8:26: Flag burnin and free speech, Cameron Mills talkin basketball way too early

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
That's right. Whatever.

Speaker 2 (00:02):
This is Leland Conways sitting in for the legendary Tony
and Dwight.

Speaker 1 (00:07):
Oh my word.

Speaker 2 (00:08):
Hey, by the way, you know how you can tell
I'm a true Kentuckian and always will be because this
is the week before UK football starts, and our guest
at the bottom of the hour is Cameron Mills to
talk about UK basketball, just saying, now, you know, right, Gus,
I mean.

Speaker 1 (00:25):
That's what's yeah. I mean, I'm not saying it doesn't matter.

Speaker 2 (00:30):
I was laughing though at Coach Stoops playing up like
like that. That the news headline there, Coach Stoops plays
up this week's supponent. It's Toledo. Come on, it's so exciting.
So no, no, no, I love it. I love UK
football because it's pre basketball season. So anyway, Camra Mills
will join us at the bottom of the hour. I
gotta jump right into this though.

Speaker 3 (00:52):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (00:52):
Lots of lots of talk about President Trump yesterday signing
in executive order directing the Department of Justice to pursue
one year in prison for those who burn American flags
in the street. He said, you get no bail, you
get one year in jail. No early exits, know nothing.
One year in jail if you burn a flag? That

(01:15):
is it?

Speaker 4 (01:17):
In general?

Speaker 1 (01:17):
Would you listen to this?

Speaker 5 (01:18):
This is very flag burning all over the country. They're
burning flags all over the world. They burn the American flag.
And as you know, through a very sad court. I
guess it was a five to four decision. They called
it freedom of speech. But there there's another reason, which
is perhaps much more important. It's called death. Because what

(01:40):
happens when you burn a flag is the area goes crazy.
If you have hundreds of people, they go crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:47):
You could do other things.

Speaker 5 (01:48):
You can burn this piece of paper. You can, and
it's but when you burn the American flag, it incites riots.

Speaker 1 (01:55):
All right, there you go.

Speaker 2 (01:56):
So President Trump says that he wants you to spend
a year in jail if you burn an American flag.

Speaker 1 (02:02):
All right, hear me out. Hear me out.

Speaker 2 (02:05):
I freaking hate flag burners. I hate them, like seriously.
I'm I'm a Christian, so I'm not supposed to hate anybody,
but I really do hate people that burn the American flag.
I got way too many friends that served in the military.
I've lost friends in the Afghanistan fight that were in
the military that went over there to save my life

(02:26):
and my freedom.

Speaker 1 (02:27):
And by God, nothing makes my blood boil more.

Speaker 2 (02:32):
Than some jackass Antifa out in the middle of the
street burning an American flag as they stand in the
greatest country that the world has ever bebirthed? Is that
a word be birthed? Actually, Kentucky State Constitution. Talk show
hosts can make up words. Well, look it up section
seven dot two two two five. Even Basher signed it.

(02:53):
Talk show hosts can make up words be birthed. Greatest
country that ever existed in the world. And these little spoiled,
rotten jackwagons get out there in the street and they
burn flags, and I hate them. I hate them, but
hear me out, But burning a flag is in fact

(03:13):
freedom of speech. But I have a better idea, okay,
because always with the solutions, okay, always with the solutions,
I have a better idea. Don't ban burning flags, unbanned
kicking flag burners' asses.

Speaker 1 (03:30):
No, seriously, I'm dead serious about this.

Speaker 2 (03:32):
I don't like violence, but I am saying it. I
think it should be legal to punch somebody who burns
a flag in the nose.

Speaker 1 (03:40):
I really do.

Speaker 2 (03:41):
I think because speech is free, but it has consequences.
So I'm one hundred percent down with your right to
burn it. I'm one hundred percent down with my right
to kick your ass. I mean, I don't mean to
be rude, but so no, this is this is kind
of interesting to me because it's debate has flared up
since yesterday, and I talked about it on my show

(04:04):
in San Diego last night, which San Diego is a
huge military town. I know what you think about the
West Coast, and most of what you think about the
West Coast one.

Speaker 1 (04:12):
Hundred percent true. So I'm there. I'm just a missionary.

Speaker 2 (04:14):
I'm taking good old Kentucky values to the West Coast.
We're gonna change him one heart at a time. But
in San Diego, it's a military town, it's pretty conservative compared.

Speaker 1 (04:21):
To the rest of the state.

Speaker 2 (04:23):
And a lot of people didn't like what I said
last night because they were like, hey, you know, it's different,
it's different, and they used Trump's logic here because that's
Trump gave you the talking point.

Speaker 1 (04:31):
And I don't get me wrong, I love Trump.

Speaker 2 (04:34):
It used to be when I was on the air
here in Kentucky. You know, I've always had kind of
like a little weird love, hate dance with Trump. Right, Like,
I voted for him all three times, but I have
always been willing to criticize him when he does something
I think is stupid. To be honest with you, this
presidency that he's had might be one of the best ever. Like,
I literally love almost everything this guy's doing. I really do.

(04:56):
I think there are fundamental earth changing changes that he's
making to the country that most people are not seeing
right now. I think there's things going on in the
background that are fundamentally changing the bureaucracy for the better.

Speaker 1 (05:10):
That I was thinking about this the other day. I
was on my way back from the gym.

Speaker 2 (05:14):
I was like, I feel weird saying this because I
never really liked the guy, but I always.

Speaker 1 (05:20):
Voted for him because I don't want socialism.

Speaker 2 (05:22):
But I was thinking about it, and I was like,
you know, he might actually be one of the best presidents,
certainly in my lifetime. And I argued with myself. I
was like, well, Leland, do you mean also including Reagan?
And I was like, I'm actually might well why so
I'm literally debating myself about Reagan versus Trump. And I
was like, well, some of the fundamental things that Trump

(05:42):
is changing about the bureaucracy, go beyond what Reagan did.
And Reagan was a great leader, and he was a
great presidential leader on the stage, and he gets credit
for ending the Cold War and all that kind of stuff.
But there's things happening. So I'm not trying to be
but I'm just telling you he's wrong on this.

Speaker 4 (06:00):
Isident.

Speaker 2 (06:00):
Trump is wrong on this, And he gave you a
talking point. He said, well, it incites riots. Okay, to
a certain extent. There is if you burn somebody's flag.
Like if if you went out into the middle of
say a majority Hispanic neighborhood, and you burned a Mexican flag, right,

(06:21):
what do you think would happen. It's probably not gonna
be good, right. I mean, pick a country and go
into an ethnic neighborhood that has mostly people from that country.
Help pick a go into a Las Vegas Raiders neighborhood,
go outside the Las Vegas Raiders Stadium in Las Vegas,
and see what happens if you burn the Raiders flag.

Speaker 1 (06:44):
Right, those people are notorious. No, I I get it.

Speaker 2 (06:49):
I'm I hate flag burners, but it is freedom of speech,
it really is. And I know maybe some people don't
believe me, and they don't want to go there. But
I'm gonna I'm gonna play you. I'm gonna play you
a little sound clip here. Okay, Gus are you Are
you a fan of a guy we all know in
the conservative world as antonin Scalia? Oh yes, maybe one

(07:13):
of the most popular on the conservative side, maybe one
of the most important Supreme Court justices that ever lived, right,
indeed one of the most consequential, because he, along with
Clarence Thomas, really revived the concept of originalism, meaning what

(07:35):
the Constitution said is what the Constitution meant. And every
one of you out there listening right now that are
hardcore Republicans and hardcore conservatives, you guys all as do
I kind of worship at the feet of Antonin Scalia
when it comes to Supreme Court things. Here's what he
said in July twenty first of twenty twenty two, or

(07:56):
excuse me to twenty twelve.

Speaker 1 (07:57):
Couldn't have done that. Twenty twelve appears Morgan, I.

Speaker 3 (08:02):
Would not allow people to go about burning the American flag.
If I were king, I would not allow people to
go about burning the American flag. However, we have a
First Amendment which says that the right of free speech
shall not be abridged, and it is addressed in particular

(08:24):
to speech critical of the government. I mean, that was
the main kind of speech that tyrants would seek to suppress.
Burning the flag is a form of expression. Speech doesn't
just mean written words or oral words. It could be semaphore.
Burning a flag is a symbol.

Speaker 2 (08:45):
Quick Gus pop quiz how many gen z? What percentage
of gen z knows what semaphore is.

Speaker 1 (08:51):
I'm not sure that.

Speaker 6 (08:51):
This gen exer knows that one. That's not what I
use a lot.

Speaker 1 (08:55):
I use a lot of words. That's a good word, manmaphore.

Speaker 2 (08:58):
Well, and not only that, but he did kind of
like a he kind of did like a Gavin Newsom
squirm to kind of demonstrate semaphore, you know, meaning acting
it out, pantomiming it.

Speaker 3 (09:08):
In words or oral words. It could be semaphore. H
Burning a flag is a symbol that expresses an idea.
I hate the government, the government is unjust whatever.

Speaker 2 (09:22):
Okay, so this is the that's the first part. But
I'm gonna play the next part in a second. But
that's that's antonin Scalia.

Speaker 6 (09:27):
Hey, it's still smaphore.

Speaker 1 (09:29):
I think it's s E M A f o R.
Let me try. Hold on, I'm gonna go to the
Google machine. Let's see what it says. And now I'm
gonna have to look it up.

Speaker 6 (09:36):
I would see not you know, Harvard educated, but I
I pride myself on knowing my words, and I'm going
I don't have that one. A semaphore is a visual signaling. Well,
that's yeah.

Speaker 2 (09:49):
It's a act a system of visual communication using signals
like flags or lights.

Speaker 6 (09:54):
You do learn something new every day.

Speaker 2 (09:56):
Hell, I was wrong about it. I was wrong about it.
I said it was acting something out pantomime. It's it's
actually smoke signals. It is, that's semaphore.

Speaker 1 (10:05):
But I was.

Speaker 2 (10:06):
I got the spelling right. S E M A fo
we're learning words this morning. Yeah, yeah, it's semaphore. That's
that's uh, I guess it's smoke smoke signals. Essentially, we
qualify using flags or different.

Speaker 6 (10:20):
Symbols the different way to people.

Speaker 2 (10:22):
So so so right there, scalia Is is very clearly
let outlining the fact that he believes. And again this
is now, now what do we do on the right right,
Because here's here's my bigger problem with this. I I
cannot stand hypocrisy, even though all of us are hypocrites,
like every single one of us. You're a hypocrite. I'm
a hypocrite. Gus is a hypocrite. We're all hypocrites to

(10:45):
some extent, because that's human nature, is to be hypocritical.
I want mine and I don't care about everything else.
But what we try to do is good people. If
we're good people, many of you are, then we try
to be less of a hypocrite if we can, right,
We try to recognize it. We try to be enough
of a we had intellectual enough to sort of self

(11:06):
examine our own thought processes, right, And so what.

Speaker 1 (11:11):
Do we do on the right if we can't do
that right?

Speaker 2 (11:15):
Like well, Trump said it, So we have to believe
that burning and the flag should be illegal. But then Scalia,
oh god, I love Scalia. But could Scalia be wrong
and Trump be right? Like that starts off this huge
inner turmoil in the conservative side. How could the great
antonin Scalia be wrong? But Trump, I mean, he's Trump right.
You got to get past that, and we have to this.

(11:36):
I am a free speech absolute. Here's the problem. Here's
the problem with me. I'm an absolutist on all things
Bill of Rights, Like I'm a Second Amendment absolutist, Like
if the government can have it, Dude, when Joe Biden
said that we can't have an F fifteen, I'm on
freaking Amazon looking for an F fifteen, I'm like, could
you deliver it tomorrow? Like, if the government can have it,

(11:59):
so can I What are you talking about? Like, I
am a Second Amendment absolutist. Bazooka, bring me three flame
wrote the flame thrower, let's go, that's how we plow
the snow. I am a First Amendment absolutist in the
same way. I want to know who the idiots are
and I want to knock some of their blocks off.
So again, I'm just solving this whole problem. The whole

(12:23):
problem is you got jackwagons out in the street burning flags,
and I agree, I agree with the sentiment that Trump
is presenting there. But you can't ban one form of
free speech and just say this one is inconvenient for
us right now. The inciting a riot, that's an interesting
thing because Piers Morgan asks Kalia about that in this

(12:45):
interview in twenty twelve, and I thought, if Kalia had
a fairly nuanced answer to that too.

Speaker 1 (12:51):
But of course he was a really smart man.

Speaker 3 (12:53):
The government is unjust whatever.

Speaker 7 (12:55):
If you're not sure that in the end, doesn't no
one knows the constitution better than you did. Doesn't it
come down to your personal interpretation of the constitution if
it isn't clear cut, which it clearly isn't.

Speaker 2 (13:08):
By the way, this is all the way back in
twenty twelve, and you can I can see like Pears
is asking this question when he says, your interpretation of
the constitution and it clearly is you know, and you
can the camera switches to Scalia and you see this
look on his face like, oh, hell.

Speaker 1 (13:25):
No, you're not gonna go there. It means what it says.

Speaker 7 (13:28):
It means you, in the end have to make it
an opinion, don't you.

Speaker 4 (13:32):
Well, I don't forget.

Speaker 3 (13:33):
This person has to be convicted by a jury of
twelve people who unanimously have to find that he was
inciting to riot. So you know, it's not all up
to me. It would be up to me to say
that there was not enough evidence for the jury to
find that.

Speaker 1 (13:49):
Perhaps, Wow, think about that answer.

Speaker 2 (13:53):
Oh my god, this is okay, walk through it. It's
not up to It's not up to President Trump to
determine guilt or innocence. Is it illegal to incite a riot?

Speaker 4 (14:08):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (14:10):
Is it illegal to say something that intentionally incites a riot? Yes,
that's different than free speech, and Trump is correct on that.
But if you're but you what the the intent there
is what makes the criminality of it right? So we

(14:30):
have to prove that. You can't just say throw them
in jail. It is not a crime to burn the flag.
It's a crime to inside a riot. And the two
can be two different things. And what Scalia is saying
there is really powerful because he's saying, well, you know,
how do we determine the actions of the crowd were

(14:52):
incited by that one thing that that person said, did or.

Speaker 1 (14:57):
Semaphored?

Speaker 2 (14:58):
Right, We're gonna use that word all day, Gus because
we learned a new one. So like it's just gonna
come out like every I'm you know what, use the phone,
Gus to semaphore Cameron Mills at the bottom of the hour,
so who could talk.

Speaker 1 (15:11):
I'm just we gotta use some signals.

Speaker 6 (15:13):
Just go around to your co workers, your friends day. Well,
you know, I was trying to get a semaphore out
there at the house last night to tell my neighbors something.
Then people will look at you like they're gonna look
at you with great knowledge. They're gonna go, what in
the world are you talking?

Speaker 1 (15:27):
What are you talking about?

Speaker 2 (15:29):
So again, I I just, I just, I'm firmly in
the in the camp of free speech, no matter what,
even if we don't like it. And trust me, I
don't like it, and I don't like being in the
position of defending flag burners, and I want them to
make it legal to knock flag burners block off. That's

(15:50):
that's my solution to this problem. So anyway, I got
more to say on this. We'll do this at the
ten o'clock hour because there's a whole nother angle on
this that's kind of interesting. I'm gonna kind of I
don't mean to play both sides of the fence, but
I am gonna make a little bit of Trump's argument
at ten o'clock because there's a point in all of
this that everybody is missing in this debate. So we'll

(16:11):
dive into that bottom of the hour. Cameron Mills is
gonna join us when we talk a little bit of
Kentucky basketball. I'm Leland Conway and for Tony and Dwight
on news radio and forty whas.

Speaker 1 (16:20):
I really do.

Speaker 2 (16:21):
But there's a couple of other thoughts that we have
to dig into here, which we'll do later in the program.

Speaker 1 (16:27):
But as much as I think it is free.

Speaker 2 (16:31):
Speech, and I think we have to be intellectually honest
about this because remember, one of the big arguments that
the left is making, and I think it's an empty
argument most of the time, is that Trump is an
authoritarian and when you start to eat around things like
the freedom of spree, freedom of speech, it gives them
a leg to stand on in their argument. Now they
are the worst perpetrators of authoritarianism ever. And even yesterday

(16:56):
Governor Pritzker of Illinois was saying that he was fighting
down people's names who were supportive of Trump coming in
and cleaning up the crime in Chicago, and it's like,
wait a minute, you're gonna fight authoritarianism with authoritarianism like
so so at the end of the day, they're the

(17:17):
leftist authoritarians, but I hate when we give them a
little bit of a leg to stand down. Now, the
other angle on this all the way to the other
side is the leftists, right now, who are decrying what
Trump is saying as banning free speech. We'll all gather
up like lemmings and flip to the other side of
the argument the moment. We say, well, if you can

(17:41):
burn the American flag, you can burn the LGBT flag.
And I don't advocate for burning anybody's flag. I'm just
saying we'll dig into that angle on this very interesting
discussion later in the program. Coming up next, Cameron Mills
is gonna join me again.

Speaker 1 (17:57):
In true Kentucky.

Speaker 2 (17:58):
Fashion, it's the week before football season, and we're gonna
talk a little basketball. I'm Leland Conway and for Tony
and Dwight on News.

Speaker 1 (18:05):
Radio eight forty whas.

Speaker 2 (18:08):
It's Tonya Dwight Show, Leland Conway sitting in and of
course it's football week in Kentucky, which means what we're
gonna talk basketball?

Speaker 1 (18:16):
Camra Mill's on the line. When is going on? My friend?
How are you, buddy? How are you?

Speaker 4 (18:21):
I'm well, man, how are you?

Speaker 1 (18:22):
Oh my god? I love this. I love this. I'm excited.

Speaker 4 (18:24):
Man. What a great introduction. It's football week, so let's
talk basketball.

Speaker 1 (18:29):
It's like I said, that's how you know a true
Kentucky right.

Speaker 4 (18:32):
Well, you had to be worried for a second because
I'm like, Oh, he doesn't think I'm going to talk
basketball or football. Doesn't I don't know anything about football.

Speaker 1 (18:37):
Oh yes, let's talk about let's talk about pass rushing
for this year. How are they gonna be?

Speaker 4 (18:41):
Yeah? Yeah, I mean I think that's a defensive thing.

Speaker 1 (18:44):
Hey, Cameron break down Toledo for us.

Speaker 4 (18:48):
Well, from everything, I understand, we're somewhat worried about him.
So yeah, I'm that's that's all I gathered.

Speaker 1 (18:56):
I love it. I love it.

Speaker 2 (18:58):
So no, No, you and I talked a lot last
year about coach Pope, and I remember, I'll go back
to I had a little tweet that kind of went viral,
but it was because of you. I have to I
have to give you credit for it.

Speaker 4 (19:12):
Initially, First of all, what is somewhat viral? What is
that there's like.

Speaker 2 (19:16):
Ten thousand or ten or twenty thousand likes or something
like that.

Speaker 4 (19:19):
I don't really ridiculous that would be viral.

Speaker 2 (19:21):
That's okay, that's fine, all right, So I get credit
for it, You get credit for it. So what happened
was what happened was so when when Pope was first selected.

Speaker 1 (19:32):
I was like, I don't think elected.

Speaker 4 (19:35):
You're you're doing far too many politics.

Speaker 2 (19:37):
Pope was elected, come on thee in conclict.

Speaker 1 (19:43):
It's a play on words.

Speaker 4 (19:44):
We're but now confusions. I don't know what pope we're
talking about.

Speaker 2 (19:48):
So when when Pope was first chosen, I was a
little bit like, you know, I remembered him obviously in
his Kentucky ties, which I liked, but I was not
like overly impressed. And he wasn't He wasn't bad at BYU.
It just it wasn't like they were world beaters. And
I was like, what is this? And you, you and
I had a conversation and you were like, Leland, this

(20:11):
is gonna be the greatest thing that's happened to the
UK in.

Speaker 1 (20:12):
A long time, and you explain it to me.

Speaker 2 (20:15):
And then I saw him at rapp Arena when he
was introduced, and I was like, holy crap, this is
the greatest thing that's happened to the UK in a
long time.

Speaker 1 (20:24):
Right, you were right, Cameron, You were right. And what
I love about last year I would have loved us
to have gone farther.

Speaker 2 (20:31):
But the entire demeanor of big Blue Nation was changed
by this man's amazing leadership in terms of his character,
in terms of how he approaches the game and turn
out he approaches his players, And it was so refreshing
last year.

Speaker 1 (20:48):
You were right, brother, Yeah, you were right. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (20:49):
No, And I think the one word you left out
all of those things being accurate about who he is,
but I think the one word you left out was
is everything that you just described in it, it's authentic.
And that's the thing I keep going back to, is,
you know, spending time with him. I played with him
for two years and then we've you know, all of
us from that that group of you know, the ninety six,

(21:12):
ninety seven, ninety eight kind of group because we all
kind of played together. Even though Scott Pageant wasn't on
the ninety sixteen he had to sit out for academic
issues and of course came back and was SEC academic
honor roll. You know, Jared Prickett set out the ninety
six season and Jeff Shepherds out in ninety seven, so
there wasn't you know, guys in that group weren't always
on the same group, but we've all kept track of
each other and just keeping track of each other, we've

(21:34):
all kind of grown closer and closer over the years,
and and just you know, Mark was always the guy
on the team that he was the most positive. He
was the guy that you could, you know, because you
couldn't always go to coach Patino and complain about coach Patino,
but you could go to maybe an assistant coach, or
certainly if you go to your teammates, because your teammates
understood more than anybody how hard it is or how

(21:56):
hard it was playing for coach p And so Mark
was just that guy that constantly was positive, constantly was
telling you to just listen, fight through it. It gets easier.
And he didn't mean like it gets easier as in
practice gets easier or the tire age get easier. It's
how you deal with him gets easier. So I just
kind of felt because I remember putting out because you
weren't the only one Leland. Everybody had doubts. Everybody was like,

(22:17):
wait a minute. We went from you know, two national
championship coaches, right, one of them who had just come
off for national championship at Yukon and a double national championship.
He said no. Then we went down to Baylor, he
said no, And then we went to a guy who
had never won an NCAA tournament game, and so, you know,
the doubt was fair for everyone to have, but for
those of us who know Mark, it was like, okay,

(22:40):
this changes everything. It's my fact I told and I
think I may have pulled you this. I was on
the airplane the morning I found out that coach Cal
had left. I was getting on an airplane and I
didn't know I actually had a Delta Gate agent to
tell me that Cal had left.

Speaker 1 (22:54):
I had no idea.

Speaker 4 (22:55):
It was like six am in the morning and it
happened overnight, and the guy was like, so, what you
think about Cal leaving. I'm like, Cow's not leaving. He's like, yeah,
it broke class night. He's going to Arkansas. I'm like,
are you kidding. So I'm on the plane and I'm
sitting next to a bunch of people and they're they're
all like, who should we get And I remember saying, well,
I don't think we'll get him because I don't think
we'll ask him, but I'd love to have Mark Pope.

(23:17):
And they all look at me kind of the same way.
You know, everyone did you know? It's like who And
it wasn't even who was in is in? Who is
he where? Some people weren't sure that the younger people
don't remember him, but it's like why would why why him?
And I'm like, I don't think everybody understands. I know
he doesn't have a big name. I know, but if
if you were to see him coach, if you if

(23:38):
you were to understand what kind of person he is,
if you're to understand his work ethic, like literally, this
is last week. He's supposed to be on vacation. Now,
in this day and age in college basketball, you don't
there's no time for a vacation, right, You've got you've
got to work the freshman recruiting classes. You've got to
work the portal recruiting classes. And there is like one

(23:58):
week really one week, and that was last week as
far as I know where, you know, a head basketball
coach can get some time off, and he didn't take
any time off. And I even told him, I said, look, dude,
I said, we don't want you here for like a
year and a half or two years and then you
immediately burn out. We want you. I want you for
the long run because I genuinely think not only are

(24:20):
we going to be successful, and I genuinely think last
year was successful. One things I love about him is
that think about what he said after last year last
and he sounds so much like a UK fan.

Speaker 1 (24:30):
Right, I love that about him.

Speaker 4 (24:32):
Was a failure. We failed last year. Now does he
really believe that? Well, that's the thing is, I don't
really believe that because I know how hard it is
to do what he's doing and what all UK fans want.
But he does really believe that because I've had so
many I don't know that i'd call private conversations, but
you know, the ninety six group, we all get together.
We had a wit a zoom call the other night

(24:53):
with about ten of us, just kind of planning some
stuff because this upcoming year is our thirtyth anniversary of
the ninety six championship team.

Speaker 1 (25:00):
And Mark, dude, you just made me feel like an
ancient old man. Thank you for that. I appreciate it.
You suck.

Speaker 4 (25:05):
It's just I mean, it does. I agree. It's It's ridiculous, dude.

Speaker 1 (25:09):
I was.

Speaker 2 (25:09):
I was on the tarmac when you got off the
plane in ninety six.

Speaker 4 (25:12):
Brother, Yeah, I know, I get it, But well, when
I got off the plane ninety that was one of
the first ones off the plane, and everybody thought I
was a manager of ninety Yeah, I.

Speaker 1 (25:20):
Didn't know who were fair because just kidding, just getting
just kidding.

Speaker 4 (25:24):
No, you didn't, nor should you have anybody other than
you know, my family, like, oh, there's camera and everyone else.
Here come the man.

Speaker 1 (25:29):
Oh is that guy?

Speaker 4 (25:31):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (25:32):
So, but to be fair, I was there in ninety
eight too.

Speaker 4 (25:35):
I was yes, and now that I did get off
the plane a little bit differently, I had a little
more swagger.

Speaker 1 (25:40):
We knew who you were then for ninety eight.

Speaker 4 (25:44):
But but Mark is like he didn't take last week
off like he was working. And you know, the fun
thing is he can't get his players to take tom
off either, like and and he said that multiple times.
He's like, look, I cannot get these guys out of
the gym, and I want them out of the gym
like they you know, and every coach, even coach Peter,
was like this, you know, I want them to take
some time off. I need their bodies to recuperate from

(26:05):
the long season and then we'll get back to work.
But you know, Mark and his staff, and I don't
know what kind of break he gave his staff last week.
But I mean, these guys are hard working, and I mean,
so you take Mark's intellect, he's just and I don't know, Leland,
have you seen the video that I think Jami actually
produced with with Mark and his love and his love

(26:28):
of chess and how he kind of, uh, you know,
kind of compared chess to basketball and and and now
you know everything everything you do defensively, it affects what
you do offensively. And Mark's got three chess boards set
up in his in his uh in his office, and
they're used and they're used between he and his players
because he brings in his players and he's got these

(26:49):
running games of chess that he plays and it's just
and what's cool about it? And these are just the
little things that's like, yes, this is totally Mark Pope.
This is who he is, and they're I think ultimately,
you know, you know, net positives for who the team
is going to be. Every year where he brings them in,
he teaches him chess if they don't know it, and
then they play and then it that's the time where

(27:09):
he is, Okay, we're not necessarily gonna sit here, though
they may, but it's not that it's not necessarily a
chance to talk offensive to defensive strategy with your player.
It's how's your mom, how's your dad? It's those kinds
of things where and I'm I'm sitting here thinking, I
even even Coach Smith, who was who was much more
of a U and I say it, much more of

(27:29):
a familiar, a familial coach, you know, where Coach p
was all business all the time. You know, Coach Smith,
you know, would do those how's your mom, how's your dad?
And then Tom wouldn't deear you to him. He never
did anything like this. You know, Mark is just very
intentional about everything he does. And I think that's the
overwriting thing. He's intentional. And if I go back to
what everybody thought when he was hired, and I think,

(27:52):
this is this amazing and I know put this in
a tweet and it may have been a text I
gat I sent to you too. I said, look, you know, uh,
Yukon's coach, and I'm like, on his name Hani, not
hany whatever, they miss Yukon's coach. He had never won.
He had a sixty five percent winning percentage until he
got to Yukon, Okay, and he had obviously never won

(28:15):
a national championship until he got to Yukon. Mark Pope
had never won a national championship until he got to
Kentucky still hasn't, but he had a sixty seven percent
winning percentage. So it's it's easy to look at a
lot of these coaches who you know they're up and comers,
but until you get to a school that has the
resources that Kentucky has, which I think we're seeing, Kentucky's

(28:36):
got resources that no one else can match right now,
with it with nil and with you know, the way
they're doing things, and you know, you may have other
coaches complaining about that. We'll complain all you want, guys,
because the bottom line is n CUAA has never been fair.
They can talk all they want about how well we
want a fair playing field. Really, let's talk to UK
football basketball. You think Toledo has the recruiting budget that
UK football does, right, so let me give you that.

Speaker 2 (28:59):
Let me give you a little outs perspective on that
point real quick, just because now that I'm living in
the West, right so I'm I'm seeing and hearing and
talking to people that are fans of Western based teams,
and obviously everybody here knows that I'm a freaking nut
job about Kentucky, right because I don't. I wear Kentucky
on my sleeve everywhere I go. And I had some

(29:20):
really good friends that played at Gonzaga and some of
the other Western schools, and when they heard that Mark
Pope being at BYU was going to Kentucky, they all
called me and they said, Leland, you guys are gonna
win a freaking championship. They know they did, because what
they what they knew in terms of the respect that

(29:40):
they had for him was exactly what you just said
right before, right before then, right before I rudely.

Speaker 1 (29:45):
Interrupted you, you said the resources.

Speaker 2 (29:48):
And they knew BYU didn't have the resources or the
fan base to propel the engine that Mark Pope could
put on a basketball team. And they all said, dude,
when he's at Kentucky, he he's gonna win a championship.

Speaker 1 (30:01):
That's what they told me.

Speaker 4 (30:01):
Well, look at where BYU is now, right, I mean?
And that's I mean. And granted, I know there've been
transfers both in and out, and I know that their
their head coach now is a great coach. And I believe,
I believe could be incorrect here and thinking, but I
believe he was one of Mark's coaches while he was there.
I could be completely wrong about that, but even if
I'm wrong about that part, the point is is that

(30:22):
Mark didn't leave the cupboards bear at BYU. I mean,
all of a sudden, BYU is looking at you know,
maybe a top ten preseason ranking and one of the
best you know incoming classes. Well a lot of that
and I'm not taking any credit away from their current
head coach or staff, but a lot of that is
how Mark left BYU in the state he left BYU,
So you take and BYU is not a perennial juggernaut

(30:44):
at all, but Mark was building them into one. And
you know, they weren't world beaters when he was there,
but they did. They were part of the Big twelve
at that point. Yeah, and they had beaten Texas, they
had beaten I believe Kansas, they had beaten Baylor. You know,
his last year at by you they were beating world beaters.
So then of course he comes to Kentucky in his
first year a week behind schedule, mind you, of everybody else,

(31:08):
because cal said he was staying and then a week
later he was gone. So where everyone else has been
able to hit the portal for a full week. Mark's
got to come in and get his staff together, then
they've got to hit the portal. And then he still
wound up putting together a team that set a record
or at least tied a record for the most top
fifteen victories in the UK season. Now, yeah, it'd been
nice if we'd gone on a little bit further. But

(31:29):
what I love more than any saying is I was
one hundred percent satisfied with last season, understanding the situation
we were in with a new coach. Basically, I mean
it was it was not only like what we used
to deal with with Cal. We got new players every year.
We had new players, we had new coaches, and we
had a new head coach. Everything was brand new, and
yet they still were as successful as they were last year.

(31:50):
And that all to me goes to Mark being able
to understand how to build a team and the importance
of team as opposed to the importance of individual talent and
that kind of thing. But I was completely satisfied it
last year. Mark, however, not, and I mean he's sincerely not.
He's those when he goes to the media and he
says you know, they ask him, you know, grade last year,

(32:11):
and I forget what grade he gave himself. I think
it was like a B minus or something.

Speaker 2 (32:15):
Well, that's because he knows what Kentuckians want. He knows
what Kentuckians demanded will want to have.

Speaker 4 (32:22):
That's true, but it's also what he wants, right, And
I think that's what makes this perfect, right exactly, And
that's my point is that when you've got Okay, look,
you know, he he's he is a he has a
national championship at Kentucky, not as a coach but as
a player, right, and he when he talks about how
this place and think about all the places he played.

(32:43):
He played at Washington in college, he played here in college,
and then he had an I want to say, seven
eight year NBA career. He also played overseas for a while.
All of the various coaches that he had that he
has a lot of respect for. I don't think I
don't think he has any better more respect and than
he does for Rick Patino. And I know for a

(33:04):
fact that this place because he talks about it constantly. Yeah,
this the three years he's spent here to about a
year and then he played two years, so the three
years he's spent in Lexington, he says, these were the
most impactful years of my basketball career and even maybe
even my life.

Speaker 1 (33:19):
That's all.

Speaker 4 (33:19):
And that has to do with the fans being who
they are. What it means to be a Kentucky basketball
player to the fans, what it means to be one
of those very fortunate thirteen or fourteen guys that you
know get to wear that uniform. And I'll give you
one more perfect example of how important that is to him.

Speaker 2 (33:33):
Okay, and then I'm up against the break. I gotta
go after that, So go for it, all.

Speaker 4 (33:36):
Right, I'll be real quick. So basically, you've got a
guy like Dusty Mills. I don't know if you remember
Dusty Mills just played for So Dusty played half a
year as a walk on for Gillespie, and Gillespie basically
used him as a kind of as a as a
guinea pig. He threw him off the team in the
middle of a game basically for laughing along with other
teammates on the bench. He didn't throw the other teammates

(33:58):
off the team. He threw Dusty out the team. Why
Usty was a walk on Dusty wore a uniform at
the University cuchue for half a year. Half a year,
that's it. And so when Mark comes in and grabs
me and a couple of the other guys and says, guys, listen,
I really want X players back. I need X players back.
And so we're like, okay, well, who are we counting
these ex players? He said, if you were the uniform

(34:18):
for a half a second, as an actual UK basketball player,
you are part of this club. And so he and
Dusty mills. All of a sudden, I see him back.
And I've known Dusty for a while, I've known his
dad for a while. We're not related, but I have
I gotta run. Yeah, my buddy.

Speaker 2 (34:32):
That no, that's awesome, man, I love it. I love you, brother,
Thanks for the time. Appreciate you brother.

Speaker 4 (34:37):
All right, man, love you too.

Speaker 1 (34:38):
All right.

Speaker 2 (34:38):
It's Tony and Dwight Show, News Radio eight forty whas