January 19, 2025 • 15 mins
Original Air Date: January 19, 2025
Jon Frederick is the CEO of Housing Alexandria, a non-profit taking innovative steps in affordable housing.
Jon Frederick is the CEO of Housing Alexandria, a non-profit taking innovative steps in affordable housing.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Sunstein Sessions on iHeartRadio, Conversations about issues that matter.
Here's your host, three time Greasie Award winner, Shelley Sunstein.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
I want to introduce you to John Frederick. He's the
CEO of Housing Alexandria, which is a nonprofit for affordable
housing in Alexandria, which happens to be a super expensive
place to live, being right outside of DC. And I mean,
(00:31):
you could just imagine like it is here in New
York City where the first responders and people who work
in restaurants and service industries really can't afford to live
where they work. So tell us about what you're doing, John, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Sure, So once again, thank you for having me here.
Housing Alexandria is a nonprofit that works exclusively in the
city of Alexandria, Virginia. For those that might not know,
it's about a city of one hundred and sixty thousand
people within the bigger DC metropolitan area and our task
our mission is to provide affordable housing opportunities through preservation
(01:15):
through new development for those that work in our community.
And you know, I'm always asked, well, what does affordable
housing mean? What does that mean for folks? And I
try to break it down in three ways. And the simplest,
simplest way, affordable housing means that someone is not paying
more than thirty percent of their income towards housing cost.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
You know, interesting, John, You say that because when I
was growing up and when I first started out in
the radio business, that figure was twenty five percent.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
Yeah, and there was there's some that would argue now
that it should be thirty five percent, and there are
some that try to make the Well, really, the two
biggest costs you have are transportation and housing costs, and
so those things together shouldn't be more than forty five percent.
But usually we try to stay right around thirty to
thirty five percent.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
So how do you do this? What do you do?
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Yeah? Well, and before I even even get there, I
think that it's sometimes we use percentages, and I like
to try to put it in numbers that people maybe
sometimes understand. So what we the folks that we serve
usually between thirty and eighty thousand dollars a year, right,
And so you don't have to think very hard of someone.
(02:31):
You mentioned some of them firefighters, police policeman, nurse, educators,
but also maybe the bartender at your favorite restaurant, you know,
like all of them are are work within this area
or within this area of those that need affordable housing.
And so we really work very much locally. Local partnerships
(02:53):
try to use flexible funding sources to create these housing
opportunity The.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Work with who I mean and how do people get
access to the affordable housing because I know you provide
you know, some, but certainly not the number that we need.
Speaker 3 (03:18):
Yeah, that's right, that's right. It is a it's a
national crisis. Yeah, housing and housing is a national crisis
that hits every part of this country. Actually, in twenty
twenty four, there was no place in the country that
nowhere in the country that someone working on the prevailing
(03:40):
minimum wage, whether that's set by the federal government or
your local government, that could provide or that could afford
excuse me, a two bedroom apartment. And so the need
is just vast. And so we work with our local government,
we work with our state government, we work with corporate
(04:01):
partners we work with other nonprofits. We work with landowners
that have an other kind of market rate, developers that
understand that this is an issue and want to find
ways to incorporate affordable housing in their projects. It's all
about partnerships, it's all about creating local solutions to serve
(04:22):
the local population.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
How do you see things moving forward with the new
administration in Washington coming in now?
Speaker 3 (04:34):
It's a great question. And the one thing that I
will say about affordable housing I kind of touched on
that it is this national crisis and that it touches,
you know, very ral parts of our country, very urban
parts of our country, and everything in between. And so
it really is a bipartisan issue. Now, different sides of
the aisle certainly see different solutions to how to create
(04:58):
more affordable housing. But I will say on both sides
of the aisle, they see the issue, and you know
it depending on your lens in life, some of it
see it as just a humanitarian issue and how do
we create communities and how do we create housing. On
certain lens, it's well, if we're going to grow business
(05:19):
and we're going to have people starting small businesses and
we're going to have corporations coming in, they need folks,
need places for folks to live, and so it becomes
an economic development issue. And so it really is a
bipartisan issue across so as the new administration comes in,
I don't know. I think that there will be different
types of solutions, but I don't think the issue of
(05:42):
addressing affordable housing goes away.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Right now as I speak to you, there is such
a crisis in LA with the wildfires and you know,
southern California, and you think of you know, I'm not
talking about the wealthy who have lost their home, which
is heartbreaking enough, the celebrities, but the working class, the
(06:06):
middle class and that are going to need affordable housing
and may not be able to rebuild. Any thoughts on
how we could possibly move forward there?
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Yeah, Well, first, there was a significant housing crisis in
LA to begin with. Most can point to, you know,
some of the homelessness issues in LA, but just the
folks that we are working with have always had and
recently had a real difficult time living in LA. So
this is gonna, you know, worse than that problem for sure.
(06:46):
But one of the things that and I just saw
something that Governor Gavin Newsom came out with is getting
rid of some of the red tape, the regulations to
allow the housing to be rebuilt. Some of the reasons
that we've gotten to the area and the way that
we are in this country now is because we used
to build a lot more housing than what we do now,
(07:09):
and now it takes a very very long time to
actually do that, to get housing built, and so getting
out of the way and allowing developments to go forward.
I'm not saying that communities shouldn't have a say and
have a way to be involved in the development process,
but letting things go forward in a reasonable amount of
(07:30):
time instead of the years and years of delay is
going to be really important as they as they move forward.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
You know what was really interesting I saw last week,
I think it was in the Wall Street Journal, and
this was happening in LA. This was before the wildfires,
that a costco in LA was going to build affordable
housing above the costco.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
Yeah, yeah, I read that article too. I think the
real interesting part of that article was that they were
not going to use a lot of government subsidy to
build that, and so it's a lot of units, right
and mixing units. I think it was eight hundred units
that were going to be built, if I remember correctly
(08:12):
from the article. And so that's another example of having
the ability to build more units allows you to build
some of them at a lower price point and using
land more efficiently where above a costco or above a
grocery store or you know, things that we're used to
in kind of more urban areas. But as you get
(08:35):
into more suburban areas, using your land more efficiently to
be able to kind of squeeze more density onto development
onto a parcel is really really important to keeping the
cost down.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
You know what my mind jumped to after hearing about
the costco, because so many malls are in trouble, was
why not do this at shopping malls?
Speaker 3 (08:56):
Yeah, I mean, I think that every situation is different.
In Alexander, we had an aging mall that needed to
be redeveloped and at the end of the day, there
was so much parking there that it didn't really make
sense to build on top of the mall. But the
mall is going to be redeveloped more as a mixed income,
(09:17):
mixed use center that has housing in retail and a
new hospital. But they are reusing some of the garage parking.
So looking at ways to reuse land that has kind
of no longer its best use is certainly important.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
I'm speaking with John Frederick. He is CEO of Housing Alexandria,
nonprofit for affordable housing in Alexandria. But we're really sort
of just envisioning what to do overall, because affordable housing
is not just an issue for one area, It's an
(09:54):
issue for the United States. One of the other things
that we've been dealing with John here in New York City,
and I'm sure you are in the Washington, DC area
as well, is the amount of office space that that
is going unused since COVID, since people started working hybrid
(10:20):
And I know there's a big push to get people
back in office, but I also know that there's a
big push back from the workforce that wants to work
remotely at least part time, and it has created a
huge issue for areas like Manhattan, and that also affects
(10:40):
the tax space. So what are your thoughts on this,
on turning some office space into affordable housing. And of course,
you know, again looking at Manhattan, wouldn't that drive down
the cost of housing period but also drive down you know,
prices and the wealth for those you know who own
(11:04):
real estate in Manhattan.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
Yeah, So a couple of things. One, every situation is different,
every building is different in how it can be reused.
But Alexandria has actually been a national leader in converting
some of the older office space into residential. Not all
of that has been affordable, but some portion of it
(11:27):
has been affordable. And as we mentioned earlier, housing is
really a lack of supply, right there's a lack of
supply of housing that is creating kind of upward pressures.
So anything we can do to create a new housing
does help the overall kind of housing costs. And so
Alexandria has a better part of I think ten or
(11:49):
eleven office buildings in a relatively small area that has
been converted to apartment buildings and that really works with
kind of older, maybe less desirable office space. I think
one of the things that we're going to see as
the workforce maybe comes back is that maybe less space,
(12:10):
like a company will take less office space but have
a higher quality, make a really an experience where workers
when they do come in, do want to be there.
But that's going to leave a lot of this older
office space that was kind of suburban or not as
kind of user friendly to be used for other things.
And I think conversion to residential is a really really
(12:32):
important part of that.
Speaker 2 (12:34):
Is there any area of the world, any country, or
any city that is doing this right that you can
talk about.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
And I hate to be the homer here, but I
mean I think we're a national leader the DC area
and specifically Alexandria because I think we know in Alexandria
and a lot of the reason is because our a
zoning allows those office buildings to be residential or to
be office right.
Speaker 2 (13:06):
And this is an issue in New York City where
zoning is a huge roadblock to you.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
And that gets back to what we talked about. What
could happen in California is that finding ways to not
just let the development industry run wild, but to create
reasonable regulations that allow things to go forward in a
more expedited manner. And one of the reason Alexandria has
been so successful is because you still have to get
your building permits, you still have to go through all
(13:32):
of the code stuff, but you don't have to go
through a year or two year long rezoning process to
allow residential to be built. It can be happened very
very quickly, and I think that has found to be
very very successful.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
We only have about a minute left. What have we
not touched on that you'd like to impart to our listeners.
Speaker 3 (13:52):
So the one thing that I think is really important.
Is I mentioned it, but flexible funding sources that are
available to do this, And I would be remiss not
to mention our partner, Amazon, who relocated their second headquarters
to Northern Virginia a couple of years ago, and as
part of that created a three point six billion dollar
(14:14):
equity Housing Equity Fund, which is grants and loans that
they're implementing in the areas of their corporate offices that's
the Seattle area, Northern Virginia, and Nashville. That's going to
create approximately thirty five thousand homes for low and modern
income individuals over the next several years. And we have
been a partner with them. We've created five hundred units,
(14:36):
even some home ownership opportunities for folks using that resource.
And I think that sometimes we look at Amazon and
some of these tech companies that's creating the problem, and
I think they deserve some credit to say we understand
there's a problem here and really putting some real funds
behind it to create solutions.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
That's really interesting. I thank you so much, John Frederick,
CEO of Housing Alexandria.
Speaker 1 (15:00):
You've been listening to Sunsteen sessions on iHeartRadio, a production
of New York's classic rock Q one O four point
three
Welcome to Sunstein Sessions on iHeartRadio, Conversations about issues that matter.
Here's your host, three time Greasie Award winner, Shelley Sunstein.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
I want to introduce you to John Frederick. He's the
CEO of Housing Alexandria, which is a nonprofit for affordable
housing in Alexandria, which happens to be a super expensive
place to live, being right outside of DC. And I mean,
(00:31):
you could just imagine like it is here in New
York City where the first responders and people who work
in restaurants and service industries really can't afford to live
where they work. So tell us about what you're doing, John, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Sure, So once again, thank you for having me here.
Housing Alexandria is a nonprofit that works exclusively in the
city of Alexandria, Virginia. For those that might not know,
it's about a city of one hundred and sixty thousand
people within the bigger DC metropolitan area and our task
our mission is to provide affordable housing opportunities through preservation
(01:15):
through new development for those that work in our community.
And you know, I'm always asked, well, what does affordable
housing mean? What does that mean for folks? And I
try to break it down in three ways. And the simplest,
simplest way, affordable housing means that someone is not paying
more than thirty percent of their income towards housing cost.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
You know, interesting, John, You say that because when I
was growing up and when I first started out in
the radio business, that figure was twenty five percent.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
Yeah, and there was there's some that would argue now
that it should be thirty five percent, and there are
some that try to make the Well, really, the two
biggest costs you have are transportation and housing costs, and
so those things together shouldn't be more than forty five percent.
But usually we try to stay right around thirty to
thirty five percent.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
So how do you do this? What do you do?
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Yeah? Well, and before I even even get there, I
think that it's sometimes we use percentages, and I like
to try to put it in numbers that people maybe
sometimes understand. So what we the folks that we serve
usually between thirty and eighty thousand dollars a year, right,
And so you don't have to think very hard of someone.
(02:31):
You mentioned some of them firefighters, police policeman, nurse, educators,
but also maybe the bartender at your favorite restaurant, you know,
like all of them are are work within this area
or within this area of those that need affordable housing.
And so we really work very much locally. Local partnerships
(02:53):
try to use flexible funding sources to create these housing
opportunity The.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Work with who I mean and how do people get
access to the affordable housing because I know you provide
you know, some, but certainly not the number that we need.
Speaker 3 (03:18):
Yeah, that's right, that's right. It is a it's a
national crisis. Yeah, housing and housing is a national crisis
that hits every part of this country. Actually, in twenty
twenty four, there was no place in the country that
nowhere in the country that someone working on the prevailing
(03:40):
minimum wage, whether that's set by the federal government or
your local government, that could provide or that could afford
excuse me, a two bedroom apartment. And so the need
is just vast. And so we work with our local government,
we work with our state government, we work with corporate
(04:01):
partners we work with other nonprofits. We work with landowners
that have an other kind of market rate, developers that
understand that this is an issue and want to find
ways to incorporate affordable housing in their projects. It's all
about partnerships, it's all about creating local solutions to serve
(04:22):
the local population.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
How do you see things moving forward with the new
administration in Washington coming in now?
Speaker 3 (04:34):
It's a great question. And the one thing that I
will say about affordable housing I kind of touched on
that it is this national crisis and that it touches,
you know, very ral parts of our country, very urban
parts of our country, and everything in between. And so
it really is a bipartisan issue. Now, different sides of
the aisle certainly see different solutions to how to create
(04:58):
more affordable housing. But I will say on both sides
of the aisle, they see the issue, and you know
it depending on your lens in life, some of it
see it as just a humanitarian issue and how do
we create communities and how do we create housing. On
certain lens, it's well, if we're going to grow business
(05:19):
and we're going to have people starting small businesses and
we're going to have corporations coming in, they need folks,
need places for folks to live, and so it becomes
an economic development issue. And so it really is a
bipartisan issue across so as the new administration comes in,
I don't know. I think that there will be different
types of solutions, but I don't think the issue of
(05:42):
addressing affordable housing goes away.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Right now as I speak to you, there is such
a crisis in LA with the wildfires and you know,
southern California, and you think of you know, I'm not
talking about the wealthy who have lost their home, which
is heartbreaking enough, the celebrities, but the working class, the
(06:06):
middle class and that are going to need affordable housing
and may not be able to rebuild. Any thoughts on
how we could possibly move forward there?
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Yeah, Well, first, there was a significant housing crisis in
LA to begin with. Most can point to, you know,
some of the homelessness issues in LA, but just the
folks that we are working with have always had and
recently had a real difficult time living in LA. So
this is gonna, you know, worse than that problem for sure.
(06:46):
But one of the things that and I just saw
something that Governor Gavin Newsom came out with is getting
rid of some of the red tape, the regulations to
allow the housing to be rebuilt. Some of the reasons
that we've gotten to the area and the way that
we are in this country now is because we used
to build a lot more housing than what we do now,
(07:09):
and now it takes a very very long time to
actually do that, to get housing built, and so getting
out of the way and allowing developments to go forward.
I'm not saying that communities shouldn't have a say and
have a way to be involved in the development process,
but letting things go forward in a reasonable amount of
(07:30):
time instead of the years and years of delay is
going to be really important as they as they move forward.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
You know what was really interesting I saw last week,
I think it was in the Wall Street Journal, and
this was happening in LA. This was before the wildfires,
that a costco in LA was going to build affordable
housing above the costco.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
Yeah, yeah, I read that article too. I think the
real interesting part of that article was that they were
not going to use a lot of government subsidy to
build that, and so it's a lot of units, right
and mixing units. I think it was eight hundred units
that were going to be built, if I remember correctly
(08:12):
from the article. And so that's another example of having
the ability to build more units allows you to build
some of them at a lower price point and using
land more efficiently where above a costco or above a
grocery store or you know, things that we're used to
in kind of more urban areas. But as you get
(08:35):
into more suburban areas, using your land more efficiently to
be able to kind of squeeze more density onto development
onto a parcel is really really important to keeping the
cost down.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
You know what my mind jumped to after hearing about
the costco, because so many malls are in trouble, was
why not do this at shopping malls?
Speaker 3 (08:56):
Yeah, I mean, I think that every situation is different.
In Alexander, we had an aging mall that needed to
be redeveloped and at the end of the day, there
was so much parking there that it didn't really make
sense to build on top of the mall. But the
mall is going to be redeveloped more as a mixed income,
(09:17):
mixed use center that has housing in retail and a
new hospital. But they are reusing some of the garage parking.
So looking at ways to reuse land that has kind
of no longer its best use is certainly important.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
I'm speaking with John Frederick. He is CEO of Housing Alexandria,
nonprofit for affordable housing in Alexandria. But we're really sort
of just envisioning what to do overall, because affordable housing
is not just an issue for one area, It's an
(09:54):
issue for the United States. One of the other things
that we've been dealing with John here in New York City,
and I'm sure you are in the Washington, DC area
as well, is the amount of office space that that
is going unused since COVID, since people started working hybrid
(10:20):
And I know there's a big push to get people
back in office, but I also know that there's a
big push back from the workforce that wants to work
remotely at least part time, and it has created a
huge issue for areas like Manhattan, and that also affects
(10:40):
the tax space. So what are your thoughts on this,
on turning some office space into affordable housing. And of course,
you know, again looking at Manhattan, wouldn't that drive down
the cost of housing period but also drive down you know,
prices and the wealth for those you know who own
(11:04):
real estate in Manhattan.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
Yeah, So a couple of things. One, every situation is different,
every building is different in how it can be reused.
But Alexandria has actually been a national leader in converting
some of the older office space into residential. Not all
of that has been affordable, but some portion of it
(11:27):
has been affordable. And as we mentioned earlier, housing is
really a lack of supply, right there's a lack of
supply of housing that is creating kind of upward pressures.
So anything we can do to create a new housing
does help the overall kind of housing costs. And so
Alexandria has a better part of I think ten or
(11:49):
eleven office buildings in a relatively small area that has
been converted to apartment buildings and that really works with
kind of older, maybe less desirable office space. I think
one of the things that we're going to see as
the workforce maybe comes back is that maybe less space,
(12:10):
like a company will take less office space but have
a higher quality, make a really an experience where workers
when they do come in, do want to be there.
But that's going to leave a lot of this older
office space that was kind of suburban or not as
kind of user friendly to be used for other things.
And I think conversion to residential is a really really
(12:32):
important part of that.
Speaker 2 (12:34):
Is there any area of the world, any country, or
any city that is doing this right that you can
talk about.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
And I hate to be the homer here, but I
mean I think we're a national leader the DC area
and specifically Alexandria because I think we know in Alexandria
and a lot of the reason is because our a
zoning allows those office buildings to be residential or to
be office right.
Speaker 2 (13:06):
And this is an issue in New York City where
zoning is a huge roadblock to you.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
And that gets back to what we talked about. What
could happen in California is that finding ways to not
just let the development industry run wild, but to create
reasonable regulations that allow things to go forward in a
more expedited manner. And one of the reason Alexandria has
been so successful is because you still have to get
your building permits, you still have to go through all
(13:32):
of the code stuff, but you don't have to go
through a year or two year long rezoning process to
allow residential to be built. It can be happened very
very quickly, and I think that has found to be
very very successful.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
We only have about a minute left. What have we
not touched on that you'd like to impart to our listeners.
Speaker 3 (13:52):
So the one thing that I think is really important.
Is I mentioned it, but flexible funding sources that are
available to do this, And I would be remiss not
to mention our partner, Amazon, who relocated their second headquarters
to Northern Virginia a couple of years ago, and as
part of that created a three point six billion dollar
(14:14):
equity Housing Equity Fund, which is grants and loans that
they're implementing in the areas of their corporate offices that's
the Seattle area, Northern Virginia, and Nashville. That's going to
create approximately thirty five thousand homes for low and modern
income individuals over the next several years. And we have
been a partner with them. We've created five hundred units,
(14:36):
even some home ownership opportunities for folks using that resource.
And I think that sometimes we look at Amazon and
some of these tech companies that's creating the problem, and
I think they deserve some credit to say we understand
there's a problem here and really putting some real funds
behind it to create solutions.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
That's really interesting. I thank you so much, John Frederick,
CEO of Housing Alexandria.
Speaker 1 (15:00):
You've been listening to Sunsteen sessions on iHeartRadio, a production
of New York's classic rock Q one O four point
three
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