Jon Wilner on Pat Chun to UW, Culture Fit, Kyle Smith, PJ Carlesimo

Jon Wilner of The San Jose Mercury News and Wilner Hotline joins Dave Softy Mahler and Dick Fain to talk about Washington hiring Pat Chun to be the new Athletic Director, the culture fit, Kyle Smith going from WSU to Stanford, and PJ Carlesimo’s comments.

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Episode Transcript

(00:00):
It's time for a weekly PAC twelveconversation with Sen Jose Mercury News reporter John
Wilner, brought to you by SimplySeattle. Our friends at simply Seattle dot
com have the most amazing collection ofall things Seattle, Seahawks gear, UW
hats, and the largest selection ofSonics gear anywhere in the world. Learn
more at simply Seattle dot com.Alrighty, boys and girls, here we

(00:21):
go big thanks to our friends.It's simply Seattle dot com. New Mariner
drops happening every single day on thewebsite. We sure and use code kjar
fifteen for fifteen percent off anything atsimply Seattle dot com. Here he is
the outgoing pope of the pack,the incoming baron of the Big ten.
I'd like to apologize to John WilnerDick on behalf of not having any topics

(00:46):
to discuss here on the radio program. Our friend John Wilner from the San
Jose Mercury News. Johnny, howare you man? My head is spinning?
Have you guys ours too? Yeah? Uh, in a good way
though. Now. I mean,it's amazing things have turned for Washington and
why don't we just kind of startthere. I mean six days ago we
were talking about Troy Dannon taking offfor Nebraska, and within the next week

(01:10):
you got a new basketball coach andDanny Sprinkle and a brand new AD in
Pat Schun. How would you sayanamara cause and you dub rebounded from the
exit of Troy Dannon. I'd givehim an a plus. Now, you
know, Sprinkle I think is agood hire. The sample size is still
a little bit on the small side, but you know, I certainly no

(01:34):
qumbs with that higher the Chun hiretoday. To me, that is a
home run for the Huskies. Heis very, very good, very well
respected in the industry. He youknow, he's got every box checked for
an AD, fundraising, chops,track record of good hires, and men's

(01:57):
basketball and football, understanding of thecollege sports landscape which is changing dramatically by
the month. He was on theNCAA Transformation Committee with SEC Commissioner Greg Sank.
You know, he obviously he knowsthe Pacific Northwest. He's not gonna
have the Troy Dannon culture shock issue, right, I mean, I can

(02:21):
see Seun staying there for ten,fifteen, twenty years. I just there's
no they should have hired him,you know, five months ago, right,
that really, But I don't knowwhy they didn't. I think they
tried to. They tried to.He woned the Ohio State job. Oh,
that's true. Ohio State was stillopen at that point, and he
was waiting for that. That's yeah, No, that's a good point.

(02:43):
But he would have been the homerun higher for them back then and he
is now and his you know,his understanding of the Big ten landscape is
huge, right. He worked forJeene Smith, Ohio State. He went
to Ohio State, he's from Ohio, he's you know, they now now
have a leader of their department whowill be very comfortable dealing with Big ten

(03:05):
issues. John, and and Softy, I want you to weigh in on
this too. Do you guys thinkthat we can now see this as the
Huskies got their number one guy?They just had an interim for five months
before the number one guy was availableto come. Yeah, John, how
about you? Yeah? Absolutely?It was like Dannon was the bridge to

(03:27):
get to to get to Chun rightthat he wasn't available, so they hired
somebody else. They made a badhire, didn't work out, and they
ended up in a better place.I mean They're a way better place,
there's no question about. It's crazyhow things work out. And if you're
Pat schun right, not getting theOhio State job was a gut punch,
right, That's that was his dreamjob. But you know this is I

(03:49):
would have to imagine if you askedhim, all right, you're not going
to get Ohio State, give what'syour other top choice? Washington might have
been at the top. Yeah,I'm looking at the timeline for this.
And by the way, to answeryour question, Dick, yes, I
agree. I would have been coolwith hiring patchun back in October when they
announced that Troy dan And was gettingthe job. And it's almost like,

(04:10):
you know, look when they hiredTroy dan And, the culture changed and
for the worst inside that department.I mean, I'm getting the same is
it a meme or a jiff fora gift, whatever it is, I'm
getting the same thing back from peopleat you dub today that I got from
them six days ago when Troy Dannonquit, and that is elation. They

(04:30):
were happy when Troy Dannon quit andthey were happy when Pat Chuhn was hired.
So a lot of people inside thedepartment whatever that means for people are
thrilled with the hire. But I'mlooking at the timeline. So ross Bjork
was approved back in February of thisyear as the new ad of Ohio State.
So when Dan was hired in October, it certainly is possible guys at

(04:51):
that point in time that Pat Schunthought he was in the mix for the
Buckeye job, and that's why he'snot here at Washington. But I want
you to talk more job and again, John Wilner is with us courtesy of
SIMP with Seattle. I want youto talk more about why you think this
guy's the right fit for this jobright now. Well, I think that
the culture piece is huge, Andto get back to your point, Softy

(05:15):
about being a well received hire withinthe athletic department. Part of the reason
for that is because everybody who knowswho works in the athletic department knows that
Jen Cohen and Pat Sewn are veryclose correct and see they see eye to
eye on how you run a department, the culture that you want to build,
the type of people that you wantto hire, and the delegation of

(05:40):
responsibility and accountability. They everybody inthere knows what Jen thought of pat and
so I'm sure that's part of thereason why they're so they're so happy,
And that's also part of the reasonwhy I think he's the right higher for
them, right. I mean,Washington, the state and the university is
different than most of the rest ofthe country. Right. You cross the

(06:02):
Rockies and it gets different. Youcross the Cascades and it's even a bigger
culture change. And now you've gotsomebody who has been living in Washington for
six six years, has spent alot of time in Seattle, a lot
of time on Yes, absolutely,so in that regard it works well.
But also the biggest thing to me, and he's not going to have to

(06:25):
hire a football or men's basketball coach. You will at least any time soon.
Maybe can I not get it.We'll not get into the Florida thing
with fish. But the biggest thingfor me is that he understands the landscape.
He understands the way things are moving, with the lawsuits against the stable

(06:46):
A, with players becoming employees,with the media changes in media, with
the college football playoff changes. Hehas a very good handle on all that
stuff. And you need an adwho was one step ahead and not one
step behind on all of these issues. College sports is changing, the evolution

(07:10):
is happening in real time. Forreal time, really, you need an
ad who is going to see aroundthe corner and not get caught unaware.
And Chun is very very smart andthose big picture landscape issues. Dick,
let me just add one thing towhat John said about the gen Co infactor,
because I don't know if you'll everbe able to get her on record

(07:32):
saying this. I don't know ifI will either, but I can guarantee
you this that when Troy Dannen tookover the department and the stories began to
kind of get out about what wasgoing on behind the scenes, nobody was
more crushed than her because she thoughtshe was leaving that place in a pretty
good spot, right and then whenshe finds out what's happening behind the scenes,
she's crissfallen. I also can guaranteeyou this that Pat Sun would have

(07:56):
been one of her if she hadthe ability to do it, hand picks
the accessors to come to Seattle totake over this job. So when you
say there's people in that department thatknow about the relationship between Jen Cohen and
Pat Seohn, You're exactly right.That's why I think for him, guys,
it's gonna be a lot easier thanit would Troy Dannen to get things
going in the right direction, becausehe's already got a lot of respect before

(08:20):
John he even steps foot in thatbuilding, he's got respect. Oh,
he's gonna be hailed as a conqueringhero, no doubt what the folks that
there have been through for the lastfive and a half months. There's no
doubt about that. And you knowwe should. We'd be remiss if we
didn't talk about Anna Marie cause,and certainly I have been plenty critical of
her over the years on this show, and you know my columns, but

(08:45):
you do have to give her credithere. Now. I don't know exactly
what happened with Parker, right Theyhired Parker Executive Search to find them Troy
Dannen, and that obviously went wrong. My sense is that Parker probably did
this the extent to which they hadto redo with Search here in the last
week. Parker probably did a probono. But you do have to give

(09:07):
Cows credit for recognizing that there wasan obvious choice, you know, a
few hundred miles to the East.Why wasn't he given the OSU job.
He seemed like the perfect fit.He was the OSU guy. Why do
you think that he didn't get thatjob? Because I'm sure some people are
saying right now, probably Cougar fans, right, Well, if he's such

(09:28):
a great ad for you, youdub, why didn't he go to OSU
like we all thought he was.Well, that's it's an interesting story,
right. So for many years therewere three ads. Ohio State is considered
the number one job in the countryfor an athletic director, because you know,
you've got one hundred thousand season ticketsand you got thirty six sports and

(09:50):
you've got ridiculous amounts of money.Anyhow, So Jeane Smith, who's been
the ad there for a long time, very well respected. He had three
people who looked as were viewed tosuccess, Pat Chun, Martin Jarman who's
at UCLA and also worked for Smith, and Heatherlikey who's at Pittsburgh and also
worked for Smith. So his threeformer lieutenants were viewed as the favorites.

(10:11):
But then this new president comes intoOhio State and makes a U turn and
doesn't hire someone who's been at OhioState under Jean Smith. He hires ross
Byorke from Texas A and m rossb Yorke, the architect of the disasters
Jimbo Fisher contract and hire ross Byorke, who has had a lot of questionable

(10:33):
moves in terms of NC double Arules with when he was at Mississippi,
Mississippi State, I think it wasone of the Mississippi schools. So it
was a very surprising move when OhioState did not hire a former Jean Smith
Lieutenant Chun I have to think wascrushed by it. That had been his

(10:56):
dream job. And you know thathappened the course of the winter, and
then he was you know, atthis point he knew he wasn't gonna get
that. He's not OWSU alum obviously. I mean, fans want the fans
are fans forever, right, sothey want their coaches and their ads to
be at the schools forever. Butit doesn't work like that, right,

(11:18):
And if you're not an alum,and you put in six years of blood
and sweat like Pat Shunn had oreven like Jen Cohen had at you dubbed
for how long was she there intotal? Like fifteen years, seventeen years
and she went to Pou by theway, Oh that's right. So,
but they're not a lums. It'sa little different. You can't ask your
ad or your head coach to bethere forever, and fans sometimes forget that.

(11:41):
John. I want to read youa tweet here, and I'll read
it and then i'll tell you whowrote it after I'm done, okay,
and get your response to it.I think Dick knows who this came from.
Some jobs you just don't take.But now I understand and believe the
rumblings from inside the athletic department regardinghis poor relationships, greasy move by Pat

(12:01):
Chun, probably some celebrating going oninside the football office, and Bowler Jim
with his departure hashtag go Koob's.That was written by Ian Furness, who
does the show before Dick and Ione to three every day on this radio
station. What do you say toIan about those comments he made on Twitter
this afternoon. Well, again,I mean, I think, right,

(12:24):
you can't if you're an alum,you cannot expect your ad to be there
forever, especially if it's not analumnus. I think it's it'd be hard
for any Cougar fan to say PatChun didn't do a good job, right,
I mean, he's He's hired KyleSmith, he got through the Rollo
itch fiasco with COVID, and youknow their program. If you remove if

(12:50):
you just focus on the things thatwere within Chun's control, which is not
the collapse of the Pac twelve,they are in a much better spot.
He did a good job there,and it's a tough job. I could
understand Cougar fans being upsets, especiallygoing to the rival, especially after what
happened on August fourth, with whatWashington did, right, I mean why

(13:11):
it has been a tough slog forWashington State given the impact that Washington's decisions
have had on the Cougars. ButI don't think you can blame Patch on
at all. So now we getthe Cougar's in the situation the Huskies were
in not long ago. They haveno basketball coach, they have no athletic
director. Is is Kyle Smith theright fit at Stanford? And you surprise

(13:33):
he went there? No? Ithought that was the obvious. The only
surprise is that Stamford made the obviousmove. I thought he was a clear,
the clear candidate for them. Hewasn't going to want to coach in
the WCC again. He had beenat San Francisco for three years and Washington
State's playing in the WCC next year. Right, to me, the main
reason that he fits thought Stanford ishe spent six years at Columbia. Right.

(13:56):
He won twenty games two different timesat Columbia, so he is he
is used to recruiting with a highlyselective admissions process, right, and that's
crucial for Stanford. I think hewill do as well as anybody they could
have hired, given that they don'thave much leeway with the transfer portal.
I mean, they're kind of playingwith one hand tied behind their back in

(14:18):
football and men's basketball with the portalsituation. I don't think that's going to
change just because Kyle Smith's in there. But to me, that was he's
as good as hire as they couldhave made. All Right, We got
to get to the PJ Carlismo comments. We do we kind of bear like
Pat Shun folks. It forced usto bury the lead here, John.

(14:39):
I mean, if not for thatstory, we'd be knee deep in this
already. So I don't even knowhow to get to this by the way,
you just play it. We hadPJ. Carlismo on the radio show
yesterday, right, he's the formerSonic head coach. He lives in Seattle,
Seaton Hall. Does you know alot of radio work for Westwood One,
So whenever John, we need somebodyon talking college basketball or NBA.

(15:03):
You know, Pj's kind of oneof our guys. And so I think
you Dick asked about the Zags andhe just went off on this tangent about
a certain writer from the Bay Areathat's drawn his ire, the guy who
allegedly covers the PAC twelve. It'sthe Bay Area guy that for some reason,
the Seattle newspaper puts him in allthe time. All he wants to

(15:24):
write about his coaches on the hotseat and second guest the PAC twelve.
After the fact, he didn't supportyou know, he was saying they were
only going to get two teams in. He didn't support Colorado. He never
thought Oregon had a chance. Hedidn't think they were going to do as
well in the tournament as they have. And now you know today it's after
the fact, winners and losers,and like Tommy Lloyd didn't know what he

(15:46):
was doing. He got, youknow, his team to the Round of
sixteen two years ago with Danny.He and Danny were in the same place
at San Diego State when Tommy wontwo games. It really bothers me that
Seattle newspaper has got to bring someguy from the Bay Area it doesn't know
anything about basketball, and he writesall these gossip columns and to cover basketball.

(16:07):
But I read his stuff on thePAC twelve and it disappoints me.
I don't think he defended the conferenceenough. He second guessed it after the
fact. And I know he doesn'tknow anything about basketball from what he's written
about the coaches. And wow,he loves to do coaches on the hot
seat, which I hate some guyfrom the Bay Area who knows nothing about
basketball. Wow. But I readhis columns. I do read him on

(16:30):
a daily basis, though. Imean, John, we got to give
you a chance to defend yourself here. Powell, Well, I mean that
was the first thing he trashes me. And yet he says he's reading the
columns, so you're a winner.But he's he's the thing is I mean,
he's right. I have been criticalof the PAC twelve because the Pack
twelve is very good, and thedata supports that. Right, they wouldn't

(16:53):
have gotten four teams in the tournamentif Oregon hadn't won the won the PAC
twelve automatic bid. Right, Coacheson the hot seat? Yeah, guess
what, they're firing coaches left andright in the conference because the coaching wasn't
any good. I would say thisto PJ if he thinks the product is
so great. Why was the PACtwelve three and twenty four against ap top

(17:18):
twenty five teams? Why was itagainst other Power six teams? I should
say, why was it one andsix against the Mount West? Why did
it have a losing record head tohead against the WCC? Why are the
team seeded seven and ten and ten? Because it wasn't very good and it

(17:40):
wasn't very good because a lot ofthe coaching wasn't very good. And now
those coaches are getting fired and sothe I mean, the proof to me
is in the results on the court. And Johnny Lowe, I totally agree
with you, Carlo get your ticketsto the time. Yeah, I mean,
I love PJ, but on this, on this instance, I totally
agree with you because we're getting thesame thing in the ACC now, right,

(18:03):
all these ACC fans are coming.See the ACC was a great conference
this year. No, it wasn't. It was a bad conference that just
happened to get a couple of goodmatchups and play a couple of good games
in March. That doesn't validate whatthey did the last four months, right,
John, That absolutely. And thething is the pekwuov only has one
team in the Sweet sixteen, right, I mean, getting your teams in

(18:26):
the second round is a power conference. That's like the bare minimum. I
mean, you know, it's notlike these Colorado and Oregon are in the
final four. And I would alsosay that they those two teams, they
had better personnel than their seasons suggest. They underperformed. Now, injuries played

(18:47):
a little bit of a role,but I'd argue that Colorado and Oregon had
better personnel than ten seeds. Yes, So look, I love PGA two.
I think he's terrific. And whenhe comes on the NBR down here,
I think he's great. And Iremember him coaching Terry Gahare at Seaton
Hall. That's right, right,and Eton beatn to Arizona in the second
Sweet sixteen decades ago. I lovePJ and I'm I thank him for reading

(19:12):
my college. All right, pointWilner, we'll get We'll get PJ back
on and get that. All right, man, listen, great stuff,
just absolute chaos, amazing how muchis going on right now in college athletics.
And you know, I just I'lljust kind of leave you with this
that there's a lot of fans thatare just kind of disenfranchised right now.
Right Like, I'm friends with alot of Cougar fans that are like,

(19:33):
the hell with all this college footballis broken? Blah blah blah, and
all this movement, you know,is just kind of really wearing on people.
You know, we went through thisdick with Debor went through it with
Troy Dan, and you know,it's all gonna work out, I think
with the ad and the basketball coach. But what do you say to college
basketball fans and football fans, justcollege fans out there that are just kind
of pissed off at the whole thingright now? Well, Unfortunately, the

(19:57):
thing I say is it's only goingto get more chaotic because all the changes
that are happening the last year ortwo, it's only gonna get worse.
The transformation of college sports in thenext two or three years is gonna make
the last year or two look likeamateur hour, and that's It's unfortunate in

(20:19):
a lot of ways, but that'sthe direction the industry is headed, and
I totally get it. And thefact is, it is hard to be
to root for your players because they'rechanging every year, right And in some
ways women's basketball is in a muchbetter position than men's basketball on the college
level because there's not as much playerturnover and you can get behind them for

(20:41):
multiple years. The same players inyour team's you know, wereant. Men's
college basketball has got a big problemwith that, and I don't know how
it's gonna get solved because the transfersituation is just gonna get worse, no
doubt. The guy who allegedly coversthe PAC twelve, Oh man, John
will elected? Is that going inhis open? Now my life had been

(21:02):
alleged? Hey what not? Theguy who allegedly covers the PAC twelve?
You know what? That should beon your tombstone, by the way,
it's going in the open. Theguy who allegedly covers the PAC twelve,
All right, John, great stuff, man, don't let it beat it
down. I love you. We'retalking a week. I'll see you then.
Thanks a lot, guys. Allright, John Wilner with us.
We've got a break man. Howabout that? The big news of the

(21:25):
day, Pat Shun the new adat Washington. How do Cougar fans feel
about it? Four nine four fiveone. Hit us up now on ninety
three to three kJ RFM. Theguy who allegedly covers the Pac twelve