The Man Behind Loud Records: Steve Rifkind on Wu-Tang, Tupac, Mobb Deep, Kanye & More Untold Stories

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Yo bouleg cap podcast man special guests here a legend
man Steve Rifkin is in the building. Good to see you, bro,
you keV Yes, sir, what's going on? Ran into you
at the Wu Tang show show at dinner a few Yeah, Yeah,
for sure, it's good to see you.

Speaker 2 (00:14):
Man.

Speaker 1 (00:14):
You're you're a legend. Like I don't say that like lightly.
I remember like growing up, like reading about you and
like the Source and Double X Ship.

Speaker 3 (00:20):
And man, I'm just me, like, you know, just give
me some good music, good basketball game to watch. I'm happy.

Speaker 1 (00:29):
Yeah, I mean, did you did you watch the last
night's game?

Speaker 3 (00:32):
Was at the Arena, but I did see it. It
was heartbreaking, man, when Halliburton went down. So you know,
it's it's it's funny. I I told my achilles round six, okay.
And I'm granted I'm a lot older, right right right,
but I'm not in shape. So when he said strain

(00:55):
in his calf, there should be a new like how
they have to they have a concussion, they should the
same thing they should happened Tatum not only well I
don't know if Tatum was hurt, but uh the kid
on Milwaukee Damien, right, he had a blood clot everything
else like that, and then if you have a strained calf,

(01:16):
you should sit out like a month. It should definitely
be a month. And you know, both my son's a
high level ballplayer. One played but number one high school
team in the country. The other one played at the
one basketball And they said, man, like, because I'm playing
game six and seven, like I'd rather sit out of
yet like this is you know, yeah, I think like

(01:38):
in that spot.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
I mean they I think they talked to him before
the game too, and he essentially was like, I understand
the risk, but it's game seven and and imagine if
he didn't play, they lose the season. There's that regret,
but it's like, now you know he's going to be
out a year.

Speaker 3 (01:55):
Definitely out of year.

Speaker 1 (01:56):
Yeah, it's crazy, And yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:59):
I've never met him, but I I've only heard I
love his game and even though they beat the Knicks,
he's a beast.

Speaker 1 (02:08):
He is a beast man, and he's like, That's what
I like about like him and Brunson is they're not
like they feel like very very like modest superstars, if
that makes sense.

Speaker 3 (02:20):
Yeah, listen, I'm Brunson is modest and he's right. I'm
not a fan of his dad's and I'm not a
fan of Brunson's game. Fair, I don't think. I don't
think the Knicks will win a championship with him as
the point guard.

Speaker 1 (02:32):
It's very It's yeah, it is very. He's all heavy
ball centric.

Speaker 3 (02:35):
It's very. It's very James Harden. And as great as
Harden is and as great as Brunson is, he's not
gonna he he dripples the wall too much, he shoots
too much. You know, I'm an old school point guard, right.
So it's though, oh there's no question about because he
thinks about passing.

Speaker 1 (02:55):
It's like he can affect the game in so many
different ways, even if he you know, if he has
fourteen points, but he's got all these Yeah, not for sure.
Now that was a sad, sad day.

Speaker 3 (03:04):
But no, it was how I when I saw it,
I was like like the first time that you could
actually there was no sound where, but you actually saw
what you saw it, saw it.

Speaker 1 (03:16):
And then you see him like when you see his
because he knows exactly what happened.

Speaker 3 (03:20):
Yeah, Oh it was heart broad. He was on a tear.
He had he had three three streets yeah, long threes.

Speaker 1 (03:25):
Yeah, it was crazy man. So obviously, man, you're somebody
who you know is like one of the few people
who I feel like is responsible for helping shape like
so much of like hip hop history. Like I think
in the eighties, we think like Russell Simmons and Rick
Rubin and Deaf Jam and uh. I think at the nineties,
I think of Loud Records, like you know, what you

(03:49):
would was like kind of get take me back to
your roots, because I know in the eighties you had
worked with New Edition, right.

Speaker 3 (03:55):
I started in nineteen seventy nine, seventy nine, my dad
on the label called Spring Record. Okay, so that was
fat back then, which put out the first hip hop record,
King Tim the third they had an artist my name
of Joe Simon, and then an artists but name of
Millie Jackson and another artist I'm sure we all heard
of by the name of James Brown of course. So

(04:21):
and we gave Russell his first record with the Jimmy
Spice Dollar Bill. Y'all. Wow. Crazy, So so hip hop
to me, I've known Russell Sinstem seventeen, oh like your
whole life, Yeah, like he would like I didn't know,

(04:44):
you know, Russell is such a creature of habit, you know,
knowing him now and just you know, my dad would
go to lunch every day from one o'clock to two thirty,
but Russell would call every day. I want. But then
he would come speak to me like so I didn't
know if he was. I didn't want to scared to
talk to my dad and just start screaming at me,

(05:06):
you know, whatever it was. And all he kept on,
like for three weeks. No, he would say, w z
A case playing the record, But w za ca'se playing
the record. W Zak's playing the record, So I said,
you know, and then I was about to go on
like my first little run at radio. Yeah, but by
myself with that an artists.

Speaker 1 (05:25):
Okay, so you were essentially going to hit the road
and just work your records to stations PD yeah.

Speaker 3 (05:29):
Yeah so and eventually that's why I ended up putting
the street team together. I'm like seventeen, eighteen years old.
I don't want to hang out with guys even in
their thirties. I mean I was, I was, I mean
a knucklehead to be honest, To be honest with you,
I was just slexic. I didn't know how to read
till I was fourteen, fifteen years old. So it was
like my grandfather called me one day. He says, get

(05:51):
down to Florida. And that's one person that you know,
I'm scared of three Like my whole life I was
scared of you know, scared of God. I'm scared my
daughter now and my grandfather like he ran that family,
you know, with like an impist jumped down. I remember
getting on an Eastern Airlines flight at a JFK landed

(06:14):
in Fort Lauderdale, picked me up. When did Denny said,
you canna end up beater in jail? You picked a choice,
and this is when you're seventeen, might have just turned eighty.

Speaker 4 (06:25):
Okay, okay, he goes, it doesn't pay to be a
gangst trust me, right, And but I said, you know,
and I said, look, he goes, don't look at me.

Speaker 1 (06:38):
Right, that's crazy. But for you, it was like you
feel like that was like a fork in the road,
like if your grandpa maybe hadn't.

Speaker 3 (06:47):
Have I would have been beater in jail.

Speaker 1 (06:48):
Yeah, because you weren't like would you say that?

Speaker 3 (06:52):
The funny thing is kept I didn't need to steal,
like I came like my dad had one of his
most successful independent labels, a vault of all of all time.
I was just doing it to get attention because people
were calling. You know, it's not a great word to
say he's retarded, he's this, he's that. And ball saved
my life as a kid kid, right, basketball basketball, So.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
Like that's what you were doing at school to take
your mind off and maybe not being the greatest at.

Speaker 3 (07:16):
School, but I really, you know, and like I didn't
know how to read write, you know, I knew how
to write, but I didn't. So it was like nobody
knew what dyslexia was in nineteen seventy eight, right, But no, no,
I was a little bit younger when they found out
that whatever dyslexi.

Speaker 1 (07:33):
Is, Like, I got some a couple of family members who.

Speaker 3 (07:37):
Nine, yes, seventy eight, I was sixteen, right, So so
you go and see Grandpa in Florida. He goes, he
goes go work, he goes go work for your dad
and uncle Roy, my dad and uncle brothers in your partner.
I was like, when I walk in, they run, he goes,
I'll talk to him, right, So I fly home the

(07:58):
next day to weeks later, the household rings again, but
there's no cell phones, there's nothing. He goes, pick me
up the airport to say, afternoon for thirty Grandpa Grandpa. Okay,
so he flies them. Grandpa flies with an entourage. Okay,
some bodyguards this, right. So it was like, your grandpa's

(08:19):
like a guy. Oh he was a real guy. Yeah,
So I picked him, but he only had one guy
with him. Usually three or four, he had one guy
with him. He goes, all right, we're going into the city.
I think, like, I think he forgot about what he
told me, and I think we're doing something. He's picking

(08:40):
you up, I'm picking him up, and I'm thinking, like
we're about to go get into some ship. Yeah, and
I'm like, I'm happy as a pig, and shit right,
I'm thinking he forgot the conversation Grandpa. Let's go. So
I'm like, where we're going. He goes, We're going to
Daddy's building. A little disappointing for you. Yeah, I was like,

(09:04):
ah fuck, he goes. I go, what are we doing
that for? He goes, we're sitting down with him and
Uncle Rod. Yeah. I remember our talk as much as
you want me to forget it. And you know, my
uncle was older than my dad, and like he said, like,
don't funck this up. Mhm.

Speaker 1 (09:25):
It's crazy too, because man, I feel like back then
you saw the music. I mean even in the nineties,
but but then it was very much like I always
hear these stories about like you know, like in the
like seventies and eighties, like sometimes like program directors would
get like like a lot of rock pds would take

(09:45):
like an eight ball of cocaine to add a record.

Speaker 3 (09:48):
Yeah, or like it was like the wild Wild West
for real, they would get the cleans like you were
payment records sometimes you know, but at the end, at
the end of the day.

Speaker 1 (09:58):
But that was like really like though, like the record
business was very like you know, I got in.

Speaker 3 (10:05):
It sucks.

Speaker 1 (10:06):
I'm thirty eight, and I feel like I got in.
I never got to experience like mix Sure Power Summit
because when it was going on the last few years
that I was relevant, or when I got into the game,
I wasn't relevant enough to even get invited. I was
an intern. So it was like I didn't get to
see before debauchery of like the record industry. I feel

(10:28):
like I got in when it started to kind of
like clean up a little.

Speaker 3 (10:31):
So there was a convention called non Convention.

Speaker 1 (10:33):
I remember, hey, it still isn't there is?

Speaker 3 (10:35):
But then you talk about sex drugs rock and roll? Right,
the sex drugs rock and roll. So before I officially started,
I'm Jewish and norm was always around the Jewish holidays. Okay,
so my grandparents were what lo it and the convention
was always at the Diplomat Hotel Hollywood Flower. Right, So

(11:00):
they take me down and I'm going just setting up
this promotion to off for me to go on this
that whatever. In a few weeks, I was like, wow,
this is like a business, like the most beautiful woman
in the world. And everybody was like I was like,
I was like in heaven, but I you know, I
didn't know, but I was like, all right, you know, yeah.

Speaker 1 (11:19):
No, it's it's crazy too because it's like you see
it to exist today and you see even just like
it portrayed like there was that I forget the HBO
show there was Vinyl.

Speaker 3 (11:29):
Yes, actually that the head of the company. That show
didn't last long, but that character the headed a record
company was based on my dad and two other people,
all all in one, all.

Speaker 1 (11:43):
Kind of encapsulated.

Speaker 3 (11:44):
Yeah. But the office, how the office looked was exactly
like my dad's office. Did it? Did it? T Wow?

Speaker 1 (11:52):
And you So that's so so you're like thrown into
this ship. What do you What is your first job
for your dad's label?

Speaker 3 (11:58):
Is it promotion? You're doing promo?

Speaker 1 (12:02):
Like you're hitting the streets like, hey, son, I need
you to go visit this program director. Yeah, I need
to go on this run. We gotta go see this
college radio station.

Speaker 3 (12:08):
It wasn't even college. There was I mean there was
college radio. I would end up going back to college radio.
But it was just literally like starting Mobile Alabama going
to WBLK.

Speaker 1 (12:18):
Right, it's crazy, right.

Speaker 3 (12:20):
And there's no GPS, there's no anything. And I don't
even really know how to read. There's no cell phone
in a car, in a car by myself with like
fifty hours worth of quarters to call the radio station.
I'm here, Birmingham. How do I get to Mobile Alabama?
Can you?

Speaker 1 (12:35):
Oh my? It's so funny because like we're so spoiled
where we think about, like I even think about like
how far away we are from like the map quest days.
We used to be able to print direction. Yeah, but
when I was a little kid, my dad used to
buy a fucking at list from the gas station and
then just try to figure it out, like you know
what I mean, It's damn that's crazy. So you end
up doing promotion. What would you say outside of your

(12:56):
dad's label, what was your first kind of break in
the business where you were able to kind of it
starts to create your own legacy.

Speaker 3 (13:05):
So I'm living out here and what year six? Okay,
actually I just told my first apartment I was negative
one years old at the time. So I took a
picture on my way here at the first apartment I
ever had? Was it in the valleys six o five
Kowango Boulevard? Oh yeah, right, but like right off of Riverside.

Speaker 1 (13:29):
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back to the interview.

Speaker 3 (13:48):
So you moved to la in eighty six eighty six
in the valley in the valley Flus six oh five
Cowanngo Boulevard right off for Riverside, there's a seven. There's
a seven to eleven right there. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I
know exactly where that is. My best friend lived on
the first floor. Me and my girlfriend lived on the
second floor, and she was an actress and somebody on this.

Speaker 1 (14:07):
Was the plan. Like when you say I'm going to
move to La, did you already have?

Speaker 3 (14:10):
I was. I was managing New Addition, okay, which is
a big deal in eighty six, right, that's fucking huge.
So we were making the any Heartbreak album.

Speaker 1 (14:19):
Wow, So it just made sense. Hey, I got to
get out to La. It makes more sense.

Speaker 3 (14:24):
Well, I also fell in love for the first time.
It happens, leve will make you move, Yeah, it definitely will,
especially an actress where else you're going to live there,
So you're out here and I guess you know it's
interesting too because in eighty six that's pre n w
A right, it was yeah like two years before NWA right,

(14:46):
So at that time it's like ice Teas out, Ice
Teas out, so two shorts out ish So I started.
So what happened was when I when I moved New
Addition fired us like maybe five months after I got
out here. Oh break, It's all right, And I hook
up with a company called Delicious Final legendary company. Right,

(15:06):
So Young MC tone lok, I guess was that eighty
seven eighty eight?

Speaker 1 (15:12):
Yeah, people always like to pass over tone look like.

Speaker 3 (15:15):
Wild Thing and Funky Colemandina, you know.

Speaker 1 (15:18):
Starting blank check. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (15:21):
And then Young MC would bus to move so I
would promote the records and I would put the little
street team together and go on. So I started making
a name for myself. So I hadn't took three thousand dollars.
I wasn't loaded. I took three thousand dollars and I

(15:41):
made a like a pamphlet and I had to go
to New York for a wedding and I was gonna
stay in New York, and I sent it out to
every head of promotion pop Urban. There was no rap
department in those days, Brian, When did you start, Gavin?
I got around nineteen ninety. I sent at these pamphlets

(16:02):
and and you're sitting in the radio. I'm sending into
record labels to get business, okay, got it? So essentially
because you I'm starting his street team and then set
the promo online, right, so and we're doing heavy Gavin
was it CMJ? Right? It was you? And right it
was Gavin CMJ Street Team Mix Show and I and

(16:24):
I also one of my best friends was to head
a programming at MTV. So YO started well, we gave
YO their first real video that broke out was the
Home Local wild Thing video. But make a long story short,
I come back with two hundred thousand dollars.

Speaker 1 (16:40):
Worth of business off of that three thousand dollars investment.

Speaker 3 (16:43):
Yeah, and I hired the guy the name of Malik Levy.
Malik worked with me for like three or four months
and then he wanted to go in more into an
R and he introduced me to guy him with Fae Duvenet. Okay,
and that's when things started to really roll for us.

(17:04):
There was no lawed at the time.

Speaker 1 (17:07):
And because I think a lot of people have a
misconception about Loud because it's obviously such a closed label.

Speaker 3 (17:12):
It started here, but it started here eighty three sixty Melrows.

Speaker 1 (17:16):
And now was was your first artist Aloud? The Licks?
No Twister, Twister, the Twist and the speed not mobsters
right or was it just twisted Twister?

Speaker 3 (17:27):
Interesting and we had Tupac at the same time, right
Bryan to Apocalypse.

Speaker 1 (17:35):
Well, I wanted to talk to you because you also,
you know, when we were hanging out, I didn't know
that Tupac was your roommate for a short time.

Speaker 3 (17:42):
Yeah, so we would go on the road.

Speaker 1 (17:44):
Well, for I wanted the genesis of you and pox relationship.

Speaker 3 (17:49):
It was he worked like he wasn't like he was.
He was a true worker. My first office before we
moved to the Big office eighty three sixty Melrows, we
had an office at seven for North Gardner, right across
Nipsey's burger spot as they now. But he used to
be a Johnny Rockets. Yeah, and we used to be
right across the street and the room was half the size,

(18:10):
and it would be me, Fade and Lisa, who ended
up being Fade's wife Crazy and my girl, the girl
who I moved out for a system. Yeah, and then
Park would come to the office. We'd all sit on
the floor, smoke cigarettes and chip out his rackets.

Speaker 1 (18:29):
Wow, that's crazy. So you're he was like a client
of yours.

Speaker 3 (18:34):
Essentially, Well, in a scope, he was signed to Interscope
directly through a Trian Gregory, but then the Interscope would
hire you to they gave me, they gave us our
first retainer. So your first retainer ever was for two Apocalypse.

Speaker 1 (18:44):
Now, yeah, that's so crazy.

Speaker 3 (18:49):
Was you know?

Speaker 1 (18:49):
What's interesting because Tupac is such a like a I
feel like he has so many errors of he has
short life. But from a fan's perspective, there's so many
like errors of like Tupac and how we kind of
know him right, Like by all accounts I heard, he
was a hard worker and he was a sweet dude
to deal with, like he was a nice guy.

Speaker 3 (19:10):
We never had a problem. I mean, Brian, when we
brought him up every time to see you, was there
ever a problem? Oh yeah, yeah, that's crazy.

Speaker 1 (19:24):
Tupac was seventeen eighteen.

Speaker 3 (19:26):
Yeah damn.

Speaker 1 (19:28):
And so how does he end up how do you
guys end up getting close enough to where he he
ends up crashing at your spot?

Speaker 3 (19:33):
So we would go on the road from Thursday to
Sunday or Thursday to Monday, just working the record, working
the record, and then we would have to leave again
on Thursday. So instead of him going back home, he
would just crash it at the house. Wow. And I
didn't take him all like fade would take him somebody
would like, but he would always like whenever they landed,

(19:54):
like he would just And.

Speaker 1 (19:55):
At that time, your guys is like probably in at
these like when it comes a radio or Whoever's like,
oh no, no, the kid from the Digital Underground record.

Speaker 3 (20:03):
Yeah, yeah, Like that was like that was our story.

Speaker 1 (20:06):
That was like how you kicked the door, Like no,
you know Humpty, this is the kid from the Humpty record.
Like that's so wild, man. It's interesting. So you work
with Tupac, that's your first retainer. Who's the first like
record contract where when the album comes out Loud Records
is on the back of the album Twist of the

(20:27):
Twist album I'm Twisted, Yeah, And and at that time
it's interesting because there was like a a real I
would say, like the Midwest was known for bone Thugs.
There was like a well there was no bone Thugs.
There wasn't so.

Speaker 3 (20:44):
This is this is ninety two. Well that's what I
was gonna say.

Speaker 1 (20:46):
It's funny because I feel like people get it fucked
up because there was that like weird like rivalry between
Twist and Bone. But it was like Twist it was
before Bone.

Speaker 3 (20:56):
Way before Bone, and I mean to me it was
Twist and Common. Yeah, but they weren't. I don't think
they were competitive. Well, it was very different too.

Speaker 1 (21:05):
I mean they were both out of Chicago and Son.

Speaker 3 (21:08):
And right around the same time.

Speaker 1 (21:10):
Yeah, Resurrection is one of my favorite ones. Damn. So
you go from Twist and then then.

Speaker 3 (21:15):
It's the Licks, then it's a group called Madcap out
of Pasadena, and then the Licks, then will what was uh?
And then East Swift was was he was with me?
He was with me when Riza just showed up out
of Noah. We were in New York getting ready for.

Speaker 1 (21:32):
Something breakdown because you know, obviously we just went to
the Wu Tang's Final Chapter tour, which was so amazingly sequenced.
They did such a good job putting that show together
because I was like, damn, two hours, there's so much
records to do. They did such a good job. They
come the beginning of that show out your face off. Yeah,

(21:53):
you you hear this music. It's unlike anything else, right,
there's nothing. There's nothing that has ever sounded like thirty
six Chambers at that time.

Speaker 3 (22:05):
There's nothing that's like it.

Speaker 1 (22:09):
What was your initial like, did you have to be
sold on it or why.

Speaker 3 (22:13):
Didn't have to be sold on it. Trevor Williams, who
was he would end up doing college radio for US
found found it, gave it to me and I was like,
protect your neck, protect your neck. Yeah, and I'm like,
there's no hook. He was the ship's fire called Jason
Stayton at of whatever he was out of, like Flint, Michigan,

(22:35):
and it's lighting up, it's slighting up the phones like crazy,
and so I was like, all right, cool, I'm trying
to get in touch with Rizzy. He was Prince Raquem
at the time, and he's not picking up the phone.
There's no answering machine. And then I'm in New York
with my thirty first birthday. I think we were having
an album release party for Madcap and they just showed
up and I was introducing Eastwift was up there. I

(23:00):
was introducing everybody at RCAA.

Speaker 1 (23:03):
Crazy and then Wu Tang shows up. Do they do
they have the like what's the aura of like that
that that like late like I guess time period of
like do they feel like d own ship?

Speaker 3 (23:19):
There's like nine dudes and they all like like how
are they moving? Like there's nine And again I'm in
a guest office. All right, more than nine, by the way,
because it's not just like they're just the nine. There's
no no, there was just it was the group. Oh okay,
they think we play the record, and they performed the
record like in a in a guest office. Somebody comes
right to this day, Me and Riz a joke about
it all the time. Did you set me up? Or
is that somebody from the mail room that I've never

(23:40):
seen ever again? Some guy you know, in a mail room.
Aufid comespodging. He says, that's that ship punches his hand
like that's that ship stormed out. I've never seen this
guy ever again. That's crazy. And they came to the
Madcap Party. They took over the party and in New York,

(24:02):
and I was like, I gotta figure. I just gotta
do whatever it takes to get them. So when riz
Is said, you know, we want to do these solo records,
I went through something like this with new addition, when
Ralph wanted to leave everything else like that, and I
was like, this is perfect, Like I'll get the group.
The group is always bigger than the whole, right, and

(24:24):
even if you're Michael Jackson, Like when the Jacksons went
on tour after the Thriller album. That's that tour was
still bigger than a Michael Jackson thought, right, right, right,
So I was like, I'll take the group. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (24:38):
So it was already kind of planned, like, look, we're
going to drop the group and then everyone's gonna kind
of yeah.

Speaker 3 (24:44):
And I was lucky enough where I still got the best,
the Purple tape. I got the Purple tape. Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 1 (24:51):
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I always wondered this as a record executive for the
What was the thoughts running through your head the first
time you heard the torture skit on thirty six Chambers
hard on my life because that shit is wild and

(27:57):
I know it by heart.

Speaker 3 (27:58):
Yeah, And it was like one of those things.

Speaker 1 (28:00):
Were if I was in the car, I was with
my parents, I just couldn't play that ship loud because
I can't hear have them here here, you know, tell
motherfuckers by their dick off the third story building or whatever.

Speaker 3 (28:10):
So you laughed, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (28:12):
What I can only imagine what that studio session was like,
where these guys are just trying to one at each
other on some crazy You.

Speaker 3 (28:18):
Could even hear them laughing. And yeah, I wasn't in
the studio, no, but that's that's so you laughed.

Speaker 1 (28:26):
I just you know, you always hear like you know
back then, I'm sure like especially during that time period,
I feel like a lot more labels were like a
little a little more.

Speaker 3 (28:33):
Like cautious, a lot more cautious. Even radio is a
lot cautious. Like they were like we had to explain
some what the metha man recon meant because.

Speaker 1 (28:41):
They thought it was probably meth.

Speaker 3 (28:43):
Well not only they thought it was Meth. They sont,
I'm gonna stick it. They thought he was talking about it,
he was going to stick somebody up, and just like right.

Speaker 1 (28:51):
Crazy was for you. You know, you end up with
the Purple tape. I think early on a lot of
people will probably coming out of thirty six Chambers. You know,
Cream is the biggest record on that album, probably right,
if you had to pick one in terms of like

(29:11):
commercial success, et cetera. But Method Man to me comes
out of that album feeling like the star.

Speaker 3 (29:19):
He's the snoop of the East Coast.

Speaker 1 (29:21):
Right was what did you ever try to work out
onto cow?

Speaker 3 (29:28):
I didn't have the money, RCAA said no. So then
when we started talking about like who like Giz was
going to Geffen yep, Meth went to Deaf Jam and
Dirty was that electu. So I told HERZ I want right.
So we start negotiating and RCAA with twenty thousand dollars apart,

(29:48):
and I go to the business fast person. I'm like,
give them the twenty thousand dollars and she says, I'm
tired of your shit. You're supposed to be on my side,
and I take a chair. We're in the thirty sixth
floor conference room and I'm literally facing this way, and
but this way is all glass, right, and if we
went through the window, it would have killed somebody. And

(30:10):
I grabbed the chair like while, like I was a lefty,
I grabbed it with this and then I turned around
and I threw it through the glass door. And I
was just like.

Speaker 1 (30:20):
We're talking about twenty grand to get this deal done, yeah.

Speaker 3 (30:23):
And not twenty grands to pay for the album. We
were twenty grand apart, twenty grand apart to get the Yeah.
But the relationship that me and Rizza had, like we're
supposed to be negotiating against each other, but I was
like from day one, we were always with each other,
like we figure this out. We were always a lot aligned.
And then the cops came there, arrested me at the

(30:48):
RCAA office, at the r s A offices. I got
out immediately, like you know, they gave me a fine
note ball on the right, and then Rizz a call. Hees,
we're going to be with you, but let's torture them
a little bit, let them rate. So the Meth album,
I just found out my girlfriend was pregnant with my
first child, so I was like, I do need to

(31:09):
get this done, no matter what. And then Meth scanned
one hundred and twenty thousand first week, which was crazy,
and then here's the twenty thousand, and I was like, no,
I sent the crazy There were no emails at that time,
but I sent the crazy. No, like, well yeah, whatever,

(31:30):
was like, this is you know, we can have this
fuck you not the Meta Man record, but right, I go, now,
it's going to cost us, so, you know, and it
cost us a lot more than three or four times more,
right than the twenty just what we were actually offering
it at the beginning, and then beginning of the year
presidered let's go, can we get this? And I'm like,

(31:53):
I'll figure out a way how to get it.

Speaker 1 (31:55):
Did you have any like when you because I mean again,
nothing sounds like the Purple tape. The Purple Tape is
nothing like thirty six Chambers. Obviously there's the Purple Tape.

Speaker 3 (32:04):
Should have really been the second album, the thirty six Chambers.

Speaker 1 (32:08):
Right, it felt like, you know, just it's it's almost
like when we think of the Marvel movies. Killer Mike
said this about Run the Jewels and his last album
is this Logan project. But it really felt like like
a its own like branch of like the Wu.

Speaker 3 (32:27):
Tang MCU if you will.

Speaker 1 (32:29):
But when you when you like first sit with the album,
do you understand like, because this is a pretty complex project,
it's very very like it's just it's different than thirty
six Chambers, but it is, did you understand like, yo,
this is this might rival what we've already done with
the first album.

Speaker 3 (32:44):
Yeah. So so my thing was that f GM did
one hundred and twenty on meth. Meth is like a
sun to me. We have the same birthday everything, and.

Speaker 1 (32:54):
And the fucking Superstar if you ever watched that movie
the show.

Speaker 3 (32:57):
Yeah, yeah, so that well, that's my best friend who
did the movie.

Speaker 1 (33:01):
Great fucking movie.

Speaker 3 (33:01):
So when I said he was somebody who lived on
the first floor, that was him. Okay, when we moved
four six or five, Cooin had it on VHS, right,
so we all. I said, we got to beat one
hundred twenty, We got to beat a hundred, not against
Smith but against Steph jam And we did one hundred
and thirty.

Speaker 1 (33:17):
So you guys got it. That's crazy.

Speaker 3 (33:20):
Then I wrote another fuck you letter to r c A.

Speaker 1 (33:24):
When the shark the biton nwards uh skid is on there.
Do you try to like talk them out off the
ledge with that sort of thing or is it like,
did you guys feel that way?

Speaker 3 (33:37):
Like no, I mean at the end of the only
thing that we had, they wanted to name the album
Wu Gambinos mm hm, And we get a phone call
from the gambat if you get to use that name,
we want half.

Speaker 1 (33:52):
Yeah, I mean obviously they ended up like loosely using
Wu Gambinos a few.

Speaker 3 (33:56):
As as a song, right, but they were cool with
that if you're to name it so destroyer. They reached
out to my dad.

Speaker 1 (34:04):
Okay, your dad would be the guy to get that call.

Speaker 3 (34:08):
And my dad lived in Long Island, and he says,
I need to see you tonight. I'm saying, like, what
the fuck did I right, like, are you coming? He goes, no,
you come to see me now. I'm just like, what's
going on? What's going on? I said, Am I bringing Nicole? Alex?
Alex is now one old right? He goes no. So

(34:33):
I'm like, right, So I call somebody. I'm like, do
you know anything? Hell, Like, what's going on? He guys,
nobody told me to come to the house too. So
I'm just like there's more than what are you going
to the house? So take a ride to Long Island?

(35:00):
What's up? So and so called you're not honest? Named
Ray Kwan? Name the album game? Yeah? I think we
got named it, Like what's the problem because they want
half I'm like cool, said so and so, And I
was like, you gotta be kidding me, Like I got
pissed at my dad. I was like this you pulling

(35:21):
some ship like so you could eat off this?

Speaker 1 (35:26):
Which is this fair question?

Speaker 3 (35:27):
Right? And I'm like that's fucking crazy. So all right,
I'm just gonna name it something else.

Speaker 1 (35:40):
That's wild.

Speaker 3 (35:41):
You know.

Speaker 1 (35:41):
It's interesting because it's like back then, like you would
think when everything was like super active with Mafia that
that probably happened more than that.

Speaker 3 (35:54):
I don't know. I mean, it was like there was
no issue. They didn't like jam oh you got to
keep the name like not.

Speaker 1 (35:59):
Like like I know recently, like Burner named the album Gotti.
But he only did it because he cleared he called
the family got the green line, didn't want to do
it without there.

Speaker 3 (36:08):
But like I wonder what IRV did true r P.

Speaker 1 (36:14):
Yeah that's true because he I mean, I feel like
he didn't necessarily become like a super public face up
until I feel like the Gotti stuff was already kind
of put the rest.

Speaker 3 (36:26):
Yeah, So I mean I don't know, like we like
once we called it something else, like we didn't have.

Speaker 1 (36:31):
It didn't matter. Yeah, do you know how that like, like,
was there other name contenders besides only built for Cuban
links when you guys had to change it.

Speaker 3 (36:39):
No, I was more nervous that I had it t Ray,
and Ray was like the same expression as mees, you
got to be kidding me. I'm like, nah, I'm like,
did he already have the backup name? He came with
the name the next day, So I mean, I'm sure.

Speaker 1 (36:52):
It's crazy. Yeah, it's it's wild because I feel like,
you know, there's so many There's like thirty six Chambers
is like the put it on the on the Mantle,
It's like the the Precipice of Wu Tang And to me,
you know, it's one of the greatest albums of all time,
but man.

Speaker 3 (37:11):
Only built for Cuban leaks and liquid swords.

Speaker 1 (37:13):
They have a lot to say about which which are
those three albums the best? Because they are all incredible.
How hard was it to get Wu Tang forever done.
It was such a long wait.

Speaker 3 (37:27):
I remember we had to do all the other records first,
so but then I didn't realize that Leo was like saying,
all right, Beth, we'll give you X y Z, we'll
double it this that or whatever. But you know what,
I take my head off to Rizza and Divine Brother,
you know, for keeping their work.

Speaker 1 (37:46):
And like, was it always the because because back then
when you would sell a double album, it would count
as two. Yeah, was that always the plan?

Speaker 3 (37:52):
No, they asked for a lot of money, which I
got them, and then.

Speaker 1 (37:56):
Like, well, if we're gonna do this, I need to
to discord the And it was such a different album too.

Speaker 3 (38:03):
You know what, if they made it into just one album,
it would have been ridiculous. But this is where and
we talk about it all the time, and I'll take
some of the blame. We had this rage against the
machine talk. I mean, I got that there, and they
weren't getting paid a lot of money. And I'll tell

(38:28):
you a crazy story about this date a few seconds. Okay,
they weren't getting paid a lot of money. Rages the headliner,
rages the headliner, and they weren't getting paid but you
see that where it says Illinois. If we did the Midwest,

(38:49):
we would have sold twenty million albums. This it was
all like Nebraska, like the whitest of white. And even
when you went to the show this past Friday was
eighty five percent. Who would have been the biggest hip
hop album of all time? Guarantee?

Speaker 1 (39:06):
And they quit because they talk.

Speaker 3 (39:10):
So this day. Two things happened on this day. My
grandfather passed, not that year, but on August twenty nine.
And then I just get home from my honeymoon, right
and I get a phone call and they beat shit

(39:33):
out of one of my employees at the show, Wu
Tang okay, and he was he was wrong. What Wu
Tang wasn't actually wrong?

Speaker 1 (39:45):
So your employee fucked up.

Speaker 3 (39:47):
He went on the air on the radio and says,
come to my after party. I'm the original after party,
not Ray Kwan, somebody who's not in the group.

Speaker 1 (39:56):
Yeah, oh yeah, that's a problem.

Speaker 3 (39:59):
So that was the first call I got on that
day on that show.

Speaker 1 (40:05):
Crazy.

Speaker 3 (40:07):
Yeah, it's funny.

Speaker 1 (40:08):
I remember seeing like as a kid, you know, MTV
News and Kurt Loder talking about this tour and and
you know, Wu Tank forever it felt like such a
like a just huge event.

Speaker 3 (40:20):
It was like.

Speaker 1 (40:22):
You know it was it was such a big deal,
and then you know, Triumph ends up being the I mean,
it's a song they closed the tour out with.

Speaker 3 (40:28):
And how expensive was that video? That was the first
million dollars hip hop video of all time?

Speaker 1 (40:33):
It felt like it because at that time, that was
before the Victory video. That felt like the craziest video
I'd ever seen in my life when I was a kid,
I'm like, this is fucking it is seven minute song.

Speaker 3 (40:42):
Brett Rattner, who just kind of a rush out and
money Talks, directed the video million dollars. Well do you
do you were?

Speaker 1 (40:51):
I mean, I don't know if you remember the specifics
or care to share, but what the total budget was
for marketing alone for that album.

Speaker 3 (41:00):
To be close to him? I mean a million, not
the video is the video is only a million. Video
is a millillion. It's probably probably another million.

Speaker 1 (41:07):
Jaz that's crazy. Two million dors two million dollars.

Speaker 3 (41:11):
We scanned eight hundred thousand week one week one debut
number one around the world, like in ninety five percent
of the world, So eight hundred thousand times ten dollars
times twenty dollars because was a double album.

Speaker 1 (41:28):
So yeah, it's.

Speaker 3 (41:30):
Interesting twenty so twenty it was like sixteen million dollars
that we didn't.

Speaker 1 (41:34):
Yeah, I mean those double albums used to hit you. You'd
hit that Sam Goodie like oh damn yes, or you'd
wait for that shit to get used, do you know.

Speaker 3 (41:44):
I mean at the.

Speaker 1 (41:44):
Warehouse, you'd be all right, it's used. I could get it.
That's crazy. Triumph was that. I can just imagine, like
you guys probably did. You guys put too like much
of an effort into pushing that record to radio. It's
a it's there's like you said, no hook seven minutes long.

Speaker 3 (41:59):
No, we didn't do. The other thing we did was
college radio. Brow were you still a gabinet ninety seven?
You in New York were Virgin Mercury? Well we cand
about was college radio? Mike sure?

Speaker 1 (42:17):
Yeah, I mean who replaced your Kelly right right? She
did probably did a much better job, he said it. Yeah,
just Triumph is one of them. I would I would say,
you know, there's this fifty U fifty New York list
that has gone viral again two years old. But it's like,

(42:37):
how does inspected deck? Who's got arguably two of the
greatest verses of all time, Triumph and Cream. I also
think the above the Clouds verse on the Gangster album
is up. It's up in the rafters. How do you
not have fun? And then this is our face? Shit,
He's like, God, do you not have expected deck on it?
It's crazy, It's it's wild. I'm gonna talk a little

(42:59):
bit about you know, Loud as a whole has been
there's just so we talked a little bit about the licks.
You know, you guys. You also end up sign an
exhibit I Have forty Days, forty Nights out there, which
is his second album, At.

Speaker 3 (43:17):
The Speed of Life.

Speaker 1 (43:17):
Obviously the first project was incredible. Was did you have
a real because you put effort into trying to break
West Coast artists? Was that something that because you lived
here that you had like a like you felt like
you needed to do or was it.

Speaker 3 (43:34):
I mean no, I mean, I mean, I think Exhibit is.
I mean he is, he's a superstar and he's one
of the greats. I mean, what are we talking about?
I mean lyrically, he was incredible money.

Speaker 1 (43:47):
He's got three personal classics. To me, like, I think
his first three albums.

Speaker 3 (43:51):
So what do you I'll tell you my three what
are you three?

Speaker 1 (43:54):
I think it's at the speed of life, forty days,
forty nights, and oh you talk about you talked about
sing no no albums. I think, I mean, I know
everyone loves restless, but I think you go he's got
chamber music. Three Card, Oh my god, three Card Molly
was rest in Peace to spear Man. But that song
I told Exhibit I just ran into him at his

(44:17):
his his release show. He did a show at the Peppermint
Club and I was like, he's doing this show called
Rhyme Fest and it's like him dilated people's I said, buddy, please,
that is the boom back backpack wraps. Please do three
Card mom bring out ras please.

Speaker 3 (44:33):
But yeah, no, I mean what you see is what
you get.

Speaker 1 (44:36):
That video was game changing, right, it was.

Speaker 3 (44:39):
It was well all his videos, even even his first
single of all time, Paparazzi, well off the first album.
It was a game, I mean with an orchestra and
a cello player on the beach Ian.

Speaker 1 (44:48):
Yeah, it's crazy. Was there like like when Exhibit starts
to get you know, I think he's he gets put
on the top Dog album right, the Snoop album The Bitch,
which I felt like introduced him to such a a
new audience. Right, Snoop Dog at that time is the
biggest and one of the biggest rappers on the planet.

Speaker 3 (45:07):
Well, that record turned Snoop's career around too.

Speaker 1 (45:10):
Because the first Snoop No Limit album was a dud
and it didn't really have anything redeeming about it in
my opinion, But that album had some ship on it.
Bitch Please was like his first like real I think
hit after death Row. But then he then exhibit gets
kind of put into the crew, right, he goes out
on tour with the Up and Smoke Tour and he's

(45:31):
on two thousand and one and and all that. Like,
it feels like the creation of Restless was like an
important moment for you.

Speaker 3 (45:40):
Guys and just for his career. What was it?

Speaker 1 (45:42):
What was it like? Just kind of being behind the
scenes and watching that.

Speaker 3 (45:47):
He was like he was intense and he was like
I want off. I'm like, I'm not letting you off, because.

Speaker 1 (45:56):
At that time, I'm sure he had pressure to sign
with Interscope.

Speaker 3 (45:59):
Yeah, and I'm like, let's just do it, you know.
I don't know if he said if I said it,
but we both agreed, let's just do a JV between
after Math and Loud. Right then the scope can't distribute it,
but they could see fifty percent of the profit mm,
which is a fair Yeah, and dre still got paid whatever.

(46:19):
I don't remember what Drake got paid, but at the end,
and that's what it was. It was a Loud after
MAK was that.

Speaker 1 (46:28):
The only type of it was that the first time
you did a deal.

Speaker 3 (46:30):
Like that, the only time I've ever did a deal
like that, rack out.

Speaker 1 (46:33):
You know, it makes sense to let dray in on it. Yeah,
and I remember seeing him come out with the with
that that that tour was insane. Yeah, it's crazy too
because you also had uh thug mentality, which was crazy.
Bone solo album was that because Bone Thugs is coming

(46:56):
up the same time Loud's coming up. It's kind of like,
you know, similar trajectories at that time, like they're doing
the Grammys there. I mean at a certain point in
time in Bone Thugs is they were the ship, the
biggest group.

Speaker 3 (47:07):
Yeah world and they you know, they were on Relativity,
which was a Sony owned company, so they had the
Sony machine. So when I sold loud to Sony, it
was easier. I took over relativity and relativity relativity turned
into loud. Ah. So so anything that was not relativesitivity
we kept at loud.

Speaker 1 (47:26):
What A was what?

Speaker 3 (47:27):
Because there's a lot of stuff on relative. So if
I remember again, if I remember correctly, I think Ruthless
was a P and D deal through relativity. Okay, so
we had if there were still the Bone Thugs, but
all the solo members, you know, we had Three six

(47:48):
was putting out mixtapes, yes, And I went master P
was blowing up and I said, I understand what he's doing.
I just want to understand how he's doing it, Like
how is he putting out these records so quick? And
I did this tour. I went on a tour bus
by myself, like with when I'm taking about myself, no artists,

(48:09):
just a few other street team guys and I and
we only did the South and everybody had said the
next one to come out of the South. There is
this group called three six Mafia. Now I'm already and
I'm like, what label. They said, It's weird that it's relativity,
but only through mixtapes, and they have a special deal
with Selector Hits, which was a one stop yeah yeah

(48:33):
in Memphis. So me and Tommy started talking quietly about
me leaving BMG to go to RCA. I really wanted
to be at Enniscope, Okay, But at the end of
the day, when Thomy says, are we going to do this?

(48:56):
I did it. It was a three six Mafia.

Speaker 1 (48:59):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (49:00):
I didn't do it for no other reason. And Timer said,
do you want to be a Columbia epic? I said, no,
I want this label that you have club Relativity, And
he's looking at you, guys, that's actually a brilliant idea.
You'll be the third major inside the Sony system.

Speaker 1 (49:13):
Wow, that's crazy. Three six man yeah, other mixed. I
always as a fan, I was always confused because they'd
be like the mixtape Ship.

Speaker 3 (49:22):
And they'd be like Triple six month, Fiat three six miles,
the cub up Thugs. Yeah, so that's fucking crazy.

Speaker 1 (49:31):
Man. Hey, you gotta stop the interview. You want to
give a shout out.

Speaker 3 (49:33):
Man. The only thing we smoke ladies and gentlemen is
slap Woods.

Speaker 1 (49:37):
That's right. Make sure you follow them at slap Woods.
And you know the reason why we smoked flap Woods.
It's literally because they slap you can't smoke a slapoos.
What the fuck are you doing?

Speaker 3 (49:48):
Hey, don't forget to go to bootleg cav dot com.

Speaker 1 (49:50):
You know, we had to celebrate the two year anniversary
of the most viral interview of all time.

Speaker 3 (49:54):
Throw the shirt up so you could see it. I
turned it down.

Speaker 1 (49:56):
Shout out to that boy, Big Boogie, a big college
in Jacksonville. And we just threw these on sale half
off for the five hundred episode t Bootleg cab dot com.
Go get you a shirt. Let's get back to the interview.
What when you sold? Because how much did you sell?

Speaker 3 (50:11):
All allowed? I sold seventy.

Speaker 1 (50:14):
Percent and that's seventy percent of the master seventy percent
of everything at the time.

Speaker 3 (50:18):
Yeah, and I kept thirty percent, so I owned still
thirty percent. So two thousand going into two thousand and one.
At the end of two thousand, we had a one
hundred and eighty six million dollars fourth quarter. We had
a three to six month Favorite record. We had a

(50:39):
Project Pet record, we had the MP record, we had
the Restless record, we had a Wu Tang record, we
had a Prodigy solo record. Was it the w.

Speaker 1 (50:47):
Two doesn't win. The W might have been n iron flag,
no iron flag. The W was first. I think that
was the W. Maybe maybe I'm not Damn Jack Pat
had fucking Chicken, Don't don't Save. Yeah, I mean that's crazy.

Speaker 3 (51:07):
M P had Annie that preys like.

Speaker 1 (51:10):
You know, it's it's it's at what point in time
is is Warriors the first album you work with m
op on?

Speaker 3 (51:18):
Is that the record? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (51:20):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, fucking classic album.

Speaker 3 (51:23):
I can't hear.

Speaker 1 (51:24):
I love the remix obviously, Remy mas I just the
original was funk Flex.

Speaker 3 (51:29):
That's not even that's not even the original. But I'm
saying like, look, if you bought the album, here flex.

Speaker 1 (51:35):
Get ready to go down big Flex SI for Annie
up in the fucking background. Man, so good. Those guys
were like, you know, when I was a kid, I
bought a double XL around the time that album dropped,
and I remember they were talking about how they used
to like shoot people off the top of their project buildings,
and I remember the first time in my life I.

Speaker 3 (51:54):
Was like, oh, these guys are like, no, I believe
these guys. And they had a woman but the name
of Fox, who is their bodyguard? Yes? She she she
just passed, but she was to this day one of
my favorite people of all time.

Speaker 1 (52:10):
I saw Fox beat the ship out of a sound
man at scott there's a venue of Scottsdale in Arizona.
MP had a show. The sound man kept fucking with
their sound. She fucked this dude up in the middle
of their set. They killed the music and and Mop
jumps into the crowd and does any a cappella at

(52:32):
the top of their fucking lungs in the crowd, and
then I don't know what happens after that, but it
was fucking to see this giant lady beat the ship
out of this little white sound dude who kept it
was amazing. And she's also you know, she's on four
alarm blaze, you know, talking that ship with jay Z.
Shout out to rest in peace to Fox. I didn't
know you passed away. YEA, that's crazy. MP. Were they

(52:53):
like cool to deal with because you're dealing with some
like serious Brownsville gentleman like at that point.

Speaker 2 (52:59):
I mean, there was definitely, like I've always repeated, all
the artists with respect, like I think most of them
knew what my background was, right, but I wasn't trying to.

Speaker 3 (53:15):
Flex or anything like that, Like I never had a
I'm sure they've got they've gotten upset with me, not them,
you know all you know, but I mean, it happens.
But I won't fight over money. I'll fight over principal.
And if you're not working hard, it's like I can't
want this more than you.

Speaker 1 (53:33):
Or if you go on the radio and promote after party,
well he was like that that was what was was
like MLP though for you? Was that like because you
would work with so many artists and I feel like
I don't feel like they don't get enough flowers.

Speaker 3 (53:49):
That's a classic. That's definitely a classic. I mean, but
at the end of the day, it's like every one
of them, like yeah, who I mean, who held their own?
Everywhere mob held their own? Joe and punt Hell, It's
like I just was attracted to, you know, when me

(54:09):
and Joe spoke for the first time, we spoke on
a Thursday, and I remember this like it was an
hour ago. I was in Chicago with Quincy Jones and
Oprah winfree Crazy and I get this call. He goes,
FATCHO wants to talk to you? He was, I got
this artist boom boom, boom boom. I said, I'm in
Chicago and I'll be back in New York on Tuesdays.

(54:31):
Let's meet. So from Thursday to Tuesday, I must have
gotten eight calls don't do business with Joe. He's this,
he's that, everything. And Joe comes in on Tuesday and
I tell him this is what I said. I said,
but there's something about even though we're meeting now first

(54:53):
time face to face, I'm going to tell you two stories. Joe.
I was with Chris he let him rest in peace,
and Chrit he was signed to Chris and we were
on our way to play basketball, but he had to
stop off give something to Joe, and Joe cracked a
joke like and he just made me laugh. I'm in
the car, we haven't even met. I'm just laughing. I said,

(55:17):
whatever the joke was, just you know, you had me
on the floor in the car and had he handled
yourself on the phone. The fuck what everybody says.

Speaker 1 (55:27):
MM, because I mean, you always hear some crazy stories
about back then, fat Joe, yeah, sos and all kind
of crazy shit.

Speaker 3 (55:35):
So then he said, let's meet Thursday. I'm going back
to LA. This was my wife and kids. Yeah, lived
in LA and my head of A and R guy
my name of Maddie c who discovered Biggie actually Wow,
was in the office and he never showed up to
be in the office. I'm like, what are you doing here,

(55:57):
especially at ten thirty in the morning. He goes, don't
you haven't pun? And I'm like, you're here for this meeting.
He says yeah. So the second they walked in, I said,
who's your lawyer? They said Tim Al Tim represented whom
I called Tim, and his office was maybe five blocks
I said, Tim, get it here as soon as possible.
We're doing a deal. They said, you haven't heard any music.

(56:17):
I said, Maddi's here. You guys can make the music.
If Maddie s here, that means he's a superstar. They
looked at me like I was fucking crazy. We shook hands.
Tim came and said, this is what I could afford.
Boom your job to make the records now.

Speaker 1 (56:33):
So you signed Pun without hearing anything. Yeah, just based
off of your guy, Maddie's he's here.

Speaker 3 (56:40):
I know that this is he and I had a
trust in Joe, Like to this day, me and Joe
are still brothers. And everything that he's going through right
now with all the bullshit. I like technology it, yeah.

Speaker 1 (56:51):
I mean, but it's like it's it's it's I went
on that dude's Instagram page and I realized, Yo, that
guy's been trying to troll Joe for fucking the last
two years straight because he's probably a fucking nobody, loser
who's just trying to stir up ship.

Speaker 3 (57:05):
And it's just like, it's fucking crazy, man, And it's
just like it's wild. Joe's one of the best dads
I know, and it's just like everything that he's gone
through in the past two months, losing a dad, losing
his mom, you know, within a two months radius. I mean,
it's just like.

Speaker 1 (57:20):
I love the podcast man. I shot him and I
was like, Yo, you got you. And I don't know
way out into this sooner.

Speaker 3 (57:26):
Like dis Lawyer should be this bar that. That's how
I honestly feel.

Speaker 1 (57:29):
I do feel like there should be some sort of
there should be a gratifications when you're like Tony Busby
or you're one of these guys who are like ambulance
chasers and you're just gonna take something because you hope
to get a settlement, check out of it, because.

Speaker 3 (57:40):
That's really all it is.

Speaker 1 (57:41):
Right, you'll take it like a lot of these lawyers
will take a case knowing it's bullshit, but they're all
hopefully they settle. Fuck that. That's crazy, man, that's crazy.
So what do you remember the first song you heard
from pun then if you didn't sign him?

Speaker 3 (57:55):
Here in the music the first song I ever heard
Mojo Nick Sea? Who was I became co head of
promotion with my brother. He goes, if you heard this,
you ain't a killer record? And I'm like nah. He goes,
he goes, where are I said, I'm in. I was
in a meeting somewhere. He goes, you got to hear
this fucking record you go with dropping it as a

(58:17):
white label. I'm like when he was like, now, that's crazy, man,
that is wild.

Speaker 1 (58:25):
What about you? So you know Mob Deep, who's one
of my favorite groups ever. They had a juvenile hell
album before they were with Loud right yep, And so
their kids during that album like actual like kids. What
was that the album that put them on the map
for you to be like, yo, what.

Speaker 3 (58:46):
What is now? I mean? I know? I mean Hid
from the Back was a was a cool record. I
just got too many calls and WU now was blowing
up and I need to follow up with something right, right,
So the pressure is on, right. I used to don't
want to be like a one hit one though, right.
So Prodigy was sick and have comes and he comes

(59:11):
with the Mob crew and I just knew some again.
I heard one song I think it was called Patty Shop.
I was like, wow, this is this is really cool.
And I got a phone call from a woman who
worked with distribution who was like, like managing him. Then

(59:33):
I had an assistant by the name of Scott Free
who had just started. He goes, these guys are incredible.
Then there was a big DJ in New York called
Stretcher Armstrong stretched Man Right, so Maddie wasn't working for
us yet, and then I meet Maddie. He goes, these
guys are incredible and like we did the deal. That album,

(59:54):
to me, Wu Tang was thirty six Chambers. That album
was the start of the tree and then you get
the infamity, but then we get with the infamous, and
to me, that's the most important album. I'm not thinking
the best album for your label. It gave us real
credibility and it gave.

Speaker 1 (01:00:14):
Us Yeah, because look we put we put two on
the board at that point.

Speaker 3 (01:00:18):
Yeah, within two years, do you like?

Speaker 1 (01:00:22):
I can only imagine because that album is such a
and we.

Speaker 3 (01:00:25):
Had a Flex album that did everybody was like, what
the fuck you're doing?

Speaker 1 (01:00:29):
Yeah the first Yeah, I still have that. I actually
think I have that on vinyl shot the Flex Crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:00:37):
I forgot that was, But did you guys have the
Tunnel album?

Speaker 1 (01:00:45):
The Infamous is an album that is like, you know,
there's such a vulnerability about parts of the album. There's
so there. It's just it's just such a dynamic.

Speaker 3 (01:00:55):
But it's making a second life like chook Ones. The
beat was voted the best hip hop beat of all time, right,
and then an I for an Eye for Me is
one of my favorite records of all time.

Speaker 1 (01:01:10):
Yes, I think dude, give up the goods?

Speaker 3 (01:01:12):
Yeah, one understand. But I remember, like I said, I
was a basketball junkie, right, so I'd be in the city.
But on Sundays there was this one game in Long
Island where I grew up with and even though I'm
in my thirties now, yeah, everybody would still go to
this park. So I'd wake up at seven thirty in
the morning, get in a car, go to the park

(01:01:32):
and play the album and I would for forty five minutes.
I would keep it on repeat an I for an eye.
Oh yeah, yeah, I mean it's one of the and
it was like fighting music for me, like I would
get to that fucking park of like ready, yeah, no,
for sure. It's crazy. Like do you guys, do you
recall when you heard Shook.

Speaker 5 (01:01:49):
Ones for the first time? The original or yeah, I
mean or part two, part two? Yeah, I'll tell you
exactly where I heard it. I just found out my
girlfriend was pregnant. Okay, found out around one o'clock. Comes
to the office with a bunch of cookies. Okay, she

(01:02:10):
tells me she's pregnant. Big deal.

Speaker 3 (01:02:14):
Two thirty Maddie and free Walking is we got to
play something. What the fuck is it? Man? And I'm
like wow. And then two days later we had to
go down to Florida for how can I be That?

Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
Which was another conference?

Speaker 3 (01:02:32):
It was it was a conference and I guess Maddie
already played the record for Stretch and Barbido.

Speaker 1 (01:02:42):
They probably loved it.

Speaker 3 (01:02:43):
And there was a basketball game at you know, one
of the parks, pick up.

Speaker 4 (01:02:49):
And I'm good.

Speaker 3 (01:02:51):
You gotta fucking smash on and it's not to bubble
like just you know in New York boat go way
for Christmas break and when we come back, the thing
is through the roof.

Speaker 1 (01:03:05):
Like it's crazy too, because I mean, like you said,
the Second Life, I think there was a generation that
found that song through the eight Mile movie, which is rang.

Speaker 3 (01:03:18):
Yeah, but no, but now there's another there's like a
it's just like my youngest son now even though he's
twenty four, it's like it just keeps getting new legs.

Speaker 1 (01:03:25):
Yeah, it's crazy, Like is it platinum at this point?

Speaker 3 (01:03:28):
It's gotta be, oh yeah, definitely platum.

Speaker 1 (01:03:30):
It's funny because you'll see certain songs that you would
assume were platinum already. Sometimes you'll see an ri like,
oh wait, that's barely like that's gold, Like damn, it
feels like that should be fucking diamond.

Speaker 3 (01:03:40):
I think this album has more streams than thirty six Chambers.
That might make sense because the streaming era. How do
we you could look it up, if we could go
to if we go to Spotify and see what my
deep monthly listeners on what who Things Monthly listen as a.

Speaker 1 (01:04:03):
Group just go mob Deep, go whute. That's interesting. Five
point four million from mob Deep, So it's close. It's close.
That's fucking Do me a favorite.

Speaker 3 (01:04:21):
What's that kind of.

Speaker 1 (01:04:23):
Yeah, I'm gonna say fourteen.

Speaker 3 (01:04:29):
That's the that.

Speaker 1 (01:04:35):
He doesn't put out a record in fucking I mean,
he's had a couple of new singles, but but they
but they haven't.

Speaker 3 (01:04:40):
They're not big streaming hits. They've been doing it a radio.

Speaker 1 (01:04:42):
But that ship's fucked.

Speaker 3 (01:04:46):
You know, I have nineteen billion streams with him, and
I haven't.

Speaker 1 (01:04:51):
Seen I want to get I haven't seen it get
to the sea.

Speaker 3 (01:04:54):
I haven't seen it. I haven't seen a penny from
it because there was no streaming when I sold. We
got it. You're gonna get to the src.

Speaker 1 (01:05:01):
Shit, Hey, we gotta wrap up this interview another one
presented by hard Dan. Baby, you already know what it is.
Shout out to Hardeen for presenting another episode of the
Bootleg podcast. Don't forget when you're in Vegas. You're getting
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(01:05:21):
then they break down all what all the terps mean?
It's incredible. Go to Harden Underscore Las Vegas, shoot them
a follow and when you're in Las Vegas and make
sure you shoot them a visit. But I gotta ask you.
Mob Deep gets into it with Tupac. Now I think.

Speaker 3 (01:05:38):
I told you the story, though didn't but we didn't
do it on camera.

Speaker 1 (01:05:41):
Okay, this is a podcast, all right, so obviously drop
a gem on him comes out.

Speaker 3 (01:05:49):
But this even before I drop a gem come from Well, yeah,
I want to know, Like, wait, can it break down?

Speaker 1 (01:05:53):
Because you're you have a perspective, You're living in LA
You're cool with Tupac. There's the East coast, West coast
shit happening.

Speaker 3 (01:05:59):
Mob Deep gets involved. So remember Tony Rich, Yes, I
told you the story, so I'm just claiming again. So
Tony Rich is performing at the House of Blues on
wherever the Pendry Hotel is now last and I got
rendered and I get a smack. We got bald heads
even though, like, well love right, So I don't know

(01:06:19):
and I see and it's Pac and I don't know
if it's a love slap or if it's a real smack.
Be which the ship still burns, no matter, right, So
I look at him. He looks at me. He goes,
you don't say hello to an end, and I'm like, man,
I don't know where I stand with you. He was
You're my brother for life. What are you talking about?
You know what I'm talking about. You talk about the

(01:06:40):
two little Guys. I'm like, man, I love them. That's
my favorite record in the world, not Drop a Gem.
This is just shook Ones and you know whatever, I go,
I'm just trying to be relevant. He goes. I'm like,
he was the biggest pop star in the world at
the time, so there was beef, but there was really
no beef. It wasn't anything serious. It was more some.

(01:07:03):
And he did the same thing with Exhibit both West
Coast and he loved Paparazzi. I didn't know him, and
Exhibit had a thing. Yeah, he he answered. He goes,
I forget which record, he goes, and for the new guy.
Exhibit like, when are you think it's about Paparazzi. It's
the thing, you know whatever, No, he goes, it's about
the money.

Speaker 1 (01:07:22):
That's interesting. Yeah, it's it's it's crazy because you think
about like, yeah, drop a jam on The Most Crazy Man.

Speaker 3 (01:07:29):
That's one of my favorite like that album too. When
he when he got shot, I found out Sunday morning. Well,
pe and Have I had a promotion my head of
We had a dinner at my house in New York,
and I said I would like us to the record's exploding,

(01:07:54):
and then Prodigy said, don't go any further for the record.

Speaker 1 (01:08:00):
They wanted to pull it. We did, like pull it
from like just being on MTV, BTV.

Speaker 3 (01:08:08):
We didn't we didn't shoot a video yet, but we
pulled it from radio.

Speaker 1 (01:08:12):
That's crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:08:14):
So because that was that ninety seven I think at
the time I was playing the record seventy times a week.
The record was maybe.

Speaker 1 (01:08:19):
Because that record was made in regards to his shooting
in New York.

Speaker 3 (01:08:23):
Yeah, so when he got shot.

Speaker 1 (01:08:24):
In Vegas, they were like, yeo, we got to pull
the record. I mean, it's a good call by them.
That's that's crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:08:30):
No, there was respect. I mean, like you can't punk Prodigy.

Speaker 1 (01:08:35):
Well, I have and Park had is such a great
relationship with meth Man, Like meth Man's on fucking all
eyes on me, like, yeah, it's wild, dude. Do you
where do you put uh? Because I think Keep It
Thorough is also one of the greatest feats of all time.

Speaker 3 (01:08:50):
So now didn't we speak about it again the other night?
Probably the Kendrick record. Yeah, I mean to me, it's
the same beat. I think it has the same sample
in it for sure.

Speaker 1 (01:09:00):
Yeah, it's such a fucking oh my goodness, rest in
peace of Prodigy man. Just one of the all time greats.

Speaker 3 (01:09:06):
And you know, Kendrick has said that if it wasn't
a Prodigy, he really wouldn't be rapping.

Speaker 1 (01:09:11):
That makes sense because you hear it back in the day.
Would you guys get mad because there are albums that
didn't get I used to look at the source like
a bible, and the fact that some of these albums
that came, I mean, I don't think did you guys
ever have a five mic album?

Speaker 3 (01:09:28):
I was pissed on you. Thirty six Shams, Cuban Leaks, Infamous,
and we go on and on. But like I was
just Dave Mays was one of my I still love
Dave that he was one of my best friends. And
I was like, I'm like, Dave, what the fuck you
got four and a half? Four and a half, Oh
my god, they got a lot of shit wrong over there. Yeah,

(01:09:49):
I mean it's safe to say so. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:09:53):
So I want to kind of get to you have
another era of your career because SRC is its own monster.
David Banner a con. We go on and on and on.
There's so much it's like a I would say, you
kind of came onto the scene with SRC with a
different approach with it.

Speaker 3 (01:10:11):
But no, it wasn't. It was supposed to be a
loud point two point h it's so loud, right, so loud,
and I had to work so Sony wanted me to
become chairman okay of Columbia. It just didn't work out.
But I've left. I couldn't work for them, right. So
the original SRC was Stephen Rifkin Company, which was the

(01:10:32):
marketing company, right. We were the independent promotion company.

Speaker 1 (01:10:36):
That that that that Hadvando lips now and I mean
what I mean what we worked pretty much from those years.

Speaker 3 (01:10:44):
Let's say, from the time you started at Cavan and
when did you go to Mercury. Everybody, this is Brian Sampton,
the media, so ninety would you say we worked probably
eighty percent of ball hip hop records.

Speaker 1 (01:10:57):
That's crazy. So the original SRC was that Stephen Rifting Company.

Speaker 3 (01:11:01):
So when I couldn't bring the Loud name, I said,
you know what, I'm gonna call it SRC, but it's
not gonna be Stephen Rifking Company. It's gonna be Street
Records Corporation. So I signed this art s out of Orlando,
Florida by Naven Granddaddy's South, and he had a record
called fuck the Law I'm on and I signed him
to Loud. Okay, and we're in Orlando when we're in

(01:11:23):
this fucking backwards club, like and the DJ plays this
fucking record and I never saw it like five hundred
the club only maybe help a hundred people. Everybody knew
the fucking word to the t. And I'm like, all right,
I'm signing this guy, but how the funk am I

(01:11:44):
going to convince the new company university behind the law.
So bannacoms and like a pan. But the great thing
is little Flip was less Our. I signed to Loud.

Speaker 1 (01:12:02):
Interesting, that was the last Loud Records artist that I signed,
So the underground legends Loud, right, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:12:11):
So I was like, this is meant to be whips
on the record. I fly Banner and Wendy Day out
to l a. I wouldn't let him leave.

Speaker 1 (01:12:23):
Yeah, and he had such an independent thing going himself,
like David Banner was such an incredible producer too, right.

Speaker 3 (01:12:30):
And then when I hear a com it's like the
beginning of the year, literally the beginning year. And it's
the first meeting at Universal. I said, I just found
the biggest orders in my career. And everybody left in
my face like, oh, bigger than Wu Tang. And I
have a temper those days. I had a temper. Yeah,
it's like, fuck you motherfuckers. You won't see me for

(01:12:51):
a year. And I don't know if you know Gobby.

Speaker 1 (01:12:55):
I know that.

Speaker 3 (01:12:55):
Oh yeah, with French and everything. Ye, he's lost a
lot of weight, God bless him. Yes, so God's wife
was pregnant. I said, God, you do the East coast,
I'll do the West coast. Take a Kon. I'll take
his brother who looks just like him. And there was
no video, so you were running around with boot. I

(01:13:19):
had Boot.

Speaker 1 (01:13:21):
So you guys were doubling up on the promo. This
before YouTube, before social media, before any So you're you
have Akon's brother on the West coast all these stations.

Speaker 3 (01:13:32):
No, but it's me and Boo and and Gotta be
an Akon Like that's fucking insane, and the record broke.
I don't know, I don't even remember the station in
fucking two markets, Utah, which is the white of White
in Albuquerque, New Mexico, locked Up, locked Up, styles P

(01:13:56):
and we started bringing it, you know, and they were
such a research company they didn't understand what the fuck
we were doing. So now comes I want to say,
it's Father's Day, who you're talking about? I'm still talking
about the say Conrada locked Up. So we still haven't

(01:14:17):
got in New York, but we're getting marked by market
and the record is going up each week. And it
was the lowest selling album I've ever had in my
life first week. First week sales were low first week,
and we're going up thirty forty percent every week.

Speaker 1 (01:14:37):
So it's like truly like you're seeing the correlation between
radio and then the sales.

Speaker 3 (01:14:42):
And the sales. So Sunday, Father's Day, get out a show.
I get a phone call, what the fuck did you do?
In Brooklyn? Like what are you talking about? Because I
just left King plasm Mall. Every car is playing this
fucking record. I'm like, I didn't do anything. The only

(01:15:07):
thing I did was I kept New York out of it.
I just covered Connecticut, I covered the Boston, I covered
Philly and it just would leak in.

Speaker 1 (01:15:20):
Tetrick. It was a dope album too.

Speaker 3 (01:15:21):
Hebro calls Monday on my way to New York, says
the number one phone so and research was the new
word for me, right, And I'm like, well, what's the research?
He goes quite back and a half hour I said him,

(01:15:42):
I have a flight. I don't know if like I
don't know if I could pick up a right. And
I called him literally right before he goes your top
three call out m hm. And I was like, he's
just in brand new in New York. He just came
to New York maybe like a month or two right
before that. And then they also have lean back. So

(01:16:09):
I the second I land, I'm calling Manty Litman, who's
the president of Republic. Before I could even call him,
his brother calls me. He goes, how are you doing this?
I'm like, I go, this is why you brought me in.
There was no secret sauce like right, and like I

(01:16:30):
sent an email like saying, hey, this is what's going
on with these records? They said no fucking way, and
I'm like, and when they realized that it was top three,
call out lean Back.

Speaker 1 (01:16:41):
Was the number one song. I mean it was insane, dude,
the lean Back moment.

Speaker 3 (01:16:46):
That whole fucking summer man between Locked Up, Exploding and
lean Back, I don't know if.

Speaker 1 (01:16:53):
I will love it. I mean, yeah, I mean those
are I mean, I don't. I don't think people understand
like the gravity of how big lean Back was during
that summer. I mean it was.

Speaker 3 (01:17:02):
It was so fucking big. We couldn't even come with
another record.

Speaker 1 (01:17:06):
I remember because there were some other joints on that album.

Speaker 3 (01:17:08):
Yeah, there was a record. The second single, there was.

Speaker 1 (01:17:10):
Some shit like that was a that was a solid
project and it was funny because like.

Speaker 3 (01:17:14):
Oh and again I didn't hear any music on that either.
Joe said, hey, I want to do a Terros Squad
album and the first album, what's the first album online?
The first album was on Atlantic, which was a dud.

Speaker 1 (01:17:24):
Yeah it was a dud. Yes, and pun was on
that right. Yes, that's fucking crazy. So it's like you
have locked like a. Kon was such an unconventional voice
and an unconventional artist, obviously with his background and shit, like,
I mean, that's that's that. I mean, obviously you hear
it and you're like, this is different, but at the
time it's like it's kind of hip hop but it's not.

(01:17:48):
And then after that it's just to pop. It's over right.

Speaker 3 (01:17:53):
Yeah, but we became a pop label. Yes, from that,
I signed this girl Chantelle g had two massive top
ten pop record wow ell Fiona had two.

Speaker 1 (01:18:02):
Yeah, yeah, that's crazy. So Akon ends up also becoming
his own executive.

Speaker 3 (01:18:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:18:12):
You know, you think about t Pain Lady Guy, it's
it's it's it's kind of crazy, like damn the Lane
back and locked up in the same summer. I remember
when Green Lantern had a ghetto remix for the Acon
Ghetto record. I think he put Tupac.

Speaker 3 (01:18:27):
That fucking killed me that I thought I was gonna
win a fucking Grammy on that record. That record, to
me is still one of my favorite, one of my
favorite songs ever. Right, and they put this fucking remix together.
Whatever I'm like was on it, Tupac and Biggie, and
I was like, what the fuck, Like you were not
a fan of it? No, because it's like like and

(01:18:49):
the and the record was dead right now, where are
a million albums? Now? Okay, album's platinum albums platinum? Where at?
I mean, I thought this record was gonna take us
to three right, and we still had the Money record,
which was lonely yep. And now that this record was dead,
I think there goes the perfect I think Universe is

(01:19:13):
going to pull the plug, like we went to a million,
let's not spend any more money. So I think it
was Shaggy am I saying yes, probably right, here's a record.
Thought it was me but breaks out Hawaii. No, these
are facts. I fly to Hawaii, did the station cook

(01:19:37):
was a k I w I? Yeah, k I k
I And they put the record on have five phones lonely?

Speaker 1 (01:19:48):
Oh yeah, lonely. That sample is right.

Speaker 3 (01:19:50):
So I land back in l A and Avery Manci's
brother says, what the fuck were you just in a while.
It's like no, why, He goes, well, it's really I was,
you know, And it was like the record's exploding. They said,
somebody from SRC came out there, and I was like,
I have Avery, I have no idea what the fuck
you're talking about. So I'm living in Miami now with

(01:20:18):
my wife and kids. There's the station in Miami called
Power ninety six. Yeah yeah, well yeah, so at that
time it was Tony the Tiger, who I guess was
the program director.

Speaker 1 (01:20:28):
Yeah still there, station's still there.

Speaker 3 (01:20:30):
Yeah yeah. So I land from LA to Miami and
I go straight to see Tony the Tiger said, if
you like this record and play this record right now,
I'll take it to this restaurant called Maderanos, which was
like this spot, but this Italian spot. It was really
puts the record on top five phones again. Monday comes

(01:20:54):
request retail like now hitting three four million, like the
ship like, so I'm living. I'm splitting my time between
New York, Floria and La.

Speaker 1 (01:21:05):
Crazy and.

Speaker 3 (01:21:08):
Montecle was when he come to New York tonight. He
goes me and Avery needs to talk to you, and
I'm like, what's the matter. He goes, we need to
know your secret, sauce. And I'm like, it's called hitting
the streets once you started.

Speaker 1 (01:21:25):
Yeah, Crazy, you're at that point in time in your
career and you're not above I'm gonna fly to fucking
Hawaii and hand this record to a radio station, so.

Speaker 3 (01:21:38):
You know, and I came clean. I said, yeah, I
went to Hawaii. I was like, you guys weren't going
to spend any more money, and I promised Akon that
we would come with this record.

Speaker 1 (01:21:47):
It's so crazy, man. It's interesting too because you fast
forward to today. I wonder we were talking a little
bit about the streams earlier. Do you ever have fomo
that you might have.

Speaker 3 (01:21:59):
Sold to early with with s r C with the
I don't want to get into it, but I should
never I should never have sold s r C. I
would probably still be there, mm hmm, and the company
would be worth notth of a billion dollars right what?
At what what point in time? Let's say they wanted

(01:22:21):
to fire somebody in my staff and I said, if
you fire him, that means you want to cut my
legs off. So just buy me out now. And I
don't know if anybody else would have done that, but
I should have said, you know what, so and so

(01:22:41):
they want to get rid of you. You still have this,
and but I still got to support a family. But
I'm so loyal to my to my people.

Speaker 1 (01:22:50):
And you you made it work with your people. So
it's like here, you're not going to take away my this,
my sauce, my people, your people, your stand is a
part of your sauce.

Speaker 3 (01:22:57):
Like you said, Hey real.

Speaker 1 (01:22:59):
Quick, want to tell you about our sponsors at odds Socks.
That's our day one family. Make sure you follow them
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(01:23:20):
dot com. Use that promo code bootleg right now or
bootleg keV. I forget which one it is. I think
it's both. I think both work. Anyway, let's get back
to the interview. Can you break down the economics back
then of an album sale?

Speaker 3 (01:23:34):
Album sell, you would get ten dollars.

Speaker 1 (01:23:36):
Do you get ten bucks if you're the label? Yeah,
so the retailer probably gets whatever's on top of the
ten dollars.

Speaker 3 (01:23:42):
They would charge how much?

Speaker 1 (01:23:43):
So yeah, whatever it is, right, but whatever it is,
so the label would take ten bucks and then that
would get broken down.

Speaker 3 (01:23:49):
Ye artists manufacturing stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:23:52):
Like that, right right right right?

Speaker 3 (01:23:53):
Damn today it's so that was the crazy thing about
the record. It So before the CD came, you would
sell that album for four dollars. CD coms yourself to
ten dollars. You're still spending the same amount of money
on marketing, you're still spending the same amount of money
on radio, but.

Speaker 1 (01:24:09):
It goes up your profitabilities.

Speaker 3 (01:24:10):
All of a sudden, there's six extra fucking dollars, which
changes everything. So on a million, right on a million records,
I'm just saying, it's a do easy math right on
a platinum record. Before there was a CD. Four million
dollars off of.

Speaker 1 (01:24:23):
A vinyl or a tape, Yeah, okay, because those cost
it more to make.

Speaker 3 (01:24:27):
Us on the On the CD, you do a million,
that's ten million dollars. All of a sudd there's an
extra six million dollars. So that that's when everybody do
the deals change with that? Also, now the deals start
changing and all and all the motherfuckers care about if
you take uh Teddy Riley's not the Back the Blackstreet, right,

(01:24:51):
So no diggity right.

Speaker 1 (01:24:54):
Great album by the way, that whole album, but.

Speaker 3 (01:24:56):
That one single really turned it into I think whatever
it did a million two million records so everybody only
gave a fuck about was that one hit. Wonder, Let's
get some Teddy Riley records, Let's get some rizz of
records for ll Come, Let's get some FOREL records. And
the executives, the A and R executives, got fucking lazy
because they started getting so fucking rich because of the bonuses,

(01:25:19):
because all of a sudden, you do a million records,
if you do two million, twenty million dollars, So they
were chasing.

Speaker 1 (01:25:25):
I mean that kind of explains a lot because back
then you would always see if there was a hot producer.

Speaker 3 (01:25:32):
And the next you know, the radio radio was like
also the producer became the star.

Speaker 1 (01:25:37):
Yeah, it was like everybody had to get a Kanye beat.

Speaker 3 (01:25:41):
Or a Swiss speed you know, yes or whatever. It
was so and nobody and they didn't work anymore to
develop a writer or to develop a producer. Like everybody
that I ever signed, and it wasn't intentionally, but they
were all self contained. Rizak right, self contained, East Swift,
self contained, Joe and Punn self contained.

Speaker 1 (01:26:01):
But you also also did real artist development, like you
weren't signing.

Speaker 3 (01:26:05):
I mean, I don't know how many artists you signed
at the top of their Like, I never signed an
artist at the top of their career ever in my life.
That's what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (01:26:12):
It's like Akon was, Like I didn't know who Akon
was prior to No No, No.

Speaker 3 (01:26:16):
You might have knew Banner was, but Banner wasn't having great,
great success. But Banner was self contained. Everybody was self contained.
So I'm just like this, this is how I'm gonna go.
I never considered myself an an R guy. Like He'll
tell you, I spoke to him every day. I was
a promotion guy. Tell me like, you know, I'm sorry,

(01:26:37):
I to keep on bringing you on.

Speaker 1 (01:26:38):
Brian, this is Brian's he's over there, he's this is
the best day of his month right now. So and
his kid graduated this month.

Speaker 3 (01:26:46):
Congratulation.

Speaker 1 (01:26:49):
Was there ever any artists that you almost signed in
the nineties that just.

Speaker 3 (01:26:54):
It for me? There was a few, There was them.
There was Jay. BMG. Wouldn't let me sign Jay? Why
because we we were throwing so much weight up there,
and what they wanted was a little bit different.

Speaker 1 (01:27:06):
We've already done this, We've already seen this. This No Jay,
j Jay, wont it was different? Okay, and Dame and
they were like not like and they didn't want a
lot of money. That's crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:27:19):
They just wanted their independence.

Speaker 1 (01:27:22):
Eminem too, huh yeah, because it's crazy because you think
about Eminem.

Speaker 3 (01:27:26):
He had like, I guess there's a tape that's somebody
said when he went to visit Pow, I don't know
who was interviewing him, and they said what label do
you want to be? And he said low.

Speaker 1 (01:27:36):
I don't doubt that at that time, of course, I
mean with what he was into.

Speaker 3 (01:27:40):
And Paul interned for my partner Rich Isaacs.

Speaker 1 (01:27:46):
Did you guys have any sort of loud records and
Raucous records?

Speaker 3 (01:27:52):
Did you ever we consulted Ruckus records. I never consider
Ruckus records competition.

Speaker 1 (01:27:56):
It wasn't even a competition, but I just because you
guys were much bigger. Raucus was very much like kind
of the backpack they were.

Speaker 3 (01:28:01):
They were owned by Marvel, not Margaret Rupert Murdoch's son
James Murdoch. They hired they would they hired us to
consult them.

Speaker 1 (01:28:08):
But that whole movement tale black Star most now, was
that ever anything where you were like, you know, maybe
we can kind of make this like, go a little
more mainstream this sound and should we start.

Speaker 3 (01:28:20):
I never looked at them. I never. I never looked
at them that way. I never looked at it. I mean,
I knew James Murdoch was gonna run fox one.

Speaker 1 (01:28:27):
That's pretty crazy that Rupert Murdoch's kid owned Raucus, by
the way, for people who don't know that, that's a
that's a that's an insane.

Speaker 3 (01:28:34):
Little and what Ruckus said Raucus did. But I never
I never, you know, I never worried about I didn't
worry about def Jam. I didn't worry about Babe. I
didn't worry about that throw like. I just did what
I had. You know, if you're running a race and
if you look over your shoulder, see what you can

(01:28:55):
get this you get past so you could trip, like
just focus on the fish line man for all us
that that's what it was. I remember a Mob Deep
second album. We didn't have a smash like suck On
right Drop a gym was supposed to be but we
pulled it. But we were coming the same thing that
Foxy was coming mm hmm. And that was the only

(01:29:16):
time I had a huge argument with my cousin who
was my GM methodism, and I was like, I need
to know every fucking and I'm not even saying in
a bad way, of course, but yeah, and he was,
what are you so worried about?

Speaker 1 (01:29:29):
I'm like, we got a beater.

Speaker 3 (01:29:31):
It wasn't even hard. I just I didn't like how
LEYO did that hmmm. And I knew he was good
like and we were so authentic and ethical and.

Speaker 1 (01:29:43):
You feel do you?

Speaker 3 (01:29:44):
Did you and Leo have a bit of a rivalry
at that time. We came out of Noah and we
smacked him.

Speaker 1 (01:29:50):
I mean, listen, I don't even mean like, I just
mean like from an executive to executive.

Speaker 3 (01:29:54):
No, because I looked at it like we we we
when we came, We came, and at the end of
the day, Wu tang Or met the man saved their ass.
I had an Warren g Right and I had Gotti.

Speaker 1 (01:30:12):
Before they did interesting.

Speaker 3 (01:30:14):
I was gonna sign Mike Geronima.

Speaker 1 (01:30:16):
Shout out to Mike Geramia, Man, that's that's.

Speaker 3 (01:30:19):
We couldn't get to sample Clinton and just didn't work out.
And he says a nerve call. He was, let me
just bring it to godlieb right, you know, so like
we were always with that jam one step ahead.

Speaker 1 (01:30:32):
So crazy. Yeah, you always hear things about you, obviously,
I've never I've never I met Leord once and I
was like, I know your brother, Madi, what's up, bro?
The tallest Jewish guy in the world. That's fucking nuts.
Can you share a couple of just like, give me
you have a random mop story you could share.

Speaker 3 (01:30:57):
They were in Vegas for magic.

Speaker 1 (01:31:00):
Okay, they're clothing convention, right, And I was in.

Speaker 3 (01:31:02):
Vegas and I had to show them what I was
built that of. So my family owned the umber An
Italian restaurant okay in Vegas, which which it's called Heiroes
Okay Okay. It's the longest free standing and I mean
there was not I mean there was never no beef,
but like I was always aware of, like you know,

(01:31:25):
and like their manager I truly loved, but like I
had to show them that you come, I'm coming. But
there was We never had a beef. I know. They
went on me at record one time, led us off
the label. I was already gone from the label, you'd
already sold it. Yeah, But I'm closer to them today
than I was.

Speaker 1 (01:31:44):
It feels like they've aught that, each of them guys
are like, you know, obviously they're fucking older now. Yeah,
you know, but yeah, that's shout to MP Man. You
also had a point in TI where you were working
with Mariah.

Speaker 3 (01:31:56):
Yeah, I'll tell you that I thought everybody knew that.

Speaker 1 (01:32:02):
Was that out there.

Speaker 3 (01:32:03):
I tried to keep it quiet. I always thought that
was I've known that.

Speaker 1 (01:32:07):
I thought I thought people knew that that.

Speaker 3 (01:32:10):
You were like like helping her, you were managing her.
So I was, yeah, I was like whatever, My thought
was like a management wrong?

Speaker 1 (01:32:18):
What what era of.

Speaker 3 (01:32:20):
If I went to Sony in ninety nine, I want
to say, night that's peak.

Speaker 1 (01:32:25):
Holy shit, that's like ninety's like uh uh fucking honey
and and and I.

Speaker 3 (01:32:33):
Think it was right after Honey she did director with
Whitney with that movie.

Speaker 1 (01:32:38):
Yeah, that's crazy. You just I mean, dude, your your
your jacket is pretty stacked at this point. Do you
feel like do you like like cause you you seem
like a guy who hasn't lost that fire, the motivation
you're you're a guy who likes to work. What is
the current like, what are you what are you currently

(01:32:59):
working on? What drives you currently? And and and what
is kind of like current situation for Steve.

Speaker 3 (01:33:07):
What I'm doing? You know I got sick in twenty thirteen. Yeah,
I had a heart attack. I really thought I was
going to die. I mean I did die. I died
three times, but I thought I was gonna have another one.

Speaker 1 (01:33:18):
And when you got kids, man, it's like, yeah, so
I stopped working, got the Boss and then.

Speaker 3 (01:33:26):
Two thousand and eighteen at the Kanye at a restaurant,
and how did you? I never worked anybody in my life.

Speaker 1 (01:33:39):
In my life, I mean you were you were present.
I want to say you were present when he had
that Drink Champs interview. Weren't you? Were you there for
the crazy dream.

Speaker 3 (01:33:47):
Change which when he said when he yeah, so that's
a funny story. I wasn't supposed to be there, but
you were there. I'm going to tell you. I'm going
to tell you. I'm going to tell you what. So
Norway's family, you know that, right. So my fiance nawn
So Glori had somebody who worked for him. Every time
I would come into town. You can get me a
car Miami in Miami. Yeah, so I'm dropping the car

(01:34:09):
off and we're on our way today. When she was
let me have to go to the bathroom. So we
go in and I'm like, why is he filming now?
Why is there so much security? And they said, jays here,
and I'm like, what the fuck? And this is when
he first started going after the Jews. And even though

(01:34:30):
I'm Jewish, I had every Jew in the world call
me people that I didn't know, they said, and like
the most powerful people like that I've never met. And
I'm getting bombarded, like you got. I'm like, I haven't
spoken to him in a year, and the last time
I spoke to me, he told me to go fuck
myself crazy, not over religiouship, just on. So she's walking

(01:34:58):
straight to the set like I don't know if she's lost,
like I don't know right or and then she said
she saw a guy with a bald head, so she
thought that was And I'm trying to grant and you
can't scream. I'm like, so I go and he sees me, Yeah,
he sees you. And what I think he said, my
favorite Jew. And I do believe I am his favorite Jew.

(01:35:23):
And I said, if you play What I said was
if you play nice, the world still loves you, I
mean for sure, And that was the thing. And then
he goes fly home with me. I said, I'm going
to down. He goes, I'll drop you off, and she
was like, he saw what I went through. I just
got the Lifetime Achievement Award with B E T. And

(01:35:44):
I went to Miami to see my moum. So went
to Miami for a few days just that whatever, and
then I was going to meet her family in Dallas.

Speaker 1 (01:35:55):
So I guess that that interview is probably four years
ago now half something like that. Yeah. Yeah, So so
twenty eighteen, Kanye, that is Daytona, that is the YA album,
That's Kids.

Speaker 3 (01:36:07):
He goes, that's the five albums, So that five album era,
that was hout we Will and you're with him at
that time Wyoming era. Yeah, and you and him, I'm
me and we just say. He goes, I'm gonna put
out these five albums, and he came with these states
like this. And I wasn't his manager, but I was running.
I guess there's a whole bunch of people running good music.

(01:36:28):
But you know, with Paul being at def Jam, Rich Isaacson,
who is my partner in loud as the number two
with theft Jam, it was like I pretty much and
I and Scooter. I gave his first deal to so
you know so, and at that time, Scooter's like the
manager on manager, the Scooter's the manager. And it was
just but it was he was relying on me to know,

(01:36:52):
you got to do what I do right, and it
worked the perfection.

Speaker 1 (01:36:57):
Yeah, I mean, I mean, look, I think kids, he
goes my favorite album out of the dad and ya
and then Daytona is a fucking classic.

Speaker 3 (01:37:03):
But it's crazy.

Speaker 1 (01:37:04):
So were you around when Drake comes to Wyoming? I was.

Speaker 3 (01:37:09):
He didn't look at me as an A and R guy.
He looked at me just run run the business. I
wasn't in Wyoming, So you.

Speaker 1 (01:37:13):
Didn't do the Wyoming thing or nothing like that because
the Wyoming shit seemed crazy because he remember he flew
all the people out there.

Speaker 3 (01:37:18):
Yeah, he flew everybody in the mom out there, Travis Drake.

Speaker 1 (01:37:21):
What resulted in you him telling you to go fuck yourself?
And was this in twenty eighteen? Like how long did
that last? Was it more than a year?

Speaker 3 (01:37:30):
Less than a year? It was? I was only I said,
I'm only doing this for a year was if I could.
I was the only reason why I did it, to
see if I was strong enough mentally not to deal
with him, but with my heart, I thought I was dying.
I was dying. So this is five years after you
have that scare at three thirteen, and so now he

(01:37:54):
wants to figure out not to how to get off
Universal somehow, and like, I really love the guy, I
really like. My heart breaks fro him sometimes and like,
and I always think how I could help him? Right,
So he was going through some shit and I remember

(01:38:16):
he was. I was talking to Biggs and Big says, yeah,
I think I think they said they were going to Jamaica.
I don't know where where they were going. So when
you see him and you have him, call me because
I have an idea how I could get this.

Speaker 1 (01:38:27):
Thing done from get him off Universal, not get.

Speaker 3 (01:38:31):
Him off but the partner really partner up with him
and let him do what he does best. And falls me.
We speak. He goes, call me tomorrow. Now it's a
Jewish holitay. It's the funniest thing. And he goes, I'm

(01:38:51):
going to land and meet with this lawyer and joelcats
like Joel's my attorney. He goes, if I send you
a plane, will you come? Will you come to Alanta?
I said I supposed to have dinner with I didn't
say the Jewish Holliday, but I said, suppost have dinner
with my mom tonight. Let me just see if I
could just move it. When don't we back? We're back whatever.

(01:39:12):
And the plan was for Universal to give him a fund,
not to make an album, creation fund to create and
do whatever the fuck he wants to do. And I
had Universal say yes.

Speaker 1 (01:39:29):
To an amount.

Speaker 3 (01:39:30):
I don't want to say the amount, but it was
brasy amount, okay. And I told Joel because Joel was
also my attorney, because this is the most brilliant thing
I've ever heard. And We're flying back home and I'm
looking at his p and L I was like, why
is he still on payroll? I should never have said it,

(01:39:51):
but I was trying to get I was trying to
spark him on something.

Speaker 1 (01:39:56):
And that's when when you say why he's on payroll?

Speaker 3 (01:39:58):
Why?

Speaker 1 (01:39:58):
Like why is Kanye pain?

Speaker 3 (01:40:00):
No, not Kanye some I don't want to say someone
a random name, like hey, why is this person getting it? Yeah?
And I did it to get a reaction, and the
reaction was min drone fucking business, go fuck your and
I shouldn't And the truth is I was looking to
start something just and see the reaction, so that he

(01:40:25):
probably forgot.

Speaker 1 (01:40:25):
It does feel like yay, during that time, had a
lot of random people eating off of them.

Speaker 3 (01:40:30):
Still it does.

Speaker 1 (01:40:31):
No, I'm sure he does now, but even then, you
would see the people who'd be around.

Speaker 3 (01:40:35):
Him, and and that's what and that's really what. That
that broke my heart, like be like nobody gave a
fuck about him.

Speaker 1 (01:40:44):
Like yeah, it feels like, you know, I feel like
he is a guy who's who's hurt, you know, and
I feel like he's turned his hurt into you know,
whatever point he's trying to make, he's communicating in a very.

Speaker 3 (01:41:01):
Hurtful way, So he's trying to hurt everybody in it.

Speaker 1 (01:41:04):
Yeah, And I think it's like there's a difference between like,
you know, having a conversation about his grand point that
he might be trying to make without it being hateful,
without it ostracizing so many people have supported you without
being like it you know, it's it's just it's sad man.
And then like that, now the music just feels so sloppy.
It's like, wait, how where do I gotta go? Feels

(01:41:26):
all undone, It feels like he's just dropping demos now
and would you if he called you today, would you
pick up the call.

Speaker 3 (01:41:34):
I would pick up the call. And but I don't
know what the call. I don't know how I would
act on. He made my mom cry. Yeah, so that's
it is interesting. My mom is what, she's ninety one
years old. She wanted the toughest. She was married to
my dad, so she had to be tough.

Speaker 1 (01:41:55):
I wonder for you man, like being Jewish right now?
I see there's a lot of things that are going
on with the government of Israel that are you know,
a lot of people don't agree with, a lot of
people don't like it's conflated into like the extreme on
both sides, right where if you do criticize Israel, you know,

(01:42:18):
a lot of things people do to shut you ups,
called you anti Semitic. But on the other side, it
has also resulted in a ton of true anti Semitism.
And then you got the Kanye thing going on. It
just feels like, you know, it for you somebody who's
done so much in the music industry, and like you said,
your mom, it hurts your mom the stuff Kanye said,

(01:42:39):
like where do you feel like the world is right
now because we're in a fucked up place.

Speaker 3 (01:42:44):
World War threes. I mean, I'm not even worried about
World War three, to be honest with you. Yeah, I'm
more worried about the civil war here.

Speaker 1 (01:42:50):
Yeah, it's very possible.

Speaker 3 (01:42:55):
Right. My kids are black, right, right, so you got
black white My sons have black. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:43:01):
So it's like it just feels especially with like disconnect
from the geopolitical shit and just connect to what's going
on here. It feels like with the ice ship, it's
the beginning of something really dark, because if it's if
it's it starts with the ice raids, does it then
go to like people who don't agree with you? Does it?
You know, are they gonna start like they're gonna cut

(01:43:23):
off funding the states based on who they voted for?

Speaker 3 (01:43:26):
And yeah, so like the mother of my children, she's
from training that one and raised or granted she has
a citizenship now, right, but she really well what does
that mean? Yeah? So like granted she has a US passport, right,
does that mean like I don't trust anything? So I'm
just like I don't like, I don't know, man, I'm

(01:43:50):
just like I'm not you know, I'm more worried about.

Speaker 1 (01:43:53):
Yeah, yeah, it makes sense, man, it doesn't make sense.
Are you currently I know we were talking a little bit.
I know, you know, I don't want to get into
what you were talking about, but I know you're at
least listening to a new artist, checking out new artists.
You sign an artist or like what is what is
I mean?

Speaker 3 (01:44:08):
I signed? I helped. I found an artist that was
already was signed to a label, an independent, and I
brought the independent over to Sony and I think this
kid is gonna be as like my next Acon.

Speaker 1 (01:44:20):
That's big.

Speaker 3 (01:44:22):
I'll played a record as soon as Yeah. And you know,
Sony said, you know you wanted like a first look deal,
and I really don't know what I want right I
have a hot time talking these new artists.

Speaker 1 (01:44:35):
It's a different time, huh.

Speaker 3 (01:44:36):
I mean you saw when we at the hotel.

Speaker 1 (01:44:39):
Oh ye Jesus Christ. I don't even want to get
into the details of that. That was a fucking ship show.

Speaker 3 (01:44:44):
But what so I was. I just came back from
Atlanta and I'm going back tomorrow. One of the girls
could really spit developing fan base, a fan base, and
you know, and she's selling some lip gloss.

Speaker 1 (01:44:59):
I mean, hell, that's great.

Speaker 3 (01:45:00):
Yeah, and then the other girl is really sing you
just needs records, right, So is somebody really going to
take the time and the patient.

Speaker 1 (01:45:08):
But yeah, it's it's artist development again. Yeah, it's most
most people want to get on board when the records
already happened.

Speaker 3 (01:45:13):
And the reason why and the reason why I left
so early was there was just too many people talking.

Speaker 1 (01:45:18):
There was a lot. Yeah, yeah, it was a lot.

Speaker 3 (01:45:19):
And I was like, at then, I like, you know,
I understood. I heard both stories. I was like, all right,
I get this. This is yeah cool. And so you
know Magic is a partner of mine, right and you know,
big bro that was great. So it's just like, yeah,
I mean they yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:45:40):
I mean I feel like nowadays it's like you have
to figure out how to monetize so much outside of
the music because the music is like we said, it's
like a million streams is thirty eight hundred dollars. What
the fuck are we doing if?

Speaker 3 (01:45:55):
But you got ten million streams it's thirty eight grand?
But fuck yeah. But at the end of the day,
I want to raise money and I want to stop
buying catalog in the right way. I don't like I
don't want to buy your kind of I want to buy.

Speaker 1 (01:46:12):
And let me just get in and out, get some pieces.

Speaker 3 (01:46:14):
And and help and help you grow it. Partner her
up with an advertising where things could you know? So
those are the things I don't know if I have
the patience to really run a label.

Speaker 1 (01:46:25):
My youngest run through some loud nerd stuff. When you
guys did the rock album with the blue dude on
the cover, that.

Speaker 3 (01:46:30):
Was my favorite. I thought that woulda be the biggest
album in my career.

Speaker 1 (01:46:33):
This was like during the time when I mean it
was like the kid rock living but you had like
that press on there.

Speaker 3 (01:46:42):
Present system is downright crazy time? Did it only went
on drunk with your yeah ye yea give like how
fun was that to put together? And I mean I
hired somebody to do it. But I really thought that
that was literally my idea And I really thought this
is before the jay Z Lincoln Park. Yeah, I thought
this was gonna be the biggest album, like I really did.

(01:47:03):
Was it an expensive album to make? It was an
expensive problems. We couldn't get fucking clearance anyway.

Speaker 1 (01:47:08):
From the other artist labels. System of a down on
that album at that time. It is crazy. That's early
for them. That's fucking nuts. Jesus. What was the biggest
band on that? It was System of Down the big
it was. There was a pun record, du sounds about right.

(01:47:29):
Was it hard to get those guys, the rappers to
sign on to do it? No?

Speaker 3 (01:47:32):
They did it in two seconds, that's for you.

Speaker 1 (01:47:41):
In Dangered Species has a pun album right came out
after he passes away? Was that Is there a lot
of unreleased pun left?

Speaker 3 (01:47:50):
Or was that that? I don't know. I think that
was more of like a fell in just like I
don't know where the fuck that even? Mm hmm that album? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:48:00):
This, yeah, baby, yeah, baby was obviously he was he was,
he was alive for that, making, the making of it, the.

Speaker 3 (01:48:05):
Making of it.

Speaker 1 (01:48:06):
Yeah, yeah, that's crazy. Yeah, because in Dangerus Species comes
out and I'm like, oh shit, this is obviously a
lot of unrelease shit people hopping up.

Speaker 3 (01:48:15):
But I don't I don't think we ever really did
anything with it. No, you didn't, But I just wondered,
was there more that you guys pulled from from then?
Or that?

Speaker 1 (01:48:23):
Interesting? Interesting? What is your personal most slept on Loud
Records release of all time? Slept On Alcoholics damn ooh,
great album. Do you feel like the Links get enough
credit for because I just had Tash on because I
think rap life is to me, rap life is, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:48:43):
That's it was an incredible album. But I feel like,
but I'm talking about the song damn right Coast to Coast.
I think it was Coast to Coast the album.

Speaker 1 (01:48:49):
Yeah, they re I think they re recorded it. Did
they They just re recorded an alcoholics album. It was
either Coast to Coast or twenty one and over when.

Speaker 3 (01:48:57):
It went over was the first album? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:48:58):
They re recorded an album them like Taylor Swift style
if I talked to about y know you guys, but
you know, I think, yeah, the shouts of the licks uh,
rap life, Tash.

Speaker 3 (01:49:10):
Though I got put it up there.

Speaker 1 (01:49:12):
That's crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:49:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:49:14):
And then for you, what was you know, in your
opinion man, an artist who you felt like was on loud,
but maybe you don't think it hit their full potential.

Speaker 6 (01:49:30):
Press that bras albums if there was trust? What do
you mean by that?

Speaker 3 (01:49:41):
They were so militant and they were anti the establishment that.

Speaker 1 (01:49:46):
They almost didn't trust the establishment to like, let us
do what we're gonna do. You feel like hip hop
could have been bigger, should have been bigger. You want
to talk about one of the greatest beats of all time.

Speaker 3 (01:50:00):
Any of it might be my two, my two favorite
records such so when I got that Last Time Achievement award,
we started off with about mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (01:50:09):
Fake fake records, right, oh man, that was such a
good album. Mind sex was crazy. I feel like even
the the second album though, was that RBG their second
album with that had uh hell yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:50:27):
That whole song that.

Speaker 1 (01:50:28):
By the way, if you guys are all the scammers
out there, if you want to listen to how to
og Crack the System, go listen to hell Yeah by
Dead Press and One and stick Man Man.

Speaker 3 (01:50:38):
If there was trust, they could have been the biggest album,
not the biggest album, they could have been the biggest
artist on that was it that they just didn't trust,
Like they didn't trust the system and they didn't trust me,
and you know, and I would say, if you didn't
trust me, then why did you sign it? You know,

(01:50:58):
I get along great with them now and everything else
like that.

Speaker 1 (01:51:00):
But at the time you guys were at it was
like an artist at odds with the label situation. That's crazy.
Were you with Loud when they dropped the second album.
I don't think so, yeah, because that's when jay Z
got on the remix. Yeah, that is a big what
if it's dead press man, because that first album ridiculous, incredible,

(01:51:22):
and Drey was a big I always heard Dre was
a big fan of that. Scenes. That's crazy, man. Well listen,
you're a fucking legend. You gotta write a book. We're
gonna we're talking about it. You gotta get a book together,
or I'll tell you would be fire like a Loud
Records fucking TV series, but with like actors and shit,

(01:51:43):
like a mini series based loosely around your your life.

Speaker 3 (01:51:47):
There are things we're talking about. Me and Rizz are
cooking up some things right now.

Speaker 1 (01:51:51):
Shout to Riza, man. I just told him. I saw
him the other night and I was like, I was
cleaning out my one of my boxes in my garage
and I found the Domestic Violence VHS tape, which is
his first movie he ever made. It was like a
fifteen minute short film and he's like, Yo, I can't
find that. Can you send that to me? I was like,
of course, fuck, yeah, no, that'd be crazy exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:52:15):
No, No, we're talking about. There's a lot of things
we're talking about. We're gonna be making some announcements a
few weeks.

Speaker 1 (01:52:20):
Were you a part of the Wu Tang video game
at all?

Speaker 3 (01:52:23):
I was a part of the Wu Tang documentary. I
wasn't part of any of that stuff. But I'm bringing
ris of a part of me, just from a director
and a producer.

Speaker 1 (01:52:31):
Got to, got to got to. I love it, man,
We'll see.

Speaker 3 (01:52:33):
I appreciate thanks, thanks for coming. Thank you, yes, sir, well,
thank you for coming. My God, I appreciate it. Boom

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Hosts And Creators

James Andre Jefferson Jr.

Bootleg Kev

Brian Baumgartner

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