Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
And I want to take another shot at this because
twenty four hours ago, uh, operator error on my part,
we didn't get the chat with Jeremy Rosenthal, which I
wanted to do, our legal expert and attorney who joins
us on the show this morning. Jeremy, good to have you.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Good morning, How are you well?
Speaker 1 (00:24):
I wanted I wanted to get your view. Now, Jim
and I are a little bit across at odds here
about the fact that the woman, the HR woman, that
astronomer who was caught playing around during the Coldplay concert
has not been fired as far as we know. The CEO,
her partner up there on the on the big screen,
(00:47):
resigned immediately. My view is that if you're if you're
the head of HR, you gotta go. Jim thinks no,
she might have something on the on the on the
ceo know, and that the company is worried about a lawsuit.
What's your take?
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Okay, Well, first off, who's going to pay me? Between
you and where we're going to we can set We
can sell that that I'm a lawyer, my legal my
legal views are subject to who's paying.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
All right, So this is a negotiation. It's not about
the money. It's how much I got it.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
It's a different Okay, Okay, So here is here's what
I think is happening here. I think that when you
are the head of HR, I think you know where
all the bodies are buried. I think that corporation and
this is this is me being a little jaded, so
so take it with the grain of salt. I think
corporations and and and industry. I think they act out
(01:48):
of fear. And there's nothing to fear with this CEO.
He's a national joke. He's resigned. If anything, if you're astronomer,
you're going to pin your ears back. You're going to
go after that guy because he violated probably his morality
claus and he hurt the shareholder, hurt the profile of
the company because he was thinking with something different than
(02:10):
his head. She, on the other hand, can really still
hurt you. And she can still hurt you because she
knows again where all the bodies are buried. She's the
head of HR. Her job, she's the JEdgar Hoover in
this place. Her job is to collect the dirt on everybody.
So that's why they're trying. They're probably trying to negotiate
with her a severance. They might be afraid of a lawsuit.
(02:34):
I doubt it. You can say when you have there's
two types of sexual harassments. What you would call vertical
sexual harassment, which is when it's the person in the
cube next to you that keeps, you know, kind of
grabbing and screaming and touching, and hey, look at this
on my phone. There's that, and the company there has
a lot of defenses because the company is entitled to
(02:55):
notice when it's horizontal, hardened the pun when it's horizontal, uh,
A sexual harassment when it's the CEO.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
There's a lot of arguments that, look, he's compelling this,
that that we feel like we have to do this,
that he's got some sort of grip on you, and
that's a little harder to defend. Although exhibit is going
to be a picture of her looking pretty darn happy
at the Coldplay concert. So I don't think there's liability,
But that's how I think the company.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
Is thinking, Yeah, he definitely had a grip on her.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
That's so hard a drawn.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
Well, No, I think he's leaning in my direction because,
as I pointed up yesterday, Satar, I believe there are
two things going on here. Number one, she can say, hey,
he was my direct report. He was sexually harassing me.
I felt like I had to go along or I
was going to lose my job, and or they're negotiating
a settlement here that includes an NDIA.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
You didn't say that.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
I did too, I said that, all right, roll the tape.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Okay, all right, So well that all makes sense. I
want to ask you too about uh, this horrible Coburger case.
Do you think they screwed up by not by doing
the plea deal number one, and by not at least
requiring him to make a statement at the sentencing.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Uh, there's there's no there's no right answer here. I
think you could have compelled a waiver of the Fifth Sendment, Uh,
as part of a plea bargain. You can. When you're
in the defense, you wave rights, you wave right, the
wave left, you wave up, you wave middles. You can
you can require the defense to wave the Fifth Amendment
and answer questions. And and that's not a very common thing.
(04:39):
It is common, but it's not for that reason. Thousands
of people plead guilty in this country every day, and
the judge has standard and the mission he has to
ask the defense. Do you understand what's going on? Do
you understand the nature of these charges? Are you crazy?
Have you been to a mental hospital? Are you on
anything right now? Those are the type of questions that
(05:00):
are typically answered when you wave the fifth But you
can do it to press him on things. Now. I
don't know that you're going to get any answers that
are satisfactory. So that part of it could have been done.
But I don't fault the prosecutor. But the bigger question
here should they have sought death or not death? I'll
tell you this much. I don't have a lot of
sympathy for prosecutors. I'm a criminal defense lawyer. I love
(05:23):
what I do, but this is what makes being a
prosecutor hard. If I have to take my hat off
to them for anything, it's this. There are not just
four victims here. There is There are moms, and there
are dads, and there are sisters and cousins and uncles
and brothers. And they're not going to agree on what
(05:43):
they want, and they don't agree on what they want,
and as the DA, you're going to upset something.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
Yeah, plus the jury trial, you never know. Just ask
you Marcia Clark about jury trials and how sideways they
can go. Ask Mark Furman about up those. One quick
clarification and that is his ability to earn money off
of this. There is some sort of maybe there was
(06:09):
some negotiated issue, or maybe it's a state low in Idaho.
But my suspicion is he's kept quiet because that content
is very valuable. Is there any pathway for him to
generate money as a result of this story?
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Yes, but not money that he can keep. OJ died broke,
I remember, and he wrote book after book after book,
and the Goldman family just sewed the potatoes out of
that guy. And this guy if he ever makes anything
that would actually be good for the families because they'll
just assume him and take it. So I think there's
(06:46):
the short answer there, But again there's just no right answer.
And the Parkland, Florida shooter didn't get the death sentence
when they sought the death sentence. How painful would that
be if for the for the family to go through that.
So that's what makes being an elected da Hall.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
Jeremy, thanks, So we'll do it again. Jeremy Rosenthal our
legal legal here on k a ABS Morning News
And I want to take another shot at this because
twenty four hours ago, uh, operator error on my part,
we didn't get the chat with Jeremy Rosenthal, which I
wanted to do, our legal expert and attorney who joins
us on the show this morning. Jeremy, good to have you.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Good morning, How are you well?
Speaker 1 (00:24):
I wanted I wanted to get your view. Now, Jim
and I are a little bit across at odds here
about the fact that the woman, the HR woman, that
astronomer who was caught playing around during the Coldplay concert
has not been fired as far as we know. The CEO,
her partner up there on the on the big screen,
(00:47):
resigned immediately. My view is that if you're if you're
the head of HR, you gotta go. Jim thinks no,
she might have something on the on the on the
ceo know, and that the company is worried about a lawsuit.
What's your take?
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Okay, Well, first off, who's going to pay me? Between
you and where we're going to we can set We
can sell that that I'm a lawyer, my legal my
legal views are subject to who's paying.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
All right, So this is a negotiation. It's not about
the money. It's how much I got it.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
It's a different Okay, Okay, So here is here's what
I think is happening here. I think that when you
are the head of HR, I think you know where
all the bodies are buried. I think that corporation and
this is this is me being a little jaded, so
so take it with the grain of salt. I think
corporations and and and industry. I think they act out
(01:48):
of fear. And there's nothing to fear with this CEO.
He's a national joke. He's resigned. If anything, if you're astronomer,
you're going to pin your ears back. You're going to
go after that guy because he violated probably his morality
claus and he hurt the shareholder, hurt the profile of
the company because he was thinking with something different than
(02:10):
his head. She, on the other hand, can really still
hurt you. And she can still hurt you because she
knows again where all the bodies are buried. She's the
head of HR. Her job, she's the JEdgar Hoover in
this place. Her job is to collect the dirt on everybody.
So that's why they're trying. They're probably trying to negotiate
with her a severance. They might be afraid of a lawsuit.
(02:34):
I doubt it. You can say when you have there's
two types of sexual harassments. What you would call vertical
sexual harassment, which is when it's the person in the
cube next to you that keeps, you know, kind of
grabbing and screaming and touching, and hey, look at this
on my phone. There's that, and the company there has
a lot of defenses because the company is entitled to
(02:55):
notice when it's horizontal, hardened the pun when it's horizontal, uh,
A sexual harassment when it's the CEO.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
There's a lot of arguments that, look, he's compelling this,
that that we feel like we have to do this,
that he's got some sort of grip on you, and
that's a little harder to defend. Although exhibit is going
to be a picture of her looking pretty darn happy
at the Coldplay concert. So I don't think there's liability,
But that's how I think the company.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
Is thinking, Yeah, he definitely had a grip on her.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
That's so hard a drawn.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
Well, No, I think he's leaning in my direction because,
as I pointed up yesterday, Satar, I believe there are
two things going on here. Number one, she can say, hey,
he was my direct report. He was sexually harassing me.
I felt like I had to go along or I
was going to lose my job, and or they're negotiating
a settlement here that includes an NDIA.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
You didn't say that.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
I did too, I said that, all right, roll the tape.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Okay, all right, So well that all makes sense. I
want to ask you too about uh, this horrible Coburger case.
Do you think they screwed up by not by doing
the plea deal number one, and by not at least
requiring him to make a statement at the sentencing.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Uh, there's there's no there's no right answer here. I
think you could have compelled a waiver of the Fifth Sendment, Uh,
as part of a plea bargain. You can. When you're
in the defense, you wave rights, you wave right, the
wave left, you wave up, you wave middles. You can
you can require the defense to wave the Fifth Amendment
and answer questions. And and that's not a very common thing.
(04:39):
It is common, but it's not for that reason. Thousands
of people plead guilty in this country every day, and
the judge has standard and the mission he has to
ask the defense. Do you understand what's going on? Do
you understand the nature of these charges? Are you crazy?
Have you been to a mental hospital? Are you on
anything right now? Those are the type of questions that
(05:00):
are typically answered when you wave the fifth But you
can do it to press him on things. Now. I
don't know that you're going to get any answers that
are satisfactory. So that part of it could have been done.
But I don't fault the prosecutor. But the bigger question
here should they have sought death or not death? I'll
tell you this much. I don't have a lot of
sympathy for prosecutors. I'm a criminal defense lawyer. I love
(05:23):
what I do, but this is what makes being a
prosecutor hard. If I have to take my hat off
to them for anything, it's this. There are not just
four victims here. There is There are moms, and there
are dads, and there are sisters and cousins and uncles
and brothers. And they're not going to agree on what
(05:43):
they want, and they don't agree on what they want,
and as the DA, you're going to upset something.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
Yeah, plus the jury trial, you never know. Just ask
you Marcia Clark about jury trials and how sideways they
can go. Ask Mark Furman about up those. One quick
clarification and that is his ability to earn money off
of this. There is some sort of maybe there was
(06:09):
some negotiated issue, or maybe it's a state low in Idaho.
But my suspicion is he's kept quiet because that content
is very valuable. Is there any pathway for him to
generate money as a result of this story?
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Yes, but not money that he can keep. OJ died broke,
I remember, and he wrote book after book after book,
and the Goldman family just sewed the potatoes out of
that guy. And this guy if he ever makes anything
that would actually be good for the families because they'll
just assume him and take it. So I think there's
(06:46):
the short answer there, But again there's just no right answer.
And the Parkland, Florida shooter didn't get the death sentence
when they sought the death sentence. How painful would that
be if for the for the family to go through that.
So that's what makes being an elected da Hall.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
Jeremy, thanks, So we'll do it again. Jeremy Rosenthal our
legal legal here on k a ABS Morning News
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