October 11, 2024 • 35 mins
In 2024 when everything and everyone is on display in a 24-hour loop worldwide, how important is your visibility and the visibility of your brand? Businesses that deserve recognition but don’t have it yet, and leaders who deserve a space as a thought leader and want to be visible with ease and purpose. This is where our guest, Angela Cross, shines.
Connect with Angela:
Like the show? Be sure to Like, Subscribe, Review and Share! Interested in being a part of WEE? Reach out to our group liaison, Kelli@WomenExcellingEverywhere.com
Connect with Angela:
Like the show? Be sure to Like, Subscribe, Review and Share! Interested in being a part of WEE? Reach out to our group liaison, Kelli@WomenExcellingEverywhere.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Welcome everyone to the Women Excelling Everywhere Podcast. I am
Julie Anderson, your host Akay Brand Lady Julie, and I'm
very honored and excited to be here with another great interview.
We are with Women Excelling Everywhere, and our goal is
to help women excel wherever they're at, at whatever part
of their journey they are in in business, or in
(00:30):
personal life or in relationships. And one of the ways
we do that is by highlighting and showcasing amazing women
who are on their entrepreneurial journey or their growth journey
and they have a message to share that will be
beneficial to those who listen. And that is no exception
to the amazing guests that we have here today, Angela Cross. Angela,
(00:52):
thank you so much for being a guest on the show.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
Oh thanks for having me, Julie. I'm really excited about
talking with you.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Yes, I am as well. And as you can tell
by her accent, she is joining Angela is joining us
from a completely different time zone, all the way down
in Australia, and so we're honored to have an international
guest as well as there are international viewers that we have,
so they'll enjoy that as well, So thank you so
much for being here. And I'm going to introduce you
(01:20):
formally by reading your formal bio and then we'll get
to know the real Angela. So with more than two
PR and crisis and issue management, Angela has led led
reputation programs for multi national businesses, built thought leadership strategies
(01:40):
for businesses and leaders, and has been diving the driving
force behind a successful creation of CEO and executive profiles. Today,
she applies the asset based approach to reputation that she
utilized was utilized with her corporate clients to deliver results
focused platform reputation strategies for two types of clients businesses
(02:04):
that deserve recognition but don't have it yet, and I
know there's some of you out there and leaders who
deserve a space as a thought leader and want to
be visible with ease and purpose. She does this through
her company PILOTPR dot com, dot au and she is
also on LinkedIn. So we're going to give all of
those ways to contact Angela at the end of the show.
(02:25):
But Angela, welcome to the Women Excelling Everywhere podcast.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
I am I am excited. You know, PR is something
that I've often has often just like confused, the you
know what out of mean, it's a confusing topic for me.
It's kind of its own, its own dimension in a business,
and I do I do a lot of leadership coaching,
(02:55):
but it's I like that that piece that you deal
with leaders who does that space as thought leadership but
aren't able to be visible. So there's a lot of
a lot of room for amazing women like you who
are and men who are out there driving force for
PR to help those women get visibility, help those individuals
(03:16):
get visibility in their space. So I might start the
first question I'd like to ask you, and I asked
this of all my clients or all of my guests,
is I'd like to hear kind of what drove them.
So you were obviously in corporate for quite a while
and now you're on your own. So what drew you
into that space as a I mean, because you were
(03:39):
in not just PR. Were you in the crisis management?
Did that did you take the PR angle like having
to you know, deal with the PR the public side
of what people saw during crisis or were you boots
on the ground helping companies deal with the crisis in
the moment.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
The former option. So before starting Pilot PR, I worked
in PR consultancies, so working with a range of clients
in the corporate space, and most of my clients would
have a crisis or issues requirement because they were operating
in an industry that tended to get you know, negative attention,
(04:24):
whether it was insurance or construction, you know, property development, environmental,
sort of that kind of space. But with those clients
I worked on sort of whole of reputation PR work.
So it might be crisis and issues management when they
needed it, but it might be profiling for their CEO
(04:47):
or their leadership team. Also PR for the business, so
you know, announcing new products, initiatives, milestones, growth, anything like that.
And the way I got into doing what I do
now was a bit of a two stage process, I guess.
(05:07):
So eleven years ago I had my first baby and
I left PR consulting to have him, and when it
was time to go back to work, I sort of
had the opportunity to do my own thing, and I
felt like that would work for me as an individual
(05:30):
because it meant that I could at the time work
from home and be you know, around for my son
and my growing family, but also do work that had
meaning for me and continue my career and keep working
with clients that I cared for and you know, wanted
to help. So that's what I did. I did for
(05:51):
a number of years, and then in twenty seventeen, an
executive was referred to me who had been on the
leadership team of a company that had been found guilty
of fraud, and that situation was reported on in the media,
and ten years later, those articles were still all over Google,
(06:14):
and that executive deserved a chance to move on basically,
and so we started working together to sort of, you know,
replace that content and help him take back control of
his online reputation because he in person reputation was really amazing,
so we needed both to fit. And what that did was,
(06:38):
I guess gave me the idea that maybe there were
leaders out there who weren't in as an extreme situation
as he was, but who needed support in the background
because they knew they needed to be more visible. But
they're time pressed. They need to get it right from
the start. They need the work that they do with
(07:01):
their reputation to reflect the decades of experience that they
have in the professional realm, and you know, would there
be space for someone like me to go and support
them in the background. So I sort of tested that
idea with clients and you know, colleagues, and it was
well received and that sort of started the direction of
(07:23):
my business and where it is today, and how I
either work with leaders who want to be visible, but
want to do it so that it feels right for them.
You know, a lot of the time we can see
people being really visible and the work that they do
to you know, build their personal brand is you know,
(07:45):
inspiring and amazing, but it might not feel quite right
for the types of clients that I work with. So
how can they be visible so that they feel like
they're doing it with purpose and adding value, but it's
also aligned to the career path that they have ahead
of them, the people they lead, the type of business
they lead, and that kind of thing. And then I
(08:06):
also work with leaders who want to build their profile
at the same time as building the profile of their
business because they've probably experienced a really strong period of
growth and they're about to take on that next stage
of growth and they know that to do that, they
not need to start building their business reputation beyond their
(08:28):
industry and beyond their direct networks.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
Yeah, you know, it's interesting because in the that's one
of the things that unless they're in some type of
a PR world. A lot of women entrepreneurs, and I
know that there's a lot of women entrepreneurs that do
watch or listen to and watch this the women excelling everywhere.
They that's not what they think about. They don't think
(08:52):
about that. It's whatever their passion is. And with all
of the white noise, which I'm sure regarding social media
and having to have a presence, and I'm sure that
plays into some of what you do, because you do
have to be careful about what you do and say
and from a professional standpoint, but they don't. They're more about, oh,
I just have to get all the likes, or I
(09:13):
just have to get all the followers, or I just
that They don't think in the broader version of their
entire presence online, across the board or even in their
local communities. So I can see how the your PR
experience as could definitely definitely be helpful. So obviously this
is something that you're skilled at and you're passionate about.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
You know, I'm very passionate about it, especially helping women
to be more visible, because generally it's it is you know,
while there are a lot of experts out there who
are men, and they have a lot of expertise and
knowledge and value to share. The more we help women
be visible, the more you know female leaders can follow
(10:00):
their footsteps and you know, lead companies, found companies have
the careers that they want, and you know, a leadership
career if that's what anyone wants, looks more attainable than
maybe what it once did.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
Yeah, definitely, definitely. So then do you work with women
entrepreneurs obviously that have businesses and are in leadership and
that role. Do you still work with corporate clients who
are who might be women who are endeavoring to establish
themselves more as leaders in their companies.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Yeah, absolutely, So I work with women who maybe on
their way to the C suite and are looking to
establish their reputation and be more visible as one part
of their plan to get them there, because they know
that also once they're in the C suite, it's going
to be expected of them to be more visible. So
(10:59):
that's one sort of group of women that I work with.
Another group of women that I work with, the women
who've had amazing executive careers. They may have been in
the C suite themselves, and they're looking to take the
step into the boardroom and establish a career as a
non executive director. So how can they know, build their
(11:22):
profile and position themselves as an authority so that that
work supports their sort of next step in their career.
I work with women who own and run their own
businesses and know that to grow their business, they need
to be visible as the face of their business. Really
(11:43):
sort of you know, they've probably got their networking and
got you know, they're known in their industry, but how
can they utilize platforms like the media like LinkedIn, maybe
even you know, Instagram for the right person. How can
they get on the speaking circuit, How can they be
on panels or conferences and that kind of thing to
(12:04):
really push the visibility of their business. So it's sort
of yeah, I work with women at a reign across
a broad remit of career paths, I guess, and at
different stages of that career.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
That's great, that's wonderful. Lots of different expertise in different
areas that you can assist in. So let's talk about that.
Let's talk about some of those those those things that
women need to do to become more visible in the
way they want to be visible. Right, What are some
of their in leadership activities? And even if they're whether
(12:46):
they're in the corporate world or outside of that, we
building their own their own business. You want to be
a leader and you want to be recognized as a leader.
So what are some of How can women become more
visible in their work and in their leadership whatever role
it is that they're playing. How can they become more
(13:07):
visible in a positive way? Right? Because it's so hard
to do that in a positive light.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
It in so many ways, And what it really comes
down to initially is who do they who? You know,
where is their audience, who is their audience, and why
do they want to be more visible with that audience.
So for some leaders that I work with, they may
(13:34):
just be focused initially on building their internal visibility. So
they may have had advice from a mentor or their
CEO or their managing director that to really take that
next step in their career, they need to be more visible.
So is that going to be hosting town halls within
(13:57):
the business, so that people get to know what their
division is doing and how they're leading and what the
results are of their work for themselves and their team.
Do they need to start sharing internal content via the
internal platforms such as newsletters, the intranet, internal webinars, lunch
(14:18):
and learns and that kind of thing to really showcase
the work that they're doing and the results that their
division is getting for the business. A lot of the time,
the sort of clients that I work with her on
the way to the executive team may have a need
to be more visible internally, so they'll be doing that work,
(14:38):
but externally as well. So how do they sort of
elevate their LinkedIn profiles so it reflects the leader that
they are and the leader that they're going to become.
What do they need to do on that platform? Do
they need to be sharing the work and the results
that their team is doing. Do they need to have
a voice on industry issues and they share and celebrate
(15:01):
you know, milestones and announcements for the company. And then
if they do want to be at events, you know,
on panels discussing industry trends and issues or speaking at
events and conferences, how do we get them there what's
their point of difference really, what's their topic area of
expertise that is going to be of interest to the
(15:25):
organizers of those events, and how each of those elements
going to work together to help them get them to
where they want to be.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
ATCHA great. I mean there's a lot there to unpack,
and I'm sure that's where your expertise comes in. Okay,
So that leads me to ask, then there's lots of
different ways, which I obviously you help with, but why
is it important for professional women to be more visible?
Like why can't you know thinking about For me? I
(15:57):
deal with individuals and I always give them a break
personality assessment, which is basically a personality assessment and the
different types of personalities and what works best in your career.
Being out on a platform may not be what they
want to do because they're a little too introverted or something.
And yet it's you feel it's important for women, professional
women especially to be more visible. Why is that?
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Okay? So, firstly, it's important for women leaders to be
more visible because overwhelmingly male leaders are visible, and there
is there are so many women leaders out there that
have expertise, knowledge value to share that is going to
(16:44):
be of benefit to the audiences that they want to
connect with. It's going to help them achieve the career
that they want or grow the business that they're leading.
But it's also going to show the women that follow
them that a leadership career is completely attainable and it's not.
(17:08):
It's the norm basically, So we've got you know, like
I said before, a lot of male leaders out there
who have a wealth of expertise and ideas to share,
and that is great, but women leaders typically may feel
that they may have stronger imposter syndrome or they may
(17:29):
deprioritize it down the list because they're focused on leading
their people well and leading their business well and it's
just not as high a priority necessarily. But if they
have specific career goals or specific goals for their business,
it's something that they're going to need to prioritize to achieve,
(17:50):
you know, the results that they want. When I ran
through all of the ways that you know, my clients
can be visible, I didn't want to. I don't want
to overwhelm anyone. And that's sort of the way that
I work with clients is that I might have clients
who say to me I have a huge fear of
(18:11):
public speaking. I never want to speak at a conference,
so we won't do that. Or someone says to me,
you know, I'm not a good writer. I don't want
to write. I don't want to have a blog. I
don't want to write articles. That's kind of thing. This
visibility work is about being visible in a way that
feels aligned to who you are as a human being,
(18:33):
what your skill set is, and where you want to
go with your career. So it's a bit of a
pick and mix, and it's absolutely not when you start.
You have to start by doing it all. And that's
one of the things that I think anyone does when
they're considering being more visible and building their reputation. We
(18:54):
probably look at the leaders who've been doing it for
decades and seem to be everywhere. So they're posting on
LinkedIn every day, they're quoted in the media regularly, they're
speaking at this conference and at that conference, they're on
this webinar, and you think, how do they do it?
How do they have the one, how do they have
(19:16):
the time to do it, How do they move past
their imposter syndrome or whatever barrier it is that is
in front of them so that they can be visible
like that. And what that does is when someone's starting out,
it makes it feel more overwhelming because we think that
we have to be doing all of those things to
be visible as well, but that's not the case. Often
(19:38):
we're looking at someone who's been doing this work for ten, fifteen,
twenty years. They may have a team of people behind
them helping them to be more visible, and maybe they
did write, you know, an article, and that article got
you know, pitched for them to be on a podcast
or to host a webinar or to speak an event.
(20:01):
Those people that are really at the top of what
they're doing with their reputation do tend to have support.
But when someone's first starting out, maybe they haven't really
done anything. Small things can have a huge impact. And
so if you just start posting on LinkedIn, or maybe
you do you know, a couple of interviews with the media,
(20:23):
or you know, you host a town hall within your business,
those small things have an impact and they may be
what you need to do to build the reputation that
you want. Having a reputation doesn't mean that you have
to have an audience of you know, hundreds of thousands
of people for your reputation work. To get results for you, you
(20:46):
may need a much smaller audience, but of people who
are going to be engaged with what you do and
are going to benefit from the knowledge that you have
to share.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Gotcha, I get it. I get it. That makes sense.
That makes a lot of sense. You said that that
women or men tend to be more visible than women.
What do you think is the most common barrier that's
holding women back from getting that at that additional or
(21:15):
being in the should I say, on the same level
of visibility as men, Like what's what's? What is? It?
Is it us? So we hold in our own selves back?
Speaker 2 (21:24):
Or it's funny sometimes So when I work with leaders,
there's sort of six barriers that I come like I
kind of call the most common barriers for leaders when
they're considering doing this reputation work. One of the most
common probably comes up every single time, whether it's the first,
(21:47):
you know, it might be in their top three is
lack of time. So we will prioritize the work that
we need to do in the business. You know, if
we've got a family at home also tires that and
we'll really you know, leaders are time poor they've generally
got huge jobs, they're running a business, they've got their
(22:09):
eyes on the next you know, deliverable growth target, whatever
it is. And so any work that you're going to
do on your reputation needs to feel easy and it
needs to feel like it's sustainable. You can kind of
integrate it with your everyday working life and you know,
still do everything that you need to do. The second
(22:33):
one is probably imposter syndrome, so you know, looking at
other people and thinking, yep, they've got the expertise, but
I don't know, I don't quite yet, or yes, I've
got expertise in this area, in that area, but I'm
a bit lacking here. Another barrier can be that I
just I know I'm a leader, and I know I've
got decades of experience, but I don't really know where
(22:54):
to start with my reputation because sometimes it can be
hard to see ourselves. So really, what are my areas
of expertise? What can I start to build my reputation
on that's going to feel you know, aligned to who
I am and who I am as a leader, but
also is going to set me apart from the you know,
(23:15):
maybe the people in the industry who are already visible
and already talking about you know, topic areas that you
know I also work on as well.
Speaker 1 (23:25):
Gotcha, gotcha. I. Oftentimes it's funny. I was doing another
interview or an interview earlier, and she was talking about journaling,
and we both agreed that at the end of the day,
you know, you need to do do something where you're
acknowledging your expertise or being proud of yourself for something,
(23:47):
because oftentimes women don't don't take that in and of
themselves right. They use it or they kind of feel
like somebody gives you a compliment and you reject it
because you're like, oh, well, you know, oh I thank you.
Instead of just saying thank you, they're like covering it
up with something else. Oh no, not really, blah blah blah.
And so I can see how that might be a
(24:09):
barrier to women saying no or standing up and getting
the visibility because they're like, ah, what do I really
deserve it? You know, that that imposter syndrome that you've
talked about. So I can see how.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
Visible can feel really uncomfortable, especially if you're an introvert
and you know a lot of the time, or especially
the people I work with. They want to be visible,
but know that they're being visible in a way that
adds value, not just because they want the spotlight on
(24:43):
them or not just because they've been told that they
need to be visible. They want to do it so
that they feel like they're adding value to the people
that they're trying to connect with.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
That's a that's a good angle, that's very good and
that I think would help women because my next question
would how can they overcome that? Are those things that
are holding them back? And that's a really good point
because when you phrase it in your mind that I'm
bringing value and I'm helping the people that are there
by sharing that information, I would think would be able
(25:16):
to help them get over it. What do you tell
women when they're like, when they're in that position, how
can they overcome those things that back?
Speaker 2 (25:28):
One is starting small and building up, so you know,
especially for someone who's never done work like that before,
it may be like, Okay, we're just going to focus
on one platform at a time, So what's your priority
right now? Is your priority to be more visible internally? First?
Are we going to start there? Get you comfortable in
(25:52):
that space? And for leaders who are wanting to be
more visible internally and externally. Building their internal visibility can
be a great place to start because they can also
test their topic areas of expertise, so they may, you know,
we may work together and say, okay, you know, what's
(26:14):
your background, what are you doing right now? Where do
you want to be in five or ten years time?
What are the big trends and issues that are happening
in your industry right now? What do you think is
not being spoken about enough? Are there any sort of
thought leaders or people being visible in your industry on
those topics yet not so much? Okay? That could be
(26:36):
a good opportunity for you. And then you may have
you know, two to three topics that you want to
start being visible about, and you can test those with
your internal audiences and see which ones resonate. Because often
the leaders that I work with, especially when we compare
ourselves to those people who are really established with their visibility,
(26:57):
we think that we need to have our poor topic
of area of expertise, you know, buttoned down from the
very beginning. And if that's what we start talking about now,
that's what we have to be talking about in five
or ten years time, and that's actually not the case.
You know, your reputation and your profile will evolve and
(27:18):
grow with you as you evolve and grow as a leader.
But building up that internal visibility can be a really
good place to say, oh, okay, you know that topic
area that I'm talking about, it's really resonating with people
at the moment, so let's, you know, focus on that
a little bit more. And then now that you're established
(27:39):
and you're feeling comfortable with your level of visibility internally,
how can we transition that to and you know, external platforms.
How comfortable or uncomfortable are you feeling with, you know,
talking to the media, being visible on social media, speaking
at events. Well, then we're going to start with the
one that you're most or you know, least uncomfortable with,
(28:03):
and we'll start you with something small because it needs
to integrate into your everyday you know, work and home
and life. But also once as you get comfortable doing that,
then you can take the next step and the next
step and the next step until you're potentially doing visibility
(28:23):
work that if you'd asked, you know, yourself, two years prior,
would you be doing it? The answer would be no.
But if you take that sort of step ladder approach.
You get further with your visibility than you ever thought
that you would be able to.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
I love it. I love it. It's all. It's all
taking the overwhelmed what some people may feel is overwhelming
and putting it into doable activities and knowing that they
can ebb and flow with the needs of the audience
or the needs of the people that they're leading. So
(29:01):
that's great, great advice. I appreciate. I like that very much. Now,
as I wrap up this kind of topic of pr
or reputation, why what piece of advice would you give
to women. You've talked about different ways to get started,
different to work small, to work with what you're most
(29:24):
comfortable with, and why it is so important for women
to think about reputation and are their visibility connected to
their leadership and their business goals and their company goals
or their career goals. How do you what's the what's
(29:45):
the starting point? I know you keep saying what's most
comfortable for you, But if somebody's listening right now and
they're going, Okay, I like Angela's message, I understand Angela's message.
I'm not necessarily in that place where I'm ready to
work with Angela. So what can what can they walk
away with from hearing you speak that would would get
(30:05):
them started on the right track.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Now, I would say two things. One would be think
about where they want to be in five years time,
whether it's in the C suite, their businesses you know,
has achieved that next level of growth that they're working
to now and they're onto their you know, next stage
of scaling that leader in five years time, what sort
(30:33):
of reputation do they need that is going to help
them to lead well to achieve that level of growth
for their business. So maybe they could start thinking about
how they're going to what they'd need to do to
be in that position in say, you know, two, three,
five years time. The other thing that I always say
(30:58):
to clients or people can see ding being more visible
is pay attention to the people in your industry or
in your business who you think handle their reputation well.
So they're visible without being over the top. You feel
like they're adding value and they're really genuine with their
(31:21):
reputation work. But look at why you like them? So
is it the topics that they you know are visible about?
Is it the platforms do they that they use. Do
they write, you know, really amazing thought leadership? Are they
great to listen to? You know you've seen them on webinars,
(31:42):
listen to them on podcasts. Are they really you know,
generous with their knowledge? You know what? What do you
connect with? Because when you look at people who are
you know, doing a great job of their leadership, reputation
and that you connect with, those little reasons that you
(32:04):
like them are bits that you can take away and go, Okay,
well maybe that would work for me when I'm going
to start being more visible, And that can help you
to see how you could build your reputation and be
more visible in a way that's going to feel comfortable
and aligned to you and get you the results that
you want.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
I love it. I love it. I love it. Great
information whatever your career is, whether your career is entrepreneur,
your career is in a company, and if you do it,
I'm feeling like, if you do it right from the beginning,
then it's going to be that much easier as you
progress and shift and do the ebbs and flows throughout
(32:47):
your career.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
That's it can be small things in the beginning. It
can be small.
Speaker 1 (32:54):
Yeah, I like that I like that. Wonderful. Okay, so
let's talk. Let me be sure. I want to leave.
I want to go back here and get all of
make sure that I am getting putting in. All of
this information will be in the show notes. It will
be in the show description over the podcast as well
as on our YouTube channel. If you are interested in
talking with Angela, and I encourage you to stay connected
(33:16):
with her. Obviously she shares bits and pieces of wisdom
in her posts and in her leadership and in of
the things that she does. So she is at pilotpr
dot com dot au because she is in Australia, and
if you want to reach out an email and talk
to her, you can send her an email at Angela A.
(33:38):
N G. E. L A at pilotpr dot com dot au.
And of course she is on Instagram and LinkedIn obviously,
so LinkedIn is Angela Cross and Angela R. Cross Is
that right? Yeah? The R in there? Be sure you
(33:59):
get the R in there and Instagram she is pilot
PR underscore Au. So wonderful having this conversation with you.
Enjoyed getting to know you. And again I appreciate and
I'm honored that you were on the program. Today.
Speaker 2 (34:15):
Yep, thank you so much for having me, Julia. I
really enjoyed speaking with you.
Speaker 1 (34:19):
It was wonderful all right, And for everyone who's listening,
remember to stay in contact with us at Women Excelling Everywhere.
Our main website is Women Excelling Everywhere dot com. That
is plural, Women Excelling Everywhere dot com. Get involved with
us on different levels. We have a wonderful platform there
on our website where if you want to become a
(34:40):
visibility or if you want to expand your visibility and
have a complete page and profile on the website to
app your SEO and just get more touch points to
you and your business, be sure to contact us regarding
that and we can tell you how you can become
a member on the website. We also have our private
(35:01):
membership called Women Excelling Everywhere Success Collective, and those links
will all be in the show notes. We'd encourage you
to join us every month. It's a lot of personal
and professional growth, right because it takes it all for
us to be all areas of our lives, and that's
what we do in that group. It's kind of like
our own little private Facebook, if I can drop that word.
(35:21):
Ben it's like you know, we're there for a community
to help you excel wherever you're at, in whatever your
goals are, so be sure to join us there. And
as always I like to wrap up our shows. I
want everyone and roll your shoulders back, take a nice
deep breath in, go out there and simply enjoy every
(35:42):
moment until next time.
Welcome everyone to the Women Excelling Everywhere Podcast. I am
Julie Anderson, your host Akay Brand Lady Julie, and I'm
very honored and excited to be here with another great interview.
We are with Women Excelling Everywhere, and our goal is
to help women excel wherever they're at, at whatever part
of their journey they are in in business, or in
(00:30):
personal life or in relationships. And one of the ways
we do that is by highlighting and showcasing amazing women
who are on their entrepreneurial journey or their growth journey
and they have a message to share that will be
beneficial to those who listen. And that is no exception
to the amazing guests that we have here today, Angela Cross. Angela,
(00:52):
thank you so much for being a guest on the show.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
Oh thanks for having me, Julie. I'm really excited about
talking with you.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Yes, I am as well. And as you can tell
by her accent, she is joining Angela is joining us
from a completely different time zone, all the way down
in Australia, and so we're honored to have an international
guest as well as there are international viewers that we have,
so they'll enjoy that as well, So thank you so
much for being here. And I'm going to introduce you
(01:20):
formally by reading your formal bio and then we'll get
to know the real Angela. So with more than two
PR and crisis and issue management, Angela has led led
reputation programs for multi national businesses, built thought leadership strategies
(01:40):
for businesses and leaders, and has been diving the driving
force behind a successful creation of CEO and executive profiles. Today,
she applies the asset based approach to reputation that she
utilized was utilized with her corporate clients to deliver results
focused platform reputation strategies for two types of clients businesses
(02:04):
that deserve recognition but don't have it yet, and I
know there's some of you out there and leaders who
deserve a space as a thought leader and want to
be visible with ease and purpose. She does this through
her company PILOTPR dot com, dot au and she is
also on LinkedIn. So we're going to give all of
those ways to contact Angela at the end of the show.
(02:25):
But Angela, welcome to the Women Excelling Everywhere podcast.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
I am I am excited. You know, PR is something
that I've often has often just like confused, the you
know what out of mean, it's a confusing topic for me.
It's kind of its own, its own dimension in a business,
and I do I do a lot of leadership coaching,
(02:55):
but it's I like that that piece that you deal
with leaders who does that space as thought leadership but
aren't able to be visible. So there's a lot of
a lot of room for amazing women like you who
are and men who are out there driving force for
PR to help those women get visibility, help those individuals
(03:16):
get visibility in their space. So I might start the
first question I'd like to ask you, and I asked
this of all my clients or all of my guests,
is I'd like to hear kind of what drove them.
So you were obviously in corporate for quite a while
and now you're on your own. So what drew you
into that space as a I mean, because you were
(03:39):
in not just PR. Were you in the crisis management?
Did that did you take the PR angle like having
to you know, deal with the PR the public side
of what people saw during crisis or were you boots
on the ground helping companies deal with the crisis in
the moment.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
The former option. So before starting Pilot PR, I worked
in PR consultancies, so working with a range of clients
in the corporate space, and most of my clients would
have a crisis or issues requirement because they were operating
in an industry that tended to get you know, negative attention,
(04:24):
whether it was insurance or construction, you know, property development, environmental,
sort of that kind of space. But with those clients
I worked on sort of whole of reputation PR work.
So it might be crisis and issues management when they
needed it, but it might be profiling for their CEO
(04:47):
or their leadership team. Also PR for the business, so
you know, announcing new products, initiatives, milestones, growth, anything like that.
And the way I got into doing what I do
now was a bit of a two stage process, I guess.
(05:07):
So eleven years ago I had my first baby and
I left PR consulting to have him, and when it
was time to go back to work, I sort of
had the opportunity to do my own thing, and I
felt like that would work for me as an individual
(05:30):
because it meant that I could at the time work
from home and be you know, around for my son
and my growing family, but also do work that had
meaning for me and continue my career and keep working
with clients that I cared for and you know, wanted
to help. So that's what I did. I did for
(05:51):
a number of years, and then in twenty seventeen, an
executive was referred to me who had been on the
leadership team of a company that had been found guilty
of fraud, and that situation was reported on in the media,
and ten years later, those articles were still all over Google,
(06:14):
and that executive deserved a chance to move on basically,
and so we started working together to sort of, you know,
replace that content and help him take back control of
his online reputation because he in person reputation was really amazing,
so we needed both to fit. And what that did was,
(06:38):
I guess gave me the idea that maybe there were
leaders out there who weren't in as an extreme situation
as he was, but who needed support in the background
because they knew they needed to be more visible. But
they're time pressed. They need to get it right from
the start. They need the work that they do with
(07:01):
their reputation to reflect the decades of experience that they
have in the professional realm, and you know, would there
be space for someone like me to go and support
them in the background. So I sort of tested that
idea with clients and you know, colleagues, and it was
well received and that sort of started the direction of
(07:23):
my business and where it is today, and how I
either work with leaders who want to be visible, but
want to do it so that it feels right for them.
You know, a lot of the time we can see
people being really visible and the work that they do
to you know, build their personal brand is you know,
(07:45):
inspiring and amazing, but it might not feel quite right
for the types of clients that I work with. So
how can they be visible so that they feel like
they're doing it with purpose and adding value, but it's
also aligned to the career path that they have ahead
of them, the people they lead, the type of business
they lead, and that kind of thing. And then I
(08:06):
also work with leaders who want to build their profile
at the same time as building the profile of their
business because they've probably experienced a really strong period of
growth and they're about to take on that next stage
of growth and they know that to do that, they
not need to start building their business reputation beyond their
(08:28):
industry and beyond their direct networks.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
Yeah, you know, it's interesting because in the that's one
of the things that unless they're in some type of
a PR world. A lot of women entrepreneurs, and I
know that there's a lot of women entrepreneurs that do
watch or listen to and watch this the women excelling everywhere.
They that's not what they think about. They don't think
(08:52):
about that. It's whatever their passion is. And with all
of the white noise, which I'm sure regarding social media
and having to have a presence, and I'm sure that
plays into some of what you do, because you do
have to be careful about what you do and say
and from a professional standpoint, but they don't. They're more about, oh,
I just have to get all the likes, or I
(09:13):
just have to get all the followers, or I just
that They don't think in the broader version of their
entire presence online, across the board or even in their
local communities. So I can see how the your PR
experience as could definitely definitely be helpful. So obviously this
is something that you're skilled at and you're passionate about.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
You know, I'm very passionate about it, especially helping women
to be more visible, because generally it's it is you know,
while there are a lot of experts out there who
are men, and they have a lot of expertise and
knowledge and value to share. The more we help women
be visible, the more you know female leaders can follow
(10:00):
their footsteps and you know, lead companies, found companies have
the careers that they want, and you know, a leadership
career if that's what anyone wants, looks more attainable than
maybe what it once did.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
Yeah, definitely, definitely. So then do you work with women
entrepreneurs obviously that have businesses and are in leadership and
that role. Do you still work with corporate clients who
are who might be women who are endeavoring to establish
themselves more as leaders in their companies.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Yeah, absolutely, So I work with women who maybe on
their way to the C suite and are looking to
establish their reputation and be more visible as one part
of their plan to get them there, because they know
that also once they're in the C suite, it's going
to be expected of them to be more visible. So
(10:59):
that's one sort of group of women that I work with.
Another group of women that I work with, the women
who've had amazing executive careers. They may have been in
the C suite themselves, and they're looking to take the
step into the boardroom and establish a career as a
non executive director. So how can they know, build their
(11:22):
profile and position themselves as an authority so that that
work supports their sort of next step in their career.
I work with women who own and run their own
businesses and know that to grow their business, they need
to be visible as the face of their business. Really
(11:43):
sort of you know, they've probably got their networking and
got you know, they're known in their industry, but how
can they utilize platforms like the media like LinkedIn, maybe
even you know, Instagram for the right person. How can
they get on the speaking circuit, How can they be
on panels or conferences and that kind of thing to
(12:04):
really push the visibility of their business. So it's sort
of yeah, I work with women at a reign across
a broad remit of career paths, I guess, and at
different stages of that career.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
That's great, that's wonderful. Lots of different expertise in different
areas that you can assist in. So let's talk about that.
Let's talk about some of those those those things that
women need to do to become more visible in the
way they want to be visible. Right, What are some
of their in leadership activities? And even if they're whether
(12:46):
they're in the corporate world or outside of that, we
building their own their own business. You want to be
a leader and you want to be recognized as a leader.
So what are some of How can women become more
visible in their work and in their leadership whatever role
it is that they're playing. How can they become more
(13:07):
visible in a positive way? Right? Because it's so hard
to do that in a positive light.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
It in so many ways, And what it really comes
down to initially is who do they who? You know,
where is their audience, who is their audience, and why
do they want to be more visible with that audience.
So for some leaders that I work with, they may
(13:34):
just be focused initially on building their internal visibility. So
they may have had advice from a mentor or their
CEO or their managing director that to really take that
next step in their career, they need to be more visible.
So is that going to be hosting town halls within
(13:57):
the business, so that people get to know what their
division is doing and how they're leading and what the
results are of their work for themselves and their team.
Do they need to start sharing internal content via the
internal platforms such as newsletters, the intranet, internal webinars, lunch
(14:18):
and learns and that kind of thing to really showcase
the work that they're doing and the results that their
division is getting for the business. A lot of the time,
the sort of clients that I work with her on
the way to the executive team may have a need
to be more visible internally, so they'll be doing that work,
(14:38):
but externally as well. So how do they sort of
elevate their LinkedIn profiles so it reflects the leader that
they are and the leader that they're going to become.
What do they need to do on that platform? Do
they need to be sharing the work and the results
that their team is doing. Do they need to have
a voice on industry issues and they share and celebrate
(15:01):
you know, milestones and announcements for the company. And then
if they do want to be at events, you know,
on panels discussing industry trends and issues or speaking at
events and conferences, how do we get them there what's
their point of difference really, what's their topic area of
expertise that is going to be of interest to the
(15:25):
organizers of those events, and how each of those elements
going to work together to help them get them to
where they want to be.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
ATCHA great. I mean there's a lot there to unpack,
and I'm sure that's where your expertise comes in. Okay,
So that leads me to ask, then there's lots of
different ways, which I obviously you help with, but why
is it important for professional women to be more visible?
Like why can't you know thinking about For me? I
(15:57):
deal with individuals and I always give them a break
personality assessment, which is basically a personality assessment and the
different types of personalities and what works best in your career.
Being out on a platform may not be what they
want to do because they're a little too introverted or something.
And yet it's you feel it's important for women, professional
women especially to be more visible. Why is that?
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Okay? So, firstly, it's important for women leaders to be
more visible because overwhelmingly male leaders are visible, and there
is there are so many women leaders out there that
have expertise, knowledge value to share that is going to
(16:44):
be of benefit to the audiences that they want to
connect with. It's going to help them achieve the career
that they want or grow the business that they're leading.
But it's also going to show the women that follow
them that a leadership career is completely attainable and it's not.
(17:08):
It's the norm basically, So we've got you know, like
I said before, a lot of male leaders out there
who have a wealth of expertise and ideas to share,
and that is great, but women leaders typically may feel
that they may have stronger imposter syndrome or they may
(17:29):
deprioritize it down the list because they're focused on leading
their people well and leading their business well and it's
just not as high a priority necessarily. But if they
have specific career goals or specific goals for their business,
it's something that they're going to need to prioritize to achieve,
(17:50):
you know, the results that they want. When I ran
through all of the ways that you know, my clients
can be visible, I didn't want to. I don't want
to overwhelm anyone. And that's sort of the way that
I work with clients is that I might have clients
who say to me I have a huge fear of
(18:11):
public speaking. I never want to speak at a conference,
so we won't do that. Or someone says to me,
you know, I'm not a good writer. I don't want
to write. I don't want to have a blog. I
don't want to write articles. That's kind of thing. This
visibility work is about being visible in a way that
feels aligned to who you are as a human being,
(18:33):
what your skill set is, and where you want to
go with your career. So it's a bit of a
pick and mix, and it's absolutely not when you start.
You have to start by doing it all. And that's
one of the things that I think anyone does when
they're considering being more visible and building their reputation. We
(18:54):
probably look at the leaders who've been doing it for
decades and seem to be everywhere. So they're posting on
LinkedIn every day, they're quoted in the media regularly, they're
speaking at this conference and at that conference, they're on
this webinar, and you think, how do they do it?
How do they have the one, how do they have
(19:16):
the time to do it, How do they move past
their imposter syndrome or whatever barrier it is that is
in front of them so that they can be visible
like that. And what that does is when someone's starting out,
it makes it feel more overwhelming because we think that
we have to be doing all of those things to
be visible as well, but that's not the case. Often
(19:38):
we're looking at someone who's been doing this work for ten, fifteen,
twenty years. They may have a team of people behind
them helping them to be more visible, and maybe they
did write, you know, an article, and that article got
you know, pitched for them to be on a podcast
or to host a webinar or to speak an event.
(20:01):
Those people that are really at the top of what
they're doing with their reputation do tend to have support.
But when someone's first starting out, maybe they haven't really
done anything. Small things can have a huge impact. And
so if you just start posting on LinkedIn, or maybe
you do you know, a couple of interviews with the media,
(20:23):
or you know, you host a town hall within your business,
those small things have an impact and they may be
what you need to do to build the reputation that
you want. Having a reputation doesn't mean that you have
to have an audience of you know, hundreds of thousands
of people for your reputation work. To get results for you, you
(20:46):
may need a much smaller audience, but of people who
are going to be engaged with what you do and
are going to benefit from the knowledge that you have
to share.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Gotcha, I get it. I get it. That makes sense.
That makes a lot of sense. You said that that
women or men tend to be more visible than women.
What do you think is the most common barrier that's
holding women back from getting that at that additional or
(21:15):
being in the should I say, on the same level
of visibility as men, Like what's what's? What is? It?
Is it us? So we hold in our own selves back?
Speaker 2 (21:24):
Or it's funny sometimes So when I work with leaders,
there's sort of six barriers that I come like I
kind of call the most common barriers for leaders when
they're considering doing this reputation work. One of the most
common probably comes up every single time, whether it's the first,
(21:47):
you know, it might be in their top three is
lack of time. So we will prioritize the work that
we need to do in the business. You know, if
we've got a family at home also tires that and
we'll really you know, leaders are time poor they've generally
got huge jobs, they're running a business, they've got their
(22:09):
eyes on the next you know, deliverable growth target, whatever
it is. And so any work that you're going to
do on your reputation needs to feel easy and it
needs to feel like it's sustainable. You can kind of
integrate it with your everyday working life and you know,
still do everything that you need to do. The second
(22:33):
one is probably imposter syndrome, so you know, looking at
other people and thinking, yep, they've got the expertise, but
I don't know, I don't quite yet, or yes, I've
got expertise in this area, in that area, but I'm
a bit lacking here. Another barrier can be that I
just I know I'm a leader, and I know I've
got decades of experience, but I don't really know where
(22:54):
to start with my reputation because sometimes it can be
hard to see ourselves. So really, what are my areas
of expertise? What can I start to build my reputation
on that's going to feel you know, aligned to who
I am and who I am as a leader, but
also is going to set me apart from the you know,
(23:15):
maybe the people in the industry who are already visible
and already talking about you know, topic areas that you
know I also work on as well.
Speaker 1 (23:25):
Gotcha, gotcha. I. Oftentimes it's funny. I was doing another
interview or an interview earlier, and she was talking about journaling,
and we both agreed that at the end of the day,
you know, you need to do do something where you're
acknowledging your expertise or being proud of yourself for something,
(23:47):
because oftentimes women don't don't take that in and of
themselves right. They use it or they kind of feel
like somebody gives you a compliment and you reject it
because you're like, oh, well, you know, oh I thank you.
Instead of just saying thank you, they're like covering it
up with something else. Oh no, not really, blah blah blah.
And so I can see how that might be a
(24:09):
barrier to women saying no or standing up and getting
the visibility because they're like, ah, what do I really
deserve it? You know, that that imposter syndrome that you've
talked about. So I can see how.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
Visible can feel really uncomfortable, especially if you're an introvert
and you know a lot of the time, or especially
the people I work with. They want to be visible,
but know that they're being visible in a way that
adds value, not just because they want the spotlight on
(24:43):
them or not just because they've been told that they
need to be visible. They want to do it so
that they feel like they're adding value to the people
that they're trying to connect with.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
That's a that's a good angle, that's very good and
that I think would help women because my next question
would how can they overcome that? Are those things that
are holding them back? And that's a really good point
because when you phrase it in your mind that I'm
bringing value and I'm helping the people that are there
by sharing that information, I would think would be able
(25:16):
to help them get over it. What do you tell
women when they're like, when they're in that position, how
can they overcome those things that back?
Speaker 2 (25:28):
One is starting small and building up, so you know,
especially for someone who's never done work like that before,
it may be like, Okay, we're just going to focus
on one platform at a time, So what's your priority
right now? Is your priority to be more visible internally? First?
Are we going to start there? Get you comfortable in
(25:52):
that space? And for leaders who are wanting to be
more visible internally and externally. Building their internal visibility can
be a great place to start because they can also
test their topic areas of expertise, so they may, you know,
we may work together and say, okay, you know, what's
(26:14):
your background, what are you doing right now? Where do
you want to be in five or ten years time?
What are the big trends and issues that are happening
in your industry right now? What do you think is
not being spoken about enough? Are there any sort of
thought leaders or people being visible in your industry on
those topics yet not so much? Okay? That could be
(26:36):
a good opportunity for you. And then you may have
you know, two to three topics that you want to
start being visible about, and you can test those with
your internal audiences and see which ones resonate. Because often
the leaders that I work with, especially when we compare
ourselves to those people who are really established with their visibility,
(26:57):
we think that we need to have our poor topic
of area of expertise, you know, buttoned down from the
very beginning. And if that's what we start talking about now,
that's what we have to be talking about in five
or ten years time, and that's actually not the case.
You know, your reputation and your profile will evolve and
(27:18):
grow with you as you evolve and grow as a leader.
But building up that internal visibility can be a really
good place to say, oh, okay, you know that topic
area that I'm talking about, it's really resonating with people
at the moment, so let's, you know, focus on that
a little bit more. And then now that you're established
(27:39):
and you're feeling comfortable with your level of visibility internally,
how can we transition that to and you know, external platforms.
How comfortable or uncomfortable are you feeling with, you know,
talking to the media, being visible on social media, speaking
at events. Well, then we're going to start with the
one that you're most or you know, least uncomfortable with,
(28:03):
and we'll start you with something small because it needs
to integrate into your everyday you know, work and home
and life. But also once as you get comfortable doing that,
then you can take the next step and the next
step and the next step until you're potentially doing visibility
(28:23):
work that if you'd asked, you know, yourself, two years prior,
would you be doing it? The answer would be no.
But if you take that sort of step ladder approach.
You get further with your visibility than you ever thought
that you would be able to.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
I love it. I love it. It's all. It's all
taking the overwhelmed what some people may feel is overwhelming
and putting it into doable activities and knowing that they
can ebb and flow with the needs of the audience
or the needs of the people that they're leading. So
(29:01):
that's great, great advice. I appreciate. I like that very much. Now,
as I wrap up this kind of topic of pr
or reputation, why what piece of advice would you give
to women. You've talked about different ways to get started,
different to work small, to work with what you're most
(29:24):
comfortable with, and why it is so important for women
to think about reputation and are their visibility connected to
their leadership and their business goals and their company goals
or their career goals. How do you what's the what's
(29:45):
the starting point? I know you keep saying what's most
comfortable for you, But if somebody's listening right now and
they're going, Okay, I like Angela's message, I understand Angela's message.
I'm not necessarily in that place where I'm ready to
work with Angela. So what can what can they walk
away with from hearing you speak that would would get
(30:05):
them started on the right track.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Now, I would say two things. One would be think
about where they want to be in five years time,
whether it's in the C suite, their businesses you know,
has achieved that next level of growth that they're working
to now and they're onto their you know, next stage
of scaling that leader in five years time, what sort
(30:33):
of reputation do they need that is going to help
them to lead well to achieve that level of growth
for their business. So maybe they could start thinking about
how they're going to what they'd need to do to
be in that position in say, you know, two, three,
five years time. The other thing that I always say
(30:58):
to clients or people can see ding being more visible
is pay attention to the people in your industry or
in your business who you think handle their reputation well.
So they're visible without being over the top. You feel
like they're adding value and they're really genuine with their
(31:21):
reputation work. But look at why you like them? So
is it the topics that they you know are visible about?
Is it the platforms do they that they use. Do
they write, you know, really amazing thought leadership? Are they
great to listen to? You know you've seen them on webinars,
(31:42):
listen to them on podcasts. Are they really you know,
generous with their knowledge? You know what? What do you
connect with? Because when you look at people who are
you know, doing a great job of their leadership, reputation
and that you connect with, those little reasons that you
(32:04):
like them are bits that you can take away and go, Okay,
well maybe that would work for me when I'm going
to start being more visible, And that can help you
to see how you could build your reputation and be
more visible in a way that's going to feel comfortable
and aligned to you and get you the results that
you want.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
I love it. I love it. I love it. Great
information whatever your career is, whether your career is entrepreneur,
your career is in a company, and if you do it,
I'm feeling like, if you do it right from the beginning,
then it's going to be that much easier as you
progress and shift and do the ebbs and flows throughout
(32:47):
your career.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
That's it can be small things in the beginning. It
can be small.
Speaker 1 (32:54):
Yeah, I like that I like that. Wonderful. Okay, so
let's talk. Let me be sure. I want to leave.
I want to go back here and get all of
make sure that I am getting putting in. All of
this information will be in the show notes. It will
be in the show description over the podcast as well
as on our YouTube channel. If you are interested in
talking with Angela, and I encourage you to stay connected
(33:16):
with her. Obviously she shares bits and pieces of wisdom
in her posts and in her leadership and in of
the things that she does. So she is at pilotpr
dot com dot au because she is in Australia, and
if you want to reach out an email and talk
to her, you can send her an email at Angela A.
(33:38):
N G. E. L A at pilotpr dot com dot au.
And of course she is on Instagram and LinkedIn obviously,
so LinkedIn is Angela Cross and Angela R. Cross Is
that right? Yeah? The R in there? Be sure you
(33:59):
get the R in there and Instagram she is pilot
PR underscore Au. So wonderful having this conversation with you.
Enjoyed getting to know you. And again I appreciate and
I'm honored that you were on the program. Today.
Speaker 2 (34:15):
Yep, thank you so much for having me, Julia. I
really enjoyed speaking with you.
Speaker 1 (34:19):
It was wonderful all right, And for everyone who's listening,
remember to stay in contact with us at Women Excelling Everywhere.
Our main website is Women Excelling Everywhere dot com. That
is plural, Women Excelling Everywhere dot com. Get involved with
us on different levels. We have a wonderful platform there
on our website where if you want to become a
(34:40):
visibility or if you want to expand your visibility and
have a complete page and profile on the website to
app your SEO and just get more touch points to
you and your business, be sure to contact us regarding
that and we can tell you how you can become
a member on the website. We also have our private
(35:01):
membership called Women Excelling Everywhere Success Collective, and those links
will all be in the show notes. We'd encourage you
to join us every month. It's a lot of personal
and professional growth, right because it takes it all for
us to be all areas of our lives, and that's
what we do in that group. It's kind of like
our own little private Facebook, if I can drop that word.
(35:21):
Ben it's like you know, we're there for a community
to help you excel wherever you're at, in whatever your
goals are, so be sure to join us there. And
as always I like to wrap up our shows. I
want everyone and roll your shoulders back, take a nice
deep breath in, go out there and simply enjoy every
(35:42):
moment until next time.
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