August 26, 2025 • 37 mins
DP reacts to recent NFL contract extensions. NFL QB Ben DiNucci explains the backstory behind his recent viral tweet and explains what it's like to be cut from NFL teams seven different times. PFF lead NFL Draft analyst Trevor Sikkema breaks down how PFF evaluates elite players and highlights Patrick Surtain's rare value at cornerback.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Sports Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
It's our one on this Tuesday, Dan and the Dan
Net's Dan Patrick Show. Gang's all here, Marvin, Paulie Seaton,
also Fritzie and the back room guys. Guile us up
if you'd like Age seven to seven three DP Show
operator Tyler's sitting by.
Speaker 3 (00:20):
Also good morning.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
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Speaker 3 (00:25):
Stat of the Day has always.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
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buying should be, poll question play Theday stat of the Day,
(00:48):
All of that forthcoming. Well, there's only one left now
and it's Micah Parsons. Trey Hendrickson is in got a
little pay bump but not an extended deal here, and
Terry McLaurin is in a three year deal with the Commander.
So Michael Parsons on the outside looking in. I still
think this is going to get done, but it does
get tricky. A source said to me yesterday. You know,
(01:10):
Jerry may make a statement here and say you got
a one year deal left, and then we're going to
we can franchise you the next two years unless you
want to give us a team friendly deal. Whether that
happens or not, they're on the clock and the Philadelphia
Eagles are waiting for the Dallas Cowboys. All right, it's
an NFL cutdown day. We'll talk about that coming up.
(01:33):
Kenny Pickett got sent to the Raiders yesterday afternoon, and
I immediately thought, Dylan Gabriel is probably the backup quarterback
in Cleveland by all accounts. He has played really well
and has outplayed Shador Sanders, and Shadoor Sanders will be
the third quarterback. Now, keep in mind they had five
quarterbacks a week ago. Now you got Joe Flacco. They
(01:56):
had Tyler Hunley in there as well. They brought him him.
They didn't have anybody healthy. That's why Shador got that
first start. It wasn't a healthy room. Now Kenny Pickett
goes after Aiden O'Connell got injured. He'll be the backup
quarterback in Las Vegas.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
Yes, Paul, I have.
Speaker 4 (02:12):
The Browns current depth chart. Joe Flacco first string, Kenny
Pickett gone, Dylan Gabriel second string, Shador third string.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Yeah, I'm not surprised.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
The Raiders made it be known that they needed a
backup quarterback after they lost Aidan O'Connell, and you get
Kenny Pickett, who's bounced around a little bit. He was
on the Eagles roster when they won the Super Bowl
last year. You go into Cleveland and Joe Flacco has
earned it, and almost by default, nobody really challenged him
that it was going to be Joe Flacco unless somebody
(02:44):
really blew away the coaching staff. But even then, you're
not going to start a rookie. From what I was
told that Dylan Gabriel will probably get a chance, and
maybe Shador Sanders as well. But it's Joe Flacco right now,
all right? Eight seven to seven, three D Show Email
address DP at Danpatrick dot com, Twitter handle at DP show.
It's hard to believe, but let's say I came in
(03:07):
today and I told you Josh Allen just retired.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
You'd go why like you.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
Wouldn't believe that if somebody told you and Adam Schefter
Ian Rappaport said, hey, I'm hearing Josh Allen is retiring.
What it was six years ago this week when Andrew
Luck shocked everybody and said he's retiring. And when you
think of shocking retirements. Now, I had been in touch
with Barry Sanders and his agent, and the season ended
(03:38):
and he was going to London on a flight overnight
and he was retiring. Calvin Johnson walked away. I mean,
we've seen players who walk away and they still have
years left. But Andrew Luck was a three time Pro
Bowl quarterback, and I think Josh Allen is around a
three or four time Pro Bowl. Now, he did win
(03:59):
an m but I'm talking about the age.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
The age of.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
Josh Allen I think is what twenty eight and Andrew
Luck I think was twenty eight or twenty nine, bo nine,
twenty nine, Okay, but imagine that that was his Saturday night.
The Colts were at home, Andrew Luck is on the sidelines,
and Schefty gets word he's at a wedding, and he
(04:24):
breaks the news. Andrew Luck is going to announce his retirement.
I think on Monday or on Sunday, but we didn't
believe it. And so Andrew Luck is on the sidelines
and you can tell with the crowd that everybody is
sort of going, wait a minute, I'm just wait. I'm
getting this from schefter here. So Andrew Luck doesn't know
(04:46):
that the story's out there, and then they had to
walk him out and he got booed.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
That was six years ago this week.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
Now he's the general manager with the Stanford football team.
But imagine if Allen said I'm done now. Josh hasn't
battled the injuries that Andrew Luck did, and I said
for years, you have this unbelievable talent and you do
not have a good offensive line. It's like I got
(05:15):
this unbelievable engine, but I don't have tires that are
filled up. That's what you had with the Colts, and
it came back to haunt them because Andrew Luck got
banged up, and I think he just got to that
point where he realized there's more than just football. But
it still surprised us because that's where you go kicking
and screaming that I'm going to continue to play.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
They're gonna have to carry me out of here.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Well, that's not who Barry Sanders was, and that's not
who Andrew Luck was. Calvin Johnson I don't know, but
Calvin Johnson may have just said, hey, I don't like
what's going on with the franchise. We're not going anywhere,
and he decided to retire. I think at the age
of thirty. Barry Sanders around that same age. But you know,
(06:01):
once again, we think we know an athlete when we
see them. How could you walk away all that money,
a chance to be a starting quarterback, a chance to
be Super Bowl winning quarterback. But that's why we are
truly all different, because what our goals are, our motives are.
Andrew Luck had a bigger picture, maybe a bigger calling
(06:23):
than just being a professional quarterback. He struck me as
there's certain players that I've said this before, there are
guys who are really good at their sport, but they
may not love their sport. They are guys who are
in the gym all the time, in the weight room
all the time. There are other guys that they're just
really good at this. And I didn't know if Andrew
(06:45):
Luck loved football as much as he was just really
good at football. And then he may have gotten to
the point where he said I can walk away from this.
But six years ago this week, Andrew Luck in one
of the most surprise retirements in sports history.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
Yeah, Paul and Luck was coming off a very good
season in twenty eighteen, sixteen starts ten and six as
a starter, forty seven hundred yards and thirty nine touchdowns.
Both of those were second in the NFL to Mahomes.
And they were coming off a season the Colts where
they had won a playoff game.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
They didn't stink.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Yeah, let me go back to the Trey Hendrickson situation
with the Browns that they doubled his salary and this
is a win win for both. It's not a good
look for the Bengals, but I understand why they're doing this.
You get Trey Hendrickson, who now is going to make
thirty million dollars, which he should compared to everybody else,
and considering what he's done the last two years, and
(07:41):
you're going to make him a free agent, total free
agent the following season, he can go wherever he wants,
and the Bengals don't get anything in return. This is
where you go. I'm going to bawl out and I'm
going to have a great year and then I'll go
play for the Texans or Dolphins or whoever it might be.
But the Bengals they get him, and they get him. Really,
(08:03):
this is a contract year because he wants to prove
that he's a TJ. Watt, Miles Garrett kind of talent there.
But I think you look at the age now. Terry
McLaurin apparently wasn't old at thirty as a wide receiver,
but Trey Hendrickson felt older as a thirty year old
(08:24):
defensive end. But I think what happened with the Commanders
with Terry McLaurin is it's Jayden Daniels. This is his
coming in his second year. He had a great year,
went to the playoffs. You had everything worked for you.
Let's not mess this up. You brought in Deebo Samuel,
but that's a beat up, banged up Deebo Samuel. You
(08:47):
need Terry McLaurin. Terry McLaurin there every day for you,
every game for you. Not flashy. He's one of those
where you see after the game, I'll be damn he
had eight catches, ninety one yards and a touchdown. They
had to have him. Now, the Bengals Bengals had Trey
Hendrickson last year and didn't make the playoffs. This is well,
(09:08):
they got him, which is great. I don't know if
they solved everything. That offense is going to be great.
They'll be fun, be exciting. But you didn't make the
playoffs last year, and this feels like for that coaching staff,
you got to make the playoffs this year. They spent
a whole lot of money on their offense, but Terry
McLaurin got paid, and I think in large part because.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
They needed him.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
Jayden Daniels needed him, all right, what's poll question today?
Speaker 3 (09:37):
Seton?
Speaker 5 (09:37):
Yeah, I almost feel like to that Josh Allen comparison
is a little Josh Allen I think is a little
too accomplished, Okay, But at the same time, then the
next person that I would go down to her that
came to mind was Joe Burrow. If Joe Burrow retired today,
I would be pretty shocked. But he's actually Andrew luck
is probably more accomplished than Joe Burrow is at this point,
so he occupies this funny spot there.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
And Joe's been banged up, He's had a lot of injuries.
Oh yes, sure, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5 (10:04):
They there's a couple of comparisons there that I think
are pretty apt.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
How about most touchdown passes in their first six seasons
in NFL history, Dan Marino one ninety six, Patrick Mahomes
one ninety two, third on the list all time most
touchdown passes first six seasons, Andrew Luck. Then it's Josh Allen, Peyton, Manning,
(10:29):
Russell Wilson, Matt Ryan, Brett Farv, Derek Carr, Dak Prescott.
That's a pretty impressive list. At Russ, Yeah, Russell is
up there.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
Cook. Oh, he's cooking Hall of Favor. Come on, let's
get that fireback kid, come on. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:48):
But those guys are sort of you know, Mahomes and
Luck and Josh Allen, Peyton, Manning, Russ, Matt Ryan, Derek Carr, Dak.
That's modern you know, that's that's the new NFL. When
Marie was doing it, that was the old NFL where
you might throw thirty touchdown passes. He threw forty eight
one year. Farv in there as well at one forty seven.
(11:11):
All right, So the pole question or pole questions that
we're considering today.
Speaker 5 (11:15):
Well, we had a conversation before the show about the
value of edge rushers. And if they're I mean, they've
got to be average salary, they've got to be what
like top three or four.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
Yeah, positions in the game.
Speaker 5 (11:29):
Yes, right, but they still seem to be somehow undervalued
in a way or maybe not as respected as they
could be.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
Well, I think Aaron Donald is as valuable as any
defensive player in the last twenty five years. And I
could even look at his you know, his value to
offensive players, and you'd be hard pressed to find somebody
other than a quarterback.
Speaker 3 (11:54):
Now there are other positions.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
You know McCaffrey and Saquon Barkley and you know Derek Henrier.
I understand that what Aaron Donald did was disrupt everything
and edge rusher if I know bosas over here or TJ.
Watt is over here. Okay, now I can adjust. Aaron
Donald would go up the middle, disrupt everything, and then
(12:17):
he would make the quarterback choose if he was rolling
right or left. The edge rusher might not do that.
Now he's there, we can have two guys on him
and you could still stay in the pocket. Aaron Donald
with what he did, and you know, I'll go back
to you know, when I talk about winning Super Bowls,
it comes down to defense in my opinion. You know
(12:39):
when Chris Jones, Jalen Carter, Aaron Donald. You know this
is just recently. These are guys that disrupt and their
defensive lineman defensive tackles, or they used to be called
nose tackles. Having that guy, to me is just as,
if not more valuable, than having edge rusher.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
The edge rusher.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
It's great, we get to see you, you get to
do your sack dance, but if you give me, because
Jalen Carter had like four sacks and thirty two tackles,
but that's not his impact. Aaron Donald was unbelievable. Aaron
Donald won the Super Bowl for the Rams because if
Joe Burrow has one more second, one more second, he's
(13:25):
got Jamar Chase. Because Jalen Ramsey fell down. It was
a sack off in the Super Bowl. Has that ever
been used? We said sack off the day after a sack.
Speaker 3 (13:38):
Off mock headline.
Speaker 5 (13:41):
The headline something about a sack off for shack off
sack off.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
But Aaron Donald, those guys, Warren Sap, you know your
interior linemen mean Joe Green, those guys who play defensive
tackle or nose tackle. Those are the guys who I love.
And it feels like every year when I'm watching college football,
go man, that Danny Shelton, he's a great nose tackle.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
And Dominican Sue. You know, I, oh, man, that dude killer.
He should have been He should have been He should
have been great, Yes, he should have should have been
good career, not a great career. He should have been
something more known for the wrong things. His career ended
up being. He it all, it's somehow it made a
(14:27):
wrong turn. Yes, PAULI.
Speaker 4 (14:29):
There were times when Dominicansu was at Nebraska it looked
like one of those movies where there's a kid who's
way too big playing with high school kids.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
It was awesome.
Speaker 5 (14:36):
Yeah, like, why does this guy have to play college?
Just let him go to the NFL.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
And I remember talking to somebody who played at Nebraska
and they were like, we were scared of him. You know,
everybody's a football player, but he's got pads on. But
he said, we were scared of the Dominican sue. Okay,
stop me, you know, yeah, I don't know again, all.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
Right, let me take a break. We'll come up with
a pole question here.
Speaker 2 (14:58):
We got a lot of things to get to today,
and I thought it would be interesting to have Ben
Denucci on former NFL quarterback. If you follow social media,
he posted a picture of him at the airport and
he was having a beer on Saturday, had just gotten
cut for the seventh time. Now, I did have that
one game during COVID Cowboys Eagles and he started for
(15:19):
the Cowboys, and I thought we could talk to him
about what this life is like where you're not quite
sure and you know, quarterback's a great position to play,
but he's been cut seven different times, and I don't
know when you get to that point where you say
all right enough.
Speaker 3 (15:40):
But we'll talk to him coming up a little bit
later on.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan
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Speaker 6 (15:52):
Hey, Steve Covino and I'm Rich David and together we're
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Speaker 3 (15:58):
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Speaker 7 (15:59):
Weekdays from bot seven pm Eastern two to four Pacific
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Speaker 6 (16:05):
Why should you listen to Cavino and Rich.
Speaker 7 (16:07):
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Speaker 6 (16:11):
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Speaker 7 (16:19):
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(16:44):
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Speaker 2 (16:50):
Ben Denucci, NFL quarterback recently cut by the Falcons, the
seventh time he's been released in his pro career. He
played at Pittsburgh. He played a James Madison and was
initially I think selected by the Cowboys and the twenty
twenty NFL Draft. Got to start a game for the Cowboys.
I think that same year during COVID and Ben joining US,
(17:11):
I wanted to buy you a beer. I felt bad
when you posted you were at the airport.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
What time was that you were having a beer on Saturday?
Speaker 8 (17:20):
About three pm?
Speaker 9 (17:22):
So I thought I thought it was I thought it
was good enough time to crack one open, so FIG
figured it was fine.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
Do you ever get used to getting cut.
Speaker 8 (17:32):
Honestly?
Speaker 9 (17:33):
Yeah, I mean I was very fortunate the first couple
of years of my career to be.
Speaker 8 (17:36):
To be in Dallas, and then the last couple of years.
Speaker 9 (17:40):
Yeah, the last twelve or twelve or eighteen months, I've
been on three or four teams. It seems like every
every couple of months you're you're packing up, finding finding
a new place to play, and you know, going about
your business.
Speaker 8 (17:50):
So yeah, I'd say at this point, I'm I'm used
to it. I'm kind of numb to it. Not necessarily
that it's a bad thing, it's you just kind of
get used to it.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
How tense is cut down day?
Speaker 8 (18:03):
For me?
Speaker 9 (18:04):
The last I mean the last couple of years, it
hasn't been very tense. I didn't see myself having any
chance to make the roster, to make the practice squad.
But it's it's tough, right, I mean you people don't
realize for the guys that are trying to make this roster,
the any roster, the preseason is your is your super Bowl?
Speaker 8 (18:20):
Right?
Speaker 9 (18:20):
Your playoffs you get two or three games. Uh, you
get maybe a couple of quarters a game to go
put on tape what you're what you're gonna do not
only for the team you're on, but the thirty one
other teams.
Speaker 8 (18:29):
So it's it's very stressed.
Speaker 9 (18:30):
I've got a few buddies who are still sitting around
waiting this morning to see if see if their phone
rings are not and uh, they'll go from there. But yeah,
it's stressful. It's guys live livelihoods. It's their way of
making money and it's uh, you know what they do.
So it's it's very stressful.
Speaker 3 (18:43):
Hell, were you told.
Speaker 9 (18:47):
My phone rang from a New York number that I
didn't have in my phone And that's normally, uh you know,
that's normally a number you don't ever want to see
pop up on your phone. I answered, he Ben, you know,
coach wants to see you bring your iPad, bring your charger,
bring your playbook. And that's kind of kind of how
it rolls. When you get into the facility, there's somebody
waiting for you. They take you around, drop your iPad off,
go see your coaches, go see you know whoever else
(19:08):
you need to see, and then you know, they buy
you a flight and then you're out. Next thing you know,
you're drinking an airport beer.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
So okay, what do you do now, Like, at what
point do you say, now, I know you're you're going
to do a football game coming up air Force and
Bucknill and CBA Sports Network, But are you done trying
out for NFL teams?
Speaker 8 (19:28):
So no, I don't think.
Speaker 9 (19:29):
I'm officially done yet, right, I mean, the NFL is
an interesting kind of animal. You get a phone call
at any second, could be today, tomorrow.
Speaker 8 (19:36):
Could be in six months, could could never be again.
Speaker 9 (19:39):
So yeah, the tough part guy for guys is staying
in it, right, waking up every morning, still doing what
you've been doing the last couple of years, to make
sure that you know if the phone rings, you know
you're you're doing what you're supposed to do and ready
to roll that if a team needs you. But at
the same time, I've been in the situation a couple
of times the last couple of years and don't necessarily.
Speaker 8 (19:56):
Want to be waiting around again.
Speaker 9 (19:57):
I'll fall just stressing myself out watching an NFL all
games on Sunday.
Speaker 8 (20:00):
So I'm excited to UH to move on a little bit.
Speaker 9 (20:03):
Progress the next chapter of my career outside of football,
and looking forward to to calling Buckelver's Air Force to Saturday.
Speaker 2 (20:08):
Okay, but if you get a call on Friday night
by an NFL team, what happens to Saturday afternoon Bucknell
and Air Force?
Speaker 9 (20:17):
I'll tell him, hey, I can't I can't be anywhere
until Sunday, and hopefully their response.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
Is is what I expected?
Speaker 2 (20:26):
UH?
Speaker 3 (20:26):
Seventh round draft pick by the Cowboys.
Speaker 8 (20:29):
Correct?
Speaker 2 (20:30):
What was that like when Jerry Jones called you to
tell you he was drafting you?
Speaker 8 (20:35):
Very cool?
Speaker 9 (20:35):
I think I might be one of the only people
in Cowboys history to say that I got drafted from
UH from Jerry Jones's yacht. It was that COVID year,
so they weren't. They weren't in their draft room in Dallas.
I think Jerry was calling everybody from UH from from
his yacht in the middle of the ocean somewhere, and
UH saw the phone ring. It was his assistant. He said, hey,
you know, Ben, you know, mister mister Jones wants to
talk to you. We've got the next pick. We're drafting you,
(20:56):
and uh, you know, at that point it was kind
of like, all right, this is this is It's really cool.
Everything that we work for growing up, high school, college,
it's kind of all come first, full circle and worth
it in this kind of the moment that we've been
waiting for.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
Ben Denutci NFL quarter I'm still going to introduce you's
NFL quarterback.
Speaker 8 (21:13):
That's fair. I'll take it.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
Yeah, Okay, released for the seventh time in his pro career,
and it'll be in the broadcasting booth. It'll be Bucknell
in Air Force. That'll be a three thirty Eastern this
weekend for CBS Sports Network. Being on the practice squad
as opposed to the active squad, what's the difference in
how you're treated, your pay lifestyle.
Speaker 9 (21:38):
Yeah, honestly, nothing's different except your weekly checks that you're
getting in every week. You know, everybody treats you the
same way, right, I Mean, there's fifty three guys on
the active roster and there's sixteen on the practice squad,
And the reality of the NFL is that guys are
going to get hurt over the course of the year, right,
whether it's you know, whatever position it is. And so
those guys that are on the practice squad, they're a
vital part of the team.
Speaker 8 (21:57):
They're the guys that are getting.
Speaker 9 (21:58):
The starters ready to go to go, uh you know,
play out there on Sundays.
Speaker 8 (22:03):
They have a vital, vital role in making these teams go.
Speaker 9 (22:06):
And so there's a reason that these teams put a
lot of effort into into the practice squad, just.
Speaker 8 (22:11):
Just like they do the active rosters. So yeah, it's
really all the same.
Speaker 9 (22:15):
You're still traveling with the team, You're still still practicing,
still part of meetings. The pay cuts a little bit,
a little bit less, but at the end of the day,
it's it's it's still great.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
So but can you can you leave it now?
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Like if I say, what is your moment, You're gonna
tell your kids are grand kids where you that's my
NFL moment?
Speaker 3 (22:33):
What is it?
Speaker 7 (22:35):
Yeah?
Speaker 9 (22:36):
I mean it'd be it'd be hard not to say,
you know, my rookie year, when I got to start
that game on Sunday Night football against the Cowboys. I
think that's a moment that everybody kind of grows up thinking, Hey,
I'd love to I'd love to play in the NFL.
Let alone, let it be for the Dallas Cowboys, right,
I mean, the stars just kind of this iconic brand,
not only you know in the US, but you know
overseas as well. So yeah, it's uh, it's it's crazy
(22:56):
that it just happened my first year. Some guys, it
happens year ten, something happens you or five. Mind, just
happened to be.
Speaker 8 (23:01):
To be a rookie year. And so to be able
to do that and say.
Speaker 9 (23:04):
I started a game for the Dallas Cowboys, it's something
that a lot of people can't can't say and stick
their name to.
Speaker 8 (23:08):
So that was kind of my hey, welcome to the
NFL moment.
Speaker 9 (23:11):
And I think when it's all said and done, that'll
be what I look back on and saying, man, was
that was pretty cool?
Speaker 8 (23:15):
I'm g glad that happened.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
Hell nervous, were you?
Speaker 8 (23:20):
Well?
Speaker 9 (23:21):
Honestly, I think I would have been a lot more
nervous had there been seventy five thousand people in the
stands like a year opposed to only five or six
thousand for COVID. So honestly, wasn't that nervous, right, I
think you're more nervous just kind of the week leading up,
the practice, the game plan, making sure you know that checks,
everything is kind of you're good mentally, and then when
you get out there on the on the day of
(23:41):
the game. Shoot, it's the same game I've been playing
for the last fifteen years. So when you step inside
the white lines, it's it's go time. You got to
shut everything else out and go play ball.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
You get to keep your jerseys from all these stumps.
Speaker 4 (23:54):
You do.
Speaker 8 (23:55):
Yeah, you can see my Cowboys one up here.
Speaker 9 (23:56):
I grabbed my Falcons one last weekend and I think
I've got the only the only one I don't have
is the bills from last year during camp, So trying
to trying to find a way to get that one.
Speaker 8 (24:05):
That's the last one I need.
Speaker 3 (24:06):
Do you have to ask or do you steal?
Speaker 9 (24:10):
Well, you steal, but they still, uh, they still deduct
it from your paycheck. You've got to got to sign
off on everything. The day after the games, when they're
checking all the jerseys back in there, like all of
a sudden, Hey, Danuccies's Jersey's not here. Let's make sure he, uh,
he pays for this thing on his way out. So
that might have been my last party and gift from
the Falcons.
Speaker 3 (24:25):
How much was it?
Speaker 9 (24:29):
Uh, four hundred bucks? Yeah, so, I mean, I guess
it depends who you ask if that's.
Speaker 8 (24:35):
A lot of money or not.
Speaker 3 (24:37):
So is it game used?
Speaker 8 (24:38):
Worth it? It was worth it?
Speaker 9 (24:40):
Yeah, it's game used it when I worked the game,
took it right off. I took it right off my
pads after the game and through my bags.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Good luck with the broadcasting career and maybe the phone rings.
But you got the opportunity though, Ben, that's the key,
and a lot of us never had it. You got it,
and maybe you get that opportunity again. But like you're
in good spirits. I don't know if you're masking something.
Did you cry?
Speaker 8 (25:05):
I've cried a couple of times.
Speaker 9 (25:07):
I'm at this point in my career where it's just
I'm filled with a lot of gratitude at this point.
Right to be able to be cut that many times,
you've got to you know, team's got to like you
enough to sign you in the first place. Right, So
it's been an unbelievable career got five good years, played
on a bunch of different teams, played for some you
know head coaches that I grew up idolizing, you know,
Coach McCarthy, coach Peyton, coach McDermott, and Buffalo. Played with
a lot of guys, right, Dak, Josh Allen, Russell Wilson,
(25:29):
Guys that you know I've had on my fantasy team
for years growing up, and then all of a sudden
you're sitting next to him in the in the meeting
room saying, how the hell the heck did I get here?
So it's been really cool for me. Yeah, there's no
reason to hang my hat. I'm excited about the next chapter,
and it's been it's been a heck.
Speaker 8 (25:42):
Of a ride.
Speaker 3 (25:43):
It might be awkward, and it might be awkward me
even saying this, But did you ever try to swap
jerseys with Dak or Russell Wilson or Josh Allen?
Speaker 8 (25:55):
Honestly, no, that thought never even even crossed my mind.
Speaker 9 (25:57):
But looking back now, I sure would like to have
a couple of a couple of those jerseys to throw
up next to mine in my in my man cave,
just to say, hey my kids one day, Yeah, your
dad was decent.
Speaker 8 (26:06):
He actually did play with these guys. He doesn't just
have much of r random jerseys of himself hanging up
on the wall.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
Thanks for joining us.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
We appreciate being a good sport here and good luck
against with Bucknell and air Force this weekend.
Speaker 8 (26:19):
Thank you, Dan, appreciate it all the best.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
That's Ben Denucci. Fox Sports Radio has the best sports
talk lineup in the nation. Catch all of our shows
at Foxsports Radio dot com and within the iHeartRadio app
search FSR to listen live.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
I've been talking about Aaron Donald, how I think he's
underrated and I love having that defensive tackle, nose tackle.
He disrupts everything up the middle, and Aaron Donald certainly
did that. We ran down some other names in NFL history.
I know edge rushers get a lot of attention, certainly cornerbacks,
but that guy up the middle that just changes everything
(26:57):
and lo and behold. Fritzy reaches out to Trevors sak A,
the Pro Football Focus Lead draft analyst host of NFL
Stock Exchange podcast. Help me understand the metrics for Pro
Football Focus on the most valuable If I put Aaron Donald,
and I said TJ. Watt, like, how do you equate
(27:17):
the value of Aaron Donald to TJ. Watt or another
edge rusher Miles Garrett.
Speaker 10 (27:24):
Yeah, So we have a model over at PFF dot com.
It's called win's above average, wins above replacement, whatever you
want to call it, and actually it's available for our
team clients to be able to use.
Speaker 3 (27:35):
It's not a PFF.
Speaker 10 (27:36):
Plus product that we have there, and honestly it's because
a lot of stuff goes into it. And the question
that you asked is it's a tough one, right. I mean,
I think in baseball, a lot of people will reference
wins above average, winsbow replacement, that kind of stuff, and
it's a little bit easier because a lot of the
stats are a little.
Speaker 3 (27:52):
Bit more common.
Speaker 10 (27:53):
We're viewing things on a little bit more of a
of an equal playing field, especially when it comes to offense.
In the NFL, it's different and it really is a
total team game and it is tough to individualize those
certain performances. But with the model that we have, you know,
we get to take things into account like PFF grades,
which of course grade every single player on every single play,
(28:14):
which kind of tell us how well a player is
executing their job. And then we're able to give a
little bit of value to that with the rise in
popularity and perfection of the EPA per play, EPA per rush,
those kinds of metrics. So now all of a sudden
you have stats that or grades, data points I should say,
that allow you to grade performance.
Speaker 8 (28:35):
And then we also have a.
Speaker 10 (28:37):
Data point that gives you a little bit of an
idea for value. And so going back to your question
of like hey, Aaron Donald versus TJ. Watt versus Miles Garrett,
it all kind of comes down to how an individual
player is making an individual play and necessarily not only
how much are they leaned upon just themselves on an island,
(28:58):
if you will, but also does doing their job either
at a net zero level or a positive or a
negative level, how much that actually impacts the football game.
And so we have our own wins above Average metric,
which a lot of those things sort of get into it,
and we can get into that a little bit deeper
for as much as I can. I didn't invent the
(29:18):
metric myself. I just kind of know it pretty well
from everything that we do. But it is that way
where we take a total team game and try to
give these guys individual value and just to what you
were talking about about, you know Aaron Donald before, it
felt like he was breaking our wins above average model
sometimes with how much he was able to impact the
(29:39):
game at his high of a level. But we have
to take that into account when we do stuff like that.
Speaker 3 (29:44):
Least valuable defensive position is what oh I would say.
Speaker 10 (29:51):
I would say the least valuable is often linebacker because
the word replacement or average does a lot of the
heavy lifting for this formula when you get linebackers, of course,
like Fred Warner is at the very top of the list,
and it's because of what he can do in coverage,
as a run defender, as a pass rusher.
Speaker 3 (30:12):
He does all of those things. But there are so
many linebackers.
Speaker 10 (30:15):
That don't have that capability to give you those plus
grades and maybe more important, just those even grades of
not screwing up his job the way that Fred Warner
does that with a high floor and a high ceiling.
So a guy like that will have a wins above
average that is a little bit closer to you know,
normal interior defender, some edge rushers guys like that, but
(30:37):
there's a lot of linebackers that it gets a lot
lower to that zero point zero wins above average number,
the further you go down from Fred Warner, and it
doesn't take you long to get to that point. So
I think that the most valuable linebackers in the league
still hold that word a ton of value themselves. But
there's just a lot of guys that, much like the
(30:58):
running back position, the more replaceable you are, the more
close to average you are, the less value you're going
to hold.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
Like that, if the Bengals ask you and Pro Football
Focus if they should give Trey Hendrickson a three year
deal or just giving me a one year deal and
let him walk, what would Pro Football Focus tell the Bengals.
Speaker 10 (31:18):
Yeah, I think that it comes down to sort of
exactly what the conversation ended up being between these two parties,
and that is he's I believe thirty right now are
about the third thirty one. What does his performance look
like in twenty twenty six and twenty twenty seven? Where
is that drop off there? And you know, it's a
little bit of a different metric. I don't know, you know,
if we have something out there for necessary like age decline,
(31:41):
but I can tell you from a winds above average standpoint,
the only edge rusher that we had in our system
that was more valuable than Trey Hendrickson, who led the
NFL and pressures last year, was Miles Garrett. And the
reason why Miles Garrett was a little bit higher is
simply because he was better as a run defender. But
Trey was doing his job extremely well out and I
would stack that up with the rest of the team
(32:03):
there with the Bengals, you're not just looking at what
Trey Henderson is versus the rest of the league. Of course,
that goes into the overall number of what you're discussing
with the contract, but it also goes into who else
do you have on your team, because if you look
at the Bengals, the three players that are higher and
wins above average are the three that you would expect.
It's t Higgins's Jamar Chason, of course is Joe Burrow,
(32:24):
but after that it's Trey Henderson, and then you know
the next guy on the team is much much lower.
So I would certainly tell the Bengals, like, hey, if
you want to compete for a Super Bowl, if you
want to compete in what is maybe the toughest division
in the NFL, you probably cannot do it with this guy,
and you're not going to be able to replace him
in the aggregate.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
Trevor Sikamau, the Pro Football Focus Lead NFL Draft analyst
co host of NFL Stock Exchange podcast. For a guy
who won the Heisman and is coming in and maybe
playing both ways, there is little conversation about Travis Hunter,
which I find remarkable. Has Pro Football Focus looked at
(33:05):
what's more valuable in all Pro cornerback or an All
Pro wide receiver with Travis Hunter?
Speaker 10 (33:13):
So these guys are it is pretty close between those
because you know, as we were putting together and again
I wasn't in the beginning stages of this. I've just
done a lot of reading up on it and had
conversations with a lot of people who kind of came
up with this metric for us. What we realized is
that wins above average and wins above replacement in the
game of football gets a lot higher the further you
(33:34):
are away from the ball, actually because normally you have
less help, right, I mean, like when you're closer to
the ball, if you're in the box, you know, as
an interior defensive lineman or a linebacker, and even sometimes
edge rushers you have a lot of help next to you.
But when you get all the way out to the
sideline and it's a corner and a wide receiver, you're
on an island. It's all about your individual skills. How
(33:55):
can you get open? How can you not let a
receiver get open? And what we have figured out is
that some years it can flip right. Some years the
highest wins above average wide receiver like a Jamar Chase
or a Justin Jefferson can be a little bit higher.
But last year, for example, it was Patrick Shirtan. He
was the highest graded defender that we had from a
(34:15):
wins above average standpoint. He ends up winning Defensive Player
of the Year, and it's just because of exactly what he's.
Speaker 3 (34:20):
Able to do.
Speaker 10 (34:20):
You can stick him on an island against the other
team's best playmaker in the passing game and he can
totally take him away. That is unbelievably valuable from an
individual standpoint in a team game, so it is sort
of close. But to answer your question, I think that
for the most part, if you are a true top tier,
(34:42):
top five corner, that is going to be more valuable
than even the top wide receivers, because again we get
back to scarcity. There's a lot of wide receivers who
can do it at a very high level. There's not
a ton of corners that you can go out there
and tell them to play cat cover and say, hey,
you go cover that cat, make sure he doesn't catch
the football. Top ones do and our numbers reflect that
(35:02):
type of scarcity and that value. So that's why I
was a big proponent of Travis Hunter being a corner
in the NFL and understanding that if you wanted to
get benefit of the both sides of the ball with him,
you'd probably have to, you know, play him a little
bit differently. But I always said, you can play him
full time at corner, get maximum value there, and then
(35:24):
moonlight him a little bit as a wide receiver and
sort of get that value there.
Speaker 8 (35:27):
You can't do the opposite.
Speaker 10 (35:28):
You can't have a guy play full time at wide
receiver and then say hey, go go play a couple
of plays at corner or at least it's really damn
difficult to do that. So that's why I was a
big proponent of him playing cornerback because our wins above
average model sort of spoke to that value there.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
Does Pro Football Focus have Hall of Fame grades?
Speaker 8 (35:48):
I don't know if we do.
Speaker 10 (35:49):
Our data goes back to two thousand and six, and
I know that that every year we kind of try
to take the data a little bit further, you know,
like we'll watch a bunch of the season for five
before all those kinds of things.
Speaker 3 (36:01):
But I'm not sure.
Speaker 10 (36:02):
I'm not sure if we have a specific Hall of
Fame grades for all those guys that are in the Hall.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Yeah, well, even those who could get in the Hall
of Fame, like pending Hall of famers.
Speaker 10 (36:13):
Yes, we definitely would, certainly, certainly, certainly if they're recent guys, Yes.
Speaker 3 (36:17):
Like Russell Wilson.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
Is Russell Wilson, by your metrics, already a Hall of Famer?
Speaker 10 (36:23):
Yeah, I mean that's a that is a great question.
I wouldn't be able to answer off the top of
my head. But I do know that Russell has a
ton of value. Again, Like I know that just from
off the top of my head. If you were making
a case for Russell Wilson to make the Hall of Fame,
his wins above average numbers I think would really help
him in that case, Like I really do. I think
(36:45):
that's a it's a great case study, it's a great
you might have just given me a future article to write.
Speaker 3 (36:50):
Over at PFF dot com.
Speaker 10 (36:51):
They're looking at some of those guys who are active
players and might have a Hall of Fame case. But
I do know off the top of my head that
that that would be a metric that would help him,
because I've seen him at the very top of that
list a handful of times.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
Great to talk to you. We'll talk to you during
the season. Thank you, Trevor. Appreciate DP anytime. Trevor Sikama
You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Sports Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
It's our one on this Tuesday, Dan and the Dan
Net's Dan Patrick Show. Gang's all here, Marvin, Paulie Seaton,
also Fritzie and the back room guys. Guile us up
if you'd like Age seven to seven three DP Show
operator Tyler's sitting by.
Speaker 3 (00:20):
Also good morning.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
If you're watching on Peacock, our streaming partner, download the
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Speaker 3 (00:25):
Stat of the Day has always.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Brought you by Panini America, the official trading cards of
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buying should be, poll question play Theday stat of the Day,
(00:48):
All of that forthcoming. Well, there's only one left now
and it's Micah Parsons. Trey Hendrickson is in got a
little pay bump but not an extended deal here, and
Terry McLaurin is in a three year deal with the Commander.
So Michael Parsons on the outside looking in. I still
think this is going to get done, but it does
get tricky. A source said to me yesterday. You know,
(01:10):
Jerry may make a statement here and say you got
a one year deal left, and then we're going to
we can franchise you the next two years unless you
want to give us a team friendly deal. Whether that
happens or not, they're on the clock and the Philadelphia
Eagles are waiting for the Dallas Cowboys. All right, it's
an NFL cutdown day. We'll talk about that coming up.
(01:33):
Kenny Pickett got sent to the Raiders yesterday afternoon, and
I immediately thought, Dylan Gabriel is probably the backup quarterback
in Cleveland by all accounts. He has played really well
and has outplayed Shador Sanders, and Shadoor Sanders will be
the third quarterback. Now, keep in mind they had five
quarterbacks a week ago. Now you got Joe Flacco. They
(01:56):
had Tyler Hunley in there as well. They brought him him.
They didn't have anybody healthy. That's why Shador got that
first start. It wasn't a healthy room. Now Kenny Pickett
goes after Aiden O'Connell got injured. He'll be the backup
quarterback in Las Vegas.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
Yes, Paul, I have.
Speaker 4 (02:12):
The Browns current depth chart. Joe Flacco first string, Kenny
Pickett gone, Dylan Gabriel second string, Shador third string.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Yeah, I'm not surprised.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
The Raiders made it be known that they needed a
backup quarterback after they lost Aidan O'Connell, and you get
Kenny Pickett, who's bounced around a little bit. He was
on the Eagles roster when they won the Super Bowl
last year. You go into Cleveland and Joe Flacco has
earned it, and almost by default, nobody really challenged him
that it was going to be Joe Flacco unless somebody
(02:44):
really blew away the coaching staff. But even then, you're
not going to start a rookie. From what I was
told that Dylan Gabriel will probably get a chance, and
maybe Shador Sanders as well. But it's Joe Flacco right now,
all right? Eight seven to seven, three D Show Email
address DP at Danpatrick dot com, Twitter handle at DP show.
It's hard to believe, but let's say I came in
(03:07):
today and I told you Josh Allen just retired.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
You'd go why like you.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
Wouldn't believe that if somebody told you and Adam Schefter
Ian Rappaport said, hey, I'm hearing Josh Allen is retiring.
What it was six years ago this week when Andrew
Luck shocked everybody and said he's retiring. And when you
think of shocking retirements. Now, I had been in touch
with Barry Sanders and his agent, and the season ended
(03:38):
and he was going to London on a flight overnight
and he was retiring. Calvin Johnson walked away. I mean,
we've seen players who walk away and they still have
years left. But Andrew Luck was a three time Pro
Bowl quarterback, and I think Josh Allen is around a
three or four time Pro Bowl. Now, he did win
(03:59):
an m but I'm talking about the age.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
The age of.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
Josh Allen I think is what twenty eight and Andrew
Luck I think was twenty eight or twenty nine, bo nine,
twenty nine, Okay, but imagine that that was his Saturday night.
The Colts were at home, Andrew Luck is on the sidelines,
and Schefty gets word he's at a wedding, and he
(04:24):
breaks the news. Andrew Luck is going to announce his retirement.
I think on Monday or on Sunday, but we didn't
believe it. And so Andrew Luck is on the sidelines
and you can tell with the crowd that everybody is
sort of going, wait a minute, I'm just wait. I'm
getting this from schefter here. So Andrew Luck doesn't know
(04:46):
that the story's out there, and then they had to
walk him out and he got booed.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
That was six years ago this week.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
Now he's the general manager with the Stanford football team.
But imagine if Allen said I'm done now. Josh hasn't
battled the injuries that Andrew Luck did, and I said
for years, you have this unbelievable talent and you do
not have a good offensive line. It's like I got
(05:15):
this unbelievable engine, but I don't have tires that are
filled up. That's what you had with the Colts, and
it came back to haunt them because Andrew Luck got
banged up, and I think he just got to that
point where he realized there's more than just football. But
it still surprised us because that's where you go kicking
and screaming that I'm going to continue to play.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
They're gonna have to carry me out of here.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Well, that's not who Barry Sanders was, and that's not
who Andrew Luck was. Calvin Johnson I don't know, but
Calvin Johnson may have just said, hey, I don't like
what's going on with the franchise. We're not going anywhere,
and he decided to retire. I think at the age
of thirty. Barry Sanders around that same age. But you know,
(06:01):
once again, we think we know an athlete when we
see them. How could you walk away all that money,
a chance to be a starting quarterback, a chance to
be Super Bowl winning quarterback. But that's why we are
truly all different, because what our goals are, our motives are.
Andrew Luck had a bigger picture, maybe a bigger calling
(06:23):
than just being a professional quarterback. He struck me as
there's certain players that I've said this before, there are
guys who are really good at their sport, but they
may not love their sport. They are guys who are
in the gym all the time, in the weight room
all the time. There are other guys that they're just
really good at this. And I didn't know if Andrew
(06:45):
Luck loved football as much as he was just really
good at football. And then he may have gotten to
the point where he said I can walk away from this.
But six years ago this week, Andrew Luck in one
of the most surprise retirements in sports history.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
Yeah, Paul and Luck was coming off a very good
season in twenty eighteen, sixteen starts ten and six as
a starter, forty seven hundred yards and thirty nine touchdowns.
Both of those were second in the NFL to Mahomes.
And they were coming off a season the Colts where
they had won a playoff game.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
They didn't stink.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Yeah, let me go back to the Trey Hendrickson situation
with the Browns that they doubled his salary and this
is a win win for both. It's not a good
look for the Bengals, but I understand why they're doing this.
You get Trey Hendrickson, who now is going to make
thirty million dollars, which he should compared to everybody else,
and considering what he's done the last two years, and
(07:41):
you're going to make him a free agent, total free
agent the following season, he can go wherever he wants,
and the Bengals don't get anything in return. This is
where you go. I'm going to bawl out and I'm
going to have a great year and then I'll go
play for the Texans or Dolphins or whoever it might be.
But the Bengals they get him, and they get him. Really,
(08:03):
this is a contract year because he wants to prove
that he's a TJ. Watt, Miles Garrett kind of talent there.
But I think you look at the age now. Terry
McLaurin apparently wasn't old at thirty as a wide receiver,
but Trey Hendrickson felt older as a thirty year old
(08:24):
defensive end. But I think what happened with the Commanders
with Terry McLaurin is it's Jayden Daniels. This is his
coming in his second year. He had a great year,
went to the playoffs. You had everything worked for you.
Let's not mess this up. You brought in Deebo Samuel,
but that's a beat up, banged up Deebo Samuel. You
(08:47):
need Terry McLaurin. Terry McLaurin there every day for you,
every game for you. Not flashy. He's one of those
where you see after the game, I'll be damn he
had eight catches, ninety one yards and a touchdown. They
had to have him. Now, the Bengals Bengals had Trey
Hendrickson last year and didn't make the playoffs. This is well,
(09:08):
they got him, which is great. I don't know if
they solved everything. That offense is going to be great.
They'll be fun, be exciting. But you didn't make the
playoffs last year, and this feels like for that coaching staff,
you got to make the playoffs this year. They spent
a whole lot of money on their offense, but Terry
McLaurin got paid, and I think in large part because.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
They needed him.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
Jayden Daniels needed him, all right, what's poll question today?
Speaker 3 (09:37):
Seton?
Speaker 5 (09:37):
Yeah, I almost feel like to that Josh Allen comparison
is a little Josh Allen I think is a little
too accomplished, Okay, But at the same time, then the
next person that I would go down to her that
came to mind was Joe Burrow. If Joe Burrow retired today,
I would be pretty shocked. But he's actually Andrew luck
is probably more accomplished than Joe Burrow is at this point,
so he occupies this funny spot there.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
And Joe's been banged up, He's had a lot of injuries.
Oh yes, sure, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5 (10:04):
They there's a couple of comparisons there that I think
are pretty apt.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
How about most touchdown passes in their first six seasons
in NFL history, Dan Marino one ninety six, Patrick Mahomes
one ninety two, third on the list all time most
touchdown passes first six seasons, Andrew Luck. Then it's Josh Allen, Peyton, Manning,
(10:29):
Russell Wilson, Matt Ryan, Brett Farv, Derek Carr, Dak Prescott.
That's a pretty impressive list. At Russ, Yeah, Russell is
up there.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
Cook. Oh, he's cooking Hall of Favor. Come on, let's
get that fireback kid, come on. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:48):
But those guys are sort of you know, Mahomes and
Luck and Josh Allen, Peyton, Manning, Russ, Matt Ryan, Derek Carr, Dak.
That's modern you know, that's that's the new NFL. When
Marie was doing it, that was the old NFL where
you might throw thirty touchdown passes. He threw forty eight
one year. Farv in there as well at one forty seven.
(11:11):
All right, So the pole question or pole questions that
we're considering today.
Speaker 5 (11:15):
Well, we had a conversation before the show about the
value of edge rushers. And if they're I mean, they've
got to be average salary, they've got to be what
like top three or four.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
Yeah, positions in the game.
Speaker 5 (11:29):
Yes, right, but they still seem to be somehow undervalued
in a way or maybe not as respected as they
could be.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
Well, I think Aaron Donald is as valuable as any
defensive player in the last twenty five years. And I
could even look at his you know, his value to
offensive players, and you'd be hard pressed to find somebody
other than a quarterback.
Speaker 3 (11:54):
Now there are other positions.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
You know McCaffrey and Saquon Barkley and you know Derek Henrier.
I understand that what Aaron Donald did was disrupt everything
and edge rusher if I know bosas over here or TJ.
Watt is over here. Okay, now I can adjust. Aaron
Donald would go up the middle, disrupt everything, and then
(12:17):
he would make the quarterback choose if he was rolling
right or left. The edge rusher might not do that.
Now he's there, we can have two guys on him
and you could still stay in the pocket. Aaron Donald
with what he did, and you know, I'll go back
to you know, when I talk about winning Super Bowls,
it comes down to defense in my opinion. You know
(12:39):
when Chris Jones, Jalen Carter, Aaron Donald. You know this
is just recently. These are guys that disrupt and their
defensive lineman defensive tackles, or they used to be called
nose tackles. Having that guy, to me is just as,
if not more valuable, than having edge rusher.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
The edge rusher.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
It's great, we get to see you, you get to
do your sack dance, but if you give me, because
Jalen Carter had like four sacks and thirty two tackles,
but that's not his impact. Aaron Donald was unbelievable. Aaron
Donald won the Super Bowl for the Rams because if
Joe Burrow has one more second, one more second, he's
(13:25):
got Jamar Chase. Because Jalen Ramsey fell down. It was
a sack off in the Super Bowl. Has that ever
been used? We said sack off the day after a sack.
Speaker 3 (13:38):
Off mock headline.
Speaker 5 (13:41):
The headline something about a sack off for shack off
sack off.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
But Aaron Donald, those guys, Warren Sap, you know your
interior linemen mean Joe Green, those guys who play defensive
tackle or nose tackle. Those are the guys who I love.
And it feels like every year when I'm watching college football,
go man, that Danny Shelton, he's a great nose tackle.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
And Dominican Sue. You know, I, oh, man, that dude killer.
He should have been He should have been He should
have been great, Yes, he should have should have been
good career, not a great career. He should have been
something more known for the wrong things. His career ended
up being. He it all, it's somehow it made a
(14:27):
wrong turn. Yes, PAULI.
Speaker 4 (14:29):
There were times when Dominicansu was at Nebraska it looked
like one of those movies where there's a kid who's
way too big playing with high school kids.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
It was awesome.
Speaker 5 (14:36):
Yeah, like, why does this guy have to play college?
Just let him go to the NFL.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
And I remember talking to somebody who played at Nebraska
and they were like, we were scared of him. You know,
everybody's a football player, but he's got pads on. But
he said, we were scared of the Dominican sue. Okay,
stop me, you know, yeah, I don't know again, all.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
Right, let me take a break. We'll come up with
a pole question here.
Speaker 2 (14:58):
We got a lot of things to get to today,
and I thought it would be interesting to have Ben
Denucci on former NFL quarterback. If you follow social media,
he posted a picture of him at the airport and
he was having a beer on Saturday, had just gotten
cut for the seventh time. Now, I did have that
one game during COVID Cowboys Eagles and he started for
(15:19):
the Cowboys, and I thought we could talk to him
about what this life is like where you're not quite
sure and you know, quarterback's a great position to play,
but he's been cut seven different times, and I don't
know when you get to that point where you say
all right enough.
Speaker 3 (15:40):
But we'll talk to him coming up a little bit
later on.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan
Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio w app.
Speaker 6 (15:52):
Hey, Steve Covino and I'm Rich David and together we're
Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
You could catch us.
Speaker 7 (15:59):
Weekdays from bot seven pm Eastern two to four Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and of course the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 6 (16:05):
Why should you listen to Cavino and Rich.
Speaker 7 (16:07):
We talk about everything, life, sports, relationships, what's going on
in the world.
Speaker 6 (16:11):
We have a lot of fun talking about the stories
behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture,
stories that well, other shows don't seem to have the
time to discuss.
Speaker 7 (16:19):
And the fact that we've been friends for the last
twenty years and still work together, I mean that says something, right.
Speaker 6 (16:24):
So check us out. We like to get you involved too,
take your phone calls, chop it up. As they say,
I'd say the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio,
maybe the most interactive show on planetar. Be sure to
check out Covino and Rich live on Fox Sports Radio
and the iHeartRadio app from five to seven pm Eastern
two to four Pacific, And if you miss any of
the live show, just search Covino and Rich wherever you
(16:44):
get your podcasts, and of course on social media, that's
Covino and Rich.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
Ben Denucci, NFL quarterback recently cut by the Falcons, the
seventh time he's been released in his pro career. He
played at Pittsburgh. He played a James Madison and was
initially I think selected by the Cowboys and the twenty
twenty NFL Draft. Got to start a game for the Cowboys.
I think that same year during COVID and Ben joining US,
(17:11):
I wanted to buy you a beer. I felt bad
when you posted you were at the airport.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
What time was that you were having a beer on Saturday?
Speaker 8 (17:20):
About three pm?
Speaker 9 (17:22):
So I thought I thought it was I thought it
was good enough time to crack one open, so FIG
figured it was fine.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
Do you ever get used to getting cut.
Speaker 8 (17:32):
Honestly?
Speaker 9 (17:33):
Yeah, I mean I was very fortunate the first couple
of years of my career to be.
Speaker 8 (17:36):
To be in Dallas, and then the last couple of years.
Speaker 9 (17:40):
Yeah, the last twelve or twelve or eighteen months, I've
been on three or four teams. It seems like every
every couple of months you're you're packing up, finding finding
a new place to play, and you know, going about
your business.
Speaker 8 (17:50):
So yeah, I'd say at this point, I'm I'm used
to it. I'm kind of numb to it. Not necessarily
that it's a bad thing, it's you just kind of
get used to it.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
How tense is cut down day?
Speaker 8 (18:03):
For me?
Speaker 9 (18:04):
The last I mean the last couple of years, it
hasn't been very tense. I didn't see myself having any
chance to make the roster, to make the practice squad.
But it's it's tough, right, I mean you people don't
realize for the guys that are trying to make this roster,
the any roster, the preseason is your is your super Bowl?
Speaker 8 (18:20):
Right?
Speaker 9 (18:20):
Your playoffs you get two or three games. Uh, you
get maybe a couple of quarters a game to go
put on tape what you're what you're gonna do not
only for the team you're on, but the thirty one
other teams.
Speaker 8 (18:29):
So it's it's very stressed.
Speaker 9 (18:30):
I've got a few buddies who are still sitting around
waiting this morning to see if see if their phone
rings are not and uh, they'll go from there. But yeah,
it's stressful. It's guys live livelihoods. It's their way of
making money and it's uh, you know what they do.
So it's it's very stressful.
Speaker 3 (18:43):
Hell, were you told.
Speaker 9 (18:47):
My phone rang from a New York number that I
didn't have in my phone And that's normally, uh you know,
that's normally a number you don't ever want to see
pop up on your phone. I answered, he Ben, you know,
coach wants to see you bring your iPad, bring your charger,
bring your playbook. And that's kind of kind of how
it rolls. When you get into the facility, there's somebody
waiting for you. They take you around, drop your iPad off,
go see your coaches, go see you know whoever else
(19:08):
you need to see, and then you know, they buy
you a flight and then you're out. Next thing you know,
you're drinking an airport beer.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
So okay, what do you do now, Like, at what
point do you say, now, I know you're you're going
to do a football game coming up air Force and
Bucknill and CBA Sports Network, But are you done trying
out for NFL teams?
Speaker 8 (19:28):
So no, I don't think.
Speaker 9 (19:29):
I'm officially done yet, right, I mean, the NFL is
an interesting kind of animal. You get a phone call
at any second, could be today, tomorrow.
Speaker 8 (19:36):
Could be in six months, could could never be again.
Speaker 9 (19:39):
So yeah, the tough part guy for guys is staying
in it, right, waking up every morning, still doing what
you've been doing the last couple of years, to make
sure that you know if the phone rings, you know
you're you're doing what you're supposed to do and ready
to roll that if a team needs you. But at
the same time, I've been in the situation a couple
of times the last couple of years and don't necessarily.
Speaker 8 (19:56):
Want to be waiting around again.
Speaker 9 (19:57):
I'll fall just stressing myself out watching an NFL all
games on Sunday.
Speaker 8 (20:00):
So I'm excited to UH to move on a little bit.
Speaker 9 (20:03):
Progress the next chapter of my career outside of football,
and looking forward to to calling Buckelver's Air Force to Saturday.
Speaker 2 (20:08):
Okay, but if you get a call on Friday night
by an NFL team, what happens to Saturday afternoon Bucknell
and Air Force?
Speaker 9 (20:17):
I'll tell him, hey, I can't I can't be anywhere
until Sunday, and hopefully their response.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
Is is what I expected?
Speaker 2 (20:26):
UH?
Speaker 3 (20:26):
Seventh round draft pick by the Cowboys.
Speaker 8 (20:29):
Correct?
Speaker 2 (20:30):
What was that like when Jerry Jones called you to
tell you he was drafting you?
Speaker 8 (20:35):
Very cool?
Speaker 9 (20:35):
I think I might be one of the only people
in Cowboys history to say that I got drafted from
UH from Jerry Jones's yacht. It was that COVID year,
so they weren't. They weren't in their draft room in Dallas.
I think Jerry was calling everybody from UH from from
his yacht in the middle of the ocean somewhere, and
UH saw the phone ring. It was his assistant. He said, hey,
you know, Ben, you know, mister mister Jones wants to
talk to you. We've got the next pick. We're drafting you,
(20:56):
and uh, you know, at that point it was kind
of like, all right, this is this is It's really cool.
Everything that we work for growing up, high school, college,
it's kind of all come first, full circle and worth
it in this kind of the moment that we've been
waiting for.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
Ben Denutci NFL quarter I'm still going to introduce you's
NFL quarterback.
Speaker 8 (21:13):
That's fair. I'll take it.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
Yeah, Okay, released for the seventh time in his pro career,
and it'll be in the broadcasting booth. It'll be Bucknell
in Air Force. That'll be a three thirty Eastern this
weekend for CBS Sports Network. Being on the practice squad
as opposed to the active squad, what's the difference in
how you're treated, your pay lifestyle.
Speaker 9 (21:38):
Yeah, honestly, nothing's different except your weekly checks that you're
getting in every week. You know, everybody treats you the
same way, right, I Mean, there's fifty three guys on
the active roster and there's sixteen on the practice squad,
And the reality of the NFL is that guys are
going to get hurt over the course of the year, right,
whether it's you know, whatever position it is. And so
those guys that are on the practice squad, they're a
vital part of the team.
Speaker 8 (21:57):
They're the guys that are getting.
Speaker 9 (21:58):
The starters ready to go to go, uh you know,
play out there on Sundays.
Speaker 8 (22:03):
They have a vital, vital role in making these teams go.
Speaker 9 (22:06):
And so there's a reason that these teams put a
lot of effort into into the practice squad, just.
Speaker 8 (22:11):
Just like they do the active rosters. So yeah, it's
really all the same.
Speaker 9 (22:15):
You're still traveling with the team, You're still still practicing,
still part of meetings. The pay cuts a little bit,
a little bit less, but at the end of the day,
it's it's it's still great.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
So but can you can you leave it now?
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Like if I say, what is your moment, You're gonna
tell your kids are grand kids where you that's my
NFL moment?
Speaker 3 (22:33):
What is it?
Speaker 7 (22:35):
Yeah?
Speaker 9 (22:36):
I mean it'd be it'd be hard not to say,
you know, my rookie year, when I got to start
that game on Sunday Night football against the Cowboys. I
think that's a moment that everybody kind of grows up thinking, Hey,
I'd love to I'd love to play in the NFL.
Let alone, let it be for the Dallas Cowboys, right,
I mean, the stars just kind of this iconic brand,
not only you know in the US, but you know
overseas as well. So yeah, it's uh, it's it's crazy
(22:56):
that it just happened my first year. Some guys, it
happens year ten, something happens you or five. Mind, just
happened to be.
Speaker 8 (23:01):
To be a rookie year. And so to be able
to do that and say.
Speaker 9 (23:04):
I started a game for the Dallas Cowboys, it's something
that a lot of people can't can't say and stick
their name to.
Speaker 8 (23:08):
So that was kind of my hey, welcome to the
NFL moment.
Speaker 9 (23:11):
And I think when it's all said and done, that'll
be what I look back on and saying, man, was
that was pretty cool?
Speaker 8 (23:15):
I'm g glad that happened.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
Hell nervous, were you?
Speaker 8 (23:20):
Well?
Speaker 9 (23:21):
Honestly, I think I would have been a lot more
nervous had there been seventy five thousand people in the
stands like a year opposed to only five or six
thousand for COVID. So honestly, wasn't that nervous, right, I
think you're more nervous just kind of the week leading up,
the practice, the game plan, making sure you know that checks,
everything is kind of you're good mentally, and then when
you get out there on the on the day of
(23:41):
the game. Shoot, it's the same game I've been playing
for the last fifteen years. So when you step inside
the white lines, it's it's go time. You got to
shut everything else out and go play ball.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
You get to keep your jerseys from all these stumps.
Speaker 4 (23:54):
You do.
Speaker 8 (23:55):
Yeah, you can see my Cowboys one up here.
Speaker 9 (23:56):
I grabbed my Falcons one last weekend and I think
I've got the only the only one I don't have
is the bills from last year during camp, So trying
to trying to find a way to get that one.
Speaker 8 (24:05):
That's the last one I need.
Speaker 3 (24:06):
Do you have to ask or do you steal?
Speaker 9 (24:10):
Well, you steal, but they still, uh, they still deduct
it from your paycheck. You've got to got to sign
off on everything. The day after the games, when they're
checking all the jerseys back in there, like all of
a sudden, Hey, Danuccies's Jersey's not here. Let's make sure he, uh,
he pays for this thing on his way out. So
that might have been my last party and gift from
the Falcons.
Speaker 3 (24:25):
How much was it?
Speaker 9 (24:29):
Uh, four hundred bucks? Yeah, so, I mean, I guess
it depends who you ask if that's.
Speaker 8 (24:35):
A lot of money or not.
Speaker 3 (24:37):
So is it game used?
Speaker 8 (24:38):
Worth it? It was worth it?
Speaker 9 (24:40):
Yeah, it's game used it when I worked the game,
took it right off. I took it right off my
pads after the game and through my bags.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Good luck with the broadcasting career and maybe the phone rings.
But you got the opportunity though, Ben, that's the key,
and a lot of us never had it. You got it,
and maybe you get that opportunity again. But like you're
in good spirits. I don't know if you're masking something.
Did you cry?
Speaker 8 (25:05):
I've cried a couple of times.
Speaker 9 (25:07):
I'm at this point in my career where it's just
I'm filled with a lot of gratitude at this point.
Right to be able to be cut that many times,
you've got to you know, team's got to like you
enough to sign you in the first place. Right, So
it's been an unbelievable career got five good years, played
on a bunch of different teams, played for some you
know head coaches that I grew up idolizing, you know,
Coach McCarthy, coach Peyton, coach McDermott, and Buffalo. Played with
a lot of guys, right, Dak, Josh Allen, Russell Wilson,
(25:29):
Guys that you know I've had on my fantasy team
for years growing up, and then all of a sudden
you're sitting next to him in the in the meeting
room saying, how the hell the heck did I get here?
So it's been really cool for me. Yeah, there's no
reason to hang my hat. I'm excited about the next chapter,
and it's been it's been a heck.
Speaker 8 (25:42):
Of a ride.
Speaker 3 (25:43):
It might be awkward, and it might be awkward me
even saying this, But did you ever try to swap
jerseys with Dak or Russell Wilson or Josh Allen?
Speaker 8 (25:55):
Honestly, no, that thought never even even crossed my mind.
Speaker 9 (25:57):
But looking back now, I sure would like to have
a couple of a couple of those jerseys to throw
up next to mine in my in my man cave,
just to say, hey my kids one day, Yeah, your
dad was decent.
Speaker 8 (26:06):
He actually did play with these guys. He doesn't just
have much of r random jerseys of himself hanging up
on the wall.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
Thanks for joining us.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
We appreciate being a good sport here and good luck
against with Bucknell and air Force this weekend.
Speaker 8 (26:19):
Thank you, Dan, appreciate it all the best.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
That's Ben Denucci. Fox Sports Radio has the best sports
talk lineup in the nation. Catch all of our shows
at Foxsports Radio dot com and within the iHeartRadio app
search FSR to listen live.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
I've been talking about Aaron Donald, how I think he's
underrated and I love having that defensive tackle, nose tackle.
He disrupts everything up the middle, and Aaron Donald certainly
did that. We ran down some other names in NFL history.
I know edge rushers get a lot of attention, certainly cornerbacks,
but that guy up the middle that just changes everything
(26:57):
and lo and behold. Fritzy reaches out to Trevors sak A,
the Pro Football Focus Lead draft analyst host of NFL
Stock Exchange podcast. Help me understand the metrics for Pro
Football Focus on the most valuable If I put Aaron Donald,
and I said TJ. Watt, like, how do you equate
(27:17):
the value of Aaron Donald to TJ. Watt or another
edge rusher Miles Garrett.
Speaker 10 (27:24):
Yeah, So we have a model over at PFF dot com.
It's called win's above average, wins above replacement, whatever you
want to call it, and actually it's available for our
team clients to be able to use.
Speaker 3 (27:35):
It's not a PFF.
Speaker 10 (27:36):
Plus product that we have there, and honestly it's because
a lot of stuff goes into it. And the question
that you asked is it's a tough one, right. I mean,
I think in baseball, a lot of people will reference
wins above average, winsbow replacement, that kind of stuff, and
it's a little bit easier because a lot of the
stats are a little.
Speaker 3 (27:52):
Bit more common.
Speaker 10 (27:53):
We're viewing things on a little bit more of a
of an equal playing field, especially when it comes to offense.
In the NFL, it's different and it really is a
total team game and it is tough to individualize those
certain performances. But with the model that we have, you know,
we get to take things into account like PFF grades,
which of course grade every single player on every single play,
(28:14):
which kind of tell us how well a player is
executing their job. And then we're able to give a
little bit of value to that with the rise in
popularity and perfection of the EPA per play, EPA per rush,
those kinds of metrics. So now all of a sudden
you have stats that or grades, data points I should say,
that allow you to grade performance.
Speaker 8 (28:35):
And then we also have a.
Speaker 10 (28:37):
Data point that gives you a little bit of an
idea for value. And so going back to your question
of like hey, Aaron Donald versus TJ. Watt versus Miles Garrett,
it all kind of comes down to how an individual
player is making an individual play and necessarily not only
how much are they leaned upon just themselves on an island,
(28:58):
if you will, but also does doing their job either
at a net zero level or a positive or a
negative level, how much that actually impacts the football game.
And so we have our own wins above Average metric,
which a lot of those things sort of get into it,
and we can get into that a little bit deeper
for as much as I can. I didn't invent the
(29:18):
metric myself. I just kind of know it pretty well
from everything that we do. But it is that way
where we take a total team game and try to
give these guys individual value and just to what you
were talking about about, you know Aaron Donald before, it
felt like he was breaking our wins above average model
sometimes with how much he was able to impact the
(29:39):
game at his high of a level. But we have
to take that into account when we do stuff like that.
Speaker 3 (29:44):
Least valuable defensive position is what oh I would say.
Speaker 10 (29:51):
I would say the least valuable is often linebacker because
the word replacement or average does a lot of the
heavy lifting for this formula when you get linebackers, of course,
like Fred Warner is at the very top of the list,
and it's because of what he can do in coverage,
as a run defender, as a pass rusher.
Speaker 3 (30:12):
He does all of those things. But there are so
many linebackers.
Speaker 10 (30:15):
That don't have that capability to give you those plus
grades and maybe more important, just those even grades of
not screwing up his job the way that Fred Warner
does that with a high floor and a high ceiling.
So a guy like that will have a wins above
average that is a little bit closer to you know,
normal interior defender, some edge rushers guys like that, but
(30:37):
there's a lot of linebackers that it gets a lot
lower to that zero point zero wins above average number,
the further you go down from Fred Warner, and it
doesn't take you long to get to that point. So
I think that the most valuable linebackers in the league
still hold that word a ton of value themselves. But
there's just a lot of guys that, much like the
(30:58):
running back position, the more replaceable you are, the more
close to average you are, the less value you're going
to hold.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
Like that, if the Bengals ask you and Pro Football
Focus if they should give Trey Hendrickson a three year
deal or just giving me a one year deal and
let him walk, what would Pro Football Focus tell the Bengals.
Speaker 10 (31:18):
Yeah, I think that it comes down to sort of
exactly what the conversation ended up being between these two parties,
and that is he's I believe thirty right now are
about the third thirty one. What does his performance look
like in twenty twenty six and twenty twenty seven? Where
is that drop off there? And you know, it's a
little bit of a different metric. I don't know, you know,
if we have something out there for necessary like age decline,
(31:41):
but I can tell you from a winds above average standpoint,
the only edge rusher that we had in our system
that was more valuable than Trey Hendrickson, who led the
NFL and pressures last year, was Miles Garrett. And the
reason why Miles Garrett was a little bit higher is
simply because he was better as a run defender. But
Trey was doing his job extremely well out and I
would stack that up with the rest of the team
(32:03):
there with the Bengals, you're not just looking at what
Trey Henderson is versus the rest of the league. Of course,
that goes into the overall number of what you're discussing
with the contract, but it also goes into who else
do you have on your team, because if you look
at the Bengals, the three players that are higher and
wins above average are the three that you would expect.
It's t Higgins's Jamar Chason, of course is Joe Burrow,
(32:24):
but after that it's Trey Henderson, and then you know
the next guy on the team is much much lower.
So I would certainly tell the Bengals, like, hey, if
you want to compete for a Super Bowl, if you
want to compete in what is maybe the toughest division
in the NFL, you probably cannot do it with this guy,
and you're not going to be able to replace him
in the aggregate.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
Trevor Sikamau, the Pro Football Focus Lead NFL Draft analyst
co host of NFL Stock Exchange podcast. For a guy
who won the Heisman and is coming in and maybe
playing both ways, there is little conversation about Travis Hunter,
which I find remarkable. Has Pro Football Focus looked at
(33:05):
what's more valuable in all Pro cornerback or an All
Pro wide receiver with Travis Hunter?
Speaker 10 (33:13):
So these guys are it is pretty close between those
because you know, as we were putting together and again
I wasn't in the beginning stages of this. I've just
done a lot of reading up on it and had
conversations with a lot of people who kind of came
up with this metric for us. What we realized is
that wins above average and wins above replacement in the
game of football gets a lot higher the further you
(33:34):
are away from the ball, actually because normally you have
less help, right, I mean, like when you're closer to
the ball, if you're in the box, you know, as
an interior defensive lineman or a linebacker, and even sometimes
edge rushers you have a lot of help next to you.
But when you get all the way out to the
sideline and it's a corner and a wide receiver, you're
on an island. It's all about your individual skills. How
(33:55):
can you get open? How can you not let a
receiver get open? And what we have figured out is
that some years it can flip right. Some years the
highest wins above average wide receiver like a Jamar Chase
or a Justin Jefferson can be a little bit higher.
But last year, for example, it was Patrick Shirtan. He
was the highest graded defender that we had from a
(34:15):
wins above average standpoint. He ends up winning Defensive Player
of the Year, and it's just because of exactly what he's.
Speaker 3 (34:20):
Able to do.
Speaker 10 (34:20):
You can stick him on an island against the other
team's best playmaker in the passing game and he can
totally take him away. That is unbelievably valuable from an
individual standpoint in a team game, so it is sort
of close. But to answer your question, I think that
for the most part, if you are a true top tier,
(34:42):
top five corner, that is going to be more valuable
than even the top wide receivers, because again we get
back to scarcity. There's a lot of wide receivers who
can do it at a very high level. There's not
a ton of corners that you can go out there
and tell them to play cat cover and say, hey,
you go cover that cat, make sure he doesn't catch
the football. Top ones do and our numbers reflect that
(35:02):
type of scarcity and that value. So that's why I
was a big proponent of Travis Hunter being a corner
in the NFL and understanding that if you wanted to
get benefit of the both sides of the ball with him,
you'd probably have to, you know, play him a little
bit differently. But I always said, you can play him
full time at corner, get maximum value there, and then
(35:24):
moonlight him a little bit as a wide receiver and
sort of get that value there.
Speaker 8 (35:27):
You can't do the opposite.
Speaker 10 (35:28):
You can't have a guy play full time at wide
receiver and then say hey, go go play a couple
of plays at corner or at least it's really damn
difficult to do that. So that's why I was a
big proponent of him playing cornerback because our wins above
average model sort of spoke to that value there.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
Does Pro Football Focus have Hall of Fame grades?
Speaker 8 (35:48):
I don't know if we do.
Speaker 10 (35:49):
Our data goes back to two thousand and six, and
I know that that every year we kind of try
to take the data a little bit further, you know,
like we'll watch a bunch of the season for five
before all those kinds of things.
Speaker 3 (36:01):
But I'm not sure.
Speaker 10 (36:02):
I'm not sure if we have a specific Hall of
Fame grades for all those guys that are in the Hall.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Yeah, well, even those who could get in the Hall
of Fame, like pending Hall of famers.
Speaker 10 (36:13):
Yes, we definitely would, certainly, certainly, certainly if they're recent guys, Yes.
Speaker 3 (36:17):
Like Russell Wilson.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
Is Russell Wilson, by your metrics, already a Hall of Famer?
Speaker 10 (36:23):
Yeah, I mean that's a that is a great question.
I wouldn't be able to answer off the top of
my head. But I do know that Russell has a
ton of value. Again, Like I know that just from
off the top of my head. If you were making
a case for Russell Wilson to make the Hall of Fame,
his wins above average numbers I think would really help
him in that case, Like I really do. I think
(36:45):
that's a it's a great case study, it's a great
you might have just given me a future article to write.
Speaker 3 (36:50):
Over at PFF dot com.
Speaker 10 (36:51):
They're looking at some of those guys who are active
players and might have a Hall of Fame case. But
I do know off the top of my head that
that that would be a metric that would help him,
because I've seen him at the very top of that
list a handful of times.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
Great to talk to you. We'll talk to you during
the season. Thank you, Trevor. Appreciate DP anytime. Trevor Sikama
Hosts And Creators
Todd "Fritzy" Fritz
Dan Patrick
Patrick "Seton" O'Connor
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