July 23, 2024 • 40 mins
This week, the The West Indies showed a marked improvement at Trent Bridge - but can they extend it for the third test?
Later, we discuss if there's a quick fix for the White Ferns ahead of their next world T20 in October, and who should be the next Black Caps bowling coach?
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
You're listening to a podcast from News Talk sat B.
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
Take another pad.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
Now it's a trick.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
It is out. The Test is over. Goodness smooth, wows
a beauty. It is out and hearing guys.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
This delivery has in the uses to Bowl.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
On the Front Foot with Brian Waddell and Jeremy Cody,
powered by News Talks head B at iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Hello, here we are on the front foots again. Louis
Didnay couldn't sustain their batting format. Brent Bridge who should
be the black cats next bowling coach? And there's turmoil
in the women's game up the failure of a white
fern to win a game in England. Boy, wasn't that
a fat time for our women cricketers. But it was
(01:09):
a sad time for the West Indies who Jeremy Coney.
They made a good turnaround, much better effort from them.
They got a first in into league, but couldn't sustain it,
could they?
Speaker 4 (01:19):
I was, yeah, right, yeah, I think I suppose what
we've said last week in a way, wasn't it that
It's not as if Test cricket is completely dead and
you know, dead in the water. But it's you know,
they were better overall, weren't they.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
Like any side? You know, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
And that's some of the problems, isn't it for developing
teams like the West Indies. We all know their situation.
They can't pick their best players, we know that. So
they've got a younger side, lots of them have hardly
played any Test matches and it makes a few games
(02:05):
of cricket, doesn't it. And look, five days of competitive
cricket can expose you.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
And yet they.
Speaker 4 (02:11):
Lasted what three and a half days and were very,
very competitive, and they're up against the side that plays
probably what would you say, twice as many Tests a
year than they play anybody exactly, And so you do
become vulnerable at a point against a team like England
(02:31):
and you're chasing a total of say three to eighty
the balls turning and they fell at a heap in
a session.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
They couldn't play spin, and that's understandable. On a slow
track they didn't have the expertise to play. But they've
got some good players amongst that group. You know, Hodge
has been around a while, but by gosh, that century
got in the first innings was good to watch. I
watch most of the partnership with the Athenase and it
(02:58):
was good cricket. They were matching the England attack and
making them look, you know, a less than powerful organization.
But of course in their own conditions they're going to
be a strong bowling attack, even though it's relatively new.
Is it a strong bowling attack that could beat Australia,
don't know, but it's good enough against the West Indies
(03:21):
and the next batting that they're playing a Sri Lanka
I think, isn't it. So you know, they've got the
advantages of playing fairly weak sides to get themselves into
some kind of rhythm for I too down here and
then an Ashes series in Australia.
Speaker 4 (03:38):
They West Indies won the toss field at first. That's
pretty understandable, isn't it, after after what had happened in
the at Lord's. Yeah, And they didn't have and they
didn't have Moti who was this main spinner who was
out and they used three during the match. A guy
called Sinclair, Kevin Sinclud's who bowls off breaks and bats
(04:02):
about number eight and breathweight bowls a few off breaks
and Kavin Hodge. You just mentioned the balls left orthodox
and you.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
Know they they worked pretty hard.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
I thought even in the second innings wards, when when
Brooke and Root had both scored hundreds, they didn't give up.
They they at that stage. I don't know what the
score was, but England must have been four for what
three hundred and something three forty whatever they lost they
(04:36):
they lost their last six wickets for about ninety runs.
That the West Indies didn't give up. I mean there
was some good, good Test cricket that that day when
Wood was bowling. Wods wasn't there? Did you see some
of that? How fast he was bowling?
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Yeah, yeah, he was pretty lethal. And you know, I
think the comment was made by one of the Westerning
players that he was thinking of his family and could
would also think of his family.
Speaker 4 (05:07):
That's right, my wife's I'm thinking of a wife here.
This is not cricket any longer. Yes, it's interesting, isn't it.
But you know Wood bowl, you know, like the wind.
Actually I saw him expose Australia and the Ashes a
year or so ago. He knocked over Kowaja and it
(05:29):
was thrilling watching to see a guy bowling I would
have said in the mid nineties. And he started in
this match, this last match, and I think about ninety three,
and then it went up to ninety five and then.
Speaker 3 (05:44):
It hit ninety seven.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
Well that's about one hundred and fifty seven or one
hundred and fifty eight clicks, and you know, really he
was flinging himself at the batsman. It was a bit
like I hadn't seen that since i'd seen show back
to Bowl. I'd seen Brett Lee bowl Alan Donald at times.
(06:07):
But Wood is up there and maybe they won't yeah,
maybe they won't let him. And then it was back
to the WESTERNI is when I was facing them, and
I knew what Kavim Hodge.
Speaker 3 (06:20):
Was going through.
Speaker 4 (06:21):
So it wasn't perhaps as clinical as the Western because
they spent you know, years playing in county cricket, but
the raw speed, nevertheless, it was it was really good
to watch, So well done the Western is for surviving
that part. They just didn't play long enough. Give them
some more games. That's a problem, isn't it. There's no
(06:43):
games in between the tests.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
They've got to get ready for edge person. That won't
be an easy pitch. In fact, that's quite a difficult
pitch to play on, and they've got the Test match there.
I see that they're very bold now England, they're coming
out oli Pope says they can score six hundred in
a day. Well, the best they've done was about twenty
two years ago against Bangladesh five hundred and nine for nine,
(07:06):
and more recently they scored five hundred six in a
day against Pakistan and Raul Pindy. So they're certainly starting
to believe in themselves. I won't say it's an impossibility.
It could happen, but you're going to have to be
playing pretty well. It'score six hundred in a day against
you know, the Ilford second eleven pretty much, wouldn't you.
Speaker 4 (07:27):
Well, yeah, it could happen. You'd have to be dropping
a few catches. You'd think it's six hundred that they're
having to play quite a few shots, so you can
make mistakes. Of course, when you're doing that and you've
really got the catching becomes suddenly very very important as well.
(07:49):
So we'll wait and see. Yeah, Edgeburston, it doesn't. It's
generally a drier pitchure. It turns a wee bit and
it starts in a couple of days, doesn't it. There's,
as I say, no preparation in between games at all
to give batsman a go and give them a chance
(08:09):
again or bowlers to have a rest or just a
chance to take a breath. Really, So yeah, I hope
the West Indies are able to build on that second Test.
They got a bit out of it, I think, and
so let's let's hope that they can. But show Bashir
(08:30):
also was the man for the second innings for England,
wasn't he. I mean, he's that's going to be interesting
at the baseminds.
Speaker 3 (08:37):
You know, we've watched that pitch last.
Speaker 4 (08:39):
Year and we saw Nathan Lyon how he destroyed New Zealand.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
This guy Basher.
Speaker 4 (08:48):
Turns it, you know, quite dramatically, and he's quite tall.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
He doesn't really give it.
Speaker 4 (08:54):
He bowls into the pitch, doesn't give you a chance
to go down the pitch too much.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
So he's going to be a handful.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
Tough time for the West in these tough times for
the New Zealand women's team. The England clean sweep over
the New Zealand side, winning all eight matches in the
white ball format, shows a glaring concern for women's international
cricket generally. Yes, England a good Australia, good South Africa,
(09:21):
India other side that I think are going to be
the more dangerous side coming up. But the White Fans,
who won't the bronze medal at the Cononwealth Games by
beating England, have now lost those eight games to them.
And when you look at the teams, nine of the
eleven who played at Edgeburston were playing in the last
match that the White Fans played and nine of the
(09:45):
England players were in that side. But they've been winning.
New Zealand have been struggling. And the interesting comment came
from that series through the former New Zealand all rounder
Frankie McKay, at least a decade away from catching up
with England and Australia, she says, well, that's a fairly
(10:06):
savage criticism of of where New Zealand is at, but
it may well be right. Joining on the front foot
is Kirsty Bond, former New Zealand player and also a
former selector over a long period of time for the
White Ferns. Kirsty, is it a fair assessment from Frankie?
Speaker 5 (10:22):
I would think that's probably fairly fair. I mean to
be honest with you, it's a real worry and I
think it is quite hard to see at the moment
how we're going to bridge that gap. It's just gone
on for such a long time now that is really
difficult to see where we're going to go from here
(10:44):
and with what the short term solutions are.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
Really the short term solutions are probably the most important
at the moment, although the long term goals also have
to be considered, because there was a lot of positive
air about the professional contracts that players were getting and
the fact that there were opportunities for the women players
to progress. Is it all about money or I know
(11:09):
that finance is going to be a significant part of it,
But does there need to be other areas where investments
should be made.
Speaker 5 (11:18):
Yes, well, it's not just all about the money. Obviously,
we do need significant injection of capital, I think into
the game to try and make some progress. You Know.
The sad thing is when from from when I played
the game through most of the nineties, late eighties, most
(11:39):
of the nineties, you know, there were some really significant
progress made with the white fans through that through that period,
I feel, you know, we made two World Cup finals
during that decade we really started to develop some depth
in the White Fans and then of course in two
thousand the White Fans won the World Cup, which is
still the only New Zealand team to ever win a
World Cup and the only team in the women's game
(12:01):
outside of Australia or England to win a World Cup.
So there was there was a momentous moment when the
curred and unfortunately the you know, the ball wasn't picked
up and run with from there, and the game, unfortunately
here in New Zealand has been I believe, largely ignored
(12:24):
since then, and we're seeing the fruits of that now,
which is you know, really sad. And the numbers in
the women's game just have not progressed, have not increased
during the professional era, and so yeah, I really believe
there needs to be significant you know, resourcing and money
(12:46):
put into the grassroots of the game to try and
build it up from build it from the bottom.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
Yes, I guess that's easier said than done because there's
only a limited supply of money. But they've got to
do more than pay lip service to the development of
the game. The worry of courses that New Zealand has
relied on Bait Divine previously Sat and to a lesser
extent now Kerr, who's younger. But those other players are
(13:14):
coming to the end of their international careers, one would imagine.
I mean, it doesn't make them old to be mid thirties,
but you know time is running out, isn't it for
some of those players, And we need to develop younger
players to take over the mantle.
Speaker 5 (13:29):
Yeah, we do, and that's been the unfortunate thing is
we just have not had that development underneath the White
Funds happening. And I know that New Zealand Cricket have
and some of the mas have made some progress in
that area in the last you know, two or three years,
but that's going to take time to sort of embed itself,
(13:52):
if you like, and for those players who come through
those programs to make their way through to the higher levels.
You know, we do have some young players and the
White fans at the moment who potentially could be good players,
but unfortunately they have not had that strong cricket underneath
(14:15):
the White Fans that's required to play at international level now.
And I don't think that it's unusual for the White
Funds to be reliant on two or three of their batters,
because that's always been the case, even back in you know,
the nineties, we were we were reliant to a great
extent on DeBie Hockley, and we did during that period
(14:38):
over that time and start to build, like I say,
start to build some depth through some other batters as well.
You know, that was part of the reason why that
that decade became. You know, the White fans were more
successful through that period.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
If we go back a couple of years and the
New Zealand Cricket decided to cut Amy Sattathwaite and others
loose in terms of their contract lad to who at
the time, although she's been back playing again, was that
a bit premature? Did we not have a plan to
have players that's Awdrey will to go to youth and
there is some developing talent there, but it would have
been nice to have some of those players still associated
(15:16):
with the side. Do you agree with that?
Speaker 5 (15:19):
Well, I mean we're only really talking about Amy, I think,
and possibly you know, Frankie herself. So you know, most
of those senior players remained in Baits and Divine and Kerr.
I suppose you'd have to class who now as a
senior player. Even though she's only twenty three, she's played
(15:42):
a lot of cricket and she's been in the White
Ferns environment for getting on for seven or eight years now.
So yeah, I guess the other thing that is a
worry is that some of our players who have been
there for a while for quite some time, like Maddie
(16:03):
Green and Brock Calla Day and Hannah Row perhaps haven't
performed as well as what we would like them to,
and that they're kind of the players that sort of
are the bridge between those older players and they're really
genuine young ones that have come in. So it's really
(16:23):
it is frustrating to watch the White fans at the moment.
But I don't believe we can place too much on
the heads of those young players that have come in
the likes of Plumber and Gays and Carson and so forth,
because that would be really unfair on them. You know.
I do think that it's unfortunate that our senior players
aren't stepping up more and performing more consistently so that
(16:49):
they're you know, leading the leading from the front and
showing those young players how to do it.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Really, I receive email from a lot of cricket fans
and a lot of passionate women cricket fans saying there
needs to be a change also in leadership at the top,
whether it be coaching or administration. Do you feel as
though there's a need to do that or does what
would what would you see as an area that needs
(17:16):
the immediate change from the administration.
Speaker 5 (17:21):
Yeah, well, I think that there isn't there. There is
quite a number of us former players and I expect
to you know, a number of them regularly who are
very frustrated with the current situation and have been for
quite some time. And I think I think it's really
unfortunate that since the amalgamation took place in the nineties
(17:42):
between using on cricket and the women's administration, that many
women who have you know, wanted to put something back
into the game and assist where they can have have
really not had that opportunity. I think there is a
lot of frustration. I think there there are definitely there
(18:03):
needs to be a change of some kind because what
we've been doing is not working and so and I
think we do need to look to our women more
for you know, to provide that drive for the women's
game because they're the ones to me that are really
passionate about the game for women and girls. And I'm
(18:26):
not saying that, you know, men aren't passionate too, but
I do think that there's a lot of women out
there who would be prepared to work for the game
if they were given that opportunity.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
You work around the game in the Canterbury region, do
you see that there is an interest from young girls
and young women to play the game? There seems to
be numbers. I look at the results of the age
group tournaments and I see some outstanding performances in Wellington.
I see some of the young women and their winning
(19:00):
cups and performing well at the seventeen, eighteen to twenty
age group. Are you seeing that our players being developed
properly through the age group?
Speaker 5 (19:12):
Well, I'm certainly seeing it because yeah, I'm quite involved
with that age group through the Willows Cree Club here
in Kensbury, and we certainly are working hard to provide
opportunities for that youth age group. Yeah, I mean, I
think there's definitely talent out there and it just needs
(19:36):
to be identified, and it needs good coaching and it
needs hard cricket, and so there's definitely young women who
are keen to play the game, And I mean, why
wouldn't you. There's there's a definite career opportunity now, and
(19:56):
you know, these young women can be paid very well
if they make it to the elite level. So yeah,
there's definitely there's definitely women out there, were young girls
out there who are really keen to play the game,
and they just are looking for those opportunities. It's just
about providing the right structures and the right systems and
the pathways for them to come through.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
And top level coaching. I sense that the White Fern's
coach is only a part time coach when it comes
to being in New Zealand. He has other business and
that's fine. I guess he has to make a living
as well. But do we need somebody to lead the
coaching and development of young players in New Zealand? Is
there somebody doing that?
Speaker 5 (20:36):
Well, there's a good question, and I don't actually know
the answer to that, you know, I do know. I mean,
obviously we've got an Australian coach at the moment, and
so he doesn't live here full time. Whether that is
something that needs to be locked at, I don't know,
but certainly you know, there certainly needs to be an
awful lot more done for the development of the game
(21:00):
so that we can start to bring young women through
through our ranks, through domestic cricket, through through underage level,
through New Zealand a systems that where they're getting plenty
of strong competitive cricket, so that when they reached that
white fans level, they are ready for that sort of competition.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
Well, we know they were playing a tough side England
and they are a very good side. But you know,
a couple of years ago we beat them for a
Commonwealth Games bronze medal and there are nine players from
the New Zealand side in the team that got beaten recently,
and there were nine from the English side. Yet they
looked as though they were playing a positive brand of
cricket and looked as though they were enjoying themselves. I
(21:47):
read the body language of the New Zealanders. They are
almost totally opposite in terms of the confident group that
won that bronze medal. They need to have a change
and they've got a competition coming up in Bangladesh in
a couple of months, haven't they for the women's T twenty.
Speaker 5 (22:03):
Yeah, and when you look at actually the record of
the team, it's that Commonwealth Games. The record in TA
twenties and one days is not great. So but then
you look at England, who we beat for that bronze medal.
What they've done with since then, has they've really developed
their England team? And I know that they're giving plenty
(22:23):
of opportunities for the players below just below that as well,
so that they're creating real depth and competition for places,
and that's we need to be able to. We need
to do that more as well.
Speaker 2 (22:35):
Yeah, interesting stuff from Kirsty Bond, and I think she's
saying what a lot of New Zealand women cricketers are
saying about the side at the moment. They're just not
fronting up when they should be and the better players,
the experienced players, are not being able to deliver. I
think Kirsty's right when she says Jerry that you know
(22:58):
it's been a common feature that the experienced players have
held the batting together even in her time. You know
where Debbie Hockley and other players were fronting up. Now
it's it's a tough time and a quick repair job
is something that's not going to be easy to defined
(23:21):
and all the money in the world won't prove it either,
will it.
Speaker 4 (23:24):
I found it a hard listen actually once, to be honest,
I know Kirsty, I met her oh years ago and
spent two to three days in christ Church.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
How they're making a coaching video.
Speaker 4 (23:38):
And she and Chris Harris very kindly put up with me.
I felt it was it was, yeah, it was. I
felt a bit heavy hearted there listening to her because
she told a narrative to me. I've lost lost impetus
and momentum from where New Zealand were and in the
(24:01):
in the nineties and of course reaching the pinnacle in
two thousand winning the World Cup. They they were quite
a formidable force actually that New Zealand women's side in
the early two thousands. They got to a semi final
in two thousand and five in the World Cup. They
got to the finals of the ODI World Cup and
the T twenty World Cup in two thousand and nine.
Speaker 3 (24:23):
But since then England.
Speaker 4 (24:26):
And Australia in particular, I guess India have joined that
have raised money and the profile of the women's game
and the importance of it and the disparities that Kirsty
and you have just mentioned are so large now it
kind of looks like amateurs playing professionals those eight matches recently,
(24:50):
And that's our top side, isn't it. They are our
top players. They represent all the female players in New Zealand.
And to be fair, I mean, with the exception of
say the third T twenty match they played, the general
consensus was that was the best team we could have
selected to go to England that was on offer. And
(25:12):
you know, the numbers clearly aren't there. And she also
mentioned that amalgamation didn't she how things when the women's
game came and joined the men's administration. Initially it went
were very well with coaching in the media, but the
grassroots then has atro feed. And I looked up last
(25:35):
night when you told me we were doing this that
in twenty sixteen, over ninety percent of clubs had no
female sides in New Zealand and sixty percent of clubs
didn't even offer cricket.
Speaker 3 (25:51):
For girls at all. What about the short term?
Speaker 4 (25:55):
I'm thinking when you said that you asked her that question,
I guess you're talking about October when they played the
in Blangladesh, isn't it? And I would if it was me,
I'd try and say a few things. I'd say, find
a way to play spin, because you're going to get
spin bowling over in Bangladesh and you're going to find
(26:18):
conditions that are going to assist spin bowling, and they've
a got to stay in b they've got to work
out where they can score and when they move from
defense to trying to score to attack, be aware of
not opening up and favoring the leg side. Do you
(26:39):
know what wadds The England team on green pictures that
had been raining a lot there when they had been playing,
took twenty one of the thirty week in New Zealand
wickets to four. That's about sixty eight to seventy percent.
They bowled over half the overs and they weren't really
turning pictures. They were just right arm or left arm
(27:01):
bowlers bringing the ball back in and so that's one
thing they've got to do, learn to practic against them.
Speaker 3 (27:09):
Secondly, our tech was.
Speaker 4 (27:12):
Reliant on medium fast bowling and in dry spinning conditions,
you've got a bowl at the stumps and clever changes
of pace.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
That's number two.
Speaker 4 (27:22):
Number three, hold their catchers, hold their catchers. And the
lastly people like Green and Halliday have got a join
baits Divine Kerr and use their batting to get use
most of the overs, so that I don't know, what
(27:42):
do you think in the short term.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Well, I think they've got to do something different, because
as the old adages, you don't do the same thing
and expect a different outcome. And that is one of
the areas that I was concerned about whether the coaching
is that is getting through to those players. They took
Lauren down who to my mind is probably one of
their best technically equipped players, and how she hasn't played
(28:07):
a lot of cricket, but when they used her, they
batted her down the order. And also they took another player,
Mikayla greg who's been around for quite a period of
time in the New Zealand Woman's game and she didn't
even play a game. Now, somewhere along the line, you've
got to make a change. The likes of Plumber is
struggling at the top of the order. Divines should be
(28:28):
opening in ten twenties to my mind, and plumb it
down the order. Now you can understand that they are
trying new things and that might well have been the
case for this side but it hasn't worked. And they're
going to go to a World Championship a series in
Bangladesh and as you say they're going to need spinners, well,
England had three of the very best on show, didn't
(28:48):
they And they just monstered the New Zealand side. So
somewhere along the line, they've got to find a way
to play the game in those conditions. They've got to
find a way to work the ball into a gap
and take a single, to rotate the strike, to do anything,
rather than be left with having to play million dollar
(29:08):
shots that ended up getting them out towards the end.
And I watched the games on the New Zealand Cricket website.
They came in from SkyTV, so we had to put
up with the likes of Nick Knight and and just
cronies basically doing their best to give New Zealand a chance.
(29:29):
But it was difficult to watch. But the things that
you say are to me the most important things. The
other thing is body language. England looked as though they
were enjoying themselves. They were having fun. They told us
they were there to be ruthless and they were. The
New Zealand side looked as though they were looking to
(29:51):
try and save the game all the time rather than
go out and win it. And I think you have
to achieve that first before you can believe in yourself
and your ability to win games. I know it's harsh,
but I think they've got a face up to that
and I hope they're doing the inquiry that is doing
that at New Zealand Cricket High Performance.
Speaker 3 (30:14):
Yeah, I believe they are.
Speaker 4 (30:16):
I've made a few inquiries and I think that is
that's that's that's going to happen.
Speaker 3 (30:21):
I just want to see the team improve once.
Speaker 4 (30:24):
I'd like to see them getting better, you know over
a five Well there's eight games here. You'd want to
see them improve over those eight games. That might not
mean that they necessarily win straight away.
Speaker 1 (30:37):
Brian Waddle Jeremy Cooney on the front foot.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
Jerry, I s hit your task last week?
Speaker 3 (30:42):
Did you do it?
Speaker 2 (30:43):
Well?
Speaker 3 (30:43):
What was the task again?
Speaker 2 (30:47):
Don't tell me?
Speaker 3 (30:50):
What about the coach?
Speaker 2 (30:53):
About the bowling coach? Who's going to be the next
bowling coach? Is that there's an offer up They've asked
for somebody to apply. Have you applied? I've applied time
during the cricket season.
Speaker 4 (31:04):
Yeah, I've applied, I've written a very long letter and
I'm sending it by a pigeon.
Speaker 3 (31:11):
Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (31:14):
I don't know quite how to approach this one, Wadds.
I mean with you and I can trade names, which
is kind of the way most podcasts kind of go,
if you know what I mean, I'm The first thing
is it'll be it's run by the High Performance. They
(31:35):
are the people who'll be, you know, interviewing, so it'll
be old Stronach will be there interviewing potential coaches who
are interested, so you might get the message yourself tomorrow, Wodds.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
And and he will have run around the various thing.
Speaker 4 (31:55):
He'll have his little black book that he'll have names
and I would hope, and he'll consult I would have
thought he had consulted overseas players, you know, even if
they're New Zealands. Wouldn't he can salt Fleming and Bond
and Vittore and those sorts of people to get their ideas.
Surely you use you'd use that resource that we've got.
(32:20):
The second thing, so that's who's in charge at this stage.
The second point is you can't avoid seeing the different
coaches around when New Zealand play this last year. I've
seen Jacob Orum, Kyle Mills was at the base in Reserve,
(32:42):
if you remember Graham Oldridge. I've seen around as well.
So I would ask you a couple of questions. Is
there a pathway for coaching. We've got a pathway for players,
we know that age groups, development teams, you know, and
then working through to provincial sides, A teams going through
(33:04):
and to again different selection elevens and from the A
side you then move, if you're good enough, into the
New Zealand side. Is there some sort of pathway for coaches?
Can you tell me that.
Speaker 2 (33:17):
No, they have a plan I suppose about what they're
going to do with coaches. I mean, Jurgensen was not
going to be the bowling coach for the rest of time,
so you know you must have somebody lined up who
would we like next Onnce Shane moves on, which he
has done to take over Wellington and he's spent a
good time with a lot of the bowlers and now
he's working with the likes of Seers and down well
(33:40):
Nathan Smith as well, and down in Canterbury a guy
called Brendan Donkers who's coached the New Zealand eighteen when
they went on a trip to Australia. Is working with
Zach Fuchs, with Will O'Rourke, and they must be in
the frame. Donkers certainly must be in the frame seeing
that Shane Jurgenson has moved on, so they must have
(34:04):
a front runner, you would think, wouldn't you.
Speaker 4 (34:07):
You're right, well, I'm not sure whether we've asked the
question about a pathway for coaches, because that's a more
long term kind of thing.
Speaker 3 (34:15):
Is that we are in the end.
Speaker 4 (34:17):
I don't think we could ever if most boards get
their money to dispense with around New Zealand from the
television broadcast funds. Spark have pulled out, HEVI and z
have moved in for the last couple of years.
Speaker 3 (34:37):
What's going to happen then?
Speaker 4 (34:39):
So I'm not convinced we are going to have that
money to be able to spend on the people like, well,
you're not going to get a fleming, are you. You're
not going to get a bond, You're not going to.
Speaker 3 (34:52):
Get a vitry.
Speaker 4 (34:54):
Those kinds of coaches McCullum, they're out of out of
the league, I'm afraid. And those coaches that come from Australia, England,
India are are untouched of and I would have thought
they're a coaches as well, wouldn't be interested in coming
(35:15):
to New Zealand and we couldn't offer them the money anyway.
So we are restricted if we are looking elsewhere in
the world other than at home, we are restricted to
going and looking at South Africa eighteen. Now that's what
makes me think there's no pathway. Rob Walter was here
in New Zealand at Central Districts. He took the eighteen
(35:38):
to India and he's gone. He's now lead.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
Coach to South Africa, isn't he.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (35:47):
Heinrich Mullan was up in Auckland. He's now head coach
of Ireland. We are losing coaches. They're going the other way.
Speaker 3 (35:59):
Now.
Speaker 4 (35:59):
That says to me there's no pathway. There was no
one tapping Rob Walter or Heinrich Mallard on the shoulder
saying hey, my name is Brian Strottich. We're really interested
in looking at you for the for the New Zealand coach.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
That didn't happen.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
I don't think, well, they've taken the other per path.
That's the that's the problem. You're talking about the pathway's
gone in the wrong direction and we are needing some
Well that's right now. So you know the bowling coach
is the first option that they've had to make a
decision on. And I guess in time we'll know I'll
(36:33):
go for Brendan Donkers.
Speaker 4 (36:35):
Well what what what I mean? We're in a time
of transition, right. You need experienced coaches, you need a
lot of technical info.
Speaker 3 (36:47):
You've got to have.
Speaker 4 (36:47):
Good systems of data so you when you analyze things,
you improve them and you avoid injuries.
Speaker 3 (36:53):
Are raw and seers.
Speaker 4 (36:56):
And we've got Duffy in the contract now in the
contract system.
Speaker 3 (36:59):
Yes, who is going.
Speaker 4 (37:01):
We've also, if you think about it, we've got a
number of spinners plying their trade with the Red but
we've got Phillip's a beginner. We've got Satna learning to
be different in how to get a turning ball through
the defense, not just a through attack a batsman attacking.
We've got ag As Patel who goes up and down.
It gets the ball up and then down before the batsman,
(37:23):
but he needs more consistency. We've got Bracewooll who is
much the same as Patel up and down but potentially
a big turner. I think we need a spin coach.
We're off to India for three Tests.
Speaker 3 (37:36):
We are also.
Speaker 4 (37:36):
Playing Pakistan and Sri Lanka. You know, do we want
up and downsmen?
Speaker 3 (37:42):
As?
Speaker 4 (37:42):
Do we want to show a Basha a tall bowler
to bowl into the pitch. So I reckon we need
a spin coach as well, a Jeeton Patel who's with England. Now,
we can't afford this swads. New Zealand cannot afford those people.
What do we do We come back to New Zealand
(38:04):
is the answer.
Speaker 3 (38:06):
Now.
Speaker 4 (38:06):
I like the look of Andre Adams and I think
he thinks differently. I think he he's shown that he's
been a coach of New Zealand in the past.
Speaker 3 (38:22):
He was at Auckland for some years.
Speaker 4 (38:28):
He's currently in Bangladesh. They all get paid US dollars
of course, and they'll be all converting and back to
New Zealand dollars and things like that. I would like
to see him given an opportunity. I think he's a
very good player, highly regarded coached in Australia as well
(38:50):
as stateside. I'd like to see him have a crack.
But I understand you Brent your donkers, not your bonkers,
your donkers, because he's at the high performance as well,
and he's worked with those players, so that I think
we're going to have to be homegrown. Was I don't
We've got haven't got a chance otherwise.
Speaker 2 (39:10):
Themes the way it's going, and it'll be interesting to
see what happens when they finally make a decision, because
as you say, they're not far away from sending a
team to the subcontinent and to play against India where
a good bowling coach will be required. We'll wait for
the outcome of that. You have your money where it is, Jerry.
I'll bow to your knowledge, experience and research capacity.
Speaker 3 (39:38):
And that's what you.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
Said, the ultimate compliment and thank you for doing the
work that I gave you. You can have a little
rest and watch the Test match from Edgemstone and we'll
talk about that next week on the front four eight.
Speaker 3 (39:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (39:56):
I'm looking forward to that, see how the Westerndies go
and see if they can continue that little bit of
improvement back for another half day and the second innings.
Speaker 3 (40:07):
That'll be good.
Speaker 4 (40:08):
Those little improvements and steps that I was talking about
for the.
Speaker 3 (40:12):
Women exactly trip the next week, mate, take care of
me winter well, all the world the qualities of summer sing.
Speaker 4 (40:22):
Do do
Speaker 1 (40:27):
For more from News Talk, set B Listen live on
air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever
you go with our podcasts on iHeartRadio
You're listening to a podcast from News Talk sat B.
Follow this and our wide range of podcasts now on
iHeart Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Take another pad.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
Now it's a trick.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
It is out. The Test is over. Goodness smooth, wows
a beauty. It is out and hearing guys.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
This delivery has in the uses to Bowl.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
On the Front Foot with Brian Waddell and Jeremy Cody,
powered by News Talks head B at iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Hello, here we are on the front foots again. Louis
Didnay couldn't sustain their batting format. Brent Bridge who should
be the black cats next bowling coach? And there's turmoil
in the women's game up the failure of a white
fern to win a game in England. Boy, wasn't that
a fat time for our women cricketers. But it was
(01:09):
a sad time for the West Indies who Jeremy Coney.
They made a good turnaround, much better effort from them.
They got a first in into league, but couldn't sustain it,
could they?
Speaker 4 (01:19):
I was, yeah, right, yeah, I think I suppose what
we've said last week in a way, wasn't it that
It's not as if Test cricket is completely dead and
you know, dead in the water. But it's you know,
they were better overall, weren't they.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
Like any side? You know, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
And that's some of the problems, isn't it for developing
teams like the West Indies. We all know their situation.
They can't pick their best players, we know that. So
they've got a younger side, lots of them have hardly
played any Test matches and it makes a few games
(02:05):
of cricket, doesn't it. And look, five days of competitive
cricket can expose you.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
And yet they.
Speaker 4 (02:11):
Lasted what three and a half days and were very,
very competitive, and they're up against the side that plays
probably what would you say, twice as many Tests a
year than they play anybody exactly, And so you do
become vulnerable at a point against a team like England
(02:31):
and you're chasing a total of say three to eighty
the balls turning and they fell at a heap in
a session.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
They couldn't play spin, and that's understandable. On a slow
track they didn't have the expertise to play. But they've
got some good players amongst that group. You know, Hodge
has been around a while, but by gosh, that century
got in the first innings was good to watch. I
watch most of the partnership with the Athenase and it
(02:58):
was good cricket. They were matching the England attack and
making them look, you know, a less than powerful organization.
But of course in their own conditions they're going to
be a strong bowling attack, even though it's relatively new.
Is it a strong bowling attack that could beat Australia,
don't know, but it's good enough against the West Indies
(03:21):
and the next batting that they're playing a Sri Lanka
I think, isn't it. So you know, they've got the
advantages of playing fairly weak sides to get themselves into
some kind of rhythm for I too down here and
then an Ashes series in Australia.
Speaker 4 (03:38):
They West Indies won the toss field at first. That's
pretty understandable, isn't it, after after what had happened in
the at Lord's. Yeah, And they didn't have and they
didn't have Moti who was this main spinner who was
out and they used three during the match. A guy
called Sinclair, Kevin Sinclud's who bowls off breaks and bats
(04:02):
about number eight and breathweight bowls a few off breaks
and Kavin Hodge. You just mentioned the balls left orthodox
and you.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
Know they they worked pretty hard.
Speaker 4 (04:13):
I thought even in the second innings wards, when when
Brooke and Root had both scored hundreds, they didn't give up.
They they at that stage. I don't know what the
score was, but England must have been four for what
three hundred and something three forty whatever they lost they
(04:36):
they lost their last six wickets for about ninety runs.
That the West Indies didn't give up. I mean there
was some good, good Test cricket that that day when
Wood was bowling. Wods wasn't there? Did you see some
of that? How fast he was bowling?
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Yeah, yeah, he was pretty lethal. And you know, I
think the comment was made by one of the Westerning
players that he was thinking of his family and could
would also think of his family.
Speaker 4 (05:07):
That's right, my wife's I'm thinking of a wife here.
This is not cricket any longer. Yes, it's interesting, isn't it.
But you know Wood bowl, you know, like the wind.
Actually I saw him expose Australia and the Ashes a
year or so ago. He knocked over Kowaja and it
(05:29):
was thrilling watching to see a guy bowling I would
have said in the mid nineties. And he started in
this match, this last match, and I think about ninety three,
and then it went up to ninety five and then.
Speaker 3 (05:44):
It hit ninety seven.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
Well that's about one hundred and fifty seven or one
hundred and fifty eight clicks, and you know, really he
was flinging himself at the batsman. It was a bit
like I hadn't seen that since i'd seen show back
to Bowl. I'd seen Brett Lee bowl Alan Donald at times.
(06:07):
But Wood is up there and maybe they won't yeah,
maybe they won't let him. And then it was back
to the WESTERNI is when I was facing them, and
I knew what Kavim Hodge.
Speaker 3 (06:20):
Was going through.
Speaker 4 (06:21):
So it wasn't perhaps as clinical as the Western because
they spent you know, years playing in county cricket, but
the raw speed, nevertheless, it was it was really good
to watch, So well done the Western is for surviving
that part. They just didn't play long enough. Give them
some more games. That's a problem, isn't it. There's no
(06:43):
games in between the tests.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
They've got to get ready for edge person. That won't
be an easy pitch. In fact, that's quite a difficult
pitch to play on, and they've got the Test match there.
I see that they're very bold now England, they're coming
out oli Pope says they can score six hundred in
a day. Well, the best they've done was about twenty
two years ago against Bangladesh five hundred and nine for nine,
(07:06):
and more recently they scored five hundred six in a
day against Pakistan and Raul Pindy. So they're certainly starting
to believe in themselves. I won't say it's an impossibility.
It could happen, but you're going to have to be
playing pretty well. It'score six hundred in a day against
you know, the Ilford second eleven pretty much, wouldn't you.
Speaker 4 (07:27):
Well, yeah, it could happen. You'd have to be dropping
a few catches. You'd think it's six hundred that they're
having to play quite a few shots, so you can
make mistakes. Of course, when you're doing that and you've
really got the catching becomes suddenly very very important as well.
(07:49):
So we'll wait and see. Yeah, Edgeburston, it doesn't. It's
generally a drier pitchure. It turns a wee bit and
it starts in a couple of days, doesn't it. There's,
as I say, no preparation in between games at all
to give batsman a go and give them a chance
(08:09):
again or bowlers to have a rest or just a
chance to take a breath. Really, So yeah, I hope
the West Indies are able to build on that second Test.
They got a bit out of it, I think, and
so let's let's hope that they can. But show Bashir
(08:30):
also was the man for the second innings for England,
wasn't he. I mean, he's that's going to be interesting
at the baseminds.
Speaker 3 (08:37):
You know, we've watched that pitch last.
Speaker 4 (08:39):
Year and we saw Nathan Lyon how he destroyed New Zealand.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
This guy Basher.
Speaker 4 (08:48):
Turns it, you know, quite dramatically, and he's quite tall.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
He doesn't really give it.
Speaker 4 (08:54):
He bowls into the pitch, doesn't give you a chance
to go down the pitch too much.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
So he's going to be a handful.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
Tough time for the West in these tough times for
the New Zealand women's team. The England clean sweep over
the New Zealand side, winning all eight matches in the
white ball format, shows a glaring concern for women's international
cricket generally. Yes, England a good Australia, good South Africa,
(09:21):
India other side that I think are going to be
the more dangerous side coming up. But the White Fans,
who won't the bronze medal at the Cononwealth Games by
beating England, have now lost those eight games to them.
And when you look at the teams, nine of the
eleven who played at Edgeburston were playing in the last
match that the White Fans played and nine of the
(09:45):
England players were in that side. But they've been winning.
New Zealand have been struggling. And the interesting comment came
from that series through the former New Zealand all rounder
Frankie McKay, at least a decade away from catching up
with England and Australia, she says, well, that's a fairly
(10:06):
savage criticism of of where New Zealand is at, but
it may well be right. Joining on the front foot
is Kirsty Bond, former New Zealand player and also a
former selector over a long period of time for the
White Ferns. Kirsty, is it a fair assessment from Frankie?
Speaker 5 (10:22):
I would think that's probably fairly fair. I mean to
be honest with you, it's a real worry and I
think it is quite hard to see at the moment
how we're going to bridge that gap. It's just gone
on for such a long time now that is really
difficult to see where we're going to go from here
(10:44):
and with what the short term solutions are.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
Really the short term solutions are probably the most important
at the moment, although the long term goals also have
to be considered, because there was a lot of positive
air about the professional contracts that players were getting and
the fact that there were opportunities for the women players
to progress. Is it all about money or I know
(11:09):
that finance is going to be a significant part of it,
But does there need to be other areas where investments
should be made.
Speaker 5 (11:18):
Yes, well, it's not just all about the money. Obviously,
we do need significant injection of capital, I think into
the game to try and make some progress. You Know.
The sad thing is when from from when I played
the game through most of the nineties, late eighties, most
(11:39):
of the nineties, you know, there were some really significant
progress made with the white fans through that through that period,
I feel, you know, we made two World Cup finals
during that decade we really started to develop some depth
in the White Fans and then of course in two
thousand the White Fans won the World Cup, which is
still the only New Zealand team to ever win a
World Cup and the only team in the women's game
(12:01):
outside of Australia or England to win a World Cup.
So there was there was a momentous moment when the
curred and unfortunately the you know, the ball wasn't picked
up and run with from there, and the game, unfortunately
here in New Zealand has been I believe, largely ignored
(12:24):
since then, and we're seeing the fruits of that now,
which is you know, really sad. And the numbers in
the women's game just have not progressed, have not increased
during the professional era, and so yeah, I really believe
there needs to be significant you know, resourcing and money
(12:46):
put into the grassroots of the game to try and
build it up from build it from the bottom.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
Yes, I guess that's easier said than done because there's
only a limited supply of money. But they've got to
do more than pay lip service to the development of
the game. The worry of courses that New Zealand has
relied on Bait Divine previously Sat and to a lesser
extent now Kerr, who's younger. But those other players are
(13:14):
coming to the end of their international careers, one would imagine.
I mean, it doesn't make them old to be mid thirties,
but you know time is running out, isn't it for
some of those players, And we need to develop younger
players to take over the mantle.
Speaker 5 (13:29):
Yeah, we do, and that's been the unfortunate thing is
we just have not had that development underneath the White
Funds happening. And I know that New Zealand Cricket have
and some of the mas have made some progress in
that area in the last you know, two or three years,
but that's going to take time to sort of embed itself,
(13:52):
if you like, and for those players who come through
those programs to make their way through to the higher levels.
You know, we do have some young players and the
White fans at the moment who potentially could be good players,
but unfortunately they have not had that strong cricket underneath
(14:15):
the White Fans that's required to play at international level now.
And I don't think that it's unusual for the White
Funds to be reliant on two or three of their batters,
because that's always been the case, even back in you know,
the nineties, we were we were reliant to a great
extent on DeBie Hockley, and we did during that period
(14:38):
over that time and start to build, like I say,
start to build some depth through some other batters as well.
You know, that was part of the reason why that
that decade became. You know, the White fans were more
successful through that period.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
If we go back a couple of years and the
New Zealand Cricket decided to cut Amy Sattathwaite and others
loose in terms of their contract lad to who at
the time, although she's been back playing again, was that
a bit premature? Did we not have a plan to
have players that's Awdrey will to go to youth and
there is some developing talent there, but it would have
been nice to have some of those players still associated
(15:16):
with the side. Do you agree with that?
Speaker 5 (15:19):
Well, I mean we're only really talking about Amy, I think,
and possibly you know, Frankie herself. So you know, most
of those senior players remained in Baits and Divine and Kerr.
I suppose you'd have to class who now as a
senior player. Even though she's only twenty three, she's played
(15:42):
a lot of cricket and she's been in the White
Ferns environment for getting on for seven or eight years now.
So yeah, I guess the other thing that is a
worry is that some of our players who have been
there for a while for quite some time, like Maddie
(16:03):
Green and Brock Calla Day and Hannah Row perhaps haven't
performed as well as what we would like them to,
and that they're kind of the players that sort of
are the bridge between those older players and they're really
genuine young ones that have come in. So it's really
(16:23):
it is frustrating to watch the White fans at the moment.
But I don't believe we can place too much on
the heads of those young players that have come in
the likes of Plumber and Gays and Carson and so forth,
because that would be really unfair on them. You know.
I do think that it's unfortunate that our senior players
aren't stepping up more and performing more consistently so that
(16:49):
they're you know, leading the leading from the front and
showing those young players how to do it.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Really, I receive email from a lot of cricket fans
and a lot of passionate women cricket fans saying there
needs to be a change also in leadership at the top,
whether it be coaching or administration. Do you feel as
though there's a need to do that or does what
would what would you see as an area that needs
(17:16):
the immediate change from the administration.
Speaker 5 (17:21):
Yeah, well, I think that there isn't there. There is
quite a number of us former players and I expect
to you know, a number of them regularly who are
very frustrated with the current situation and have been for
quite some time. And I think I think it's really
unfortunate that since the amalgamation took place in the nineties
(17:42):
between using on cricket and the women's administration, that many
women who have you know, wanted to put something back
into the game and assist where they can have have
really not had that opportunity. I think there is a
lot of frustration. I think there there are definitely there
(18:03):
needs to be a change of some kind because what
we've been doing is not working and so and I
think we do need to look to our women more
for you know, to provide that drive for the women's
game because they're the ones to me that are really
passionate about the game for women and girls. And I'm
(18:26):
not saying that, you know, men aren't passionate too, but
I do think that there's a lot of women out
there who would be prepared to work for the game
if they were given that opportunity.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
You work around the game in the Canterbury region, do
you see that there is an interest from young girls
and young women to play the game? There seems to
be numbers. I look at the results of the age
group tournaments and I see some outstanding performances in Wellington.
I see some of the young women and their winning
(19:00):
cups and performing well at the seventeen, eighteen to twenty
age group. Are you seeing that our players being developed
properly through the age group?
Speaker 5 (19:12):
Well, I'm certainly seeing it because yeah, I'm quite involved
with that age group through the Willows Cree Club here
in Kensbury, and we certainly are working hard to provide
opportunities for that youth age group. Yeah, I mean, I
think there's definitely talent out there and it just needs
(19:36):
to be identified, and it needs good coaching and it
needs hard cricket, and so there's definitely young women who
are keen to play the game, And I mean, why
wouldn't you. There's there's a definite career opportunity now, and
(19:56):
you know, these young women can be paid very well
if they make it to the elite level. So yeah,
there's definitely there's definitely women out there, were young girls
out there who are really keen to play the game,
and they just are looking for those opportunities. It's just
about providing the right structures and the right systems and
the pathways for them to come through.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
And top level coaching. I sense that the White Fern's
coach is only a part time coach when it comes
to being in New Zealand. He has other business and
that's fine. I guess he has to make a living
as well. But do we need somebody to lead the
coaching and development of young players in New Zealand? Is
there somebody doing that?
Speaker 5 (20:36):
Well, there's a good question, and I don't actually know
the answer to that, you know, I do know. I mean,
obviously we've got an Australian coach at the moment, and
so he doesn't live here full time. Whether that is
something that needs to be locked at, I don't know,
but certainly you know, there certainly needs to be an
awful lot more done for the development of the game
(21:00):
so that we can start to bring young women through
through our ranks, through domestic cricket, through through underage level,
through New Zealand a systems that where they're getting plenty
of strong competitive cricket, so that when they reached that
white fans level, they are ready for that sort of competition.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
Well, we know they were playing a tough side England
and they are a very good side. But you know,
a couple of years ago we beat them for a
Commonwealth Games bronze medal and there are nine players from
the New Zealand side in the team that got beaten recently,
and there were nine from the English side. Yet they
looked as though they were playing a positive brand of
cricket and looked as though they were enjoying themselves. I
(21:47):
read the body language of the New Zealanders. They are
almost totally opposite in terms of the confident group that
won that bronze medal. They need to have a change
and they've got a competition coming up in Bangladesh in
a couple of months, haven't they for the women's T twenty.
Speaker 5 (22:03):
Yeah, and when you look at actually the record of
the team, it's that Commonwealth Games. The record in TA
twenties and one days is not great. So but then
you look at England, who we beat for that bronze medal.
What they've done with since then, has they've really developed
their England team? And I know that they're giving plenty
(22:23):
of opportunities for the players below just below that as well,
so that they're creating real depth and competition for places,
and that's we need to be able to. We need
to do that more as well.
Speaker 2 (22:35):
Yeah, interesting stuff from Kirsty Bond, and I think she's
saying what a lot of New Zealand women cricketers are
saying about the side at the moment. They're just not
fronting up when they should be and the better players,
the experienced players, are not being able to deliver. I
think Kirsty's right when she says Jerry that you know
(22:58):
it's been a common feature that the experienced players have
held the batting together even in her time. You know
where Debbie Hockley and other players were fronting up. Now
it's it's a tough time and a quick repair job
is something that's not going to be easy to defined
(23:21):
and all the money in the world won't prove it either,
will it.
Speaker 4 (23:24):
I found it a hard listen actually once, to be honest,
I know Kirsty, I met her oh years ago and
spent two to three days in christ Church.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
How they're making a coaching video.
Speaker 4 (23:38):
And she and Chris Harris very kindly put up with me.
I felt it was it was, yeah, it was. I
felt a bit heavy hearted there listening to her because
she told a narrative to me. I've lost lost impetus
and momentum from where New Zealand were and in the
(24:01):
in the nineties and of course reaching the pinnacle in
two thousand winning the World Cup. They they were quite
a formidable force actually that New Zealand women's side in
the early two thousands. They got to a semi final
in two thousand and five in the World Cup. They
got to the finals of the ODI World Cup and
the T twenty World Cup in two thousand and nine.
Speaker 3 (24:23):
But since then England.
Speaker 4 (24:26):
And Australia in particular, I guess India have joined that
have raised money and the profile of the women's game
and the importance of it and the disparities that Kirsty
and you have just mentioned are so large now it
kind of looks like amateurs playing professionals those eight matches recently,
(24:50):
And that's our top side, isn't it. They are our
top players. They represent all the female players in New Zealand.
And to be fair, I mean, with the exception of
say the third T twenty match they played, the general
consensus was that was the best team we could have
selected to go to England that was on offer. And
(25:12):
you know, the numbers clearly aren't there. And she also
mentioned that amalgamation didn't she how things when the women's
game came and joined the men's administration. Initially it went
were very well with coaching in the media, but the
grassroots then has atro feed. And I looked up last
(25:35):
night when you told me we were doing this that
in twenty sixteen, over ninety percent of clubs had no
female sides in New Zealand and sixty percent of clubs
didn't even offer cricket.
Speaker 3 (25:51):
For girls at all. What about the short term?
Speaker 4 (25:55):
I'm thinking when you said that you asked her that question,
I guess you're talking about October when they played the
in Blangladesh, isn't it? And I would if it was me,
I'd try and say a few things. I'd say, find
a way to play spin, because you're going to get
spin bowling over in Bangladesh and you're going to find
(26:18):
conditions that are going to assist spin bowling, and they've
a got to stay in b they've got to work
out where they can score and when they move from
defense to trying to score to attack, be aware of
not opening up and favoring the leg side. Do you
(26:39):
know what wadds The England team on green pictures that
had been raining a lot there when they had been playing,
took twenty one of the thirty week in New Zealand
wickets to four. That's about sixty eight to seventy percent.
They bowled over half the overs and they weren't really
turning pictures. They were just right arm or left arm
(27:01):
bowlers bringing the ball back in and so that's one
thing they've got to do, learn to practic against them.
Speaker 3 (27:09):
Secondly, our tech was.
Speaker 4 (27:12):
Reliant on medium fast bowling and in dry spinning conditions,
you've got a bowl at the stumps and clever changes
of pace.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
That's number two.
Speaker 4 (27:22):
Number three, hold their catchers, hold their catchers. And the
lastly people like Green and Halliday have got a join
baits Divine Kerr and use their batting to get use
most of the overs, so that I don't know, what
(27:42):
do you think in the short term.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Well, I think they've got to do something different, because
as the old adages, you don't do the same thing
and expect a different outcome. And that is one of
the areas that I was concerned about whether the coaching
is that is getting through to those players. They took
Lauren down who to my mind is probably one of
their best technically equipped players, and how she hasn't played
(28:07):
a lot of cricket, but when they used her, they
batted her down the order. And also they took another player,
Mikayla greg who's been around for quite a period of
time in the New Zealand Woman's game and she didn't
even play a game. Now, somewhere along the line, you've
got to make a change. The likes of Plumber is
struggling at the top of the order. Divines should be
(28:28):
opening in ten twenties to my mind, and plumb it
down the order. Now you can understand that they are
trying new things and that might well have been the
case for this side but it hasn't worked. And they're
going to go to a World Championship a series in
Bangladesh and as you say they're going to need spinners, well,
England had three of the very best on show, didn't
(28:48):
they And they just monstered the New Zealand side. So
somewhere along the line, they've got to find a way
to play the game in those conditions. They've got to
find a way to work the ball into a gap
and take a single, to rotate the strike, to do anything,
rather than be left with having to play million dollar
(29:08):
shots that ended up getting them out towards the end.
And I watched the games on the New Zealand Cricket website.
They came in from SkyTV, so we had to put
up with the likes of Nick Knight and and just
cronies basically doing their best to give New Zealand a chance.
(29:29):
But it was difficult to watch. But the things that
you say are to me the most important things. The
other thing is body language. England looked as though they
were enjoying themselves. They were having fun. They told us
they were there to be ruthless and they were. The
New Zealand side looked as though they were looking to
(29:51):
try and save the game all the time rather than
go out and win it. And I think you have
to achieve that first before you can believe in yourself
and your ability to win games. I know it's harsh,
but I think they've got a face up to that
and I hope they're doing the inquiry that is doing
that at New Zealand Cricket High Performance.
Speaker 3 (30:14):
Yeah, I believe they are.
Speaker 4 (30:16):
I've made a few inquiries and I think that is
that's that's that's going to happen.
Speaker 3 (30:21):
I just want to see the team improve once.
Speaker 4 (30:24):
I'd like to see them getting better, you know over
a five Well there's eight games here. You'd want to
see them improve over those eight games. That might not
mean that they necessarily win straight away.
Speaker 1 (30:37):
Brian Waddle Jeremy Cooney on the front foot.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
Jerry, I s hit your task last week?
Speaker 3 (30:42):
Did you do it?
Speaker 2 (30:43):
Well?
Speaker 3 (30:43):
What was the task again?
Speaker 2 (30:47):
Don't tell me?
Speaker 3 (30:50):
What about the coach?
Speaker 2 (30:53):
About the bowling coach? Who's going to be the next
bowling coach? Is that there's an offer up They've asked
for somebody to apply. Have you applied? I've applied time
during the cricket season.
Speaker 4 (31:04):
Yeah, I've applied, I've written a very long letter and
I'm sending it by a pigeon.
Speaker 3 (31:11):
Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (31:14):
I don't know quite how to approach this one, Wadds.
I mean with you and I can trade names, which
is kind of the way most podcasts kind of go,
if you know what I mean, I'm The first thing
is it'll be it's run by the High Performance. They
(31:35):
are the people who'll be, you know, interviewing, so it'll
be old Stronach will be there interviewing potential coaches who
are interested, so you might get the message yourself tomorrow, Wodds.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
And and he will have run around the various thing.
Speaker 4 (31:55):
He'll have his little black book that he'll have names
and I would hope, and he'll consult I would have
thought he had consulted overseas players, you know, even if
they're New Zealands. Wouldn't he can salt Fleming and Bond
and Vittore and those sorts of people to get their ideas.
Surely you use you'd use that resource that we've got.
(32:20):
The second thing, so that's who's in charge at this stage.
The second point is you can't avoid seeing the different
coaches around when New Zealand play this last year. I've
seen Jacob Orum, Kyle Mills was at the base in Reserve,
(32:42):
if you remember Graham Oldridge. I've seen around as well.
So I would ask you a couple of questions. Is
there a pathway for coaching. We've got a pathway for players,
we know that age groups, development teams, you know, and
then working through to provincial sides, A teams going through
(33:04):
and to again different selection elevens and from the A
side you then move, if you're good enough, into the
New Zealand side. Is there some sort of pathway for coaches?
Can you tell me that.
Speaker 2 (33:17):
No, they have a plan I suppose about what they're
going to do with coaches. I mean, Jurgensen was not
going to be the bowling coach for the rest of time,
so you know you must have somebody lined up who
would we like next Onnce Shane moves on, which he
has done to take over Wellington and he's spent a
good time with a lot of the bowlers and now
he's working with the likes of Seers and down well
(33:40):
Nathan Smith as well, and down in Canterbury a guy
called Brendan Donkers who's coached the New Zealand eighteen when
they went on a trip to Australia. Is working with
Zach Fuchs, with Will O'Rourke, and they must be in
the frame. Donkers certainly must be in the frame seeing
that Shane Jurgenson has moved on, so they must have
(34:04):
a front runner, you would think, wouldn't you.
Speaker 4 (34:07):
You're right, well, I'm not sure whether we've asked the
question about a pathway for coaches, because that's a more
long term kind of thing.
Speaker 3 (34:15):
Is that we are in the end.
Speaker 4 (34:17):
I don't think we could ever if most boards get
their money to dispense with around New Zealand from the
television broadcast funds. Spark have pulled out, HEVI and z
have moved in for the last couple of years.
Speaker 3 (34:37):
What's going to happen then?
Speaker 4 (34:39):
So I'm not convinced we are going to have that
money to be able to spend on the people like, well,
you're not going to get a fleming, are you. You're
not going to get a bond, You're not going to.
Speaker 3 (34:52):
Get a vitry.
Speaker 4 (34:54):
Those kinds of coaches McCullum, they're out of out of
the league, I'm afraid. And those coaches that come from Australia, England,
India are are untouched of and I would have thought
they're a coaches as well, wouldn't be interested in coming
(35:15):
to New Zealand and we couldn't offer them the money anyway.
So we are restricted if we are looking elsewhere in
the world other than at home, we are restricted to
going and looking at South Africa eighteen. Now that's what
makes me think there's no pathway. Rob Walter was here
in New Zealand at Central Districts. He took the eighteen
(35:38):
to India and he's gone. He's now lead.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
Coach to South Africa, isn't he.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (35:47):
Heinrich Mullan was up in Auckland. He's now head coach
of Ireland. We are losing coaches. They're going the other way.
Speaker 3 (35:59):
Now.
Speaker 4 (35:59):
That says to me there's no pathway. There was no
one tapping Rob Walter or Heinrich Mallard on the shoulder
saying hey, my name is Brian Strottich. We're really interested
in looking at you for the for the New Zealand coach.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
That didn't happen.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
I don't think, well, they've taken the other per path.
That's the that's the problem. You're talking about the pathway's
gone in the wrong direction and we are needing some
Well that's right now. So you know the bowling coach
is the first option that they've had to make a
decision on. And I guess in time we'll know I'll
(36:33):
go for Brendan Donkers.
Speaker 4 (36:35):
Well what what what I mean? We're in a time
of transition, right. You need experienced coaches, you need a
lot of technical info.
Speaker 3 (36:47):
You've got to have.
Speaker 4 (36:47):
Good systems of data so you when you analyze things,
you improve them and you avoid injuries.
Speaker 3 (36:53):
Are raw and seers.
Speaker 4 (36:56):
And we've got Duffy in the contract now in the
contract system.
Speaker 3 (36:59):
Yes, who is going.
Speaker 4 (37:01):
We've also, if you think about it, we've got a
number of spinners plying their trade with the Red but
we've got Phillip's a beginner. We've got Satna learning to
be different in how to get a turning ball through
the defense, not just a through attack a batsman attacking.
We've got ag As Patel who goes up and down.
It gets the ball up and then down before the batsman,
(37:23):
but he needs more consistency. We've got Bracewooll who is
much the same as Patel up and down but potentially
a big turner. I think we need a spin coach.
We're off to India for three Tests.
Speaker 3 (37:36):
We are also.
Speaker 4 (37:36):
Playing Pakistan and Sri Lanka. You know, do we want
up and downsmen?
Speaker 3 (37:42):
As?
Speaker 4 (37:42):
Do we want to show a Basha a tall bowler
to bowl into the pitch. So I reckon we need
a spin coach as well, a Jeeton Patel who's with England. Now,
we can't afford this swads. New Zealand cannot afford those people.
What do we do We come back to New Zealand
(38:04):
is the answer.
Speaker 3 (38:06):
Now.
Speaker 4 (38:06):
I like the look of Andre Adams and I think
he thinks differently. I think he he's shown that he's
been a coach of New Zealand in the past.
Speaker 3 (38:22):
He was at Auckland for some years.
Speaker 4 (38:28):
He's currently in Bangladesh. They all get paid US dollars
of course, and they'll be all converting and back to
New Zealand dollars and things like that. I would like
to see him given an opportunity. I think he's a
very good player, highly regarded coached in Australia as well
(38:50):
as stateside. I'd like to see him have a crack.
But I understand you Brent your donkers, not your bonkers,
your donkers, because he's at the high performance as well,
and he's worked with those players, so that I think
we're going to have to be homegrown. Was I don't
We've got haven't got a chance otherwise.
Speaker 2 (39:10):
Themes the way it's going, and it'll be interesting to
see what happens when they finally make a decision, because
as you say, they're not far away from sending a
team to the subcontinent and to play against India where
a good bowling coach will be required. We'll wait for
the outcome of that. You have your money where it is, Jerry.
I'll bow to your knowledge, experience and research capacity.
Speaker 3 (39:38):
And that's what you.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
Said, the ultimate compliment and thank you for doing the
work that I gave you. You can have a little
rest and watch the Test match from Edgemstone and we'll
talk about that next week on the front four eight.
Speaker 3 (39:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (39:56):
I'm looking forward to that, see how the Westerndies go
and see if they can continue that little bit of
improvement back for another half day and the second innings.
Speaker 3 (40:07):
That'll be good.
Speaker 4 (40:08):
Those little improvements and steps that I was talking about
for the.
Speaker 3 (40:12):
Women exactly trip the next week, mate, take care of
me winter well, all the world the qualities of summer sing.
Speaker 4 (40:22):
Do do
Speaker 1 (40:27):
For more from News Talk, set B Listen live on
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