July 12, 2024 • 25 mins
Katie Gorka, co-author of the book 'Next-Gen Marxism', joins Tudor to discuss the rise of Marxism in the United States and how it is infiltrating schools and universities. They explore the history of Marxism, its core beliefs, and its impact on society. They also discuss the role of China in fueling Marxist ideologies and the importance of understanding and combating Marxism to protect American values and freedoms. The Tudor Dixon Podcast is part of the Clay Travis & Buck Sexton Podcast Network. For more visit TudorDixonPodcast.com
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Tutor Dixon Podcast. I am so excited
about today because I think we're going to have a
lot of our questions answered. Everybody has been asking how
did the country seem to take such a quick right turn,
and we're just in a totally different direction than when
I grew up. And today we have Katie Gorka with us,
who is going to explain because she is the co
author of a new book called Next Gen Marxism. What
(00:23):
it is and how to combat it? That is what
we need to know. Katie, thank you for joining me.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Tudor, thank you so much for having me on. Great
to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
And I'm so glad because I mean it when I
say everybody talks about Marxism and I don't think it's
one of those those trigger words that people throw around,
but they haven't really defined it and what it actually means.
And as I was going through some of the things
that you're talking about in this book, I'm like, man,
this is exactly what's going on. And just before we
got on air, I was saying to you when you
(00:54):
said that it was like the generation from the sixties
that then got into schools, got into you universities, and
started teaching this because they were so aggressive. I mean,
I think about Jane Fonda and talking about down with
government and all of this. Explain a little bit about that,
because I don't think anybody's really saying this right now.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Yeah, well, and I'm surprised they're not saying it, because honestly,
with all the student protests that happened this past April
and May, it really came up a lot more into
the news, and I think there was actually a lot
more proof and a lot more clarity that Marxism is
at work here students themselves and those who are kind
of organizing the protests, which, to be fair, is many
(01:36):
people who are not students, right, but they are all
bandying about the term Marxism very freely. So, I you know,
Marxism is a tricky term, right. When Mike and I,
my co author and I talked about what do we
call the book? What do we call the problem? Right,
I think there was maybe initially some hesitation to use
(01:59):
the word Marxism because I worry that it's almost like
the word communism, like it's overused. Do people really get
what it is? But you know, the more we talked
about it, the more strongly. We felt that we have
to use this term. It's so important that people understand
what is at the root of what we are seeing
in our country today. And it reminds me a lot
(02:22):
for anybody who sort of has studied foreign affairs and
our history and national security. You know, there were some
pivotal moments in the fight against communism. One was George Kennan,
who worked for the State Department at the time. He
was a worker at the Kremlin, you know, he was
on staff for the State Department at the Kremlin, and
he wrote this what was called the Long Telegram, where
(02:45):
for the first time somebody really explained to people in
American government why the Soviet Union was directly opposed to
the United States. And importantly, he argued that the Soviet
Union in the United States could not peacefully coexist. Many
people thought that we could, right, but the fact that
(03:05):
he explained their ideology and how their ideology meant that
they could not coexist peacefully was a really key turning
point in that fight. And I feel that we're kind
of at a similar moment right. It's so important to
use the term Marxism because we have to understand that
what these kids are asking for what the radical progressive
(03:27):
wing of the Democrat Party is asking for. It is
not something that can coexist peacefully in the United States
with the system that we all know and love. It
wants to bring down what we have and people have
to understand that.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
So to define a little bit what you're seeing when
you say that these these professors have brought this in
and that we can't coexist with that, because I agree
with you. I see things, I see points of view
that they don't. They don't like America, they don't like
what the constitution says, they don't want this form of government,
and they want they believe they can change it and
(04:04):
make it better, which is why all communists, socialists, Marxists believe. Right,
how entrenched is this in the next generation from that
generation that came out and started teaching us.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Okay, let me say first of all, so what makes
Marxism so dangerous for the United States is that it
is a worldview. Right. Our founders created this nation with
the belief that if they set up the government in
a particular way, particularly the notion of freedom of belief,
that they could find a way for people of diverse
(04:38):
beliefs to live together peacefully, right, And I think they
did an incredible job. The United States is really founded
on the notion that people with holding a wide set
of different beliefs can actually live peacefully together and come
together to solve common problems. This is the most important thing.
(05:00):
Marxism is the exact opposite. Marxism says the world is
divided into two and these two sides are irreconcilable, so
they divide the world into what they call oppressor and oppressed.
You know, it used to be the workers on the
one hand, where the oppressed and the owners were the oppressors. Today,
of course, it's a little bit different. Today it's the
(05:21):
white people and Jews and Asians who are the oppressors.
And it's kind of black people, anybody have a different ethnicity,
of a different sexual orientation who are the oppressed. But
same division, same split into this very divided world that
is fundamentally at conflict, and the only way forward is
(05:45):
for one side to succeed over the other and defeat
the other. That's what they want, right, And how have
they made such inroads with our students today. It is
exactly through the university. So you know, one of the
things we talk about a lot in the book is
we trace the history of communism and different people's fascination
(06:08):
with communism sort of through the years. But really importantly
we focused on what happened in particular in the sixties. Right,
you had that radical student movement of the sixties, which
was quite big, quite extensive, but was very important is
they got to the end of the sixties and they
felt that their revolution had failed. Right, they hadn't brought
(06:29):
about the collapse of the United States, which is what
they wanted. They hadn't ended the Vietnam War, and they
hadn't brought about the civil rights reforms that they said
they wanted. So it kind of fizzled out. But the
people in the student movements went sort of one of
three directions. So some of them went hardcore terrorists. That
was the weather underground and you know, a rampage of
(06:52):
bombings and violent attacks about you know. Another big group said,
our problem is that we didn't organize well enough. We
have to learn to organize better, and so they actually
created organizations that train people on how you organize grassroots
for revolution and those so.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Don't understand how powerful that is, but you are making
a great point right there.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
Yeah, and and you know that, thank you. That's how
we got Obama, that's how we got Black Lives Matter,
and we trace that, we showed the evidence, and then
and then a bunch of them went into the universities,
and you know, again it's it's there's too much there
to really cram it into just a short SoundBite, because
they went in through different paths. But you know, all
(07:37):
you have to do, I think, is just read the
chapter on Bill Airs and Bernardine Dorn, who were just
so unspeakably evil, and now they are celebrated and they
are in the universities and they are held up as
kind of heroes. It's incredible to me.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
You talk about the oppressed and the oppressor, and I
think that's something that we were so blind to for
a long time, because we kept seeing victim and victimhood
and the victor and the victim and all of this,
and that is a different terminology. It's a kinder way
of saying it, and it masks the real problem in
(08:17):
my opinion, And so we weren't seeing where they were going.
We kept thinking, gosh, if you're a part of the
Democrat Party or you have to be some sort of
a victim and they're going to lift you up. But
it was way bigger than that. We really didn't see
it at the time. And so now you talk about
all these different areas where it's community organizing in the universities,
but what it's doing to our youth has gone from
(08:40):
you know, we don't want to we don't want a war,
make love not war, be free to do drugs, all
of these things, to really evil as you mentioned, because
this race, this division over race. Here was a country
that was really getting to a point where we had
done great things to bring people together. And I believe
that always there's work to do, but this was the best.
(09:03):
We were at the pinnacle of the world when it
came to acceptance of all people together in this country, because,
like you said, the country was founded on bringing different
groups together. And then these Marxists came in and they
said they're racist, and it was like all they needed
to say. But it built from there, and that's kind
(09:24):
of what I want to talk about. How did they
build from racism to anti semitism to sexual identity. I mean,
this extreme of you aren't going to tell kids what
gender they are. It's I feel like we're choking what
we're talking about this, and yet here we are like,
stop cutting children up, and yes, this is a real problem.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
Yeah, I mean, I still think it's unbelievable. You know,
when Mike and I were talking about writing the book
and why we felt it needed to be written, we
were like, you know, I think so many people are
just utterly baffled how we reached How did it actually
an extreme stage? And it felt very quick for most
of us. And I agree with you. I think part
(10:09):
of the problem is that initially we kind of overlooked
the seriousness of it. You know, It's interesting because nineteen
eighty nine was sort of a key turning point, and
I find that really interesting because I was very focused
on Central and Eastern Europe, as were many people. Right
that was the collapse of the Berlin Wall. We all
kind of felt like, ah, communism is dead. But here
(10:32):
in the United States there was actually a New York
Times article that same year that said Marxism has found
wide spread acceptance on American universities. And it was also
the year that a conference was held where they basically
named and established critical race theory, which is, you know,
(10:52):
the foundation of what we're seeing today right, where where
race and ethnicity and sexuality are the phinitions of the
oppressed class.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
Which you're right, we thought was new. So this is
very interesting to me.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Yeah, And what I find interesting is is how did
we miss that? And I think part of it is, yes,
because we were focused on Central and Eastern Europe and
the Soviet Union and we really thought communism was dead.
We thought Marxism was dead. But what's also interesting is
there were a number of books at the time. There
were a bunch of people that talked about what was
(11:27):
happening on the universities to try to warn us, right,
there were there were five or six really important books
trying to warn us. But at the time the terms
were like political correctness. Right. That was sort of the
beginning of the repression, the suppression, and I just, for
whatever reason, we didn't take it seriously. Okay, So then
(11:51):
it just it's snowballs and it's snowballs, and you know,
I think what happens is you have these these professors,
you know, turned by radical students of the sixties, their
students rise up become professors themselves. Then you see the
hiring process. They're more and more hiring people who are
like themselves, and you see this really radical drop in
(12:14):
conservative representation on campuses to where it is today that
it is absolutely crazy. But I want to mention one
other piece. I mean, I think this is something that
won't surprise people. I wasn't necessarily surprised by it, although
it was interesting to see all the pieces put in place.
But I'll tell you what I was surprised about was
(12:35):
a bit of research that my co author did and
I wouldn't even have really thought to look down this path.
But one of the things that Mike found, and it's
a whole chapter in the book called In the Belly
of the Beast, is he really traced the roots of
collaboration between European Marxists and Latin American South American Marxists.
(12:58):
How they started to work together. They helped bring in
Marxist regimes in South America. Then they all started collaborating
and saying, we need to see more of this in
the United States. So there were Americans that were traveling
down to these conferences, and you know those at those
(13:18):
big gatherings, they started saying, hey, you know, you radical Americans,
you need to create your own organizations. It led directly
to the emergence of Black Lives Matter and others. So
I think it's important to recognize that this isn't just
a purely domestic problem, but that our enemies are very involved.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue next on
a Tutor Dixon podcast. I don't think people fully understand
that China has even made a big move into South America,
and then you have people going there, you have people
going to Central America. China is taking over. They definitely
want the closer they get to the United States, the
(13:58):
more disruption in the United States. That to me is
not a coincidence in this latest disruption. I mean, my
sister the other day, she said, did you get one
of our relatives a baby gift? She said, I can't
believe it. You go on the registry and everything is tan.
She's like, there are no there's no, nothing that's colorful,
even though you don't know the gender of the baby.
(14:20):
There's not even color we've I mean, and you think
about how that affects people, you take away joy from
and color, to me is part of the joy of
having a child in the house. Everything is colorful, and
yet the idea of taking that away seems to me
so depressing, and it creates again that creates this inner
(14:42):
turmoil of I don't want to force a gender. I
don't want to force this. I want to be And
this started when I and it's probably way before that,
but I remember when I was having my kids and
people were like, well, you're not going to put color
in the nursery, are you? Like, what in the world
is happening that we want to take? Suck off all
of the identity out of this. You can't be American.
(15:04):
If you're American, you're a nationalist. You can't be a
Christian or you're a Christian nationalist, and you can't be
a parent. You have to just be like someone who
raises children. And pretty soon they won't to be with children,
they'll just be like humans that are smaller or something.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
Well, and I want to go back to China because
I think this is a really key piece. You know.
One of the things that was so interesting about the
student protests, the fact that over three thousand people got
arrested at I think sixty different university campuses, was actually
sort of helpful because then we were able to get
a better idea of who was doing this who was
(15:40):
behind this? And to me, one of the really important
pieces that came out of this was this huge amount
of money that came in to fund groups that were
helping foment these protests, help organize and foment these protests.
It was money tied to China. And you know, I'll
tell you another thing, like in Virginia we found because
(16:02):
you know, I don't know if you know this, but
a couple months ago I became chair of the Fairfax GOP,
so I'm deep into I've deep into all things elections
and election integrity, as you can imagine, is a huge, huge,
huge subject. And one of the things we found here
in Virginia is that there is Chinese money that was
that was being used to send voter registration applications multiple versions,
(16:27):
like six seven times to the same people, targeting likely
Democrat voters. So I'm telling you China is not only
on our doorstep because of their involvement amongst our neighbors,
but they are absolutely fighting irregular war here in the
United States and trying to divide us. And I just
(16:49):
want to say, I think that's another reason why recognizing
this as Marxism will help us to understand what we're
fighting and will help us to fight it better.
Speaker 1 (16:59):
And I fully believe that the majority of these people
that they are getting voted in are truly useful idiots.
They don't understand what they're doing, and that's why, I mean,
that actually makes them more compelling to the average person,
because they don't truly understand that they're manipulating you. They've
been manipulated, and they're like, oh my gosh. The other
side is so racist, they're so homophobic, they're so transphobic,
(17:20):
they're so mean. They don't want you to have the
life that you want to live. But there's also this
movement of you can do whatever you want, you shouldn't
be limited, which is funny to me because once they
actually got control, you would be limited in anything you did.
I mean, we look at Gaza, for example, and all
these you know, gays for Gaza, and I'm like, are
you kidding me? If you went there, you would have
(17:42):
none of the advantages that you have here. And I
keep seeing this like trans people will have rights soon,
and then I see people say, what rights do you
not have? What country are you living in? At what
point is a wake up call? Because I wonder how
this happens. I mean, do we end up getting to
a point of no return and we're all in that
(18:03):
wake up call? Because that's my fear is suddenly we're
all under Marxist rule and we don't get the choice
of you know, we all have to have the same
cell phone, we all have to have the same car.
You don't get a choice in anything because of these
useful idiots who are saying you're so oppressed and ultimately
bringing in the kind of oppression they've never seen.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
So I think you're I think this is kind of
the million dollar question, right, And I have to say
I come out. I think I really taken an optimistic
view to tell you the truth. And I think it's
because I was really fortunate when COVID hit. I had
just started working at the Heritage Foundation, and one of
(18:45):
the things that I got pulled into very very quickly
was working with the all the parent groups that started
to emerge. Right that was when you had this great
parent awakening because they started seeing what their kids were learning,
and it was an elosion and I saw it in
so many places. So I still fundamentally trust in the
(19:07):
American people. I still think Americans are overall deeply committed
to the founding principles, deeply they I think most Americans
love this country and they recognize how precious our freedoms are.
So I think you have that going for us on
the one hand. And I'll tell you the other thing.
(19:28):
I see, and this is partly the benefit of being
in the position I'm in with our local GOP is many, many,
many people are so fed up that they are now
engaging in a way that I think they never did
ten years ago. And what's I think particularly interesting is
it's not just your sort of traditional Americans, but the
(19:51):
new Americans. You know, Fairfax County has a huge immigrant population,
legal immigrants, thirty percent of Fairfax County citizens. We're not
born in this country. Now, you have to remember that
a lot of those people, you know, if you come
here from a communist country, you come out of a
tradition of keeping a very low profile. Right, you don't
(20:12):
speak out if you're from China, you don't speak out.
If you know, if you're from Cuba, Venezuela. Even they
are turning and they are saying, we did not leave
our countries to come to this, right, we did not
come here to have our kids education turned into indoctrination camps.
So I and I think this is what's driving this
(20:36):
big movement for Trump is I think the left went
too far. And I'll just say one more quick thing
on this. I think the other thing that's in our favor.
We know what happens with Marxist regimes, we know what
happens with socialism, with communism, they eat themselves because it
is not a sustainable you can't have you can't have
(21:00):
a country or even a community built on the politics
of envy, which is what Marxism is. It destroys itself
from inside. So I think you have Americans rising up
on the one hand, I think you're gonna have the
left eating itself from the inside and it will collapse
on the other hand, and thankfully those two things combined
will lead us to a beautiful new day in America.
Speaker 1 (21:22):
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(22:29):
I mean, we didn't even get into destabilizing the country
through sex and sex said in schools, and I think
you were alluding to some of that, and that's something
that we've talked about at great length here. But I
think there's more to that conversation because I believe that
what they've done with our kids. And something that I
talked about in my campaign was that planned parenthood was
a part of sex ed. Now I find out planned
(22:51):
parenthood is also providing hormones for gender transition. I'm like,
oh my goodness, this is in our schools. And ultimately,
those communities that you're talking about who are coming into
the country are saying, we don't like this idea of
free love. You go out and have sex with whomever
you choose, and you don't ever have any commitment to
one or another. And I think that emotionally, when we
(23:13):
talk about the mental health issues in this country, they
go to this. They go to this idea that you
don't have to have a companion, that you don't have
to be loved, that you don't have to have that
connection with other human beings, and that is unnatural. The
human body is built to be in connection with other
people and a committed connection with the person that you love,
(23:36):
and this idea that there is no commitment anymore. And
the destruction of the American family has been so devastating
to mental health. I think that that's something when we
talk about all of the issues that people talk about
violence and this and crime and that. I mean, it
all goes back to one thing, and that's happening in
our schools. So we'll have to get into that the
(23:56):
next time. But before you go, I just want you
to promo the book again. Tell people where they can
get it. I think it's so important that we all
fully understand this.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
Yeah, so it's called next Gen Marxism, what it is
and how to combat it. And you can get it
at all the leftist bookstores that unfortunately, this is one
of my pet thieves that there are no conservative bookstores.
So I used to say, like, get it from your
local bookstore, but I realize they're all leftists anyway, So
(24:23):
whether you go to Amazon or wherever. And I will
just say, I wrote a whole chapter on sex, and
I'm telling you this is what they've been after from
the very beginning, is tearing down sexual sexuality and tearing
down the family. And so there is a long progression
(24:43):
that has led us here, and I think it's one
more reason why if people understand what's behind this. You know,
I think a lot of parents, I think they are
not actually evil. I don't think that they want to
inflict hurt and damage on their child. I think they
truly have been led to believe that they are doing
the right thing by supporting quote gender transition. I think
(25:06):
if more people understood what was behind this, they would
not fall for that.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Yeah, I agree. I think there's so much going on.
I tell my girls all the time that you are
so special and when you are with someone else, that
is something special that will change you forever. And that's
something that you do when you're married. And it's just
such a hard thing in this world to have that conversation.
But I think that those are These are the conversations
(25:31):
as parents we're uncomfortable having, and it's time to have them.
So I appreciate you taking the time to come on
here today and tell us about this, and certainly for
the book. Thank you so much, Katie Gorka. It's been
a pleasure.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
Thanks didter great being on with.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
You, absolutely and thank you all for joining us on
the Tutor Dixon Podcast. For this episode and others, go
to Tutor dixonpodcast dot com or head over to the
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts
and join us next time. Have a blessing
Welcome to the Tutor Dixon Podcast. I am so excited
about today because I think we're going to have a
lot of our questions answered. Everybody has been asking how
did the country seem to take such a quick right turn,
and we're just in a totally different direction than when
I grew up. And today we have Katie Gorka with us,
who is going to explain because she is the co
author of a new book called Next Gen Marxism. What
(00:23):
it is and how to combat it? That is what
we need to know. Katie, thank you for joining me.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Tudor, thank you so much for having me on. Great
to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
And I'm so glad because I mean it when I
say everybody talks about Marxism and I don't think it's
one of those those trigger words that people throw around,
but they haven't really defined it and what it actually means.
And as I was going through some of the things
that you're talking about in this book, I'm like, man,
this is exactly what's going on. And just before we
got on air, I was saying to you when you
(00:54):
said that it was like the generation from the sixties
that then got into schools, got into you universities, and
started teaching this because they were so aggressive. I mean,
I think about Jane Fonda and talking about down with
government and all of this. Explain a little bit about that,
because I don't think anybody's really saying this right now.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Yeah, well, and I'm surprised they're not saying it, because honestly,
with all the student protests that happened this past April
and May, it really came up a lot more into
the news, and I think there was actually a lot
more proof and a lot more clarity that Marxism is
at work here students themselves and those who are kind
of organizing the protests, which, to be fair, is many
(01:36):
people who are not students, right, but they are all
bandying about the term Marxism very freely. So, I you know,
Marxism is a tricky term, right. When Mike and I,
my co author and I talked about what do we
call the book? What do we call the problem? Right,
I think there was maybe initially some hesitation to use
(01:59):
the word Marxism because I worry that it's almost like
the word communism, like it's overused. Do people really get
what it is? But you know, the more we talked
about it, the more strongly. We felt that we have
to use this term. It's so important that people understand
what is at the root of what we are seeing
in our country today. And it reminds me a lot
(02:22):
for anybody who sort of has studied foreign affairs and
our history and national security. You know, there were some
pivotal moments in the fight against communism. One was George Kennan,
who worked for the State Department at the time. He
was a worker at the Kremlin, you know, he was
on staff for the State Department at the Kremlin, and
he wrote this what was called the Long Telegram, where
(02:45):
for the first time somebody really explained to people in
American government why the Soviet Union was directly opposed to
the United States. And importantly, he argued that the Soviet
Union in the United States could not peacefully coexist. Many
people thought that we could, right, but the fact that
(03:05):
he explained their ideology and how their ideology meant that
they could not coexist peacefully was a really key turning
point in that fight. And I feel that we're kind
of at a similar moment right. It's so important to
use the term Marxism because we have to understand that
what these kids are asking for what the radical progressive
(03:27):
wing of the Democrat Party is asking for. It is
not something that can coexist peacefully in the United States
with the system that we all know and love. It
wants to bring down what we have and people have
to understand that.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
So to define a little bit what you're seeing when
you say that these these professors have brought this in
and that we can't coexist with that, because I agree
with you. I see things, I see points of view
that they don't. They don't like America, they don't like
what the constitution says, they don't want this form of government,
and they want they believe they can change it and
(04:04):
make it better, which is why all communists, socialists, Marxists believe. Right,
how entrenched is this in the next generation from that
generation that came out and started teaching us.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Okay, let me say first of all, so what makes
Marxism so dangerous for the United States is that it
is a worldview. Right. Our founders created this nation with
the belief that if they set up the government in
a particular way, particularly the notion of freedom of belief,
that they could find a way for people of diverse
(04:38):
beliefs to live together peacefully, right, And I think they
did an incredible job. The United States is really founded
on the notion that people with holding a wide set
of different beliefs can actually live peacefully together and come
together to solve common problems. This is the most important thing.
(05:00):
Marxism is the exact opposite. Marxism says the world is
divided into two and these two sides are irreconcilable, so
they divide the world into what they call oppressor and oppressed.
You know, it used to be the workers on the
one hand, where the oppressed and the owners were the oppressors. Today,
of course, it's a little bit different. Today it's the
(05:21):
white people and Jews and Asians who are the oppressors.
And it's kind of black people, anybody have a different ethnicity,
of a different sexual orientation who are the oppressed. But
same division, same split into this very divided world that
is fundamentally at conflict, and the only way forward is
(05:45):
for one side to succeed over the other and defeat
the other. That's what they want, right, And how have
they made such inroads with our students today. It is
exactly through the university. So you know, one of the
things we talk about a lot in the book is
we trace the history of communism and different people's fascination
(06:08):
with communism sort of through the years. But really importantly
we focused on what happened in particular in the sixties. Right,
you had that radical student movement of the sixties, which
was quite big, quite extensive, but was very important is
they got to the end of the sixties and they
felt that their revolution had failed. Right, they hadn't brought
(06:29):
about the collapse of the United States, which is what
they wanted. They hadn't ended the Vietnam War, and they
hadn't brought about the civil rights reforms that they said
they wanted. So it kind of fizzled out. But the
people in the student movements went sort of one of
three directions. So some of them went hardcore terrorists. That
was the weather underground and you know, a rampage of
(06:52):
bombings and violent attacks about you know. Another big group said,
our problem is that we didn't organize well enough. We
have to learn to organize better, and so they actually
created organizations that train people on how you organize grassroots
for revolution and those so.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Don't understand how powerful that is, but you are making
a great point right there.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
Yeah, and and you know that, thank you. That's how
we got Obama, that's how we got Black Lives Matter,
and we trace that, we showed the evidence, and then
and then a bunch of them went into the universities,
and you know, again it's it's there's too much there
to really cram it into just a short SoundBite, because
they went in through different paths. But you know, all
(07:37):
you have to do, I think, is just read the
chapter on Bill Airs and Bernardine Dorn, who were just
so unspeakably evil, and now they are celebrated and they
are in the universities and they are held up as
kind of heroes. It's incredible to me.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
You talk about the oppressed and the oppressor, and I
think that's something that we were so blind to for
a long time, because we kept seeing victim and victimhood
and the victor and the victim and all of this,
and that is a different terminology. It's a kinder way
of saying it, and it masks the real problem in
(08:17):
my opinion, And so we weren't seeing where they were going.
We kept thinking, gosh, if you're a part of the
Democrat Party or you have to be some sort of
a victim and they're going to lift you up. But
it was way bigger than that. We really didn't see
it at the time. And so now you talk about
all these different areas where it's community organizing in the universities,
but what it's doing to our youth has gone from
(08:40):
you know, we don't want to we don't want a war,
make love not war, be free to do drugs, all
of these things, to really evil as you mentioned, because
this race, this division over race. Here was a country
that was really getting to a point where we had
done great things to bring people together. And I believe
that always there's work to do, but this was the best.
(09:03):
We were at the pinnacle of the world when it
came to acceptance of all people together in this country, because,
like you said, the country was founded on bringing different
groups together. And then these Marxists came in and they
said they're racist, and it was like all they needed
to say. But it built from there, and that's kind
(09:24):
of what I want to talk about. How did they
build from racism to anti semitism to sexual identity. I mean,
this extreme of you aren't going to tell kids what
gender they are. It's I feel like we're choking what
we're talking about this, and yet here we are like,
stop cutting children up, and yes, this is a real problem.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
Yeah, I mean, I still think it's unbelievable. You know,
when Mike and I were talking about writing the book
and why we felt it needed to be written, we
were like, you know, I think so many people are
just utterly baffled how we reached How did it actually
an extreme stage? And it felt very quick for most
of us. And I agree with you. I think part
(10:09):
of the problem is that initially we kind of overlooked
the seriousness of it. You know, It's interesting because nineteen
eighty nine was sort of a key turning point, and
I find that really interesting because I was very focused
on Central and Eastern Europe, as were many people. Right
that was the collapse of the Berlin Wall. We all
kind of felt like, ah, communism is dead. But here
(10:32):
in the United States there was actually a New York
Times article that same year that said Marxism has found
wide spread acceptance on American universities. And it was also
the year that a conference was held where they basically
named and established critical race theory, which is, you know,
(10:52):
the foundation of what we're seeing today right, where where
race and ethnicity and sexuality are the phinitions of the
oppressed class.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
Which you're right, we thought was new. So this is
very interesting to me.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Yeah, And what I find interesting is is how did
we miss that? And I think part of it is, yes,
because we were focused on Central and Eastern Europe and
the Soviet Union and we really thought communism was dead.
We thought Marxism was dead. But what's also interesting is
there were a number of books at the time. There
were a bunch of people that talked about what was
(11:27):
happening on the universities to try to warn us, right,
there were there were five or six really important books
trying to warn us. But at the time the terms
were like political correctness. Right. That was sort of the
beginning of the repression, the suppression, and I just, for
whatever reason, we didn't take it seriously. Okay, So then
(11:51):
it just it's snowballs and it's snowballs, and you know,
I think what happens is you have these these professors,
you know, turned by radical students of the sixties, their
students rise up become professors themselves. Then you see the
hiring process. They're more and more hiring people who are
like themselves, and you see this really radical drop in
(12:14):
conservative representation on campuses to where it is today that
it is absolutely crazy. But I want to mention one
other piece. I mean, I think this is something that
won't surprise people. I wasn't necessarily surprised by it, although
it was interesting to see all the pieces put in place.
But I'll tell you what I was surprised about was
(12:35):
a bit of research that my co author did and
I wouldn't even have really thought to look down this path.
But one of the things that Mike found, and it's
a whole chapter in the book called In the Belly
of the Beast, is he really traced the roots of
collaboration between European Marxists and Latin American South American Marxists.
(12:58):
How they started to work together. They helped bring in
Marxist regimes in South America. Then they all started collaborating
and saying, we need to see more of this in
the United States. So there were Americans that were traveling
down to these conferences, and you know those at those
(13:18):
big gatherings, they started saying, hey, you know, you radical Americans,
you need to create your own organizations. It led directly
to the emergence of Black Lives Matter and others. So
I think it's important to recognize that this isn't just
a purely domestic problem, but that our enemies are very involved.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue next on
a Tutor Dixon podcast. I don't think people fully understand
that China has even made a big move into South America,
and then you have people going there, you have people
going to Central America. China is taking over. They definitely
want the closer they get to the United States, the
(13:58):
more disruption in the United States. That to me is
not a coincidence in this latest disruption. I mean, my
sister the other day, she said, did you get one
of our relatives a baby gift? She said, I can't
believe it. You go on the registry and everything is tan.
She's like, there are no there's no, nothing that's colorful,
even though you don't know the gender of the baby.
(14:20):
There's not even color we've I mean, and you think
about how that affects people, you take away joy from
and color, to me is part of the joy of
having a child in the house. Everything is colorful, and
yet the idea of taking that away seems to me
so depressing, and it creates again that creates this inner
(14:42):
turmoil of I don't want to force a gender. I
don't want to force this. I want to be And
this started when I and it's probably way before that,
but I remember when I was having my kids and
people were like, well, you're not going to put color
in the nursery, are you? Like, what in the world
is happening that we want to take? Suck off all
of the identity out of this. You can't be American.
(15:04):
If you're American, you're a nationalist. You can't be a
Christian or you're a Christian nationalist, and you can't be
a parent. You have to just be like someone who
raises children. And pretty soon they won't to be with children,
they'll just be like humans that are smaller or something.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
Well, and I want to go back to China because
I think this is a really key piece. You know.
One of the things that was so interesting about the
student protests, the fact that over three thousand people got
arrested at I think sixty different university campuses, was actually
sort of helpful because then we were able to get
a better idea of who was doing this who was
(15:40):
behind this? And to me, one of the really important
pieces that came out of this was this huge amount
of money that came in to fund groups that were
helping foment these protests, help organize and foment these protests.
It was money tied to China. And you know, I'll
tell you another thing, like in Virginia we found because
(16:02):
you know, I don't know if you know this, but
a couple months ago I became chair of the Fairfax GOP,
so I'm deep into I've deep into all things elections
and election integrity, as you can imagine, is a huge, huge,
huge subject. And one of the things we found here
in Virginia is that there is Chinese money that was
that was being used to send voter registration applications multiple versions,
(16:27):
like six seven times to the same people, targeting likely
Democrat voters. So I'm telling you China is not only
on our doorstep because of their involvement amongst our neighbors,
but they are absolutely fighting irregular war here in the
United States and trying to divide us. And I just
(16:49):
want to say, I think that's another reason why recognizing
this as Marxism will help us to understand what we're
fighting and will help us to fight it better.
Speaker 1 (16:59):
And I fully believe that the majority of these people
that they are getting voted in are truly useful idiots.
They don't understand what they're doing, and that's why, I mean,
that actually makes them more compelling to the average person,
because they don't truly understand that they're manipulating you. They've
been manipulated, and they're like, oh my gosh. The other
side is so racist, they're so homophobic, they're so transphobic,
(17:20):
they're so mean. They don't want you to have the
life that you want to live. But there's also this
movement of you can do whatever you want, you shouldn't
be limited, which is funny to me because once they
actually got control, you would be limited in anything you did.
I mean, we look at Gaza, for example, and all
these you know, gays for Gaza, and I'm like, are
you kidding me? If you went there, you would have
(17:42):
none of the advantages that you have here. And I
keep seeing this like trans people will have rights soon,
and then I see people say, what rights do you
not have? What country are you living in? At what
point is a wake up call? Because I wonder how
this happens. I mean, do we end up getting to
a point of no return and we're all in that
(18:03):
wake up call? Because that's my fear is suddenly we're
all under Marxist rule and we don't get the choice
of you know, we all have to have the same
cell phone, we all have to have the same car.
You don't get a choice in anything because of these
useful idiots who are saying you're so oppressed and ultimately
bringing in the kind of oppression they've never seen.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
So I think you're I think this is kind of
the million dollar question, right, And I have to say
I come out. I think I really taken an optimistic
view to tell you the truth. And I think it's
because I was really fortunate when COVID hit. I had
just started working at the Heritage Foundation, and one of
(18:45):
the things that I got pulled into very very quickly
was working with the all the parent groups that started
to emerge. Right that was when you had this great
parent awakening because they started seeing what their kids were learning,
and it was an elosion and I saw it in
so many places. So I still fundamentally trust in the
(19:07):
American people. I still think Americans are overall deeply committed
to the founding principles, deeply they I think most Americans
love this country and they recognize how precious our freedoms are.
So I think you have that going for us on
the one hand. And I'll tell you the other thing.
(19:28):
I see, and this is partly the benefit of being
in the position I'm in with our local GOP is many, many,
many people are so fed up that they are now
engaging in a way that I think they never did
ten years ago. And what's I think particularly interesting is
it's not just your sort of traditional Americans, but the
(19:51):
new Americans. You know, Fairfax County has a huge immigrant population,
legal immigrants, thirty percent of Fairfax County citizens. We're not
born in this country. Now, you have to remember that
a lot of those people, you know, if you come
here from a communist country, you come out of a
tradition of keeping a very low profile. Right, you don't
(20:12):
speak out if you're from China, you don't speak out.
If you know, if you're from Cuba, Venezuela. Even they
are turning and they are saying, we did not leave
our countries to come to this, right, we did not
come here to have our kids education turned into indoctrination camps.
So I and I think this is what's driving this
(20:36):
big movement for Trump is I think the left went
too far. And I'll just say one more quick thing
on this. I think the other thing that's in our favor.
We know what happens with Marxist regimes, we know what
happens with socialism, with communism, they eat themselves because it
is not a sustainable you can't have you can't have
(21:00):
a country or even a community built on the politics
of envy, which is what Marxism is. It destroys itself
from inside. So I think you have Americans rising up
on the one hand, I think you're gonna have the
left eating itself from the inside and it will collapse
on the other hand, and thankfully those two things combined
will lead us to a beautiful new day in America.
Speaker 1 (21:22):
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(22:29):
I mean, we didn't even get into destabilizing the country
through sex and sex said in schools, and I think
you were alluding to some of that, and that's something
that we've talked about at great length here. But I
think there's more to that conversation because I believe that
what they've done with our kids. And something that I
talked about in my campaign was that planned parenthood was
a part of sex ed. Now I find out planned
(22:51):
parenthood is also providing hormones for gender transition. I'm like,
oh my goodness, this is in our schools. And ultimately,
those communities that you're talking about who are coming into
the country are saying, we don't like this idea of
free love. You go out and have sex with whomever
you choose, and you don't ever have any commitment to
one or another. And I think that emotionally, when we
(23:13):
talk about the mental health issues in this country, they
go to this. They go to this idea that you
don't have to have a companion, that you don't have
to be loved, that you don't have to have that
connection with other human beings, and that is unnatural. The
human body is built to be in connection with other
people and a committed connection with the person that you love,
(23:36):
and this idea that there is no commitment anymore. And
the destruction of the American family has been so devastating
to mental health. I think that that's something when we
talk about all of the issues that people talk about
violence and this and crime and that. I mean, it
all goes back to one thing, and that's happening in
our schools. So we'll have to get into that the
(23:56):
next time. But before you go, I just want you
to promo the book again. Tell people where they can
get it. I think it's so important that we all
fully understand this.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
Yeah, so it's called next Gen Marxism, what it is
and how to combat it. And you can get it
at all the leftist bookstores that unfortunately, this is one
of my pet thieves that there are no conservative bookstores.
So I used to say, like, get it from your
local bookstore, but I realize they're all leftists anyway, So
(24:23):
whether you go to Amazon or wherever. And I will
just say, I wrote a whole chapter on sex, and
I'm telling you this is what they've been after from
the very beginning, is tearing down sexual sexuality and tearing
down the family. And so there is a long progression
(24:43):
that has led us here, and I think it's one
more reason why if people understand what's behind this. You know,
I think a lot of parents, I think they are
not actually evil. I don't think that they want to
inflict hurt and damage on their child. I think they
truly have been led to believe that they are doing
the right thing by supporting quote gender transition. I think
(25:06):
if more people understood what was behind this, they would
not fall for that.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Yeah, I agree. I think there's so much going on.
I tell my girls all the time that you are
so special and when you are with someone else, that
is something special that will change you forever. And that's
something that you do when you're married. And it's just
such a hard thing in this world to have that conversation.
But I think that those are These are the conversations
(25:31):
as parents we're uncomfortable having, and it's time to have them.
So I appreciate you taking the time to come on
here today and tell us about this, and certainly for
the book. Thank you so much, Katie Gorka. It's been
a pleasure.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
Thanks didter great being on with.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
You, absolutely and thank you all for joining us on
the Tutor Dixon Podcast. For this episode and others, go
to Tutor dixonpodcast dot com or head over to the
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts
and join us next time. Have a blessing
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