themselves, you know, and we've had, you know,
a good representation good quality coaches. And it wasn't anything,
oh you're a minority here, we're going to hire you. No,
we've had since I started back in shoot was in
ninety ninety one, was when I first started coaching in
the county. We've had several minority head coaches come through
and they've done excellent jobs.
Speaker 6 (23:08):
So that's a good a testament to the times and change.
Speaker 5 (23:12):
And then everybody you know that are deserved and that
have the you know, be affording.
Speaker 6 (23:17):
The opportunity to coach.
Speaker 5 (23:19):
And I'm very proud of Pobbach County and what we've
done with affording you know, different types of people and
personalities to lead to leave young men and women.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
I want to leave you with one last question. I
got to ask a question all the time, especially in
the name of the show. It's called Why Johnny Hates Sports?
And people say, why does Johnny hate sports? And I say, well,
first of all, Johnny's six years old and he doesn't
know or she doesn't know what she wants to do,
(23:52):
but their parents want to know in so many overwhelming cases,
and they say, you're going to play little league baseball, football, basketball, whatever,
it doesn't matter. So they get thrust into this situation.
Some of them the other athletes, some of them have competitiveness,
but they're thrust into it. And then somebody says, well,
(24:14):
who's going to coach your kid? And then they say, well,
I don't because I don't know anything about coach. Well,
if you don't coach, then your kid's not going to
get a chance to play. So you got to coach.
So now you got Billy Jones's father or mother that
gets recruited that knows nothing about it, and therefore you
(24:36):
also recruit somebody that should not even be around kids.
And then the next thing is why Johnny eight Sports,
is you now have a league that has formed that
has a whole bunch of these coaches that have never
been trained, never told what this is all about. And
the only thing that they look is see is the scoreboard, championships,
(24:59):
all star games, things that are focused on nothing but
winning at all costs, and so many situations. So I'm
going to ask you this, have you ever witnessed that
type of situation in your career?
Speaker 6 (25:16):
Oh? Yeah, most definitely, from little league to I think,
I mean, unfortunately.
Speaker 5 (25:23):
By these people that get into coaching for what I'd
say is, you know, a selfish or into.
Speaker 6 (25:30):
A wrong reason.
Speaker 5 (25:32):
You know, they taint the professional coaching because they do
we used to call daddy ball and they take their
child and they put them in football, put them at quarterback,
you know, and the kid doesn't have the ability to play.
Speaker 6 (25:47):
Quarterback and it becomes frustrating.
Speaker 5 (25:50):
Or in baseball, they take their kid and put him
at shortstop, clean up hitter and the kid's not that
at Youth sports should be a tool for young kids,
boys and girls to learn the values of teamwork. That
is basically what it is, there's a very select few
(26:12):
that will make it to the ultimum level of professional football,
professional basketball, baseball, softball, whatever it is. There's only a
select few that's going to make it to collegiate athletics
and earn a scholarship or have an opportunity to play.
And unfortunately parents don't understand that, they don't realize or
(26:34):
they refuse to accept the fact that your child's not
that person, but he or she deserves an opportunity to
try to play. But once they get to high school
and you get cut, if you're not that talented, then
you get cut.
Speaker 6 (26:46):
But that's life.
Speaker 5 (26:47):
You're supposed to fail or have those negative moments in
life to be better people. But you know, parents have
a tendency to try to protect their child or provide
an opportunity to their child. Will you know, benefit from,
uh those special moments of being the quarterback and the
(27:07):
starting point guard, the shortstop, the picture, the you know,
the striker in soccer.
Speaker 6 (27:14):
But they didn't earn it. They're not that good, and
that sets the child up to have issues later on
in life.
Speaker 5 (27:20):
So, uh, it's it's very unfortunate that it's out there
that is still happening, and I think organizations like yourself,
you know, should, should, should be afforded opportunities to get
into these youth organizations and provide knowledge beyond x's and
o's to these moms and dads and men and women
(27:42):
that are trying to coach for the right reason.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
Wow, you sound you sound exactly like me forty years
ago when I and I created and founded the National
Lines for youth sports. And it's amazing that you're you're
saying all these things, but it doesn't surprise me at all. Coaches,
but I just want to thank you very much for
your time, and not only just today but for what
(28:09):
you've done for kids in sports. So again, thanks again.
Speaker 6 (28:14):
Hey, I appreciate you, Fred Again, thanks for having me.
I really enjoyed it. And I hope some of the
things that we talked.
Speaker 5 (28:20):
About get out there and and and if it helps
one coach, one parent, you know, I think our time
was well spent and I have no problem anytime you
need me.
Speaker 6 (28:32):
I'm here for you.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
Okay, thank you from more than that. So, today we've
had with US coach Brian co the Coach of the
Year for Palm Beach County, and I want to thank
him again. Thank you, Freds.
Speaker 7 (28:58):
Billy Jones's Father is more more than just a story
about a boy and his father. It's an eye opening
journey into the emotional struggles faced by children in the
world of competitive sports. As you turn the pages, you'll
see how unrealistic expectations and unchecked ambitions can shape, mold,
and sometimes break a child's spirit. This book dives deep
(29:22):
into the human experiences that resonate with so many and
calls on us to reflect on the roles we play
in the lives of young athletes.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
Well, that's it for this week. For more why Johnny
Hates Sports, and again it was great having coach Brian
Cole with us. I hope you'll tune in next Friday
at eleven am and we'll be back with a new
issue talking about the elite travel teams for kids in
sports and how it's ruining what recreation ball used to be.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
This program is sponsored by Sir Dirff Publishing in the
interest or Better Sports for Kids, Better Kids for Life.
In this best selling book, a child, while failing to
live up to his father's expectations, is shamed and humiliated
beyond belief. He vows to never allow his own son
(30:22):
to face the same
The topics and opinions expressed in the following show are
solely those of the hosts and their guests, and not
those of w FOCY Radio. It's employees are affiliates. We
make no recommendations or endorsements for radio show programs, services,
or products mentioned on air or on our web.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
No liability, explicit or.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
Implied shall be extended to W FOURCY Radio or its
employees are affiliates. Any questions or comments should be directed
to those show hosts. Thank you for choosing W FOURCY Radio.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
Sports for kids in America began with what we affectionately
called sandlot ball, where kids organized their own games, made
their own rules, and played until the sun went down.
Then came along parents.
Speaker 4 (01:25):
The National Alliance for Youth Sports was born out of
a desire to bring order to the world of organized
sports for children in America. While for the most part,
children have a great experience playing sports, far too often
parents and coaches lose perspective. This program is aimed at
bringing some of America's best experts to talk about what
(01:46):
we can do to change the atmosphere of win at
all costs and parent poor behavior to one that focuses
on children having a positive learning experience through sports. Here's
our host, Fred eng Under of a National Alliance for
Youth Sports.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Hey, good morning everybody, and welcome to Why Johnny Hates Sports.
And today we got a guest that I'm very happy
to present to you. He was the Coach of the
Year in Palm Beach County football coach and then he
coaches other stuff. But what a great guy to have
(02:28):
on this program because he and I have talked about
an issue concerning the NIL. You know, it took me
a while for I figured out what NIL was, but
then I'm will let coach tell you what NIL means
even though I do know. So please welcome Brian Coke,
(02:49):
Coach of the Year. Boy to Brian, Hey, Brett, are
you doing?
Speaker 5 (02:53):
I coached you and I was back in twenty nineteen,
so that that ship has sailed, you know, I'm still having.
Speaker 6 (02:59):
A good time doing it and guiding youth.
Speaker 5 (03:04):
So you uh, The NIL stand for name, image and likeness,
and that's a way that these kids now in the
collegiate level have been afforded an opportunity to benefit from
their generating the money for the college programs over the
years where the NCAA dropped the ball on allowing them
to do so.
Speaker 6 (03:24):
They want a court case.
Speaker 5 (03:26):
So now these kids are able to get paid for
their contribution to these institutions raising you know, millions to
billions of dollars a year in college sports.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
That's to me kind of crazy. Coach. I was looking
at the thing the other day and this guy named
let me look here, Darren menshis he was going to
Tulane and then they went to Duke for eight million
bucks they gave him were going there. And then there's
another guy, Bryce Underwood. It was a high school player
(04:03):
and they gave it ten point five million dollars for
four years. I mean, he's in high school. And then
I mean, what is going on? Is this crazy or
what's your take on all this?
Speaker 6 (04:14):
It is crazy.
Speaker 5 (04:15):
I mean I understand the aspect of it as far
as like the collegiate sports, where these kids, you know,
everybody wants to say, well, they're getting a collegiate education.
Speaker 6 (04:24):
For that guest, I totally agree.
Speaker 5 (04:26):
However, these kids can't benefit from all the financial gains
that these institutions make from ticket sales to food and
beverags at games, to the TV rights, the parking and
all those things. That these kids helped generate there and
(04:48):
if they go to a function and sign autographs somewhere.
Speaker 6 (04:54):
Back in the day, they got, you know, declared ineligible.
So I understand that.
Speaker 5 (04:59):
Aspect of it, but I agree with you it is
getting out of hand in a sense of the purity
of college sports. I mean, we all sports fans enjoy
college sports more than we do pros at times, and
it's really messing that up. And my fear is when
it really gets into full swing with high schools, it's
going to be a terrible situation, a terrible situation for
(05:22):
high school athletics.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
Well, you say when it gets into the high school level,
has in it already to a certain degree, Yes.
Speaker 5 (05:31):
It's been approved, and of course everything starts out West Texas,
I believe was the first to do what I think,
and now it's coming across. It has been approved here
in Florida, but they haven't wrapped their head around how
to make it work yet because the high school institutions
are not permitted to have anything to be involved with it.
But once it gets figured out and they figure out
(05:52):
how to do this and pay these kids, high school
sports is going to be the wild wild West it's
going to be really crazy for these kids. Are the
coaches more so than the kids. The kids are going
to get what they want, but coaches are going to
have a very difficult time managing to run in a legitimate,
respectable program.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
Yeah, I mean, you've been around for a while, so
tell me. I mean, I remember, it just seemed like
yesterday that the nc double A was well against paid
college athletes, and they went into a big fight and
everything with you know whoever, and then all of a sudden,
it just seemed like overnight. Now we have all these
(06:36):
college athletes going from one college to another, getting paid,
you know, to go. And then the effects of what
I wonder is the booster clubs with all the money.
Speaker 6 (06:49):
How did this all change so quick? So like what happened?
You know, we had a couple of stories.
Speaker 5 (06:55):
I'm the biggest one was this kicker I think now
he's I believe he's kicking in USFL now forget his
name became a YouTube sensation and then the NCAA declared
him ineligible because he was making money off of who
you know, of being himself and he had gotten into.
Speaker 6 (07:10):
The whole thing.
Speaker 5 (07:11):
He was making a bunch of money so that prompted
the lawsuits and and things. From the perspective of the players,
I mean remember NCAA football used to be really big,
and then because the people are like, well, you guys
are making all this money by me, you know, the
college athletes, that it would stopped for a while because
you know, they stopped promoting because they couldn't use the
(07:33):
kids' names and stuff, and nobody was very interested. Now
that all this has come back, the money part of
it is being you know, generating. These kids are being
allowed to benefit from that. I think it's gone out
of control. And I think the NCAA, you know, they
have to look at themselves and bland themselves. I mean,
because they were in a situation they could have did
some type of litigation to allow these kids to you know,
(07:57):
make a little bit more money or whatever the case
may be, whether you know, whether we think is right
or not.
Speaker 6 (08:01):
But they could have been in control.
Speaker 5 (08:02):
But they let the laws get it, you know, the
the they let the you know, the law get it.
Speaker 6 (08:09):
Lawsuits happened, and and now this is what we have now.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
You use the term of you know, the wild wild West,
and and it just seems to me that's so correct,
because you know, I wondered about booster clubs. I remember,
I was a high school coach like you, and and
I knew the effect of booster clubs when I was coaching,
and they they kind of had control over the program
(08:35):
and certainly had control over me because they would buy
uniforms and everything and anything that I need as long
as I was winning. But I wonder, in the aspect
of the n C Double A and n I L
is what effect did booster clubs play in all of this?
I mean, you got you got a lot of people
(08:57):
with a lot of money. So you know, you got
one guys, like I said before, whatever his name was,
getting eight million dollars to go from too Lane to Duke.
What is it to say that they don't get twenty
five million dollars? I mean, the booster clubs have a
lot of money.
Speaker 5 (09:14):
And that's and that's what me and my friends that
we always talk about all the time.
Speaker 6 (09:18):
I mean, I knock on wood.
Speaker 5 (09:20):
Unfortunately I didn't have a booster club at the schools
I coached at where it allowed me to have more
economic support. But as far as a coach that wanted
to be in control of my own program. I didn't
have to answer to them, so I lucked out on that.
But I know a lot of places where, uh you know,
the small town areas where their sports, high school sports
(09:40):
are very big. Yes, the booster club does play a
very big role in mandating hiring and firing of coaches.
I mean, that's that's really big. And you know, those
are those things where you know, I had to tell
my guys, hey, be careful what you asked for. You
go get one of those big time positions in a
little small town and lose that big game with that
(10:00):
crosstown rival. You know, like the old movie I was
at on Friday Night Lights, that's that signs in your
front yard fire coach code, you know. So they're going
to have a big input on that. Like I said,
once it gets managed to where they know how and
what's acceptable and what's not acceptable.
Speaker 6 (10:22):
With reference to.
Speaker 5 (10:24):
The money being given to these high school kids, I
mean it's already been approved, but once they figured out, you're.
Speaker 6 (10:29):
Going to have what I what I call to have
versus the have not.
Speaker 5 (10:33):
Communities that have a lot of money from boosters and
businesses are gonna be able to entice these young men
and women to come to their schools and play.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Yeah, let's get down to another different topic, not topic,
but same topic, but different level. I'm talking about below
the high schools. When do you think that that's gonna happen?
I mean, I look around and I live in an area.
They got a park right across the street, and I
see elite soccer programs going on with these paid coaches
(11:08):
and kids out there that I'm saying, uh oh, these
kids are being recruited from one program to the other
because they're all trying to win these championships. And do
you see that maybe money would come into paying a
ten year old kid to play because he's exceptionally good.
Speaker 5 (11:28):
Yeah, I mean in a roundabout way. I mean, I
wouldn't say legally, are morally ethically those things are happening already.
I mean the travel program is a little bit different
in the sense that those kids and those families have
to pay for those program roster spots or whatever. But yes,
(11:49):
they are recruited to come play for certain teams. As
far as basketball, baseball, soccer, those things are very very
big travel season, So yes, they are being recruited to
come to places. But as far as the economics, with
that being in play, that's done.
Speaker 6 (12:07):
The problem that.
Speaker 5 (12:08):
I've noticed, especially as football is concerned, is when you
go to these parks and you see these little league
parks being played.
Speaker 6 (12:15):
You probably saw a couple of stories on ESPN years.
Speaker 5 (12:18):
Ago where these neighborhood individuals are paying these kids to
come play at their parks and paying them for performance
on the fields and touchdowns, score tackles made, making a
tackle that takes out the other teams.
Speaker 6 (12:38):
You know, they're you know, they.
Speaker 5 (12:39):
They are doing that quote under the table, and I
think that is horrendous to be doing in little league
sports or sports in general, let alone. You know, you
have eight, nine, ten year twelve year old kids out
there being paid to you know, score touchdowns and being
blamed if a team loses a game. I mean, it's crazy,
(13:02):
but it's happening.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Yeah, you talk about ten year olds being out there,
you know, with them being paid or whatever. But the
reason that they're getting paid and to make those tackles
and whatever they're doing is the fact that you know,
there's guys up in the stands that are betting money
(13:24):
on whose team wins. So that's influencing that to a
great degree. That's amazing how all of this that used
to be recreational sports, fun for kids and development, which
with the national lines for you, sports is all about,
is trying to make sports positive and safe for kids.
(13:46):
And yet you have all this new influence based on money.
So you know, I know that what you've done and
at the high school level has been tremendous. And you know,
I know the win loss records are one thing, but
it's so great when you have kids that come back
to you to tell you what you did to implode
(14:10):
improve their life and made it great because not only
are you telling them how to tackle and punt and
kick and throw whatever, but how to live life. And
I know that's what you based a lot of your
coaching on. You agree with that, I know one percent.
Speaker 5 (14:30):
I sit around Collage times and I tell people, you
know why, coach, I've never picked my family up and
moved to another county or state in order to get
a coaching job that would be more prestigious or whatever.
I would consider myself very blessed to be chosen to
be a high school coach at the places I've been.
(14:52):
And that's the one thing I hang my hat on
is the fact that I've had those moments that you know,
a kid came back. I mean, I had this one
particular moment where I was in that little what am
I doing moment. I'm not a head coach anymore. I'm
just a little league football coach. You know, what is
my purpose?
Speaker 2 (15:11):
What is it?
Speaker 5 (15:12):
Know?
Speaker 6 (15:12):
Whatever?
Speaker 5 (15:12):
And I had one of my former players come by
and give me a conversation such as that, and he said, Coach,
I never got a chance to tell you, thank you
for everything you told me when I was in high school.
Speaker 6 (15:23):
And that meant so much to me.
Speaker 5 (15:27):
And the last thing he said to me says, coach,
thank you, and if you ever get a chance, can
you coach my son?
Speaker 6 (15:33):
And that right there was worth a million dollars.
Speaker 5 (15:35):
I mean, is that answered my question and got my
head clear and put me back in a good place
for my own personal life because of that moment you
referred to.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
Yeah, that's so great for those kind of stories, let
me tell you one that's on the opposite side. We
do a training program for coaches and one of the
first ones that we did was using a video and
we had a sports psychologist who would be on the
screen and be talking about you know, the role that
(16:09):
coaches play in winning with kids in sports, and you
know why they come out for sports. And we let
the coaches talk about it amongst themselves. And when it
was over, I thought, okay, because the program was mandatory
that the coaches had to be there, and this coach,
the coach came up to me and pointed his finger
(16:34):
and I thought, oh, here he goes. He's going to say,
how come I had to come to this program. I
know all about coaching and I know everything. But he said, hey,
I want to ask you a question. I said, you
go ahead. He said, do you think I should be
a coach? I said, excuse me? Do you do you
(16:54):
think I should be a coach? He said? And I said,
why do you say that? He said, because I heard
all these other guys talking in the group I was in,
and they were talking about how important it was to
try to help kids and whatnot. And he said, but
I want to tell you something that's not what I did.
(17:15):
And I want to know do you think i'd for
sure really be a coach? And I said, of course
you should, because one thing you told me that this
program is working. And he turned around, took about two steps,
but the most critical thing he said when he came
back to me, he said, I want to tell you something.
(17:37):
I've ruined a lot of kids, and that has stuck
with me for all these years. And then I turned
around to hear your story about how important role you
play as a coach. So one thing that you did say, coach,
I read all the time, and I can't believe it.
(17:57):
Where Coach X goes to Georgia and signs is to
be ahead football coach and val dasta making wherever you
know that far it could be farther away, and I'm thinking,
wait a minute, this guy's going to uproot his whole
family and move to be a coach at the different
(18:18):
high school. Is a booster clubs paying him under the
table a lot of money? What goes on in these situations?
Speaker 6 (18:26):
Oh no, it's not anything wrong, slash or illegal about that.
Speaker 5 (18:31):
I mean when you get to those like I said,
when you get to those towns like that, like your Georgia's,
your Alabama's, your Northern States Texas, those places.
Speaker 6 (18:41):
I mean, football, high school sports is big. I mean
there's nothing wrong with that. I mean it is big.
Speaker 5 (18:46):
Unfortunately, sometimes it gets it gets taken away from what
you and I talk about all the time as being
the true essence of youth sports, which is to help
raise young men and women that can be productive citizens
and be part of a team, be it an athletic team,
be it a group project in school, be it on
(19:07):
the job when they become a professional.
Speaker 6 (19:09):
And that's why most of us do what we do.
Speaker 5 (19:13):
Some people are professionals and this is what they do
as a profession I'm an educator that coaches. There's a
lot that are professionals, and yes, when those opportunities to
move on, I'm not mad.
Speaker 6 (19:24):
That's what they want to do.
Speaker 5 (19:25):
They want to go to that big time job and
get paid and those and those those places pay their
coaches very well. You know, I think Florida now is
in a possibility where they're looking to legislation. Talks are
happening to pay coaches better because a lot of good,
really good coaches are leaving the state because we don't
(19:45):
pay our coaches very well.
Speaker 6 (19:47):
But that's in talks right now.
Speaker 5 (19:49):
But there's nothing wrong with that with the coaches going
to move to do that as long as they're for me.
My only judgment is, hey, are you raising young men?
Are you raising young men women, when you go to
these places, if you're doing that, and you're providing for
your family and taking care of your own personal wants
and wishes, because we all have to have a drive,
we all have to have a purpose, and yes, helping
(20:12):
kids become better people it should be the basis of that.
But then you know, hey, you want to submit your
personal selfish mark on this sport or whatever sport it
is as well, and I can't blame it for that.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
You know, I mentioned before the fact that you were
the coach of the year in Palm Beach County. Now
a lot of people may be watching this and saying, well,
you know, Palm Beach County, how many of you high
schools are there? But there are plenty of high schools
and football is very important in Palm Beach County. But
I want to ask you this important question. You gave
(20:49):
it all up. Why it was time?
Speaker 5 (20:53):
I promised myself that, well we'll back up a little
bit further.
Speaker 6 (20:59):
You know, in my minority coach in Palmbi's county.
Speaker 5 (21:02):
When I first started, there were only two black head
football coaches in the county, and I was coaching and
educate teaching, and I realized that the young kids didn't
have that leader, the head.
Speaker 6 (21:17):
Football coach that looked like them.
Speaker 5 (21:19):
They didn't have that mentor to say, oh, I could
be a head coach if I want to do this.
So that was my drive to be a head coach,
and I became a head football coach. You know, you're
coaching and trying to earn the respect of your peers
is one of the big things that we do. We
want to know that our peers respect us, not because
we want a championship because of the type of program
(21:41):
you have, because how your kids act on and off
the field, that's what you really shouldn't be judged by,
in my opinion. And went through that whole thing and
then I wasn't a head coach for a while, and
then I said to myself, Hey, can I do this?
Speaker 6 (21:55):
Can I really coach? Do I know what I'm doing?
Speaker 5 (21:58):
And so when I got the opportunity to be here
said Rancious High School, I said to myself, Okay, I'm
gonna go all out. I'm gonna do everything that I
think I need to do, get good people around me,
raise young men and women that are evolved in my program.
And when it becomes not fun for me anymore. Selfishly,
then I'm going to back away. And after the COVID season,
(22:18):
I didn't see it going.
Speaker 6 (22:20):
To be enjoyable for me anymore.
Speaker 5 (22:22):
So I knew it was time for me to step
away because I wasn't going to be as productive as
I want to be when leading the football program.
Speaker 2 (22:31):
You mentioned the fact that there were only two African
American coaches when you started. Did you set a trend? Now?
Are there more African American head coaches?
Speaker 6 (22:44):
Yes? In the county. I don't know if I set
the trend, but the.
Speaker 5 (22:47):
Opportunities have made themselves, you know, and we've had, you know,
a good representation good quality coaches. And it wasn't anything,
oh you're a minority here, we're going to hire you. No,
we've had since I started back in shoot was in
ninety ninety one, was when I first started coaching in
the county. We've had several minority head coaches come through
and they've done excellent jobs.
Speaker 6 (23:08):
So that's a good a testament to the times and change.
Speaker 5 (23:12):
And then everybody you know that are deserved and that
have the you know, be affording.
Speaker 6 (23:17):
The opportunity to coach.
Speaker 5 (23:19):
And I'm very proud of Pobbach County and what we've
done with affording you know, different types of people and
personalities to lead to leave young men and women.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
I want to leave you with one last question. I
got to ask a question all the time, especially in
the name of the show. It's called Why Johnny Hates Sports?
And people say, why does Johnny hate sports? And I say, well,
first of all, Johnny's six years old and he doesn't
know or she doesn't know what she wants to do,
(23:52):
but their parents want to know in so many overwhelming cases,
and they say, you're going to play little league baseball, football, basketball, whatever,
it doesn't matter. So they get thrust into this situation.
Some of them the other athletes, some of them have competitiveness,
but they're thrust into it. And then somebody says, well,
(24:14):
who's going to coach your kid? And then they say, well,
I don't because I don't know anything about coach. Well,
if you don't coach, then your kid's not going to
get a chance to play. So you got to coach.
So now you got Billy Jones's father or mother that
gets recruited that knows nothing about it, and therefore you
(24:36):
also recruit somebody that should not even be around kids.
And then the next thing is why Johnny eight Sports,
is you now have a league that has formed that
has a whole bunch of these coaches that have never
been trained, never told what this is all about. And
the only thing that they look is see is the scoreboard, championships,
(24:59):
all star games, things that are focused on nothing but
winning at all costs, and so many situations. So I'm
going to ask you this, have you ever witnessed that
type of situation in your career?
Speaker 6 (25:16):
Oh? Yeah, most definitely, from little league to I think,
I mean, unfortunately.
Speaker 5 (25:23):
By these people that get into coaching for what I'd
say is, you know, a selfish or into.
Speaker 6 (25:30):
A wrong reason.
Speaker 5 (25:32):
You know, they taint the professional coaching because they do
we used to call daddy ball and they take their
child and they put them in football, put them at quarterback,
you know, and the kid doesn't have the ability to play.
Speaker 6 (25:47):
Quarterback and it becomes frustrating.
Speaker 5 (25:50):
Or in baseball, they take their kid and put him
at shortstop, clean up hitter and the kid's not that
at Youth sports should be a tool for young kids,
boys and girls to learn the values of teamwork. That
is basically what it is, there's a very select few
(26:12):
that will make it to the ultimum level of professional football,
professional basketball, baseball, softball, whatever it is. There's only a
select few that's going to make it to collegiate athletics
and earn a scholarship or have an opportunity to play.
And unfortunately parents don't understand that, they don't realize or
(26:34):
they refuse to accept the fact that your child's not
that person, but he or she deserves an opportunity to
try to play. But once they get to high school
and you get cut, if you're not that talented, then
you get cut.
Speaker 6 (26:46):
But that's life.
Speaker 5 (26:47):
You're supposed to fail or have those negative moments in
life to be better people. But you know, parents have
a tendency to try to protect their child or provide
an opportunity to their child. Will you know, benefit from,
uh those special moments of being the quarterback and the
(27:07):
starting point guard, the shortstop, the picture, the you know,
the striker in soccer.
Speaker 6 (27:14):
But they didn't earn it. They're not that good, and
that sets the child up to have issues later on
in life.
Speaker 5 (27:20):
So, uh, it's it's very unfortunate that it's out there
that is still happening, and I think organizations like yourself,
you know, should, should, should be afforded opportunities to get
into these youth organizations and provide knowledge beyond x's and
o's to these moms and dads and men and women
(27:42):
that are trying to coach for the right reason.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
Wow, you sound you sound exactly like me forty years
ago when I and I created and founded the National
Lines for youth sports. And it's amazing that you're you're
saying all these things, but it doesn't surprise me at all. Coaches,
but I just want to thank you very much for
your time, and not only just today but for what
(28:09):
you've done for kids in sports. So again, thanks again.
Speaker 6 (28:14):
Hey, I appreciate you, Fred Again, thanks for having me.
I really enjoyed it. And I hope some of the
things that we talked.
Speaker 5 (28:20):
About get out there and and and if it helps
one coach, one parent, you know, I think our time
was well spent and I have no problem anytime you
need me.
Speaker 6 (28:32):
I'm here for you.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
Okay, thank you from more than that. So, today we've
had with US coach Brian co the Coach of the
Year for Palm Beach County, and I want to thank
him again. Thank you, Freds.
Speaker 7 (28:58):
Billy Jones's Father is more more than just a story
about a boy and his father. It's an eye opening
journey into the emotional struggles faced by children in the
world of competitive sports. As you turn the pages, you'll
see how unrealistic expectations and unchecked ambitions can shape, mold,
and sometimes break a child's spirit. This book dives deep
(29:22):
into the human experiences that resonate with so many and
calls on us to reflect on the roles we play
in the lives of young athletes.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
Well, that's it for this week. For more why Johnny
Hates Sports, and again it was great having coach Brian
Cole with us. I hope you'll tune in next Friday
at eleven am and we'll be back with a new
issue talking about the elite travel teams for kids in
sports and how it's ruining what recreation ball used to be.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
This program is sponsored by Sir Dirff Publishing in the
interest or Better Sports for Kids, Better Kids for Life.
In this best selling book, a child, while failing to
live up to his father's expectations, is shamed and humiliated
beyond belief. He vows to never allow his own son
(30:22):
to face the same
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