August 28, 2024 • 24 mins
Award-winning film Producer Ray Roman discusses his new sports documentary, "Concussed: The American Dream," starring Brett Favre, Jim McMahon, and Christian Okoye! "Concussed: The American Dream" is now playing on Apple TV and Amazon Prime.
The New York Giants drafted Tyler Sash and became a part of the 2012 Super Bowl-winning team. Concussions would cut Sash's career short, and the film is paralleled by NFL Hall of Famer Brett Favre's CTE experience.
The New York Giants drafted Tyler Sash and became a part of the 2012 Super Bowl-winning team. Concussions would cut Sash's career short, and the film is paralleled by NFL Hall of Famer Brett Favre's CTE experience.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
The Jam Rice Show, All about Movies.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
You're listening to The Jam Price Show, All about Movies,
and today my guest is film producer Ray Roman, and
we're going to be talking about a brand new documentary
entitled Concussed the American Dream.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Welcome to the show, Ray, Hi, Jennet, thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Oh, you're welcome. This is a film that it's a
really important film that I think people should be seeing,
but particularly families with young boys and maybe young girls
too now which we are also playing football, that they
should be seeing this before they decide whether they're going
to allow their children to play football at such a
young age. Let's dive into this fairly quickly. This is
(00:40):
about CTE, and so let's tell the audience a little
bit about what Cancussed the American Dream is all about.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
Okay, So Concuss the American Dream is written and directed
by David Kano executive producer Brett Park And so the
film goes into the story about Tyler Sash. He played
for the New York Giants and has since passed a
and it has been found that he has had CTE
chronic traumatic encephalopathy, and something found with players who've had
a lot of years playing the game of football and
(01:09):
other sports, and a lot of people think it's from concussions,
but it can be from the smaller subconcussive blows over
the years. And that's something that Tyler had gone through
in his life. And it's paralleled with Rad Farr's story,
who's been in the year in the league for about
twenty years and has played football for much of his life.
And so we just kind of show the two stories
(01:30):
and we've got to meet the family and everything, and
it's a pretty strong story.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
It's a very strong story. I cried quite a bit actually, yet, yeah,
I really did. It was a very important story, you know,
even though it's tragic in what's happening, it's important because
there it hasn't been that long that this has even
been in our consciousness to have a discussion about this,
so it's still rather new. So that's why this documentary
(01:56):
is so important because it gives you a true picture
of what players go through, what they have been going
through and not knowing for all those years what was
creating this problem for them.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Yes, yeah, kind of.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
Like early Alzheimer's in a way.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Yeah, there are kind of some similarities. I believe with
I think it's a protein gene. It's apoe for trying
to get technical here, but they were looking for a
biomarker to determine if this is something that they can
discover while people are live. I guess they have come
close to it, but they're not quite there with saying
that they can actually determine while somebody is alive. So
(02:33):
part of this too is you know, yeah, like you said,
they go through their life without knowing whether or not
they have this and face all these struggles and obstacles
that may change their life over time, and it's not
until there have since passed away where their brain would
have to be sent in for research and basically cut
open and to determine if they have this disease or not.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
So they're trying to know what I think. What I
got is they're trying to develop a test to find
out whether they have it.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Now, Yeah, they call it a biomarker, so they would
be able to tell whether or not somebody has it
while they're alive. There are tests which I believe they
did do on a former player who was once alive.
They do a pet scan, so I believe you have
to do some sort of radiation and then when you
do the pet scam, it will basically light up those
parts of the brain that is having some kind of
(03:20):
a disease. And in that particular player, I believe he
had passed. And then they did see that he did
have it in his brain, but they still couldn't I
guess one hundred percent say, or determine you know, while
you're alive. So they're still working on that in the
science aspect of things.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Let's talk a little bit about Tyler Sash. This is
really his story. You've bringing other people and we'll talk
a little bit about Brett Farv too, but let's talk
about Tyler Sash and his story and that and how
this came about too.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Yeah. So Tyler is from Oscaloosa, Iowa. On small town.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
He was very well known. He played basketball much of
his younger career and actually thought he was going to
play that, move on to play that into high school
and whatnot, but he eventually ended up playing football, became
all state. He was breaking all kinds of records in
his school and still holds many of those records. We
got to go visit in his high school where you
played at interview one of his coaches, Darryl Shoemaker, and
(04:15):
just heard many good stories from him. And you know,
while we were filming there, people were coming up to
us and asking what is this about, and then we'd
bring up Tyler Sash and it would just kind of
turn head. He really was a community driven person, did
things to help within the community that we show within
the film as well. So he was a very loved
person and so when he had passed, it really raised
(04:37):
some eyebrows. And then even until today, you mentioned his
name and many people are talking about him, and they
just chime in and everybody has something positive to say
about him.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
Yeah, he was a beautiful soul inside and out. Saw
his heart, You saw his soul and who he was
and how he was. You show that so beautifully in
the film about who he was, and that's why it
was even more tragic. And he was so young too,
you know, so young, right, It's happened, I mean, and
the symptoms started fairly quickly soon too, in his young years,
(05:10):
wasn't it didn't They start pretty much after the he
won the Super Bowl. I mean, he was a Super
Bowl winner with that New York Giants.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
Yeah, with the New York giants.
Speaker 3 (05:20):
Yeah, it definitely started fairly long young his symptoms and
it's something that we kind of compare, you know, with
Brett Fahr. Many people know him. He's a household name,
you know, throughout the years playing football, and he's taken
some big hits and has been able to play and
play year after year. And we never know. I guess
each individual is different how our bodies may react. So
(05:40):
it does bring into question, you know, when you bring
up youth sports, whether or not is this something somebody's
child may want to endure. So but I mean I
played football myself when I was younger, and it's definitely
something to help shape or form you or bring discipline
to your life. So there are the positive aspects. Just
maybe they play flag football or just learned the six
(06:00):
first so right.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
And I think you know, when you think about it,
you know, Pop Warner starts at what age? What age
can they start playing football?
Speaker 3 (06:08):
I believe I played. I was probably about seven years old,
six or seven years.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Old, but you can start younger than that, correct.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Probably, I believe.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
Actually is I have a younger brother who played and
I remember him playing flag football fairly young.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
So if they're doing tackles, you know, if they're if
they're playing, and that's what we'll get into a little
bit more about flag, but if they're doing you know,
if they're tackling, you know, at this young age, they're
just forming, you know, their brains are still forming, you
know at that day, you know, and to have it
your head knocked, and they're resilience, so they probably think
nothing's wrong, you know, but we you know, over years
and years and years of having that happen, obviously, this
(06:42):
is what's creating these these issues with these players, these
football players. And we'll get into other sports too, because
it's not the only sport that is having this issue.
But if they just if everyone decided let's just do
flag football, that would keep it safe for these younger
children and still learn all the wonderful things that you
do learn playing a sport. You know, let's not take
(07:03):
that away, because I think it's important. It does develop
character and teamwork and you know, how you work together,
and there's so many aspects of that. They're so positive
about playing a sport when you're younger, but you don't
want your child, when you think you're doing something good
for them, then discover that in the years later, it
probably wasn't so good for them. And so if they
are You mentioned this a little bit in the film.
(07:25):
But are more and more Pop Warner leagues thinking about
just doing flag football or is it it's up to
the community itself. How does that actually work?
Speaker 3 (07:33):
Yeah, I believe there have been some changes as far
as leagues promoting the flag football. I have seen personally
within my family actually have a nephew who shifted to
playing lacrosse. There's still some they get pretty rough in there,
but there's no actual kind of tackling and whatnot. They
are kind of bumping and grinding each other with the
lacrosse sticks. And then even within I believe within the
(07:55):
NFL they have limited number of padding practices they can have,
so they're trying to limit the number of tackles off
of the main stage during the games. So and then
they've also introduced this year they have been practicing with
the Guardian caps. That's they wear that on top of
their helmet.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
So this year tell us that is for people.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
Yeah, So it's basically like a protective I guess kind
of like a sleeve and then it has padding, uh
to give them some protection.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
When they tackle. So this is the first year that
it's being allowed within gameplay.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
So I believe the helmets are underneath their.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
Helmet, yes, over the helmets, So I believe the Steelers
and then the Colts were first to do it. And uh,
you know, some people you may see on Twitter and
whatnot bringing up that, you know, it kind of looks funny.
I myself kind of didn't notice it at first, but
you know, it is to protect the athlete as well
(08:55):
as you know, keep the game entertaining. I believe it
added a tenth sent safety as far as from the collision,
and then if two players are wearing it, it raises
it to twenty percent more safer.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
So I think, go ahead ahead.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
I believe too.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
I had read something that it there was a study
on it in high school sports, and I believe those
percentages were higher, like thirty or thirty thirty percent. So
I was meaning to look into that a little bit
more to see is that just because you know, they're
not these super athletes at the NFL level with the
(09:36):
you know, bigger bodies, bigger speeds, So maybe that's why
at that level the percentage, the safety percentage is a
little bit more elevated compared to the NFL, but they
are doing the efforts and trying to make the game
safer as well as keep it entertaining.
Speaker 1 (09:53):
So that's good to see, you know.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
And also, you know, you show it in the film
and I can't remember who it was or how was,
but you know, there's a scene where you know, somebody
just they've tackled them and then they kind of just
throw them down again and hit his head. You know.
I mean I was like appalled, you know that it
was kind of like, Okay, he's already down and they
he gets re injured, you know, from doing that. I
(10:15):
mean the players also have to I know, they're they're
all revved up and they are adrenalines going, and they're
taught to be you know, killers in their own way,
but there's no need for the extra you know, tackling.
I guess or you know, I want to say abuse,
but that's the wrong word. Abuse is not the right word,
but you know, additional pain and you know to somebody,
(10:39):
especially when they've been down, you know, and I think
that's when we see you know, the anger on the field,
and that's not that's not entertaining for anybody.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
Yeah, I believe you're referring to Super Bowl champion Jim McMahon.
He was taken down on a big play and you know,
he goes into talking about that back then he says,
we just we just.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Went back in the game. That's what we did it.
Speaker 3 (11:00):
And even for myself recently, I found a old VHS
clip of I was being interviewed after a Pop Warner
game and they asked me, you know, what do you
what do you like about being out there? And I
was mentioning hitting, hitting people, tackling people, and they asked
me what kind of sounds I hear and I said,
helmets smashing.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
So looking back at that, it was kind of.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Eye opening that that is kind of you know, the
way you're taught, you know, to be tough and get
in there and and get the other guy, which is
you know, it's it's really you know, it's a high
impact sport and it is exciting, and that's the part.
You know, how much do you eliminate well keeping it
(11:45):
you know, keeping it safe and entertaining. It's kind of
a fine line. But just looking back for me, it
was like, wow, it was eye opening.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
That Wow. Interesting, you know, there is a point though.
I mean, you know, you bring up a number of
times in the film. It's brought up about, you know,
the entertainment value. And yes, we all love football, you know,
most of us, I should say, you knows, most America
loves football. And and yet you know, do we need
to be entertained by the violence of the sport? You know,
(12:17):
because there is you know, is that is that necessary?
I guess that's what we're you know, having this discussion about,
you know how, and I think players when they they
know what the consequences are of you know, and I
don't know if they're being educated as much. Maybe this
film will be an education for them perhaps, but I
don't know how. How prevalent is this conversation in the NFL.
Speaker 3 (12:42):
Right yeah, I think some of the older generation now
looking back, is you know, becoming aware of it. We
hope to reach you know, the younger generation up and
coming who can decide possibly to make that change.
Speaker 1 (12:58):
Obviously it may be too late for you.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
Know, the ones who have gone a whole career through it,
but there are still ones that may be transitioning from
either high school into college or college into professional you know.
Speaker 1 (13:13):
It's a small amount that is actually going to make
it into the professional level.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
But for those that do, you know, maybe it's something
that they can consider possibly retire early or find a
way to transition into a new career. You know, as
you see a lot of the players transition into broadcasting
or journalism and things like that. So you know, bringing
the knowledge that they have from the game, their experience,
(13:39):
it's something that they can continue to be involved with
with the game of football.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
Yes, definitely. Will you interview Britt Farm We brought him
up earlier. Let's talk a little bit more about his story.
And he's actually involved in this as a producer too,
Is that correct.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Right, that's correct.
Speaker 3 (13:57):
Yeah, Yeah, So Brett, we got to interview him multiple
times for this. He's very vocal about concussions and even
himself having concussions. He's even tallied up himself within twenty
years professionally, and he mentions, you know, high school and
so on, so he thinks, like about twenty six years
(14:19):
you know worth of collisions could have tallied up to
a thousand concussions. So, you know, I don't know there
actually one thousand concussions, but you can imagine all of
the small subconcussive hits that are.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
What seems to be the issue.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
And we got to speak with doctor Ann McKee from
Boston University who did a big study on NFL players
and she's the one who found the one hundred and
ten out of one hundred and eleven brains that she
studied had CTE. So that was a big eye opener,
you know, And.
Speaker 2 (14:58):
Yeah, a big eye opener. Was she the one who
discovered it.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
She didn't discover, you know, CTE herself.
Speaker 3 (15:07):
Just that was a big study where on a professional level,
you know, people turn their.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Hands right, it was it was really eye opening to
hear her studies. And for sure, how did you get
involved with being a producer on this film?
Speaker 3 (15:26):
Me and my partner David Kano, writer director of the film,
had just been around different sporting events and athletes. We
would actually cover, for instance, a sport of m M
A like media and we've got to interview different fighters, boxers,
things like that. So just being around a contact sport
(15:49):
like that and seeing the damage that is happening, you know,
within football, we had different contacts and different people that
we've been able to interview for this film that unfortunately
didn't get to make the cut. We met so many
people and it just it's really you know, to hear
(16:10):
their stories and hear what.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
They're all going through.
Speaker 3 (16:13):
It's very difficult and it was very i guess vulnerable,
and you know a lot of them really opened up
to us and for us to share this story Tyler
Sasha's story, we got to you know, meet his mother
as well, who really definitely.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
Opened up to us.
Speaker 3 (16:30):
And it's just a touching thing that behind the scenes,
you know, you see the super athlete on TV, but
you don't see behind the scene was what happens when
the player's at home and the struggles that they're dealing
with day in and day out.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
So you did you really covered that beautifully as they
said it was. You did have incredible access with his mother,
his sister, and his girlfriend. How difficult was it for
you to have them open up and tell this story,
a very important story. Was it difficult for you to
get them to open up and to do this?
Speaker 3 (17:10):
I believe at first his mother, Barney Sash, was a
little hesitant about it, but are we wanted to come
from uh, you know, as a chance for her and
her family to share, you know, like the legacy of
their son and share this disease with other families that
(17:33):
you know, either may go through it or if they're lucky,
they don't have to go through it.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
So but you.
Speaker 3 (17:40):
Know, sitting there with them and hearing their stories and whatnot,
it was definitely difficult, and you feel a connection with them,
you know, because it just feels like you know somebody
that you know, you know, my you know, but almost
like immediate family, you know, just because you're you can
really eight, you know, on a human level, and that's
(18:03):
something that's kind of not seen again when you see
them on the on the big screen.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
The football players, you know, you just.
Speaker 3 (18:11):
See them as superstars there for the two hour game
and you switch to the next game, and you know,
you just see those hits, hits, hits. So to be there,
you know, silent in a room with them and hear
them explain what they went through, it was really difficult.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Actually, was it? I can imagine well, as I said,
I was crying, you know at the end of it myself,
you know, it was yeah, you now, I wonder if
it was it? Did they feel it was cathartic? When
after they had finished recording.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
This film, I'm not quite sure.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
I'm sure they had a wide range of emotions and.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
Still do you know, grief for anybody is different.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
So have they seen it? Have they seen the film?
Speaker 3 (18:57):
Yes? I believe my partner David is in contact with
them and was able to share this with them.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
Did you get any comments or anything from them about it?
Speaker 3 (19:07):
Not quite yet that I could I could relate back
to you.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
Yeah, see, this is this is a series you said
you want to do more. This was covered football, but
you have other sports you want to cover. Do you
want to talk about that a little bit?
Speaker 1 (19:22):
We could talk about it briefly.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
We you know, like I said before covering MMA and boxing,
we were able to interview other athletes and are planning on,
you know, putting something together regarding those sports as well.
Speaker 2 (19:37):
So this is yeah, so this is very important film
to see. What would you what advice would you give
a parent who you know whose child wants their son
and or daughter, because I don't know if they do
they tackle with girls football in the Pop Warner League.
(19:57):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (19:58):
Yeah, I'm not quite sure. I don't necessarily think they
have a women's or girls league. I know there have
been girls who have played and I've seen even within school,
you know, going through school girls who have played, which
is kind of questionable as well, I think, because you know,
you're kind of mixing two genders and you know, yes,
(20:18):
we want equality for everybody and things like that, but
you know, they may actually receive more damage, and you know,
maybe that's not something that is a smart idea.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
So I agree, I agree with that. So what advice
would you give a parent.
Speaker 3 (20:35):
Just to consider the long term effects that this may
have on somebody's on their child and whether or not
this sport is good for them, and at what age is.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
It good for them?
Speaker 3 (20:47):
You know, I think flag football is definitely something that
can learn the game of football and still learn that
discipline that can help, you know, a kid grow up
because sometimes you know, many kids, I myself kind of
needed the discipline and you know, because you know, kids
can be all over the place, you know, so to
have you know, these other figures after school, you know,
(21:09):
teach you and teach you that role of discipline can
be helpful. But just consider, you know, is my is
my child going to be a star athlete? You know,
and things like that, and you know they can always
do other things too, as far as you know, track,
as far as keeping up speed, definitely would keep somebody
in shape. But uh, you know, there's definitely other options.
(21:31):
And I'm not saying to forget or move on from
the game of football, because, like I said, I think
flag is a good option, and lacrosse.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
As well another in soccer too.
Speaker 3 (21:42):
Now, yes, yes, but there are studies as well from
the soccer Yeah, because of the I believe they're heading
with the ball is a big factor within the game.
So it's something that you know, we don't really pay
attention to as far as what we do to our
brains many of the times for the sake of entertainment.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
So that's what I think this film is.
Speaker 3 (22:03):
It's a real eye opener just to kind of take
a look at our health and what are we doing.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
Yeah, I agree with you, Yes, soccer, I would have
they had this CTE if they do they know anything
about that? Have they studied soccer soccer players.
Speaker 1 (22:20):
That you're yes, I believe.
Speaker 3 (22:21):
I mean there are studies where they have found it
and they're aware of it. I mean they it goes
on in other sports as well, cheerleading, So yeah, things
you wouldn't expect right right.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
Where Where can people see Cancust The American Dream?
Speaker 3 (22:42):
Right, people can see Cancust the American Dream on Apple
TV as well as Amazon Prime Video, and those are
the two big spots right now, and then they'll be
rolling out to other platforms as well as as the
weeks move on.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Wonderful. It's perfect timing as we move into a football
season which everybody always I'd love the fall and football
and you know all the excitement around it. So this
is a film that you know should be seen by
everyone who even if you love football, we will have
a different appreciation when you watch this year after seeing
this film, you really will. It will. It's eye opening
(23:19):
and yeah, I know when I'm watching football this year,
I'll have a different appreciation when I'm watching it too.
So thank you so much, Ray. I wish you much
success with this and when you do your series of
documentaries on the other sports, please get in touch and
I'd love to have you back on the show to
talk about that.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
All right, thank you so much for your time.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
Thank you.
Speaker 4 (23:40):
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Speaker 1 (24:15):
The Janprice Show All about movies.
The Jam Rice Show, All about Movies.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
You're listening to The Jam Price Show, All about Movies,
and today my guest is film producer Ray Roman, and
we're going to be talking about a brand new documentary
entitled Concussed the American Dream.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Welcome to the show, Ray, Hi, Jennet, thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Oh, you're welcome. This is a film that it's a
really important film that I think people should be seeing,
but particularly families with young boys and maybe young girls
too now which we are also playing football, that they
should be seeing this before they decide whether they're going
to allow their children to play football at such a
young age. Let's dive into this fairly quickly. This is
(00:40):
about CTE, and so let's tell the audience a little
bit about what Cancussed the American Dream is all about.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
Okay, So Concuss the American Dream is written and directed
by David Kano executive producer Brett Park And so the
film goes into the story about Tyler Sash. He played
for the New York Giants and has since passed a
and it has been found that he has had CTE
chronic traumatic encephalopathy, and something found with players who've had
a lot of years playing the game of football and
(01:09):
other sports, and a lot of people think it's from concussions,
but it can be from the smaller subconcussive blows over
the years. And that's something that Tyler had gone through
in his life. And it's paralleled with Rad Farr's story,
who's been in the year in the league for about
twenty years and has played football for much of his life.
And so we just kind of show the two stories
(01:30):
and we've got to meet the family and everything, and
it's a pretty strong story.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
It's a very strong story. I cried quite a bit actually, yet, yeah,
I really did. It was a very important story, you know,
even though it's tragic in what's happening, it's important because
there it hasn't been that long that this has even
been in our consciousness to have a discussion about this,
so it's still rather new. So that's why this documentary
(01:56):
is so important because it gives you a true picture
of what players go through, what they have been going
through and not knowing for all those years what was
creating this problem for them.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Yes, yeah, kind of.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
Like early Alzheimer's in a way.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Yeah, there are kind of some similarities. I believe with
I think it's a protein gene. It's apoe for trying
to get technical here, but they were looking for a
biomarker to determine if this is something that they can
discover while people are live. I guess they have come
close to it, but they're not quite there with saying
that they can actually determine while somebody is alive. So
(02:33):
part of this too is you know, yeah, like you said,
they go through their life without knowing whether or not
they have this and face all these struggles and obstacles
that may change their life over time, and it's not
until there have since passed away where their brain would
have to be sent in for research and basically cut
open and to determine if they have this disease or not.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
So they're trying to know what I think. What I
got is they're trying to develop a test to find
out whether they have it.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Now, Yeah, they call it a biomarker, so they would
be able to tell whether or not somebody has it
while they're alive. There are tests which I believe they
did do on a former player who was once alive.
They do a pet scan, so I believe you have
to do some sort of radiation and then when you
do the pet scam, it will basically light up those
parts of the brain that is having some kind of
(03:20):
a disease. And in that particular player, I believe he
had passed. And then they did see that he did
have it in his brain, but they still couldn't I
guess one hundred percent say, or determine you know, while
you're alive. So they're still working on that in the
science aspect of things.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Let's talk a little bit about Tyler Sash. This is
really his story. You've bringing other people and we'll talk
a little bit about Brett Farv too, but let's talk
about Tyler Sash and his story and that and how
this came about too.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Yeah. So Tyler is from Oscaloosa, Iowa. On small town.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
He was very well known. He played basketball much of
his younger career and actually thought he was going to
play that, move on to play that into high school
and whatnot, but he eventually ended up playing football, became
all state. He was breaking all kinds of records in
his school and still holds many of those records. We
got to go visit in his high school where you
played at interview one of his coaches, Darryl Shoemaker, and
(04:15):
just heard many good stories from him. And you know,
while we were filming there, people were coming up to
us and asking what is this about, and then we'd
bring up Tyler Sash and it would just kind of
turn head. He really was a community driven person, did
things to help within the community that we show within
the film as well. So he was a very loved
person and so when he had passed, it really raised
(04:37):
some eyebrows. And then even until today, you mentioned his
name and many people are talking about him, and they
just chime in and everybody has something positive to say
about him.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
Yeah, he was a beautiful soul inside and out. Saw
his heart, You saw his soul and who he was
and how he was. You show that so beautifully in
the film about who he was, and that's why it
was even more tragic. And he was so young too,
you know, so young, right, It's happened, I mean, and
the symptoms started fairly quickly soon too, in his young years,
(05:10):
wasn't it didn't They start pretty much after the he
won the Super Bowl. I mean, he was a Super
Bowl winner with that New York Giants.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
Yeah, with the New York giants.
Speaker 3 (05:20):
Yeah, it definitely started fairly long young his symptoms and
it's something that we kind of compare, you know, with
Brett Fahr. Many people know him. He's a household name,
you know, throughout the years playing football, and he's taken
some big hits and has been able to play and
play year after year. And we never know. I guess
each individual is different how our bodies may react. So
(05:40):
it does bring into question, you know, when you bring
up youth sports, whether or not is this something somebody's
child may want to endure. So but I mean I
played football myself when I was younger, and it's definitely
something to help shape or form you or bring discipline
to your life. So there are the positive aspects. Just
maybe they play flag football or just learned the six
(06:00):
first so right.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
And I think you know, when you think about it,
you know, Pop Warner starts at what age? What age
can they start playing football?
Speaker 3 (06:08):
I believe I played. I was probably about seven years old,
six or seven years.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Old, but you can start younger than that, correct.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Probably, I believe.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
Actually is I have a younger brother who played and
I remember him playing flag football fairly young.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
So if they're doing tackles, you know, if they're if
they're playing, and that's what we'll get into a little
bit more about flag, but if they're doing you know,
if they're tackling, you know, at this young age, they're
just forming, you know, their brains are still forming, you
know at that day, you know, and to have it
your head knocked, and they're resilience, so they probably think
nothing's wrong, you know, but we you know, over years
and years and years of having that happen, obviously, this
(06:42):
is what's creating these these issues with these players, these
football players. And we'll get into other sports too, because
it's not the only sport that is having this issue.
But if they just if everyone decided let's just do
flag football, that would keep it safe for these younger
children and still learn all the wonderful things that you
do learn playing a sport. You know, let's not take
(07:03):
that away, because I think it's important. It does develop
character and teamwork and you know, how you work together,
and there's so many aspects of that. They're so positive
about playing a sport when you're younger, but you don't
want your child, when you think you're doing something good
for them, then discover that in the years later, it
probably wasn't so good for them. And so if they
are You mentioned this a little bit in the film.
(07:25):
But are more and more Pop Warner leagues thinking about
just doing flag football or is it it's up to
the community itself. How does that actually work?
Speaker 3 (07:33):
Yeah, I believe there have been some changes as far
as leagues promoting the flag football. I have seen personally
within my family actually have a nephew who shifted to
playing lacrosse. There's still some they get pretty rough in there,
but there's no actual kind of tackling and whatnot. They
are kind of bumping and grinding each other with the
lacrosse sticks. And then even within I believe within the
(07:55):
NFL they have limited number of padding practices they can have,
so they're trying to limit the number of tackles off
of the main stage during the games. So and then
they've also introduced this year they have been practicing with
the Guardian caps. That's they wear that on top of
their helmet.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
So this year tell us that is for people.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
Yeah, So it's basically like a protective I guess kind
of like a sleeve and then it has padding, uh
to give them some protection.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
When they tackle. So this is the first year that
it's being allowed within gameplay.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
So I believe the helmets are underneath their.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
Helmet, yes, over the helmets, So I believe the Steelers
and then the Colts were first to do it. And uh,
you know, some people you may see on Twitter and
whatnot bringing up that, you know, it kind of looks funny.
I myself kind of didn't notice it at first, but
you know, it is to protect the athlete as well
(08:55):
as you know, keep the game entertaining. I believe it
added a tenth sent safety as far as from the collision,
and then if two players are wearing it, it raises
it to twenty percent more safer.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
So I think, go ahead ahead.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
I believe too.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
I had read something that it there was a study
on it in high school sports, and I believe those
percentages were higher, like thirty or thirty thirty percent. So
I was meaning to look into that a little bit
more to see is that just because you know, they're
not these super athletes at the NFL level with the
(09:36):
you know, bigger bodies, bigger speeds, So maybe that's why
at that level the percentage, the safety percentage is a
little bit more elevated compared to the NFL, but they
are doing the efforts and trying to make the game
safer as well as keep it entertaining.
Speaker 1 (09:53):
So that's good to see, you know.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
And also, you know, you show it in the film
and I can't remember who it was or how was,
but you know, there's a scene where you know, somebody
just they've tackled them and then they kind of just
throw them down again and hit his head. You know.
I mean I was like appalled, you know that it
was kind of like, Okay, he's already down and they
he gets re injured, you know, from doing that. I
(10:15):
mean the players also have to I know, they're they're
all revved up and they are adrenalines going, and they're
taught to be you know, killers in their own way,
but there's no need for the extra you know, tackling.
I guess or you know, I want to say abuse,
but that's the wrong word. Abuse is not the right word,
but you know, additional pain and you know to somebody,
(10:39):
especially when they've been down, you know, and I think
that's when we see you know, the anger on the field,
and that's not that's not entertaining for anybody.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
Yeah, I believe you're referring to Super Bowl champion Jim McMahon.
He was taken down on a big play and you know,
he goes into talking about that back then he says,
we just we just.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Went back in the game. That's what we did it.
Speaker 3 (11:00):
And even for myself recently, I found a old VHS
clip of I was being interviewed after a Pop Warner
game and they asked me, you know, what do you
what do you like about being out there? And I
was mentioning hitting, hitting people, tackling people, and they asked
me what kind of sounds I hear and I said,
helmets smashing.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
So looking back at that, it was kind of.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Eye opening that that is kind of you know, the
way you're taught, you know, to be tough and get
in there and and get the other guy, which is
you know, it's it's really you know, it's a high
impact sport and it is exciting, and that's the part.
You know, how much do you eliminate well keeping it
(11:45):
you know, keeping it safe and entertaining. It's kind of
a fine line. But just looking back for me, it
was like, wow, it was eye opening.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
That Wow. Interesting, you know, there is a point though.
I mean, you know, you bring up a number of
times in the film. It's brought up about, you know,
the entertainment value. And yes, we all love football, you know,
most of us, I should say, you knows, most America
loves football. And and yet you know, do we need
to be entertained by the violence of the sport? You know,
(12:17):
because there is you know, is that is that necessary?
I guess that's what we're you know, having this discussion about,
you know how, and I think players when they they
know what the consequences are of you know, and I
don't know if they're being educated as much. Maybe this
film will be an education for them perhaps, but I
don't know how. How prevalent is this conversation in the NFL.
Speaker 3 (12:42):
Right yeah, I think some of the older generation now
looking back, is you know, becoming aware of it. We
hope to reach you know, the younger generation up and
coming who can decide possibly to make that change.
Speaker 1 (12:58):
Obviously it may be too late for you.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
Know, the ones who have gone a whole career through it,
but there are still ones that may be transitioning from
either high school into college or college into professional you know.
Speaker 1 (13:13):
It's a small amount that is actually going to make
it into the professional level.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
But for those that do, you know, maybe it's something
that they can consider possibly retire early or find a
way to transition into a new career. You know, as
you see a lot of the players transition into broadcasting
or journalism and things like that. So you know, bringing
the knowledge that they have from the game, their experience,
(13:39):
it's something that they can continue to be involved with
with the game of football.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
Yes, definitely. Will you interview Britt Farm We brought him
up earlier. Let's talk a little bit more about his story.
And he's actually involved in this as a producer too,
Is that correct.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Right, that's correct.
Speaker 3 (13:57):
Yeah, Yeah, So Brett, we got to interview him multiple
times for this. He's very vocal about concussions and even
himself having concussions. He's even tallied up himself within twenty
years professionally, and he mentions, you know, high school and
so on, so he thinks, like about twenty six years
(14:19):
you know worth of collisions could have tallied up to
a thousand concussions. So, you know, I don't know there
actually one thousand concussions, but you can imagine all of
the small subconcussive hits that are.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
What seems to be the issue.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
And we got to speak with doctor Ann McKee from
Boston University who did a big study on NFL players
and she's the one who found the one hundred and
ten out of one hundred and eleven brains that she
studied had CTE. So that was a big eye opener,
you know, And.
Speaker 2 (14:58):
Yeah, a big eye opener. Was she the one who
discovered it.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
She didn't discover, you know, CTE herself.
Speaker 3 (15:07):
Just that was a big study where on a professional level,
you know, people turn their.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Hands right, it was it was really eye opening to
hear her studies. And for sure, how did you get
involved with being a producer on this film?
Speaker 3 (15:26):
Me and my partner David Kano, writer director of the film,
had just been around different sporting events and athletes. We
would actually cover, for instance, a sport of m M
A like media and we've got to interview different fighters, boxers,
things like that. So just being around a contact sport
(15:49):
like that and seeing the damage that is happening, you know,
within football, we had different contacts and different people that
we've been able to interview for this film that unfortunately
didn't get to make the cut. We met so many
people and it just it's really you know, to hear
(16:10):
their stories and hear what.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
They're all going through.
Speaker 3 (16:13):
It's very difficult and it was very i guess vulnerable,
and you know a lot of them really opened up
to us and for us to share this story Tyler
Sasha's story, we got to you know, meet his mother
as well, who really definitely.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
Opened up to us.
Speaker 3 (16:30):
And it's just a touching thing that behind the scenes,
you know, you see the super athlete on TV, but
you don't see behind the scene was what happens when
the player's at home and the struggles that they're dealing
with day in and day out.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
So you did you really covered that beautifully as they
said it was. You did have incredible access with his mother,
his sister, and his girlfriend. How difficult was it for
you to have them open up and tell this story,
a very important story. Was it difficult for you to
get them to open up and to do this?
Speaker 3 (17:10):
I believe at first his mother, Barney Sash, was a
little hesitant about it, but are we wanted to come
from uh, you know, as a chance for her and
her family to share, you know, like the legacy of
their son and share this disease with other families that
(17:33):
you know, either may go through it or if they're lucky,
they don't have to go through it.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
So but you.
Speaker 3 (17:40):
Know, sitting there with them and hearing their stories and whatnot,
it was definitely difficult, and you feel a connection with them,
you know, because it just feels like you know somebody
that you know, you know, my you know, but almost
like immediate family, you know, just because you're you can
really eight, you know, on a human level, and that's
(18:03):
something that's kind of not seen again when you see
them on the on the big screen.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
The football players, you know, you just.
Speaker 3 (18:11):
See them as superstars there for the two hour game
and you switch to the next game, and you know,
you just see those hits, hits, hits. So to be there,
you know, silent in a room with them and hear
them explain what they went through, it was really difficult.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Actually, was it? I can imagine well, as I said,
I was crying, you know at the end of it myself,
you know, it was yeah, you now, I wonder if
it was it? Did they feel it was cathartic? When
after they had finished recording.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
This film, I'm not quite sure.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
I'm sure they had a wide range of emotions and.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
Still do you know, grief for anybody is different.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
So have they seen it? Have they seen the film?
Speaker 3 (18:57):
Yes? I believe my partner David is in contact with
them and was able to share this with them.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
Did you get any comments or anything from them about it?
Speaker 3 (19:07):
Not quite yet that I could I could relate back
to you.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
Yeah, see, this is this is a series you said
you want to do more. This was covered football, but
you have other sports you want to cover. Do you
want to talk about that a little bit?
Speaker 1 (19:22):
We could talk about it briefly.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
We you know, like I said before covering MMA and boxing,
we were able to interview other athletes and are planning on,
you know, putting something together regarding those sports as well.
Speaker 2 (19:37):
So this is yeah, so this is very important film
to see. What would you what advice would you give
a parent who you know whose child wants their son
and or daughter, because I don't know if they do
they tackle with girls football in the Pop Warner League.
(19:57):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (19:58):
Yeah, I'm not quite sure. I don't necessarily think they
have a women's or girls league. I know there have
been girls who have played and I've seen even within school,
you know, going through school girls who have played, which
is kind of questionable as well, I think, because you know,
you're kind of mixing two genders and you know, yes,
(20:18):
we want equality for everybody and things like that, but
you know, they may actually receive more damage, and you know,
maybe that's not something that is a smart idea.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
So I agree, I agree with that. So what advice
would you give a parent.
Speaker 3 (20:35):
Just to consider the long term effects that this may
have on somebody's on their child and whether or not
this sport is good for them, and at what age is.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
It good for them?
Speaker 3 (20:47):
You know, I think flag football is definitely something that
can learn the game of football and still learn that
discipline that can help, you know, a kid grow up
because sometimes you know, many kids, I myself kind of
needed the discipline and you know, because you know, kids
can be all over the place, you know, so to
have you know, these other figures after school, you know,
(21:09):
teach you and teach you that role of discipline can
be helpful. But just consider, you know, is my is
my child going to be a star athlete? You know,
and things like that, and you know they can always
do other things too, as far as you know, track,
as far as keeping up speed, definitely would keep somebody
in shape. But uh, you know, there's definitely other options.
(21:31):
And I'm not saying to forget or move on from
the game of football, because, like I said, I think
flag is a good option, and lacrosse.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
As well another in soccer too.
Speaker 3 (21:42):
Now, yes, yes, but there are studies as well from
the soccer Yeah, because of the I believe they're heading
with the ball is a big factor within the game.
So it's something that you know, we don't really pay
attention to as far as what we do to our
brains many of the times for the sake of entertainment.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
So that's what I think this film is.
Speaker 3 (22:03):
It's a real eye opener just to kind of take
a look at our health and what are we doing.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
Yeah, I agree with you, Yes, soccer, I would have
they had this CTE if they do they know anything
about that? Have they studied soccer soccer players.
Speaker 1 (22:20):
That you're yes, I believe.
Speaker 3 (22:21):
I mean there are studies where they have found it
and they're aware of it. I mean they it goes
on in other sports as well, cheerleading, So yeah, things
you wouldn't expect right right.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
Where Where can people see Cancust The American Dream?
Speaker 3 (22:42):
Right, people can see Cancust the American Dream on Apple
TV as well as Amazon Prime Video, and those are
the two big spots right now, and then they'll be
rolling out to other platforms as well as as the
weeks move on.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Wonderful. It's perfect timing as we move into a football
season which everybody always I'd love the fall and football
and you know all the excitement around it. So this
is a film that you know should be seen by
everyone who even if you love football, we will have
a different appreciation when you watch this year after seeing
this film, you really will. It will. It's eye opening
(23:19):
and yeah, I know when I'm watching football this year,
I'll have a different appreciation when I'm watching it too.
So thank you so much, Ray. I wish you much
success with this and when you do your series of
documentaries on the other sports, please get in touch and
I'd love to have you back on the show to
talk about that.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
All right, thank you so much for your time.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
Thank you.
Speaker 4 (23:40):
Have a great day to all my wonderful loyal listeners.
Your love of film allows me to do what I do.
If you want to support me, the best way to
do that is to hit the subscribe button on the
iHeart Podcast Network, Apple Podcast, Google Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever
you listen to your favorite podcast and of course on YouTube.
(24:01):
Subscribing matters. If you are feeling really compelled, I want
to hear from you. Have a burning question, comment or review,
Drop me an email at the Jamprice Show dot com.
Thank you for listening
Speaker 1 (24:15):
The Janprice Show All about movies.
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