November 17, 2025 • 12 mins
This is a quick tutorial for making things more accessible and checking for accessibility when creating documents mostly in MS Office and Adobe. So, this will be a how-to with recommendations and a little commentary. Let us know about your accessibility strategies.
Join our supporter's club: www.patreon.com/wwdwwdpodcast
Links and References: https://webaim.org/resources/contrastchecker/
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/why-we-do-what-we-do--3419521/support.
Support our podcast: www.patreon.com/wwdwwdpodcast
Join our supporter's club: www.patreon.com/wwdwwdpodcast
Links and References: https://webaim.org/resources/contrastchecker/
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/why-we-do-what-we-do--3419521/support.
Support our podcast: www.patreon.com/wwdwwdpodcast
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
You're listening to Why we Do what we Do. Welcome
to Why We Do what we Do Mini. I am
your host Abraham and I'm your O Shane. We are
a psychology podcast. We talk about the things that humans
(00:24):
and non human animals do. In these mini episodes. We
just take a short topic and we get in there
like fifteen minutes and then get out and let you
go about your day. And it's really quick and it's easy,
and it's fun and everybody likes it and that's why
we do them. And they're minis.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
It's just a bite size. It's a bite size us.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Yeah, And I apologize to listeners if my voice is
sounding a little off. I am a little under the
weather right now. Hopefully it is not too distracting. And
if you're joining us for the first time, you have
nothing to compare it to, so as far as you're concerned,
it's just sultry goodness. But for everyone else who's more
familiar with the rich, leathery tambur of my normal voice
with weather, yeah, of all the things, Yeah, the vegan
(01:02):
with a leathery voice. Anyway, this is a medi It's
a short one. If you would like to support what
we do as a podcast, you can pick up some
merch like and subscribe, rate, review, tell a friend, join
us on Patreon. I'll talk more about those things at
the end of this discussion. But this one's a little
unique among the minis, mostly in the sense that we
(01:25):
are currently in the middle of a suite of episodes
about disability and accessibility, and for the most part, we
really hadn't planned to have the minis follow suit and
beyond that same topic. It was really just going to
be our full length discussions. But there was one discussion
that is either going to be published before pretty soon
(01:46):
before or after this episode drops, and the content for
this felt like it didn't belong in that episode, so
we decided to put it into a mini. So this
one will be about accessibility and disability.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Yes, and we're so excited about it. I think this
will be really cool, especially somebody who does a lot
of presentations. Yeah, I'm really excited to learn about some
new tools and like to really make this make this
really like, really make my presentations pop very good.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
Yeah, this is going to be a how to type episode.
We're going to talk about how to plan for designing
with accessibility in mind, and the materials that you create,
particularly around the Microsoft Office Suite, but it'll be around
multiple things. But yeah, that's going to be sort of
the main point of this.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Yeah, let's do it.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
Okay, So just diving in here, I'm going to try
and keep this as light and fun as possible while
also being like it's a how to, like it's really informative.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Okay.
Speaker 1 (02:39):
First of all, there's some features that are fairly identical
across various Microsoft Office Suite platforms that we'll get to.
But one of the things to know is as you're
designing a PowerPoint, So people who use powerpoints, particularly if
you're giving a presentation, all slides in a PowerPoint must
have a title, even if you end up blocking the
title with an image or something else, or you could
(03:00):
even potentially put the title on there and then wipe
it out so it looks invisible. Ensure there is a
title on the slide, and there's a specific reason for that.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:09):
Screen readers are common accessibility tools for people with visual impairments.
So people who have enabled screen readers can use the
screen reader to describe slides and other documents to them.
So there are some important considerations to ensure that the
screen reader works as well as possible.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
And having the title is one of the ways. And
I don't think we mentioned this later, but all slide
titles should be unique from one another. So if you
are doing like let's say you're presenting on a study
or something, it might be methods Slide one of three,
and then your next slide is method Slide two of three,
or it could be Methods continued if there was only
two slides or something. But every title needs to be
(03:45):
unique so that people understand as they're using their screen
reader that they're onto a new slide as they go.
But one of the tools that also works with the
screen readers is called alt text alt t ext. This
is a brief description of something, usually a visual something
or other. All images must have alt text to facilitate accessibility,
(04:09):
and particularly for those screen readers, unless they are decorative.
As long as the image is essential to the content,
then it should have all text. But if it's not,
you can simply click on the image and select it
as decorative.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
So to add all text.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
When you add an image, you can select the format
picture tab or click the right click drop down menu,
select all text, and write a brief description.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
So for example, if you had an image of let's
say a graph, you could say, this is a graph
showing instances of this behavior, with the y axis going
from zero to one hundred and as a percent of intervals,
and the x access going from zero to twenty of sessions,
and like that could be sort of the brief description
of something that's like a quick description of what that
(04:57):
thing is, and that case a graph, but it could
be of basically something else, right, things that are like logos,
you usually just going to mark as decorative right. Another
tool that facilitates the screen readers able to access these
is using the slide layout templates that come with PowerPoint.
These are designed to organize text in the order that
they're intended to be read by the audience. Similarly, in
(05:17):
MS word, you want to use those header formats. They
have like automatic formats to prioritize different texts, and you
can modify the formats because one of the issues is
you might select and be like, I don't want my
text to look like that. You can create your own
defaults so that when you select it it defaults to
the formatting you want for that, or you can simply
apply those headers and then modify the font however you
want afterwards. That's how you go about using those templates
(05:40):
and formats to ensure that the screen readers can follow them.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
Yeah, I mean that makes sense.
Speaker 3 (05:44):
I think sometimes what we'll find is that, like when
it comes to templates, they're super easy and super great,
Like you can just kind of copy and paste in
the templates too, which is really nice, which is a
lot of times what ads do, Like ads will through
that world will just kind of like drop in like
you know, formats and then they'll just play like right.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Now, Yeah, okay, we are back and we are continuing
on with this very riveting discussion about how to make
things more accessible.
Speaker 3 (06:14):
Yeah, so if you're not sure whether you have created
accessible materials, you can use the check Accessibility feature which
is built in the software platforms, which is really cool.
So in Microsoft for Mac and PC, under the review tab,
select check Accessibility. It will list the design features important
for accessibility and identify where and to what extent what
(06:35):
you have designed meets or fails accessibility standards in some
direction as to how to improve that accessibility, which is
really nice. It's like a tool that tells you, hey,
like this doesn't quite like meet the mark, so let's
do a little bit better.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Yeah, it'll point out things like contrast is low, like
improve your contrast ratio, or like this image doesn't have
alt text at all text things like that, So they're
really like it lists all of them and you can
just go through and check on them. Truly handy. Yeah,
that feature is actually not available by default in Google Docs.
For this, you'll need to install a check accessibility add
(07:07):
on for Google Docs. It is free, only takes like
I'm minute to install now, like the other things, Google
Docs does have some accessibility tools already built in for
the user side, so they can select things from the
accessibility menu, but as far as checking for accessibility, you
have to install that as a separate add on.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
Yeah. When it comes to fonts.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
That's whatever one's really here for. They're here for the fonts.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Yeah, like, yeah, for fonts, right, So when it comes
to fonts, ideally, anything that's sans Sarah is ideal. So
you've also got aerial Calibri or Calibri open sands to
home of Veranda. They all sound like coffees as well. Verdonna, Verdona,
Oh my god, whatever Verona.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
You know my Sharona, my Sharona Verdonna.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
So there are some accessible saraph fonts Century Gothic, Helvetica, Georgia, Times,
New Roman, anything that just basically makes it so that
the lettering is really clear and not like, you know,
you're not guilding the lily by making it too fancy.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
Do you know what the serafs are?
Speaker 2 (08:10):
I have no idea I learn it. I don't know.
I'm so excited to learn right now.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
Sarah's are those little flares they put on letters where
it's like at the bottom of the letter, like where
an H might start is sort of flares out at
the bottom or the top of the line. That's what
a seraph is. And so any sans Sarah sands is
French for without Yeah, so it just means without Sarah.
So not all sands Sarah fonts are considered accessible, but
sans Sarah fons are generally more accessible than Sarah fonse,
(08:38):
with some of those exceptions that you read like Times
in Roman.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Okay. Adobe also is not particularly well set up for
checking for accessibility. To do this, what you have to
do is go into when you if you're using Adobe
and you're trying to check for accessibility for something you've made,
You got to go into Tools, look for the accessibility panel,
and then you can select from their accessibility check and
then make sure you check options that are available for
checking for accessibility, and then you click start checking, and
(09:05):
then it will create from there a report of any
issues that might require manual review or that could potentially
even be fixed automatically. But it's it's more cumbersome than
anything in Microsoft.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
Now, appropriate contrast is important for people with visual impairments
and without really, I mean, if you've ever seen like
a PowerPoint that like the colors are too close or
it's hard to read the lettering, you kind of go like,
this is feah, it just sucks. There is a contrast
checker which will include in the show notes I believe.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
Yeah, it's a you know, I won't read the whole
thing here web aim dot org.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Yeah is probably the best way to say that.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:40):
So Now this allows you to select the color or
use a dropper tool to click on a color for
the foreground and background to determine the contrast ratio. It
will tell you how accessible the contrast is per type
of accessibility at standard and at different font hierarchies, which
is really nice.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
So there's like there's a single D and triple A
accessibility standards. Triple A is like the most it is
a very difficult standard to meet most of the time.
If you're doing double A accessibility, you're doing a really
good job. Yeah, and that's kind of the goal. I mean,
if you can get to triple A, great, But this
will tell you, based on the font size and the
contrast ratio, how accessible the font is. The larger the font,
(10:19):
the more accessible it's going to be, generally speaking. But
of course, if you have font that's so gigantic that
one letter takes up more than the entire screen, nobody
can read that, you know, within reason, right, Yeah, Okay,
I think that's what we have to say in our
riveting topic about how to use Microsoft.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Yeah, but you know what, at the end of the day,
it's going to make you a better presenter and make
your materials much better for everybody involved.
Speaker 1 (10:41):
Yeah, just to just as a way to consider, like,
as you're making stuff, make it with the broadest possible
audience in mind, and these are some things you can
do to make that possible.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
Yep, nailed it perfect. All right, very good.
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Well, if you would like to tell us your thoughts
on accessibility, you can email us directly at info at
WWDWWD podcast. You can also reach us on the social
media platforms. If you join us on Patreon, then I'm
going to read your name in the list of names
of people who support us at the end of our
full length discussions, and at the end of the minutes,
I'll say thank you, patron supporters. We appreciate you, we
love you. Yes. Otherwise you can support us. You can
(11:16):
like and subscribe, leave a rating and a review, tell
a friend, just like anything that like when you like
an episode, that makes it more likely that we show
up as a suggested thing in people's feed. If you
go tell a friend, then maybe they will listen to
episode and they'll be like, this was really boring, but
it's cool that you recommended it. Hopefully not. But I'm
just coming around the description of how you use Microsoft
(11:36):
Office anyway. I think that is what I have to
say about that. Thank you so much to my team
of people without whom I could not make this podcast.
Thank you all for listening. Thank you for recording with
me today.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Shane, Hey anytime.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
Is there anything that I missed or anything you'd like
to add before we wrap up?
Speaker 2 (11:49):
Nope, not right now?
Speaker 1 (11:50):
All right, go forth and be accessible. This Sabram, It's Shane.
Why We Do What we Do? Mini is out. Bye.
Speaker 4 (11:57):
You've been listening to Why We Do What We Do.
You can learn more about this and other episodes by
going to ww D ww.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
D podcast dot com.
Speaker 4 (12:07):
Thanks for listening, and we hope you have an awesome day.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
I think our front here right
You're listening to Why we Do what we Do. Welcome
to Why We Do what we Do Mini. I am
your host Abraham and I'm your O Shane. We are
a psychology podcast. We talk about the things that humans
(00:24):
and non human animals do. In these mini episodes. We
just take a short topic and we get in there
like fifteen minutes and then get out and let you
go about your day. And it's really quick and it's easy,
and it's fun and everybody likes it and that's why
we do them. And they're minis.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
It's just a bite size. It's a bite size us.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Yeah, And I apologize to listeners if my voice is
sounding a little off. I am a little under the
weather right now. Hopefully it is not too distracting. And
if you're joining us for the first time, you have
nothing to compare it to, so as far as you're concerned,
it's just sultry goodness. But for everyone else who's more
familiar with the rich, leathery tambur of my normal voice
with weather, yeah, of all the things, Yeah, the vegan
(01:02):
with a leathery voice. Anyway, this is a medi It's
a short one. If you would like to support what
we do as a podcast, you can pick up some
merch like and subscribe, rate, review, tell a friend, join
us on Patreon. I'll talk more about those things at
the end of this discussion. But this one's a little
unique among the minis, mostly in the sense that we
(01:25):
are currently in the middle of a suite of episodes
about disability and accessibility, and for the most part, we
really hadn't planned to have the minis follow suit and
beyond that same topic. It was really just going to
be our full length discussions. But there was one discussion
that is either going to be published before pretty soon
(01:46):
before or after this episode drops, and the content for
this felt like it didn't belong in that episode, so
we decided to put it into a mini. So this
one will be about accessibility and disability.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Yes, and we're so excited about it. I think this
will be really cool, especially somebody who does a lot
of presentations. Yeah, I'm really excited to learn about some
new tools and like to really make this make this
really like, really make my presentations pop very good.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
Yeah, this is going to be a how to type episode.
We're going to talk about how to plan for designing
with accessibility in mind, and the materials that you create,
particularly around the Microsoft Office Suite, but it'll be around
multiple things. But yeah, that's going to be sort of
the main point of this.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Yeah, let's do it.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
Okay, So just diving in here, I'm going to try
and keep this as light and fun as possible while
also being like it's a how to, like it's really informative.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Okay.
Speaker 1 (02:39):
First of all, there's some features that are fairly identical
across various Microsoft Office Suite platforms that we'll get to.
But one of the things to know is as you're
designing a PowerPoint, So people who use powerpoints, particularly if
you're giving a presentation, all slides in a PowerPoint must
have a title, even if you end up blocking the
title with an image or something else, or you could
(03:00):
even potentially put the title on there and then wipe
it out so it looks invisible. Ensure there is a
title on the slide, and there's a specific reason for that.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:09):
Screen readers are common accessibility tools for people with visual impairments.
So people who have enabled screen readers can use the
screen reader to describe slides and other documents to them.
So there are some important considerations to ensure that the
screen reader works as well as possible.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
And having the title is one of the ways. And
I don't think we mentioned this later, but all slide
titles should be unique from one another. So if you
are doing like let's say you're presenting on a study
or something, it might be methods Slide one of three,
and then your next slide is method Slide two of three,
or it could be Methods continued if there was only
two slides or something. But every title needs to be
(03:45):
unique so that people understand as they're using their screen
reader that they're onto a new slide as they go.
But one of the tools that also works with the
screen readers is called alt text alt t ext. This
is a brief description of something, usually a visual something
or other. All images must have alt text to facilitate accessibility,
(04:09):
and particularly for those screen readers, unless they are decorative.
As long as the image is essential to the content,
then it should have all text. But if it's not,
you can simply click on the image and select it
as decorative.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
So to add all text.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
When you add an image, you can select the format
picture tab or click the right click drop down menu,
select all text, and write a brief description.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
So for example, if you had an image of let's
say a graph, you could say, this is a graph
showing instances of this behavior, with the y axis going
from zero to one hundred and as a percent of intervals,
and the x access going from zero to twenty of sessions,
and like that could be sort of the brief description
of something that's like a quick description of what that
(04:57):
thing is, and that case a graph, but it could
be of basically something else, right, things that are like logos,
you usually just going to mark as decorative right. Another
tool that facilitates the screen readers able to access these
is using the slide layout templates that come with PowerPoint.
These are designed to organize text in the order that
they're intended to be read by the audience. Similarly, in
(05:17):
MS word, you want to use those header formats. They
have like automatic formats to prioritize different texts, and you
can modify the formats because one of the issues is
you might select and be like, I don't want my
text to look like that. You can create your own
defaults so that when you select it it defaults to
the formatting you want for that, or you can simply
apply those headers and then modify the font however you
want afterwards. That's how you go about using those templates
(05:40):
and formats to ensure that the screen readers can follow them.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
Yeah, I mean that makes sense.
Speaker 3 (05:44):
I think sometimes what we'll find is that, like when
it comes to templates, they're super easy and super great,
Like you can just kind of copy and paste in
the templates too, which is really nice, which is a
lot of times what ads do, Like ads will through
that world will just kind of like drop in like
you know, formats and then they'll just play like right.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Now, Yeah, okay, we are back and we are continuing
on with this very riveting discussion about how to make
things more accessible.
Speaker 3 (06:14):
Yeah, so if you're not sure whether you have created
accessible materials, you can use the check Accessibility feature which
is built in the software platforms, which is really cool.
So in Microsoft for Mac and PC, under the review tab,
select check Accessibility. It will list the design features important
for accessibility and identify where and to what extent what
(06:35):
you have designed meets or fails accessibility standards in some
direction as to how to improve that accessibility, which is
really nice. It's like a tool that tells you, hey,
like this doesn't quite like meet the mark, so let's
do a little bit better.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Yeah, it'll point out things like contrast is low, like
improve your contrast ratio, or like this image doesn't have
alt text at all text things like that, So they're
really like it lists all of them and you can
just go through and check on them. Truly handy. Yeah,
that feature is actually not available by default in Google Docs.
For this, you'll need to install a check accessibility add
(07:07):
on for Google Docs. It is free, only takes like
I'm minute to install now, like the other things, Google
Docs does have some accessibility tools already built in for
the user side, so they can select things from the
accessibility menu, but as far as checking for accessibility, you
have to install that as a separate add on.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
Yeah. When it comes to fonts.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
That's whatever one's really here for. They're here for the fonts.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Yeah, like, yeah, for fonts, right, So when it comes
to fonts, ideally, anything that's sans Sarah is ideal. So
you've also got aerial Calibri or Calibri open sands to
home of Veranda. They all sound like coffees as well. Verdonna, Verdona,
Oh my god, whatever Verona.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
You know my Sharona, my Sharona Verdonna.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
So there are some accessible saraph fonts Century Gothic, Helvetica, Georgia, Times,
New Roman, anything that just basically makes it so that
the lettering is really clear and not like, you know,
you're not guilding the lily by making it too fancy.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
Do you know what the serafs are?
Speaker 2 (08:10):
I have no idea I learn it. I don't know.
I'm so excited to learn right now.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
Sarah's are those little flares they put on letters where
it's like at the bottom of the letter, like where
an H might start is sort of flares out at
the bottom or the top of the line. That's what
a seraph is. And so any sans Sarah sands is
French for without Yeah, so it just means without Sarah.
So not all sands Sarah fonts are considered accessible, but
sans Sarah fons are generally more accessible than Sarah fonse,
(08:38):
with some of those exceptions that you read like Times
in Roman.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Okay. Adobe also is not particularly well set up for
checking for accessibility. To do this, what you have to
do is go into when you if you're using Adobe
and you're trying to check for accessibility for something you've made,
You got to go into Tools, look for the accessibility panel,
and then you can select from their accessibility check and
then make sure you check options that are available for
checking for accessibility, and then you click start checking, and
(09:05):
then it will create from there a report of any
issues that might require manual review or that could potentially
even be fixed automatically. But it's it's more cumbersome than
anything in Microsoft.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
Now, appropriate contrast is important for people with visual impairments
and without really, I mean, if you've ever seen like
a PowerPoint that like the colors are too close or
it's hard to read the lettering, you kind of go like,
this is feah, it just sucks. There is a contrast
checker which will include in the show notes I believe.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
Yeah, it's a you know, I won't read the whole
thing here web aim dot org.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Yeah is probably the best way to say that.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:40):
So Now this allows you to select the color or
use a dropper tool to click on a color for
the foreground and background to determine the contrast ratio. It
will tell you how accessible the contrast is per type
of accessibility at standard and at different font hierarchies, which
is really nice.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
So there's like there's a single D and triple A
accessibility standards. Triple A is like the most it is
a very difficult standard to meet most of the time.
If you're doing double A accessibility, you're doing a really
good job. Yeah, and that's kind of the goal. I mean,
if you can get to triple A, great, But this
will tell you, based on the font size and the
contrast ratio, how accessible the font is. The larger the font,
(10:19):
the more accessible it's going to be, generally speaking. But
of course, if you have font that's so gigantic that
one letter takes up more than the entire screen, nobody
can read that, you know, within reason, right, Yeah, Okay,
I think that's what we have to say in our
riveting topic about how to use Microsoft.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Yeah, but you know what, at the end of the day,
it's going to make you a better presenter and make
your materials much better for everybody involved.
Speaker 1 (10:41):
Yeah, just to just as a way to consider, like,
as you're making stuff, make it with the broadest possible
audience in mind, and these are some things you can
do to make that possible.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
Yep, nailed it perfect. All right, very good.
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Well, if you would like to tell us your thoughts
on accessibility, you can email us directly at info at
WWDWWD podcast. You can also reach us on the social
media platforms. If you join us on Patreon, then I'm
going to read your name in the list of names
of people who support us at the end of our
full length discussions, and at the end of the minutes,
I'll say thank you, patron supporters. We appreciate you, we
love you. Yes. Otherwise you can support us. You can
(11:16):
like and subscribe, leave a rating and a review, tell
a friend, just like anything that like when you like
an episode, that makes it more likely that we show
up as a suggested thing in people's feed. If you
go tell a friend, then maybe they will listen to
episode and they'll be like, this was really boring, but
it's cool that you recommended it. Hopefully not. But I'm
just coming around the description of how you use Microsoft
(11:36):
Office anyway. I think that is what I have to
say about that. Thank you so much to my team
of people without whom I could not make this podcast.
Thank you all for listening. Thank you for recording with
me today.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Shane, Hey anytime.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
Is there anything that I missed or anything you'd like
to add before we wrap up?
Speaker 2 (11:49):
Nope, not right now?
Speaker 1 (11:50):
All right, go forth and be accessible. This Sabram, It's Shane.
Why We Do What we Do? Mini is out. Bye.
Speaker 4 (11:57):
You've been listening to Why We Do What We Do.
You can learn more about this and other episodes by
going to ww D ww.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
D podcast dot com.
Speaker 4 (12:07):
Thanks for listening, and we hope you have an awesome day.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
I think our front here right
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