April 21, 2023 • 27 mins
Medicaid coverage has taken on so many people that is it now hitting our doctors in the paycheck. It's the "high cost off a good deed." Also, taxpayers are paying so much of the bill, we're starting to look like a socialized system.
Did you know that there are things that you shouldn't tell your doctor? Craig and the guys covered that too!
Craig Gottwals, aka "Craig the Healthcare Guru", talks about that and more in a new episode of A&G's Extra Large Podcast.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
So we got a couple of things we want to
talk with our healthcare expert, Craig. We've been having on
for many, many years, including we're going to get to
I actually had a discussion with him as he's a lawyer,
like what things should you tell your doctor or shouldn't
tell your doctor?
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Which is an you just.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Gotta tell him everything. Jack, You certainly you would think.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
That that's a good idea and probably is the best
idea for your health. It is not the best idea
for the next time you apply for life insurance or
maybe something with the DMV or a.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Variety of things, which is not a good system.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
We don't want a system where you're not being honest
with your doctor because you're not going to get good results.
But let's live in reality and we'll talk to Craig
about that coming up in a few minutes.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
You're probably thinking, what about HIPPA the privacy stuff. Yeah,
exactly what we're going to talk about. So Craig Gottwaals,
Craig the healthcare guru, joins us. He's an attorney, a
law and benefit consultant with Benefit Revolution, and a good
friend as well.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
Craig, how are you I am well finded, sir as,
how are we are? Kick ass? Thank you?
Speaker 3 (01:06):
So we wanted to have you on for a couple
of things. Number one the thing we just mentioned. But
first we just thought it was time to have you
on again to re explain to help people new listeners
perhaps understand what a scam government healthcare and the accounting
and legislation behind it is, how dishonest it all is.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Are you up for that?
Speaker 4 (01:28):
Oh? Absolutely, I'm always up for that one, Joe, all right,
So talk to us. We passed Medicare and Medicaid in
nineteen sixty five in this country. Medicare covers the oldsters.
Medicaid covers our lowest income amongst us. So the first
point with respect to these programs is how mission creep
is so fantastic within government programs. When Medicaid again low
(01:51):
income in California, we happen to call it medi coal,
which is kind of a complicated, weird way of you know,
it makes it weird, But it was designed to cover
the lowest two percent of wage earners in the country.
Today it covers forty percent of all babies born in
about one third of all people in the country, and
(02:11):
at least in blue states a little bit less than
that in red state.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
God, and that is so classic from that book of
the high cost of good intentions. I mean, because you
can convince voters that the bottom two percent of let's
help them out. I mean, come on, it could happen
to anybody. Blah blah blah blah. Next thing you know,
damn near half of babies are covered by it.
Speaker 4 (02:35):
That's right. And if you guys read the hippo article
that I had published this week, and the high cost
of good intentions is another way of what one of
my law professors used to ironically say, is no good
deed goes unpunishing. Right now, medicare, interestingly, and so both
of these programs systematically underpaid doctors. I mean, when you
when you add this many bodies to a program that
(02:56):
was only designed to cover two percent of the population
and now it covers. In the case of Medicaid, you
you have to cut costs somewhere, right, And we know
the one place government doesn't cut cost is on administration.
In fact, we know it's highly highly ineffective in that matter,
fun stack for you there, hospital administ So we've basically
(03:20):
doubled the number of doctors in our country since nineteen seventy.
But if you look at medical administration, primarily hospital administration,
that's up three thousand percent.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
Wow, oh my god, just like schools and everything else.
Speaker 4 (03:36):
Just like schools, that's right. And in that if you
look at just look at inflation in the economy since
two thousand, from two thousand to now, hospital services are
up the most at two hundred and forty percent. People
always ask me, well, what's college tuition, Well that's only
one hundred and seventy percent.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
Yeah, Well, I don't mean to derail you in case
you have a carefully laid out plan for how we're
going to get there. But you mentioned that the doctors
are like ridiculously underpaid by Medicare. How does that even out?
How do doctors and hospital stay in business?
Speaker 4 (04:11):
Yeah, So this has been going on since roughly the
mid nineties. This has been a big problem where the
amount that Medicare pays each year and Medicaid for the
most part, the amount that they pay more each year
only goes up by about one percent. And right around
the mid nineties that became a problem where you know,
some of the higher cost facilities, some of your more
premium hospitals, for example, they it wasn't even necessarily covering
(04:36):
their costs. So what has to happen then in the
system is these hospitals when they go into the big
negotiations with the big four or five national medical carriers,
they have to negotiate higher reimbursements for these same procedures
just in order to keep their doors open, because Medicare
and Medicaid increasingly don't pay what the actual costs are.
(04:57):
So we've ended up with a system where nationally, if
you were to have an elective surgery, it would cost
you X at your you know, within your Medicare or
we call it Medicare system, it would cost you X.
That has to be about two hundred and fifty percent
of X through your private insurer, just so that hospitals
(05:19):
can stay afloat. So, in other words, all of us
that have private healthcare insurance are paying a tax roughly
two and a half times the cost of what Medicare
and Medicaid pay, just in order to keep.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
The facilities afloat.
Speaker 4 (05:33):
And in the industry we know this is a hidden
tax or a hidden cost shift associated with the fact
that Medicare systematically and Medicaid systematically underpay facilities.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
So it is quite directly a tax. It's a transfer
of wealth. So I think people need a hidden tax, need.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
To understand that.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
And then the utter dishonesty of Congress and their budgeting
for it. That fascinated me the first time you brought
that up.
Speaker 4 (05:57):
Yeah, Joe, you're so good. You remember these things ten
years ago. So like when you pass something like Obamacare
had this in it. For example, it's they always Congress
in order to when they were pricing Obamacare, it was
coming in one in a quarter one and a half
trillion dollars overall ballpark. When the CBO was scoring it
(06:18):
and the congressional bodies people that wanted to pass Obamacare,
they knew that it's going to be very hard for
us to pass this if, in fact, it's more than
a trillion dollars. So we got to get the scorecard
on Obamacare down under a trillion. Well, one of the
ways they do that systematically is they write into Obamacare,
and they did. They wrote in that. You know, one
(06:39):
of the ways we're going to save money with this
law is starting in twenty fourteen, four years out, we're
going to start reducing what Medicare pays doctors by one
percent per year until such point that you get the
overall price tag of Obamacare to look like it's going
to be less than a trillion dollars, which is exactly
what they did. They passed Obamacare, and then, of course
when twenty four team rolled around four years later, they
(07:01):
repealed the provision that said they were going to reduce
what's paid in Medicare and Medicaid, because of course if
you try to actually cut that, no oldsters or low
income folks would get any healthcare whatsoever. And then the
price tag of Obamacare shoots up to two trillion dollars.
It doubles, and they it's not just done in Obamacare.
This has been done in a handful of major legislation
related to healthcare over the past twenty years.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
So they claim will be cutting costs in the future,
but when the future comes they always put it off.
That's right, utterly dishonest. Craig Gotwall's the healthcare guru is
on the line.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Go ahead.
Speaker 4 (07:35):
Oh, and then so when the CBO scores it, of
course they just have to score. They're just you know,
they're just actuaries and accountants. They simply have to score
what's written in the bill, and the bill was written
that Medicare and Medicaid were going to get cut even further.
So of course, you know, they scored it as under
a trillion, and then quickly it doubled.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
Right, And then the final point is that as this
you know, accounting trickery and terribly low payments to medical
facilities continues, are fewer and fewer doctors who are willing
to see these patients.
Speaker 4 (08:04):
Yeah, that's right. In fact in Blue states because because
Blue states have expanded Medicaid the low income fortion as
far as they lawfully can, you're in a situation now
where roughly half of doctors won't even take a Medicaid patient.
And it's something like ten to twenty percent of doctors
won't take a new Medicare patient again because of the
fact that it systematically pays you much less than the
(08:28):
private corporate plans. And the bigger problem that we've mentioned
on this show before is if you're in California, for example,
and this is true across all Blue states, seventy one
percent of all healthcare expenses are paid by the taxpayer.
Now in Blue.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
States, so damn near three quarters yep as already government
healthcare tax start scare.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:53):
So it's weird that we even have this argument over
whether or not we're going to go down the road
of socialized healthcare because three quarters of the way there,
at least in Galabi.
Speaker 3 (09:01):
That's one of the main reasons, sorry to interrupt this,
one of the main reasons the country is going into
such incredible debt is paying for this dishonest budgeting trickery anyway.
Speaker 4 (09:11):
Well, and I would even argue at this point, Jack,
we have a socialized system because I've been full time
doing nothing but this and negotiating with these massive carriers
for twenty two years. And let me just share this
statistic with you two thousand and nine before Obamacare passed.
Since from two thousand and nine to today, the S
and P five hundred is up four hundred and twenty
(09:32):
two percent. The stock prices on the five largest medical
insurers is up one nine and twenty one percent.
Speaker 5 (09:40):
Wow.
Speaker 4 (09:41):
And so, in other words, they're all in it together, folks.
Healthcare is the number one employer in the United States,
number one private employer, and it's the number one lobby
in the United States, spending seven hundred million annually. The
government and the large insurers are all in bed together
on this thing.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
It doesn't seem like that would please anybody, though lefties
like Bernie Sanders crowd or the Rand Paul crowd, it
doesn't seem like anybody would be happy with that.
Speaker 4 (10:06):
Well, Jack, you just committed a huge sin that you
guys rail against all the time. You assume that Bernie
represents the Democratic Party and that Rand represents the Republican Party,
and you know darn well they are the outliers on
both ends.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Yeah, that's truels, dirty rebels.
Speaker 4 (10:23):
Eight percent in the middle of the republic cracks love
this because they are lining their pockets with this.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
So I had a conversation with Craig over the last
couple of weeks about what you should or should not
tell your doctor, And it seems like on the face
of it, you'd want to be honest with your doctor,
but there's some stuff that can end up in your
permanent record, just like when you're in second grade, it's
going to go on your permanent record.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
Talking to Craig got palls the healthcare guru. So the
topic is what.
Speaker 1 (10:46):
You should or shouldn't tell your doctor so I would
say this, and I certainly don't want to get you
in trouble, Craig, but I don't want to have anybody
out there not being honest with the doctor and ends
up killing them or making them sick or something like that.
So I'll look at it this way, because I've had
this experience. You should be aware that some things you
(11:07):
tell your doctor will get out to say insurance companies
can happen with DMVs that could come back to haunt you,
and you might think, well, how would that information get
out with the hippo violations of our boss had a
major health thing happened in his life and nobody knew
(11:28):
it around here. So somebody you work with on a
regular basis, you can't reach out to them and say hey, okay,
or hey anything I can do to help because they
aren't allowed to tell you because a HIPPA. But something
you tell your doctor in the privacy of that office
could leak out and have an effect on your life
insurance or the DMV in the future. Craig, explain how
that could happen.
Speaker 4 (11:45):
Oh, Jack, you just you threw me two different topics
here that are related but so complicated. Okay, so let's
just take the doctor's office visit. I'm just going to
tell you what the law is. I will not get
into discussing what people should and shouldn't tell their doctors, because,
as you said, people should always be help honest with
their healthcare provider and get the help they need.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
I'm not and I won't be there, but you should.
Speaker 4 (12:09):
So when you go into a doctor's office, and if
you are to tell your doctor things that could make
it such that you could be a danger on the road.
For example, you're having some kind of mental impairment, maybe
you've blacked out, maybe you've you've had seizures, et cetera.
Speaker 2 (12:30):
If there's my uncontrollable rage.
Speaker 4 (12:33):
Yeah right, it's like it's trets, like cussing and rage.
If you disclose these things to a medical professional. In
twelve of our fifty states, California and Nevada being two
of those twelve as an example, the healthcare provider is
required to report that information over to the Department of
(12:55):
Motor Vehicles. And if they don't report that information and
you kill somebody on the road and the investigation reveals
their last healthcare visit with you, and that information is
in the medical file that healthcare provider is liable.
Speaker 1 (13:10):
Now, to make it clear, I don't want somebody who's
having regular seizures driving either. But if you had kind
of like an iffy situation, you're not sure what it was,
and it was a one off because of some weird circumstances,
you know why your driver's license taken away?
Speaker 4 (13:24):
No, no, you don't. And this is where you know
I have I have good friends and colleagues who are
doctors and administrators of hospitals, and so what I can
tell you on this topic is a good doctor, especially
a doctor with whom you have a relationship, they really
don't want to have to make this report because this
is a lot of paperwork. It is a very time consuming.
(13:48):
You get sucked into the bureaucratic a mass of these
of these entities working together. And then of course, this
particular doctor I spoke with said and Craig, I don't
want to do it because I don't want this person
coming back with a gun and shooting out my workplace,
because hey, I get it, if we have to report this,
we could very well be ruining their life.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
See.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
I don't want to phrase this wrong way because I'm
not trying to encourage people not to be honest with
their doctors.
Speaker 3 (14:11):
Remember I almost went to law school, Jack, May I
take a shot at it?
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Sure?
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Well, I'm thinking about the morality of it versus the
legality of it. But you're do you think about the
legality of it?
Speaker 5 (14:21):
Well?
Speaker 3 (14:21):
No, you almost became a theologian, So I'll let you
head it. I will tell you that Craig Gotwols is
our guest. Craig's the healthcare guru, attorney of law, benefit consultant.
Benefit revolution could follow on Twitter, et cetera, et cetera,
and a good guy to talk to if you need
benefits for your company.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
I guess the way to state it is don't think
what you tell your doctors just between you and your doctor.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
It absolutely is not.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Now I have had that experience and I don't want to,
for a variety of reasons explain what it was. But
it was just like a one off comment to an
urgent care doctor one time. Then this is many years ago.
Then when I went to get life insurance, that showed up.
Couldn't get life insurance? What what that was?
Speaker 2 (15:02):
A nothing? Are you kidding? And that happens a lot
so Craig, How does.
Speaker 1 (15:09):
This information with all the HIPPO laws end up getting
out there and is there anything we can do about it?
Speaker 4 (15:14):
I want to be careful on that. So again, if
you have if you say something that could be an
exception to HIPPA, which would be a safety health and
safety of them passing out at the wheel, drunk driving,
that kind of thing, that very well can leak to
the DMB, which then makes it a public record effectively,
and that's going to be out there in your medical
file when insurance looks at it in the future. But
(15:36):
what I honestly think the bigger problem is is that
when your employer goes to get health insurance, all of
the carriers bidding on the health insurance are not bound
by HIPPA at that time in the same way that
your carrier is bound by HIPPA. So what they've learned
to do over the last ten years is rely on
(15:57):
consumer data brokers and these health adsators that go out
onto the Internet and scour every single imaginable grain of
sand about each and every one of us with respect
to health. Again, remember, healthcare is the number one employer
and the number one lobby in the United States. So
there's tons of money in this, and they really want
to know, for example, if you have an employee with
(16:20):
hemothelia or HIV or any other very expensive disease. So
what these health aggregators are doing is they're relying upon
social media, they're relying upon hacks, leaks, public records like divorces, lawsuits,
earth records, police reports, and they're pulling in all of
this data and they have a file on each and
(16:41):
every one of us. And then when when the bidding
carrier comes to quote on your employer's business, they take
the census of names and all your dependents because they
won't quote without your name and your dependence name now,
and they run that list of names through these health
broker databases and they get back very specific information like, Okay,
in this group of five hundred people, you're likely to
(17:03):
have seven hivs, three hemothliacs, and two part yeah exactly.
So this information's out there. It's leaked because of basically
a loophole built within HIPPA that doesn't protect you on
this line, because again they're getting it from public, public places.
And where it gets really insidious is again an old
(17:26):
Armstrong and getty adage. Remember if you're using a free service,
it's because you are the product. So where do many
of us communicate online other than social media? Maybe with
a free email service. So I spent a couple hours
last night actually reading the two most popular email services
(17:49):
privacy statements.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
Well you've got to be a lawyer to want to
do that.
Speaker 4 (17:52):
Well I didn't really want to do it, but I
forced myself to do it. And let me just tell
you it's a PhD level course and how to circumvent
how to write something that sounds like it's private but
is really just wide open out there, folks. I mean,
they are littered with things that say things like we
reserve the right to share your information with trusted partners
(18:12):
or affiliates.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
And you're talking about Yahoo, Male and Gmail.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
I'm not naming anybody, but yeah, talking about these free
email services. Yeah, those are the two.
Speaker 1 (18:22):
I read frankly, and so like that, actually, content of
your emails is not private.
Speaker 4 (18:27):
Well I would just say I would encourage people to
go read those documents and then and decide for themselves
whether they think it's private. I think there are so
many loopholes in there that I think I think a
lot of it's not private. Frankly, wow, let's say you
click on an ad within what let's there's just so
many examples in those in those statements that make it
(18:50):
pretty clear that, like, for example, here's one example that's
easy to follow. They'll say clearly they have to share
your information with all of their subsidiaries and affiliates that
help them store, analyze, and transmit your information. So now
let's say you're sending private health information to a doctor
via your email. Well, even if they weren't going to
quote sell that information out of your email directly, any
(19:13):
one of their supply chain, any one of the data
centers or transmission facilities they're using to send that email.
If there's a leak or if one of those entities
unscrupulously wants to sell your data, it's out there.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
It's gone.
Speaker 3 (19:27):
I'm telling you, privacy is dead and gone, buried, mourned.
Its great grandchild is in its sixties. I mean, it's
just over. Yeah right, Gottwaals Craig, the healthcare guru, is
on the line. I don't I just don't know what
to do anymore. Our former producer Vince would say, there's
(19:47):
no privacy anymore.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
Get over it.
Speaker 4 (19:50):
I think Vince is right. Really, I hate to tell
you that, folks, but I think Vince is right. It's
one of the paragraphs in one of these statements said
went through a long lift of trusted partners with whom
they may share your data for various legitimate reasons in
their mind. And then they said, and by the way,
these reports may include aggregate or pseudoname information. Well that
was a that was a PhD level course and spin
(20:12):
because it said we may include aggregate or pseudonym information.
But nowhere in the document did it say it won't
include personalized information. You see how they they throw in
these other terms to make you conclude that it's probably
going to be scrubbed free of identifiers, But nowhere does
it specifically say we must scrub them free of identifiers.
So I do believe this information is leaking out, maybe
(20:36):
through subsidiaries, maybe directly. I spoke with an IT expert
last night, a very very high level person, who said, look,
your IP address at your home is they know who
lives there? Right, So you're unless you're running a VPN,
your clicks are very likely being either stolen or sold
on the open Internet. So let's say you have a
house guest who looks up hemophilia drugs that you're at
(20:58):
your home, there very well could be a record put
out to one of these unscrupulous data brokers that says, hey,
this address might have a concern with hemophilia. And I
keep using that expect term guys, because the drugs to
treat hemophilia are often a million dollars a year just
on that alone.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
So business would have a great reason to want to
know they're hiring somebody that would cost them them.
Speaker 4 (21:20):
So the largest government complex in our country, the government
healthcare complex, which I believe really Trump's, the government industrial,
weaponized military complex, has a massive interest in knowing who
has what malady and how much they can charge for that.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Wow, that's crazy.
Speaker 1 (21:37):
That is really crazy, and it could be you can
think about this in terms of you. You could also
think that about this in terms of your kid's health
and stuff that is out there and on their permanent
record as they go out into the world.
Speaker 4 (21:49):
Kids are worse because kids are on social media. I mean,
see one of the ways that's easy to get your
head around, is it like, let's say you join a
Facebook group on how to live with diabetes, or how
to live with heart disease. That's public done, that's gone.
You doubt you're now tagged with that in the data
brokers for the rest of your life. The toothpaste is
out of the tube.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Or depression is I actually had a doctor give me
the example the other day of a client who got
turned down for their health insurance because they had once
told their doctor they were depressed, and when into somebody
put it in their record and there showed up and
Life insureds like, well, we're not going to ensure you,
certainly not at this rate if you're depressed.
Speaker 2 (22:23):
Not like what I guess I kind of remember that
from five years ago. But so that's that's the way
it can affect you.
Speaker 4 (22:29):
Well, I would, I would honestly have to think a
little bit about that. I'm not entirely Life Insurance. I
see how that gets out. But what I would be
more concerned about is probably this person somewhere online put
out that they're depressed and really got wow, really sang.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
I don't no kidding.
Speaker 4 (22:46):
Yes, the protections that you have with your medical providers
are are much greater than those than these outside data
brokers who are just scraping the internet. So if I
were to just look at that on its face, I
would say I would be much more confident that information
got out through it. An it lea.
Speaker 1 (23:02):
So you're saying my Facebook group, which is those of
us who on the weekends like to get drunk and
balance on wood chippers, I could have an effect on
my life.
Speaker 4 (23:12):
Insurance, absolutely, Jack, no questions as.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Nobody's business but mine.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
And I find the worrying to be relaxing, and I
just chipping wood relaxes man. So Craig, I just you
know your your IP address VPN thing sparked a couple
of thoughts in my head. I mean, if I have
some like, uh, golf buddy to visit and and he
(23:40):
uses either my laptop or just our our our system,
our network, he's like really into I don't know, some
bizarre sort of pornography farm farm yard porn or something
like that. Get better friends, well, right exactly. I choose
my guests more careful.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
But I just would that is that no seeking.
Speaker 4 (24:06):
Out, that's leaking out. You cannot assume you have privacy
on that. Again, I spoke with I can't. I can't
even name this person. They're so high level, they're a
federal contractor in this field, and he told me, you
absolutely must assume all of those clicks are associated with
your address. Absolutely, There's there's no way you can assume
that's safe, even if you're running Now, if you're running
(24:28):
a VPN, you have much more protection. But even if
you're running a VPN, depending on which VPN that even
that may not be entirely secure.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
So I'll be damned.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
There's no such thing as privacy anymore, is there. There's
just no such thing as privacy.
Speaker 4 (24:44):
Well, think about this, what do I do for a living.
I'm constantly googling high priced drugs and treatments and therapies
because I'm managing that for my clients, and of course
I work at home a lot. So I I shuddered
to think at what these data brokers have on me
out there. Right, My address is probably a with every
known malady you can have.
Speaker 1 (25:02):
Yeah, you're a you're a hemophiliac with stage four pancreatic
cancer as far as they know HIV.
Speaker 3 (25:07):
Yeah, right, Well drink Craig Craig Gottwals Craig the healthcare guru. Craig,
It's always so thought provoking. Thanks for the time.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Today. Huh.
Speaker 4 (25:19):
You're welcome, sir. And I know you guys will have
my article up so readers can can look at this
hip of stuff. It's unbelievable, but you got to like
register to read it once again, pre registration.
Speaker 3 (25:31):
But yeah, okay, use your use your dummy email address everybody,
It'll be fine.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Yeah, no worries, right, thanks, great, you have all your
data anyway, Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (25:41):
Yeah, we'll have it at armstrong and getty dot com
under hot mics. Thanks again, get well soon.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
Yeah, I don't I don't know how this is coming off.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
Like I we got an email from one of our
cop listeners who doesn't like the idea of encouraging people
who are seizures behind the wheel to hide that from
their doctor.
Speaker 4 (26:02):
Oh no.
Speaker 1 (26:03):
Also, we also had an email from a truck driver
who had an experience who one time he had something
he doesn't know it was as a seizure or what.
It was, a one off like not enough sleep, too
much coffee, whatever, who caused it, caused one thing to
happen one time in his life years ago, years ago,
told his doctor about it, and and uh, and became
a big deal with the commercial driver license.
Speaker 2 (26:25):
So yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 5 (26:29):
Yeah, we should have a say, and I can understand
the motivation, like all, like so many things that get
out of hand, safety and liability being the motivation.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
But god, we got to have an ability to be
like super honest with your doctor about stuff. Hey, doc,
is this something.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
To be worried about?
Speaker 3 (26:47):
This happened or I thought this or whatever without a turning.
This is a minor problem. I want to nip it
in the bud before it becomes something major.
Speaker 4 (26:55):
Uh huh.
Speaker 3 (26:55):
You know, for instance, Well, there's an aspect of all
of this that we haven't even mentioned. I will give
you one hint. He looks like Winnie the Pooh.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
Okay, hmm.
Speaker 3 (27:09):
How does the malevolent Global actors their access to everything
about you?
Speaker 2 (27:18):
Apparently you're going to tell us about that coming up?
Is that what I tell us about that coming up?
Speaker 3 (27:24):
You can assume that safe thing that's next
So we got a couple of things we want to
talk with our healthcare expert, Craig. We've been having on
for many, many years, including we're going to get to
I actually had a discussion with him as he's a lawyer,
like what things should you tell your doctor or shouldn't
tell your doctor?
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Which is an you just.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Gotta tell him everything. Jack, You certainly you would think.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
That that's a good idea and probably is the best
idea for your health. It is not the best idea
for the next time you apply for life insurance or
maybe something with the DMV or a.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Variety of things, which is not a good system.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
We don't want a system where you're not being honest
with your doctor because you're not going to get good results.
But let's live in reality and we'll talk to Craig
about that coming up in a few minutes.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
You're probably thinking, what about HIPPA the privacy stuff. Yeah,
exactly what we're going to talk about. So Craig Gottwaals,
Craig the healthcare guru, joins us. He's an attorney, a
law and benefit consultant with Benefit Revolution, and a good
friend as well.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
Craig, how are you I am well finded, sir as,
how are we are? Kick ass? Thank you?
Speaker 3 (01:06):
So we wanted to have you on for a couple
of things. Number one the thing we just mentioned. But
first we just thought it was time to have you
on again to re explain to help people new listeners
perhaps understand what a scam government healthcare and the accounting
and legislation behind it is, how dishonest it all is.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Are you up for that?
Speaker 4 (01:28):
Oh? Absolutely, I'm always up for that one, Joe, all right,
So talk to us. We passed Medicare and Medicaid in
nineteen sixty five in this country. Medicare covers the oldsters.
Medicaid covers our lowest income amongst us. So the first
point with respect to these programs is how mission creep
is so fantastic within government programs. When Medicaid again low
(01:51):
income in California, we happen to call it medi coal,
which is kind of a complicated, weird way of you know,
it makes it weird, But it was designed to cover
the lowest two percent of wage earners in the country.
Today it covers forty percent of all babies born in
about one third of all people in the country, and
(02:11):
at least in blue states a little bit less than
that in red state.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
God, and that is so classic from that book of
the high cost of good intentions. I mean, because you
can convince voters that the bottom two percent of let's
help them out. I mean, come on, it could happen
to anybody. Blah blah blah blah. Next thing you know,
damn near half of babies are covered by it.
Speaker 4 (02:35):
That's right. And if you guys read the hippo article
that I had published this week, and the high cost
of good intentions is another way of what one of
my law professors used to ironically say, is no good
deed goes unpunishing. Right now, medicare, interestingly, and so both
of these programs systematically underpaid doctors. I mean, when you
when you add this many bodies to a program that
(02:56):
was only designed to cover two percent of the population
and now it covers. In the case of Medicaid, you
you have to cut costs somewhere, right, And we know
the one place government doesn't cut cost is on administration.
In fact, we know it's highly highly ineffective in that matter,
fun stack for you there, hospital administ So we've basically
(03:20):
doubled the number of doctors in our country since nineteen seventy.
But if you look at medical administration, primarily hospital administration,
that's up three thousand percent.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
Wow, oh my god, just like schools and everything else.
Speaker 4 (03:36):
Just like schools, that's right. And in that if you
look at just look at inflation in the economy since
two thousand, from two thousand to now, hospital services are
up the most at two hundred and forty percent. People
always ask me, well, what's college tuition, Well that's only
one hundred and seventy percent.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
Yeah, Well, I don't mean to derail you in case
you have a carefully laid out plan for how we're
going to get there. But you mentioned that the doctors
are like ridiculously underpaid by Medicare. How does that even out?
How do doctors and hospital stay in business?
Speaker 4 (04:11):
Yeah, So this has been going on since roughly the
mid nineties. This has been a big problem where the
amount that Medicare pays each year and Medicaid for the
most part, the amount that they pay more each year
only goes up by about one percent. And right around
the mid nineties that became a problem where you know,
some of the higher cost facilities, some of your more
premium hospitals, for example, they it wasn't even necessarily covering
(04:36):
their costs. So what has to happen then in the
system is these hospitals when they go into the big
negotiations with the big four or five national medical carriers,
they have to negotiate higher reimbursements for these same procedures
just in order to keep their doors open, because Medicare
and Medicaid increasingly don't pay what the actual costs are.
(04:57):
So we've ended up with a system where nationally, if
you were to have an elective surgery, it would cost
you X at your you know, within your Medicare or
we call it Medicare system, it would cost you X.
That has to be about two hundred and fifty percent
of X through your private insurer, just so that hospitals
(05:19):
can stay afloat. So, in other words, all of us
that have private healthcare insurance are paying a tax roughly
two and a half times the cost of what Medicare
and Medicaid pay, just in order to keep.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
The facilities afloat.
Speaker 4 (05:33):
And in the industry we know this is a hidden
tax or a hidden cost shift associated with the fact
that Medicare systematically and Medicaid systematically underpay facilities.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
So it is quite directly a tax. It's a transfer
of wealth. So I think people need a hidden tax, need.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
To understand that.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
And then the utter dishonesty of Congress and their budgeting
for it. That fascinated me the first time you brought
that up.
Speaker 4 (05:57):
Yeah, Joe, you're so good. You remember these things ten
years ago. So like when you pass something like Obamacare
had this in it. For example, it's they always Congress
in order to when they were pricing Obamacare, it was
coming in one in a quarter one and a half
trillion dollars overall ballpark. When the CBO was scoring it
(06:18):
and the congressional bodies people that wanted to pass Obamacare,
they knew that it's going to be very hard for
us to pass this if, in fact, it's more than
a trillion dollars. So we got to get the scorecard
on Obamacare down under a trillion. Well, one of the
ways they do that systematically is they write into Obamacare,
and they did. They wrote in that. You know, one
(06:39):
of the ways we're going to save money with this
law is starting in twenty fourteen, four years out, we're
going to start reducing what Medicare pays doctors by one
percent per year until such point that you get the
overall price tag of Obamacare to look like it's going
to be less than a trillion dollars, which is exactly
what they did. They passed Obamacare, and then, of course
when twenty four team rolled around four years later, they
(07:01):
repealed the provision that said they were going to reduce
what's paid in Medicare and Medicaid, because of course if
you try to actually cut that, no oldsters or low
income folks would get any healthcare whatsoever. And then the
price tag of Obamacare shoots up to two trillion dollars.
It doubles, and they it's not just done in Obamacare.
This has been done in a handful of major legislation
related to healthcare over the past twenty years.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
So they claim will be cutting costs in the future,
but when the future comes they always put it off.
That's right, utterly dishonest. Craig Gotwall's the healthcare guru is
on the line.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Go ahead.
Speaker 4 (07:35):
Oh, and then so when the CBO scores it, of
course they just have to score. They're just you know,
they're just actuaries and accountants. They simply have to score
what's written in the bill, and the bill was written
that Medicare and Medicaid were going to get cut even further.
So of course, you know, they scored it as under
a trillion, and then quickly it doubled.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
Right, And then the final point is that as this
you know, accounting trickery and terribly low payments to medical
facilities continues, are fewer and fewer doctors who are willing
to see these patients.
Speaker 4 (08:04):
Yeah, that's right. In fact in Blue states because because
Blue states have expanded Medicaid the low income fortion as
far as they lawfully can, you're in a situation now
where roughly half of doctors won't even take a Medicaid patient.
And it's something like ten to twenty percent of doctors
won't take a new Medicare patient again because of the
fact that it systematically pays you much less than the
(08:28):
private corporate plans. And the bigger problem that we've mentioned
on this show before is if you're in California, for example,
and this is true across all Blue states, seventy one
percent of all healthcare expenses are paid by the taxpayer.
Now in Blue.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
States, so damn near three quarters yep as already government
healthcare tax start scare.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:53):
So it's weird that we even have this argument over
whether or not we're going to go down the road
of socialized healthcare because three quarters of the way there,
at least in Galabi.
Speaker 3 (09:01):
That's one of the main reasons, sorry to interrupt this,
one of the main reasons the country is going into
such incredible debt is paying for this dishonest budgeting trickery anyway.
Speaker 4 (09:11):
Well, and I would even argue at this point, Jack,
we have a socialized system because I've been full time
doing nothing but this and negotiating with these massive carriers
for twenty two years. And let me just share this
statistic with you two thousand and nine before Obamacare passed.
Since from two thousand and nine to today, the S
and P five hundred is up four hundred and twenty
(09:32):
two percent. The stock prices on the five largest medical
insurers is up one nine and twenty one percent.
Speaker 5 (09:40):
Wow.
Speaker 4 (09:41):
And so, in other words, they're all in it together, folks.
Healthcare is the number one employer in the United States,
number one private employer, and it's the number one lobby
in the United States, spending seven hundred million annually. The
government and the large insurers are all in bed together
on this thing.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
It doesn't seem like that would please anybody, though lefties
like Bernie Sanders crowd or the Rand Paul crowd, it
doesn't seem like anybody would be happy with that.
Speaker 4 (10:06):
Well, Jack, you just committed a huge sin that you
guys rail against all the time. You assume that Bernie
represents the Democratic Party and that Rand represents the Republican Party,
and you know darn well they are the outliers on
both ends.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Yeah, that's truels, dirty rebels.
Speaker 4 (10:23):
Eight percent in the middle of the republic cracks love
this because they are lining their pockets with this.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
So I had a conversation with Craig over the last
couple of weeks about what you should or should not
tell your doctor, And it seems like on the face
of it, you'd want to be honest with your doctor,
but there's some stuff that can end up in your
permanent record, just like when you're in second grade, it's
going to go on your permanent record.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
Talking to Craig got palls the healthcare guru. So the
topic is what.
Speaker 1 (10:46):
You should or shouldn't tell your doctor so I would
say this, and I certainly don't want to get you
in trouble, Craig, but I don't want to have anybody
out there not being honest with the doctor and ends
up killing them or making them sick or something like that.
So I'll look at it this way, because I've had
this experience. You should be aware that some things you
(11:07):
tell your doctor will get out to say insurance companies
can happen with DMVs that could come back to haunt you,
and you might think, well, how would that information get
out with the hippo violations of our boss had a
major health thing happened in his life and nobody knew
(11:28):
it around here. So somebody you work with on a
regular basis, you can't reach out to them and say hey, okay,
or hey anything I can do to help because they
aren't allowed to tell you because a HIPPA. But something
you tell your doctor in the privacy of that office
could leak out and have an effect on your life
insurance or the DMV in the future. Craig, explain how
that could happen.
Speaker 4 (11:45):
Oh, Jack, you just you threw me two different topics
here that are related but so complicated. Okay, so let's
just take the doctor's office visit. I'm just going to
tell you what the law is. I will not get
into discussing what people should and shouldn't tell their doctors, because,
as you said, people should always be help honest with
their healthcare provider and get the help they need.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
I'm not and I won't be there, but you should.
Speaker 4 (12:09):
So when you go into a doctor's office, and if
you are to tell your doctor things that could make
it such that you could be a danger on the road.
For example, you're having some kind of mental impairment, maybe
you've blacked out, maybe you've you've had seizures, et cetera.
Speaker 2 (12:30):
If there's my uncontrollable rage.
Speaker 4 (12:33):
Yeah right, it's like it's trets, like cussing and rage.
If you disclose these things to a medical professional. In
twelve of our fifty states, California and Nevada being two
of those twelve as an example, the healthcare provider is
required to report that information over to the Department of
(12:55):
Motor Vehicles. And if they don't report that information and
you kill somebody on the road and the investigation reveals
their last healthcare visit with you, and that information is
in the medical file that healthcare provider is liable.
Speaker 1 (13:10):
Now, to make it clear, I don't want somebody who's
having regular seizures driving either. But if you had kind
of like an iffy situation, you're not sure what it was,
and it was a one off because of some weird circumstances,
you know why your driver's license taken away?
Speaker 4 (13:24):
No, no, you don't. And this is where you know
I have I have good friends and colleagues who are
doctors and administrators of hospitals, and so what I can
tell you on this topic is a good doctor, especially
a doctor with whom you have a relationship, they really
don't want to have to make this report because this
is a lot of paperwork. It is a very time consuming.
(13:48):
You get sucked into the bureaucratic a mass of these
of these entities working together. And then of course, this
particular doctor I spoke with said and Craig, I don't
want to do it because I don't want this person
coming back with a gun and shooting out my workplace,
because hey, I get it, if we have to report this,
we could very well be ruining their life.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
See.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
I don't want to phrase this wrong way because I'm
not trying to encourage people not to be honest with
their doctors.
Speaker 3 (14:11):
Remember I almost went to law school, Jack, May I
take a shot at it?
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Sure?
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Well, I'm thinking about the morality of it versus the
legality of it. But you're do you think about the
legality of it?
Speaker 5 (14:21):
Well?
Speaker 3 (14:21):
No, you almost became a theologian, So I'll let you
head it. I will tell you that Craig Gotwols is
our guest. Craig's the healthcare guru, attorney of law, benefit consultant.
Benefit revolution could follow on Twitter, et cetera, et cetera,
and a good guy to talk to if you need
benefits for your company.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
I guess the way to state it is don't think
what you tell your doctors just between you and your doctor.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
It absolutely is not.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Now I have had that experience and I don't want to,
for a variety of reasons explain what it was. But
it was just like a one off comment to an
urgent care doctor one time. Then this is many years ago.
Then when I went to get life insurance, that showed up.
Couldn't get life insurance? What what that was?
Speaker 2 (15:02):
A nothing? Are you kidding? And that happens a lot
so Craig, How does.
Speaker 1 (15:09):
This information with all the HIPPO laws end up getting
out there and is there anything we can do about it?
Speaker 4 (15:14):
I want to be careful on that. So again, if
you have if you say something that could be an
exception to HIPPA, which would be a safety health and
safety of them passing out at the wheel, drunk driving,
that kind of thing, that very well can leak to
the DMB, which then makes it a public record effectively,
and that's going to be out there in your medical
file when insurance looks at it in the future. But
(15:36):
what I honestly think the bigger problem is is that
when your employer goes to get health insurance, all of
the carriers bidding on the health insurance are not bound
by HIPPA at that time in the same way that
your carrier is bound by HIPPA. So what they've learned
to do over the last ten years is rely on
(15:57):
consumer data brokers and these health adsators that go out
onto the Internet and scour every single imaginable grain of
sand about each and every one of us with respect
to health. Again, remember, healthcare is the number one employer
and the number one lobby in the United States. So
there's tons of money in this, and they really want
to know, for example, if you have an employee with
(16:20):
hemothelia or HIV or any other very expensive disease. So
what these health aggregators are doing is they're relying upon
social media, they're relying upon hacks, leaks, public records like divorces, lawsuits,
earth records, police reports, and they're pulling in all of
this data and they have a file on each and
(16:41):
every one of us. And then when when the bidding
carrier comes to quote on your employer's business, they take
the census of names and all your dependents because they
won't quote without your name and your dependence name now,
and they run that list of names through these health
broker databases and they get back very specific information like, Okay,
in this group of five hundred people, you're likely to
(17:03):
have seven hivs, three hemothliacs, and two part yeah exactly.
So this information's out there. It's leaked because of basically
a loophole built within HIPPA that doesn't protect you on
this line, because again they're getting it from public, public places.
And where it gets really insidious is again an old
(17:26):
Armstrong and getty adage. Remember if you're using a free service,
it's because you are the product. So where do many
of us communicate online other than social media? Maybe with
a free email service. So I spent a couple hours
last night actually reading the two most popular email services
(17:49):
privacy statements.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
Well you've got to be a lawyer to want to
do that.
Speaker 4 (17:52):
Well I didn't really want to do it, but I
forced myself to do it. And let me just tell
you it's a PhD level course and how to circumvent
how to write something that sounds like it's private but
is really just wide open out there, folks. I mean,
they are littered with things that say things like we
reserve the right to share your information with trusted partners
(18:12):
or affiliates.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
And you're talking about Yahoo, Male and Gmail.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
I'm not naming anybody, but yeah, talking about these free
email services. Yeah, those are the two.
Speaker 1 (18:22):
I read frankly, and so like that, actually, content of
your emails is not private.
Speaker 4 (18:27):
Well I would just say I would encourage people to
go read those documents and then and decide for themselves
whether they think it's private. I think there are so
many loopholes in there that I think I think a
lot of it's not private. Frankly, wow, let's say you
click on an ad within what let's there's just so
many examples in those in those statements that make it
(18:50):
pretty clear that, like, for example, here's one example that's
easy to follow. They'll say clearly they have to share
your information with all of their subsidiaries and affiliates that
help them store, analyze, and transmit your information. So now
let's say you're sending private health information to a doctor
via your email. Well, even if they weren't going to
quote sell that information out of your email directly, any
(19:13):
one of their supply chain, any one of the data
centers or transmission facilities they're using to send that email.
If there's a leak or if one of those entities
unscrupulously wants to sell your data, it's out there.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
It's gone.
Speaker 3 (19:27):
I'm telling you, privacy is dead and gone, buried, mourned.
Its great grandchild is in its sixties. I mean, it's
just over. Yeah right, Gottwaals Craig, the healthcare guru, is
on the line. I don't I just don't know what
to do anymore. Our former producer Vince would say, there's
(19:47):
no privacy anymore.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
Get over it.
Speaker 4 (19:50):
I think Vince is right. Really, I hate to tell
you that, folks, but I think Vince is right. It's
one of the paragraphs in one of these statements said
went through a long lift of trusted partners with whom
they may share your data for various legitimate reasons in
their mind. And then they said, and by the way,
these reports may include aggregate or pseudoname information. Well that
was a that was a PhD level course and spin
(20:12):
because it said we may include aggregate or pseudonym information.
But nowhere in the document did it say it won't
include personalized information. You see how they they throw in
these other terms to make you conclude that it's probably
going to be scrubbed free of identifiers, But nowhere does
it specifically say we must scrub them free of identifiers.
So I do believe this information is leaking out, maybe
(20:36):
through subsidiaries, maybe directly. I spoke with an IT expert
last night, a very very high level person, who said, look,
your IP address at your home is they know who
lives there? Right, So you're unless you're running a VPN,
your clicks are very likely being either stolen or sold
on the open Internet. So let's say you have a
house guest who looks up hemophilia drugs that you're at
(20:58):
your home, there very well could be a record put
out to one of these unscrupulous data brokers that says, hey,
this address might have a concern with hemophilia. And I
keep using that expect term guys, because the drugs to
treat hemophilia are often a million dollars a year just
on that alone.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
So business would have a great reason to want to
know they're hiring somebody that would cost them them.
Speaker 4 (21:20):
So the largest government complex in our country, the government
healthcare complex, which I believe really Trump's, the government industrial,
weaponized military complex, has a massive interest in knowing who
has what malady and how much they can charge for that.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Wow, that's crazy.
Speaker 1 (21:37):
That is really crazy, and it could be you can
think about this in terms of you. You could also
think that about this in terms of your kid's health
and stuff that is out there and on their permanent
record as they go out into the world.
Speaker 4 (21:49):
Kids are worse because kids are on social media. I mean,
see one of the ways that's easy to get your
head around, is it like, let's say you join a
Facebook group on how to live with diabetes, or how
to live with heart disease. That's public done, that's gone.
You doubt you're now tagged with that in the data
brokers for the rest of your life. The toothpaste is
out of the tube.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Or depression is I actually had a doctor give me
the example the other day of a client who got
turned down for their health insurance because they had once
told their doctor they were depressed, and when into somebody
put it in their record and there showed up and
Life insureds like, well, we're not going to ensure you,
certainly not at this rate if you're depressed.
Speaker 2 (22:23):
Not like what I guess I kind of remember that
from five years ago. But so that's that's the way
it can affect you.
Speaker 4 (22:29):
Well, I would, I would honestly have to think a
little bit about that. I'm not entirely Life Insurance. I
see how that gets out. But what I would be
more concerned about is probably this person somewhere online put
out that they're depressed and really got wow, really sang.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
I don't no kidding.
Speaker 4 (22:46):
Yes, the protections that you have with your medical providers
are are much greater than those than these outside data
brokers who are just scraping the internet. So if I
were to just look at that on its face, I
would say I would be much more confident that information
got out through it. An it lea.
Speaker 1 (23:02):
So you're saying my Facebook group, which is those of
us who on the weekends like to get drunk and
balance on wood chippers, I could have an effect on
my life.
Speaker 4 (23:12):
Insurance, absolutely, Jack, no questions as.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Nobody's business but mine.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
And I find the worrying to be relaxing, and I
just chipping wood relaxes man. So Craig, I just you
know your your IP address VPN thing sparked a couple
of thoughts in my head. I mean, if I have
some like, uh, golf buddy to visit and and he
(23:40):
uses either my laptop or just our our our system,
our network, he's like really into I don't know, some
bizarre sort of pornography farm farm yard porn or something
like that. Get better friends, well, right exactly. I choose
my guests more careful.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
But I just would that is that no seeking.
Speaker 4 (24:06):
Out, that's leaking out. You cannot assume you have privacy
on that. Again, I spoke with I can't. I can't
even name this person. They're so high level, they're a
federal contractor in this field, and he told me, you
absolutely must assume all of those clicks are associated with
your address. Absolutely, There's there's no way you can assume
that's safe, even if you're running Now, if you're running
(24:28):
a VPN, you have much more protection. But even if
you're running a VPN, depending on which VPN that even
that may not be entirely secure.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
So I'll be damned.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
There's no such thing as privacy anymore, is there. There's
just no such thing as privacy.
Speaker 4 (24:44):
Well, think about this, what do I do for a living.
I'm constantly googling high priced drugs and treatments and therapies
because I'm managing that for my clients, and of course
I work at home a lot. So I I shuddered
to think at what these data brokers have on me
out there. Right, My address is probably a with every
known malady you can have.
Speaker 1 (25:02):
Yeah, you're a you're a hemophiliac with stage four pancreatic
cancer as far as they know HIV.
Speaker 3 (25:07):
Yeah, right, Well drink Craig Craig Gottwals Craig the healthcare guru. Craig,
It's always so thought provoking. Thanks for the time.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Today. Huh.
Speaker 4 (25:19):
You're welcome, sir. And I know you guys will have
my article up so readers can can look at this
hip of stuff. It's unbelievable, but you got to like
register to read it once again, pre registration.
Speaker 3 (25:31):
But yeah, okay, use your use your dummy email address everybody,
It'll be fine.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Yeah, no worries, right, thanks, great, you have all your
data anyway, Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (25:41):
Yeah, we'll have it at armstrong and getty dot com
under hot mics. Thanks again, get well soon.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
Yeah, I don't I don't know how this is coming off.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
Like I we got an email from one of our
cop listeners who doesn't like the idea of encouraging people
who are seizures behind the wheel to hide that from
their doctor.
Speaker 4 (26:02):
Oh no.
Speaker 1 (26:03):
Also, we also had an email from a truck driver
who had an experience who one time he had something
he doesn't know it was as a seizure or what.
It was, a one off like not enough sleep, too
much coffee, whatever, who caused it, caused one thing to
happen one time in his life years ago, years ago,
told his doctor about it, and and uh, and became
a big deal with the commercial driver license.
Speaker 2 (26:25):
So yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 5 (26:29):
Yeah, we should have a say, and I can understand
the motivation, like all, like so many things that get
out of hand, safety and liability being the motivation.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
But god, we got to have an ability to be
like super honest with your doctor about stuff. Hey, doc,
is this something.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
To be worried about?
Speaker 3 (26:47):
This happened or I thought this or whatever without a turning.
This is a minor problem. I want to nip it
in the bud before it becomes something major.
Speaker 4 (26:55):
Uh huh.
Speaker 3 (26:55):
You know, for instance, Well, there's an aspect of all
of this that we haven't even mentioned. I will give
you one hint. He looks like Winnie the Pooh.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
Okay, hmm.
Speaker 3 (27:09):
How does the malevolent Global actors their access to everything
about you?
Speaker 2 (27:18):
Apparently you're going to tell us about that coming up?
Is that what I tell us about that coming up?
Speaker 3 (27:24):
You can assume that safe thing that's next
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Joe Getty
Jack Armstrong
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