Robert Gallery Shares The Mental Toll Of Football & Healing After NFL Career With Raiders | Bussin' - Bussin' With The Boys

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
All right, We're good.

Speaker 2 (00:06):
You like go.

Speaker 3 (00:09):
Busting with the boys, hanging with the fast, betting on
a game. No woman's gonna tell us what you do.
Not be over here just drinking beer and making nad Baby,

(00:37):
I'm hanging with the Fellers. He's busting with the boys. Bro.

Speaker 2 (00:46):
Welcome to another episode of Busting with the Boys. If
you're in the car right now listening, please make sure
that you are subscribed to our channels where they're listening
on Spotify, Apple, Amazon on audio, make sure you're following
or subscribed, and if you're watching the boys on YouTube
right now, just again, we encourage you to subscribe. Helps
the boys out a lot. We've got a lot to
talk about. We got a lot to talk about. We
have an awesome interview with Robert Gallery.

Speaker 4 (01:08):
Awesome.

Speaker 2 (01:09):
Yeah, his journey, mental health, all the stuff it is.
It is very much worth your two and a half
hours of time. We'll be breaking down our weekends, having
some fun with some spicy road tier talk, best compliments
to your wife, some final bites before we sign off
and get into the interview. But this this episode is
brought to us and presented by the Fandel Sportsbook, America's

(01:30):
number one sportsbook. We got week twelve bills versus Texans,
and we'll be watching the game live from our stream room.
We'll have a same game parlay for you guys to tail.
We'll have a nice little giveaway for you guys courtesy
of Fandel who will also have a thirty percent profit
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(01:51):
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picks now, gentlemen, we have a good weekend with a

(02:13):
fun little weekend.

Speaker 5 (02:14):
Yeah, New Orleans.

Speaker 2 (02:16):
How was Nola?

Speaker 6 (02:18):
I just feel like it was cool. I was visiting
one of my buddies. I used to live here, but
I got just going back and I didn't get sick,
but I had like PTSD from you guys being sick,
So I was like this place just just kind of.

Speaker 2 (02:31):
Like stayed away from the oysters.

Speaker 6 (02:32):
Yeah, just try to eat like the most bland food. No,
I mean I have a very bland diet to begin with.

Speaker 2 (02:39):
You get chicken, fingers and fries.

Speaker 6 (02:42):
Uh basically. Yeah. But it was just like I'm just
uncomfortable in that city.

Speaker 2 (02:47):
Brought my own PB and is uncomfortable in that city.

Speaker 6 (02:49):
But it was great to see, like I saw some
old buddies, so it was it was.

Speaker 1 (02:53):
It was a lot of fun.

Speaker 7 (02:54):
Is Nolah the best dirtiest city in the US.

Speaker 1 (02:57):
It's so dirty, the dirty ones.

Speaker 2 (02:59):
Yeah, number one dirtiest sitting in the US.

Speaker 8 (03:01):
I'd say it's definitely had like the biggest and the
most recognition.

Speaker 1 (03:04):
I feel like a Dirty Boys.

Speaker 6 (03:06):
Broadway can be considered pretty dirty.

Speaker 7 (03:08):
I wouldn't even put those in the same Yeah, was
a streak, there's like a smell everywhere.

Speaker 4 (03:14):
A fragrance.

Speaker 2 (03:15):
Yeah, it's the most popular dirtiest city.

Speaker 7 (03:18):
Yeah, you can throw like a Portland in there, but
like I'm I have no desire to go to Portland.

Speaker 6 (03:22):
But you know, how's Saint Louis.

Speaker 4 (03:24):
Saint Louis clean.

Speaker 2 (03:25):
It's got some dirty parts, but yeah, for the most part,
I wouldn't say Saint Louis is close to New Orleans.

Speaker 1 (03:30):
Philly's pretty dirty Philly.

Speaker 2 (03:32):
Philly seems like a dirty, little.

Speaker 6 (03:33):
Bit gritty, Like I feel like Philly's is more gritty
than it is dirty, if that makes sense.

Speaker 1 (03:40):
Yeah, a lot of grit fighter mentality there.

Speaker 4 (03:43):
They probably New Orleans.

Speaker 8 (03:45):
Dirtiest destination city in the world.

Speaker 9 (03:48):
He really keeps it.

Speaker 2 (03:49):
Yeah, nice and dirty.

Speaker 1 (03:52):
The weather down there was actually pretty good.

Speaker 6 (03:53):
It was like seventy five eighty, but it wasn't humid
it also it felt really good.

Speaker 4 (03:57):
Oh that's nice. That's nice. Would you do anything special
this weekend?

Speaker 2 (04:02):
Yeah, we celebrated, uh a little Scottie. Joelee turned one.
She turned one last Wednesday twelfth, Yeah, November twelfth, she
turned she turned one last Wednesday. We had my uh
my dad in town with Stephanie. We had my brothers
in town with their significant others. Cody by the way,
Cody just got engaged, so have a have a sister

(04:24):
in law. And then uh, yeah, Charles's parents. Charles's parents
came over. So it was very rare moment to have
the grandparents, the brothers, everybody kind of like all in town.

Speaker 4 (04:34):
Nice little dynamic hanging out.

Speaker 1 (04:36):
Yeah, whyott is on the clock.

Speaker 2 (04:38):
Why it's on the clock.

Speaker 4 (04:39):
Yeah, I did his girl come?

Speaker 2 (04:45):
Why at the trip?

Speaker 4 (04:45):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (04:46):
Yeah, Morgan.

Speaker 9 (04:47):
What'd you'll have on the menu?

Speaker 2 (04:49):
Arcouterier board? Oh board? Some cookies, a smash cake?

Speaker 9 (04:54):
What's a smash cake?

Speaker 2 (04:55):
Cake? Coud you just smash and eat with your hands up? Yes,
it's one year old Boycott. He was very weary of
the smash cakes. She didn't really. We were trying to
like put the frosting and stuff in her mouth to
taste it, but she she didn't care about those smash cakes.
She wanted the rich crackers that were close by. Good good, Yeah,
it's strong.

Speaker 4 (05:12):
Yeah, I know I've talked about this quite a bit
on this show, but the addiction my oldest child has
to sugar needs to be studied. She is so obsessed
with and we try to like keep her away from
sugar for the first three years. Was pretty good about it,
and I think it just it just harbored everything because
it is it is insane to watch itis right now,
menace about it. She's a menas, great kid, outstanding individual,

(05:34):
but it's like it's crack. Sugar is cracked to that child.

Speaker 9 (05:37):
Yeah, she old for you to throw.

Speaker 7 (05:39):
I don't know if there's like these like hacks where
you can like put an ingredient on candy, like whether
it's like a vinegar substance, where like she would have
a bad reaction, which is like I.

Speaker 9 (05:49):
Don't like candy.

Speaker 4 (05:49):
That's a that's a Yeah, she's too old for that.
She's too old. Set her, she's too quick, yeah, yeah,
she's yeah, she's too aware of what's kind of going
on right now. Oh win rebel. Dude, Uh my weekend,
I mean, dude, forty eight hours. We flew Wednesday, flew
to New York, flew back Thursday morning, spent lunch with
my family, flew to Arizona Thursday and night. I had

(06:11):
to handle a little something something over there. But after
I handled that something something me Tanner, his wife, his
wife's kids, Jack and Scotland, which, by the way, I
have no idea what I did to those kids. I'm
their favorite person in the entire world. I am their
favorite person. Scotland is six five or six, and then
Jack is in that three four category. But they were

(06:31):
just they stayed up late to see me. Yeah, and
like we play like they had a ball and it's
just like it's just it's the power of yes with them, dude,
you say yes, you play with them. They do things
that their parents get mad about. But I'm just hey,
we can kind of do whatever around here, right.

Speaker 8 (06:43):
You have the look of if I was ages four
to nine, I would be like, Yo, this guy is
the coolest person to ever exist. Let's smaller than everyone,
he has tattoos, and you just never know what's going
to come from gives high five.

Speaker 4 (06:57):
Ye oh oh yeah, and you just got to fine.
Like with the younger kids, especially when starting to get
out of the agehe I'm like, oh, I got to
actually be cool for her to So that's a taking
time bomb for us. But everybody under the age of eight,
I do. I find one thing that they're obsessed with,
and I just beat that ship into the ground with roots.

Speaker 2 (07:14):
The high five. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (07:15):
At tigh five with Scotland Tanner's daughter stepdaughter, it's cartwheels
meet and her trying to watch me do the splits.
If I try to just splits in front of her,
she think it's the funniest thing in the world. And
Jack's just a homie bro, little Jack, He's awesome. Me
sit there and be like, man, I kind of want
a boy. Yeah, I kind of want a boy. He's
a little psycho.

Speaker 2 (07:32):
Boy did that?

Speaker 4 (07:32):
We go to zips Man.

Speaker 1 (07:35):
Photo.

Speaker 4 (07:36):
It was the best I've had. It was the best
I have ever had. Just continues to exceed expectations, continue.
It just keeps on, dude. Just when you think like
we've had enough of it, I'm sure it's gonna not
taste as good as time it is.

Speaker 2 (07:50):
I go not that thing out.

Speaker 4 (07:51):
I'm in a full suit, and uh, it's Tanner's sister, Valentina,
her kid Madeline's there with both her kids. And Tanner
was doing this already, golfing. I don't think this is
something that does more charity work than Tanner. I don't
know if he ever actually raises money, but he's always
on like a hunt or a golfing or whatever, but
he's always doing that. I get the zips waiter comes by.

(08:11):
We exchanged pleasantries about our mustachers. He's got one. I
complement him. He gives it back and I said, yeah,
I was actually fishing for one, so thank you, and
then I give him the whole spiel. Buddy. I don't
live here anymore, but I used to live here. This
is what I need. If you could just say make
it with love to the chef that being credible, and
he really did it, he truly did and it was buddy,

(08:32):
it's so fucking good. It's so good. And my foot
was starting to feel a little bit better. So I
treated myself a little bit. Yeah this foot man, get
back Friday. Put the I'm like, hey, I've been traveling
so much. Joan's like, hey, the next two days like
put your foot up and just rest your foot, Like
we have to figure out what the hell's going on

(08:52):
with this thing. So I rested for a couple of days.
Sunday night, my daughter has a rehearsal or not a rehearsal,
like I don't know this thing. She started a band
with two other girls and they wrote their own songs,
and this lady helped them write songs ladies paying the
piano of the ukulele. While these kids are like going
back and forth seeing not bad, I will say they

(09:12):
are not. It's not a bad club. There After that,
we go to Hugh Babies and I'm starting to feel like, Okay,
I can actually walk. I can't like press off my foot,
but I'm like walking without a limp and I'm like
a little milkshake kind of sound nice right now, baby,
once again, just falling into the trap that got me
in the situation again. And Buddy, I woke up this
morning at three am, foot ballooned up, go to stand

(09:33):
up to take a piss, and it's just fucking hell.
It is just hell. I've lost thirteen pounds. I am,
I am pray, I am, I am not I. At
one point in time, boys, I was a highly successful
Pro Bowl football player, possibly arguably the best tackle in
the NFL. Now I am just less than I am pray.

(09:57):
I'm a shell of myself. If a large gust of
wind take off when I'm outside, I might fly away.
Haven't worked out in three weeks. I look at my
body and I'm just like, what the fuck is this?
I look at the man, I'm just like, what are
you doing here?

Speaker 2 (10:08):
Huh?

Speaker 4 (10:09):
You're just oozing away? And I am dude, I am
getting to the point where I'm just I'm just always
in pain. I am always in pain now and it
just sucks and it won't go away and I can't
fix it. I've been on pain pills for like twelve
days straight. That's like kind of tight, because you gotta
feel kind of nice at certain times, but other times,

(10:31):
I've been through this game before. To come down is horrible.
My personality is like, how do we get more? And
so I'm just like fighting the good fight. And I
don't like where I'm at right now. November twenty twenty five.
I don't like where I'm at.

Speaker 1 (10:43):
You got one week to get it together, buddy.

Speaker 4 (10:47):
Yeah, I'm I'm in the movie Saw. I'm in the
movie one hundred and twenty seven hours and there's a
knife staring at me right now, and I'm like, do
I just cut my foot off? It might be better
than what is happening right now. It is awful, bro,
It's awful, and it sucks too, And be like, oh Taylor,
oh no, what happened to your foot? You're in a
boot and I have to go hide?

Speaker 2 (11:08):
Go out now.

Speaker 4 (11:08):
I don't rough out, but I think I had gout
and I rolled in my foot and then I looking
at my my foot. I don't even know if I
actually tore a look at my foot. I'm just like
kind of sitting there and be like, they think this,
So I'm just gonna say it like that so it
looked like less of a bitch. There was a time dude,
when you would have a boot on after a football
game and it was low key at badge of honor, like, yeah,
I played through it, I'm gonna play next week. I
think about junior year in Michigan State, had a high

(11:31):
ankle sprain and a broken hand, and I was at
the bar at Rick's American Cafe, slugging beers in a
boot and a cast on my wrist, and there was
a piece of me that's like, you fucking earn this beer,
and what're you gonna do next week? You're gonna play Now.
I'm thirty four, and my kids are like chopping at
the bit, be like, hey, Dad, play with us. If
you could play Burgoin with us, just go on your knees.

(11:51):
And I'm like, I just truly I can't do it,
and I'm I'm on the couch. I'm withering away. I'm
slowly to tear. I take so much pride, dude, taking
care of my body because I've taken so many shots
in the head and I played so recklessly in football.
I know there's a vegetative state in my future, and
so I just try to stay ahead of the chains.
And here I am with a fucking boot on man,

(12:12):
Damn Mitch. A vegetative state is somebody that's in the
hospital can't like non responsive.

Speaker 5 (12:19):
I didn't mean to say you're already acting.

Speaker 4 (12:22):
Yeah, it's accelerating, and I like to think I am
very conscious about my health. What I eat, it's how
I how I train, Like stay ahead the chains, cold tubs,
hot tubs, saw us get a little n ida every
once in a while.

Speaker 2 (12:37):
Like it's crazy to think a milkshake can take you out, bro,
dam Like that's where you are.

Speaker 4 (12:45):
Man, I know, dude, I know, and it's like everything
you just said hurt. But it's like he's what what
am I mad about? Because there's truth and that's what sucks. Bro.

Speaker 1 (12:55):
I think you see how far you can go.

Speaker 4 (12:58):
No, dude, let me tell you something. Know, Like I
like you guys, have you had gout? Has anybody here
had gout?

Speaker 9 (13:05):
You're at the beach one time?

Speaker 4 (13:07):
And what did he say?

Speaker 7 (13:08):
I honestly didn't take it seriously because when your buddy's hurt,
you're like, thank god, you're being a bitch.

Speaker 9 (13:13):
I know.

Speaker 7 (13:14):
But then I'm hearing it from you and I'm like,
maybe I should have taken them more serious.

Speaker 2 (13:17):
Dude.

Speaker 4 (13:17):
People some more empathy with people in the comments who
are listening to this right now. If you've had gout, please
explain to these boys what it's like.

Speaker 2 (13:24):
People are. People are I've been seeing people.

Speaker 1 (13:26):
There's a lot of aud was.

Speaker 8 (13:28):
Like a World War two disease when I was first due.

Speaker 4 (13:31):
It is literally it's the people call it the king's disease,
like in medieval times. That's legit how it looks, by
the way, except for the dude's left foot as crazy as.

Speaker 1 (13:39):
Well, drop a feet pick for the people.

Speaker 4 (13:41):
But dude, and medieval times, kings and like higher end
people in these worlds would get them because they wouldn't exercise,
the heat, read and meat all the time, and so
it was literally like a distinguished disease they called the
King's disease. And I fucking hate it, man, I literally
I feel so defeated. I feel so defeated right now,

(14:04):
and I just don't I don't want to be the
guy that's on antibiotic every day. Wake up with my
fucking Onday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday pills and I have to
open it up, take it out and take that. And
if I don't take it then I get sick or whatever.
That's the start of the end, Like, how do I
fix this? How do I get it right? I've worked
so hard, and I know this is I listen bos,
you guys don't deserve me just fucking vomiting on you
guys right now. But give me some time here. I

(14:27):
have worked so hard since my football career has ended
of trying to get my gut health back in order
because of all the steroid packs and all the pills
and all the things that the tourtal shots over and
over and over again I've done. I've tried so hard
to fix those things. I've taken a steroid pack in
the last couple of weeks. I'm on this uric acid
thing right now. I'm taking tram it all and I'm

(14:47):
just looking at myself like, bro, you're going to fuck
your gut up again. If not, it's already fucked up
and it sucks.

Speaker 2 (14:54):
Onward.

Speaker 4 (14:55):
Somebody else tell me something bad that's happen to them
misally JP, I'll.

Speaker 2 (14:58):
Say this, Yeah, I mean, back's not the backs on
all the way there, but I'll say this. Since eight
thirty this morning, I've had twelve missed calls from spammers,
Like there is a there's an epidemic right now, like
spam callers good, and I don't know what to do.

Speaker 7 (15:09):
One two minutes ago and I've had four since I've
been on this bus.

Speaker 2 (15:13):
Do I've blocked like forty numbers and they just keep coming.

Speaker 9 (15:17):
Bro, I feel better that you're getting them.

Speaker 7 (15:18):
But all weekend, I legitimately probably got thirty plus spam
calls messages galore, and I'm like, did I die enroll
in something where they ship my number out?

Speaker 9 (15:28):
It is so frustrating.

Speaker 4 (15:30):
The problem is, too, is if I heard, if you
ignore it, it's actually better than blocking it because if
you block it, they know that's an active number, so
they go and send it off to other places.

Speaker 2 (15:39):
I heard.

Speaker 4 (15:40):
I heard something to think about. But hey, thank you.
I know you guys are dealing with a lot now too,
and it is annoying. Bro, Yeah I bet I bet
it sucks. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (15:51):
Yeah, it's probably the worst thing going on right now
for people besides gout. Yeah, I mean having to ignore
my phone and put them on silence send them in
the voicemail right right before the holidays. Yeah. It's frustrating, man,
it's annoying. Yeah, but yeah, that's that's probably the worst
thing going on right now that I'm dealing with, I

(16:14):
think Scotty could be. Is there such thing as like
a twelve month sleep regression.

Speaker 4 (16:19):
Yeah, we'll talk about it.

Speaker 2 (16:20):
There's always some sleep regression. So like six times trying
to you know, just quieter, down, down, Like, dude, why
are you yelling? Bro? Get with your ship?

Speaker 4 (16:30):
Figure it the fuck out?

Speaker 2 (16:31):
Then?

Speaker 8 (16:32):
How far away is she from talking? When do kids
start talking?

Speaker 4 (16:35):
She should be getting going.

Speaker 2 (16:36):
She gets dad dad, Yeah, Gaga.

Speaker 4 (16:41):
Lady Gaga a big fan of her.

Speaker 2 (16:43):
She can go, she can do the snake noise. So
seems like we're close.

Speaker 1 (16:50):
She's fluent.

Speaker 4 (16:51):
Dude, Willow was talking quick. Like, if I had Willow
first and then Win second, I'd be looking at when
what's going on here? But because I had to win that,
will was just like kind of they're always around each other.
Start talking real fast, start walking real fast. It's dope
that you got Scotty to one though. I feel like
this year is flown by for y'all.

Speaker 2 (17:08):
Celebration. Man, get the kid to survive for a year.

Speaker 4 (17:12):
Yeah, you've made it. Like at this point, it's on them. Yeah,
you just gotta you can walk now. Yeah, make a sandwich, dude,
and get a job those types of things. But yeah, dude,
gout fucking still doubtful. I'm still goutful. And it's just
like I just want to feel good, dude, I just

(17:33):
want to feel good. Have I not earned that? And
then Jared's dumb ass he go I walk in and
I'm like, hey, guys, I'm in such a bad mood
today that actually I'm in a good mood. Like it's
it's reversed to me, and Jared goes, isn't there like
a super rich hospital you can go to that fixes it?
I go, Jared, do you think he's like some sort
of aluminum like cloaked group of people. I just go

(17:54):
drink some child's blood, and all of a sudden it's fixed.
Because if there is point me in that direction, dude,
I need to fix.

Speaker 7 (17:59):
This in his mind, though he legitimately believes there is
that hospital.

Speaker 4 (18:03):
No doubt, and still it Jared and I, man, we've
had a little bit of we've had a back and
forth last week or so. There's there's gotta be mare
if somebody has an Illuminati type of crew that is
interested in having me be a part of it, and

(18:24):
I am the most vulnerable.

Speaker 8 (18:25):
I could be right now, it exists for sure.

Speaker 4 (18:27):
I gotta believe. Bro, how's Brad Pitt look that good?

Speaker 1 (18:30):
Saying?

Speaker 4 (18:31):
I took a little selfie video this morning, like a victory, Hey,
victory Monday. Got myself a black coffee, Michigan hat, throw
on saaleball, all that thing. I'm looking at myself in
the selfie video thing, and I'm like, look, how old
you look?

Speaker 2 (18:40):
Dude?

Speaker 4 (18:41):
You haven't slept eight hours in three weeks? Like hours?

Speaker 2 (18:46):
You look good? You look good, buddy, trying to give
you some optimism. Thank you.

Speaker 4 (18:50):
I feel like shit, though slowly withered away. You cannot
cure gout.

Speaker 8 (18:57):
Not yet, bro, not yet be the first.

Speaker 2 (19:01):
Can you go back to that jack?

Speaker 1 (19:03):
Click off that.

Speaker 2 (19:06):
You're on the yuric as? Are you staying hydrated?

Speaker 4 (19:09):
I could use more.

Speaker 2 (19:10):
Let's get some more high purine foods in your diet.

Speaker 4 (19:13):
What is purine?

Speaker 2 (19:14):
What is that?

Speaker 1 (19:15):
Who knows?

Speaker 2 (19:15):
Sounds like dog food?

Speaker 4 (19:16):
Purina Tailing says to me the other day, She goes,
have you been drinking more to the type of Water's
like if someone does can in water. The alkalis ball,
they said, the gout and then it went away and
I'm like, dude, I'm all about unique styles of health
and wellness. I'm bigging the juices and the turmerics and
all that stuff. But my mental headspace where I'm at,

(19:39):
I'm thinking, what the fuck are you talking about?

Speaker 2 (19:41):
Dude?

Speaker 4 (19:42):
What water?

Speaker 8 (19:44):
Yeah, plastics, We've crossed the line with waters. There's way
too many waters that get too many waters, too many water.

Speaker 4 (19:50):
You have to get a cankin water system in my house.

Speaker 1 (19:52):
But I need it.

Speaker 4 (19:53):
I need it.

Speaker 1 (19:54):
You can probably get it.

Speaker 4 (19:55):
Probably just point me in the door from that Luminati
crew and I'll get that done.

Speaker 7 (19:58):
It says best foods for Cherry's, Vitamin C, coffee, skim milk, water.

Speaker 4 (20:04):
Okay, good, I'll those thirteen more pounds the next week.

Speaker 2 (20:07):
Get you some cherries, man, Yeah, I do.

Speaker 4 (20:09):
I used to take tar Tart cherry pills and I've
recently just reordered it. But I haven't had meat or
like red meat in three weeks, two weeks. Whatever it is.
I just don't understand, man, Yeah, I don't understand.

Speaker 2 (20:22):
You'll get there.

Speaker 4 (20:23):
You think, so, yeah, like this camp.

Speaker 2 (20:24):
Maybe because you've had you've had a few situations just
with your foot, because I want to say you had
something going on when you're playing on that last year your.

Speaker 4 (20:32):
Foot was like, Bob, that was my first bout of gout.

Speaker 2 (20:34):
Yeah, so it's when was the last one? Was? How
long ago?

Speaker 7 (20:38):
Was?

Speaker 4 (20:38):
That is my third season not playing football?

Speaker 2 (20:41):
Yeah so three years ago. You've had some episodes and
as somebody too, like you take care of yourself as
much as anybody, so knowing that it's like a diet
type thing, it's very surprising. I know.

Speaker 4 (20:51):
Here's what I have to do, dude. I truly have
to understand that my life of eating junk food it
has to be over in order to be happy. And
that's sucks because I have to rewrout my brain. Like
Thanksgivings right around the corner. I'm terrified. I'm terrified of
our Thanksgiving day.

Speaker 5 (21:07):
One day.

Speaker 4 (21:10):
It was one day yesterday, dude, I'm not joking, Mitch.
I was on the ups. I was like, oh, I
might not wear a boot do work tomorrow.

Speaker 2 (21:16):
I might be.

Speaker 5 (21:16):
I might be.

Speaker 4 (21:17):
I might put my trucks back on. I might put
my vans back on. That's how good I was feeling.
I'm out there playing air hockey with my youngest thumbmeater,
but like we're getting we're getting after it, having a
good time.

Speaker 1 (21:26):
And Bro, do you think your those shoes are could be.

Speaker 2 (21:31):
The shoes could be a fact.

Speaker 4 (21:32):
That's a structural thing, though, But I've been doing it
my whole life. Might have flat feet. It's not like
I need arch support. I have no arch in my foot.
I have no arch. Yeah, little flippers. Bro Will loves
talking about my thumbs and my feet.

Speaker 7 (21:46):
Bro.

Speaker 4 (21:46):
Yes, she was a significant factor. Fuck dude, No.

Speaker 9 (21:51):
You might have to get some like Hoka or something.

Speaker 2 (21:53):
Yeah, Bro, get some old guy shoes. Man, get them
clouds start walking. Yeah, I get some.

Speaker 4 (22:00):
I remember, dude, I remember being at Michigan and the trainers.
I was having foot paint because I was wearing a
Dida shoes. I didn't know at the time, but my
freshman year of college football, they're like, hey, I think
the problem is you're wearing vans all the time. Like
you shouldn't be wearing vans. You need something with more
art support. And I think I was like, I'd rather
kill myself basically did not wear vans. And here I am, dude,

(22:23):
thirty four years old, and I have to while you're
telling me I can't wear the number one thing I
associate myself with as far as like clothing goes.

Speaker 6 (22:34):
Would you rather stick with Vans and still have foot
Is shoes or have to change up your style?

Speaker 4 (22:39):
Bro, it sounds like I'd rather change up my style.
I can't live like this, dude, I cannot live like this. Answer, thanks, Mitch.
I know, I'm sorry, man, that's song. Yeah, man, I'm just.

Speaker 1 (22:51):
No, it's okay. I I we were talking earlier.

Speaker 4 (22:54):
So you called me a vegetable like five minutes ago.
You're already there.

Speaker 6 (22:58):
I phrased that wrong. I said, you're it's getting closer.
But what we were saying earlier this morning, it's like
you're in such a bad mood that it's almost like yeah, it's.

Speaker 4 (23:07):
It's like almost Actually it's funny to me where I'm at.

Speaker 6 (23:09):
Yeah, but like we're just no, just nowhere, all on
your side. If you need anything, let us know, right.

Speaker 4 (23:16):
Yeah, years aund my team and that actually really means
a lot because I feel so alone right now, dude,
I'm finding this fire so alone, right Yeah, Yeah, it's awful.

Speaker 2 (23:27):
Should we get into some spicy road tier talk and
best compliments to give your significant other?

Speaker 4 (23:31):
Nothing transitions better from gout than that. So yeah, let's
do it.

Speaker 2 (23:33):
Well, maybe some optimisms, you know, throw out some ideas,
just get out of the conversation.

Speaker 4 (23:39):
Let's get out of there. We're going to make our
own together, Like we're all gonna think take this one.

Speaker 2 (23:43):
Yeah, I think we can. We can all throw stuff
out there. I think you look gorgeous. That could be
on the list right tier three. Yeah, well here's I
think you look stunning. You look gorgeous.

Speaker 4 (23:55):
But here I like those. This is where I think
it takes it a step above. Like you're in a
regular converse sta like you get home from work and
may how is your day? And she just starts talking like, hey,
by the way, you look out standing today.

Speaker 1 (24:05):
Like you you look really.

Speaker 4 (24:07):
Good, and she's like kind of like throwing back off.
She goes really and You're like, yeah, Like why would
I just say that?

Speaker 2 (24:12):
Yeah, you know smooth?

Speaker 4 (24:13):
That to me, that happens like five times a week
at my house.

Speaker 2 (24:17):
I like, I like looking at your and be like
dead ass is looking right?

Speaker 4 (24:20):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'll have that thing looks crazy.

Speaker 2 (24:26):
Yeah. I don't know if she likes it, but in
my mind, I'm thinking this is a huge compliment, Like
she'll be you know, I might be coming down from
putting ruor Scottie down, she might be finishing up in
the kitchen. I'll just like walk up, say she's at
the sink, I'll just walk up behind her and just
whispering her You're like I need that, Yeah, and then
to do a little dry hump. Yeah. We'll just just

(24:46):
press it on her real quick, put it on her head. Yeah.
She'll be brushing with a zero sensation for them at all,
like the right cheetes. If I catch her like putting
the ad dish in the dishwasher, like brushing her teeth,
I'll just walk up behind, grab her hips and kind
of dry hump her a couple of times.

Speaker 1 (24:59):
Yeah, will about to have a mug shot out there.

Speaker 2 (25:04):
Dude, hate to the married to the married man, you guys,
don't you guys, don't you know spontaneously dry you hump
your wife every now and then.

Speaker 8 (25:11):
No, crazy, don't do that.

Speaker 1 (25:16):
I do.

Speaker 4 (25:16):
Dude, like the you know in high school when like
you like are cuddling with a girl whatever, and you're
clearly hard as a rock, clearly and like you think
this is a good idea for me to press my
hips into him as much as possible, so they know,
like the options there if you want it. I still
love doing that. I still love being a gilet and
just be kind of chubbed up and just be like

(25:38):
fucking and it's got to be so annoying to them.
I'm just.

Speaker 2 (25:43):
But what's the compliment you're giving her while you're doing Yeah,
you got.

Speaker 4 (25:48):
Nine years married, tyther N, nine years married, still fucking done.
You still still give me some Which sucks about this
show is I know that tales grandfather tales dad. He
listens to the show like Chuck listens to show religiously.
So Chuck, I'd like to apologize, but I do do that.

Speaker 5 (26:04):
Is that like a compliment you still got it?

Speaker 4 (26:07):
Yeah, that's a that's a that's a body language compliment. Yeah,
I think here too, action.

Speaker 9 (26:12):
Speaking, I feel like a really good one too.

Speaker 7 (26:15):
Is noticing a haircut or new nails, yeah, or clothing,
just any anything that like they have gone out of
their way to get done. That goes a long way
with women because for guys, it's like we're happy that
you're happy, but you know, no, we're not.

Speaker 9 (26:32):
Getting pedicures and manicures.

Speaker 4 (26:34):
You know, it's frequently unless you if you want eyebrows, eyelashes.

Speaker 2 (26:37):
You're right too, especially clothing they get something new, like
Tar had a jacket going on. I'm like, you're mess
with that jacket.

Speaker 9 (26:43):
Noticing it before they have different things.

Speaker 2 (26:46):
Yeah, I think is.

Speaker 9 (26:47):
Where you hit the home run.

Speaker 4 (26:48):
Hell yeah, dude, that's.

Speaker 2 (26:49):
A good stuff right there, Jack, good stuff.

Speaker 8 (26:52):
Sitting hit a new little like hair dress combo on Saturday,
and I was like, God, they okay, I see you
and just that you could tell it went a long way.

Speaker 2 (27:02):
God, dang, okay, I see you. Yeah. I need that
on the list as well.

Speaker 8 (27:06):
God yeah, I love that.

Speaker 2 (27:12):
Clump. You got one to add to the list.

Speaker 10 (27:15):
Outside of them, my big one is like if Lynn
says she's like a busy day, I have to do this,
this or this. When I get home, I'm I try
to like hit back on those topics like oh wow,
like it's nice and cleaning here, it smells good. Just
kind of compliment like things she was stressed, things she
was stressed about.

Speaker 4 (27:30):
Yeah, that's good.

Speaker 2 (27:32):
Yeah, remembering remembering, Yeah, just like like appreciating the stressed.

Speaker 1 (27:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (27:38):
Yeah, you guys don't like that one, No, no, no, no,
I do. I'm thinking in my head, like yesterday Dylan's like, hey, like,
I feel like I've been like a single parent for
the last couple of weeks. And I'm like, hey, you
really have, and I cannot thank you enough. Yeah, for
how I've had to deal with this, And it's really
I haven't been able to do a whole lot of shit.
So that's really big of you. And you could just
tell she was like she needed the acknowledgment, which I
think we all needed sometimes.

Speaker 8 (28:00):
It was big before we hop off. The world needs
to know clumb had an aura dump on me just
a second ago. He has a pizza named after him
in his hometown local pizza spot.

Speaker 10 (28:10):
It's a special pizza. It's called Theah the Clump Pizza.
It's a buffalo chicken pizza, but instead of buffalo sauce,
it is mango haamanaro sauce on the pizza. You get
a specially you got a pizza named every now and then.

Speaker 1 (28:22):
It's in the rotation. I'll show you a picture of it.

Speaker 2 (28:24):
Oh you were him back in the No no, no,
oh you were hold on hold on no no no,
Hey god, dang, okay, I see.

Speaker 10 (28:34):
This is gonna turn so poorly bad of how it happened.
It's not because of my high school football playing days.
It's because my family goes there every Friday and they
just love our family. So like, just order the pizza
and he's like, no one ever orders this, this is awesome,
it's great. So they put it as a special and
it like sold out. So we always joke that was
all like I kind of created my own.

Speaker 2 (28:53):
Yeah you guys did. Man, that ain't a joke. It's
from eating pizza though, it's not from like anything.

Speaker 4 (29:00):
Yeah, what dude, you love you never worked a day
in your Life's.

Speaker 2 (29:04):
Community universal shout.

Speaker 6 (29:07):
I'm sure Will would love to have a pizza named
after him at home team.

Speaker 2 (29:10):
Would love that.

Speaker 9 (29:11):
He's on Twitter every Friday.

Speaker 2 (29:13):
Yeah, yeah, we'll be We'll be back over Thanksgiving.

Speaker 1 (29:18):
I'll send you a picture of it.

Speaker 4 (29:19):
The nice nice. I also have something named after me.

Speaker 2 (29:23):
All right, onward, what what do you got a name?

Speaker 4 (29:26):
That brown jug Southwest the Southwest Burger.

Speaker 2 (29:29):
Tell us about the story. Man, let's hear the like Perry.

Speaker 4 (29:31):
You guys know Perry and I played football there and
they're like Taylor on Southwest Burger.

Speaker 2 (29:35):
That's what it is. That's awesome.

Speaker 4 (29:37):
I think I think that's awesome. Yeah, hell yeah, dude,
thank you very much. I don't know. That's a good question.
I like to think. So I like to think. So,
what time does Nebraska Penn State play this week? So

(29:57):
we hope to be able to stream that as well.

Speaker 2 (30:00):
Yeah, we'll be on the stream. I'll be balls deep
in that Nitney Lions Huskers game.

Speaker 4 (30:04):
Well, that'll be eleven am. We're streaming at eleven am
this week. Yeah, what do you mean we'll be on
the stream. I wish we were streaming for that.

Speaker 2 (30:12):
Oh, I wish we were streaming. Got you, got you? Yeah,
we'll be all right, we'll be solid. All right, let's
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(30:32):
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(30:55):
say whether it's a bold prediction, a hot take, or
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dipping in denim.

Speaker 1 (31:13):
I got a final bite.

Speaker 2 (31:15):
Oh oh okay, Mat Taylor.

Speaker 6 (31:17):
My final bite is Taylor's gonna get over this gout
and this foot thing and it'll never happen again for
as long as he lives, and for whatever reason it
was just a spell. He's gonna be able to eat
whatever he wants, do whatever he wants, and it'll never
happen again.

Speaker 4 (31:32):
It will never happen again. That is my favorite dude.
I would dip all day in denhim with that. I
would dip all day in.

Speaker 9 (31:37):
That my final bite.

Speaker 7 (31:40):
And I don't even take pride in saying this because
the Balls play the Gators in games of this weekend.

Speaker 9 (31:46):
Historically we lose in Gainesville all the time, and then
we have Vandy.

Speaker 7 (31:50):
So if the worst possible case scenario, my final bite Tennessee,
Nebraska and the Music City Bowl.

Speaker 2 (31:57):
Oh sho would be electric bro.

Speaker 9 (32:01):
Right right in Nashville we'd have to go to.

Speaker 7 (32:04):
It'd be like the ninth Music City Bowl for the
Balls in the last two nurs.

Speaker 2 (32:08):
I'd love to get a link into Nashville.

Speaker 4 (32:11):
That'd be awesome. And what's great about that is you
guys are supposed to play at the Debressos Like we're
not playing guys.

Speaker 7 (32:15):
Yeah, next year, I don't want to talk about that.

Speaker 2 (32:20):
JP clumb Do you guys have a final bite heading
into the weekend, because you guys already know what mine's.

Speaker 1 (32:25):
Going to be.

Speaker 8 (32:26):
Yeah, I mean, after what happened to me this weekend,
one of the only things that could cheer me up
is that I the McDonald's breakfast for my final bite
after leaving that Texas A and M game.

Speaker 1 (32:41):
How I felt, how I feel right now?

Speaker 2 (32:43):
What's your order? What's your breakfast order?

Speaker 8 (32:46):
So I go back and forth between two things. I'll
give you this one. This is what I had most recently.
I was actually inspired by your tweet last week to
go get McDonald's breakfast and I got bacon or bacon sorry, sausage,
egg and cheese, bagel meal plus breakfast.

Speaker 2 (33:02):
Burrito, A little two for breakfast burritos.

Speaker 1 (33:05):
Bro.

Speaker 8 (33:06):
The breakfast burritos are maybe the best fast food breakfast
burritos to ever exist. Yeah, I'm out there the breakfast
burrito streets.

Speaker 4 (33:13):
Now you're in the community.

Speaker 1 (33:14):
Yeah, I'm in then.

Speaker 2 (33:16):
And when you take a bite too, and there's almost
a little pop of cheese that comes into your mouth.

Speaker 8 (33:20):
Yeah, and there hot sauce.

Speaker 2 (33:24):
You're a bagel guy for your breakfast sandwich, over the
biscuit and over.

Speaker 9 (33:27):
The mcgriddle bagels.

Speaker 7 (33:30):
The Nashville McDonald's JP and like four people they like
called him out on Twitter McDonald's for bringing back the bagels.

Speaker 8 (33:36):
Oh wow, I'm McDonald's had at the house.

Speaker 2 (33:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (33:40):
And I was also a part of the snackcraft campaign.

Speaker 2 (33:44):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I do remember that. A Rico
Bosco hit me up when he saw that tweet, like,
hoo fucking I'm getting I'm getting McDonald's, I'm getting mc
I'm getting McDonald's for breakfast on this Friday morning. He
was like, bro get the steak, egg and cheese bad,
trust me, and usually my order. I love getting the
sausage the breakfast burritos, and I like getting just for

(34:06):
nostalgia purposes, bacon, egg and cheese mcgriddle. And I also
got a steak, egg and cheese bagel. Like he was saying,
but it was very it was subpar, Like it was good,
But I feel like he puts such an expectation on
it because I'm not like for me on the McDonald's
it's mcgriddle and bagel sandwich or mcgriddle on biscuit sandwich.

Speaker 4 (34:23):
On pancakes and either the hash Browns are all time.
Might be the number one thing on their roster in
that Orange high Sea.

Speaker 1 (34:37):
We might have to next the next final bite.

Speaker 8 (34:38):
We might have to create a starting five and then
a reserve five, just like a basketball team starting five
on the menu, and then who's our bench on the me.

Speaker 2 (34:47):
Yeah, I like that because they have a great roster
and that bench is deep. Yes, I mean. My final
take is We're gonna go into Happy Valley Saturday night,
double digit underdogs Nebraska TJ Latife. We take down the
Nitney Lion, Foxhole game, Foxhole game. Yeah, we got an
opportunity fish strong here. I will probably be ranked by
the time we play. Get the ranked. Win monkey off

(35:09):
our back against the Alwahaul guys.

Speaker 4 (35:11):
I was ranked before they lost to USC. They're gonna
be out now.

Speaker 2 (35:15):
You think they probably they might be able to snip
at twenty four to twenty five in there.

Speaker 4 (35:20):
Yeah, it would be nice. Yeah, because you guys gotta
get that off your That's the next that's the next step. Yeah,
right there. My final bite hot take. If the Rams
and the Seahawks played again, the Seahawks win that game. Yeah,
they win that game. Bag, I think for your fortune
overs to Sammy D. What I hate for that game

(35:41):
is is my expectation in that game was for Sam
Donald to go in and be able to outduel Matthew Stafford.
But it ended up being more of a defensive game
than anything else, which is great. It's great for football
just how complete both those teams are. But for Sammy
D to have foreignerceptions, a lot of the haters are
gonna come out of the woodwork and be like, oh,
you know, he's really not great quarterback. He's had a
good year, but he's not like an elite top five guy.

(36:04):
I think those guys play again, and I believe they
they do play again, right, they haven't played twice yet,
so they will play again. I am taking the Seahawks
in that game. Mark it down right here.

Speaker 8 (36:13):
Final final bite, keep Shane Beemer.

Speaker 4 (36:16):
Final final Bite. Michigan makes the playoffs.

Speaker 2 (36:20):
All right, Good to go boys, Big hugs, shiney kisses,
and enjoy Robert Gallery. This is an incredible interview. Listen
all two and a half hours of it, leave comments, subscribe,
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Speaker 4 (40:07):
Play Joe.

Speaker 9 (40:08):
Let's give it up for our guests today. We got
a two time.

Speaker 4 (40:11):
All Bank Ten, one time All American Outland Trophy winner,
and a man who has had an incredible story that
we're gonna break down on this beautiful Tuesday morning. Let's
get up for Robert Gallery. Excited to have you on.

Speaker 2 (40:26):
Right before we started, we were talking about the ego
and the Big ten going around right now. Yeah, and
if Robert would have been a great guest to have
on before leading up to the Iowa game, maybe after
the Iowa game. Talking about Michigan football. A lot of
Big ten energy in this bus right now.

Speaker 4 (40:41):
A lot of big Yeah.

Speaker 2 (40:42):
I was looked tough this year.

Speaker 1 (40:44):
Yeah, they're doing well. I was back last week for
the game and just to seem steamroll through that. It's nice.
It's nice to see when you don't just squeak it out,
but they're rolling. That quarterback makes a big difference for
them and they're a fun team to watch. We're moving
the ball and you know it's Hawk football.

Speaker 2 (40:58):
We got God to beat your ass at the end
of the year.

Speaker 4 (41:01):
Nine and one so far the last ten. Yeah, I
was one the last ten. Great school. I feel like
you guys' rivalry, it's like it's a rivalry, but there's
a level of mutual respect in it. Is that Am
I correct in saying that.

Speaker 1 (41:14):
Respect is a big word?

Speaker 2 (41:16):
I think, yes, it's yeah, O, there's but it's a rivalry,
rivalry that kind of like came about or kind of
gets forced in whenever we made the move to the
Big Ten, as I would in Nebraska, going to play
at the end of the year every season from here
on out. But it's there. I wouldn't say that there's
like people love each other right, true, but.

Speaker 4 (41:35):
People are also understanding, like if your kid wanted to
go to Iowa at the end of the day, you
would be okay with it.

Speaker 2 (41:40):
I personally wouldn't. Some some folk in Nebraska might be
okay with it.

Speaker 1 (41:43):
So I did, I did hear that? And the sad
part is, I guess I have a great My wife
played for the women's basketball team there. We have a
great relationship with that no at Iowa. Okay, yeah, no, No,
wouldn't have married her. I mean another start. But we
have a great relationship up with the head coach there,
and I know you have two girls and we were talking.
We were just back and we were just talking with her,

(42:05):
you know. So they are ready to see your girls
come up. And they actually sent a bunch of stuff
for you. That is so sweet. You know, there's some
women's basketball T shirts. I threw in a Kirk Farance
poster just because I figured you put it up somewhere.
But I know you'll do it's best for your girls
and get him ready to go be a Hawkeye.

Speaker 4 (42:26):
That is so coind. Not a lot of people come
on this show and give out gifts. Let's get it.
That's so sweet. That is so cold. What do you say? Well,
what do you is it signed?

Speaker 2 (42:38):
Some you smalls?

Speaker 1 (42:40):
You know he's won a few games, you know few.

Speaker 2 (42:43):
I respect this. I respect this. I respect it so
much that if you guys beat us, I'll post a
photo with Rue with this little phone paper.

Speaker 4 (42:52):
That's a wild just walking. I told Will's got to
gross hair for a year, and it looked like the
world was coming down to him. You're giving a gift
and you're like, if I lose, I'll have ru hold
this up. No problem.

Speaker 2 (43:01):
I just respect the U. I just respect him being
on his toes coming in the bus. Yeah, fair enough.

Speaker 1 (43:07):
At A little bit might be too that I did
take a recruiting visit to Nebraska. I never got offered,
So there might be a little bitterness in our relationship
with that or did not.

Speaker 2 (43:18):
But that's because you were probably you were an athlete,
right right, Yeah, No, I was was Gallery that came
to be Robert Gallery, all American all that stuff, like
you know who was the head coach at the time
of Nebraska.

Speaker 1 (43:30):
You know, that's a good question. That was at I
don't even remember. Don't remember that trip.

Speaker 4 (43:36):
Early two thy ninety ninety nine was when you were
a senior in high school. That's wild because you don't
you look our age, which is really upsetting for me.
And so you you're from Iowa, you go to Iowa?

Speaker 1 (43:48):
Was it?

Speaker 2 (43:48):
Ever?

Speaker 4 (43:49):
How many offers did you have?

Speaker 1 (43:51):
It's like four Purdue Northwestern, Iowa State and Iowa had four.

Speaker 4 (43:56):
And I was clearly like you wanted to go to Iowa.

Speaker 1 (43:59):
I did. My older brother played there. He was an
all big ten punter there from ninety three to ninety six.
So I was hanging around the university. I was hanging
around the program, all the guys that were there, the
Tim Dwight's, the Jared Devrizes, the So I'm in the
dorms as a junior high kid hanging out with these guys.
So in my mind, it was like, this is where
I want to go because I knew the culture and
I knew all the guys. You know, It's it's cool

(44:20):
to be recruited and go check out the other places.
But at the end of the day, I knew I
was going to Diowa.

Speaker 4 (44:24):
Yeah, it didn't matter what other school offered you if
it was like an Alabama SEC school, Michigan Michigan.

Speaker 1 (44:31):
Yeah, but I don't. I was an athlete, right, I
played basketball. You know, I was a second state in
the high jump. You know, I ran the four by one,
but I.

Speaker 2 (44:38):
Wasn't the one.

Speaker 4 (44:40):
This is fucking out of control.

Speaker 1 (44:42):
Yeah, so we were, you know, we were How were
you jumping? I still have the school record at six
or five? Yeah, I mean I could. I had some hops, now.

Speaker 2 (44:50):
Dude, that is nuts.

Speaker 1 (44:51):
Yeah. So I was an athlete, right, So I wasn't.
You didn't turn on my VHS tape that I sent
all these schools and see like this killer football player.
He saw an athlete that could run. You know, my
high school we didn't. We didn't throw the ball either,
So I'm they showed me blocking, that's for sure, because
we would go entire games and not throw the ball.
But I wasn't high. Michigan wouldn't have sniffed me. I
sent them a VHS tape. No return call.

Speaker 4 (45:13):
Really, And what were you wainning when you got to Iowa?

Speaker 1 (45:17):
I showed up about two hundred and thirty pounds, soaking wet.

Speaker 4 (45:19):
Okay, yeah, so there was you had a red shirt
year on the horizon.

Speaker 1 (45:23):
No problem for you, for sure. It was my senior
year high school. I was right at two ten, and
they told me when I showed up, like, you need
to put some pounds on. So before we weighed in,
I drank two gallons of water. Been on that program, yes,
So I was like two thirteen, just full of water.

Speaker 4 (45:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:39):
But by Christmas my first year, I think I was
two seventy five or two eighty. I got on that
lifting program and that eating program. They're like, when you
wake up, you drink a protein shake in the middle
of the night, and if you wake up again, you
drink another one.

Speaker 2 (45:50):
Dude.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
But we had that Chris Doyle program. Chris Doyle was
our string coach and we had his program of putting
lean mass on and it worked.

Speaker 4 (45:58):
Now as Chris Doile, the streak coat was he there
for a very long time with Kirk Farence, he was
there for a while.

Speaker 1 (46:02):
He was there for the first year when Kirk started.
So ninety nine is when Kirk came, Chris Doyle came.
That's when it all started. When I my first year
and Chris had was there for fifteen plus years, eighteen years.

Speaker 2 (46:12):
Where was Dobson at at the time, James Dobson. So
that's a mutual connection that we have.

Speaker 4 (46:17):
This whole thing got connected, correct.

Speaker 2 (46:19):
Yeah, Yeah, dob hit me up and I was talking
to me about Robert Gallery and knowing that Dobson he
started at Iowa before he came and was our head
strength coach at Nebraska, So you knew about all the
Doyle programming. I'm sure we were doing a lot of
the stuff in Nebraska that you guys were getting into
and doing because Doyle was like ahead of his time
in the strength training program. But but yeah, Dobson because

(46:40):
he had to have been young.

Speaker 1 (46:41):
Yeah, and he was assistant ninety nine. He came with
Doyle and he was there my entire career until they
moved on later on. He was there quite a few years.
But yeah, James, James is the best. We kept in
contact over the years. And yeah, he learned from that,
the Doyle stuff and then put his own stuff into it.
And he's just a great human being.

Speaker 2 (46:58):
That was his like authority figure vibe that young as
an assistant.

Speaker 1 (47:04):
You know, you look back on it, and we were
you know, obviously we were all a lot younger. You
look back at pictures of Coach Ferrence in nineteen ninety nine,
you're like, yeah, holy Kyle. But James, James was a
young guy. We were all just trying, right, they were.
They were trying to put in their program and we
were bad right nineteen ninety nine, we were one to ten,
you know, my red shirt year, right, So everyone's trying
to bring in the toughness. But it was Coach Doyle
and James like bringing in that like if you don't

(47:26):
do it right, get out the door, right, And it
was yeah, there was.

Speaker 4 (47:29):
A week out the week type of mentality for sure.

Speaker 1 (47:31):
And if you did stuff right, they loved you. Right.
It was it wasn't hard for sure, but those you know,
guys like me, we fed on that, you know, the
Iowa guys, the people they brought in for that culture,
that we fed on that stuff. And if they called
you out, you're like, oh you know, oh yeah watch this,
Yeah you know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (47:46):
Yeah, yeah, there're three California guys. They were like, I
gotta go, I gotta get that. I had to get
the hell out of here quickly.

Speaker 1 (47:53):
Right.

Speaker 4 (47:53):
So you're you're with fantasy read your your your first year.
The next year you're.

Speaker 1 (47:57):
Starting started at tight end? Really, yes, true athlete, Yes I.

Speaker 2 (48:02):
Was tighten you you can potentially claim being a part
of the group.

Speaker 1 (48:07):
For a very small time. I think I had three catches,
one of which was at Nebraska. We ended up losing
that game, but I did have a catch in that game.
So my first year, my red shirt freshman year, started
at tight end, and then four games in they came
to me like, hey, we need to have a discussion,
and then I moved the tackle and the rest is history.

Speaker 2 (48:30):
How did you like playing for coach Farents.

Speaker 1 (48:31):
I loved it. He's the best is I was just back.
He's a guy I talked to regularly. He hasn't changed
since nineteen ninety nine. He's just the most steady, genuine
person you've ever met. Now you see him right, obviously,
he was twenty seven years younger when we first started.
But you see him now getting emotional. It's cool because
I knew him twenty seven years ago when we were
just trying to get a program turned around, right. He

(48:53):
was coming in. He was a young new coach or
newer coach, right head coach. And he's just the genuine
human being. There's no raw rah. It's it's everything he
says is meaningful and to the point and and just
just genuine. It's hard to say I took my son
back for training camp. You know, my son's in his
office hanging out with him. It's there's no like, oh,

(49:15):
Roberts here, we gotta fake this and make him feel included.
He's like, this place is your place, and your son.
Lincoln's so Lincoln's high fiving him, knocking him right, running
in and out of his office. He's just a genuine,
genuine human being. And you know that's why he's had
so much success.

Speaker 4 (49:27):
And your son's name is Lincoln, very interesting in Nebraska, Lincoln, Nebraska.

Speaker 2 (49:33):
You didn't think that comes back.

Speaker 1 (49:35):
I did not think of that. I'm I'm a car guy,
so it's actually more after Lincoln Continental.

Speaker 2 (49:42):
But now but now now he's gonna he won't be
able to help. But think about it now.

Speaker 4 (49:46):
Now yeah, yeah, now from now on, Lincoln, I definitely
should name you Ford.

Speaker 2 (49:53):
You for UH. Coach Faris was the first head coach
I had to call and basically say that I wasn't
coming to Iowa. And it was so painful, but he
was incredible to me. Whenever I made that call, my
parents like you have to call the schools like Iowa.
I was very much like considering Ira and they recruited
me hard and I had a.

Speaker 1 (50:11):
Cool You said you were considering Iowa.

Speaker 2 (50:12):
Yeah, I was considering Iowa because my brother. So, my
brother was a year younger than me, and he was
a very good wrestler growing up. He was like he
was a senior national champion coming out of high school.
So when I would go on my recruiting trips, we
would take a you know, family road trip and We'd
hit Missoo because Miszoo had a good wrestling program. We
hit Nebraska because Nebraska had a good wrestling program. We

(50:32):
had Iowa because I was unbelievable at wrestling, So a
lot of a lot of majority of my decision. I
wanted to go to a spot to where I know
my brother could go and wrestle too, so we'd go
to school together. So Iowa was very much in the conversation.
I forget my recruiting coordinator, but had a cool relationship
with coach Farence. Super awesome dude. It's cool hearing you
talk about him, because he did seem very genuine, whether

(50:55):
I got to sit and meet with him, talk to
him on the phone. Doyle kind of intimidating, bald dude.
Like they had the chains going on everywhere in the
weight room. It just seemed like a spot where you
go and get yoked. Yeah, you get after it around there. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (51:07):
Bubble.

Speaker 2 (51:08):
They just had a bubble. They didn't really have an indoor.
I visited Iowa right after after Nebraska, so the difference
in facility was like you walk into the bubble and
it was a humid like you know, they didn't have
like an indoor very well.

Speaker 1 (51:20):
Yeah, yeah, we were behind the times with the.

Speaker 2 (51:22):
Behind the times, like we're building a new weight room.
But I had I had cool. I had a cool visit.
I had a cool visit at Iowa.

Speaker 1 (51:28):
Yeah, that's great, they're both. You know. My first day,
my first day at camp with the freshman coach, Doyle
was holding the bag. So it was just a freshman
and I'm a skinny, tight end, scared shit, let's right,
just want to come in and make it. And he
was holding the bag and I remember the first one
I came off. My hands slid up off the bag,
smacked him in the face, and my shoulder problems in
high school, and my shoulder came out of the socket,

(51:50):
and I'm like, oh God, is this for me? So
he's look staring at me, right, and he was a
massive man back then. He's staring at me. I just
jacked him in the face and I'm trying not to
cry because my shoulder came out and just had to
go back to the drills. And I'll never forget that
day because he looked at me and just told me
to keep your hands down. I'm like, yes, sir. She
was this massive, scary human being, But the greatest guy out.

Speaker 2 (52:11):
There are the is the dorm situation? Was it called
the six pack?

Speaker 1 (52:16):
We didn't have that then? Okay, yeah, no, I don't
know we had the dorm coach was too gritty for me.

Speaker 4 (52:23):
Some could say that, yeah, the way you talk, how
I've trained with you. Yeah, I could see that.

Speaker 1 (52:27):
Ye didn't the shiny lights.

Speaker 2 (52:30):
Didn't have all the pretty stuff.

Speaker 1 (52:31):
That's all right, dude?

Speaker 4 (52:32):
Is it the Maybe the most scared anybody can be
in their entire life is your freshman year when you
go from high school to college and it's your first
workout with the entire team, not the freshman workouts, but
the first one. Like when I first got to Michigan,
whichevergus is the head coach we had Mike bar West
was just like world renowned head coach, and we did
like this tabata type of workout where it's like three

(52:53):
sets of twelve squad, three sets of twelve hand clean
like very high reps, high volume and also high weight,
and then we do like high perchase feeding. And by
the time we got to the hyperchery jumping, I was
like hit like a full body cramp, like dying. And
after that everyone started jogging out to the field to
go do our sprints and our running after that. So
it was like just a hell of a day on
a Monday. My bars walks up and he's got this

(53:14):
like super rasp, like he swallowed glass voice, and he goes,
welcome to Michigan. How do you leave my dick in
your mouth? And then walks away. I'm thinking, I got
to get the fuck out of here. There is no
way I'm going to make it.

Speaker 1 (53:26):
This is not for me.

Speaker 4 (53:28):
And then you had to go shower for the first time,
and then for all the boys, and you're like, do
I wear underwear? Do I not wear underwear? Like it's
a dude, it's a mental warfare.

Speaker 1 (53:36):
Is when you go in like I think we did,
Like we were not grown men, right sky, you know.
And you walk in and Colin Cole he came from Florida.
He was a grown man when he showed up as
a freshman, and I'm like, I gotta play against this guy.
I mean, three and twenty pound yoke dude from Florida.
And I remember thinking, oh my god, this is not

(53:56):
going to work.

Speaker 2 (53:57):
Yeah, dude is yeah, we have bring it is of mind.
Fuck did you walk in there. You're not developed whatsoever
compared to the college the grown men that are in college.
You're skinny, got a little pecker. You're walking the shower,
just fear, fear, fear, who's gonna look?

Speaker 4 (54:11):
Maybe they are, maybe they aren't. You accidentally look at
another guy. He's black. It's way different than yours.

Speaker 1 (54:16):
We got good story, cold tub story, but we had
uh Khalil Hill. He came and just stood at the
top of the cold tub and said, I'm gonna get
here and get to see what it's like to be
all you white boys. We were just just standing at
the top of the top of the coach the helicopter.
In the helicopter, I remember thinking, oh my lord, what
is this.

Speaker 2 (54:35):
You're like, You're like, I'm going to keep my shorts
and spandex and everything on. Yeah, terrifying. What's it like
to be you guys?

Speaker 4 (54:43):
Yes, Jesus Christ, What what was the moment You're realized, Oh,
the NFL is a real option for me as a player?

Speaker 1 (54:51):
You know, Honestly, I was so you know, and this
sounds easy to say now, but I was so in
the moment the entire my entire career. It wasn't until
after my junior year. A great junior year. That's we
were eleven in one season Orange Bowl before we went
down to the Orange Bowl and got throttled by USC.
But that's another story. But great year, right, Brad Banks
is our quarterback. Our offensive line was five guys that

(55:12):
ended up playing in the league. After that season, coach
Ferns brought me in and you know, he said, hey,
there's guys are going to be calling you. There's a
chance you could come out early and probably be in
the top ten. And honest to god, till that point,
I had no idea. Really did I know I was
playing well? Yes, but it was I was so in
the moment till that point. I wasn't thinking about you know,
I wasn't the kid that showed up in college like

(55:33):
this is my step to the NFL. Right do you
watch that stuff and be like I want to play
in the league for sure? But it wasn't on my mind.
I was just worried about getting better and better. And
it wasn't until my junior year when coach brought me in.
He's like, you know, it's your choice. You know, could
probably be a top ten pick. And I was remember
thinking like really. You know, it sounds dumb or ignorant,
but I really I really hadn't thought about it because
it was just enjoying the process of what we had

(55:55):
been doing to that point.

Speaker 2 (55:57):
And too, it's like it's early two thousands now, like
you got all this social media and everything going on
like you do now to where everybody knows absolutely everything
for sure.

Speaker 1 (56:04):
Yeah, we had dial up internet, I remember. I remember.

Speaker 2 (56:06):
Yeah, now there's combines for eighth graders, right, exactly.

Speaker 4 (56:08):
Getting combined as nuts.

Speaker 2 (56:10):
Yeah, yeah, yeah it is.

Speaker 4 (56:12):
Well, so what did you end up leaving earlier? Did
you end up staying first?

Speaker 1 (56:15):
I stayed. Yeah. It was one of those things. I'm like, oh,
I don't you know, I want to get my degree.
You know, I was the old school Iowa farm kid.
My parents told me go to school and get your degree. Yeah,
so I wanted to get my degree. And I said, well,
can I get I'm gonna I'm going to get better,
right because I didn't think I was that good yet, right,
And coach said, yeah, I see you being better. I
see you'd be able to be a you know, a
top one or two pick, right, Like that's what we

(56:36):
shoot for for you. And so I was like, great,
like them, I'm here, Sandy.

Speaker 2 (56:40):
Yeah, how do you feel like that infiltrated your brain?
Like your ego?

Speaker 1 (56:44):
I mean it was.

Speaker 2 (56:45):
It was because you going from not being like not
you were aware that you're good, but being that good
or seen from NFL scouts as like oh if I
had left, I could be a top ten pick. Now
you know it. Coach is also saying like, I think
you could be one or two if you stay another
you can get this much better here, here, and here.
How does that affect you going into your senior year?

Speaker 1 (57:05):
I mean it was tough. It was. That was the
point where I kind of switched to to. Up to
that point, it was just having fun. Right my first
few years, you're getting your ass kicked, right, you're just
trying to make it. First day, I first day they
moved me to tackle. I'm going against Fred Wakefield versus Illinois,
who's a senior and a beast All American. Just hoping
to not give up a sack. To my junior year.
We're dominating, but it's just fun. So that started that

(57:27):
senior year was when it was like, oh, there is expectation,
Oh I am pretty good, and that's kind of when
it crept in, it's like I need to be perfect, Like, oh,
I'm that guy. So you know I could have sixty
nine of seventy plays on film. Now I can say it.
Back then I would never, but now I can say
it that I, you know, dominated those sixty nine plays
and had one bad one and it would ruin it
for me. I'm like, I'm supposed to be I'm supposed

(57:48):
to be the guy that's perfect, and it's so unrealistic,
but that's how my mind thought, right.

Speaker 2 (57:51):
You're probably like I want to be the greatest to
ever do it.

Speaker 1 (57:54):
Well, it was that was just my mindset, like like
we all right, you just grind and grind and grind.
It's like that's great, Like this, oh I achieved this
great moved to the next thing, right, You never really
thought about that because it's like, okay, well that's great,
big deal next.

Speaker 2 (58:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (58:08):
Yeah, And so I mean it was still fun, but
it was definitely more, you know, more pressure. I thought
about it more. It's like, you know, in a game,
to where something would happen, my hands will be wide,
Oh he got me. Whatever next plan will go killing
to where something would happen. It would ruin the rest
of the game, I'd be stealing. I don't know that
can't happen to me like this.

Speaker 2 (58:28):
Yeah, the rest of the week when you're watching films,
like even for me, like when I was seeing like
be where I could potentially be a late round pick,
like before the season and everything else, and agents are
trying to talk to you, like it infiltrates your mind.
Like we were in the locker room last week and
Clay was kind of like, I bet you were the
man at Nebraska, and like, how were you in Nebraska.
I'm just thinking, like my senior year kind of feels
like a blur because I feel like I didn't enjoyed

(58:51):
in a way like I look back, I'm proud of
how I went about everything, but enjoyed in such a
way to where I felt like the man or was
having all this fun. Like I just felt like I
wanted to be drafted so badly to where any bad
plays it would like ruin your damn weekend.

Speaker 1 (59:07):
Absolutely. Scott Pioli was a GM at New England at
the time, very close friends with coach parents, and he
had visited that week and I kind of, you know,
lost it, but I was talking to him about it, like, oh,
I got him, you know this, I messed this one
play up. And I remember him leaving me his business
card at my locker and on the back he wrote,
lighting up Francis right, because he was talking to me
about like, dude, relaxed this, it's fun, like you're playing great,

(59:29):
Just go out and do what you've been doing the
last couple of years. But I was so intent on
everything has to be perfect because now I want to
be this right when they threw that out there, oh
you could be you know, you could have been top ten,
you could be at the top of the draft. So
now that that's a new goal and anything that affected
it would affect me for days and weeks. But it

(59:50):
was still fun and was still able to you know.
I was the level of competition too. I was still
playing very well, But it was just the mental part
of it.

Speaker 4 (59:57):
Yeah, the mental park definitely as soon as expectations get
put on you, because when you get to college, it's like,
how do I just put myself in a starting role
or a contributor at the very least, And you do that,
it's like, how awesome is this? And I'm wearing a
uniform in college and playing and then to slowly but
sure like their expectation. After expectation, you continue to move
the goalpost for yourself, but it ended up working out.
You go second overall to the to the Raiders. What

(01:00:18):
is like in the early two thousands, what is the
draft process like for you? Like combines? Is it still
in Indianapolis?

Speaker 1 (01:00:23):
Yep, still an Indie. So go to the combine, you
know the typical and it.

Speaker 4 (01:00:27):
Was sounds like you went nuts based on your high
school athleticism.

Speaker 1 (01:00:31):
Yeah, I did. I did well. You know the one
thing that is true, Yeah, the one I ran very well.
I want to say it was sub five electronic. I
think four eight nine handheld was what they had me.
And so I ran well, jumped heavy?

Speaker 2 (01:00:43):
Are you at this point?

Speaker 1 (01:00:45):
I weighed in at three twenty.

Speaker 4 (01:00:47):
Unit, almost one hundred pounds more than the first day
you walked in Aisle?

Speaker 1 (01:00:50):
Exactly? Did the I remember, I won't forget the bench press,
so did the bench press and in the I don't
remember what team he was with at the time, but
he had a big ego and he said I was
bouncing right because they I was a fast bencher, like
as fast as I can. I'm like, I'm gonna go
in there and put up you know, this many thirty
some as fast as I can. Well, he didn't count
a bunch of them, and he's like, nope, because I

(01:01:12):
was going too fast, so you got a pause. So
I remember coming out, right, So I've tuck to the
media right after that, and I'm pissed off because he
counted twenty six, right, so that was not the standard.
I think I did thirty four, but he didn't count
eight of them, so I'm pissed off about that, right,
So that was the whole combine. I remember stewing on
that the rest of the entire combine, trying to do
interviews and meet with gms, and all I can think

(01:01:33):
about it is like, this motherfucker didn't count these many
reps in my bench press.

Speaker 4 (01:01:38):
So I think four sounds way better than twenty six.

Speaker 1 (01:01:41):
Well sure, yeah, yeah, I'll be hot too tight. Yeah. No,
So it was you know, combine. It was. It was great.
It was you know, not what it is now. Obviously
there wasn't all the cameras, so that was great because
you know, you just go in there and you did
your stuff. When we got out of there, and I
ended up showing that that guy in the bench press
when we I redid it at Iowa. There, it's a
good story behind coach Doyle coaching on that one. Yeah,

(01:02:03):
they came to Iowa. So we have our pro day
and he's like, all right, we'll show them. We're gonna
do thirty two and then you're gonna stop and rack it.
So scouts come in. I come in. They set it up.
Had one bench with you know, forty five on each plate,
aro on each side. Next rack had two forty fives,
next had three, and next had four. So I sat
down with the one and did a bunch of reps.

(01:02:24):
Moved to the next bench, did a bunch of reps.
Now I've got three plates on each side, two a
few reps, four plates on each side. Knocked out like
three of them. Then went and sat down and did
my my test and did stopped every I mean arrogant,
but stopped every single time. Stopped one thousand and one,
did thirty two of those, racked it and walked out
the door just a big They're watching me warm up,

(01:02:49):
and like you know, when I sat down at the
bench with four forty five's on the side there, I
can remember them looking what is this kid doing. Doyle
was like, we got a plan, just do it, sat down,
knocked out a couple of those, did my reps, and
walked out the door.

Speaker 4 (01:03:03):
I love that, dude. Oh this is uh the RAS score.
RAS is relative athletics score. And you're at perfect ten.

Speaker 1 (01:03:10):
Interesting, I've never seen that.

Speaker 2 (01:03:11):
There you go.

Speaker 4 (01:03:12):
If that's a little ego booster for your right here.
Can't get better than ten, brother, can't get better than ten.

Speaker 2 (01:03:16):
And you got you got to give sub five out
of your language.

Speaker 1 (01:03:19):
That's a that's a four nine perfect.

Speaker 7 (01:03:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:03:22):
Yeah, you ran a four nine. Yeah, that's a four nine.

Speaker 4 (01:03:24):
Yeah. Sub five doesn't sound as good.

Speaker 2 (01:03:26):
Short shuttle four eight three, that's quick.

Speaker 1 (01:03:30):
We had we had some good teaching coach Doyle and Dobson. Yeah,
oh yeah, those guys knew how to teach that. And
the you know, the athletic ability helped. But those guys
were great teachers, man. I owe the credit to them.

Speaker 4 (01:03:40):
What is this stuff we would do, Adopson, where the
pushing and the pulling of the sleds? What was it
called gpp GP. Did you guys do gpp at Iowa?

Speaker 1 (01:03:46):
Huh?

Speaker 2 (01:03:46):
All right, I'm sure they did some version of it
at Iowa. Again, like sitting down in the whole recruiting process,
like my dad was a sick o working out growing up,
like the Franco training and different things, so I kind
of understood some West Side bar bell and a lot
of those variations in concepts of training. And everybody was
super high on Doyle. So getting to sit down and

(01:04:07):
listen to Doyle speak and then getting the train with
Dobson throughout my career in Nebraska, like it did feel
like they were you guys, I will I remember all
my visit, you were the only school that had the
tendo units happening at that point. And so obviously Dobson Nebraska,
we're getting those tendo units to kind of measure your speed,
power velocity. So very much like ahead of like I stayed,

(01:04:27):
I wasn't a combined guy, but just staying and training
with coach Dobson throughout to get ready for Pro Day
and everything else, Like, yeah, they are very good teachers.
You never run the forty. You're always doing like tens
and twenties, and you never cap out to where you
know you're like I have no clue what I'm going
to run, But yeah, I enjoyed. I enjoy training with
Dobson during that during that time getting ready for the

(01:04:49):
for the pro day.

Speaker 1 (01:04:49):
Oh, they were ahead of their time. You know. Yeah,
they're way ahead of their time. Well, here we go.

Speaker 2 (01:04:55):
Is this a real thing or is this AI? Hold
on a second?

Speaker 4 (01:04:58):
Four six two you lie?

Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
People have different versions. We can call Dopson right now
and he said four five four five six electronic.

Speaker 5 (01:05:08):
Electronic doesn't mean your phone is this?

Speaker 1 (01:05:11):
Oh perfect? Ten? I see you here, he said.

Speaker 2 (01:05:15):
Oh, and it's not even a team for Tailor, it's
Pro Bowl.

Speaker 4 (01:05:21):
Yeah, dude. When I went to the combine, I was like,
this is I'm going to excel in this. It was
definitely my my world.

Speaker 2 (01:05:29):
Uh, just the the short speed, the short shuttle, like
four four nine is great, Like four four nine is
awesome for a left tackle of your size. Yeah, you
just knowing you hit you're in the four threes like
that is incredible.

Speaker 4 (01:05:43):
Dude, the short shuttle. It's funny that Will brings it
up because Will in twenty eighteen when Will came to
the Titans, we worked out with Dobs in the summertime,
so we would run together, we do these GPP things.
We would do this French eccentric work that Rex would
always put us on. But whenever we would do the
short shuttle will beat me like edge me out by
like this much barely get me, we would always me, hey,

(01:06:04):
you must be pretty fast, I'm pretty good at that.
It was always wils like go to daniel A caring
from me like you're pretty QUI because I'm really good
at these.

Speaker 1 (01:06:14):
It was cheating, and back then it was cheating. Kevin
Casper broke some all time records at the combine, but
it was almost cheating because there was a certain the
first step was a certain way.

Speaker 2 (01:06:23):
There was a two step those first five yards.

Speaker 1 (01:06:25):
And it was it was cheating. Even the three the
way you.

Speaker 2 (01:06:28):
Jump around that that the tip of the yl, the
way you like jump around and get around. And there
are some like certain skills that if you just sit
there and practice it and can perfect it, it's you
get shaved so much off of your time.

Speaker 4 (01:06:41):
Yeah, after I read my forty of the combine, I
don't think I cared about anything else. Like we jumped,
we did broad jump, vertical jump, and then it was
forty and the way they set it up was there
was like the I was o l twenty three, so
I was number twenty three, and then the first group
was one through twenty two. So I was the first
one to go and run the forty in my group,
and I was I was shitting myself. I was so nervous.

(01:07:04):
But once I ran, I knew I ran under four nine,
I was like, fuck, the rest of this can kick rocks. Right. Well,
I remember doing the l don't we're doing the short
shuttle and you spend so much time, like you right
the five ten five, it's like two three, Yeah, through
like two steps and then you try to get to
the other side on three. But yeah, as soon as
I ran the forty, I was like, nothing else matters anymore.
That's all I really wanted.

Speaker 1 (01:07:24):
Yeah, that would come mine up so much too, right, Like,
you get to that point.

Speaker 4 (01:07:27):
Everything to you talk about the expectation like you're so
like all that matters is the combine, and once combin's over, you're.

Speaker 1 (01:07:33):
Like tweak, tweak to hamstring, like two weeks before right now, Yeah,
this is the biggest job in review my life.

Speaker 2 (01:07:39):
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:07:40):
Doyle's like relax, you know, Toyo and James like you'll
be fine, Like just we'll get you out there. But
same thing. I got through that felt great, and I'm
like the rest of this is, I'm good the same
thing and knew knew it was good. I looked up
somebody gave me the thumbs up. I'm like, I'm great. Yeah, yeah, move,
I know I did fine, it's all yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:07:55):
But you were at you were in Oakland for actually
before we even get into Oakland, the drafting thing that
you're there for Kirk Farance, and it's like beginning part
of his career that's obviously lasted as long as it has.
Do you have any like great Kirk Farens stories that
maybe no one really knows the early days.

Speaker 1 (01:08:11):
Yeah, I think they were just right. They were trying
to figure out who they were. But I had a
line coach and Joe Filben. So when I got to
college in high school, my mom would cut my hair
high and tight, right haircut. Every week. Mom would fade
it up. She did a real nice job on a fade.
But get to college, right, poor, Yes, I'm on scholarship,
but I got no money. We're living in the dorms,
got nothing. So I started growing my hair out all right,
So the hair is getting long, and my line coach

(01:08:33):
kept telling me every day had come in the office,
he cut your fucking hair. Cut your fucking hair. So
I one day I finally was like, man, you know,
I'm a young kid, right, still obviously a new player.
Go knock on Coach Farence's office. I'm nervous as hell.
I'm like, hey, coach. He's like yeah, it's like coach
Philbin keeps telling me to cut my hair, Like do
you care? Do you want me to cut my hair?

Speaker 2 (01:08:53):
Right?

Speaker 1 (01:08:54):
Just a scared little kid. Yeah, and he goes come
in here, walks in and he shuts the door. He goes,
I'll get shit, what your hair looks like. I just
want you to play good football. Let's copy that, coach.
And so from that point on. But no, he was
just he's the same guy the speeches you see now,
he was the same just go to work. It was
him and Doyle and Dopts. It was just like you

(01:09:14):
go to work, do things right, and you know they
love you, right. That's It's just that's the culture there.
So he wasn't. He's not a big flashy guy. He's
not jumping up on the surfing the team. He's he
is who he is, and I think that's what everybody
loved about him back then, and now you see it,
and that's what you really love about the guy. He
is just a genuine just the same guy, doesn't change

(01:09:35):
for anybody. Right, he's not buying into the new hype
and all this stuff. It's just the coach Farren say
that we knew. So that's that's probably you know, it's
typical of him, very not a big flashy story, but
it was you know, that's just who he was. Just like,
I don't care about that. Let's play football.

Speaker 4 (01:09:51):
Being consistent for a quarter century, it is pretty incredible.

Speaker 2 (01:09:54):
Any like initiation stories with the O line room or
as you being to a young cat, no, and what
line were you where you were like, hey, let's get
him uncomfortable like we'd have we'd have old lineman like
when we were fresh, when they come up and put
their leg up on the bench, they be button naked,
just try to make you feel very uncomfortable.

Speaker 1 (01:10:13):
Well, we do a little bit of that right stand
close in the cold tubs. Some of the you know,
walk into walk into the meeting rooms and you know,
you graze up against a guy or a new young guy.
That's kind kind of kind of weirded out, but it
was you know, I wasn't a I wasn't big into that.
It wasn't a bunch of talking. It was more the hey,
we come in and go to work, right. I'd tell
the stories these kids, you know kids as I was older,

(01:10:35):
they were younger. You know, I'm sorry, I'm this or
I'm I'm tired and I'm not doing it. So I
told the story when I was Again, when I was
a freshman, we were learning to do uh cleans, overhead cleans, right,
so I do one. Well, I came too close to
my head and I caught my forehead with the bar
on the way up. Still did the clean while I
can just feel blood running down my face. So I
gash my head open, and Doyle and Dobson are looking

(01:10:58):
at me, and I'm just like put it down, and
I kept going and like you all right, and I'm
like wiping all the I mean, he's running.

Speaker 4 (01:11:04):
Down my field like the most badass ever, right.

Speaker 1 (01:11:06):
And they're like, go get that checked out. So I
tell the story to the to younger guys like, hey,
we don't give a ship what you do, but you know, right,
something like this happens. I'm this tough. This is what happened,
and I kept going, well, when did you fix it?
Well after the workout. You know, It's just stuff like
that to make him feel like, oh, you're not You're
not as tough as you think you are.

Speaker 4 (01:11:26):
Just then, yeah, you want to be tough. This is
how tough.

Speaker 2 (01:11:32):
Just head butts the wall starts bleeding.

Speaker 4 (01:11:33):
Yeah, And so you go second overall to the writers.
Correct who who had the first pick that year?

Speaker 1 (01:11:38):
It was Eli? What was the the whole Eli? Philip
Rivers swap right.

Speaker 4 (01:11:45):
So you're sitting there in the background going, I know
I'm not going number one. Let me just sit back
and hit this too, no problem.

Speaker 1 (01:11:50):
Right, and leaning up to it right. It was just
you know, Eli's Eli's saying pre draft right where in
New York? Ended up going to New York? You know,
I'm you know, I'm probably not going to go there,
and I'm like, you know, I'm the smart asking back, like, shit,
I'll go number one. I don't give a shit, right,
you know you don't want to go there, I'll go there, right,
you know, not knowing where I would end up thinking
more four or five, But it was you know, that

(01:12:10):
was that was great because that took a lot of
the media attention. Right, I'm a small kid from you know,
small town Iowa. Went to New York for the experience.
Took my family. We were a fish out of water, right,
We my family did not belong in New York. It
was a fun experience, but we were just you know,
all that took away the you know, took all the
media attention. So that was great.

Speaker 2 (01:12:28):
That's awesome when you're going when you're going into Oakland
to that franchise and you're coming from Iowa where you
had a lot of success. What was your first years
of experience like in a place like Oakland Cluse, you
guys were pretty bad, Like the Oakland Raiders were pretty bad.
It was very much the entire time you were there.

Speaker 1 (01:12:44):
Yeah, it was you know going in I'm sure like
for you guys, the first year was just for me.
It was just the joy of playing football and getting
paid for it. I mean, it didn't matter. We were
four and twelve. I believe my first year didn't matter
what the record was. I remember walking out in Denver.
It's nuking snow, right and I'm gonna cut off t
shirt and it's Newke and snow. I just remember thinking,

(01:13:04):
I get paid to do this. Right. That was kind
of the first year for me, like holy cow, like
we the the wins and losses didn't affect me as much.
It was just like holy shit, like I made it
to here. I get a paycheck, I get to come
do this every day. But you know, as time went on,
like you guys know, you know that the wins and
losses count, you know, and they matter, you know, and

(01:13:25):
and it messes with you. But yeah, we have we
had a ton of turnover, right we talked. I had
five head coaches in seven years when I was there.
Uh So that part of it. It was tough because
every year you start over, like every team does every year, right,
you guys talk about it on your show. Well we're
shooting for big things this year, right right, and every
year get you know, you got to buy into that, Well,
coach has gone up up, Let's learn a new offense,

(01:13:47):
let's learn a new system. So it was it was
fun to be a part of that organization and you learn,
you know, you only know what you know, right, you
know how it was done there. Uh So it met
a bunch of great guys and you know, there's some
great memories, but you do it to win, right, and
it's just unfortunately there wasn't a lot of much at
all winning. You know during my career.

Speaker 2 (01:14:06):
There when you're a second overall pick and you're starting
to stack like as a team bad years. Given everything
that is known about Robert Gallery, when are certain moments
of pressure starting to affect you differently, whether it was
expectation living up to be in a second overall pick,
when was that starting to take place for you as
you look back on your career, you.

Speaker 1 (01:14:27):
Know, I think going into my third year, So third year,
new head coach. Right, they brought back Artshelle out of
retirement from twenty some years. Right, So we have our offensive.

Speaker 2 (01:14:35):
Coordinator coach, he was retired for twenty years.

Speaker 1 (01:14:38):
Yeah, you didn't coached, I think it was for almost
twenty years.

Speaker 4 (01:14:41):
Our classical Davis.

Speaker 2 (01:14:44):
Glass. We're working. We're going to fire the second head coach.
This is the guy. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:14:48):
Sometimes to go forward, you have to go backwards.

Speaker 1 (01:14:50):
Yeah, and then you know, so it is you know,
it is what it is. Right, Our offensive coordinator was
running a bed and breakfast in Idaho, I think, right,
So I think that was the year that it was like,
oh man, right, and it was you know, it was tough, right,
So we're we're putting stuff in and I think that
was year I didn't play well. That year, you know
had you know, Jackie Slater came in as a as
a line coach, and Jackie is one of the best

(01:15:11):
players to ever play, right, but he had a certain
way and it was one of those to where you're
going to do it this way. I tried to do
that way. It didn't work, and I did not play well,
you know, it was injured, did not play well. So
I think that was the year it was like, you know,
so then that's media is coming on and that's part
of it. I mean, you want to do well, but
it was you know, I'll admit I struggled that year, right,
trying to do the straight sets back and the thing

(01:15:31):
I'd never done and what I got successful at. So
at that point it was, yeah, it's tough, right, and
there you know, we're one and I think we're two
and fourteen. That year, you know, it was just bad, right,
So you know you're adding a year after year and
and as you guys know, right, there's you know, the
new guy comes in, they're supposed to you know, save
the franchise or you know, that's the expectation, right, the
unrealistic expectation. And then when you're not playing well, when

(01:15:54):
stuff goes bad, it goes bad. Right as a team, right,
we all looked That's that's what was great at Iowa.
When we were doing good, I look so good because
I had four other dogs next to me on the line, right,
and we were just that good that it made Robert
Gallery look that much better. Right. So when you're you
get in those other situations, yeah, it's tough, and you
want to win, right, and you don't want to year
after year be starting over. So some of the expectation stuff.

(01:16:16):
And then you know media, you know, now you got
NFL Network and all this stuff, and it's like now
it's in your face, right, And now you're around NFL
fans and they're great, love NFL fans, right, but they're
also seasons going bad. They're leaving a note down your
door telling you to get out of town. And it's like, oh,
this is this is a little different deal.

Speaker 4 (01:16:31):
Yeah. And when you met your wife at Iowa, she
played basketball there, she comes with you to Oakland, I'm
assuming yep, how is she handling this pressure with you?
As like you get in this third year, you're starting
to think, am I going to get another contract? Like
the excitement of getting paid in the league is kind
of like now dwindled down. This is part of what
you do now. It's like I need to exceed this
type of expectation I have in my own head to
get this new contract because that's the new standard I

(01:16:52):
have of myself. People are leaving notes like how is
your wife and you handling this as a couple in
Oakland when you guys both from Iowa.

Speaker 1 (01:17:00):
I think it was just we favre as part of
the gig right, it's a you know, we get it right.
Losing winning helps everything right for an organization, for a person.
But yeah, where there are tough times and you know,
nobody in that organization was happy those year in and
year out, right, So it was you know, we we
dealt with it, you know, like everybody else. Right, it
was just back to work. I didn't try and put
too much thought into it, like, but like we do,

(01:17:21):
we get on something and you're you know what bothers
you because you want to be successful, you want your
team to be successful. You want to write, and I
just kept going deeper.

Speaker 2 (01:17:29):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:17:29):
After the third year, I went back and trained with
with Doyle and Dobson. I went i with City and
lived at my buddy's house and trained with the with
those guys two days, two times a day, and just
kind of going back to the you know, the things
that made me successful. And you know, and then the
next year Tom Cable comes in and you know, great
coach and an you know, things get back. We're doing
better as a team. You know, he's my style of play.

(01:17:50):
So you just I don't know, you don't really dwell
on it. You don't have time to think about it.
You just do what always made you successful, and that's
just go back to work.

Speaker 2 (01:17:59):
Well. At what point in your career was it was
the image starting to shift from he's going to be
our savior, drafting him second overall to where the noise
of bust and he's not playing well. Is that popping
up going into the third year like when you were
like when you're like when you're explaining that, you know,
people are leaving notes on your door or now it's

(01:18:19):
in your face, like what are the moments that you're
thinking about to where you felt like the shift was
now starting to come, like I have to fucking play better.
This pressure, this expectation started to come with all this. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:18:30):
It was probably that third year, right because it was bad.
I mean it was offensively, it was terrible for everyone,
you know, as a team. So after that that year,
I think some of that was right, you get you
know now NFL networks and I only remember the guy.
I don't even know where the guy is now or
but Jamie Dukes was on there. I guys probably don't
remember him.

Speaker 2 (01:18:47):
Yeah, I recognize the name of.

Speaker 1 (01:18:48):
So he was on NFL Network and that's the first
time I saw it. Happened to be watching NFL Network
and he's you know, we're one in eight at this time,
and you know, he he came on and you know,
was bad mouthing us, and it's like, oh, that's like
he's talking about me. Yeah, you know, so it was
you know, after that year.

Speaker 2 (01:19:05):
But then you know, in the moment, I if like
if stuff's like written in it's like at me, I know,
as a as a player, and you're singing for the
first time, like you're enraged, right, Like I would be
like I'm just thinking these well in the.

Speaker 4 (01:19:20):
World we grew up in too, It's like we have
the social media was in full force. So like, you
go after a game and you make the mistake of
putting your name in the search bar and you see
all the comments. Man, you see maybe you have a
good game. You see seven comments are like this guy
had a good game. You're like, that's kind of nice.
But then you see two or three it's like this
guy sucks, he got beat on this plane, and you're like, dude,
they're right, Like there's a piece of you that like

(01:19:41):
agrees with them.

Speaker 2 (01:19:42):
Before whatever. We're thinking, like, I wonder if my coaches
secretly feel this way, because that's really like, ultimately, you're
you're wanting to please your teammates, you want to please
your coaching staff because you know how much work you
put into it, and just that little bit of the
outside noise now would now have me thinking, I wonder
if my coaches, Like I wonder if these conversations are
being had and the coaches rooms and they're just you know,

(01:20:03):
you know it's not coming out to me in front
of me, but you just start playing these weird, these
terrible assumption games, right, it just starts infiltrating your mind, dude.

Speaker 4 (01:20:11):
We had a it was twenty eighteen. I just got
off a suspension. Was it twenty eighteen?

Speaker 2 (01:20:15):
I was spending?

Speaker 4 (01:20:16):
Yeah, twenty nineteen. I got off suspension and we played
the Bills and we ended up losing that game. It
was like a field goal game, like twelve to nine.
They end up beating us. After the game, our head coach,
Mike Rabel, his notes were like somehow publicly brought to
everyone's iPad so you could see the notes that Rabel
put on the players. And the first play of the game,

(01:20:37):
we ran like this play action pass. We throw a
ball down the field fifteen twenty yards, I run down,
hit a guy late in the pile. I get a penalty,
brings us back. And the note Rabel had was why
are we paying him this much? And I remember seeing
that note just being like, that's I want to kill
myself right now. It was the word because you're already suspended,
you're coming back, and it's like the worst feeling. So

(01:20:57):
it brings up all those like do the coaches really
feel this way?

Speaker 2 (01:21:01):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:21:01):
And you're just like, man, yeah, the good or they're
bad because it's funny. And then that's when you learn
about like mental health. Right, you didn't think of it
back then, but it was like you read that stuff
or you hear then you are start doubting yourself and
you press harder. But then you know after you know,
coach k Able came in, ran the system that I
was used to, Like we had a lot of success,
moved to guard was playing really well. You're six five

(01:21:22):
and six, six and seven right and after the season
and he's like, oh, you know, if we would have
won more games, you would have made the Pro Bowl.
Well that's great, thanks, but you know, it's it's the
same thing. It's like, oh, oh great, so you know,
people recognize I'm playing real well, but we were four
and twelve, right, so did you take this? It was
a double sided compliment. It was like, oh, that's awesome.
Then it's like, well that sucks right because we didn't

(01:21:43):
you know, because we didn't win games. Like so you know,
you're playing at a high level, but it's like, eh,
but it doesn't really count, you know what I mean.
Like the mental warfare of all that stuff, and.

Speaker 4 (01:21:52):
You had so many different personalities, like obviously the owner
has his own unique personality. Jerry Rice your rookie year,
JaMarcus Russell. I think Lane came and was your coach
at one point. It had to be very unique walking
in this locker room and seeing all these different characters,
Like what was JaMarcus Russell.

Speaker 2 (01:22:07):
Likes you and you said that. I'm like, oh shit,
you played with JaMarcus Russell.

Speaker 4 (01:22:11):
That's the classic. They give him a playbook, right with
like a one hundred dollars bill at the end of
the playbook and he like never opened it up or
something like that.

Speaker 2 (01:22:17):
Yeah, something like that.

Speaker 1 (01:22:20):
Game of Blank. Yeah, yeah, the story is a game
of blank disc to film. Yeah, it was, you know
part of it. You you know, I have compassion now
for a young kid coming is anointed the you know,
coming out of college. He's anointed the guy, right and
not everyone. Again, this is where we're old now, or
I'm old because I think of it compassionately about I
had a great family and a great you know, my

(01:22:42):
mindset coming in. I knew certain things where you see
certain kids coming now, right, and it's they don't have
maybe the mindset you do, or the upbringing or I'm
not saying JaMarcus had a bad upbringing. I'm just saying
his life experiences. So he's comes in, he's anointed this guy, right,
driving a Rose Royce and write all stuff I would
not do. It was it was all the thing of

(01:23:04):
making it to the NFL, and it was you know,
it was obviously a tough go. We had a we
had a lot of personalities come through there, right, you know,
we had you know, uh J Warne Sap played with
Warren Sap. Right, Warren was there at the end of
his career. Just You're walking into this locker room and
it's like, man, weird different people, which is cool, which
is cool for you know, NFL locker rooms. Yeah, but
it's also so Warren and I got along well. Warren

(01:23:28):
was great. Warren was not afraid to voice his opinion
good or bad to somebody. But you know, I'm still
a young guy. I think my favorite guy of all
time was Ted Washington, so big. Ted was there my
rookie year and Ted was the I don't know how
Ted is now. Ted was the biggest human being I've
ever seen. Right, puts his hand down at dtackle first
OTAs and he looks at me and he goes, don't

(01:23:50):
fucking touch me, or I'll kill you. So I'm a
rookie and I'm like, I gotta go. So I'm back
and forth, like what am I going to do here?
But I remember seeing his hand look like a bear Paul, right,
he put it down in the ground. So same thing right,
high school to college, college to the pros. And I'm like,
how am I supposed to block this human being? And
he just told me he's going to kill me if
I touch him. So I block him and he grabbed
me and he's like, I told you, don't touch me. Right.

(01:24:12):
But Ted was the greatest guy in the world. He
was just his personality, you know, Tyrone Wheatley, Right, Tyrone
was you know, blocked for him, so that some of
these guys when I was, especially a young guy, you
they were just that stuff I'll never forget. And the
guys that I looked up doing this is just a badass. Right.
Tyrone would tell me get out of my way. I'm
going to run through the middle of your spine and
he would, right, he would not cut around you, he

(01:24:36):
would he would come right through you. But those those
experiences in the locker room that made it fun because
coming from a small town in Iowa, right, we had
you know, experience and diversity at Iowa, but you know,
coming from where I came from, I go to Oakland
and it's just a different, different deal, you know. I
remember my rookie year had an old hootie had a
Ford or Buhicle saber that I drove in college. So

(01:24:57):
I took it with me. Right, and I'm at a
gay station off on ninety eighth Street getting gas because
it's cheap, right, And I'm pumping gas and one of
the guys on the team, the black guy, stopped and
he's like, what are you doing here? I'm getting gas.
I gotta work out. He goes look around, buddy, like
you're the only white guy here, like you should not
be getting gas here and right, So it's like this

(01:25:19):
big world for me. It's like, oh copy right. Yeah
he was dead serious, right, but it was like, oh,
looking out for you. I guess I'm not anyway anymore. Right,
So it's funny there's experiences like that, and then like
that bond that I created with him, He's like, I
got you, Like there's certain parts you you know, you
don't go here, you don't drive through right for whatever reason. Right,
this is this is not where you grow up. Those

(01:25:39):
relationships in the locker room were awesome.

Speaker 4 (01:25:41):
You uh sot, Like, at what point in when you're
in the league are you starting to deal with some
of these like mental things you talked about the shoulder
early in your career that comes out your first day
at IOWA, Like you have these injuries ailments that essentially
like coaches just like playing football, Like they're gonna give
you the meadroll dose pack. They're gonna be the pain pills,
like we need you to play. So here's the band
aids over and over again. And obviously a big reason

(01:26:04):
why you're here is a lot of the mental health
stuff and all the things you have had to go through.
What at what point in your career did you start
to feel these things taking a toll on your body
and mind?

Speaker 1 (01:26:13):
Yeah? I think you know two three years in it started.
I started having some injuries, right, Like I was a
warrior in college. You never missed anything, never missed a game,
never missed practice. Right when I went to the combine
and gave my medical sheet, there was nothing in there
because I never missed anything.

Speaker 2 (01:26:24):
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:26:25):
Yeah, I had injuries. I broke my hand, but I
didn't miss stuff, right, so like everybody else, you your
body breaks down or you have an injury, I had
a surge start having surgeries, right, so that stuff's wearing
on your on you mentally, right, you know, I'm three four,
five sixty seven surgeries in some of them big ones,
some of them little ones. And then as you know,
year four and five, as you know, I was like

(01:26:45):
you right, like I love the dirty part of the
game within the rules, but the dirty part the late
cleaning up piles, the chop blocks, to all the stuff
to slow a guy down from how he was going
to play. And so as these things are happening, right,
you're getting them off the ground after trying to cut
someone and you catch them on the side of the
knee and you're like, oh, you know, staggering drunk getting

(01:27:06):
back to the to the line because you're you know,
you got your bell rung.

Speaker 4 (01:27:09):
Someone notices it. You're like, that's a shoulder. Yeah, you
always got there's always your guy in the corner that
has your back for sure. If you get your bell
run a little bit.

Speaker 1 (01:27:15):
Yeah. And so as those things started having more lasting effects,
that's when I noticed, especially you know, you're six seven eight,
that's especially in year eight, I'm like, well, you know,
got my bell rung right? And I didn't have a
clue what was going on, right, and I did. I
had a knee injury earlier that year, the ego right,
So I knee injury, missed a game and I come
off and they're like, you know, that's when they started

(01:27:37):
taking the helmets or you know, if they took your helmet,
you're out. And I remember stagging off like it's my knee.
It's my knee, right because I missed a game well
for at MCL and he's arguing with me. I'm like,
it's my fucking knee right, like I'm fine, and and
so that went back in and it just wasn't all there.
So those those times to where then you get home
and you're dizzy and you know, the brain fog and
all the things. You know, it was part of the game,

(01:27:58):
you know, That's that's what I thought it was. It
was part of it, and it was I was. I
was a guy like like you, like you that was
not coming out. A lot had to happen for me
to come out of the game, right, like major injury
to where there's physically you can't go.

Speaker 2 (01:28:11):
Yes, your Lineman from Iowa.

Speaker 1 (01:28:14):
Yeah, that's what made you successful.

Speaker 2 (01:28:15):
And the long hair got the cut off tea like
absolutely in the middle of the winter. Yeah yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:28:22):
So as the as the years one on, I noticed
that stuff and then like everybody else, right, like you're
trying to make it to the next week. You know
your your eight, I'm you know, you're doing what you
got to do to make it to the next week, right,
the turtle shot, you know, I tell everyone without tortle shots,
I couldn't kept playing. I don't know if you guys
could get the shot, but they were. They were towards
the end of my career, were trying to make it

(01:28:43):
so you couldn't get the shot. You had to take
the pill. Pill.

Speaker 4 (01:28:45):
Pill didn't work, and they would say the pill works
faster than the shot. That there's no way.

Speaker 1 (01:28:50):
Yeah, you know there was.

Speaker 2 (01:28:51):
Once you get that shot too, you just feel like
you've you know, life change went back in time.

Speaker 1 (01:28:55):
Oh, absolutely right, And so that was just to me,
it was just part of it. But is the you
know six seven eight. I noticed that stuff, and then
then I noticed other things, right, the not only the
injuries and the surgeries, right, you're going into you know,
surgery seven, right, whether it's a you know, ankle scope,
elbow scope, or having my back fused. Right, I had
some major major injuries and major surgeries.

Speaker 4 (01:29:16):
Is it backfusion the biggest one.

Speaker 1 (01:29:19):
Yes, yep, So that was you know, you're six, you know,
came back, but yeah, you you know, they pull your
back open, they put rods and stuff in there, and
but yeah, you just rehab and get back to work.
That was part of it. But coming out of those surgeries,
I don't want to do this anymore. Right, You're going
for a scope and they're going to put you under,
and you're just like, I just don't let me wake up, right,
because the it just wears on you. You're not tough.

(01:29:39):
It's like, you know, it's like a hangover, right, you know,
you can't handle the hangover as much. So you know,
as time went on, it was that. And then I
then I noticed it. You know, after games, I'd get
in the car and my wife would say something, I'd
lose it, right, and so I'm just thinking, this is
just me, right, I care about our team, I care
about success. Right. To me, it was like you win,

(01:29:59):
you're lose. It's black and white, right, And that was
how my mood was so good or bad. I never
was able to handle the losing very well because it
meant a lot, right Like you guys, there's stuff meant
a lot like you don't you know, the paycheck's great,
but the winning is why we do this. So I
noticed things with that where my trigger getting, you know,
snapping right for no reason, or she said something and

(01:30:20):
now I'm dealing with kids. You know, my daughter's at
home and something happens, or and I just noticed a
switch goes off to where things go kind of dark.
So that's that's when I kind of started noticing that stuff,
but never really dealt with it till after I retired.

Speaker 2 (01:30:33):
Now, when you're trying to deal with it, what are
things that you're doing that nobody else is seeing to
where you're trying to mask some of whether it's pain
like you were you getting in the pain pills heavy,
like were you drinking? Like things that your wife might
not have been seeing at the time, until when you
look back and kind of check yourself, you're like, man,
I was really kind off the rails and nobody understood it.

Speaker 1 (01:30:53):
Now she knew what was going on in what I
was doing. You know, I feel like I did it
with within the mind. Yeah, but painkillers, you know, the
sleeping pills didn't work to go to sleep, so then
you're taking percoset instead.

Speaker 2 (01:31:04):
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:31:04):
It was just anything to like, I need to sleep, right,
I get done with a game my body. Here's sleeping
pill doesn't work. So thirty beers and three percoset, four percoset,
this is going to make me go to sleep. Right,
So yeah, you know, you know that was the coping right, like,
and it wasn't an everyday thing, but it was like,
you guys, I'm sure I was in extremes, right, No

(01:31:25):
matter what I was doing is extreme. So if I'm
gonna sit on drink, I'm gonna drink ten twenty beers
like that's that's what we do, right as fast as
you can, not not trying to not knowing it, but
it's like drinking cups of water. Right. And so then
it was the same with the whatever you can do
to feel better. And so she noticed things and it was,
you know, more surgery. So then it's taking painkillers and

(01:31:47):
you know, trying to get them to work better. So
you have a couple of drinks. Nothing that I was
hiding but definitely it was abusive, right, and it wasn't
the right way to deal with them. But also, you know,
you had to do what you had to do to
get to the next game to be able to play,
you know, I mean that was my mindset, and right,
you know, I do it all over again.

Speaker 4 (01:32:04):
There's so many different ways you can justify it too.
When you're like trying to get to the next game,
Like you're taking care of your family at this point.
I'm assuming you have kids, like you want to. This
person is asking for this type of help, and you're like,
I have to help all these people around me, and
if I don't get to play, I don't get to
get paid. So I have to do these things. This
is why it's okay for me to take these pills
and drink these beers. So there's always something you can
tell yourself to keep that kind of decision making prossure

(01:32:27):
going that way.

Speaker 1 (01:32:27):
And I don't think it was you know, was it
abusive in those moments? Right? Is it? Is it normal
and not abusive to drink fifteen twenty beers after a game?
It's probably to a normal person abusive, But that's very
common between us, right, we Right, it was.

Speaker 4 (01:32:40):
Away games, so yeah, it was you on the flights.
They have cases of beer right in to them.

Speaker 1 (01:32:43):
It wasn't every single night of the week the hogs.

Speaker 4 (01:32:45):
Yeah, drinking beer. Yeah, it's a very normal thing.

Speaker 1 (01:32:49):
That's want. So you know it was it abusive, yes,
but it was also that's part of being a young guy.
It wasn't every single night I was doing that, right.
But as you just right, there's also the business side
of it. You're getting older, You're making a bunch of money,
right if you miss games because you're hurt. I mean,
we know the business side of it. So you're like,
I gotta do whatever I gotta do, Like this paycheck
is nice. I'm trying to set my family up for life, right,

(01:33:11):
So whatever I got to do, right, whether that's taking
pergoset to go to sleep instead of painkiller or instead
of sleeping pills, great, I'll do it. Right. You're not
thinking about what it's doing to your body, but it's yeah,
part of its part of the business. Like this, there's
gonna be a business decision at some point here, right,
So I gotta do whatever I can to make sure
I keep playing. Right.

Speaker 2 (01:33:27):
How long did you? How long did you.

Speaker 1 (01:33:28):
Play eight full seasons and then once Camp retired in
camp by ninth.

Speaker 4 (01:33:32):
Year, okay, retired, and what you're here in camp?

Speaker 1 (01:33:35):
In Camp? I went to Camp. I got released from Seattle,
signed with New England, went there and it was just
you know, had had my eight ninth and tenth surgery
before after that year in Seattle or during went there
and my body just wasn't there. Mentally, I was, I
was gone, right, I was, it was, But physically I
was like, I can't move. I'm trying. And I got

(01:33:56):
to an organization, signed with an organization, the Holy Cow, right, like,
this is a winning organization. This is what I wanted
my whole career. So I wanted to and I my
standard wasn't my standard at that point. And so a
couple of weeks in the camp, I went in and
was like, you know, coach, I appreciate the opportunity, but
it's time for me to be done. And it was
the mental part too, I mean it was you know.

Speaker 2 (01:34:17):
What was going on, but what was going on all encompassing? Yeah,
because I'm assuming that conversation is probably very hard.

Speaker 1 (01:34:23):
Yeah, it was, you know, it was the physical part
to where I'm I'm struggling to move right, trying to
be fluid, and then you know, so ego right comes
in because I'm like, I am not what I used
to be right, and I can't move and you're getting
you know, getting beat at practice, and I was like,
oh my god, I can I do this? And then
you know, the mental part of it was was equally
as tough. Right, there was points and not a you know,

(01:34:45):
it's hard to say, but there was a point where
I'm like, I wish I'd just blow something out so
I could be done, right. And that's where how bad
it had gotten mentally because I didn't you know, I
felt like if I retired, chose to retire, then you
know that I was quitting or I was it was
this this thing right. That's but if something happened, it
could just be like, oh you had to right, And
so that mental part of it, it's, you know, you're

(01:35:07):
in a because I remember running, I kept pulling stuff
and my body here. I remember doing the conditioning test
and I'm like, I wish I just blow an achilling
so I could be done. I'm like, well, you know,
so now you're now you're judging who you are as
a person. Like you coward, Like who says that to themselves?
But it's the mental side of it that going into
that year and it was taking pinkillers to get out,
Bed just couldn't move and decided, like, you know, the

(01:35:29):
good part is I, you know, I was with it
enough to know that I don't want to be this.
I don't want to be the guy that does this
till he's non functioning. And I felt like that's where
it was leading. And so I had the conversation with
Coach there and it was like, I think this is
best for both of us, you know, because I was
I was like, I don't want to waste your time, Like, yeah,
you're not getting what I was a few years ago.

Speaker 4 (01:35:49):
Did you quickly after quickly or maybe not quickly? Did
you after you decided to retire? Did you have this
identity crisis of like, okay, what am I? Who am I?

Speaker 2 (01:35:57):
Now?

Speaker 1 (01:35:57):
For sure? Yeah? You get home and you know, I,
you know, I chose, you know, I chose to be done.
But now you're home and you're watching your buddies still play, right,
they're still going to practice. You're trying to you know,
can't turn the TV on when you're home because you're like, oh,
I should still be doing this right and I should
be there with them.

Speaker 4 (01:36:12):
Because I'm sure at some point your body starts to
feel better, you know, like you know what, maybe I
could do X, Y and Z, and then you pop
on a game You're like, why aren't I doing this right?

Speaker 1 (01:36:19):
Yeah, So it was definitely the identity. And I remember
screaming at my wife one day. I was, you know,
I'm not a I'm not an f and stay at
home dad, right, because I was trying to let her
do her thing her whole life. You know, my whole
career was everything for me, right. She took care of
the kids like you like, concentrate on your career. And
I just remember, like that, what am I? Right? And
that's terrible to say that because I'm proud to be
a father, but you this identity like I'm not a

(01:36:40):
stay at home dad every day. This is not what
I do. So yeah, that's tough. I think we all
go through that. And then you're dealing with other stuff
on top of that. You know mentally that that doesn't
have you thinking clearly. That makes it even harder. And
now you know, like I said, now you're now I know,
I don't have to go to practice. So now I'm
at my buddy's drinking beer, you know, three nights a
week right now. Now, now I need to lose weight

(01:37:01):
because I don't need to be three on twenty pounds.
So I'm drinking tequila instead because my body can process
it better. But drinking the same valume with tequila that
you know when I was drinking beer. Right, So it's
this whole thing that this transformation, and you wonder who
you are, what should I do? And you know what,
am I going to go get a job? Right? You've
been making all this money, right, getting these big checks,
and I'm going to go you know I liked old cars, Right,

(01:37:23):
I'm gonna go work at my buddy's shop. I'm gonna
go san Bondo for twenty five dollars an hour. You're like, yeah,
you know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (01:37:29):
It's like clearly world, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:37:31):
Yeah, And now I'm thirty some years old and or
I don't want to, you know, go get a job
and you know, work with a bunch of twenty year olds. Right,
So it's just this whole ego and identity of who
you are and what you were, and that's what you
did your whole life. That's all you knew, right, that's
what we did. And then you get done, You're like,
oh shit, they ain't calling. Like when you say you're done,
you're done right right, I'm not in a band to

(01:37:52):
where we can go to the local bar and just
keep playing, right, Like when you're done with the sport,
that's it?

Speaker 2 (01:37:58):
What the what was the break point to start diving
into your mental health and figuring out that there could
be a lot more going on?

Speaker 1 (01:38:06):
I think the breaking point for me as time went on.
So now we're three four, five years post retirement, and
all these reactions and in moods and all these things
got more intense. So now my kids are laughing or
giggling at the breakfast table and I lose it, right,
I go from zero to two thousand, and I'm so
angry and smashing my fist on the table to get

(01:38:27):
them to be quiet. But I'm also realizing that, hey,
this is not a normal reaction, right, So why did
that that just happen? Right? So it's instance after instance,
and I'm coping with alcohol, right, not every day, not
every week, but when I did, it was how big
of a bottle of tequila did I have?

Speaker 2 (01:38:45):
Right?

Speaker 1 (01:38:45):
You know, we go to a kid's the fundraiser for
the school. Right I was socially I did you know?
I was. I'm not a social person, you know. Even
before all this, right, I would always you know, I
had social anxiety. I didn't like that. Even in college,
I didn't like all the attention, right when everything's great
and everybody like you're the greatest ever. I didn't like
the attention, you know, for the good or the bad.
And so now we go to school fundraisers and you know,

(01:39:07):
I take my bottle of tequila in with me because
the stuff they serve at the bar I don't like, right,
So that makes a lot of sense, all right. So
now it's you know, doing things like that. So and
I'm realizing these things as they happen. I'm like, this
is not normal behavior that I took my own tequila
brand in because the bar doesn't serve it, you know.
And then I'm having these reactions to my wife or

(01:39:28):
the kids. We went to dinner one night her my
mother in law, was in town, and I just remember
it because of the reaction I had. We walked into
my wife, It's like, oh, let's sit inside. So we're
waiting for the lady to see this, and then she goes, oh,
the sun came out, we should sit outside, and I
remember going dark. I mean, I want to I want
to strangle her. And I hate to say that, but
I was so angry that she changed from wanting to

(01:39:49):
sit into out inside to outside, and I had no
idea why I was. I'm like, why am I reacting
like this? So in my head, I'm fighting myself because
I mean, it doesn't make sense, right, you guys look
at me, like why with that trigger? Yeah, it made
zero sense to me.

Speaker 2 (01:40:02):
So these things, how's your wife reacting when you're having
these reactions and knowing that we're we're kind of in
a song and dance around dad right now at times?

Speaker 1 (01:40:11):
You know, Honestly, at the time, I think she saw
I was an asshole, right she. I don't think she understood.
She didn't understand why things were happening. You know, when
someone does that, you'll be like, what is wrong with him? Right?
These are me popping off or getting upset, or the
days I'm fine and all of a sudden, I'm just
either super depressed or super angry. I mean, anger more
than you should have right, stuff that shouldn't set you off.

(01:40:32):
So it was tough because I think she was like,
what is going on? Right? She also knew I was
going through stuff right being done, she knew, you know,
the injuries and those things took a toll. But so
the rock bottom, I think was a couple instances like
that to where I'm like, you know, I'm aware of
all this, right, Because then I feel like the biggest
piece of trash on the face of the earth because

(01:40:53):
I lose my stuff because my kids are laughing right
or I'm sitting in a chair like you know, hurting
them or or making it stop, and I'm like, I'm
a terrible human being. And so I think that was
rock bottom for me when I'm having these thoughts And
then then I'm beating myself up because I'm like, they're
better off without me, right, Like, this is this is

(01:41:14):
who I am. This is not a life for them.
I love my family, It's the greatest family on the
face of the earth. I love my wife. She's you know,
she's been through it all with me. But I'm like,
they don't deserve this. I I they're better, they're better
off without me, And so you know. It happened to
be a morning we were working out. We always worked
out in the morning, and and broke down in our driveway.
I was just I remember sitting down and she's like,

(01:41:35):
you're okay, and I just start bawling, and I'm like,
I need help because all this stuff had been going
through my head and I hadn't told her. She knew
I was struggling, and she saw these outbursts, she saw
these things that happened. But in my mind, I'm like,
I shouldn't be here, Like they're better off. They don't
need to see their dad losing his shit over nothing.
They don't need I don't need to be this depressed
guy sitting in a chair shaking because I think something

(01:41:56):
else is going on, right, And so that was probably
rock bottom. It was rock bout them for me. And
the fact that I actually asked her for help and
I just remember saying, just in tears, like I need help.
I'm struggling. I don't I think I'm losing my mind,
you know. So that that was kind of the start
of it, and so, you know, just happened to be
at the same time that through my workers comp case,

(01:42:16):
you know, I'm going through that whole process, which is great,
you know, ten years later, but they had me get
a brain scan. So going and get a brain scan,
and this was a very close in proximity to when
I asked for help, you know, I asked her for help.
I reached out to a couple of friends that you know,
had been through you know, been through their own stuff,
to like, hey, I'm struggling, like, you know, how do

(01:42:36):
you deal with this? But I get this brain scan,
and that's when it was really kind of the aha
moment because they pulled up my brain scan. He's like,
you know, all these symptoms you're having, the rage, the anger,
the depression of this, of that, right, and then put
up a healthy brain on there, and then put up
my brain. You know, it was a spec scan at
the time, and it was you know, it looks looked
like someone had taken a baseball back to it, right.
And so my wife was there and I remember she's

(01:42:59):
crying in obviously you look at it. And I started
laughing and she looked at me and she's like, what
the fuck are you laughing at? And she was mad,
obviously mad, and I just said I'm not crazy because
I had thought to that At that point, I thought
I was losing my mind. You're getting an answer, right,
So I'm like, oh, this is the reason, right, and
so you know, I just that sticks in my head.
But that was the point where, you know, kind of

(01:43:20):
my healing journey started and I knew, Hey, there's there's
something going on, not just me. I'm not just a
ex athlete that can't handle being done, that doesn't have
an identity, Like there is a physical, physical issue that
is causing these outburst and these thoughts and these suicidal
ideation and these all these different things, and there's a
reason that's happening. And now we got to either do
something or continue the way we are.

Speaker 2 (01:43:41):
Did you ever get extremely close to killing yourself?

Speaker 1 (01:43:45):
I did, Unfortunately, Yes, it got bad enough to where
with the you know, suicide nightmares at night, and then
it turned to suicidal ideation during the day to you know,
I felt like I was a burden on my family. Right,
So You're having these thoughts that and you see your
self acting in a certain way, and I'm like, they
are better off with that, And I believed it. I
believe that, and I told my wife on multiple ocations,

(01:44:05):
you guys are better off without me. Here's all the stuff, right,
because I'm aware of these reactions I'm having, and I'm
aware that I'm getting triggered by my kids to where
or my wife to where I want, you know, like
physically think I'm hurting them. Right, So now I'm sitting
in the chair thinking I'm hurting them. And there's a
couple instances and she's like, what is wrong with you?
And I'm literally sitting there shaking because I thought I

(01:44:27):
was hurting my children. Never physically touch them, thank god, right,
But the story in my head it was that I
was so now I feel like I'm a terrible human
being because I think, how could you have this thought
about your children? Yeah, and so you know, not proud
of it. There were times that I thought, you know,
and a friend of mine that I meant, military friend,
he ended up taking his life. He said it best,

(01:44:48):
he said, nobody wants to commit suicide. They want the
noise to stop. And that's what I wanted. I just
I can't live like this. I can't be around and
function around my children and have these thoughts. I need
the noise to stop. And there were there were times
I had, you know, my pistol in my gulp compartment
of my truck, and I'm like, this would be really
easy right here, right, and and so you know, never

(01:45:10):
never attempted it, thank god, but there are multiple times
that it got to that point, unfortunately. And you know,
then it was like, oh, everybody's gonna think I'm a coward, right,
So then it's driving down the highway and it's just
and then yeah, then there's a semi coming. All right, Well,
if I just swerve over in front of this semi,
I won't look like a coward, right. And so it
was the not thinking clearly part, on top of all

(01:45:33):
the other things that I'm affecting people that I love,
I'm affecting them and and that's but I wanted to
be better. I wanted I was aware of this, and
so when that stuff started happening, that's that's when I
reached out for help. And that's what kind of started
the whole journey.

Speaker 2 (01:45:45):
When you're when you're having By the way, I'm sorry
for asking that very bluntly too. I was just kind
of like listening you start talking about the suicide ideation
and everything else, and it's just I'm almost just sitting
here in my check because I'm captivated by you storytelling,
and I just had to know.

Speaker 4 (01:45:58):
I'm glad you asked because I'm thinking, I wonder how
I can ask it.

Speaker 2 (01:46:00):
And knowing that he yeah, knowing that he's having the
rage and the outburst, and I can only imagine the
shame and embarrassment that you quickly have after that, or
people looking at you and you're telling these stories and
you're shaking in your chair and then you're seeing on
the scans like, uh, how and how badly in shape
your brain has been. And then once you said like

(01:46:20):
the suicide ideation, I'm just like, yeah, if you're you've
already been saying that they're better off without me. I'm
just thinking to myself, like, I wonder what he's meaning
by that. So then whenever I had that land, I'm like,
I just need to I didn't know how to ask
it either.

Speaker 5 (01:46:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:46:32):
No, it's and the good thing is now I can
sit here, right, and that'll be the rest of the story.
But I can sit here and talk about it and
not be nervous. Right, you asked that, I'd be sweating
because I'm like, yeah, it's every single day. Yeah, And
so it's a very real part of it, and I
don't think enough people talk about it, and that's you know,
that's that's real talk like that was Yah was very

(01:46:52):
very close. I'm not proud of it, but that was
part of the journey. And and unfortunately for a lot
of people it gets that way and if you know,
you keep hiding it, that's that's the issue.

Speaker 4 (01:47:00):
Yeah, And for you to be able to sit here
and have this conversation and talk about these super deep
things so calmly, it just shows how much growth that
you've had. And I'm sure there's people that are watching
this that might struggle struggle similarly that don't know how
to put it into words. So you could be absolutely
helping somebody right now just by being as vulnerable as
you are with two guys you just met.

Speaker 2 (01:47:20):
Boys.

Speaker 4 (01:47:21):
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The question I have is when you're happy these out
of the bathroom go ahead, When you're having these outbursts

(01:49:09):
with your children, are laughing and you're slamming your fist
or your wife, you know she wants to go from
inside to outside. When you're like mentally having a hard
time and having an outburst, are you internally in your
head in the moment being like, hey, why are you
acting like this? Or is this How long does it
take for you to kind of realize, Oh, I just
did something that is not me. I wonder why that happened.

Speaker 1 (01:49:31):
Like, yeah, I think it was some of both. I
think some of it. Like I could tell when when
I went dark. My wife would say I went dark,
like my eyes. She's like, your eyes were dead. And
I could tell when your mood changed because like instantly
everything went black. So yeah, completely, body language, everything, And
so I knew that in the moment because something would
happen and I remember just this anger. But I know,
I'm like, why is this happening? Like so I'm having
that internal dialogue right, But then it got to the

(01:49:53):
point where I would have these moments and then get
done right. I you know, times on my Harley. I'd
get on my Harley to let loose right, to get
this stuff out of my head. And I'm doing eighty
ninety mile an hour and a thirty five down Lake
Shore Boulevard in Lake Tahoe. We even through cars, and
I remember, you know, in that moment, that's just what
it was. It was like making it all stop, right,

(01:50:14):
And then I get to town and I'm like, what
did I just do? Right? I look back at the
carnage behind me, like, oh god, I was just doing that,
like and knew it, but it was just in the moment.
It was just like we even in and out of
cars on the side of the road, and like then
all of a sudden it snapped back in. I'm like,
oh my god, what am I doing? Like I'm gonna
kill myself? Like and so a little bit of both,

(01:50:35):
but it was that was the hard part. That's how
it's hard mentally to cope with because there's times I'm
like I don't know what's going on, or I snap
out of something and I'm like, oh, that's not right,
Like I did I just I'd ask my wife did
that just happen? Did I just do that? Did I
just have that reaction? She's like, yeah, you know really?
And so that that was a tough part, and that's
what I think led to the other the very negative thoughts,

(01:50:56):
because you know, now you're doing this, like what, I'm
gonna hurt somebody, Like, right, I gonna hurt wife, I'm
hurt kids, I'm gona hurt something in the street. I'm
gonna right, this is this is getting back.

Speaker 4 (01:51:04):
Did your wife ever express concern for her wellbeing and
the kids well being? Ever have fear of that?

Speaker 1 (01:51:10):
I'm talking about it now. I don't know. I don't
think now. Did she walk on eggshells for a few years, Yes,
if you ask her, I think she she's like I
was never for whatever reason, I wasn't. I wasn't scared
you were gonna hurt us because I just didn't think
that's who you were, you know, and that's someone that
really believes in you to be able to say that

(01:51:31):
because my actions were showing different. So she was she scared? Yes,
I think she walked on eggshells to make it so
these things didn't happen, Right. She talks about it, to
try and do these things so if she could see
them coming, to make them not as intense, or to
stop them altogether, like kids start laughing, Stop, I'll go
out of the room, right, all these different things too.
But I think were the reactions scary? Absolutely? So? Luckily

(01:51:55):
I don't think I just you know, it's spiritual to say,
but I think I think she knew who I was.
That's what she said. She's like I knew who you were.
I knew you, you know, I believed you wouldn't hurt us, right,
you know? But were we scared at times and nervous? Absolutely,
because the reactions were so intense.

Speaker 4 (01:52:10):
Yeah, relatively strategic too about getting kids out of the room.
No one will started to trigger you starting to realize
those types of things, right, Very brave and strong on
her part too, absolutely to see like the truth in
you and to be able to work through that with
you and like let you go through your process. So
when you guys are sitting there and you look at
the brain scans, she's crying, you're laughing, she calls you
an asshole, and you're like you there's a level of

(01:52:31):
relief that you have because you're looking at these scans
and being like, I'm this isn't just a me thing.
This is something that's happened to me, so I have
and I'm sure it was extremely settling for you to
be like, Okay, like I see the problem now, now
I can work on a ways to resolve this problem.
What is the first step you guys take when you're
in this meeting room? How quickly do you start working
on different therapies? To help your.

Speaker 1 (01:52:53):
Brain instantly, right, Because I remember asking the neurologist and
I said, well, is this bad? You know where does
this on the level of that? Right? And I'm sure
you've seen seem sure you've seem better, and he goes,
I've seen, I've seen worse. It's pretty bad. Yeah, And
I was in that just in that mode of.

Speaker 4 (01:53:06):
Which in a sick way. I don't know how you
you felt in that moment, but for me, it's like
when I like get blood work done or I like,
uh see my levels and all these things, like I
kind of want it to be really bad because I know, like, oh,
if i'm I can be this much better. Absolutely, there's
a weird like sick o mode you go into. It's
like make it as bad as it can.

Speaker 1 (01:53:22):
Write an ego right, And I'm like, yeah, I do something,
I do it.

Speaker 4 (01:53:24):
Right right now, it can be the best at much
farther I've come right exactly, So.

Speaker 1 (01:53:28):
You know, I asked him that and they said, you know,
not so many words that you know you have you
know you have CT right like this is you know
obviously you can't tell post mortem and they pull your
brain out there like he's like all the symptoms your
brain scan, you have CTE and if you do nothing,
you're going to become a statistic. Well I knew what
a statistic was in my life. Say what does that mean?
She's like, this leads to suicide? Like this is that

(01:53:49):
these people that are having these reactions, and gave examples
of other guys, athletes, other people in the past that
have done things. Right, That's that's what a statistic is.
So at that point I'm like, okay, and again the
all are not thing. I remember just feeling hope. So
I'm like, well, let's do it. What do I need
to do. He's like, well, you need to stop drinking.
You know, I'm that first thing. You know. Alcohol is
the worst thing in the world for your brain, number one,

(01:54:09):
number one depressant in the world, you know. So I
tried that. I didn't do very well at it. I
toned it down. But everything else they threw at me,
I did you know? They were you need to be
in a hyperbaric chamber, you know, every day for the
rest of your life, they said. So I rented one.
I did two hours a day for a month and
a half to see you, and then I ended up
buying one.

Speaker 2 (01:54:27):
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:54:27):
Luckily, through our retirement stuff and reimbursement fun I bought one. Yeah,
so I'm doing that. I'm doing ivs. I'm getting all
my levels checked right because all my hormones are messed up, right,
So I'm doing blood work every few days. I'm taking
you know, getting different ivs of different medicines that are
supposed to help with brain regeneration. Figuring out my sleep. Right,
I couldn't sleep. I'd be up tweaking at night because
I'd wake up and go back, couldn't go back to sleep. Well, sleep,

(01:54:50):
learn that sleep is very big on brain health, right obviously,
So learning that right.

Speaker 11 (01:54:54):
Thought, Yeah, your body right, just the way he led
to saying and as he's saying it in his mind's
like obviously, and you're like yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:55:06):
But in the moment, you don't think of that.

Speaker 4 (01:55:07):
If you, if you, if you're not doing something, and
then you just someone just explains it, You're like that
makes all this.

Speaker 2 (01:55:12):
Yeah, yeah, like that's a general statement, but when you're
learning the actual details why it's so beneficial, that's like
the aha, what's like like the alohol it seems good
for you, It's like, oh for real?

Speaker 1 (01:55:24):
Yeah, And you don't sleep on when you drink a
bunch like, oh, that's how I used to get that's weird. Howlckhim.
I wasn't getting good RESTful sleep when I drink ten
ten doubles of tequila.

Speaker 2 (01:55:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:55:32):
Yeah, So doing all this, you know, any like I
said anything they threw out me because I wanted to
be better, right, and it was kind of hope for me.
I'm like, oh, okay, I'm again not back to that.
There is a cause, like, let's fix it, full war,
let's let's do it. So I spent a year and
a half doing that. Anything they threw out me, you know,
light therapy, anything I could to help with my brain health.
And I'm seeing a therapist. So finally call right, this

(01:55:54):
is pre brain scan and it's not funny, but it is.
I it's like, I need to talk to somebody. I
didn't know how to get a therapist, right. The NFL
offers that stuff. So I called the suicide hotline that
they give us on our sheets, called Suicidehighlight. They're going
to hurt yourself. I'm calling them for a reason, but no,
I'm not right, and okay, we'll get you a therapist. Well,

(01:56:16):
took them a week to get me a therapist that
was covered through my insurance. I'm like, this is not
the way, so I you know, okay, I'm gonna find
something else. So got hooked up with somebody else, got
a therapist. So I'm doing doing all that stuff right.
Talking these things out right fired that therapist right, because
I'm talking about like the you know, the the level
that I take everything right, She'd like, well, how much

(01:56:37):
do you drink? Well, how big is a bottle? Like
I'm not trying to glamorize it, but you know, I
might drink once a week, but if I had the
full bottle of tekeil, I drink the whole thing. I
was fine. That's the messed up part. My wife's like,
how are you functioning? Like I'm fine, Like I'm drunk,
but I'm not stumbling, I'm not puking. I can handle it, right.
So I'm talking about that, and I'm also talking about, Oh,
then I trying to cope. So I'm gonna go on

(01:56:58):
a bike ride. So I go on, you know whatever,
the longest bike ride I can to try and get
my heart to explode, right, because it's everything's an extreme
and He's like, well that's not healthy. I remember saying that,
and I'm like, well you don't get us then, right,
because we do everything extreme, Like there's no like this
is healthy, right you just you know you you go
for a nice little jog, right, No, you go to
like grind out all the bad stuff, right, right, And

(01:57:20):
so work through the therapy, you know, I'm I'm doing
all these treatments and am I a little bit better? Yes,
you know, five five percent better, ten percent better, but
still having a ton of ideation. Right, there's still days, right,
I'm telling my wife again, like when you go into
it and be like here's all the stuff right like this,
I can't be around you guys like this is And she'

(01:57:42):
said what are you talking about? Right? And I meant
it I did because at that point I'm like, I'm
a I'm not a good father, I'm not a good husband.
I can't barely function. I'm trying to do I'm trying
to get healthy and it's not working. And then so
it happened to be I was started listening to military podcasts.
I'm a huge military supporter. You know, my dad was
in the Marines. I just I have affection for those

(01:58:03):
guys and what they've done and just like kind of
like you guys, like there are people right, they think
like us, they say mannerisms, they yes, right. And so
I was listening to the Team Never Quit podcasts that
Marcus Latrell does, and I had to listen to a
bunch of them listen to because every story was like, oh, Okay,
this guy made it right. He did he alcohol abuse,

(01:58:23):
all the rage, depression, all this stuff and tells their
feel good story. And then it happened to be listening
to one of those and Marcus Capone who was another
he played actually played college football and then was a
thirteen year seal and he was on there talking about
his journey and I'm like listening to it and again
back to this moment to where I don't know if
I'm really here or not. I'm listening. I think that

(01:58:45):
I'm talking in the radio. So I'm driving. I was
we're still living in the Bay aer it's time and
driving up to Tahoe to our cabin to give my
wife and kids a break from me, and I remember
listening to them. I'm like I'm in the radio talking right,
and I'm like I'm losing my mind because I thought
my voice was coming out of the rad and I
called my wife and I was like, hey, I'm on
the radio. What are you talking about? Like, listen to

(01:59:05):
this podcast. It's me talking, right, because it was the
story all the stuff TBI and and then it was
his wife, Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:59:13):
I'm on the radio right, and say yea, yeah, yeah,
it was right funny.

Speaker 1 (01:59:17):
But that's funny now because she's like yeah, I'm like, no,
turn it on right now. She's like, okay, I'm putting
the kids to bed. I'll listen to the podcast later,
and you know, it's but in my head, I'm like, no,
it's me. And she's like, man, you're off your rocker, right,
But thank god, you know I told her numerous times ago,
I said you should leave me, like you know, and
I meant it because I'm like, I'm a mess, Like
this is happening right, I'm like, this is not sane,

(01:59:39):
the fact that I'm calling you and telling you that
I'm on the radio and I mean it. I don't
just mean, oh, this is my story. I'm I'm talking
on the radio. So I hear that, and then Marcus
Capone and his wife are on there and he went
through all this stuff, right, So I'm like, holy cow,
this is me.

Speaker 4 (01:59:53):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:59:53):
And then at the end his story was, you know,
he went to Mexico did this psychedelica to theray be
with this drug called iba gain and I knew nothing
about it. And then he's talking about his recovery and
how it changed his brain fog and his mental clarity
and took away all this his ego and his rage
and all these things that I'm like, oh shit. So
for me it was hope. I'm like, holy cow, there's

(02:00:15):
there's something i can do because all this other stuff
I've been doing for a year and a half is
not working.

Speaker 4 (02:00:19):
And it helped a little bit, but nothing substantial.

Speaker 1 (02:00:22):
Right, And so listen to it. Call my wife, beck,
you gotta listen to it. I'll listen tomorrow, all right.
So I get to our He's.

Speaker 2 (02:00:30):
Like, I crushed this podcast.

Speaker 1 (02:00:33):
That was good. So I reached out. So they had
started an organizations called VET Solutions, and because he had
healing and he wanted to help, you know, obviously with
the suicide epidemic and with veterans, he wanted to help
his guys. And so I'm like, I'm gonna try. So
I get on the web internet and get their website.
Emailed them, thinking no way, but hey, for that night

(02:00:54):
I felt good, like there's hope. Next day and get
a call from his people. Then Marcus and Amberg Campone
call me and we talk that day for quite a
while and multiple days in a row, and he's talking
about all these things, right, He's like, well, hey, there's
there's other stuff you can do first, like I did,
you know, hyperbaric therapy in this and this and then
and I finally stopped like, hey, not to be rude,

(02:01:15):
hold my beer, like I've done all this, Like everything
you're talking about, I've done. And so he was talking
about this medicine, you know, drug and you know how
it helped him, and they had sent two hundred guys,
two hundred veterans, so his organization deals with special OT veterans. Them.
He put me in contact with some of his guys
who had gone through this treatment. And there's no way, right,

(02:01:38):
But he was talking about the brain fog because I
had super bad brain fag, right, just all day in
a haze, and he's talking about how that goes away
and the ringing in my ears, right, I couldn't There
was always a ringing, right, So on top of the
emotional stuff, it was the actual brain stuff. And so,
long story short, we talk about it on and off
for a week and he's like, Hey, I'm taking a

(02:01:59):
group of my kind a well known you know, some
higher profile veterans. There's four of them. We have one
extra spot in three weeks if you want to join, Like,
you seem like a guy that would fit in with this,
and I think this will help you. And so I'm like,
I'm in right. He's like, Okay, well, we gotta you know,
we need there's a few things we got to do beforehand, right,
because you can.

Speaker 4 (02:02:18):
Before you go into that out at this point in
your life, how much experience have you had with other
drugs other than just marijuana, like psychedelics, different things like
did you ever take part in any of those things,
like in college or NFL.

Speaker 1 (02:02:34):
To this point?

Speaker 5 (02:02:34):
None?

Speaker 4 (02:02:35):
So this point none, nothing. I'm on a phone and
you're like, I'm in on trying this thing, and I'm
assuming TJ.

Speaker 1 (02:02:41):
Yes, yep. I mean I'd smoked weed a couple of
times in my life. It didn't work for me because
I tried that when I was coping to like, oh,
you know, Kyle Turley found healing through marijuana. I reached
I reached out to him, right, like, trying all these
different ones, and it made me feel sick or I
was out right, it was just it wasn't yep, it
wasn't my thing. So I had zero experience, knew nothing
of That.

Speaker 2 (02:03:00):
Helps shut it down for maybe momentarily, but.

Speaker 1 (02:03:02):
Right, yeah, and so I'm learning about this and he
puts me on the phone with the doctors and they're
explaining it and that. You know, at that point, I
didn't care. I'm like, I'm in. But it was like,
knew nothing about psychedelics and they're talking about the hallucinations. Right,
I knew the you know, I went through dare like,
I'm sure you guys did. Yeah, some of the stories, right,
you know the people that did psychedelics and jumped off
the roof, right.

Speaker 4 (02:03:23):
The crazy stories, Yes, scare tactics.

Speaker 1 (02:03:26):
But by the way, dare t shirt actually bought one
a few years ago.

Speaker 2 (02:03:31):
Shirt.

Speaker 1 (02:03:33):
That's awesome.

Speaker 2 (02:03:34):
So now, are you on prescriptions too before you out
there because you're obviously doing the hyperbarak, you're doing all
these things, but I'm assuming working with therapists and doctors
there's probably some prescriptions.

Speaker 1 (02:03:42):
Yes, indepressants, And that was part of the deal when
he said, hey, we got to so they put me
in contact. And that's the thing about iby gain, which
so I be gain is the highest highest powered psychedelic
theory is so you know, there's psilocybin, there's ayahuasca. It
is here compared to here, I mean, it is the
highest power now at all altill has. You know, if
you're on it can react with SSRs, it can react

(02:04:05):
with antidepressants and send you into cardiac arrest. So it
can also kill you. And I'm like, it's all good.
I'm fine, right, yeah, right, I don't care if it
kills me. It kills me, it's better than the way
I'm living right now. I mean funny, but not funny.
But that's the way. I was like, if it kills me,
it was supposed to because this way to live is
not the way I want to live. And so, yes,
I had to. That treatment was three weeks from that date,

(02:04:27):
and they're like you have to get off this, this
and this right, So and I was on a high
powered antidepressant and so I call my doctor and she's like,
you can't get off that fast. I mean, you have
to wean off this for months. And I said, you know,
I remember the conversation. I says, is it going to
kill me? And she said, no, it's not going to
kill you, but you're going to have bad side effects,
like you're going to lose your mind like it is.

(02:04:48):
It is hard to come off this stuff. And said,
I don't give a shit if it's not going to
kill me, hung up on her, you know, and I
quit taking it. I did a half pell for one day,
and I'm like, I got four days to do this.
It's going to stop taking it. So I get, you know,
but my wife knew, right, my friend and I knew
that there was going to be side effects.

Speaker 4 (02:05:02):
So my wife, are you in Tahoe by yourself still
or are you back home?

Speaker 1 (02:05:05):
We are living full time in Tahoe at this point,
so we moved up there and so I'm there my wife,
you know, she knows, she knows what I told her.
They said, oh, I'm gonna have effects from this, and
so her and couple friends are checking on me. Right
My my buddies would come over at five in the
morning to make sure I was okay. And because I
always got up super early and worked out, and she's

(02:05:25):
working me through this. But I had huge side effects.
I mean I showed up at my buddy's shop. My
my buddies are steel workers, like old school metal forgers,
younger than me, but they do the old school way.
And I remember showing up at their their shot just raging.
I didn't know how I got there and just losing
losing my shit and I don't know I got here

(02:05:47):
and almost didn't and they're like whoa. And I learned
later they're like, oh dude, you scared us, right, So
this is during that process of what I'm weaning off of,
you know, when I went cold turkey on these medicines.
So they got me through it, you know, my wife
got me through it. And then you know, three weeks later,
I get on a plane to San Diego meet up
with this group and then to go down to Pest.

(02:06:09):
You wanted to go get this treatment.

Speaker 4 (02:06:11):
Jesus, that is fucking wild.

Speaker 2 (02:06:14):
I would have been. I would have been terrified. Yeahs oh, no,
doubt was one.

Speaker 8 (02:06:20):
Right.

Speaker 4 (02:06:20):
Now, We've been around somebody with a manic episode before
and it's like you really don't know how.

Speaker 2 (02:06:24):
To handle it.

Speaker 1 (02:06:24):
Yeah, Well, later, I asked them in there because I
remember it because I remember losing it. But they were like,
you know, I came back after healing, and then I
was like, hey, what what happened that day? Because I,
you know, recalled it and relived it in my in
my treatment. But they're like, oh god, you just get
shadows like and told me what happened. I'm like, oh god,
I'm like, you know, then I kept asking my wife

(02:06:45):
what else did I do? Right, Like, yeah, what what
did I do at home? You know? So it was
kind of one of those like funny but not funny,
but I'm like, oh God, like you kind of forget
how bad stuff was. But yeah, those they were they
were like, oh you scared us. Like they're working class,
their dudes, and they're like, we were frightened.

Speaker 4 (02:07:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:07:01):
Yeah, you can only imagine you're you're a guy saying
you're on a podcast. It this is prescribed, Rob, say
you're on a podcast. Tell them therapist? Is he gonna
kill me?

Speaker 5 (02:07:10):
No?

Speaker 2 (02:07:10):
Click? Hang up quick, cold turkey. We don't know what
kind of side effects are about to come out of
rock right right now?

Speaker 4 (02:07:15):
Yeah? So you okay, you fly to San Diego, you
meet up with Marcus Latrell and four or five other
high profile vets. Yeah, you guys getting a van head
down to TJ just south of TJ, Like are you
in the middle of the desert, Like talk me through
this entire process as if I'm going to go take
it as well, and you're giving me the map to it.

Speaker 1 (02:07:34):
Yeah. So it was it was full circle. So, you know,
I listened to all the Marcus's podcast and then I
get there and he's come out with this story. We've talked,
I've been on his pocket, We've talked about it, right,
So I'm not nothing that is not out there. But
I remember walking in. I'm like, holy shit, I'm out
of my mind right, Like I'm like just trying to
survive to get to the streatment course. Yes's Marcus a
trail and I remember going up to him like idiot, Hey,

(02:07:56):
I don't know if you like doing your podcast, but
it saved my life a few times, like listening to it,
and I remember looking at me and look back down
that was in I'm like, right, and so all these
these guys are in the same boat. I am right,
getting off all their They're sixty pack from the VA,
so getting a van driver us through Tijuana. You know,
we go to a you know, a gated kid it's
a nice spot, gated community. But we're going through Tijuana, right,

(02:08:19):
and now I'm like where it right? So now I'm
like kind of sobering up. And I'm like, you know,
so you go into these episodes to where you're out
of your mind, not thinking clearly to like I'm fine,
Like I'm not really like that, right, that stuff didn't happen.
I'm not you know, I'm not suicidal. I'm not this
and I'm driving through Mexico thinking where am I going?
Like again, I've taken it too far? Now I'm driving
through the hood of Mexico, right, and I get.

Speaker 2 (02:08:42):
Up your story even more?

Speaker 1 (02:08:43):
Right, I'm not I don't travel a ton, And I'm like,
I grew up in a small town and I live
in a small town. I'm not a world traveler, right,
so I haven't seen these other countries and I'm like,
oh my god, where are we going? So get take
us to the facility. It's a it's in a gated community.
It's a home, you know, it's just a normal house.
And then we walk in and it's it's like a
medical center. Right, there's part of it that looks like

(02:09:04):
a healing you know, like what you think of a
psychedelic treatment center. Then we go upstairs and it's lay down,
take a shirt off, blood test, make sure we're on nothing, EKG.
Checked to make sure your heart's healthy, you know, so
you know in the case we're lying, you know, right, yes,
because this medicine they've told us, right, this stuff can
counter counteract with things and it can kill you. Or
if you have a weak Herder heart problem, it's harder

(02:09:26):
on your heart.

Speaker 2 (02:09:26):
Right, and you're like three weeks cold turkey right.

Speaker 1 (02:09:28):
Right, right, right right, So you know, I'm scared. Now,
I'm scared, like what did I do? I'm taking this
too far again, right, So I'm now I'm beating myself
up again, Like what are you doing? You're in Mexico
in this random house with a bunch of Navy seals
and fighter PILs. You know, these guys, what am I doing?
Go through the process, you know, get checked in, they
do all these tests, and then we all sit down

(02:09:49):
and it's a you know, it's a therapy session, right,
It's like why are you here? Right? And it's for
whatever reason you know I wanted healing, and I was
very honest as were these other veterans about why they
were there, what they wanted to get rid of. Right,
that's part of this medicine is in any plant medicine
is you know, take this from me. And I remember
saying that take this rage from me, take this self hatred,

(02:10:10):
take all these things. Right, So there was ceremonies involved, Right,
So we do a fire ceremony. You write the stuff down,
you burn it, and then they hand you a cup
with some pills in it. Right, and it's it's this,
it's this medicine. It's a root bark. It's an African
root bark, and it's in a capsule and you know,
down the hatch. And then they take you upstairs to room.

(02:10:31):
There's five mattresses on the ground. Hook us up to
the EKGs, get us, you know, comfortable and and this
then then it starts, right waiting for the for the
for the medicine to kick in.

Speaker 2 (02:10:44):
What's the fear levels? Like as you throw it down
the hatchet, you go up, lay down on the bed.
It's like get comfortable. And at this point you're just
waiting for I don't even know what I'm.

Speaker 4 (02:10:55):
Because I'm thinking, like, uh, when I first envisioned this,
it's like you're in the desert Zakaria. Everyone's got like
a handler type of thing. You're running around different places,
but you're just laying down for this whole thing.

Speaker 1 (02:11:06):
It is this this medicine is very I mean it
melts you into the floor. There you can get up
and move. Not too many people are you're either getting
nauseous or but it is I mean, it literally feels
like it melts you into the floor. There's there's not
a lot of moving.

Speaker 4 (02:11:17):
And how quickly is this medicine taking place? Like are
you fasted at this point?

Speaker 1 (02:11:21):
Yes, so we had Neaton since breakfast that morning and
now you so that's a breakfast and then this is
eight o'clock at night and we're taking so you're fasted
and within an hour, you know, you start I start
hearing the buzzing. So I'm scared, Like I'll admit, I'm
in tears laying there like you know, I guess you
either fix me or kill me, right, because I wanted

(02:11:42):
healing at that point, right and to me, it was
the last ditch effort. I didn't know if this didn't work.
If I was going to make it, quite honestly, because
it'd just gotten bad again and I didn't know if
this wasn't the answer because I tried everything right, and
so that was my thought during this. Well, then you
start having the reaction to the medicine, right, so there's
and they tell you things that are gonna happen, but

(02:12:02):
like this buzzing and then these feelings, and I'm like,
and I don't like that, right, That's probably why I
hadn't you know, Dare worked with me, right, I was
scared of drugs. Yeah, and it's like this is you know,
I am very much like I like to control everything,
and now I'm out of control. So it was super scary,
and it is. It kicked in more and more. Right
now I'm panicking and like my heart's racing and I'm like,

(02:12:22):
I'm not going to die, and so all these things
and they're great, they work you through this. You have
therapy sessions before, they have coaching to tell you how
to deal with that, and so I just like, you know,
they had told us just be curious and just give
into it. So I just did this breathing stuff they
taught us. And then then the medicine fully kicked in,
and so now you know, you have eye shades over

(02:12:43):
your eyes. You're laying on the ground, and now different.
Now there's buzzing, and now there's now I'm seeing lights
and I'm like, holy shit, my first experience with psychedelics. Right,
So I'm seeing these lights coming in and then all
of a sudden, I see things. And they kept telling
us be curious. Right, So we have a therapist next
to you, right, and I'm like, you know, I'm seeing
this or They're like, just you know, be curious to

(02:13:03):
go look at it, you know, so in this mask,
and so I know, I'm take my mask off to
make sure I'm still in the room. Right, guys are
puking because a lot of guys purge, right, so they
had not a win on their part, but they had
little tin buckets for our puke buckets. So everything's super intense.
So all I hear is ding ding ding, you know, guys,
like it's like the most intense thing you've ever been

(02:13:23):
a part of. So you've got four other guys working
through stuff already in the medicine.

Speaker 4 (02:13:28):
You can obviously hear them talking about what they are
going through.

Speaker 1 (02:13:31):
Right, So this is everything. It's super intense. So then
I get fully into it, right, and I just remember,
you know, seeing, you know, hearing these things, seeing the lights. Right,
So I felt like I was up in space, like
with all these lights coming at me like the stars.
And then all of a sudden there was like these
movies and I'm watching this movie. So it was this
continual movie flying through space of my life, like different things, right.

(02:13:54):
And I didn't have I didn't have childhood trauma like
I have a great family, I have great parents. Did
I get a whooping every now and then because I
deserved it?

Speaker 2 (02:14:03):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (02:14:04):
So I'm not working through child abuse or sexual abuse right,
like some of these veterans are right. But it was
just more a story of my life, whether it was football,
whether it was Iowa, whether it was a prose, whether
it was different things. I'm watching this movie float through
the sky, which sounds crazy unless you've done it. But
it was this continual show right going through this. I

(02:14:25):
remember watching him like why is it showing me this?
And then I'd grab stuff. I'm like, oh that was sweet.
You know Iowa, when we beat Michigan at Michigan, I'll
take that kept up my heart may or may not
have been in there, but things like that, right, stuff
that I'd grab and I'd throw it to my throat,

(02:14:46):
to my heart, and I want to keep that. It
makes me feel good, right, And then I'd grab stuff
out of the movie and I'd sling it out in
the universe, and I just remember that that reel just
floating off into space. So I'm watching all this stuff
and it's right, and you're like, is this for real? Right?
So you're in and out of it, go through that
for which seemed like hours. Then there's a point I

(02:15:06):
don't remember anything. I'm like, I must have fallen asleep
whatever it was. I wake up the next morning, So
this is twelve hours later. Right, You're in this trip
for ten to twelve hours? Holy shit, so wake up,
like what time is it? Right? Well, instantly I thought
nothing happened, because in that moment, I couldn't remember anything,
and I'm like, I fucked this up too, Like first

(02:15:26):
thing I said, I'm like I screwed this up to
like I'm a failure again. And then I go to
get up right, And that was the instant feeling because
I didn't recall all of these things like instantly, and
then I go to get up and now I start
throwing up. I can't get up, like my legs don't work.
Like I'm like, oh, I messed myself up, like again

(02:15:46):
failure right, Like trying to get up to go to
the bathroom because ID lay there for twelve hours, couldn't
function my legs. They put me in a wheelchair, rolled
me to the bathroom, and go to the bathroom. So
I'm living through this that morning, finally things start coming around.
But I'm definitely sick all day, throwing up all day,
could not function. But things started coming back. I'm like,
the real part came back to me because I feel

(02:16:08):
a little bit better now and I'm remembering, like, holy crap.
So I'm writing in my journal as they tell us
to remember all these things I saw. I threw this away.
I kept this. What was that? So you're trying to
process these things you remember that happened. So that second
day is a gray day, right, they're getting IV's, you're
super hydra. Gray is like a down day. It's a
you're gonna just feel gray, right, You're gonna you're gonna

(02:16:29):
feel sick like it is. It is physically. The medicine
is physically demanding on you physically and mentally, but it's
physically demanding high heart rate all night, you know, for
twelve hours of your heart beating super fast. You're dealing
with So it's you're gonna feel like crap, right, that's it.
So that's why they call it the gray day. Gotcha,
So do nothing that day, try and get some food in.
I just feel deathly sick. Finally able to get up

(02:16:51):
and somewhat walk that night, go down and have a
little suit. There's a picture of all of us and
I just looked like death warmed over, right, and go
to bed, get up the next morning and then that day.
So now we do the second medicine, which is five
me o d MT. So they like pairing it with
ibagain and five me o because they say the IBA
gain like defrags your brain does all this healing, and

(02:17:12):
the five me e o is more of a spiritual,
a spiritual trip you take to deal stuff, loss of ego.
Do you experience death right? More things? I'm like, So
I get through this iby gain and now it's the
next morning and you smoke five d NTU smoke right,
it's toad poison. It comes from derived from a toad,
a poisonous tote.

Speaker 4 (02:17:32):
Yeah, called DNT like blasting off right, It's like a
rocket ship sending you into space.

Speaker 1 (02:17:36):
Yes, uh, And so now I'm scared again.

Speaker 2 (02:17:38):
I'm like, yeah, I gotta go on another fucking drift
good death drug.

Speaker 4 (02:17:42):
Right, like they say, like the last that seven seconds
of your life or whatever that you recall everything like,
that's d MT. That's a chemical thing that comes off
in your body.

Speaker 1 (02:17:51):
So they had talked to us about this, and so
I'm scared again, right, I'm like, I feel deathly sick
from the iby gain, still feel terrible, and I'm just
like what am I doing right? And they're telling us, Okay,
we're gonna like the pipe, you know, it's a crap
pipe looking thing, and I'm like, what am I doing right?
But I just feel so terrible leading into it. I'm like,
this part of it, right, just trust the process, and

(02:18:12):
so go in. We go in one at a time,
and they do. They light it, and I mean it
like you say, rocket ship, It sends you, right. It
took a drag, went back, wasn't all there? Asked for more?
Got up took the second drag, and it was, like
you said, they call it the you know, the the
death draw. I mean you I experienced death like I

(02:18:32):
went to I went fully out. I came out of
my body. I was not in that room where I began.
I felt. I could tell I was in the room
for the most part, right, I could feel the floor.
This was an out of body experience. I went to
the white light, right, And they had talked about this
and I never believed it. But I'm like, oh, I'm dying.
This is it? Like to me? It was what death was.

Speaker 4 (02:18:51):
What are your emotions while you were going towards this
white light? Are you actually like, is the feeling of
death in this moment like high anxiety, fear or is
it more more of like a freeing feeling?

Speaker 1 (02:19:01):
It was free? It was. It was the most beautiful
thing ever. Right, really, I remember floating. I like to
up to what you know. I was born and raised Catholic.
I you know, I have a vision of what my
God is and and what death is. But it was
that exact thing. Go into the white light. Oh this
is it. I mean, I was so freeing, and so
I get to get to the white light and and

(02:19:22):
you know, my God is there and I'm talking to God,
and all of a sudden, I lose it and I'm like,
I'm a failure, I'm a piece of shit, I'm a
terrible father, I'm a terrible husband. Send me to hell.
And I'm screaming at him, right so I'm like, I
don't deserve to be in heaven. And then he's like,
you need to talk to her. And then my wife
appeared from behind him, and I'm screaming at her, telling
her the same things, and all of a sudden, it

(02:19:43):
was just calm, and this weight was lifted off me.
And I figured out was like my ego because they
talk about ego loss, like literally, this something left my
body and I was like, oh, I do like instantly,
I deserve to be here. I'm a good father, I'm
a good husband, i had a good career, all these things.
This negative self tough was gone. And then it was

(02:20:04):
this overwhelmingly peaceful feeling. I'm like, oh, I wish I
would have known this, but now I'm dead, but I
was super peaceful. Well then I came back into right.
I feel myself back on the floor and I'm coming
out of it and I'm like, wow, right in my life.
I remember asking like am I dead? And they're like, oh,
You're not dead, buddy. But it was this overwhelming feeling

(02:20:24):
of freedom, clarity, and came out of it, and it
was the most enlightening thing you've ever seen. Like it's
unless you've experienced it. And this is not just me, right,
there's talk to people who have gone through it. Is
the most enlightening thing you've ever seen. And so came
out of it, go back in the room, and I
just felt like I was instantly back right that sick

(02:20:45):
feeling I had twenty minutes earlier. Now I'm just like
bright eyed. There's no ringing, I don't feel like, I
don't feel sick, I don't feel any of those negative effects.
And I literally felt like like I could go run
a marathon. I remember walking back in the room, right,
and all the other guys are looking at me because
I went last, and I'm like, I'm back, bitches, That's
exactly what I said. I'm like, I'm back right. So

(02:21:07):
it was the hearing things and like after coming out
of it, they sit you in the grass to like
come back, and I remember touching the grass right and
feeling the energy from the earth, and I'm like, what
is all this? Right? I could hear everything. I could
hear the birds, I could hear the ocean that was
two miles away. I felt like I was in the
movie Big where the grass was like super tall around me,

(02:21:28):
like I was a midget, and I could hear all
the grass rustling and all these sensations and things that
I could hear and feel. I was like, oh, and
I didn't know it at the point, but I'm just like,
holy cow, this is amazing. Go back in the room,
talk to the guys, and everybody's just like right, and
you're enlightened. So something worked, right, right, So get through that.

(02:21:50):
But I definitely I was like, oh, something's different. We
went to the beach and we did for a walk
as a group. I remember watching the waves, one wave
at a time. I'm like, man, I am something's going on.
I can see every single wave turning in the water,
like the droplets coming off it, and I'm like, am
I still high? Like no, this is like you're in
the moment, you're you know, so someone You're like, yeah, whatever, hippie, right,
But I was like, whatever is this is great? I

(02:22:12):
remember turning to Marcus and like saying to him, like, hey,
I'm supposed to be worrying about something. I'm worried and
I'm supposed to be worrying about something, but I'm not
worrying right, just babbling. Yeah, because it was clear. Everything
was clear. There was nothing nothing in my head. It
was complete clarity. And then so next day we drive
back to San Diego. My wife came and met me

(02:22:33):
down there with some of the other wives and walked
into the restaurant and we met on Matt that we
originally left from, and she says, you know, when she
walked in, she's like, I knew something was different. She's like,
I could see your eyes. Your eyes were wide open,
they were bright white, because she had said it that
in the past. She's like, your eyes were just dead,
like you just he had no life in your eyes.

(02:22:53):
You were always tired. And she's like, I knew instantly
something was different. And she's like I could to see
it the way you guys are all giggle in and
laughing and like these grown badass men like hugging each
other and crying and just she's like, you guys were
so happy and so fast forward. We stayed in San Diego,
San Diego for a couple of days to reintegrate, because
they talk about that, right, you're gonna have this life

(02:23:15):
changing experience and you got to reintegrate, Like, may not
be the best thing to go back home to kids,
right initially, So we spent a couple of days in
San Diego and we just started learning. She noticed it
more I notice it now or I recall it now,
but noticing things that happened that were different. So I
had a therapy session the second day I was back,
get on my computer won't connect to the internet. Now,

(02:23:37):
if that had happened pre treatment, that computer probably wouldn't
have made it through it. I probably would have been
broken against a wall, right, because you're a loser. You're
a piece of shit. If you're late to a meeting,
you guys, I'm sure have PTSD like that about I
do being late anything. Yeah, And so I'm I just
remember trying to get onto it, and I'm like, okay,
it must be something, right, and my wife's running around

(02:24:00):
like a maniac, and I'm like I remember thinking like
what is going on? She came and grabbed the computer,
took off out the door. I just remember sitting there.
I'm thinking, like, man, what's going on with her? She
comes back. I ended up getting on my phone. I
was three minutes late and there was no big deal.
I'd do my therapy session with the lady and I
got off and I said, hey, what's going on. She's like,

(02:24:21):
what do you mean? And I'm like, you run around
like a crazy person, right, And she's like And I
remember her just looking at me like what are you
talking about? Like, and she later said like if that
would have happened in the past, like, do you know
what would have happened? Do you know what your action
would have been? Do you know how you what you
would have done to that computer? Or what you would
have said to me? And so things like that started happening.
We fly back home, come in the house. You know,

(02:24:43):
my wife had warned the kids, hey, dad might be different. Well,
six hours later, I'm on the floor whipping them around
in their sweatshirts, you know, slinging them around like mops,
creating chaos like you wouldn't, you know, screaming and yelling.
And I'm down there tickling them and I remember looking
at her and she's I remember the look on her
face shoes, just like, mouth wide open, like what in
the hell is going on? Didn't recalled in the moment.

(02:25:05):
I remember her reaction, but I didn't really put anything
whatever right playing with the kids. And so time goes on, days, weeks, months,
and my reactions are different. And for me personally, there's
no there's no brain fog, I'm super clear, no bringing
in my ears. There's zero suicide stuff, there's zero depression,
there's zero anxiety. I'm like going to pick the kids

(02:25:26):
up at school with my wife and talking to the
other moms and the dads, and she was like, you
haven't You've never done this? Yeah right. I was the
guy that sat in the car and waited for the
kid to come get in. I didn't want to interact
with anybody. And so I'm just a different human being.
And so as time goes on, we learn more and
more things.

Speaker 2 (02:25:43):
Now, are you getting back into the routines of like
the cold tub and hyperbaric.

Speaker 1 (02:25:48):
And yeah, so I had a lot of that stuff,
but I added a lot of stuff because they teach
you that through this too. It's like, hey, you know meditation,
you should learn to meditate, right, That's a big part
of being in the moment and helping this treatment stick.
So I'm trying to learn how to meditate. Right I'm
doing and I got right back into my routune up early.
But I loved it. It wasn't for survival. It was you know,
it's because I wanted to do it made me feel good.

(02:26:09):
Cold tub was great. I you know, would go for
a walk and be like stoked to be alive. Right
before I went, I was training for a five k
because my buddy and I said we're going to do it,
and he's the one that ended up taking his life.
But I'm like, oh, I'm going to follow through on this.
So I'm out running and remember acrossing the street and
looking at the trees, like, man, the treats are so
beautiful and green and everything was vibrant, and oh that

(02:26:30):
Semi stopped for me. Right I'm across the street where
in the past, I'm like, you know, that same instance
happened before I went, and I would stop there and
be like, Okay, it'll look like an accident. Just step
out in the road because Semi's not going to stop.

Speaker 2 (02:26:42):
That's crazy.

Speaker 1 (02:26:42):
So it's a complete same instances are happening, and it's
a different reaction. I'm like, oh that's weird. This is great.
So just all those things start happening. The clarity, Like
if pre treatment I was forgetting my kids names, I'd
be like, what's she doing? She said, what are you
talking about?

Speaker 2 (02:26:58):
Like her?

Speaker 1 (02:26:59):
What's her name? It's like Hayden, you know. So those
things are happening. And now I'm like I'm crisp, Like
I'm up every morning and I go for a bike
ride and i go wake surfing and then I'm like
I'm going to do this and like I'm just high
on life. So this happens, you know, for three four months, right,
and I remember the first day I got my first anxiety.

(02:27:19):
I'm like, oh, what is that? You know I was anxious, right,
it wasn't a big deal with something small. It's like, oh,
I'm nervous to go to this thing. Right, So over
time things started popping back in, right, But I had
this new thought process of things, and so fast forward, right,
because this is not this medicine is not a magic pill.
It's not you know, it took multiple times for me,

(02:27:39):
so now we're in it. You know, things started coming back.
Then I started having some ideation again. I got COVID
and took the whatever the pill is for COVID that
has you know they say on there it can have
a metallic taste. So I remember having my first suicide nightmare.
I had COVID, took this medicine. I remember waking up
gripping my neck because I had thought I had a
gun in my mouth because of the metallic taste from
the medicine. So it was my first suicide nightmare again.

(02:28:02):
So I went originally twenty twenty one. Now we're pushing
close to twenty twenty three. Things have popped back in.
I'm not near as bad as I was, but still
having some of the old.

Speaker 4 (02:28:12):
Sea starting to see something, this old programming come back there.

Speaker 1 (02:28:14):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (02:28:15):
How long? How long did you have the residual from
the trip? Like nothing clarity.

Speaker 1 (02:28:22):
Fell like four months of absolutely nothing, I'm talking no anxiety,
the most high in life. And then then at about
a year little things started popping back in, right, some
of the anger stuff started coming back, some of the
uncontrollable outburst or you know, like I said, jump my
Harley and go ninety mile an hour into town. Christmas My,
you know, I don't talk about this a lot but

(02:28:44):
Christmas before twenty twenty three, my parents were out and
I remember taking my son for a haircut and I
was in the truck and I'm like, Mom and Dad,
I'm struggling again. And I said, I if I if
I mess up, because at this point it wasn't like, oh,
this is how I'm gonna make it go away. But
I'm like, I'm gonna screw up. I screw up on
my hardley. I'm going to screw up and I'm kill myself.
I'm going to screw up. And I'm very much with it,

(02:29:05):
and I've learned a lot of things. And I told
my parents, Hey, you guys were great parents. If I
mess up and kill myself, it's not your fault. Right.
So I was back in that bad spot again. Yeah,
And so was it as bad. It wasn't as bad.
It wasn't near as bad. But when you've been to
super clarity and then things come back, it's like the
first day, it feels way heavier. And it wasn't before.
It was all the time, So I could deal with

(02:29:27):
it all the time. I was in that mindset all
the time. Now it was a little bit here, a
little bit there, but it seems more intense. So I
go back for treatment again twenty twenty three, So that's
two years from my first one very similar experience on
iby game. I thinks super sick. I felt like it,
you know, defrag did things. I worked through some stuff,

(02:29:47):
a lot of the same visions, new visions. Then the
real turning point for me was the next day the
five MEO DMT again. So I smoke the fivemeo and
I die. I saw that I'd killed myself. It wasn't
this peaceful death that I saw the first time. I
messed up and I killed myself right whether it wasn't

(02:30:08):
necessarily suicide. It was a vision of me on my
Harley right weaving through cars, and I'm watching that, and
I killed myself, And then I saw what it did
to my family. I'm watching down from the sky now
I'm up at that I'd gone to that killed myself,
went to the white light. I'm watching down. I see
what it did to my family. So I'm watching my
kid's age and I'm seeing how it messed them up.
I'm seeing what it did to my wife, because before

(02:30:29):
I left for this second treatment, I had told my
wife again I'm a burden like, and I got back
to that mindset that you're better off without me, unfortunately,
and so it showed me in this I saw what
it did to them, and I was like, oh god,
this is not right. I remember thinking like, oh, I'm
going to mess them up, right, and that's sounds like
a crazy person, but I didn't think that before. I

(02:30:52):
thought I gotten back to this old Robert right even
you know, maybe not all the time, So this is
going to mess them up. And then I saw what
it actually did to them. Woke up out of this.
I actually started throwing up, so I reacted to the
you know, and I think I woke up kind of
towards the end of this trip, and so I thought
I died. So they're cleaning my mouth right, some puke

(02:31:13):
and they're cleaning my mouth out, and I start raging
because I thought, I literally think I'm dead. I'm like,
this is hell, like I whatever it was, I was
in a spot I thought I was dead, and I
grabbed the therapist and I'm raging streaming and I'm like,
I eft up my family, I'm a you know, streaming
and just I'm throwing them on the ground and just
complete rage. And I remember my female therapist was there

(02:31:35):
that we work with, and I grabbed here and I'm like,
you got to call my wife tell him. I'm tell
her I'm sorry. So I think I'm dead. I'm back
on Earth, out of this trip, but I'm still half
in it, I think. But I literally thought I was dead,
and so this happens. I later found out. I raged
for like twenty minutes, and they're calming me down, and
some things happened, and finally I calmed down and realized

(02:31:57):
I was back on Earth and I wasn't actually dead,
but I can asking them like did I die? Did
you guys resuscitate me? It was that profound uh. And
so I come out of it and I was just
in shock. So we're before it was blissful, and this
time I was like, I mean I was in shock
for hours, even till we got back. I got back
home and I'm telling my wife about it, and I'm like,
I think they're lying to me. I think they had

(02:32:18):
to resuscitate me, like I pushed it too far. And
so as I process all this, but what I what
did stick and the rewiring the medicine, what it did
do is that it made me, see what would happen
if I did screw up and did take my life
in one way or another, And that is stuck with
me since that day, Like if something pops up, now,
I know full well on my worst day, I'm better

(02:32:40):
off here and my family's better off without me, or
is better with me. Even the days. You know, if
I have a bad day or I get angry and
that stuff doesn't happen since then you know it happens
like we happens when you're a dad, and you know
the normal angry exactly.

Speaker 4 (02:32:55):
If anybody's watching this and plaything and I'm assuming this,
you can tell me if I'm wrong. But like you're
not going to take this medicine. All your issues are
always going to be fixed, but you're going to have
better tools and better understanding of where your value is
in life exactly.

Speaker 1 (02:33:07):
Yeah, and these like this instance for me is like, oh,
I'm I'm you know I and I didn't believe it before,
and I truly believe it even you know, no matter
what happens, right, even worst case I never want to happen,
I get dementia, I'm better off here. My family needs me, right,
And so that's what this experience showed me. And so
since then it's been you know, I have the tools
now and it rewired some things. They're showing that, you know,
I begained specifically actually scientifically rewires your brain. Right, it's

(02:33:32):
growing new white brain matter. So doctor Nolan Williams, you know,
God rest his soul, he has passed since this study,
but he did a study with thirty vets special ops
vets and improving it. Right, That's a big part of
this movement with this medicine. It's actually proving not only
the spiritual part, but it is you know, creating new
neural pathways. It is actually fixing brain damage or working

(02:33:55):
around it. Right, some of my damage is still there,
but I'm creating new neural pathways around it. And so
knowing all this on top of the spiritual stuff, since then,
I have the tools, and I know I knew after
these treatments that my something was working on my brain.
I mean for days afterwards, I would in months or weeks,
I could just feel like a buzzing in my head. Right,
I'm like something, something's working up there right, right, and

(02:34:16):
then I notice all the again, all the emotional changes.
And so since twenty twenty three, Right, none of that stuff
has really come back, right, Like, yes, do I get anxious?
Yes do I It is not the magic pill, but
I have the tools, right, I know now to right
if something pops in, it's like nope, I see that
vision of what it did to my family, right, And
I don't have these over the top reactions like I

(02:34:37):
did before the brain fog and that stuff has gone.
Do I still have days I get a little brain fog? Yes? Right,
you know late, you know, sure, like you guys, you're
like late in the day, it's like, oh wow, that's
something's not working right, you know. But for the most
part before it was twenty four to seven. Now I'm
super clear, right to get talking fast because I'm like,
I'm just crisped and everything's working good. And so I

(02:34:58):
know not only the scientific part of it, but the
spiritual part of it. I know I'm a different human being.
And my wife will still bring stuff up, you know,
some huff and I'll get frustrated be like, oh, I
overreacted on that, and I'm very aware, right, Oh, I
shouldn't reacted like She's like your son just walked out
in the street and almost got hit by a car
when we were, you know, instance, going to our get

(02:35:19):
on our boat, and I grabbed him and I lit
into him like you gotta right, And then I felt bad.
I'm like, oh, the old Robert's back and she's like,
that's what a dad should do. That is a normal reaction. Yeah,
And so she's like, no, you're She brings it up
to me all the time. She's like, you know, I
can she can trust me to take the kids to
soccer practice, basketball practice and not worry about me one

(02:35:42):
forgetting where I'm at or two having a reaction around people.
So it's daily stuff happens. And you know the fact
that I flew here by myself, She's like, just a
little step like that. Five years ago, you couldn't do that.
I would have had to be with you because you
would either lost at the airport, you know, I wouldn't
have forgot where you were, whatever these things were. So

(02:36:04):
it's that my life is different now because of the
tools I have, and I know that some of the
work it's done right. I went through the some of
the you know, you guys will find it funny, but
I went through some of the brain concussion stuff pre
pre medicine and post medicine. Right, so I pre medicine,
I'm doing, you know, jump through the hoops right all right,

(02:36:26):
you know the ten years of stuff they make you
jump through to try and get something out of it.
And I finally was like, I don't care. I don't
care about this, you know. So I had had a
couple of doctor's appointments pre medicine and a couple post medicine.
So I come back post medicine and it is I'm like,
you know, pre medicine, I'm talking about you know, suicide
and talking about these things, and post medicine, my my

(02:36:48):
scores are better, My everything's better. And they're like, oh,
you don't qualifying. Of course I don't, right, But at
that point didn't care because I I mean, that showed
me because some of my scores and some of the
things that happened pre and post. I'm like, I'm definitely
a different person. My scores are better, Like I cleared
my recall and it's kind of funny, but I'm also like,
of course, of course I went and did something else then. Yeah,

(02:37:10):
And you know a lot of guys do it, you know,
want the money or want the because they deserve it.
But I was just like, I just I want to
be healthy. So I kind of laughed it off, and
it's like, oh, this is showing me now on top
of everything else that that I am, things are fixed
or drastically better.

Speaker 2 (02:37:25):
Yeah. Have you gotten a brain scan since the first
one you got where it was like you look like
somebody took a baseball bat to it?

Speaker 1 (02:37:32):
I did the part where So my initial brain scan
was a spec scan. It's called a spec scan, right,
which measures It gives you a three D image. It
measures the surface of your brain pretty much things that
are living or not living. So it measures electrical current
in your brain, it measures blood flow. What they are
finding out. So I got the same scan afterwards, thinking oh,

(02:37:54):
I'll see it drastically better. But what I learned is
that's not the correct scan to do that. Now does
that measure damage? Absolutely, But they're learning, and this is
where this medicine is new. These neurologists are learning that
that scan for whatever reason, there's been a few people
like me, it doesn't show a drastically better brain. Now
why is that? Well, depression all these things is inflammation.

(02:38:18):
So I had huge inflammation on my brain. So that's
why certain parts were lit up, and then it shows
the dead parts. I begain takes inflammation away, so now
some of this actually some of it looks worse or
the same because I have less inflammation. It's not actually
creating the surface of a new those areas that were damaged.
It's the internal stuff. So a long winded way of

(02:38:39):
answering that is. And fMRI actually looks deep into the brain.
That's what doctor Nolan Williams used at Stanford, and they
can see the new white brain matter. They can see
the new neural pathways. So I'm messed up, which I
can accept now, right, So right, you're.

Speaker 2 (02:38:54):
Thinking, damn, I WISHONA had this scan or MRI before,
so you can actually see for sure whether it's rewire.

Speaker 1 (02:39:00):
Or exactly the actual where they can sign and they
did it in the study from Stanford. You can look
at the study and it shows the brain new areas internally,
where mine was more the surface of how is everything
currently working. It's not the in depths of new things starting.
So long story short, it was kind of a bummer,
but it was also that's why I didn't want to
get another one, because I'm like, I know, I feel better,

(02:39:22):
and at the end of the day it was the
wrong scan to do. It was right to figure out
the damage, but the neurologe say, hey, we don't understand
it either, right, for whatever reason, the psychedelics part of it,
because of the infamation. This is not the right scan.
This is more of a surface level where the fMRI
goes deep into it, which I am going to get
at some point, but it would have been nice to
have a baseline. But you look at these the study

(02:39:43):
they did and they have pre imposed fMRI and it's
black and white on there that there is new stuff
growing and that that's that's the standard for what you.

Speaker 2 (02:39:52):
Need from the psychedelics. There isn't there somebody that put like,
what was it, like fifty million dollars toward a Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:40:00):
Through this process, I became, you know, the military community
became my old football family, right. So you know, Marcus
is a very close friend. We talked almost daily. He's
just a guy that we check in. It's you know,
telling stories. O, Hey, this happened and I used to
react like this. Guess what I did? I laughed, right,
like just stuff to We talk about how we used

(02:40:20):
to be now we're different. Our wives talk. But through
the community I met and Marcus dam Or Capone with
VET Solutions. They started really they treated, they've treated a
couple thousand guys now right, and it's and I'm not
talking at works for a couple. I mean, you could
bring of the two thousand they've tested. You bring almost
all two thousand in here, and you're gonna hear the

(02:40:41):
same story, really right, one level or another, sometimes one treatment,
sometimes two took two for me, but you're gonna hear
the same story. It is. The results are astounding. And
so I got introduced to some people you know, with
this study through Stanford and then they started going A
group put together to go to Texas, were trying to
get money from Texas to study it. So former Governor

(02:41:03):
of Texas, Rick Perry, he asked me to be involved.
He's heading all this or was. So we were in
Texas working with politicians, legislators and they signed a bill
and again I'm a small lego in this thing, but
gave my story. They signed a bill that put fifty
million dollars towards the study of ibegame for PTSD TBI addiction.

(02:41:24):
It's choose on addiction. I haven't drank since my first
treatment in twenty twenty one. Haven't had a drop of alcohol.
I have zero interest in having any alcohol. It is,
so it's huge for addiction. So they originally started using
IBA gain with heroin addicts. They still do, like eighty
some percent of heroin addicts will go through this treatment
and not touch heroin again. So it's huge, huge for addiction.

(02:41:47):
You know, Marcus, these guys were on numerous right, they
call it the military sixty pack right of antidepressants, all
these things. The majority of them are not on any
of their pills. A ton of these guys don't drink.
Marcus has never drank again. Right, There's tons of stories
like mine. So Texas put the money sign that bill
here a few months ago, so they're going to start
studying it. They're going to do trials on veterans, on

(02:42:10):
athletes to try and get this pass because it is
currently a Schedule one drug, right, it's so there's that
loophole to jump through to get it off Schedule one.
So they're got that money, and then we started the
which I'm a part of, also is the American I
Begain Initiative. So other states now are trying to pull
fronts from their state to study it so there's scientific

(02:42:31):
proof and they want to continue it to show Hey,
this is just not a spiritual drug. This is not
what everyone thinks it is. This is a medicine that
will drastically help people's mental health and help fix parts
of their TBI, like it did me and has done
other guys. So there's lots of things going on within

(02:42:52):
this realm of this medicine that there's not a there's
not a stigma of the you know, psilocybin or ayahuasca.
There's because it's so unknown. But that's why we're having,
you know, having success and things like that. And that's
what brought me to create my foundation, which is Athletes
for Care. And so I saw all these veterans and

(02:43:15):
I saw what I was doing for them. I saw
what it did for me, and going through this couple
of year process, you know, I was like, I want
to help guys. Because I finally opened up after healing,
called a couple of my friends that I disappeared for
like ten years, right, guys I played with and like, hey, sorry,
you know, I just was going through some stuff. Here's
what happened. And like Oh. So then I had guys

(02:43:35):
reaching out, hey I'm going through this, or I the
anger part resonated with me, like what's that like? Or
the suicide stuff, And so I'm like, man, I could
help people, right, right, because I'm not the you know,
I thought I was the only guy, right, I'm the
only NFL football player that got done. Yep. Well I'm
the only guy out there going through this, right, and
I don't want no one else wants to hear about it, right,

(02:43:57):
And so I started having these stories and I'm like
I want to help, right because I'm like that in
my wife's like, you know, saved our saved your life,
saved our marriage, it saved you know, saved you like
you're back as a human being. And so started Athletes
for Care. And what we want to do is, you know,
be a voice for athletes. I want you know, we're
doing this storytelling because that I went on Marcus's podcast. Right,

(02:44:20):
the outreach we got from that, we get guys, ex
athletes and all sports calling like, hey, this is me, right,
the same thing you talking. I think it's me, you know,
whether it's all the stuff, some of the stuff, So
educating athletes that hey there are other options. And I'm
not saying I begin as the magic pill, everyone should
go do it, but when other things don't work, it's

(02:44:40):
an option. It's another modality of something that can help.
It helped me. I can show you two thousand other
guys that it helped drastically, and so we want to
be a resource, and I want to be a resource
for these guys. And I've had more and more people
reach out and I'm sure, like you guys, I know
these guys. Right. There's guys we played with that you
see around town or you see at an event and

(02:45:03):
you're like, dude's got a screw loose. Yeah, right, And
it's not I don't mean to make it funny, but
there's they're either coping with alcohol or drugs. And I've
been around these guys and I'm like, oh man, they
need this medicine. Because these guys you play.

Speaker 4 (02:45:16):
With and you look at them and you'll have like
a concerning conversation with like a teammate, being like that's
a guy you have to worry about after football, Like
a lot of guys you have to worry about. But
some guys just even when they're playing, You're like, I
can see where something could happen there for sure.

Speaker 1 (02:45:30):
Yeah, and you know, and it's not always right. I
was pre pre this healing, you see. And it's unfortunate
like these guys that make the news because they do
something drastic, right, whether it's suicide or hurting right, you know,
hurting their neighbor or there's been instances of that to
where you're like, this dude's lost his rocker right right
now you look at it, and I'm like, check his brain, right,

(02:45:51):
and a lot of it now they are checking their brain.
So it's TBI related issues, right, they raged anger a
lot of stuff. And so being able to tell the
story and be a resource for these people that are
going through what I did. Yeah, it's not fun, right,
sit here and tell you the stories about my kids
and those things, right, but it's healing for me and
the amount of people that it is, Like, dude, you

(02:46:12):
saved my life by talking about it because you were
you know, strong enough to like put your shit out there, right,
like thank you. And so that's that's why I continue
to do this with athletes for Care because there are
lots of guys that are suffering, and there's you know,
there's there's ways of healing. And that's why I want
to be help push this medicine forward and just be

(02:46:33):
a resource for guys. Hey, maybe maybe I begain isn't
for you, but hey, won't you try this right once't
you try the cold waterer therapy. Won't you try these
breathing exercises?

Speaker 2 (02:46:41):
Right?

Speaker 1 (02:46:42):
I'm I've turned into a super focused hippie, right because
you know, like you, we've talked about it, the the
longevity stuff. Right. I get up and I do breathing exercises.
They want to Jane, and it's there's so many things
you can do. But that medicine for me got me
years ahead and I know, fix some stuff. But now
I'm addicted, right, I'm addicted to doing those things and

(02:47:04):
I do. I get up at four in the morning,
I go get my cold sub, I do my meditation,
I do my breathing, I do my workout, I do
my hyperbaric chamber. I know these tools. If I walk
into a gym and I get activated because it's loud,
I'm still I don't like chaos, right, That's who I am.
I'm very straightforward as a dad, as a coach, as
a person. But I walk in and I get activated
because you know, everyone's not us. I don't know how

(02:47:26):
you guys are with your kids. I'm guessing we're very similar, right,
this is not a free for all. Right, kids act
a certain way right walking to a gym and people
are bouncing off the walls and no judgment on their parenting.
But it activates me. Right. But now it's not this
over the top activation that I have to leave the gym.
It's like, I'm okay, not my kids. It's not my problem.
My kids are doing what they're supposed to do. I

(02:47:47):
can walk in, I can sit down. I cannot be
up there shaking because of the reaction. And so I know,
sitting here to watch my daughter and enjoy what she's
doing or whatever one of my kids I'm watching, or
if we're coaching. Now I'm coaching, and you know, with
my wife, we're coaching basketball. We're about to start the
high school basketball season, coaching girls. And it's the greatest
thing in the world. I couldn't have done that five years show.

Speaker 4 (02:48:08):
When you talk about being your vulnerable state and saving
as many people, there's like you hear a lot of
stories about people who have gone through processes either similar
to yours or whatever, and how they've you know, changed
so many people's lives. Has your wife ever told her
side of the story and been vulnerable in those senses
because you talk about you know, as you're telling me
this story, I'm thinking, like, it's amazing the amount of

(02:48:29):
growth you've had and how you're very humble sitting on
this bus talking about these hard times that I've had
and this is the process that it took, and this
is where I'm at now, And I just think about
your wife and as you come out of this first
medicine and she's singing a different version of you, there's
probably a bunch of stones that haven't been on turned
for her of like different things that maybe you did

(02:48:50):
that she hasn't healed from, and there's a process for
her to heal through. Has she ever been able to
kind of tell her side of the story and these things?

Speaker 1 (02:48:56):
It's funny you ask. We just did it. We went
to Iowa that week, did some mental health work with
the Athletic department with current student athletes, you know, not
regarding psychedelics, just more mental health in general. Met with
the psychiatric department. We're collabing with them at the University
of Iowa. But we sat down and she had a
couple hour interview and it's the first time she's told

(02:49:17):
her story. She's given tidbits on different things that she's
people she spoke to with different articles that they'd done
on me. But we have that in the pipeline to
come out. Because I took a good friend of mine
from Iowa. He played in the league. He was struggling
and I talked to him about this two years ago,
and about a year and a half ago he reached out.
He's like, I need help, I want I need to

(02:49:38):
go do this. So I went down with him to
Mexico just to hold space. And I remember, this is
when it hit me, like you said, because I was
down there and I called my wife and said, hey,
can you call such and such as wife and kind
of tell her what's going to be like when they
get back, because remember how much we struggled, right, because
she was she was for a long time. She was like, oh,

(02:49:58):
it's great, you're fixed. Awesome, right, Like I've been living
through all this stuff and it's awesome.

Speaker 4 (02:50:04):
She has multiple years of going through all these things.

Speaker 1 (02:50:07):
Yeah, so she you know, that's when it hit me.
I was like, we need to if she wants to,
and she did. She's willing to tell it because it's
the wives and the kids that go through it. And
so she called my buddy's wife and and it was
great because she wasn't really into him going down there.
She's like, what is Robert doing? Like they're going to
make he's taking him to Mexico? Do drugs? Trust us? Right? Well,

(02:50:28):
then he gets home and I waited. I didn't want
to call an ask how's he doing. A week later,
get a call from our text It's like, I'm sorry,
I didn't believe in this when you left. He is
a different person. Thank you so much and the stuff
you told me. And then we were like, okay, well,
now here's this going to happen, right, You're gonna get
some resentment coming up, just like my wife did. And

(02:50:48):
she did. She called my wife and was like, yep,
it's there, he's fixed. It's all great. You know, tell
me to relax. Yeah, right, because I'm the one reacting now.
So it's a big part of this whole story, is
the entire part of it. And that's what Marcus and
Amber Capone did for me at Vets They are my
best friends now one of my best friends because they

(02:51:09):
took that call from me, right, And that's why I
want to help other guys. And it's just another it's
a way of of healing, right, because we all have
our issues, right, We're always going to have our issues. Right.
But and it's not not that it's not everyone in
the world, but you know, athletes especially right, you come
out of being what we were and the identity and
all these things, and like we're full bore, you know.

(02:51:29):
So I want to start with that and help guys,
you know, get healing. And that's you know, this is
how I know how to do it.

Speaker 2 (02:51:35):
Yeah, I just I sit here and think it's like,
how do you reach another Robert Gallery out there? That's
more so in the phase of the years until you
decided like, hey, I need help, the moment on the
on the driveway where you look at your wife and
you say I need help, like the guy that isn't
wanting to hear it. I feel like that's always the

(02:51:55):
that's always got to be the challenge.

Speaker 1 (02:51:57):
Right, it is, And I think that's I think talking
about it, I've learned. I've had numerous guys that have like, Hey,
seeing you talk about it, they reach out and like,
I'm having the same thing. Seeing you talk about it
made me reach out. Am I ready to go to Mexico? No,
some of them are. We've helped guys get down there. Yeah,
But I think it's just the vulnerability. So it's not
just me, right, it's you hear you know, that's just

(02:52:19):
this day and age too. Is like not only athletes,
but you hear Marcus Latrell talk about it, you hear
DJ Shipley. These guys are the baddest dudes on the
face of the earth. And what they did right, and
you hear them talk about it right, And that's what
did it for me, Like to sit in a room
and cry with a bunch of Navy seals and hug
and tell them you love them, right, the stuff that
you're like ten years ago, none of us would have
said that, right, you know what I mean. So to

(02:52:40):
be vulnerable and talk about this, you know, we've been
getting a lot of outreach and guys like, hey, something's
going on. You know, I don't know if I'm ready,
but but this, you know, stay keep me in the
loop on what you're doing, because just that talking about
it makes people think it's okay to like, oh shit,
that's me. And we've had guys. I've had a couple
of guys that reached out, had heard my story on

(02:53:01):
a different podcast or a news article, went and did
the medicine and went on their own like wanted healing,
went and did it and then reached out again or
reached out then post treatments like dude, you save my life,
like and that's pretty cool.

Speaker 2 (02:53:13):
In with Marcus Latreel at the first spot, like yeah,
I don't know if you like your stuff, but you
saved my life.

Speaker 1 (02:53:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:53:20):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:53:20):
It's like you know the days it's that I'm you know,
working on the business side of having a foundation, right,
I tried to raise money and do all these things
that you got to do to keep running. And you
get an email like that and you're like, holy cow,
like there is a reason, and it's it's pretty cool,
and you know, sit and talk to guys. There's been
numerous ex players that I've been at vents with and
what are you up to now? And it just wasn't
me preaching like you should do medicine. It's just more

(02:53:43):
out this is what happened. I went dark, did this
found healing in this and they're like, oh right, I've
had numerous guys like the rage thing. He's like, and
it's like they relive what I was doing, and so
I hope they, you know, find something that helps them.
But there's lots of guys like that. It's not everybody.
I'm not playing, you know, like you guys, I'd go
do the whole thing all over again. I'd go back

(02:54:04):
to Iowa and do the same stuff and hit the
same way and be the guy that was trying to
kill people with my head. Yeah, because that's what I was.
I was. I was not a finesque guy, right. I
was a smash a face mask through your face.

Speaker 2 (02:54:15):
Mask type of guy, be ready to die on the field.

Speaker 4 (02:54:17):
And so yeah, there's those moments on Saturdays in the
Fall where you're just like, man if I died out here,
this is an honorable death. I'm willing to do it.

Speaker 1 (02:54:24):
Yeah, it's a sick part about it, and I'm still right.
That's also the thing with the medicine. It's not I'm
not a hippie now, like yes do I do. I
am right because you've seen me or I can like
in the airport, right, things are getting activating me. Right,
it's like chaos. I don't like chaos. There's a bunch
of noises because I can hear. Now, I can hear,
and I'm thinking clearly, and I'm like, oh, there's a
lot going on in here. Sorr sit in the corner

(02:54:44):
right close my eyes, and I'm sure people like, who
is this massive tattooed dude in the corner. And it's awesome.
It's a it's a great feeling to be you know,
healed and be that much far ahead of where I
I was and to be able to offer it to
other people and guide them through maybe before they get

(02:55:05):
to where I get. That's my whole My whole goal
with athletes for care is to be there before they
get to where I got. Telling my wife like, here's
all this stuff, right, let's get you the rage stuff
now that you're recognizing, Right, that's what leads to this
other stuff. That's part of TBI. That's the reality of it, right,
not blaming the league, not blaming anyone, Like I said,
I do it all over again, but like, let's offer healing.

(02:55:28):
And that's a big part of what we're doing and
why I'm on here.

Speaker 2 (02:55:33):
What's your relationship, like with football.

Speaker 1 (02:55:35):
Now you know when I got.

Speaker 2 (02:55:37):
And how's it changed? Since it's probably the bitter taste
you had in your mouth when you left it.

Speaker 1 (02:55:41):
Yeah, I can sit and enjoy and watch a game
with my son because he loves it. Am I going
to choose to on a Saturday or Sunday in December
when it's dumping snow out stay and watch it, watch
the NFL games on Sunday ticket rather than being on
the mountain snowboard and absolutely not right. I'm not a
I was never that way, Like, I'm not a guy
that sit and watches it every weekend. But I can

(02:56:03):
turn it on now. My son can turn it on,
like Dad, let's watch the football game? Like sure, buddy. Yeah,
pre all this, I would lose it, like turn that
stuff off. It was just all this hatred.

Speaker 4 (02:56:15):
Towards footballs for the devil time of Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:56:17):
It was. I hated it. I didn't want to watch
it because it brought back all the negative stuff. Well,
you're a failure. You should still be playing. I'm forty
five years old. I shouldn't be playing still, right, But
it was all these things that go through your head
as an ex athlete to where now it's fun with
my son to watch it. It's like, oh, yeah, George
Kittle's on the you know, it's you know, I know
George and his family. And to hear my son be

(02:56:37):
so excited about oh, you know, I was watching Receiver
and you know, am I gonna sit and watch it?
I will because he wants to.

Speaker 4 (02:56:43):
Dude, isn't it you're bringing up George Kittle. Isn't it
so crazy that you went to Iowa and a young
eight year old George Kittle waited in line for an
hour for you to take a photo with you as
a kid, and then now because of how long you
waited and signed those photos and autographs and all those things,
he's now a guy that does that because he saw
you do that. And now your kids watching George Kittle

(02:57:05):
being like, holy shit, George Kittle.

Speaker 1 (02:57:06):
Yeah, and that just nuts. It's amazing. And to hear
that I heard the you know, George and his dad
shared that story with me and I had no idea,
right and showed me the picture and it's yeah, it's
it's a big deal because we get in the thing.
It's like, you know, I remember doing that. I remember
standing there because I'm like, I can't let these kids down.
I was that kid. I was that kid when my
brother was playing waiting for Tim D. White to get
an autographed Yeah, and so to have that relationship with them,

(02:57:27):
you know, and George is actually George has been great.
Like we're doing a fundraiser with him through All True.
It's a rally fundraiser. They're they're actually giving away a
Himalaya e V defender a vehicle. Right, So if you
go to All True dot com and check that out.
George is all show exactly. Carl Rudolph started it and

(02:57:50):
and George does a lot of things for them. We
have a lot of things intertwined, Like he's big in
the military community. You know, what he's done with his career,
you know, is great, but all the other stuff he does,
so it's great to partner with them. You know, they're
going to help raise funds through that All True fundraiser
for our organization for Athletes for Care and just just
good human beings right there. You know that's the Midwest,

(02:58:12):
the Midwest in them and and you know the Iway guy.
So what else what else is?

Speaker 2 (02:58:16):
Yeah? How how hard was it to eventually love your
career and love what you accomplished and love what you
did because I can imagine, I can only imagine how
angry you probably would be at times being a number
two overall pick. And like I just I can just
tell listening to you loved the game of football. You

(02:58:38):
loved fucking grinding, you loved putting on one hundred pounds,
you loved imposing your will against the opponent and working
out and grinding and getting better. And for your career,
you know, we're all psychos, we all want to be
the greatest. For it not to work out and in
a way of the expectation of the world and everything else.
I'm sure that you were very bitter for a while.

(02:59:00):
And because you talked about your ego death, you talked
about you speaking on it, and it was very fleeting.
But loving your career when you said you were coming
out of and from the spiritual side of everything, I'm
sure that was very hard.

Speaker 1 (02:59:11):
Yeah, no, it is right. We're competitors. That stuff doesn't
go away. But this, you know, this whole journey led
me to there's a lot of other thing you guys
know it right, Like, there's a lot of other factors
that go into what happens. Right, So I look back
at my career at Iowa and why was I so
successful there? Because the head coach that started in nineteen
ninety nine is still there in twenty twenty six, right,

(02:59:33):
So it was the same coach, the same system, right,
and all these other things. But it's about right you
look back and yeah, you played ten years. You think
you should have played twelve, You played twelve, right, it
doesn't matter, right at the end of the day, that's
who we are as competitors. Could have played twenty years
and I'm sure I'd be sitting here and playing I
should have played twenty two, right, Like this whole expectation
of what you should do. Yeah, So it's yeah, it's

(02:59:55):
it's also looking at things in a healthy way. There's
a lot of things that are in life or out
of your factors that affect what happens, right, and you
have a story in your head of how you want
things to happen. But it's, yes, it's a sit here
and like, I'm proud of what I did. Right. I
didn't dwindle it away because I was out, you know,
not not putting everything into it. And so yes, it's

(03:00:17):
it's it's a much better relationship now. And that's you know,
I wouldn't be here, you know, that's part of the
spiritual part of it. I wouldn't be here talking about
this if all that stuff didn't happen, right, So it's
part of the process it was supposed to be for me.
Did I still want to go to the playoffs every
year or a year never? You know what I mean? Like, yeah, yeah,
that stuff still bothers me, right, it gets the playoff

(03:00:39):
time and I'm like, I mean, it doesn't debilitate me,
but I'm like, ah, that's a'd January see the winning
team just like man, yeah, feeling yeah. And and as
you guys know, when you're winning, it's it's fun, right,
it's and it's easy, right. And then you're like, I
got bullrust there, but it didn't matter because we were
rolling and he got it out and like you know,

(03:01:00):
and that happens in a you know, you're losing and
you're you know, down twenty and your were past blocking
every single one, like hold on, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 (03:01:07):
That's the worst. When you open up the second half
and you're like two minute boys, hold on to your
nothing for the rest of the game.

Speaker 1 (03:01:13):
You're praying to.

Speaker 4 (03:01:13):
Get a couple of slides. Hey, that's the worst feeling
in the world when it comes to a career, dude,
Like we've talked about it. I still miss playing football,
but I am extremely proud of Like if you if
you're able to be proud of what you were able
to accomplish and put it giving one hundred percent effort
at the end of the day, like the result of
you know, everyone has this like idea in your head
of like how you're going to write the end of

(03:01:34):
your story, and everyone has it the same way, like
Tom Brady did it, or these other you know one
guys did and it's like, if you gave everything you
had to it, and then there's nothing to be upset
about because you you put everything you had into the game.

Speaker 1 (03:01:48):
That'bsolute the most.

Speaker 2 (03:01:48):
Important had to have been very freeing too to kind
of have that ego death. Let it go, love and
appreciate it because we all know, like I know that
you being two hundred and twenty thirty pounds with high
jump records or four by one, you would have never
imagined somebody coming to you and say, hey, you're going

(03:02:09):
to gain one hundred pounds you're gonna be an Outland
Trophy winner, You're gonna be an All American, You're gonna
be the number two overall pick in the NFL and
be an offensive lineman and play for eight nine years
in the NFL. You'd be like, Yeah, you're fucking crazy
being a farm boy from small town Iowa. So it is.
It's like you've done a lot of badass shit that
absolutely everybody would trade places for. And it's really cool

(03:02:32):
that you've learned. You've had this process of learning and
very much lows and now you're getting new experience highs
again and love yourself and be a family man and
do all these things and start a foundation that you've
started and changing people's lives. So dude, I appreciate you
for sharing all this. I'm sure it gets still at
some point no matter how much you talk about it.
I'm sure there's some still some discomfort at times, like

(03:02:54):
having to pull from old memories that you probably feel
shame and embarrassment from. So dude, thank you for sharing
all those sincerely.

Speaker 1 (03:03:01):
Yeah, no, it's it's like I said, it's been. It's
great for me. It's right, this process helped me enjoy
like you said other things in life. Right, my I'm
one of eight guys in the Ring of Honor in
Kinnick Stadium at the University of Iowa. Right, it's eighty right,
and that like something I am so proud of. And
I went post medicine to where I didn't really I
was still right embarrassed or whatever it was. Right, there's

(03:03:24):
all these other factors, and I'm like, that's one instance
where I'm like, I remember standing there that day they
unveiled it, and I'm like, holy shit, I'm one of
eight dudes in the history of Iowa football that has
their name on the stadium. Like, I did some really
big time stuff, right, doesn't That's not who I am
just because my name's there, but that to be able

(03:03:44):
to really enjoy that stuff, and we all did it
right as our careers went on your next thing, next thing,
next thing, next thing, and now stand back and truly
enjoy the process of what you did and what you
accomplished from it. It's it's a it's a very amazing deal.

Speaker 2 (03:03:57):
Yeah, that's awesome.

Speaker 4 (03:03:58):
I got one more question for you. I was so
hung up on your first d MT trip and You're
like going to the light and you see God and
you're like, I saw God the way I see God?
How clear was this trip for you? Was like we're
all sitting here right now talking absolutely what does God
look like?

Speaker 1 (03:04:15):
There's two things I don't get into, politics and religion. No,
but for me, right, it was the typical what I
learned in in CCD class when I was beard beard,
long white hair, the white robe. Right.

Speaker 4 (03:04:28):
Was he a heavier set guy or medium build?

Speaker 1 (03:04:30):
What we look at medium build, white guy? Right? Yeah,
God's white.

Speaker 2 (03:04:35):
We're not judging that.

Speaker 1 (03:04:37):
But yeah, it was like very crystal clear. Yeah, and
so yeah, some of those things and that's part of
this too. We can laugh about it now. But the
people that have gone through we talk about these things
you see and you're like they get it. Or if
you've experienced things like that, you're like, holy cow, right,
like talking about seeing the light and doing these different things.
The death, you're like, you know, I'm very clear what

(03:04:58):
it's going to be like when I do die. Like
that came out of that too, like that peaceful. It's like, oh,
this is this is not bad, right, It's not a
scary thing. Yeah, you know, some of the stuff that
happened in there but it's yeah, it's it was crystal clear.

Speaker 2 (03:05:11):
Yeah. I saw my god, he had a thirty Rex
sitting next to you.

Speaker 4 (03:05:15):
Yeah. Yeah, tuxedo T shirt on mullet.

Speaker 2 (03:05:21):
Shirt.

Speaker 4 (03:05:22):
I bro, that's got to be such a crazy feeling
in your head to be like, yo, this is this
is the guy everyone's talking about all the time. This
is him.

Speaker 2 (03:05:29):
You know, I was gonna say the tuxedo T shirt
just cutting have to.

Speaker 4 (03:05:32):
Yeah, he got his belly out a little cropped up
and me too, squat. Yeah yeah, Now that's all. Your
story is incredible. Man, We all the things Will said.
I would love to double down on that, but like,
thank you for sharing your story with us. It's awesome
and I hope that anybody who hears this that's going
through something they reach out because that's the mental health
side is so important. So thank you.

Speaker 1 (03:05:52):
Yeah, no, that's what you know, that's I want to continue.
We have you know, websites set up, you know, and
like like any foundation, right like that, you know, people
feel inclined to donate. There's a donate page on there
because this we can help send guys for treatment. Right
Because unlike what most people think, not all professional athletes
have money or save their money or had careers like

(03:06:13):
we did that we put stuff away, you know. So
we're raising money to help with the research and you know,
help send guys that need help that are in financial meaning.
It's not as football guys, right, there's UFC guys. We've
got hockey guys. We've got tons of guys. So that's
a big part of this is also but that's all
on our website and just a resource of things you
can do and people to reach out to.

Speaker 4 (03:06:34):
What's the average cost to take one person down.

Speaker 1 (03:06:37):
There's a couple of different facilities, but you know, anywhere
from six thousand dollars to ten plus, but the place
that the majority of that I've gone to is just
over six thousand dollars, you know, to get there. The treatment,
it's the doctors, it's the pre impost therapy, integration, reintegration,
so not you know, not cheap. But I also came

(03:07:01):
out of it and like dude, I would have paid
sixty thousand dollars. Right, It's easy for me to say,
but I also think it's such a profound thing that's like,
holy cow, let's figure out how to make this happen.
And that's what Vets has done. You know, they give grants.
You know, we want to do that if we start
raising enough money. We want to give grants to guys
that are a need that can't can't financially do it

(03:07:21):
and give them part of a grant. And so you
know the other thing I would love to, you know,
give a small plug too, is this experience is easy
for me to talk about it and you listen to
me and like, okay. But there's a new documentary that
actually just came out on Netflix that Marcus and Amber
Capoem were a part of with their organization. It's called
In Waves and War and it's very very good. I've

(03:07:41):
seen them multiple times. Just got released. It's on Netflix
and it gives a good idea of this process. More
scientific stuff on the medicine, but it's some great storytelling
like mine that you'll be like, oh I heard that
from Robert right if you go watch it, because it's
it's very similar and it's just bringing awareness to guys.

Speaker 2 (03:08:01):
We talk about, you know, things that we can laugh about.
We do have a final question. It's brought to us
by bud Light. It is it is comical, you know
how people would do anything for a nice I've heard that,
what is something in your life that Robert Gallery would

(03:08:21):
do anything for? And you've seen Brendsey's Taylor. It's a
coin thing. You can't say family, Oh yeah.

Speaker 4 (03:08:27):
Can't say family.

Speaker 1 (03:08:31):
I think for me it would be being able to
consistently live in the moment, to be in the moment,
like I'm very much more in the moment now than
I was, But I've had that feeling of being in
the moment for days on end. Right post medicine work,
there's times where I you know, I'm on my routine
to go into guys like us, we push and push

(03:08:52):
and push, right, got to be great, gotta do this
like you guys started this like we got a ticket
to the next level. You're doing this, But to go
to be able to be in the moment, gym, watch
my daughters play basketball and just be in the moment
watching them, not worrying about like, oh, they screwed this up, right.
It's that mentality of high level athletes, right, I'm guessing
you guys are the same. Or as your kids get older,

(03:09:12):
you just push and push all you should have done that.
But there's been instances where I've been in the moment.
I've been on a snowmobile in the middle of the
mountains and I can see every single snowflake that's coming
towards me. I'm like, oh, I am in this moment
right now, right there's me the snowmobile. I'm out. It
is nuking snow and there's nothing else and I can
see every single snowflake flying at me. So I'm so
it's like a meditative state. And I've been in a

(03:09:33):
gym where I just I'm in pure enjoyment of watching
my daughter do something she likes, not being like, oh,
she should have done this, or why didn't she do this?
Or she didn't enough protein this last week, so that's
why she's tired. Right, this thing that that high level.
I'm guessing you guys are the same. It's like go,
go go, But when you've seen that, calm miss So.

(03:09:53):
I would like to say to be in the moment
all the time the rest of my life. Just be
in the moment with whatever's going on, whether that's good
or bad, Like the past doesn't matter, the future doesn't matter.
Like sitting here talking with you guys, right, just be
which it is. It's great, right, Like that's why it's
easy and you can talk about it because it's like
you're completely in the moment. I'm not worried about anything
other than right, the great stories and about how you

(03:10:15):
know most people listening to this will be Hawkeye fans
and not you know, Nebraska after this.

Speaker 8 (03:10:21):
So right, that's true.

Speaker 4 (03:10:24):
It is true.

Speaker 2 (03:10:25):
It always comes back to the Big ten. It always
comes back before we came on the bus too. He's like,
I got a gift for your daughters. Would you want
it now before or would you want me to give
to you on the podcast. So I'm just thinking like, oh,
that's a solid dad given another day, a gift for
his girls or something like that, like we can wait
till the bus. And now that he pulled it out,
I'm like, ah, he got me.

Speaker 4 (03:10:46):
I mean that's a solid gift.

Speaker 2 (03:10:47):
Yeah, it's a solid gift. Very heady play by you.

Speaker 4 (03:10:50):
You know that was given to you by Robert Gallery,
guy who's names on the stadium.

Speaker 1 (03:10:53):
Yeah, right right, And I know the coach very well,
like my wife's still very close. So you know, maybe
there's some scholarships in the future, but I know how
you said you wouldn't send them there no matter what.
But I'm also thinking, I mean, they look good in
the black and gold, right, black and gol car kids
team up right. I think you a little younger than mine, But.

Speaker 2 (03:11:13):
I've already started incorporating Like we had on our for
the Dad's podcast, we curated this story, this Ai story
of good guys and bad guys, and the good guys
are huskers and the bad guys or haul guys. So
trying to Indoctrinatom into thinking it's uscer football and I
was the bad guys.

Speaker 1 (03:11:30):
Yeah, well, we do play each other in a few weeks,
so we might need to figure out offline here how
to get back to that game and then we can
posture up on the opposite side lines. Okay, duel it out.

Speaker 2 (03:11:40):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (03:11:41):
We might have to try and make that happen.

Speaker 2 (03:11:42):
Yeah, we will definitely have to have fun, some more
fun because I do have fun with George each year.
I used to have fun with the when he was
a teammate of mine, Brandon Sheriff, we'd have fun with
it every year too. But we'll come we can come up.

Speaker 4 (03:11:54):
He was a stunt he and Yellen Trophy as well.
He's a stud.

Speaker 2 (03:11:58):
Tackle that went to guard and he was a monster, bro,
Like hitting him thinking rich was not fun.

Speaker 1 (03:12:04):
Yeah, he's a good dude too. That's that's the cool part.
Like you guys, right, we played with all these people
and different people, but like they're just good dude. They're dudes. Right,
at the end of the day, we're all sitting here,
bs and right, and the dude's a dude.

Speaker 5 (03:12:19):
Right.

Speaker 1 (03:12:19):
There were savages, right, like some guys that were you know,
I grew up watching Kyle Turley of right, Like, I'm
sure you had somebody, but it was I want to
be Kyle Turley. Got a jersey made from you know,
with my name on the back but his number and
the Saints, Like I want what do you think the
hair came from? Right, Like yeah, dude ripping Telman off, Like, oh,
that's that's the type of player. That's who I want
to be, right, And then we all get together. I

(03:12:40):
met him, like, dude, you were my hero, Like, you know,
it's pretty cool.

Speaker 2 (03:12:44):
Yeah, dude, thank you, bro, thank you big hug Seiny
Kisses Pastes podcast around, Leave comments and we will see
you next week. Next week,

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Robert Gallery Shares The Mental Toll Of Football & Healing After NFL Career With Raiders | Bussin'

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Robert Gallery Shares The Mental Toll Of Football & Healing After NFL Career With Raiders | Bussin'