August 20, 2024 • 46 mins
The Athletic’s Dianna Russini joined the show to discuss the expectations around the New York Jets heading into 2024. And MLB analyst Tim Kurkjian stops by to break down the potential of a six-inning mandate for starting pitchers and Shohei Ohtani's pursuit of a 50/50 season.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Sports Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
It's Day two from the Main Cave. Some of the
headlines here, justin Herbert cleared to practice for the Chargers,
Planter Fasciidis, Jade and Daniels named the starter for the Commanders.
You're probably gonna have Bo Nix, who's going to be
the starter for the Denver Broncos. We're going to bring
back something Tom Brady said over the weekend where he's
(00:25):
talking about quarterbacks and dumbing down quarterbacks and trying to
get them to play early, which I don't agree with
what Tom is saying, but I'll let you hear what
Tom has to say, and then you'll hear what I
have to say as far as disagreeing with that. But
you have these quarterbacks. Jaden Daniels has been a professional.
Caleb Williams has been a professional. Bo Nix has been
(00:48):
a professional. Jaden Daniels with two different universities, Bo Nicks
with two different universities, Caleb Williams with two different universities.
This is different. They've had fifty plus starts in college.
They're ready. They're ready now. It didn't used to be
that way. But then that's when it took quarterbacks maybe
one or two years to get acclimated to a system.
(01:10):
Maybe they played in year three. Carson Palmer, number one pick,
didn't play his first year. John Kittna was the starting quarterback.
Things have changed, and I think that's what Tom is
looking at the way it used to be for him
as opposed to what it is now. And I don't
think they're dumbing down the position because a lot of
these quarterbacks played in pro style offenses in college, so
(01:34):
the transition is a lot easier. But I'll let you
hear what Tom had to say about it. Who am
I to argue with Tom? Also to a tongue of ioloa,
you know, Mike McDaniel has been such a benefit for
him that Brian Flores used to be the head coach
of the Dolphins and Tua. He was on Dan Levittard
(01:54):
Show and was asked about the difference between playing for
Brian Flores and Mike McDaniel.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
To put it in simplest terms, if you woke up
every morning and I told you you suck at what
you did, that you don't belong doing what you do,
that you shouldn't be here, that this guy should be here,
that you haven't earned this right, and then you have
(02:21):
somebody else come in and tell you, dude, you are
the best fit for this, like you are accurate, you
are the best.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Whatever you are this, you are that. Like how would it.
Speaker 3 (02:32):
Make you feel listening to one or the other? You
see what I'm saying, and then you hear it. You
hear it regardless of what it is, the good or
the bad, and you hear it more and more. You
start to actually believe that.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
I'm not used to this kind of honesty or well,
certainly from two a tongue of Iloa. But what he's
saying is you show up and you get beat down
by your head coach. And then Mike McDaniel, who when
he was with us a couple of weeks ago, you
could understand he would be mister ponzactivity. He would find
the right thing to say to bolster your confidence. Whether
he believed it or not, he was trying to build
(03:06):
up your confidence level. And Tua I think in large
part got that contract because of Mike McDaniel. I think
Mike McDaniel is such an offensive minded I don't want
to say genius, but he's an offensive minded head coach
and utilizing those receivers, getting two of the fastest receivers
in football, and then Tua just has to be quick,
(03:27):
be accurate, and not take sacks. That's all we're waiting
for with Tua. Stay healthy and get the ball out
to those guys, and you don't have to throw forty
yard bombs. This is what Tom Brady did his entire career.
Could be three yards, five yards, seven yards, occasionally go
down the middle of the field. That's what Tua has
to do. If you see that the Dolphins have scored
(03:49):
an eighty yard touchdown on a pass, chances are it's
a seven yard pass and seventy three yards for Tyreek
Hill and Tua got paid. But I still have ounce
about to later in the season when they go on
the road. The numbers aren't pretty. When he plays in
colder weather, the numbers aren't pretty, and you're gonna have
(04:09):
to win. If you don't win your division, chances are
you're gonna be going to Buffalo or maybe you're going
to the Jets. You're not going to go to New
England as far as a playoff game, but you're gonna
have to win in maybe a cold weather climate and
Tua hasn't done that, but I do like the honesty
that he has, and I certainly understand that's almost like
the old way, the old school way, that they kind
(04:32):
of beat you down to build you up. I think
we're kind of past that that. We're like, I know
what you're doing. You're yelling at me to deflate me,
and then you're going to inflate me, and then I'll
do whatever you tell me to do. Coach, Thank you, sir.
May I have another our stat of the day. I
mentioned Panini America the hottest Rookie's biggest superstars, the old
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Started continue your collection now. Panini America dot Net went
out with the big German last night here in Maine. Whoa, whoa, yeh.
Big German was getting after it a little bit and
(05:15):
we met up with the main cabin masters, Ryan and
Jedi Ashley, so hung out with them, had a couple
of beverages, you know, just maners talking to mayners, stuff
like that. Yeah and yeah, it was good, but the
big German was you know, everybody's like, wow, you're the
big German. He's like yeah. He was eating it up,
(05:36):
you know, photos with people, you know, the whole thing,
and it's like, all right, that's the power of the
Dan Patrick Show. But we were just chopping it up
with the maners.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
And yes, Paul, now we pretty much know Main's a
beer beer state, right Is it a heavy beer state?
Where can you drink wine when you're out? Can you
drink cocktails?
Speaker 2 (05:55):
Or is it pure beer? Well, I would say it's
beer now. I don't want to speak for fellow maners,
but I would say we were having, uh, some draft beers.
They're big on their their I p as and uh
maybe maybe a bourbon or something or whiskey something like that.
You know what men drink. I mean, that's what we do. Yeah,
(06:18):
you know when I was fishing yesterday and then we
went and had some beers, as we do, and then
I was going to chop some wood seat and got
me an axe, and you got the axe. I've been
wondering if you have the axe in Maine or not. No,
I have an axe to grind, and I literally have
the axe the seat and gave to me, I may
have to step in here. I may have you to
(06:40):
use an axe. I got some wood delivered, and then uh.
One of the guys said, you know you can split
some wood there, and I go, yeah, all right.
Speaker 5 (06:50):
Dan, you chop your own firewood. You warm yourself twice
as they say.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Uh. I made the mistake of telling my wife. I said, yeah,
you know, I think of using Seaton's acts that he
got me. And she goes for what And I said
for chopping wood. She goes, oh, no, no, no, no,
we're not doing that. And I said, why why not.
That's what we do, That's what maners do. Hunt. Yeah,
oh she's a buzzkill. Yeah. So yeah, I might chop
(07:17):
some wood later on today, maybe a flannel shirt. You know,
it's kind of getting that football weather here on the
East Coast, so I'm ready. I got football this weekend.
I'll say goodbye to my wife and family coming up
on Saturday, and then I'll talk to them probably in February.
But we got college football week. I don't like week
zero and just call it the opening weekend, like, let's
(07:41):
be fair to those games coming up this weekend. Week zero, Yes, Paul, Well,
you have to have a title.
Speaker 4 (07:46):
It's week zero, and then like you said, opening weekend
is next week, so it's like a preview weekend, every weekend, showdown, Saturday,
Grudge weekend.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Yeah yeah, but week zero just that it doesn't sound like, man,
that's must see TV. Week zero, Yes, Todd, so called
w EAK one, and let's start at number one and.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Call it what it is.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
We'll see that's a negative time.
Speaker 6 (08:09):
It's a negative at least it's not zero zero means
like it does.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
It's useless, it doesn't count, it's nothing, Todd. We're ten
minutes in and you've gone negative on me. Everyone's happy.
Then if you instead of calling your week zero it's
week one.
Speaker 4 (08:21):
No, yes, Paul, you got Florida State Georgia Tech from Dublin,
then you just they sprinkle in some games this Saturday
Montana State in Mexican year since we were there with
Will Ferrell a year ago. Today we were testing our
studio in Dublin.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Wow, that was so much fun and Will Will is
ready to go if we go back. But we didn't
think Florida State Georgia Tech would be as festive as
Notre Dame certainly Notre Dame in Dublin, but we were.
We'll do that again. We'll have a road trip. All right.
What other games you're coming up this weekend?
Speaker 4 (08:56):
You got SMU, the new look SMU, Big Money SMU
versus Novada. You got Delaware State Hawaii that's a little
more niche. But then there's a couple of one double
A games. So you have like seven or eight college
football games scattered on TV Saturday. But what's wild is
next Thursday. Not next Saturday, but next Thursday. There's probably
twenty college football games and some of them are like
(09:17):
real games, like Arkansas's playing Missouri's playing North Carolina, Minnesota
playing each other.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Like there's real games next Thursday. Wow. Weird starting earlier
and earlier, and it's like the NFL trying to go
longer later in February. College football starting earlier because you
want those standalone nights days games, and now you have
that opportunity. But it does feel like any other story
(09:45):
or sports that were kind of sharing the spotlight. All
of a sudden, the NFL takes over. Last preseason game
coming up, college football coming up this weekend, fantasy drafts,
So now it's on set let's poll question today. Well,
we got a couple of options.
Speaker 5 (10:03):
Uh, well, we could go with this sort of the
topic you were just hitting before. I don't know exactly
how to word this the right way, but which coaching
style works best?
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Oh?
Speaker 5 (10:13):
Is it like criticism and tough love or support and encouragement?
How do we word that exactly? To say, like, you know,
one dude is screaming your garbage and worthless, you'll never
be anything?
Speaker 2 (10:29):
Oh that made me so great?
Speaker 5 (10:31):
Or you're like no, man, like you're doing well, keep going.
Speaker 7 (10:35):
Well.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
There's part of me that would like to still have
a little bit of the old school. But then I
know with today, with parents with kids, you can't do it.
You shouldn't do it. But you know, I kind of
grew up on tough love with coaches, and I I
don't think you need to yell. I never understood that
(10:56):
when grabbing your face mask or screaming at you. I mean,
I would feel bad if I didn't play well. But
I think there's a time and place for a little
bit of that. I think it really depends.
Speaker 5 (11:10):
I think what we've figured out over the years is
that it just depends on the person that you're talking to.
Not everybody responds the same way to the same thing.
It's it's not really about the coach. It's more about
the person the coach is talking to, because like, like
my son has had it sort of like what you
were just speaking to. My son has had a coach
before he plays soccer, and the coach would be on
(11:32):
the sideline and he would be going Karen.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Kieran, Tom down, Tom down.
Speaker 3 (11:40):
Like.
Speaker 5 (11:42):
Like, my guy, you realize you're screaming at the top
of your lungs telling him to calm down, right, You
realize how weird that sounds.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Well, that always bothered me with Bob Knight, that Bob
Knight was never under control, but he told you to
be under control. And I like, don't you understand stand here,
Like you're supposed to be under control, then I'll be
under control. But when you're yelling, it's not like I go, oh, okay,
I'm gonna calm down as you're chewing my neck off. Yes, Paulin, this.
Speaker 4 (12:11):
Is a really tough question because the first when I
looked at this, is it Mike McDaniel's style or Brian
Flora's style, his old style. They're a year and a
half difference in age. Mike McDaniel's not twenty six, he's
forty one, and Brian Flores is forty three, so they
grew up in the same NFL. They just have two
different directions. I do agree with you though, there always
has to be some light level of fear for your
(12:33):
job to some level, no matter where you're work. You
don't want people too terribly comfortable. You want to be
positive and get the most out of them. But if
they're completely comfortable, I think that's dangerous as well.
Speaker 2 (12:44):
But also it's when you raise your voice. If you
don't raise it very often, but when you do, now
I have your attention. It's like with my daughters. They
know doesn't happen often. When it does, there's trouble. But
if you do it all the time and then you
kind of, you know, tune that out. But you're I mean,
growing up in these coaches that that's what you did.
(13:06):
You Woody Hayes. He was yelling Atja Bo Schembeckler yelling
at you, Bob Knight yelling at you. You know, even
Mike Kruzhevsky. I went to one practice and I was like,
whoa coach k simmer down? But he you know, he'd
learned with Bob Knight. I like Mike McDaniel's approach, but
(13:27):
it doesn't sound like he's a head coach with all
of that encouragement. But if it works for the Dolphins
and works for TUA, that's all that matters. It feels
like there still has to be that. I can be
a jerk. If I have to be a jerk, I
can raise my voice. I can get your attention. But
I don't think you know the days of slamming your
hand into the wall and then you break your hand
(13:49):
and then you go, boy, that was stupid. I think
those days are long. Yeah. I know, I had a
coach who did that, and it was one of those
where you kind of, you know, kind of put your
hand over mouth because you're going, that's stupid, and he
heard his hand. He broke his little finger. Yes, Marvin,
did you ever hear any stories about Tony Dungee raising
his voice? No?
Speaker 1 (14:11):
What was his style to get his guys so motivated
and have such great teams when he was playing?
Speaker 2 (14:16):
He seems so mild mannered. That's the way it is.
But once again, he if he raised his voice, it's
different than the octave that somebody else might be raising
their voice. Tony could raise his voice, but in a
way that he would be disappointed in you. But I've
never heard him yell. Never, even if when we were
(14:37):
Football Night in America for what eight or nine years,
never heard him raise his one. Now, he would deliver
a message in a way that was he was angry
at himself or disappointed in something, but it was never
raising his voice.
Speaker 4 (14:53):
Yeah, Paulin, that's a guy who's going to bring up.
Tony Dungee seems like the first old school new style.
When we started having him on before or he worked
with him, were like, this guy is so soft spoken,
how does it work? But then there's also the caveat
is with Tony Dungee. I mean, he was a great coach,
but he had Peyton Manning, which makes your coaching style
seems so much better than Mike McDaniels. I'm sure he's
(15:14):
a very good coach, but having Tyreek Hill and Jalen
Wattle breaths the success. It's like, does your style work
or does your personnel and style work?
Speaker 2 (15:24):
Yeah? I mean Mike McDaniel that's a different cat man.
He was. He was chill, funny sense of humor. Almost
felt like he would be the quarterback coach as opposed
to the head coach. But if it works, you know
the Giants the Bears when they had ditka Is yelling
at everybody, Giants with Bill Parcells yelling at everybody. I mean,
(15:48):
they're just certain coaches. That's why you know Saban, I
don't know if he yells as much as he just
delivers a stinging kind of criticism there. And you know,
maybe Belichick the same way.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
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Speaker 8 (16:12):
Hey, it's Ben, host of The Fifth Hour with Ben Maller.
Would mean a lot to have you join us on
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(16:35):
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get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Let's bringing Diana Roussini, the Athletics senior n FL insider
co host of the Athletics Scoop City podcast with our
buddy Chase Daniel. Let me start there, who do you
think has the best chance to be a Pro Bowl
quarterback this year?
Speaker 6 (16:57):
Well, I want to go with the people who know football,
and those are head coaches who I've been talking to
over the last week. Some coaches that I was even
talking to over the weekend as they were waiting to
go out and play their own games, and they had
the Bears game on, and they were checking Caleb Williams out.
And he is as advertised in terms of being ready
for this offense, being pro ready. And look, we spent
(17:20):
the entire offseason singing his praise is highlighting how good
of a player is. It was a short thing that
Chicago was going for him. Probably about a week before
the combine was when the conversations really started to pick
up that they were definitely going to go with Caleb.
And it was very difficult to find an organization that
didn't believe that Caleb was the best quarterback of this class.
(17:44):
So the fact that he's already been able to start
working towards being a starter and a ready one and
one that is good to probably have a lot of
success this season, especially with the way they built the
Chicago Bears team. My vote is for Caleb. But it
is so good to be back, Dan. I feel like
it's been a while. Yeah, last time, the last time
(18:05):
we chatted, I think I was still at ESPN. I
think I was in stephen A's office with a cowboy
hat on and a cigar in my mouth. And if
I recall, well, I think we were talking about what
the New York Jets were selling to Aaron Rodgers in
Green Bay and essentially, come here, you can win a
(18:26):
Super Bowl. We'll give you everything. So two years later,
two kids later, we are back. Okay, if you gave
the Jets a do over, where am I starting?
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Would they keep Aaron Rodgers? Would they still go after
Aaron Rodgers?
Speaker 6 (18:46):
Yeah? This has always been a great decision, the way
they've orchestrated this or choreograph, the way this all came together.
At the time, I was on television of a writing
that the New York Jets are brilliant. They're doing what
they should be doing. An organization that hasn't won a lot,
(19:07):
that hasn't had a lot of success, is handing over
the keys to a guy who knows how to do it,
a guy who understands how to win, how to run
a hard practice, how to win in big moments, and
how to lead a locker room. Give the keys to
Aaron Rodgers made all the sense in the world. But
what I didn't see in the moment as someone covering
that team pretty closely, was that when you hand the
(19:30):
keys to Aaron Rodgers, then all the rules go out
the window too. And I think the team ran into
a lot of issues, not just in the off season,
but during that time when they were trying to build
what they were going to be, and Aaron say at
times became a problem because that's not exactly what the
(19:51):
head coach wanted to do. It's not what the GM
wanted to do all the time. So once the toothpaste
was out of the bottle, there they it was hard
to get it back in.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
So he brought in players who you know, he's not
a good GM. Yeah, you know, the players that he
wanted brought in.
Speaker 6 (20:11):
Yeah, he wanted players that he was comfortable with. And
it's not like I ever saw that list that he
handed over to the Jets that he shared with them
that most of them made sense to me at the time.
This is, you know, Aaron wants to be comfortable. He
wants to be around guys that he's played with before.
With the exception of Odell Beckham Junior, I think that
(20:31):
was really the only one on the list that he
had never played with. But the Jets granted a lot
of those wishes, not all of them, but a lot
of them. Remember David Baktiari was on that list that
never worked out, and look, Alan Wizard's having a better
camp now, but that obviously didn't work out great last
(20:51):
year he was he wasn't doing much. Nathaniel Hackett is
a really important element. Granted he was hired before Rogers
became a Jet officially, but obviously there were conversations being
had Nathaniel Hackett's not getting the offensive coordinator job for
the New York Jets. If Aaron Rodgers isn't telling Woody
this is what I want, right, He wanted his play
caller there, and it still makes all the sense in
(21:12):
the world. This offseason, the Jets looked into adding another
offensive coach, though they talked to Arthur Smith. There was
a time where they wanted to bring Arthur Smith in
to assist with perhaps some of the play calling that
they thought wasn't as sharp as they wanted to be.
That maybe Nathaniel Hackett was losing his fastball. But that
(21:34):
didn't work out obviously. Arthur Smith now in Pittsburgh and
he's got his own set of challenges as we speak.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
I know you spent some time with Sean Payton and
bo Nick seems to be picking up Sean's system, which
isn't easy for anybody to pick up, but he seems
to be thriving. When does Sean make the call on
who's his starting quarterback?
Speaker 6 (21:55):
Yeah, I expect Bownicks to be named the quarterback over
the next few days. Sean hasn't done any media, I think,
since their preseason game, so I'm expecting when he steps
up to the microphone, most likely tomorrow, I would see
I could see that possibly happening. Look, I spent two
days around them and Dan. There's when you stop by
(22:17):
a lot of different camps, there's a vibe there is.
It's not made up. You can feel it on the ground,
and the vibes in Denver were extraordinary from the head
coach to the quarterback. And yet the stars of the
camp from my perspective, was actually the Denver Broncos defense. Yes,
(22:38):
Bo Nix and Sean Payton appear to be a marriage
meant to be. Sean Payton joined my podcast, Coop City,
and normally I like to have my guests on for
about ten minutes. Sean was on with us for forty minutes.
And that's not because I ask good questions. It's because
he talks a lot, and when he's happy, he talks plenty,
and he is glowing about what bo Nicks has been
(23:01):
able to do. And a lot of it has to
do with his experience in college. Obviously, he's twenty four
years old, he's had sixty one starts. He's had the
most experience in going back to even that draft process.
I recall, you know, lots of GM sharing with me
and even even guys that were doing the work on
these players that Bo was in that category of Caleb
in terms of being pro ready, right, a lot of
(23:23):
these other guys needed a little bit more time, right.
So Sean's leaning into the fact that he can understand
what is being asked of him. He's not panicking in
the pocket. He appears to be a veteran type of
player out there when you're watching him. And then let's
just talk about this quarterback room in Denver, right, it's
a bizarre one.
Speaker 7 (23:44):
Right.
Speaker 6 (23:44):
You have Garret Stidham, who was with Sean last year.
You've got Zach Wilson traded from the Jets now in Denver,
and you have this rookie bow Nicks. And Zach Wilson's
only like three months older than Bo Nicks, so I say,
but it's not like he's this big older brother. He
just has a little bit more experience than Bo. And
(24:06):
you've got Davis Webb, the former backup quarterback of the
New York Giants, now the quarterbacks coach there, which he's
getting tons of praise out there what he's been able
to do in terms of teaching this Sean Peyton offense.
Because I asked Bo how he was digesting Sean, all
of it, from the play calling to just Sean Payton,
(24:26):
the person, the coach, the demands, the standard he holds
for a quarterback. And you know, he said that he
just felt that everyone has been on the same page
and Sean has been almost a better listener than a talker,
which obviously was the opposite on my podcast. That he's
just done a good job of understanding what Bo needs
(24:46):
and Sean is supplying that. And Sewan even shared that
with his play calling, he's cut down some of it
to help Bo take this next step and get comfortable
in this offense.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Talking to Diana Roussini, the athletics senior NFL insider co
host of Scoop City Podcasts with Chase Daniel, Tom Brady
over the weekend at the Fanatics Fest talked about the
tragedy of forcing rookie quarterbacks to play early. Seems like
a little bit of hyperbole with the tragedy. We're there,
(25:18):
but as you've mentioned, Jayden Daniels, Bo Knicks, Caleb Williams,
they've been quarterbacks with two different universities, two different offenses,
and they played upwards of forty five to sixty games.
I don't and they've gotten their money nil. It feels
like they're more pro ready than they've ever been. And
(25:40):
I don't know if Tom is just thinking what it
was like when he was seventh string quarterback in New
England and moved up to be the third string and
then eventually the starter. But is it a tragedy of
what we're doing with rookie quarterbacks.
Speaker 6 (25:55):
Yeah. My takeaway from listening to Tom specifically talking on
the topic.
Speaker 2 (25:59):
Was more his.
Speaker 6 (26:02):
Experience of playing the position and the challenges it brings,
and it was almost like he was admitting that this
is a tall task, this is hard. I had to
go through this, this and this, And I think it's
also human nature. We tend to reflect back on our
own experiences and you sort of become the old man
(26:25):
in the room now that I'm calling Tom olds. But
the way he reflects on his career may not be
exactly the way the game is now. And I'll call
them my football dads, the men that I've been around
all these years that have helped me understand this game
and get better as a reporter covering it. They would
(26:45):
probably most of them, the majority of them would probably
side with a Tom Brady in this respect, because there
is definitely definitely value to sitting. I mean, everyone uses
the example because it's the best example, and that's Patrick
Mahomes in Kansas City having that time to sit and
watch and learn and grow. Despite the fact that, if
(27:05):
you recall, we would hear during the season during practices
from players chatting behind Alex Smith's back. I guess how
good Patrick Mahomes was that he was already blowing them away,
but just getting that time to adjust and learn. I
spoke to Jordan Love on Friday. It was such a
great conversation about that first year, not just the hype
(27:29):
around him, the fact that he became this controversial quarterback
to join the Green Bay Packers, knowing that Aaron Rodgers
obviously the start and the green Bay Packers did what
they did at the time, the drama surrounding that. Forget
that he did talk about it, but forget that for this.
For what I want to talk about, though, is his
ability to play in the NFL at that time. And
(27:50):
I dooped to him. I said, let's pull some film
ovele from your practices that year. He's like, oh my god, please,
don't please.
Speaker 7 (27:56):
I don't even know.
Speaker 6 (27:57):
Who that guy is. I don't know who.
Speaker 7 (28:00):
He is, you know.
Speaker 6 (28:01):
And I appreciated how candid he was about it and
obviously very confident in what he is and who he
is now. To go, Yeah, I sunk. I was not good.
And look, I can remember back Jordan's first and second
year talking to people in Green Bay being like, Yep,
we messed up. He ain't the guy. Well, guess who's
the guy now. Guess who's blowing coaches the way, Guess
(28:21):
who's understanding the offense. Guess who is the clear leader,
clear leader on the field when you're watching the Packers,
And just from the way he conducts himself and just
his understanding of what his job is now. And I
think him getting this deal done was the best for
his overall confidence. And I felt it too, just just
talking to him. So really, to go back to your
(28:43):
question about Brady, I do think times have changed, and
it's great that this quarterback crop we're gonna truly see it.
We're gonna be able to see some of these guys
that are to sit and some of these guys that
are to play, and more we're gonna be playing. Obviously,
as you point now, we got Caleb and Jayden. I
think JJ McCarthy had a really good shot there before
(29:05):
he got hurt. I was with Minnesota the day that
news came out. That was not fun. You know, coach
was heartbroken about it. The whole team was you just
you felt that they just felt for the kid, because
I do think the plan was to play Sam, but
JJ was making a strong case to get in there,
you know. And then and then now you have bo
(29:25):
Nix here, who who who seems such he won this
job fair and square.
Speaker 2 (29:30):
Yeah. Before I let you go, you were talking about
training camps have a vibe. Uh you know, when you're
defending champs or you did well, you didn't do well,
and you go to camp. When's the last time you
were at a training camp and you go, oh boy,
this isn't going to be a good season.
Speaker 6 (29:48):
Last week, did we guess?
Speaker 2 (29:53):
Guess the team?
Speaker 6 (29:54):
And it's like, go to my Instagram, look at all
my pictures of all the different places. I stopped that
to show the world look at me. I'm working.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
Okay, everybody gets one guess. Hold on, Pauline, I'm gonna
just think, hold on, okay, but hold on. We got
a guess. Okay, Paulie, your guests, the New York Giants,
all right, Fritzy, I'm gonna say New England, okay, Seaton.
Speaker 5 (30:20):
I don't remember which teams looked at last week. Uh,
I would say probably New England too.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
Actually, all right, Marvin Titans, Titans, I'm gonna go Minnesota.
Speaker 6 (30:38):
Great guess. And I know why you did that, because
you were thinking, Oh, the day the JJ McCarthy news
comes out, maybe everyone you know was a little on focus.
Maybe they were all alpha big great guess. It was
the team that they were practicing against that day, actually,
and it was the Cleveland Browns. And I just happened
to be there on a day that the offense was
(30:59):
just off. The offensive line didn't look as sharp as
I was expecting them to. Deshaun didn't look like he
had a lot of presence out there, now, I'm going
to add I then returned and it was different. But
to your question of do you ever show up, you
know this isn't I'm not a believer, and oh, every
(31:20):
camp is so great and everyone is optimistic. Yes, people
are happy, people are excited because everyone has the same
record right now, and everyone believes that they're gonna be
the best team. But the value of these joint practices
has helped really sort of burst a lot of bubbles.
The question I would have preferred was, what's the camp
I went to where I went, oh wow, and that
(31:43):
was the Houston Texans. Holy cow, I knew.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
They were good.
Speaker 6 (31:50):
When I showed up. I left like and look, I
went on a day that everyone told me CJ was unbeskievable,
but I just was watching and going, who is going
super Bowl? All in on the Houston Texans, just based
on what they're building. Okay, something even simple and small.
This is tiny, but this is important, and it's been
(32:12):
told to me by many people. It's important in the
big grand scheme of things. When they make good plays
during the preseason, when guys are scoring touchdowns, backups players
that we may never even see again in the NFL,
the way the sideline, the way the starters are running
down into the end zone and showing that support. Because
(32:33):
what that is, that's culture, right, That's the Miko Ryans.
That's him saying we are going to be there for
everybody on this team, not just the superstars. And I
felt that when I was there. I had conversations. Stefan
Diggs told me this has just been refreshing for him.
He's growing up. He reflects on some of his younger
ears and just knows he made some mistakes and is
(32:56):
ready now to really try to be the best at
his position and based on what I was watching out there,
he's just been such an added bonus to this offense.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Great to catch up with you. We'll talk to you
during the season, and good luck with Scoop City Podcast
with our buddy Chase Daniel. Thank you, Diana, thank you.
Speaker 6 (33:15):
I can't wait for the aggregators. Rassini Cleveland, Brown's horrendous can't.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
Wait Diana Rossini, the Athletics senior NFL insider co host
of the Athletics Scoop City Podcast with Chase Daniel.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan
Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2 (33:39):
We make way for Tim Kirchin, ESPN analyst and National
Baseball Hall of Fame sports writer. He's a Little League
World Series Williamsport, Pennsylvania. Timmy, good to see you again.
There's a few things I want to dive into. We
thought about you yesterday when we saw this, the possibility
of a six inning rule for starting pitchers and Baseball's
floating it out there. I always get nervous when they
(34:01):
float something out there that it feels like it's a
little further down the line, how do you enforce a
six inning rule for starting pitchers?
Speaker 7 (34:12):
Well, I'm not sure how you do that. And Larry
Bird was an unbelievably skilled player, notkidding me. You've never
seen a guy pass in the half court better than him.
One of the greatest shooters of all time. Please, Okay,
I don't know how we're going to do this, Dan,
This is not going to work at six innings. It's
(34:32):
going to tie the hands of the managers even more
so than they are now. But Dan, we have to
bring back the value of the starting pitcher in today's game. Look,
I'm a tired old little man now. But when I
grew up, Jim Palmer faced Sandy Kofax in the World Series,
(34:52):
and Bob Gibson faced Jim Lonborg in Game seven, and
he faced Denny McClain in Game one the next year.
That's what baseball was about. And not only did they
start against each other, most of the time, they went
nine innings both of them. We have to get back
to something close to that. I don't know how to
do it. But Max Scherz got me on a headlock
(35:14):
last year at the postseason and said, you guys meeting
the writers have to do something about this. We have
to come up with a better way to bring back
the value of the starting pitcher. And he kind of
hooked it to the designated hitter. If you take your
starter out after one inning, you lose the DH for
the rest of the game. That is a possibility. But
(35:36):
I just don't see how everyone has to go six
innings unless you've thrown a hundred pitches, or of course,
unless you got hurt, or if you gave up four
earned runs. This is something they're knocking around. I just
don't know how you implement it.
Speaker 2 (35:52):
Sho hey, Utani not pitching this year, but I'm assuming
he will be able to next year. But here he
is cruising to forty forty. The possibility that he could
go fifty to fifty, I mean, that's uncharted territory here, Dan,
Everything is uncharted territory when it comes to this guy.
Speaker 7 (36:13):
He is the most remarkable player we've ever seen. I
got asked about two weeks ago if I thought he
would get to forty forty. I thought it was a joke.
I thought it was a trick question. Of course, he's
going to get to forty forty and yes, he's got
a shot to get to fifty to fifty. And I
know he's not pitching anymore. I know he doesn't play
the field. But it is difficult, Dan, you know this,
(36:36):
to just be a designated hitter. You're not playing in
the field, you're not pitching. And yet he hasn't lost
a beat. Not only has he not lost to beat,
he's hit even better than he has in the past.
And that is really really saying something.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
But you look at these guys. You know there's some
cloud ash suspicion with some of the forty forty guys.
You know that those numbers are tainted bonds A rod Well,
it's bonds. It's his tainted when he went forty forty.
Speaker 7 (37:11):
No, No, he did that, I believe before he became
the greatest slugger that we've ever seen.
Speaker 6 (37:18):
So I think he.
Speaker 7 (37:19):
Had already done that. He had already done a lot
of things before the problems or whatever we call it,
I don't even know what to call it anymore.
Speaker 2 (37:29):
Dan, And it feels like, and I know that there's
so much pressure on the Hall of Fame, you being
a Hall of Famer voting on this. The Pete Rose
documentary that came out. There's the ground swell once again
that Pete deserves to be in the Hall of Fame.
It is a museum. There's a lot of things in
museums that are done by bad people, or you know,
(37:51):
there's not necessarily a representation of the best of all
of us. But can we can we compromise and have
people in the Hall of Fame and tell the story
of baseball through the Hall of Fame even though there's
gonna be some warts at all.
Speaker 7 (38:09):
Well, as you know, Dan, there are a bunch of
people in the Hall of Fame who have plenty.
Speaker 2 (38:13):
Of wards right now.
Speaker 7 (38:14):
And you're right, that's the only way to do this
is to attach a story to every person so we
know exactly what happened. Is it a museum or is
it just a place for the greatest players of all time.
If you're writing a story about Cooperstown and the Hall
of Fame, well Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens have to be
(38:35):
in it. But I totally understand the other side of
this that people say, no, you can't put people in
who you cheated on any level, and guys have been
cheating in baseball for one hundred and forty years, Dan,
you know that you played, you are encouraged to cheat.
I remember Jeter got Jeter got hit on the knob
(38:57):
of his bat once and he pretended like I could
hit him on the hand because he was behind in
the count, and he ended up in first base. That's
what you're taught, That's what I was taught in high
school to do. And then when somebody does he go,
oh my gosh, he tried to deceive the empire. Well,
they've been deceiving the Empire and the referees in the
NBA for years. This is part of the gig. It's
(39:19):
not Magan doesn't make it right, but you can't ignore it.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
Is Pete getting in posthumously. Could you see like a
sympathetic type of vote for Pete after the fact. Yeah.
Speaker 7 (39:36):
I just refuse to believe that he will never get
into the Hall of Fame. But it's going to take
a different commissioner in my opinion, who's going to have
to come in and open it up again and see
where it goes from there, because I don't think Rob
Manford is going to allow this to happen. It's a
really tricky spot, Dan, I made speeches all the time,
(39:58):
and like within the first five questions, no matter where
I am, no matter what the group is, there's should
Pete Roseby in the Hall of Fame question happens every
single time. That's how interested people still are in this topic.
Speaker 2 (40:12):
Talking to Tim Kirkchin, ESPN analyst, National Baseball Hall of
Fame sports writer, he's at the Little League World Series
in Williamsport, Pennsylvania. Let me go back to o'tani. He
had a procedure. Now, I don't know if we're going
to make Tommy John the name obsolete, if, like, are
we coming up with a different type of surgery that
(40:35):
it'll be called something different than Tommy John surgery and
therefore Tommy becomes obsolete.
Speaker 7 (40:43):
Well, I'm certainly hope so, because Tommy John was a really,
really good major league pitcher one over two hundred and
eighty games, should not have an injury attached to his name.
But this is the fifty year anniversary of Tommy John surgery,
and Dan somebody he asked me once, like whose name
comes up more in regular conversation in baseball, Cy Young
(41:07):
or Tommy John, And I think the answer is Tommy John.
And there's something wrong with that. So Let's hope they
can and they know how to do this really well,
and they're gonna keep doing it better and better, and
maybe instead of being out a year, they're only going
to be out six months. But I would really like
to see fewer pictures get hurt and fewer discussions of
(41:28):
all of this. But I just don't see that happening
anytime soon.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
But it's like Kevin Durant and Aaron Rodgers with Achilles
surgery that you know, modern medicine procedures that now you
have different doctors who are doing different things to get
players back sooner. And that's what I wondered that we've
been we just throw out Tommy John. Oh, Tommy John surgery.
Otani didn't have Tommy John surgery, but he had a procedure.
(41:55):
I don't know if that was something that can circumvent
Tommy John surgery. So but I do like that we'd
mentioned Tommy and continue to mention him, and then maybe
people will look at his career record and I mean,
it's hard to win two hundred and eighty games and
you're not in the Hall of Fame, But can he
be in there for contributions to the game, Well, Tommy
(42:17):
shun surgery.
Speaker 7 (42:19):
Its name comes up every day. He should be in
there for this. The guy asks him once, is losing,
you know, really burn your stomach? He said, the only
thing that burns my stomach is Schwan food.
Speaker 2 (42:30):
And I said, all right, that's good enough for me.
I think. You know, when he passes away, he just
donates his arm to the Baseball Hall of Fame.
Speaker 7 (42:39):
Well, I think for his sake, someday we're going to
rename this this surgery, and it's going to be named
after someone else, or it's just going to be given
a different name, at least I hope.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
So I'm listening to the Mets game and you had
Keith Hernandez and Ron Darling, and they're both going on
a three to zero coount. No, no, you don't swing
on a three zero count. You don't you know you're
not swinging on a three zero count. Well, the hitter
swung on a three zero count and hit a home run.
I don't know what is uh analytics. I don't know
(43:10):
what is new baseball, because back in the seventies or
eighties when we were growing up, you're not swinging on
a three to zero pitch. Is it okay to swing
on a three to zero pitch in today's game.
Speaker 7 (43:22):
Dan, I'm at the Little League World Series and the
kid swung at a three to zero pitch yesterday and
we laughed out loud. It was wonderful in the press box,
me Ravi, Eduardo Perez, three to ozero pitch. It was
out of the strike zone that he swung at it. Yes, Dan,
you're allowed to swing at a three tozero pitch. Mike
Trout a couple of years ago hit the first home
(43:43):
run of his career on a three to zero pitch,
so he usually doesn't. The rule. The unwritten rule about
three to zero count is you never swing three to
zero when you're up by ten runs, which, of course
Fernando Tatiste Junior did a few years ago and then
celebrated it on his way around the basis that a
(44:03):
couple of veterans on his team said, come over here,
we need to talk to you about this, because I
don't think he understood that that is really forbidden, because
somebody's going to get thrown out after that. Somebody on
your team is going to get hurt because you swung
at a three to zero pitch. Just look at the scoreboard,
read the room and you'll know what to do.
Speaker 2 (44:25):
Have you noticed a change in coaching style at the
Little League World Series? We were talking about growing up
tough love. Now you have coaches who are more what
came up with tuatongua Ioloa with Mike McDaniel as opposed
to Brian Flores. Flores used to demean him and you know,
really rough him up, and then Mike McDaniel came in
(44:47):
and was basically an arm around your shoulder looking at
you know these coaches, and many of them have kids
on the team. Has it changed at all kind of
the tone of how they coach?
Speaker 7 (45:00):
Yeah, I think so, and so as being miked up
during the game. Look, the Little League World Series is
so beautifully run, Dan, nobody makes a mistake here, and
if a manager goes out there and says something even
mildly inappropriate, it's just not gonna work. And they're gonna
tell him you can go home now if he's miked
(45:20):
up and says something that he shouldn't have said. But Dan,
it's a way bigger thing, as you know, than just littlelygue.
We don't yell at anyone in the big leagues anymore.
A few years ago, a guy made a horrendous based
running mistake. If I had made that at age fifteen,
my high school coach would have taken me off the
field and said, you're not playing the rest of this
(45:40):
game if you don't know any better than that. But
this guy makes it's a major leaguer makes a terrible mistake.
He gets called into the manager's office after the game.
The manager puts his arm around him and says, we
love you. Okay, just remember we love you, And then
he explained, you can't make this mistake again. This is
what you do the next time. Three times he was
(46:01):
told we love you. Don't forget that. Whereas back when
I first started covered, if you made that mistake. Jick Williams,
Jim Fragozi Whitey hers up, Earl Weaver, what a crush
your bones there right on the field. Those days don't
exist anymore.
Speaker 2 (46:21):
Always great to talk to you, Tim, Thank you have
fun there in Williams Sport.
Speaker 7 (46:25):
It's impossible not to have fun here.
Speaker 2 (46:27):
Dan.
Speaker 7 (46:27):
Thanks, They'll talk to you soon.
Speaker 2 (46:29):
Okay, that's Tim Kirkshin
You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Sports Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
It's Day two from the Main Cave. Some of the
headlines here, justin Herbert cleared to practice for the Chargers,
Planter Fasciidis, Jade and Daniels named the starter for the Commanders.
You're probably gonna have Bo Nix, who's going to be
the starter for the Denver Broncos. We're going to bring
back something Tom Brady said over the weekend where he's
(00:25):
talking about quarterbacks and dumbing down quarterbacks and trying to
get them to play early, which I don't agree with
what Tom is saying, but I'll let you hear what
Tom has to say, and then you'll hear what I
have to say as far as disagreeing with that. But
you have these quarterbacks. Jaden Daniels has been a professional.
Caleb Williams has been a professional. Bo Nix has been
(00:48):
a professional. Jaden Daniels with two different universities, Bo Nicks
with two different universities, Caleb Williams with two different universities.
This is different. They've had fifty plus starts in college.
They're ready. They're ready now. It didn't used to be
that way. But then that's when it took quarterbacks maybe
one or two years to get acclimated to a system.
(01:10):
Maybe they played in year three. Carson Palmer, number one pick,
didn't play his first year. John Kittna was the starting quarterback.
Things have changed, and I think that's what Tom is
looking at the way it used to be for him
as opposed to what it is now. And I don't
think they're dumbing down the position because a lot of
these quarterbacks played in pro style offenses in college, so
(01:34):
the transition is a lot easier. But I'll let you
hear what Tom had to say about it. Who am
I to argue with Tom? Also to a tongue of ioloa,
you know, Mike McDaniel has been such a benefit for
him that Brian Flores used to be the head coach
of the Dolphins and Tua. He was on Dan Levittard
(01:54):
Show and was asked about the difference between playing for
Brian Flores and Mike McDaniel.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
To put it in simplest terms, if you woke up
every morning and I told you you suck at what
you did, that you don't belong doing what you do,
that you shouldn't be here, that this guy should be here,
that you haven't earned this right, and then you have
(02:21):
somebody else come in and tell you, dude, you are
the best fit for this, like you are accurate, you
are the best.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Whatever you are this, you are that. Like how would it.
Speaker 3 (02:32):
Make you feel listening to one or the other? You
see what I'm saying, and then you hear it. You
hear it regardless of what it is, the good or
the bad, and you hear it more and more. You
start to actually believe that.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
I'm not used to this kind of honesty or well,
certainly from two a tongue of Iloa. But what he's
saying is you show up and you get beat down
by your head coach. And then Mike McDaniel, who when
he was with us a couple of weeks ago, you
could understand he would be mister ponzactivity. He would find
the right thing to say to bolster your confidence. Whether
he believed it or not, he was trying to build
(03:06):
up your confidence level. And Tua I think in large
part got that contract because of Mike McDaniel. I think
Mike McDaniel is such an offensive minded I don't want
to say genius, but he's an offensive minded head coach
and utilizing those receivers, getting two of the fastest receivers
in football, and then Tua just has to be quick,
(03:27):
be accurate, and not take sacks. That's all we're waiting
for with Tua. Stay healthy and get the ball out
to those guys, and you don't have to throw forty
yard bombs. This is what Tom Brady did his entire career.
Could be three yards, five yards, seven yards, occasionally go
down the middle of the field. That's what Tua has
to do. If you see that the Dolphins have scored
(03:49):
an eighty yard touchdown on a pass, chances are it's
a seven yard pass and seventy three yards for Tyreek
Hill and Tua got paid. But I still have ounce
about to later in the season when they go on
the road. The numbers aren't pretty. When he plays in
colder weather, the numbers aren't pretty, and you're gonna have
(04:09):
to win. If you don't win your division, chances are
you're gonna be going to Buffalo or maybe you're going
to the Jets. You're not going to go to New
England as far as a playoff game, but you're gonna
have to win in maybe a cold weather climate and
Tua hasn't done that, but I do like the honesty
that he has, and I certainly understand that's almost like
the old way, the old school way, that they kind
(04:32):
of beat you down to build you up. I think
we're kind of past that that. We're like, I know
what you're doing. You're yelling at me to deflate me,
and then you're going to inflate me, and then I'll
do whatever you tell me to do. Coach, Thank you, sir.
May I have another our stat of the day. I
mentioned Panini America the hottest Rookie's biggest superstars, the old
(04:54):
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Started continue your collection now. Panini America dot Net went
out with the big German last night here in Maine. Whoa, whoa, yeh.
Big German was getting after it a little bit and
(05:15):
we met up with the main cabin masters, Ryan and
Jedi Ashley, so hung out with them, had a couple
of beverages, you know, just maners talking to mayners, stuff
like that. Yeah and yeah, it was good, but the
big German was you know, everybody's like, wow, you're the
big German. He's like yeah. He was eating it up,
(05:36):
you know, photos with people, you know, the whole thing,
and it's like, all right, that's the power of the
Dan Patrick Show. But we were just chopping it up
with the maners.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
And yes, Paul, now we pretty much know Main's a
beer beer state, right Is it a heavy beer state?
Where can you drink wine when you're out? Can you
drink cocktails?
Speaker 2 (05:55):
Or is it pure beer? Well, I would say it's
beer now. I don't want to speak for fellow maners,
but I would say we were having, uh, some draft beers.
They're big on their their I p as and uh
maybe maybe a bourbon or something or whiskey something like that.
You know what men drink. I mean, that's what we do. Yeah,
(06:18):
you know when I was fishing yesterday and then we
went and had some beers, as we do, and then
I was going to chop some wood seat and got
me an axe, and you got the axe. I've been
wondering if you have the axe in Maine or not. No,
I have an axe to grind, and I literally have
the axe the seat and gave to me, I may
have to step in here. I may have you to
(06:40):
use an axe. I got some wood delivered, and then uh.
One of the guys said, you know you can split
some wood there, and I go, yeah, all right.
Speaker 5 (06:50):
Dan, you chop your own firewood. You warm yourself twice
as they say.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Uh. I made the mistake of telling my wife. I said, yeah,
you know, I think of using Seaton's acts that he
got me. And she goes for what And I said
for chopping wood. She goes, oh, no, no, no, no,
we're not doing that. And I said, why why not.
That's what we do, That's what maners do. Hunt. Yeah,
oh she's a buzzkill. Yeah. So yeah, I might chop
(07:17):
some wood later on today, maybe a flannel shirt. You know,
it's kind of getting that football weather here on the
East Coast, so I'm ready. I got football this weekend.
I'll say goodbye to my wife and family coming up
on Saturday, and then I'll talk to them probably in February.
But we got college football week. I don't like week
zero and just call it the opening weekend, like, let's
(07:41):
be fair to those games coming up this weekend. Week zero, Yes, Paul, Well,
you have to have a title.
Speaker 4 (07:46):
It's week zero, and then like you said, opening weekend
is next week, so it's like a preview weekend, every weekend, showdown, Saturday,
Grudge weekend.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Yeah yeah, but week zero just that it doesn't sound like, man,
that's must see TV. Week zero, Yes, Todd, so called
w EAK one, and let's start at number one and.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Call it what it is.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
We'll see that's a negative time.
Speaker 6 (08:09):
It's a negative at least it's not zero zero means
like it does.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
It's useless, it doesn't count, it's nothing, Todd. We're ten
minutes in and you've gone negative on me. Everyone's happy.
Then if you instead of calling your week zero it's
week one.
Speaker 4 (08:21):
No, yes, Paul, you got Florida State Georgia Tech from Dublin,
then you just they sprinkle in some games this Saturday
Montana State in Mexican year since we were there with
Will Ferrell a year ago. Today we were testing our
studio in Dublin.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Wow, that was so much fun and Will Will is
ready to go if we go back. But we didn't
think Florida State Georgia Tech would be as festive as
Notre Dame certainly Notre Dame in Dublin, but we were.
We'll do that again. We'll have a road trip. All right.
What other games you're coming up this weekend?
Speaker 4 (08:56):
You got SMU, the new look SMU, Big Money SMU
versus Novada. You got Delaware State Hawaii that's a little
more niche. But then there's a couple of one double
A games. So you have like seven or eight college
football games scattered on TV Saturday. But what's wild is
next Thursday. Not next Saturday, but next Thursday. There's probably
twenty college football games and some of them are like
(09:17):
real games, like Arkansas's playing Missouri's playing North Carolina, Minnesota
playing each other.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Like there's real games next Thursday. Wow. Weird starting earlier
and earlier, and it's like the NFL trying to go
longer later in February. College football starting earlier because you
want those standalone nights days games, and now you have
that opportunity. But it does feel like any other story
(09:45):
or sports that were kind of sharing the spotlight. All
of a sudden, the NFL takes over. Last preseason game
coming up, college football coming up this weekend, fantasy drafts,
So now it's on set let's poll question today. Well,
we got a couple of options.
Speaker 5 (10:03):
Uh, well, we could go with this sort of the
topic you were just hitting before. I don't know exactly
how to word this the right way, but which coaching
style works best?
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Oh?
Speaker 5 (10:13):
Is it like criticism and tough love or support and encouragement?
How do we word that exactly? To say, like, you know,
one dude is screaming your garbage and worthless, you'll never
be anything?
Speaker 2 (10:29):
Oh that made me so great?
Speaker 5 (10:31):
Or you're like no, man, like you're doing well, keep going.
Speaker 7 (10:35):
Well.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
There's part of me that would like to still have
a little bit of the old school. But then I
know with today, with parents with kids, you can't do it.
You shouldn't do it. But you know, I kind of
grew up on tough love with coaches, and I I
don't think you need to yell. I never understood that
(10:56):
when grabbing your face mask or screaming at you. I mean,
I would feel bad if I didn't play well. But
I think there's a time and place for a little
bit of that. I think it really depends.
Speaker 5 (11:10):
I think what we've figured out over the years is
that it just depends on the person that you're talking to.
Not everybody responds the same way to the same thing.
It's it's not really about the coach. It's more about
the person the coach is talking to, because like, like
my son has had it sort of like what you
were just speaking to. My son has had a coach
before he plays soccer, and the coach would be on
(11:32):
the sideline and he would be going Karen.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Kieran, Tom down, Tom down.
Speaker 3 (11:40):
Like.
Speaker 5 (11:42):
Like, my guy, you realize you're screaming at the top
of your lungs telling him to calm down, right, You
realize how weird that sounds.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Well, that always bothered me with Bob Knight, that Bob
Knight was never under control, but he told you to
be under control. And I like, don't you understand stand here,
Like you're supposed to be under control, then I'll be
under control. But when you're yelling, it's not like I go, oh, okay,
I'm gonna calm down as you're chewing my neck off. Yes, Paulin, this.
Speaker 4 (12:11):
Is a really tough question because the first when I
looked at this, is it Mike McDaniel's style or Brian
Flora's style, his old style. They're a year and a
half difference in age. Mike McDaniel's not twenty six, he's
forty one, and Brian Flores is forty three, so they
grew up in the same NFL. They just have two
different directions. I do agree with you though, there always
has to be some light level of fear for your
(12:33):
job to some level, no matter where you're work. You
don't want people too terribly comfortable. You want to be
positive and get the most out of them. But if
they're completely comfortable, I think that's dangerous as well.
Speaker 2 (12:44):
But also it's when you raise your voice. If you
don't raise it very often, but when you do, now
I have your attention. It's like with my daughters. They
know doesn't happen often. When it does, there's trouble. But
if you do it all the time and then you
kind of, you know, tune that out. But you're I mean,
growing up in these coaches that that's what you did.
(13:06):
You Woody Hayes. He was yelling Atja Bo Schembeckler yelling
at you, Bob Knight yelling at you. You know, even
Mike Kruzhevsky. I went to one practice and I was like,
whoa coach k simmer down? But he you know, he'd
learned with Bob Knight. I like Mike McDaniel's approach, but
(13:27):
it doesn't sound like he's a head coach with all
of that encouragement. But if it works for the Dolphins
and works for TUA, that's all that matters. It feels
like there still has to be that. I can be
a jerk. If I have to be a jerk, I
can raise my voice. I can get your attention. But
I don't think you know the days of slamming your
hand into the wall and then you break your hand
(13:49):
and then you go, boy, that was stupid. I think
those days are long. Yeah. I know, I had a
coach who did that, and it was one of those
where you kind of, you know, kind of put your
hand over mouth because you're going, that's stupid, and he
heard his hand. He broke his little finger. Yes, Marvin,
did you ever hear any stories about Tony Dungee raising
his voice? No?
Speaker 1 (14:11):
What was his style to get his guys so motivated
and have such great teams when he was playing?
Speaker 2 (14:16):
He seems so mild mannered. That's the way it is.
But once again, he if he raised his voice, it's
different than the octave that somebody else might be raising
their voice. Tony could raise his voice, but in a
way that he would be disappointed in you. But I've
never heard him yell. Never, even if when we were
(14:37):
Football Night in America for what eight or nine years,
never heard him raise his one. Now, he would deliver
a message in a way that was he was angry
at himself or disappointed in something, but it was never
raising his voice.
Speaker 4 (14:53):
Yeah, Paulin, that's a guy who's going to bring up.
Tony Dungee seems like the first old school new style.
When we started having him on before or he worked
with him, were like, this guy is so soft spoken,
how does it work? But then there's also the caveat
is with Tony Dungee. I mean, he was a great coach,
but he had Peyton Manning, which makes your coaching style
seems so much better than Mike McDaniels. I'm sure he's
(15:14):
a very good coach, but having Tyreek Hill and Jalen
Wattle breaths the success. It's like, does your style work
or does your personnel and style work?
Speaker 2 (15:24):
Yeah? I mean Mike McDaniel that's a different cat man.
He was. He was chill, funny sense of humor. Almost
felt like he would be the quarterback coach as opposed
to the head coach. But if it works, you know
the Giants the Bears when they had ditka Is yelling
at everybody, Giants with Bill Parcells yelling at everybody. I mean,
(15:48):
they're just certain coaches. That's why you know Saban, I
don't know if he yells as much as he just
delivers a stinging kind of criticism there. And you know,
maybe Belichick the same way.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
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Speaker 8 (16:12):
Hey, it's Ben, host of The Fifth Hour with Ben Maller.
Would mean a lot to have you join us on
our weekly auditory journey. You're asking, what in God's name
is the Fifth Hour. I'll tell you it's a spin
off of it. Ben Maler show a cult hit overnights
on FSR. Why should you listen? Picture if you will,
a world where we chat with captains of industry in media, sports,
and more every week explore some amazing facts about human
(16:35):
nature and more. Listen to the Fifth Hour with Ben
Maller on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast or wherever you
get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Let's bringing Diana Roussini, the Athletics senior n FL insider
co host of the Athletics Scoop City podcast with our
buddy Chase Daniel. Let me start there, who do you
think has the best chance to be a Pro Bowl
quarterback this year?
Speaker 6 (16:57):
Well, I want to go with the people who know football,
and those are head coaches who I've been talking to
over the last week. Some coaches that I was even
talking to over the weekend as they were waiting to
go out and play their own games, and they had
the Bears game on, and they were checking Caleb Williams out.
And he is as advertised in terms of being ready
for this offense, being pro ready. And look, we spent
(17:20):
the entire offseason singing his praise is highlighting how good
of a player is. It was a short thing that
Chicago was going for him. Probably about a week before
the combine was when the conversations really started to pick
up that they were definitely going to go with Caleb.
And it was very difficult to find an organization that
didn't believe that Caleb was the best quarterback of this class.
(17:44):
So the fact that he's already been able to start
working towards being a starter and a ready one and
one that is good to probably have a lot of
success this season, especially with the way they built the
Chicago Bears team. My vote is for Caleb. But it
is so good to be back, Dan. I feel like
it's been a while. Yeah, last time, the last time
(18:05):
we chatted, I think I was still at ESPN. I
think I was in stephen A's office with a cowboy
hat on and a cigar in my mouth. And if
I recall, well, I think we were talking about what
the New York Jets were selling to Aaron Rodgers in
Green Bay and essentially, come here, you can win a
(18:26):
Super Bowl. We'll give you everything. So two years later,
two kids later, we are back. Okay, if you gave
the Jets a do over, where am I starting?
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Would they keep Aaron Rodgers? Would they still go after
Aaron Rodgers?
Speaker 6 (18:46):
Yeah? This has always been a great decision, the way
they've orchestrated this or choreograph, the way this all came together.
At the time, I was on television of a writing
that the New York Jets are brilliant. They're doing what
they should be doing. An organization that hasn't won a lot,
(19:07):
that hasn't had a lot of success, is handing over
the keys to a guy who knows how to do it,
a guy who understands how to win, how to run
a hard practice, how to win in big moments, and
how to lead a locker room. Give the keys to
Aaron Rodgers made all the sense in the world. But
what I didn't see in the moment as someone covering
that team pretty closely, was that when you hand the
(19:30):
keys to Aaron Rodgers, then all the rules go out
the window too. And I think the team ran into
a lot of issues, not just in the off season,
but during that time when they were trying to build
what they were going to be, and Aaron say at
times became a problem because that's not exactly what the
(19:51):
head coach wanted to do. It's not what the GM
wanted to do all the time. So once the toothpaste
was out of the bottle, there they it was hard
to get it back in.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
So he brought in players who you know, he's not
a good GM. Yeah, you know, the players that he
wanted brought in.
Speaker 6 (20:11):
Yeah, he wanted players that he was comfortable with. And
it's not like I ever saw that list that he
handed over to the Jets that he shared with them
that most of them made sense to me at the time.
This is, you know, Aaron wants to be comfortable. He
wants to be around guys that he's played with before.
With the exception of Odell Beckham Junior, I think that
(20:31):
was really the only one on the list that he
had never played with. But the Jets granted a lot
of those wishes, not all of them, but a lot
of them. Remember David Baktiari was on that list that
never worked out, and look, Alan Wizard's having a better
camp now, but that obviously didn't work out great last
(20:51):
year he was he wasn't doing much. Nathaniel Hackett is
a really important element. Granted he was hired before Rogers
became a Jet officially, but obviously there were conversations being
had Nathaniel Hackett's not getting the offensive coordinator job for
the New York Jets. If Aaron Rodgers isn't telling Woody
this is what I want, right, He wanted his play
caller there, and it still makes all the sense in
(21:12):
the world. This offseason, the Jets looked into adding another
offensive coach, though they talked to Arthur Smith. There was
a time where they wanted to bring Arthur Smith in
to assist with perhaps some of the play calling that
they thought wasn't as sharp as they wanted to be.
That maybe Nathaniel Hackett was losing his fastball. But that
(21:34):
didn't work out obviously. Arthur Smith now in Pittsburgh and
he's got his own set of challenges as we speak.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
I know you spent some time with Sean Payton and
bo Nick seems to be picking up Sean's system, which
isn't easy for anybody to pick up, but he seems
to be thriving. When does Sean make the call on
who's his starting quarterback?
Speaker 6 (21:55):
Yeah, I expect Bownicks to be named the quarterback over
the next few days. Sean hasn't done any media, I think,
since their preseason game, so I'm expecting when he steps
up to the microphone, most likely tomorrow, I would see
I could see that possibly happening. Look, I spent two
days around them and Dan. There's when you stop by
(22:17):
a lot of different camps, there's a vibe there is.
It's not made up. You can feel it on the ground,
and the vibes in Denver were extraordinary from the head
coach to the quarterback. And yet the stars of the
camp from my perspective, was actually the Denver Broncos defense. Yes,
(22:38):
Bo Nix and Sean Payton appear to be a marriage
meant to be. Sean Payton joined my podcast, Coop City,
and normally I like to have my guests on for
about ten minutes. Sean was on with us for forty minutes.
And that's not because I ask good questions. It's because
he talks a lot, and when he's happy, he talks plenty,
and he is glowing about what bo Nicks has been
(23:01):
able to do. And a lot of it has to
do with his experience in college. Obviously, he's twenty four
years old, he's had sixty one starts. He's had the
most experience in going back to even that draft process.
I recall, you know, lots of GM sharing with me
and even even guys that were doing the work on
these players that Bo was in that category of Caleb
in terms of being pro ready, right, a lot of
(23:23):
these other guys needed a little bit more time, right.
So Sean's leaning into the fact that he can understand
what is being asked of him. He's not panicking in
the pocket. He appears to be a veteran type of
player out there when you're watching him. And then let's
just talk about this quarterback room in Denver, right, it's
a bizarre one.
Speaker 7 (23:44):
Right.
Speaker 6 (23:44):
You have Garret Stidham, who was with Sean last year.
You've got Zach Wilson traded from the Jets now in Denver,
and you have this rookie bow Nicks. And Zach Wilson's
only like three months older than Bo Nicks, so I say,
but it's not like he's this big older brother. He
just has a little bit more experience than Bo. And
(24:06):
you've got Davis Webb, the former backup quarterback of the
New York Giants, now the quarterbacks coach there, which he's
getting tons of praise out there what he's been able
to do in terms of teaching this Sean Peyton offense.
Because I asked Bo how he was digesting Sean, all
of it, from the play calling to just Sean Payton,
(24:26):
the person, the coach, the demands, the standard he holds
for a quarterback. And you know, he said that he
just felt that everyone has been on the same page
and Sean has been almost a better listener than a talker,
which obviously was the opposite on my podcast. That he's
just done a good job of understanding what Bo needs
(24:46):
and Sean is supplying that. And Sewan even shared that
with his play calling, he's cut down some of it
to help Bo take this next step and get comfortable
in this offense.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Talking to Diana Roussini, the athletics senior NFL insider co
host of Scoop City Podcasts with Chase Daniel, Tom Brady
over the weekend at the Fanatics Fest talked about the
tragedy of forcing rookie quarterbacks to play early. Seems like
a little bit of hyperbole with the tragedy. We're there,
(25:18):
but as you've mentioned, Jayden Daniels, Bo Knicks, Caleb Williams,
they've been quarterbacks with two different universities, two different offenses,
and they played upwards of forty five to sixty games.
I don't and they've gotten their money nil. It feels
like they're more pro ready than they've ever been. And
(25:40):
I don't know if Tom is just thinking what it
was like when he was seventh string quarterback in New
England and moved up to be the third string and
then eventually the starter. But is it a tragedy of
what we're doing with rookie quarterbacks.
Speaker 6 (25:55):
Yeah. My takeaway from listening to Tom specifically talking on
the topic.
Speaker 2 (25:59):
Was more his.
Speaker 6 (26:02):
Experience of playing the position and the challenges it brings,
and it was almost like he was admitting that this
is a tall task, this is hard. I had to
go through this, this and this, And I think it's
also human nature. We tend to reflect back on our
own experiences and you sort of become the old man
(26:25):
in the room now that I'm calling Tom olds. But
the way he reflects on his career may not be
exactly the way the game is now. And I'll call
them my football dads, the men that I've been around
all these years that have helped me understand this game
and get better as a reporter covering it. They would
(26:45):
probably most of them, the majority of them would probably
side with a Tom Brady in this respect, because there
is definitely definitely value to sitting. I mean, everyone uses
the example because it's the best example, and that's Patrick
Mahomes in Kansas City having that time to sit and
watch and learn and grow. Despite the fact that, if
(27:05):
you recall, we would hear during the season during practices
from players chatting behind Alex Smith's back. I guess how
good Patrick Mahomes was that he was already blowing them away,
but just getting that time to adjust and learn. I
spoke to Jordan Love on Friday. It was such a
great conversation about that first year, not just the hype
(27:29):
around him, the fact that he became this controversial quarterback
to join the Green Bay Packers, knowing that Aaron Rodgers
obviously the start and the green Bay Packers did what
they did at the time, the drama surrounding that. Forget
that he did talk about it, but forget that for this.
For what I want to talk about, though, is his
ability to play in the NFL at that time. And
(27:50):
I dooped to him. I said, let's pull some film
ovele from your practices that year. He's like, oh my god, please,
don't please.
Speaker 7 (27:56):
I don't even know.
Speaker 6 (27:57):
Who that guy is. I don't know who.
Speaker 7 (28:00):
He is, you know.
Speaker 6 (28:01):
And I appreciated how candid he was about it and
obviously very confident in what he is and who he
is now. To go, Yeah, I sunk. I was not good.
And look, I can remember back Jordan's first and second
year talking to people in Green Bay being like, Yep,
we messed up. He ain't the guy. Well, guess who's
the guy now. Guess who's blowing coaches the way, Guess
(28:21):
who's understanding the offense. Guess who is the clear leader,
clear leader on the field when you're watching the Packers,
And just from the way he conducts himself and just
his understanding of what his job is now. And I
think him getting this deal done was the best for
his overall confidence. And I felt it too, just just
talking to him. So really, to go back to your
(28:43):
question about Brady, I do think times have changed, and
it's great that this quarterback crop we're gonna truly see it.
We're gonna be able to see some of these guys
that are to sit and some of these guys that
are to play, and more we're gonna be playing. Obviously,
as you point now, we got Caleb and Jayden. I
think JJ McCarthy had a really good shot there before
(29:05):
he got hurt. I was with Minnesota the day that
news came out. That was not fun. You know, coach
was heartbroken about it. The whole team was you just
you felt that they just felt for the kid, because
I do think the plan was to play Sam, but
JJ was making a strong case to get in there,
you know. And then and then now you have bo
(29:25):
Nix here, who who who seems such he won this
job fair and square.
Speaker 2 (29:30):
Yeah. Before I let you go, you were talking about
training camps have a vibe. Uh you know, when you're
defending champs or you did well, you didn't do well,
and you go to camp. When's the last time you
were at a training camp and you go, oh boy,
this isn't going to be a good season.
Speaker 6 (29:48):
Last week, did we guess?
Speaker 2 (29:53):
Guess the team?
Speaker 6 (29:54):
And it's like, go to my Instagram, look at all
my pictures of all the different places. I stopped that
to show the world look at me. I'm working.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
Okay, everybody gets one guess. Hold on, Pauline, I'm gonna
just think, hold on, okay, but hold on. We got
a guess. Okay, Paulie, your guests, the New York Giants,
all right, Fritzy, I'm gonna say New England, okay, Seaton.
Speaker 5 (30:20):
I don't remember which teams looked at last week. Uh,
I would say probably New England too.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
Actually, all right, Marvin Titans, Titans, I'm gonna go Minnesota.
Speaker 6 (30:38):
Great guess. And I know why you did that, because
you were thinking, Oh, the day the JJ McCarthy news
comes out, maybe everyone you know was a little on focus.
Maybe they were all alpha big great guess. It was
the team that they were practicing against that day, actually,
and it was the Cleveland Browns. And I just happened
to be there on a day that the offense was
(30:59):
just off. The offensive line didn't look as sharp as
I was expecting them to. Deshaun didn't look like he
had a lot of presence out there, now, I'm going
to add I then returned and it was different. But
to your question of do you ever show up, you
know this isn't I'm not a believer, and oh, every
(31:20):
camp is so great and everyone is optimistic. Yes, people
are happy, people are excited because everyone has the same
record right now, and everyone believes that they're gonna be
the best team. But the value of these joint practices
has helped really sort of burst a lot of bubbles.
The question I would have preferred was, what's the camp
I went to where I went, oh wow, and that
(31:43):
was the Houston Texans. Holy cow, I knew.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
They were good.
Speaker 6 (31:50):
When I showed up. I left like and look, I
went on a day that everyone told me CJ was unbeskievable,
but I just was watching and going, who is going
super Bowl? All in on the Houston Texans, just based
on what they're building. Okay, something even simple and small.
This is tiny, but this is important, and it's been
(32:12):
told to me by many people. It's important in the
big grand scheme of things. When they make good plays
during the preseason, when guys are scoring touchdowns, backups players
that we may never even see again in the NFL,
the way the sideline, the way the starters are running
down into the end zone and showing that support. Because
(32:33):
what that is, that's culture, right, That's the Miko Ryans.
That's him saying we are going to be there for
everybody on this team, not just the superstars. And I
felt that when I was there. I had conversations. Stefan
Diggs told me this has just been refreshing for him.
He's growing up. He reflects on some of his younger
ears and just knows he made some mistakes and is
(32:56):
ready now to really try to be the best at
his position and based on what I was watching out there,
he's just been such an added bonus to this offense.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Great to catch up with you. We'll talk to you
during the season, and good luck with Scoop City Podcast
with our buddy Chase Daniel. Thank you, Diana, thank you.
Speaker 6 (33:15):
I can't wait for the aggregators. Rassini Cleveland, Brown's horrendous can't.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
Wait Diana Rossini, the Athletics senior NFL insider co host
of the Athletics Scoop City Podcast with Chase Daniel.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan
Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2 (33:39):
We make way for Tim Kirchin, ESPN analyst and National
Baseball Hall of Fame sports writer. He's a Little League
World Series Williamsport, Pennsylvania. Timmy, good to see you again.
There's a few things I want to dive into. We
thought about you yesterday when we saw this, the possibility
of a six inning rule for starting pitchers and Baseball's
floating it out there. I always get nervous when they
(34:01):
float something out there that it feels like it's a
little further down the line, how do you enforce a
six inning rule for starting pitchers?
Speaker 7 (34:12):
Well, I'm not sure how you do that. And Larry
Bird was an unbelievably skilled player, notkidding me. You've never
seen a guy pass in the half court better than him.
One of the greatest shooters of all time. Please, Okay,
I don't know how we're going to do this, Dan,
This is not going to work at six innings. It's
(34:32):
going to tie the hands of the managers even more
so than they are now. But Dan, we have to
bring back the value of the starting pitcher in today's game. Look,
I'm a tired old little man now. But when I
grew up, Jim Palmer faced Sandy Kofax in the World Series,
(34:52):
and Bob Gibson faced Jim Lonborg in Game seven, and
he faced Denny McClain in Game one the next year.
That's what baseball was about. And not only did they
start against each other, most of the time, they went
nine innings both of them. We have to get back
to something close to that. I don't know how to
do it. But Max Scherz got me on a headlock
(35:14):
last year at the postseason and said, you guys meeting
the writers have to do something about this. We have
to come up with a better way to bring back
the value of the starting pitcher. And he kind of
hooked it to the designated hitter. If you take your
starter out after one inning, you lose the DH for
the rest of the game. That is a possibility. But
(35:36):
I just don't see how everyone has to go six
innings unless you've thrown a hundred pitches, or of course,
unless you got hurt, or if you gave up four
earned runs. This is something they're knocking around. I just
don't know how you implement it.
Speaker 2 (35:52):
Sho hey, Utani not pitching this year, but I'm assuming
he will be able to next year. But here he
is cruising to forty forty. The possibility that he could
go fifty to fifty, I mean, that's uncharted territory here, Dan,
Everything is uncharted territory when it comes to this guy.
Speaker 7 (36:13):
He is the most remarkable player we've ever seen. I
got asked about two weeks ago if I thought he
would get to forty forty. I thought it was a joke.
I thought it was a trick question. Of course, he's
going to get to forty forty and yes, he's got
a shot to get to fifty to fifty. And I
know he's not pitching anymore. I know he doesn't play
the field. But it is difficult, Dan, you know this,
(36:36):
to just be a designated hitter. You're not playing in
the field, you're not pitching. And yet he hasn't lost
a beat. Not only has he not lost to beat,
he's hit even better than he has in the past.
And that is really really saying something.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
But you look at these guys. You know there's some
cloud ash suspicion with some of the forty forty guys.
You know that those numbers are tainted bonds A rod Well,
it's bonds. It's his tainted when he went forty forty.
Speaker 7 (37:11):
No, No, he did that, I believe before he became
the greatest slugger that we've ever seen.
Speaker 6 (37:18):
So I think he.
Speaker 7 (37:19):
Had already done that. He had already done a lot
of things before the problems or whatever we call it,
I don't even know what to call it anymore.
Speaker 2 (37:29):
Dan, And it feels like, and I know that there's
so much pressure on the Hall of Fame, you being
a Hall of Famer voting on this. The Pete Rose
documentary that came out. There's the ground swell once again
that Pete deserves to be in the Hall of Fame.
It is a museum. There's a lot of things in
museums that are done by bad people, or you know,
(37:51):
there's not necessarily a representation of the best of all
of us. But can we can we compromise and have
people in the Hall of Fame and tell the story
of baseball through the Hall of Fame even though there's
gonna be some warts at all.
Speaker 7 (38:09):
Well, as you know, Dan, there are a bunch of
people in the Hall of Fame who have plenty.
Speaker 2 (38:13):
Of wards right now.
Speaker 7 (38:14):
And you're right, that's the only way to do this
is to attach a story to every person so we
know exactly what happened. Is it a museum or is
it just a place for the greatest players of all time.
If you're writing a story about Cooperstown and the Hall
of Fame, well Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens have to be
(38:35):
in it. But I totally understand the other side of
this that people say, no, you can't put people in
who you cheated on any level, and guys have been
cheating in baseball for one hundred and forty years, Dan,
you know that you played, you are encouraged to cheat.
I remember Jeter got Jeter got hit on the knob
(38:57):
of his bat once and he pretended like I could
hit him on the hand because he was behind in
the count, and he ended up in first base. That's
what you're taught, That's what I was taught in high
school to do. And then when somebody does he go,
oh my gosh, he tried to deceive the empire. Well,
they've been deceiving the Empire and the referees in the
NBA for years. This is part of the gig. It's
(39:19):
not Magan doesn't make it right, but you can't ignore it.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
Is Pete getting in posthumously. Could you see like a
sympathetic type of vote for Pete after the fact. Yeah.
Speaker 7 (39:36):
I just refuse to believe that he will never get
into the Hall of Fame. But it's going to take
a different commissioner in my opinion, who's going to have
to come in and open it up again and see
where it goes from there, because I don't think Rob
Manford is going to allow this to happen. It's a
really tricky spot, Dan, I made speeches all the time,
(39:58):
and like within the first five questions, no matter where
I am, no matter what the group is, there's should
Pete Roseby in the Hall of Fame question happens every
single time. That's how interested people still are in this topic.
Speaker 2 (40:12):
Talking to Tim Kirkchin, ESPN analyst, National Baseball Hall of
Fame sports writer, he's at the Little League World Series
in Williamsport, Pennsylvania. Let me go back to o'tani. He
had a procedure. Now, I don't know if we're going
to make Tommy John the name obsolete, if, like, are
we coming up with a different type of surgery that
(40:35):
it'll be called something different than Tommy John surgery and
therefore Tommy becomes obsolete.
Speaker 7 (40:43):
Well, I'm certainly hope so, because Tommy John was a really,
really good major league pitcher one over two hundred and
eighty games, should not have an injury attached to his name.
But this is the fifty year anniversary of Tommy John surgery,
and Dan somebody he asked me once, like whose name
comes up more in regular conversation in baseball, Cy Young
(41:07):
or Tommy John, And I think the answer is Tommy John.
And there's something wrong with that. So Let's hope they
can and they know how to do this really well,
and they're gonna keep doing it better and better, and
maybe instead of being out a year, they're only going
to be out six months. But I would really like
to see fewer pictures get hurt and fewer discussions of
(41:28):
all of this. But I just don't see that happening
anytime soon.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
But it's like Kevin Durant and Aaron Rodgers with Achilles
surgery that you know, modern medicine procedures that now you
have different doctors who are doing different things to get
players back sooner. And that's what I wondered that we've
been we just throw out Tommy John. Oh, Tommy John surgery.
Otani didn't have Tommy John surgery, but he had a procedure.
(41:55):
I don't know if that was something that can circumvent
Tommy John surgery. So but I do like that we'd
mentioned Tommy and continue to mention him, and then maybe
people will look at his career record and I mean,
it's hard to win two hundred and eighty games and
you're not in the Hall of Fame, But can he
be in there for contributions to the game, Well, Tommy
(42:17):
shun surgery.
Speaker 7 (42:19):
Its name comes up every day. He should be in
there for this. The guy asks him once, is losing,
you know, really burn your stomach? He said, the only
thing that burns my stomach is Schwan food.
Speaker 2 (42:30):
And I said, all right, that's good enough for me.
I think. You know, when he passes away, he just
donates his arm to the Baseball Hall of Fame.
Speaker 7 (42:39):
Well, I think for his sake, someday we're going to
rename this this surgery, and it's going to be named
after someone else, or it's just going to be given
a different name, at least I hope.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
So I'm listening to the Mets game and you had
Keith Hernandez and Ron Darling, and they're both going on
a three to zero coount. No, no, you don't swing
on a three zero count. You don't you know you're
not swinging on a three zero count. Well, the hitter
swung on a three zero count and hit a home run.
I don't know what is uh analytics. I don't know
(43:10):
what is new baseball, because back in the seventies or
eighties when we were growing up, you're not swinging on
a three to zero pitch. Is it okay to swing
on a three to zero pitch in today's game.
Speaker 7 (43:22):
Dan, I'm at the Little League World Series and the
kid swung at a three to zero pitch yesterday and
we laughed out loud. It was wonderful in the press box,
me Ravi, Eduardo Perez, three to ozero pitch. It was
out of the strike zone that he swung at it. Yes, Dan,
you're allowed to swing at a three tozero pitch. Mike
Trout a couple of years ago hit the first home
(43:43):
run of his career on a three to zero pitch,
so he usually doesn't. The rule. The unwritten rule about
three to zero count is you never swing three to
zero when you're up by ten runs, which, of course
Fernando Tatiste Junior did a few years ago and then
celebrated it on his way around the basis that a
(44:03):
couple of veterans on his team said, come over here,
we need to talk to you about this, because I
don't think he understood that that is really forbidden, because
somebody's going to get thrown out after that. Somebody on
your team is going to get hurt because you swung
at a three to zero pitch. Just look at the scoreboard,
read the room and you'll know what to do.
Speaker 2 (44:25):
Have you noticed a change in coaching style at the
Little League World Series? We were talking about growing up
tough love. Now you have coaches who are more what
came up with tuatongua Ioloa with Mike McDaniel as opposed
to Brian Flores. Flores used to demean him and you know,
really rough him up, and then Mike McDaniel came in
(44:47):
and was basically an arm around your shoulder looking at
you know these coaches, and many of them have kids
on the team. Has it changed at all kind of
the tone of how they coach?
Speaker 7 (45:00):
Yeah, I think so, and so as being miked up
during the game. Look, the Little League World Series is
so beautifully run, Dan, nobody makes a mistake here, and
if a manager goes out there and says something even
mildly inappropriate, it's just not gonna work. And they're gonna
tell him you can go home now if he's miked
(45:20):
up and says something that he shouldn't have said. But Dan,
it's a way bigger thing, as you know, than just littlelygue.
We don't yell at anyone in the big leagues anymore.
A few years ago, a guy made a horrendous based
running mistake. If I had made that at age fifteen,
my high school coach would have taken me off the
field and said, you're not playing the rest of this
(45:40):
game if you don't know any better than that. But
this guy makes it's a major leaguer makes a terrible mistake.
He gets called into the manager's office after the game.
The manager puts his arm around him and says, we
love you. Okay, just remember we love you, And then
he explained, you can't make this mistake again. This is
what you do the next time. Three times he was
(46:01):
told we love you. Don't forget that. Whereas back when
I first started covered, if you made that mistake. Jick Williams,
Jim Fragozi Whitey hers up, Earl Weaver, what a crush
your bones there right on the field. Those days don't
exist anymore.
Speaker 2 (46:21):
Always great to talk to you, Tim, Thank you have
fun there in Williams Sport.
Speaker 7 (46:25):
It's impossible not to have fun here.
Speaker 2 (46:27):
Dan.
Speaker 7 (46:27):
Thanks, They'll talk to you soon.
Speaker 2 (46:29):
Okay, that's Tim Kirkshin
Hosts And Creators
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Patrick "Seton" O'Connor
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