January 6, 2026 • 20 mins
Former Seahawks tackle Ray Roberts joins Dave Softy Mahler and Dick Fain to discuss the Seahawks amazing season so far, Mike Macdonald’s success as coach, the season for Sam Darnold, the running game’s turnaround, Charles Cross, and NFC contenders.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Here.
Speaker 2 (00:00):
He is a former Seahawk from nineteen ninety two to
nineteen ninety five, then finished his career as a member
of the Detroit Lions. It's been twenty five years, man,
unbelievable since Ray Roberts last put on a football helmet,
at least professionally.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
It's with us now on the air talking Hawks in
the NFL. Ray, how are you?
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Man? Man, I'm doing good.
Speaker 4 (00:21):
Just listen to the energy you guys have doing the headlines,
even with the coaching fire, and I'm over jacked up.
I'm like, man, they got me excited about the bad news.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Yeah, well, you know what, there ain't no bad news
if you're a Seahawk fan right now, big guy.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
It is awesome. And I guess the question.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Is this, and kind of all three of us agree
that this seems like the timeline for Mike McDonald to
have some real success in Seattle. Whatever you thought it
was gonna be, Ray, whatever John Schneider thought it was
gonna be, it feels like it's been accelerated right. Like,
I don't know if I saw this coming in year
two of the Mike McDonald regime.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
How about Yeah, I have to be honest with you,
because I thought maybe coming into the season they had
maybe ten wins and maybe squeak out a win the
end of the season to get into the playoffs. I
wasn't really sold on Sam Donald's at first, not that
I was sold on Gino either. I just wasn't told
that Sam donald was gonna be the guy. Didn't know
(01:22):
what they were going to do with the offensive line,
didn't know if the running game, this outside wide zone
thing was going to work here in Seattle. So there's
a lot of question marks I had going into it,
and I figured they would do, like the first year,
just try to figure it out as the season went on,
when they released players and cut players and traded players
and all this kind of stuff. But they were able
to kind of rally all that stuff together and kind
(01:44):
of get everyone all the arrows pointed in the right direction.
And to me, it's been pretty amazing, not only how
great they've played, but how the team has embraced the
essence of who coach McDonald is. Who's he's a very
serious football twenty four seven, three sixty five type of
a dude. Uh, and he's you know, he tries to
(02:04):
be very connected to the team. This team is very connected, tough,
physical football team, and to me, it's amazing how quickly
that took hold of this team.
Speaker 5 (02:13):
Well, he is raising the ranks right now and the
head coaches in the NFL, no question about it. What
impresses you the most about him and what you've seen
in the two years that he's been here.
Speaker 4 (02:24):
Uh, The thing that impresses two things. One is that
he has a very good idea of what it is
that he's looking for. Like he like he's not trying
to figure out what his system is, or what his
type of player is, or you know, all these different kinds.
He knows what he wants and he knows what it
looks like looks like when he sees it. So that's
why the first year, the two linebackers they had early,
(02:46):
they're able to just you know, move on past them
because they they didn't look like and do the things
that they needed to needed them to do. And then
the other part of it is as as kind of
straightforward and serious and locked in as he is, he's
also open to looking at things from a different perspective.
I thought that was interesting the first time I met him,
(03:09):
and he said that he gives the assistant coaches like
this leeway to kind of go down the rabbit hole
every now and again and go like, hey, man, I
think this might work. And that's sometimes when someone is
so locked into who they are, it's hard to get
them to see something else. But he wants the coaches
to have some agency and trying to be innovative in.
Speaker 1 (03:28):
What they do. And you know, Pete Carroll was more.
Speaker 4 (03:31):
Of like, this is how I'm doing it every day
of my life.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
This is how we're doing it.
Speaker 4 (03:36):
And Coach McDonald's like, this is how we're doing it.
But man, if that fits in how we're doing let's
try that too. And I thought that was pretty awesome
because it gives the assistant coaches some autonomy and then
you're able to pass that on to the players and
I think that creates a different type of atmosphere, a
different type of environment and culture to play under.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Yeah, well, Ray Roberts is with us, and Ray it's
a great point. And I'm really curious to see in
twenty five thirty years from now, you know, how willing
is Mike McDonald going to be to evolve, right, because
let's face it, I mean Pete Carroll was seventy years old.
Mike McDonald's are twelve, for God's sakes, right, So I
mean we are kind of seeing maybe a little bit
of a of a window, if you will, into what
(04:18):
maybe Pete Carroll would have been like when he was
thirty five years old versus mid sixties when he came
to Seattle. And I love the fact that they've got
this guy because you know, Ray Dick and I are
watching all these coaches get fired, We're hearing all these names.
It's the same stupid names that you hear every single year,
just get recycled over and over and over again. And
(04:40):
they got a guy here who is unique. He's innovative
as a pioneer, he's energetic, he's young, he's got great ideas.
I do wonder though, because with Pete Carroll, I think
we can honestly say a big part of their reason
that they had success on defense was because of the
skill they had on defense. Pete's scheme was phenomenal. No
doubt Pete was a great scheme out guy. But there's
(05:01):
hall of famers all over that Lob. I don't know
if we have those in Seattle. So how much of
this is scheme and how much of it is talent
in your opinion, But the way I look at.
Speaker 4 (05:11):
It is that they have the talent that fits the scheme,
and so it's both and because, like you said, it's
not like they have at this point a bunch of
Hall of Famers back there, like you could project with
the Legion of Boom, But they have dudes that fit
exactly how they want to play. Emon Worry is an example.
They like guys that can do multiple things. They don't
(05:32):
want to necessarily have one player that has only one
thing that he can bring to the defense. So you
see some of those outside linebackers dropping in the coverage.
They can rush the quarterback, they can play the run.
You have defensive linemen that can do the same. You
have linebackers that can cover and then also fill the
gap and make tough tackles along.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
The line of scrimmage.
Speaker 4 (05:49):
You got a guy like Witherspoon who can play anywhere
in the secondary. You got a guy like Julian Love
who can come down into the box but play deep
or in play the safety. Kobe Bryant the same way.
So he loves of guys that can bring multiple things
to the defense, but then play within this scheme that
they have, and and then even more than that is
(06:10):
I just love like the forty nine er game. I
can't even remember a mistackle. I can't remember a guy
even falling forward as he was getting tackled. And so
that to me says a lot about he has this
thing in the down at the BMAC that we want
to play like no one else wants to play basically,
(06:31):
and that's what they did against the forty nine ers.
They played a tough, physical football game. And then on
the oppositive line, it's starting to kind of it's starting
to kind of pick up as they start. They're starting
to get their momentum in the run game, and they
figured out what they can and can't do. They're starting
to get some of that physicality along the offensive line too.
Speaker 5 (06:48):
Ray, you said at the beginning here that you weren't
sold on Sam Donald the beginning of the season.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
What sold you on Sam?
Speaker 5 (06:55):
Because there are still Seahawks fans that aren't sold on
Sam Donald after going fourteen and three here.
Speaker 4 (07:01):
Yeah, Well, I think one of the things is like,
and my even my perspective of it, I'm thinking, like, man,
they need to bring a quarterback in here, who is
like the guy like he's gonna be like like one
of these dudes that can, you know, pull the rabbit
out of the hat whenever time, every time you even
if you want him to or not. And then what
I came to realize is Sam Donald is not that,
(07:22):
but he is a dude that can make pros. And
in the crunch time, when you can give him some
layups to kind of get the game started and get
him into a rhythm, he becomes deadly. This dude has
like especially early in the season, the first half of
the season. Uh, you know, been on the show with
Brian Walters and Michael Bumpus. They're like, man, the ball
is catching the receiver. That's that's what the placement of
(07:43):
the ball he's He's putting it only where the JS
San or Cooper Cup whoever can catch it, and it's
catching them. They all all they have to do is
put their hands up. So he has that type of ability.
And then even with the you know, throughout the season,
every player like that's very rarely a player that's just
kind of kill it entower season and not have at
least one or two little hiccups. And so he had
(08:04):
his little hiccups, but he was able to recover from that.
And I don't think that you're asking him to win
the game necessarily, and you're not, but you're asking him
not to lose it. But even in that, you want
him to play free and I think he I think
they've been able to do that. And if they get
this running game going, yeah, and then get back to
the play action pass and you know, helping move in
(08:25):
the pocket and taking the shots down the field. Man,
the Scott's the limit for this offense. That's why it's
not Sam Darnold, it's the offense.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
I totally Ray Roberts is with us, And you just
led me perfectly into the next question, Ray, because I
was going to ask you about the running game, right.
I mean, this was a problem about a month and
a half ago. You know, it's all we talked about. Man,
these guys can't run the ball for Jack squat. You know,
is is it going to change? Is this is this
who they are? Is there time to change it? And
I think most people we talked to kind of said, hey, man,
(08:54):
it's kind of getting to that point of the year
where this is what it is, and then they pop
for a buck seventy one against the Rams, one hundred
and sixty three against Carolina, and one hundred and eighty
against the Niners, which is all season high. So are
you buying that the running game has had some kind
of rebirth here in Seattle?
Speaker 3 (09:13):
Is it bad defenses that they're playing? What gives it?
Speaker 1 (09:18):
Could be a.
Speaker 4 (09:18):
Little bit of both, you know what I'm saying. But
as long as it's given the guys confidence that they
can do the stuff, then that's all that matters to me.
The thing that the way they view the running game
is kind of like a big heavyweight boxing match. They're
just throwing body blows with the running game and then eventually,
you know, people break, whether that's in the passing game
or or you know, running the football. And even in
(09:38):
early in the season when the individual running backs weren't
putting up big yardish at the end of the game,
they were finishing with close to one hundred yards rushing
between the two of them and Sam Darnold every now
and again using using his legs. And then the running
game has been impactful in that it was they were
crowding the line of scrimmits on defense and then biting
on all of those wide zones. They moved the pocket,
(10:00):
take a shot deep, and it was working that way.
But then I think people started going, man, I think
that's kind of like pulling the wall over. I with
this run game, two tight ends like type thing, and
they're actually trying to throw the ball. And I think
they kind of shifted a little bit and took some
of that away. But here's what I will tell you.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
The year that the.
Speaker 4 (10:18):
Indianapolis coach won their first Super Bowl, they averaged about
maybe eighty yards a game rushing for the regular season
until the last regular season game, I think it was
the last two, they rushed for about one hundred and
maybe ten twenty yards a game, and then from that
point on they led the entire playoffs in rushing. They
averaged about one hundred and forty yards a game running
(10:39):
the football. And Howard Mudd, who was my coach here,
offensive line coach here, was the offensive line coach there.
And so I called Howard and I'm like, man, like,
what happened?
Speaker 1 (10:47):
And he said, we.
Speaker 4 (10:48):
Found like these two or three running plays that our
guys felt good about and we're making yards on and
we just addressed it up in a bunch of different formations,
and then that is what propelled them to the Super
Bowl to win. It is because they got the running
game going, and so it doesn't matter that it didn't
work for the last sixteen weeks. What matters is that
it's starting to work now. And if it starts to
(11:10):
work now, the teams that can run the football and
the playoffs are the teams that go to the Super Bowl.
Speaker 5 (11:15):
The first of this new breed of Hawks has gotten
paid four years, one hundred and four million at your
old position, Charles Cross. I mean, is this a guy
that when you watch him play, does he still have
upside or is what we're seeing in Charles Cross now
pretty much what we're going to get from Charles Cross.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
No, I think he has some still from upside, because
I don't know that he has like much short in
his ability to be a physical run blocker all the time.
So the last couple of years he started the season
off like really physical like that. I don't know if
it was this year or last year, the first four
or five games or something like. If you follow the
(11:53):
pro football focused stuff, he was like the highest rated
lineman in the league for like running and run blocking
end pass blocking, and then it just started to kind
of dwindle down. And I think, I don't know if
that's a matter of just like your maturity as the
season going is going on and you're doing enough self
scouting and really challenging yourself to be to be better,
or if he gets nicked up here and there. But
(12:14):
I will say it's hard to maximize your potential when
you've had two or three or four different offensive line coach,
two or three different you know, offensive systems, and you're
trying to like everyone's language is just a little bit different,
and what they're asking to do may not be exactly
how you did it the year before, and so it
takes a while to kind of grasp what other people
are teaching you and then make that part of what
(12:36):
you do. So I still think that's some upside. There's
some like even just in this past protection, like when
you get power rush sometimes it's kind of this this
weakness get bull a guide rush speed the power So
they rush real hard up to feel like they're trying
to go around the corner, and it just turned right unto.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Them put their face in his chest.
Speaker 4 (12:54):
Like sometimes he has a little bit of trouble handling that,
and then just in the run blocking, I think he
can be a much better run blocker than he's been,
even though he's been better than he was when he
first out here.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
Well, we got Ray another week and a half or so.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
You know, I think a lot of us think the
Hawks will play on Saturday, But you know whatever, we're
talking roughly a week and a half between now and
their next game, and Charles has not played. I think
he got hurt in a cult game, right, and he
missed the RAM game Miss Carolina, missed the Niners. So
he's gonna have a month off the hamstring injury. Have
you ever played with a hamstring injury like that? And
is that something for him that might still be lingering
(13:30):
in the postseason and he'll have to just deal with
that or is that something that you expect to be
totally healed by next weekend.
Speaker 4 (13:38):
Well, let me just first put it to you this way, softy,
I don't know if I have muscles in my hamstring,
So I probably.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
Had a Hey I'm talking twenty five years ago, not today,
by the way.
Speaker 4 (13:47):
I probably had. I probably had a beat fat pool
or something, And I don't know. I don't know if
I had a hamstring pool, but I have a son
that plays that played at Portland State and he plays
offensive line and he the hamstring and it did take
a while because you know, you get a even when
it's healed, you still feel like man, like if I explode,
you know, off the ball, is it gonna tear again
(14:10):
or rip again or strain again, or if it's a
little bit tight, you got.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
To make sure it's warmed up. And it's one of
those things.
Speaker 4 (14:14):
That you gotta you have to be real close to
like ninety five ninety nine percent ready to go, because
if you don't, you just keep re injuring it, and
you just it'll just never get healthy. And so hopefully
with this time off with the advances and like how
they how they do things these days. Uh. And you
know he's a big guy like I. You know, come
(14:35):
on now, the hamstring can't be too damaged. We don't
explode off the ball that much, you know, to tear
it that bad. So Uh, but I think he'll be fine.
I think if if he can get out there, move around,
feel comfortable with it, uh, and have confidence in it,
and he's able to go, I think he'll be fine.
Speaker 5 (14:52):
Ray, I'm petrified by the Rams.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
Uh.
Speaker 5 (14:54):
Softy raised a good point though. Last second, he's like,
you know, the Rams have not exactly been the Rams
for a good in the last four to six weeks.
Speaker 3 (15:01):
So are you scared like I am?
Speaker 5 (15:04):
Or do you think that maybe the Rams aren't the
same team they were the first three months of the season,
and we can take care of business against them if
we have to play well.
Speaker 4 (15:13):
The thing is that, uh, the first time we played
the Rams, we're maybe like two yards away from beating them.
You get a two yards closer, you probably make the
field go so you and so you're probably one play
from being undefeated against the Rams this year. And then
even with the forty nine ers, you're one fumbled away
with less than two minutes left in the game to
(15:35):
beat them twice. And so I think people, you know,
when they try to figure out who's the best team
and who who has is the most dangerous team and
all this stuff, they may overlook that that the Seahawks
could possibly with two plays being successful, they could be
four to no against the forty nine ers and the
and the Rams. And so, yeah, the Rams scare me
(15:56):
because they're uh their offensive like prowess. It's pretty amazing,
Like just the way they can scheme guys open. They
do a really good job running the football, even though
the fields have done a pretty good job shutting them down.
And then Sam down on his phone what six and happens.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
In two games?
Speaker 4 (16:12):
So you know that's what kills the field's offense against them.
It's the turnovers. Otherwise I think they go toe to toe.
And then if they're going toe to toe at our
whole field, I'm taking us every time.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Well, I'm glad you brought up the darnold thing before
you go, Ray Ray Roberts with us. You know, I
gotta tell you, I had a photo of you and me,
remember the time that you and I did Radio Row
in Jacksonville.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
Together, way back in the day.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
We were down there and I got a picture of
you and me on radio Row, and I'm smiling my
fat ass off.
Speaker 3 (16:37):
And I was fat back then, by the way, all right,
I was like Orca fat. Back then.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
You had a look on your face that you would
have rather been anywhere else besides sitting next to me
on Radio Row in Jacksonville. Yes, I mean, I'm not
saying that you felt like that. That's just what the
picture looks like. I gotta send this picture to you.
And there's some people that when they look at Sam
Darnald they have the same look that you had on
(17:03):
your face in Jacksonville because they expect him to turn
the ball over every time he drops back to pass.
And my question to you is this, he's got He's
got twenty turnovers, right, guys, which leaves the NFL?
Speaker 3 (17:14):
Is that correct? Seven of them?
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Seven of them came over a two week period in
back to back games against Arizona and the Rams. So
does Sam Donald really have a turnover problem or is
his are his numbers may be a little bit jacked
up because he just played terribly for eight quarters.
Speaker 4 (17:35):
I think he just not think he just had a
bad stretch there for for eight quarters. Some like I
think one or two of the interceptions for a tip.
But then sometimes like the one against the Rams, I
think the guy took back for an interception that was
great coverage, Like it looks like the slot, the guy
over the slot is going to follow the slot, so
you're trying to throw the slant behind him, but the
guy just stopped. He didn't follow the slot. Receiver he
(17:55):
just stops. You end up throwing the ball right to him,
and so you think like, oh, man, like he the
whole sand ghost thing.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
But it wasn't.
Speaker 4 (18:02):
It's just like great defense in that situation, you know.
And but I think Sam would tell you himself that
you know, he can't. He can't afford the turnovers. Really,
that is the only thing that will give the Seawks,
will guarantee that they won't get to.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
The super Bowl. It's the turnovers, because the defense.
Speaker 4 (18:19):
Is going to keep the score at a place where
the offense is going to always be in it. But
the offense is going to have to do their point
part and finish drives with touchdowns, not field goals, because
that that first Rams game, they kick what like six
field goals or something, and so it's like you can't
win in the playoffs kicking five six field goals.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
You gotta score some touchdowns.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
And so I think that's where Sam Darnold is gonna
And I don't want Sam to play scared either.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
I don't.
Speaker 4 (18:46):
I don't want him to play like, oh, like, I
can't lose the game. I can't throw an interception, because
he is he has thrown some amazing dimes all season long,
and so I want him to be that Sam and
still play that way. And but obviously, you know, protect
the ball, like if some of the interception he was
trying to make the play throwing off his back foot
like that kind of stuff, and he wasn't doing that
(19:07):
early in the season, and so the protection is part
of that as well. Like early in the season, man,
there was like I could have stepped up in the pocket.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
In some of those uh spaces where he's throw in
the football.
Speaker 4 (19:16):
Then later in the season there was more push in
the middle of the offense and so he couldn't step
in the throws and that type of stuff. So it's
never like one singular thing that is uh causing that,
you know, some of these things that happen. Sometimes there's pressure,
sometimes there's a tip football, sometimes there's great defense, and
then other times you'd be like, what the hell are
you doing? You know, so, uh, it's a little bit
(19:37):
of all of that.
Speaker 3 (19:38):
I'm gonna I'm gonna find this picture and said.
Speaker 1 (19:43):
I want to.
Speaker 4 (19:43):
I mean because I always thought that that was like
one of the coolest coolest things was to go there
and do that, like I talk about it, you know,
all the time, and so it just probably just caught
me at a at a weird time.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
Uh you know, I don't know.
Speaker 4 (19:54):
I'll probably trying to look at all the stars and
stuff that were walking through that.
Speaker 3 (19:59):
That's a different one.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
That's a different thing to show you how fat I
was there by the way, all right, Ray, you're the man.
Speaker 3 (20:05):
Great stuff. Go Hawks and we'll talk soon, buddy.
Speaker 4 (20:08):
Absolutely hit me up when you need me by button.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Ray Roberts with us. We're gonna break good stuff from Ray,
come back and react to it. We got John Willer
joining us A five on ninety three three k j
R F M
Here.
Speaker 2 (00:00):
He is a former Seahawk from nineteen ninety two to
nineteen ninety five, then finished his career as a member
of the Detroit Lions. It's been twenty five years, man,
unbelievable since Ray Roberts last put on a football helmet,
at least professionally.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
It's with us now on the air talking Hawks in
the NFL. Ray, how are you?
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Man? Man, I'm doing good.
Speaker 4 (00:21):
Just listen to the energy you guys have doing the headlines,
even with the coaching fire, and I'm over jacked up.
I'm like, man, they got me excited about the bad news.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Yeah, well, you know what, there ain't no bad news
if you're a Seahawk fan right now, big guy.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
It is awesome. And I guess the question.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Is this, and kind of all three of us agree
that this seems like the timeline for Mike McDonald to
have some real success in Seattle. Whatever you thought it
was gonna be, Ray, whatever John Schneider thought it was
gonna be, it feels like it's been accelerated right. Like,
I don't know if I saw this coming in year
two of the Mike McDonald regime.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
How about Yeah, I have to be honest with you,
because I thought maybe coming into the season they had
maybe ten wins and maybe squeak out a win the
end of the season to get into the playoffs. I
wasn't really sold on Sam Donald's at first, not that
I was sold on Gino either. I just wasn't told
that Sam donald was gonna be the guy. Didn't know
(01:22):
what they were going to do with the offensive line,
didn't know if the running game, this outside wide zone
thing was going to work here in Seattle. So there's
a lot of question marks I had going into it,
and I figured they would do, like the first year,
just try to figure it out as the season went on,
when they released players and cut players and traded players
and all this kind of stuff. But they were able
to kind of rally all that stuff together and kind
(01:44):
of get everyone all the arrows pointed in the right direction.
And to me, it's been pretty amazing, not only how
great they've played, but how the team has embraced the
essence of who coach McDonald is. Who's he's a very
serious football twenty four seven, three sixty five type of
a dude. Uh, and he's you know, he tries to
(02:04):
be very connected to the team. This team is very connected, tough,
physical football team, and to me, it's amazing how quickly
that took hold of this team.
Speaker 5 (02:13):
Well, he is raising the ranks right now and the
head coaches in the NFL, no question about it. What
impresses you the most about him and what you've seen
in the two years that he's been here.
Speaker 4 (02:24):
Uh, The thing that impresses two things. One is that
he has a very good idea of what it is
that he's looking for. Like he like he's not trying
to figure out what his system is, or what his
type of player is, or you know, all these different kinds.
He knows what he wants and he knows what it
looks like looks like when he sees it. So that's
why the first year, the two linebackers they had early,
(02:46):
they're able to just you know, move on past them
because they they didn't look like and do the things
that they needed to needed them to do. And then
the other part of it is as as kind of
straightforward and serious and locked in as he is, he's
also open to looking at things from a different perspective.
I thought that was interesting the first time I met him,
(03:09):
and he said that he gives the assistant coaches like
this leeway to kind of go down the rabbit hole
every now and again and go like, hey, man, I
think this might work. And that's sometimes when someone is
so locked into who they are, it's hard to get
them to see something else. But he wants the coaches
to have some agency and trying to be innovative in.
Speaker 1 (03:28):
What they do. And you know, Pete Carroll was more.
Speaker 4 (03:31):
Of like, this is how I'm doing it every day
of my life.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
This is how we're doing it.
Speaker 4 (03:36):
And Coach McDonald's like, this is how we're doing it.
But man, if that fits in how we're doing let's
try that too. And I thought that was pretty awesome
because it gives the assistant coaches some autonomy and then
you're able to pass that on to the players and
I think that creates a different type of atmosphere, a
different type of environment and culture to play under.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Yeah, well, Ray Roberts is with us, and Ray it's
a great point. And I'm really curious to see in
twenty five thirty years from now, you know, how willing
is Mike McDonald going to be to evolve, right, because
let's face it, I mean Pete Carroll was seventy years old.
Mike McDonald's are twelve, for God's sakes, right, So I
mean we are kind of seeing maybe a little bit
of a of a window, if you will, into what
(04:18):
maybe Pete Carroll would have been like when he was
thirty five years old versus mid sixties when he came
to Seattle. And I love the fact that they've got
this guy because you know, Ray Dick and I are
watching all these coaches get fired, We're hearing all these names.
It's the same stupid names that you hear every single year,
just get recycled over and over and over again. And
(04:40):
they got a guy here who is unique. He's innovative
as a pioneer, he's energetic, he's young, he's got great ideas.
I do wonder though, because with Pete Carroll, I think
we can honestly say a big part of their reason
that they had success on defense was because of the
skill they had on defense. Pete's scheme was phenomenal. No
doubt Pete was a great scheme out guy. But there's
(05:01):
hall of famers all over that Lob. I don't know
if we have those in Seattle. So how much of
this is scheme and how much of it is talent
in your opinion, But the way I look at.
Speaker 4 (05:11):
It is that they have the talent that fits the scheme,
and so it's both and because, like you said, it's
not like they have at this point a bunch of
Hall of Famers back there, like you could project with
the Legion of Boom, But they have dudes that fit
exactly how they want to play. Emon Worry is an example.
They like guys that can do multiple things. They don't
(05:32):
want to necessarily have one player that has only one
thing that he can bring to the defense. So you
see some of those outside linebackers dropping in the coverage.
They can rush the quarterback, they can play the run.
You have defensive linemen that can do the same. You
have linebackers that can cover and then also fill the
gap and make tough tackles along.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
The line of scrimmage.
Speaker 4 (05:49):
You got a guy like Witherspoon who can play anywhere
in the secondary. You got a guy like Julian Love
who can come down into the box but play deep
or in play the safety. Kobe Bryant the same way.
So he loves of guys that can bring multiple things
to the defense, but then play within this scheme that
they have, and and then even more than that is
(06:10):
I just love like the forty nine er game. I
can't even remember a mistackle. I can't remember a guy
even falling forward as he was getting tackled. And so
that to me says a lot about he has this
thing in the down at the BMAC that we want
to play like no one else wants to play basically,
(06:31):
and that's what they did against the forty nine ers.
They played a tough, physical football game. And then on
the oppositive line, it's starting to kind of it's starting
to kind of pick up as they start. They're starting
to get their momentum in the run game, and they
figured out what they can and can't do. They're starting
to get some of that physicality along the offensive line too.
Speaker 5 (06:48):
Ray, you said at the beginning here that you weren't
sold on Sam Donald the beginning of the season.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
What sold you on Sam?
Speaker 5 (06:55):
Because there are still Seahawks fans that aren't sold on
Sam Donald after going fourteen and three here.
Speaker 4 (07:01):
Yeah, Well, I think one of the things is like,
and my even my perspective of it, I'm thinking, like, man,
they need to bring a quarterback in here, who is
like the guy like he's gonna be like like one
of these dudes that can, you know, pull the rabbit
out of the hat whenever time, every time you even
if you want him to or not. And then what
I came to realize is Sam Donald is not that,
(07:22):
but he is a dude that can make pros. And
in the crunch time, when you can give him some
layups to kind of get the game started and get
him into a rhythm, he becomes deadly. This dude has
like especially early in the season, the first half of
the season. Uh, you know, been on the show with
Brian Walters and Michael Bumpus. They're like, man, the ball
is catching the receiver. That's that's what the placement of
(07:43):
the ball he's He's putting it only where the JS
San or Cooper Cup whoever can catch it, and it's
catching them. They all all they have to do is
put their hands up. So he has that type of ability.
And then even with the you know, throughout the season,
every player like that's very rarely a player that's just
kind of kill it entower season and not have at
least one or two little hiccups. And so he had
(08:04):
his little hiccups, but he was able to recover from that.
And I don't think that you're asking him to win
the game necessarily, and you're not, but you're asking him
not to lose it. But even in that, you want
him to play free and I think he I think
they've been able to do that. And if they get
this running game going, yeah, and then get back to
the play action pass and you know, helping move in
(08:25):
the pocket and taking the shots down the field. Man,
the Scott's the limit for this offense. That's why it's
not Sam Darnold, it's the offense.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
I totally Ray Roberts is with us, And you just
led me perfectly into the next question, Ray, because I
was going to ask you about the running game, right.
I mean, this was a problem about a month and
a half ago. You know, it's all we talked about. Man,
these guys can't run the ball for Jack squat. You know,
is is it going to change? Is this is this
who they are? Is there time to change it? And
I think most people we talked to kind of said, hey, man,
(08:54):
it's kind of getting to that point of the year
where this is what it is, and then they pop
for a buck seventy one against the Rams, one hundred
and sixty three against Carolina, and one hundred and eighty
against the Niners, which is all season high. So are
you buying that the running game has had some kind
of rebirth here in Seattle?
Speaker 3 (09:13):
Is it bad defenses that they're playing? What gives it?
Speaker 1 (09:18):
Could be a.
Speaker 4 (09:18):
Little bit of both, you know what I'm saying. But
as long as it's given the guys confidence that they
can do the stuff, then that's all that matters to me.
The thing that the way they view the running game
is kind of like a big heavyweight boxing match. They're
just throwing body blows with the running game and then eventually,
you know, people break, whether that's in the passing game
or or you know, running the football. And even in
(09:38):
early in the season when the individual running backs weren't
putting up big yardish at the end of the game,
they were finishing with close to one hundred yards rushing
between the two of them and Sam Darnold every now
and again using using his legs. And then the running
game has been impactful in that it was they were
crowding the line of scrimmits on defense and then biting
on all of those wide zones. They moved the pocket,
(10:00):
take a shot deep, and it was working that way.
But then I think people started going, man, I think
that's kind of like pulling the wall over. I with
this run game, two tight ends like type thing, and
they're actually trying to throw the ball. And I think
they kind of shifted a little bit and took some
of that away. But here's what I will tell you.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
The year that the.
Speaker 4 (10:18):
Indianapolis coach won their first Super Bowl, they averaged about
maybe eighty yards a game rushing for the regular season
until the last regular season game, I think it was
the last two, they rushed for about one hundred and
maybe ten twenty yards a game, and then from that
point on they led the entire playoffs in rushing. They
averaged about one hundred and forty yards a game running
(10:39):
the football. And Howard Mudd, who was my coach here,
offensive line coach here, was the offensive line coach there.
And so I called Howard and I'm like, man, like,
what happened?
Speaker 1 (10:47):
And he said, we.
Speaker 4 (10:48):
Found like these two or three running plays that our
guys felt good about and we're making yards on and
we just addressed it up in a bunch of different formations,
and then that is what propelled them to the Super
Bowl to win. It is because they got the running
game going, and so it doesn't matter that it didn't
work for the last sixteen weeks. What matters is that
it's starting to work now. And if it starts to
(11:10):
work now, the teams that can run the football and
the playoffs are the teams that go to the Super Bowl.
Speaker 5 (11:15):
The first of this new breed of Hawks has gotten
paid four years, one hundred and four million at your
old position, Charles Cross. I mean, is this a guy
that when you watch him play, does he still have
upside or is what we're seeing in Charles Cross now
pretty much what we're going to get from Charles Cross.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
No, I think he has some still from upside, because
I don't know that he has like much short in
his ability to be a physical run blocker all the time.
So the last couple of years he started the season
off like really physical like that. I don't know if
it was this year or last year, the first four
or five games or something like. If you follow the
(11:53):
pro football focused stuff, he was like the highest rated
lineman in the league for like running and run blocking
end pass blocking, and then it just started to kind
of dwindle down. And I think, I don't know if
that's a matter of just like your maturity as the
season going is going on and you're doing enough self
scouting and really challenging yourself to be to be better,
or if he gets nicked up here and there. But
(12:14):
I will say it's hard to maximize your potential when
you've had two or three or four different offensive line coach,
two or three different you know, offensive systems, and you're
trying to like everyone's language is just a little bit different,
and what they're asking to do may not be exactly
how you did it the year before, and so it
takes a while to kind of grasp what other people
are teaching you and then make that part of what
(12:36):
you do. So I still think that's some upside. There's
some like even just in this past protection, like when
you get power rush sometimes it's kind of this this
weakness get bull a guide rush speed the power So
they rush real hard up to feel like they're trying
to go around the corner, and it just turned right unto.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Them put their face in his chest.
Speaker 4 (12:54):
Like sometimes he has a little bit of trouble handling that,
and then just in the run blocking, I think he
can be a much better run blocker than he's been,
even though he's been better than he was when he
first out here.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
Well, we got Ray another week and a half or so.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
You know, I think a lot of us think the
Hawks will play on Saturday, But you know whatever, we're
talking roughly a week and a half between now and
their next game, and Charles has not played. I think
he got hurt in a cult game, right, and he
missed the RAM game Miss Carolina, missed the Niners. So
he's gonna have a month off the hamstring injury. Have
you ever played with a hamstring injury like that? And
is that something for him that might still be lingering
(13:30):
in the postseason and he'll have to just deal with
that or is that something that you expect to be
totally healed by next weekend.
Speaker 4 (13:38):
Well, let me just first put it to you this way, softy,
I don't know if I have muscles in my hamstring,
So I probably.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
Had a Hey I'm talking twenty five years ago, not today,
by the way.
Speaker 4 (13:47):
I probably had. I probably had a beat fat pool
or something, And I don't know. I don't know if
I had a hamstring pool, but I have a son
that plays that played at Portland State and he plays
offensive line and he the hamstring and it did take
a while because you know, you get a even when
it's healed, you still feel like man, like if I explode,
you know, off the ball, is it gonna tear again
(14:10):
or rip again or strain again, or if it's a
little bit tight, you got.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
To make sure it's warmed up. And it's one of
those things.
Speaker 4 (14:14):
That you gotta you have to be real close to
like ninety five ninety nine percent ready to go, because
if you don't, you just keep re injuring it, and
you just it'll just never get healthy. And so hopefully
with this time off with the advances and like how
they how they do things these days. Uh. And you
know he's a big guy like I. You know, come
(14:35):
on now, the hamstring can't be too damaged. We don't
explode off the ball that much, you know, to tear
it that bad. So Uh, but I think he'll be fine.
I think if if he can get out there, move around,
feel comfortable with it, uh, and have confidence in it,
and he's able to go, I think he'll be fine.
Speaker 5 (14:52):
Ray, I'm petrified by the Rams.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
Uh.
Speaker 5 (14:54):
Softy raised a good point though. Last second, he's like,
you know, the Rams have not exactly been the Rams
for a good in the last four to six weeks.
Speaker 3 (15:01):
So are you scared like I am?
Speaker 5 (15:04):
Or do you think that maybe the Rams aren't the
same team they were the first three months of the season,
and we can take care of business against them if
we have to play well.
Speaker 4 (15:13):
The thing is that, uh, the first time we played
the Rams, we're maybe like two yards away from beating them.
You get a two yards closer, you probably make the
field go so you and so you're probably one play
from being undefeated against the Rams this year. And then
even with the forty nine ers, you're one fumbled away
with less than two minutes left in the game to
(15:35):
beat them twice. And so I think people, you know,
when they try to figure out who's the best team
and who who has is the most dangerous team and
all this stuff, they may overlook that that the Seahawks
could possibly with two plays being successful, they could be
four to no against the forty nine ers and the
and the Rams. And so, yeah, the Rams scare me
(15:56):
because they're uh their offensive like prowess. It's pretty amazing,
Like just the way they can scheme guys open. They
do a really good job running the football, even though
the fields have done a pretty good job shutting them down.
And then Sam down on his phone what six and happens.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
In two games?
Speaker 4 (16:12):
So you know that's what kills the field's offense against them.
It's the turnovers. Otherwise I think they go toe to toe.
And then if they're going toe to toe at our
whole field, I'm taking us every time.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Well, I'm glad you brought up the darnold thing before
you go, Ray Ray Roberts with us. You know, I
gotta tell you, I had a photo of you and me,
remember the time that you and I did Radio Row
in Jacksonville.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
Together, way back in the day.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
We were down there and I got a picture of
you and me on radio Row, and I'm smiling my
fat ass off.
Speaker 3 (16:37):
And I was fat back then, by the way, all right,
I was like Orca fat. Back then.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
You had a look on your face that you would
have rather been anywhere else besides sitting next to me
on Radio Row in Jacksonville. Yes, I mean, I'm not
saying that you felt like that. That's just what the
picture looks like. I gotta send this picture to you.
And there's some people that when they look at Sam
Darnald they have the same look that you had on
(17:03):
your face in Jacksonville because they expect him to turn
the ball over every time he drops back to pass.
And my question to you is this, he's got He's
got twenty turnovers, right, guys, which leaves the NFL?
Speaker 3 (17:14):
Is that correct? Seven of them?
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Seven of them came over a two week period in
back to back games against Arizona and the Rams. So
does Sam Donald really have a turnover problem or is
his are his numbers may be a little bit jacked
up because he just played terribly for eight quarters.
Speaker 4 (17:35):
I think he just not think he just had a
bad stretch there for for eight quarters. Some like I
think one or two of the interceptions for a tip.
But then sometimes like the one against the Rams, I
think the guy took back for an interception that was
great coverage, Like it looks like the slot, the guy
over the slot is going to follow the slot, so
you're trying to throw the slant behind him, but the
guy just stopped. He didn't follow the slot. Receiver he
(17:55):
just stops. You end up throwing the ball right to him,
and so you think like, oh, man, like he the
whole sand ghost thing.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
But it wasn't.
Speaker 4 (18:02):
It's just like great defense in that situation, you know.
And but I think Sam would tell you himself that
you know, he can't. He can't afford the turnovers. Really,
that is the only thing that will give the Seawks,
will guarantee that they won't get to.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
The super Bowl. It's the turnovers, because the defense.
Speaker 4 (18:19):
Is going to keep the score at a place where
the offense is going to always be in it. But
the offense is going to have to do their point
part and finish drives with touchdowns, not field goals, because
that that first Rams game, they kick what like six
field goals or something, and so it's like you can't
win in the playoffs kicking five six field goals.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
You gotta score some touchdowns.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
And so I think that's where Sam Darnold is gonna
And I don't want Sam to play scared either.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
I don't.
Speaker 4 (18:46):
I don't want him to play like, oh, like, I
can't lose the game. I can't throw an interception, because
he is he has thrown some amazing dimes all season long,
and so I want him to be that Sam and
still play that way. And but obviously, you know, protect
the ball, like if some of the interception he was
trying to make the play throwing off his back foot
like that kind of stuff, and he wasn't doing that
(19:07):
early in the season, and so the protection is part
of that as well. Like early in the season, man,
there was like I could have stepped up in the pocket.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
In some of those uh spaces where he's throw in
the football.
Speaker 4 (19:16):
Then later in the season there was more push in
the middle of the offense and so he couldn't step
in the throws and that type of stuff. So it's
never like one singular thing that is uh causing that,
you know, some of these things that happen. Sometimes there's pressure,
sometimes there's a tip football, sometimes there's great defense, and
then other times you'd be like, what the hell are
you doing? You know, so, uh, it's a little bit
(19:37):
of all of that.
Speaker 3 (19:38):
I'm gonna I'm gonna find this picture and said.
Speaker 1 (19:43):
I want to.
Speaker 4 (19:43):
I mean because I always thought that that was like
one of the coolest coolest things was to go there
and do that, like I talk about it, you know,
all the time, and so it just probably just caught
me at a at a weird time.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
Uh you know, I don't know.
Speaker 4 (19:54):
I'll probably trying to look at all the stars and
stuff that were walking through that.
Speaker 3 (19:59):
That's a different one.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
That's a different thing to show you how fat I
was there by the way, all right, Ray, you're the man.
Speaker 3 (20:05):
Great stuff. Go Hawks and we'll talk soon, buddy.
Speaker 4 (20:08):
Absolutely hit me up when you need me by button.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Ray Roberts with us. We're gonna break good stuff from Ray,
come back and react to it. We got John Willer
joining us A five on ninety three three k j
R F M
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