Hugh Millen joins Softy.

Hugh Millen joins the show to talk about Seahawks taking the last day of OTA's off, other NFL and Seahawks news, and much more.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Joining us right now on the radioshow. I realize here day there's two
things I'm missing in my life.Number one, a fully functional backswing on
the golf course, and number twomore Hugh Millan. When you go two
weeks without Hugh mellan, you alwaysneed more Hugh Millan. And he's back
from his vacation, joining us rightnow on the air. How are you

(00:21):
No, I'm kind of like abad golf swing. Yeah, no,
I'm doing fine. The good tobe with you. It's been a while.
Where did you go? Can youtell us where you went? I've
just been around. Hey, hu, where are you been? Oh my
god, that was going to besuch a long description. I was just
he he just absolutely flummes me.But nah, Well, last week I

(00:42):
was in New York City with myfamily. Uh yeah, kids flew,
every flew, everybody in and everybodyjust kind of tooled around New York had
a good time. I love it, man. That is what's up man?
Where you've been? Yeah, it'sbeen around. Uh so since we
talked. There's a lot going on. First of all, Mike Donald canceling
the last day of py caamp.I know they got the extra time because

(01:03):
of the extra because of the newcoaching staff obviously, but Dick and I
on that day was like, Oh, that's interesting. If a brand new
offense, brand new defense, everything'sbrand new, and you had an extra
day to work on this and yougave it back, were you surprised by
that? I was a little bitsurprised, because you know, you think,
for example, DK Metcalf, there'ssome guys that are only showing up

(01:23):
for mandatory stuff, right, andso if you're only going to have them
three days and some of the othersdon't mean to single out any one player,
I would want to have all three. Now. There's no question that
that he he got a lot ofyou know, kudos from his team and
a lot of you know, affectionand goodwill. So and they had the

(01:48):
extra week as you describe. AndI think another part of that is that
it's becoming now in the NFL,if it's becoming commonplace, so that now
players are not feel like they're rewarded. It's it's they're gonna feel jipped if
they don't get it. Uh.In in theory that would never happen.

(02:09):
In reality, it would if thatagain, if if all these guys know
that there's twenty teams, for example, that are saying, uh, so
long and and and foregoing that lastday, then they're gonna feel okay,
well that they're they're getting jips.So I was a little bit surprised,
But given that it becomes seems tobe commonplace, I think I don't think

(02:30):
it was a bad move. Well, there's this, there's this this idea
that they're looking at, h andtell me if I'm wrong here here getting
rid of the mini camps and theoffseason stuff all together and just extending training
camp, to which some players whohave kids out of school that are home
for the summer would say, Hey, I I'd rather have camp while they're
in school and then have more timeoff in the summer to spend with my

(02:52):
with my kids. How do youthink that would go over with the players
if they did that? Yeah,I don't think that the player is going
to be keen on coming in earlierthan the mandate, which is fifteen days
before the first preseason game, right, So I don't know. I think
it's kind of a mess when youlook at how the collective bargaining. I
tell you, in my opinion,the league, our perception of the product

(03:16):
is driven by quarterback play, evendefensive minded head coaches that the defensive minded
head coaches that I've played for,they seem to be more chipper when the
offense is when the passing game isjust crisp in practice, if the quarterbacks
are dirt and balls and airmailing balls, even defensive coaches you might say,

(03:38):
well, oh, I love it. You know, nobody's completely passes against
my defense. No, they don't. Maybe the defensive coordinator does, but
not the head coach. And Ithink fans when you look at when you
turn on a game, if youdon't, if you don't have good quality
quarterback play, it's it feels likea bad product. How many fans are
sitting there going, oh, thedefense is great. No, they're saying
the quarterback stuck. Now if you'restripping down all these days for the quarterback

(04:04):
development, And I'll throw another componentin. It's of a local nature.
Ten years ago, the Seattle Coverthree was the dominant. You know,
everybody was trying to play it allthe proliferation. It was very easy to
decipher for a quarterback. You knowwhere everybody is now Mike McDonald ten years

(04:28):
later, it's the Seaak head coachagain who is the premier strategist. And
it has nothing to do with thesimple cover three. It's highly complex,
a lot of different looks, verydifficult to process and where there used to
be. I mean, I'll justgive you a term that I when I
was playing years ago, we hadwhat's called quarterback school. And in your

(04:49):
mind, miscal well, the quarterbacksin the off season are going to school,
and it's just the quarterbacks. No, we would have four day,
might have been three, three days, something that weeks for we would have
eleven on eleven. It was Dave. If you watch those practices, it
would look exactly like a mini camp, just like a mini camp. But
they called a quarterbacks school. Weekafter week after week. We were getting

(05:12):
this. So I think you needthat, and I think with with Mike
McDonald and some of his disciples,over the next five years, you're gonna
see some lousy quarterback play and theperception of the product is really going to
be questioned. Well, you justsaw a guy in Trevor Lawrence who is
now the highest paid quarterback in theNFL along with Joe Burrow, and he's
what He's got one playoff win underhis belt, there's a now a discussion.

(05:36):
I think you may have kind ofbrought this up a few years ago
as a possibility. Maybe I'm wrongon that. Tell me if I'm right
or wrong about a separate salary pooljust for quarterbacks. What do you make
of that idea? Well, youthink as a as a former quarterback,
i'd be knee jerk, just,you know, ardently against it. I
think if it makes sense and it'sdefensible and there's a fairness, I wouldn't

(06:02):
be against it. I'd need tosee the particulars right, and of course
it'd have to be bargained upon collectively. And you know, it is interesting.
I would kind of equate it onsome level to the franchise tag.
The franchise tag is really what's describedif you do some research on it,

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it's the l Way clause. BecauseI was a player rep when we were
trying to get free agency. WhenI came in the league, there was
no it was what's called player indemnity. When Joe Montana's contract expired with the
forty nine Ers, didn't matter ifhe was in year nine. He was
still the property of the forty nineErs, had no ability to negotiate with
anybody. And so we had tostrike and decertifize the union and do all

(06:47):
these things to get free agency theplayers now enjoy, of course. But
in that process we remember getting updatesand the owners. There were some of
the owners that were willing to gosomewhere like no, and Pat Bolan was
kind of a pivotal guy. AndPat Bolan, the owner of the of
the Broncos, said hey, I'mnot signing anything that allows me to lose

(07:11):
John Alway period, end of story, right, and I'm gonna remain on
the old circuit camp of these otherowners. And so one of the compromises,
okay, we'll have an Lway clause. Well, and thus was born
the franchise tag And so you couldsay, well, if you're the guy
in the league that's been franchise taggedand you lose some right, you know,

(07:32):
that is a real what could betermed a restraint of the free market,
which is in violation of the antitrust. Well, the only way
you get get that through is tohave the labor laws which superseded the anti
trust laws. And so that happenedfor the franchise guys. Of course,
it's been exercised on players not justquarterbacks, but there could be something in

(07:54):
a similar manner where where it wasshoved down the John Elways of the world,
it could be down all the quarterbacks. But and a final point on
that, I will say that themarket, if we're talking about this great
sport that we all love and wealways knew for decades. I've been watching
football fifty years, you brought youforty. We always knew quarterbacks were value

(08:15):
valuable. The market is showing usjust in fact, how valuable quarterbacks are.
And now they want to put youknow, these these again restraints and
caps on it and what have youjust to you know, in some sense,
just control themselves, no question.I mean, all this just seems
like it's there to suppress quarterback salaries. End of story. I mean,

(08:35):
I don't think owners are going todo anything that would make them pay quarterbacks
more money, but suppressing it forsure. And I'm like you, what,
what are the details is that?Is it a portion of the current
salary cap that has set aside?Is it a portion plus ten percent,
plus five percent, whatever it isthat's set aside. So I'm like you
curious to see. But from aquarterback perspective, in Seattle. I remember

(08:56):
having a conversation with you two yearsago about Drew Lock and how you were
adamant we got to have a competition. We gotta have a competition between Drew
Lock and Gino Smith, and therereally wasn't a competition. I guess somebody
could say, well, Drew Lockwas gonna start and then he got COVID
and he was done. But Ithink we all saw what was going on
when that thing began. Are youas adamant now that there needs to be

(09:18):
a competition between Geno and Sam Howeas you were two years ago with Gino
and Drew Lock. No, becausethat was prior to twenty twenty two and
Gino hadn't done anything. Now Ginohas has proven himself to be a serviceable
quarterback. You know my feeling aboutGeno. He's about middle of the leg

(09:39):
of the league, and I thinkthat there should be some competition, but
not to the extent that I wouldhave advocated back in the Drew Locke situation.
Now in twenty twenty two, Ithink it's worth noting here we're talking
about caps. Gino Smith's cap wasthree point five million. That was one
point sixty one percent of the cap. Then last year's four point five to

(10:01):
five. This year it's going tobe ten point one percent of cap.
His cap is twenty six point fourmillion. It's going up to over twenty
five million, I believe thirty millionnext year. And we don't know the
percentage because the cap will vary.But you know that that I think is
an equation and for Sam Howe's youknow here in looking at Sam Howe and

(10:22):
Gino. First of all, let'stalk about Gino for a second. One
of the concerns among many and I'vetouched on him, and this is not
a Geno segment, but the redzone passer rating Gino last year twenty ninth,
a red zone completion percentage thirty firstin the league, a successful play
percentage thirty sixth. On third downconversions, Gino was thirtieth. And there's

(10:46):
similar poor numbers for the Seahawks asa team in those in those specialized areas.
So you're here about Gino led theNFL in fourth quarter comebacks. Well,
there's more opportunities in that. Andand look that's a great stat that
is that there's no tracking from that. That's important stuff. But in my
mind, I'm almost thinking like,as an NFL player, you have Wednesday's

(11:07):
your first practice, that's first andsecond down. Is this a general rule?
Some violate this, but is ageneral You can say Wednesday's the first
and second down, Thursday is yourthird down day, and then Friday is
your specialized day. That's short yardage, goal line, it's red zone.
What have you? Right? Soto me, it's like gino, Okay,

(11:28):
you're good on Wednesday, but there'ssome things on the Thursday and Friday,
the specialized stuff, like we've gotto get better on third down and
we've got to get better on thered zone. Now, for Sam Howe,
the big issue for him was hewas the sacks that most sacks in
the league. Right, His pressurepercentage went in the pocket was thirty four
point six, that was the eighthmost percentage. Does he hold the ball,

(11:50):
that's a fair question. In thepocket, his average time to throw
was two point four to eight seconds. These are command or plays. A
year ago, Sam with the footballin is and and he's in the pocket
again two point four eight seconds perplay? Where does that rank? Well?
Tied with Pat Mahomes? Wow?Wow? For nineteenth and twenty he

(12:11):
the two point four to eight isexactly the number that Pat Mahomes is in
and oh, by the way,yeah it's Gino is twenty first in that
sect he was two point four sevenseconds, So you're basically, I would
I think statisicians would say, Okay, that's not an important statistic to correlate

(12:31):
to good quarterbacking because here we gotthe best in Mahomes, We've got you
know, whatever you think of howyou know you got Gino and and they
all basically are the same. Sothat's not as a strong statistical category.
But at any event, for thoseI've heard it mentioned about, okay,
the sacks is that because he's holdingthe ball, what have you? You
know, can he get does hehave the capacity to get rid of it

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the way Sean Payton was really needingafter having the Russell Wilson experience and he
loved how bo Nicks gets rid ofit and what have you. That's a
real thing, get rid of thedamn ball. And those are the numbers
that reflect well. Hugh Mellon's withus on the show, and Hugh I
heard Mike McDonald I think Ian wasalluding to this on his show talking about
getting Canine Kenny Walker more involved inthe passing offense as a catcher, as

(13:15):
a pass catcher, not like acatcher like Kyle Rawley, but you get
the punderstand as a receiver, thankyou. In three years in college at
waken in Michigan State, he caughtnineteen passes. Is it nineteen or eighteen?
I had a eight at thirteen,two and three, but my research
says nineteen. All right, SoI just want to be accurate. We
just see the host ten and twowere driving nineteene nineteen. He's caught fifty

(13:39):
six balls in his first two yearsin the NFL. So for somebody to
say we should use Kenny Walker moreas a receiver, they are and they
have been. But is there anotherlevel you think in Ryan Grubbs offense,
both of them has been under thirty. I thought it was twenty nine and
twenty eight. But yeah, we'reclose on the numbers, right, And
so there are sixteen receivers. Excuseme, let me start again. There

(14:01):
are sixteen running backs in the leaguelast year that had fifty or more highlighted
by CMC Music Factory at eighty six, right, So I'm not saying that
he should catch eighty six balls.Like Christ McCaffrey. But I don't think
it's unreasonable given his dynamic, hisexplosiveness, his acceleration, his I think

(14:24):
there's a broken field running capacity thathe has that you get the ball mount
on the wing and the screens makesthe first guy layer miss. And I
think now he's really dynamic in theopen field. So for me to be
under two catches per game, Ithink that's light. And so I think
if we can push it up toapproximately you know three or more, right,

(14:48):
that would be you know fifty one, right, sure, And again
there's sixteen guys that are over thefifty threshold, So I don't think that's
unreasonable. Well, i'll tell youwhat, Dick and I had this conversation
a few weeks ago this time,and a year from now, or even
like maybe ten months from now,the Seahawks and DK Metcalf probably be talking
about a deal, right because he'sgot two years left in his contract.

(15:09):
Free agent year is next season.What do you think DK Metcalfs year looks
like? And do you think theSeahawks are really in a good mood and
a charitable way to get this guyresigned as soon as possible. Well,
I think that they're going to usehim more as a deep threat. If
you go back and you look atRoma Dunza, and obviously that the constant

(15:31):
variable is going to be Ryan Grubb. Roma Dunze last year led the nation
forty nine attempts where the ball wastwenty yards or more, and that was
in fifteen games. DK in sixteengames had just twenty six. So again,
forty nine to twenty six, youdo if you go on a per
game basis, Rome had more thandouble, and you could and there's similar

(15:52):
numbers on balls in the year longerthan thirty yards. So I think that
we're gonna we're gonna see come hellor high water, They're they're either gonna
get the ball to DK deep,or they're gonna die trying, or they're
just gonna They're gonna see rold coverageand safeties over the top, in which
case I would not counsel Geno tojust force the ball down the field.

(16:15):
But there'll be other things open.And Tyler's already been a beneficiary of that,
of that role coverage, and soso I think, uh yeah,
look, I'm I'm if I'm thelast guy that dies on the beach supporting
DK Metcalf, then so be it. I will be that guy. That's
just what I see in him.Yeah, and and uh, I think

(16:36):
he's been underutilized. I'm in TroyAikman's camp. They need to throw the
ball to him more. And souh you said this year, I think
that probably because of the new offensivecoordinator. Uh, DK's just twenty six
years old. I would say thatthe real referendum would be after two seasons,
not one. I would argue fora real assessment that way. But
if if financial consideration, you know, Trader or et Stan, if that

(17:00):
happens happening a year ago, I'mstill gonna be this is This is a
bull market for me on DK Metcalf. If you're asking my opinion, well,
it's never a bad idea to hookup with Troy Aikman's camp ever,
ever, ever, ever, ever. Hey, listen, good stuff,
welcome back from the Big Apple.We're talking a week, buddy, appreciate
it. Okay, Hamer down