The Alabama Home Builders Licensure Board and Memorial Day

JR “Chip” Carden Jr. the Executive director of the Alabama Home Builders Licensure Board explains how the limerences they issue protect home owners, and benefit the builder alike.  He also explains the resources available on their website. Then in Honer of Memorial Day, Author and historian Jared Frederick joins us to talk about the contributions that Alabamians have made to our military forces on this Memorial day weekend. We also talk about the roll Alabama played in the civil war.

Episode Transcript

(00:04):
Well, it's shaping up to bea beautiful summer in Alabama and that means
a lot of people want to improvetheir homes and maybe build a new one.
Hi. I'm John Mounts and thisweek on Viewpoint Alabama, I'm talking
with Jr. Chip Carden Jr.The Executive director of the Alabama home Builders
Licensure Board. Chip, Welcome toViewpoint. Thanks for having me. So,
like a lot of our listeners,I'm a real do it yourself and

(00:24):
there's some projects I look at andsay, you know what, this one's
probably better left to a professional.And that's why I want to know that
the professionals I hire are they knowwhat they're doing. And that's where the
Alabama home Builders Licensure Board comes intopractice, because standards are important. We
have to make sure that you knowpeople are doing things the right way so
it's built to last. So Chip, tell me why licensing protects both the

(00:47):
client and the builder. Using alicensed home builder slash remodeler in state Alabama
comes with, lack of a betterword, good points for the for the
consumer to use that person. Firstof all, you have access to the
Consumer Recovery Fund if you use alicensed builder or remodeler. If you wind
up having a disagreement with the builder, you sue that builder, you get

(01:08):
a judgment, you can have thecourt order our recovery fund to pay up
to twenty thousand dollars per transaction.If you use an unlicensed builder that is
not available to you as a consumer, you can Also if you hire a
licensed roofer through US, they're requiredto have a ten thousand dollars bond.
If they really mess the job upand they don't fix it, then the
board can call the bond and theconsumer can have recourse that way. The

(01:33):
umbrella under which all of these licensingyou issue licenses to different trades or is
it one big license. There's threelicenses that we issue. We issue an
unlimited home builder's license, which meansyou can do anything you want to do
on a home as defined in ourstatue. We have a limited license,
which is strictly single trade, nonstructural. And then we have a roofer's license,

(01:57):
which is exactly what it sounds like. It's a roofer's license, So
put a roof on a house.Lit a roof on a house. Now,
what about other trades like plumbing,electrical? Is that is that you.
Is that somebody else? It's it'sanother board, another licensing board,
but those guys are licensed by theirrespective licensing boards. Talk about this consumer
because I didn't know about this consumerRecovery fund. So is that something that

(02:17):
your organization pays for through the feesthat licensees pay or is it paid for
by the state or correct? Correct, that's it comes through licensees through the
industry that pay license fees to theboard. There's a there's a license fee
every year, or a portion ofthat license fee that goes into the recovery
fund, and then any overages throughoutthe year that the licensure board has drops

(02:40):
off into the recovery fund. Andwe've paid out over six million dollars in
the twenty five years that I've beenthere. If I'm going to get somebody
come out to my house and let'ssay we've had some hail damage. The
roof was damaged. They're going tofix my roof, and I ask,
so are you licensed? Of coursethey're going to well, of course we're
licensed, But how do I knowtheir license? That's a great question.
One of the common scams that getused is the individual will produce a business

(03:06):
license anybody with a checkbook or acredit card can get a business license,
and our license means that they havemet some minimum qualifications. In the instance
of an unlimited homebuilder slash remodeler,he has had to produce a credit report
that's clean of Lean's judgments and chargeoff accounts, and the roofer has to
be financially secure enough to be ableto obtain a bond. Right, And

(03:29):
I think also doesn't it protect youfrom situations like somebody's on your property doing
work. They could injure themselves andthey could potentially say, well, your
property was unsafe, I injured myself, I want to sue you. Does
this also does that license also protectyou from that? Or is that your
own home artists insurance of it?Well, the contractors in state Alabama should
be carrying that's another question as aconsumer that you need to ask do you

(03:52):
carry workers comp? In general liabilityworkers comp? The first line is the
contractor that's actually performing the work.Then it goes to to the general on
the job or home builder, andthen if there's no insurance there, then
it's coming to your homeowner's insurance.So as the homeowner, you need to
verify those things that they've got thatinsurance and it's in effect. So back

(04:13):
to my original question. Then theyclaim they've got that they've got a license
with the Alabama Home Licensure Board,But how do we know that? Is
there a number? They can golook it up. They can go to
our website which is hb LB dotAlabama dot gov and there's a license search
that you can check. Follow theinstructions that are on the page and it

(04:35):
will help you find them. Andit's very just important to be vigilant and
look because if they produce a businesslicense it looks very official, says State
of Alabama on the top of it, in the county that issues it.
That's not the correct license that youhave to have to you know, you
have to have minimum qualifications in orderto hold it. But when you produce
that credit card size license, eitherin printed form or digital form, and

(04:59):
it's got the current you're on it, it's got the person's name address on
it, then you know you've gotsomething. This is Viewpoint Alabama on the
Alabama Radio Network. MA. Nameis John Mountain. I'm speaking with Chip
cardon He is with the Alabama Homebuilder'sLicense your Board. Chip we talked a
lot about the consumer protections. Butif you are a actual home builder or
a roofer or something like that andyou want to become licensed by the board,

(05:21):
what do you need to do?The first thing you should probably do
is go to our website at THEHBLBdot Alabama dot gov and go through the
how to how to get a licensesection. Tons of information in there.
There's a candidate information bulletin that givesyou a full description on what the test
is like. If you're an unlimitedyou're seeking an unlimited license, you have

(05:45):
to pass two tests. One isa skills test and the other is a
business and law test. This isa skills test, like you have to
nail a board together with another boardor what's involved in simple terms, Yeah,
it talks about concrete, It talksabout estimating, It talks about nailing
patterns. You know from throughout allthe trades, because you, as the
builder slash remodeler, have to beable to supervise those subcontractors or those trades

(06:10):
on your job in order to producethe best product. And you know,
you need to know what you're lookingat when you're when you're dealing with the
consumer. How does our state licensureboard stack up against other states in terms
of the the cost, in termsof the regulations that sort of thing.
Is it pretty standard or is everystate very different? Every state is pretty
different, especially here in Alabama.There's a separate board for residential construction,

(06:32):
which is us the home Builder's LicensureBoard, and there's the General Licensing Board
for general contractors, which is strictlycommercial. So that makes us a little
bit different than other states. Uh, we are pretty aggressive as far as
as the regulation is concerned. Weget after the guys that are doing bad
work and and you know those consumercomplaints. Sometimes they go both ways and

(06:57):
we're we're left to try to figureout what the result is, what the
truth is. Sometimes they are probablecause, sometimes there are no probable cause,
but it gives the consumer a placeto turn other than the core system.
And once you've obtained a license,you have to keep the license.
So is there is that annual renewalor they have to renew it annually.

(07:18):
Beginning October one, you can renewpenalty free up until November thirtieth. After
November thirtieth there's fifty dollars late fee, and then after December thirty. First,
there's a ugly six hundred dollars expiredlicense fee. Well, yeah,
you don't want to deal with that. I don't want to have to deal

(07:39):
with that. What's the initial outlayor does it depend on the business or
the volume business you do. What'sthe outlay that somebody could expect to have
to pay to obtain a license.The books for the tests are the most
expensive. Sometimes you can rent them, sometimes you can borrow them from a
friend or somebody that's in the business. I think they're in the in the
five six hundred dollars range. Thenyou've got testing costs, which are two

(08:01):
fifty. It's pretty reasonable. Andthe good part about the test is you
can take the test anytime you wantto get registered for it because you can
do it from your house wherever youcan get internet access. As long as
you've got a laptop with a cameraon it, they can procter the exam
remotely and watch you take the test. So while this is not the price

(08:22):
is not so onerous that it's itmakes it unobtainable, it does kind of
ensure that the people working on yourhouse they are not just some guy who
woke up one day and said,I'll take a fifteen dollars online test and
now I'm good to go to puta roof on your house. These people
they're in the business because they meanto be in the business. They know
what they're doing, and they've actuallygone through some testing, like a road

(08:43):
test as it were. This isnot the fictitious Joe swinghammer with a nail
apron and a pickup truck. Theseguys are professionals. They have minimum requirements
they have to meet in order tohold that license. You're supposed to have
a written contract if you're going todo business, and disclosures for liability insurance
in workers comp that they need tobe able to produce. I like that

(09:07):
Joe swing Hamry. I was thinkingof Remember the old show New Heart,
Remember the next Door Neighbors. Iwas it Larry and his brother Daryl's or
brother Darrel. Remember they had abusiness called anything for a Buck. So
it's not those guys that have workedon your house. Is not those guys
Daryl and his other brother Daryl areout there though, beware. Yeah,
exactly so your website. I waslooking through at some and there are actually

(09:28):
a lot of great resources on there. Can you talk about some of the
resources available on the website for bothconsumers and for people who are looking to
get the license. The guys thatare looking to get licensed, they need
to hit that hit that how toget a license section first and read through
there and look at the candidate informationbullets and there's tons of information there.

(09:48):
And then you can always call theboard and talk to them to folks that
answer them. Most of the time. I give out our number and I'm
glad that if I'm there, I'lltalk to you on the telephone. And
what's that number. It's eight hundredand three four eight five three, and
we'll give that again before the endof the show. Chip, let's go
through some dees and don'ts and theseare located on the consumers on the under

(10:09):
the consumers tab on the website.What are some dues for people who are
who are looking for somebody to work? Number one thing that you need to
do as a consumer looking for tohire somebody do or is asked to see
their license card. Like we saidbefore, it's a credit card sized,
can be printed, can be digital, which we started last year was the

(10:33):
first year that we did the digitalcard. But it's going that direction,
which eventually they'll all be digital andbe able to contractors be able to use
them on their smartphone. But onceyou do that, that's that kind of
opens the door for some consumer protectionthat's not available to everybody else. One
of that don'ts I see is aboutnot rushing. This is a common scam.

(10:54):
You see a lot of times afterthere has been a storm and there's
all of a sudden there's a suddenneed for a lot of work to be
done, and people will just showup and say, it looks like your
roof damage. Don't worry, Ican fix that right here, right now,
and they rush you into it,and you you don't think because you're
acting on emotion, and that canbe some of the worst decision making you
can make. One hundred percent.You know, you can need to do

(11:15):
your homework. We've been I've workedso many bad storms over my twenty five
year career, and getting in ahurry is probably the worst thing that you
can do. Once the house istarped down and secured enough that you're not
causing further damage, you know,if your house is destroyed, it's going
to be a slow process anyway,So slow down be more careful, take

(11:39):
your time, do your homework,and ask that gentleman that's coming to you
to do work to see his card. The way the construction his business has
been for the last ten or fifteenyears has been crazy busy. So if
there's a guy out there that's notbusy, that should be red flag number
one for you, because you knowhe there's a reason that he's not busy,

(12:01):
and you shouldn't feel ashamed because sometimespeople almost be like, well,
I don't want to have to askhim for the car this. I mean,
it would be like I guess somepeople will think about it. If
I'm getting on an airplane to flysomewhere, I turned to the pilot sitting
there, let me see a pilotlicense. But this is different, right,
you should be proud to display thatcard showing your licensed if if you
if they're hesitant at all to showoff the card, there might be something

(12:22):
wrong one hundred percent. You know, we've had a couple of cases where
guys have forged licenses before, butthat's very, very rare most of the
time. We were doing a licensecheck operation in Coleman County one time,
and we asked the guy who's standingon the ridge ridge of the house,
putting deck in on. He says, heck yeah, I said, you
don't have to come down. Sohe comes running down off the roof,

(12:45):
climbs down and digs through his truckand shows me his card. And you
know, it's something to be proudof. It's you've had to put some
effort in it to get it,and it's not cheap. So I imagine
if you're going to pay that kindof money, you know you want to,
you want to, by golly,I bought this thing. I'm going
to show it off, you know. The gentleman's words were, I've been
carrying this license for ten years asthe first time somebody has ever checked me.
So that works out. We've donelicense checks on the area lakes around

(13:09):
Alabama. We rent a pontoon boatand ride the shoreline. It was kind
of funny story the auditors got afterus. I wanted to know why we
were renting pontoon boats. Well,if you rent a pontoon boat and ride
the shoreline, you can check fiftyor sixty jobs in a day, where
if you're going by car, youcan imagine going around Smith Lake up around
Coleman. It takes forever to getfrom one side to the other. You
might check five or six jobs ina day. Plus you get a little

(13:33):
time on the lake, which isalso you do. But you know the
rules always been no fishing poles,no beer at least not on duty.
Any not on duty. That's correct, Chip Card and the executive director of
the Alabama home Builder's Licenseure Board,Chip one more time. That website it's
www dot hb LB dot Alabama dotgov and the phone number eight hundred three

(13:56):
oh four eight five three. I'velearned a lot today, Chip, Thank
you so much for coming in.Great you're listening to Viewpoint Alabama on the
Alabama Radio Network. I'm your host, John Mounts and coming up on Monday,
it's Memorial Day. It's the daywe remember the sacrifice made by so
many to protect our country and ourway of life. And if you're looking
for some great reading this weekend,I recommend to you the new book Fierce

(14:16):
Valor by Jared Frederick and Eric Dort. Jared, Welcome to the show.
Thank you so much for having me. I'd like to talk to you a
little bit about your book, notonly your book, but also some of
the other stuff that you have backgroundin because you're the host of something called
Real History on YouTube and an instructorof history at Penn State in Altoona.
So, Jared, you know alot. Also, you've worked at Gettysburg,

(14:39):
right, that's correct, I meanthe park, not the battle.
Yes, thank goodness. You've writtena book on almost every war fought by
our American soldiers, and I wantedto start with one that was fought right
here on the American soil, theCivil War. Living here in the South,
I've got mixed feelings about this warbecause I love our country and I
always pull for America. The peoplein the South who fought in the war,

(15:01):
they thought that they were fighting forthe right side too, and so
I can't always condemn the South forfighting for what they believed in, even
if maybe I didn't agree with allof it. So I thought i'd start
with that and talk about your perspectiveon that. And you're well aware Montgomery,
Alabama was the first capital of theConfederacy. We were also the first
to seceed from the Union. Howdid all that come about? Well,

(15:22):
there's a lot to unpass in thatquestion. There's a lot of nuance in
our interpretations of the American Civil Wartoday, A lot of that it's really
nothing new. People who fought inthe war themselves got involved in hotly debated

(15:43):
partisan issues over its meanings, itslegacies. How it affects us today,
and we still confront many of itslegacies. We continue to debate what is
the role of government in our lifelives, how do the various racial divisions

(16:03):
stemming from the American Civil War affectus as well? And as I always
tell my students, whether we realizeit or not, we live the legacies
of the American Civil War every day, And regardless of what sid of the
issue you come down looking at,I think would be hard pressed to find
that there aren't many many lessons thatwe can find from it. Absolutely,

(16:27):
because you know, it's not likeit just happened overnight. Gradually the North
and the South had differences, andat some point the enough people in the
South said the only way to solvethis is for us to become a separate
nation. Clearly it didn't work outany number of reasons, but I think
it is important to remember these lessonsbecause here today we're you know, there's

(16:48):
different parts of the country. Whoare you see all the time where I
just saw where part of Idaho orpart of Oregon is thinking of succeeding and
becoming part of Idaho. There's alwaysthese places where we're mad and we're going
to leave this place and to thatplace, and you kind of wish they
could solve their problems. And Ilike what you said that you don't lead
with slavery. There's no question thatslavery was a major issue involved in the
Civil War, but it wasn't theonly issue. Well, it was a

(17:11):
long boiling issue, and slavery istruly at the heart of the matter.
There's really no way around it.And as you look at the articles of
secession from the various the southern statesthat did secede, that is the primary
issue that is referenced in all ofthem. But in a more immediate sense,

(17:36):
with the election of Abraham Lincoln,there was the perception that he would
threaten slavery's expansion into these new westwardterritories. And the more immediate sense or
implication of secession is that you hadmany people who didn't want to abide by
the results of a perfectly legal presidentialelection. In a nutshell, is the

(18:03):
long term ripple effects of the CivilWar and what led to it. Although
a lot of the people who fought, the majority of the people who fought
on the side of the South werenot themselves slave owners. There were a
lot of people who themselves might beworking on a farm, but they were
not the slave owners. In fact, I would dare say most of the
slave owners were not on the frontlines. About two thirds of white Southerners

(18:29):
were in fact to poor to ownslaves, and it's been a point of
speculation. There are even some Confederatesoldiers themselves who wrote this that they were
involved in a rich man's war anda poor man's fight, which is often
one of the universal things that wesometimes hear about warfare. But that doesn't

(18:52):
necessarily mean that Confederate soldiers weren't fightingfor the opportunity to earn human property at
any one given point, and theConfederacy offered them that opportunity. And so
once again there's some nuance to it. And if you read between the lines
and look at period newspapers, youcan really get a sense of the passions

(19:17):
and the perspectives of the era.And it was far from a fair fight
between the North and the South.There's no question of the North had the
upper hand. They had the infrastructure, they had the railroads, they had
the supply lines, and all thesethings that made the war a lot easier
for the North. There's a mixedbag to all of that. Both sides
had their various advantages. Much ofthe wars fought in the South, and

(19:38):
so many of the Confederate forces hadwhat we could call a home field advantage.
The one downside to that is thatit's their homes and their property and
their infrastructure which is simultaneously being destroyedas these vast armies are marching across their
territory. But US victory in thewar was, at least until eighteen sixty

(20:03):
four, never a foregone conclusion.Abraham Lincoln himself thought there was a strong
possibility that he wouldn't win re electionin eighteen sixty four because the conflict was
going so poorly. And so whenwe look at manpower and mechanics versus the
political dynamics that were at play,that was the real eight ball that was

(20:26):
in the equation. And the likesof Roberty Lee believed that if he could
bloody the nose of US armies asmuch as possible, that that might weaken
the will of Northerners to continue thefight, and they would therefore vote Abraham
Lincoln out of office. That's oneof the big objectives that they were pushing

(20:47):
for in eighteen sixty four. Andyou do make a good point, because
a lot of the war was notfought. Much of the war was not
fought in Alabama just because there wasnot many people living in Alaba. Georgia
got the branch of a lot ofTennessee. You know, they pretty much
Sherman pretty much burned down Atlanta.So you know, that's the reason why

(21:08):
a lot of people in Atlanta stillvery feel, very up They're still very
upset over one hundred and fifty yearslater that, you know, we had
to start over thanks to the CivilWar. Wherever you want to blame it's
they're still kind of upset about that. Can you tell me why, because
I always kind of wondered this part. Montgomery started off as the capital of
the Confederacy and then it ended upin Richmond. How did that take place?

(21:29):
Virginia was a more populous state,It was more prominent from an economic
standpoint. I think at the outsetof the Civil War, leaders of the
Confederacy realized that Virginia was going tobe front and center in the conflict because
it was more so a border state. It was on that periphery between north

(21:53):
and South, and in the daysbefore telecommunication, than the easiness of politicians
being able to communicate with their generals, I think they realized the centrality of
Virginia and that was one of theprimary reasons why the capital was relocated from

(22:15):
Montgomery to Richmond very early on inthe conflict. So to wrap up my
conversation about the Civil War with youa little bit, because this is Veterans
Day, I don't know, asa historian, you probably have a unique
perspective on this. We honor thesacrifices of our veterans on Veterans Day,
the ones who fought for the UnitedStates. But there are people who fought,

(22:37):
for whatever reason, fought on theside of the South, who are
buried all over the South. Aredo we consider them to be These are
our ancestors of us, some ofus. Do we consider them to be
veterans although they were fighting actually againstthe United States? Or are they considered
you know, and technically it wasanother country, but at the same time
it was our country all at thesame time. Yeah, And I think
you'll offer a great question for descendantsto think about in that regard. And

(23:03):
it's an issue that the federal governmentitself grappled with in the decades following the
conflict, because they're emerged these bureaucraticquestions of who qualifies as a veteran,
what sort of benefits do they get, how should they be cared after?

(23:25):
Do they get a tombstone provided bythe government when it's all said and done,
And sometimes that varied state by stateand situation by situation, and ultimately,
you know what, whether you feelthat they were in the right or
the wrong, I think there's allsorts of lessons that we can learn from

(23:48):
our ancestors. I also think whilewe should remember our ancestors, it's also
important to disassociate ourselves with them alittle bit. And I think it's always
important to remember the actions of yourancestors are not a reflection upon you,
unless you wish them to be goodor bad. Just because your great grandpa

(24:10):
did this or that, or hefought for this side or didn't fight for
that side, that's not a reflectionon you. History is something for us
to learn about. We can growfrom it. But that doesn't necessarily mean
that we have to live in theshadows of the people who've gone before us.
And so I think that's something importantto think about. Good points.

(24:33):
Let me move forward to a morepopular If a war can be popular,
a more popular war that's been Iguess you know, we've kind of romanticized.
It has been in ssconsin so manybooks and movies and stuff. In
World War Two. I guess forme, it's the one I always like
to read most about because I haveI can trace myself back to. I

(24:53):
have family members who fought, multiplefamily members who actually fought in World War
Two. And you know here inall Obama, I don't know if you've
ever been down to Mobile, butwe have the USS Alabama, which was
a battleship that was deployed in thePacific during the war. Have you ever
been there? I have been there. It's a it's a tremendous trip back
in time to walk around on thedecks there. When I was in boy

(25:15):
Scouts, we had the opportunity toactually spend the night on the ship and
we would sleep in the bunks thatthe soldiers slept in and you really can
can kind of get yourself in themindset of what it was like for these
soldiers who were serving at sea,what a day was like. Can you
walk me through what a day wouldbe like for one of these men who
was serving on just a regular guyI guess would be a Navy officer or

(25:38):
a Navy a officer, enlisted Navyguy, a seaman, what it was
like for him to fight and livein one of those ships. Yeah,
I can certainly relate to the storythat you just shared. My own grandfather
served on a slightly bigger ship atthe end of the war that people can
likewise go visit. That's the theUS since North Carolina. It's located in

(26:02):
Wilmington, North Carolina, andike you, a number of years ago, I
had the opportunity to spend a weekendon that ship, and I can tell
you what I gained a whole newperspective and appreciation on life at sea,
because it was one thing you havefor a few dozen of us to be
stain on the ship for a weekend, But when you think about such vessels

(26:27):
at full capacity that might have anywherebetween two and four thousand men on them,
sailing through the South Pacific. It'slike living in a sauna for months
at a time as you across thevast expanse of the oceans, and it
was an incredibly crowded lifestyle. Youknow, there was always this joke that

(26:52):
sailors were fed better than ground troops. But when you look at all of
the hurdles and challenges, from theirconfined living spaces to the heat, to
the claustrophobia, it certainly gives youa new appreciation for what those sailors had

(27:15):
to endure. And I think whenone goes and visits the USS Alabama they
can gain those sorts of insights andappreciations. And I always encourage people to
go visit historic sites as such.And one of the things that is different
even now when you go there isthey somehow reprofitted it with some air conditioning.
They didn't have air conditioning pactory backin the forties. So that gigantic

(27:37):
chunk of metal that you were standingon, you know, in the middle
of the South Pacific, that washot, ready to heat back at you,
and the sea, the sun,it had to be incredibly uncomfortable on
those things. It was it waswalking up on the decads. It's like
walking on a baking sheet in anoven in some cases. And so yes,

(27:59):
it was incredibly humid. I towardpart of the South Pacific, I
had the opportunity to go visit theRejima. These are desolate, humid,
incredibly arduous bits of terrain. Theseindividuals scraped their way across as they were
pushing across the South Pacific. Andso once again, if you want to,

(28:25):
you can read a book, youcan watch a film. You never
truly understand the experience though, untilyou go walk in their footsteps, and
if you have the ability to dothat once against stress, it's so worthwhile
to go and visit these places absolutelyand really put yourself in the mindset of
your your father, your grandfather,great grandfathers who had to serve on these

(28:48):
ships for months and sometimes years atsea. Not to mention the fact that
you could, in addition to allthe other unpleasantries, you could die because
somebody could actually, you know,hit you with a missile. So yeah,
yeah, these are all things tobear in mind. Jared, There's
so much we could cover, butyou cover a lot of this in your
books. What are some of thebooks that you've written. My latest book
is entitled Fierce Valor, The TrueStory of Ronald Spears and his Band of

(29:12):
Brothers. It just came out inpaperback, and for any of your listeners
who may be familiar with the acclaimedHBO series Band of Brothers, it traces
the life of one of the famousofficers depicted in that film and some of
the mysteries and legacies associated with hisexploits in World War Two and subsequent conflict.

(29:33):
Jared Frederick, thank you so muchfor joining us today on Viewpoint Alabama.
You've been listening to Viewpoint Alabama,a public affairs program from the Alabama
Radio Network. The opinions expressed onViewpoint Alabama are not necessarily those of the
staff, management, or advertisers ofthis station.