October 3, 2024 • 31 mins
In this conversation, Karol interviews Erika Sanzi about the topic of schools banning books. Erika argues that the conversation around book banning is misleading, as books are not actually being banned but rather certain books are being excluded from school library collections. She highlights the infiltration of highly ideological books, particularly those related to LGBTQ topics, in school libraries. Erika also discusses the challenges of discussing this issue with different audiences and the need to protect childhood by not burdening children with adult topics. She shares her passion project, Love My View Sports Apparel, which promotes gratitude in the context of youth sports. The Karol Markowicz Show is part of the Clay Travis & Buck Sexton Podcast Network - new episodes debut every Monday & Thursday.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hi, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show. On iHeartRadio,
last episode, I talked about meeting someone when you feel
like you're running out of time to get married and
have a family. I gave five tips that I think
are useful, and they were treat it like a job,
don't bend on your must haves, have sane must haves,
(00:31):
give people who are not your type a chance, but
also don't settle, especially when it comes to attraction. I
forgot what I think is actually the most important one
that I've talked about on this show before. If you've
decided that you're serious about getting married, you have to
cut off anyone that you're spending time with that is
(00:54):
not the person you're going to marry. I see this
all the time that people have someone they're in a situationship,
as the kids say, they have someone they talk to
every day, they hang out with, maybe they have a
physical relationship with, and this is definitively not the person
they're going to marry. I would say that having this
(01:18):
kind of side person in your life slows you way
way down for meeting the person that you will actually marry.
It fulfills so many needs to have someone like this,
and it decreases the urgency that you might feel to
find someone. I know it gets lonely. I know it's
(01:40):
nice to have someone, anyone to spend intimate time with,
but having that person is an actual roadblock for you
to meet your forever person. If you have someone in
your life who really wants to meet someone, put that
advice at the top of the lists that you give them.
(02:02):
They can't be spending time with someone who will never
be their spouse, or they won't find the one who
might be. I'm going to have tips for the younger
set in future episodes. If you've got suggestions, I love
hearing them, Send them over. Carol Markowitz Show at gmail
dot com. It's k A r O L m A
r kow i cz Show at gmail dot com. So
(02:27):
many of you have checked out my new podcast, co
hosted with my good friend Mary Katherine Ham. It's called Normally,
and unlike this podcast, it is a political show. New
episodes are posted Tuesdays and Thursdays, and just like this show,
you can hear it anywhere you get your podcasts. Please
subscribe and tell your friends I appreciate you all so much.
(02:48):
Coming up next and interview with eric A Sanzi. Join
us after the break. Thanks so much for joining us
on The Carol Markowitz Show. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
Welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show on iHeartRadio. My
guest today is Erica Sanzi. Erica is director of outreach
at Parents Defending Education, where I'm also on the board
full disclosure, a mom of three teenage sons Woe, and
the founder of Love My View Sports Apparel, which focuses
on gratitude in the context of youth sports. Hi Erica, Hi, Carol.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Great to see you and so nice for me.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
So nice for you to come on. I am a
longtime fan of yours, obviously, but you recently came across
my feed in a million different places because you were
arguing something very interesting and I think you made some
very unique points, and it was about schools banning books.
(03:48):
So can you tell us about your work in this
area and your what your viral comments were. I think
they involved nude magazines.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
Yes, I think that they involved Don't Play magazine. So first,
the book banning conversation is by far one of the
most frustrating and annoying conversations for anybody who really does
know what's going on on the ground. It's been one
of those things that tribalism has kicked in, and so
people keep picking up this book banning ball and running
(04:20):
with it. And I'm screaming at the television and at
the radio because I'm like, this is just not true.
So the whole frame of books being banned is wrong.
There really isn't anywhere that books are being banned. If
you can go into the local library in your town
or city, if you can go on Amazon, if you
(04:40):
can go into the bookstore and get these books, they're
obviously not banned. So the conversation is really about, you know,
library collections in schools, and I think all of us
know that a school library clearly cannot have every single
book in the universe in it. They have to make choices.
I'm pretty sure mine does not have The Art of
(05:01):
the Deal by Donald Trump, and I've never heard anybody
complaining or saying that that book is banned. But what
has happened is that libraries have been against school libraries
have really been infiltrated with books that are highly ideological,
largely around the umbrella of LGBTQ. So we see a
(05:25):
lot of books that obsess about sexual orientation, about transgender ideology,
and in the name of inclusion, they think that these
books are appropriate and needs to be in the school.
But the truth about these books is that they are
pretty new, horribly written, extremely vulgar. In many ways, they
(05:47):
present safeguarding challenges because some of these books actually teach
children how to do things like meet up with adults
on apps designed for people to find sexual partners. So
when people talk about their concerns about books and schools,
it really is a very different conversation than the one
(06:08):
that we may remember, you know, from forever, where people
were upset about certain Judy Bloom books, or people were
upset about books by Alice Walker or Tony Morrison because
there was a lot of sexual content in those very
rich works of literature. Right, we're not talking about literature.
We're talking about basically garbage books. But because all of
(06:33):
the institutions have been so captured, the American Library Association
being one of them, they look for books about sexual
orientation and transgender ideology. They name these books to award lists,
and these are the award lists that librarians have always
looked to when they're trying to add to their collection,
(06:53):
so they go on the award list, and there's never
been a reason for them to assume that the books
that they're buying for the school library are going to
be wildly inappropriate for students.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Yeah, I think, you know, it's interesting. We covered this
in our book Stolen Youth, which of course is probably
banned in your school library as well. Guys, maybe you
should all check that out and see my banned book
is in your kids elementary school library. But they use
that LGBTQ thing as a shield. They use it, as
(07:29):
you know, you're not allowed to have these books, and
it's because they're LGBTQ, and that's ridiculous. It's not because
I don't want a lot of these stories wouldn't make
sense to me in a straight context either. I don't
want my kids reading about kids meeting up with grown ups,
even if it's male and female or you know.
Speaker 3 (07:48):
Whichever direction correct.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
So I think that they use that as a crutch
to make it so that you really can't complain too
much about it. And the thing that I want to
ask you about, you know, I thought that the Right
was doing a fantastic job on showing this kind of
stuff in libraries, like Ron DeSantis presenting these books at
a press conference and the media being unable to show
(08:11):
the books on TV. I thought it was all brilliant
and genius, and then an activist told me that it
wasn't polling. Well, it's that we were still seen as
book banners even though we were showing pictures of children,
you know, giving oral sex and that kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
So is that true?
Speaker 2 (08:33):
And how is that so?
Speaker 3 (08:36):
Parents of any education? We did polling on this too,
and the polling on anything involving the words book banning
polls really badly because it's just a knee jerk reaction.
And I also think, to be honest, because many of
these texts are so incredibly and outrageously inappropriate. Most people
(09:00):
who you know, don't focus on this in their daily life,
do not believe that the content that people are describing
could possibly be true.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Right, So it's a challenge that.
Speaker 3 (09:13):
Can't be happening, that can't be true, or it's that
has to be a one a one off, that's an outlier.
And you're realizing that actually again, and partly too because
I was working in schools as recently as twenty fifteen.
In twenty fifteen, I didn't see these texts. So this
has been very quick new and so person thinks, well,
(09:38):
when I was in school, you know, yeah, there was
like that Judy Bloom book. But come on, guys like
lighten up, or they just think that it can even that.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Judy Bloom book. I don't want it for my you know,
sixth grader. I don't want it from my third grader.
My daughter's in ninth grade. I don't know, maybe another
year or two before I think she should be. You know,
we could read Forever by Judy Bloom. It was racy.
I remember that, so I did. If there's anything wrong
about keeping those books, even the Judy Blue books, out
of the hands of small children.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
But at least on the Judy Bloom front, you could
probably go out for drinks or dinner with your friends
and you guys could have like a pretty like robust
discussion and disagreement about that. Whereas the text that we're
talking about, if you laid those out on the table
of a bunch of your friends, we'd be like uncomfortable
from it who have like different politics or who have
really different feelings about you know this, this idea of
(10:29):
you know, controlling what people can read. They would all
be like, this is insane and anybody that wants this
in schools is deranged, Right, Yeah, that's why you think
it's different. And I think it's polling really badly because
they're thinking back, you know, they're thinking back to the
movie Footloose when like you know, they're throwing books in
the garbage can and setting them on fire because they
(10:52):
talk about dancing.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
And so I just think book's not about dancing.
Speaker 3 (10:57):
Not about dancing, And I feel like it's just it's
it's an awareness thing where like you and me and
people that are really dialed in on this, like we
have to sort of constantly remind ourselves that the average
person out there living their life is not focused on this.
They're hearing about it a little bit, it's not really
breaking through, and so like as much as we think,
(11:18):
how do you not know this? I can speak to
all the people in my own life right who I'm
at this on the sidelines of my kid's games, or
I'm at the grocery store and it's new to them,
or it's they've only heard a little bit about it,
but they really have no working knowledge of what's going on,
(11:38):
and I think that's also why the pulling on it
is so bad.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
I talk about this a lot, but I always find
it a challenge to talk to Red state or Red
area audiences about this kind of stuff because they believe
it's happening. They think it's happening for sure, but not
at their kids' school. They think they somehow are immune
from it, like not in my kid's school. I live
(12:01):
in a deep red area, and you're just like, here's
a list of books, go find out, and they often
find out that, of course they have their Red state school,
their Red area school does have these books. And it's
a challenge because people love their local school. It's like
the whole thing would like you, Congress pulls badly, but
when you pull people about their individual Congress person, they
(12:22):
pull high that that's exactly what's happening here too.
Speaker 3 (12:25):
I think, oh, one hundred percent, And again it's possible
it's not in their school. You know. I live in
a blue state, Rhode Island the smallest one, and there
are schools where they don't really have these books, and
then there's other ones where it's absolutely full of them.
So again it's you can't say for sure, but it
is completely naive and wrong to think that if you
(12:48):
live in a red state or in a red district,
that you're not going to see these texts. Partly also
because again some people think back to like the librarian
who was like little old lady with the sweater hanging
on the back of her chair, and she was going around,
you know, telling people to stop talking and shushing people,
and she would have been horrified and mortified by these texts.
(13:12):
But that's not necessarily Also, who the librarians are now,
so you know, when you come up through the education
system to become a school librarian, they're marinating in a
lot of this ideology. And so again some order off
the award list totally unwittingly and are like shocked when
this whole thing blows up in their face because they're thinking,
(13:34):
I had no idea. Others are totally on board with this,
and they want these books in their library, and they
are making displays in the school where they'll put, you know,
all of these books about gender ideology, all of these books,
you know, children's books about Harvey Milk, because they think
that young children have to know who Harvey Milk is
(13:56):
or else they're not an educated person.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
So a question I ask all of my guests is
what do you worry about? What do you think is
our largest cultural problem?
Speaker 3 (14:07):
I mean, there's many to pick from. So if I
had to name something, I think it would have to
do with our abdication of responsibility around projecting childhood. And
I'm actually not just saying this. I know you've wrote
a book called Stolen Youth, but this would have been.
This is my answer anyway, largely because again of the
work I do and the work I've done, it just
(14:28):
seems to me that we are burdening children with topics
and issues that don't belong anywhere on their radar, right right, So,
and so, for example, instead of it used to be
that you might have a child that is really dealing
with some really bad, tough issues, there's something really serious
going on, and that would be addressed. What has happened
(14:50):
now is they've sort of made it so that every child,
the default is now to make these topics that every
child has to talk, right, right, So, so in sixth grade,
when they fill out the I think it's like a
a youth risk or behavior survey or something like they're
bombarded with questions about suicide. Now, that's an eleven year
(15:12):
old child, And is it ever the case that there's
something going on with a child at that age where
it needs to be discussed, Yes, But does it have
to be the default for every kid that something that
they never would have thought of, don't really know anything about,
and is scary, you know, is suddenly kind of pushed
in their face. And that's how I feel about, you know,
(15:33):
Like in the Chicago public schools, they're they're they're teaching
very technical sexual terms in pre K, and then they're
teaching the third graders that their sex is assigned at
birth and that they can be a boy or a
girl or anything or neither and it's their choice. It's like,
it's like putting aside how crazy that is. When you
(15:53):
layer on top of that how young these children are.
It's like, I'm always like, why are you talking to
chillchildren who put the their tooth under their pillow for
the truth carey and sit on Santa Claus's lap because
they literally believe he comes down their chimney, like their
childhood is supposed to be magical. And it's like this
weird new movement of burdening them with things that are
(16:20):
completely outside they're even like their developmental ability to comprehend.
But also it's like you take the worst situations that
could be facing children and then you force every child
to grapple with it.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
And I think, I think these kids want to believe
what adults are telling them, so they end up really
internalizing this stuff, and especially the suicide stuff. I think that's,
you know, obviously so dangerous. It's you could plant an
idea in a kid that never had that idea before
so easily, And I don't know how it isn't a
(16:56):
wider conversation about this.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
Yeah. I mean, like I've posted screenshots of the surveys
to show people, and you get a lot of people
that think it's outrageous and terrible. But then there's always
the ones, Yeah, but what if a kid, you know,
has a problem, And I'm like, that would be handled individually, right,
Like that is something that you address. You don't make
every single child in the sixth grade. I think it's
(17:22):
actually six through twelve because they that The other crazy
thing is they ask the sixth graders the same questions
as the twelfth graders. But it's like you don't, because,
especially if a child is predisposed to any sort of anxiety,
some of those questions really can scare them and can
get into their head. And it's like you took a
kid that had no issue going and no problem, and
(17:42):
now they've they've got a problem because they were forced
to answer these questions. So I just think that that
is this idea that we that we burden them with
adult topics and we pathologize their childhood so that because
it almost like it's like this equity thing, right, Well,
if a few kids are going through this, then we
need to make sure that every child is aware of
(18:04):
it and we're asking them about it. I mean an
example is, and I only know this because during COVID
they had to fill out this survey at home. So
my son's at the dining room table. He's in the
sixth grade at the time, and he's like, he yells out,
I was He's like, I was drunk or stoned. So
(18:24):
I'm like, what are you doing And he's like, well,
I'm filling out this survey and I'm trying to answer
this question about why I was absent. He's like, and
I'm looking for a choice that says doctor's appointment, but
instead all the choices were things like I'm being bullied
so badly. I don't want to go to school. You know,
we didn't have any transportation to get there. I was drunk. Oh,
(18:47):
that's what it was. I was drunk or high. There
was another one about you know, oh, I had to
go with my parents. I had to go with my
family to help them with translation. Like it's so it's like,
here you have a kid who's like I just had
a doctor's appointment that was kind of far away, so
I had to miss the whole day, and those are
(19:11):
like like he because it's like now you're like, wait,
there's kids who stay home from school because they're really
badly bullied, Like it becomes this It also.
Speaker 2 (19:19):
I could get drunk or stoned, Like I think that
kind of also plants that idea.
Speaker 3 (19:25):
And also I'm eleven.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
I never think that that's even an option for them.
Is suddenly like wait, kids do this.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
Yeah, Like and also I'm like he's eleven, Like why
are you suggesting that that a plausible reason that he's
not at school is that he's drunk or high exactly?
And again, it's not that it's never happened. I've worked
in schools long enough to know yes, but again that
is the outlier case, and you've now made it the
default for every child in this because of some weird
(19:55):
I don't even really understand the reasoning, but I just
think it's bad for kids. And I also think again, like,
I get it, you need to track, you know, youth behavior.
You're looking to see if kids are smoking and drinking
and having sex, and so I understand that they feel
the need to collect this information, but I'm increasingly opposed
(20:17):
to the school being the vehicle because I think that
the questions have become really inappropriate. I think that again,
parents have no idea what's on these surveys. I was shocked,
and I'm betting dialed into this, and I had no
idea that the questions had become so invasive and really
about really mature topics at younger and younger grades. So
(20:39):
again that's my very long way of saying, like, I
just think that we're failing our children in because we're like,
it's almost like we're swapping out the magic of childhood
for like adult problems.
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f E. I'll be right back with more from Erica Sanzi.
Speaker 2 (22:36):
You have this job where you help protect kids, You
have a beautiful family, you have a new apparel line.
Love my view, do you feel like you've made it?
Speaker 3 (22:46):
I feel like I've made it, so, I mean, I
guess I would say that you're always kind of like evolving, right,
so at least for me, like I don't mentally sit still. Well. So,
on the one hand, yes, because to your point, I
have a beautiful family. My parents are still alive and healthy.
(23:07):
I have a strong marriage. I don't, you know, struggle
to figure out how we're going to eat or if
there's going to be a roof over ihead like our
basic needs are definitely met. So in all of that, Oh,
and I have a job that I love, and I
have colleagues that I love right, So yes, on the
other hand, I feel like there's like more, but it's
(23:31):
not more like, oh, I want to make more money,
or oh I want more status, or oh I want
to get you know, make my platform really huge and
become famous. It's more like I don't mentally stay still.
I think is the issue. Right, So when people talk
about how much they love all their free time because
they can like do their hobbies, like I'm a little
(23:52):
bit like, yeah, I don't think I really have hobbies because.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
So my hobby is saving the next generation, right.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
So like this this new thing that I'm doing. So
here's an example of something. So just call and this
just start.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
For the audio listeners. Erica showed us a hat that
sulf love my view.
Speaker 3 (24:11):
And there's a football in place of the Oh. I
actually have another one over here which I made. My
husband just got his band back together, so I made
this one with the guitar and the guitar oh nice,
so that when I'm playing the role of groupie, I
can wear that. But so this is just like a
new thing for me that I feel like is like
another chapter. And it's largely because one of my favorite
(24:34):
favorite things in my life could be my favorite thing
actually is watching my kids play sports. In fact, my
oldest after fourteen years of playing baseball, just played his
last game a few weeks ago, and it's a loss.
Like it's a real feeling of loss. And it doesn't
matter that it's baseball. It it would be anything, you know
(24:54):
what I mean, if your child had played the piano
or been in musicals or dance their whole life and
then you go to the last perform and it would
be the same thing. It's this idea of getting to
watch your children do what they love and thrive. Ette
So the whole point. So years ago, I would go
on Twitter and I would take a picture of the
field or the basketball court, you know, and I would
(25:17):
just write the words love my view next to that picture.
And after a bunch of years, I just thought, you know,
like this is kind of a cool thing and it
and at first it started out as like an idea
where I was like, Okay, youth sports is a kind
of like a stew of lots of emotions and behaviors.
(25:37):
Some are very positive, some are not so positive. So
my thought was like if you just for a moment
say to yourself, like, I'm so lucky. This is what
I get to do, this is what I get to watch,
This is what I get to see, it's like it
brings gratitude into that stew So it doesn't mean that
you're not you know, people aren't going to be mad
(25:59):
at the rest for a kid got dropped in the
batting order, or you know, mad because something didn't go
their way. Like I'm not I'm not naive enough to
think that all that goes away because there is kind
of a natural tension between competition and gratitude. But on
the other hand, they also kind of fit nicely together
because part of what people love about that is the competition.
(26:22):
So yeah, so it started out as just a sports thing,
but parents have reached out to me and said, I
love this concept so much of loving my view as
it pertains to my children or my grandchildren. But my
kids don't play sports. So they'll say, you know, my
daughter is really into music and she does singing and
she does musicals, and so my answer was, well, then
(26:44):
I'll make that so I love that on sports collection now.
So like if you're you know, and and I keep
getting I get like requests, and because I'm just swapping
in a new design for the oh and love, I
can actually do it really easily. So even if it's
like a one off that almost nobody else wants. Like
(27:07):
to give an example, there's a woman that I know
whose son is on track and field at University Wisconsin.
He does the hammer throw, and of course she's like,
you're obviously not going to have like a hammer throw design,
and I was like, well, I'll make one for you, right,
you know what I mean, Like I can do that.
So yeah, So it's so it's and again, part of
this is I spent my weekends for over a decade
(27:30):
every Saturday and Sunday at my kids' games. But as
kids get older, the games aren't on the weekends really,
and so you wake up on Saturday morning and you're like,
I have nowhere to be. And some people are like,
here's oh my god, you must love that, but like
for me, it's a void. And part of the way
that I'm avoiding my midlife crisis is I started this
(27:51):
this a local writer did a story on it and
he called it my passion project. So I'm doing this
sort of love my view passion project. And my son
got and my husband got his band back together after
twenty three years, so I feel like we're like we're
avoiding that, like this is great.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
This is like crisis of why you get a corvette,
you know, It's exactly.
Speaker 3 (28:09):
Really that's the thing. I'm not going to get a corvette,
and I'm probably not going to go get a boob
job or I don't know something. So instead I'm like,
I'm finding fulfillment in this project. It's it is a company,
and of course, like, oh my gosh, if it like
became super successful, that would be great, but really it
is also just like it's like me taking this thing
that I find so meaningful and that I feel like
(28:29):
really resonates with people and just trying to like put
it out there in the world.
Speaker 2 (28:33):
I love that, I really do. I think that that's
a really good idea, and I love the idea of
staving off your midlife crisis and doing something productive and
you know, kind of pretty with it.
Speaker 3 (28:43):
So yeah, no, it is it's a great it's it
actually is, and I've really enjoyed it. And I was
only going to do four sports because I was because
I'm trying to trade, you know, I'm in the trademark
process with all of this. But I was like, you
know what, like I'm just going to like if people
want something and I can make it. I'm just going
to make it because why not. That's the whole that's
kind of the whole fun of it, right, is they're like, oh,
I love this concept. I got a message this morning
(29:06):
from somebody asking me, is there any way you can
make a hat with a fishing pole? And I'm like, yes, ma'am, yep.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
And as soon as take the special orders, I like it.
Speaker 3 (29:15):
Yeah. So anyway, so it's so, it's it's awesome. I
love it.
Speaker 2 (29:18):
Well, I love talking to you. I think you're doing
some really great work. And here with your best tip
for my listeners on how they can improve their lives.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
Oh well, well, this is becoming a theme, I guess
because I just mentioned it. But I would one hundred
percent say, like, trying to focus on feeling gratitude is
really important. And it's funny I did. I wrote a
column on this, probably a couple of years ago. And
so the research is there obviously that this does improve
our lives. But as I'm in this stage of where
(29:51):
suddenly all of my children are taller than I am,
one of them is already out of the house, another
one is a senior, partly because it goes by so
fast that it's like and it's so easy to be
frustrated about things also related to our children and our families,
just because it's like tries your patience and it's and
(30:11):
it's frustrating and it's a lot. But just like taking
that moment and finding things to be grateful for really
does turn around your your mindset, right, So even if
there are things that are bothering you deciding I'm just
gonna I'm just gonna think of some things that I'm
really grateful for. I just think it reframes and I
(30:32):
think that and I think that the way that our
society and culture is right now, which just feels a
kind of negative and it feels very sort of like
gotcha all the time and people kind of mean to
each other. I just have to believe that like if again,
if we bring gratitude into this like toxic stew, like
it has to help, It can't hurt, hurt. It's not
(30:54):
going to fix everything, but it can't hurt. So that
would be my answer.
Speaker 2 (30:57):
Love it. She is Rika Sanzi. Check out her love
my View sports apparel. Thank you so much for coming on, Erica.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
Carol, Thanks so much for having me, and thank you
for everything you did.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
Thanks so much for joining us on the Carol Marco
which show. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.
Hi, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show. On iHeartRadio,
last episode, I talked about meeting someone when you feel
like you're running out of time to get married and
have a family. I gave five tips that I think
are useful, and they were treat it like a job,
don't bend on your must haves, have sane must haves,
(00:31):
give people who are not your type a chance, but
also don't settle, especially when it comes to attraction. I
forgot what I think is actually the most important one
that I've talked about on this show before. If you've
decided that you're serious about getting married, you have to
cut off anyone that you're spending time with that is
(00:54):
not the person you're going to marry. I see this
all the time that people have someone they're in a situationship,
as the kids say, they have someone they talk to
every day, they hang out with, maybe they have a
physical relationship with, and this is definitively not the person
they're going to marry. I would say that having this
(01:18):
kind of side person in your life slows you way
way down for meeting the person that you will actually marry.
It fulfills so many needs to have someone like this,
and it decreases the urgency that you might feel to
find someone. I know it gets lonely. I know it's
(01:40):
nice to have someone, anyone to spend intimate time with,
but having that person is an actual roadblock for you
to meet your forever person. If you have someone in
your life who really wants to meet someone, put that
advice at the top of the lists that you give them.
(02:02):
They can't be spending time with someone who will never
be their spouse, or they won't find the one who
might be. I'm going to have tips for the younger
set in future episodes. If you've got suggestions, I love
hearing them, Send them over. Carol Markowitz Show at gmail
dot com. It's k A r O L m A
r kow i cz Show at gmail dot com. So
(02:27):
many of you have checked out my new podcast, co
hosted with my good friend Mary Katherine Ham. It's called Normally,
and unlike this podcast, it is a political show. New
episodes are posted Tuesdays and Thursdays, and just like this show,
you can hear it anywhere you get your podcasts. Please
subscribe and tell your friends I appreciate you all so much.
(02:48):
Coming up next and interview with eric A Sanzi. Join
us after the break. Thanks so much for joining us
on The Carol Markowitz Show. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
Welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show on iHeartRadio. My
guest today is Erica Sanzi. Erica is director of outreach
at Parents Defending Education, where I'm also on the board
full disclosure, a mom of three teenage sons Woe, and
the founder of Love My View Sports Apparel, which focuses
on gratitude in the context of youth sports. Hi Erica, Hi, Carol.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Great to see you and so nice for me.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
So nice for you to come on. I am a
longtime fan of yours, obviously, but you recently came across
my feed in a million different places because you were
arguing something very interesting and I think you made some
very unique points, and it was about schools banning books.
(03:48):
So can you tell us about your work in this
area and your what your viral comments were. I think
they involved nude magazines.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
Yes, I think that they involved Don't Play magazine. So first,
the book banning conversation is by far one of the
most frustrating and annoying conversations for anybody who really does
know what's going on on the ground. It's been one
of those things that tribalism has kicked in, and so
people keep picking up this book banning ball and running
(04:20):
with it. And I'm screaming at the television and at
the radio because I'm like, this is just not true.
So the whole frame of books being banned is wrong.
There really isn't anywhere that books are being banned. If
you can go into the local library in your town
or city, if you can go on Amazon, if you
(04:40):
can go into the bookstore and get these books, they're
obviously not banned. So the conversation is really about, you know,
library collections in schools, and I think all of us
know that a school library clearly cannot have every single
book in the universe in it. They have to make choices.
I'm pretty sure mine does not have The Art of
(05:01):
the Deal by Donald Trump, and I've never heard anybody
complaining or saying that that book is banned. But what
has happened is that libraries have been against school libraries
have really been infiltrated with books that are highly ideological,
largely around the umbrella of LGBTQ. So we see a
(05:25):
lot of books that obsess about sexual orientation, about transgender ideology,
and in the name of inclusion, they think that these
books are appropriate and needs to be in the school.
But the truth about these books is that they are
pretty new, horribly written, extremely vulgar. In many ways, they
(05:47):
present safeguarding challenges because some of these books actually teach
children how to do things like meet up with adults
on apps designed for people to find sexual partners. So
when people talk about their concerns about books and schools,
it really is a very different conversation than the one
(06:08):
that we may remember, you know, from forever, where people
were upset about certain Judy Bloom books, or people were
upset about books by Alice Walker or Tony Morrison because
there was a lot of sexual content in those very
rich works of literature. Right, we're not talking about literature.
We're talking about basically garbage books. But because all of
(06:33):
the institutions have been so captured, the American Library Association
being one of them, they look for books about sexual
orientation and transgender ideology. They name these books to award lists,
and these are the award lists that librarians have always
looked to when they're trying to add to their collection,
(06:53):
so they go on the award list, and there's never
been a reason for them to assume that the books
that they're buying for the school library are going to
be wildly inappropriate for students.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Yeah, I think, you know, it's interesting. We covered this
in our book Stolen Youth, which of course is probably
banned in your school library as well. Guys, maybe you
should all check that out and see my banned book
is in your kids elementary school library. But they use
that LGBTQ thing as a shield. They use it, as
(07:29):
you know, you're not allowed to have these books, and
it's because they're LGBTQ, and that's ridiculous. It's not because
I don't want a lot of these stories wouldn't make
sense to me in a straight context either. I don't
want my kids reading about kids meeting up with grown ups,
even if it's male and female or you know.
Speaker 3 (07:48):
Whichever direction correct.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
So I think that they use that as a crutch
to make it so that you really can't complain too
much about it. And the thing that I want to
ask you about, you know, I thought that the Right
was doing a fantastic job on showing this kind of
stuff in libraries, like Ron DeSantis presenting these books at
a press conference and the media being unable to show
(08:11):
the books on TV. I thought it was all brilliant
and genius, and then an activist told me that it
wasn't polling. Well, it's that we were still seen as
book banners even though we were showing pictures of children,
you know, giving oral sex and that kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
So is that true?
Speaker 2 (08:33):
And how is that so?
Speaker 3 (08:36):
Parents of any education? We did polling on this too,
and the polling on anything involving the words book banning
polls really badly because it's just a knee jerk reaction.
And I also think, to be honest, because many of
these texts are so incredibly and outrageously inappropriate. Most people
(09:00):
who you know, don't focus on this in their daily life,
do not believe that the content that people are describing
could possibly be true.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Right, So it's a challenge that.
Speaker 3 (09:13):
Can't be happening, that can't be true, or it's that
has to be a one a one off, that's an outlier.
And you're realizing that actually again, and partly too because
I was working in schools as recently as twenty fifteen.
In twenty fifteen, I didn't see these texts. So this
has been very quick new and so person thinks, well,
(09:38):
when I was in school, you know, yeah, there was
like that Judy Bloom book. But come on, guys like
lighten up, or they just think that it can even that.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Judy Bloom book. I don't want it for my you know,
sixth grader. I don't want it from my third grader.
My daughter's in ninth grade. I don't know, maybe another
year or two before I think she should be. You know,
we could read Forever by Judy Bloom. It was racy.
I remember that, so I did. If there's anything wrong
about keeping those books, even the Judy Blue books, out
of the hands of small children.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
But at least on the Judy Bloom front, you could
probably go out for drinks or dinner with your friends
and you guys could have like a pretty like robust
discussion and disagreement about that. Whereas the text that we're
talking about, if you laid those out on the table
of a bunch of your friends, we'd be like uncomfortable
from it who have like different politics or who have
really different feelings about you know this, this idea of
(10:29):
you know, controlling what people can read. They would all
be like, this is insane and anybody that wants this
in schools is deranged, Right, Yeah, that's why you think
it's different. And I think it's polling really badly because
they're thinking back, you know, they're thinking back to the
movie Footloose when like you know, they're throwing books in
the garbage can and setting them on fire because they
(10:52):
talk about dancing.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
And so I just think book's not about dancing.
Speaker 3 (10:57):
Not about dancing, And I feel like it's just it's
it's an awareness thing where like you and me and
people that are really dialed in on this, like we
have to sort of constantly remind ourselves that the average
person out there living their life is not focused on this.
They're hearing about it a little bit, it's not really
breaking through, and so like as much as we think,
(11:18):
how do you not know this? I can speak to
all the people in my own life right who I'm
at this on the sidelines of my kid's games, or
I'm at the grocery store and it's new to them,
or it's they've only heard a little bit about it,
but they really have no working knowledge of what's going on,
(11:38):
and I think that's also why the pulling on it
is so bad.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
I talk about this a lot, but I always find
it a challenge to talk to Red state or Red
area audiences about this kind of stuff because they believe
it's happening. They think it's happening for sure, but not
at their kids' school. They think they somehow are immune
from it, like not in my kid's school. I live
(12:01):
in a deep red area, and you're just like, here's
a list of books, go find out, and they often
find out that, of course they have their Red state school,
their Red area school does have these books. And it's
a challenge because people love their local school. It's like
the whole thing would like you, Congress pulls badly, but
when you pull people about their individual Congress person, they
(12:22):
pull high that that's exactly what's happening here too.
Speaker 3 (12:25):
I think, oh, one hundred percent, And again it's possible
it's not in their school. You know. I live in
a blue state, Rhode Island the smallest one, and there
are schools where they don't really have these books, and
then there's other ones where it's absolutely full of them.
So again it's you can't say for sure, but it
is completely naive and wrong to think that if you
(12:48):
live in a red state or in a red district,
that you're not going to see these texts. Partly also
because again some people think back to like the librarian
who was like little old lady with the sweater hanging
on the back of her chair, and she was going around,
you know, telling people to stop talking and shushing people,
and she would have been horrified and mortified by these texts.
(13:12):
But that's not necessarily Also, who the librarians are now,
so you know, when you come up through the education
system to become a school librarian, they're marinating in a
lot of this ideology. And so again some order off
the award list totally unwittingly and are like shocked when
this whole thing blows up in their face because they're thinking,
(13:34):
I had no idea. Others are totally on board with this,
and they want these books in their library, and they
are making displays in the school where they'll put, you know,
all of these books about gender ideology, all of these books,
you know, children's books about Harvey Milk, because they think
that young children have to know who Harvey Milk is
(13:56):
or else they're not an educated person.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
So a question I ask all of my guests is
what do you worry about? What do you think is
our largest cultural problem?
Speaker 3 (14:07):
I mean, there's many to pick from. So if I
had to name something, I think it would have to
do with our abdication of responsibility around projecting childhood. And
I'm actually not just saying this. I know you've wrote
a book called Stolen Youth, but this would have been.
This is my answer anyway, largely because again of the
work I do and the work I've done, it just
(14:28):
seems to me that we are burdening children with topics
and issues that don't belong anywhere on their radar, right right, So,
and so, for example, instead of it used to be
that you might have a child that is really dealing
with some really bad, tough issues, there's something really serious
going on, and that would be addressed. What has happened
(14:50):
now is they've sort of made it so that every child,
the default is now to make these topics that every
child has to talk, right, right, So, so in sixth grade,
when they fill out the I think it's like a
a youth risk or behavior survey or something like they're
bombarded with questions about suicide. Now, that's an eleven year
(15:12):
old child, And is it ever the case that there's
something going on with a child at that age where
it needs to be discussed, Yes, But does it have
to be the default for every kid that something that
they never would have thought of, don't really know anything about,
and is scary, you know, is suddenly kind of pushed
in their face. And that's how I feel about, you know,
(15:33):
Like in the Chicago public schools, they're they're they're teaching
very technical sexual terms in pre K, and then they're
teaching the third graders that their sex is assigned at
birth and that they can be a boy or a
girl or anything or neither and it's their choice. It's like,
it's like putting aside how crazy that is. When you
(15:53):
layer on top of that how young these children are.
It's like, I'm always like, why are you talking to
chillchildren who put the their tooth under their pillow for
the truth carey and sit on Santa Claus's lap because
they literally believe he comes down their chimney, like their
childhood is supposed to be magical. And it's like this
weird new movement of burdening them with things that are
(16:20):
completely outside they're even like their developmental ability to comprehend.
But also it's like you take the worst situations that
could be facing children and then you force every child
to grapple with it.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
And I think, I think these kids want to believe
what adults are telling them, so they end up really
internalizing this stuff, and especially the suicide stuff. I think that's,
you know, obviously so dangerous. It's you could plant an
idea in a kid that never had that idea before
so easily, And I don't know how it isn't a
(16:56):
wider conversation about this.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
Yeah. I mean, like I've posted screenshots of the surveys
to show people, and you get a lot of people
that think it's outrageous and terrible. But then there's always
the ones, Yeah, but what if a kid, you know,
has a problem, And I'm like, that would be handled individually, right,
Like that is something that you address. You don't make
every single child in the sixth grade. I think it's
(17:22):
actually six through twelve because they that The other crazy
thing is they ask the sixth graders the same questions
as the twelfth graders. But it's like you don't, because,
especially if a child is predisposed to any sort of anxiety,
some of those questions really can scare them and can
get into their head. And it's like you took a
kid that had no issue going and no problem, and
(17:42):
now they've they've got a problem because they were forced
to answer these questions. So I just think that that
is this idea that we that we burden them with
adult topics and we pathologize their childhood so that because
it almost like it's like this equity thing, right, Well,
if a few kids are going through this, then we
need to make sure that every child is aware of
(18:04):
it and we're asking them about it. I mean an
example is, and I only know this because during COVID
they had to fill out this survey at home. So
my son's at the dining room table. He's in the
sixth grade at the time, and he's like, he yells out,
I was He's like, I was drunk or stoned. So
(18:24):
I'm like, what are you doing And he's like, well,
I'm filling out this survey and I'm trying to answer
this question about why I was absent. He's like, and
I'm looking for a choice that says doctor's appointment, but
instead all the choices were things like I'm being bullied
so badly. I don't want to go to school. You know,
we didn't have any transportation to get there. I was drunk. Oh,
(18:47):
that's what it was. I was drunk or high. There
was another one about you know, oh, I had to
go with my parents. I had to go with my
family to help them with translation. Like it's so it's like,
here you have a kid who's like I just had
a doctor's appointment that was kind of far away, so
I had to miss the whole day, and those are
(19:11):
like like he because it's like now you're like, wait,
there's kids who stay home from school because they're really
badly bullied, Like it becomes this It also.
Speaker 2 (19:19):
I could get drunk or stoned, Like I think that
kind of also plants that idea.
Speaker 3 (19:25):
And also I'm eleven.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
I never think that that's even an option for them.
Is suddenly like wait, kids do this.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
Yeah, Like and also I'm like he's eleven, Like why
are you suggesting that that a plausible reason that he's
not at school is that he's drunk or high exactly?
And again, it's not that it's never happened. I've worked
in schools long enough to know yes, but again that
is the outlier case, and you've now made it the
default for every child in this because of some weird
(19:55):
I don't even really understand the reasoning, but I just
think it's bad for kids. And I also think again, like,
I get it, you need to track, you know, youth behavior.
You're looking to see if kids are smoking and drinking
and having sex, and so I understand that they feel
the need to collect this information, but I'm increasingly opposed
(20:17):
to the school being the vehicle because I think that
the questions have become really inappropriate. I think that again,
parents have no idea what's on these surveys. I was shocked,
and I'm betting dialed into this, and I had no
idea that the questions had become so invasive and really
about really mature topics at younger and younger grades. So
(20:39):
again that's my very long way of saying, like, I
just think that we're failing our children in because we're like,
it's almost like we're swapping out the magic of childhood
for like adult problems.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
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f E. I'll be right back with more from Erica Sanzi.
Speaker 2 (22:36):
You have this job where you help protect kids, You
have a beautiful family, you have a new apparel line.
Love my view, do you feel like you've made it?
Speaker 3 (22:46):
I feel like I've made it, so, I mean, I
guess I would say that you're always kind of like evolving, right,
so at least for me, like I don't mentally sit still. Well. So,
on the one hand, yes, because to your point, I
have a beautiful family. My parents are still alive and healthy.
(23:07):
I have a strong marriage. I don't, you know, struggle
to figure out how we're going to eat or if
there's going to be a roof over ihead like our
basic needs are definitely met. So in all of that, Oh,
and I have a job that I love, and I
have colleagues that I love right, So yes, on the
other hand, I feel like there's like more, but it's
(23:31):
not more like, oh, I want to make more money,
or oh I want more status, or oh I want
to get you know, make my platform really huge and
become famous. It's more like I don't mentally stay still.
I think is the issue. Right, So when people talk
about how much they love all their free time because
they can like do their hobbies, like I'm a little
(23:52):
bit like, yeah, I don't think I really have hobbies because.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
So my hobby is saving the next generation, right.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
So like this this new thing that I'm doing. So
here's an example of something. So just call and this
just start.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
For the audio listeners. Erica showed us a hat that
sulf love my view.
Speaker 3 (24:11):
And there's a football in place of the Oh. I
actually have another one over here which I made. My
husband just got his band back together, so I made
this one with the guitar and the guitar oh nice,
so that when I'm playing the role of groupie, I
can wear that. But so this is just like a
new thing for me that I feel like is like
another chapter. And it's largely because one of my favorite
(24:34):
favorite things in my life could be my favorite thing
actually is watching my kids play sports. In fact, my
oldest after fourteen years of playing baseball, just played his
last game a few weeks ago, and it's a loss.
Like it's a real feeling of loss. And it doesn't
matter that it's baseball. It it would be anything, you know
(24:54):
what I mean, if your child had played the piano
or been in musicals or dance their whole life and
then you go to the last perform and it would
be the same thing. It's this idea of getting to
watch your children do what they love and thrive. Ette
So the whole point. So years ago, I would go
on Twitter and I would take a picture of the
field or the basketball court, you know, and I would
(25:17):
just write the words love my view next to that picture.
And after a bunch of years, I just thought, you know,
like this is kind of a cool thing and it
and at first it started out as like an idea
where I was like, Okay, youth sports is a kind
of like a stew of lots of emotions and behaviors.
(25:37):
Some are very positive, some are not so positive. So
my thought was like if you just for a moment
say to yourself, like, I'm so lucky. This is what
I get to do, this is what I get to watch,
This is what I get to see, it's like it
brings gratitude into that stew So it doesn't mean that
you're not you know, people aren't going to be mad
(25:59):
at the rest for a kid got dropped in the
batting order, or you know, mad because something didn't go
their way. Like I'm not I'm not naive enough to
think that all that goes away because there is kind
of a natural tension between competition and gratitude. But on
the other hand, they also kind of fit nicely together
because part of what people love about that is the competition.
(26:22):
So yeah, so it started out as just a sports thing,
but parents have reached out to me and said, I
love this concept so much of loving my view as
it pertains to my children or my grandchildren. But my
kids don't play sports. So they'll say, you know, my
daughter is really into music and she does singing and
she does musicals, and so my answer was, well, then
(26:44):
I'll make that so I love that on sports collection now.
So like if you're you know, and and I keep
getting I get like requests, and because I'm just swapping
in a new design for the oh and love, I
can actually do it really easily. So even if it's
like a one off that almost nobody else wants. Like
(27:07):
to give an example, there's a woman that I know
whose son is on track and field at University Wisconsin.
He does the hammer throw, and of course she's like,
you're obviously not going to have like a hammer throw design,
and I was like, well, I'll make one for you, right,
you know what I mean, Like I can do that.
So yeah, So it's so it's and again, part of
this is I spent my weekends for over a decade
(27:30):
every Saturday and Sunday at my kids' games. But as
kids get older, the games aren't on the weekends really,
and so you wake up on Saturday morning and you're like,
I have nowhere to be. And some people are like,
here's oh my god, you must love that, but like
for me, it's a void. And part of the way
that I'm avoiding my midlife crisis is I started this
(27:51):
this a local writer did a story on it and
he called it my passion project. So I'm doing this
sort of love my view passion project. And my son
got and my husband got his band back together after
twenty three years, so I feel like we're like we're
avoiding that, like this is great.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
This is like crisis of why you get a corvette,
you know, It's exactly.
Speaker 3 (28:09):
Really that's the thing. I'm not going to get a corvette,
and I'm probably not going to go get a boob
job or I don't know something. So instead I'm like,
I'm finding fulfillment in this project. It's it is a company,
and of course, like, oh my gosh, if it like
became super successful, that would be great, but really it
is also just like it's like me taking this thing
that I find so meaningful and that I feel like
(28:29):
really resonates with people and just trying to like put
it out there in the world.
Speaker 2 (28:33):
I love that, I really do. I think that that's
a really good idea, and I love the idea of
staving off your midlife crisis and doing something productive and
you know, kind of pretty with it.
Speaker 3 (28:43):
So yeah, no, it is it's a great it's it
actually is, and I've really enjoyed it. And I was
only going to do four sports because I was because
I'm trying to trade, you know, I'm in the trademark
process with all of this. But I was like, you
know what, like I'm just going to like if people
want something and I can make it. I'm just going
to make it because why not. That's the whole that's
kind of the whole fun of it, right, is they're like, oh,
I love this concept. I got a message this morning
(29:06):
from somebody asking me, is there any way you can
make a hat with a fishing pole? And I'm like, yes, ma'am, yep.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
And as soon as take the special orders, I like it.
Speaker 3 (29:15):
Yeah. So anyway, so it's so, it's it's awesome. I
love it.
Speaker 2 (29:18):
Well, I love talking to you. I think you're doing
some really great work. And here with your best tip
for my listeners on how they can improve their lives.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
Oh well, well, this is becoming a theme, I guess
because I just mentioned it. But I would one hundred
percent say, like, trying to focus on feeling gratitude is
really important. And it's funny I did. I wrote a
column on this, probably a couple of years ago. And
so the research is there obviously that this does improve
our lives. But as I'm in this stage of where
(29:51):
suddenly all of my children are taller than I am,
one of them is already out of the house, another
one is a senior, partly because it goes by so
fast that it's like and it's so easy to be
frustrated about things also related to our children and our families,
just because it's like tries your patience and it's and
(30:11):
it's frustrating and it's a lot. But just like taking
that moment and finding things to be grateful for really
does turn around your your mindset, right, So even if
there are things that are bothering you deciding I'm just
gonna I'm just gonna think of some things that I'm
really grateful for. I just think it reframes and I
(30:32):
think that and I think that the way that our
society and culture is right now, which just feels a
kind of negative and it feels very sort of like
gotcha all the time and people kind of mean to
each other. I just have to believe that like if again,
if we bring gratitude into this like toxic stew, like
it has to help, It can't hurt, hurt. It's not
(30:54):
going to fix everything, but it can't hurt. So that
would be my answer.
Speaker 2 (30:57):
Love it. She is Rika Sanzi. Check out her love
my View sports apparel. Thank you so much for coming on, Erica.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
Carol, Thanks so much for having me, and thank you
for everything you did.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
Thanks so much for joining us on the Carol Marco
which show. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.
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